A Conversation with Coach Pete Carroll

Exclusive: Coach Pete Carroll joins Marshawn, Gavin and Doug for a brutally honest conversation.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Man, what's handed?

Speaker 2 (00:01):
Man?

Speaker 1 (00:01):
You got Marshaw Bismall Lynch.

Speaker 3 (00:04):
Doug Hendrickson and Gavin Knewsome and you're listening to politickets.

Speaker 1 (00:08):
You're knowing to be, You're known to be.

Speaker 4 (00:20):
Marshawn likes this nice jersey right there, Marshawn, how you doing?
They just dust that off today for you.

Speaker 5 (00:23):
Marshawn, No, man, your little Homer Simpson three hairs at
the top of your head between them glasses and that
little mohawk thing on the top.

Speaker 6 (00:34):
Of your Simpson out.

Speaker 1 (00:36):
Yeah, you got out, Help you out, man.

Speaker 6 (00:38):
I've heard a lot of shit that was next level, Brue.

Speaker 2 (00:41):
Marshawn's here's the deal, Like I told Marshawn did last night, Gavin,
I said, here's the problem. If you take a tape
measure from one to one hundred, the average life expectancy
is seventy five. I'm fifty five, So we cut out
zero to fifty five and then seventy five hundreds.

Speaker 4 (00:57):
So that gives me and you, Gavin about eight more
good summer.

Speaker 7 (01:00):
Really eight.

Speaker 2 (01:01):
So what we have to do is start traveling with
Marshaan a little bit more, have a little bit more fun.

Speaker 4 (01:06):
Right now, you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 5 (01:07):
We gotta get some jail where you gotta lick your
And it smoothed that ship over a little bit here, right.

Speaker 7 (01:14):
I got the jail.

Speaker 6 (01:15):
That's that's what I do best.

Speaker 7 (01:19):
But I don't man.

Speaker 3 (01:21):
By the way, I also good Doug said he was
dusting off the jersey.

Speaker 6 (01:27):
You took that a little personally, I know, marshawn I did.
It was old, bro old.

Speaker 5 (01:33):
You know what I figured out I was old when
my brother sent me a congratulations this morning for for
the Hall of Fame thing, and I just realized, like,
you know, he's still playing this somebody who I was
coaching up since damn since he was ship, since he
came out the wound. And to hear him, to hear

(01:55):
him say that, it was just like, oh you you
kind of up there, my boy.

Speaker 3 (02:01):
By the way, guys, do you know this literally no
bs just today on my desk is a big brick.

Speaker 6 (02:06):
I'm like, what the hell is this brick?

Speaker 3 (02:08):
And a bunch of folks had signed it, some of
the guards and some of those incarcerated folks in Quentin.
They just tore down that wall. Talk about tear down
the wall that was built in eighteen sixty. Remember you
saw that temporary fence in Quenton. They literally just bulldozed
that damn thing down and there was a brick sitting
on my desk again.

Speaker 6 (02:29):
But talk about bringing people.

Speaker 5 (02:31):
Gavin, you can't be using that shit like is you
don't fucking goddamn amusement.

Speaker 1 (02:35):
Park Man, you getting, You're getting souvenir bricks and shit.

Speaker 6 (02:38):
No, you in this. It's not my damn amusement.

Speaker 3 (02:42):
I know you all greeks of damn Amusic. Why is
he so happy in prison? I'm trying to stay out
of prison. No, man, the brick, but the brick it
represents what you're just saying. It was signed by some
of the guards, called some of the inmates, and they
sent it to me man, because it's about people coming
together speaking of that day. And just before we bring
up Pete, I'm serious, Marshaan, this has got to be

(03:04):
interesting you and Pete Carroll. Have you guys had a
lot of conversations over the course of the last couple of years.

Speaker 6 (03:10):
I mean, how many times you guys engaged?

Speaker 5 (03:12):
Yeah, you gotta remember I went back and uh and
played for another season. You played, I know, I'll call
it a season if I played a game. It's a season.
I don't know if I.

Speaker 4 (03:23):
Get you played three games?

Speaker 7 (03:25):
It was four?

Speaker 1 (03:27):
I think?

Speaker 4 (03:27):
Was it for no? It was the last.

Speaker 2 (03:29):
It was the last game against the Niners, and then
the playoff game and then green.

Speaker 5 (03:31):
Bay green Bay. Shit, the playoffs was involved, so shit,
it felt like a season.

Speaker 6 (03:37):
By the way, the only thing I remember about that, Doug,
you remember it well too.

Speaker 3 (03:40):
It is like beas Quake two point zero, when you
came out and leadies have gone to introduced the rest
of the team, and then it was finally your turn.
Music up, We're on the field. Next letter, Doug was like,
Doug was like a kid.

Speaker 4 (03:53):
It's like, get ready, man.

Speaker 6 (03:54):
Doug was so nervous, like it's about to happen.

Speaker 3 (03:57):
And it was like, I mean, and I never span
a lot. In fact, I don't think I've ever been
to that stadium in person. And Doug was like, man,
it gets loud in here.

Speaker 4 (04:06):
I'm like, damn, that's the beauty of that game. Guy.
That was the only game where Shawn didn't yell at
me after the game.

Speaker 5 (04:11):
Shut the fuck up. You know what, hey, bro, you
know what you are? Prankster, my dude? You know what
they call you. The younger kids in today's time right now,
they would call you a troll.

Speaker 6 (04:23):
You know, it was very cool.

Speaker 3 (04:25):
I met Pete Carroll five or six times, but just hello,
goodbye in passing Doug. Remember before the game, Pete came
all the way to the other side to meet with
us and spend time with us. And I'm like, this
guy is just a little different. I mean, you know,
we can talk about that, but just as a personal
guy for him to take that time to come over
and uh, and obviously we're bsing about Marshawn behind Marshawn's

(04:47):
back as we.

Speaker 6 (04:49):
Are right now.

Speaker 1 (04:50):
But oh ship see look that's y'all. That's y'all.

Speaker 5 (04:53):
Uh, that's y'all Marine connection, cause you ain't y'all y'all
from the same hood.

Speaker 6 (04:58):
Yeah, San Francisco in connection.

Speaker 1 (05:01):
Oh my bad.

Speaker 6 (05:01):
That's how we rolled Redwood High School. Bro, my high school.

Speaker 3 (05:06):
That's why, that's why Pete has been so successful in
his life.

Speaker 1 (05:10):
Oh he got that bad. It's oh, it's in you,
not on y'all.

Speaker 6 (05:14):
Hunt. That's what it's about. Those public school kids.

Speaker 5 (05:18):
I'm gonna tell you this. I was in Seattle for
what maybe eight nine years and I'm talking about every
single day. This motherfucker. Pete would come in with the
same energy when lose draw rain sleep snow. I don't

(05:43):
give a fuck what it was. He came in every
day the same exact person, regardless, and that shit used
to drive me fucking crazy.

Speaker 1 (05:56):
I used to ask. I used to ask that motherfucker
all the time, Hey, what kind of drugs did you
want on? Bro?

Speaker 5 (06:01):
Because I need some of that ship. Because the way
you come in and in this negrit it was never
never negative, never negative, never negative until he pulled yell
ass in that room and then he started gassing.

Speaker 1 (06:14):
Now we've got to throw these hands, but it was never.
He was never. You couldn't catch this dude in a
bad mood.

Speaker 4 (06:22):
Everlse, we bring him in, Marshawn.

Speaker 6 (06:23):
Let's bring him in. Let's bring in mister positivity himself.

Speaker 1 (06:27):
It's positive.

Speaker 6 (06:28):
Yeah, Hockey Carrollton.

Speaker 2 (06:41):
Marshaun, and Gavin, we have an incredible episode of politics
today straight from Marin County.

Speaker 4 (06:49):
High School College Marin.

Speaker 2 (06:52):
That's one of only three coaches Gavin to win a
national championship, two of them and a Super Bowl former
head coach the Jets, the Patriots, and of course, the
Seattle Seahawks coach thirteen years with Seattle eligible for the
Hall of Fame this year, the legendary Pete Carroll thanks
for joining his peach.

Speaker 7 (07:11):
What's up, Doug. We got a lot of bearer going
on right now.

Speaker 6 (07:15):
But by the way, which one of you two? I'm
curious which one of you two again in the Hall
of Fame? First? Mark Shawn or coach.

Speaker 7 (07:22):
I heard him just say that his favorite color was gold,
so maybe he might.

Speaker 1 (07:25):
Be Oh you remember that, huh?

Speaker 7 (07:28):
I heard that? Yeah, by the.

Speaker 3 (07:29):
Way, coach, I don't know if you heard. I mean,
Marshawn just going completely crazy about all your positivity. You know,
it doesn't matter what happened every damn day in every way,
you're all bringing that positivity.

Speaker 7 (07:41):
It said.

Speaker 6 (07:42):
It drove Marshawn completely crazy.

Speaker 7 (07:45):
I know, yeah, I know he could stand it. I
left get him up in the corner of the room.
I sat the way back, you know, kind of making
a little statement, last guy in the room and all
that kind of stuff. And I know it just pissed
him off because he thought I was trying to make
him have fun and be positive too. I didn't care
about him. He was it's fun guys.

Speaker 2 (08:03):
Hey, coach, Well, before we begin, Coach, did you ever
think in a million years you would be doing a
podcast with more shaan?

Speaker 7 (08:09):
Uh? You know, I thought I thought he may be
following me around here, I'm following him around.

Speaker 5 (08:13):
I'm not quite sure I was wrong, right, Man, Nah,
I've been told you a long time ago, man enview. Man,
I do not understand y'all. I don't think y'all get it. Like, well,
it'll be probably like on a you know, a Thursday.
We got practice on Friday morning, and I'll be litt

(08:34):
as fuck. I'm talking about I'm littus fuck. I'm coming
too the facility like shit, maybe Fox Fox thirty because
I ain't gonna be late, and I'll just go into
the locker room and go to sleep in one of
the little big reclined chairs or something and a light
clockwork around five five thirty or something. Here come Pete

(08:55):
walking in that goddamn room with that the same energy
he just left it last day, bouncing around.

Speaker 1 (09:00):
Shit.

Speaker 5 (09:01):
Hey, hey, I'm going joint hell a bubble gum ship
and I'm like, how the fuck is you?

Speaker 1 (09:06):
Brit You ain't even brush your teeth yet?

Speaker 5 (09:08):
You happy than the motherfucker, Like, God damn, how you
do that?

Speaker 1 (09:14):
Bro? You know what, I'm about to go back to
sleep for a minute.

Speaker 7 (09:18):
It's all about attitude. You got a good under your
don't and that doesn't ever has to be the same
obviously obviously, but uh but there's a lot of guys
that they kind of used it a little bit. You know,
I was their attitude, So that's that's okay.

Speaker 4 (09:33):
Coach. Did you have that your whole life grown up?

Speaker 2 (09:34):
Because obviously as everything ever since I you know, knew
you back in the day when you were coaching the Jets,
did you have that grown up as a kid?

Speaker 4 (09:40):
Steam are in?

Speaker 2 (09:41):
Were you always that guy that was upbeat energy and
and bringing everything together and attitude and that kind of stuff?

Speaker 7 (09:46):
My mom my mom taught me that some goods just
about to happen. And I've never never lost sight of that,
and uh, you know, and somehow they empowered me to
you get to do what you want to do and
have the attitude want to have. But it was always
about something just just around the corner was going to turn.
So why would you be thinking glumming down and out?
And you know, because he was going to get good.

(10:08):
And so I've been like that my whole life, I'm sure, coach.

Speaker 6 (10:12):
I'm still trying to recover from Marshawn say. And he
came in lit uh.

Speaker 3 (10:17):
I mean, I'm trying to translate that exactly, you know,
like lit up or you know, was something else.

Speaker 1 (10:26):
I was lit up, like I'll tell you that lit
up like a Christmas tree.

Speaker 7 (10:32):
The point was to me, you know, my guys were
all different and uh, and I want to give him
space to be what they needed to be he needed
to be and make his statement of what he was
all about it and I loved it. I mean I
told him just recently that it was so important for
me to get him to come to our team because
I wanted him to affect everybody on the team. And
I didn't care about him affecting it the way I

(10:53):
want him to affect it. I want him affect the
way he was gonna affect it. And I just figured
we'd work it out, you know, and we would figure
out a way to make it all fit and and uh,
you know, and we did and he and hes still
pissed because he he didn't figure out I didn't care
that he was like you, I loved that he was
like he was, and I thought the more he was,
the better it was for us. And and uh and
I could put up with him. I was okay, you know.

(11:14):
And if you heard him say he wasn't gonna get fined,
he knew. He knew that where that line was drawn,
it was about the cash, and he was not going
to give up his money. So he stayed close enough
to it so it worked out just fine.

Speaker 4 (11:24):
Hey, coach, take me through.

Speaker 2 (11:26):
You know, I think it was your second year there,
right when when I was talking to you and John
about trading for Marshawn when stuff is going on the
first year.

Speaker 4 (11:34):
Was that your one?

Speaker 2 (11:34):
Yeah, your one, and and and and you know, we're
talking about the trade and at the time the packers
want him and you guys want him, and we're going.

Speaker 4 (11:41):
Back and forth.

Speaker 2 (11:42):
Take me through how that that trade changed kind of
the the tenor and the identity of Seattle and and
and and and really put you guys on the map
as far as what you built there.

Speaker 4 (11:52):
Correct.

Speaker 7 (11:53):
Yeah, well, really this is how this worked. I wanted.
I knew that I had missed Marshawn and recruiting and
uh uh, we had a whole plenty of guys, but
I missed him, and then we played against him, and
I knew who he was and knew about all this stuff.
I knew a lot better after the recruiting than than before.
And so I already had this this, you know, kind
of notion of what he would be like. And he's

(12:14):
up there in Buffalo and he's kind of in trouble
and he's kind of pissing him on and the working out.

Speaker 4 (12:20):
Yeah and uh.

Speaker 7 (12:23):
Yeah, So so we tried to trade him for if
you remember Doug, it was for months. It really took
us three months to get them to say that they
would trade him to us. I don't know what else.
They don't know what the packers or nothing else. But uh,
you know, we kicked in a couple another five or
something for me, and they were they were hard on us.
They didn't they didn't want to trade him, but they
knew that they kind of needed to, And to me,

(12:43):
I was trying to get it. It was so important. There
was nobody I never pursued anybody like that. It was
so important because I wanted his attitude and his his
makeup on our team because we were down and out
club at the time. You know, we han't done anything
in the last years before I got there, and it
was time to see if we could turn it. And
he was such a big personality, uh that I thought

(13:04):
we could really build around and and you know, I
don't think many people thought of marshall the way back
in the day. I don't know, I don't know. Maybe
maybe there was others.

Speaker 5 (13:12):
I don't think no, because you guys, remember at that
point in time, motherfuckers had counted me out. A lot
of motherfuckers had counted me out. So that's one of
them situations where you get in the position and you say, like,
you know what I mean, somebody else see something in you
that you don't see in yourself.

Speaker 1 (13:28):
Now, not that I was.

Speaker 5 (13:29):
Involved or you know, I mean I let you know
all the outside uh you know, consume my my thoughts
or my personality or whatever, but I mean, you know,
at that point, considering in Buffalo, you know, I'm not playing.
Uh you know, I'm i'm i'm i'm I'm coming off
the bench, or I'm I'm suited and I'm not playing,
or I'm just saying regular street clothes on the sideline.

(13:51):
So and go from from being on the on the
on the sideline and street clothes. You know what I
mean to the beast quake, you know, I mean that
that's a that's a yeah, I mean, that's that's some
some belief in a motherfucker though, you know what I'm
talking about.

Speaker 7 (14:05):
No, I definitely had conviction for you now, And I
can't even tell you why it was. It was so
obvious to me because nobody else saw John, and the
guys in the building didn't didn't see it the same way.
But that's why I kept fighting for it, you know.
And and finally it just, you know, I bugged him enough,
I say, let's call him again. You know, there's really
I went down to that office a number of times
and he had to call again because I was making

(14:25):
them call again. And and finally something happened, you know.
And uh, it's just it was, you know, I took
a shot that you might be able to bounce back
in a big way, you know, because it wasn't working out,
and I knew I could help you work it out,
you know. I knew we could fit it together so
that would make sense and not I can't tell you
I knew how crazy it was going to be. But

(14:46):
but the rest of history is history, you know. And
and so really it was really the most important move
that we made in making the statement of the kind
of team we wanted to be and the kind of
personalities we wanted to jump around and play with. And uh,
and it really was. It was huge.

Speaker 6 (15:05):
Coach.

Speaker 3 (15:05):
It's interesting, I mean, you you were talking about, you know,
just letting players be there themselves and personalities take shape.

Speaker 6 (15:11):
Of course you're You're not only.

Speaker 3 (15:12):
It sounds like with Marshaun you weren't just looking for
the athletic talent. You're also looking for the attitude. You're
looking for someone that can express themself at another level.
Is that something I mean, you spending all those years
and you know, usc working your way up obviously multiple
teams and then Seattle. Was that something that came to
you instinctly as a coach early on or you developed

(15:33):
that over time and then found that, you know, specific
at this time with these personalities that that can really
gel and express.

Speaker 7 (15:40):
Interestingly, the first year I was coaching the dB is
back at the University of Specific and a million years
before I got in trouble for having a meeting one
time with the players and asking what they needed to
work on. And we had a great meeting. Everybody had
ideas and suggestions, you know, and these we were lousy,
fucked is the team, you know. But but we had
a great meeting and I can't run them back from
the meet the night meeting during camp, and ran into

(16:03):
the head coach, Chester katz And and told he coached,
I just had the best meeting. I can't believe how
I energized it was. These guys were so fired up,
and I asked, you know, I asked them of the
guys and what they needed to work on. And he
stopped me, cut me and said, don't you ever know,
in this big southern Kentucky draw, don't you ever you
know they ask the players what they want, you tell
them you're the coach. I said, okay, So so I
you know, I was. I was crushed because I thought

(16:24):
I'd really done something good. And by the time I
got to the next day, I was doing everything that
we said we were gonna do. The coach you know,
so and it worked out great and he never knew
it and all that, But the point was that I
never knew. The point was that that connecting with people,
uh and and going to where they where they feel

(16:46):
good about themselves is a place of destination. Man, that
they can make a difference. And and whether it's one guy,
it's it's you know, many people, a whole football team,
a whole group of people. Uh, when you when they
feel your commitment to them and they know that you
care about what they're doing, and you know that. I've
always been that way, It's what I'm saying. I was
all the way back to my second year in coaching,

(17:07):
you know. So, Uh, it's always been part of it
and the part that always gets lost. And I can
even tell right now, Gavin, you're thinking, Okay, this is
Lucy Goosey and here's all these guys running all different directions.
And you can't play football like that. You've got to
have discipline. You've got to have a consistency to it.
You've got to have you know, rules and guidelines and
things to keep people in order. But that doesn't mean

(17:30):
that you can't recognize the extraordinary uniqueness of the individuals.
And when you do, and and and then you open
up to that and you receive them there like Marshaun
was a recipient. He fought me anyway. I was the
best guy you could ever possibly be with he bought
me anyway, you know, just because he was so contrary.
But that was great, that was him and it can work,

(17:50):
you know, No, it's not. Most people don't do it
that way now because it's it's harder, it's more difficult
because you're dealing with the individual the changes, the uniqueness
of the personalities, and you know, and they can mix it.
I mean, Sean can tell you we had troubles with
some guys in our club and you know, throughout and
but we were able to find the way to keep
them connected U for the purpose being a great team.

(18:12):
And they did it and we showed that we could
do that.

Speaker 5 (18:15):
So I want to ask you something like with with
with all of that being said, though, right and if
I if I remember correctly, you have a you have
a degree in uh psychology right.

Speaker 7 (18:27):
Well it's sports psychology.

Speaker 1 (18:29):
Yeah, So how how.

Speaker 5 (18:31):
How much of that do you think played a role?
And you know, your philosophy, your philosophy and football and
your development of teams and players because you know, I
mean when I first had got there, I think it
was a like a crazy fucking number of like two

(18:51):
hundred and like seventy plus players that you hadn't brought
you know what I mean, in and out of the uh,
out of the facility, out of the facility to create
the exact team that you that you wanted.

Speaker 1 (19:06):
Right, So how much how much do you think.

Speaker 5 (19:08):
Your your your background and uh what what you got
a degree in sports psychology?

Speaker 7 (19:14):
Well it was it was in uh in physical education
with amptasist and sports psychology. Yeah, I had a ton
of stuff that I did in those days. I'm glad
you asked the question because I really was affected by
stuff I learned right then there, and I was able
to because of being so close to the Bay area.
There was a couple of great guys that were that
had written stuff on their own, done their own stuff.

(19:36):
The guy Tim Galway wrote the inter Game of Tennis,
and Michael Murphy was the guy who wrote about golf
and he did some amazing things in his own studies.
He was the guy that had started Ethelyn the Institute
down on the coast. Uh. Those two guys in particular,
not only did we get to read their books, but
we got to we had to meet them and be
with them and hang out with them, and and and

(19:57):
and developed the friendship relationship with them and I so much.
I was affected so much by the way they thought
and the way that they presented their stuff. And they
were totally different, they were the same. But both those
guys still to this very day, I still preach right
from the Gospel of what those guys believed in. And
they were really something about about performance and about they

(20:17):
both were highly influenced by Eastern philosophy and their young
days when when they went and did their you know,
their mission over in India and wherever they went, Uh,
they came back and they had a slant to it
that made sense to me that I've never lost contact with.
And it's really about helping people perform, uh totally in
trusting themselves and totally in command of their moments and

(20:38):
their times, and and creating the moments and the mindfulness
that it takes to really be at your best. And
so throughout all. I mean, I've never talked about those guys.
I would never mention those those guys to you as
a team. But I was working from that mentality of
helping people get to the very best of what they
had to offer. And that's why it is why it

(20:58):
was so important to to champion the individuals and to
find the place where each player could be at his
best and what he needed to be at his best.
That's why I could have Marshan, and they could have Richard,
and they could have Doug Baldwin and all the cam
and all the different guys that were the personalities. They
were all able to find their own space and be
comfortable with it. But yet I was I was there

(21:20):
and kick their asks to make them great at what
what they were capable of doing too, and so all
of that blended together, Sean. So yeah, it goes way
back and that was it never left me and I
wrote about it in the book I did you know
ten years or fifteen years ago, whatever it was, All
that stuff was all part of my makeup that I
never lost. And it was really the cool part about it.
And Marshaan was one of the best at He just

(21:41):
needed to be in his own space. He didn't want
anybody to fuck with him in any way. He didn't
want anybody to, you know, try to get him this
way or get him that way. Just leave me alone.
And if you watched him after you make touchdowns, you
know he wouldn't celebrate, you know, other than grabbing his
nuts on the big run.

Speaker 6 (21:54):
Talk about that.

Speaker 4 (22:06):
You probably need a PhD.

Speaker 2 (22:07):
You know, after the Super Bowl loss with the player,
I mean that was take me through that time after
the game, because obviously, I mean that wasn't just one day,
one week that was that was months and months, and
I mean, take me through your mindset after that game
with how do you? I mean I had to be
Take me through your mindset. That'd be very very tough.
I can't even imagine being in your shoes.

Speaker 1 (22:27):
Yeah, because motherfucker tried to whoop your ass.

Speaker 7 (22:31):
Let me back you up a bit. If you remember
when I was at st we played Texas and we
were in the Rose Bowl and we get down like
seventeen seconds left or something like that, fourth and seven,
nineteen seconds left, fourth and seven from the seven yard line.
If we don't want that, if we just stopped the
dude right there, we don't won the third straight national
championship that I ain't been done before. And we were
right at the precipice of doing everything. We had won

(22:53):
every game for years up until that at that point
right there, and bang, you know, he scrambles. They the
running back screwed up the protection. We send double b
and he releases instead of blocks the backer like he's
supposed to. So we lose across the record and contain
it's all the football stuff, but and the guy scrambled
in the end zone, and so we go in the
locker room. You know, minutes later, I'm talking to this team.

(23:15):
We were on the verge of, you know, something absolutely historic.
And and what I my thought was that those seventeen
seconds or nineteen second one going to find us we
were what we were. And I carried that thought to
the moment that that stupid fricking play happened in that
game where they get to pick and to change the
whole game. And the instant that I bent down to

(23:37):
think about, I knew it was gonna you know, there,
I would have to be ready for moments like this,
and these years of coaching is this is that moment,
and you're gonna have to be a stud and I
was gonna have to, you know, handle it, and because
I was going to stand up for everybody and they're
all gonna be pissed just like you were. The whole world.
And Marshaw and I have talked about this in the past.
You know, that was a meaningful moment and we lost

(24:00):
all that that would have been two in a row.
We might have come back one three in a row,
is way I feel about it. But uh, And so anyway,
it was huge, and it was but you had to
deal with it, and you had to deal with it,
and I had to be the leader and I had
to stand up for it and take the hit and
just you know, okay, you know, take as my call
and the whole thing. And I was willing to do
that for everybody else. And I mean he was pissed

(24:21):
at me, and the fellows were pissed at me.

Speaker 5 (24:23):
Everything was you know, with with with that band said,
a lot of players from that team don't feel that,
you know, I mean, considering your philosophy and what you
stood for and what you got a lot of those
guys to believe in, they don't feel that, you know.
I mean you you you owned it from a perspective
of which they would have liked you to own it.

(24:46):
Because then it started to get rough over there, well,
it started to get rough for it got really rough
for us though, to a point where it was like, yeah,
I mean, and and the way I the way I
think about it is like, uh, considering and like everybody, Oh,
you should have just ran the ball with Marshan.

Speaker 1 (25:02):
You know this, that and the third.

Speaker 5 (25:04):
But you know, considering you know and the type of
player I am, and you know, ship from what you
just said to you know, any teammate of mine, I'll
tell you like no, Marshan for show is a is
a team player in which you know what I mean.
At the end of the day, I know a lot
of a lot of guys took that ship a lot

(25:24):
harder even than I did, because of because of what
you instilled and you know, I mean that Seahawk team.
So when I start thinking about it and I think
about your mindset and you know, the psychology of you know,
of people, but then you know, putting it into a
term of ball players and then having this moment of

(25:49):
of I'm gonna say, for us was like, uh was
failure and then not for it to be you know,
I mean something that a fa us personally because you know,
I mean we felt like we was on that type
of time and then a lot of them felt like,
you know, we were stripped of it.

Speaker 7 (26:10):
Yeah, I know I felt the same way. There's no
there's nobody is better compared than I am about the
whole thing I was trying to I would have done
anything in my power to change the moment, but the
moment just happened so quickly. It was gone. It was
gone before it even happened, And I wish I would
have been able to affect it differently, but I didn't.
I couldn't. You know. It had nothing to do with
all of the storylines. Marshaan and I talked about it. It

(26:31):
had nothing to do with all the storylines about some
other players or some other agenda. There was not That's
not how the game works. It happened so fast they
substitute we do this bump calls made. It just happened,
and we got smacked in the freaking nuts by it.
But you know, it's interesting, you guys got us on
this this talk together because nobody had to deal with
this more than Marshan and myself. I mean, nobody had

(26:52):
to ever deal with that. And we carried our whole
life and it's just something that it's affected us both
in different ways and all that. But but hey, it
met us part of our life, and that's that's what
we had to deal with it. We had to get
on and we have and uh, he's kicking ass and
I'm retired.

Speaker 2 (27:10):
Because as a non football guy, I don't know that.
I don't think i'd asked for Sean. Was it was
the call from BEVL or was you made the call?
Or how how did that?

Speaker 4 (27:18):
Well? Who made the call?

Speaker 7 (27:20):
We did the way we always did, Okay, it was
There's there's defensive coordinators, offensive coordinators. They call this stuff.
We play the game, and I'm responsible for every call
that was ever made, that's all, Doug.

Speaker 5 (27:31):
If you didn't catch that, Bevil made the motherfucking call
and Pete didn't get to it quick enough to get
out of that motherfucker, that's how that.

Speaker 1 (27:40):
That's how what he just told you in a nutshell
you know what I'm talking about.

Speaker 5 (27:44):
But I mean, look, with with that being said, like
you know, I mean because me and you we had
a conversation when we talked, uh yesterday and uh, I
was just talking about how, you know, how it affected
my life and you know after that moment, you know,
I was telling you like I was having a conversation

(28:04):
with some ex players and you know, like.

Speaker 1 (28:06):
Oh, you know, if you get that uh, if they give.

Speaker 5 (28:09):
You the ball again, you go in and you score,
you get the MVP of the super Bowl, and you know,
I mean it, it is what it is. And I
was like the fact that that didn't happen. It's almost
to the point where it was like, you know, like
that one guy in a movie that everybody rooting for
that just quite he just don't make it. And now

(28:31):
I'm living a life of that guy. But I'm actually
here to experience what it would be for an individual
to you know what I mean, live life after you know,
I mean all that, uh, after that, after that downfall,
and I mean, you know, and in reality has been
you know, I mean uh, I mean by the graces

(28:53):
of God is like you mean, uh, he.

Speaker 1 (28:55):
Blessed you in so many ways.

Speaker 5 (28:57):
And it's more so like by me not you know
what I mean, getting that ball or us not running
that ball in uh. I feel like it made a
stain on the world to where, no matter what the
situation is, that particular play is always gonna be talked about.
And the fact of the matter is like you know,
Tom Brady winn uh, I mean, win another Super Bowl,

(29:19):
Malcolm Butler going, you know, become the MVP of the game,
you know what I mean, But no matter what you
talk about that Super Bowl. It always just come down
to the fact like, oh they didn't didn't give oh
boy the ball.

Speaker 1 (29:34):
Marshing the ball and they lost, Like oh my god.

Speaker 5 (29:37):
Like that shit turned my life in a way that
I could never imagine because I asked those guys the
same guy, I say, well, who want to who won
the Super Bowl MVP the year before? And they're like, oh,
Russell Wilson want to, Like, Nah, Russell Wilson didn't win it.
Oh Percy Harvin, Percy Grvin got no, Percy Harvin didn't.
And it's like Malcolm Smith did. Oh yeah, I was

(30:01):
gonna say, Malcolm, Yeah, I mean you add who didn't
who didn't win the Super Bowl? And the next year
and that oh Marshan they should have gaven him. And
it's like, you know, I mean that, Doug, you like
to use it post the rise. It it boasted my
life and my career to a level of you know,
I mean some that I could not have, you know,

(30:23):
I mean understood or even imagine that my life could be.

Speaker 7 (30:27):
Yeah, it's an amazing it's an amazing perception that you
have of that, and and you're it's the truth. You're
just talking the truth. That's what That's what happened. It's
good that something good came from it, you know what
I mean, that's all that you know that sounds like
me does something good came out of that the crap
that we had to go through and live with, and
you know, they ain't going away. And that's I knew
in that moment, it ain't going away that we're gonna

(30:48):
have this forever. It's a statement about how regardless of
what happens in your life you we still have the
ability to make of it which we what we want.
And it's no matter how dark it as horrible a
situation or the hugest mistake you could ever have made, whatever,
it's still there's there's a life to follow it. And
if you if you, if you hang in there and

(31:09):
you keep battling. I mean, that's just the basical story
of it. But both of us men. Wherever I go
now as a retired guy, people freaking boring to get
over me, to get to me, to get into a picture,
an autograph or whatever. They don't talk about the super Bowl,
you know, they don't mention that they're there.

Speaker 1 (31:26):
I don't know.

Speaker 7 (31:27):
I just I get so much love that I couldn't
ask for more. I'm shocked by it and I had
no idea.

Speaker 1 (31:44):
It's the exact opposite for me. So in a sense,
it really showed me like how.

Speaker 5 (31:50):
Much you know, I mean, the the world and people
really you know, I mean, fuck with me from a
respect level, and I really like I to me, I
can I appreciate that shit to the max, like you
know what I mean, because before that, like you know
what I mean, considering like when I first got there
and motherfuckers had counted me out, you know what I mean,

(32:11):
all he washed up, he done, you know what I mean,
stick a fork in.

Speaker 1 (32:14):
He it's over with He a thug, he is, he'd
a blah blah blah.

Speaker 5 (32:19):
But then to see on the out, on my way
out and the realities to that shit is like, nah,
people really fuck with me on some like nah, we
really fuck with you, shine, Like we really wish we
would have been able to see you do that. And
since you know we wasn't able to, like even though
it didn't happen, we feel that it did, and we

(32:40):
gonna show you the love and the respect as if
it did happen, So you know what I mean, Like
I said, I really fucked with the people for really
fucking with me on some you know what I mean,
on some real like to me, cause that's some real shit,
like if you get me four opportunities down there for
show just my stubborn like Tom Hell is stubborn like
you ain't Finna just not allowed me to get up

(33:00):
in this motherfucker.

Speaker 1 (33:01):
Now, at the end of the day, shit happened, you
know what I mean.

Speaker 5 (33:03):
I done fumbled, you know what I mean, done, got
tackled for a loss, all the type of ship that happened.
But if you look at the situation and see how
many times I go forward then I went backwards. We
gonna take that. We don't. We don't take that opportunity.
We gonna give you that chance. So I mean, you know,

(33:24):
as much as I could look at would happened, Look
as much as I could look at and be upset this,
that and the third. You know what I mean, My my, my,
my biggest thing is whenever somebody say that to me.
And I'm pretty sure like anytime I step outside on
a day to day base, like at least once somebody

(33:44):
you know, mention that to me. Uh you know about
you know about that play, and it's just get to
the point where it's like, uh, you say, what's that
big dog?

Speaker 7 (33:55):
No, No, just tell us it's your life, you know what,
It's gonna keep coming this that's not gonna change. And
it's it's love. Really, they're showing you the love and
they they feel for you, you.

Speaker 1 (34:06):
Know, yeah, man, so I respect that.

Speaker 5 (34:08):
So just know that if you come up to me
and you you say something though I'm not the most
you know, I mean receiving or you know, outspoken.

Speaker 1 (34:17):
Or ye know what I mean?

Speaker 5 (34:19):
Uh, what do you call approachable or friendly or whatever?
But just know that I really do appreciate that ship
and I do have a lot of love and respect.
And the love is is bulletproof, you know what I
mean when you show me love and respect on a
sense that you can appreciate you know, I mean the
body of work that I put in.

Speaker 1 (34:38):
So I just want to tell everybody I appreciate you
for that.

Speaker 3 (34:41):
My Hey, Doug, the only two. It sounds like Coach
and Marshawn have moved on and different different and they've
translated this differently. Of course you and I haven't. We're
still raw about this damn thing. But that's a different conversation.
By the way, I feel like I'm listening to the.

Speaker 6 (34:58):
Stoics this is.

Speaker 3 (35:00):
Like Marcus aurelia is talking about the obstacles the way.
It's not what happens to you is what we do
with what happens that determine our faith in future. But
I love this notion that you guys have translated it
in different ways but ultimately recognizing, uh, that these are
moments in our life. And at the same time, you know,
let's be honest, we've all had those moments. I think
about political terms, you know, what about the emails, and

(35:22):
it is something that that ultimately you can't.

Speaker 6 (35:25):
Completely dismiss and coach.

Speaker 3 (35:27):
I imagine, you know, despite the fact that you know
it's got a still you know, it's hard to hard
to fully recover.

Speaker 6 (35:35):
From those decisions.

Speaker 3 (35:36):
But I love that you had this experience before. So
you you are you exaggerating when you say when you
were leaning over that you literally had that memory of
of that that rose ball game in your mind literally
going through in real time.

Speaker 7 (35:51):
It was it was the moment of realization that I'm
this is this is the job I got, this is
what I'm gonna have to deal with and I'm gonna
have to deal with this now on and so and
I thought before I even raised back up, the thought was,
I want to do it and be the epitome of
of how you can handle stuff like this and put
it in the right spot. But meanwhile it's gonna be

(36:13):
just hell. And that's it's been. It's been like that,
you know, if you're you compete like we do. Yeah,
I don't ever get there's I don't ever get over
that stuff. I don't put it away. I don't get
over it at all. I carry it right to this
very moment. I would do anything to change that that moment,
but I don't get to, you know, so I gotta deal
with it. So I'm gonna deal with it.

Speaker 5 (36:31):
I got I got a way you could get over
you in the phone booth for thirty seconds and we
just go straight all body shots and just I mean.

Speaker 6 (36:41):
This was going so well.

Speaker 5 (36:43):
Man, it was for a minute, like, man, I wanted
to put so many hands and feet on you. But
you know what, because I respect my elders and I
know you like ninety four right.

Speaker 1 (36:56):
So man, you know I can't go out, you know
what I mean?

Speaker 2 (36:58):
He coach but I when I shake coach, and I'll
you know the story, Gavin. But you know, after the game,
you know, Pete was incredible because he recognized that, you know,
we're going through some contract talks. And remember, Coach, you
immediately say, hey, listen, we gotta we got to get
him done. And normally, timing wise, this would be probably
some point and uh, you know, the summer, and you
recognize it was important to kind of get him redone

(37:20):
and you engage with Paul Allen and we got together,
remember in your office for Paul's office, and we got
him done, you know, probably a month after Super Bowl,
which was I think was an important part.

Speaker 4 (37:30):
And you led that charge, Coach. I appreciate that.

Speaker 7 (37:33):
Well. Remember we went back to the playoffs the next
year too, you know, we made it through that the
garbage of it all. And and like Marshawn and I
both agree, if if we'd have won that game, we
probably would have won the next game too. I think
we would have. It would have been totally obviously a
different thing circumstances.

Speaker 1 (37:49):
The league agree with They Yeah.

Speaker 7 (37:50):
Yeah, I mean, I mean, well I think all of
us knew that. You know, there was just that time
that we could have captured. But anyway, so that yeah,
those were just the gestures, you know, showing the faith
and the love that Marshawn can't do anything. Matter of fact,
let me tell you one more story. The uh when
Marshawn comes back, it comes back to us after being
out on about for a couple of years. The first thing,

(38:12):
he comes walking down the hall to my office and
he and he starts apologizing, whatever you were doing, you
felt bad about. Whatever, you have to No, no, no, no,
you don't have to say nothing. You don't have to
say a word. I know, I know where your heart is,
I know where I know where we are. I got
no problem, and I'm not gonna not love you no
matter what happens. It doesn't no matter what was said
or what's done. I know when in the long run

(38:34):
of it all, we're all going to be connected back
together again. And so and and it was. It was
such a cool gesture that you wanted to, you know,
try to clear the air or whatever. But you didn't
need need to. I didn't need it. I didn't need
to hear that. I knew.

Speaker 5 (38:46):
Yeah, because I think before that time, I think I
was on some ship, like hey, if I see you brow,
I'm gonna beat this ship out of you.

Speaker 7 (38:52):
Know you aren't.

Speaker 4 (38:53):
You know you aren't.

Speaker 7 (38:54):
You may say you are. You gotta realize I ain't
going down now. You're not gonna knock me down.

Speaker 5 (39:00):
So when I'm coming in the office and I'm coming
for a job, like hey, I don't want like you know,
if I know he thinks I'm gonna come and swing
on him, he probably gonna be a little like.

Speaker 7 (39:10):
This jo.

Speaker 1 (39:12):
Like I told you got that stewe Joel right.

Speaker 6 (39:14):
Now, Boin by the way, by the way, coach, I
don't know if you know this.

Speaker 3 (39:18):
I'm responsible for getting Marshawn to the hotel right after
the game.

Speaker 6 (39:23):
And he was completely docile, completely calm, sitting in the
front seat, turned on the music, had a drink I
don't know what the hell with, some whiskey or something.

Speaker 1 (39:33):
Nah, that was some pure white Hennessy.

Speaker 6 (39:35):
Whatever the hell it was.

Speaker 3 (39:36):
And he had a window my blunt and you guys
weren't it I don't even know if you were off
the damn field. And he's he's he calmly says, let's
get the hell out of here, batman. So we're driving
through when the parking lot. People are just starting a
couple of people leaving the game. Most people weren't even
leaving the game. And he's just casually, calmly listening to music.
I'm sitting there back back of the car with Doug going. Man,

(39:56):
Marshawn is taking us very responsibly and respectfully. Appreciate his maturity.
And now I'm here, and he wanted to beat the
shit out of you, and he was gonna come get
your ass.

Speaker 6 (40:06):
Fine in a fun I mean this, you shattered everything.
Marshaan shattered it.

Speaker 7 (40:10):
Oh.

Speaker 1 (40:10):
Man would look I mean, you know.

Speaker 7 (40:12):
He always stretched a little bit now, Jesus Christ.

Speaker 3 (40:14):
Oh he wasn't shocked though, Coach, he was flat out
in shock because we got out of the car and
shit out of me.

Speaker 6 (40:21):
I'm like, I'm just the driver, bro, I'm the other
guy got you.

Speaker 4 (40:25):
Home because somebody asked the question.

Speaker 2 (40:26):
And as as thirty years of an agent, those six
seven eight years in Seattle, it was like it was iconic.

Speaker 4 (40:32):
It was rock star status.

Speaker 2 (40:34):
The town was crazy, I mean everything about it, and
you were blessed, Coach, to have two teams like that.

Speaker 4 (40:39):
USC for those years was the same way.

Speaker 2 (40:43):
I mean, how do you compare the two, because literally,
I don't know if another coach had both sides like
you did, other than you know, Bearry Switzer at Oklahoma
and the Cowboys obviously.

Speaker 4 (40:52):
But and maybe Jimmy Johnson Miami.

Speaker 2 (40:54):
But you had literally two beatles rolling stones of teams.

Speaker 4 (41:00):
How do you compare the two? And the environments in
LA and Seattle and all that stuff.

Speaker 7 (41:04):
I'm curious. There's nothing that compares to the SD thing
in this regard. We won every game for three years straight.
I mean, think about that, and we won thirty something
games in a row and all the way to that
Texas game, and had we won that one, what would happen?

Speaker 2 (41:20):
You know?

Speaker 7 (41:20):
So there was a golden time there, back to gold
the golden time there that was just extraordinary. And I
felt like, you know, I I had arrived my calling
and coaching, my life had already happened. I mean, that
couldn't be any better than that, but I did have
I did feel the challenge because of the competitiveness, the
challenge go to the NFL and take the mentality of

(41:42):
taking care of people and loving people up and helping them,
you know, be the best they could be. I want
to see if it would happen in the NFL, I
really because I was always I had become an NFL
guy for all the years I've been in there, and
so I like that challenge is the ultimate challenge. And
so so we make you know, we get our run
going and we're rolling and it. But let me say this,
there's never enough wins. There's never enough wins. And it's, uh,

(42:06):
you know, that's what I'm saying. Thirty four in the
row or whatever. Okay, there should have been thirty five,
you know, and then there's never enough, and so it
keeps you coming back. But yet it also kicks your ass,
you know. And and so in Seattle, you know, we
don't win every game. You know, we won over ten
games a year for fourteen years or something whatever it was,
but it still wasn't enough, you know.

Speaker 2 (42:26):
And so.

Speaker 7 (42:29):
That stretch in in La was in the things that
we were doing in the city and all of the
stuff that was happening, and all the glorious moments that
we had, you know, in the Collie and all that stuff.
It was that was just the top to the top.
And I went to try to do it again. I
wanted to try to do that in Seattle too, But
you know, you can't win every game in the NFL.
It just doesn't happen, you know, So there's just never

(42:51):
enough wins.

Speaker 2 (42:52):
Was there more pressure at US or Seattle? In your
painting and knowing it was a USC, I.

Speaker 7 (42:58):
Didn't feel I didn't deal with that, and the pressure thing,
I didn't deal with that, really, I mean, that's not
I didn't even thought of it that way, you know.
I just ball coaching was not that I was a mercenary,
was fighting somebody else's wars, you know, and and going
forward and taking it as far as you could with
the highest of expectations. And I really didn't It wasn't
the pressure and that then. It was it was hard working,

(43:19):
you know, to keep everybody together and to make sure
that everybody's on the same page and everybody was loving
what we were doing. And I mean that it was
a challenge and all that, but it wasn't about the pressure.
I don't see it that way.

Speaker 3 (43:43):
The coach despite I mean, you're suggesting to the lack
of pressure, which is remarkable that mindset. I mean, you've
been doing this a couple of decades coaching. Now you're
walking the campus at USC again teaching, not coaching. I mean,
is at next level decompression still processing or you just stayble?
Do you have that mindset? Whatever I'm doing, I'm doing,

(44:03):
that's my focus. What's my energy closing?

Speaker 7 (44:05):
No, I'm competing. I'm competing to make this a great
freaking year. Now it's already been a great sum But
I'm I am. I mean, that's just frankly, how I'm doing.
I'm not doing that any I'm not doing anything different
at all in that regard that that the springtime, I'll be,
you know, at the st thing. But there's other stuff
going on. We're doing other things that I'm really excited about.
It's just different, you know, And and uh, my mentality
is so much it's so much different because all of

(44:27):
the little, uh the little nit pick and stuff that
you've got to be involved with when on the team,
when you're coach players, and all of it that's been
set aside now and so my mind is clear and
I'm freer to take it where I want to go.
And I love this sense coach.

Speaker 4 (44:44):
What class are you? What class are you teaching over there?

Speaker 2 (44:46):
Uh?

Speaker 7 (44:46):
Well, we're gonna we're gonna be I'm gonna be teaching
the class with a gun named barn Sony who's the
dean of religious studies on campus, and he's a freaking
rock star, and he and I gotta do this thing
together and uh we it's gonna be uh pop through
the Business School to Marshall. It'll be it's gonna be
very close to my heart. Let me just say that,

(45:08):
I don't give away the title of what we're doing that,
but it's gonna be very close to my heart and
the stuff that that I believe in and and mixing
it with with what veron news that he is an
extraordinary uh uh instructor in all of ancient religions and
all the kind of cool things spirituality and so many
things that he's gonna connect with us. It's gonna be uh,
it's gonna be really something, I think. So we're all

(45:30):
really excited about it.

Speaker 2 (45:31):
Well, we have more Sean with the cal degree and
the Prince gree coach. He might he might be a
guest lecture a few times with.

Speaker 6 (45:37):
Yeah, I know and no one exactly Coach, don't buy
any of that, bs No. Then again, he's got.

Speaker 7 (45:43):
Years for real.

Speaker 1 (45:47):
The hanging oh my goddamn on my wall.

Speaker 6 (45:50):
He does have evidence.

Speaker 7 (45:51):
All I heard is three point two was three point.

Speaker 1 (45:54):
Three point three point two.

Speaker 2 (45:56):
We do a special thing on the show code where
we asked the governor questions, whatever question you want to
ask the governor.

Speaker 4 (46:01):
Coach uh it balls in your court?

Speaker 7 (46:04):
Uh man, I got so many questions.

Speaker 6 (46:07):
Why did I sign the nil? By the way, first
state to sign the nil? We can have that conversation.

Speaker 7 (46:12):
Oh lord, hey Gavin, that's a big mistake. Now, that's
a huge mistake. Now I'm not even asking about that,
but that's a huge error that we should should work
to correct.

Speaker 6 (46:22):
You. I mean, no, bs, are you rid? I mean,
are you that concerned about it that it's gone out
of control?

Speaker 7 (46:26):
Absolutely? Think about it? Okay, you want to go there
for a second. Think about those poor kids, Those poor kids,
and those families and those moms and dads are figuring
out how can I make money on my kid when
he's he's a sophomore in high school and he's going
to be a star, and they're thinking about stuff like
that instead letting the kid go to school and be
an athlete. What are you talking about? You know? And
and attorneys and lawyers and reps and and just like

(46:46):
Doug did are representing those high school kids? You know
what is that all about? Who thought that was a
good idea? It was I can talk about forever, but
that's it should be changed. If you want to do
something good, fix that.

Speaker 6 (46:59):
Fix that.

Speaker 3 (47:00):
I don't disagree, and I have strong opinions about the
transfer portal and what's happened with that as well.

Speaker 6 (47:04):
Though you don't think that's a mean mess, but it's interesting.

Speaker 3 (47:07):
You never I mean you, I mean, but look with
all all the money in college sports, particularly programs like
USC and others, but I mean the fact that some
of these players, I mean the vast mentor overwhelming majority,
are never going to play in the NFL. They never
became Marshal Lech. I mean, there was Did you ever
think about it?

Speaker 1 (47:24):
At least?

Speaker 6 (47:24):
Should there be some framework, even if it's not nil as.

Speaker 7 (47:27):
We know it? What are you worried about? What are
you worried about? You worried about these kids getting compensated
because other people are making money on them. They're getting
an education, they get they get a pilgrimt they got
money in their pocket. This is the time of their life.
They don't need that element of professionalism to cloud what's
going on, and also the mentality of the teams in

(47:48):
the different aspects of how it works in the locker room,
with some kids making a million bucks and some kids
don't making anything. I mean, it's it's just a mess.

Speaker 5 (47:56):
It takeaway from the actual game of football, where's the
game in a way that you approach it, but from
a standpoint of you know, I mean, because you know
a lot of those kids won't never yeah, I mean
reach a level of you, I mean a Hall of
Fame football player. So being able to capitalize in those moments,

(48:18):
I do believe that. I don't think it's a bad
idea in order to get these kids, you know, I
mean paid, but for the simple fact of all of
the unnecessary outside shit that they have to go through
in order to get that, and then the lack of education.
That you're going to put a million dollars in the

(48:41):
pocket of an eighteen year old with somebody who looking
at them as just an eighteen m or just a
way to you know, I mean, capitalize and make some
money off of them.

Speaker 1 (48:52):
It put them in a It put them in a.

Speaker 5 (48:55):
Tough ass position before they become you know, I mean
mindful of what's really going on and the responsibilities of
what it actually means to have this type of chilula
and your and your bank account. To me, it's a
it's a plus and a minus. And I think that
with you know, I mean with great response, I mean

(49:16):
with great Yeah, I mean success come with great responsibilities.
And a lot of these individuals who yeah, I mean
don't even know what it is to be successful for
you put them in a position where, yeah, I mean,
you give them the bread before they actually know what
it feel like to actually know.

Speaker 1 (49:30):
How to how to how to rock with the money.

Speaker 2 (49:33):
Well, coach, one of the one of the problems last
year I had, I had a player I signed and
I'm not going to end the player of the school,
but this player got like five hundred thousand dollars, okay,
And it came to me before the draft. He said, hey, man,
winter taxes do I said, well, they're doing April. And
I said, well, how much do you have left from nil?
He said nothing. I said, what do you mean nothing?

(49:53):
He said, it's spent it off. I said, well you
got to pay, you know, at least to seventy five
to Uncle Sam. And so now in his case he
went he went to the NFL and he was able
to get the money. The problem is these schools are
not educating the kids. And so let's say this kid
didn't make the NFL, Well, Uncle Sam's not gonna go away.
They're gonna they're gonna find him somewhere and say you

(50:16):
is two fifty. So now the guy's life is started
with basically in the hole, you know, two hundred and
fifty grand.

Speaker 7 (50:24):
Yeah, this is this is the parents game. This whole
thing is about the parents or whoever is mentoring the kids.
They're the ones getting the money. They're the ones that
are they're gonna put it where they're supposed to. They're
not gonna the kids are aren't gonna They're only gonna
screw it up. They don't have a chance to be
prepared to do that. Why would we what's the what's
the rush? You know what's the rush? And if there's

(50:45):
if they want to up the pelgram, they want to
up the general money that every kid gets something gets
five thousand, ten thousand dollars a year, And I'm like, great,
but give it to everybody and let me let them
all be just players and playing the program and deal
with those is enough. It just doesn't make sense. It's
not right. The thing I don't like about the parent

(51:05):
taking the money.

Speaker 5 (51:06):
But if you're willing to put that much money into
the to the hands of the student, then you should
be willing to put you know, I mean as equal
amount of money into you know, I mean the education
that these kids need, you know what I mean.

Speaker 1 (51:21):
So then when they actually do get to the league,
you have less.

Speaker 5 (51:24):
You have less of a situation where it's almost what
the high ass percentage of like what eighty percent of
all professional athletes go bankrupt type situation. But if you
start them with the education as early as as college,
knowing that they're gonna come into some money, the mindset

(51:44):
is different because now you're thinking in terms of, Okay,
how do I actually spend money. Now, I know I
could go out and I can fucking go blow a
bag on whatever it is I want, But how do
I spend money the right way in order to make
sure that in the long run, I'm still gonna be
able to be able to take care of everything that
I need to take care of right now, because at
the end of the day, like you said, those problems

(52:05):
don't go away. The thing is with I think Big
said at the business, more money, more problems. But the
thing is, a lot of individuals don't see like you know,
I mean when we come into money, we don't come
into money with education of how to spend the fucking
bread considering you know, when you think about you know,
uh uh, you know the on the other side where

(52:28):
you look at white people who come under trust funds
and you know, I mean fall into the family business
like they're taught this shit from you know what I mean,
from from a jit age of how this whole system
of how the money situation works. And then it's like okay,
so they understand that. But then on our end, you know,

(52:48):
I mean, it's just like an overnight type of situation.
One minute you got top rammin in the motherfucking cabinet
to I could go and eat that fucking Benny Hanna's
and it's like that's your life. And the thing is,
if you don't properly take care of your situation, you
put yourself in a motherfucking position to go back to

(53:09):
eating top rummen or worse, then you can't get ahead
and contribute to the problem that we have in California.

Speaker 1 (53:15):
That's on some other shit.

Speaker 5 (53:17):
But you know, I mean it begins to you know,
I mean that cycle just continue to repeat itself. So
I mean, like anything, the first thing that you need
to do is make sure that you get education on
any situation that you're going into. So if you're gonna
put the motherfucking money into the kids' hands, then you
need to go ahead and put the money into the

(53:37):
motherfucking education of these kids at the same time, so
they don't continue to make the same mistakes that the
motherfucker's made before them.

Speaker 3 (53:45):
No, and by the way, just and just be you know,
as the guy that did the first nil in the country,
and of course it was inevitable.

Speaker 5 (53:52):
Coach, Okay, soldier boy, I did it first, ask no No.

Speaker 3 (53:57):
Based on this conversation, I should run never and I'll
do that, But I will say this, I mean, and
I completely and Coach, I appreciate your conviction and your
insight and few people uniquely positioned to understand it better
than you. And but there's no question in my mind
when we signed that that this was not what was intended.
The world that now is taking place is not what

(54:22):
that legislation was originally about. So I could not agree
more in the basis of this conversation, the imperative for
the n C two A to immediately reconcile that uh
and address this issue. They've got to move on this.
In the absence of that, we're looking at state by
state moves, but that's going to put states like California
and other states at a competitive disadvantage. So it has

(54:42):
to be done at the national level, and they need
to move on it quickly, because there's no doubt this
was never what was intended.

Speaker 7 (54:48):
Yeah, good luck. I hope you can do it. I
hope you can do it. Like Seawn, I'm saying, education,
that's what this whole thing was supposed to be about.
Your a ballplayer, or you're a dancer, or your a scholar.
You get you get some help get going to school
so you can get your education, you know, And we're
forgetting about that. But there's it works to be done.

Speaker 2 (55:06):
Well, coach, we we can't. We can't thank you enough
for joining us. I mean, I've I've always loved you
and appreciated you and and uh, everything you've done in
your career and and you're not done yet obviously, and
I appreciate how you've just lived your life. Man, you've
lived it a glass out full and uh, you've always
lived life on borrow of time. And I really appreciate
you and always have and we can't thank you for

(55:28):
joining us.

Speaker 6 (55:28):
And his glass has been overflowing. Next level, first ballot
Hall of Fame, the one and only coach, Carol Coach.
I appreciate you being here.

Speaker 7 (55:39):
Hey, thanks for bringing the Bay area back together with
the guys here, it's pretty good.