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February 5, 2024 62 mins

Cheryl Burke's life story is the stuff movies are made of. From childhood traumas to long-lost siblings, to run-ins with the Russian mob!! But amidst the drama and the dancing, Cheryl and her little sister Nicole had each other.They join the revelry to talk about their unbreakable bond, their nine-year age difference, and how they overcome their ferocious fights!Plus, find out the mysterious way Kate and Oliver discovered they have ANOTHER BROTHER! And, is Oliver finally ready to foxtrot his way to the Dancing with the Stars ballroom?!?

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Episode Transcript

Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:05):

Speaker 2 (00:05):
I am Kate Hudson and my name is Oliver Hudson.

Speaker 3 (00:08):
We wanted to do something that highlighted our.

Speaker 2 (00:11):
Relationship and what it's like to be siblings. We are
a sibling. Railvalry.

Speaker 4 (00:21):
No, no, sibling. You don't do that with your mouth, revelry.

Speaker 5 (00:33):
That's good, Oliver. I'm very excited about today's guest. Do
you want to know why?

Speaker 2 (00:41):
Well, you're in New York first of all, and I'm
in la I know.

Speaker 5 (00:45):
And actually this was a very challenging scheduling situation.

Speaker 1 (00:52):

Speaker 2 (00:52):
For some reason.

Speaker 5 (00:53):
It was totally chaotic and it was like, no, it's
a two o'clock.

Speaker 3 (00:57):
I was on this.

Speaker 5 (00:58):
I was ready at two for this inner and Iver's like, no,
it's a five Eastern time. And then you're like, what
twelve thirty and I'm like.

Speaker 2 (01:05):
Four, woke up. I woke up at three am just
to sort of make sure I was going to get
it all right. But we're weird. We made it. We
made it. We're here, we made it.

Speaker 5 (01:17):
I'm excited because I am a huge Dancing with the
Stars fan. As you know, I also have friends Derek
and Jules who are friends of mine, who are you know,
have been on that.

Speaker 3 (01:29):
Show for years and years.

Speaker 5 (01:30):
So our this guest for me, Cheryl, Cheryl Burke is
someone I've always loved to watch. I think she's an
incredible dancer and a wonderful choreographer.

Speaker 3 (01:44):
And very emotional.

Speaker 5 (01:46):
So I like, I feel like I know her, But
I'm really excited to interview her talking about crazy sibling situation.

Speaker 2 (01:52):
I know, I think she's in the lobby right now waiting,
but before we get there, you know, I think they've
asked me to do Dancing with the Stars a couple
of times.

Speaker 3 (01:59):
Oh my gosh, Cheryl could have been your partner.

Speaker 2 (02:02):
Yeah, but I'm too scared. I don't want to do
I can't do it, you know what I mean. Like,
it's not I'm not there yet.

Speaker 3 (02:09):
I bet you would love it. You'd like cry about
being abandoned. It would be it would be.

Speaker 2 (02:16):
Interpretive like this dance. This dance it's called.

Speaker 5 (02:23):
It's an interpretation of when my father left me on
the steps.

Speaker 2 (02:29):
It's called lonely leather suitcase.

Speaker 3 (02:37):
You just like you just like sit there so cry. Okay,
let's not leave Cheryl. Let's not leave Cheryl.

Speaker 5 (02:48):
In the in the in the waiting room here for
too long but I love you Allie, and I love
it too.

Speaker 1 (02:56):

Speaker 3 (02:57):
Hi, pretty Hi?

Speaker 1 (03:01):
How's it going?

Speaker 3 (03:02):
You look gorgeous?

Speaker 1 (03:03):
How's it going good?

Speaker 6 (03:06):
You know?

Speaker 1 (03:06):
Leve me? The podcast dream?

Speaker 5 (03:08):
Yeah, that's what it is these days, isn't it? So
many podcasts dreams.

Speaker 1 (03:12):
Sobody, so many, and just so many in general.

Speaker 3 (03:16):
I know, But I love a pod.

Speaker 2 (03:18):
I love a good Well. When when we first got
into the game, they were like, oh my god, there's
nine hundred thousand podcasts, we were like, holy shit, now
there's like six million.

Speaker 1 (03:29):
Exactly, exactly exactly.

Speaker 5 (03:31):
Well, we love it, We love we love talking and
obviously because we started this whole podcast about really about
the sibling relationship, it's so fun because we get to
talk to people about things that we don't usually get
to talk about, you know.

Speaker 1 (03:46):
Right, yeah, no, totally. I was thinking like should I
have done this with my sister? But then I was like, uh,
we've got like a nine year age gap my half sister.
My life is complicated, as you're about to hear, but uh, yeah,
it's it's an interesting dynamic. But I've heard a couple
of episodes and you guys seem to just nail it
so well.

Speaker 5 (04:03):
We have fun we try to keep it light on
its feet, yeah, until Oliver and I start crying, until
it gets heavy.

Speaker 1 (04:09):
Crying is not a bad thing though, right no, yeah,
you know we run all the emotion.

Speaker 2 (04:14):
We run through gamut of all emotions on this show,
you know, from the completely absurd to in a puddle
of tears.

Speaker 5 (04:22):
Right right, right, Well real life, Cheryl, I was saying
before you got on that I'm I'm obviously such a
huge dancer with the storys Fance. I feel like I
know you because you were on for so many years. Yes,
just have to tell you. I think you're incredible and
you're an amazing choreographer, and your thank you always moved me.

Speaker 1 (04:40):
Thanks so much, I can't believe what I mean. Obviously,
I know that you and Derek are friends, so you know,
maybe that's the connection. But that's awesome. And Joels the whole,
the whole.

Speaker 3 (04:50):
Huff the whole.

Speaker 5 (04:52):
They're taking over the world, those huffs, Oh my gosh,
I just love them.

Speaker 2 (04:56):
And so I know it's not Dancing with the Stars,
but I and I've watched that plenty of times, of course,
but you know, when I sort of watching, so you
think you can dance or something I think that's what
it's called. I never knew that I could be so
nogreat getting back to crying, so moved by two people
or one person moving their body to some piece of music.

There were moments in that show where I am sobbing
uncontrollably and I don't even understand why it's unbelievably moving.

Speaker 1 (05:28):
I mean, it's an art form. I mean it's it
is an expression through movement instead of you know, using
the complication of language and English. For me, at least,
that was complicated growing up. You know, it was my
way of communication was through movement. And I think when
you bring authenticity to it, it is a beautiful thing.
Or it could be a shit show. You know, it

just depends.

Speaker 5 (05:50):
Wells it's usually a little bit about Yes, yes, absolutely, it's.

Speaker 3 (05:55):
A very dramatic growing up. You know, dance it's a.

Speaker 5 (05:58):
Very dramatic art form as well, So you bring all
of that drama to the floor and to the class
and sometimes unfortunately to the community.

Speaker 3 (06:08):
Yeah, you know it's like but.

Speaker 2 (06:11):
But but but growing growing up, when you're saying that
that was your sort of form of communication, yeah, was
that was that? Was there a reason for that? Was
it the way that you will how come, Like, why
was that your bad communication?

Speaker 1 (06:25):
I would to give you a cliff note version. It's
going to sound like I'm so casually talking about someone
else's life, but I'm just gonna give it to you. Okay.

Speaker 3 (06:32):
This is an elevator pitch of your life, right.

Speaker 1 (06:36):
Yeah, So you guys want to like act about it
or do a movie, you know, feel free?

Speaker 2 (06:40):

Speaker 1 (06:42):
Okay. So at two years old, my mom and my
real dad divorced. So my very first memory as a
kid was seeing my father with another woman. I was
like around two years old, and then I from there,
my mom remarried my stepfather, and what came with my
stepfather and his previous marriage was a caretaker who molested

both me and my stepsister at the time. I say
at the time, because she just passed in August this
past August, and I testified against him in court. I
was nine years old, and it was happening for like
four or five years. And it was interesting because at
the time, you know, it wasn't like physical it wasn't
like a physical pain that went that. I guess it's

hard to translate, but it's like the physical pain wasn't
there as much as the grooming was, you know what
I mean. So it was like he acted as that
father figure. My mom and my stepdad were both like
working and my mother, you know, built a business and
you know, has a rags to riches Story's Philip. She's
from the Philippines, and you know when she when she

divorced my father, who went to you know, follow his passion,
which was and starts with the p ends with a y,
I say it was because he, uh, he was very
successful attorney the Bay Bay area where I'm from, and
then from there he just fled to the Philippines and
then went to Thailand and built a whole strip of

strip clubs in Thailand in Pataya, which is like a
small little town.

Speaker 3 (08:13):
Yeah, and it's not an elevator pitch. This is this
is wow.

Speaker 5 (08:18):
First of all, I just you know you, I mean,
it's first of all, I'm so sorry anyone would ever
have to go through anything like that. But for you
like that, you have to constantly be working through that,
I guess.

Speaker 1 (08:30):
Oh yeah, so much compassion and love, Thank you you,
thank you. And you know I was I was really
really quiet as a kid. My mom thought I was deaf.
She brought me to a hearing specialist and the doctor
was like, no, she can hear. She's just going through
major PTSD, you know. And so for me there was

I guess the communication. The there's two languages being spoken
at home from my other nanny who raised me practically
from when I was born in eighty for until I
was thirteen, and she only spoke to Gollog, which is
the Filipino language. And then my mother was working constantly,
like twenty four hours a day. She was building a
business and a company. So on top of the sexual

you know, abuse, and then also the languages, I just
was more of an observer. Now I can't shut the
f up, but I guess that's what happens. But I
was definitely you know, it was hard for me to
communicate through language. So for me, that's why I say,
you know, dance was my way of communication.

Speaker 3 (09:30):
So and where did you find dance?

Speaker 5 (09:33):
Was that something that your your mother had something to
do with or was that something you discovered.

Speaker 1 (09:39):
No, I come from the original dance mom. So she's like,
get in that, get in the classes.

Speaker 2 (09:44):
You know.

Speaker 1 (09:45):
She put me into everything from like ballet to tennis
to soccer, horseback riding. I wasn't great at school, so
I mean, thank God for her in the long run.
But I started in ballet from four to eleven and
then literally grew out of my tights, Like I became
I'm a woman at a very early age. I'm nine
years old. I started developing and I basically have the

same body that I do now. Then when I was nine,
which is insanity. And then yeah, and then I just
literally grew out of my tights, couldn't hang with all
the other, you know, girls, and so I switched to ballroom.
My mom and stepdad they were trying to find a
family sport for us to do, and golf just wasn't
wasn't it. So They're like, have about ballroom dancing? And

I was like, that is for old people, but I'll
try it, like I'll see what, you know, if there's
kids or whatever. I went to a local dance competition
in the bar area and I saw kids my age,
you know, shake their little butts, and I was like,
sign me up.

Speaker 3 (10:40):
We were like put that little sparkly outfit on.

Speaker 1 (10:43):
Me and spray tand and some lashes, like are you
kidding me?

Speaker 2 (10:47):
Yes? How long did the stepdad stick around.

Speaker 1 (10:51):
He's still around. I call him my dad, like, he's
my dad.

Speaker 2 (10:54):
You know who was the asshole?

Speaker 1 (10:56):
Yeah, I'm which was my real father?

Speaker 2 (10:58):
Oh, the real father?

Speaker 3 (11:00):
It was your real father.

Speaker 1 (11:01):
My real father cheated on my mother, like multiple multiple times.
I mean he cheated on her with his secretary. Then
that's why I have a half sister who I just
met at my dad's wake, you know, right, so and
then and then who knows how many half I mean
I just did my twenty three and meters, and I
mean there's a lot. I've got a dynamic of a

different I guess individuals.

Speaker 2 (11:24):
Wait, wait, I know. I was trying to get this
straight that who did the Who was the groo? Who
did the grooming?

Speaker 1 (11:28):
Who is that the man who was sexually abusing me
and my stepsister who came from my step dad and
his previous marriage.

Speaker 2 (11:36):
God, So he was like the caretaker.

Speaker 1 (11:39):
Yeah, he drove us around because the other nanny who
only spoke to Golg she couldn't drive. She didn't have
her driver's license. Sorry, I didn't make that care got it,
got it?

Speaker 2 (11:46):

Speaker 3 (11:46):
Yeah, father didn't protect you.

Speaker 1 (11:50):
My father wasn't there, like he had left, he moved
to Thailand or the Philippines, and he's you know, he
had so many different relationships and probably so many different kids,
but my mom made sure I connect. I still had
a relationship with my real father, so as a new
family with my stepdad. My stepsister who looks like a
live Barbie doll, Like, we look nothing alike, you know,

She's blond, and I was like this Asian little kid.
And we would travel to Thailand and visit my dad
at his strip clubs. He would live on top of
a I mean we wouldn't go in the stream. I
mean well we had to actually because he lived on
top of Bubbles, which is one of his strip clubs. Yeah,
the name of one of his Wow. Oh but then

check this out. Then you know, my father passes away.
He was an alcoholic. I'm also an addict as well,
but I've been sober for like five and a half
years almost. But when we would go visit him, you know,
he would just always say to me, never come back
here if I pass away. And I'm like, okay, Like
I was just a little naive. I still felt like

my real dad was my best friend. Because as I
grew up, you know, we would always like FaceTime and
we would have our drink and poison of choice and
we would just have hours and hours of conversations. And
then when I went there, when he passed away, I
guess he was involved in the Russian mafia and they
chased me out of my father's wake because there was
this Yeah, so basically his attorney who was the power

of attorney, which is insanity anyway, this type man spread
a rumor, I guess, saying my father wired me like
five hundred million dollars and so but really that wasn't
the case.

Speaker 3 (13:33):
Wow, my god, I.

Speaker 1 (13:34):
Know that's what. I don't really care write this shit.

Speaker 3 (13:37):
Yeah, but no, you can't.

Speaker 2 (13:38):
Well that's so interesting. So you had a relationship with
your father because your mother was keen on you, Yes,
keeping that established, you know, correct. But your stepdad, who
you call dad, is the one who raised you.

Speaker 1 (13:52):
So I would say, yes, yes, right, it's it's.

Speaker 2 (13:55):
Not a dissimilar story, you know, because Katie, I have
a similar situation where our dad was out of the picture.
Kurt came into our lives and basically raised us. Okay,
him our dad, we call him paw Pa because he
there was a moment we were actually just joking about
right before you came on, where our dad comes to
pick us up. There's a fight in the house and

he leaves my sister and I standing on the doorstep
with our little suitcases waiting to go for the weekend,
and we run inside and I'm do an after school
special moment where I'm like, mom, it's all your fault,
you know. And that's when Kurt comes up to us
and says, look, I'm not your father and I'm not
Kurt anymore. We need to figure out a name for me,

and I will always be here for you, even if
I'm not with your mother, I will be here. He
made that promise to us, and so we came up.
He came up, I'm sure with the name Paw. So
we called him.

Speaker 5 (14:48):
We had all kinds of different names. One of them
was Popcorn. We were like making up all crazy names.

Speaker 1 (14:54):
Yeah, I love that.

Speaker 5 (15:04):
So your father passes away in two thy eighteen.

Speaker 1 (15:08):
I think, so, Yeah, did.

Speaker 3 (15:10):
You know when you went to the funeral or to
the to the wake that you're that you had a
half sister at all? Or was she just there?

Speaker 1 (15:19):
Yeah? No, no, so she actually my half sister. Sorry,
I think I said that she was there. It wasn't
my half sister that was there was my half brother
who was like a Canadian opera singer. So I had
never met him. Now there are pictures of me and
my half sister. I don't remember. Obviously, we were really young,
and I think my father if it was with his
secretary from his law firm, then this must have still,

this must have been happening when you know, my mom
and dad were separated in San Francisco. So it's like,
so there was this like weird yeah, so it was
like a weird overlap. You're like, Okay, the story.

Speaker 5 (15:53):
Was just common, but I feel like there's some overlap, yes,
and a lot of yeah. So that you have a
half brother as well, so you too, did you you
didn't know about your half brother?

Speaker 1 (16:05):
No, I knew about him, I just never met him
in person until then.

Speaker 3 (16:09):
So what was that like?

Speaker 6 (16:11):

Speaker 1 (16:11):
You know, it's all I always I don't know. I
think probably because of the way what happened to me. Obviously,
I have trust issues and I don't necessarily, you know,
trust you, and I'm not like the most open vulnerable person.
But I'm learning and I get I get it. Like
I'm putting the pieces together, so it wasn't necessarily welcoming

with open arms. I just wanted to like because at
that time too, it's like what's going where? But then
everything got stolen, so you're just like, what is happening?
Why am I just seeing you for the first time?
What is your you know, intention with all of this?
Like I swear, you know, my father may have never
talked about him as much. You know, I know, I'm
his firstborn, So there's just all this like red flags,

red flags, So it's just so complicated stolen. Well, so yeah,
so I guess with the strip club business, if you
ever interested in knowing this, in Thailand it is very
much run by mafia and so I mean, like I
couldn't even finish. I had to hire armed guards because

also they don't speak that much English in Thailand, and
it was really complicated. I hired an attorney. It was
just a lot, and I turned it into like Claire
Danes from Homeland, like literally this took my life over
knowing that, you know, my father passed away already. There
was no way of bringing him back. But I had
so many unanswered you know questions basically, and I will

for the rest of my life. I guess I just
have to be okay with it.

Speaker 2 (17:39):
So are you constantly seeking answers to some of these questions?
Have you let it go? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (17:43):
I have to for my own mental health. Like actually,
I don't know if you guys believe in this stuff,
but you know John Edwards the medium.

Speaker 3 (17:51):
Yeah, do I believe in it?

Speaker 1 (17:54):
I live with it. So he's like a closet ballroom dancer.
Did you know that he loves ballroom dancing. It's like
a ballroom dancer. Anyway, I met him years ago, and
he's the one that convinced me just to like let
it go because it was actually taking my life over
and I was like what am I going to do?
Like this is it? My father died. There's nothing I
can do, you know. But still it's like I'm just,

you know, an addict in that way.

Speaker 2 (18:18):
What were you obsessing over? Specifically with this was.

Speaker 1 (18:22):
Like breaking into his bank account. I was like going
because I was like, where is everything right? Like also
there was two different wills, like I you know in Thailand,
like it's so shady a shit happens over there, and
you know, at the end of the day, Okay, I
can fight all day and long. It's like, where is
it going to get me other than broke? Right?

Speaker 3 (18:42):
Like yeah, really, sometimes you just have to let go.

Speaker 1 (18:47):
Yeah, I know, so now to John Edwards.

Speaker 2 (18:50):
But the attic nature is so interesting where you can
the addiction can be transferred over to pretty much anything.

Speaker 1 (18:58):
Absolutely. Yeah. And that's when I had just stopped drinking,
so it was a full on yeah, that was where
I was all my energy was going to. And then
I was engaged to at that time, so it was
just a yeah.

Speaker 2 (19:09):
Oh gosh, I don't know how that was that engagement.

Speaker 1 (19:15):
I'm divorced.

Speaker 5 (19:16):
Yeah, what is your relationship now with your half siblings?

Speaker 1 (19:24):
So I'm really close to Nicole, who you're about to meet.
She's nine years younger than me, so she's comes from
my mother and my stepdad. And then I was when
I was growing up, I was close to my stepsister
who was five years older than me. But she had
just passed away end of August, I believe from addiction.

So sorry, thank you.

Speaker 3 (19:48):
And then what about your half brother.

Speaker 1 (19:51):
I don't really have a relationship with.

Speaker 3 (19:52):
Him and your half sister.

Speaker 1 (19:55):
I mean we're we talk every once in a while.
It's not like at first I think when this was
all happening, I just needed to like I wanted somebody
that knew my dad to talk to, and so we
became really close and then like you know, I had
just this wall started to develop. And it has nothing
to do with them. It has everything to do with
me and my own issues, you know.

Speaker 2 (20:17):
So it's also probably protecting yourself as absolutely. Yeah, yeah,
have you done twenty three and me? And do you
have a thousand?

Speaker 1 (20:26):
First of all, my father lied to me. I'm not
Russian Irish. I'm straight up Oshganazi Jewish fifty three percent.

Speaker 2 (20:33):
Oh my god, Oh my god.

Speaker 1 (20:35):
I'm more Ashganazi Jewish than Filipino. My mother's Filipino. And
it's pretty cut.

Speaker 3 (20:40):
Yeah, that's so funny.

Speaker 1 (20:43):
Yeah, yeah, I don't know why he didn't tell me that,
But I mean, I wire.

Speaker 5 (20:47):
Dad lied to us because he was so Italian, Italian Italian.
But the truth is is that we were more Italian
than I thought we were.

Speaker 2 (20:53):
Oh really well yeah, And the other thing is we
we've told the story before and I'll go, but but
I have we have the same situation. I show up
at my house and there's a note under the door
and it says my name is Paul. I'd love to
have a conversation with you. Turns out this guy who
lives in Utah is my our half brother. My father

had him when he was sixteen and had to give
him up for adoption. Wow. Yeah, so we have discovered
this and on twenty three and me, there's potentially another
one for trying to figure out for sure.

Speaker 1 (21:30):
I'm almost like, do I even want to know? You know,
it's like it's just so complicated already. But he just
left a note under the door. He didn't give a knock.

Speaker 2 (21:39):
No, no, there was a note. I came home and to
be he was more respectful.

Speaker 1 (21:44):
Yeahs did he send mail?

Speaker 2 (21:48):
No? No, he went to Disneyland and then and slipped
them under the door.

Speaker 5 (21:54):
And the funniest thing is he didn't want to do
it to mine because he thought then I would definitely
he thought Oliver would be the better way, because totally
you know. And the irony is is that Oliver was like,
I can't deal with this.

Speaker 2 (22:09):
I have enough problem.

Speaker 1 (22:12):
Did he tell you, like, did you tell her your
sister right away this happened?

Speaker 2 (22:16):
Oh yeah, well I had I had Claudia, who's taking
care of our kids at the time, like Claudia, I
don't know who the fuck this guy is, Like, I
don't know if this is real or not. I said,
call this number and pretend you're my assistant and let's
let's start there. And so she called and she's like, huh,
this is all of my assistant and he's like, I'm sorry,
here's the situation, blah blah blah. And then she's like, well,

let me see if I can get him. And I'm
standing right next to her, and then I get and
then I tell Kate.

Speaker 3 (22:43):
You didn't you didn't get on the phone.

Speaker 2 (22:46):
No, I got scared you.

Speaker 3 (22:50):
Never got on the phone. Because then I didn't want
to deal it.

Speaker 2 (22:53):
I have enough therapy for my whole life, Like, I
can't deal with another situation the same.

Speaker 1 (22:59):
I beg sucking four like to like.

Speaker 2 (23:04):
And then Kate. But then Kate takes over. I'm we're
getting DNA tests. We're going to DNA test. I'm like, Kate,
I love you you.

Speaker 3 (23:14):
The best thing was that Paul said.

Speaker 5 (23:16):
The first thing he said is like, yeah, I guess
your brothers. She said she was his assistant, but it
didn't sounds very professional. That the first thing which which
made me immediately realize he actually was our brother.

Speaker 3 (23:33):
Yes, that's so good.

Speaker 1 (23:34):
You're hearing about bathing in the background.

Speaker 5 (23:37):
I thought it was so amazing. It's like, I you know,
there's he has three kids and and.

Speaker 2 (23:42):
He looked we saw a picture like holy ship.

Speaker 6 (23:46):

Speaker 2 (23:49):
No, no, no, yeah, my gosh.

Speaker 3 (23:53):
Well he lives in Utah.

Speaker 2 (23:55):
We d M I DM with him. You know, yeah,
a little bit nice.

Speaker 3 (23:59):
That's nice, cheryld Do you think there's any more siblings?
Do you think?

Speaker 2 (24:04):

Speaker 1 (24:05):
I mean he married one of his employees. I guess
you could say, uh tiland and supposedly there's like two
little dancers, there's two little girls or something. But you
know what, all I know, Yeah, all I know is
I am his first for now. I mean, honestly, nothing

shocks me at this point. And your mom, my, mom,
she's great.

Speaker 3 (24:33):
And you're close, you're super close.

Speaker 1 (24:35):
Well we're as close as we can be. Look, it's
a really different dynamic. Like you see, like you'll meet
my sister here in a second, and she's she doesn't
come from a broken family, you know what I mean.
So it's like, yeah, it is different, like regardless and
you know her her insecurities are may not be I mean,
I'm not comparing the two. It's so different, but like,
but also then she had to see me go on television,

and then my mother holding like Filipino tea parties at
her house and like celebrating her daughter, her daughter's success
on primetime TV. For I was on that show for
twenty six seasons, you know. So it's like, at the
end of the days, so long I just retired.

Speaker 5 (25:13):
It is so long, seventeen years. Honestly, that makes me
feel like, are we all that much older?

Speaker 1 (25:19):
How old were you when you started that, Sally twenty one?
I'm thirty nine, but like, but still we had did
two seasons a year. I mean, it was it's since.
I mean, I thought I was just going to do
one season and go back to Harlem, you know.

Speaker 2 (25:31):
Yeah, before we get before get to your sister. This
is so fascinating. I talked for hours about all this.
I love this intricate, dark underbelly.

Speaker 1 (25:38):
It's crazy shit, definitely interesting it is.

Speaker 2 (25:41):
But did you get to know your father well before
he passed?

Speaker 1 (25:46):

Speaker 2 (25:46):
Yeah, okay, yes, And how much did you see yourself
in him? You know what I mean?

Speaker 1 (25:55):
No, one hundred percent. I am more my father than
anybody else, that's for damn.

Speaker 6 (25:59):

Speaker 1 (25:59):
I look like him, I act like him, which isn't
always appropriate, but you know, it's just it's interesting. And
that's why I felt so close to him, and I
didn't really think of him. Yes, it was I hurt
by feeling abandoned, And yes, do I suffer from abandoned
mint attachment or whatever the hell? Or no, it's it's

a whatever something attachment anyway, who cares anxious? Anxious? Anxious
attachment anxious? Yes, but he knows more about me than
my mom will ever know, you know, because I felt safe,
I didn't feel judged by him.

Speaker 2 (26:32):
Yeah, it's so interesting.

Speaker 3 (26:34):
Oh, it's really so. You felt more judged by Mama.

Speaker 1 (26:38):
Well yeah, I mean she was the active, but I
feel more obviously grateful for like thank God for her,
you know. But it's just a different dynamic, different dynamic
I can't compare.

Speaker 5 (26:51):
I know kids are always harder on the most present parents.

Speaker 1 (26:54):
Oh, I feel bad for my mom.

Speaker 2 (26:56):
Actually, you have you not been to the Hoffman Institute.

Speaker 1 (27:00):
Not yet, but I've heard amazing things about it. But
I'm a little bit scared. I'm a little scared of it.

Speaker 2 (27:05):
I've done it I've done it.

Speaker 1 (27:06):
It was.

Speaker 2 (27:07):
It's incredible. It's incredible.

Speaker 3 (27:08):
I'm just scared.

Speaker 1 (27:10):
Of very loud.

Speaker 2 (27:13):
It's incredible. I heard.

Speaker 1 (27:15):
No, I'm definitely I should do that. I'm about to
turn forty in May, so I probably should gift myself.
I've thought about it, Okay.

Speaker 7 (27:29):
Nicole, precious guys.

Speaker 3 (27:33):
Hello, oh yeah, we're so good.

Speaker 5 (27:38):
We just got the full Cheryl Rundown and we're like
our mouths like our jaws have dropped.

Speaker 1 (27:45):
Mainly about Steve Burke. Nicole.

Speaker 6 (27:48):
Oh, yeah, that's a crazy story.

Speaker 7 (27:51):
That is a crazy story. This is wild wild. So
I actually when I met him, I took the I
took like.

Speaker 6 (27:59):
An iPhone not worth of quotes that he would say,
and they're just like, you can't write dialogue that good.

Speaker 1 (28:08):
It's insane. I was saying, like, we should do a movie.
They should do a movie on this whole. It's just fascinating.

Speaker 3 (28:15):
Such a care also a true character character.

Speaker 7 (28:19):
Yeah. He was also a very small person like his
why I like short dudes.

Speaker 1 (28:24):
No, I'm kidding.

Speaker 8 (28:25):
Really, everything in everything in his house was like miniature
like like it was like many slices of cheese and
his refrigerator like all of that it was so I
don't know why.

Speaker 3 (28:39):
This is completely this has completely changed my perspective on him.

Speaker 2 (28:44):
I picture him like literally three to eight with like tinyard.

Speaker 6 (28:50):
In his house.

Speaker 3 (28:51):
In my mind, he was a totally different type of person.

Speaker 1 (28:55):
Right, No, totally like like this macho like sex and
the city that mister big Yeah, though definitely not. I
mean his voice is but he gets yeah, no.

Speaker 2 (29:03):
No, it looks yeah.

Speaker 5 (29:06):
I like the idea that he's that he's he's on
the shorter side and likes smaller ports.

Speaker 1 (29:11):
Well, my ex husband looks. How about this. If you
look up my ex husband, he looks exactly like my father.
They look exactly like Yes.

Speaker 5 (29:19):
I feel like I remember, weren't you, didn't you? Who's
your ex husband?

Speaker 1 (29:22):
Matthew Lawrence the Lawrence brothers?

Speaker 2 (29:25):
Yeah yeah, okay, got it.

Speaker 1 (29:27):
But like almost identical.

Speaker 5 (29:29):
Really yeah, that's so crazy.

Speaker 3 (29:32):
God, Nicole, where are you or are you in? Are
you in l A?

Speaker 2 (29:36):

Speaker 1 (29:37):
Yeah, I'm in Venice?

Speaker 3 (29:39):
And where where did you both grow up?

Speaker 7 (29:41):
All alco?

Speaker 3 (29:44):
So you were up north? And then did you Nicole?
Do you did you dance as well?

Speaker 7 (29:48):
No? Not at all? Awful yeah awful dancer.

Speaker 1 (29:53):
No, you were not when you were a little girl.
Mom forced you you were really cute.

Speaker 2 (29:57):
I have some.

Speaker 7 (29:58):
Photos of me and ballroom dance competitions. I was like
very tiny with the sequindra.

Speaker 6 (30:05):
Actually, what I really used to do is when Cheryl
would go and compete, they would have like tables of
people seated around like the ballroom dance floor, and I
would go underneath the tables. I was like five six,
and I would pick up the rhinestones that had fallen
from the dresses when they were spinning, and I would
put them in like little plastic cups and make like

art pieces with the fallen feathers and rhinestones.

Speaker 1 (30:31):
It's so cute.

Speaker 2 (30:32):
That was.

Speaker 1 (30:33):
It's kind of been way worse under that table, you know.

Speaker 6 (30:35):
So people were like, oh my god, there's a I love.

Speaker 3 (30:41):
I love that as like a cinematic visual.

Speaker 1 (30:45):
We're turning into a movie. That's it.

Speaker 2 (30:47):
That should be ballroom So show you were nine when
she was born.

Speaker 1 (30:54):
Yeah, I begged for a little sister.

Speaker 2 (30:57):
You did.

Speaker 1 (30:58):
I did. I even saw Oh maybe that's Tami. Never mind, okay,
go ahead, what.

Speaker 2 (31:04):
You saw her birth?

Speaker 1 (31:05):
No, I saw the process prior to the birth in
the cup. When you guys do the thing in the
you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 2 (31:13):
Yeah, that one.

Speaker 1 (31:16):
I saw her as a little you know, yeah, yes,
you like visualized her, Yes, yes I did. I manifested her.

Speaker 3 (31:27):
That's so cute.

Speaker 2 (31:29):
Wow. So when she was when she was born, it
must have been an incredible an incredible day.

Speaker 1 (31:34):
It was. It was as if I gave birth to her.
I always say that I'm like your mother.

Speaker 5 (31:40):
I felt that way with Wyatt because I have a
I have my I'm seven and a half years older
than my our younger brother, and I always felt when
he was born it was like having.

Speaker 3 (31:51):
My own doll, like human doll, you know, like, oh,
I was like playing mom.

Speaker 5 (31:56):
You know.

Speaker 2 (31:56):

Speaker 1 (31:56):
I would always pick her up out of the crib
when she was crying, and I didn't be leaving that rule,
like just leave her that. I'm like, that's abuse, that's abuse, Like,
no way, never happening.

Speaker 3 (32:06):

Speaker 5 (32:07):
So Nicole, like, how was it for you guys growing up?
I mean that's a that's a pretty big age difference.

Speaker 7 (32:13):
Yeah, yeah it was.

Speaker 1 (32:15):
It was.

Speaker 6 (32:16):
Uh, it was weird until like eighteen, I guess because
it was just such an age gap, like Cheryl is sixteen,
you know, like when you're When she was like a teenager.

Speaker 7 (32:30):
I looked like like a little doddler following her around,
like growing up.

Speaker 6 (32:38):
She would like go into the kitchen and eat an orange,
and I'd like go into the kitchen and eat an orange.
You know, like you just like mimic everything that your
older sister does. But then, but then when eighteen happened,
then it was like you could start hanging out as
people and have those types of experiences. But there was
like it's such an age gap, and it's it's different for.

Speaker 2 (32:58):
Sure, right because then show you left the house at
some point when you're saying.

Speaker 1 (33:02):
I left when I was like eighteen seventeen.

Speaker 3 (33:04):
But those are your competitive dancers, so you've probably gone
a lot.

Speaker 1 (33:07):
Were you caught a lot? Yes, all over the world,
Like I spent my summers in England training like the.

Speaker 3 (33:12):
Whole So you did the same kind of thing that I've.

Speaker 1 (33:15):
Known Derek and julian since they were ten years old.
Like I was at her tenth I was at Julianne's
tenth birthday in England. She had she had an English accent.

Speaker 3 (33:24):
I'm not kidding, that's I mean, I'm not surprised.

Speaker 1 (33:28):
Yeah, no, but so were you also?

Speaker 3 (33:30):
Did you also dance with Mark's mom.

Speaker 1 (33:33):
Well she i for a little bit and then I
switched over.

Speaker 3 (33:38):
Yeah yeah, okay, so but it was it's a different
kind of.

Speaker 1 (33:42):
It's the same world though. I just I think I'm
like an eight, like maybe three four years older. But
we competed against each other. I have a picture of
us at a competition in the Bay Area, and it
was like me and my partner super tall. And remember
I developed at a young age, so was like Julianne
was like she I looked like I was kind yes,
and I was like I had boobs and a waiste

in a butt and then like then there was little Derek,
little Julianne, little Mark Ballast.

Speaker 2 (34:07):
You know.

Speaker 1 (34:08):
It just was so crazy.

Speaker 3 (34:09):
It's so crazy, it's so funny.

Speaker 5 (34:12):
So so when when Nicole, when Cheryl was gone, was
that hard for you or was that just like a
normal thing.

Speaker 7 (34:19):
It was a normal thing.

Speaker 6 (34:21):
We made like family trips out of where her competitions were.
So like if she had a dance competition in Italy,
I've been to like random fucking places like.

Speaker 7 (34:33):
Italy, like.

Speaker 6 (34:38):
You know, and then I just find like really weird
ways of entertaining myself because I didn't I didn't really
like love the whole ballroom thing. So I was just
like this little kid who would just wander through these
like massive ballroom dance competitions.

Speaker 1 (34:53):
Were drawn to.

Speaker 2 (34:56):
What I drown.

Speaker 3 (34:57):

Speaker 6 (34:58):
I studied acting in college and right now I'm finishing
my master's in film productions. So I've always been like
creative for sure, but just wasn't into the dance thing.

Speaker 2 (35:10):
Yeah, when did you guys start to get really close?
You know? I mean obviously when you're back and forth,
you're not there and there's such an edge gap. Was
there that moment where it was like, oh shit, we're
on the same We're kind of on the same level here,
you know what I mean.

Speaker 1 (35:25):
It was like I would say, when we started going
on these like huge trips that I tay you on.
We went to like France, Like this was like about
what season I based my whole life off seasons? Okay,
so it was like really good seven see season seven
hundred and twelve, and that we would go to like Paris,
we went to Spain, you know. Yeah.

Speaker 6 (35:46):
It was like that was around when I I graduated
high school, so like I was like seventeen or something
like that, and that's why we call each other mouse
because we we went took me to Paris and you
know that's that scene from Ratitui where the little mouse
the steering for all of Paris and the Eiffel Tower.

Speaker 7 (36:07):
Yes, like we're obsessed.

Speaker 2 (36:09):
With that movie so now.

Speaker 6 (36:13):
And I think it was like those trips honestly. So,
so I was in high school and then Cheryl was
like in her you know, mid.

Speaker 1 (36:21):
Trime, kidding, kidding, Yeah.

Speaker 5 (36:25):
So so when Cheryl, you're twenty one, when you started
Dancing Stars, did you start out as a partner or
were you in kind of the like.

Speaker 1 (36:35):
I was part I was like a pro pro dancer
right away right away.

Speaker 3 (36:39):
Yeah, I feel like I remember that.

Speaker 1 (36:41):
And then and then I had that was a short haircut,
like I had the dumb and dummer bangs like my uh,
dancing coach just like messed me up.

Speaker 3 (36:50):
I blame him, and it just always had some.

Speaker 1 (36:53):
Yes, it only looked good in movement though, But if
I was here, like having a conversation with you, it
would be quite embarrassing.

Speaker 5 (37:01):
What was that like for you, Nicole, because that show
kind of like it was such a hit.

Speaker 1 (37:06):
Yeah, I was like fully for votes, I love you, mom,
trained you.

Speaker 6 (37:13):
Well, I remember I have like these like buttons that
had like a vote for Cheryl and Emmett on it,
and I would like Smith like middle school all the time,
so I was super into it.

Speaker 3 (37:27):
Didn't you win with him at Smith?

Speaker 1 (37:29):
I went with Drew Lash my very first two seasons,
I won, and then it just went downhill from there.

Speaker 2 (37:35):
Do you blame every partner?

Speaker 1 (37:38):
No, I blame my opinions, my mouth.

Speaker 2 (37:42):
Oh really?

Speaker 5 (37:44):
So, so while your sister's like dancing her heart out
and Nichole like, I'm just gonna say it, which is
Cheryl You're saying like you've always struggled with addiction? Was
that something that you were aware of growing up with her?
Or well, she's working and was that something that you
know what was challenging to confront.

Speaker 6 (38:09):
I think I was mildly aware of it, like you
have to think, like when she was like your first
few seasons, I was like eleven.

Speaker 1 (38:17):
Oh, I was a functioning drunk.

Speaker 7 (38:19):
So yeah, so I was really young.

Speaker 6 (38:21):
So I don't think I understood it until or really
clocked it until I was like probably a teenager, until
I was like fifteen sixteen, and then and then it
was something I was aware of but it didn't really
seem worrisome to me until I was probably in my
I don't know, like like late teens.

Speaker 2 (38:45):
Anyway, Why why why I was worriedome? What happened?

Speaker 3 (38:50):
What happened?

Speaker 7 (38:51):
I mean a lot, I mean a lot happened, But
what I don't I can't remember. It's funny, I.

Speaker 1 (38:58):
Can't like when we started traveling together and stuff you
started to see.

Speaker 6 (39:02):
Not really traveling. I feel like it was it was
like more because you know, I would go out with
her and her friends and I was like very underage.
I would like hand the the bouncer like.

Speaker 1 (39:18):
Sher bages and bottles. We were just all up in there, had.

Speaker 6 (39:21):
Like to enter the freaking bar like one, you look
like you're nine, and two this girl you still do
here and so it was like really but like I
didn't have a fake ID, so.

Speaker 2 (39:33):
So I don't.

Speaker 6 (39:35):
It was interesting to like see, you know, I would
like go to bed and they would stay.

Speaker 7 (39:39):
Up all night, and I was like, yep, the totally
normal no.

Speaker 6 (39:45):
So yeah, I got little glimpses of it then and
and maybe also on the trips, but it's hard to
say if there was like a moment because I think
when it's your sibling, you don't really think like.

Speaker 1 (39:55):
Well, also know, I wasn't very educated about addiction. I
don't think we were like we didn't put the work
to the action, I guess, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 7 (40:03):
And it was also just got normalized with like what
all of her friends were doing.

Speaker 1 (40:08):
Well, I was a ballroom dancer by day and a
partier bitches and bottles at night. Like I literally it
was seven nights a week. And because I was functioning.
That's the scariest I think of with them all is
that no one knew and people when I wasn't kind
of out of it, people were like, what's wrong with you?
And I'm like, yeah, see, I gotta just continue on
with the vodka sodas.

Speaker 2 (40:28):
You were functioning in the sense that you could just
live your life and have your day. Yeah yeah, Then
what what was the trigger where it was like, holy shit,
you know I'm an alcoholic.

Speaker 1 (40:40):
It was my father dying, Like his passing really woke
me up. I also was, like I said, just engaged.
And then I realized that like I was going to
fall down this rabbit hole and most likely have to
check myself into rehab or just stop. And I didn't
tell anybody at all. Actually when I decided to stop,
because I never stopped, so I never went one day

without alcohol from when I would say around twenty one
to twenty two up until five and a half years ago,
like it was seven days a week never, I don't
think so, I mean not never. I mean maybe like
the days where I was so hung open, I think
I might be accurate. No, I really like I.

Speaker 3 (41:21):
Think she was actually drinking.

Speaker 1 (41:22):
Maybe, like I just put like my tolerance for alcohol,
that's the thing, And I think maybe I don't know. Look,
I keep going back whether addiction is hereditary or not.
I mean, I don't know. I know a lot of
people who don't have any of that in their family
and they suffer from the disease. But like I just
held my alcohol and there was it came to a
point too where it was like there's not much more

I could drink and I felt nothing.

Speaker 2 (41:46):
You know, So were you waking up and boozing?

Speaker 1 (41:50):
I was no, no, no, no, no, definitely not no.

Speaker 3 (41:55):
But it never affected your relationship together you and I.

Speaker 1 (41:59):
Oh no, did it I.

Speaker 3 (42:00):
Think it did.

Speaker 7 (42:01):
I don't think it did. I just remember when you
stopped you it.

Speaker 6 (42:05):
Was like the funniest thing because it was it was
actually I think the night of your engagement party or
like the day, yes it was. Yeah, you were like,
I don't know what's going on, but if I drink alcohol,
I get hives.

Speaker 1 (42:16):
So I stopped for vanity reasons.

Speaker 6 (42:17):
And then so she was breaking out, like her neck
and her under her eyes face these red spots and
so like, I think the last time I've ever seen
you with like a sip of alcohol was that engagement party.
And then from then on it was just like, no,
it gives me hives.

Speaker 7 (42:31):
No, it gives me hives.

Speaker 1 (42:32):
Yeah, thank God for that, because yeah.

Speaker 6 (42:35):
Months and months later then it was like no, I'm
I'm sober because I know. So it was like it
kind of happened in an interesting.

Speaker 1 (42:42):
Way, but like, yeah, you know, also no judgment for
the way it happens. Just like no, I mean, thank
God for that to happen. I think it was I
think the poison. My body was rejecting the poison. I
mean eventually, right, So I also think part of that
We're Asian too, though I do like, no, no, I
never was that a type of Asian.

Speaker 5 (42:59):
I was were red. I was never man my man's
that type of Asian. Really, yeah, he gets red, he
gets super red. It hurt, you know, it's like he's
like he always says, it feels like it feels like
an allergic reaction in skin.

Speaker 3 (43:18):
It's like hot for him.

Speaker 1 (43:19):
Maybe that's what I just maybe that's why. And maybe
you're right, Nicole, No, I I mean I.

Speaker 7 (43:23):
Get flushed too.

Speaker 6 (43:25):
That's why I don't drink very much red wine, like
like it's the real thing, and there'thing Asian genetics and
there's like an enzyme that helps you break down that
alcohol and if you're.

Speaker 1 (43:34):
Asian, but like deeper than that though, I think it
was my I think I was just the trauma in
my body, like you know, there was not much more
I could numb.

Speaker 2 (43:43):
Yeah, really yeah.

Speaker 5 (43:45):
So do you do you guys fight or is your
relationship pretty.

Speaker 3 (43:50):
Sweet? And can we fight? We fight?

Speaker 6 (43:54):
I feel like our relationship is pretty sweet, and then
when you fight, it's really bad.

Speaker 2 (43:59):
It's bad.

Speaker 1 (44:00):
It's so sad. It ruins my life.

Speaker 6 (44:02):
I can't I get like, like when we do fight,
it's like periods of time where we don't talk, and
it'll be like somewhere between a few days and maybe
like two weeks, and during those two weeks, like I
can't sleep as well, Like my heart is like fluttering
a lot of you know, like you're like you get
like dumb or your like heartache or something like.

Speaker 7 (44:24):
That, kind of like Withdred it doesn't happen very often.

Speaker 2 (44:30):
Yeah, so then why not just pick up the phone.
Who's the stubborn one? And that me?

Speaker 1 (44:35):
I think it's a little bit of both of us
to be I'm stubborn too.

Speaker 2 (44:38):
Yeah, what are you fighting about?

Speaker 1 (44:42):
You know? Family dynamics?

Speaker 2 (44:44):
Like bullshit stuff.

Speaker 1 (44:46):
I mean it's all bullshit really at the end of it, right,
life is so fucking short. It's like what are you
What are we even fighting about? For real? Like who
We're so focused on something that makes no sense. In
about a year or two from now, we'll be laughing
about it, you know, but like it's horrible.

Speaker 2 (45:01):
I've been on this whole trip, Like I know it's
you know, I go through my have anxiety and I'm
on lipoto or lexapro and blah blah blah, you know,
and I got the kids in a life can be
so fucking overwhelming, And then you think in probably one
hundred million years from now, it's just going to be
a big ball of fire this earth. So why do

I give a shit? Right, why do we care so much?
None of it really is going to matter. At the
end of the day, men, bro a, We're all going
to be dead. Human civilization will no longer fucking exist.

Speaker 1 (45:34):
So what is time? There's a ticking bomb, Like we're
just like literally like we're just waiting here.

Speaker 2 (45:39):
That's it.

Speaker 3 (45:40):
This is all very true.

Speaker 5 (45:42):
There is an actual scientific reason for this. I mean,
what you're saying is very rational and makes sense, and
therefore you would think and I think that too. When people,
as we know, actively live in that frame of mind
they call it like a lot of stoics are like that,
where they think more practically about like, well, we're gonna die,

so today might as.

Speaker 3 (46:03):
Well be great.

Speaker 5 (46:07):
And then also we know that gratitude allows us to
like not have that kind of live in that kind
of chaos or anxiety the other But but the reality
is is we're just programmed to be negative bias. Our
brains are just programmed to be negative yeah, biased. So everything,
it's like the most bizarre things become these sort of

like survival instincts that have no use to us.

Speaker 3 (46:32):
But our brain is like totally.

Speaker 1 (46:34):
Brain is like, but we don't listen to our bodies.
Like our body is the most intelligent you know, thing
we each have. Yet I still I can speak for myself,
still follow whatever my brain thinks. It's no, it knows better, right,
but like, really the intuition is so powerful and you're right, like,
but what is the how do you retrain the brain?

You know? And also your brain doesn't know the difference
between a lie and the truth, and it's like what
the fuck? You're like, wait, yeah, and then you believe
your thoughts and they're not even the reality. And then
how you go in this suit?

Speaker 2 (47:08):
That's CBT, that's cognitiavioral therapy right there.

Speaker 5 (47:11):
That's why I say when people ask about happiness or
joy or like optimism, it's like this, these are all
active pursuits.

Speaker 3 (47:19):
Yes, there's no like passive happiness.

Speaker 1 (47:22):
I mean there can be well, right, but it's not consistent.
How No, We're like.

Speaker 3 (47:27):
We're just literally not programmed to be well.

Speaker 2 (47:30):
If you think about it moments, our default is fear.
Our primate fault is fear. That's that's why we have survived.

Speaker 1 (47:40):
Like I'm addicted to fight flight our freeze because that's
all I know, right, Like really, if you think about
every like the timeline of what has happened, and when
I don't have it, it's almost like I'm addicted to
stress in that sense, because then I don't feel like
if I'm not stressed, then I'm lazy. Right, there's no
like gray area with me in my brain. But then,
like I realized, when it comes to happiness, my goal

is never to be happy. It's to be content, like
actually content, because like that is happiness is like and
I'm not. I'd like to say I'm not a fake person.
So it's like I can't fake that, Like I just can't.

Speaker 2 (48:16):
And I'm with you.

Speaker 5 (48:24):
I'm going to give you another word that maybe you
want to meditate on, liberated.

Speaker 1 (48:30):

Speaker 2 (48:31):
And then I want to give you another article I've
been reading.

Speaker 1 (48:35):
Yes, I.

Speaker 2 (48:37):
Just sent it to my family. Lazy brain, lazy people,
it's a sign of high high intelligence.

Speaker 1 (48:45):
Shut up procrastination.

Speaker 2 (48:48):
So I live on this meme, Kate, it's not it's
not a meme, it's an article. And why it made
the funniest joy joke My our brother goes your price
so late that you just read the headline I'm like.

Speaker 3 (49:01):
I did, Oh my god, I didn't.

Speaker 2 (49:05):
Even read the article, but the article was from a
reputable magazine. Lazy people.

Speaker 1 (49:13):
Said that I would love to I will, I will
the full article.

Speaker 2 (49:18):
So crazy, nobody, but the human condition is just so fascinating.
I mean, at the end of the day, we have
all been the therapy for a million years, but it's
so fucking interesting to try to unders I.

Speaker 1 (49:31):
Mean, they don't even know the therapists don't even know
the whole the actual dynamics in the brain.

Speaker 2 (49:36):
No one.

Speaker 1 (49:37):
I mean, so everybody's complicated.

Speaker 3 (49:39):
We're learning. It's a constant. It's a constant. You know,
it's constantly changing battle.

Speaker 5 (49:47):
Yeah or yeah or or you know, you know you're
a dancer, Like that is a great metaphor for life, Like,
in order to feel that uninhibited freedom with your body,
you have to go through so much training and so
much discipline, and a lot of pain goes.

Speaker 1 (50:04):
With that, and you have to let go and all
of it.

Speaker 5 (50:08):
And then when you when you're when you've got all
that discipline and you've done it, and then all of
a sudden, you're like actually dancing and you're in it.
Everything else goes away and you. You're totally free, your
body's free.

Speaker 1 (50:20):
You do hit the fourth state of consciousness. I totally
believe that because it's like when people are like I
have an outer body experience, but that's what it is, right.
But to lead up to that was a lot.

Speaker 3 (50:29):
Yeah, I think life, that's just life. That's the same thing.

Speaker 5 (50:32):
You know.

Speaker 2 (50:33):
I was in a hip hop dance crew called the
Rice Rice Crispy, Snap, Crackle and Pop.

Speaker 3 (50:42):
Yeah, we talked about it a lot of.

Speaker 2 (50:45):
People. People want to know, you know, I mean I
was I trained again named Logic came over and like,
we like practiced before we went out to the clubs.

Speaker 1 (50:55):
Do you have any VHS tape?

Speaker 2 (50:58):
But I wish we did. We would go to battle
all these other crews and like the little.

Speaker 1 (51:02):
That's are you serious?

Speaker 3 (51:06):

Speaker 1 (51:07):
Are you a good dancer? Is he a dancer?

Speaker 3 (51:09):
Oliver a good dancer?

Speaker 2 (51:11):
Okay, well, I'm untrained. Incredible.

Speaker 1 (51:16):
I think you've got talent.

Speaker 2 (51:18):
I can move, I can move dancing with.

Speaker 3 (51:21):
The stars that by the end of it, he'd have
a lot of progress.

Speaker 1 (51:25):
Oh, you can't be lazy.

Speaker 2 (51:29):
I'm not just saying this is a joke. I think
I could win it.

Speaker 1 (51:32):
Okay, down buddy, calm down, I really do. Let me
tell you something. I will train you. Okay, I will
never come out of retirement, but I will train you.
And you tell me if you think you'll win.

Speaker 2 (51:44):
I swear to God I think I can win it
because I have natural ability my body. The problem is right, No,
what do you mean?

Speaker 1 (51:51):
Because it ain't natural? Ballroom dancing is definitely not natural.

Speaker 3 (51:55):
Definitely stiff, stiff, got.

Speaker 5 (51:59):
A like I could put the that's wait your leg? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (52:08):
Can you imagine it's a leg?

Speaker 7 (52:12):
Up so quickly I'm certain that I thought.

Speaker 1 (52:16):
That was like, yeah, no, that is not your leg.
Is that not?

Speaker 2 (52:23):
That's not your leg, that's my legs?

Speaker 1 (52:26):
Stop it, No, it ain't it.

Speaker 2 (52:28):
There's no way that is my leg. Wait.

Speaker 1 (52:31):
First of all, that is you're more flexible than men.

Speaker 2 (52:36):
This is what I'm saying.

Speaker 3 (52:37):
Mobility is crazy.

Speaker 5 (52:40):
Is it really like he can only move them my
leg He can't move them front and back.

Speaker 1 (52:48):
It looks like a mannequin.

Speaker 2 (52:49):
To stop it.

Speaker 1 (52:50):
That's not your leg.

Speaker 6 (52:52):
That is.

Speaker 2 (52:54):
No. I swear God, very flexible man, It's just the
way it is.

Speaker 3 (52:58):
This has been so much fun. Ship Eryl. Your life
is Cheryl, Your life is colorfil Thanks and I'm.

Speaker 5 (53:06):
So grateful that you're so open and sharing those things.
I always think that when people are really open about
their lives, that they've experienced all of the things like
you've experienced.

Speaker 3 (53:16):
It's so helpful to so many people.

Speaker 1 (53:18):
Thank you.

Speaker 5 (53:20):
So it's so nice that you're But let's can we
do a little bit of the rapid fire before.

Speaker 1 (53:25):
We end love? Rapid fire?

Speaker 3 (53:28):
Okay? Who's the better cook?

Speaker 1 (53:31):
Nicole? Actually I took up banking recently. I'm fucking good. Yes,
I don't know.

Speaker 3 (53:40):
Okay, what is your favorite trait about your sister?

Speaker 1 (53:44):
Which one? Who are you talking to?

Speaker 2 (53:46):
Both of you?

Speaker 1 (53:47):
Go ahead?

Speaker 6 (53:47):

Speaker 7 (53:50):
Oh, super loyal, the most person m m person?

Speaker 1 (53:57):
Yeah, period, And for me it would be how she
just has this excitement and happiness for life.

Speaker 5 (54:06):
Oh okay, if you were gonna rob a bank? Hell,
y ever, who would rob the bank?

Speaker 3 (54:17):
And who would drive the getaway car?

Speaker 1 (54:19):
Both? I do both? Okay, Cheryl does vote?

Speaker 2 (54:23):

Speaker 7 (54:24):
I actually feel like sure definitely drive the getaway car.

Speaker 1 (54:27):
Hell, yes, absolutely so?

Speaker 5 (54:30):
Nicholes, Like Nicole, you're like in a van with an
ear wig, like with a thing like talking to her
from the van kind of thing.

Speaker 1 (54:39):
Would I would be the race car driver. I've always
wanted to be wanded. I'm pretty good.

Speaker 2 (54:43):
I feel like Nicole would be in the bank, like
distracting people like she's kind of funny with their kindness,
and she's she's witty and funny, and she'd be like,
oh and then you know, totally that's what happened.

Speaker 1 (54:54):
Yeah, absolutely we should try it.

Speaker 2 (54:57):
Who is your What about your first celebrity crush?

Speaker 1 (55:00):
Well? I wasn't allowed to watch TV, but the only
hour I watched was nine O the original back in
the nineties. It was obviously Luke Perry. I slept on
his face. I had bed sheets where in my dream?

Speaker 2 (55:22):
I guess.

Speaker 3 (55:24):
Nicole Aaron Carter?

Speaker 1 (55:27):
Oh, yes, sorry, I shouldn't be laughed. Sorry, so uncomfortable.

Speaker 3 (55:38):
That's that's right there, Boat.

Speaker 1 (55:39):
Aaron really mouse, I had no idea Aaron or Nick Aaron? Right?
Which they both did Dancing with the Stars?

Speaker 2 (55:51):
Oh really?

Speaker 6 (55:52):

Speaker 5 (55:55):
Okay, guys, what was what was your like childhood song? Like, like, like,
what was the song that was like, oh, this was
my song like my child.

Speaker 2 (56:06):
Like Kate's was Brian Adams, you know, like, okay, yeah.

Speaker 1 (56:12):
Which was I I love that song?

Speaker 3 (56:17):
Yes, Kate's song? Great?

Speaker 1 (56:19):

Speaker 3 (56:20):
It was like Van Halen Jump Oka.

Speaker 2 (56:24):
You were young young when Jump was.

Speaker 1 (56:26):
Around first there was to be forty remember.

Speaker 2 (56:30):
Them Amazing Red Red.

Speaker 1 (56:33):
But I would say it was like my eighth grade
graduation was like Green Day, you know that song. Yeah, yeah,
but it was Atlantis Morissette, I love her still do.

Speaker 3 (56:43):
Jag a Little Pill. That was game changer.

Speaker 1 (56:46):
In my spinner, my CD spinner, I had like Doctor
Dre with the freaking Wet the Leaf, like yeah c LC.

Speaker 2 (56:57):
Yeah yeah, yeah, this time.

Speaker 3 (57:01):
My language that music though you're nine years younger.

Speaker 7 (57:06):
It was really embarrassing. It was Nickelback.

Speaker 6 (57:09):
Yeah, you know that's some photography, of course.

Speaker 3 (57:16):
But those guys are really nice. We we didn't we
interview them, they were on the show. They were so nice.

Speaker 5 (57:23):
Yeah that was Nickelback, right, Yeah, it's like they were
actually really great. I was like god, you know, and
and we had to ask that hard question, which was
did it feel like, like was it hard when people
would make fun of your music? You know, oh, they
were made fun of all.

Speaker 2 (57:43):
The kind of but you know, just laughing all the
way to the bank.

Speaker 3 (57:46):
They're they're fine, They're like a meme.

Speaker 5 (57:49):
They are really Yeah, Alie, you asked the last two questions.

Speaker 2 (57:54):
Okay, it's a two parter.

Speaker 1 (57:55):
It's look at you over how flexible you are? Dude?
That is insanity one more time. So I can't. I can't.
You're totally faking it. There's no way. Am I looking
for the plastic leg somewhere? Okay, go ahead, all.

Speaker 2 (58:10):
Right, if there's one thing that you could emulate that
your sister has, something that you could take from them
that you wish you had, what would that be? And
if there was something that you could sort of extract
from them, take away something that would make their lives
a little bit better for them, what would what would
that be?

Speaker 1 (58:26):
Oh my gosh, Nicole, you do the honors her or
her drive just driving the car, no like ruthless.

Speaker 6 (58:33):
Commission and just ability to like be so wholeheartedly dedicated
to something without and take away something.

Speaker 2 (58:45):
Like like as in like something that like like burns
her that if she didn't have alleviate something.

Speaker 1 (58:52):
You know, there's a lot of choices.

Speaker 7 (58:56):
Uh like like the chatter in her mind.

Speaker 1 (59:00):
Amen's sister like you know a loud yeah, like you
know that we all have.

Speaker 7 (59:06):
I mean that I think that's something that can be burdensome.

Speaker 2 (59:10):
To her at times, such self the negative self talk.

Speaker 1 (59:14):
That's why I used to drink. Yeah, thanks God.

Speaker 2 (59:19):
I wonder if i'd an alcoholic? Am I an alcoholic?

Speaker 1 (59:22):
Well? You know, I mean that's a loodcast that deeper
maybe conversation, yeah.

Speaker 2 (59:34):
Mom maybe no, no, no, no, momm thought I was
an alcoholic. I was seventeen. She used to be like,
and then I hear you around the house with a
little tinkling of the ice going up and down the stairs.

Speaker 1 (59:48):
And like, okay, maybe okay, Nicola, Okay, so what I
would okay, so hmm, her her hope, joy and just
like gratitude for like the present in life, and just

how grounded and empathetic and compassionate she is, even though
that was like twelve things. Okay, no, it's good. And
then I think I would take away just like any
type of worry of the future whatsoever, because all we
can live is now in the present. So they say

that is for sure. It's okay, we all are, we
all are.

Speaker 2 (01:00:40):
It does feel good, though, when you have those moments
of just sort of spinning out because of something in
the future, something you don't have or something you need,
and then being able to really just settle in to
the moment of now and understand that you're creating this
sort of false narrative because of reality.

Speaker 1 (01:00:57):
That's true.

Speaker 2 (01:00:58):
You're creating a false reality that is actually causing you pain.
And they're like, oh wait, and then you're able to
sort of find that place where nothing matters and there's
that relief.

Speaker 1 (01:01:09):
Yeah, you have to get flexible poses in order for that.

Speaker 2 (01:01:13):
Yes, I do like a lever and then I feel better.

Speaker 1 (01:01:24):
Yeah, I can't. This is oh my god, I'm very oppressed.

Speaker 3 (01:01:27):
Okay, thank you so much, thank you, thank you, thank you.

Speaker 2 (01:01:33):
This is really fun.

Speaker 3 (01:01:36):
And and Cheryl, you should dance with Oliver. Oliver, you should.

Speaker 1 (01:01:39):
Actually, I'll come out of retirement.

Speaker 2 (01:01:42):
Yeah, I'll win that ship.

Speaker 1 (01:01:45):
Change your attitude. Okay, you got to change that attitude.

Speaker 2 (01:01:47):
Yeah, I'll change it once I'm on the show.

Speaker 1 (01:01:50):
But for right now, yeah, you know, like that whole
present living. You can't worry about that miracle right away.

Speaker 2 (01:01:56):
Okay, No, I won't, I won't. I'll step by step.

Speaker 1 (01:02:00):
This was so fun. Thank you guys for bretting sas
Thank you.

Speaker 2 (01:02:04):
Nice to be Nicole, appreciate it, y'all.

Speaker 1 (01:02:06):
Bye h
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