David Denman

In another brand new interview, Brian talks to David Denman, who played Pam’s high school sweetheart and former fiancé, Roy Anderson. David talks about finding out there was such a thing as acting school, working with Kate Winslet and her Cheez Whiz, and makes a riveting case in defense of Roy.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
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you get your podcasts. Hey, guys, this is David Denman

(01:26):
and I played Roy Anderson on The Office. Well. Hello, friends,
welcome once again to another episode of the Office Deep Dive.
I am your host, Brian baum Gartner, and today I
am so excited about this our guest today, as you know,

(01:50):
played well. I'd call him iconic. An iconic character on
the Office. He dated everyone's favorite receptionist, He vandalized a bar,
and he threw some punches, or he would have if
not for dwightes Pepper spray. If you catch my meaning,
you know I am bringing on the incredible David Denman today,

(02:14):
a k a. Roy Anderson. Now. David currently is on
one of my favorite shows, HBO's Mayor of Easttown, but
before that, he spent many years playing an ordinary guy
just working in a warehouse. He really has a unique
perspective on the office, right, because his character was on

(02:37):
and off the show for all nine years, and he
went through quite a journey during that time. Today we're
going to talk about that, as well as Roy's standout moments,
his wedding, the Booze Cruise, and much much more. We're
also going to bring up some big questions for David.
Was Roy a sympathetic character, do we think he cheat

(03:00):
it on Pam? And most importantly, what was in his
trash bag from the pilot. It's a good question, right,
So join me today in welcoming half of Pam and Roy,
or boy as no one has called them ever. David Denman,

(03:23):
Bubble and Squeak. I love it, Bubble and Squeak, Bubble
and Squeaker, cooking it every month, left over from the
night before. David, what's happening, brother? What is going on?

(03:51):
Oh my god, it's been so long. How are you.
I'm good, I know I was. We were just trying
to figure out last time I saw you, I think
was at your wedding when I don't remember when that was. Gosh,
that is just so that's just disgustingly too long. It's
all right, Oh my god, all right, Well we are
we're going to get in to a lot, but I

(04:13):
want to start back at the beginning. You're from California,
but you end up getting accepted and go to Juilliard,
which basically what that means to me is you knew
what you wanted to do pretty early. Is that true? Yeah? No,
I knew I wanted to be an actress since I
was a kid. I remember I went and saw that

(04:35):
movie The Black Stallion when I was a kid, and
I must have been six when it came out, I think,
and my dad took me. I never forget it, and
I remember going, I want to be that kid, and
it was the ongoing joke in the family, like David,
You're not going to be a jockey. It's just not
gonna happen. And then shortly after that et came out
and I was like, I want to do what that

(04:55):
guy's doing, and uh my family was just like, what,
we have no idea what to do with you? And so, uh, yeah,
I knew from a young age all these pictures of
me dressing up in costumes, running around and you know,
pretend me too. Did you have any family connection, I mean,
being from California, did you have any family connection to
the business or anything. No, nothing at all. You know.

(05:16):
My dad was a draftsman and my mom my mom
worked like as a receptionist. Basically, I had no connection whatsoever.
I actually didn't even hear of Juilliard until I was
in high school. And I remember there was a kid
named Michael his adorf and he was like a real
actor because I grew up in Orange County, which is
about an hour from l A. And he would go

(05:37):
up and do commercials and do bit parts and movies
and stuff, and so, you know, I was like, oh, wow,
you're really doing it and uh. And he was like, well,
I'm gonna go Tom, I'm gonna apply and try to
go to Juilliard. And I said, what is that, because
well it's an acting school. And I was like, there's
schools for acting. I mean, it was that naive. He
was like, yeah, dude, Robin Williams, Kevin Klein. I was like,

(05:58):
what they went there? He's like yeah. I was like
blown away. And then I went because I was a
terrible student and I knew I wasn't going to go
to college, no that my family had gone to college.
And then I, you know, went down the rabbit hole
of like, wait a minute, I can go to school
for acting. And so a friend of mine went to
the American Conservatory Theater. They had a summer training congress

(06:18):
the summer before my senior year. He was a year
ahead of me, a guy named Craig Brewer who went
on to be a writer director of Hustle and Flow
and Black Snake, Moan and Dolomite is my name another one. Anyway,
he's been very successful. But he was an actor when
we were in school, and he went and I was like, oh,
I'm gonna go there. So my whole senior year was

(06:40):
all about going to act summer program. And then once
I did that, I wanted to go to the you know,
the grad program, but they wouldn't let you in and
for two years you had to have two years of college.
So I went to junior college for two years, and
I was like, I'm gonna do as many plays as
I can do here, and do you know, take some classes,

(07:01):
and and then I'll apply for a c T. And
then I figured, well, from applying there, I might as
well apply to all these other schools that I want
to go to. And Juliard was at the top of
the list and an n y U and Harvard had
a program, and so I went up an audition for
Juilliard and Harvard the same weekend they did it like

(07:22):
in San Francisco, and then that Monday, I got a
call from Juilliard saying, hey, we'd like to offer you
a spot, and that was like my top choice, so
I was like what Yeah, of course, So I didn't
even do the other auditions and awesome A end up
getting getting into the Harvard program as well, and I
was like, thanks guys, but I'm I'm gonna go here
and stand there like good for you. Have fun. That's incredible.

(07:46):
So you moved to New York? I did. Yeah, I
moved to New York And yeah, I had no idea
when I was getting into I mean, like I said,
no one in my family went to college, so my
idea of college was dead poets society. I was like,
I know what New York City was like or what
a campus was going to be like. And I walked
into Lincoln Center and I'm like, oh, this is interesting.

(08:06):
I mean, this is all before the Internet or you
could just look everything up. This is like here's a pamphlet,
here's a couple of pictures of what are the inside
of our school? Looks like like you have no idea.
It was definitely not Dead Poets Society. There was no
beautiful what was that Princeton? I think they shot that
or something. Yeah, beautiful campus. Right at this point, were

(08:26):
you interested in film and television? I mean you referenced
your friend who was going and doing commercials and stuff
or or for you was it was it theater? You know?
It was theater? Was was everything? I mean I kind
of like I remember when I was in junior college
and having a conversation with a buddy of mine, this
guy Todd Kolezack, who we were doing rosen Crants and

(08:46):
Guildensterner Dead, and I was like, yeah, I just wanted
to do theater and something. He's like, what are you
talking about, dude, why don't you go try to do
film and TV? Like, I don't know, I don't know.
And I remember one of my teachers I was like
reading this play and he was like, what do you
What are you reading? And I'm like, oh, that's this
new play just came out of New York And he goes, Okay,
you need to read more books. I go what do

(09:08):
you mean? He goes, why are you reading a play
that somebody else already did? Why don't you read a
book so you can do the the original version of it,
you know, and some movie or something. And I was like, wow,
I think these people have a lot more faith in
me than I have in myself. And and and those
those conversations did start sparking like, well, maybe I'll go
and give it a shot. And and then I went

(09:30):
to New York. I went to school, which was a grind,
and I saw all these really talented people come out
and just get beat up. And I went and did
a summer Shakespeare festival in Utah, and there was a
guy who had come out of another grad program a
few years before us, and he had spent I don't
know five ten years out of grad school doing theater

(09:52):
and he was just then going to go to l
A and try to break in. And he was so
impassionate about it. He was like, don't wait, don't wait,
I go what he goes, there's one time when you
come out of school where they're all interested in you.
I wish I would have capitalized on it when I
had the shot, and I didn't. And now I'm starting
from the ground up again, and it's it's going to

(10:13):
be brutal. And if you get out of school and
there's interest, get on a plane and go to l A.
And so that was like the summer before my senior year.
And so my buddy who would who was also at Utah,
who was at graduating from Yale School of Drama, he
had already done the New York thing before he went
to before he went to Yale, and so he was like,

(10:35):
I'm going to l A. We should go together. And
I'm like, you're crazy, what are you What are you
talking about? And I had family, you know, in Orange County,
So it wasn't like that crazy to do. But I
just thought I would at least spend a year in
New York and like capitalize on all those theater connections
and trying to do some regional theater. And and then
I did one play right when I graduated, and like

(10:57):
Shakespeare by the Sea, I think it was Shakespeare on
the on the Sound. I don't even know. It's something
real Wheat and Connecticut. We did so many of these
same summer things. By the way, that's actually which we've
never talked about, but anyway, you did one show. I
did one show. I was making like two fifty bucks
a week. I couldn't even pay my rent. It was
like that was good. I was good. I was like,

(11:19):
I'm so excited to get that job finally. And I
was like, this is terrible. This is not gonna this
is not gonna work. And so I remember July fift
my buddy I was like, Hey, I've got to go
to this wedding up in Oregon. You want to take
a road trip. And I hadn't been home and over
a year, and I was like, yeah, yeah, I'm gonna
come back and let's take that road trip. So I

(11:39):
came back. Luckily, I had an agent that had a
West Coast office. Come to find out afterwards that that
doesn't mean anything. That she had She had a meeting
with me and was like, hey, yeah, if you ever
feel like coming out to l A, just let me know.
She was like the owner of the company. And I
was like, yeah, no, seriously, I'm I'm I'm probably gonna
do that. She was like okay, but she she told

(12:02):
me later that she was like, you know what, we
just say that to everybody when we're signing them. But
like we work as two separate offices. Like if you
didn't get anything, I would have sent you back and
really like, well, that's just such a lie. She's like, well,
you know, what are you gonna do again? This is
like before digital and not only tax but even email.
I mean, this is like right when email is started. Man,

(12:24):
I had a page that I'd get a pager to say, hey,
you got an audition, called the page your number back
and be like what is it? And then I had
to go to the office to print out the sides
and print out the appointment sheet. But anyway, I long
story short, I came in and I booked my first audition,
which was for e Er and at the time that
was like the number one show on TV. And my

(12:45):
agent was like, you should consider staying and uh and
I said all right, And my buddy was already here
and he wanted to stay. He was like, let's get
an apartment. So we got an apartment and I never
went back. I mean I went back, god twenty years
later or to work, but never, you know, to go live.
You were l a based based immediately, Yeah, within a

(13:08):
couple of months of graduating from school. So and then
so you get this role on the Er, and so
things were just really easy from then on out right.
I mean you just just you just exactly, it's just
you never stopped working, No, it was. It was a
good first year and then a good second year. I
got that movie The Replacements about a year after I graduated,

(13:31):
and that was the one that was the big shocker.
When I'm doing that movie and it's a you know,
one of those big studio films, and you think this
is the life, this is I'm just gonna leave this
set and I'm gonna go to the next one and
then the next one, and I'm on my way. And
then I didn't work for a year and I was like,
oh no, this is this is not gonna this is
really gonna be tough. But you know, you get little

(13:53):
gigs here and they're a couple of little guest stars
on TV shows and you know a voice over a
commercial that you know, you know, it's just like you
someone told me a long time ago. You're like juggling,
you know, all these different aspects of your career and
you've got to have all of them going and because
when one of them is down, the other one hopefully

(14:14):
is up and you just gotta keep juggling him until
something happens. So I got lucky. Yeah, you know, it
was grateful. So this British show called The Office comes
out with Ricky Gervais. Now did you watch the show
when it first came out available? So I had a
buddy of mine from New York who we did to

(14:34):
talk with Theater Festival another summer Stock. He called me
and it was like, David, you've got to watch the show.
It's right up your alley. It's hilarious. And I hear
they're doing an American version of it. You've got to
get on it. And I was like, okay. And he
never does that. He never did that with any He's
never done a sinse. So you were like, done, okay,
I'll just get on like I'll make a call. And

(14:57):
I did watch it. I was like, oh my god,
this is genius. And I called my age and immediately
and my agent said, do you want to do that?
And I go what I think? Well, they're just looking
for like improv comedians, like I could improv at Juilliard.
What what do you talk? Just because I didn't go
to UCB or whatever doesn't mean I don't I can't
do that or don't want to do that. And in
his defense, at that point, that was like the third

(15:20):
incarnation of a British TV comedy that was somewhat successful
that they had brought over and they've bombed over and
over and over again, and so he was just like, here,
it's gonna be another one of those. And uh, I said,
just get me an appointment. And at that point they
had already cast John and Jenna and all those guys
they were and so he called me back and he goes, old,

(15:42):
there there they have the part of Roy. When you
want to go in for that, it's a guest star.
And I said, yeah, yeah, get me in. So I
went in and gave my audition for all those guys
and which people can see on the internet, and they
called back and give me the job. So you know,
I've done a bud show, movies at that point, a
bunch of TV. But without a doubt, that's the thing

(16:03):
that everything we have shifted. It's like you get on
the number one show, even though it wasn't number one
right away, it took a long time, but you get
on a show that was talking about and all of
a sudden, doors open up and opportunities and talk about
that big break. But it's like I had a lot
of breaks along the way to get me there, and
luckily I had more breaks afterwards. You know, like you
gotta keep getting those breaks. They someone's got a smile

(16:25):
on you somewhere to to keep it going, because it
doesn't doesn't just keep happening. You know, Had you done
much comedy at all, or no, I've done comedic movies
at all, dramatic television. That was the irony the second
I did the Office, all of a sudden, everybody wanted
you to come to comedy and that was like, great,

(16:45):
I'm happy to do it. And then the thing that
drove me crazy, and I don't I don't know if
it happened to YouTube. I'm sure it did. I would
walk into these auditions and they would go, I had
just improvate, like to do in the office, and I
would go, no, no, no, no, no, no, I'm on
the office. So I can tell you for a fact,
this isn't all improved. There's actually really amazing writers that

(17:06):
are writing all these jokes and they're throwing them at us,
and you know what, they're even adding more jokes to
it when we do another take. This isn't all just
our genius that made that show work. Hello, guys, like,
I'm happy to do that for you, But if you
want me to write your show, like, that's a different
job title. I'm happy to perform it. But but it's

(17:26):
but don't don't say like they do in the office.
There was improv for sure, but the majority of that
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(20:19):
my Heart Radio app or wherever you get your podcast.
When you started working on the show, so you you
had seen the British version, you were a fan of that,

(20:40):
and we start working on the pilot. What were your
first impressions, either with working with people or on how
things went during that pilot shoot? Because you had well
way more experienced than me, but more experienced than a
lot of the folks, right, So how was it to you?
What were your first impressions? Well, you know, I think
I only have like that once seen in the pilot, right,

(21:01):
come in with the trash bag, which you don't know
what is in that trash bag, whether it's human hand
or something. It was just for some reason, the timing
wasn't working. Something was off, and I remember Ken Coppas
was like, hey, let's take a break, and we went downstairs,
and of course I was panicking and what happened? What
did I do? You know? And John was like, no, man,
they're doing this all the time. They're like there, We're

(21:22):
constantly taking breaks to just clear the air and then
come back at it. And I think a big part
of that is because you know, we had those of
us who had seen the show. It's hard not to
have that impression, you know. And when you start imitating
somebody else you know as well as I do, you're
in trouble because you're never going to do it as
good as the person who did it originally. UM, So

(21:44):
you've got to do your own thing and you've got
to find your own voice in it. So I don't
know if that had something to do with it or what,
or it just happened to be, you know, hey, let's
just shake it up. And so we went downstairs, came
back up and did like one more take and it
was like, great, we got it. I was like, oh,
oh that was easy. And then it was, you know,
a year later before we started filming. You know, it's
like we had to wait to get picked up and

(22:05):
then wait and wait. It was like, actually, no, we
shot that stuff. It was in the fall. It was
a year later that it aired. It wasn't until like
April or whatever that we found out how the show
would turn out. Right. Jenna had a conversation with me
about backstory. She had a journal about your relationship with

(22:27):
the relationship between Pam and Roy and her history. Did
you work with her on your initial backstory or were
you Were you involved with that at all. I was
receptive to her ideas it was her show more than
it was my show. I was just a guest star
on it. But we did talk about it. You know,
with all of those things, it's so important to create

(22:47):
a backstory. But yeah, we did have to go how
long have we been together and you know when we
start dating? And how did it? You know, we did.
We did share those conversations, and I don't know that
too much of what I said shifted anything I. I
was just more amenable to her ideas, you know, I
was like, yeah, I think that's probably right. I think
they probably kind of fell into this thing and then
they kind of got into a rut and just kept

(23:08):
going along, and you know, clearly they weren't happy in
their relationship, or at least Roy wasn't happy enough to propose.
And then, you know, the nice the fun thing about
that show is those talking heads where you you could
hear characters in her thoughts, you know, and so often
in television, you're not the characters don't evolve. They want
the same thing every week, and they want to see

(23:30):
that dynamic and how it plays out, but they don't
see a character make a shift or a change. And
so I was lucky enough to have this like, oh no,
Roy's gonna lose her, try to win her back, and
it was like this different character to play in season three,
and that was really fun to do. And and then
when I found out that he didn't ever really truly
evolve by the end of it, you were like, oh no,

(23:52):
the old Roy's back. And then they, you know, they
nicely gave me a great little send off in the
you know, final season of the evolved Roy or whatever,
which was cool, right. You talk about how trying to
imitate somebody else's performance, right, So it's was Lee in
the British version. Did you feel like pretty quickly, you know,

(24:13):
the character of Roy evolved from that original British version
or became more tied to you and your sensibilities. Yeah,
I think so. I mean, you know, there's also that
British the reserve, you know, like that guy could be
just stoic and just kind of like uh and didn't
say much that that Lee character was kind of like

(24:34):
that and uh. And they gave me more more things
to do, more funnier things to say, and be a
more of a meat head, you know. And you know,
I went to high school with a bunch of meat heads,
and a lot of them I didn't like. So this
was my opportunity to make fun of them. I got
to carry that with me for the rest of my life,
you know. But but yeah, I mean it was they did.
They did right to that. I think. Also the whole

(24:55):
show just sort of evolved after those first six episodes.
It got its own voice when they didn't have those
scripts to to go to and and they had to
write for us, and they did you know, I mean,
I'm sure you're at least aware, you know that there
has been a lot of sympathy toward Roy actually and
his plight. You know, for a long time what what

(25:19):
would you call emotional cheating that she wanted to be
with someone else. My question is is that was that
a conscious decision? I mean, I guess talk a little
bit about the importance of bringing that humanity to Roy,
which gave him a depth that maybe on other shows
wouldn't have existed. Well, I gotta say, you know that
was Greg Daniels. We had a conversation between season two

(25:43):
and three and he, uh said, I want to make
Roy more of a rival to Jim. And I said,
I don't know how we're going to do that because
he's a he's pretty much a meat head, and we've
pretty much painted him into a corner that I don't
know how anyone would ever want to be with this guy.
And he laugh and said, well, I think we can,
and I know that you can as an actor, and uh,

(26:05):
we're gonna write towards it. We're gonna try to make
it happen. And I said, look, in my opinion, the
only way that there's a chance at that is, if
Roy is able to realize he's screwed up and try
to make amends or make it better somehow, and then
you might have a shot of rooting for him. Unless

(26:25):
he does that, I don't know how you can because
he's so thick headed. And he said, yeah, I agree
to I agree with that, and that's what I was thinking,
and I said, okay, cool, and then we had it
like in this season three, like the first episode there's
a talking head of the wedding has been called off
and and he just has this one moment where he says,
I gotta winner back. Yeah. It was definitely a conscious

(26:48):
effort of you know, this guy was you don't realize
how much you miss something and until they're gone. And
but at the same token, like I don't necessarily know
that they were the right match for each other. I
think gets also like you're gonna lose that thing, and
so you don't want to lose it, and so you know,
he was definitely in the doghouse trying to trying to
win her back, and you know, and there are moments

(27:10):
that they got to where you're like, oh, maybe this
is gonna happen like maybe they'll push it off for
another couple of seasons of them getting together, but no,
it was the season three arc. But yeah, you know
it's funny. I always say, like, because early on, man,
I get a lot of hate on the social media.
You're such a jerk. I hate you. But I would
always say, just please everyone, don't ever forget that, Hey,

(27:31):
I'm cheated on Roy. Like he may have been a
numb soul and not a great boyfriend, but come on, like,
Roy isn't the guy that was doing that. Do you
think Roy never cheated? I don't know. I don't know.
I don't know. That's a good question. I don't know.
I never thought about it, but I never did on camera.
You never did on camera. That's we don't know what

(27:52):
that character did. I did Roy probably cheated early on
in their relationship. I would be. I would guess he
just treated her so poorly. Yeah, he didn't really have
much respect for her, and I think it was probably
when she called it off that all of a sudden
did have respect for him, and it was like, oh okay, right,
So in Booze Crows, I mean it occurs to me

(28:12):
as you're talking that it feels like, really about you
sensing something between Jim and Pam and just wanting to
stop it as opposed to really wanting to be with her.
Is that is that how you viewed it? Did you
talk to Greg about it at all? No? I didn't.
We didn't talk about it, but it felt that way,
and when we shot it, and that it was a rivalry,

(28:35):
it was also I have to do this, you know,
and he saw them flirting with each other and just
blurted it out. So yeah, we didn't really talk about it.
But yeah, I think that's fair to say that he
was more interested in shutting that down than really being
so madly in love with Pam. I don't think that
that was the case. And also he had quite a
few drinks, you know, and was like festive and like

(28:58):
all right, let's just do this thing, you know, like,
let's just do it. We could deal with the ramifications later.
I'm sure he woke up the next morning and was like, oh, no,
we did, so boy, what do we do? Um? There's
fan theories. Do you think Roy ever cheated on Pam
with Angelo? Definitely did not. You know, I don't even

(29:20):
think he knew Angela's name. I really don't. I don't think.
I don't think he was. It was that invested. But
I haven't watched them back since we originally did them,
so maybe there's a lot more in there that they edited. Yeah. Well,
but there's also a fan theory that Kevin is a
secret genius who embezzled millions of dollars from dunder Mifflin
and and he knew what was going on the whole time.

(29:40):
So it's certainly possible that that they know more than
I do. I do have to ask you about this.
It has become, I guess, one of my favorite stories
in life. But right around this time, mid season two,
Steve gets nominated for a Golden Global Ward. And do

(30:01):
you remember that we met at my house and you
drove us too. You drove a group of us to
the Beverly Hilton, and my recollection is a Honda Civic
and we showed up like the Beverly Hillbillies to the
Beverly Hilton for the Golden Globes where we were on

(30:22):
the rooftop, not allowed in the actual room. And we
drove up and they were like you morons, like there's
no valet, this is a red carpet, and we're not
taking your car, and you were like, no problem, guys,
I'll go park, and you like had to park miles
away and walk back. Do you remember this story? I

(30:44):
swear to you I do not, but I'm not surprised
that is an awful answer, don't. I wish, I wish
I remember that. I remembered us being upstairs at that party,
having quite a few drinks, and when when Steve won,
like it was like we won the super Bowl, like
so pumped and so excited for him and the show.
But now that you're saying and I'm putting it all together,

(31:06):
like literally right now, and I do remember being at
your house, you don't remember. I'm sure I did. And
I had, God, I had an old, beat up Honda
was a Chord Chord. It was a four door. It
was old and beat up though, I mean it was
my old, agents old car. My car broke down and

(31:27):
I needed a car. I said, can I can? I
can I buy your car? And she was like, uh, okay, yeah,
just uh just pay me back when you can. I'm like,
I need a job and she was like okay, Like
she I was driving her car around for a couple
of months before I had enough money to pay it off.
It was only like or something, but it was like
it was an old beat up car. So we pulled

(31:48):
up like along the side of Wilsher Bulevard and you
were like, you guys, get out, I'll go park who
alway was in the car with us, Oscar and Angela
at least I can't fully remembering. It's become one of
my favorite memories of the time. And um that line.

(32:09):
I wish we knew we were in the good old
days while they were happening, because that, for me, it's
just kind of just the purity of that no limo,
no red carpet. I didn't even know that we were
invited on the red carpet. We may have kind of
walked through and people were like, who are they don't
you're not allowed in the room. Nobody knew we were.
I was surprised that we even got the invite to

(32:30):
the NBC party on the roof. You know, so many
of those parties, like early on shortly after that, we
did get like cars to go to like the SAG
Awards and things like that. Right, yes, no, yes, we
didn't remember ever driving to another one of those parts. No,
that was it. That was it. I think that was it.
I do remember we went to the SAG Awards, I

(32:52):
think it was the year later maybe, and we partied
so hard. It was like we thought that that party
was for us, Like the open bar. We were like,
oh my god, this is amazing, and everyone's looking at
us like, oh my god, you guys, and we're dancing.
We took over the dance floor, the dance floor, and
like it was so much fun. And now when I

(33:14):
go to those parties, I always see those like first
year shows and those kids doing the same thing. I'm
not doing that anywhere because now I know it's a
work party. Have a drink, say hello everybody you know,
and keep your head down. But like, yeah, that innocence
of us was pretty palpable and everyone everyone was smiling
and having a good time with us. On the latest

(33:42):
season of The Next Question with Katie Correct podcast, Katie
dives into Well Katie Here, exclusive podcast only conversations between
Katie and the people who made her memoir Going There Possible.
We spent a lot of time together around a dining
room table here and in the city, and you know,
it was a very intense experience. All episodes of Next

(34:04):
Question with Katie Couric are available now. Listen on the
I Heart Radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get
your podcasts. If I could be you and you could
be me for just one hour, if you could find
a way to get inside each other's mind, Walcome Mile
in My Shoes. Wacome Mile in My Shoes. Shoes. We've

(34:26):
all felt left out, and for some that feeling lasts
more than a moment. We can change that. Learn how
it Belonging begins with us dot org, brought to you
by the Act Council. Welcome Mile in Shoes. I'm Colleen
with joined me the host of Eating Wall Broke podcast.

(34:47):
While I eat a meal created by self made entrepreneurs, influencers,
and celebrities over a meal they once eight when they
were broke. Today I have the lovely aj Crimson, the
official Princess of Confident Asia kidding, and this is the professor.
We're here on Eating While Broken. Today, I'm gonna break
down my meal that got me through a time when

(35:07):
I was broken. Listen to Eating While Broke on the
I Heart Radio app, on Apple podcast or wherever you
get your podcasts. What was it like coming back to
the show when you would be gone for a bit

(35:28):
and then you would come back. Well, those early days,
because I wasn't in every episode, you guys were so
stir crazy, like stuck in that room with the same
faces to look at for twelve hours a day, all
day long. So when I would come in, you guys
were so like, hey, even, oh my god, there's another
person here. And you guys were so excited to see me.

(35:51):
It was so much fun. Um it was. It was hilarious. Yeah,
you know, that show evolved over time, and everybody's evolved
with it, and everyone's kind of star broke out in
different ways and different things, and it was a different show.
It was a different show those later years. Everyone was
still very nice, but you were there. We weren't driving

(36:11):
to an awards ceremony and your beat up Honda everyone. Yeah,
I remember that, Like, what was it, season three? All
of a sudden, everyone pulls up in new cars and
you're like, it was like, oh, all right, I guess
everybody was going to be around a little bit. Yeah,
did you have any conversations with Greg when you agreed

(36:32):
to come back with your new fiance? Uh? And you
invite Jim and Pam to your wedding. Did you have
any conversations with Greg about what you wanted in terms
of resolution to the character. That was all that I
did come to find out, like that John was always
sort of pitching to try to get me around, uh,

(36:53):
stir up some of that conflict that they had those
early years. That was fun stuff for us to play. No,
I mean, you know there was. I did that one
episode in five and then and then they brought me
in for the threat level Midnight or something and uh,
and they cut me out of that episode. So I'm
only in the extras of that. And then they called me.

(37:15):
That was the crazy one. Was that Jim and Pam's wedding.
They called me with that crazy pitch that now is
out there. I was shooting a movie up in Maine
and they were like, can you come in to do
this Niagara false thing? And I was like, I don't
know that I'll be able to, Like, we had to
carve it out of the schedule. And so then they
did carve it out. And the last second they called

(37:37):
and said it's not happening, and I was like at
all and They're like, not happening. Riding in on a
horse in the middle of the way. I mean, it
was so crazy. I'm so glad somebody stepped in. It
was like, guys, I think they were jumping the shark here.
This is a little bit too much. It did not
feel at all like what Roy would have done either

(37:58):
when I was being pitched in or told it. But
I didn't have any any say in that at all.
But I was so grateful that they that they pivoted
at the end. And I thought that that episode was
a beautiful episode and I loved how it ended. And
sometimes people get locked into an idea and they think
that's the best thing, and then and then when when
they're forced to pivot on something, all of a sudden,
something even more beautiful comes out of it that you

(38:18):
don't anticipate often. And I think that's a perfect example
of of of an episode that turned out that way. Yeah, well,
it's so crazy because I think that bond of our
early times we got so close, Like you know, even
when you would leave for a while, we may have
jumped to you because we wanted somebody else to look at,

(38:41):
but it was never like oh that guy is back,
like you were always a part of the ensemble. I'm
sure that has to do with how the show started
and what we were born out of. I've always felt
that way. I couldn't agree more. I did never Yeah,
people's excitement was not nothing about like anything other than
a new face and look at and talk to me,
like what have you been up to? But it was.

(39:03):
But we did all bund even for me, who was
not in all of the episodes. But those early years
I remember so much just hanging out and playing video
games and the trailers and yeah, I mean, but you know,
a big part of that too is who was steering
the ship of Steve. You know, he was the most
humble guy, and here he was by the time we
shot the pilot, and by the time it aired that

(39:24):
second season, one of the biggest movie stars around at
that planet, and he was still the same guy, humble,
down to earth, excited about the same things creatively, would
listen to you, and you know, it was just like
and that's he's still that guy today. I mean, I
remember I just ran into him, not just but like

(39:45):
right before COVID we were in the parking lot. We
talked for like an hour, like and it was just
like like no time had passed between the last time
I saw him and then, and I've been in a
lot of shows that a lot of people and people
as famous as he is, and that is not always
the case at all. He's a special human and um,
I always say he's my favorite actor I've ever worked
with and been around because his talent as as he is,

(40:08):
he's just that nice as a human being. Yeah. Basically
every single person that I've talked to over the last
couple of years, I've said exactly the same thing. Kind
of just doesn't get any better in terms of his
talent or just his decency as a person. Had a
tremendous impact on not just the show but all of
us individually. And it's hard to it's hard to put

(40:30):
that into words with other shows, and people have asked,
and I can't put my finger on it other than
just being a professional, always showing up on time, doing
his job, and always making everyone's day better. Yeah, that
is exactly what it is. He always showed up, He
always worked as hard as he possibly could and was
working harder than anyone else, and was still decent and

(40:52):
kind to everyone that he interacted with forever. And you know,
he taught me a really important lesson him, and I
mean it's like name drops Central, but Robin Williams as well.
This sort of mantra of it takes just as much
energy to be nice than it does to be an ass.

(41:13):
I mean, it's kind of is as simple as that,
do your job and do it excellently and at the
same time be kind to everyone around you. Yeah, it
seems so simple, but it isn't always the case, you know.
I know. So after the office you've been busy, continuing
to work hard and return to some drama. I want

(41:38):
to just for a few minutes, because this is selfish.
I loved your performance and the show, Mayor of Easttown,
So congratulations on that show. How is that to work
on for you? Just as lovely as you can imagine?
Kate is as great as Steve is. Kate's equal part

(41:59):
as a hug and being and as an actress. She's
just so down to earth and so great. Yeah, all
of those things you know I just said about Steve,
just take them and dump them right on over to Kate.
The thing it was great from talking about background and
all that stuff that Jenna was doing with her character
from the get go. You know, we had to do
all that stuff with our characters, because we had twenty

(42:20):
plus years of a relationship and a lot of stuff
that had gone down that we had to know and
had to figure out. And so you know, that was
our rehearsal. That's all we did. We got together and
we just talked with her and I and UH and
Jeans Smart and Gowery, with the writer and a director
and just flushing out all of that history because you

(42:43):
have to have that history to play that subtext. And
if you if we're not both thinking about the same
thing when she's saying our grandson is blinking again, if
we both don't know that's the same thing that our
son did, you don't have that history, you know, you
can't play that moment. So yeah, we got to do
all of that stuff. And Uh, it was a crazy experience,

(43:04):
just in the sense of we had to get shut
down for COVID for six months and then come back
and then I had more hair at the beginning of
the season than I did at the end. But we
shut it all together, and you know, it's like stuff
like that, You're like, God, this took a lot longer
than anyone anticipated. Kate was so so specific about detail,

(43:26):
and uh, you know, like she would do these things
and it's like most people wouldn't you know, wouldn't appreciate it.
But as an actor, I'm watching her and I'm just going,
oh my god, again she's she's doing that, and it's
all behavior stuff like she grabs the cheese it and
she puts the cheese whiz on and I remember, and
I just watched her in the moment when we did
the rehearsal. She goes, I gotta have I need like, like,
what's that cheese spread stuff? Like I need that. I

(43:49):
want to put her like on a cheese it or something.
And they were like, okay, let's find some cheese wizz
and and it. I mean, she must have done twenty
takes of that, pouring it on and eating it. They
never saw her eat it like it cuts it before
and it was like, no, she almost pukes that day
just to get that bit and you didn't even use it.
Her mind worked, you know, in such creative ways of

(44:11):
really digging into that character, and she spent a lot
of time with you know, detectives and being in that area.
I I got to listen to accents of people in
that region, and it was an amazing experience. It was great.
It was all the stuff you hope it would be
when you sign on to do one of those. Yeah,
you talked about behavior, because we've talked about that quite

(44:32):
a bit. That character behavior was so much a basis
of what The Office was, and I think it's really
about the characters and those behaviors and not painting the
quote unquote bad guys as bad guys or the idiots
as just idiots. That there's a complexity and a depth

(44:52):
to the character that is so vitally important. I think
I agree with that sentiment about The Office, I resolutely.
I just love that type of comedy too. That's grounded
in reality that makes you so uncomfortable you have to
you have to laugh or some people can't take it.
I have friends and be like, I can't watch that stuff.
It's just too it's so uncomfortable. What he what he says,

(45:15):
those things, and I just eat that up. But it's
it's grounded in reality and behavior, and it's about also
character development and obviously a huge journey and arc with Roy,
but so much of the work that you have done
over the years that that attention to detail and character
is there throughout and I admire you so much as

(45:37):
an actor, and you know, want you to know how
our even if you don't fully remember our Honda car ride,
those early days and the time that we shared and
getting to watch you work was always such a pleasure
for me. So thank you David so much for your
work and and for for joining us today. I appreciate
you so much. Right back at you, I've always been
a fan and I'm excited for you to be doing

(46:00):
these deep dives. I mean, like, it's crazy how long
this thing has lasted. It's a beautiful thing. I'm grateful
for it. It's crazy. I'll close by asking you, then,
why do you think that this show is bigger now
than it ever was when we were shooting? Oh boy?
I mean I would just go back to something Steve

(46:23):
said when we first started doing it, and he was like,
this is not going to be everyone's cup of tea.
We have to let people find this show. If we
try to make it like what's already out there and
it's not gonna work. We have to do our own
thing with it. They had done office comedies before, and
they'll do them again in the future, but ours was
unique at the time. You know reality TV was had

(46:45):
been in our our our universe so that we could
use that format that I don't think anyone had really
used that format, and I think that's that's unique about it.
And frankly, because you have streaming, no one is going
to try to do this right now, because why would
you if you could just go watch The Office, You're
not gonna try to do the same thing. So I
think he's gonna last. It's going to continue to last,

(47:07):
I think, and so many people go back to this
like comfort food. It's like me putting on Sports Center
to that and just your lax. Yeah, awesome, Thank you
David so much. Thanks for coming on the problem brother.
Good to see again. David, You're the best. I enjoyed

(47:40):
that so much. You are an actor's actor, and I
for one am fascinated by you and all of the
characters you have created with such intelligence, depth and sincerity.
So thank you so much, and for talking all about Roy,
who I dare say is one of the most overlooked
actors on the Office. Thank you for joining me, my friend,

(48:03):
it was indeed my pleasure. The rest of you, We'll
see you soon for new episodes in the Brian Baumgartner
podcast machine. Is that a thing? I don't know, but anyway,
I'll see you next week for another episode of the
Office Deep Dive. Until then, be very very well, my friends.

(48:30):
The Office Deep Dive is hosted and executive produced by
me Brian bam Gardner, alongside our executive producer Langley. Our
producers are Emily Carr and Diego Tapia, and our intern
is Hannah Harris. Our theme song Bubble and Squeak, performed
by my great friend Creed Bratton, and the episode was
mixed by Seth o'landskip give us silver attention. We need

(49:13):
everything you've got fast. Waiting on Reparations would beat the podcast.
Tune in every Thursday politics and wordplay. We fight for
the people because they got us in the worst way,
from the Hill Cooper, the Bombay to Kant, from the
left Enclave to what the neo kanz. Every Thursday the
heavy conversation and to break us off with some break
because we're waiting the repas. Listen to Waiting on Reparations

(49:36):
on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever
you get your podcasts. M Hey, Elizabeth, you're the co
host of that new podcast Ridiculous Crime. Yes I am.
You know what's ridiculous? Yeah, carpeting in kitchens and bathrooms.
Oh wow, you are good. But you know what's also ridiculous?
A sixteen year old who breaks into a car dealership

(49:57):
and steals guy theories, Lamborghini. What yes to oppressive Girl?
I'll tell you all about it on Ridiculous Crime, our
podcast about absurd and outrageous capers, heist and cons. It's
always murder free and ridiculous. Listen to Ridiculous Crime on
the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you
get your podcasts. I'm Colleen with join me the host

(50:21):
of Eating Wall Broke podcast while I eat a meal
created by self made entrepreneurs, influencers, and celebrities over a
meal they once ate when they were broke. Today, I
have the lovely aj Crimson, the official Princess of Compton,
Asia Kidding, and Asia the Professor. We're here on Eating
wall Broken Today I'm gonna break down my meal that

(50:42):
got me through a time when I was broken. Listen
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(51:04):
doesn't glorify promoti list of activities. We just discussed the
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