Billy Talks Mental Health With Irene Buchine

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Episode Transcript

(00:00):
You're listening to Food for Thought withBilly and Jenny, brought to you by
the Box Center. For more thanfifteen years, this dining duo has been
eating their way through New England,mixing it up with top chefs, jumping
behind the line of the hottest lestlawns, and giving you the inside scoop
on where to wine, dine andspend your time. So get ready,
it's Food for Thought giving you somethingto chew on. Hey, folks,

(00:22):
welcome into Food for Thought. BillyCosta here and Jenny Johnson and I started
the show. AJ, you're theexecutive producer. How long have we had
Food for Thought on this He startedin twenty eighteen, believe it or not,
twenty eighteen. Yes, it's beena long time. Five years.
Yes. And when Jenny Johnson andI started the show, it was primarily

(00:44):
a food show. And then Ithink over the years we've kind of spread
out to include food and travel andlifestyle and things of incredible interest. And
I think this week is one ofthose shows. It's going to be about
things of incredible interest. For starters. We're coming up on the month of
September, and as it happens,September is Suicide Prevention Month. You've seen

(01:10):
the stories, We've all heard thefun facts. It's crazy how many people
are suffering and eventually dying of suicidein Massachusetts and throughout the country. So
as part of September and Suicide PreventionMonth, we have a special guest in
studio. Her name is Irene Bouchein. She's a mental health advocate, she's

(01:32):
a parent, she's an author.In fact, I've got the books Celia
and the Little Boy right next tome here in studio. Yes, I
have read the book. Irene isalso an educator, and Irene, welcome
to the show. Thank you,Billy, happy to be here. We'll
get to all the very valuable informationin just a couple of minutes. But
I think it's worth telling the listenershow you and I met. Every year,

(01:55):
well, I host a bunch offundraisers over the course of the year.
One of which I've been doing Ithink for like ten years now is
City Year, New Hampshire, andlisteners know City Year is an incredible operation.
It's all over the country. Bostonhas a giant City Year operation.
But you were at the Galla andI'm up there doing a live auction trying

(02:16):
to raise money for worthy causes,and I said, I'll tell you what.
I've never done this before, butI'm going to offer up an appearance
and informational appearance on my WBZ radioshow to the highest bidder. And Irene,
you were the highest bidder and hereyou are now. Weird circumstances that

(02:39):
led up to you being here,but everybody listening is going to be thankful
that you are here. Thanks Billy. I guess I should start with Suicide
Prevention Month. What does it meanand what should we know going into September?
Well, it's a biggie. It'sa big topic. You know.
I don't think unless you're you're reallyliving under your bed sheets. You know

(03:02):
that suicide's a huge problem, andespecially with younger children and younger teenagers.
And I don't have to explain this, just go to Google and get statistics.
But we do know that it's acrisis, and we have not as
a society been able to number oneaddress it in a way that allows that

(03:24):
to be recognized full on as theproblem it is. Why do you think
that is? I've thought a lotabout it for a long long time.
I think that there are so manystereotypes to the idea that someone's brain is
not functioning, it's on all cylindersor on the cylinders, and the way

(03:45):
that people project one should present themselvesthat it makes people very uncomfortable to even
talk about their mental state. Andyou know, we're in a society,
and you and I touched on itbriefly in a conversation that, uh,
everything about what's going on in ourcountry and our in in the world is
a little overwhelming. Where all it'sa little off the charts. People are

(04:08):
are angrier. It seems like they'remore confused, and and even you know,
not just the children, but theadults. There's a lot to pack
it. There's a lot to unpackevery day, you know, whether it's
MAUI yesterday, or it's I mean, or it's a political thing the day
before, or it's always we're sotop top head crisis oriented. And I

(04:31):
think when you keep throwing that muchcrisis at a at a society and then
it trickles down. So I thinkthere's that issue. That's my perspective.
I am not a professional anything.I'm a I'm a human being on the
bus basically, and an advocate.And the children's mental health educator. And
when I first met you and westarted talking about doing this show, and

(04:54):
then you mentioned in fact that it'sSeptember is suicides prevention. I said to
you, I said, I'm soglad you brought that up, because for
months and months now I've been thinkingwhy is mental health in the news so
much? And everything you just saidseems to make sense that everything seems so

(05:17):
stressful now, And I'm sure socialmedia plays at a large part of that.
People have a lot more access toinformation, and the information isn't all
that good so often no, andI think to the point of social media,
and not necessarily, we adults don'trepresent anything more appealing regarding social media

(05:40):
than than what we show to ourkids. I mean, how many adults
are on their phones all the time? How many you know? We say,
oh, the kids, they're onsocial media all the time. They're
always distracted. Well so are theadults. I think the other thing about
accepting or facing this suicidal crisis isthat we were we This generation was brought

(06:03):
up on Daffy Duck and Disney andso many negative characters around around differences,
mental differences. And it's like Timemagazine did a special I think three years
ago called mental health and they wentthrough this whole expose of how many ways
we as in this generation, meaningyou and I have been influenced by the

(06:28):
idea that mental health is a mentalillness. God forbid, it means you're
daffy duck. And who would wantto identify with that? Who would want
to say, well, my kid, you know, or I feel or
so we have a many, manyreasons why we shy from that concept.
But everything has changed in our societyand what's happening now is that social media.

(06:51):
Sure, absolutely, I'm not anexpert on social media. I'm not
going to give statistics today other thanthe ones that are really clearly, you
know, certifiable. Okay, we'llhold that thought because we have to go
to break and I want to talkmore about this topic and generally speaking about
addiction. And you know how somepeople think addiction is a bad thing,

(07:13):
when in fact, it is anillness, just like you know, the
flu, just like any other disease. It's an illness. They're not bad
people, They're sick. They're justlooking to get better. But we do
have to take a break. IreneBouchein is my guest and we'll talk more
right after the break. You're listeningto Food for Thought, Brassy You Buy
the Box Center and Salem Waterfront Hoteland Suites. Hey, folks, welcome

(07:38):
back to Food for Thought Billy Costa. And again we're taking kind of a
different turn with the show this weekbecause I feel fortunate that I met Irene
Bouchein at a city year fundraising galaand she paid handsomely to tell her story
on WBEZ and the money goes toa great cause, and that works for

(07:58):
me. And Irene, we weretalking about the fact that you, out
of nowhere are an educator, you'rean advocate, you're an author and all
about suicide prevention and young people inhow to really see children the way you
should see them or else kind ofa thing. Yes, but it started
in a very personal way for you, right, Yes, yes it did.

(08:20):
I I have one child, andreally, really early on, I
could see that he was struggling,and the schools were telling me he was
struggling and that he wasn't able todo this, that and the other thing
as the other kids were doing.And it was much more high active level,

(08:41):
you know, and that's when theystart identifying add ADHD and all these
other So we started looking into whatis going on from a very early age,
which is something that's really important inmy work because and don't let me
forget where we were. He justwas. But yeah, but we people

(09:01):
tend to think, oh, mygod, my adolescents depressed. How did
that happen? How did they becomeanxious? What's happening now that they're they're
fifteen or they're twenty. And becausethe statistics will show you that there's a
certain like maybe fifteen to twenty fourwhere they're you know, they have this,
things can flip and suddenly they're havingsome of these presentations. But children,

(09:26):
young children can also be suffering becauseit's a it's not a it's not
just a conditional situation which certainly canmake a child unhappy or depressed or whatever.
This is a illness, just likeGod forbid cancer asthma. This is
a neurological issue that can start anywhere, and by the circumstances around them,

(09:54):
can be fed. Yes, absolutelycan be fed. But if they're not
even acknowledged, then you try tomainstream these kids and that the suffering continues,
it gets harder because it's not goingaway because somebody said you should do
this. Now you can do better. It goes away. It doesn't go

(10:16):
away. It's conditioned. You know. Fortunately, we've got so much modern
medicine around things like you know,cancer, so but there are also many
many forms of cancer. Well,there's many many forms of mental illness,
and the ones that are a childwho is struggling with a mental illness has
an illness, and just like andyou hope that you can help them find

(10:39):
a way to manage it and tolive with it and to improve. And
if you don't mind my asking,like, how old was your son when
it first surface? Well, itfirst started really really becoming a problem for
him, I would say, aroundsecond and third grade. Wow, And
how visible would it? I thinkpeople would say, well, you know,

(11:05):
I'm his mom, and I thinkhe's the most wonderful human being on
the planet, and he is.But he would be maybe disruptive or it
was hard for him to to sortof sit down one on one end and
sit still long enough, and andyou know, so those were the behaviors.
But he started becoming alienated and isolatedbecause he was different. And then

(11:31):
the kids start to treat him differently, and then the parents start to treat
people differently, and then next thingyou know, you're really a parent with
a child is struggling with mental illness, is really alone because they're in their
own little bubble of an experience thatno one else number one wants to know
much about. It's not polar it'snot popular. You can't uh, you

(11:52):
can't put it in a box yetbecause nobody knows what box it belongs in.
Therefore, it's like you're something wrongwith all of you. And he
keeps drifting further, and he keepsdrifting, And the worst part about children
who are struggling is the sense ofisolation, and also that people don't know
how to find them, don't Theydon't know what they're looking at. In

(12:15):
my case, I knew I waslooking at something, and I we did
try. You know, we've wentthrough all the other channels of doctors and
situations as the situations evolved, specialschools, all kinds of things to keep
him interested in being here out.All of them had their benefits. None

(12:39):
of them were the answer. Andthis is why I advocate, because what
I think people really need to understandabout their children is that they have little
human beings in front of them,and they can say, well, the
doctors didn't figure it out, orthat one didn't do it right, or
so. I don't know. Butthe fact is that you have to know,
you have to work hard to knowyour child. Well. You talk

(13:01):
a lot about making sure you seeyes, not just you, but everybody,
make sure you see your children.What do you mean by that,
Well, I think the way we'reraised sometimes it's hard for us to see
what's not like us. So ifyou have a child who's struggling, you

(13:22):
may not identify what that is.You could say, you could be a
parent who says, look, justgo to school and get over it.
Yeah, you know, you wantto push it away because you don't understand
it. Number one and number two, why wouldn't you be like everybody else
for God's sakes? Right, Butyou also think he's a kid. That's
right, you know what's right,whatever that's right, and go play baseball
right right? And meanwhile, there'ssomething really simmering inside. Yes, there's

(13:46):
something really wrong, but only youwrong in terms of not identified for you
and also not being identified by anybodyelse, except it becomes a problem.
So what kind of tips would yougive parents who are listening right now in
terms of making an effort to seethem better before something. Well, first
of all, I would say thattalking about mental health is something that should

(14:07):
be part of people's conversations with theirchildren, with themselves. The more we
are able to talk comfortably about mentalillness parent to parent, who doesn't know
a human being on this planet thatisn't suffering somewhere right, whether they're a
child, whether they're God forbids,someone's child who just you know, died

(14:30):
by suicide, whether it's someone who'ssick. But we all have generations of
knowing about this as an issue.The problem is as we try to hide
it. So the way to changethat that story is to try to overcome
the stigma by bringing it into theinto the dinner table or wherever the heck
we are. Kids in this nextgeneration are much more able to talk about

(14:54):
mental illness because they are suffering andthey will say so. So I have
a good point. I have evidencein the next generation. What I need
to want. What I want todo is help parents help their kids get
to this generation. In other words, if they're struggling and they're not being
seen and what do I mean bythat overlooking, not taking it seriously,

(15:15):
not being able to talk about it, not being able to say to your
kid, wow, you seem toreally be struggling, yeah, you know,
instead of just move along, right, I mean because at the point
that you realize your kid is reallyhaving a mental illness, has one,
it's diagnosed, even it's you know, all those things, you turn your
back on that and leave it tothe professionals, and you're a home with

(15:37):
someone who is still going to gointo the dark because it isn't enough out
there that people are helping on aprofessional level. We are the parents of
these children. We should be thefirst line of support, not the first
line of you know, kicking themout. I mean, they're going to
evolve and grow and become healthier ifwe can help them get to those phases.

(16:00):
So don't step away from the firewalk into the fire walk into it.
And I think that what really isa challenge is number one, people
don't want to admit to their ownissues of sadness and depression. We want
to make our kids lives much betterthan ours. Oh yeah, oh yeah,
we all want to make them better. We want to make give them
everything they ever wanted. We wantthem to know they can all go to
college, they can all do thesethings. But the fact is, if

(16:22):
we as human beings have struggled tosurvive, then we have to face that
too. We have to say,look, who am I kidding? I
can appreciate this kid's really struggling.I remember how hard it can be.
We cannot know what it's like tohave a mental illness if we don't have
one. I've learned that. Andby the way, I think it's important

(16:45):
to point out that mental illness doesn'treally have an income level. Especially in
the business that I'm in. We'realways talking about and reporting on celebrities in
their lives, and it just seemsmore and more now we're seeing very successful
celebrities say I'm stepping away from music, I'm stepping away from acting. I

(17:06):
need to focus on my mental illness. That's something you really, I mean,
think about old Hollywood. They wouldnever come for their agents. Their
managers would say, you can't saythat right, all of a sudden,
it's okay, And I think that'sa good sign. But anyway, we
got to take a break. We'vegot Irene Bouschein and again, not only
September is right around the corner,but it is suicide prevention month. And

(17:30):
by the way, don't forget schoolsare getting back in session two. We're
just a week or so away fromthat, and that brings a whole another
set of pressures on the young people. So maybe that's something else we should
talk about too. Anyway, we'regoing to take a break. Its Food
for Thought. I'm Billy Costa andwe will be right back. You're listening
to Food for Thought brought to youbuy the Box Center and Sailing Waterfront Hotel

(17:53):
and sweets. Hey, folks,welcome back to Food for Thought again.
I got a point out when Jennyand I started this show. I'm shocked
that's five years. Ah. Theexecutive producer just informed me. It was
strictly a food show. Then wekind of advanced to travel, introducing people
to new places, new places togo out and need new places to find
good experiences, and then it wasabout lifestyle and wellness. Jenny does a

(18:15):
lot of segments on wellness, andbecause September is suicide prevention a month,
we figured why not dedicate at leastone show to that, And Irene Bouschin
is our guest and Irene, youcame in with a list of points you
definitely wanted to get in before thisshow ended. Why don't you give us
two or three in the next twominutes. Okay. The first thing I

(18:37):
have learned about mental illness, andI want to remind you I didn't know
about it until I was living witha child struggling. So we learned through
experience. And what I came tounderstand still I find so fascinating is how
much pain children with mental illness arein. They are physically in pain,
silent pain. It's this silent pain. You can't see it. But when

(19:00):
they say, you have no idea, it hurts, you know it hurts.
This hurt It is hurting. Andbecause it's hurting, you want to
because you can't see it, youdon't want to own that, you want
to say it. Come on,but I have seen the pain it has
caused, and you know it hurtsso much that children who aren't being supported

(19:21):
in enough, with enough support,will choose not to stay. Yeah,
they and I say, choose notby choice, but by the illness,
like any other illness that can takeover and win and put and make you
know, and someone will die andwith illness. I want to have to
think that some parents might be afraidbecause their instant reaction is to blame themselves.

(19:45):
Well, that's facing a truth.Yeah, I mean, I think,
I think, And when we getinto the book, the fact of
the matter is is if we can'tacknowledge that we're not perfect, and and
if we can be human with ourchildren who are so human. Yeah,
they're so human. And if youcould just be straight with them about your
own failings but not oh, Ifailed in school and I know what you

(20:06):
mean. Don't try to know whothey are right, right, right,
but just admit to shortcomings and failuresso that they don't feel like they're jumping
up mark like people who are overexpecting their children to be educationally extreme,
you know the top ten. Ina lot of cases, the children grow
up, they may have you ona pedestal and they're afraid to let you

(20:26):
know that they're not on that pedestal. They have problems and they're afraid to
address them, and in some cases, so are the parents. But anyway,
hold that thought. Because it's aradio show. We have to take
another break. But you mentioned yourbook, and we're going to talk about
your book. I have it inmy hands. Celia and the Little Boy.
It's a quick read, yes,and it's a fun read, ironically

(20:47):
enough. But we'll talk about thebook when we come back. You're listening
to Food for Thought, brought toyou by the Box Center and Salem Waterfront
Hotel and sweets. Hey, folks, welcome back is Food for Thought and
again a very different top pick forthe show. Occasionally we focus on travel
and lifestyle and sometimes wellness. Jennyis huge in the wellness world. But
knowing that September is coming up andit is suicide Prevention month, I figured

(21:11):
one art dedicated show to that topic. And Irene Bouschein has been my guest
and she's with us for the restof the show. And you wrote a
book, Irene, and it's aCelia and the Little Boy, and you
know, I think you can getthrough it in ten fifteen minutes. And
my first question is the illustrations inthe book? Who did those? Really?

(21:33):
Are you an artist? On topof everything else? I think I
am. You know, I thinki'm I have a lot of creative skills
and I've never said, oh,I'm an artist, but I'd love to
draw. But it's interesting because youweave the illustrations through the storyline. And
the illustrations, although they're subtle insome way, they send a strong message,

(21:57):
like they get the points across.So what made you write the book?
Well, I didn't choose to writethe book. The book chose to
write chose me to write it.I started one morning I woke up.
I've been writing memoir for a longtime, and I had a dream one
morning, and my paper was bythe bed with a pencil, and I

(22:17):
saw this little girl sitting on astairway and I drew her quickly, and
then I saw that she was distressed, and she was going up and down
these stairs and I didn't really knowwhy, but this is still in a
morning, you know, dream state, and I saw I didn't know what
she was doing, but I knewshe was distressed. Well over time,

(22:38):
I started to let her lead me. And then then the next day or
two, I saw there was alittle boy under the under the stairway,
and then I saw that she wastrying to get him out from under the
stairway. And then I saw thathe was telling her to go away,
and he was angry with her,and I and the whole story took me
three years to write, and Idid not know what I was writing.

(23:00):
I did not know the point ofthis story exactly until I was two thirds
of the way through it and realizedthis is a creative nonfiction, so to
speak, because it is represents whatit is like to love someone who doesn't
want to be here and is struggling, and how much it takes how much

(23:22):
time, patience, determination and beliefin the future, belief and hope it
takes to take somebody through to wantto stay when they are not willing.
So there's the boy under the porchand then the girl who by the way,
you meet the girl on page fiveof the book. I see you're

(23:42):
right there on the stoop. Yes, yes, but at funny on the
very first page. Yeah, pageone. I know. In the world
of rehab and recovery and even athe general message is one day at a
time. But you've chosen in thebook to use one inch at a time.
How come? Well? In thestory the light, the hope comes

(24:03):
from a little inchworm that's found onthe ground underneath the stairwell where the little
boy sits by himself, and watchingthat little inchworm be undaunted by you know,
rocks and old nails or anything.As he's crawling through the darkness,
it becomes well life, something thatwe're following that is moving forward, regardless

(24:26):
of whether we are or not.And and the little boy becomes curious about
that inchworm and then becomes invested inthat inchworm's ability to get outside, which
is what the inchm wants to do. It's very deep. I this has
this story. First of all,I use this to help people understand how
to reach a child and why whyit's so important to show them, no

(24:52):
matter where they're at, how importantit is to be alive. I wanted
to ask, who do you wantto read this book? Who should read?
Well? I would like parents toread it to young children, and
I would like children ages eight andup to read it on their own because
it never mentions exactly what anyone's conditionis, but it brings you through the

(25:15):
experience of being stuck in the darknessand what it feels like. Yeah,
and the messages are throughout the book. I mean, what we don't realize
some of these young people are goingthrough in their own heads. That's right.
They're convinced, you know, theworld is a terrible place. They
are, yeah, and it's Imean, I know it has its moments,
but but they're convinced. And unlessyou can prove otherwise to them,

(25:37):
and unless you're willing to be therewith them enough to just be able to
point out first of all, numberone, that they're amazing. That they're
being in this universe makes them anamazing human being that I believe in my
heart that everyone is here to befully present and have a life. And

(26:00):
where can people get the book?Well, the book is is on my
website, which is at Irene Boucheendot com. It's also in some of
the local bookstores and it has beenon Amazon, but I think it's not
there anymore. But that's my faultbecause I haven't sent the more books.
Should it be in the classrooms?Yes? In fact, I just did

(26:22):
a workshop with my very dear friendand also mental health advocate, former Supreme
Court Justice John Brodrick in New Hampshire. He also met John has Yes,
of course, that's how we met. A city year. I talked to
him for a while, So Johncool is that I met and talked and
he's a fan. Yes, Johnand I Justice John and I speak together

(26:48):
and I started a workshop called whatdo I Say? When Do I Say
It? Because I think the hardestthing for parents is to know how to
talk to their kids about mental illnesses. So I started this workshop and I
also have created material for discussion forparents so that we can start breaking through
that icicle of fear and start allowingmental illness and mental health to be part

(27:11):
of what we pay attention to.All Right, we're going to get to
some of those materials, but wedo have to take a break. It's
Food for Thought. I'm Billy Kashta, and we'll be right back. You're
listening to Food for Thought, broughtto you buy the Box Center and Salem
Waterfront Hotel in sweets. Hey,folks, welcome back to Food for that
kind of a serious show this week, but for a good reason. With

(27:32):
Suicide Prevention Month coming up in September, and I've got Irene Bouschin, who
was an author and an educator andadvocate. She's had her own story in
her own family, as have alot of us, and so we kind
of know what it really means comingup on something like Suicide Prevention Month.
Right before the break, Irene,you mentioned Justice broad Rick, Yes,

(27:53):
and what an incredible human being heis. Yes, and you're very close
to him. Yes, we becomepartner advocates because he thinks my book should
be I think if I quoted andwe would say in every school in the
country, everyone should have this book. That's John's take on my book.
And the reason is because it doesn'tit helps people understand what's going on with

(28:18):
children, and it helps the childrenidentify with themselves. If they're sick,
they say, oh my gosh,somebody sees me. And that's number one.
We need to see these kids,and we need them to know we
see them so that they don't continueto give up and say nobody sees me,
no one understands me. I'm outof here. So this book is
much to my joy is saving livesand I know it and John will use

(28:42):
the book. But John also isa speaker. And when John, because
he's basically retired as a justice,he retired as it spends all of his
time advocating and speaking on mental illness. Right. In fact, he just
did a TED talk that is nowavailable. Just look for John Brodrick Ted
talk and you will hear what hetalks about. And what thing the one

(29:03):
thing I think is the most remarkableis that children are starving to talk about
mental illness and mental health, andthey know people around them, They hear
about what's going on. They mayeven have friends that they've lost. Anything
could happen. So for us topretend we don't know it's real, or
to not be able to address itis a shame and it's life threatening.
Well, isn't it an interesting ironythat as mental illness and mental health has

(29:26):
become so much more prevalent for onereason or another, ironically, that I
think has made it easier for youngpeople to talk about it correct young people.
I am very close with advocates anda lot of people who've lost their
children who started organizations and our advocates, and these people are on fire to

(29:49):
not let anybody else lose their life. Yeah, and the children. One
of them is Charlie Olsen was themayor the you know what they call it,
the year the mayor for the yearsorry sue student student governor in New
Hampshire one year and he started tohave a mental illness issue that came up.

(30:12):
His parents took wonderful care of him. So he's an advocate. He
that was his platform mental health,and he was ten or twelve or something.
And also, I'm very close nowto a lot of young kids who
have grown up to become healthier,who want to talk about mental health.
And they use my book and theyuse me to help break the ice around

(30:33):
this conversation. And so John whathe does when he does speak, he
stays at the end of every lecturehe gives and kids get in line.
I mean we're talking for forty fiveminutes. They'll stand in line and they
hug him and they cry and theysay, oh my God, my brother
and my cousin, myself, andthere, you know, there I think
he does from eighth grade to seniorsin high school. He said, the

(30:56):
lines never quit because there's no onethey can talk to. So this is
a generation starving to be able totalk about this, this problem, this
this you know whole that they arealways facing that they can't talk about,
you know, so they talk aboutit amongst themselves. But John and I

(31:18):
and and you know, all thegreat organizations like Nammis and Nammy and Connor's
Climb in New Hampshire and Reach One, Teach One, Loved One, people
are really trying to bring awareness tochildren's mental health. And that's because we
are trying to save lives and tolet people have it, have it as
a discussion and access it and notbe afraid of it so that we can

(31:41):
move forward and become a healthier society. Well, let me ask you this,
I mean, you know, becausewe'll be talking about Hey, don't
forget September is suicide Prevention Month.What are a couple of things that people
really need to focus on, peoplereally need to know as we approach suicide
Prevention Month. Well, first ofall, it shouldn't just be one month
a year. The reason it hassuicide Prevention Month is so that that we

(32:04):
can highlight the problem and there'll beconferences and if you go to your you
know, to Nami Nami National orthey will they have on their websites,
you know, suicide Prevention Month andall the things that are coming up.
It's often a time for gatherings anddiscussions. And I was part of a
kickoff or Suicide Prevention Month actually wasmental Health Awareness Month. But regardless this

(32:30):
kickoffs, they're not one and thesame, No, they're separate. I
think that one is suicide prevention,I mean mental Health Awareness Month. I
think is may okay, but sothat's okay twice a year, yeah,
yeah, and they should have oneevery every week, you know, because
the fact is, the more wecan talk about it and not wait for
this these moments of glory, youknow, the more we can normalize the

(32:54):
illness. It's not you know,do we normalize cancer, do we normalize
asthma? What do we do withthese illnesses? We try to help people
manage their lives with their conditions.These children who are sick are sick.
They're not there's nothing wrong with thesehuman beings. Exactly. There's diabetes.

(33:16):
It's an illness exactly, And whatwe need to do is know, let
them know that they can they canmanage it, and we're there to notice
it, to to stick with themand to help them get through it,
to manage it. It won't beeasy, necessarily, it's not fun when
you go for treatment and for youknow, for diabetes or any you know,

(33:37):
any illness. But the fact isis that it's what we do to
survive. So what do we needto do. We need to make sure
these kids know that surviving matters,that we love them, that they are
unique, that they have so muchto offer. The universe, whether it's
being a great car mechanic, whetherit's discovering the next you know, tire,

(33:57):
whether it's becoming a physical assist.It doesn't matter, Like you said,
it doesn't matter what their lifestyle is. What matters is that they stay
and do the and become the personthey're meant to be. So with the
Suicide Prevention Month, as an advocateand an educator, will you be book
solid? And September I am notbook solid, although I hope in the

(34:21):
years to come i am. ButI am definitely speaking at a conference in
New Hampshire coming up, a twoday conference on anti bullying and the lead
as if that wasn't a big enoughproblem now is cyber bullying And it's so
much easier to bully now. Andyeah, and kids feel more and more
isolated, they feel like they're beingpeat up, you know. And because

(34:44):
I'm so familiar with how many lossesthere are young losses, thirteen year olds,
fourteen year old, six year old. No, the youngest I personally
know about as a ten year old. But the fact is is that to
be that young and to feel sohopeless is to me is a sign of
somebody not seeing that their child wasfeeling hopeless. You know too, that's

(35:05):
the we have to pull curtain backso that we can really see these see
our children. Hey, don't youhave a podcast on the way. I
do have a podcast. It's aboutto launch in September. It's called Through
Darkness Together, One Inch at aTime and it really can't get pretty dark

(35:29):
and it Yeah, I want peopleto know it can get dark, but
it's also it's also a process.You know, we get through it because
every time we get through it,there's more hope one inch at a time,
one inch at a time out theother side. Yeah, I gotta
ask you before we go to break, how's your son. I'm happy to
say I am proud of him.He's an incredible human being and he's doing

(35:52):
really well. Is he living locallynow or no, he's out of state.
But that's all I'm going to say, because Okay, his life is
his life, and I choose notto put him in the center of any
of this because, you know,living with illnesses is your job and he's
not asking to be putting this.He's likewise with my family, there's only
so much I'm willing to share.Irene is a fascinating lady. I've got

(36:16):
to ask you, though, inconnection with the book Celia and the Little
Boy, what is Celia's Way?Oh, Celia's Way is a program I've
created because I want to work withteachers and educators and parents, any of
those venues to help them go throughthe metaphors. This book was taken apart
by a a psychiatrist at Harvard whotook it apart to it to break it

(36:38):
into its metaphors. He came upwith eight teaching metaphors, which is why
you said this book is deep.Is very deep. But if people don't
know what they these metaphors stand for, they don't get the most important aspects
of the book. So I createda little study guide to help people,
which I send out with the book. Now, Yeah, I got one

(37:00):
with my book. Yeah, Andit's just really it's it helps you go
deeper. It talks about the symbolsof the book. It talks about who
Celia represents, and who's the littleboy, and who's the grandfather? Who
are all these people and what dothey represent? Because they all represent something
that has helped the little boy stayall right, we gotta take one more
break in the show We're going tochange topics completely because I know you just

(37:22):
got back from Portugal and it's myabsolute bucket list, so I definitely have
some questions about Portugal. And itis food for Thought. So if you
had some great Portuguese food, Iwant to hear about it. It's food
for Thought. I'm Billy Costa.Will take a break and we'll be right
back. You're listening to Food forThought, brought to you buy the Box
Center and Salem Waterfront Hotel and sweets. Hey, folks, welcome back to

(37:45):
you Food for Thought. We onlyhave a few minutes left and we're talking
with Irene Machine, who was amental health advocate and educator and author,
and we've talked about the book,which by the way, is great to
have Celia and the Little Boy,and it's obviously all about suicide prevention,
with Suicide Prevention Month coming up ina September. Okay, now you my

(38:07):
bucket list is still to go toPortugal someday. I'm Portuguese. My dad
is from the Azores, San Miguel, and you just got back. We
just got back from say Miguel.There you go. Okay, what's it
like, Well, it's stunning Imean, it's stunning and it's it's breathtaking
because the Atlantic Ocean against the blueskies are are just unbelievable places to go.

(38:30):
Are you know, the the hotpools where there's lava, you know,
water, and there's a wonderful foodand Porta de Gato is just a
festive center of everything. And itwas it was really really just a wonderful

(38:50):
experience. I went with a writinggroup because I'm a writer, and I
went with a writing group, RuthHermann's Circle of Writers. We've traveled before.
This is the first time we everwent to the Azores or I've ever
been, and it's it's really beena remarkable experience. There's seven of us.
Oh my goodness, is beautiful.And you know there's a place they're
called uh Corsito da Furnace, whichis a famous restaurant where they cook this

(39:20):
special slow cooking stew underground with volcanicheat. Oh yeah, a j You
want to take a look at someof those pictures. Yeah, you know,
my sense has always been that it'sit's very clean, and your pictures
are showing me that in fact,it is stunning. It's stunning, and
the people are very hard working andwell they you know, they're all.
Everyone's got their eye on some prize. They're busy, busy business, and

(39:43):
they drive like, oh my god, don't rent a car. You know.
They have little narrow streets and theydrive at ninety miles an hour and
nobody. Everyone just it's if you'rewalking on it, it's on you to
get the heck out of the way. Wow, there really beach is beautiful.
Beaches are stunned. I'm coastline stunning. We went to a tea plantation,

(40:05):
oldest tea plantation in Europe, whichis on there, and we saw
acres and acres of tea because thevolcanic soil helps things grow in amazing ways.
Hydranger which we can always get likeit's like as somebody brought a hydranger

(40:25):
once there and now the whole placeis populated with hydrangea and it's gorgeous.
And it's travel goes to flight asnot as long as people think it's only
like five hours. It's a fivehour flight and it's beautiful. We found
ourselves gliding. We thought we werelooking at the sun rise coming up,
and it turns out we were abovethe clouds and the clouds were so thick

(40:47):
but yet beautiful that we were wewere above the clouds. We thought we
were on land. We we thoughtaround us on the ground. Well,
I think the plan is from myshow Dunning Playbook on Ness and the plan
is for us to take the showand the camera crew to Portugal Memorial Day
of next year. We were supposedto do it two Junes ago, but
then the pandemic hit and we hadto postpone or cancel the trip. We're

(41:09):
definitely doing it in twenty twenty fourthough, and I'm very excited about that.
In fact, shout out to mybuddy Mandy Costa, who owns and
operates Costa Fruit and Produce. Hehas a villa in Portugal. He knows
a lot of people in places inPortugal, and he's going to be our
tour guy when we get to Portugal. By the way, that's Dining Playbook

(41:30):
nine am on Saturday's nine pm Saturdaynights on nesson Irene. Thank you so
much for being here. Thank you. I just want to if I can
quickly thank Delta Dental for supporting me, Will to Live Foundation for supporting me
and John and John MacArthur and riveratankle for all the support they've given me
over the years to keep my bookalive, all right, keep the story

(41:51):
going. Thank you so much,Irene, and thank you so much for
listening. I'll see you on theBilly and Lisa Morning Show first thing tomorrow
morning. We'll see you, byebye