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May 23, 2022 37 min

It’s no secret that healthcare professionals and caregivers of all kinds are stretched beyond their limits. We can’t look to healthcare systems themselves to give us the care and attention we need, so where CAN we go for support (and answers)? Don’t miss this week’s episode with guests Koshin Paley Ellison and Chodo Robert Campbell of the New York Zen Center for Contemplative Care. 


To submit your questions by voicemail, call us at (323) 643-3768 or visit


In this episode we cover:


  • why it’s important to look beyond the identified patient to the invisible web of caregivers
  • the realities of caregiver burnout and stress
  • the one practice you can do even - and especially - when you have no time to care for yourself
  • do you stay or do you go? Making decisions for yourself inside this healthcare system catastrophe

    Guest info and resources:


    Sensei Chodo Robert Campbell is co-founder of the New York Zen Center for Contemplative Care — a non-profit organization that focuses on the teaching of Zen and Buddhist practice with the goal to make them more accessible to people all around the world. His passion lies in bereavement counseling and advocating for change in the way our healthcare institutions work with the dying. Find Chodo and the NYZC @newyorkzencenter on IG, and online at


    Sensei Koshin Paley Ellison is an author, Zen teacher, Jungian psychotherapist, and Certified Chaplaincy Educator. Koshin is a world-renowned thought leader in contemplative care. He is the author of Wholehearted: Slow Down, Help Out, Wake Up and the co-editor of Awake at the Bedside: Contemplative Teachings on Palliative and End of Life Care. His work has been featured in the New York Times, PBS, CBS Sunday Morning, Tricycle among other publications. Find him on IG @koshinpaleyellison


    If you work in healthcare, I very strongly recommend you check out New York Zen Center’s Contemplative Medicine Fellowship. Registrations for the 2022-2023 fellowship are open now.  


    To hear one of my favorite passages of all time, read by Chodo Robert Campbell, check out the first video at this link. The whole video is a lovely teaching from the founders of the Zen Center for Contemplative Care. 


    All of the Zen Center’s offerings, from books to support groups to ongoing educational opportunities can be found at


    Questions to Carry with you:


  • special bonus questions and meditations from our guests! I’ll be back next week with my own QtCWY, but don’t miss this edition!

    Thanks for listening to this week’s episode of Here After with Megan Devine. Tune in, subscribe, leave a review, send in your questions, and share the show with everyone you know. Together, we can make things better, even when they can’t be made right. 


    To submit your questions by voicemail, call us at (323) 643-3768 or visit


    For more information, including clinical training and consulting, visit us at

    For grief support & education, follow us at @refugeingrief on IG, FB, & TW

    Check out Megan’s best-selling books - It’s Okay That You're Not Okay and How to Carry What Can’t Be Fixed - at

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