March 6, 2024 • 42 mins
My guest today is the founder of Feeding Mama - Mona En Ting Stilwell. I first heard about Mona from my Chinese Medicine colleagues and friends who know Mona.
Feeding Mama is dedicated to nourishing new postpartum parents with premium quality essential foods carefully cultivated through the centuries-long sciences of Traditional Chinese Medicine.
If you know anyone expecting in Vancouver, BC, I highly recommend gifting them Mona's nourishing and nutritious meals.
Mona is a Chinese and Portuguese settler residing on the stolen lands of the xʷməθkwəy̓əm (Musqueam), Skwxwú7mesh (Squamish), and Səl̓ílwətaʔ/Selilwitulh (Tsleil-Waututh) Nations. A former Project Manager in software dabbling in filmmaking on the side, her priorities shifted after the birth of her twins. To have viscerally experienced the power of healing through food and connecting to community care in new ways, she then focused her attention on addressing this much-needed (and lacking) resource for families around her by founding Feeding Mama. Follow Feeding Mama on InstagramMark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
What do you love about it?
Okay, so my favorite part of feedingmama is not the cooking part.
It's actually when I deliverthe meals to the new parents.
Sometimes I have an opportunity tostand in the doorway and talk to.
That new mom, new dad, newparent, and that is the best part.
(00:26):
Welcome to Conversations withYour Chinese Auntie Podcast.
Your host, Patricia Peterson, hasconversations with BIPOC folks about
life, shares wisdom, and discussestheir experience with topics like
growing up in an immigrant family,racism, and the sense of belonging.
In this podcast, we givevoice to people of color, and
learn more about their lives.
(00:47):
So, join your Chineseauntie, as she has too.
Compelling conversationswith fascinating people.
Without any further ado, let'sdive head first into this episode.
(01:08):
My guest today is the founder ofFeeding Mama, Mona N team Stilwell.
. I first heard about Mona from myChinese medicine colleagues and friends.
postpartum parents withpremium quality Chinese foods,
carefully cultivated through.
(01:29):
The centuries long sciences oftraditional Chinese medicine.
In Chinese culture and accordingto Chinese medicine, the first 30
days after giving birth are whenyour body is at its most vulnerable.
Chinese elders often remind mothersto avoid going outside in those
30 days, to avoid catching wind,And in ancient times, it was also
(01:54):
considered a no no to wash your hair.
The practice is called sitting the month,or so new moms can be looked after and
recover from pregnancy and birthing.
I really enjoyed thisconversation with Mona.
Mona is fast becoming a dearfriend and my lunch buddy.
(02:16):
Hi, Mona.
Welcome.
Thank you for being here.
Please introduce yourself.
Thank you for the invitation.
I was born Muo Nting, and we settledin Vancouver when I was three,
and then when they put me intokindergarten, I think, it was run by
(02:37):
a Catholic nun organization, and theyinsisted I choose an English name.
They did not acceptEnting as a Valid name.
And my parents let me pick my name.
I was five years old watching a lot ofTV and I chose the name that I heard in
(03:02):
a commercial about plumbing products.
So now I go by Mona.
My ancestry is Chinese andPortuguese via Taiwan and Indonesia.
My pronouns are she, her, hers.
And I am six years post menopause,so I'm fully in my crone years.
(03:28):
I'm currently privileged to beresiding on the stolen territory of
the Squamish, Lusqueam, and TsleilWaututh, also known as Vancouver.
I'm currently running a company thatmakes organic, ready to eat meals for
people that just gave birth using ovaries.
(03:50):
You know, 2000 year old Chineseprescription kind of like boundaries
about what kind of foods to eat.
Yeah.
Feeding Mama.
Yes.
Don't forget to say the name.
Before I ask you to talk about FeedingMama, but I would love to ask because
(04:11):
you share how your name came about,any regrets or would you wish you'd
come back to the Chinese thing?
I have such a good question.
Um, when I went to college, I metan Asian person who had retained
their Chinese name and I was shocked.
(04:34):
I was seriously shocked, like,oh my gosh, this is allowable?
And I just felt the like ancestralpride for that person, like
maintaining their ancestral name.
And I had a bit of regretthat I was forced to do this.
But.
(04:56):
Yeah, I don't know.
I'm trying to weave in my Chinesename here and there, small ways, but
yeah, it was weird because that whole,my mom would call me by nickname.
She'd call me Ting Ting.
So, yeah.
The reason I ask is because a lotof us, even immigrants, when we
(05:19):
change, we were told that, oh, yourname is too difficult to pronounce.
I share this in one of the otherepisodes, when I went to the University
of Victoria, they said I shouldchange Patricia to Pat Boone, because
Boone is part of my Chinese name.
(05:39):
And this teacher said, if you takePat Boone and you put it on the
resume, you'll be more hireable.
You'll be more, uh, attractiveto prospective employees.
Rather than using the Chinese name.
It's that belonging, fitting in thing.
I think that you mentionedin previous episodes.
(06:03):
Because you've been heresince when you were so young.
Do you feel a sense of belong?
Do you feel like you fit in?
The culture, the city.
I mean, yes, and then no, dependingon where I am in the city.
I mean, I grew up in Richmond, so I knowa lot of roads in Richmond and Vancouver.
(06:24):
So there's that familiaritygives you that sense of place.
But as I've become more decolonizedin my thinking, I look at place, like,
although I'm familiar with it, I, Ithink about the thousands and tens of
thousands of years where Indigenouspeople, like, this was their land, this
(06:46):
was their home, these were their, youknow, harvesting area, and But even that
does not, I don't feel displaced by that.
I feel like an honoring is happeningby thinking in those ways and it
connects me a bit more to the land.
I feel like that is respectful.
(07:09):
Please share with us about FeedingMama, your hope for Feeding Mama
moving forward or currently.
As an ex archipelagist, I think this issuch a great service for new mothers.
The beginning of the storysounds, seems selfish, but then,
(07:30):
um, uh, then it gets better.
So, um, I was like 49 and ahalf years old and I'm like, Oh
my gosh, I'm about to turn 50.
And I was growing increasinglydisenchanted with my dream career, which
(07:51):
was being a software project manager.
And I mean, I love, Ilove working in teams.
I like working with people who care aboutdoing good work and it's just more fun.
I love being in a team environment andeverybody working together, but I was
recognizing that a lot of decisions about.
(08:12):
What project we were working on, whatwas more important was driven by a
Rosset priority, which is totallytheir purview because it's, you
know, their company, that's what thestakeholders want, you know, makes sense.
But I knew I could decide whether Iwanted to be a part of that or not.
(08:33):
And I decided, you know what,I actually have some financial
privilege that I can decide not to.
And then if I decided to leave.
A well paying job with benefits, sixweeks vacation, what would I want to do?
And so I started to brainstorm abunch of ideas, potential ideas.
(08:57):
Um, they're really not atall related to making meals.
One was to, was cause mykids were little at the time.
I wanted to take.
Like upcycle vintage, likevintage sheets from value village
into like clothing for kids.
(09:19):
That was one idea because I thoughtit would be good to not be wasteful.
Another idea was to open up a daycareagain, because I couldn't find daycare
for my kids at the time and all thedaycares have massive wait lists.
I thought, Oh, well, this is areally great business when you
know, you're going to have await list as soon as you open up.
(09:40):
Guaranteed.
And the other one was, um, toopen up a, like making videos
for women led tech startups.
I know that's very specific, but I wasin the tech sector and I also went to
film schools and I was at the time makinga documentary about a woman, uh, let's.
(10:06):
tech startups.
So I thought, oh, these videos,which would be like explainer
videos, what they call explainervideos or like pitch videos.
And also feeding mama was, it waskind of like added at the end, really.
And the reason why I thought of it wasbecause when I came back to work after
having my twins, I was telling peopleabout The postpartum meal service my
(10:31):
mom purchased from for me and peoplesaid, Oh my gosh, I wish that was a
room and I had kids like Everybodywas like saying that and yeah, and so
I, I wrote it down on my brainstormlist next to the used clothing idea.
(10:54):
And then I did a matrix oflike potential startup costs.
Like, are you first to market, like allthe, like startup evaluation things, like,
and I waited it and then feeding mamacame out on top because mostly because
I'd be first to market, like I wouldbe an original idea in that I would be.
(11:15):
Doing like a modifiedpostpartum meal service.
I wouldn't be copying the existing format,like what I received, which is, yeah.
So it was more a, a cold calculation.
But then as I started my path, Iquit my job, gave two weeks notice,
(11:40):
and then I started looking for Womenchefs, women, Asian chefs specifically.
And like, Hey man, I live in Vancouver.
There's a huge Asian populationthat shouldn't be too hard.
And it was tough to findan Asian female chef.
Wow.
Yeah.
(12:00):
But then I eventuallydid, it took me about.
Like nine months to find some and thenI went through like a few different
chefs and then I landed on KareemaShalhoub became my like the main chef
who helped create all these recipesthat are gluten free, dairy free.
(12:25):
They don't use refined salt orrefined sugar, so instead we salt
with organic miso and organic tamari.
And tamari is just fermented soy sauce.
Um, and we sweeten withorganic maple syrup.
So she really understood the goalI was going with and she was happy
(12:50):
to play with the constraints.
I think chefs actually thrive, Idon't know, thrive on constraints.
I think we all do.
So yeah, and that's part of how I started.
But doing all the, I did a ton ofresearch about what the traditional
Chinese postpartum food would look like.
(13:14):
And I know I really wantto do something different.
Usually it's Like, you get a containerof meat, a protein, a container of
vegetables, a container of Rice, acontainer of, uh, soup, like that's what
I received, and then you kind of heat upthese things separately and you eat it
(13:34):
and it's, it's very filling, it's good.
And I wanted to offer something morelike everything in a bowl situation,
and, but I didn't really, I couldn'twrap my head around it until around
like 20, 2019, I saw that some placeswere selling something like a map.
(13:55):
They call it a mackerel bowl or agrain bowl, and like, oh, that's it.
There's like a grain on the bottom,there's a big protein, it's grain,
a grain veg, some other veg, there'ssome pickled things, and like, yeah,
this is the form factor I want.
So once I figured that out, then I, Karimawas able to really run with the idea.
(14:15):
I always thought youcook the food yourself.
Oh yeah, I cook it.
But Karima came up with,she developed the recipes.
Oh, okay.
Yeah, yeah.
Oh, that's so great.
I'm curious, it takes guts to quityour job and to start feeding mama.
(14:38):
Was there like one particular thing?
Were there a few signs for you?
Because a lot of people areso afraid to make change.
I think after I started, therewas a lot of coincidences.
coming into my life that really helped me.
(15:00):
Um, and, but I think taking thatfirst step, the step off the ledge,
off the cliff was allowed theuniverse to say, okay, you're ready.
Let's go.
But it was more, I was just reallytired of listening to other people
(15:20):
make decisions that I didn'tagree with my body to sit enough.
You don't want to do this anymore.
I'm like, yeah, I don'twant to do this anymore.
You listened to your body.
It was really, uh, it was like a,an uncomfortable feeling, you know,
in Chinese is that I don't knowhow to say that word in Chinese.
(15:41):
It almost sounds like rice cake.
It's yeah.
No, I don't know.
Anyways.
Um, it's like a very likeitchy, uncomfortable feeling
inside that I need to get out.
I've always had that kind oflike, get out, leave that job.
It's time to go.
(16:02):
When was the last time that happenedbefore you started feeding mama?
I left a job that was extremely toxic.
And I like, this is my managersstabbed me in the back with, they were
friendly to my face, but then they'dsay nasty things around my back.
(16:25):
Managers tell me one thing, but thenthey would change their minds later.
And.
But they not looped mein on conversations.
I was sharing a room with someonethat was, would get so frustrated.
Like they had definitely anger issuesand they threw a pencil in my direction.
I'm like, Oh my gosh,what is going on here?
(16:46):
And this was like in the healthcare world.
So it's like, Oh, like now got to go good.
So good.
Cause I think oftentimes we staytoo long because it was so afraid
of walking away from something thatseems like security, whether it's a
(17:07):
relationship or whether it's a job,I heard, I read somewhere that, like,
Western astrology, uh, Taurus peopleare, they leave things very quickly.
Once they decide to leave, they're gone.
You're a Taurus then.
I'm a Taurus.
(17:30):
I haven't always done that.
I don't think it's bravery.
I just feel like I need to,it's all self preservation.
Yeah.
So things that I was kind of, I'mjust thinking now that have opened
up for me since I started Took thatleap of faith and started feeding
mama was like, besides chefs, likefiguring out and finding chefs.
(17:57):
I was also meeting now afriend of mine, Mimi Young.
She is a animist intuitive, uh,spirit medium, and I've learned
a lot from her, like about.
Things from like spiritual things frommy culture from China about the aging
or the doubt aging and that's reallyinformed like how I approach feeding
(18:24):
customers because just understandinglike, so the balance, like the food
that I'm making sit within a prescribed
Prescription from China, traditionalChinese medicine, which says everything's
got to be cooked for one thing, you gotto eat a subset of vegetables and meat
(18:48):
that will nourish your body postpartum tostay inside, keep warm, all this stuff.
And with under that umbrella isactually like ancient Chinese,
like spiritual thought, the agingand including the doubt aging.
And I didn't realize that wasactually, I was part of this tradition.
(19:12):
And that's really connected me to, like,the esoteric part of my ancestry, which
has brought me so much fulfillment,actually, and, yeah, a lot of, I
don't know, I just feel like I havereconnected with my ancestry when I,
growing up, I, I wished I was white.
(19:34):
So.
Oh, yeah, that's so common, right?
Do you feel that with feeding mama,do you feel like this is something
you would do for a long time?
Or is there something youwant to add some things to it?
Because, you know, yourmind is very intelligent.
(19:56):
It's like, is there, are thereother parts you want to make it
different or bigger or better?
Well, I think you'revery intuitive, Patricia.
Thank you.
That, that has been said about me.
Thank you very much.
Um, I, now that I'm like Like, youknow, Chinese medicine, there's
(20:19):
like this herbal prescriptioncomponent to Chinese medicine.
And so I actually don't use very, Iuse very almost, I don't use hardly any
Chinese medicine in my food because I wastold by my Chinese medicine advisors that
it's, those medicines are too strong.
And unless you know who you'recooking for, there could be
(20:41):
adverse reactions anyway.
So, but on, now I have this interest in.
Herbalism, as they call it in NorthAmerica, and I'm really interested in,
like, growing medicine plants and using itto In safe ways to, you know, if we have a
sore throat or a cough to go to my gardenand pick something like, I like self heal
(21:09):
is a plant that I have used recently forone of my kids that has a sore throat.
So I've been growing a lot ofyarrow and echinacea, haven't
used it yet, but I'm growing it.
But yeah, I'm really interestedin growing vegetables in general
and in feeding them specifically.
I did feel like bigger.
(21:31):
I'm like, oh yeah,fragile, blah, blah, blah.
But I'm like, no, no, no.
. I realize that it's like this is abusiness born from my heart and the
feedback that I receive from ex customershas been that They can tell that I.
put my heart into thefood when they receive it.
(21:54):
And I feel like that would be lost ifit's, uh, if it doesn't come from me.
What do you love about it?
Okay, so my favorite part of feedingmama is not the cooking part.
It's actually when I deliverthe meals to the new parents.
(22:17):
Sometimes I have an opportunity tostand in the doorway and talk to That
new mom, new dad, new parent, and thatis the best part, because I just give
them the space to, like, I ask them openended questions like, how are you doing?
How is your body feeling?
I don't even ask about the baby, I justask about the parent, because no one asks.
(22:40):
the birthing parent, the person whowas pregnant, how their body is doing.
Everyone's asking about the baby.
And so I kind of want to be thisperson that's like, Hey, I want
to care about you, the parentwho just birthed this human.
How are you doing?
And like giving them thatunconditional support and love.
And that's the best partof the feeding moment.
(23:04):
10 years ago, one of my girlfriend gavebirth and she said, same thing with it.
She said, everybody asks about thebaby, you know, even with gifts.
It's always, especially a baby shower,it's always something for the baby.
It's very rarely that you get anythingfor the mommas or the dads, right?
And for me, that was when I thought, oh,right, from now on, if I buy anything
(23:30):
for friends who just have a baby,I buy it for the moms or the dads,
because the majority of the peopleare going to get the baby something.
And when my sister waspregnant, she's like, how much
clothing is to the baby need?
right?
And they grow out of it so fast.
(23:51):
So even if I buy clothings for, one ofmy girlfriends just had a baby in the
States and I bought her a baby clothes,but I bought it for one to two, not
for like zero to three months, becauseshe's going to have so much of that.
Yeah, that's a good idea.
(24:14):
I am curious, in anotherreality, what would you be doing?
I don't know.
I think I might still be tryingto do, pursue my interest
in filmmaking, or, yeah.
(24:40):
I've made two, like one documentary andone feature length film with my film
partner, and that was very satisfying tobe a part of, but it's so difficult to
make a film in that there's absolutelyno money in it unless like funds you.
(25:00):
If you make them, if you make it yourselfand you put it on your own credit card.
No one's gonna give you money forthat, or if they do, like if someone
picks you up for distribution, it's,it's, there's very little money in it.
I don't think many people knowabout that, because people look
(25:21):
at it and go, oh, there mustbe, there must be a good payout.
No, not really.
Like a lot of people make, uh, peoplecoming out of film school, they'll make
a lot of films because they're trying tobuild up a, So like a resume of films and
that they have the ability to do that.
But really, I mean, the end goal isto get funded by a big company who
(25:47):
doesn't care about making more money.
And that's totally, you know, that'sfine, but sometimes it's less about
storytelling and amplifying voicesthat are often not seen in the cinema.
Although sometimes I see things hereand there, I'm like, Oh my gosh,
that studio is doing amazing things.
(26:08):
Like the studio that madeEverything, Everywhere, All at Once.
They're called A24.
And then they just recentlyreleased another film that
was up for an Oscar, I think.
Yeah.
And that's, so they're doing, usuallyit's Asian, South Asian focused films.
It's really heartening to seethat kind of work happening.
(26:38):
When you think about your life, arethere any events that stand out?
That you think to yourself, ohyeah, those will impact and those
will make me who I am today.
Um, Probably would be whenmy Baba died when I was
(27:08):
15 years old, suddenly withoutany like, No precursor, nothing.
And I think that changed me in away that I had, like, I think I
have abandonment issues where Iworry about abandoning other people.
Yeah.
Um,
(27:32):
and then interestingly enough, like, soa year after my dad, my papa died, my mom
remarried my stepdad, who I'm called dad.
And he was estranged with his kids.
And it was just so interesting, um, likethe, the themes that come into our lives.
(27:54):
So did, he was estranged withhis kids and was he close to you?
And you have a sibling, don't you?
Yeah, I have a younger brother.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Um, my, my dad wanted to be close withhis kids, but there was a friction
with his With the mom of the kids andthat prevented contact to be possible.
(28:23):
Just know you talk about decolonization.
You're learning theprocess of decolonization.
Just share some.
Okay.
Because a lot of my listenersalso in that process.
Thank you for asking.
I want to say it's not linear.
Um, And so my first job out ofhigh school actually worked for an
(28:46):
indigenous advocacy organization.
It doesn't exist anymore.
It was a United Native Nations Society.
And I used my BA in sociology to asa caseworker to help people apply
for something called Bill C 31,which allowed folks to apply for
Indian status under the Indian Act.
(29:10):
And I worked with thatorganization for seven years.
And I left it just because Iwanted to get into software.
I wanted to make websites.
Um, and although I worked in uh, anindigenous organization for seven
years, I still had so much to learn.
(29:33):
And I was privileged that I was ableto hear at that time, hear about the
60s scoop, about residential schools.
I never learned that in, in school,high school and entry school.
So I was aware of that and Ihave to admit that I really just.
And I really think about Indigenousrights issues for a really
(29:55):
long time, a really long time.
And Really, and honestly, notuntil I started feeding mama.
So funny enough, like as soon as theidea, like once I landed on feeding mama
as the idea, an immediate second thoughtimmediately was, and I'm going to cry now,
(30:21):
and I'm going to feed indigenous families.
Because I knew that this was a privilegethat I was going to be selling a premium
product because it's not cheap and thatit was important to pay reparations and to
support the community of those that I ambenefiting from, you know, because for the
(30:44):
longest time we used to think, Oh, I, I'ma, I'm a Chinese immigrant, like I wasn't
part of colonization for the longest time.
I thought that I'm like,Oh, I'm free from judgment.
But we, like my parents, you know,Benefited from the colonization, like they
could afford a place to live here becauseIndigenous people were, their lands were
(31:09):
stolen from them only because of that.
My parents had a, could come over, theycould get a job, like do all these things.
So yeah, so Feeding Mama reallyreconnected me to that point of
view again of decolonization.
Yeah, so from day one I've beenproviding 5 percent of gross sales.
(31:34):
To an indigenous, indigenous organization.
Yeah, every, every quarter,I don't make a donation.
Thank you for doing.
Yeah, it's not an easy path.
I have to say that.
We, uh, one thing that I would let,um, non Indigenous people know is
(31:56):
that if you want to work with anIndigenous group or an Indigenous
person that you need to create trust.
And that trust doesn't come withjust meeting someone for one minute.
It takes months and years.
To create that trust and so don'tfeel like, oh, no, it's over with
(32:17):
that person's to like, blah, blah.
No, it's just how, how thattrust, uh, needs to happen.
Because of what's happened totheir communities, they need to
know that they can trust you.
So I came here in 93.
I did not learn anything about the60s groups, residential school,
(32:42):
until maybe 10 years ago when I did.
My own work on it.
It was never talked about.
Best advice I ever got, I dunno who toldme this, but to trust myself and trust
(33:06):
my intuition, trust my inner knowing.
It was probably Mimi.
Yeah.
I'm a people pleaser and so I alwayslook outwards for approval and so looking
inside and having a relationship with me.
First of all, and who I am, it's such ablessing to, to now I'm not 100 percent
(33:29):
there, but I, but to be able to trustmyself and trust my body when it's
like, get out of there, or yes, thisis a yes, do that is, is such a gift.
Would you share how youstarted the process on that?
Because a lot of people, whetherit's because they've had traumatic
(33:50):
events in their life and.
It's really hard to listen, totrust your body, all the intuition.
And I know everyone is different.
Like, for me, for example, I had to geta lot of body work done, therapy, for me
to learn to start to listen to my body.
Was there Anything that kindof helped you, works for you?
(34:15):
I feel like I know, I remember thethings that didn't, didn't work
for me, but that doesn't mean itwon't work for anybody else, right?
I think we just all have to keep trying.
So I listened to a lot of meditationon the meditation apps and didn't work.
You know, I'd find one personwho say something and like,
(34:35):
Oh, that really resonates.
And then, yeah, I know this podcast isnot about Mimi, but Mimi really leads some
great like inner exploration exercises.
And I, I really gained confidenceand it is a confidence thing.
Cause you know, when I first was liketrying to like listen in it, it felt,
(34:58):
uh, I felt like I couldn't trust myself.
Um, Because I think, oh,my mind's making it up.
My mind's telling me all these things.
So it's in a, and yeah,that is part of it.
But also being still andbeing grounded helps.
(35:21):
Having your feet touch thewood of your floor maybe helps.
The grounding helps.
Being in a safe space.
I mean, I think that's something that alot of people don't realize they need.
Um, and that is tough to dobecause a lot of us are in spaces
that are unsafe, so hard to do.
(35:42):
But a safe space where youcan be vulnerable to yourself.
Yeah, I can't really think ofanything else but to try different
things and to love yourself.
I think that's reallythe journey I'm still on.
Last question.
What advice would yougive to new marmosets?
(36:06):
When you mama's okay, like they'vealready had the baby Oh more people what
because for what you do with feedingmama What do you want them to know?
That they're not alone.
That there are people out there,like, family and friends, and maybe
(36:30):
you need to be selective of whichfamily, and selective of which
friends that you can be safe with.
But there's other, what they callmother circles, that are held
by doula collectives, or midwifeclinic, midwife offices, just to find
space that you can feel safe, andyou can share common experiences.
(36:53):
It is so important to feelsafe in how you're experiencing
postpartum and even pregnancy.
It's, um, it is so powerful tobe in a room with someone else.
Who's in the exact same month of yourpregnancy or exact same month of,
(37:18):
you know, three months postpartum.
You're like, Oh my gosh, we're allgoing through the same exact thing.
And it's just so comforting tofeel like vent about certain things
like, Oh my gosh, I don't like.
Regression again, like, it felt likethere was a regression every three months.
Like, oh, the three month regression.
Oh, it's a six month regression.
(37:39):
Oh, it's a nine month regression.
Oh my gosh.
It's just never ending.
And then, but you can complainabout it with the other, you
can like laugh at yourself and.
What have you?
Yeah, entrust yourself.
There's a, I know that one of the,so I had twins as a geriatric mom
(38:01):
and anybody over 35 and is pregnantknows that they're called a geriatric.
It's a geriatric pregnancy.
Um, and I was 47 when I had my twins.
Uh, but it's so interesting.
Nobody said that phrase to me to my face.
It's almost like I'm too oldfor them to mess with maybe?
(38:22):
I don't know.
Anyways, yeah, trust yourself.
I didn't trust myself because I'mlike, I'm too old to know anything.
I don't know it.
The doctors know everything.
And when my babies were born, one ofthem was a little bit lighter in weight
and she was gaining weight slowly,not what the doctors We're expecting
(38:44):
based on a growth chart that is putout by the World Health Organization.
And so I would see these pediatric,uh, doctors and they're like, weighing.
Weigh my baby, measure my baby,and I'd say, so how long, how
often are you feeding your baby?
(39:04):
And it would be, I'm sure theysaid it in a nonjudgmental way.
I felt very judged and, andthey'd suggest I go, you know,
you maybe you should try formula.
And I don't know, it felt like indictmentof my ability and like, this is proof
(39:24):
that I am not cut out to be a mom.
I shouldn't, I'm too old.
This is anyways, I, but I didn'ttrust that like that baby, that
lower weight baby is now likethe taller and heavier baby.
And it's just, every babyhas their own growth cycle.
And I think I knew that inside of methat I didn't trust it and said, I
(39:48):
trusted, um, a pediatrician, which,you know, I definitely want to consult.
Trust yourself.
There's so much, you know, yourbaby, a lot more, you're spent
every single second with them.
Like, you know them so well.
So please trust yourself.
(40:16):
Trust yourself.
What a great reminder.
For many of us, trusting yourselfcan be a tricky thing, especially
if you've had trauma in your life.
So go slow.
Find a therapist or body worker you trustwho can show you that trusting yourself
and listening to your body is safe.
Then practice.
(40:37):
Learning to trust yourself when youhave never done it can be scary.
Practice can look like slowing down,sitting in silence, and paying attention
to how you feel, in your body and heart.
I spent many years ignoringmy body and instincts.
When I started the journey to healing,trusting myself and listening to my
(40:59):
body meant slowing down, skipping aworkout because my body was sore, or
saying no to an opportunity and notbypassing the icky feeling in my body.
Be kind to yourself.
Much love from Yiyi.
Your Chinese auntie.
Thanks so much for listening tothis episode of the Conversations
(41:22):
with your Chinese Auntie podcast.
If you're enjoying the show, pleasefeel free to rate, subscribe,
and leave a review whereveryou listen to your podcast.
That helps others find the showand we greatly appreciate it.
Also, remember to sign upfor our newsletter to receive
free materials and updates.
Links in the website, patriciapetersen.
ca, that's P A T R I C IA P E T E R S E N dot C A.
(41:49):
Again, thanks for listening.
We hope you have a great week, andwe'll see you in the next episode.
What do you love about it?
Okay, so my favorite part of feedingmama is not the cooking part.
It's actually when I deliverthe meals to the new parents.
Sometimes I have an opportunity tostand in the doorway and talk to.
That new mom, new dad, newparent, and that is the best part.
(00:26):
Welcome to Conversations withYour Chinese Auntie Podcast.
Your host, Patricia Peterson, hasconversations with BIPOC folks about
life, shares wisdom, and discussestheir experience with topics like
growing up in an immigrant family,racism, and the sense of belonging.
In this podcast, we givevoice to people of color, and
learn more about their lives.
(00:47):
So, join your Chineseauntie, as she has too.
Compelling conversationswith fascinating people.
Without any further ado, let'sdive head first into this episode.
(01:08):
My guest today is the founder ofFeeding Mama, Mona N team Stilwell.
. I first heard about Mona from myChinese medicine colleagues and friends.
postpartum parents withpremium quality Chinese foods,
carefully cultivated through.
(01:29):
The centuries long sciences oftraditional Chinese medicine.
In Chinese culture and accordingto Chinese medicine, the first 30
days after giving birth are whenyour body is at its most vulnerable.
Chinese elders often remind mothersto avoid going outside in those
30 days, to avoid catching wind,And in ancient times, it was also
(01:54):
considered a no no to wash your hair.
The practice is called sitting the month,or so new moms can be looked after and
recover from pregnancy and birthing.
I really enjoyed thisconversation with Mona.
Mona is fast becoming a dearfriend and my lunch buddy.
(02:16):
Hi, Mona.
Welcome.
Thank you for being here.
Please introduce yourself.
Thank you for the invitation.
I was born Muo Nting, and we settledin Vancouver when I was three,
and then when they put me intokindergarten, I think, it was run by
(02:37):
a Catholic nun organization, and theyinsisted I choose an English name.
They did not acceptEnting as a Valid name.
And my parents let me pick my name.
I was five years old watching a lot ofTV and I chose the name that I heard in
(03:02):
a commercial about plumbing products.
So now I go by Mona.
My ancestry is Chinese andPortuguese via Taiwan and Indonesia.
My pronouns are she, her, hers.
And I am six years post menopause,so I'm fully in my crone years.
(03:28):
I'm currently privileged to beresiding on the stolen territory of
the Squamish, Lusqueam, and TsleilWaututh, also known as Vancouver.
I'm currently running a company thatmakes organic, ready to eat meals for
people that just gave birth using ovaries.
(03:50):
You know, 2000 year old Chineseprescription kind of like boundaries
about what kind of foods to eat.
Yeah.
Feeding Mama.
Yes.
Don't forget to say the name.
Before I ask you to talk about FeedingMama, but I would love to ask because
(04:11):
you share how your name came about,any regrets or would you wish you'd
come back to the Chinese thing?
I have such a good question.
Um, when I went to college, I metan Asian person who had retained
their Chinese name and I was shocked.
(04:34):
I was seriously shocked, like,oh my gosh, this is allowable?
And I just felt the like ancestralpride for that person, like
maintaining their ancestral name.
And I had a bit of regretthat I was forced to do this.
But.
(04:56):
Yeah, I don't know.
I'm trying to weave in my Chinesename here and there, small ways, but
yeah, it was weird because that whole,my mom would call me by nickname.
She'd call me Ting Ting.
So, yeah.
The reason I ask is because a lotof us, even immigrants, when we
(05:19):
change, we were told that, oh, yourname is too difficult to pronounce.
I share this in one of the otherepisodes, when I went to the University
of Victoria, they said I shouldchange Patricia to Pat Boone, because
Boone is part of my Chinese name.
(05:39):
And this teacher said, if you takePat Boone and you put it on the
resume, you'll be more hireable.
You'll be more, uh, attractiveto prospective employees.
Rather than using the Chinese name.
It's that belonging, fitting in thing.
I think that you mentionedin previous episodes.
(06:03):
Because you've been heresince when you were so young.
Do you feel a sense of belong?
Do you feel like you fit in?
The culture, the city.
I mean, yes, and then no, dependingon where I am in the city.
I mean, I grew up in Richmond, so I knowa lot of roads in Richmond and Vancouver.
(06:24):
So there's that familiaritygives you that sense of place.
But as I've become more decolonizedin my thinking, I look at place, like,
although I'm familiar with it, I, Ithink about the thousands and tens of
thousands of years where Indigenouspeople, like, this was their land, this
(06:46):
was their home, these were their, youknow, harvesting area, and But even that
does not, I don't feel displaced by that.
I feel like an honoring is happeningby thinking in those ways and it
connects me a bit more to the land.
I feel like that is respectful.
(07:09):
Please share with us about FeedingMama, your hope for Feeding Mama
moving forward or currently.
As an ex archipelagist, I think this issuch a great service for new mothers.
The beginning of the storysounds, seems selfish, but then,
(07:30):
um, uh, then it gets better.
So, um, I was like 49 and ahalf years old and I'm like, Oh
my gosh, I'm about to turn 50.
And I was growing increasinglydisenchanted with my dream career, which
(07:51):
was being a software project manager.
And I mean, I love, Ilove working in teams.
I like working with people who care aboutdoing good work and it's just more fun.
I love being in a team environment andeverybody working together, but I was
recognizing that a lot of decisions about.
(08:12):
What project we were working on, whatwas more important was driven by a
Rosset priority, which is totallytheir purview because it's, you
know, their company, that's what thestakeholders want, you know, makes sense.
But I knew I could decide whether Iwanted to be a part of that or not.
(08:33):
And I decided, you know what,I actually have some financial
privilege that I can decide not to.
And then if I decided to leave.
A well paying job with benefits, sixweeks vacation, what would I want to do?
And so I started to brainstorm abunch of ideas, potential ideas.
(08:57):
Um, they're really not atall related to making meals.
One was to, was cause mykids were little at the time.
I wanted to take.
Like upcycle vintage, likevintage sheets from value village
into like clothing for kids.
(09:19):
That was one idea because I thoughtit would be good to not be wasteful.
Another idea was to open up a daycareagain, because I couldn't find daycare
for my kids at the time and all thedaycares have massive wait lists.
I thought, Oh, well, this is areally great business when you
know, you're going to have await list as soon as you open up.
(09:40):
Guaranteed.
And the other one was, um, toopen up a, like making videos
for women led tech startups.
I know that's very specific, but I wasin the tech sector and I also went to
film schools and I was at the time makinga documentary about a woman, uh, let's.
(10:06):
tech startups.
So I thought, oh, these videos,which would be like explainer
videos, what they call explainervideos or like pitch videos.
And also feeding mama was, it waskind of like added at the end, really.
And the reason why I thought of it wasbecause when I came back to work after
having my twins, I was telling peopleabout The postpartum meal service my
(10:31):
mom purchased from for me and peoplesaid, Oh my gosh, I wish that was a
room and I had kids like Everybodywas like saying that and yeah, and so
I, I wrote it down on my brainstormlist next to the used clothing idea.
(10:54):
And then I did a matrix oflike potential startup costs.
Like, are you first to market, like allthe, like startup evaluation things, like,
and I waited it and then feeding mamacame out on top because mostly because
I'd be first to market, like I wouldbe an original idea in that I would be.
(11:15):
Doing like a modifiedpostpartum meal service.
I wouldn't be copying the existing format,like what I received, which is, yeah.
So it was more a, a cold calculation.
But then as I started my path, Iquit my job, gave two weeks notice,
(11:40):
and then I started looking for Womenchefs, women, Asian chefs specifically.
And like, Hey man, I live in Vancouver.
There's a huge Asian populationthat shouldn't be too hard.
And it was tough to findan Asian female chef.
Wow.
Yeah.
(12:00):
But then I eventuallydid, it took me about.
Like nine months to find some and thenI went through like a few different
chefs and then I landed on KareemaShalhoub became my like the main chef
who helped create all these recipesthat are gluten free, dairy free.
(12:25):
They don't use refined salt orrefined sugar, so instead we salt
with organic miso and organic tamari.
And tamari is just fermented soy sauce.
Um, and we sweeten withorganic maple syrup.
So she really understood the goalI was going with and she was happy
(12:50):
to play with the constraints.
I think chefs actually thrive, Idon't know, thrive on constraints.
I think we all do.
So yeah, and that's part of how I started.
But doing all the, I did a ton ofresearch about what the traditional
Chinese postpartum food would look like.
(13:14):
And I know I really wantto do something different.
Usually it's Like, you get a containerof meat, a protein, a container of
vegetables, a container of Rice, acontainer of, uh, soup, like that's what
I received, and then you kind of heat upthese things separately and you eat it
(13:34):
and it's, it's very filling, it's good.
And I wanted to offer something morelike everything in a bowl situation,
and, but I didn't really, I couldn'twrap my head around it until around
like 20, 2019, I saw that some placeswere selling something like a map.
(13:55):
They call it a mackerel bowl or agrain bowl, and like, oh, that's it.
There's like a grain on the bottom,there's a big protein, it's grain,
a grain veg, some other veg, there'ssome pickled things, and like, yeah,
this is the form factor I want.
So once I figured that out, then I, Karimawas able to really run with the idea.
(14:15):
I always thought youcook the food yourself.
Oh yeah, I cook it.
But Karima came up with,she developed the recipes.
Oh, okay.
Yeah, yeah.
Oh, that's so great.
I'm curious, it takes guts to quityour job and to start feeding mama.
(14:38):
Was there like one particular thing?
Were there a few signs for you?
Because a lot of people areso afraid to make change.
I think after I started, therewas a lot of coincidences.
coming into my life that really helped me.
(15:00):
Um, and, but I think taking thatfirst step, the step off the ledge,
off the cliff was allowed theuniverse to say, okay, you're ready.
Let's go.
But it was more, I was just reallytired of listening to other people
(15:20):
make decisions that I didn'tagree with my body to sit enough.
You don't want to do this anymore.
I'm like, yeah, I don'twant to do this anymore.
You listened to your body.
It was really, uh, it was like a,an uncomfortable feeling, you know,
in Chinese is that I don't knowhow to say that word in Chinese.
(15:41):
It almost sounds like rice cake.
It's yeah.
No, I don't know.
Anyways.
Um, it's like a very likeitchy, uncomfortable feeling
inside that I need to get out.
I've always had that kind oflike, get out, leave that job.
It's time to go.
(16:02):
When was the last time that happenedbefore you started feeding mama?
I left a job that was extremely toxic.
And I like, this is my managersstabbed me in the back with, they were
friendly to my face, but then they'dsay nasty things around my back.
(16:25):
Managers tell me one thing, but thenthey would change their minds later.
And.
But they not looped mein on conversations.
I was sharing a room with someonethat was, would get so frustrated.
Like they had definitely anger issuesand they threw a pencil in my direction.
I'm like, Oh my gosh,what is going on here?
(16:46):
And this was like in the healthcare world.
So it's like, Oh, like now got to go good.
So good.
Cause I think oftentimes we staytoo long because it was so afraid
of walking away from something thatseems like security, whether it's a
(17:07):
relationship or whether it's a job,I heard, I read somewhere that, like,
Western astrology, uh, Taurus peopleare, they leave things very quickly.
Once they decide to leave, they're gone.
You're a Taurus then.
I'm a Taurus.
(17:30):
I haven't always done that.
I don't think it's bravery.
I just feel like I need to,it's all self preservation.
Yeah.
So things that I was kind of, I'mjust thinking now that have opened
up for me since I started Took thatleap of faith and started feeding
mama was like, besides chefs, likefiguring out and finding chefs.
(17:57):
I was also meeting now afriend of mine, Mimi Young.
She is a animist intuitive, uh,spirit medium, and I've learned
a lot from her, like about.
Things from like spiritual things frommy culture from China about the aging
or the doubt aging and that's reallyinformed like how I approach feeding
(18:24):
customers because just understandinglike, so the balance, like the food
that I'm making sit within a prescribed
Prescription from China, traditionalChinese medicine, which says everything's
got to be cooked for one thing, you gotto eat a subset of vegetables and meat
(18:48):
that will nourish your body postpartum tostay inside, keep warm, all this stuff.
And with under that umbrella isactually like ancient Chinese,
like spiritual thought, the agingand including the doubt aging.
And I didn't realize that wasactually, I was part of this tradition.
(19:12):
And that's really connected me to, like,the esoteric part of my ancestry, which
has brought me so much fulfillment,actually, and, yeah, a lot of, I
don't know, I just feel like I havereconnected with my ancestry when I,
growing up, I, I wished I was white.
(19:34):
So.
Oh, yeah, that's so common, right?
Do you feel that with feeding mama,do you feel like this is something
you would do for a long time?
Or is there something youwant to add some things to it?
Because, you know, yourmind is very intelligent.
(19:56):
It's like, is there, are thereother parts you want to make it
different or bigger or better?
Well, I think you'revery intuitive, Patricia.
Thank you.
That, that has been said about me.
Thank you very much.
Um, I, now that I'm like Like, youknow, Chinese medicine, there's
(20:19):
like this herbal prescriptioncomponent to Chinese medicine.
And so I actually don't use very, Iuse very almost, I don't use hardly any
Chinese medicine in my food because I wastold by my Chinese medicine advisors that
it's, those medicines are too strong.
And unless you know who you'recooking for, there could be
(20:41):
adverse reactions anyway.
So, but on, now I have this interest in.
Herbalism, as they call it in NorthAmerica, and I'm really interested in,
like, growing medicine plants and using itto In safe ways to, you know, if we have a
sore throat or a cough to go to my gardenand pick something like, I like self heal
(21:09):
is a plant that I have used recently forone of my kids that has a sore throat.
So I've been growing a lot ofyarrow and echinacea, haven't
used it yet, but I'm growing it.
But yeah, I'm really interestedin growing vegetables in general
and in feeding them specifically.
I did feel like bigger.
(21:31):
I'm like, oh yeah,fragile, blah, blah, blah.
But I'm like, no, no, no.
. I realize that it's like this is abusiness born from my heart and the
feedback that I receive from ex customershas been that They can tell that I.
put my heart into thefood when they receive it.
(21:54):
And I feel like that would be lost ifit's, uh, if it doesn't come from me.
What do you love about it?
Okay, so my favorite part of feedingmama is not the cooking part.
It's actually when I deliverthe meals to the new parents.
(22:17):
Sometimes I have an opportunity tostand in the doorway and talk to That
new mom, new dad, new parent, and thatis the best part, because I just give
them the space to, like, I ask them openended questions like, how are you doing?
How is your body feeling?
I don't even ask about the baby, I justask about the parent, because no one asks.
(22:40):
the birthing parent, the person whowas pregnant, how their body is doing.
Everyone's asking about the baby.
And so I kind of want to be thisperson that's like, Hey, I want
to care about you, the parentwho just birthed this human.
How are you doing?
And like giving them thatunconditional support and love.
And that's the best partof the feeding moment.
(23:04):
10 years ago, one of my girlfriend gavebirth and she said, same thing with it.
She said, everybody asks about thebaby, you know, even with gifts.
It's always, especially a baby shower,it's always something for the baby.
It's very rarely that you get anythingfor the mommas or the dads, right?
And for me, that was when I thought, oh,right, from now on, if I buy anything
(23:30):
for friends who just have a baby,I buy it for the moms or the dads,
because the majority of the peopleare going to get the baby something.
And when my sister waspregnant, she's like, how much
clothing is to the baby need?
right?
And they grow out of it so fast.
(23:51):
So even if I buy clothings for, one ofmy girlfriends just had a baby in the
States and I bought her a baby clothes,but I bought it for one to two, not
for like zero to three months, becauseshe's going to have so much of that.
Yeah, that's a good idea.
(24:14):
I am curious, in anotherreality, what would you be doing?
I don't know.
I think I might still be tryingto do, pursue my interest
in filmmaking, or, yeah.
(24:40):
I've made two, like one documentary andone feature length film with my film
partner, and that was very satisfying tobe a part of, but it's so difficult to
make a film in that there's absolutelyno money in it unless like funds you.
(25:00):
If you make them, if you make it yourselfand you put it on your own credit card.
No one's gonna give you money forthat, or if they do, like if someone
picks you up for distribution, it's,it's, there's very little money in it.
I don't think many people knowabout that, because people look
(25:21):
at it and go, oh, there mustbe, there must be a good payout.
No, not really.
Like a lot of people make, uh, peoplecoming out of film school, they'll make
a lot of films because they're trying tobuild up a, So like a resume of films and
that they have the ability to do that.
But really, I mean, the end goal isto get funded by a big company who
(25:47):
doesn't care about making more money.
And that's totally, you know, that'sfine, but sometimes it's less about
storytelling and amplifying voicesthat are often not seen in the cinema.
Although sometimes I see things hereand there, I'm like, Oh my gosh,
that studio is doing amazing things.
(26:08):
Like the studio that madeEverything, Everywhere, All at Once.
They're called A24.
And then they just recentlyreleased another film that
was up for an Oscar, I think.
Yeah.
And that's, so they're doing, usuallyit's Asian, South Asian focused films.
It's really heartening to seethat kind of work happening.
(26:38):
When you think about your life, arethere any events that stand out?
That you think to yourself, ohyeah, those will impact and those
will make me who I am today.
Um, Probably would be whenmy Baba died when I was
(27:08):
15 years old, suddenly withoutany like, No precursor, nothing.
And I think that changed me in away that I had, like, I think I
have abandonment issues where Iworry about abandoning other people.
Yeah.
Um,
(27:32):
and then interestingly enough, like, soa year after my dad, my papa died, my mom
remarried my stepdad, who I'm called dad.
And he was estranged with his kids.
And it was just so interesting, um, likethe, the themes that come into our lives.
(27:54):
So did, he was estranged withhis kids and was he close to you?
And you have a sibling, don't you?
Yeah, I have a younger brother.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Um, my, my dad wanted to be close withhis kids, but there was a friction
with his With the mom of the kids andthat prevented contact to be possible.
(28:23):
Just know you talk about decolonization.
You're learning theprocess of decolonization.
Just share some.
Okay.
Because a lot of my listenersalso in that process.
Thank you for asking.
I want to say it's not linear.
Um, And so my first job out ofhigh school actually worked for an
(28:46):
indigenous advocacy organization.
It doesn't exist anymore.
It was a United Native Nations Society.
And I used my BA in sociology to asa caseworker to help people apply
for something called Bill C 31,which allowed folks to apply for
Indian status under the Indian Act.
(29:10):
And I worked with thatorganization for seven years.
And I left it just because Iwanted to get into software.
I wanted to make websites.
Um, and although I worked in uh, anindigenous organization for seven
years, I still had so much to learn.
(29:33):
And I was privileged that I was ableto hear at that time, hear about the
60s scoop, about residential schools.
I never learned that in, in school,high school and entry school.
So I was aware of that and Ihave to admit that I really just.
And I really think about Indigenousrights issues for a really
(29:55):
long time, a really long time.
And Really, and honestly, notuntil I started feeding mama.
So funny enough, like as soon as theidea, like once I landed on feeding mama
as the idea, an immediate second thoughtimmediately was, and I'm going to cry now,
(30:21):
and I'm going to feed indigenous families.
Because I knew that this was a privilegethat I was going to be selling a premium
product because it's not cheap and thatit was important to pay reparations and to
support the community of those that I ambenefiting from, you know, because for the
(30:44):
longest time we used to think, Oh, I, I'ma, I'm a Chinese immigrant, like I wasn't
part of colonization for the longest time.
I thought that I'm like,Oh, I'm free from judgment.
But we, like my parents, you know,Benefited from the colonization, like they
could afford a place to live here becauseIndigenous people were, their lands were
(31:09):
stolen from them only because of that.
My parents had a, could come over, theycould get a job, like do all these things.
So yeah, so Feeding Mama reallyreconnected me to that point of
view again of decolonization.
Yeah, so from day one I've beenproviding 5 percent of gross sales.
(31:34):
To an indigenous, indigenous organization.
Yeah, every, every quarter,I don't make a donation.
Thank you for doing.
Yeah, it's not an easy path.
I have to say that.
We, uh, one thing that I would let,um, non Indigenous people know is
(31:56):
that if you want to work with anIndigenous group or an Indigenous
person that you need to create trust.
And that trust doesn't come withjust meeting someone for one minute.
It takes months and years.
To create that trust and so don'tfeel like, oh, no, it's over with
(32:17):
that person's to like, blah, blah.
No, it's just how, how thattrust, uh, needs to happen.
Because of what's happened totheir communities, they need to
know that they can trust you.
So I came here in 93.
I did not learn anything about the60s groups, residential school,
(32:42):
until maybe 10 years ago when I did.
My own work on it.
It was never talked about.
Best advice I ever got, I dunno who toldme this, but to trust myself and trust
(33:06):
my intuition, trust my inner knowing.
It was probably Mimi.
Yeah.
I'm a people pleaser and so I alwayslook outwards for approval and so looking
inside and having a relationship with me.
First of all, and who I am, it's such ablessing to, to now I'm not 100 percent
(33:29):
there, but I, but to be able to trustmyself and trust my body when it's
like, get out of there, or yes, thisis a yes, do that is, is such a gift.
Would you share how youstarted the process on that?
Because a lot of people, whetherit's because they've had traumatic
(33:50):
events in their life and.
It's really hard to listen, totrust your body, all the intuition.
And I know everyone is different.
Like, for me, for example, I had to geta lot of body work done, therapy, for me
to learn to start to listen to my body.
Was there Anything that kindof helped you, works for you?
(34:15):
I feel like I know, I remember thethings that didn't, didn't work
for me, but that doesn't mean itwon't work for anybody else, right?
I think we just all have to keep trying.
So I listened to a lot of meditationon the meditation apps and didn't work.
You know, I'd find one personwho say something and like,
(34:35):
Oh, that really resonates.
And then, yeah, I know this podcast isnot about Mimi, but Mimi really leads some
great like inner exploration exercises.
And I, I really gained confidenceand it is a confidence thing.
Cause you know, when I first was liketrying to like listen in it, it felt,
(34:58):
uh, I felt like I couldn't trust myself.
Um, Because I think, oh,my mind's making it up.
My mind's telling me all these things.
So it's in a, and yeah,that is part of it.
But also being still andbeing grounded helps.
(35:21):
Having your feet touch thewood of your floor maybe helps.
The grounding helps.
Being in a safe space.
I mean, I think that's something that alot of people don't realize they need.
Um, and that is tough to dobecause a lot of us are in spaces
that are unsafe, so hard to do.
(35:42):
But a safe space where youcan be vulnerable to yourself.
Yeah, I can't really think ofanything else but to try different
things and to love yourself.
I think that's reallythe journey I'm still on.
Last question.
What advice would yougive to new marmosets?
(36:06):
When you mama's okay, like they'vealready had the baby Oh more people what
because for what you do with feedingmama What do you want them to know?
That they're not alone.
That there are people out there,like, family and friends, and maybe
(36:30):
you need to be selective of whichfamily, and selective of which
friends that you can be safe with.
But there's other, what they callmother circles, that are held
by doula collectives, or midwifeclinic, midwife offices, just to find
space that you can feel safe, andyou can share common experiences.
(36:53):
It is so important to feelsafe in how you're experiencing
postpartum and even pregnancy.
It's, um, it is so powerful tobe in a room with someone else.
Who's in the exact same month of yourpregnancy or exact same month of,
(37:18):
you know, three months postpartum.
You're like, Oh my gosh, we're allgoing through the same exact thing.
And it's just so comforting tofeel like vent about certain things
like, Oh my gosh, I don't like.
Regression again, like, it felt likethere was a regression every three months.
Like, oh, the three month regression.
Oh, it's a six month regression.
(37:39):
Oh, it's a nine month regression.
Oh my gosh.
It's just never ending.
And then, but you can complainabout it with the other, you
can like laugh at yourself and.
What have you?
Yeah, entrust yourself.
There's a, I know that one of the,so I had twins as a geriatric mom
(38:01):
and anybody over 35 and is pregnantknows that they're called a geriatric.
It's a geriatric pregnancy.
Um, and I was 47 when I had my twins.
Uh, but it's so interesting.
Nobody said that phrase to me to my face.
It's almost like I'm too oldfor them to mess with maybe?
(38:22):
I don't know.
Anyways, yeah, trust yourself.
I didn't trust myself because I'mlike, I'm too old to know anything.
I don't know it.
The doctors know everything.
And when my babies were born, one ofthem was a little bit lighter in weight
and she was gaining weight slowly,not what the doctors We're expecting
(38:44):
based on a growth chart that is putout by the World Health Organization.
And so I would see these pediatric,uh, doctors and they're like, weighing.
Weigh my baby, measure my baby,and I'd say, so how long, how
often are you feeding your baby?
(39:04):
And it would be, I'm sure theysaid it in a nonjudgmental way.
I felt very judged and, andthey'd suggest I go, you know,
you maybe you should try formula.
And I don't know, it felt like indictmentof my ability and like, this is proof
(39:24):
that I am not cut out to be a mom.
I shouldn't, I'm too old.
This is anyways, I, but I didn'ttrust that like that baby, that
lower weight baby is now likethe taller and heavier baby.
And it's just, every babyhas their own growth cycle.
And I think I knew that inside of methat I didn't trust it and said, I
(39:48):
trusted, um, a pediatrician, which,you know, I definitely want to consult.
Trust yourself.
There's so much, you know, yourbaby, a lot more, you're spent
every single second with them.
Like, you know them so well.
So please trust yourself.
(40:16):
Trust yourself.
What a great reminder.
For many of us, trusting yourselfcan be a tricky thing, especially
if you've had trauma in your life.
So go slow.
Find a therapist or body worker you trustwho can show you that trusting yourself
and listening to your body is safe.
Then practice.
(40:37):
Learning to trust yourself when youhave never done it can be scary.
Practice can look like slowing down,sitting in silence, and paying attention
to how you feel, in your body and heart.
I spent many years ignoringmy body and instincts.
When I started the journey to healing,trusting myself and listening to my
(40:59):
body meant slowing down, skipping aworkout because my body was sore, or
saying no to an opportunity and notbypassing the icky feeling in my body.
Be kind to yourself.
Much love from Yiyi.
Your Chinese auntie.
Thanks so much for listening tothis episode of the Conversations
(41:22):
with your Chinese Auntie podcast.
If you're enjoying the show, pleasefeel free to rate, subscribe,
and leave a review whereveryou listen to your podcast.
That helps others find the showand we greatly appreciate it.
Also, remember to sign upfor our newsletter to receive
free materials and updates.
Links in the website, patriciapetersen.
ca, that's P A T R I C IA P E T E R S E N dot C A.
(41:49):
Again, thanks for listening.
We hope you have a great week, andwe'll see you in the next episode.
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