August 28, 2025 • 52 mins
“I thought I was the biggest piece of shit walking on God’s green earth.”
In this gripping episode of Recovering Out Loud, Anthony sits down with Bo as he shares his raw journey through crystal meth addiction, terrifying psychosis, and over 50 stays in mental hospitals.
From feeling hated by everyone and hearing voices telling him he didn’t deserve to live, to finally discovering the spiritual tools that saved his life, this story is a brutally honest look at the cunning, baffling, and powerful nature of addiction.
This conversation is proof that even in the darkest moments, recovery and purpose are possible.
00:00 – “I thought everyone hated me”
02:30 – Discovering service through video creation
04:50 – Reliving stimulant psychosis through film
13:40 – Alcohol as the gateway to everything else
15:30 – “I went to the mental hospital 50 times”
18:05 – Rock bottom: broken mentally, physically, spiritually
20:15 – Daily reprieve and spiritual principles
27:00 – Resentment, relapse, and the gift of returning
33:00 – “The greatest gift is being of service”
41:00 – Living faith one day at a time
48:20 – Closing poem: I, The Addict
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
And I just thought everyone hated me, you know?
And I was like the biggest pieceof shit walking on God's green
earth. So like, after a three day
binge, the voices would tell me to go to the mental hospital.
I didn't want to go, but I wouldgo out of fear, right?
And it's the most terrifying experience getting on the bus,
hearing these voices checking in.
And then once you check into themental hospital, you can't leave
(00:20):
until they let you out. And that's what the voices
really attacked my head, You know, just bringing up every
single selfish moment in my life.
That time I wasn't there for my son, that time I was a piece of
shit to my family. That time I stole money from my
ex-girlfriend. They would tell me that I'm the
worst father in the world and you don't deserve to live.
I was full flight from reality and I thought I was going to
die, right? Hi there, welcome back or
(00:44):
welcome to Recovering Out Loud Podcast, the show where we get
real about mental health and addiction.
I'm so glad you're here. If you or someone you love is
struggling with drugs or alcohol, please reach out for
help. Send me a message on all social
media platforms at Recovering Out Loud Pod or by e-mail at
(01:04):
recoveringoutloudpod@gmail.com. You are no longer alone.
(01:26):
Oh yeah? Yeah.
Fucking three cameras, eh? Yeah, I don't fuck around, man.
I went all addict. I addict out with it.
I got all the expensive shit. We are all or nothing people,
right? I mean, I mean, at least I am.
I don't know. I don't know about you, but I
like to think I'm an all or nothing guy.
(01:47):
I love, I absolutely love what you do, man.
Thanks, buddy. It's I appreciate you service,
right? Yeah, you're, you're helping
people that are that are scared to be out there and, and, and
talk about this stuff, right. I hope so, yeah.
I mean, you, you've been on the the video adventure too.
You like doing the videos and stuff like that.
(02:07):
What do you like about doing that?
So apparently people say like, Ihave a, a gift with making
video, you know, so I try to putit into service, right?
Because in the book it tells us selfishness, self centeredness
that we think is a bit of all our troubles, right?
So it just shows like what? Like let me ask you a question.
What? What do you get out of seeing
(02:28):
those videos? Picture I have a pictures are
one thing. OK, when I was growing up, I
used to hate when my parents, mymom especially, would be like,
let's take a family photo used to drive me nuts.
I think I was embarrassed. I think there was a lot of shame
about how I was viewed with other people.
(02:48):
Like it was a lot of embarrassment there.
I've come to realize today there's so many photos in my
life where I look back and I'm like instantly the memory is
just reignited in my brain and I'm so grateful that I have all
those photos in. So my answer to your question is
videos do that times 1000, right, where, you know, I was
(03:10):
watching that video you made of the retreat.
And that's how we met. And I'm happy that we met
because you're a fucking good dude and I appreciate you.
But that video, it just it'll bring me back to that moment and
it fully encapsulate, encapsulates the the entire
memory of the whole weekend, right.
And I think videos, if words areor if pictures are 1000 words
(03:31):
and videos are a million, right?I'm, I'm sure that's a quote
somewhere or something, but yeah, man, it's like it's
important. And that's why I loved editing
and that's why I love. I did a recent one, I don't know
if you saw it yet, but it was like a horror short of like what
stimulants did to me. Dude, when I was making that the
other day, I'm not kidding you, I had like anxiety because it
(03:52):
brought me back to all those, those moments, those hours I
spent looking through the peephole thinking someone was
coming to kill me, thinking people were outside.
Just the sheer terror of addiction and specifically
psychosis. And I love horror films.
It's one of my favorite genres. I love films.
And so to make that was like, itwas so fun for me, right?
(04:14):
But it also brought back a lot of, a lot of memories And, and
it's good too, because I, I haveto remember what it was like
because I don't ever want to go back there, you know?
You got a step One is remember the pain, right?
The disease. That's some reason I don't mind.
So yeah, with the videos, I, I, I just like I said, I put it
into service and it shows that we could be happy without drugs
(04:35):
and alcohol, right? And it gives like for the still
suffering, right? They could, they get to see us
being happy without drugs and alcohol and yeah just it's a Wii
program, you know, and I just want people to to feel love,
wanted and needed, you know whatI'm saying?
So pretty much that's it. And I, I've, I've been doing it
(04:57):
for a long time, you know, and yeah, I really enjoy doing it.
You know, it's all about love, right?
Yeah. I think a lot of people need to
see that fun side of recovery too, because my first thought
when I came in was how am I, my life is over, right?
My, how am I going to live life?How am I going to not have a
drink on my wedding day? All these bullshit stories that
(05:20):
I've played in my head, my disease just keeping me, trying
to get me back out there, right?And it still happens.
They still come. Yeah, I did not believe in
abstinence when I first got to the rooms, you know, and my
brother in I'm only human. Right, everyone's doing it.
Yeah, and alcohol was always thesolution for everything, right?
(05:42):
As long as as long as I'm off the drugs, you know, and just
doing alcohol be OK. So he's like, just try it out.
Try being abstinence for one year, right?
So that's how I, I came up with the name Bo Bridy, you know,
just as a joke, right? Like I didn't, I didn't believe
in complete abstinence, right. But this is what I didn't know
about, like the rooms, the program, you know the, the
(06:05):
unity, you know all that stuff, right?
Yeah. So can you take us through talk
about a little bit about your childhood and what it was like
growing up in your home? Looking back now, I always felt
like I need this program becauseI always felt restless,
irritable and discontent. You know, my mom was always
racing. I was always angry, always
(06:26):
uncomfortable in my own skin. You know, in school, I felt like
I, I was stupid, you know, I couldn't concentrate on
anything. And the most important thing to
me was my friends seeking validation and just trying to
fit in. Yeah.
So I was a very angry kid. You know, I was part of this
basketball team. Two of the the things that I was
(06:48):
good at was sports and instrumental.
And then the coach kicked me offthe team because of my bad
attitude. And he never brought me back on.
And that just made me resentful to adults, you know, as I was
very disrespectful to the eldersas a kid.
And my parents weren't always there for me, you know, So I
always held that resentment towards them, you know, because
that they weren't there for me. And the way I turned out, you
know, So as a kid, I did whatever the hell I want to do,
(07:10):
you know, I was like the tornadoroaring through people's lives.
You know, one of my first addictions was a steal.
So I'd steal it everywhere I went, the grocery store, the
variety store, my friends place,my family.
And when that came lying, you know, I would hurt the people
that love me the most. And I was blocking the sunlight
of the spirit way before I discovered drugs and alcohol,
you know? So yeah, pretty much I, Yeah.
(07:33):
I was working on self. Well, run, right?
My whole life until I got into these rooms, right?
I did not know how to live life.And yeah, So when I discovered
drugs and alcohols, that's when I finally felt that sense of
ease and comfort, you know, I felt comfortable, happy,
confident, alive. You know, all these fears
dropped. And I was just the life of the
party. You know, I would always wear
(07:54):
these masks with everyone because if you truly knew who I
was in my head, you wouldn't like me.
And if you didn't like me, I'd be at a pity party and, like,
what's the point of living, right?
Yeah. Always wanted to fit in right.
It's funny that there's a commonthread between addicts and
Alcoholics that I always realizes that that need to fit
in the people please to to be a part of and then that's exactly
(08:18):
what recovery does right. You come in and you're like,
hey, man, have a seat, welcome. Have a coffee, you know, but
don't you like, I just fucking flipped my car on the highway
drinking and driving. Like, why would you like me?
Why would I'm a piece of shit? All these things are going
through your mind when you come in.
And then people just love you where you're at, right?
And they listen to your stories and they're like, yeah, same.
(08:41):
I did that, you know, have a seat.
You're good bro, you know, welcome.
We watch it here. It's, it's it's crazy how living
with this disease without any defense.
Wait, we have no idea what the hell is wrong with us.
You know what I'm saying? And for me, I thought it was
different, that there was no onelike me, man, You know, I was
(09:01):
like terminally unique, you know?
And it's like nothing ever worked, right?
And then I had to be pretty badly mangled before coming into
these rooms. But then when you come into
these rooms, you find out that there's so many people just like
you with the same thoughts, the same feelings, you know, the
restless, irritable and discontent, you know, And it
doesn't work alone. We have to do this together,
(09:22):
right? Yeah, I can't.
We can. That's one of my favorite,
favorite lines. I love it.
There's a lot of people that come in that sort of like, I'm
not as bad as as these people. When I came in, I thought it was
like the biggest piece of shit walking on God's beater.
Yeah. A lot to swear, right?
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Cut, cut.
Yeah. Yeah, start over.
Yeah, no, we, we like to to keepthings raw and, and authentic.
(09:45):
And I shouldn't say, well, authentic too, but uncut, raw,
unfiltered, because that's what addiction is, man.
Like I didn't, I didn't start this podcast to have nice
conversations about how great life was.
Like, I want to talk about real shit.
You know, what did, what did yougo through?
How did you get through it? How do you get through shit
today? Right.
It's important for people to hear that that sobriety is
beautiful and amazing and fucking incredible.
(10:08):
And I, I wouldn't change it for the world, but it life still
sucks sometimes, dude. Like the shit that still gets
hard and I still have to navigate and I'm still dealing
with financial shit that that I fucking racked up.
I still, you know, I get collection calls and stuff like
that, You know what I mean? And it's like, when will it end,
right? But it's like, just do the next
right thing, practice principlesof the program, give it back and
(10:28):
things will work out. I have to do, I have to pay back
things and I have to do and showup.
I can't just say God take care of everything, right?
But the outcome is not up to me.I have to do the little things
today. And I think you live by that
principle. You know I just in talking to
you, or try to at least. Do not be discouraged, no one
among us has made maintain anything like perfect and
(10:51):
curiosity spiritual. We are not Saints.
We are not. Saints, the point is we are
trying to grow along spiritual lines, but it's such a blessing
to have the awareness of being itself right where before we
didn't know what the fuck was going on, right?
Yeah, life's going to hit, it says in the big book.
(11:11):
If we don't enlarge our spiritual life, we're not going
to be able to handle certain trials in low spots, you know
what I'm saying? Ahead.
Yeah, Yeah. But in the certain trials in low
spots, there's always blessings that come out of that.
You know what I'm saying? It's like we need all these
these pains and sufferings to grow, right?
So like, instead of being like in a pity party about it, try
being thankful at that moment, right?
(11:34):
This is all about practicing though, right?
It's not simple, but not easy. Like for me, I'm coming up on
three years in October and year 2 has been like super hard.
There were times where I just wanted to give up, you know what
I'm saying? Because I wasn't, I wasn't able
to handle certain trials in low spots.
This is what happens when I takemy will back, right?
(11:55):
Like trouble comes right? And disease centers in my mind,
it tells me that I could drink. You know what I'm saying?
And this is what we're dealing with every single day, right?
That's why we have a daily reprieve.
What does what does taking your will back look like today?
What does that look like to you?It's what I stopped doing the
(12:18):
things I'm supposed to do right?Because once I'm in my will,
like I, I get resentful. I'm uncomfortable in my own
skin. I'm full of fear, you know, I
make up resentments towards people, you know?
And this is what the my brains like, right?
It's, it's mentally strangely the range, right?
(12:39):
That like, again, the disease that is in my, in my mind, in my
thinking, right? And I suffer from an illness
which only a spiritual experience can conquer, right.
Yeah, I could be very weak to this disease sometimes, you
know, and be in that pity party.And like we, we have like 2
(13:00):
options. We could either blot out the
consciousness of our intolerablesituation with anything that
makes me feel good, right? Drugs, alcohol.
But if you're not doing drugs and alcohol, we pick up other
things. Right.
Anything bro? So, so media food, you know,
whatever man scrolling, right, That girl, right?
Whatever we focus on is pretty much our higher power, right?
(13:23):
But deep down in every man and woman shell is a fundamental
idea of God, right? So the problem is in me and the
power is deep down within me andI have to search diligently
within myself every single day, right?
What was the moment like? I want to backtrack a bit.
So was drinking your main thing?Was that like or were you
(13:43):
everything? I did pretty much everything.
Alcohol was always like the the thing that I did all the.
Time, yeah. Yeah.
Like, to me, that was like the dissolution.
But when I did alcohol, it wouldalways lead to, like, the other
stuff, right? Yeah.
Cocaine, ecstasy, whatever. I did it all.
I didn't do heroin. But what brought me to my knees
(14:04):
is crystal meth. Yeah.
Can you walk us through that? What did that look like and and
how did you ultimately seek help?
Like what was the moment? What was that like?
So I was full flight from reality when I started meth, you
know what I'm saying? Like I started hearing voices in
my head, psychosis. And what I'd hear is my friends
and family believing it's actually them with some spyware.
(14:26):
So I could. I believe that they can see what
I see, they can see what I think.
They know everything about me. And they absolutely hated me.
And this lasted for like 2 years.
And even when I'd be sober, I'd be hearing these voices, you
know what I'm saying? I'd be one of those guys that
are on the street that are just like fighting with voices in
their head, right? That's what that's how I'd be
(14:48):
when I was sober. You know what?
I'm being restless interval in this content, you know, and I
just thought everyone hated me, you know, and I was like the
biggest piece of shit walking onGod's green earth.
So like after a three day binge,the voices would tell me go to
the mental hospital. I didn't want to go, but I would
go out of fear, right? And it's the most terrifying
(15:09):
experience getting on the bus, hearing these voices, checking
in, and then once you check intothe metal hospital, you can't
leave until they let you out. And that's what the voices
really attacked my head. You know, just bringing up every
single selfish moment in my life.
That time I wasn't there for my son, that time I was a piece of
shit to my family, that time I stole money from my
ex-girlfriend. They would tell me that I'm the
worst father in the world and you don't deserve to live.
(15:31):
I was full flight from reality and I thought I was going to
die, right? So the doctors would just tell
me the voices are all in your head.
They would medicate me with olanzapine, I'd sleep it off,
wake up, and they would send me home.
And when I left that mental hospital, all I felt was shame,
guilt, and remorse, you know? And I had a firm resolution to
never use a drink again. And if you put me to a lie
(15:52):
detector test, I would pass for flight colors because I actually
believed it. So I go home, sleep for two
days, wake up, and once I wake up, I'm restless, irritable, and
discontent. And then the mind starts racing.
The mental black spot, right? I think I could use and drink.
It'll be different this time. And then once I put one in me,
it triggers the phenomena of craving.
I have this allergy to body, this abnormal reaction, and then
the binge. And what happens after the
(16:13):
binge? I would get paranoid, the voices
would scare the shit out of me, and I would go back to the
mental hospital. So I repeated going to the
mental hospital 50 times. You know what I'm saying?
Like it was just a cycle of insanity around and around and
around with no solution, right? And this is what it is.
If, if we don't have like these meetings and, and doing the
(16:36):
steps and all that, right? It's just a cycle of insanity,
right? I didn't, I didn't understand
why I kept using when I didn't want to.
I didn't understand why it hurt the people that love me the
most. I didn't understand why I did
the things I did, you know, I just thought I was the biggest
piece of shit and I, I, I didn'tthink I deserve to live, you
know? And this is how cunning,
(16:57):
baffling and powerful this thingis we're dealing with, right?
Yeah. So I tried a lot of things,
right? I went to the mental, like I
said, I went to the mental hospital like 15 times.
I went to rehab twice. I tried moving to different
places. I did programs like CAMH, you
know, tried joining different religion.
(17:18):
Nothing ever worked, right? And by the end of it, I was
living in my apartment. My roommate moved out because of
his by addiction. I rent, I miss rent payment for
like 3 months you know, I was just so isolated, you know, and
I was just so disgusted when disgusted with myself, you know,
I couldn't look at myself in themirror.
I was mentally, physically, financially and spiritually
(17:40):
broken, you know, and I would drink as much alcohol as I can
and do as much as my drug of choice as I can to build up
courage to kill myself, you knowwhat I'm saying?
I, I didn't think there was any way out and I didn't ask for
help because I didn't think anyone would ever help me, you
know what I'm saying? I was delusional.
I was full flight from reality, you know.
Yeah. So one day my mom came over, you
(18:01):
know, and she saw that the placewas a mess and, and I was just
like, intoxicated, out of my mind.
And that's what she described. This decided with my family that
I go to rehab, you know, I'm saying.
So by the grace of God, I got into these rooms and through you
guys and the big book of Alcoholics Anonymous, that's
(18:22):
what I discovered, that I sufferfrom an illness which only a
spiritual experience can conquer, right?
What does the What does the spiritual experience mean to
you? Working these spiritual
principles in all your affairs, right?
One addict working with another addict is vital, the permanent
(18:45):
recovery, right? For me, I didn't think this
problem could work for me, right, 'cause I didn't think I
was worth worthy of it, right? That's the delusion, the liar
that I believed in my head for so long.
But by doing the work right, it says the spiritual principles
will solve your problems. And when you're doing the steps,
you're working the spiritual principles in all your fears,
(19:06):
right? You're working courage, You're
working honesty, right? And by doing Step 4, you know,
and then doing Step 5, admittingto God, to myself and to another
human being, the exact nature ofmy wrongs.
That's what I knew that this poem could work for me and that
I have a chance to do better. You know, it says there's very
little hole for your recovery unless you get entire psychic
(19:28):
change. And I, I believe that's when I
got it was a on Step 5. You know what I'm saying?
But what do I really have? What I really have is a daily
reprieve contingent on the maintenance of my spiritual
condition, right? I'm not going to be, I can't
rely on yesterday's spirituality.
(19:48):
I'm not going to be full off yesterday's food.
I'm not going to spill good off yesterday's shower, right?
It's like every single day is a day I'm going to carry the
vision of God's will into all myactivities because I'm dealing
with an illness. And then if I don't and I get
into self, I get driven by 100 forms of fear to self, delude
yourself, seeking yourself, pity.
And I can't deferate the truth of the false or I'm blotting out
(20:08):
the consciousness of my tolerable situation with
anything that makes me feel good, right?
What's the hardest spiritual principle for you to work today?
Courage, yeah, like fear, it always kicks in, you know what
I'm saying? Like I'm coming about three
(20:30):
years into this, right? I, I can, I consider myself
still a baby, you know, and justlike to think about it, right?
I was running on self will pretty much my whole life until
I got into these rooms like 3 years ago, right?
And that disease that is in my mind that always kicks in,
right? And that's what holds me back
from a lot of things, right? Yeah, yeah, this, this sort of
(20:52):
like movie that we project onto the world of it's going to be
like this, right? Yeah.
I, I'm having a really hard timelately.
My thing has been like doing recovery shit that I don't
necessarily want to do, but alsojust like life shit, you know,
showing up. It's gotten easier because I've
been praying about it, talking about it, opening up about it,
that I find that really helpful too.
(21:12):
Just like even talking with another, anybody but another
addict or alcoholic about what I'm struggling with.
It takes the power away from it,right.
But I, I have this thing where I'm like, oh, you know, I have
to leave my comfortable apartment to go and do this
thing, whatever, meeting, whatever, even just like dinner,
something that doesn't serve me right, something that I don't
get immediate gratification, instant gratification out of.
(21:35):
And it's like, I'll obsess aboutit all day.
Like I have to do this thing later.
Oh my God, I have to do it. I can't, you know, I don't want
to do it, blah, blah, blah. And so I heard once, I heard a
speaker once say that the only solution to doing something you
don't feel like doing is doing it is action.
(21:56):
Straight up action. Just shut the fuck up.
Like turn this off for a second and just get in the car and
drive or walk to the bus or do whatever you have to do and it
goes away. That's not like, that's not the
answer I want to hear, right? But it's true.
Like it's fucking true. It gets easier as you do it,
right, the more you do it. What does your shirt say?
I've been wondering. Get comfortable being.
Uncomfortable. I love it.
(22:16):
What I'm saying, I love this. Is what recovery is all.
About this too shall pass, yeah.This is what I discovered
recovery in 2020, yeah. That's a beautiful.
You got that made. Yeah, I love that.
Yeah. Yeah.
That's sick. But yeah, it's all about forcing
ourselves to do the things we don't want to do.
It's like when I don't want to go to a meeting, that's probably
(22:38):
what I should go to a meeting. When I don't want to share,
that's probably what I should share, right?
I listen to a lot of Goggins. David Goggins.
Love that guy. Right, And he's like, cuz I,
we're the book says that I'm always looking for the sense of
ease and comfort, right? And that's how it's been my
whole life, right? If it was uncomfortable, I would
turn the other way. Like every job I had, you know,
(23:00):
there was like no growth, right?I just get comfortable and, and
stay like that, right? And that's, this is what
recovery is all about, right? Forcing ourselves to do the
things we don't want to do, right?
I don't always want to sponsor someone.
I don't always want to go to a meeting, you know, and I don't
always want to go to the gym, right?
(23:21):
But we force ourselves to do thethings we're not supposed to do.
And by doing that, that's how weget God's, God's grace, right?
Do a little bit of work and God does the rest right.
When life lifes you today, how do you get through it?
How do you get through tough time?
How do you get through the trials in low spots like in the
(23:41):
moment? I have to, I don't know how to
live life, right? I have a design for Living,
which is a big book, right? And it tells me when all else
fails, one addict working with another addict will save the
day, right? It's all about getting on
itself, right? And we have step four, we have
(24:06):
step 10 to continue take personal inventory and we have
step like nightly inventory, right?
And it tells us on page 62 that selfishness, self certainness
that we think is the root of allthe troubles, right?
And we get driven by this illness.
Yeah, I know it's all about using picking up the spiritual
(24:27):
toolkit, right? Hit hit a meeting, right?
Ten step suggestion says when these things prop up at once, we
go to God, right? That means fast, right?
Then we discuss it with someone immediately, right?
Fellowship. This is a we program for a
reason. And if we have to apologize,
then we we do it right away, right?
And then we turn ourselves into helping others, right?
(24:53):
That was a that's a big one for me.
So I when I relapsed after the 71/2 years I didn't, I didn't go
to anyone with with my plan right.
And I always stress this. I always try to nail home the
calling another addict or alcoholic.
I'm not trust me, I'm flawed in it.
Like I I still my phone is 1000 lbs some days, right?
Even when people are calling me in the program, I struggle to
(25:14):
pick it up or outside of the program because I'm busy or I'm
you know all this bullshit. Again, this this story spinning
in my head. I can't stress enough how
important it is to like wheneverI have a a grand idea based out
of emotion right? For me, it was at the time it
was I'm bored in recovery. My life is good, but it's not
(25:35):
what I want it to be, right? I'm not getting what I want.
This was, you know, last year. I know it'll fix this.
I haven't tried taking ADHD medication as prescribed, which
is bullshit. I did try and that's how I got
back into the second rehab. And I remember, I remember
vividly like having this plan inmy head and it wasn't like a
quick I, it wasn't like a, this will fix this relapse.
(25:58):
Boom. It was a, it was a process,
right? The relapse always proceeds.
They talk about it in the book too.
That proceeds with a thought. There's always a a, a thought.
There's always leading up to right?
We relapse with a thought beforewe relapse of the drink.
And that was my thing. It was like, I'm going to fix
this. I have, you know, I'm, I'm
depressed. My my dopamine is low.
So this will fix it. Again, to your point, using
(26:19):
external things to fix my insides, right?
And I never told anyone about it.
I would tell people 90% of the truth and I would keep that 10%
back there that took me out backon a way worse relapse, right?
It always gets worse, man, Always.
So I, I, I think it's really important, yeah.
Yeah, Disease centers in our mind, right?
It starts off with a thought andthen it becomes an obsession,
(26:42):
right? And but The thing is like
there's nothing we can do about the first thought, but we got to
stop it, right? The second thought and go down
to the solution, which is God oryour higher power, right?
And everything around the triangle is meetings, service,
prayer, fellowship, sponsoring honesty, right?
(27:02):
All of these things are are our solution is treatment to our
illness, right? But the big book says we're not
going to be inspired at all times and we are going to make
mistakes, right? It says when we take a sincere
position to trust in God's will,all sorts of remarkable things
will follow, right? And this is to say, we do this
thing perfectly. It says we do things well,
(27:23):
right? And there's a lot of growth in
all these certain trials in low spots, right?
Can you think of 1 where where there was a lot of growth, where
you in the moment, maybe in the moment you thought it was the
worst thing ever and the sky wasfalling and the outcome turned
out to be better than than it was?
Can you? Can you remember what?
Yeah. OK, so my first year of
(27:47):
sobriety, you know, I joined this group and it's my first
time in recovery. I found my tribe.
I love this group. Right.
And I did a lot of service for this group.
You know, I I did the clothing, I did the posters.
I was so welcoming to the newcomers.
I started my own gratitude meeting.
You know, I love this group, butwas I doing all that stuff for
that group? That's what my head was telling
(28:09):
me, right? I just came from a dark place
and into recovery and I wanted people to like me, right?
So yeah, again, 62 second paragraph.
Selfishness, self centeredness that we think is the root of all
our troubles, right? So I made decisions based on
self arouse character defects onmy fellows and they kicked me
out the group after my one year medallion.
(28:31):
Right. Wow.
And I'm like, they kicked you out.
Holy. Yeah, right.
And I had the biggest resentment, right?
I'm like, how can I do this to me?
I did this so, so much stuff forthem, right?
But this is a program of giving and wanting nothing in return.
And when people harm us, the bigbook says we disregard the other
person entirely and we look towards ourselves and see where
(28:52):
we went wrong. But I was a working program,
right? Recovery is unity recovery and
service, right? I was doing unity and service
and I wasn't doing the steps, right.
And what resentment is the number one offender that
destroys us, right? So I went back out, you know,
for seven months, right? On that resentment.
(29:13):
On that resentment, yeah, wow. But today I'm grateful that I
got kicked out of that group because of what it is today,
right? I got back into the rooms by the
grace of God and I, I did the steps, right?
And now I'm now it's all about living the steps, you know, and
by working a program and connecting to a power greater
(29:35):
than yourselves, you know, this and putting yourself into
service in return, you get beautiful, meaningful
relationships and it just keep coming and coming, right?
And I wouldn't have met all these people if I I don't know
if I was part of that group still, right?
Yeah. But The thing is, right.
I, I would always blame them forwhat happened, right?
(29:59):
But I would, I would never look at my part, right.
And the sick man's prayer, right?
This was our course. We realized people who wronged
us were perhaps spiritually sick, though we didn't like
their symptoms and the way they disturbed us.
They, like ourselves, were sick too.
We asked God to help show us thesame thoughts.
Pity in patients that would cheerfully grant a sick friend.
When a person offends us, we said to ourselves, this is a
sick person. How can I be helpful to them?
(30:21):
God see me for being angry, thy will be done So for so long that
resentment in my head was like brewing, right?
And I would just have like visions of like what would
happen if I saw these people, right?
I just felt so hated and rejected for getting kicked out,
right? But God presented that moment at
(30:42):
the right time. And when I saw them, I just gave
them a big hug, right? And that's the program right
there, right? That's the that's the psyche
change, you know? Yeah.
Being able to love unconditionally, right?
Yeah. What was that seven months like
for you, that relapse, and how did you get back in?
(31:02):
So that seven months was, yeah, I hung out with a bunch of
people that I I've met in recovery, right.
And you know, the behaviors, right?
It's just sketchy. Just every single day, right?
It just came to the point where I had no money left.
(31:25):
My family was going to abandon me.
All my friends never already stopped talking to me, you know?
And I had two options, right? Plotting the consciousness of my
tolerable situation with anything that makes me feel
good, right? With drugs, alcohol.
And I was about to, like, live on the streets or accept
spiritual help, right? So yeah, I had to be pretty
(31:47):
badly mangled before getting into these rooms, right?
Yeah, yeah. Well, I'm happy you got back in.
I mean, I know for me, coming back in was probably one of the
hardest things I've done, you know, in my life.
It just seemed like it seemed like such a big mountain to
climb to get back. In it was like for me, I didn't.
(32:07):
It was the scary thing for me was getting sober.
It's like, I was like thinking about like the withdrawals and
life without drugs and alcohol and all that stuff, right?
But again, that's our disease that that that that centers in
my mind. Right wants to keep us sick.
I didn't think, I honestly knew I had to get back in the rooms,
but I didn't think I could actually do it, right.
(32:28):
So the first thing I did was I went to the CA convention,
right? I was four days clean and I went
to the CA convention convention and I was trying to find like a
God squad, like fellowship, right?
Because I, I didn't think I could stay sober without that
group, that I was part of it. I love that group, right?
And I just didn't think recoverywas ever possible to get back
in, you know what I'm saying? Yeah.
(32:49):
What's the biggest gift you've received in recovery?
Like what? What?
What is getting sober and being sober and being of service?
What? What is the greatest gift?
The greatest gift is the abilityto be of service and be helpful.
You know, I couldn't be helpful to anyone.
I couldn't be helpful to myself and but not only that, right,
(33:14):
helping others helps ourselves, right?
Our very lives depend on helpingothers, right?
And that's the greatest gift. You know, I with my past, you
know, I, it's crazy. It says in the big book, our our
dark past is the greatest possession we have, right?
(33:35):
And I, I would just ignore my past, put it on the carpet,
never want to think about my past, right?
And now I'm here sharing my experience, strength and hope
you know, and hopefully it can help at least one person, right?
Yeah, so that's what we say, right?
What's what do you, what do you hope that one person gets out of
your story? Like what do you hope people get
out of here? When you Share your story, What
(33:56):
do you hope people get out of it?
I just want them to to know thatwhatever you did in the past,
your past doesn't define you, right?
We have a, we're all dealing with this illness and if you're
alive right now, you have a chance to do better, right?
(34:22):
Like I said, our past becomes our greatest asset and we use
that to help others and just want them to know that their
love wanted and needed. And to be honest, like what
would we do if we didn't have anyone to help, right?
If we couldn't be of service andwe couldn't work with another
addict, You know what I'm saying?
Because that's pretty much the solution, right?
(34:43):
Yeah, we'd be fucked. I mean, I always say this, but I
was AI was a taker my whole lifein addiction.
Take, take, take. What can I get out of this
situation? Conditional acceptance, right?
Yeah, Yeah, I'll do that. But I need something out of it,
right? And then I come in and I become
a giver, You know, I still take a lot.
But my point with all that is like, you can't have givers
(35:06):
without takers, you know what I mean?
Like, you need to have both sides, right?
So any days that it feels like I'm taking a lot, somebody's
giving, right? So it's like, I try to think
like that too. It's like you need both, right?
You need to have both sides. And that's why the newcomer is
the most important person in anysituation meeting whatever,
because I need to give away whatwas so freely given to me, and
(35:29):
then they can in turn do it to someone else, right?
It's this beautiful cycle that this sort of happens in
recovery, you know? Yeah, there's a lot of like, no,
that's OK. You don't have to give me.
But at the same time, that person that's giving you
something is trying to work the spiritual principles of like
being generous, right? Being kindness, right?
And sometimes you can't, We can.But like, I I wouldn't want to
(35:51):
rob them from from from giving, right and expecting nothing in
return, right? But I understand I was a taker
my whole life too, bro. Like I wouldn't I would give and
expect something in return, right?
And this is recovery is like my sponsor would say, don't even
expect to thank you. You know what I'm saying?
Yeah, right. It's a lot easier to live that
(36:12):
way, too. It's a lot freeing.
Expectations are nothing but premeditated resentments.
You know, If I'm always expecting something or looking
at outcomes, I'm going to be letdown no matter what.
Yeah, that person, place thing, situation is gonna let me down
because I'm not getting it the way I want, Right?
Yeah. So now you're working at a sober
house. Now how did you get into that
(36:34):
and what's that like? Well, that's a miracle to me
that I'm a house manager at a sober living house.
You know, to be honest, I, I knew some of the guys for, for
some time, but like coming into the, the sober living house is
(36:57):
like a whole new world to me, right?
Like I've been all over like CA and a a but like coming into
this is like a whole new world of like recovery.
So I moved in right away and slowly I brought my stuff in and
when I got there, we had a meeting.
And the first, the first thing Isaid to the guys, like they
(37:18):
introduced me, like house manager and I, I just said it's
a blessing and an honor to be here, you know, and I'm here to
help in any way I can. You know what I'm saying?
To me, it's still a miracle thatI, that I, I'm there.
It's such a blessing to be around all that all the time,
right? I'm supposed to be helpful to
(37:41):
the guys. But when you help someone, it's
helping you too, right? And being around these, these
guys, these newcomers all the time, It's it's been really
vital in my in me working my program, right?
Yeah. So I'm very grateful.
For that, right, it's, it's got to be tough though, too, right?
Because as we know, as I know insober living, there's a lot of
(38:04):
relapse that happens. There's a lot of, you know,
there's a lot of addiction, you know, plain and simple, right?
There's just a lot of addiction that happens and how do you deal
with that? And like, how does it affect
like how, what does that look like?
How is that? How does that affect you?
Well, there's different, all types of sobriety in there,
different ages, different peoplethat want it more people that
(38:26):
are not serious about it, right?And to be honest, I have to just
really work spiritual principlesand all my affairs, right?
If people are not serious about it, there's just nothing you
could do about that, right? They, they, they have to come to
want it, right? But for me, like it's, I have to
(38:46):
be in spiritual fake condition because if I'm in self like I, I
get, I'm dealing with it. I'm sick too, right?
And it's nothing good comes out of being in self, right?
I'm not useful or, you know, I'museless.
Have you had any relapses that you had to deal with that were
really tough like or anything like that or?
(39:07):
Well, that one relapse when I went out with that resentment
for getting kicked out of that group, which became a blessing
at the end, I had no intentions of going back out.
But yeah, I went back out seven months, came back in, you know?
What about the clients? I mean like the clients like
dealing with relapse in the house.
That's gotta be tough, isn't it?Or.
(39:29):
Yeah, old clients in the house, yeah, yeah, I mean.
You don't have to go into details, but like I just, it
must be tough to to see someone that you get a relationship with
go back out and then you got to deal with it.
Because I remember when I lived at sober living, I've been to
(39:50):
to, I've been a few Times Now. It was tough to see someone go
back out right. And it's like you can't get
dragged down with them. You can't let it affect your
sobriety. You can't control it, you can't
cure it. You didn't 'cause it right?
But like, it must be tough. It's, it all comes down to like
doing the work, right. If we're not working this
program, we're going to, we're going to go back out.
(40:13):
In my early recovery, I, I wouldget really like, it would be
really hard for me to see my friends go out, you know, but
now that I have more, a little bit more time and I have a
design for living, you know, it's, it says the big book.
If they don't want it, you know you have to.
(40:35):
You have to. Don't waste your time trying to
sway them because we we may ruina later opportunity for them,
right? A new bottom right.
Yeah, So what I the only way I can really help people that
don't really want it is pray forthem, right?
And nothing. Absolutely nothing happens in
God's world by mistake, right? And everyone is going through
(40:56):
whatever they're going through to get to wherever they're going
to, right? Wherever they need to go.
I love that. Yeah, it's true.
You talk a lot about faith and spirituality, and that's been a
real eye opener for me too. Because human, what does it say?
Human aid will fail us, right? Like no matter what could be the
nicest person in the world, theywill let you down at some point,
(41:18):
and not intentionally. It's just the way it is.
So I need a power greater than myself to rely on.
What is faith in spirituality? God, what does that look like to
you today? Well, pray step 11, right?
Seek through prayer and meditation to improve our
conscious contact with God, right?
(41:38):
Does it say maintain, right? And I, I follow the book, right?
Like what we have is a daily reprieve upon awakening, right?
Think about the 24 hours ahead throughout the day.
I always have to turn my will, right, my thinking and my life,
my actions over the care of God.I just thank God, right?
(41:59):
Taking an action, I love that. Yeah, when I'm agitated at work,
when I because I do landscaping too, right?
I have to turn my my will by thinking, right?
And I, I put gratitude into action.
And what does that look like? Doing a good job doing it to the
best of my ability, right? Because if I, there are days
(42:19):
where I'm just at work and I just want to get it over with,
you know? And no, it practices these
spiritual principles and all ouraffairs, right?
I'll be honest, I'm not always on top of my prayers, you know,
and it's all about consistency, right?
And being disciplined and just doing it like you hear, like the
(42:42):
old timers, like, you know, likeEric, he's like he's consistent,
right? But he's been around for a long
time, right? And it says we, we have to make
it use of their experience, right?
Yeah. What's the what would you say is
the best piece of advice you gotin recovery, either early
recovery or now? Best piece of advice that I ever
(43:05):
got in recovery. Let me ask you that question.
I just immediately my brain goesto Jay, right?
And Alan always, there's so much, right?
There's so much. But Alan always says, and he
quotes Jay when he says this is like, you know, if I don't know
(43:30):
if there's anything that precedes it, But he always says
try a little harder and stay a little longer, right?
And I love that it's so true. It's like if, if, if you're
going through a really rough time and you're having a hard
time getting sober, staying sober and you just can't figure
it out, try a little harder and stay a little longer, right?
Don't give up. You know, and I love that it's,
(43:50):
it's so true as like even in recovery, you know, having 7 1/2
years, all those tools that are still there, I didn't lose all
those tools. I lost the time.
I didn't even lose the time. I won't say that, but it was
really hard, man. It was really hard to come back
in and tell my my group that I had one day like I started
bawling my eyes. I can vividly remember I was
chairing a meeting at my Home group and I had just gone out.
(44:13):
I had, I had just accepted my relapse because it had been
going on for a while, but I didn't see this alcoholic addict
thinking was telling me that I hadn't relapsed yet because I
didn't drink and I was doing ADHD medication and it was
prescribed. Meanwhile, I'm buying it on the
dark web and taking all sorts ofmeths and shit like that.
It was really hard to, again, step one, getting honest was
(44:34):
really hard. And I remember that, you know,
they announced buddy, you know, 30 days, everyone claps 20 days
goes around the room and it's coming to me and I see it coming
to me and I'm just like, holy fuck.
My sponsor recommended that I that I do that.
But I, you know, admit my relapse and I was so scared.
I just remember coming to me. My name is Anthony.
I'm an addict alcoholic, and I have one day, and I just started
(44:56):
bawling my eyes out in front of all these men, this room of men,
and I'll never forget it. I had maybe six or seven people
as that was happening, get out of their fucking seat, come over
to me and just hug me. And then my sponsor, Ken, you
know, he leaned in and he goes, hey, man, do you want me to take
over? Like.
And I'm like, no, I have to do this like this.
Good. Yeah.
I didn't get sober right after that because again, we need to
(45:18):
bang our head a few more times and do some more research and
scrape our knee. But there was a big seed planted
that day, and that was that I could be vulnerable in a room
full of men, in a room full of anyone in recovery.
It was a shift. It was a shift and I'm going to
get accepted. I'm going to be OK and people
are going to love me where I'm at.
No one's going to judge me. And you fucking idiot, you had
eight, but how did you do that? You know what I mean?
(45:39):
People always ask me, people that are working really good
programs will always come up to me and be like, hey, like, how
did you relapse? And I know that you're working a
good program if you ask me that because you don't want to go
back out and relapse. And that's why I always share my
experience about relapse. And it's so important because if
you have long term sobriety, even if you have short term, but
if you have long term sobriety and you think that you it'll
(46:01):
never be a part of your story, fucking give your head a shake,
right? Because it, it, I wasn't
expecting it. I was on fucking cloud 9 in
recovery in 7 1/2 years, met my wife.
Life was amazing, dude. It was amazing.
And I never thought that relapsewould be a part of my story.
I thought that I would be that that guy that, you know, went
one time through. And I'm happy it happened
(46:22):
because to your point, out of the pain came spiritual growth,
a lot of spiritual growth and a new connection with my, my
higher power. And I realized that my higher
power never went anywhere. He was there the whole time
watching me struggle. I just didn't tap into them.
I didn't plug, plug the. I didn't put the plug in the
jug. Right.
I have to do that today. So that's probably the best.
(46:45):
There's so much, but yeah. There's so much, you know.
Page 417 Acceptance is the key to all my problems.
I need not to concentrate what needs to be changed in the
world, but what needs to be changed in me.
I love that so much because every time I get pissed off or
agitated, you know, that just shows me that I have to look
inward and that shows me that I need to work on myself, right?
(47:08):
It's not that person. It's the symptoms that we don't
like, right? And there's another part of the
big book on 1/16. It goes like this.
These experiences by land out says like fears, harm,
resentments. Whatever you're going through
may come to you, or you may already had it several times.
Should it happen again, regardedin a different light, maybe
(47:29):
it'll prove a blessing. Time after time.
The superior calamity has been aboon.
It's line out a gift, a blessing, for it led to the
discovery of God, right? Love that.
So my best advice, I heard a speaker say this.
His spots always told him to go to God, go to God, go to God, go
(47:53):
to God, go to God, and then go to God and then go to God, go to
God, go to God, go to God and then go to God.
You know what I'm saying? Go to God for everything.
Man, that's the best piece of advice I ever got.
Yeah, cuz I can't do it on my own, right?
Exactly. Let's end with this.
You have a poem that you wanted to read.
(48:14):
Is it a poem? Is that?
Is that what it is? Yeah.
So this is I call this one I theattic right?
You have it off the Dome, OK, Ofcourse you do.
I thought you were going to pullit out and read.
It let's hear it. It's called I the Attic and I
don't write, right? Maybe it's something I could do.
You know, there's a lot of stuffthat you discover being a
(48:34):
sobriety. You know, that's why it's
courage to change the things we can, right?
We don't even know what we're capable of, right?
Anyways, I read this poem to oneof my friends and he's like,
where do you think that came from, right?
And he's like God, right? So this is before I did the
steps, OK? This is when I first got back
(48:55):
into the rooms, OK. And it goes like this, such a
roller coaster of emotion. Some days being sober, should I
feel comfortable? I don't.
Last year I felt suicidal. This year, if I do something
different, like talking to God more, I'm feeling frustrated.
I need to quit the disturbance in my head, even as a position,
like a sniper unpatiently waiting for that slip to kill
(49:16):
their prey, I see despair in hate.
Mentally locked behind bars of no fate, I dance with the devil,
receiving nothing but hatred. On another next level, Lois of a
low is going to have lost my soul all alone, feeling nothing
but exposed. It was me that made the pick up.
It was me that made the drop off, it was me that made this
addiction an incurable disease. Lord forgive me, Higher power.
God, please set me free. It's not a want, it's a need.
(49:38):
I the addict, it's a routine. It's been a bad habit ever since
16. Losing my mind, nightmares and
my dreams. Thinking of the days when I was
adoc servant, haunting me, watching me, being very
observant. I was so selfish, so cold and
rebellious. Laughing at me like a clown in
the circus. The sickness is fierce for me,
my new purpose. They got me so close that I
think I resurface. They love it.
Right now I'm so shaky and nervous.
(50:00):
I'm conquering this fear of proving that I'm not worthless.
But I'm still confused. Was it really psychosis?
I was a war in my head, intentions of being dead.
I could look at my face and I'd see that look of disgrace.
It was me that wanted that sip. It was me that wanted that hit.
It was me that wanted that trip.It was me that was a piece of it
was me that made this addiction and incurable disease.
Lord forgive me. Hire power of God please.
(50:21):
I get triggered and that's the reality.
Regretting it, that would just be blasphemy.
But sometimes I can't help it. It's something I have to deal
with, that attic mind. Even in peaceful places, those
demons still lurk, feeding off you when you feel bad, broken or
hurt. I'll stand on my resilience no
matter what they say. I was so close to death.
That was the price I had to pay.So I raised my hands to the sky
and remembrance, the Most High whose powers I might kind of
(50:41):
compare, quantify. It's me that has to live with no
regrets. It's me that has to ask God to
remove all these character defects.
It's me that has to fully surrender, do the work and live
the 12 steps. Thanks for letting me share.
I love it. I'm feeling like we should
fucking drop that down and record it over there.
(51:02):
I love that man. Thanks so much for coming down
bro. I appreciate you buddy.
Thanks bro. Thanks for having me, man.
I love what you do, man. Keep doing what you're doing.
Thank you. It's helping, man.
It's helping others, man. I.
Appreciate you, buddy. Thank you.
Like you said, it's not easy to like, reach out to people and
stuff like that, right? So yeah.
Love you bro, you can do it. Thanks for listening.
Please help us grow the channel and like share.
(51:23):
And subscribe for more content. The discussions and stories
shared on this podcast are for informational and motivational
purposes only. This content is not a substitute
for professional medical advice,addiction treatment, or therapy.
If you or someone you know is struggling with addiction,
please consult A licensed physician, addiction specialist,
or mental health professional. You are no longer alone.
And I just thought everyone hated me, you know?
And I was like the biggest pieceof shit walking on God's green
earth. So like, after a three day
binge, the voices would tell me to go to the mental hospital.
I didn't want to go, but I wouldgo out of fear, right?
And it's the most terrifying experience getting on the bus,
hearing these voices checking in.
And then once you check into themental hospital, you can't leave
(00:20):
until they let you out. And that's what the voices
really attacked my head, You know, just bringing up every
single selfish moment in my life.
That time I wasn't there for my son, that time I was a piece of
shit to my family. That time I stole money from my
ex-girlfriend. They would tell me that I'm the
worst father in the world and you don't deserve to live.
I was full flight from reality and I thought I was going to
die, right? Hi there, welcome back or
(00:44):
welcome to Recovering Out Loud Podcast, the show where we get
real about mental health and addiction.
I'm so glad you're here. If you or someone you love is
struggling with drugs or alcohol, please reach out for
help. Send me a message on all social
media platforms at Recovering Out Loud Pod or by e-mail at
(01:04):
recoveringoutloudpod@gmail.com. You are no longer alone.
(01:26):
Oh yeah? Yeah.
Fucking three cameras, eh? Yeah, I don't fuck around, man.
I went all addict. I addict out with it.
I got all the expensive shit. We are all or nothing people,
right? I mean, I mean, at least I am.
I don't know. I don't know about you, but I
like to think I'm an all or nothing guy.
(01:47):
I love, I absolutely love what you do, man.
Thanks, buddy. It's I appreciate you service,
right? Yeah, you're, you're helping
people that are that are scared to be out there and, and, and
talk about this stuff, right. I hope so, yeah.
I mean, you, you've been on the the video adventure too.
You like doing the videos and stuff like that.
(02:07):
What do you like about doing that?
So apparently people say like, Ihave a, a gift with making
video, you know, so I try to putit into service, right?
Because in the book it tells us selfishness, self centeredness
that we think is a bit of all our troubles, right?
So it just shows like what? Like let me ask you a question.
What? What do you get out of seeing
(02:28):
those videos? Picture I have a pictures are
one thing. OK, when I was growing up, I
used to hate when my parents, mymom especially, would be like,
let's take a family photo used to drive me nuts.
I think I was embarrassed. I think there was a lot of shame
about how I was viewed with other people.
(02:48):
Like it was a lot of embarrassment there.
I've come to realize today there's so many photos in my
life where I look back and I'm like instantly the memory is
just reignited in my brain and I'm so grateful that I have all
those photos in. So my answer to your question is
videos do that times 1000, right, where, you know, I was
(03:10):
watching that video you made of the retreat.
And that's how we met. And I'm happy that we met
because you're a fucking good dude and I appreciate you.
But that video, it just it'll bring me back to that moment and
it fully encapsulate, encapsulates the the entire
memory of the whole weekend, right.
And I think videos, if words areor if pictures are 1000 words
(03:31):
and videos are a million, right?I'm, I'm sure that's a quote
somewhere or something, but yeah, man, it's like it's
important. And that's why I loved editing
and that's why I love. I did a recent one, I don't know
if you saw it yet, but it was like a horror short of like what
stimulants did to me. Dude, when I was making that the
other day, I'm not kidding you, I had like anxiety because it
(03:52):
brought me back to all those, those moments, those hours I
spent looking through the peephole thinking someone was
coming to kill me, thinking people were outside.
Just the sheer terror of addiction and specifically
psychosis. And I love horror films.
It's one of my favorite genres. I love films.
And so to make that was like, itwas so fun for me, right?
(04:14):
But it also brought back a lot of, a lot of memories And, and
it's good too, because I, I haveto remember what it was like
because I don't ever want to go back there, you know?
You got a step One is remember the pain, right?
The disease. That's some reason I don't mind.
So yeah, with the videos, I, I, I just like I said, I put it
into service and it shows that we could be happy without drugs
(04:35):
and alcohol, right? And it gives like for the still
suffering, right? They could, they get to see us
being happy without drugs and alcohol and yeah just it's a Wii
program, you know, and I just want people to to feel love,
wanted and needed, you know whatI'm saying?
So pretty much that's it. And I, I've, I've been doing it
(04:57):
for a long time, you know, and yeah, I really enjoy doing it.
You know, it's all about love, right?
Yeah. I think a lot of people need to
see that fun side of recovery too, because my first thought
when I came in was how am I, my life is over, right?
My, how am I going to live life?How am I going to not have a
drink on my wedding day? All these bullshit stories that
(05:20):
I've played in my head, my disease just keeping me, trying
to get me back out there, right?And it still happens.
They still come. Yeah, I did not believe in
abstinence when I first got to the rooms, you know, and my
brother in I'm only human. Right, everyone's doing it.
Yeah, and alcohol was always thesolution for everything, right?
(05:42):
As long as as long as I'm off the drugs, you know, and just
doing alcohol be OK. So he's like, just try it out.
Try being abstinence for one year, right?
So that's how I, I came up with the name Bo Bridy, you know,
just as a joke, right? Like I didn't, I didn't believe
in complete abstinence, right. But this is what I didn't know
about, like the rooms, the program, you know the, the
(06:05):
unity, you know all that stuff, right?
Yeah. So can you take us through talk
about a little bit about your childhood and what it was like
growing up in your home? Looking back now, I always felt
like I need this program becauseI always felt restless,
irritable and discontent. You know, my mom was always
racing. I was always angry, always
(06:26):
uncomfortable in my own skin. You know, in school, I felt like
I, I was stupid, you know, I couldn't concentrate on
anything. And the most important thing to
me was my friends seeking validation and just trying to
fit in. Yeah.
So I was a very angry kid. You know, I was part of this
basketball team. Two of the the things that I was
(06:48):
good at was sports and instrumental.
And then the coach kicked me offthe team because of my bad
attitude. And he never brought me back on.
And that just made me resentful to adults, you know, as I was
very disrespectful to the eldersas a kid.
And my parents weren't always there for me, you know, So I
always held that resentment towards them, you know, because
that they weren't there for me. And the way I turned out, you
know, So as a kid, I did whatever the hell I want to do,
(07:10):
you know, I was like the tornadoroaring through people's lives.
You know, one of my first addictions was a steal.
So I'd steal it everywhere I went, the grocery store, the
variety store, my friends place,my family.
And when that came lying, you know, I would hurt the people
that love me the most. And I was blocking the sunlight
of the spirit way before I discovered drugs and alcohol,
you know? So yeah, pretty much I, Yeah.
(07:33):
I was working on self. Well, run, right?
My whole life until I got into these rooms, right?
I did not know how to live life.And yeah, So when I discovered
drugs and alcohols, that's when I finally felt that sense of
ease and comfort, you know, I felt comfortable, happy,
confident, alive. You know, all these fears
dropped. And I was just the life of the
party. You know, I would always wear
(07:54):
these masks with everyone because if you truly knew who I
was in my head, you wouldn't like me.
And if you didn't like me, I'd be at a pity party and, like,
what's the point of living, right?
Yeah. Always wanted to fit in right.
It's funny that there's a commonthread between addicts and
Alcoholics that I always realizes that that need to fit
in the people please to to be a part of and then that's exactly
(08:18):
what recovery does right. You come in and you're like,
hey, man, have a seat, welcome. Have a coffee, you know, but
don't you like, I just fucking flipped my car on the highway
drinking and driving. Like, why would you like me?
Why would I'm a piece of shit? All these things are going
through your mind when you come in.
And then people just love you where you're at, right?
And they listen to your stories and they're like, yeah, same.
(08:41):
I did that, you know, have a seat.
You're good bro, you know, welcome.
We watch it here. It's, it's it's crazy how living
with this disease without any defense.
Wait, we have no idea what the hell is wrong with us.
You know what I'm saying? And for me, I thought it was
different, that there was no onelike me, man, You know, I was
(09:01):
like terminally unique, you know?
And it's like nothing ever worked, right?
And then I had to be pretty badly mangled before coming into
these rooms. But then when you come into
these rooms, you find out that there's so many people just like
you with the same thoughts, the same feelings, you know, the
restless, irritable and discontent, you know, And it
doesn't work alone. We have to do this together,
(09:22):
right? Yeah, I can't.
We can. That's one of my favorite,
favorite lines. I love it.
There's a lot of people that come in that sort of like, I'm
not as bad as as these people. When I came in, I thought it was
like the biggest piece of shit walking on God's beater.
Yeah. A lot to swear, right?
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Cut, cut.
Yeah. Yeah, start over.
Yeah, no, we, we like to to keepthings raw and, and authentic.
(09:45):
And I shouldn't say, well, authentic too, but uncut, raw,
unfiltered, because that's what addiction is, man.
Like I didn't, I didn't start this podcast to have nice
conversations about how great life was.
Like, I want to talk about real shit.
You know, what did, what did yougo through?
How did you get through it? How do you get through shit
today? Right.
It's important for people to hear that that sobriety is
beautiful and amazing and fucking incredible.
(10:08):
And I, I wouldn't change it for the world, but it life still
sucks sometimes, dude. Like the shit that still gets
hard and I still have to navigate and I'm still dealing
with financial shit that that I fucking racked up.
I still, you know, I get collection calls and stuff like
that, You know what I mean? And it's like, when will it end,
right? But it's like, just do the next
right thing, practice principlesof the program, give it back and
(10:28):
things will work out. I have to do, I have to pay back
things and I have to do and showup.
I can't just say God take care of everything, right?
But the outcome is not up to me.I have to do the little things
today. And I think you live by that
principle. You know I just in talking to
you, or try to at least. Do not be discouraged, no one
among us has made maintain anything like perfect and
(10:51):
curiosity spiritual. We are not Saints.
We are not. Saints, the point is we are
trying to grow along spiritual lines, but it's such a blessing
to have the awareness of being itself right where before we
didn't know what the fuck was going on, right?
Yeah, life's going to hit, it says in the big book.
(11:11):
If we don't enlarge our spiritual life, we're not going
to be able to handle certain trials in low spots, you know
what I'm saying? Ahead.
Yeah, Yeah. But in the certain trials in low
spots, there's always blessings that come out of that.
You know what I'm saying? It's like we need all these
these pains and sufferings to grow, right?
So like, instead of being like in a pity party about it, try
being thankful at that moment, right?
(11:34):
This is all about practicing though, right?
It's not simple, but not easy. Like for me, I'm coming up on
three years in October and year 2 has been like super hard.
There were times where I just wanted to give up, you know what
I'm saying? Because I wasn't, I wasn't able
to handle certain trials in low spots.
This is what happens when I takemy will back, right?
(11:55):
Like trouble comes right? And disease centers in my mind,
it tells me that I could drink. You know what I'm saying?
And this is what we're dealing with every single day, right?
That's why we have a daily reprieve.
What does what does taking your will back look like today?
What does that look like to you?It's what I stopped doing the
(12:18):
things I'm supposed to do right?Because once I'm in my will,
like I, I get resentful. I'm uncomfortable in my own
skin. I'm full of fear, you know, I
make up resentments towards people, you know?
And this is what the my brains like, right?
It's, it's mentally strangely the range, right?
(12:39):
That like, again, the disease that is in my, in my mind, in my
thinking, right? And I suffer from an illness
which only a spiritual experience can conquer, right.
Yeah, I could be very weak to this disease sometimes, you
know, and be in that pity party.And like we, we have like 2
(13:00):
options. We could either blot out the
consciousness of our intolerablesituation with anything that
makes me feel good, right? Drugs, alcohol.
But if you're not doing drugs and alcohol, we pick up other
things. Right.
Anything bro? So, so media food, you know,
whatever man scrolling, right, That girl, right?
Whatever we focus on is pretty much our higher power, right?
(13:23):
But deep down in every man and woman shell is a fundamental
idea of God, right? So the problem is in me and the
power is deep down within me andI have to search diligently
within myself every single day, right?
What was the moment like? I want to backtrack a bit.
So was drinking your main thing?Was that like or were you
(13:43):
everything? I did pretty much everything.
Alcohol was always like the the thing that I did all the.
Time, yeah. Yeah.
Like, to me, that was like the dissolution.
But when I did alcohol, it wouldalways lead to, like, the other
stuff, right? Yeah.
Cocaine, ecstasy, whatever. I did it all.
I didn't do heroin. But what brought me to my knees
(14:04):
is crystal meth. Yeah.
Can you walk us through that? What did that look like and and
how did you ultimately seek help?
Like what was the moment? What was that like?
So I was full flight from reality when I started meth, you
know what I'm saying? Like I started hearing voices in
my head, psychosis. And what I'd hear is my friends
and family believing it's actually them with some spyware.
(14:26):
So I could. I believe that they can see what
I see, they can see what I think.
They know everything about me. And they absolutely hated me.
And this lasted for like 2 years.
And even when I'd be sober, I'd be hearing these voices, you
know what I'm saying? I'd be one of those guys that
are on the street that are just like fighting with voices in
their head, right? That's what that's how I'd be
(14:48):
when I was sober. You know what?
I'm being restless interval in this content, you know, and I
just thought everyone hated me, you know, and I was like the
biggest piece of shit walking onGod's green earth.
So like after a three day binge,the voices would tell me go to
the mental hospital. I didn't want to go, but I would
go out of fear, right? And it's the most terrifying
(15:09):
experience getting on the bus, hearing these voices, checking
in, and then once you check intothe metal hospital, you can't
leave until they let you out. And that's what the voices
really attacked my head. You know, just bringing up every
single selfish moment in my life.
That time I wasn't there for my son, that time I was a piece of
shit to my family, that time I stole money from my
ex-girlfriend. They would tell me that I'm the
worst father in the world and you don't deserve to live.
(15:31):
I was full flight from reality and I thought I was going to
die, right? So the doctors would just tell
me the voices are all in your head.
They would medicate me with olanzapine, I'd sleep it off,
wake up, and they would send me home.
And when I left that mental hospital, all I felt was shame,
guilt, and remorse, you know? And I had a firm resolution to
never use a drink again. And if you put me to a lie
(15:52):
detector test, I would pass for flight colors because I actually
believed it. So I go home, sleep for two
days, wake up, and once I wake up, I'm restless, irritable, and
discontent. And then the mind starts racing.
The mental black spot, right? I think I could use and drink.
It'll be different this time. And then once I put one in me,
it triggers the phenomena of craving.
I have this allergy to body, this abnormal reaction, and then
the binge. And what happens after the
(16:13):
binge? I would get paranoid, the voices
would scare the shit out of me, and I would go back to the
mental hospital. So I repeated going to the
mental hospital 50 times. You know what I'm saying?
Like it was just a cycle of insanity around and around and
around with no solution, right? And this is what it is.
If, if we don't have like these meetings and, and doing the
(16:36):
steps and all that, right? It's just a cycle of insanity,
right? I didn't, I didn't understand
why I kept using when I didn't want to.
I didn't understand why it hurt the people that love me the
most. I didn't understand why I did
the things I did, you know, I just thought I was the biggest
piece of shit and I, I, I didn'tthink I deserve to live, you
know? And this is how cunning,
(16:57):
baffling and powerful this thingis we're dealing with, right?
Yeah. So I tried a lot of things,
right? I went to the mental, like I
said, I went to the mental hospital like 15 times.
I went to rehab twice. I tried moving to different
places. I did programs like CAMH, you
know, tried joining different religion.
(17:18):
Nothing ever worked, right? And by the end of it, I was
living in my apartment. My roommate moved out because of
his by addiction. I rent, I miss rent payment for
like 3 months you know, I was just so isolated, you know, and
I was just so disgusted when disgusted with myself, you know,
I couldn't look at myself in themirror.
I was mentally, physically, financially and spiritually
(17:40):
broken, you know, and I would drink as much alcohol as I can
and do as much as my drug of choice as I can to build up
courage to kill myself, you knowwhat I'm saying?
I, I didn't think there was any way out and I didn't ask for
help because I didn't think anyone would ever help me, you
know what I'm saying? I was delusional.
I was full flight from reality, you know.
Yeah. So one day my mom came over, you
(18:01):
know, and she saw that the placewas a mess and, and I was just
like, intoxicated, out of my mind.
And that's what she described. This decided with my family that
I go to rehab, you know, I'm saying.
So by the grace of God, I got into these rooms and through you
guys and the big book of Alcoholics Anonymous, that's
(18:22):
what I discovered, that I sufferfrom an illness which only a
spiritual experience can conquer, right?
What does the What does the spiritual experience mean to
you? Working these spiritual
principles in all your affairs, right?
One addict working with another addict is vital, the permanent
(18:45):
recovery, right? For me, I didn't think this
problem could work for me, right, 'cause I didn't think I
was worth worthy of it, right? That's the delusion, the liar
that I believed in my head for so long.
But by doing the work right, it says the spiritual principles
will solve your problems. And when you're doing the steps,
you're working the spiritual principles in all your fears,
(19:06):
right? You're working courage, You're
working honesty, right? And by doing Step 4, you know,
and then doing Step 5, admittingto God, to myself and to another
human being, the exact nature ofmy wrongs.
That's what I knew that this poem could work for me and that
I have a chance to do better. You know, it says there's very
little hole for your recovery unless you get entire psychic
(19:28):
change. And I, I believe that's when I
got it was a on Step 5. You know what I'm saying?
But what do I really have? What I really have is a daily
reprieve contingent on the maintenance of my spiritual
condition, right? I'm not going to be, I can't
rely on yesterday's spirituality.
(19:48):
I'm not going to be full off yesterday's food.
I'm not going to spill good off yesterday's shower, right?
It's like every single day is a day I'm going to carry the
vision of God's will into all myactivities because I'm dealing
with an illness. And then if I don't and I get
into self, I get driven by 100 forms of fear to self, delude
yourself, seeking yourself, pity.
And I can't deferate the truth of the false or I'm blotting out
(20:08):
the consciousness of my tolerable situation with
anything that makes me feel good, right?
What's the hardest spiritual principle for you to work today?
Courage, yeah, like fear, it always kicks in, you know what
I'm saying? Like I'm coming about three
(20:30):
years into this, right? I, I can, I consider myself
still a baby, you know, and justlike to think about it, right?
I was running on self will pretty much my whole life until
I got into these rooms like 3 years ago, right?
And that disease that is in my mind that always kicks in,
right? And that's what holds me back
from a lot of things, right? Yeah, yeah, this, this sort of
(20:52):
like movie that we project onto the world of it's going to be
like this, right? Yeah.
I, I'm having a really hard timelately.
My thing has been like doing recovery shit that I don't
necessarily want to do, but alsojust like life shit, you know,
showing up. It's gotten easier because I've
been praying about it, talking about it, opening up about it,
that I find that really helpful too.
(21:12):
Just like even talking with another, anybody but another
addict or alcoholic about what I'm struggling with.
It takes the power away from it,right.
But I, I have this thing where I'm like, oh, you know, I have
to leave my comfortable apartment to go and do this
thing, whatever, meeting, whatever, even just like dinner,
something that doesn't serve me right, something that I don't
get immediate gratification, instant gratification out of.
(21:35):
And it's like, I'll obsess aboutit all day.
Like I have to do this thing later.
Oh my God, I have to do it. I can't, you know, I don't want
to do it, blah, blah, blah. And so I heard once, I heard a
speaker once say that the only solution to doing something you
don't feel like doing is doing it is action.
(21:56):
Straight up action. Just shut the fuck up.
Like turn this off for a second and just get in the car and
drive or walk to the bus or do whatever you have to do and it
goes away. That's not like, that's not the
answer I want to hear, right? But it's true.
Like it's fucking true. It gets easier as you do it,
right, the more you do it. What does your shirt say?
I've been wondering. Get comfortable being.
Uncomfortable. I love it.
(22:16):
What I'm saying, I love this. Is what recovery is all.
About this too shall pass, yeah.This is what I discovered
recovery in 2020, yeah. That's a beautiful.
You got that made. Yeah, I love that.
Yeah. Yeah.
That's sick. But yeah, it's all about forcing
ourselves to do the things we don't want to do.
It's like when I don't want to go to a meeting, that's probably
(22:38):
what I should go to a meeting. When I don't want to share,
that's probably what I should share, right?
I listen to a lot of Goggins. David Goggins.
Love that guy. Right, And he's like, cuz I,
we're the book says that I'm always looking for the sense of
ease and comfort, right? And that's how it's been my
whole life, right? If it was uncomfortable, I would
turn the other way. Like every job I had, you know,
(23:00):
there was like no growth, right?I just get comfortable and, and
stay like that, right? And that's, this is what
recovery is all about, right? Forcing ourselves to do the
things we don't want to do, right?
I don't always want to sponsor someone.
I don't always want to go to a meeting, you know, and I don't
always want to go to the gym, right?
(23:21):
But we force ourselves to do thethings we're not supposed to do.
And by doing that, that's how weget God's, God's grace, right?
Do a little bit of work and God does the rest right.
When life lifes you today, how do you get through it?
How do you get through tough time?
How do you get through the trials in low spots like in the
(23:41):
moment? I have to, I don't know how to
live life, right? I have a design for Living,
which is a big book, right? And it tells me when all else
fails, one addict working with another addict will save the
day, right? It's all about getting on
itself, right? And we have step four, we have
(24:06):
step 10 to continue take personal inventory and we have
step like nightly inventory, right?
And it tells us on page 62 that selfishness, self certainness
that we think is the root of allthe troubles, right?
And we get driven by this illness.
Yeah, I know it's all about using picking up the spiritual
(24:27):
toolkit, right? Hit hit a meeting, right?
Ten step suggestion says when these things prop up at once, we
go to God, right? That means fast, right?
Then we discuss it with someone immediately, right?
Fellowship. This is a we program for a
reason. And if we have to apologize,
then we we do it right away, right?
And then we turn ourselves into helping others, right?
(24:53):
That was a that's a big one for me.
So I when I relapsed after the 71/2 years I didn't, I didn't go
to anyone with with my plan right.
And I always stress this. I always try to nail home the
calling another addict or alcoholic.
I'm not trust me, I'm flawed in it.
Like I I still my phone is 1000 lbs some days, right?
Even when people are calling me in the program, I struggle to
(25:14):
pick it up or outside of the program because I'm busy or I'm
you know all this bullshit. Again, this this story spinning
in my head. I can't stress enough how
important it is to like wheneverI have a a grand idea based out
of emotion right? For me, it was at the time it
was I'm bored in recovery. My life is good, but it's not
(25:35):
what I want it to be, right? I'm not getting what I want.
This was, you know, last year. I know it'll fix this.
I haven't tried taking ADHD medication as prescribed, which
is bullshit. I did try and that's how I got
back into the second rehab. And I remember, I remember
vividly like having this plan inmy head and it wasn't like a
quick I, it wasn't like a, this will fix this relapse.
(25:58):
Boom. It was a, it was a process,
right? The relapse always proceeds.
They talk about it in the book too.
That proceeds with a thought. There's always a a, a thought.
There's always leading up to right?
We relapse with a thought beforewe relapse of the drink.
And that was my thing. It was like, I'm going to fix
this. I have, you know, I'm, I'm
depressed. My my dopamine is low.
So this will fix it. Again, to your point, using
(26:19):
external things to fix my insides, right?
And I never told anyone about it.
I would tell people 90% of the truth and I would keep that 10%
back there that took me out backon a way worse relapse, right?
It always gets worse, man, Always.
So I, I, I think it's really important, yeah.
Yeah, Disease centers in our mind, right?
It starts off with a thought andthen it becomes an obsession,
(26:42):
right? And but The thing is like
there's nothing we can do about the first thought, but we got to
stop it, right? The second thought and go down
to the solution, which is God oryour higher power, right?
And everything around the triangle is meetings, service,
prayer, fellowship, sponsoring honesty, right?
(27:02):
All of these things are are our solution is treatment to our
illness, right? But the big book says we're not
going to be inspired at all times and we are going to make
mistakes, right? It says when we take a sincere
position to trust in God's will,all sorts of remarkable things
will follow, right? And this is to say, we do this
thing perfectly. It says we do things well,
(27:23):
right? And there's a lot of growth in
all these certain trials in low spots, right?
Can you think of 1 where where there was a lot of growth, where
you in the moment, maybe in the moment you thought it was the
worst thing ever and the sky wasfalling and the outcome turned
out to be better than than it was?
Can you? Can you remember what?
Yeah. OK, so my first year of
(27:47):
sobriety, you know, I joined this group and it's my first
time in recovery. I found my tribe.
I love this group. Right.
And I did a lot of service for this group.
You know, I I did the clothing, I did the posters.
I was so welcoming to the newcomers.
I started my own gratitude meeting.
You know, I love this group, butwas I doing all that stuff for
that group? That's what my head was telling
(28:09):
me, right? I just came from a dark place
and into recovery and I wanted people to like me, right?
So yeah, again, 62 second paragraph.
Selfishness, self centeredness that we think is the root of all
our troubles, right? So I made decisions based on
self arouse character defects onmy fellows and they kicked me
out the group after my one year medallion.
(28:31):
Right. Wow.
And I'm like, they kicked you out.
Holy. Yeah, right.
And I had the biggest resentment, right?
I'm like, how can I do this to me?
I did this so, so much stuff forthem, right?
But this is a program of giving and wanting nothing in return.
And when people harm us, the bigbook says we disregard the other
person entirely and we look towards ourselves and see where
(28:52):
we went wrong. But I was a working program,
right? Recovery is unity recovery and
service, right? I was doing unity and service
and I wasn't doing the steps, right.
And what resentment is the number one offender that
destroys us, right? So I went back out, you know,
for seven months, right? On that resentment.
(29:13):
On that resentment, yeah, wow. But today I'm grateful that I
got kicked out of that group because of what it is today,
right? I got back into the rooms by the
grace of God and I, I did the steps, right?
And now I'm now it's all about living the steps, you know, and
by working a program and connecting to a power greater
(29:35):
than yourselves, you know, this and putting yourself into
service in return, you get beautiful, meaningful
relationships and it just keep coming and coming, right?
And I wouldn't have met all these people if I I don't know
if I was part of that group still, right?
Yeah. But The thing is, right.
I, I would always blame them forwhat happened, right?
(29:59):
But I would, I would never look at my part, right.
And the sick man's prayer, right?
This was our course. We realized people who wronged
us were perhaps spiritually sick, though we didn't like
their symptoms and the way they disturbed us.
They, like ourselves, were sick too.
We asked God to help show us thesame thoughts.
Pity in patients that would cheerfully grant a sick friend.
When a person offends us, we said to ourselves, this is a
sick person. How can I be helpful to them?
(30:21):
God see me for being angry, thy will be done So for so long that
resentment in my head was like brewing, right?
And I would just have like visions of like what would
happen if I saw these people, right?
I just felt so hated and rejected for getting kicked out,
right? But God presented that moment at
(30:42):
the right time. And when I saw them, I just gave
them a big hug, right? And that's the program right
there, right? That's the that's the psyche
change, you know? Yeah.
Being able to love unconditionally, right?
Yeah. What was that seven months like
for you, that relapse, and how did you get back in?
(31:02):
So that seven months was, yeah, I hung out with a bunch of
people that I I've met in recovery, right.
And you know, the behaviors, right?
It's just sketchy. Just every single day, right?
It just came to the point where I had no money left.
(31:25):
My family was going to abandon me.
All my friends never already stopped talking to me, you know?
And I had two options, right? Plotting the consciousness of my
tolerable situation with anything that makes me feel
good, right? With drugs, alcohol.
And I was about to, like, live on the streets or accept
spiritual help, right? So yeah, I had to be pretty
(31:47):
badly mangled before getting into these rooms, right?
Yeah, yeah. Well, I'm happy you got back in.
I mean, I know for me, coming back in was probably one of the
hardest things I've done, you know, in my life.
It just seemed like it seemed like such a big mountain to
climb to get back. In it was like for me, I didn't.
(32:07):
It was the scary thing for me was getting sober.
It's like, I was like thinking about like the withdrawals and
life without drugs and alcohol and all that stuff, right?
But again, that's our disease that that that that centers in
my mind. Right wants to keep us sick.
I didn't think, I honestly knew I had to get back in the rooms,
but I didn't think I could actually do it, right.
(32:28):
So the first thing I did was I went to the CA convention,
right? I was four days clean and I went
to the CA convention convention and I was trying to find like a
God squad, like fellowship, right?
Because I, I didn't think I could stay sober without that
group, that I was part of it. I love that group, right?
And I just didn't think recoverywas ever possible to get back
in, you know what I'm saying? Yeah.
(32:49):
What's the biggest gift you've received in recovery?
Like what? What?
What is getting sober and being sober and being of service?
What? What is the greatest gift?
The greatest gift is the abilityto be of service and be helpful.
You know, I couldn't be helpful to anyone.
I couldn't be helpful to myself and but not only that, right,
(33:14):
helping others helps ourselves, right?
Our very lives depend on helpingothers, right?
And that's the greatest gift. You know, I with my past, you
know, I, it's crazy. It says in the big book, our our
dark past is the greatest possession we have, right?
(33:35):
And I, I would just ignore my past, put it on the carpet,
never want to think about my past, right?
And now I'm here sharing my experience, strength and hope
you know, and hopefully it can help at least one person, right?
Yeah, so that's what we say, right?
What's what do you, what do you hope that one person gets out of
your story? Like what do you hope people get
out of here? When you Share your story, What
(33:56):
do you hope people get out of it?
I just want them to to know thatwhatever you did in the past,
your past doesn't define you, right?
We have a, we're all dealing with this illness and if you're
alive right now, you have a chance to do better, right?
(34:22):
Like I said, our past becomes our greatest asset and we use
that to help others and just want them to know that their
love wanted and needed. And to be honest, like what
would we do if we didn't have anyone to help, right?
If we couldn't be of service andwe couldn't work with another
addict, You know what I'm saying?
Because that's pretty much the solution, right?
(34:43):
Yeah, we'd be fucked. I mean, I always say this, but I
was AI was a taker my whole lifein addiction.
Take, take, take. What can I get out of this
situation? Conditional acceptance, right?
Yeah, Yeah, I'll do that. But I need something out of it,
right? And then I come in and I become
a giver, You know, I still take a lot.
But my point with all that is like, you can't have givers
(35:06):
without takers, you know what I mean?
Like, you need to have both sides, right?
So any days that it feels like I'm taking a lot, somebody's
giving, right? So it's like, I try to think
like that too. It's like you need both, right?
You need to have both sides. And that's why the newcomer is
the most important person in anysituation meeting whatever,
because I need to give away whatwas so freely given to me, and
(35:29):
then they can in turn do it to someone else, right?
It's this beautiful cycle that this sort of happens in
recovery, you know? Yeah, there's a lot of like, no,
that's OK. You don't have to give me.
But at the same time, that person that's giving you
something is trying to work the spiritual principles of like
being generous, right? Being kindness, right?
And sometimes you can't, We can.But like, I I wouldn't want to
(35:51):
rob them from from from giving, right and expecting nothing in
return, right? But I understand I was a taker
my whole life too, bro. Like I wouldn't I would give and
expect something in return, right?
And this is recovery is like my sponsor would say, don't even
expect to thank you. You know what I'm saying?
Yeah, right. It's a lot easier to live that
(36:12):
way, too. It's a lot freeing.
Expectations are nothing but premeditated resentments.
You know, If I'm always expecting something or looking
at outcomes, I'm going to be letdown no matter what.
Yeah, that person, place thing, situation is gonna let me down
because I'm not getting it the way I want, Right?
Yeah. So now you're working at a sober
house. Now how did you get into that
(36:34):
and what's that like? Well, that's a miracle to me
that I'm a house manager at a sober living house.
You know, to be honest, I, I knew some of the guys for, for
some time, but like coming into the, the sober living house is
(36:57):
like a whole new world to me, right?
Like I've been all over like CA and a a but like coming into
this is like a whole new world of like recovery.
So I moved in right away and slowly I brought my stuff in and
when I got there, we had a meeting.
And the first, the first thing Isaid to the guys, like they
(37:18):
introduced me, like house manager and I, I just said it's
a blessing and an honor to be here, you know, and I'm here to
help in any way I can. You know what I'm saying?
To me, it's still a miracle thatI, that I, I'm there.
It's such a blessing to be around all that all the time,
right? I'm supposed to be helpful to
(37:41):
the guys. But when you help someone, it's
helping you too, right? And being around these, these
guys, these newcomers all the time, It's it's been really
vital in my in me working my program, right?
Yeah. So I'm very grateful.
For that, right, it's, it's got to be tough though, too, right?
Because as we know, as I know insober living, there's a lot of
(38:04):
relapse that happens. There's a lot of, you know,
there's a lot of addiction, you know, plain and simple, right?
There's just a lot of addiction that happens and how do you deal
with that? And like, how does it affect
like how, what does that look like?
How is that? How does that affect you?
Well, there's different, all types of sobriety in there,
different ages, different peoplethat want it more people that
(38:26):
are not serious about it, right?And to be honest, I have to just
really work spiritual principlesand all my affairs, right?
If people are not serious about it, there's just nothing you
could do about that, right? They, they, they have to come to
want it, right? But for me, like it's, I have to
(38:46):
be in spiritual fake condition because if I'm in self like I, I
get, I'm dealing with it. I'm sick too, right?
And it's nothing good comes out of being in self, right?
I'm not useful or, you know, I'museless.
Have you had any relapses that you had to deal with that were
really tough like or anything like that or?
(39:07):
Well, that one relapse when I went out with that resentment
for getting kicked out of that group, which became a blessing
at the end, I had no intentions of going back out.
But yeah, I went back out seven months, came back in, you know?
What about the clients? I mean like the clients like
dealing with relapse in the house.
That's gotta be tough, isn't it?Or.
(39:29):
Yeah, old clients in the house, yeah, yeah, I mean.
You don't have to go into details, but like I just, it
must be tough to to see someone that you get a relationship with
go back out and then you got to deal with it.
Because I remember when I lived at sober living, I've been to
(39:50):
to, I've been a few Times Now. It was tough to see someone go
back out right. And it's like you can't get
dragged down with them. You can't let it affect your
sobriety. You can't control it, you can't
cure it. You didn't 'cause it right?
But like, it must be tough. It's, it all comes down to like
doing the work, right. If we're not working this
program, we're going to, we're going to go back out.
(40:13):
In my early recovery, I, I wouldget really like, it would be
really hard for me to see my friends go out, you know, but
now that I have more, a little bit more time and I have a
design for living, you know, it's, it says the big book.
If they don't want it, you know you have to.
(40:35):
You have to. Don't waste your time trying to
sway them because we we may ruina later opportunity for them,
right? A new bottom right.
Yeah, So what I the only way I can really help people that
don't really want it is pray forthem, right?
And nothing. Absolutely nothing happens in
God's world by mistake, right? And everyone is going through
(40:56):
whatever they're going through to get to wherever they're going
to, right? Wherever they need to go.
I love that. Yeah, it's true.
You talk a lot about faith and spirituality, and that's been a
real eye opener for me too. Because human, what does it say?
Human aid will fail us, right? Like no matter what could be the
nicest person in the world, theywill let you down at some point,
(41:18):
and not intentionally. It's just the way it is.
So I need a power greater than myself to rely on.
What is faith in spirituality? God, what does that look like to
you today? Well, pray step 11, right?
Seek through prayer and meditation to improve our
conscious contact with God, right?
(41:38):
Does it say maintain, right? And I, I follow the book, right?
Like what we have is a daily reprieve upon awakening, right?
Think about the 24 hours ahead throughout the day.
I always have to turn my will, right, my thinking and my life,
my actions over the care of God.I just thank God, right?
(41:59):
Taking an action, I love that. Yeah, when I'm agitated at work,
when I because I do landscaping too, right?
I have to turn my my will by thinking, right?
And I, I put gratitude into action.
And what does that look like? Doing a good job doing it to the
best of my ability, right? Because if I, there are days
(42:19):
where I'm just at work and I just want to get it over with,
you know? And no, it practices these
spiritual principles and all ouraffairs, right?
I'll be honest, I'm not always on top of my prayers, you know,
and it's all about consistency, right?
And being disciplined and just doing it like you hear, like the
(42:42):
old timers, like, you know, likeEric, he's like he's consistent,
right? But he's been around for a long
time, right? And it says we, we have to make
it use of their experience, right?
Yeah. What's the what would you say is
the best piece of advice you gotin recovery, either early
recovery or now? Best piece of advice that I ever
(43:05):
got in recovery. Let me ask you that question.
I just immediately my brain goesto Jay, right?
And Alan always, there's so much, right?
There's so much. But Alan always says, and he
quotes Jay when he says this is like, you know, if I don't know
(43:30):
if there's anything that precedes it, But he always says
try a little harder and stay a little longer, right?
And I love that it's so true. It's like if, if, if you're
going through a really rough time and you're having a hard
time getting sober, staying sober and you just can't figure
it out, try a little harder and stay a little longer, right?
Don't give up. You know, and I love that it's,
(43:50):
it's so true as like even in recovery, you know, having 7 1/2
years, all those tools that are still there, I didn't lose all
those tools. I lost the time.
I didn't even lose the time. I won't say that, but it was
really hard, man. It was really hard to come back
in and tell my my group that I had one day like I started
bawling my eyes. I can vividly remember I was
chairing a meeting at my Home group and I had just gone out.
(44:13):
I had, I had just accepted my relapse because it had been
going on for a while, but I didn't see this alcoholic addict
thinking was telling me that I hadn't relapsed yet because I
didn't drink and I was doing ADHD medication and it was
prescribed. Meanwhile, I'm buying it on the
dark web and taking all sorts ofmeths and shit like that.
It was really hard to, again, step one, getting honest was
(44:34):
really hard. And I remember that, you know,
they announced buddy, you know, 30 days, everyone claps 20 days
goes around the room and it's coming to me and I see it coming
to me and I'm just like, holy fuck.
My sponsor recommended that I that I do that.
But I, you know, admit my relapse and I was so scared.
I just remember coming to me. My name is Anthony.
I'm an addict alcoholic, and I have one day, and I just started
(44:56):
bawling my eyes out in front of all these men, this room of men,
and I'll never forget it. I had maybe six or seven people
as that was happening, get out of their fucking seat, come over
to me and just hug me. And then my sponsor, Ken, you
know, he leaned in and he goes, hey, man, do you want me to take
over? Like.
And I'm like, no, I have to do this like this.
Good. Yeah.
I didn't get sober right after that because again, we need to
(45:18):
bang our head a few more times and do some more research and
scrape our knee. But there was a big seed planted
that day, and that was that I could be vulnerable in a room
full of men, in a room full of anyone in recovery.
It was a shift. It was a shift and I'm going to
get accepted. I'm going to be OK and people
are going to love me where I'm at.
No one's going to judge me. And you fucking idiot, you had
eight, but how did you do that? You know what I mean?
(45:39):
People always ask me, people that are working really good
programs will always come up to me and be like, hey, like, how
did you relapse? And I know that you're working a
good program if you ask me that because you don't want to go
back out and relapse. And that's why I always share my
experience about relapse. And it's so important because if
you have long term sobriety, even if you have short term, but
if you have long term sobriety and you think that you it'll
(46:01):
never be a part of your story, fucking give your head a shake,
right? Because it, it, I wasn't
expecting it. I was on fucking cloud 9 in
recovery in 7 1/2 years, met my wife.
Life was amazing, dude. It was amazing.
And I never thought that relapsewould be a part of my story.
I thought that I would be that that guy that, you know, went
one time through. And I'm happy it happened
(46:22):
because to your point, out of the pain came spiritual growth,
a lot of spiritual growth and a new connection with my, my
higher power. And I realized that my higher
power never went anywhere. He was there the whole time
watching me struggle. I just didn't tap into them.
I didn't plug, plug the. I didn't put the plug in the
jug. Right.
I have to do that today. So that's probably the best.
(46:45):
There's so much, but yeah. There's so much, you know.
Page 417 Acceptance is the key to all my problems.
I need not to concentrate what needs to be changed in the
world, but what needs to be changed in me.
I love that so much because every time I get pissed off or
agitated, you know, that just shows me that I have to look
inward and that shows me that I need to work on myself, right?
(47:08):
It's not that person. It's the symptoms that we don't
like, right? And there's another part of the
big book on 1/16. It goes like this.
These experiences by land out says like fears, harm,
resentments. Whatever you're going through
may come to you, or you may already had it several times.
Should it happen again, regardedin a different light, maybe
(47:29):
it'll prove a blessing. Time after time.
The superior calamity has been aboon.
It's line out a gift, a blessing, for it led to the
discovery of God, right? Love that.
So my best advice, I heard a speaker say this.
His spots always told him to go to God, go to God, go to God, go
(47:53):
to God, go to God, and then go to God and then go to God, go to
God, go to God, go to God and then go to God.
You know what I'm saying? Go to God for everything.
Man, that's the best piece of advice I ever got.
Yeah, cuz I can't do it on my own, right?
Exactly. Let's end with this.
You have a poem that you wanted to read.
(48:14):
Is it a poem? Is that?
Is that what it is? Yeah.
So this is I call this one I theattic right?
You have it off the Dome, OK, Ofcourse you do.
I thought you were going to pullit out and read.
It let's hear it. It's called I the Attic and I
don't write, right? Maybe it's something I could do.
You know, there's a lot of stuffthat you discover being a
(48:34):
sobriety. You know, that's why it's
courage to change the things we can, right?
We don't even know what we're capable of, right?
Anyways, I read this poem to oneof my friends and he's like,
where do you think that came from, right?
And he's like God, right? So this is before I did the
steps, OK? This is when I first got back
(48:55):
into the rooms, OK. And it goes like this, such a
roller coaster of emotion. Some days being sober, should I
feel comfortable? I don't.
Last year I felt suicidal. This year, if I do something
different, like talking to God more, I'm feeling frustrated.
I need to quit the disturbance in my head, even as a position,
like a sniper unpatiently waiting for that slip to kill
(49:16):
their prey, I see despair in hate.
Mentally locked behind bars of no fate, I dance with the devil,
receiving nothing but hatred. On another next level, Lois of a
low is going to have lost my soul all alone, feeling nothing
but exposed. It was me that made the pick up.
It was me that made the drop off, it was me that made this
addiction an incurable disease. Lord forgive me, Higher power.
God, please set me free. It's not a want, it's a need.
(49:38):
I the addict, it's a routine. It's been a bad habit ever since
16. Losing my mind, nightmares and
my dreams. Thinking of the days when I was
adoc servant, haunting me, watching me, being very
observant. I was so selfish, so cold and
rebellious. Laughing at me like a clown in
the circus. The sickness is fierce for me,
my new purpose. They got me so close that I
think I resurface. They love it.
Right now I'm so shaky and nervous.
(50:00):
I'm conquering this fear of proving that I'm not worthless.
But I'm still confused. Was it really psychosis?
I was a war in my head, intentions of being dead.
I could look at my face and I'd see that look of disgrace.
It was me that wanted that sip. It was me that wanted that hit.
It was me that wanted that trip.It was me that was a piece of it
was me that made this addiction and incurable disease.
Lord forgive me. Hire power of God please.
(50:21):
I get triggered and that's the reality.
Regretting it, that would just be blasphemy.
But sometimes I can't help it. It's something I have to deal
with, that attic mind. Even in peaceful places, those
demons still lurk, feeding off you when you feel bad, broken or
hurt. I'll stand on my resilience no
matter what they say. I was so close to death.
That was the price I had to pay.So I raised my hands to the sky
and remembrance, the Most High whose powers I might kind of
(50:41):
compare, quantify. It's me that has to live with no
regrets. It's me that has to ask God to
remove all these character defects.
It's me that has to fully surrender, do the work and live
the 12 steps. Thanks for letting me share.
I love it. I'm feeling like we should
fucking drop that down and record it over there.
(51:02):
I love that man. Thanks so much for coming down
bro. I appreciate you buddy.
Thanks bro. Thanks for having me, man.
I love what you do, man. Keep doing what you're doing.
Thank you. It's helping, man.
It's helping others, man. I.
Appreciate you, buddy. Thank you.
Like you said, it's not easy to like, reach out to people and
stuff like that, right? So yeah.
Love you bro, you can do it. Thanks for listening.
Please help us grow the channel and like share.
(51:23):
And subscribe for more content. The discussions and stories
shared on this podcast are for informational and motivational
purposes only. This content is not a substitute
for professional medical advice,addiction treatment, or therapy.
If you or someone you know is struggling with addiction,
please consult A licensed physician, addiction specialist,
or mental health professional. You are no longer alone.
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