Conspiracy and Controversy: An Interview with David Icke

David Icke is one of the most well-known, controversial people in the world of conspiracy theories. In this episode, the guys speak with Mr. Icke for a first-hand look at everything from his former career to his beliefs on the nature of reality, the accusations of his critics and more.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is
riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or
learn the stuff they don't want you to know. A
production of I Heart Gradios How Stuff Works. Welcome back

(00:24):
to the show. My name is Matt, my name they
call me Ben. We are joined as always with our
super producer Paul Mission controlled decade. Most importantly, you are you.
You are here that makes this stuff they don't want
you to know. An episode that almost never saw the
light of day. It's true, this episode you're gonna here
today went through the longest q A period I think

(00:48):
we've ever had with any episode. That's true, Matt. Yeah,
just as a little behind the curtain. Generally, what we
do after we finish an episode, one or more of
us will listen back to the episode, give some notes.
Generally there's nothing, but sometimes there is. And in this case, um,
it's taken a couple of weeks for us to come
up with, um some major decisions about this, even whether

(01:11):
or not to release it right. Yes, yes, as you said,
so let's get the badger out of the bag here.
We recently spoke to uh incredibly controversial figure prominent in
the world of conspiracy theory or fringe thought named David Ike.
To his supporters or his fans or advocates, he is

(01:31):
seen as a voice that speaks truth to power in
some cases right uh. To his opponents, and there are
many he is considered either outright uh too far afield,
you know. Some people have used phrases like crack pot
or something. Other people have called him a virulent anti semit.

(01:53):
This is a very very big figure in this world.
But this is also very much a controversial figures, so
much so that we spend a lot of t LC
going into the interview with concerns and I'm actually not
on this interview um, which I guess was a good
thing for the process, because I was able to kind
of take a step back and listen to it and
come up with some some notes and some concerns that

(02:15):
I had that we all ultimately shared. And we did
a thing that I don't think we've ever done about
an episode where we all sat down in a room
and kind of prode and conned it out as to
whether we should put this out or not, and we
ultimately decided that because this gentleman looms so large in
this space that we occupy that we're like talking about,
and our whole you know, concept behind the show is

(02:36):
to present things open mindedly. Um, we decided that it
was probably a better idea and more of a service
to our listeners to put this episode out and let
this man defend himself and speak what he sees as
his own truth. And as as we'll hear, he's pretty articulate.
Spoiler alert, we do not get to everything. No, there's

(02:58):
no way. David Ike has been speaking and writing gosh
since the nineties and early nineties and at least on
on the particular topics that we're interested in. And just
to that one point, uh, that that you both are
making here, he is such a large figure in the
space in which we occupy that there's a certain amount

(03:19):
of um fascination I think, at least for me personally
with with David Ike, no matter what you or I
think about him and his a lot of his views. Uh,
we hope that you find him as intriguing no matter
how you feel about him, as we do. And we
wanted to try something something a little bit different for

(03:41):
us in the course of this interview longtime listeners. As
you know, we often say that you are the most
important part of the show. You specifically you listening, No,
not him you. Uh. This this is where the rubber
hits the road in that regard. We're going to ask
you if you would like to participate in a project
with us after you hear this interview. We'd like to

(04:05):
start something on our Facebook page. Here's where it gets crazy,
where you can post the questions that you would like
to ask David Ike. And if this is something that
may be of interest to all of us listening, we
can attempt to arrange another interview wherein we ask those
questions of him. Yeah, that's a great idea, Ben, So

(04:26):
we we hope you'll listen and think about those questions
that you want to ask, think about the concepts that
you're interested in that you'd like to hear him talk about,
and and we'll do everything we can to to make
that happen. Or reactions to what you hear in this interview,
that's great. And here's a pro tip to see just
how long we held onto this interview and going back
and forth on whether or not we should air it.

(04:48):
You'll hear you'll hear him drop some specific dates. One
of the major reasons that we got to speak with
David Ike is because he had a new documentary coming
out called Renegade, and it was released on June four,
and it is now well into June. That's that's how
long it took. You know, if you look at it
from a technical perspective, we've never been that far ahead. Yeah,

(05:10):
that's true. That's true. And to that end, when you
hear David or us mentioning his movie is documentary Renegade
in the past tense, just know it should be the
present tense. Right. So we want to give a big
thank you to everyone listening as always. Uh and nol
I especially want to thank you as well as you, Paul.

(05:33):
You've probably had to sit through hearing different versions of
this interview the most out of all of us. Uh
and nol I think you're right. Having having a distance
to come in and evaluate it from that perspective is invaluable.
So thank you. You're welcome then, and I appreciated the opportunity.
And one thing I do want to point out that
hit me was this gentleman has a lot of work

(05:56):
out there that you can read yourself if you so choose.
He speaks about a lot of his ideas through the
lens of empirical research and scientific data. I did not
find that to be the case myself personally. UM, maybe
there's something I'm missing, but I would leave it to
you to sort out what one man's opinion is versus

(06:17):
what science and fact would support. Well said Noel, and uh,
here we go, everyone, David Ike, so for a brief
bit of backgrounds here on stuff they don't want you
to know. Since two thousand and eight, we have been
exploring some of the some of the questions that never

(06:38):
make it to the mainstream right across the wide field.
And David, you are a prominent figure and have been
in the world that the mainstream would call conspiratorial thought
or research. But you have you have a journey that
is far more complex than a simple point A two

(07:01):
point B. You were known to some originally as as
an athlete, right a professional athlete, and to some still
as that. You were known to others as a uh
an investigator who is not afraid of controversy, and to
some critics you have been you've been an adversarial figure,

(07:22):
at least in their eyes. What we would like to
do today is to is to start at the beginning,
because I think a lot of our listeners are probably
they're aware of your work, but they're not aware of
your origin. So could you tell us a little bit
about about your early life leading up to your athletic career. Well, yeah,

(07:42):
I was born in a city in the English Midlands
called Leicester, in a working class uh family, and we
didn't have any money and uh, you know, you got
by and what you had. And I went through the
school system as it was in the Auntie and fairties
I was born in. But my ambition as a kid

(08:03):
was always to be a professional footballer and a series
of coincidences, bits of luck has been the story of
my life all the way to present day really led
me to be a professional footballer. And then I had
to finish at the age of twenty one with rumortoried
Arth Riders. I became a journalist and worked in newspapers

(08:25):
and radio and television. I became a national spokesman for
the British Screen Party as well as being a sports
presenter and news presenter with the BBC, and then in
nineteen my life change, if that really started to change
in nine if we're talking about you know, paranormal happenings

(08:46):
and what have you. When throughout nine nine, whenever I
was in a room alone, I was still a television
presenter and a national spokesman for the British Green Party,
I felt I wasn't alone. It was like there was
a presence there, and I've was not into any of
the stuff before, but it got more and more tangible
throughout n until in early I was sitting on a

(09:10):
bed in an empty hotel room working for the BBC,
and this presence was so tangible that I actually said
into the room, would you please contact me if there's
something there, because you're driving me up the wall. And coincidentally,
another series of amazing events. Really it led me to
a psychic after reading her book, and I didn't tell

(09:35):
her anything that was going on. I just, you know,
just told her that I wanted to see her and
told her nothing else. And then she went into psychic
mode this is March and said you're going to go
out on the world stage and revealed great secrets and
that she said the presence that was talking to her

(09:55):
was saying that I would face enormous opposition, but they,
whatever they is, would all be always will be there
to protect me and that I would be guided to
knowledge from then on, and sometimes increasingly now knowledge will
be put into my mind and I just know things,
and all I can say. We used to have an

(10:16):
advert in on British television and the punch line was
it does exactly what it says on the tin. Well,
what I was told in this psychic experience has since
done exactly what it says on the tin, because that's
exactly what's happened in my life. From that moment. My
life became a synchronistic journey of walking into information, whether

(10:41):
it's contacts people at new things, whether it's personal experiences,
whether it's books, whether it's documents, whatever. And it's gone
on now for nearly thirty years, and that's basically how
the information has been put together. Hey David, So a
lot of our listeners out there, they they find themselves

(11:01):
in um of in a a place somewhere along the
spectrum of you know, extreme skeptic to a true believer. Right,
So there's there's this Gosh, I just want to say,
there's a spectrum that a lot of our listeners find
themselves on. So some people listening to that story will

(11:21):
will hear you talking about going to a psychic who
has a message for you that then becomes a self
fulfilling prophecy. Some some will hear that as a true
prophecy of what is to come. I'm interested to know
if you if do you feel like it influenced you
in a way that led you down this path or

(11:42):
do you think it was a path that was already
preordained in some way for you? Well, Um, the idea
that I could create a self fulfilling prophecy that would
lead me all over the world and meeting people I
didn't even kay arranged to meet just coincidental. Apparently meetings

(12:07):
over a period of thirty years is stretching self fulfilling
prophecies to the limit where they would probably snap. You know,
the control system of the human family, human society is
control of human perception because from everything, everything comes from perception.

(12:33):
What we do, how we perceive things, everything is perception.
Behavior comes from perception. And what we've what we're looking
at is a a lifelong download from cradle to grave.
If people only get their information from the mainstream, the
mainstream everything, as I call it, that is a download

(12:55):
of a perception, and it's a very narrow band of sception,
which limits the sense of the possible and dismisses the
almost entirety of possibility because it's so focused on what
I call the postage stamp consensus, which is this version

(13:16):
of normal that's taught in the schools that pounds out
from the mainstream media. Seven that peer pressure is constantly
imposing upon us. And what I've done is something very simple.
It's you know, it's not kind of rocket science. I
have let information be my guide, not preconceived idea, not

(13:38):
oh that's not possible because I can't perceive it's possible.
But just let the information be my guide. And that's
where it's. It's taken me into this vast tapestry of
information that I put together, and that the reason that
so many people are now looking at my work is
what was in my books in the ny farve Um

(14:02):
is happening, you know. I mean, that's one hell of
a self fulfilling prophecy. That is so people. All I
say to people is, um, let's look at it this way.
According to mainstream science, the electromagnetic spectrum is no point.
Do not five percent of what exists in the universe

(14:23):
visible light, which is the only band of frequency that
we can actually see. Everything else we can't see is
a smear of the north point, not five according to
the projected size of the universe by mainstream science. By
comparison with that, planet Earth is the equivalent of a

(14:44):
billionth of a pinhead. Do you know? I feel it
in my water, fellas. I really do that there possibly
is more to know than appears on CNN and MSNBC
and Fox News. I feel I feel that. I know
it's strange, but I do It's uh. I think that's
something that everyone listening can agree with. The sad truth

(15:06):
of reality or perception, whatever you want to call it,
is that things take more than five minutes to explain,
which I know. I know. Local television anchors hate to
confront that in more than a day to understand lived
I lived. I lived it on the BBC. You know,
you're trying to tell a story in some kind of

(15:27):
with some kind of substance, and it's like, oh, that's
a bit long in it. Oh yeah, it's up to
three minutes now, craikey. So this is the This is
the lack of substance, the superficiality that holds people in
this perceptual prison because you're quite right, you need time
to explain things, um, and if you don't have it,
then all you can deal with is the superficial. Okay,

(15:50):
So let's go back too and after your press conference
and then you do go onto the BBC, not for
the first time, because you've been a podcaster, you have
people are aware of you, they know what you look like.
But you go on, specifically on the Wogan Show with
Terry Wogan, and you you come out and you tell

(16:12):
your truth, that that your revelations right, and uh, you
know this has been documented so many times, it's been
spoken about so many times. It's such a turning point
for for you. You've discussed that in the past. A
lot of our listeners know about that. But let's talk
specifically about what that message was early on the first um,

(16:35):
the first communication essentially that you wanted to to have
with the world. Well, let's um, first of all, um,
look at the run up to how the Wogan Show
interview came about and where I was coming from at
that time. After I met the psychic, my life started
to change again, synchronicity, coincidence, whatever you want to call it.

(17:00):
And I left the BBC, not because I chose to
leave the BBC self fulfilling prophecy, but because they didn't
want to renew my contract, which was strange because all
I had had was commendations up to that. But it
was a perfect time for me to leave in the
in the sequence of what was to come, and through

(17:21):
nine I started writing a book called Truth Vibration. It's
just about what was happening to me and I didn't
really know at the time, but my life was changing.
It was getting very strange. And then in early I
had this overwhelming feeling to go to Peru, and I
got on a plane to Peru. I didn't know why
I was going to Peru. I just overwhelmingly intuition. I've

(17:42):
got to be in Peru. This was the kind of
thing what was happening then, And I got to Peru
and over a period of three weeks, I was really
only meant to be there for two I thought, But
over a period of three weeks again an extraordinary series
of coincidences led me all over to the place, and
then eventually I ended up at a place called c Stani,

(18:06):
which is an old ancient inca site not far from
Puno on the lake of on the banks of Lake
Titty Carcar, the highest navigable lake in the world. And
I was walking around this place and it was beautiful,
but I had this really intense feeling I had to
go there. But my experience when I was there was

(18:31):
was lovely. It's a lovely place, but it didn't match
the intensity of my feeling I had to go there.
So I got into the little taxi van with a
Peruvian guide and the driver you could a little bit disappointed, thinking, well, yeah,
it was nice, but why did I have this feeling
to go there? And just a literally minutes down the road,

(18:52):
I'm looking out the window daydreaming, and I was looking
at this hill. And as I to the hill, all
I could hear going through my head repeating was come
to me, Come to me, Come to me, Come to me.
So I'm thinking, well, what the heck? And I asked
the guy to stopped the taxi bust thing, and I said,

(19:14):
I'm just going to up that hill. I won't be long,
but I was about an hour because of what happened.
I got up the top and I walked among these
stones on this hill and I'm looking out across see
you starting which a beautiful site and distant mountains and
the lake and everything. And then suddenly my and I've

(19:35):
experienced this once before, my feet started to burn and
it was like my feet were being pulled into the ground.
And then I felt an energy going in the top
of my head and through my body. And of course
I'm all new to this, fellas, I don't know what's happening.
I can rationalize it now with the thirty years of knowledge,

(19:55):
but at the time, I'm thinking, what's happening to my life?
And as I as I was standing there and this
energy was going through me, I heard uh, not not
a voice, but a very clear thought form that said,
it will be over when you feel the rain. And
I'm standing under a clear, cloudless, perutlean sky. I've got

(20:17):
a big red nose to prove it at the time.
And and then my arms went out at forty five
degrees without me making any conscious decision to do it.
And this energy then started to build and build until
my body was shaking. And you know when you're driving
a car and you you lose two miles or so,
and you think, you know what happened to the last
two miles. Subconcerts been driving the bath Thank goodness. Um

(20:40):
it was bit like that. And one of these times,
when I came back to two if you like consciousness, UM,
I noticed that on the across the distant mountains some
way away, there was a light gray mist. And as
I watched it very quickly, it was almost like you know,
putting a video on fast forward, and if you portrayed

(21:03):
what followed in a movie, they'd say that's far fetched,
that would never happen. Well it did, and I watched
this h what was obviously a rainstorm over these distant
mountains get darker and darker, and it started to come
towards me. And in the end, by which time my
body is just shaking with his energy, I had almost

(21:27):
literally a wall of steroid rain coming towards me, and
eventually it hit me. I was soaked in an instant.
It was so powerful and the energy stopped. My legs
were like Bambi. My arms were now agony because though
I hadn't felt them before because they've been in the air.
All is done. And what happened then is um I

(21:53):
described it like this, It's like some you've lived in
a bubble all your life and someone comes along and
burst the bubble without telling you, and suddenly concepts, information,
perceptions are pouring into your conscious mind and you can't
handle it. It's like pressing too many keys on a computer.

(22:14):
The computer says, I'm going to freeze now, thank you
very much. I can't handle this. And this is what
a kind of the state I was in for about
three months, and the Wogan Show was right in the
middle of that. So um when after about three months
the computer unfroze, if you like, and I was I

(22:35):
was the David Ike that people recognized before. People were
saying to me, I thought you'd supposed to have gone mad,
You're the same David. I used to know what I
was outwardly, but I wasn't in fact, because now I
was seeing, as they say about newspapers, you know, you
don't believe the words, the real truth is in the
white bits between them, you know. And that's what it

(22:56):
was like. Instead of seeing lots in terms of world
events and happenings, I was seeing patterns. I was seeing uh,
not pixels. I was seeing pictures. I was seeing how
they connected. Because it's when you connect dots, when you
connect the apparently random events, that's when you see the door.

(23:16):
So in the middle of all that, when I'm trying
to get a grasp of what the heck is happening
to me? And I mean there's three months of of
who am I, what's my name? All the rest of it.
That's that was when the Wogan Show appeared. But that
was a phenomenal gift to me. Phenomenal gift because the

(23:39):
prison that most people live in is the fear of
what other people think, and what stops people giving their
genuine opinions and their genuine views and saying what they
really think is the fear of what other people think
and the mass, ridicule, historic levels of it that followed
that Wogan Show, where I couldn't walk down any street

(24:00):
in Britain without being laughed at. I lived my life
to the sound of distant and less than distant laugh
m was was the nightmare you would think, But it
was the gift that set me free. And some of
the things I've talked about and written about since. Um
anyone that that was concerned about other people what other

(24:21):
people thought of them would never have talked about that,
never have written about that. But to me, I don't
give a damn what people think about me. It's of
no interest to me. It's it's it's they choose to
see the world as they see it, choose to see
me as they see it. But but I choose to
see me as I see me and not be influenced
by by by what people think and what people say

(24:41):
about me. So that was the great gift that set
me free. Let's pause here for one moment. We will
be back after a word from our sponsor, and we're back.
What's fascinating about this in particular is that it leads

(25:02):
us to it leads us to a series of let's
say two or three questions that are are forefront uh
from from this uh, this experience that you're describing. First,
you know, the name of this show is stuff they
don't want you to know. And one of the main
questions that we get often is, uh. We we'll have

(25:26):
people right in and say, well, who are they uh
for for us? Uh that the nature of they or
them changes depending upon what we're exploring, and typically what
we're exploring is people, forces, groups, whatever you want to
call them, who are controlling uh some sort of narrative.

(25:51):
Right the same way that UM petroleum companies prevented studies
on pollution or certain types of pollution from coming out,
or the same way that tobacco companies prevented research on
the dangers of tobacco consumption for coming out. So one
thing that really really interested us when when you were

(26:14):
describing both your books earlier and your personal experience, was
this idea of a hive mind. You've you've mentioned this
before in earlier work of people, you know, people existing
in perhaps an invisible psychological prison. And if we look

(26:36):
at the Internet as a hive mind, the most direct
question we run into with that thought is who then
controls the hive Well, just very quickly, before I go there,
you bring up the hive mind. We are on the
cusp and people like ray Kers while the Google executive
or openly talking about this because they're trying to put

(26:57):
a positive spin on it, we're on the cusp of
the technological hive mind where AI is connected to the
human brain through technological connections UM and people like curse
while even give a time period of it of around
twenty So if we have our our brain mind connected

(27:19):
to the cloud as occurs wild calls it via AI,
then what what a fantastic description or what other description
could you give that than a hive mind that they
are seeking to turn humanity into basically a series of
computer terminals on an aim internet. In terms of they,

(27:43):
it depends on what level you want to go to.
I mean, obviously, the questions that you're asking are the
questions that I asked um way back in the ninety
nineties when I'm trying to understand how things operate. These
are the questions that I asked, who are they? And
after thirty years of research that basically the world is
controlled like this. And I would say this that people

(28:06):
might look at people like me and say, you see
conspiracies everywhere? Okay, Well, first of all, the definition of
a conspiracy Dictionary definition is basically two or more people
conspiring to bring about a desired end, usually illegal. On
that basis, the world's drowning in conspiracies, So let's get
over this idea. There are no conspiracies which were asked
to believe. And by the way, the term conspiracy theorist

(28:30):
and conspiracy theory came into widespread use because of the
c I A provable fact. The CIA put out a
a round robin UH request to major media in America
in the nineties sixties, when people who were questioning the
Kennedy assassination were starting to make ground in terms of

(28:51):
people seeing that maybe the full story hasn't been told.
Are you kidding um? And they urged the media organizations
to use the terms conspiracy theorist and conspiracy theory to
discredit those that were questioning the Kennedy assassination and other
assassinations that happened in the sixties. Of course, Martin Luther, King,
Malcolm X, and Bobby Kennedy. So that's where it came from,

(29:14):
and all these years later, without a clue where it
came from, the mainstream media just parrot conspiracy theory. And
the question they never asked when they parrot it, Oh,
it's an conspiracy theory is a simple question which any mature,
intelligent person would ask. Okay, but is it true? And

(29:36):
if you look at so called conspiracy theories and look
at one so called conspiracy theories in my books going
back to the es they've happened or are happening, you know,
maybe that's another self fulfilling prophecy. Maybe I've made that happen.
I don't know. But in terms of day, this is
how the world is basically controlled. And we can go
deeper into this if you like. One so explained. Imagine

(29:57):
a spider's web um and each strand of the web
is a secret society, a semi secret group or organizations
and agencies that we see in the the world of
the scene. At the center of the web is the spider,
as I call it, and that's where this whole control

(30:18):
agenda for humanity is coming from. The strands immediately around
the spider are the most exclusive secret societies. Some of
them don't even have names to make them harder to
track down, and they will be peopled overwhelmingly by those
that the public will never have heard of. You then
come out from the spiders, still in the hidden, and

(30:38):
you start to hit the secret society is that we've
heard of but we don't know what they do. Be
in the core of the Freemason's Opus Day, the Knights Templar,
the inner core of the Jesuit Order, Knights of Malta, etcetera.
And then you meet what I call the cusp organizations,
which are groupings overwhelmingly owners thinked tanks where the hidden

(31:03):
meets the scene, and these are the Builderberg Group, the
Council on Foreign Relations, the Trilateral Commission, the Club of Rome,
and so on. And then you go out from them
and you're into the world of the scene. You're into governments,
government agencies, cartels, corporations, banking systems, et cetera, media ownership,

(31:24):
and in the world of the scene, the decisions being made,
constantly impacting on the direction and nature of human society,
appear to be random, but actually that society changing, transforming
ones are coming from the spider. That's where it's orchestrated from.

(31:45):
And that's why as I go around the world, as
I've been many many times in the last thirty years,
you see the same things happening at the same time,
and you see the same types of legislation being introduced,
often with the same excuses and sometimes even worded almost
the same because it's being centrally orchestrated. If you think
of a corporation, a global corporation, say McDonald's, they have

(32:08):
a headquarters in the United States, but all around the
world you have McDonald's in the various countries, and they
all are the same brand, the same nature. I mean,
you go into McDonald's in Russia or South Africa, it's
the same McDonald's as in downtown Atlanta, because that network,

(32:30):
that global network of McDonald's is being centrally orchestrated. So
they all look the same, they are at the same
they all basically respond to a central point. This is
how this web works. So if you look at the
oil industry and the biotech industry, and your Monsanto's and
your bays, etcetera. And you look at these other cartels

(32:52):
like the pharmaceutical cartel, in the end, if you go
deep enough into their structure, you're meet the point where
they attached to this web. The vast majority of people
in these groupings will not be aware of what their
their cartel or their corporation is really about. But at
one point deep in the in the structure, it will

(33:15):
attach to this web. And at that point, the pharmaceutical cartel,
the oil cartel, the biotech cartel, et cetera, are all
controlled by the same force, and that's how it's orchestrated. Okay,
so David, this is all This is all fascinating stuff,
and it's it's interesting how has been and I are

(33:36):
listening to you, how we've covered a lot of the
things that you would uh, that you've mentioned here as
parts of the web, you know, the varying aspects of it.
Over the course of your career, you've had a lot
of criticisms thrown at you, and and one of the
one of the primary ones that at least we've found

(33:56):
in our research is is that mentioning of this um
even the symbology of the black spider at the center
of the web and um hearkening back to the protocols
of the Elder of zion Um, that a lot of
these beliefs, at least to some people's view who have
criticized you, appear to be anti Semitic in nature in

(34:18):
some way, at least the basis of the beliefs around
which the you know, some of the stuff you're talking about. UM,
I just want I wonder how now, in twenty nineteen,
how do you respond to to those critics. Well, I
don't respond to critics. We're talking garbage. Let me tell
you about my philosophy on life. My philosophy on life

(34:40):
and the nature of life is that we are consciousness.
We are awareness. We are a state of awareness. That's
the eye, that's the eternal lie. And all the labels
we give ourselves, whether they're Jewish or Muslim, or Atheist,
or Christian or Indo, or black or white, or whatever

(35:02):
income bracket, whatever cultural background. These are not who we are.
These are experiences that we're having. What we all are,
whether we call ourselves Jewish or Muslim or whatever. What
we all are is the awareness in the end, the
same awareness, a different point of attention, in the same awareness,

(35:23):
having different experiences. So I completely reject as a self
identity all these labels, which are basically sub dividing all
the time into smaller and smaller labels of self identity,
which what can be then what played off against each
other to divide and rule the population. So I will

(35:45):
not take lectures on discrimination from those that fundamentally, whoever
they are, identify their I with their label and perceive
everything from the filter of that label, when I'm actually

(36:05):
the one saying, actually, you know, we're all the same
consciousness having different experiences, which is the ultimate in inclusivity,
to use the word of the time, it's the ultimate
in not discriminating between labels, because I reject them all

(36:25):
as as as a self identity rather than an experience,
so that when you when you're coming from that perspective
of reality and life, and you are being accused of
the very opposite of what you are, then there has
to be another reason for it. And if someone is

(36:46):
revealing things as I am, across a vast spectrum of information,
um that the system in totality, the core that I'm
talking about, doesn't want people to hear here. Then if
you can't discredit them by having an open debate and
they won't debate with me, I've tried, UM, then you

(37:09):
you don't debate with them on what they're saying, You
accuse them of what they're saying on the basis of
lying about what they're saying. And that's that's That's basically
what it is. I mean, explain this to me. I've
got a movie coming out on June the fourth, just
what four days from now, called Renegade, story about my

(37:31):
life but also about my work. I'm in that movie,
the word Jewish and Zionism is not mentioned at all.
And yet, when there was supposed to be a premiere
of that movie at the Aero Theater in Santa Monica,
Los Angeles, theater owned by an organization called American Cinematique,

(37:54):
it was canceled two hours before that the film was
supposed to be shown with all the upset and disruption
and chaos that it caused for the audience, because I
was supposed to be antisemitic. The people that canceled it,
I've not seen the film. They don't know anything about me.

(38:14):
But it was canceled. Why because they were told what
I'm about. I'm sure they were told what was in
the film, where nothing of the kind was in the film.
You know, if you stood by my side over the
last few years, you would realize, and probably I would
think your jaw would drop if you realize how easy

(38:35):
it is to destroy someone's freedom of speech just by
lying about them. And what we're looking at here is
not a a group of organizations, because it's very coordinated
that are trying to stop discrimination against Jewish people. It's
not about Jewish people. And I'll tell you one reason why.

(38:59):
If you're a Jewish person and you criticize the government
in Israel, you are going to get abuse from these
same organizations on a scale that's much greater than even
I get. Because it's easy to dismiss someone and accuse
someone and demonize someone as anti Semitic what actually means

(39:20):
actually means anti Arab, by the way, when when they're
not Jewish, it's much more difficult to do that. When
they're Jewish people saying the same thing, so they get
more flat and more abuse from these organizations than even
I do. It's not about protecting Jewish people from discrimination.
It's about protecting the Israeli government from criticism and exposure.

(39:42):
And when you've got a movie that doesn't even do
that doesn't even talk about it being banned on the
grounds of what they've been told about me, then you
see how easy it is to silence someone by lying
about But I don't care. I don't care. I know
what I think, I know where I'm coming from, and

(40:03):
that's all that matters to me. And if people want
to lie about me, well be my guest, but it
ain't going to stop me. Absolutely. So to to UH,
two important points here. First, I I believe in hope
that everyone listening to this episode can agree that the
government of a country is not the people or the

(40:25):
population of a country. UH. And furthermore, one of the
criticisms UH speaking of freedom of speech that that we
found cited in earlier interviews was an excerpt from your
book and The Truth Shall Set You Free. I'd like
to I'd like to read this and hear your response

(40:49):
to it, uh, and and to verify that this is uh,
this is your your words, your speech. It is quote
I strongly believe that a small Jewish clique which has
contempt for the massive Jewish people, worked with non Jews
to create the First World War, the Russian Revolution, and
the Second World War. This end quote, This passage continues,

(41:10):
and this is This is one of the things that
we see critics citing when when they raise charges of
discrimination and anti semitism. It sounds is if it sounds
as if you've clearly established in this interview and other
interviews that your opinion is that all people fundamentally are

(41:34):
the are are the same, right. But in this this passage,
I think is one of the things that critics immediately
go to when they're when they're saying that you are uh,
discriminatory or anti Semitic. Could you could you respond to
that quick? Let me ask you this Let me ask
you this question, please. UM. If if I had said

(41:55):
that a small claque of Chinese people were involved, or
a small cliaku of Argentinean people are a small clique
of Australians. Would that be a problem, No, it wouldn't.
So why is it a problem because they're mentioning Jewish people.
Just take the Russian Revolution. You see what what's been

(42:17):
happening is these groups that ultimately answered to the Israeli government,
not to Jewish people. They just claimed to speak for
Jewish people, use Jewish people as a front when the Jewish,
like every other group of people, Jewish people as a
vast spectrum of opinion. And when you when you look

(42:38):
at the Russian Revolution, um, the the documents have come out,
they've been published in other books decades ago, people who
have done a scholarly research into the Russian Revolution and
found that there was a fantastic ratio of Jewish people

(43:00):
involved in the Russian Revolution compared with everyone else, major
major ratio. Now here's the other thing is one of
the things that happened after the Russian Revolution is that
very large numbers of Jewish people in Russia were subject
to programs, were subject to discrimination, were subject to violence.

(43:24):
So how do you square that? Well, you square that
by understanding that Chinese people do horrible things to Chinese
people as well as nice things, and American people do
horrible things to American people as well as nice things.
When do you take any group of people and you

(43:46):
say this group is this, you are completely missing the point.
You show me any group of people, any cultural group,
any religious group, anywhere in the world, and I'll show
you nice people, I'll show your ugly people, I'll show
you okay people, and I'll show you psychopaths. Why should
any group of people be different from from that when

(44:08):
it's all the same. So when you call out in
this case, what I would call psychopaths, you are, by definition,
according to the propaganda, accusing that entire group of being
a psychopath, which you're not doing. I mean, some of
the the people Jewish people have suffered enormously from the

(44:31):
actions of other Jewish people, so the same with every
other cultural group. But it's it's um and I will
not be intimidated from delivering my truth and the factual
research that I've done just because someone's gonna hurl abuse
and mendacity at me. I won't do it, and I

(44:52):
won't defend myself either. I've got a thing to found
myself for. If you see yourself as a label, and
you see if your label to be superior to all
the other labels, then don't accuse me of racism, because
that's what you see around the world because so many
people are trying to impose their label and what their

(45:12):
label represents on everyone else. What coup people just chill
out and just you know, if you want to be
that and you live your life like that, go ahead,
good luck to you. Just don't e pose it on
everybody else, whoever you are, whatever background you are, David,
I was having a discussion with my wife last night
about a quote of yours that speaks to this. I think,

(45:32):
really well, I'm just gonna really really fast if if
you become mesmerized by all the labels I am are this,
I am are that, then that's how we get caught
in the illusion. The labels are getting played off against labels,
and the labels are at war with each other, while
the few with their hands controlling the strings of all
the bloody labels are laughing their socks off. And she

(45:54):
and I both identified uh strongly with that. Just when
you when you think about especially culture on the Internet
today and the oppositions that exist these binary systems in
almost everything where you are for or against this, for
against that. UM. It's it's fascinating to me. And what
I really want to get to is something that Gosh

(46:19):
for for a decade now, for a decade now roughly,
UM that I've been thinking about, something that you've been
speaking of, and it's the the binary system that exists
within all the energy that exists in the universe. The
concepts that you that you brought forth in that still

(46:42):
I believe, I believe and I can't speak to you,
but I believe these are still the same UM beliefs
and at least beliefs of the energy systems that exist
in the universe. The Godhead versus the the opposition power,
the Um, the lucifer. I think you referred to it
as A several times, but that that's what the Secret
Society is referred to it as. Yes, that's their God. Well,

(47:05):
I want to get back to UM. And I think
my understanding on this is correct, at least from from
what you've you've said in the past. But it has
something to do with the planet Saturn. Can you talk
about that? WHOA? I mean, that is such a massive
subject and it needs so much background for something that

(47:26):
appears on first hearing to be crazy to make logical sense.
That's why I go into it in the books in
detail and with all the background. But let's just say
that Saturn where it is now? Um, I mean, how
how did ancient societies see it? How do they see Saturn?

(47:47):
How do they work out what satin is or even
if it's a planet or whatever? They couldn't And yet,
again and again and again you find that ancient societies
worship Saturn. How did they do that if it was
where it is now? And there's been some tremendous research.
There's a a whole scientific movement now which is known

(48:09):
as the Electric Universe, which looks at the electrical electromagnetic
nature of reality but also encompasses, um, the ancient myths
about Saturn. Because the myths about Saturn are absolutely phenomenal
in their number and their nature and when they've been

(48:30):
there's a particular guy who's done a tremendous amount of
research on this. When you break down these myths about Saturn,
it's very clear they're not talking about Saturn as where
it is now. They're talking about Saturn as where it
was when the myths were created. And it was a

(48:53):
son of the Earth Um, and we had a twin
sun system, the one we see now, but also Saturn,
which was much dominant in the Earth sky. And what
followed was a cataclysmic cataclysm in the heavens, which is
come down in the words of myth as the war

(49:14):
of the gods in the heavens. And this is when,
if you followed the research, that Mars became what we
now call a dead planet, and so many other planets
went walk about in this whole period, and the Earth
um nearly nearly came to an end. There's a book

(49:38):
I read a long time ago by some researchers who
basically looked at these ancient myths of the cataclysm that
struck the Earth, which was the Saturn cataclysm and others involved,
and they looked against that in the same book at
the geological and biological history and evidence of the Earth,

(50:00):
and they found that they correlated. They were just fantastic
upheavals on the Earth, as there would be if what
happened happened. And and this is that leads us to
the myth of the end of Atlantis and New and
the Muria and these great civilizations disappearing under the oceans
and all these stories that come out through history, and

(50:20):
when you go around the ancient or cultural native societies
that have carried this ancient knowledge through the generations, you
find that they all have the same basic story of
this period when there was this war in the heavens
and the earth nearly came to an end. And so

(50:42):
that was the start of the story that I that
I tell in the book that led to where Satin
is now. And again, when they're describing Saturn in its
previous position, they do not describe rings. They don't describe
Saturn with rings at all, just as a son. And
so where did the rings come from? And so I

(51:05):
go into that in the books as well. And there
have been some scientists, one in particular who was a mainstream,
middle of the road, um you know, songsheet scientists who
started to look at pictures coming back from the Voyager
spacecraft that took pictures of Saturn at quite close range

(51:30):
in the nine eighties, and then he started to see
even from those pictures that the rings were changing and
they weren't static, and there was something malleable about And
then when the Galileo UH spacecraft came through to Saturn
in four or something like that, and he looked at

(51:53):
their pictures with the rings, and he saw phenomenal differences
in them. He also, by the way, saw um what
he called electro magnetic vehicles, vast electro magnetic fields that
that were in the rings, and and he's put pictures
in his book. He produced a book called The Ringmakers

(52:16):
of Saturn some time ago. He's in his nineties now,
and you see some what he calls exhaust coming out
of this, these electromagnetic fields that are actually making the
rings and changing the rings. And you know, I go
into all this in some detail in the in the
great detail in the books. And when you do, you

(52:39):
realize that m. Saturn is very different to what we've
been told, and the whole story of the Solar system
is very different to what we've been told, but fits
perfectly the ancient myths about what happened in ancient history

(52:59):
to the US and uh on human society. Let's take
a quick break here. We'll be back with David soon,
but for now, let's hear a word from our sponsor.
All Right, we're back man, David. Okay, you you are

(53:21):
you are famous for your for your lectures and the
lengths of those lectures and how much you pack in
when you're speaking on subjects. And uh, man I I
heard as soon as you started answering that question when
you when you reacted with woe we hold okay, hold on,
we gotta go into so much stuff here. Um, it's

(53:43):
just it's so true because Uh, there's so much information
that you have to build up upon. And really, honestly, David,
that's what we do with this show. We try and
build up on all these things so then we can
harken back to you know, this episode that we covered
this thing. Listen to that for background. Um, you know
your your work over everything that is covered in Renegade,

(54:04):
the movie coming out with Orchard. It's just there's so
much there. And you know, in the past, people get
stuck on some of the things that you've said, and
you get criticized for those things as people get stuck
on the what seemed what's at least, um, what people
experience in their minds when they hear it as something

(54:25):
like a reptilian uh, you know, race of extraterrestrials or
something like that. That's what sticks with people. Um. But
there's so much to be discussed here. Um, Can can
we talk just really quickly right before we end here
about the stakes that we find ourselves in, um, both
with regards to humanity, you know, as a species, but

(54:46):
also with our planet Earth. And why is Earth? Why
is Earth? And the small little bipedal beings that walk
around on it? Why are those two things so important? Well,
how important they are is relative. Obviously they're very important
to us. But like I say, it's the size of

(55:08):
a billions of a pinhead compared with the size of
the universe, and we should not forget. You know, people
tend to see everything as it appears in the moment,
and they solidify that into a view of how things are.
Just to give you an example, until the nineteen twenties,

(55:31):
mainstream science believe there was one galaxy in the universe.
Less than a hundred years later, the latest highest estimate
that I've seen from science is two trillion galaxies in
the universe. So there's a great quote from Socrates in
ancient Greece that's attributed to him. Anyway, wisdom is knowing

(55:52):
how little we know. That's what keeps your mind open
to all possibility and stops it closing and coagulating and
becoming concrete like around a very narrow perception of reality. Um.
And where we are now is, from a human point
of view, a very very critical period. As I've been

(56:15):
pointing out for thirty years. You know, people have dismissed
what I've said in the past and laughed at it
because it wasn't tangible to them. But as I said
many years ago, you can only manipulate under the radar
for so long to transform human society. Before you have

(56:39):
to transform human society, and it has to break the
surface where people can see it. And we are big
time there now. So if you look at just one
level of what I've been saying all these years, but
we were going to eventually face the imposition of an

(57:00):
Orwellian um tyranny that would destroy freedom of speech and
would not allow official narratives to be challenged, Well we
are there now, big time. And let's just go back
to this sequence again. Perception, which controls human behavior comes

(57:24):
from information received. You control information received so they only
see official narratives. You will impose um perception and thus
control behavior. And what we're seeing now with the Silicon
Valley giants, in my view, all of which ultimately are
controlled by the same force. It's why they operate in unit.
In unison, we're seeing the systematic deleation of freedom of

(57:50):
speech increasingly, not even through human hand, but through AI,
which is increasingly controlling everything. Now. I've been warning about
this for such a long time, long before people like
Elon Musk, who has warned what a danger it is
and then opens a company to advance it, which is
kind of strange, and keeps putting satellites up to beam

(58:15):
WiFi Internet at every inch of the planet, which is
absolutely fundamental to this technological control system that I've written
about for so long. Because the idea is that you
attach the human brain to AI, so AI becomes the
human mind, it becomes human thinking, it becomes human emotional response.

(58:39):
And to do that you have to have what people
like kurs Wild called the cloud everywhere, Otherwise you can't
attach people to it. And this is why we're seeing
this explosion of satellites going up, pounding the Internet at
every inch of the Earth. That's what they want. Eventually,

(59:00):
they want more than twenty thousand satellites up there. We're
now even seeing astronomers complaining in the last few days
about the fact that they're destroying the night sky with
these things. There's so many well they've seen nothing yet
and and Elon Musk is right in the middle of it.
And I would love to ask him how he squares
AI could be the end of humanity with what he's doing,

(59:22):
which is allowing that process to happen. It's very very strange.
He's either bewildered or his kid in us somehow. But
the thing is that we're now having in particularly you,
but all of us in the end, particularly you in America,
are now having this five G rolled out without any
tests whatsoever, and without any independent studies funded by government

(59:47):
or anyone else to see what the consequences are, not
just physically but psychological of this um this five G
millimeter frequency band, which is actually a weapon. It's been
It's come out of the military, you know, the American
military and law enforcement. They have trucks that they used

(01:00:09):
to scatter crowds. They drive them up, you can see
them on the internet, and then they unleash this frequency
and the frequency is decoded by the skin of the protesters,
because the human body is actually an antenna. The cutting
edge of science has been aware of that for a
very long time. And if people feel their skin is

(01:00:30):
on fire, and what did they do? They scatter and
they run. That technology uses the same band of frequency
as five G, which because it doesn't travel as far
as as as what we've had up to this point,
and you can't use um big transmitters transmitting along distance,
they're going to have to put They are putting across
America as I speak, boxes, little boxes on lamp standards, etcetera,

(01:00:55):
along this every street to beam this stuff out, like
in front of children's bedrooms, etcetera. And the reason they're
doing it without testing it's because if there was testing,
as some independent scientists have come out and said this
is a potential catastrophe for the human race, then it
wouldn't be allowed to play out. So you don't test

(01:01:16):
it if you know you're going to get the wrong result.
And the whole foundation of five G is to empower
something called the smart grid. And the smart grid is
the reason that almost everything that comes out these days
is called smart. Smart They're smart that smart meat, the

(01:01:36):
smart car, smart TVs, ETCeteras. Because all these smart concepts
and smart technologies are designed to connect and communicate with
each other and the idea is to create we're talking
about smart cities now they're starting to be built where
the entire city is controlled by AI. This is the

(01:02:00):
same because we're touching now on the present into the future.
And what I appreciate what I what I appreciate you
mentioning is something that may not have occurred to many
of our listeners before hearing what you just said. So

(01:02:20):
just to re emphasize what you're saying here, we are entering.
We already exist within an orwelly in networked world, and
this touches on. This touches on multiple things, you know.
It touches on the extinction of an ownership society into
a service economy. It enters into the extinction of privacy,

(01:02:45):
right if privacy still exists? Connected might yeah, yeah, And
what I think most of our fellow listeners would would
want to know is given given your history of accurately
in some cases accurately predicting events from from your earlier work,

(01:03:08):
such as the child abuse cover ups that existing continue
in the United Kingdom and abroad, as well as predictions
regarding a surveillance state. I believe the UK has the
highest density of CCTV monitoring in the world. Uh, what
what observation, advice, prediction, even words of encouragement would you

(01:03:35):
have for people who have listened to this episode and
are thinking, for lack of a for lack of a
better phrase, pardon my French, holy sh it, what do
I do now? Right? Well, maybe I could just briefly
explain how you can predict the future in relation to
what we've been talking about. There are two worlds operating

(01:03:59):
in the same world, and these two worlds have very
different levels of information. This is why so much information
is suppressed from the the the reality the world that
the mass of the human population lives in. This cabal
and its networks operate from a very different level of knowledge.

(01:04:20):
It's knowledge that he's kept from the rest of the population,
and it's passed on through the upper echelons of the
secret society network through the generations, and they don't want
us to know that. What people like me do is
go in search of it. And so if you are
in that other world, which is much more advanced in

(01:04:41):
its knowledge and knowledge of technology and knowledge of how
reality works, knowledge of how to manipulate human psychology, then
you can project a future agenda a future sequence of
happenings to transform human society, which are not known about
in the mainstream of human society. But if you can,

(01:05:05):
through research and sweat and hours, uncover that, then you
can predict the future. Because what you're actually doing is
not so much predicting the future per se, but predicting
or revealing the sequence of events that this agenda has
in mind for humanity. And if nothing intervenes to stop

(01:05:29):
that sequence unfolded, which is the whole point of what
I do to stimulate that intervention, then it will unfold.
So now we can start to understand why old As
Huxley could be so phenomenally accurate in Brave New World,
written or published in the nineties, written and published in
the nineteen thirties, in terms of current events involving drugs

(01:05:54):
and genetics and technology. We can now understand why George
orwell real named Eric Blair could be so phenomenally accurate
with his book in four and why someone that I
have quoted at length in my last but one book
called Phanto himself. He was a doctor called Dr Richard Day,

(01:06:17):
a big time Rockefeller family insider, and in nineteen sixty nine,
no one knows why he did this, but I'm glad
you did. And he was addressing a group of pediatricians
in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, in nine, and for some reason he
asked people to turn off recording equipment and not to
take notes because he was going to tell him how

(01:06:38):
the world was going to change, because basically what he
represented was going to change it. And he reeled off
um a long list of things that were going to
happen in the world, and when you read them sixty
nine because one doctor called Dr Lawrence Dunegan did take notes,
and later he started to talk about it because he

(01:07:01):
was realizing that the world described by Day in ninety
six nine was happening. Richard Day described in nineteen sixty
nine the Internet and how it worked. He said in
nineteen sixty nine, we are going to make boys and
girls the same he said in nine. We are going

(01:07:21):
to have mass movements of people from cultures to culture
to break down cultures all over the world. And this
was nine. So how is that possible? Because if you
are part of, or can research into that projected agenda,
operating in the secret society networks, you can predict the future.

(01:07:45):
That's how it's done. That's why my books have been
so accurate and predicting the future. They've just been saying,
this is what's planned by this agenda, and the idea
is to intervene in it. And what we need to
do first of all, in fact, primarily is d program.
You know, people talk about waking up, people must wake up.
What does that mean? It means deprogramming from the perceptual

(01:08:09):
programs that we've been downloading from cradle to grave. You
come out of the womb, your parents are immediately influencing
your perceptions from the perspective of the sequence you're about
to go through. You at a ludicrously young age. Now
you've only just arrived your into the education system, as

(01:08:33):
it's bravely called, and for the rest of your formative
years you are given the system states version of everything
and reality of how things are, how things aren't, of
history of everything. And also through that same period you
are being prepared psychologically to obey authority for the rest

(01:08:55):
of your life without question. They tell you from the
earliest age when you can talk, when you can eat,
when you can go to the toilet. In in the
school system, these are all psychological preparations. And then you
go out into the world, peer pressure around you, people
who've been through the same programming sausage machine that you

(01:09:17):
have and bought the the the program bought that version
of normal. They then put pressure on you if you
want to break out of it, they ridicule you or
or condemn you or whatever. The mainstream media is pounding
out that same version of reality that all the way
through your life. Mainstream science is coming from the same

(01:09:40):
perception of normal. So is mainstream medicine, so is mainstream everything,
and and so if all you've basically heard is one
set of facts, norms, whatever, you are very likely to
believe them. This is why Muslim people overwhelming come from

(01:10:00):
Muslim families, and and and Christian people come from Christian families, etcetera.
Hindu families people come from Hindu families because as they
were growing up, that's the belief system they heard about,
so it they absorbed it. This is what the system does.
And what people need to just do is just stop

(01:10:22):
and say, why do I believe what I do? And
am I really saying that although I live within a
smear of no point, not nor five percent of the universe.
All I need to know is the tiny band of
possibility that I've been taught through the school system, but

(01:10:46):
I read in religious books. I mean, it's ridiculous. You've
got the entirety of possibility, uh in the great forever
of infinite reality, and yet were confined to this narrow
band of frequen which is the only frequence is we
can see. And we believe that a few people called authority,

(01:11:10):
within this tidy band of frequency are telling us all
we need to know. It's nonsense. And if you're in
authority and you want control, you you you tell people
to believe what will allow you to have that control.
Therefore you control by control of information. What we need

(01:11:32):
to do to escape from that is to stop believing
these these norms that we've been pressured to believe in,
and start to open our minds to other possibility. And
when you do, and I know this from people I've
spoken to and people have read my books all over
the world, When you have access to these two two

(01:11:54):
other explanations for the world, they make more sense than
what people have been told up to this point. And
and and your mind starts to flow, and you start
to stop seeing pixels and things in isolation and you
start to see how everything connects. But you've got to

(01:12:14):
let your mind open, otherwise you can't do it. And
that is that that idea of a larger picture is
perhaps a good positive analog to the web described earlier.
Everyone listening to this show is well aware that the

(01:12:35):
best way to learn about something is to read multiple
views on it, and the and the biggest thing that
any individual or group can learn about is the nature
of this wild ride that we call reality. David, I
thank you so much for your time with your time

(01:12:58):
with us today. Now I speak for many people in
our audience who are right now yelling at their phone
or at their at their computer. However they hear this
because I'm sure that there are dozens and dozens of
things that we were not able to get to today. However,

(01:13:20):
we do want people to know that they can learn
more about your work through your multiple books, through your
upcoming film that's great, Renegade, and also through your website,
through your YouTube channel, all these things. Can you just
tell our listeners where to learn more and where to
watch Renegade? Well, David dot dot com is the kind

(01:13:42):
of focal point. There's an enormous library of information and
videos that I've done on David dot dot com. Renegade.
The details of where to see Renegade are all on
David dot dot com. It's it's out very shortly on
June the fourth, and I've been very very encouraged UM
that people in the premiers have taken friends along who

(01:14:04):
know nothing about my work and they've been really gobsmacked
by what they've seen because it's it's a story about
my life, yes, but only up to a point. It's
really the information that I'm putting out. And I'm very
pleased with what the what the film company have done.
I mean, I've had no input into it apart from
you know, they Fly on the Wall filmed me. But

(01:14:26):
I'm very pleased with with what they've done. And I've
got another book coming out in UM in September called
The Trigger. And if people think, um, I've been controversial
up to this point, well strap in because that one
trumps some are in many ways. Well, we certainly hope

(01:14:46):
you'll come back to speak with us about that. David. Oh,
I absolutely love to Yeah. Oh, thank you, and that
is our show. Everyone. Thank you so much for listening.
We'd like to hear from you of course, you are
the most important part of our show. You can find
us on Instagram, Facebook, and Twitter, or you can email
us directly. We are conspiracy at i heart radio dot com.

(01:15:28):
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