May 15, 2024 • 26 mins
Abundance Community member Tori and Allison explore Tori's apprehensions about starting a private practice, marketing strategies for her therapy practice, thematic concerns of her clients, and the importance of networking. They also discuss legal considerations for email marketing, the benefits of establishing strong relationships with other professionals, and the importance of following up with contacts.
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Episode Transcript
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(00:08):
(Transcribed by TurboScribe.ai - Go Unlimited to remove this message) Hi, welcome to the Abundant Practice podcast.
I'm Allison from Abundance Practice Building.
I have a nearly diagnosable obsession with helping
therapists build sustainable, joy-filled private practices, just
like I've done for tens of thousands of
therapists across the world.
I'm excited to help you too.
If you want to fill your practice with
ideal clients, we have loads of free resources
(00:29):
and paid support.
Go to AbundancePracticeBuilding.com slash links.
All right, onto the show.
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You really wish grad school had covered how
(01:32):
to fill a private practice.
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could ask questions, someone who could tell you
what you were doing wrong and how to
fix it.
You had classmates working towards the same goal.
Think of Party Plus like that grad school
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(01:52):
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(02:13):
Check out Party Plus in the link in
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dreaming of.
Tori, how are you doing?
Hi, Allison.
Hi, I'm well.
How are you?
I'm great, yeah.
What would be helpful today?
Um, so I am actually just in my
(02:34):
last day at my current job.
So I have, I've got the tasky checklist
done.
Good.
I might need some encouragement.
Okay.
I'm feeling pretty scared about going out of
network with insurance.
I'm in a group practice right now where
I'm paneled with like the three major providers
(02:54):
in Illinois.
I live in downtown, and I'm deciding to
go private pay, and I'm scared.
Okay.
Well, first, it makes sense to be scared,
not because it's so risky, but because it's
new for you.
So like, I want to acknowledge, I don't
think I've ever talked to anybody starting their
(03:14):
practice who wasn't scared.
I was excited and terrified, and the mix
of those was kind of a mess, but
it is what it is.
So it's scary, not because you're not going
to succeed, but just because you don't see
it yet.
That's helpful.
I think sometimes I've been equating feeling scared
with meaning, I'm not doing this right, or
this isn't going to work.
(03:35):
Yeah, it's easy to do that, right?
I mean, fear is there, fear is there
to keep us from danger.
So it makes sense that we're like, oh,
maybe I shouldn't, maybe this is the wrong
path for me, maybe I shouldn't be doing
it.
But fear is, it has evolved, right?
To emails and things like that, and not
tigers.
So it makes sense that you feel scared.
(03:57):
Also, you're in great company with it.
And I feel extraordinarily confident that, especially in
a city like Chicago, with really good solid
marketing, and a really good solid niche, it's
just a matter of time until you're full.
And maybe that would be what could be
(04:17):
helpful to talk about.
Let's do it.
The marketing, do you want me to send
you my website right now in the chat?
Is it easiest just to talk?
Yeah, let's talk about, tell me about your
niche first, and we'll talk through marketing for
it.
Yeah, so I would say my niche is
a pretty specific client, and it's probably a
woman, although I work with all genders, but
(04:38):
probably a woman between about maybe 25 and
30, who presents as sort of having it
all together, and really good at being what
other people want her to be.
Inside sort of feels like the wheels are
falling off the bus.
Yeah, yeah.
Probably what she's coming to see need for
is how that is showing up in her
(05:01):
relationship to food, or feel really distressed about
her body image.
But as we continue to work on those
things, what we probably wind up figuring out
is a lot of other things around relationships
and her self-identity.
Love it, love it.
Is your client someone who could be diagnosed
with an eating disorder, or is it more?
Okay, got it.
(05:22):
Perfect.
Well, my bread and butter.
Yes, which I found it especially helpful in
your own website, but I don't use, and
I would be curious your thoughts on this,
I don't use a ton of eating disorder
diagnosis language on my website, because when I've
been thinking about my ideal clients, some of
whom are coming with me and are going
to pay out of pocket.
(05:42):
And it's interesting that it's all of my
ideal clients who are the ones who are
willing.
I love that.
What a great universe nudge.
You've got fear, but you're on the right
path.
But when I was thinking about them, not
a single one of them came in like,
hey Tori, I have bulimia and I want
to work on that, right?
So I was trying to pull some of
the language from our initial Yeah, perfect.
(06:05):
Yeah.
I think this is such a good teaching
moment for anybody listening or watching your ideal
client within the eating disorder sphere is different
from my ideal client in the eating disorder
sphere.
Cause my ideal client is like, I've got
an eating disorder.
It's ruining my life.
Like they are clear about it probably because
they've been in therapy for it in the
past.
Or if it's a teenager for like in
(06:26):
my group practice, I don't see teens, but
it's a parent who's like, oh shit, you
know, this is, this needs attention and care.
Yeah.
So it's so important to meet your ideal
clients exactly where they're at.
So you can continue to get ideal clients
because if you use eating disorder language, they're
going to be like, well, that's not me.
It looks familiar, but it's not me.
So I think, are you talking on your
(06:47):
website a lot about, oh, what was that?
I just think that's like bolstering to hear
you say that because, you know, I think
all the basic SEO stuff is like put
in all these eating disorder terms.
And I feel like that's going to scare
away the people I'm seeking to attract.
Yeah.
And I think this happens with trauma therapists
a lot where their ideal clients aren't like,
(07:07):
you know, I was raped in college and
that's why my relationships are all falling apart.
You know, it's, it's anxiety or it's relationship
issues.
They're showing up for a different reason.
So for a trauma therapist to SEO the
heck out of their website with trauma words,
isn't going to help.
So there are many of these circumstances where
it's like the underlying thing isn't what the
(07:29):
client thinks they're coming into therapy for.
So we got to just meet them where
they're at with our marketing.
So you've got, do you talk about on
your website, the body image stuff, some of
those less in your face eating disorder things?
Yeah.
Yeah.
And that's where I found the worksheets about
(07:50):
the niche really helpful.
So like some of the language I have,
like stuff like, you know, maybe wonder how
you got here constantly checking, you know, how
your body looks in the mirror, judging look,
and then maybe even judging yourself for judging
yourself.
Some of the people I work with, like
really want to be good.
They really want to recover, right.
(08:10):
Or do the work, right.
Yeah.
And so even playing with some of that,
like rigidity that comes into the, the care
processes is important.
And I like want to see that and
get that.
Absolutely.
So, okay.
So you've got a website and you're speaking
to your ideal client there.
Are you networking as well?
(08:32):
I am.
I haven't done a ton yet because I
felt constrained by time.
That's hopefully all going to change next week.
Yes.
I have a lot of time to, to
network.
Yeah.
I've already got, you know, some network from
working in this community and I'm been meeting
up with, with folks just for coffees or
(08:53):
dinners or things like that.
I think the, where I'm feeling a bit
stuck is like beyond people.
I already know like nutritionists or psychiatrists.
I'm not sure who I should be seeking
out as good referral sources.
Let's think about your ideal client and where
she calls or goes first.
(09:16):
I think a lot of my clients present
with thematic concerns that might either be related
to medical related concerns related to the eating
disorder or might be sort of presentations of
anxiety.
So probably doctors.
(09:36):
And is that like, are they going to
a primary care provider and getting a referral
to gastro or are they more likely to
have it be managed by the PCP?
Probably a specialist.
Okay.
I'm wondering too, like here where I live,
before they'd go see a gastro, they'd probably
see a functional medicine doc or you know,
(09:59):
they're, they're going to do an elimination diet.
They're going to figure out like if it's
a gut health issue while not disclosing that
it's probably because they're throwing up four times
a day, you know, like there's, and so
it might be a naturopath or a functional
medicine doctor, depending on your ideal client.
Yeah.
Maybe like trying things like I've had clients
come to her, like, you know, I've tried
acupuncture.
I've tried chiropractic services.
(10:22):
Probably folks who are hoping they can just
like fix this with like going and doing
a handful of sessions without having to really
dig into how they feel.
Yes.
Yes.
Because our people, mine are the same in
this way is like they're fixers.
They're doers.
They recognize there's a problem.
They want to solve it.
They will throw everything at that problem to
(10:44):
get it solved except deep work on their
emotions or sitting with feelings until they come
and see you.
And they realize like that's a safe thing
to do.
It's squirmy, but it's safe.
So I would hit up the chiropractors, the
acupuncturists.
I would network with those folks.
(11:05):
They're going to be easier likely to get
in with than a PCP would be to
network with.
I think it would still really be beneficial
for you to meet with gastroenterologists because they
can sometimes see the signs of something like
purging or malnutrition or things like that.
And they may not ask in a way
(11:25):
that has the patient be honest with them
about what's going on with them food wise,
but they'll know and they can make the
referral.
It might be really hard to get in
with them.
And you could, my thing with doctors and
busy practices is call the front desk, ask
for the referral coordinator.
If the referral coordinator, like when you, when
you get the referral coordinator on the line,
(11:46):
I want you to have a script you're
going to say that's already written out because
they want their information a lot faster than
therapists tend to give it.
And to just say, I'm a therapist who
works with people with anxiety and eating disorders.
And many of my clients have GI issues.
I'm wondering how I can get on your
referral list so that we can refer back
(12:06):
and forth.
Okay.
Yeah.
I'm just taking some notes.
Yeah.
I'm thinking too, that a lot of my
clients tend to either be in or recently
be out of a graduate program, right?
A lot of law students, a lot of
medical students who are near Northwestern, New Chicago.
So I'm thinking maybe counseling centers within the
(12:30):
graduate program specifically.
If they have them, usually I've worked for
University of Georgia's Counseling Center and we saw
grad students and undergrads every now and then
a department, like sometimes a law department will
have their own, but otherwise like the university
counseling center would be a really good, and
just, you know, let them know, like you,
(12:52):
you're not generally working with undergrads if older
people are more your bag.
Yeah.
And sometimes medical schools will have their own
also.
And you can probably just like Google around
on their site and see by getting in
touch with the right people to get on
referral lists.
And then if it's possible to go, you
(13:12):
know, bring some store-bought cookies you put
on a plate.
It doesn't have to be high effort or
high cost, but if you can get some
FaceTime with some folks, then they automatically feel
more connected to you, more trusting of you,
those kinds of things.
Yeah.
I mean, either when I need to refer
(13:34):
a client on or add someone to the
team, I'm thinking of the people that I've
had these good personal interactions with.
It's so often what brings people to mind
for me.
Yeah, absolutely.
Because you trust them, like you've had enough
time and experience with them that you know
the energy that they're going to bring to
a person who's hurting.
Yeah.
Okay.
So we've got website and networking on deck.
(13:54):
Do you have other marketing that you're working
on?
So I have two blog posts published and
I'm going to, I have a couple sort
of backlogged and ready, really for the thought
that I can then have some consistent things
to post to on LinkedIn, you know, on
(14:15):
the Network with people, add them to my
LinkedIn, or maybe it's emailing them to them,
adding those two as updates for my Google
business page.
And then what I really like to do,
I don't have any interest in doing social
media.
And so I'm not going to, which is,
I love to write.
I, I've always been in my current practice,
(14:37):
someone who's offered lots of like, oh, you
guys should try this resource or that.
And so I think I want to do
like a monthly email newsletter.
Awesome.
Some cute design-y parts for the person
who did my logo.
They're going to help design some stuff.
So that's something that I'm thinking could be
a good way to just keep my name
up in someone's like inbox.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And just be aware that they have to
physically opt in themselves.
(14:59):
Okay.
Sometimes like I get added to a lot
of people's email lists that I'm, did not
add myself to, and that's technically illegal.
It's considered spam and the F is it
the FCC doesn't love it.
Now, do I know anybody who's been arrested
or gotten in trouble or lost their license
for it?
No, I don't.
But if you get, I do know that
if you have enough people say like, I
(15:20):
didn't sign up for this email list, you
can get booted off of MailChimp or whatever
kind of platform you're on.
So that can be a part of your
intake paperwork where you say, would you like
to be added to my weekly newsletter where
I share resources that could be helpful?
And if they check, yes, you can add
them.
That counts as like them opting in for
(15:42):
referral sources.
It's a little trickier because like what's going
to make them want to opt in.
Uh, because it's not going to be like
really helpful for them aside from when they
need you, they'll remember you're there.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I have to, I have to think about
that then just based on what I shared
(16:03):
with you so far, do you have any
other thoughts on maybe things that I should
be utilizing that I'm not in terms of
like marketing strategies?
Yeah.
Are you on any online listings like psychology
today or therapy den or inclusive therapists?
Yeah.
Why am I not thinking about that as
marketing?
Yes, I'm on psychology today.
I've been full for a while when I
was on insurance panels.
(16:23):
So, you know, I kind of had bare
bones.
So I just want to add that up.
I did the 10 second video thing in
my entire link that I'm using.
Okay, cool.
So you've got website, we have blogging, we
have networking, we have online listings and email
marketing.
It's it depends on if we count, I
(16:44):
don't count that usually as a marketing strategy
until you've got a bunch of people on
it.
So I think it's, it's figuring out what
that fifth one is going to be.
If you enjoy public speaking, that can be
a really good way to do it.
Like I did a eating disorder talk early
on when I moved here for a university
health center where they didn't have an eating
disorder therapist on staff and they didn't know
(17:06):
a lot about eating disorders.
And I was their go-to for years
and years.
And that was really helpful.
So, and that was very specific to like,
how do these cases show up subtly instead
of coming in with the blaring?
I have an eating disorder because they were
already referring those folks out.
And later they just referred them all to
me after that talk, but that way they
(17:29):
weren't missing things because none of us want
to miss anything, especially something that's that big
a deal.
So then if you're making them feel less
anxious and more confident in what they're doing,
then that probably makes them want to refer
you more.
Exactly.
Yeah.
Every single networking, reach out or public speaking,
reach out or anything that you do.
I want you to be thinking of like,
(17:49):
in what ways am I making their jobs
or their lives easier beyond just like now
they have a great resource to refer to.
Okay.
What about thoughts on how much time should
I be investing in networking specifically with other
therapists?
Like it's no brainer to me about like
psychiatrists or dietitians, right?
(18:10):
They want to add a good therapist.
Like what about other therapists?
Most therapists have no idea what they're doing
with eating disorders.
And I think most would admit that, you
know, and the fact that you do makes
their lives much better because there will be
people like they're everybody listening right now.
If you've got a full caseload probably has
somebody with some disordered eating at the very
(18:31):
least, and you just don't know it because
they're not disclosing it or they're disclosing it
in really subtle ways that you don't know
how to pick up.
I'm not speaking to you.
I'm speaking to listeners, you know how to
pick it up, but especially talking to other
full therapists with kind of aligned niches.
I mean, you can keep your practice full
(18:51):
just from that.
If you have like two or three full
therapists that refer to you consistently, it's amazing
versus another eating disorder therapist in town, who's
also starting their practice.
That's not going to be the best thing
for your time right now, but later when
you're both full or one of you is
(19:12):
full, it'll be great.
That makes sense to make that distinction.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And therapists are also way easier to network
with.
So it's a lot less legwork to try
to get in touch with them and get
them in person.
Most of the time, like if you send
out five emails, two or three will come
back and be like, yeah, sure.
And that's it.
(19:32):
And then you go get coffee together or
something.
So it's an easier get to be with
another therapist.
And it's also easier conversation because you're already,
you know, you're doing the same job.
We have this commonality that makes us similar
in some ways and makes it easier to
connect.
What do you think about offering any sort
of consultation, like a group or a meetup
(19:54):
or anything like that as a networking strategy?
Consultation groups can be great.
Absolutely.
And to just have it be a peer
consultation group, nobody's getting paid.
You lead it to get it started, but
then nobody's in charge, in charge.
That's something I did back in Seattle that
was really effective.
And you get to know how people conceptualize
(20:14):
and treat cases in a way that has
you like when somebody calls you, you're like,
oh, this is, this is Robert's person.
Like this needs to go to Robert or
Emily would be so amazing for this client.
And so you can really give great referrals
and get great referrals because you really know
each other's work pretty well.
Yeah.
Is like, it's just supportive of your own
clinical growth, which I'm always a fan of.
(20:38):
Yeah.
Yeah.
I mean, I think too, that sometimes my
anxiety shows up when I feel like, you
know, I have to like pitch myself so
quickly.
And I think there's a part of me
that's like, yeah, but when people can really
see the work that I do, I think
that speaks for itself.
But I think trying to get that across
in these quick little, you know, moments that
can feel intimidating to me.
(21:00):
Yeah.
Yeah, it can.
And I think consultations help with group consultation
because you just get to know one another,
you get to talk through for an extended
period of time.
And when you're, when you're networking with other
people, you're not necessarily, you don't need to
prove yourself.
I want to take the pressure off that
you have to like prove yourself or you
(21:21):
don't have to sell yourself.
Basically.
You really are just showing up and connecting
human to human.
I have left networking meetings being like, I
don't know if either one of us talked
about our niche, but we like immediately connected,
started talking about life.
But when you have that kind of connection,
you follow up.
Like we always want to follow up with
the people we have good connections with.
(21:42):
And then you can be like, Hey, you
want to grab coffee again?
Or how's work going this month?
I realized, like, I don't even know who
to refer to you.
Like, who do you love to see?
I love to see people who don't know
they have an eating disorder or haven't admitted
it to themselves yet, but they're really caught
up in like anxiety and body image issues.
Well, that might be like the instant gratification
(22:03):
part of me.
That's like, all right, we have that one
networking thing.
You know, it's not like the referral is
going to come tomorrow.
Yeah, I've, I've very rarely had a one
-off conversation with someone and gotten referrals within
a month.
It's usually like nurturing.
It's kind of like dating and that you're
going to go on a bunch of these
networking dates and not everybody's going to be
(22:25):
an easy fit.
You might still like, like the person.
Okay.
And refer to them.
But not everybody's going to be like, I
want to be friends with this person.
The people that you want to be friends
with, be friends with them.
Reach out, form real relationships and you will
probably fill each other's caseloads.
Like for years, decades even.
(22:45):
And the people that you had an okay
connection with, but you really respect them.
You felt like, you know, they're just not
your people, but they probably do really great
clinical work.
Follow up with them too.
Just less frequently and less lovey-dovey.
And if anything is just like, that was
awkward.
I really like something about them or be
the wrong way.
That's the last interaction you ever have to
(23:06):
have with them.
And there are so many people in Chicago,
so you don't have to worry.
There, there are always other people around the
bend.
So yeah.
That's right.
So just continuing to follow up.
I mean, I know sometimes when the relationship
is more personal and I have, you know,
colleagues who are also friends, that's organic, but
(23:26):
it really does feel at least at the
start, like it's just solely professional.
Like how soon should I follow up after
a networking call or a Zoom or coffee?
I would say like two weeks to a
month and put it in your schedule so
you don't forget.
Cause it's really easy to forget.
And it could also be like following up
could also be, you see an article on
(23:47):
LinkedIn or you're just like scrolling Instagram and
you see something that relates to their niche
or reminds you of them and you can
just text or email it to them and
be like, Hey, I saw this today.
I'm thought of you.
I hope things are going really well for
you.
It doesn't have to be intense.
And that's like networking has filled my practice
(24:08):
more than any other thing I've ever done
in three different States that I've had practices.
It is one of those things that pays
off for, I mean, I've been here a
decade and I still get referrals from some
people I haven't even seen in 10 years.
It's really cool how these relationships, even if
they're, even if they're like for just a
season, you get stuck in someone's head as
(24:29):
the go-to for this, you know, and
they get stuck in your head as the
go-to for their niche.
And you're able to really make sure clients
get where they need to go.
Yeah.
Yeah.
This is, this has been really helpful.
Good.
I'm glad.
I'm glad you're going to be like a
master networker soon.
And you're going to have, yeah, you have
(24:50):
these other marketing strategies going along too, that
are really going to make it easy for
people to choose you.
Yeah.
Well, the, the course has been really helpful
getting started.
And there was a lot of stuff about,
especially getting into your niche that, Ooh, I'm
glad I had that.
Otherwise I think my website would have been
really nice for me to read.
(25:11):
Yeah, yeah.
When you have guidance, it just goes faster.
I mean, it's with the Arabess and we
help people heal faster or find peace faster.
Right.
So you got help when you needed it.
I'm glad I got to help.
Thank you so much.
Thanks for your time today.
Appreciate it.
(25:31):
Absolutely.
Take care and keep me updated in the
party.
I want to hear how it's going.
Sounds good.
Thank you.
Bye.
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(Transcribed by TurboScribe.ai - Go Unlimited to remove this message) Hi, welcome to the Abundant Practice podcast.
I'm Allison from Abundance Practice Building.
I have a nearly diagnosable obsession with helping
therapists build sustainable, joy-filled private practices, just
like I've done for tens of thousands of
therapists across the world.
I'm excited to help you too.
If you want to fill your practice with
ideal clients, we have loads of free resources
(00:29):
and paid support.
Go to AbundancePracticeBuilding.com slash links.
All right, onto the show.
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You really wish grad school had covered how
(01:32):
to fill a private practice.
In grad school, you had a professor you
could ask questions, someone who could tell you
what you were doing wrong and how to
fix it.
You had classmates working towards the same goal.
Think of Party Plus like that grad school
class you wish you had.
You get individual consultation about your specific practice
with clear feedback and guidance.
You get group calls with other people building
(01:52):
their practices who have your back.
We cover everything from marketing to mindset, and
you have access to everything in the Abundance
Party, all the courses and trainings that have
filled thousands of therapists' practices.
Thanks to the feedback, the support, and the
clear step-by-step, people in Party Plus
get full faster.
The majority of Party Plus members fill their
practice in three months.
(02:13):
Check out Party Plus in the link in
the show notes and join the interest list
if you're ready to build what you've been
dreaming of.
Tori, how are you doing?
Hi, Allison.
Hi, I'm well.
How are you?
I'm great, yeah.
What would be helpful today?
Um, so I am actually just in my
(02:34):
last day at my current job.
So I have, I've got the tasky checklist
done.
Good.
I might need some encouragement.
Okay.
I'm feeling pretty scared about going out of
network with insurance.
I'm in a group practice right now where
I'm paneled with like the three major providers
(02:54):
in Illinois.
I live in downtown, and I'm deciding to
go private pay, and I'm scared.
Okay.
Well, first, it makes sense to be scared,
not because it's so risky, but because it's
new for you.
So like, I want to acknowledge, I don't
think I've ever talked to anybody starting their
(03:14):
practice who wasn't scared.
I was excited and terrified, and the mix
of those was kind of a mess, but
it is what it is.
So it's scary, not because you're not going
to succeed, but just because you don't see
it yet.
That's helpful.
I think sometimes I've been equating feeling scared
with meaning, I'm not doing this right, or
this isn't going to work.
(03:35):
Yeah, it's easy to do that, right?
I mean, fear is there, fear is there
to keep us from danger.
So it makes sense that we're like, oh,
maybe I shouldn't, maybe this is the wrong
path for me, maybe I shouldn't be doing
it.
But fear is, it has evolved, right?
To emails and things like that, and not
tigers.
So it makes sense that you feel scared.
(03:57):
Also, you're in great company with it.
And I feel extraordinarily confident that, especially in
a city like Chicago, with really good solid
marketing, and a really good solid niche, it's
just a matter of time until you're full.
And maybe that would be what could be
(04:17):
helpful to talk about.
Let's do it.
The marketing, do you want me to send
you my website right now in the chat?
Is it easiest just to talk?
Yeah, let's talk about, tell me about your
niche first, and we'll talk through marketing for
it.
Yeah, so I would say my niche is
a pretty specific client, and it's probably a
woman, although I work with all genders, but
(04:38):
probably a woman between about maybe 25 and
30, who presents as sort of having it
all together, and really good at being what
other people want her to be.
Inside sort of feels like the wheels are
falling off the bus.
Yeah, yeah.
Probably what she's coming to see need for
is how that is showing up in her
(05:01):
relationship to food, or feel really distressed about
her body image.
But as we continue to work on those
things, what we probably wind up figuring out
is a lot of other things around relationships
and her self-identity.
Love it, love it.
Is your client someone who could be diagnosed
with an eating disorder, or is it more?
Okay, got it.
(05:22):
Perfect.
Well, my bread and butter.
Yes, which I found it especially helpful in
your own website, but I don't use, and
I would be curious your thoughts on this,
I don't use a ton of eating disorder
diagnosis language on my website, because when I've
been thinking about my ideal clients, some of
whom are coming with me and are going
to pay out of pocket.
(05:42):
And it's interesting that it's all of my
ideal clients who are the ones who are
willing.
I love that.
What a great universe nudge.
You've got fear, but you're on the right
path.
But when I was thinking about them, not
a single one of them came in like,
hey Tori, I have bulimia and I want
to work on that, right?
So I was trying to pull some of
the language from our initial Yeah, perfect.
(06:05):
Yeah.
I think this is such a good teaching
moment for anybody listening or watching your ideal
client within the eating disorder sphere is different
from my ideal client in the eating disorder
sphere.
Cause my ideal client is like, I've got
an eating disorder.
It's ruining my life.
Like they are clear about it probably because
they've been in therapy for it in the
past.
Or if it's a teenager for like in
(06:26):
my group practice, I don't see teens, but
it's a parent who's like, oh shit, you
know, this is, this needs attention and care.
Yeah.
So it's so important to meet your ideal
clients exactly where they're at.
So you can continue to get ideal clients
because if you use eating disorder language, they're
going to be like, well, that's not me.
It looks familiar, but it's not me.
So I think, are you talking on your
(06:47):
website a lot about, oh, what was that?
I just think that's like bolstering to hear
you say that because, you know, I think
all the basic SEO stuff is like put
in all these eating disorder terms.
And I feel like that's going to scare
away the people I'm seeking to attract.
Yeah.
And I think this happens with trauma therapists
a lot where their ideal clients aren't like,
(07:07):
you know, I was raped in college and
that's why my relationships are all falling apart.
You know, it's, it's anxiety or it's relationship
issues.
They're showing up for a different reason.
So for a trauma therapist to SEO the
heck out of their website with trauma words,
isn't going to help.
So there are many of these circumstances where
it's like the underlying thing isn't what the
(07:29):
client thinks they're coming into therapy for.
So we got to just meet them where
they're at with our marketing.
So you've got, do you talk about on
your website, the body image stuff, some of
those less in your face eating disorder things?
Yeah.
Yeah.
And that's where I found the worksheets about
(07:50):
the niche really helpful.
So like some of the language I have,
like stuff like, you know, maybe wonder how
you got here constantly checking, you know, how
your body looks in the mirror, judging look,
and then maybe even judging yourself for judging
yourself.
Some of the people I work with, like
really want to be good.
They really want to recover, right.
(08:10):
Or do the work, right.
Yeah.
And so even playing with some of that,
like rigidity that comes into the, the care
processes is important.
And I like want to see that and
get that.
Absolutely.
So, okay.
So you've got a website and you're speaking
to your ideal client there.
Are you networking as well?
(08:32):
I am.
I haven't done a ton yet because I
felt constrained by time.
That's hopefully all going to change next week.
Yes.
I have a lot of time to, to
network.
Yeah.
I've already got, you know, some network from
working in this community and I'm been meeting
up with, with folks just for coffees or
(08:53):
dinners or things like that.
I think the, where I'm feeling a bit
stuck is like beyond people.
I already know like nutritionists or psychiatrists.
I'm not sure who I should be seeking
out as good referral sources.
Let's think about your ideal client and where
she calls or goes first.
(09:16):
I think a lot of my clients present
with thematic concerns that might either be related
to medical related concerns related to the eating
disorder or might be sort of presentations of
anxiety.
So probably doctors.
(09:36):
And is that like, are they going to
a primary care provider and getting a referral
to gastro or are they more likely to
have it be managed by the PCP?
Probably a specialist.
Okay.
I'm wondering too, like here where I live,
before they'd go see a gastro, they'd probably
see a functional medicine doc or you know,
(09:59):
they're, they're going to do an elimination diet.
They're going to figure out like if it's
a gut health issue while not disclosing that
it's probably because they're throwing up four times
a day, you know, like there's, and so
it might be a naturopath or a functional
medicine doctor, depending on your ideal client.
Yeah.
Maybe like trying things like I've had clients
come to her, like, you know, I've tried
acupuncture.
I've tried chiropractic services.
(10:22):
Probably folks who are hoping they can just
like fix this with like going and doing
a handful of sessions without having to really
dig into how they feel.
Yes.
Yes.
Because our people, mine are the same in
this way is like they're fixers.
They're doers.
They recognize there's a problem.
They want to solve it.
They will throw everything at that problem to
(10:44):
get it solved except deep work on their
emotions or sitting with feelings until they come
and see you.
And they realize like that's a safe thing
to do.
It's squirmy, but it's safe.
So I would hit up the chiropractors, the
acupuncturists.
I would network with those folks.
(11:05):
They're going to be easier likely to get
in with than a PCP would be to
network with.
I think it would still really be beneficial
for you to meet with gastroenterologists because they
can sometimes see the signs of something like
purging or malnutrition or things like that.
And they may not ask in a way
(11:25):
that has the patient be honest with them
about what's going on with them food wise,
but they'll know and they can make the
referral.
It might be really hard to get in
with them.
And you could, my thing with doctors and
busy practices is call the front desk, ask
for the referral coordinator.
If the referral coordinator, like when you, when
you get the referral coordinator on the line,
(11:46):
I want you to have a script you're
going to say that's already written out because
they want their information a lot faster than
therapists tend to give it.
And to just say, I'm a therapist who
works with people with anxiety and eating disorders.
And many of my clients have GI issues.
I'm wondering how I can get on your
referral list so that we can refer back
(12:06):
and forth.
Okay.
Yeah.
I'm just taking some notes.
Yeah.
I'm thinking too, that a lot of my
clients tend to either be in or recently
be out of a graduate program, right?
A lot of law students, a lot of
medical students who are near Northwestern, New Chicago.
So I'm thinking maybe counseling centers within the
(12:30):
graduate program specifically.
If they have them, usually I've worked for
University of Georgia's Counseling Center and we saw
grad students and undergrads every now and then
a department, like sometimes a law department will
have their own, but otherwise like the university
counseling center would be a really good, and
just, you know, let them know, like you,
(12:52):
you're not generally working with undergrads if older
people are more your bag.
Yeah.
And sometimes medical schools will have their own
also.
And you can probably just like Google around
on their site and see by getting in
touch with the right people to get on
referral lists.
And then if it's possible to go, you
(13:12):
know, bring some store-bought cookies you put
on a plate.
It doesn't have to be high effort or
high cost, but if you can get some
FaceTime with some folks, then they automatically feel
more connected to you, more trusting of you,
those kinds of things.
Yeah.
I mean, either when I need to refer
(13:34):
a client on or add someone to the
team, I'm thinking of the people that I've
had these good personal interactions with.
It's so often what brings people to mind
for me.
Yeah, absolutely.
Because you trust them, like you've had enough
time and experience with them that you know
the energy that they're going to bring to
a person who's hurting.
Yeah.
Okay.
So we've got website and networking on deck.
(13:54):
Do you have other marketing that you're working
on?
So I have two blog posts published and
I'm going to, I have a couple sort
of backlogged and ready, really for the thought
that I can then have some consistent things
to post to on LinkedIn, you know, on
(14:15):
the Network with people, add them to my
LinkedIn, or maybe it's emailing them to them,
adding those two as updates for my Google
business page.
And then what I really like to do,
I don't have any interest in doing social
media.
And so I'm not going to, which is,
I love to write.
I, I've always been in my current practice,
(14:37):
someone who's offered lots of like, oh, you
guys should try this resource or that.
And so I think I want to do
like a monthly email newsletter.
Awesome.
Some cute design-y parts for the person
who did my logo.
They're going to help design some stuff.
So that's something that I'm thinking could be
a good way to just keep my name
up in someone's like inbox.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And just be aware that they have to
physically opt in themselves.
(14:59):
Okay.
Sometimes like I get added to a lot
of people's email lists that I'm, did not
add myself to, and that's technically illegal.
It's considered spam and the F is it
the FCC doesn't love it.
Now, do I know anybody who's been arrested
or gotten in trouble or lost their license
for it?
No, I don't.
But if you get, I do know that
if you have enough people say like, I
(15:20):
didn't sign up for this email list, you
can get booted off of MailChimp or whatever
kind of platform you're on.
So that can be a part of your
intake paperwork where you say, would you like
to be added to my weekly newsletter where
I share resources that could be helpful?
And if they check, yes, you can add
them.
That counts as like them opting in for
(15:42):
referral sources.
It's a little trickier because like what's going
to make them want to opt in.
Uh, because it's not going to be like
really helpful for them aside from when they
need you, they'll remember you're there.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I have to, I have to think about
that then just based on what I shared
(16:03):
with you so far, do you have any
other thoughts on maybe things that I should
be utilizing that I'm not in terms of
like marketing strategies?
Yeah.
Are you on any online listings like psychology
today or therapy den or inclusive therapists?
Yeah.
Why am I not thinking about that as
marketing?
Yes, I'm on psychology today.
I've been full for a while when I
was on insurance panels.
(16:23):
So, you know, I kind of had bare
bones.
So I just want to add that up.
I did the 10 second video thing in
my entire link that I'm using.
Okay, cool.
So you've got website, we have blogging, we
have networking, we have online listings and email
marketing.
It's it depends on if we count, I
(16:44):
don't count that usually as a marketing strategy
until you've got a bunch of people on
it.
So I think it's, it's figuring out what
that fifth one is going to be.
If you enjoy public speaking, that can be
a really good way to do it.
Like I did a eating disorder talk early
on when I moved here for a university
health center where they didn't have an eating
disorder therapist on staff and they didn't know
(17:06):
a lot about eating disorders.
And I was their go-to for years
and years.
And that was really helpful.
So, and that was very specific to like,
how do these cases show up subtly instead
of coming in with the blaring?
I have an eating disorder because they were
already referring those folks out.
And later they just referred them all to
me after that talk, but that way they
(17:29):
weren't missing things because none of us want
to miss anything, especially something that's that big
a deal.
So then if you're making them feel less
anxious and more confident in what they're doing,
then that probably makes them want to refer
you more.
Exactly.
Yeah.
Every single networking, reach out or public speaking,
reach out or anything that you do.
I want you to be thinking of like,
(17:49):
in what ways am I making their jobs
or their lives easier beyond just like now
they have a great resource to refer to.
Okay.
What about thoughts on how much time should
I be investing in networking specifically with other
therapists?
Like it's no brainer to me about like
psychiatrists or dietitians, right?
(18:10):
They want to add a good therapist.
Like what about other therapists?
Most therapists have no idea what they're doing
with eating disorders.
And I think most would admit that, you
know, and the fact that you do makes
their lives much better because there will be
people like they're everybody listening right now.
If you've got a full caseload probably has
somebody with some disordered eating at the very
(18:31):
least, and you just don't know it because
they're not disclosing it or they're disclosing it
in really subtle ways that you don't know
how to pick up.
I'm not speaking to you.
I'm speaking to listeners, you know how to
pick it up, but especially talking to other
full therapists with kind of aligned niches.
I mean, you can keep your practice full
(18:51):
just from that.
If you have like two or three full
therapists that refer to you consistently, it's amazing
versus another eating disorder therapist in town, who's
also starting their practice.
That's not going to be the best thing
for your time right now, but later when
you're both full or one of you is
(19:12):
full, it'll be great.
That makes sense to make that distinction.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And therapists are also way easier to network
with.
So it's a lot less legwork to try
to get in touch with them and get
them in person.
Most of the time, like if you send
out five emails, two or three will come
back and be like, yeah, sure.
And that's it.
(19:32):
And then you go get coffee together or
something.
So it's an easier get to be with
another therapist.
And it's also easier conversation because you're already,
you know, you're doing the same job.
We have this commonality that makes us similar
in some ways and makes it easier to
connect.
What do you think about offering any sort
of consultation, like a group or a meetup
(19:54):
or anything like that as a networking strategy?
Consultation groups can be great.
Absolutely.
And to just have it be a peer
consultation group, nobody's getting paid.
You lead it to get it started, but
then nobody's in charge, in charge.
That's something I did back in Seattle that
was really effective.
And you get to know how people conceptualize
(20:14):
and treat cases in a way that has
you like when somebody calls you, you're like,
oh, this is, this is Robert's person.
Like this needs to go to Robert or
Emily would be so amazing for this client.
And so you can really give great referrals
and get great referrals because you really know
each other's work pretty well.
Yeah.
Is like, it's just supportive of your own
clinical growth, which I'm always a fan of.
(20:38):
Yeah.
Yeah.
I mean, I think too, that sometimes my
anxiety shows up when I feel like, you
know, I have to like pitch myself so
quickly.
And I think there's a part of me
that's like, yeah, but when people can really
see the work that I do, I think
that speaks for itself.
But I think trying to get that across
in these quick little, you know, moments that
can feel intimidating to me.
(21:00):
Yeah.
Yeah, it can.
And I think consultations help with group consultation
because you just get to know one another,
you get to talk through for an extended
period of time.
And when you're, when you're networking with other
people, you're not necessarily, you don't need to
prove yourself.
I want to take the pressure off that
you have to like prove yourself or you
(21:21):
don't have to sell yourself.
Basically.
You really are just showing up and connecting
human to human.
I have left networking meetings being like, I
don't know if either one of us talked
about our niche, but we like immediately connected,
started talking about life.
But when you have that kind of connection,
you follow up.
Like we always want to follow up with
the people we have good connections with.
(21:42):
And then you can be like, Hey, you
want to grab coffee again?
Or how's work going this month?
I realized, like, I don't even know who
to refer to you.
Like, who do you love to see?
I love to see people who don't know
they have an eating disorder or haven't admitted
it to themselves yet, but they're really caught
up in like anxiety and body image issues.
Well, that might be like the instant gratification
(22:03):
part of me.
That's like, all right, we have that one
networking thing.
You know, it's not like the referral is
going to come tomorrow.
Yeah, I've, I've very rarely had a one
-off conversation with someone and gotten referrals within
a month.
It's usually like nurturing.
It's kind of like dating and that you're
going to go on a bunch of these
networking dates and not everybody's going to be
(22:25):
an easy fit.
You might still like, like the person.
Okay.
And refer to them.
But not everybody's going to be like, I
want to be friends with this person.
The people that you want to be friends
with, be friends with them.
Reach out, form real relationships and you will
probably fill each other's caseloads.
Like for years, decades even.
(22:45):
And the people that you had an okay
connection with, but you really respect them.
You felt like, you know, they're just not
your people, but they probably do really great
clinical work.
Follow up with them too.
Just less frequently and less lovey-dovey.
And if anything is just like, that was
awkward.
I really like something about them or be
the wrong way.
That's the last interaction you ever have to
(23:06):
have with them.
And there are so many people in Chicago,
so you don't have to worry.
There, there are always other people around the
bend.
So yeah.
That's right.
So just continuing to follow up.
I mean, I know sometimes when the relationship
is more personal and I have, you know,
colleagues who are also friends, that's organic, but
(23:26):
it really does feel at least at the
start, like it's just solely professional.
Like how soon should I follow up after
a networking call or a Zoom or coffee?
I would say like two weeks to a
month and put it in your schedule so
you don't forget.
Cause it's really easy to forget.
And it could also be like following up
could also be, you see an article on
(23:47):
LinkedIn or you're just like scrolling Instagram and
you see something that relates to their niche
or reminds you of them and you can
just text or email it to them and
be like, Hey, I saw this today.
I'm thought of you.
I hope things are going really well for
you.
It doesn't have to be intense.
And that's like networking has filled my practice
(24:08):
more than any other thing I've ever done
in three different States that I've had practices.
It is one of those things that pays
off for, I mean, I've been here a
decade and I still get referrals from some
people I haven't even seen in 10 years.
It's really cool how these relationships, even if
they're, even if they're like for just a
season, you get stuck in someone's head as
(24:29):
the go-to for this, you know, and
they get stuck in your head as the
go-to for their niche.
And you're able to really make sure clients
get where they need to go.
Yeah.
Yeah.
This is, this has been really helpful.
Good.
I'm glad.
I'm glad you're going to be like a
master networker soon.
And you're going to have, yeah, you have
(24:50):
these other marketing strategies going along too, that
are really going to make it easy for
people to choose you.
Yeah.
Well, the, the course has been really helpful
getting started.
And there was a lot of stuff about,
especially getting into your niche that, Ooh, I'm
glad I had that.
Otherwise I think my website would have been
really nice for me to read.
(25:11):
Yeah, yeah.
When you have guidance, it just goes faster.
I mean, it's with the Arabess and we
help people heal faster or find peace faster.
Right.
So you got help when you needed it.
I'm glad I got to help.
Thank you so much.
Thanks for your time today.
Appreciate it.
(25:31):
Absolutely.
Take care and keep me updated in the
party.
I want to hear how it's going.
Sounds good.
Thank you.
Bye.
If you're ready for a much easier practice
therapy notes is the way to go.
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