For a number of years, Ed Hertzman found knee-deep in the middle of the supply chain/logistics world. At 26, he became frustrated by the confusion and lack of timely industry information available—where even a day’s delay in placing an order could mean higher costs—Ed recognized a gap: There was no "Wall Street Journal" for supply chain professionals! Driven by this, he started the Sourcing Journal to provide real-time news and insights for the supply chain and apparel industries. What started as a solution to his own frustrations quickly transformed into a substantial business, making waves in media and challenging more traditional trade publications.
Ed, now founder of Athletech News (ATN) realized the same need in the HALO space (Health, Active Lifestyle, Outdoors.) Host Pete Moore and Hertzman sat down and explored the dynamic intersection of fitness, technology, finance, and wellness. He opens up about the realities of entrepreneurship, the evolution from newsletter to nationwide events, and the importance of building a reputation before going big.
You’ll hear Ed’s candid thoughts on expanding the definition of the HALO sector—moving beyond just gyms to a broader world of health, active lifestyles, wellness, and recovery. Pete and Ed also discuss the need for more analytical reporting and data transparency around industry deals, and how their partnership aims to deliver the kind of financial insights and case studies that have long existed in other industries but are still missing in health and fitness.
Finally, this episode also offers a peek into ATN’s exciting upcoming event in New York—a high-caliber gathering inspired by the likes of "Davos and CES"—where collaboration, innovation, and strategic networking will take center stage. Whether you’re an operator, investor, vendor, or enthusiast, this episode is packed with insights on where the industry is headed, how to drive meaningful connections, and why now is an exciting time to be a part of the ever-evolving HALO sector.
Key themes discussed
- Transition from supply chain to the HALO media space
- Building and scaling a B2B media platform
- The power of niche, industry-focused events
- Importance of data-driven industry analysis
- More and more nontraditional players entering the HALO sector
- Challenges in sector terminology and defining “HALO”
- Fostering collaboration and innovation through quality events
A few key takeaways:
1. Spotting and Building in the White Space: Ed shared how his entrepreneurial journey started by identifying under-served sectors, first in supply chain media with Sourcing Journal and now in the HALO/tech space. His experience underscores the importance of finding those “white spaces” in industries—areas where communities need a voice, connection, and credible business news.
2. Slow, Strategic Growth Over Event Hype: Rather than rushing into high-profile events, Ed took a measured approach. He grew his audience steadily through newsletters before expanding into larger conferences, waiting until he had the connections and content quality to make a true impact. A key takeaway? Avoid the temptation to “call in favors too early,” and don’t over-promise before you can truly deliver.
3. Evolving Content for a Diverse Audience: Athletech News (ATN) started as a broad industry newsletter, but Ed also recognizes the need for more tailored communication—envisioning future newsletters and content streams focused specifically on CEOs, CTOs, franchisors, wellness executives, and more. As the industry’s definition of “wellness” has broadened, ATN is beginning to attract nontraditional players from hospitality, tech, finance, and beyond, reflecting the sector’s rapid evolution.
4. The Need for Data-Driven Analysis and Transparency: Hertzman also highlighted the lack of deep analysis regarding deals and trends in the sector—especially compared to more mature industries. He’s working to change that by forging partnerships with data companies and bringing real financial insight (such as deal structure and industry benchmarking) to subscribers. He and Pete also discussed the value of expert deal breakdowns and empircal, data-driven content as a differentiator for the forthcoming ATN 2025 Innovation Summit in June in NYC.
5. Reimagining Industry Events as Collaborative Think Tanks: Ed’s vision for future ATN events is ambitious: He wants to create a “Davos meets YPO meets Sun Valley” for the industry—a highly curated gathering where top CEOs, operators, founders, and even outside thought leaders come together to share, network, and get access to exclusive research and strategic insights. The focus is on in
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
I am super excited to announce that we now have a formal partnership
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This is Pete Moore at Hilo Talks NYC. I have the pleasure of bringing on
(01:07):
a fellow New Yorker, Upritty Snyder, Ed Hertzmann,
Athlete Tech News. We are partnering with them in several
fronts. We're really excited about where he's taking this because we're taking the
events, and we're basically putting it on legal steroids. So,
Ed, welcome to the Halo sector, and thanks for coming in. Thanks for
having me, Pete. Awesome. So, look, you worked in some other different
(01:29):
industries that have kind of pivoted here recently, which was a nice refreshing,
dose of, enthusiasm from our standpoint. So talk
about where you were before, what opportunities you you uncovered and
executed on, and why you said, hey. I should do this in the Halo sector.
So, you know, I was a supply chain guy. You know, I've told
this this this story a couple of times, and it's partly
(01:52):
serendipitous and part of it maybe just be at the right place at the right
time. But supply chain guy who went 02/2009, there was a cotton
crisis, and no one really knew what was going on. I was frustrated. I was
26. None of my buyers really wanted to accept that if they didn't place an
order on a Monday, by Tuesday, there'd be an upcharge. So I'm like, where's the
Wall Street Journal of supply chain? So I started this thing called sourcing journal.
(02:13):
Never did I think that it would have, you know, morphed into this
substantial business and a thorn in some of the more traditional media
publications out there. So I ended up selling that to Penske Media
Group, and, you know, they gave us such credibility. They
gave us, you know, obviously, a financial you know, a lot of credit that was
much needed. And, more importantly, they taught me really
(02:34):
about how some of these big media companies operate, especially on the b two b
side. I got exposed to the billboard and the varieties, etcetera, etcetera. And that
was really the inspiration. Like, okay. Every single industry
has their publication or record. I remember sitting in
Vegas. This is this is not owned by by Penske, but I was sitting
at at a table and, oh, what are you guys doing here? They were here
(02:56):
for a pizza conference. And there was, like, 10,000 pepperoni salesman.
And there was a pizza magazine and pizza this. I'm like, I'm
always looking for the white space. I'm looking for the underserved community that that
maybe, you know, maybe it's not the biggest the biggest
business necessarily, but it's but it's it's but it's real business, and and they're
looking for a home. And I just thought there was such a convergence between
(03:18):
technology, finance, fitness, wellness, all this stuff going on. And
the players that were out there at the time just weren't it's almost like
Tower Records. Right? Like, there were great businesses, but you can't sell
DVDs in the streaming market. And the market was moving to streaming, and everyone else
was selling DVDs. So okay. Let's let's create the, the, you
know, the I the iPod or iPad, whatever the hell it was
(03:41):
called. And and that was really it. I mean and the rest is history.
Yep. So she'd been doing this I mean, we we got on your radar screen
probably about two years ago. And I've know it kinda started
out, you know, you know, more as a as a newsletter.
And now you've kinda moved it into two events, and now you're kinda going big.
So could you just kinda highlight those points? Because I
(04:03):
think people sometimes start a business, and they kinda say, hey. Let
me go and do this event that we're gonna talk about that you're doing in
in, you know, in New York City with with some big hitters and
kinda reframing what the event should be and what people getting out of it.
But it was kinda nice to start here, you know, and then be able to
say, hey. You know who I am, and I'm gonna get to here.
(04:24):
Look. You know, overnight success, it could be ten years. You know? For the first
two years, I was emailing myself, and no one really cared about what I was
doing or who I was, but I saw a steady growth and growth and growth,
and people would, hey. Can you feature us? Hey. Can you write about us? Oh,
can we average? Woah. And so, you know, how many times I
wanted to give up on this thing? You know, I was I was a president
of a division. I had a great income, and I would go home at night
(04:46):
and and post stories and load them into Mailchimp. I was kinda going back to
the 26 year old self, you know, starting Yeah. Sourcing journal. And so
but it was it was progress compounds as long as I kept seeing that list
go up and the feedback increase. And then
I had to make a decision, and that's a very, very hard decision. And I
realized that, what do
(05:08):
they say? You can't dance at two weddings. Right? So so I knew that I
needed to go all in, and I knew that I had to not
not just have the a very clear vision of or the goal, but what was
I willing to sacrifice? So I knew that I was gonna take a couple years
of of of hardship necessarily before I would get to a place
where this would even be considered a business and not, you know, just a
just. And the last two years has really transfer trans
(05:32):
transformative. I mean, we started 02/20, what, '4 with 50,000
subscribers, ended the year with over a hundred thousand.
And I had the intention of doing an event in '24. And I will tell
you, I remember being out there looking at venues, and it was a movie. I
I think it was called Chasing Bobby Fischer or something like that.
Yep. And there was a line in the movie. Don't move it till you could
(05:53):
see it. Don't move it till you could see it. And I said, you know
what? I don't think we're ready yet. I don't have in my phone
50, a hundred CEOs that I could put on auto dial
or speed dial and say, hey. Do me a solid and come. And I and
I knew that I was gonna introduce an event to the market.
I wanted to solve the problem or solve
(06:16):
what the you hear the same feedback. Oh, there's the same speakers. There's too much
pay to play. There's not enough brands. There's too many vendors. The production
quality, outside voices. So if I'm gonna sit there and say, okay.
I can do that. I gotta make sure I could deliver on that. And I
thought it was better to wait, a year
or eighteen months and really get ready and then go all in
(06:37):
when I felt more comfortable. Although that meant there was revenue that I was leaving
on the table, events is a is a big part of the media company. It's
where a lot of media companies actually make it make make their their their money
for the year. But I said, let's keep building the reputation. Let's keep building
the name. One of the one of the things that I think a lot of
people do wrong in business in general is they call them the favors too
early. They overpromote too early,
(07:01):
and then you lose the you lose your customer's trust.
This is Pete Moore. I wanna let you in on a little secret. There's this
company called Promotion Vault, and what they do is they give out rewards from
retailers that allow you to incentivize your
members without having to do zero down and one month
(07:21):
free or giving away shakes or giving away T shirts. What
you wanna do is build a rewards program that lasts, that
people value, and that doesn't discount your own products and services.
So here's the deal. There's something called rewards vault. The rewards
vault is going to allow a member to set up their own profile.
They are going to answer questions. You are gonna get those answers. You're gonna be
(07:44):
able to target those members, and you're gonna reward them inside your
club, inside your spa, and outside of the club and outside
of the spa to get them to become loyal, to get them to pay
their monthly dues, and to be rewarded properly for
the actions. A lot of companies are cutting back on rewards. You shouldn't
be. Promotion Vault's your answer. Trust me. This is real.
(08:10):
So on some of the newsletters that you're putting out, you know,
you're featuring technology. You're talking about deals. There's
a financial component to it. Is is that distribution
of your, you know, audience right now, are they
consuming all components of it? Because this
industry somehow sometimes very siloed between, like, who the
(08:32):
executive is and, like, what information they actually know or care about or obviously should
know all of it. But Well, look. I think what we're doing today and what
what the vision I see for this in the future is gonna be slightly different.
Right now, you know, we have that that general news call or email that goes
out every single day. And
I think it's kind of the top stories that the industry kinda if you're an
(08:55):
executive across the board, probably about 50% of
that's gonna pertain to you. Obviously, some stories are gonna lean more to finance, are
gonna be loaned into training, or more into wellness. But if I'm an executive
running x, y, and z company, here is something that gives me enough
information to so that I can be intelligent, informed on
what's going on, and could speak to to the industry in the in the industry
(09:16):
news. Do I see a world where we have
newsletters catered to the CEO, the CTO, the CMO, the
the wellness executive, the longevity, the enthusiast. Absolutely. That
also allows you to get more more
granular in your content, but also from an advertising perspective, your advertisers
(09:37):
can now be more targeted and get exactly who they want. About
60% of who we currently have as subscribers are what I would say are the
owner and operators. You know? So that's the largest cohort.
Now, again, statistics are skewed, and you know this
better than anybody. What is there?
500 top m and a, PE
(09:59):
analysts in this space. So what percentage of my list can that be? It's gonna
be very small. So I do I think we are talking to them? Absolutely.
How is that going to be as a percentage when compared to
operators? It's gonna be smaller. Yeah. Sure. The service providers, the equipment companies,
all of that is changing. But I think what's interesting and what I'm seeing is
the nontraditional players are are starting to subscribe
(10:22):
and become part of the conversation. What I mean by that
is fitness is not just a full wall gym and a treadmill.
You know? There is, you know, like, we have
the head of, wellness at Chase Travel joining
us at our event. Travel now,
you know, twenty years ago when we we went on a vacation, is it in
(10:45):
a free buffet, and is there maybe a, you know, a pool? Now people
are really is is there a fitness facility? And a fitness facility
doesn't mean weights and a treadmill. People wanna know is there recovery options, you know,
what type of equipment do the gyms have. So now if you're in the hospitality
sector, you have to rethink what it means to be
to have fitness and wellness as an amenity. Is that a new generator? Is
(11:07):
that a cost center? Etcetera, etcetera. So but how do we bring
in the people that are making these decisions or hear the data on a day
to day basis? I always say that if you wanna talk about wellness trends, how
do we bring in some of the social media giants who are who have billions
of data points who really know what the Gen z's are searching for every single
day? Yeah. So I think that we're starting to see
(11:29):
non endemic players consume this content, which is really, really encouraging.
You're seeing innovation, happen at
at at large scale companies that never played in wellness per se.
These venture studios are popping up. So there's a lot of momentum, and we
have to almost I know you guys call it halo, and I and I and
I love that you guys are doing that because I don't think there is a
(11:52):
term that probably encompasses the
fitness, the wellness, the health, the longevity, the recovery. Exactly. I
mean, that's that's what happened basically eight years ago. I kept
telling people I'm a health and wellness banker, and I hated using the term wellness.
And I could I it's just I never get an awesome wellness idea that ever
hit my desk. Okay? Ever. And,
(12:14):
and I'm like, well, where's this word come from? You probably don't even know, but
I'll tell you now. So back in the fifties, there was a guy named doctor
Halbert Dunn who worked at the Mayo Clinic. He was a biostatistician.
He was looking at all the data, seeing that people get sick, and basically
came up with the antonym of illness. So if you're not sick,
you're okay. Right? That's basically what wellness means. Like, you're okay.
(12:36):
You're not sick. Right? Not very aspirational for anybody who works
in this industry such as you and we're passionate about getting people
results. So I literally woke up at 03:00 in the morning. I'm like, shit dude,
the word halo, the acronym health, active lifestyle, and outdoors.
Right? It kinda compasses a resort. Right? That's outdoor activity. I wanna
live an active lifestyle. Health. Alright. I gotta list data in science.
(12:58):
Well, it should be preventative health, not just like I mean, like, the sick
continuum of, like, how I might be able to get better. So we'd
love you to to to embrace the term. I'm going all in on it. Obviously,
I do a halo academy, which you know about. Mhmm. Got the halo talks. And
I'm trying to basically tell all these companies, you are part of the halo sector.
Now you have to jump in because everybody who is an enthusiast in
(13:20):
enthusiast in this industry is is is one of your potential, you
know, revenue streams, dispensable, you know, disposable income available,
and they travel. They're on the move all the time. So I appreciate you bringing
that up as it relates to, like, what you're doing and your broader vision.
I think it's very smart because I I think that that we're all struggling to
figure out, you know, how do we identify the sector? Because if you use fitness,
(13:42):
it's almost limiting, and it's almost has, like, a negative connotation. If you say health,
well, we're not talking about hip replacements and and dialysis.
You know? Right. So so what is the intersection of all this? And there's one
other thing I'll add, and and you'll probably appreciate this as as,
you know, as as a former banker is that what the
other major Or current or current, unfortunately. Current. Sorry. Unfortunately.
(14:06):
What I think was missing from most of the conversations that
I saw on the outside was there was no lack of
enthusiasm. There was no lack of ideas. There was no lack of passion
in this industry. There was a lack of
commentary and analysis on, which is what you guys do, on the deals that are
happening. So I'm always interested, like, okay. This is a good
(14:27):
product. Like, this this is not my favorite cup of
coffee, but Starbucks has has a pretty
sizable business. You know what I mean? Like, Schultz was able to really
take an idea and scale it globally. And people study this. These are these are
case studies. People wanna understand what separates this from from the
individual that has three or four locations and can't get back can't get past their
(14:49):
neighborhood coffee shop. What processes has he been able to place? What
challenges has they had? What when did they introduce food or things
and they stumble? You know, the music they they they put in the store, does
that have an impact on on the the the the the amount of money people
spend? There's there's a lot of of things behind the scenes, and what I
see is there's a lack of commentary on this. You know?
(15:11):
Caterton buys Solid Core. Great. Who's doing the analysis on what
was the EBITDA? Was this good? What does this mean for the rest of the
industry? Is this gonna mean things are gonna trade higher? Things are gonna trade lower?
What is Caterton's exit strategy on this? What is the growth strategy on this?
Any other industry, if GE did something or IBM did
something or or Macy's did something, we turn on CNBC, and they'd be pontificating
(15:33):
about these things for for hours and hours because this is a largely
publicly held, privately held, sorry, privately held
sector. We don't know very much, and that's why I'm partnering with and
this is gonna be, look, somewhat this you gotta be careful what you ask
for. This is what the industry is asking for, so I'm gonna deliver it.
Partnering with with with data companies, credit card companies,
(15:55):
companies that are pinging cell phone towers, we're gonna have a level of data now
that is gonna provide transparency into what are people
spending. So what what modalities are trending? What brands are trending?
Where are people spending their money? So there's gonna be less guessing
as to what's working and not working. We're gonna be able to provide that.
Some people are not gonna like that because they're able to hide it behind the
(16:17):
guys of, hey. I'm gonna tell you whatever I wanna tell you, and it's up
to you. So so, just rewind you for a
second here. I'm happy to to officially announce that I'm
available, as Integrity Square to provide you with these deal
summaries as under your hood of, like, tell me actually
not just like this company acquired this company and, like, you know,
(16:40):
this management team staying on. Like, tell me actually, like, give me the inner workings
of the deal. Like, how does it was this priced? You know, whether that's a
rumor or based on estimates. Tell me why they're doing the deal. Did they take
that financing out to do the deal? Are they looking to go public? And and
basically, like, take one of your reporters, and then I'll and team
up with us. And I'll give you, like, the metrics. Like, when does this thing
(17:00):
fall, you know, in in all the last years? You know, why somebody paying 11
times for a Planet Finish Area Developer when the last year was done at
eight and a half times? Like, well, they had a lot more territory. They had
a prototype generating next to a hundred and $50 of cash flow. And, you know,
it's in this market, not this market. So I'm happy to do that on
on record. And, you know, if we don't do it, we'll just edit it out
(17:21):
later. So big deal. No. But I I I I love that idea, and and
I think that's what we want more of. And I think that if if you
ask me what is what is ATM gonna look like in second half of twenty
five and and '26, it's more of that. I call it, you know, the ATM
Pro or the ATM Plus. It it it's providing that level of data
and that level of sophistication because I think that the industry is asking
(17:43):
me for it, and the industry wants it. So let's see.
Let's see if we provide it, how they consume it, and what they do with
it. This is
Pete Moore. Here's the last tip for you of the podcast.
We are partnered up with a company called Higher Dose, higher dose
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(18:04):
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(18:26):
up saturating your market, having your members walk out of the club and
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(18:48):
you augment your products and services to meet the demands of your
members. And, hey, let's get people happy, healthy,
and sweating, and the recovery should be just as good as the workout.
Okay. So in closing here, give us a little bit of, you know, high
level tops and waves on the event that's gonna happen, in New
(19:10):
York. You know, my team gets mad at me for for for
using terms like this, and it it's probably you always wanna be,
underselling, overdeliver, but I I have this vision. You know? It's
funny. I again, I'm I'm taking a lot of liberty here. Is
there there's, like, a famous quote or whatever. Disney, Walt took took his friend
into the forest and said, what do you see? What do you mean? What are
(19:33):
sassy trees? What are you seeing? He goes, I see the largest amusement park in
the world. I I kinda have this vision. It's so it's so clear in
my mind of, like, a Davos meets YPO
meets Sun Valley for this industry a a day. And we and
and and we teased it out a little bit in January at NASDAQ where
you saw CEOs sitting in the audience. You
(19:54):
saw big players on stage, everyone in a suit. You
saw no one's selling to each other, people communicating, you know,
and and staying there for nine hours throughout the day. And I'm like, okay.
This is a sophisticated audience that's learning from each other,
peer to peer networking, pre pre competitive collaboration, and they loved
it. So I have this vision of
(20:17):
bringing best speakers from around the world. Mhmm. Not just from
our our, as you would say, the halo industry, but from outside industry so we
all could learn. But being very, very intentional in how I
curate this this information because if people are gonna come
three, four, five people deep as an organization, what a founder wants, what a
CTO wants, what a CFO wants, what the head of franchising wants, what the head
(20:39):
of procurement wants is very different. So we're we're spending so much time to
ensure that we are programming content that's been aligned with all
that. Then we're gonna have our recovery lounge, which is part experiential
and also part a place where people are gonna do their meetings. Because,
hey, maybe you and I wanna sit down and, and
put on these compression boots and and talk for thirty minutes. Then we're gonna have
(21:01):
an expo. This is not to be confused with the trade show. This is not
a place where people are gonna be bringing, you know, tons and tons of product
discovery. You know, that's that's why HFA's and the FEMO's
exist. But innovation, let's bring the best product you have, or let's
let's this is your meeting place for the next two days, and we're gonna we're
gonna try to do everything we can to
(21:23):
this needs to be the CES. This needs to be once a year.
Everyone's like, this is where the the money
goes to to to congregate, to meet new concepts, to, you know,
to potentially meet potential, you know, to find investment opportunities.
This is where we go to learn. This is where people go to collaborate. This
is where I go to discover new products, meet with new vendors. People are
(21:46):
gonna be announcing. We have some proprietary research that's gonna be dropping. We're we're working
with major consulting firms on on some data. We're working with data firms on on
some stuff. My goal is that everyone as many people as possible use
this June data as hey. As just the way at
CES, they dropped something new there. People are gonna be dropping research and
announcements around this. I'm really trying to get everyone to come together and make
(22:08):
this, and it's bigger than us. Right? We're gonna have a lot of the moderators
or from other, from other media outlets. This is not just
about ATN. This is about bringing this entire industry up and
getting exposure, not do it through our platform or be a conduit to get
exposure for our industry and other platforms that maybe wouldn't be covering it.
And I think if we do that, what do they say? At
(22:29):
the top, you collaborate. At the bottom, you compete. So let let's think about
Yeah. Let let's think about collaboration. Yep. That's great.
We speak in our language and, and and appreciate you devoting your time
and efforts here because we think it's fruitful, and there's a clear
opportunity and frustrations that that have not been solved.
From a standpoint of us getting involved, just to our audience, we're gonna be at
(22:52):
the show, be sponsoring, one of the the programs there. Hopefully,
there's a a halo, you know, banner that people start to resonate as as
Ed's been referencing. You know, try to pull this together under one acronym that that
fits for everyone. Also, we should introduce you to higher dose, David, if
you can do that, to potentially be a sponsor. And also in the
recovery lounge, we've got, some things there and also a sponsor for you
(23:14):
guys, you know, longer term. And, you know, look forward to
collaborating with you here, and, I think it's big, and we're excited. So thanks for
coming on and, telling our audience what you guys are up to. No. I appreciate
it, man. It's it's, it it's exciting times, and, I appreciate
all your support. You
(23:38):
got it.
I am super excited to announce that we now have a formal partnership
with The Prospect Wizard. And when I say wizard, I
mean wizard. Obviously, you have a website. This
allows you to convert your website traffic visitors directly
into leads. It's not just another chatbot, and it's not AI, but
it allows a visitor to call, text, or leave a voice mail.
(00:23):
Immediately goes to you, your sales team, or anyone else in the club
instantly. MIT shows a study that if you contact the lead
within ten minutes, chance of them converting goes up nine times
that of the average. We got the Atlanta clubs on it, Vida
Fitness, Gold's Gym, Mountainside, City Fitness
Philly, College Park. Become one of the
(00:45):
next halo companies to deploy the wizard. It's easy to
use. Go to the prospectwizard.com. Get a free
thirty day trial. Talk to my boy, Dave Gallon. He will get you all set
up and let the leads flow based on the wizard.
Go get them.
This is Pete Moore at Hilo Talks NYC. I have the pleasure of bringing on
(01:07):
a fellow New Yorker, Upritty Snyder, Ed Hertzmann,
Athlete Tech News. We are partnering with them in several
fronts. We're really excited about where he's taking this because we're taking the
events, and we're basically putting it on legal steroids. So,
Ed, welcome to the Halo sector, and thanks for coming in. Thanks for
having me, Pete. Awesome. So, look, you worked in some other different
(01:29):
industries that have kind of pivoted here recently, which was a nice refreshing,
dose of, enthusiasm from our standpoint. So talk
about where you were before, what opportunities you you uncovered and
executed on, and why you said, hey. I should do this in the Halo sector.
So, you know, I was a supply chain guy. You know, I've told
this this this story a couple of times, and it's partly
(01:52):
serendipitous and part of it maybe just be at the right place at the right
time. But supply chain guy who went 02/2009, there was a cotton
crisis, and no one really knew what was going on. I was frustrated. I was
26. None of my buyers really wanted to accept that if they didn't place an
order on a Monday, by Tuesday, there'd be an upcharge. So I'm like, where's the
Wall Street Journal of supply chain? So I started this thing called sourcing journal.
(02:13):
Never did I think that it would have, you know, morphed into this
substantial business and a thorn in some of the more traditional media
publications out there. So I ended up selling that to Penske Media
Group, and, you know, they gave us such credibility. They
gave us, you know, obviously, a financial you know, a lot of credit that was
much needed. And, more importantly, they taught me really
(02:34):
about how some of these big media companies operate, especially on the b two b
side. I got exposed to the billboard and the varieties, etcetera, etcetera. And that
was really the inspiration. Like, okay. Every single industry
has their publication or record. I remember sitting in
Vegas. This is this is not owned by by Penske, but I was sitting
at at a table and, oh, what are you guys doing here? They were here
(02:56):
for a pizza conference. And there was, like, 10,000 pepperoni salesman.
And there was a pizza magazine and pizza this. I'm like, I'm
always looking for the white space. I'm looking for the underserved community that that
maybe, you know, maybe it's not the biggest the biggest
business necessarily, but it's but it's it's but it's real business, and and they're
looking for a home. And I just thought there was such a convergence between
(03:18):
technology, finance, fitness, wellness, all this stuff going on. And
the players that were out there at the time just weren't it's almost like
Tower Records. Right? Like, there were great businesses, but you can't sell
DVDs in the streaming market. And the market was moving to streaming, and everyone else
was selling DVDs. So okay. Let's let's create the, the, you
know, the I the iPod or iPad, whatever the hell it was
(03:41):
called. And and that was really it. I mean and the rest is history.
Yep. So she'd been doing this I mean, we we got on your radar screen
probably about two years ago. And I've know it kinda started
out, you know, you know, more as a as a newsletter.
And now you've kinda moved it into two events, and now you're kinda going big.
So could you just kinda highlight those points? Because I
(04:03):
think people sometimes start a business, and they kinda say, hey. Let
me go and do this event that we're gonna talk about that you're doing in
in, you know, in New York City with with some big hitters and
kinda reframing what the event should be and what people getting out of it.
But it was kinda nice to start here, you know, and then be able to
say, hey. You know who I am, and I'm gonna get to here.
(04:24):
Look. You know, overnight success, it could be ten years. You know? For the first
two years, I was emailing myself, and no one really cared about what I was
doing or who I was, but I saw a steady growth and growth and growth,
and people would, hey. Can you feature us? Hey. Can you write about us? Oh,
can we average? Woah. And so, you know, how many times I
wanted to give up on this thing? You know, I was I was a president
of a division. I had a great income, and I would go home at night
(04:46):
and and post stories and load them into Mailchimp. I was kinda going back to
the 26 year old self, you know, starting Yeah. Sourcing journal. And so
but it was it was progress compounds as long as I kept seeing that list
go up and the feedback increase. And then
I had to make a decision, and that's a very, very hard decision. And I
realized that, what do
(05:08):
they say? You can't dance at two weddings. Right? So so I knew that I
needed to go all in, and I knew that I had to not
not just have the a very clear vision of or the goal, but what was
I willing to sacrifice? So I knew that I was gonna take a couple years
of of of hardship necessarily before I would get to a place
where this would even be considered a business and not, you know, just a
just. And the last two years has really transfer trans
(05:32):
transformative. I mean, we started 02/20, what, '4 with 50,000
subscribers, ended the year with over a hundred thousand.
And I had the intention of doing an event in '24. And I will tell
you, I remember being out there looking at venues, and it was a movie. I
I think it was called Chasing Bobby Fischer or something like that.
Yep. And there was a line in the movie. Don't move it till you could
(05:53):
see it. Don't move it till you could see it. And I said, you know
what? I don't think we're ready yet. I don't have in my phone
50, a hundred CEOs that I could put on auto dial
or speed dial and say, hey. Do me a solid and come. And I and
I knew that I was gonna introduce an event to the market.
I wanted to solve the problem or solve
(06:16):
what the you hear the same feedback. Oh, there's the same speakers. There's too much
pay to play. There's not enough brands. There's too many vendors. The production
quality, outside voices. So if I'm gonna sit there and say, okay.
I can do that. I gotta make sure I could deliver on that. And I
thought it was better to wait, a year
or eighteen months and really get ready and then go all in
(06:37):
when I felt more comfortable. Although that meant there was revenue that I was leaving
on the table, events is a is a big part of the media company. It's
where a lot of media companies actually make it make make their their their money
for the year. But I said, let's keep building the reputation. Let's keep building
the name. One of the one of the things that I think a lot of
people do wrong in business in general is they call them the favors too
early. They overpromote too early,
(07:01):
and then you lose the you lose your customer's trust.
This is Pete Moore. I wanna let you in on a little secret. There's this
company called Promotion Vault, and what they do is they give out rewards from
retailers that allow you to incentivize your
members without having to do zero down and one month
(07:21):
free or giving away shakes or giving away T shirts. What
you wanna do is build a rewards program that lasts, that
people value, and that doesn't discount your own products and services.
So here's the deal. There's something called rewards vault. The rewards
vault is going to allow a member to set up their own profile.
They are going to answer questions. You are gonna get those answers. You're gonna be
(07:44):
able to target those members, and you're gonna reward them inside your
club, inside your spa, and outside of the club and outside
of the spa to get them to become loyal, to get them to pay
their monthly dues, and to be rewarded properly for
the actions. A lot of companies are cutting back on rewards. You shouldn't
be. Promotion Vault's your answer. Trust me. This is real.
(08:10):
So on some of the newsletters that you're putting out, you know,
you're featuring technology. You're talking about deals. There's
a financial component to it. Is is that distribution
of your, you know, audience right now, are they
consuming all components of it? Because this
industry somehow sometimes very siloed between, like, who the
(08:32):
executive is and, like, what information they actually know or care about or obviously should
know all of it. But Well, look. I think what we're doing today and what
what the vision I see for this in the future is gonna be slightly different.
Right now, you know, we have that that general news call or email that goes
out every single day. And
I think it's kind of the top stories that the industry kinda if you're an
(08:55):
executive across the board, probably about 50% of
that's gonna pertain to you. Obviously, some stories are gonna lean more to finance, are
gonna be loaned into training, or more into wellness. But if I'm an executive
running x, y, and z company, here is something that gives me enough
information to so that I can be intelligent, informed on
what's going on, and could speak to to the industry in the in the industry
(09:16):
news. Do I see a world where we have
newsletters catered to the CEO, the CTO, the CMO, the
the wellness executive, the longevity, the enthusiast. Absolutely. That
also allows you to get more more
granular in your content, but also from an advertising perspective, your advertisers
(09:37):
can now be more targeted and get exactly who they want. About
60% of who we currently have as subscribers are what I would say are the
owner and operators. You know? So that's the largest cohort.
Now, again, statistics are skewed, and you know this
better than anybody. What is there?
500 top m and a, PE
(09:59):
analysts in this space. So what percentage of my list can that be? It's gonna
be very small. So I do I think we are talking to them? Absolutely.
How is that going to be as a percentage when compared to
operators? It's gonna be smaller. Yeah. Sure. The service providers, the equipment companies,
all of that is changing. But I think what's interesting and what I'm seeing is
the nontraditional players are are starting to subscribe
(10:22):
and become part of the conversation. What I mean by that
is fitness is not just a full wall gym and a treadmill.
You know? There is, you know, like, we have
the head of, wellness at Chase Travel joining
us at our event. Travel now,
you know, twenty years ago when we we went on a vacation, is it in
(10:45):
a free buffet, and is there maybe a, you know, a pool? Now people
are really is is there a fitness facility? And a fitness facility
doesn't mean weights and a treadmill. People wanna know is there recovery options, you know,
what type of equipment do the gyms have. So now if you're in the hospitality
sector, you have to rethink what it means to be
to have fitness and wellness as an amenity. Is that a new generator? Is
(11:07):
that a cost center? Etcetera, etcetera. So but how do we bring
in the people that are making these decisions or hear the data on a day
to day basis? I always say that if you wanna talk about wellness trends, how
do we bring in some of the social media giants who are who have billions
of data points who really know what the Gen z's are searching for every single
day? Yeah. So I think that we're starting to see
(11:29):
non endemic players consume this content, which is really, really encouraging.
You're seeing innovation, happen at
at at large scale companies that never played in wellness per se.
These venture studios are popping up. So there's a lot of momentum, and we
have to almost I know you guys call it halo, and I and I and
I love that you guys are doing that because I don't think there is a
(11:52):
term that probably encompasses the
fitness, the wellness, the health, the longevity, the recovery. Exactly. I
mean, that's that's what happened basically eight years ago. I kept
telling people I'm a health and wellness banker, and I hated using the term wellness.
And I could I it's just I never get an awesome wellness idea that ever
hit my desk. Okay? Ever. And,
(12:14):
and I'm like, well, where's this word come from? You probably don't even know, but
I'll tell you now. So back in the fifties, there was a guy named doctor
Halbert Dunn who worked at the Mayo Clinic. He was a biostatistician.
He was looking at all the data, seeing that people get sick, and basically
came up with the antonym of illness. So if you're not sick,
you're okay. Right? That's basically what wellness means. Like, you're okay.
(12:36):
You're not sick. Right? Not very aspirational for anybody who works
in this industry such as you and we're passionate about getting people
results. So I literally woke up at 03:00 in the morning. I'm like, shit dude,
the word halo, the acronym health, active lifestyle, and outdoors.
Right? It kinda compasses a resort. Right? That's outdoor activity. I wanna
live an active lifestyle. Health. Alright. I gotta list data in science.
(12:58):
Well, it should be preventative health, not just like I mean, like, the sick
continuum of, like, how I might be able to get better. So we'd
love you to to to embrace the term. I'm going all in on it. Obviously,
I do a halo academy, which you know about. Mhmm. Got the halo talks. And
I'm trying to basically tell all these companies, you are part of the halo sector.
Now you have to jump in because everybody who is an enthusiast in
(13:20):
enthusiast in this industry is is is one of your potential, you
know, revenue streams, dispensable, you know, disposable income available,
and they travel. They're on the move all the time. So I appreciate you bringing
that up as it relates to, like, what you're doing and your broader vision.
I think it's very smart because I I think that that we're all struggling to
figure out, you know, how do we identify the sector? Because if you use fitness,
(13:42):
it's almost limiting, and it's almost has, like, a negative connotation. If you say health,
well, we're not talking about hip replacements and and dialysis.
You know? Right. So so what is the intersection of all this? And there's one
other thing I'll add, and and you'll probably appreciate this as as,
you know, as as a former banker is that what the
other major Or current or current, unfortunately. Current. Sorry. Unfortunately.
(14:06):
What I think was missing from most of the conversations that
I saw on the outside was there was no lack of
enthusiasm. There was no lack of ideas. There was no lack of passion
in this industry. There was a lack of
commentary and analysis on, which is what you guys do, on the deals that are
happening. So I'm always interested, like, okay. This is a good
(14:27):
product. Like, this this is not my favorite cup of
coffee, but Starbucks has has a pretty
sizable business. You know what I mean? Like, Schultz was able to really
take an idea and scale it globally. And people study this. These are these are
case studies. People wanna understand what separates this from from the
individual that has three or four locations and can't get back can't get past their
(14:49):
neighborhood coffee shop. What processes has he been able to place? What
challenges has they had? What when did they introduce food or things
and they stumble? You know, the music they they they put in the store, does
that have an impact on on the the the the the amount of money people
spend? There's there's a lot of of things behind the scenes, and what I
see is there's a lack of commentary on this. You know?
(15:11):
Caterton buys Solid Core. Great. Who's doing the analysis on what
was the EBITDA? Was this good? What does this mean for the rest of the
industry? Is this gonna mean things are gonna trade higher? Things are gonna trade lower?
What is Caterton's exit strategy on this? What is the growth strategy on this?
Any other industry, if GE did something or IBM did
something or or Macy's did something, we turn on CNBC, and they'd be pontificating
(15:33):
about these things for for hours and hours because this is a largely
publicly held, privately held, sorry, privately held
sector. We don't know very much, and that's why I'm partnering with and
this is gonna be, look, somewhat this you gotta be careful what you ask
for. This is what the industry is asking for, so I'm gonna deliver it.
Partnering with with with data companies, credit card companies,
(15:55):
companies that are pinging cell phone towers, we're gonna have a level of data now
that is gonna provide transparency into what are people
spending. So what what modalities are trending? What brands are trending?
Where are people spending their money? So there's gonna be less guessing
as to what's working and not working. We're gonna be able to provide that.
Some people are not gonna like that because they're able to hide it behind the
(16:17):
guys of, hey. I'm gonna tell you whatever I wanna tell you, and it's up
to you. So so, just rewind you for a
second here. I'm happy to to officially announce that I'm
available, as Integrity Square to provide you with these deal
summaries as under your hood of, like, tell me actually
not just like this company acquired this company and, like, you know,
(16:40):
this management team staying on. Like, tell me actually, like, give me the inner workings
of the deal. Like, how does it was this priced? You know, whether that's a
rumor or based on estimates. Tell me why they're doing the deal. Did they take
that financing out to do the deal? Are they looking to go public? And and
basically, like, take one of your reporters, and then I'll and team
up with us. And I'll give you, like, the metrics. Like, when does this thing
(17:00):
fall, you know, in in all the last years? You know, why somebody paying 11
times for a Planet Finish Area Developer when the last year was done at
eight and a half times? Like, well, they had a lot more territory. They had
a prototype generating next to a hundred and $50 of cash flow. And, you know,
it's in this market, not this market. So I'm happy to do that on
on record. And, you know, if we don't do it, we'll just edit it out
(17:21):
later. So big deal. No. But I I I I love that idea, and and
I think that's what we want more of. And I think that if if you
ask me what is what is ATM gonna look like in second half of twenty
five and and '26, it's more of that. I call it, you know, the ATM
Pro or the ATM Plus. It it it's providing that level of data
and that level of sophistication because I think that the industry is asking
(17:43):
me for it, and the industry wants it. So let's see.
Let's see if we provide it, how they consume it, and what they do with
it. This is
Pete Moore. Here's the last tip for you of the podcast.
We are partnered up with a company called Higher Dose, higher dose
dot com. They are the leader in workout
(18:04):
recovery products, infrared technology, LED
light masks, neck enhancers, and other
products such as PEMF mats and sauna blankets.
If you have not gotten on the workout recovery train
yet, your time and your stop is now. You gotta
get these products in there before these workout recovery and spas end
(18:26):
up saturating your market, having your members walk out of the club and
going into one of their locations for $200 per
month where they're paying 39 to you. Let's become an
expert in workout recovery if we are already the authority in
workouts. Higher dose, check it out, is a
wholesale code, and we look forward to helping
(18:48):
you augment your products and services to meet the demands of your
members. And, hey, let's get people happy, healthy,
and sweating, and the recovery should be just as good as the workout.
Okay. So in closing here, give us a little bit of, you know, high
level tops and waves on the event that's gonna happen, in New
(19:10):
York. You know, my team gets mad at me for for for
using terms like this, and it it's probably you always wanna be,
underselling, overdeliver, but I I have this vision. You know? It's
funny. I again, I'm I'm taking a lot of liberty here. Is
there there's, like, a famous quote or whatever. Disney, Walt took took his friend
into the forest and said, what do you see? What do you mean? What are
(19:33):
sassy trees? What are you seeing? He goes, I see the largest amusement park in
the world. I I kinda have this vision. It's so it's so clear in
my mind of, like, a Davos meets YPO
meets Sun Valley for this industry a a day. And we and
and and we teased it out a little bit in January at NASDAQ where
you saw CEOs sitting in the audience. You
(19:54):
saw big players on stage, everyone in a suit. You
saw no one's selling to each other, people communicating, you know,
and and staying there for nine hours throughout the day. And I'm like, okay.
This is a sophisticated audience that's learning from each other,
peer to peer networking, pre pre competitive collaboration, and they loved
it. So I have this vision of
(20:17):
bringing best speakers from around the world. Mhmm. Not just from
our our, as you would say, the halo industry, but from outside industry so we
all could learn. But being very, very intentional in how I
curate this this information because if people are gonna come
three, four, five people deep as an organization, what a founder wants, what a
CTO wants, what a CFO wants, what the head of franchising wants, what the head
(20:39):
of procurement wants is very different. So we're we're spending so much time to
ensure that we are programming content that's been aligned with all
that. Then we're gonna have our recovery lounge, which is part experiential
and also part a place where people are gonna do their meetings. Because,
hey, maybe you and I wanna sit down and, and
put on these compression boots and and talk for thirty minutes. Then we're gonna have
(21:01):
an expo. This is not to be confused with the trade show. This is not
a place where people are gonna be bringing, you know, tons and tons of product
discovery. You know, that's that's why HFA's and the FEMO's
exist. But innovation, let's bring the best product you have, or let's
let's this is your meeting place for the next two days, and we're gonna we're
gonna try to do everything we can to
(21:23):
this needs to be the CES. This needs to be once a year.
Everyone's like, this is where the the money
goes to to to congregate, to meet new concepts, to, you know,
to potentially meet potential, you know, to find investment opportunities.
This is where we go to learn. This is where people go to collaborate. This
is where I go to discover new products, meet with new vendors. People are
(21:46):
gonna be announcing. We have some proprietary research that's gonna be dropping. We're we're working
with major consulting firms on on some data. We're working with data firms on on
some stuff. My goal is that everyone as many people as possible use
this June data as hey. As just the way at
CES, they dropped something new there. People are gonna be dropping research and
announcements around this. I'm really trying to get everyone to come together and make
(22:08):
this, and it's bigger than us. Right? We're gonna have a lot of the moderators
or from other, from other media outlets. This is not just
about ATN. This is about bringing this entire industry up and
getting exposure, not do it through our platform or be a conduit to get
exposure for our industry and other platforms that maybe wouldn't be covering it.
And I think if we do that, what do they say? At
(22:29):
the top, you collaborate. At the bottom, you compete. So let let's think about
Yeah. Let let's think about collaboration. Yep. That's great.
We speak in our language and, and and appreciate you devoting your time
and efforts here because we think it's fruitful, and there's a clear
opportunity and frustrations that that have not been solved.
From a standpoint of us getting involved, just to our audience, we're gonna be at
(22:52):
the show, be sponsoring, one of the the programs there. Hopefully,
there's a a halo, you know, banner that people start to resonate as as
Ed's been referencing. You know, try to pull this together under one acronym that that
fits for everyone. Also, we should introduce you to higher dose, David, if
you can do that, to potentially be a sponsor. And also in the
recovery lounge, we've got, some things there and also a sponsor for you
(23:14):
guys, you know, longer term. And, you know, look forward to
collaborating with you here, and, I think it's big, and we're excited. So thanks for
coming on and, telling our audience what you guys are up to. No. I appreciate
it, man. It's it's, it it's exciting times, and, I appreciate
all your support. You
(23:38):
got it.
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