August 28, 2024 • 51 mins
Sandra's journey to healing through running began at the age of 43, driven by a desire to break free from the childhood limitations imposed by her body size. Viewing her running journey as a powerful tool for healing and self-discovery, Sandra found solace in the rhythm of her strides, even during challenges like her daughter's graduation during Covid and ongoing home renovations. Her transformation from self-loathing to self-love culminated in completing six marathons and countless races, proudly identifying as a plus-sized runner and inspiring thousands on Instagram. Through her fitness magazine for unconventional athletes, Sandra demonstrates the importance of self-acceptance and resilience, advocating for generational healing and the power of community support in overcoming personal struggles.
Key Takeaways:
- Self-love and self-worth are more important than physical appearance in Sandra's journey. - Commitment to daily running helped Sandra build trust in herself and break free from self-loathing. - Community support is crucial in dealing with personal struggles and developing resilience. - Using visceral experiences like running can help process emotions and overcome internal struggles. - Courage is about facing fear head-on, as shown in Sandra's journey. - Demonstrating self-care and self-love sets a positive example for future generations. - Self-acceptance, individuality, and prioritizing self-perception over external opinions are key for well-being and influencing future generations.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
I'm Makini Smith. After going through a divorce, my
sister passing away, experiencing narcissistic abuse and some significant
health scares, I realized through sharing my story that
I wasn't alone in my suffering. Suffering subjective distress
generated by the experience of being out of balance
in a deep dive to holistically heal mind, body
(00:21):
and soul is where I discovered peace, clarity and
connection. It is impossible to be truly wise without
some real life hardship, and we cannot develop post
traumatic wisdom without making it through, and most importantly,
through it together. Social connection builds resilience, and resilience
(00:43):
helps create post traumatic wisdom, and that wisdom leads
to hope. Hope for you and others witnessing and
participating in your healing and hope for your community.
A healthy community is a healing community. And a
healing community is full of hope because it has
seen its own people weather, survive and thrive. At
(01:23):
43 years old, Sandra Mukulik decided to lace up
and start running. She's run six marathons and 250
kilometer races in six years and started a five
kilometer streak on January 1 of 2019 that has
helped her to heal trauma and self loathing. Sandra
is a self proclaimed plus sized runner and now
(01:47):
magazine publisher of the first ever fitness magazine for
the unconventional athlete. And she's not shy to talk
about her 260 pound size body. And also, she
helps inspire thousands of women on Instagram to move
in the body that they have today and not
wait for a thinner body tomorrow. So please welcome
(02:08):
to the show Sandra McCulich.
Thank you McKinney. Thanks for having me.
Thank you for saying yes and agreeing to come
on and share your healing journey with us.
It's my pleasure, honestly. And thank you for having
me in this space that you've created over the
last six years. I'm honored to be able to
(02:29):
share this platform with you today, and let's just
get into it. I can't wait.
Yes. Yes. So I usually like to start the
show by going back to your childhood before we
get to where you are presently, just so we
can understand better, because we all know our present
day behaviors and trauma responses and all the things
(02:52):
that we do are very connected to our childhood,
our childhood wounds, childhood traumas, any of the things
that we experience as a child, our childhood conditioning.
So I would love to know, you know, before
society tried to limit you or tell you who
or what you should be, you know, when our
imaginations were vivid and running wild, who did Sandra
(03:14):
want to be as a child?
Oh my God. I've never been asked this question
and it's such a good question. Wow. Sandra, little
Sandra, wanted to be free as possible without any
limitations set on her, based on her body size.
(03:36):
She wanted to play outside, run wild. She wanted
to be told that she is worthy, just as
she is and not worthy if she became this
or if she looked like this. And that's who.
(03:59):
That's who Sandra really is. And I think that's
why I love running so much, is because it
reminds me of the little girl who didn't get
to play in the mountains or in the trails
or outside freely.
Wow. I love that. And that is so powerful.
(04:20):
It's interesting how the things we didn't get to
do as children, how doing them as adults helps
heal those childhood wounds, helps hug that little girl
inside to let her know it's okay to do
those things and be all those things that she
wanted to be. So I would love if you
(04:41):
could share with the listeners how you even got
into running. I know it's been about six years
since both of our lives were transformed, so I
would love if you could share that with the
listeners.
Yeah. That is so serendipitous that both our journeys
started six years ago. And so I was not
born in Canada. I was born in Croatia, actually.
(05:04):
Not Croatia. Bosnia Herzegovina. I just say it's Croatia.
Cause it's just next door, and most people don't
know Bosnia Herzegovina.
And then I came here when I was six
years old, so my parents didn't speak any English
and were immigrant parents and did not let me
go outside very much at all. And if I
did, I had to bring my little sister and
babysit her and watch her. And I apologized to
(05:27):
her for maybe flipping her upside down to show
off friends because that was the only way that
I could maybe get attention is by.
So, anyways, that's. That's another story. My poor little
sister. But so, you know, my parents wanting to
hide us or not allow us to be as
free as children, you know, who were 6789 years
(05:51):
old, should have been free at that age, I
think, really set the tone for what the rest
of my life was going to look like until
I put it back into my own hands. So,
also, I'm a 511. Just to kind of give
a description of me, I'm a 511 woman right
(06:13):
now and 260 pounds.
And when I was little, I was not overweight.
I was just a normal sized kid, big boned,
but I was normal sized. I don't know. Like,
I just. You know. But my mom thought that
I was looking too big. So probably from the
(06:37):
age of, I want to say ten to twelve,
probably twelve years old when she took me to
the bay. And we had to go into the
women's section because I had to get a confirmation
dress because it was my confirmation, and she was
so upset because she had to buy the woman
sized dresses instead of the children's dresses.
(06:59):
So that's kind of when it all started. And
probably from that point on, I played sports in
school, but as a young adult, I would use
exercise as a way to try and control my
weight. So I was always kind of active. I
played basketball. I ran. I did track. I can't
(07:22):
say I ran. It was, like, slow. I was,
like, pulling a hamstring and trying to run as
fast as the other kid because tall, you know,
tall girls didn't do the 200 meters sprints. It
was painful. I did shopwood and discus and that.
But, you know, there was always, like, a bit
(07:44):
of athleticism in me. And then after I had.
I have four children, and after I had each
of the children, I remember there was a phase
where I was like, okay, I gotta go and
work out now because I gotta lose all this
baby fat.
And it was just always there, like, pecking at
me like a. Like a woodpecker. Like this notion
(08:06):
of, okay, you have to. You have to get
yourself in order and, you know, blah, blah, blah.
But the other thing that happened after having the
children was postpartum was pretty severe. And I had
really severe anxiety, like, to the point where it
would ruin. It would ruin relationships because of.
(08:27):
My thoughts were so obsessive that I had to
go on medication after consultation with some doctors. And
it was the best decision I ever made was
to. And I've been on this medication for nine
years, anxiety medicine. So, anyways, fast forward. I bought
this treadmill when I was 42 in the fall,
(08:50):
put it downstairs in our basement, and I use
the treadmill as a warm up to do the
YouTube videos in the basement. And then what I.
What ended up happening was I started spending more
and more time on this treadmill. So I would
look at YouTube videos and I was. I would
watch documentaries. So around October 2017 was when I
(09:11):
bought the treadmill. And March 18, 2018, was the
very first run I went outside on in the
trails since high school.
Wow.
I swear to you, I came back a different
person. It was a seven kilometer run. I went
(09:33):
out three and a half, came back three and
a half. I don't know what happened, but I
was like, oh, my God, they sign me up
for the Olympics. And, you know, I don't know
if you see any, like, videos where it's, like,
what I think I look like and then what
(09:53):
I look like. Videos.
Yeah. Yeah.
It's so true. It's what we think we look
like. And did you see, like, the. The person
shuffling along? Yes. That was. That was me. And
that was it. March after that run, I signed
up for five local races. Wow. And when you
(10:16):
have. When you're an all or nothing person, probably
like, right?
Yep.
You have a podcast. You didn't just dabble into
podcasting. You have a mega podcast. Right? So we're
an all or nothing person. You just go all
in, and you only look later to see if
you've hurt yourself along the way. You just keep
(10:39):
going. You're running through the wall. And that's literally
what happened. And in 2018, I decided, you know
what? I'm going to do a marathon. So I
did my first marathon in 2018, and I've done
one ever since then, so that's six years. And
there's something in the running community called a streak.
And so I had decided. So this ties into
(11:04):
my trauma work. So I saw this streak thing,
and I was like, oh. So a streak is
defined by runners running World magazine as a 1
mile run every single day. And I was like,
okay, I don't feel like running every day. Like,
even if it's a mile, I'm not committed to
that. Like, no, yeah. What I did commit to
(11:28):
was a five kilometer every day, because I'm like,
no, I'm not doing a 1 mile every day,
but I'll do a five kilometer walk or run.
Run or walk every day, even if I'm sick.
So I have been sick a couple of times,
and let me tell you that. Let me. Let
me show you how slow you can walk. If
you had to walk, I've done it, and you
(11:51):
still get your five k in. And so that
was January 1, 2019, was when I started my
five kilometer streak, and it's. And I'm going to
hit day 2000 on June 23.
Wow.
Yeah.
Wow.
It's changed my life, as you know. It hasn't
(12:15):
changed the physical structure of me, but it's changed
the physical structure of my brain. I haven't lost
any weight, but I've lost self loathing. I've lost
feeling low self worth. I've lost all the negativity.
I've lost the self defamating self. I can't remember
(12:44):
that word. Thoughts?
Yeah.
It'S at the tip of my tongue, but, yes.
So those are all the things that I've lost,
but not the weight, because I just am not
in a calorie deficit. And that's still one of
the puzzles that I'm not in a hurry to
(13:08):
solve, because a lot of people are like, you
run so much or you do so much activity,
why haven't you lost weight? Well, because I haven't
wanted to. I haven't gone into a calorie deficit.
I'm in a maintaining stage. I maintain really well,
(13:30):
I'm good at maintaining.
I've maintained this physique, consistency.
Ask me all about maintaining, I'll tell you.
That speaks to your consistency. Okay.
Exactly. See, I knew you'd appreciate that. Some trolls
(13:51):
don't appreciate that on the Internet.
Don't get me started with the trolls. That's their
own self loathing, that's their own, uh, self doubt,
their own insecurities. Things that they need to work
on. Most definitely. Um, so much that you said
there that I want to unpack. Um, I want
to start with the, you know, after you had
(14:14):
each child and you feeling like you needed to
lose the baby weight, and dealing with postpartum, all
of that in itself is a lot of pressure.
I have three kids. I get it. And for
any woman who is presently listening, going through that,
because there are some young women in my DM's
experiencing postpartum right now, and, you know, they're reaching
(14:36):
out because my daughter just had a baby. Well,
she's almost eight months now, but, you know, feeling
like they need someone to share those experiences with
the heaviness, the emotions, all those things. If you
could just share some of the things that helped
you get through that, and then we'll get into
the running part.
(15:00):
When there were thoughts in my head that somebody
was gonna climb through the window of the. The
place where we were living, and I was living
right next door to my parents, and they had
a duplex, and my husband was working out of
town for ten years. And the thought that I
(15:23):
had was that my dad wasn't going to be
able to hear me scream. And so I didn't
know which kid to save. And it was impossible
to get to sleep. Impossible to get to sleep
at night. And this was especially after my fourth
one, when I had my daughter, because I have
(15:43):
three boys and a girl. That was the worst
postpartum that I had. And I'm wondering if it's
because she's a female and I'm a female, and
the chromosomes, like, I'm just, you know, that's just
my grade nine science brain. I don't know. But
when I had my. And then the last one.
(16:05):
The last one. Also probably because my husband was
away, he would work two weeks away and come
home, uh, you know, for five days or something
like that. I just knew I needed help, and
I went to my doctor, and she's like, oh.
And we were living in Burnaby, BC, at the
time, and she's like, oh, there's a. There's a
(16:26):
postpartum. There's a postpartum group that I can get.
You signed up to. And I was like, oh,
my God, yes, please. And that's when I met
a female doctor who was a specialist in postpartum.
And then she ended up taking me on as
a patient and took probably a few months to
(16:50):
actually diagnose me and then give me this medicine,
which is one of the oldest kinds of anxiety
medicines. It's not just one of those ones the
doctor pulls out of his pocket, like, wellbutrin excel
or some shit like that. And it's like, here,
try this. And it's like, you don't. You. You
had a five minute conversation with me. Um, so
(17:10):
after I spoke to her, I realized that thank.
Like, I just realized that I'm not crazy. Like,
I'm not. There's nothing wrong with me. My. Whatever
it is, my nervous system or my brain cells,
they're just not. Something is. There's a short there,
(17:31):
and it just made me feel relieved, because all
these years, I had been so hard on myself,
thinking, I am a horrible mother. I do feel
like I was completely different with my first two
firstborns than I was with the last two. And,
(17:52):
you know, I'll never be able to change that.
And I've apologized to them many, many times, and.
And I try to, you know, make up for
it now, and. But the more you show your
children that mistakes are inevitable, it's how we bounce
(18:12):
back from the stakes, that's it. From the mistakes
that shows your true character. It's not how much
you hide your mistakes from people or how strong
you can look in the face of those mistakes.
It's how you react to them. That's the most
important thing, and that's one of the things I
want them to remember about me, is that.
(18:36):
There'S so much you said there that I wanted
to highlight. One in terms of dealing with the
postpartum and having someone confirm or validate for you
that you're not crazy. Definitely needed to the group
where it's community. We talked about this before we
(18:58):
started recording. We heal best in community. So that
community, the social proofing helped to validate. These are
real feelings. I'm not crazy. This is not a
one off, all those things. So I want the
women that are listening, you know, to highlight those
points where, one, you need someone who makes you
(19:19):
feel seen, heard, and understood, and two, that sense
of community, because that's a huge pillar in our
ability to be resilient. But also, when you spoke
about your children, I can completely relate. So each
one of our children will experience a different part
of us based on where we are in that
(19:39):
moment in time. And the. I. I feel like
for me personally, because my deepest healing is happening
now. My youngest child is getting the best version
of me, the aware version of me, the healed
version of me. Whereas, like you said, you apologize
to the previous children and you try to make
(20:00):
up for certain things, but at the end of
the day, we were doing the best we could
then with the tools and the knowledge that we
had at that time. But knowing now that you
can't change the past, you can apologize for what
you've done, and you're now doing differently. It's up
to them now, at this point, for them to
accept that and to also do their own healing.
(20:22):
Because no matter how hard we try as a
parent, like, there's no. There's no rulebook for parenting,
because every child is different. So no matter how
hard we try as a parent, we are going
to make mistakes. We're human. We're human beings. We
are not. We're not perfect. And even if one
(20:42):
thing worked perfectly for one child, it may completely
do the opposite for the other child. Right. So
we have to be able to give ourselves some
grace and be gentle with ourselves on our own
healing journey, because children are brutal. We can be.
No, it's like, it's not even. You know, it's
not even that. It's not even that children are
(21:05):
brutal. Honestly, I think you bring a child into
this world, and that child is fucking pure magic.
They are pure innocence and pure bliss. And then
you put that child in society.
Yes.
Society is what's poisonous. Yes, children are. They are.
(21:29):
Oh, I even look at. I even. I don't
know if Marina's gonna listen to this, but I.
I have a very strong connection to Marina's baby,
who is now nine months. Really strong connection to
her. And it's probably my future grandma kind of
connection coming out as a predicament of what I
(21:52):
will be like as a grandma. And I feel.
I feel sorry for my kids who might have
children as a precursor to what I will be
like, because I now understand why some grandparents are
the way they are, because you're wanting to make
up for. You're wanting to make up for, you
(22:14):
know, lost time. But I'll give you another example
of how so my daughter is half the size
of me, less. She's 511, and she's probably 120
pounds. So if I could have birthed the perfect
model looking kid, it was her. But I guarantee
(22:36):
you that she had a worse high school experience
than I ever did because of the way that
society is today.
Yes.
You know, sure, I got called Butch and, you
know, names here and there, but she was, like,
(22:57):
ostracized and, like girls would. And especially now with
social media, they don't just leave it at school.
It's like, oh, no. And then we're gonna create,
like, a page. So, you know, this society makes.
(23:18):
Makes children have really, really challenging atmospheres to try
to be children in. They really do. They have
no chance. These kids. They have no chance.
Yeah. I was listening to, I think it was
a Jay Shetty episode, and he was talking about
(23:38):
how today we consume more. More information in, like,
a month than, like, 25 years ago that they
experienced in their entire lifetime. Right? So our children,
like, there are some people who may not be
aware or don't, I guess, care about mental health
(24:01):
or any of those things to understand. Like, they
are overwhelmed. All of the mental health struggles that
these kids are having, the depression, the anxiety, like,
all of these things, they have every right to
be overwhelmed. There was a point I could say
maybe, I don't know, ten years ago where I
didn't understand as before I started my heavy healing.
But I get it now. Where the pressures that
(24:23):
they have today are so much more intense than
the pressures that we had because of social media,
because of technology, because of, you know, all of
the access that they have to things or how
far they can spread things, how quickly they can
spread things, how things can go viral. So the
pressures that our kids have today are so different
(24:45):
than, you know, what we had or what. In
the days when people were living out in the
wilderness and they were trying to survive because of
wild animals, the stress levels are very intense for
our young people. So I get. Society can be
very cruel, but also, I wanted to, I guess,
(25:09):
also bring it back to your. Your running journey
and. Yeah, you know, because you're talking about, you
know, we're talking about trolls, but we're also talking
about, like, you. You lost the self loathing. You
lost the, you know, all the negative self talk.
You lost all of those things. But then you
mentioned that you didn't lose any weight. And I
(25:32):
personally don't think there's anything wrong with that. I
feel like I, you are who you are supposed
to be right now, but they're because of social
media, because of society, because of the negativity or
the, the work that other people have to do,
the projections that they may put onto you. Like,
I guess, how have you handled dealing with that?
(25:57):
Yeah, that's so I think the first thing that
for some people when they see me, for some
trolls, when they've seen me, is my stance that
I've taken on accepting myself conflicts with the premonition
that they were fed as a, whether it's a
(26:20):
household or society that if you exercise, you should
lose weight, or some people you should lose weight,
therefore you should start exercising. So my stance that
I've taken conflicts with, that there are some people
who are really freaking close minded. So they're like
all over it. I just want to give you
(26:41):
my opinion and, well, okay.
Thanks, Bob.
Thanks, Karen. Yeah, thanks. You know what? Thanks for
that comment because you just made my video go
viral. So I'm gonna use your comment to make
another video with it. And that's how I've dealt
with trolls. The other thing is that there's a
(27:04):
book called the body keeps the score.
Oh, love that book.
Yes. So there's a quote in there that I
frequently quote, and it goes like this. Use your
body to have visceral experiences that contradict the helplessness
and rage you feel.
(27:25):
Say that again.
Use your body to have visceral experiences that contradict
the helplessness and rage you feel. So I felt
rage, anger, bitterness for the longest time. And it
(27:46):
was held inside my body all the way from
twelve years old, probably ten. I don't remember any
of my childhood. There's only two moments that I
remember, and two moments up to six years old
is not good. But that's another story.
(28:06):
And so all this rage that I held inside
me was coming out, you know, in my parenting,
etcetera. Right? So when I started running, because we
hold things viscerally and we hold things in our
nervous system, and in our nervous system, it's programmed
(28:27):
to create patterns for us that already are pre
exist. So the patterns that I had created from
a small age that pre existed in my nervous
system were I quit things, I don't follow through
on things.
And I self loathe, I think, the worst of
(28:50):
myself. Those are my patterns. So when I started
that streak, I just want to tell you how
that nervous system was screaming every day, what are
you doing? What the fuck do you think you're
doing? Who the hell do you think you are
(29:13):
doing a five k every day? Are you kidding
me? You're going to quit this? That was year
one, year two. This nervous system was like, oh,
my God, ladies. You are ridiculous. Okay? You did
one year. You think you're going to do year
two, and it was like, okay, whatever.
(29:36):
Just. Okay, just do it. These are the thoughts
going on in my brain, and here I am
on the street outside by myself, and these thoughts
are going on in my brain. And there were
nights where I was crying. I was crying. There
were nights where I did the five k at
like 10:00 at night. One year we had a
flood, and the whole downstairs is being renovated because
(29:58):
we had this flood and my daughter was graduating.
But it wasn't a real graduation because. Cause I
couldn't watch her walk on the stage because it
was fucking Covid, all this shit. And I'm out
there doing my five k. It was the loneliest
thing, the loneliest journey. Anybody who's ever gone on
a journey to change themselves, it is one of
the loneliest things that you can do, which is
(30:18):
why we seek community, which is why you and
you started the podcast. I started my instagram because
you don't want to feel lonely. And year three
was the year of change, and that was the
year.
So 2019 was the first year. 2020 was the
second year. 2021 was the year that, towards the
(30:41):
end of the year where real change happened, where
I started to talk back to that nervous system,
and I was like, what are you talking about?
I am a real runner because one day this
asshole was like, um, you're not a real runner
because you only do five k. What? And I
(31:03):
was like, um. Okay, let's. Yeah. Are you reaching
much? Oh. Oh, you're reaching. You can't find anything
else to say to me.
Literally, this is me going. But after year three,
that was when really, things changed. And then in
year four, so in year three, I decided to
(31:26):
do the magazine. So I decided to publish my
magazine. And it started, like, at the end of
2021. In January, February 2022, the first issue was
published. But the running, the reason I said that
quote is because what the running did was, you
(31:47):
know how there's certain therapies where you're supposed to
shake your body? Yes.
That's what the running did for me. But I
didn't know was doing that. I had no idea
that what I was doing, I was actually healing
and going through my own therapy. That's why this
(32:10):
is so mind blowing to me. That, and I'm
not saying that everybody should go start a five
k every day, but I'm saying that everybody should
start moving their body every day.
Absolutely.
And stick to it every day. And you will
see what happens to you. You will see that
your nervous system is going to try and resist
(32:31):
that, especially if you have difficulty sticking to things.
It will do everything in its power to make
every excuse in the book for you to stick
to it. And that's, that's how I lost the
self loathing was I started to trust myself. Every
time I did a five k, I didn't break
a promise to myself. And I realized I had
(32:55):
no idea that I was breaking promises to myself,
you know, in the last, from 20, from 18
to 43 when I started running. So in a
nutshell, that is my journey.
I mean, there's like such a beautiful journey there.
(33:18):
There is so much you said there that I
actually want to highlight that. I'm like, do I
even have enough time? Let me see if I
can start from the beginning. My memories. And I'm
getting old. Okay. We are 44. Thank you. When
(33:43):
you were talking about the trolls, because I want
to highlight that because I feel like, well, there's
a lot that I want to highlight, but I
feel like sometimes it's very easy when we're on
social media to be emotionally affected by the trolls.
And for those that are listening, because you talked
about the trolls and people being closed minded, like
(34:03):
a closed mind can accept new ideas because they,
it's like that door is closed, there's nothing. They
won't allow anything in. So arguing back with them
and doing all those things, you're just like wasting
energy. So the people who are listening, who are
on social, who give their valuable time and energy
(34:23):
to these trolls, unless you can find a way
to flip it positively, like you said, where you,
you use it to, you know, make a new
video and to inspire and to make a greater
impact, that is wonderful. But to use your energy
to go back and forth, a waste of time,
they're not open to it. Two, when you mentioned
the body keeps the score, I love that book.
(34:44):
I have, I read the audio and I have
the physical book. I feel like it helped me
understand and heal a lot of things within my
body as well. And there's another doctor, Doctor Joe
Dispenza, who, I love his work. He mixes science
and spirituality.
And for me, that's very important because I feel
like both worlds have kept things so apart, but
(35:06):
if they were to combine that information, they would
have so much solutions for so many things in
the world. But I was watching one of his
videos this weekend, and in it, because we were
talking, like, he was talking about, like, affirmations and
frequency and things like that.
And it's like, a lot of people have a
hard time with affirmations because they're saying all these
(35:27):
positive things, but they're not seeing changes in their
life. And he was saying that we only accept,
believe, and surrender to the thoughts that are equal
to our emotional state. So our emotions are a
label for the vibration that we're on, right? So
if we are happy, we're on a high vibration.
If we're sad and we're angry, we're on a
low vibration. So when we are in this low
(35:49):
vibration and we're in this, um, heavy emotional state,
we can't accept the things, the. The positive information,
the positive energy, all those things that are coming
to us because we're not in vibrational harmony with
those things. Um, and then you were talking about,
um, the, like, I guess, the struggle of even
(36:14):
being consistent with the runs in the beginning, right?
And I'm presently listening to Sarah Jakes new audiobook
called power moves. But in it, she says, just
because you got it done doesn't mean that you
didn't come undone in the process.
(36:34):
So people have this perception that you being courageous
or you doing something vulnerable, you doing all these
big things things is because you have no fear
or because you, you know, have all of these
other positive things. It's like, my example would be
me being extreme introvert and being diagnosed with anxiety.
(36:57):
But when I go on big stages or speak
in front of big audiences or do these things,
people are like, oh, like, you're an extrovert.
There's no way. And, you know, you look confident
doing it. Like, uh, no, I am shaking inside.
My heart rate is 145. Like, I'm not okay,
but I'm feeling the fear, and I'm doing it
anyway. Which makes me think of Susan Cain's quote
(37:20):
that courage is fear walking. The fear exists, but
we are moving in the fear to get to
the other side, where the rewards are. Which makes
me think of your example of how you just
broke down each year of you running, working through
the process of, you know, your thoughts, working through
(37:43):
the negative thoughts that were in your head.
And each year, even though you were being consistent,
you fighting your own thoughts, your own self, to
push through and get to the other side. And
it's like all change is uncomfortable at first, messy
in the middle, but beautiful in the end. You
know, we, we can't stay the same and change
(38:05):
at the same time. Like, there's so much you
said that I want to highlight.
Oh, my God. And I actually have to. I
actually have to correct myself. Not correct myself, but
I have to add in a. What's that called?
A preface. So the preface that I want to
add in when I go back and talk about
how I was talking to myself, it's because I
(38:27):
was listening to these two podcasts. Oh, my God.
And that was what also changed me. So the
quote from Doctor Bessel van der Kalk changed me.
The second thing that changed me was the first
podcast that Huberman, Andrew Huberman did with Richrol, and
that was where I heard about neuroplasticity. And he
(38:48):
talked about, so my whole life, my mom told
me that I don't have any willpower, which is
why I didn't stick to anything. So I was
like, okay, I'm going into this. And I'm like,
I don't have any willpower. But I really did.
And Willpower has nothing to do with it. But
it was that podcast with Andrew Herberman and rich
roll. I think it's like number 359, it's back
in 2019 or 2018 that they recorded it. So
(39:11):
it's the first one, not the second one. That
was where he explained that your body, when you
try to break a pattern, the reaction that your
body shows you is agitation, frustration and opposition. I
(39:33):
was like, what? I rewound that section of the
podcast, and I was like, oh, my gosh. Mind
blown. I was like, so you're telling me that
my natural reaction to wanting to stick to something
is completely scientific and it has nothing to do
(39:56):
with willpower? Oh, my gosh. So that was when
I realized, aha, this is what's going on. The
third thing, the third evidence that I had towards
me continuing on this journey was listening to atomic
habits.
Yes.
And it was about stacking evidence. What was the
(40:20):
previous evidence that you stacked against yourself to confirm
that you lacked that characteristic? What is the new
evidence you're going to stack for yourself that is
going to confirm that you are, in fact, that
(40:40):
person? So you, being an introvert and being able
to go on stage, you continuously stack evidence to
confirm that you are a speaker, which has nothing
to do with being an introvert. I am a
speaker, but I'm also an introvert. That's the evidence
you're stacking. The last thing I just wanted to
address was the trolls. So I agree with you.
(41:04):
There is no point in debating with trolls. But
the reason I made videos and I would snip
their comment and I would make a video was
the same reason that I actually did that. But
somebody else who had done that showed me that.
This is how you positively react to trolls.
(41:28):
Yeah.
So the example they set is the example I
wanted to set for future plus size women who
are wanting to run and me showing them, hey,
you know what? You start running, it's okay. You're
gonna get Joe blow from freaking I don't know
(41:49):
where, sitting at his computer, being a keyboard warrior,
telling you so and so. It's okay. You're gonna
get that. But guess what? We do. This is
what we do.
Yes, yes, yes, yes to all of that. Um,
you know, I was thinking about what you said
about, you know, your mom told you that you
(42:11):
had no willpower and that that's like we have.
To say, no idea, right?
So our. Our parents, our guardians, our caregivers as
kids, sometimes they say things and don't realize the
weight that those words have and how long they
stick with us. And oftentimes now as adults, when
(42:32):
we have this negative self talk, my new pattern
is to ask myself, is that me saying that?
Or was that something someone once said to me?
Where does this belief come from? Was that someone
else's belief based on their perceptions and what they
believe is possible? Or is this mine? Because most
times it's not mine. So I'm. It's easier for
me to remove that once I realize it's not
mine, it's theirs. Let them deal with that.
(42:54):
Right.
Um, but also you being consistent with the running
and keeping that commitment to yourself. You know, you
read atomic habits, so, you know, like, how we
do anything is how we do everything. So if
you were able to keep. Keep this commitment to
yourself, it has sharpened your skills and your habit
in life to keep commitments to yourself. Like, I
(43:18):
love it so, so much. The fact that it's
like you doing these five k runs a day,
even if it had absolutely nothing to do with
losing weight or, you know, any of those other
things, the fact that you have kept this commitment
to yourself, how that impacts you. Keeping commitments to
(43:39):
yourself in other areas of your life, how the
compound effects of this habit will help your life
tremendously. But also set examples for your children about
what it means to keep commitments to yourself. You
know, kids, often there's a saying, and I don't
(44:02):
remember where I got it from, but I say
some things are taught and some things are caught.
We could talk to her blue in the face
with what we teach our kids, right? But they
look at what we do. You are setting a
beautiful example to your kids about keeping commitments to
yourself, about self care, about self love, about all
these things that generationally are going to. You are
(44:25):
changing generations. You are creating legacy. Like, I'm trying
not to cry right now because I'm such a,
like, emotional person, but. But we don't realize sometimes
something that may seem small, the great effect and
impact that it is having on us and our
(44:47):
life and our family and generations of our family.
I agree. Like.
Oh, like, yeah.
You know, I never even thought about that, McKinney.
I never even. I was just focusing on them
today, the kids today, and what I could do
today. I never even thought about the fact that
(45:09):
that could rewrite the future generations and their way
of thinking about themselves. Wow. That's. That's.
I saw, um. I don't know if I can
find it right now, but I. But there was
a post that I saw on instagram, and I
had shared it in my story because I was
(45:30):
like, this is very powerful. But it was talking
about generations of healing and how. When. Let me
see. I found it here. When you heal yourself,
you heal the people around you. You heal your
family, your children, their children. Where did it go?
I lost it. Where did it go? Okay. Let
(45:52):
me. I scrolled too fast. Oh, there it is.
Okay.
You heal the people around you. You heal your
family, your children, their children, and their children's children.
You heal generations and generations. So what you're doing
is generational healing.
Oh, that just puts it into context. Wow. Yeah.
(46:16):
Yeah. So thank you for the work that you
were doing on you and future generations.
Thank you. And right back at you. Right back
at you. Yeah. For our children and anybody who
they're gonna touch, because it's not just our children
and their families, but it could be anybody that
(46:38):
they're gonna touch along the way.
Yeah, the butterfly effect, right.
That, too. Yeah.
So I would love if you could tell the
listeners where they could stay connected with you, where
they can learn more from you and about you.
My. Thank you. My handle on Instagram, that's another
(47:02):
story. But, yeah, I didn't. Yeah. So my handle
on Instagram is big fit underscore. I underscore run.
So even if you just punch in big fit,
I should pop up and then my magazine is
called run your life magazine on Instagram. Love it.
(47:27):
Love it.
I will definitely have your handles in the details
section so they could just click and connect with
you directly. I normally do a rapid fire at
the end of every episode, but I feel like
we have given so many gems just on your
experiences and your story. I just want them to
(47:49):
go back and listen again and take notes and
highlight. And I want to thank you. I'm thinking
about your experiences and your journey. And usually, you
know, the beauty of sharing your story is that,
you know, it connects with someone else. It connects
(48:10):
with their story. There's something they can take from
it. And it's like listening to how you've used
your running journey, your five k a day to
heal. And I'm thinking to myself, it's interesting around
the same time. Like, I don't. I don't run,
but I do five k every day. And sometimes
on weekends I try to do ten. But it's
(48:33):
like all the similarities, listening to your story. And
I'm thinking to myself, like, my fitbit lets me
know every single day. My average is like, 5.
All that good stuff. But it's like we don't
realize the patterns that we are creating, how generationally
they are helping, and the beauty of running in
(48:54):
nature and grounding all the practices that we are
doing today to heal ourselves, how they're healing future
generations. So I want to thank you, Sandra, for
not just making the commitment to yourself, but sharing
that with the world, sharing that with your children,
being an example and, you know, leading by example
(49:16):
and showing us, you know, what it looks like
just to be the best version of ourselves, even
when it's hard.
And even, you know, being the best version of
yourself. But even when other people think you should
be a different version and you're taking a stance
on, no, this is my version, and I will
(49:38):
continue to only choose my version over what anybody
else thinks. I should look like, I should run
like I, you know, that we have to take
a stance, and we have to teach our children
that the version of themselves that they think is
good enough is the version that they should stick
(50:00):
to, not what somebody else thinks. And the other
thing I just wanted to offer here is that
if anybody has an interesting story that they'd like
to share in the magazine, all of the contributors
are real people sharing real stories. So that's, you
know, part of this sharing.
(50:23):
Love it. Thank you. Love for having.
Love it. Amazing.
Thank you, Sandra, so much. And to all the
healers out there, until next time, subscribe on all
platforms. Don't forget to rate the show. Leave us
a review on Apple Podcast. I just want to
thank each and every one of you that continues
to listen each week to help the show rank
globally in the top 1.5% of most popular podcasts,
(50:46):
which is over 3 million podcasts out there. So
it's mind blowing, but I want to challenge you
to share your aha moments. Share any gems that
Sandra left with you in screenshot this week's episode.
You can tag Sandra at Bigfit, underscore I run.
You can tag myself at the real McKinney Smith.
(51:06):
A healthy community is a healing community, and a
healing community is full of hope because it has
seen its own people weather, survive, and thrive. So
let's continue to heal her.
I'm Makini Smith. After going through a divorce, my
sister passing away, experiencing narcissistic abuse and some significant
health scares, I realized through sharing my story that
I wasn't alone in my suffering. Suffering subjective distress
generated by the experience of being out of balance
in a deep dive to holistically heal mind, body
(00:21):
and soul is where I discovered peace, clarity and
connection. It is impossible to be truly wise without
some real life hardship, and we cannot develop post
traumatic wisdom without making it through, and most importantly,
through it together. Social connection builds resilience, and resilience
(00:43):
helps create post traumatic wisdom, and that wisdom leads
to hope. Hope for you and others witnessing and
participating in your healing and hope for your community.
A healthy community is a healing community. And a
healing community is full of hope because it has
seen its own people weather, survive and thrive. At
(01:23):
43 years old, Sandra Mukulik decided to lace up
and start running. She's run six marathons and 250
kilometer races in six years and started a five
kilometer streak on January 1 of 2019 that has
helped her to heal trauma and self loathing. Sandra
is a self proclaimed plus sized runner and now
(01:47):
magazine publisher of the first ever fitness magazine for
the unconventional athlete. And she's not shy to talk
about her 260 pound size body. And also, she
helps inspire thousands of women on Instagram to move
in the body that they have today and not
wait for a thinner body tomorrow. So please welcome
(02:08):
to the show Sandra McCulich.
Thank you McKinney. Thanks for having me.
Thank you for saying yes and agreeing to come
on and share your healing journey with us.
It's my pleasure, honestly. And thank you for having
me in this space that you've created over the
last six years. I'm honored to be able to
(02:29):
share this platform with you today, and let's just
get into it. I can't wait.
Yes. Yes. So I usually like to start the
show by going back to your childhood before we
get to where you are presently, just so we
can understand better, because we all know our present
day behaviors and trauma responses and all the things
(02:52):
that we do are very connected to our childhood,
our childhood wounds, childhood traumas, any of the things
that we experience as a child, our childhood conditioning.
So I would love to know, you know, before
society tried to limit you or tell you who
or what you should be, you know, when our
imaginations were vivid and running wild, who did Sandra
(03:14):
want to be as a child?
Oh my God. I've never been asked this question
and it's such a good question. Wow. Sandra, little
Sandra, wanted to be free as possible without any
limitations set on her, based on her body size.
(03:36):
She wanted to play outside, run wild. She wanted
to be told that she is worthy, just as
she is and not worthy if she became this
or if she looked like this. And that's who.
(03:59):
That's who Sandra really is. And I think that's
why I love running so much, is because it
reminds me of the little girl who didn't get
to play in the mountains or in the trails
or outside freely.
Wow. I love that. And that is so powerful.
(04:20):
It's interesting how the things we didn't get to
do as children, how doing them as adults helps
heal those childhood wounds, helps hug that little girl
inside to let her know it's okay to do
those things and be all those things that she
wanted to be. So I would love if you
(04:41):
could share with the listeners how you even got
into running. I know it's been about six years
since both of our lives were transformed, so I
would love if you could share that with the
listeners.
Yeah. That is so serendipitous that both our journeys
started six years ago. And so I was not
born in Canada. I was born in Croatia, actually.
(05:04):
Not Croatia. Bosnia Herzegovina. I just say it's Croatia.
Cause it's just next door, and most people don't
know Bosnia Herzegovina.
And then I came here when I was six
years old, so my parents didn't speak any English
and were immigrant parents and did not let me
go outside very much at all. And if I
did, I had to bring my little sister and
babysit her and watch her. And I apologized to
(05:27):
her for maybe flipping her upside down to show
off friends because that was the only way that
I could maybe get attention is by.
So, anyways, that's. That's another story. My poor little
sister. But so, you know, my parents wanting to
hide us or not allow us to be as
free as children, you know, who were 6789 years
(05:51):
old, should have been free at that age, I
think, really set the tone for what the rest
of my life was going to look like until
I put it back into my own hands. So,
also, I'm a 511. Just to kind of give
a description of me, I'm a 511 woman right
(06:13):
now and 260 pounds.
And when I was little, I was not overweight.
I was just a normal sized kid, big boned,
but I was normal sized. I don't know. Like,
I just. You know. But my mom thought that
I was looking too big. So probably from the
(06:37):
age of, I want to say ten to twelve,
probably twelve years old when she took me to
the bay. And we had to go into the
women's section because I had to get a confirmation
dress because it was my confirmation, and she was
so upset because she had to buy the woman
sized dresses instead of the children's dresses.
(06:59):
So that's kind of when it all started. And
probably from that point on, I played sports in
school, but as a young adult, I would use
exercise as a way to try and control my
weight. So I was always kind of active. I
played basketball. I ran. I did track. I can't
(07:22):
say I ran. It was, like, slow. I was,
like, pulling a hamstring and trying to run as
fast as the other kid because tall, you know,
tall girls didn't do the 200 meters sprints. It
was painful. I did shopwood and discus and that.
But, you know, there was always, like, a bit
(07:44):
of athleticism in me. And then after I had.
I have four children, and after I had each
of the children, I remember there was a phase
where I was like, okay, I gotta go and
work out now because I gotta lose all this
baby fat.
And it was just always there, like, pecking at
me like a. Like a woodpecker. Like this notion
(08:06):
of, okay, you have to. You have to get
yourself in order and, you know, blah, blah, blah.
But the other thing that happened after having the
children was postpartum was pretty severe. And I had
really severe anxiety, like, to the point where it
would ruin. It would ruin relationships because of.
(08:27):
My thoughts were so obsessive that I had to
go on medication after consultation with some doctors. And
it was the best decision I ever made was
to. And I've been on this medication for nine
years, anxiety medicine. So, anyways, fast forward. I bought
this treadmill when I was 42 in the fall,
(08:50):
put it downstairs in our basement, and I use
the treadmill as a warm up to do the
YouTube videos in the basement. And then what I.
What ended up happening was I started spending more
and more time on this treadmill. So I would
look at YouTube videos and I was. I would
watch documentaries. So around October 2017 was when I
(09:11):
bought the treadmill. And March 18, 2018, was the
very first run I went outside on in the
trails since high school.
Wow.
I swear to you, I came back a different
person. It was a seven kilometer run. I went
(09:33):
out three and a half, came back three and
a half. I don't know what happened, but I
was like, oh, my God, they sign me up
for the Olympics. And, you know, I don't know
if you see any, like, videos where it's, like,
what I think I look like and then what
(09:53):
I look like. Videos.
Yeah. Yeah.
It's so true. It's what we think we look
like. And did you see, like, the. The person
shuffling along? Yes. That was. That was me. And
that was it. March after that run, I signed
up for five local races. Wow. And when you
(10:16):
have. When you're an all or nothing person, probably
like, right?
Yep.
You have a podcast. You didn't just dabble into
podcasting. You have a mega podcast. Right? So we're
an all or nothing person. You just go all
in, and you only look later to see if
you've hurt yourself along the way. You just keep
(10:39):
going. You're running through the wall. And that's literally
what happened. And in 2018, I decided, you know
what? I'm going to do a marathon. So I
did my first marathon in 2018, and I've done
one ever since then, so that's six years. And
there's something in the running community called a streak.
And so I had decided. So this ties into
(11:04):
my trauma work. So I saw this streak thing,
and I was like, oh. So a streak is
defined by runners running World magazine as a 1
mile run every single day. And I was like,
okay, I don't feel like running every day. Like,
even if it's a mile, I'm not committed to
that. Like, no, yeah. What I did commit to
(11:28):
was a five kilometer every day, because I'm like,
no, I'm not doing a 1 mile every day,
but I'll do a five kilometer walk or run.
Run or walk every day, even if I'm sick.
So I have been sick a couple of times,
and let me tell you that. Let me. Let
me show you how slow you can walk. If
you had to walk, I've done it, and you
(11:51):
still get your five k in. And so that
was January 1, 2019, was when I started my
five kilometer streak, and it's. And I'm going to
hit day 2000 on June 23.
Wow.
Yeah.
Wow.
It's changed my life, as you know. It hasn't
(12:15):
changed the physical structure of me, but it's changed
the physical structure of my brain. I haven't lost
any weight, but I've lost self loathing. I've lost
feeling low self worth. I've lost all the negativity.
I've lost the self defamating self. I can't remember
(12:44):
that word. Thoughts?
Yeah.
It'S at the tip of my tongue, but, yes.
So those are all the things that I've lost,
but not the weight, because I just am not
in a calorie deficit. And that's still one of
the puzzles that I'm not in a hurry to
(13:08):
solve, because a lot of people are like, you
run so much or you do so much activity,
why haven't you lost weight? Well, because I haven't
wanted to. I haven't gone into a calorie deficit.
I'm in a maintaining stage. I maintain really well,
(13:30):
I'm good at maintaining.
I've maintained this physique, consistency.
Ask me all about maintaining, I'll tell you.
That speaks to your consistency. Okay.
Exactly. See, I knew you'd appreciate that. Some trolls
(13:51):
don't appreciate that on the Internet.
Don't get me started with the trolls. That's their
own self loathing, that's their own, uh, self doubt,
their own insecurities. Things that they need to work
on. Most definitely. Um, so much that you said
there that I want to unpack. Um, I want
to start with the, you know, after you had
(14:14):
each child and you feeling like you needed to
lose the baby weight, and dealing with postpartum, all
of that in itself is a lot of pressure.
I have three kids. I get it. And for
any woman who is presently listening, going through that,
because there are some young women in my DM's
experiencing postpartum right now, and, you know, they're reaching
(14:36):
out because my daughter just had a baby. Well,
she's almost eight months now, but, you know, feeling
like they need someone to share those experiences with
the heaviness, the emotions, all those things. If you
could just share some of the things that helped
you get through that, and then we'll get into
the running part.
(15:00):
When there were thoughts in my head that somebody
was gonna climb through the window of the. The
place where we were living, and I was living
right next door to my parents, and they had
a duplex, and my husband was working out of
town for ten years. And the thought that I
(15:23):
had was that my dad wasn't going to be
able to hear me scream. And so I didn't
know which kid to save. And it was impossible
to get to sleep. Impossible to get to sleep
at night. And this was especially after my fourth
one, when I had my daughter, because I have
(15:43):
three boys and a girl. That was the worst
postpartum that I had. And I'm wondering if it's
because she's a female and I'm a female, and
the chromosomes, like, I'm just, you know, that's just
my grade nine science brain. I don't know. But
when I had my. And then the last one.
(16:05):
The last one. Also probably because my husband was
away, he would work two weeks away and come
home, uh, you know, for five days or something
like that. I just knew I needed help, and
I went to my doctor, and she's like, oh.
And we were living in Burnaby, BC, at the
time, and she's like, oh, there's a. There's a
(16:26):
postpartum. There's a postpartum group that I can get.
You signed up to. And I was like, oh,
my God, yes, please. And that's when I met
a female doctor who was a specialist in postpartum.
And then she ended up taking me on as
a patient and took probably a few months to
(16:50):
actually diagnose me and then give me this medicine,
which is one of the oldest kinds of anxiety
medicines. It's not just one of those ones the
doctor pulls out of his pocket, like, wellbutrin excel
or some shit like that. And it's like, here,
try this. And it's like, you don't. You. You
had a five minute conversation with me. Um, so
(17:10):
after I spoke to her, I realized that thank.
Like, I just realized that I'm not crazy. Like,
I'm not. There's nothing wrong with me. My. Whatever
it is, my nervous system or my brain cells,
they're just not. Something is. There's a short there,
(17:31):
and it just made me feel relieved, because all
these years, I had been so hard on myself,
thinking, I am a horrible mother. I do feel
like I was completely different with my first two
firstborns than I was with the last two. And,
(17:52):
you know, I'll never be able to change that.
And I've apologized to them many, many times, and.
And I try to, you know, make up for
it now, and. But the more you show your
children that mistakes are inevitable, it's how we bounce
(18:12):
back from the stakes, that's it. From the mistakes
that shows your true character. It's not how much
you hide your mistakes from people or how strong
you can look in the face of those mistakes.
It's how you react to them. That's the most
important thing, and that's one of the things I
want them to remember about me, is that.
(18:36):
There'S so much you said there that I wanted
to highlight. One in terms of dealing with the
postpartum and having someone confirm or validate for you
that you're not crazy. Definitely needed to the group
where it's community. We talked about this before we
(18:58):
started recording. We heal best in community. So that
community, the social proofing helped to validate. These are
real feelings. I'm not crazy. This is not a
one off, all those things. So I want the
women that are listening, you know, to highlight those
points where, one, you need someone who makes you
(19:19):
feel seen, heard, and understood, and two, that sense
of community, because that's a huge pillar in our
ability to be resilient. But also, when you spoke
about your children, I can completely relate. So each
one of our children will experience a different part
of us based on where we are in that
(19:39):
moment in time. And the. I. I feel like
for me personally, because my deepest healing is happening
now. My youngest child is getting the best version
of me, the aware version of me, the healed
version of me. Whereas, like you said, you apologize
to the previous children and you try to make
(20:00):
up for certain things, but at the end of
the day, we were doing the best we could
then with the tools and the knowledge that we
had at that time. But knowing now that you
can't change the past, you can apologize for what
you've done, and you're now doing differently. It's up
to them now, at this point, for them to
accept that and to also do their own healing.
(20:22):
Because no matter how hard we try as a
parent, like, there's no. There's no rulebook for parenting,
because every child is different. So no matter how
hard we try as a parent, we are going
to make mistakes. We're human. We're human beings. We
are not. We're not perfect. And even if one
(20:42):
thing worked perfectly for one child, it may completely
do the opposite for the other child. Right. So
we have to be able to give ourselves some
grace and be gentle with ourselves on our own
healing journey, because children are brutal. We can be.
No, it's like, it's not even. You know, it's
not even that. It's not even that children are
(21:05):
brutal. Honestly, I think you bring a child into
this world, and that child is fucking pure magic.
They are pure innocence and pure bliss. And then
you put that child in society.
Yes.
Society is what's poisonous. Yes, children are. They are.
(21:29):
Oh, I even look at. I even. I don't
know if Marina's gonna listen to this, but I.
I have a very strong connection to Marina's baby,
who is now nine months. Really strong connection to
her. And it's probably my future grandma kind of
connection coming out as a predicament of what I
(21:52):
will be like as a grandma. And I feel.
I feel sorry for my kids who might have
children as a precursor to what I will be
like, because I now understand why some grandparents are
the way they are, because you're wanting to make
up for. You're wanting to make up for, you
(22:14):
know, lost time. But I'll give you another example
of how so my daughter is half the size
of me, less. She's 511, and she's probably 120
pounds. So if I could have birthed the perfect
model looking kid, it was her. But I guarantee
(22:36):
you that she had a worse high school experience
than I ever did because of the way that
society is today.
Yes.
You know, sure, I got called Butch and, you
know, names here and there, but she was, like,
(22:57):
ostracized and, like girls would. And especially now with
social media, they don't just leave it at school.
It's like, oh, no. And then we're gonna create,
like, a page. So, you know, this society makes.
(23:18):
Makes children have really, really challenging atmospheres to try
to be children in. They really do. They have
no chance. These kids. They have no chance.
Yeah. I was listening to, I think it was
a Jay Shetty episode, and he was talking about
(23:38):
how today we consume more. More information in, like,
a month than, like, 25 years ago that they
experienced in their entire lifetime. Right? So our children,
like, there are some people who may not be
aware or don't, I guess, care about mental health
(24:01):
or any of those things to understand. Like, they
are overwhelmed. All of the mental health struggles that
these kids are having, the depression, the anxiety, like,
all of these things, they have every right to
be overwhelmed. There was a point I could say
maybe, I don't know, ten years ago where I
didn't understand as before I started my heavy healing.
But I get it now. Where the pressures that
(24:23):
they have today are so much more intense than
the pressures that we had because of social media,
because of technology, because of, you know, all of
the access that they have to things or how
far they can spread things, how quickly they can
spread things, how things can go viral. So the
pressures that our kids have today are so different
(24:45):
than, you know, what we had or what. In
the days when people were living out in the
wilderness and they were trying to survive because of
wild animals, the stress levels are very intense for
our young people. So I get. Society can be
very cruel, but also, I wanted to, I guess,
(25:09):
also bring it back to your. Your running journey
and. Yeah, you know, because you're talking about, you
know, we're talking about trolls, but we're also talking
about, like, you. You lost the self loathing. You
lost the, you know, all the negative self talk.
You lost all of those things. But then you
mentioned that you didn't lose any weight. And I
(25:32):
personally don't think there's anything wrong with that. I
feel like I, you are who you are supposed
to be right now, but they're because of social
media, because of society, because of the negativity or
the, the work that other people have to do,
the projections that they may put onto you. Like,
I guess, how have you handled dealing with that?
(25:57):
Yeah, that's so I think the first thing that
for some people when they see me, for some
trolls, when they've seen me, is my stance that
I've taken on accepting myself conflicts with the premonition
that they were fed as a, whether it's a
(26:20):
household or society that if you exercise, you should
lose weight, or some people you should lose weight,
therefore you should start exercising. So my stance that
I've taken conflicts with, that there are some people
who are really freaking close minded. So they're like
all over it. I just want to give you
(26:41):
my opinion and, well, okay.
Thanks, Bob.
Thanks, Karen. Yeah, thanks. You know what? Thanks for
that comment because you just made my video go
viral. So I'm gonna use your comment to make
another video with it. And that's how I've dealt
with trolls. The other thing is that there's a
(27:04):
book called the body keeps the score.
Oh, love that book.
Yes. So there's a quote in there that I
frequently quote, and it goes like this. Use your
body to have visceral experiences that contradict the helplessness
and rage you feel.
(27:25):
Say that again.
Use your body to have visceral experiences that contradict
the helplessness and rage you feel. So I felt
rage, anger, bitterness for the longest time. And it
(27:46):
was held inside my body all the way from
twelve years old, probably ten. I don't remember any
of my childhood. There's only two moments that I
remember, and two moments up to six years old
is not good. But that's another story.
(28:06):
And so all this rage that I held inside
me was coming out, you know, in my parenting,
etcetera. Right? So when I started running, because we
hold things viscerally and we hold things in our
nervous system, and in our nervous system, it's programmed
(28:27):
to create patterns for us that already are pre
exist. So the patterns that I had created from
a small age that pre existed in my nervous
system were I quit things, I don't follow through
on things.
And I self loathe, I think, the worst of
(28:50):
myself. Those are my patterns. So when I started
that streak, I just want to tell you how
that nervous system was screaming every day, what are
you doing? What the fuck do you think you're
doing? Who the hell do you think you are
(29:13):
doing a five k every day? Are you kidding
me? You're going to quit this? That was year
one, year two. This nervous system was like, oh,
my God, ladies. You are ridiculous. Okay? You did
one year. You think you're going to do year
two, and it was like, okay, whatever.
(29:36):
Just. Okay, just do it. These are the thoughts
going on in my brain, and here I am
on the street outside by myself, and these thoughts
are going on in my brain. And there were
nights where I was crying. I was crying. There
were nights where I did the five k at
like 10:00 at night. One year we had a
flood, and the whole downstairs is being renovated because
(29:58):
we had this flood and my daughter was graduating.
But it wasn't a real graduation because. Cause I
couldn't watch her walk on the stage because it
was fucking Covid, all this shit. And I'm out
there doing my five k. It was the loneliest
thing, the loneliest journey. Anybody who's ever gone on
a journey to change themselves, it is one of
the loneliest things that you can do, which is
(30:18):
why we seek community, which is why you and
you started the podcast. I started my instagram because
you don't want to feel lonely. And year three
was the year of change, and that was the
year.
So 2019 was the first year. 2020 was the
second year. 2021 was the year that, towards the
(30:41):
end of the year where real change happened, where
I started to talk back to that nervous system,
and I was like, what are you talking about?
I am a real runner because one day this
asshole was like, um, you're not a real runner
because you only do five k. What? And I
(31:03):
was like, um. Okay, let's. Yeah. Are you reaching
much? Oh. Oh, you're reaching. You can't find anything
else to say to me.
Literally, this is me going. But after year three,
that was when really, things changed. And then in
year four, so in year three, I decided to
(31:26):
do the magazine. So I decided to publish my
magazine. And it started, like, at the end of
2021. In January, February 2022, the first issue was
published. But the running, the reason I said that
quote is because what the running did was, you
(31:47):
know how there's certain therapies where you're supposed to
shake your body? Yes.
That's what the running did for me. But I
didn't know was doing that. I had no idea
that what I was doing, I was actually healing
and going through my own therapy. That's why this
(32:10):
is so mind blowing to me. That, and I'm
not saying that everybody should go start a five
k every day, but I'm saying that everybody should
start moving their body every day.
Absolutely.
And stick to it every day. And you will
see what happens to you. You will see that
your nervous system is going to try and resist
(32:31):
that, especially if you have difficulty sticking to things.
It will do everything in its power to make
every excuse in the book for you to stick
to it. And that's, that's how I lost the
self loathing was I started to trust myself. Every
time I did a five k, I didn't break
a promise to myself. And I realized I had
(32:55):
no idea that I was breaking promises to myself,
you know, in the last, from 20, from 18
to 43 when I started running. So in a
nutshell, that is my journey.
I mean, there's like such a beautiful journey there.
(33:18):
There is so much you said there that I
actually want to highlight that. I'm like, do I
even have enough time? Let me see if I
can start from the beginning. My memories. And I'm
getting old. Okay. We are 44. Thank you. When
(33:43):
you were talking about the trolls, because I want
to highlight that because I feel like, well, there's
a lot that I want to highlight, but I
feel like sometimes it's very easy when we're on
social media to be emotionally affected by the trolls.
And for those that are listening, because you talked
about the trolls and people being closed minded, like
(34:03):
a closed mind can accept new ideas because they,
it's like that door is closed, there's nothing. They
won't allow anything in. So arguing back with them
and doing all those things, you're just like wasting
energy. So the people who are listening, who are
on social, who give their valuable time and energy
(34:23):
to these trolls, unless you can find a way
to flip it positively, like you said, where you,
you use it to, you know, make a new
video and to inspire and to make a greater
impact, that is wonderful. But to use your energy
to go back and forth, a waste of time,
they're not open to it. Two, when you mentioned
the body keeps the score, I love that book.
(34:44):
I have, I read the audio and I have
the physical book. I feel like it helped me
understand and heal a lot of things within my
body as well. And there's another doctor, Doctor Joe
Dispenza, who, I love his work. He mixes science
and spirituality.
And for me, that's very important because I feel
like both worlds have kept things so apart, but
(35:06):
if they were to combine that information, they would
have so much solutions for so many things in
the world. But I was watching one of his
videos this weekend, and in it, because we were
talking, like, he was talking about, like, affirmations and
frequency and things like that.
And it's like, a lot of people have a
hard time with affirmations because they're saying all these
(35:27):
positive things, but they're not seeing changes in their
life. And he was saying that we only accept,
believe, and surrender to the thoughts that are equal
to our emotional state. So our emotions are a
label for the vibration that we're on, right? So
if we are happy, we're on a high vibration.
If we're sad and we're angry, we're on a
low vibration. So when we are in this low
(35:49):
vibration and we're in this, um, heavy emotional state,
we can't accept the things, the. The positive information,
the positive energy, all those things that are coming
to us because we're not in vibrational harmony with
those things. Um, and then you were talking about,
um, the, like, I guess, the struggle of even
(36:14):
being consistent with the runs in the beginning, right?
And I'm presently listening to Sarah Jakes new audiobook
called power moves. But in it, she says, just
because you got it done doesn't mean that you
didn't come undone in the process.
(36:34):
So people have this perception that you being courageous
or you doing something vulnerable, you doing all these
big things things is because you have no fear
or because you, you know, have all of these
other positive things. It's like, my example would be
me being extreme introvert and being diagnosed with anxiety.
(36:57):
But when I go on big stages or speak
in front of big audiences or do these things,
people are like, oh, like, you're an extrovert.
There's no way. And, you know, you look confident
doing it. Like, uh, no, I am shaking inside.
My heart rate is 145. Like, I'm not okay,
but I'm feeling the fear, and I'm doing it
anyway. Which makes me think of Susan Cain's quote
(37:20):
that courage is fear walking. The fear exists, but
we are moving in the fear to get to
the other side, where the rewards are. Which makes
me think of your example of how you just
broke down each year of you running, working through
the process of, you know, your thoughts, working through
(37:43):
the negative thoughts that were in your head.
And each year, even though you were being consistent,
you fighting your own thoughts, your own self, to
push through and get to the other side. And
it's like all change is uncomfortable at first, messy
in the middle, but beautiful in the end. You
know, we, we can't stay the same and change
(38:05):
at the same time. Like, there's so much you
said that I want to highlight.
Oh, my God. And I actually have to. I
actually have to correct myself. Not correct myself, but
I have to add in a. What's that called?
A preface. So the preface that I want to
add in when I go back and talk about
how I was talking to myself, it's because I
(38:27):
was listening to these two podcasts. Oh, my God.
And that was what also changed me. So the
quote from Doctor Bessel van der Kalk changed me.
The second thing that changed me was the first
podcast that Huberman, Andrew Huberman did with Richrol, and
that was where I heard about neuroplasticity. And he
(38:48):
talked about, so my whole life, my mom told
me that I don't have any willpower, which is
why I didn't stick to anything. So I was
like, okay, I'm going into this. And I'm like,
I don't have any willpower. But I really did.
And Willpower has nothing to do with it. But
it was that podcast with Andrew Herberman and rich
roll. I think it's like number 359, it's back
in 2019 or 2018 that they recorded it. So
(39:11):
it's the first one, not the second one. That
was where he explained that your body, when you
try to break a pattern, the reaction that your
body shows you is agitation, frustration and opposition. I
(39:33):
was like, what? I rewound that section of the
podcast, and I was like, oh, my gosh. Mind
blown. I was like, so you're telling me that
my natural reaction to wanting to stick to something
is completely scientific and it has nothing to do
(39:56):
with willpower? Oh, my gosh. So that was when
I realized, aha, this is what's going on. The
third thing, the third evidence that I had towards
me continuing on this journey was listening to atomic
habits.
Yes.
And it was about stacking evidence. What was the
(40:20):
previous evidence that you stacked against yourself to confirm
that you lacked that characteristic? What is the new
evidence you're going to stack for yourself that is
going to confirm that you are, in fact, that
(40:40):
person? So you, being an introvert and being able
to go on stage, you continuously stack evidence to
confirm that you are a speaker, which has nothing
to do with being an introvert. I am a
speaker, but I'm also an introvert. That's the evidence
you're stacking. The last thing I just wanted to
address was the trolls. So I agree with you.
(41:04):
There is no point in debating with trolls. But
the reason I made videos and I would snip
their comment and I would make a video was
the same reason that I actually did that. But
somebody else who had done that showed me that.
This is how you positively react to trolls.
(41:28):
Yeah.
So the example they set is the example I
wanted to set for future plus size women who
are wanting to run and me showing them, hey,
you know what? You start running, it's okay. You're
gonna get Joe blow from freaking I don't know
(41:49):
where, sitting at his computer, being a keyboard warrior,
telling you so and so. It's okay. You're gonna
get that. But guess what? We do. This is
what we do.
Yes, yes, yes, yes to all of that. Um,
you know, I was thinking about what you said
about, you know, your mom told you that you
(42:11):
had no willpower and that that's like we have.
To say, no idea, right?
So our. Our parents, our guardians, our caregivers as
kids, sometimes they say things and don't realize the
weight that those words have and how long they
stick with us. And oftentimes now as adults, when
(42:32):
we have this negative self talk, my new pattern
is to ask myself, is that me saying that?
Or was that something someone once said to me?
Where does this belief come from? Was that someone
else's belief based on their perceptions and what they
believe is possible? Or is this mine? Because most
times it's not mine. So I'm. It's easier for
me to remove that once I realize it's not
mine, it's theirs. Let them deal with that.
(42:54):
Right.
Um, but also you being consistent with the running
and keeping that commitment to yourself. You know, you
read atomic habits, so, you know, like, how we
do anything is how we do everything. So if
you were able to keep. Keep this commitment to
yourself, it has sharpened your skills and your habit
in life to keep commitments to yourself. Like, I
(43:18):
love it so, so much. The fact that it's
like you doing these five k runs a day,
even if it had absolutely nothing to do with
losing weight or, you know, any of those other
things, the fact that you have kept this commitment
to yourself, how that impacts you. Keeping commitments to
(43:39):
yourself in other areas of your life, how the
compound effects of this habit will help your life
tremendously. But also set examples for your children about
what it means to keep commitments to yourself. You
know, kids, often there's a saying, and I don't
(44:02):
remember where I got it from, but I say
some things are taught and some things are caught.
We could talk to her blue in the face
with what we teach our kids, right? But they
look at what we do. You are setting a
beautiful example to your kids about keeping commitments to
yourself, about self care, about self love, about all
these things that generationally are going to. You are
(44:25):
changing generations. You are creating legacy. Like, I'm trying
not to cry right now because I'm such a,
like, emotional person, but. But we don't realize sometimes
something that may seem small, the great effect and
impact that it is having on us and our
(44:47):
life and our family and generations of our family.
I agree. Like.
Oh, like, yeah.
You know, I never even thought about that, McKinney.
I never even. I was just focusing on them
today, the kids today, and what I could do
today. I never even thought about the fact that
(45:09):
that could rewrite the future generations and their way
of thinking about themselves. Wow. That's. That's.
I saw, um. I don't know if I can
find it right now, but I. But there was
a post that I saw on instagram, and I
had shared it in my story because I was
(45:30):
like, this is very powerful. But it was talking
about generations of healing and how. When. Let me
see. I found it here. When you heal yourself,
you heal the people around you. You heal your
family, your children, their children. Where did it go?
I lost it. Where did it go? Okay. Let
(45:52):
me. I scrolled too fast. Oh, there it is.
Okay.
You heal the people around you. You heal your
family, your children, their children, and their children's children.
You heal generations and generations. So what you're doing
is generational healing.
Oh, that just puts it into context. Wow. Yeah.
(46:16):
Yeah. So thank you for the work that you
were doing on you and future generations.
Thank you. And right back at you. Right back
at you. Yeah. For our children and anybody who
they're gonna touch, because it's not just our children
and their families, but it could be anybody that
(46:38):
they're gonna touch along the way.
Yeah, the butterfly effect, right.
That, too. Yeah.
So I would love if you could tell the
listeners where they could stay connected with you, where
they can learn more from you and about you.
My. Thank you. My handle on Instagram, that's another
(47:02):
story. But, yeah, I didn't. Yeah. So my handle
on Instagram is big fit underscore. I underscore run.
So even if you just punch in big fit,
I should pop up and then my magazine is
called run your life magazine on Instagram. Love it.
(47:27):
Love it.
I will definitely have your handles in the details
section so they could just click and connect with
you directly. I normally do a rapid fire at
the end of every episode, but I feel like
we have given so many gems just on your
experiences and your story. I just want them to
(47:49):
go back and listen again and take notes and
highlight. And I want to thank you. I'm thinking
about your experiences and your journey. And usually, you
know, the beauty of sharing your story is that,
you know, it connects with someone else. It connects
(48:10):
with their story. There's something they can take from
it. And it's like listening to how you've used
your running journey, your five k a day to
heal. And I'm thinking to myself, it's interesting around
the same time. Like, I don't. I don't run,
but I do five k every day. And sometimes
on weekends I try to do ten. But it's
(48:33):
like all the similarities, listening to your story. And
I'm thinking to myself, like, my fitbit lets me
know every single day. My average is like, 5.
All that good stuff. But it's like we don't
realize the patterns that we are creating, how generationally
they are helping, and the beauty of running in
(48:54):
nature and grounding all the practices that we are
doing today to heal ourselves, how they're healing future
generations. So I want to thank you, Sandra, for
not just making the commitment to yourself, but sharing
that with the world, sharing that with your children,
being an example and, you know, leading by example
(49:16):
and showing us, you know, what it looks like
just to be the best version of ourselves, even
when it's hard.
And even, you know, being the best version of
yourself. But even when other people think you should
be a different version and you're taking a stance
on, no, this is my version, and I will
(49:38):
continue to only choose my version over what anybody
else thinks. I should look like, I should run
like I, you know, that we have to take
a stance, and we have to teach our children
that the version of themselves that they think is
good enough is the version that they should stick
(50:00):
to, not what somebody else thinks. And the other
thing I just wanted to offer here is that
if anybody has an interesting story that they'd like
to share in the magazine, all of the contributors
are real people sharing real stories. So that's, you
know, part of this sharing.
(50:23):
Love it. Thank you. Love for having.
Love it. Amazing.
Thank you, Sandra, so much. And to all the
healers out there, until next time, subscribe on all
platforms. Don't forget to rate the show. Leave us
a review on Apple Podcast. I just want to
thank each and every one of you that continues
to listen each week to help the show rank
globally in the top 1.5% of most popular podcasts,
(50:46):
which is over 3 million podcasts out there. So
it's mind blowing, but I want to challenge you
to share your aha moments. Share any gems that
Sandra left with you in screenshot this week's episode.
You can tag Sandra at Bigfit, underscore I run.
You can tag myself at the real McKinney Smith.
(51:06):
A healthy community is a healing community, and a
healing community is full of hope because it has
seen its own people weather, survive, and thrive. So
let's continue to heal her.
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