May 21, 2025 • 29 mins
Author and psychotherapist Britt Frank returns to the MGMA Insights podcast to discuss her new book, Align Your Mind. She and host Daniel Williams explore the power of "parts work," how to navigate the inner critic, manage stress during high-pressure times, and lead yourself with more clarity and compassion.
Key Takeaways:
- 00:45 — Welcoming back Britt Frank; Introduction to her new book, Align Your Mind; book availability at local and national retailers.
- 02:15 — Why "Align" Your Mind, Not "Fix" It: Britt compares mental health to tire or spinal alignment — a shift in thinking about how we manage ourselves.
- 06:10 — Introduction to "Parts Work": Understanding the mind as a system of different parts and voices; practical everyday examples (e.g., "part of me wants to relax, part of me wants to work").
- 09:10 — How to Build a Relationship with Your Inner Critic: Instead of fighting it, validate it ("That's a little bit true") to deactivate stress responses.
- 13:30 — Real-World Mindfulness: Daniel shares his retreat disappointment; Britt explains how to "diffuse" from negative thinking and find alternative truths.
- 18:50 — Managing Stress in Healthcare Settings: How to realign expectations realistically when facing staff shortages, flu season, and patient overflow.
- 22:30 — Micro-Yes Strategy: How to break big challenges into tiny, doable steps to prevent overwhelm and support momentum.
Resources:
- Britt Frank’s Website: brittfrank.com
- Purchase Align Your Mind at Amazon, Barnes & Noble or Target
- Connect with Britt Frank on LinkedIn
Additional Resources:
Email us at dwilliams@mgma.com if you would like to appear on an episode. If you have a question about your practice that you would like us to answer, send an email to advisor@mgma.com. Don't forget to subscribe to our network wherever you get your podcasts.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Daniel Williams (00:53):
Well, hi, everyone. I'm Daniel Williams,
senior editor at MGMA, host ofthe MGMA Podcast Network. We are
back with another MGMA Insightspodcast, and we have Britt Frank
joining us joining us for asecond time this year. Britt,
spoke as a keynote speaker atone of our events earlier this
(01:14):
year and now has a new book. Letme get this title right, Britt.
Align your mind, tame your innercritic, and make peace with your
shadow using the power of partswork. That is I love that
subtitle. That's a lot there.First of all, welcome, and we'll
talk a lot about the book.Welcome, Britt.
Britt Frank (01:34):
Thanks for having you back on. And, yes, that is
the most epicly long subtitle ofall time.
Daniel Williams (01:41):
Yeah. I love that. I started saying it, then
I just kept going, and I keptgoing. And maybe that's the
whole point here. So, first ofall, welcome back.
We talked to you before youspoke at the MGMA event. Just
fill us in. How did that go?
Britt Frank (01:55):
Oh, it was such a blast. I so I love conferences.
I I have this weird thing whereI think conference people are
the best people. We've all leftour normal day to day lives, and
we're gathered for the samepurpose, and we speak the same
language. And I had such a blastbeing conference.
So thank you everybody who cameand who was there and who made
(02:17):
me feel so warmly welcomed. Andand book book is launching. The
book is about to be birthed aweek from today.
Daniel Williams (02:23):
That is so good. Yeah. By the time y'all
hear this, the book will be out.We'll have a direct link. I
mean, there are links out thereright now because I have it
bookmarked on Amazon.
You can preorder there, but alsolots of other places you can get
it. And, Britt, you can sharethat information with us. Like,
right now, where would peoplego? They go to the Amazon, and
(02:46):
then are there other book placeswhere you're directing people as
well, your website?
Britt Frank (02:51):
I mean, I I would always start with local
booksellers. Yeah. Or local, butyou can get it on Amazon,
Target, you know, Barnes andNoble, wherever wherever you buy
books, it is available.
Daniel Williams (03:01):
That's right. And, Britt, I will share with
you. I also am in a waitingline, on a couple of, library
apps. I'm on Libby and Hooplaand oh gosh. There's one more I
just joined this week,everybody.
I will share that with y'all aswell. So I have been out there
(03:22):
bookmarking it to place it onhold at all these library apps
as well. So that is really Yeah.So let's talk about it. We'll
just stay with the main title.
We won't, you know, do the fulltitle every time. Align your
mind. Talk about the origin ofthis, where your thinking was
coming to to focus on this, andtell us a little bit about the
(03:45):
writing and research process.
Britt Frank (03:47):
So I called the book a mind because as a
practicing psychotherapist, Ithink the emphasis, especially
these days, is very much onwhat's wrong. What's wrong with
my mind? How do I fix my mind?How do I change my mind? And
there's not enough inherentlyspoken about what's right about
our minds.
And we're all taught till mostof us are taught to think that
(04:08):
our brains are this evil entitythat sets out to destroy our
plans and interrupt our goalsand plague us with bad habits.
But I called the book Align YourMinds because much like tires on
a car or your spine, when thewhen the things are aligned,
meaning they're in rightrelationship to each other, life
along smoothly. And parts ofourselves that we think we like,
(04:31):
like the inner critic and thesaboteur and the procrastinator
and the perfectionist. What ifall of those parts could have a
seat, the giant conference tableinside our heads. And the book
goes into the the hows, thepractical tactic.
Here's how you train your brainto be on your team instead of
feeling to it all the time.
Daniel Williams (04:51):
Okay. Is there any psychic connection here?
Because my tire light flickeredon as I drove here. And, also,
my back is a little tweaked, andI started stretching when you
said spine and and aligning yourtires. But I'm guessing nothing
on the psychic side here.
Right?
Britt Frank (05:09):
That's so funny. Well, it's a common dilemma.
Right? And with tire alignment,if your tire light goes on, you
don't go, oh, no. Now it mustdestroy my car, and I'm a
terrible driver.
But with things like anxiety orthe inner critic, if you don't
know that that's just thebrain's check engine light
saying we need to make a shift,you're gonna think the problem
is inside you instead of analignment problem. And it's a
(05:32):
lot easier to align your mindthan to erase it. You can't get
rid of your parts, but you cantrain them. The book is sort of
like a giant HR experiment takeninward. Here's how you can't
riff your mind.
You can't, you know, send themaway. You can't put them on
furlough. You're sort of stuckwith your brain, so we might
well develop a relationship withit that creates an optimal life.
Daniel Williams (05:55):
Right. I love that. So talk about the writing
process a little bit. How longwhen you from first idea to
getting it published here in Mayof twenty twenty five, what how
long was that, and what's theresearch and the writing process
like for you?
Britt Frank (06:11):
Yeah. So my first book was five years of research
and careful plotting andplanning and pitching and
getting rejected a thousandtimes. And after the first book
came out, I continued to pitchmy publisher with ideas. And as
anyone who's in the writingworld knows, it's a lot of no.
No.
No. This is terrible. No.Thanks. But no.
No. And then I had a middle ofthe night idea, and it it wasn't
(06:33):
even a fully formed idea. I Ididn't even have a proposal. I
just shot off an email. Hey.
How about I do a book aboutthis? And then within a week, I
had a deal. And then it was,hey. Can you give this to us in
six months? Fortunately, thetopic is based on a model of
therapy that I've been trainedin for many, many years.
So the research had already beenfront loaded, but it was, okay.
(06:56):
You have a book deal. Go. Andthen it was six months of up at,
you know, five in the morning toten, I write. Ten to five, I
practice.
Five to ten, I admin, and then Igo to sleep and start it again
the next day.
Daniel Williams (07:06):
Well, good. I'm glad you made it out on the
other side. What did you do whenyou, sent off that draft and
could exhale for a moment? Didyou go on a vacation? Did you
just get right back to thegrind?
What happened?
Britt Frank (07:19):
It's so funny. And then every month, I went away
for a week because really can'twell, I couldn't put together a
book without taking a step awayso every so often. The last
chapter was so anticlimactic. Itwas, you know, I've been
wrestling with I think the introand the conclusion of a book are
particularly important to getthe tone right, and I did not
use AI to write the intro or theconclusion. And so I'm wrestling
(07:42):
and I'm wrestling.
And then all of a sudden, it waslike, oh, this is how the book
ends. And it was like, okay. Iguess I'll go eat lunch now. I
guess I'll go take a walk withmy dog. It was very just like,
oh, I guess the storm is over.
It's sort of you don't thinkit'll end, and then the sun
comes back out. And it's, oh, Iguess it's nice. I guess I don't
have to get it before in themorning every day anymore. Yeah.
Daniel Williams (08:02):
That is so good. I love that. So you
introduce a term. It's in theadditional title we hear that we
read earlier, parts work. AndI'm not even sure if I'm
pronouncing putting the emphasison which part there.
So tell us about parts work.What is that? What goes into it?
Britt Frank (08:21):
It's so funny because parts work is so trendy
now for Gen Z and, you know,their contemporaries. But it's
been around forever, and mygeneration never heard of it.
And most people that I work withhave also heard of it unless
they're in my industry. And it'sso simple. And parts work is
this.
Parts work is the idea that yourmind, just like your body, just
(08:43):
like your car, just like anycomplex item, is not the
singular thing, but it's made ofparts. More simply put, everyone
knows the feeling of, okay, it'sSunday afternoon and part of me
knows I should get up and getsome housework done, but this
other part of me just really isinvested in watching White Lotus
for another episode and anotherepisode and another episode. And
(09:04):
I have these parts of me thatwant to do things and parts of
me don't want to do things.Parts of me who love my family
and parts of me who need a breakfrom these people or else I'm
going to scream. Parts worktakes that notion and puts it
into action.
Yes. Your mind, like your bodyis made of parts. You would not
treat a sore throat the same wayyou would a fractured knee. So
(09:27):
why do we think our mind can beapproached in a singular unified
way? Kind of glibly put, we allhave multiple personalities
Daniel Williams (09:35):
Right.
Britt Frank (09:35):
And they all need to get along better. And this
book is the how for thatproblem.
Daniel Williams (09:39):
Okay. Well, let's talk about navigating
parts work then. I'm lookingthrough some notes here I made
about it. So let us understandthat a little bit more. What
does it look like in practice?
You gave some examples of howyou might love the family, but
hey, I need some me time aswell. Let's talk about it from a
(10:01):
health care perspective.Practice administrators, you got
to meet a lot of them at ourconference, how they balance
their lives, how they put theseparts to work and make
everything work for them.
Britt Frank (10:13):
So I think anyone who's in a health care arena in
any capacity innately is a giverand cares about humanity. You
tend to not end up in thisindustry otherwise. Well, I
suppose some do. But generallyspeaking, if you're listening to
this podcast, you are probablysomeone who cares about making
humanity better. But most of ushave a voice that says you're
not doing enough.
You're not showing up enough.You're not working hard enough.
(10:36):
And we call that the innercritic. And that part of us were
told, just ignore it. Just getrid of Just tell it to take eye.
Daniel Williams (10:44):
Right.
Britt Frank (10:45):
But that doesn't work. And if that worked, it
would have. So parts work isthis idea that, well, what if
you could actually talk to thatvoice? Many of us think our
thoughts are there and they'reuniversally true and whatever we
think we must believe, andthat's just not how minds work.
Mhmm.
So my solution for healthcarepeople is when you hear that
(11:05):
voice say, you're not workinghard enough, instead of fighting
with it, instead of arguing withit or trying to get rid of it,
what if you validated it? Whatif you said, you're right. You
know what? There's not enoughwork I could do to solve the
problems facing the health careindustry. It doesn't mean that
I'm a bad person.
It just means I'm telling thatlittle voice, and here's here's
(11:26):
what you say. Not, oh my gosh.You're right. I'm terrible. You
say this.
You know what? That's a littlebit true. Because any critical
thought when it's met with,yeah, that's a little true
deactivates its charge, And thenyou're less likely to have the
cortisol spike and all thestress hormones, which then
amplify all the things thatwe're suffering with to begin
(11:48):
with. And so the sort of radicalapproach from parts work is what
if you started with validation?Oh my gosh.
You're a terrible parent. Well,yeah, that's probably a little
bit true. A little bit of truthis sort of microdosing the
little nugget of truth becauseno one's perfect. So if
something is a little bit true,that leaves room for nuance,
which leaves space for choiceand lots of other things. So the
(12:13):
phrase, yeah, that's a littlebit true, does a lot of job
comes to the inner critic.
Daniel Williams (12:16):
I love that. That's so cool. Let's talk about
the inner critic just a littlebit more and building that
relationship with it. Anybodywho's listened to this podcast,
we've had several episodes wherewe talk about mindfulness,
about, you know, either havingthat active formal meditation of
sitting, closing the eyes, orlowering the gaze, and following
(12:39):
the breath. But there are otherways to do that as well.
But when you do that particularaction I was just talking about,
anybody that's done that,suddenly they have what we call
the monkey mind, and they'rethey're the monkey mind may may
not be criticizing, but it'sthat inner inner dialogue. You
know? There's something, a storygoing on. Again, how do you work
(13:05):
with that? How do you work withthat in a positive way or even
simply a neutral way?
If if the mind and the stress isgoing in a certain direction,
maybe we can't get it in a happyplace, so to speak. You know?
Maybe that's a misnomer that ifwe meditate, we're suddenly
happy. We may not be happy, butwe may be present with what is
(13:27):
in that present moment. So Igave you a lot to think about
there, but I see you nodding.
So please just share yourthoughts on this about how we
work with that, if we wanna callit an inner critic or a monkey
mind or what's going on and cantake us into story time when we
need to be right here right now.
Britt Frank (13:46):
So it's interesting because meditation, the kind
most people think of is the calmthe mind, center the mind, clear
the mind, and that's a beautifultype. And it's not the only
kind. Right. And sometimes it'simpossible to do that. And so we
do want a a solution to, well,is meditation just off the table
for me if I can't quiet themonkey mind?
(14:06):
And parts would suggest, well,if you have a monkey mind, why
don't we go to the circus?Because the stories are only
problematic if we feel there'sno structure to them. And so
what Parks' work would do withall those monkey mind thoughts
is, well, let's turn all ofthose thoughts into imagine
they're people with an opinion.And what if we could sit on the
(14:28):
I'm changing metaphors here. Sonow take all the monkey minds.
Imagine they're just a bunch ofpeople yelling at you. What if
we were to all sit around thecampfire and share those
stories? I'm listening to thestoryteller parts of me, and I'm
not the storyteller, and thestoryteller is not me. And any
type of mindfulness creates theobserver and the thing being
(14:50):
observed. And when you can besort of the inner CEO, as I like
to call it, but if you'resitting around the campfire with
all of your storytelling parts,you can listen to them, don't
have to be driven by them.
And you can say to all of them,that's probably a little bit
true. Thank you for that. Andeven the most critical parts of
ourselves, if you were I callthis the coffee cup solution.
(15:12):
Sit down at a table with twocups of coffee. Put one in front
of you and one across from you.
Imagine that that voice that'syelling at you is sitting there.
What would it actually you toknow? Because when parts of
ourselves are listened to, theydon't yell, and they don't
scream, and they don't abuse uswith critical thoughts. So it's
really about treat your mindwith the same consideration you
(15:32):
would a friend or even anemployee.
Daniel Williams (15:34):
Yeah. I'm hearing you say that, and I'm
thinking to my other self overthere, are you gonna finish that
coffee? Because I think I maytake it and finish it if you're
not going to. This is fun. Ienjoy talking to you about this
because it's what I'm interestedin.
Let me give you a scenario, andI want you to just help us
understand because I think ourlisteners, we've all been in
(15:55):
this kind of situation before.So over the weekend, my family
and I had found a little daylong meditation retreat, mindful
retreat up in the mountains herein Colorado. We drove up there,
and there were five or six othercars there. And we quickly
ascertained from the otherpeople that it had been
(16:16):
canceled. And when we hear thatkind of news, when we've built
something up for a week orwhatever it has been, we have an
expectation.
I know for myself, in the past,I've allowed it to kind of ruin
my day. I've taken this littlething because I had an
expectation built up, but whatwe found was, well, the facility
(16:39):
is open. There are mats here. Wecan put the cushions and the
mats down, have a meditation.Then there was beautiful gardens
up in the Colorado Mountains,and we walked around the
mountains and enjoyed a littlehike there, and then had a
really nice lunch beside a creekand just were very peaceful.
(17:00):
We didn't let it ruin our day.We kind of rolled with the
punches, so to speak, rolledwith whatever that outcome was,
and then just took it fromthere. And I want you to speak
to a little bit about that.What's going on when either the
inner critic or that selfdefeating attitude, this door
closed, so I'm closing down now.So tell us a little bit about
that.
What's going on there in themind, and then how do we work
(17:23):
with that? How do we align ourmind to what's actually
happening?
Britt Frank (17:26):
I love that story because it's so true. I remember
going to a retreat and beingready to be all zenned out, and
then I was so angry. I was justso, like, black. All my love and
light went right out the window.So I love that you made the best
of that situation.
So what happens often is what Icall being fused. So if you
imagine that your mind is madeof all different parts, when the
(17:47):
parts are all fused together,you're only aware, you're only
conscious of one reality. Mymeditation retreat was canceled.
I was looking forward to it. I'mdisappointed.
Therefore, everything isterrible. Therefore, nothing
goes my way. Therefore,therefore. And so if you're
fused with your parts, then youdon't have the ability to see
the whole board. You can't seethe whole picture.
(18:07):
And so I call that beingdiffused from your parts. And
you'll be refused when you haveno sense of your choices. Your
emotions are out of whack. Feelslike everything and always and
nothing in these very bigsweeping statements. Defusing,
which is really just beingmindful that you are not your
parts.
You are not your thoughts. Youare the observer of the
(18:29):
thoughts. Once you're defused,then you can say to yourself,
well, yeah, this little bittrue. It's actually a lot of it
true that we're disappointed.And what else is true?
I call this the making an alsotrue list because you just wanna
be swept away by yourdisappointment, But you also
don't want to be like, well, Ishouldn't be that upset because
(18:50):
it's no big deal. It's not thatthat you know? No. No. No.
Yes. This is disappointing. Alsotrue. There are mats and there
are mountains and we have eachother. And so it's an improv
comedy principle, actually.
It's called the yes and wherewhatever you're doing with your
scene partner, you always justsay yes no matter how bonkers
what they're suggesting isaliens had taken over the
(19:12):
grocery store. In an improvscene, my job is to say, yes.
And help is on the or whatever.And so you can learn to say yes
to whatever distressuncomfortable thought is coming
up. Yes.
And is how you diffuse from thatmushed together sense of I don't
have multiple parts. I don'thave multiple choices.
(19:33):
Everything is one singularthing.
Daniel Williams (19:35):
Okay. That is so cool. So let's put it into a
medical practice setting. It'sflu season. Maybe the people at
practice are overrun with peoplethere with the flu.
But, also, hey. Half the staffhas the flu. So now we're
understaffed, and we'reoverwhelmed with all the people
coming in. And there's babiescrying. There's grown ups
(19:58):
crying.
Everybody feels terrible, andthere's a lot of stress. How do
how do our listeners, whenthey're dealt with this kind of
situation, maybe they have toeven run from the back of the
office to help out in the frontof the office, just everybody's
little bit of chaos, little bitof things going on. How do they
work with that? How do theyalign the mind again to make
this as achievable a day, youknow, a goal, whatever it might
(20:24):
be? How do how do we get throughthis?
You know?
Britt Frank (20:27):
So it starts by setting expectations in an
appropriate place. In asituation like that, you're not
gonna be able to do all thethings for all the people.
Right. When you're understaffedand overworked and it's flu
season and baby adults arecrying and people are screaming
and you don't have enoughhealth, the it's not actually
the chaos that takes us out ofalignment. The chaos, if you're
(20:51):
in health care, is a Tuesday.
What takes us out of alignmentis the belief that we should be
more or do more or have more orbe able to give more. And that's
the belief we wanna go with,well, yeah, that's a little bit
true. Else is true. Mhmm. Youknow, you're not working hard
enough, and you're never gonnabe able to get all this work
done today.
Yeah. That's a little bit true.And also true, no one can. And
(21:14):
that's where you get to giveyourself expectations that match
the context. I'm not suggestingsettling for mediocrity, but we
also wanna be realistic.
Striving for excellence is goingto produce, if not joy, at least
a sense of peace. Striving forperfection will always do shame
no matter how hard you work orhow much you give.
Daniel Williams (21:35):
Okay. In your book, you talk about the
difference between fixingourselves versus leading our
parts. Talk about that. Whattalk about those two principles
and what that looks like inpractice.
Britt Frank (21:50):
So I think there's this trend in the zeitgeist. Now
that we talk about feelings,every feeling that I'm feeling
needs to be expressed inwhatever way I feel like, and my
triggers must be avoided, and Imust be comfortable no matter
what. And I appreciate thatwe're talking about feelings.
I'd rather do that than not. Ithink it's important to know
(22:10):
that our job is to lead ourfeelings and our parts, not to
be led by them.
I'll give you an So if I were toshow up at a meditation class
and someone took my spot, thisis a real example. And again, my
I love humanity is now replacedby that person is sitting in my
spot. That's my spot. So I'mhaving that thought. That's a
(22:33):
part of me.
That's a snarky part that wantswhat she wants. I can observe
that thought. I can notice it. Icould tell that part of me.
Yeah.
That's a little bit true. It's abummer that she's sitting in our
spot. Also true, we're in classand there's plenty of spots.
That is me not trying to changethat part. I'm not saying, you
should be grateful that we caneven be in a class right now.
(22:55):
I'm just saying, yeah. I hearyou thought. I hear part of me.
Gotcha. You're probably a littlebit right.
And now I am going to make adecision on behalf of the team
of my parts, and not every partgets to have what they want when
they want it. Just like a familyor a company. A competent CEO
will take employees' feelingsand thoughts into consideration,
(23:17):
but the leader of a largeorganization knows you can't
make everybody happy in everyinstance every time, and we have
to make decisions on behalf ofthe group. Not everybody gets to
have everything they want allthe time. That's chaos.
That's not leadership. That'snot efficiency. And we can treat
our minds with the same skillthat leaders treat companies, or
I should say qualified leaders,competent leaders treat
(23:40):
companies.
Daniel Williams (23:41):
Right. I have a question for you, and it's the
relationship we have. Maybe youcan give us some examples of
what you have with technologybecause you use the term
efficiency, and we keep gettingthese incredible tools, these AI
tools, these other platformsthat make things just go faster
and faster, but then I can't bealone. I suddenly see, but I
(24:06):
feel even more overwhelmed, youknow, or I feel even more, you
know, pressed here or, okay,let's go do that, or I just have
additional time to think about,oh my gosh. What should I be
doing right now?
You know? So what what's yourrelationship with technology,
and then what's some advice youcan give us how we can work with
(24:27):
all these incredible tools thatwe have but not make us more
overwhelmed with things?
Britt Frank (24:33):
I'm a fan of AI, and I don't see its its
potential for problems and theoverwhelming nature of, well,
which tool do I use? And whichtechnology do I use? And how do
I learn it? And so, again,working in health care is an
overwhelming task regardless ofwhat century you're in, what
tools are available to you. So Ithink when it comes to our tech,
(24:57):
one a good question to ask iswhat are my choices?
Because if you are beingmandated to use a particular
type of software, you're notgonna have decision fatigue, but
you're gonna need to learn howto use it. If you're told use
whatever you want, you might getdecision fatigue. So if we're
gonna answer the question, whatdo I do? Whether it's about tech
or overwhelm or burnout orwhatever, we have to start with,
(25:21):
can we make a list of three tofive choices? They don't have to
be good.
We don't have to like them. Butlet's start by identifying a
menu of options. Just a veryactive listing choices can
deactivate an overwhelmed brain.Of those choices, what are we
absolutely not willing to do?That's gonna narrow it down even
(25:41):
further.
And then once you have a choicethat's reasonable, then I call
this a micro yes. Break thatdown into as many pieces as it
takes to get a tiny little winunder your belts. If it's a it's
a a micro yes is taking a stepso small you feel silly doing
it. That's how you know it's amicro yes.
Daniel Williams (25:59):
Okay. One last question about the book. What's
your favorite part about it?What is in it like for somebody
who's, oh, this soundsinteresting. I might get this.
What would be your one pitch topeople? This is something that
just lights me up when I thinkabout it. Maybe it's a case
study. Maybe it's an anecdote.Maybe it's a tool.
(26:19):
What's something you wanna sharewith us about Align Your Mind?
Britt Frank (26:22):
Oh, I love this question. So what I love about
the book is that it puts intojust a general nonclinical
population this idea that yourmind is made of parts. This is
not a trendy idea. It's not myidea. It has been around since
humans painted on Polaris.
The idea that part of me wantsto do this thing, but part of me
(26:44):
wants to do that thing. It's inour language. It's in, you know,
every major culture has aversion of it. And so I love
that align your mind takessomething so universal that's
been around for so long that noone's ever heard of. Like, parts
work is the greatest idea aboutconsciousness that no one's ever
heard of.
And so I love that I got tocontribute to the body of work
(27:06):
that normalizes that humans arecomplex and have a multiverse
inside us. It doesn't make uscrazy. It makes us human.
Daniel Williams (27:16):
I love that. Alright. Well, Britt Frank,
thank you so much for joining usagain, and it's been wonderful
to have you on here. Britt's newbook is Align Your Mind. I've
got it here releasing on05/13/2025.
By the time y'all hear this, itwill be in your local
bookstores. It will also be onthose online bookstores.
(27:40):
Wherever you get your books,please reach out. Look for it.
It's a wonderful book.
Britt, thank you for joining usagain.
Britt Frank (27:47):
Thanks for having me. It's so good to see you
again.
Daniel Williams (27:49):
Alright. Everybody, that is gonna do it
for this episode of MGMAInsights podcast. I will put
direct links to several, localbooksellers here to me in the
Denver area, but also some ofthose national sites as well.
So, again, thank you all forlistening to the MGMA Insights
(28:10):
podcast.
Well, hi, everyone. I'm Daniel Williams,
senior editor at MGMA, host ofthe MGMA Podcast Network. We are
back with another MGMA Insightspodcast, and we have Britt Frank
joining us joining us for asecond time this year. Britt,
spoke as a keynote speaker atone of our events earlier this
(01:14):
year and now has a new book. Letme get this title right, Britt.
Align your mind, tame your innercritic, and make peace with your
shadow using the power of partswork. That is I love that
subtitle. That's a lot there.First of all, welcome, and we'll
talk a lot about the book.Welcome, Britt.
Britt Frank (01:34):
Thanks for having you back on. And, yes, that is
the most epicly long subtitle ofall time.
Daniel Williams (01:41):
Yeah. I love that. I started saying it, then
I just kept going, and I keptgoing. And maybe that's the
whole point here. So, first ofall, welcome back.
We talked to you before youspoke at the MGMA event. Just
fill us in. How did that go?
Britt Frank (01:55):
Oh, it was such a blast. I so I love conferences.
I I have this weird thing whereI think conference people are
the best people. We've all leftour normal day to day lives, and
we're gathered for the samepurpose, and we speak the same
language. And I had such a blastbeing conference.
So thank you everybody who cameand who was there and who made
(02:17):
me feel so warmly welcomed. Andand book book is launching. The
book is about to be birthed aweek from today.
Daniel Williams (02:23):
That is so good. Yeah. By the time y'all
hear this, the book will be out.We'll have a direct link. I
mean, there are links out thereright now because I have it
bookmarked on Amazon.
You can preorder there, but alsolots of other places you can get
it. And, Britt, you can sharethat information with us. Like,
right now, where would peoplego? They go to the Amazon, and
(02:46):
then are there other book placeswhere you're directing people as
well, your website?
Britt Frank (02:51):
I mean, I I would always start with local
booksellers. Yeah. Or local, butyou can get it on Amazon,
Target, you know, Barnes andNoble, wherever wherever you buy
books, it is available.
Daniel Williams (03:01):
That's right. And, Britt, I will share with
you. I also am in a waitingline, on a couple of, library
apps. I'm on Libby and Hooplaand oh gosh. There's one more I
just joined this week,everybody.
I will share that with y'all aswell. So I have been out there
(03:22):
bookmarking it to place it onhold at all these library apps
as well. So that is really Yeah.So let's talk about it. We'll
just stay with the main title.
We won't, you know, do the fulltitle every time. Align your
mind. Talk about the origin ofthis, where your thinking was
coming to to focus on this, andtell us a little bit about the
(03:45):
writing and research process.
Britt Frank (03:47):
So I called the book a mind because as a
practicing psychotherapist, Ithink the emphasis, especially
these days, is very much onwhat's wrong. What's wrong with
my mind? How do I fix my mind?How do I change my mind? And
there's not enough inherentlyspoken about what's right about
our minds.
And we're all taught till mostof us are taught to think that
(04:08):
our brains are this evil entitythat sets out to destroy our
plans and interrupt our goalsand plague us with bad habits.
But I called the book Align YourMinds because much like tires on
a car or your spine, when thewhen the things are aligned,
meaning they're in rightrelationship to each other, life
along smoothly. And parts ofourselves that we think we like,
(04:31):
like the inner critic and thesaboteur and the procrastinator
and the perfectionist. What ifall of those parts could have a
seat, the giant conference tableinside our heads. And the book
goes into the the hows, thepractical tactic.
Here's how you train your brainto be on your team instead of
feeling to it all the time.
Daniel Williams (04:51):
Okay. Is there any psychic connection here?
Because my tire light flickeredon as I drove here. And, also,
my back is a little tweaked, andI started stretching when you
said spine and and aligning yourtires. But I'm guessing nothing
on the psychic side here.
Right?
Britt Frank (05:09):
That's so funny. Well, it's a common dilemma.
Right? And with tire alignment,if your tire light goes on, you
don't go, oh, no. Now it mustdestroy my car, and I'm a
terrible driver.
But with things like anxiety orthe inner critic, if you don't
know that that's just thebrain's check engine light
saying we need to make a shift,you're gonna think the problem
is inside you instead of analignment problem. And it's a
(05:32):
lot easier to align your mindthan to erase it. You can't get
rid of your parts, but you cantrain them. The book is sort of
like a giant HR experiment takeninward. Here's how you can't
riff your mind.
You can't, you know, send themaway. You can't put them on
furlough. You're sort of stuckwith your brain, so we might
well develop a relationship withit that creates an optimal life.
Daniel Williams (05:55):
Right. I love that. So talk about the writing
process a little bit. How longwhen you from first idea to
getting it published here in Mayof twenty twenty five, what how
long was that, and what's theresearch and the writing process
like for you?
Britt Frank (06:11):
Yeah. So my first book was five years of research
and careful plotting andplanning and pitching and
getting rejected a thousandtimes. And after the first book
came out, I continued to pitchmy publisher with ideas. And as
anyone who's in the writingworld knows, it's a lot of no.
No.
No. This is terrible. No.Thanks. But no.
No. And then I had a middle ofthe night idea, and it it wasn't
(06:33):
even a fully formed idea. I Ididn't even have a proposal. I
just shot off an email. Hey.
How about I do a book aboutthis? And then within a week, I
had a deal. And then it was,hey. Can you give this to us in
six months? Fortunately, thetopic is based on a model of
therapy that I've been trainedin for many, many years.
So the research had already beenfront loaded, but it was, okay.
(06:56):
You have a book deal. Go. Andthen it was six months of up at,
you know, five in the morning toten, I write. Ten to five, I
practice.
Five to ten, I admin, and then Igo to sleep and start it again
the next day.
Daniel Williams (07:06):
Well, good. I'm glad you made it out on the
other side. What did you do whenyou, sent off that draft and
could exhale for a moment? Didyou go on a vacation? Did you
just get right back to thegrind?
What happened?
Britt Frank (07:19):
It's so funny. And then every month, I went away
for a week because really can'twell, I couldn't put together a
book without taking a step awayso every so often. The last
chapter was so anticlimactic. Itwas, you know, I've been
wrestling with I think the introand the conclusion of a book are
particularly important to getthe tone right, and I did not
use AI to write the intro or theconclusion. And so I'm wrestling
(07:42):
and I'm wrestling.
And then all of a sudden, it waslike, oh, this is how the book
ends. And it was like, okay. Iguess I'll go eat lunch now. I
guess I'll go take a walk withmy dog. It was very just like,
oh, I guess the storm is over.
It's sort of you don't thinkit'll end, and then the sun
comes back out. And it's, oh, Iguess it's nice. I guess I don't
have to get it before in themorning every day anymore. Yeah.
Daniel Williams (08:02):
That is so good. I love that. So you
introduce a term. It's in theadditional title we hear that we
read earlier, parts work. AndI'm not even sure if I'm
pronouncing putting the emphasison which part there.
So tell us about parts work.What is that? What goes into it?
Britt Frank (08:21):
It's so funny because parts work is so trendy
now for Gen Z and, you know,their contemporaries. But it's
been around forever, and mygeneration never heard of it.
And most people that I work withhave also heard of it unless
they're in my industry. And it'sso simple. And parts work is
this.
Parts work is the idea that yourmind, just like your body, just
(08:43):
like your car, just like anycomplex item, is not the
singular thing, but it's made ofparts. More simply put, everyone
knows the feeling of, okay, it'sSunday afternoon and part of me
knows I should get up and getsome housework done, but this
other part of me just really isinvested in watching White Lotus
for another episode and anotherepisode and another episode. And
(09:04):
I have these parts of me thatwant to do things and parts of
me don't want to do things.Parts of me who love my family
and parts of me who need a breakfrom these people or else I'm
going to scream. Parts worktakes that notion and puts it
into action.
Yes. Your mind, like your bodyis made of parts. You would not
treat a sore throat the same wayyou would a fractured knee. So
(09:27):
why do we think our mind can beapproached in a singular unified
way? Kind of glibly put, we allhave multiple personalities
Daniel Williams (09:35):
Right.
Britt Frank (09:35):
And they all need to get along better. And this
book is the how for thatproblem.
Daniel Williams (09:39):
Okay. Well, let's talk about navigating
parts work then. I'm lookingthrough some notes here I made
about it. So let us understandthat a little bit more. What
does it look like in practice?
You gave some examples of howyou might love the family, but
hey, I need some me time aswell. Let's talk about it from a
(10:01):
health care perspective.Practice administrators, you got
to meet a lot of them at ourconference, how they balance
their lives, how they put theseparts to work and make
everything work for them.
Britt Frank (10:13):
So I think anyone who's in a health care arena in
any capacity innately is a giverand cares about humanity. You
tend to not end up in thisindustry otherwise. Well, I
suppose some do. But generallyspeaking, if you're listening to
this podcast, you are probablysomeone who cares about making
humanity better. But most of ushave a voice that says you're
not doing enough.
You're not showing up enough.You're not working hard enough.
(10:36):
And we call that the innercritic. And that part of us were
told, just ignore it. Just getrid of Just tell it to take eye.
Daniel Williams (10:44):
Right.
Britt Frank (10:45):
But that doesn't work. And if that worked, it
would have. So parts work isthis idea that, well, what if
you could actually talk to thatvoice? Many of us think our
thoughts are there and they'reuniversally true and whatever we
think we must believe, andthat's just not how minds work.
Mhmm.
So my solution for healthcarepeople is when you hear that
(11:05):
voice say, you're not workinghard enough, instead of fighting
with it, instead of arguing withit or trying to get rid of it,
what if you validated it? Whatif you said, you're right. You
know what? There's not enoughwork I could do to solve the
problems facing the health careindustry. It doesn't mean that
I'm a bad person.
It just means I'm telling thatlittle voice, and here's here's
(11:26):
what you say. Not, oh my gosh.You're right. I'm terrible. You
say this.
You know what? That's a littlebit true. Because any critical
thought when it's met with,yeah, that's a little true
deactivates its charge, And thenyou're less likely to have the
cortisol spike and all thestress hormones, which then
amplify all the things thatwe're suffering with to begin
(11:48):
with. And so the sort of radicalapproach from parts work is what
if you started with validation?Oh my gosh.
You're a terrible parent. Well,yeah, that's probably a little
bit true. A little bit of truthis sort of microdosing the
little nugget of truth becauseno one's perfect. So if
something is a little bit true,that leaves room for nuance,
which leaves space for choiceand lots of other things. So the
(12:13):
phrase, yeah, that's a littlebit true, does a lot of job
comes to the inner critic.
Daniel Williams (12:16):
I love that. That's so cool. Let's talk about
the inner critic just a littlebit more and building that
relationship with it. Anybodywho's listened to this podcast,
we've had several episodes wherewe talk about mindfulness,
about, you know, either havingthat active formal meditation of
sitting, closing the eyes, orlowering the gaze, and following
(12:39):
the breath. But there are otherways to do that as well.
But when you do that particularaction I was just talking about,
anybody that's done that,suddenly they have what we call
the monkey mind, and they'rethey're the monkey mind may may
not be criticizing, but it'sthat inner inner dialogue. You
know? There's something, a storygoing on. Again, how do you work
(13:05):
with that? How do you work withthat in a positive way or even
simply a neutral way?
If if the mind and the stress isgoing in a certain direction,
maybe we can't get it in a happyplace, so to speak. You know?
Maybe that's a misnomer that ifwe meditate, we're suddenly
happy. We may not be happy, butwe may be present with what is
(13:27):
in that present moment. So Igave you a lot to think about
there, but I see you nodding.
So please just share yourthoughts on this about how we
work with that, if we wanna callit an inner critic or a monkey
mind or what's going on and cantake us into story time when we
need to be right here right now.
Britt Frank (13:46):
So it's interesting because meditation, the kind
most people think of is the calmthe mind, center the mind, clear
the mind, and that's a beautifultype. And it's not the only
kind. Right. And sometimes it'simpossible to do that. And so we
do want a a solution to, well,is meditation just off the table
for me if I can't quiet themonkey mind?
(14:06):
And parts would suggest, well,if you have a monkey mind, why
don't we go to the circus?Because the stories are only
problematic if we feel there'sno structure to them. And so
what Parks' work would do withall those monkey mind thoughts
is, well, let's turn all ofthose thoughts into imagine
they're people with an opinion.And what if we could sit on the
(14:28):
I'm changing metaphors here. Sonow take all the monkey minds.
Imagine they're just a bunch ofpeople yelling at you. What if
we were to all sit around thecampfire and share those
stories? I'm listening to thestoryteller parts of me, and I'm
not the storyteller, and thestoryteller is not me. And any
type of mindfulness creates theobserver and the thing being
(14:50):
observed. And when you can besort of the inner CEO, as I like
to call it, but if you'resitting around the campfire with
all of your storytelling parts,you can listen to them, don't
have to be driven by them.
And you can say to all of them,that's probably a little bit
true. Thank you for that. Andeven the most critical parts of
ourselves, if you were I callthis the coffee cup solution.
(15:12):
Sit down at a table with twocups of coffee. Put one in front
of you and one across from you.
Imagine that that voice that'syelling at you is sitting there.
What would it actually you toknow? Because when parts of
ourselves are listened to, theydon't yell, and they don't
scream, and they don't abuse uswith critical thoughts. So it's
really about treat your mindwith the same consideration you
(15:32):
would a friend or even anemployee.
Daniel Williams (15:34):
Yeah. I'm hearing you say that, and I'm
thinking to my other self overthere, are you gonna finish that
coffee? Because I think I maytake it and finish it if you're
not going to. This is fun. Ienjoy talking to you about this
because it's what I'm interestedin.
Let me give you a scenario, andI want you to just help us
understand because I think ourlisteners, we've all been in
(15:55):
this kind of situation before.So over the weekend, my family
and I had found a little daylong meditation retreat, mindful
retreat up in the mountains herein Colorado. We drove up there,
and there were five or six othercars there. And we quickly
ascertained from the otherpeople that it had been
(16:16):
canceled. And when we hear thatkind of news, when we've built
something up for a week orwhatever it has been, we have an
expectation.
I know for myself, in the past,I've allowed it to kind of ruin
my day. I've taken this littlething because I had an
expectation built up, but whatwe found was, well, the facility
(16:39):
is open. There are mats here. Wecan put the cushions and the
mats down, have a meditation.Then there was beautiful gardens
up in the Colorado Mountains,and we walked around the
mountains and enjoyed a littlehike there, and then had a
really nice lunch beside a creekand just were very peaceful.
(17:00):
We didn't let it ruin our day.We kind of rolled with the
punches, so to speak, rolledwith whatever that outcome was,
and then just took it fromthere. And I want you to speak
to a little bit about that.What's going on when either the
inner critic or that selfdefeating attitude, this door
closed, so I'm closing down now.So tell us a little bit about
that.
What's going on there in themind, and then how do we work
(17:23):
with that? How do we align ourmind to what's actually
happening?
Britt Frank (17:26):
I love that story because it's so true. I remember
going to a retreat and beingready to be all zenned out, and
then I was so angry. I was justso, like, black. All my love and
light went right out the window.So I love that you made the best
of that situation.
So what happens often is what Icall being fused. So if you
imagine that your mind is madeof all different parts, when the
(17:47):
parts are all fused together,you're only aware, you're only
conscious of one reality. Mymeditation retreat was canceled.
I was looking forward to it. I'mdisappointed.
Therefore, everything isterrible. Therefore, nothing
goes my way. Therefore,therefore. And so if you're
fused with your parts, then youdon't have the ability to see
the whole board. You can't seethe whole picture.
(18:07):
And so I call that beingdiffused from your parts. And
you'll be refused when you haveno sense of your choices. Your
emotions are out of whack. Feelslike everything and always and
nothing in these very bigsweeping statements. Defusing,
which is really just beingmindful that you are not your
parts.
You are not your thoughts. Youare the observer of the
(18:29):
thoughts. Once you're defused,then you can say to yourself,
well, yeah, this little bittrue. It's actually a lot of it
true that we're disappointed.And what else is true?
I call this the making an alsotrue list because you just wanna
be swept away by yourdisappointment, But you also
don't want to be like, well, Ishouldn't be that upset because
(18:50):
it's no big deal. It's not thatthat you know? No. No. No.
Yes. This is disappointing. Alsotrue. There are mats and there
are mountains and we have eachother. And so it's an improv
comedy principle, actually.
It's called the yes and wherewhatever you're doing with your
scene partner, you always justsay yes no matter how bonkers
what they're suggesting isaliens had taken over the
(19:12):
grocery store. In an improvscene, my job is to say, yes.
And help is on the or whatever.And so you can learn to say yes
to whatever distressuncomfortable thought is coming
up. Yes.
And is how you diffuse from thatmushed together sense of I don't
have multiple parts. I don'thave multiple choices.
(19:33):
Everything is one singularthing.
Daniel Williams (19:35):
Okay. That is so cool. So let's put it into a
medical practice setting. It'sflu season. Maybe the people at
practice are overrun with peoplethere with the flu.
But, also, hey. Half the staffhas the flu. So now we're
understaffed, and we'reoverwhelmed with all the people
coming in. And there's babiescrying. There's grown ups
(19:58):
crying.
Everybody feels terrible, andthere's a lot of stress. How do
how do our listeners, whenthey're dealt with this kind of
situation, maybe they have toeven run from the back of the
office to help out in the frontof the office, just everybody's
little bit of chaos, little bitof things going on. How do they
work with that? How do theyalign the mind again to make
this as achievable a day, youknow, a goal, whatever it might
(20:24):
be? How do how do we get throughthis?
You know?
Britt Frank (20:27):
So it starts by setting expectations in an
appropriate place. In asituation like that, you're not
gonna be able to do all thethings for all the people.
Right. When you're understaffedand overworked and it's flu
season and baby adults arecrying and people are screaming
and you don't have enoughhealth, the it's not actually
the chaos that takes us out ofalignment. The chaos, if you're
(20:51):
in health care, is a Tuesday.
What takes us out of alignmentis the belief that we should be
more or do more or have more orbe able to give more. And that's
the belief we wanna go with,well, yeah, that's a little bit
true. Else is true. Mhmm. Youknow, you're not working hard
enough, and you're never gonnabe able to get all this work
done today.
Yeah. That's a little bit true.And also true, no one can. And
(21:14):
that's where you get to giveyourself expectations that match
the context. I'm not suggestingsettling for mediocrity, but we
also wanna be realistic.
Striving for excellence is goingto produce, if not joy, at least
a sense of peace. Striving forperfection will always do shame
no matter how hard you work orhow much you give.
Daniel Williams (21:35):
Okay. In your book, you talk about the
difference between fixingourselves versus leading our
parts. Talk about that. Whattalk about those two principles
and what that looks like inpractice.
Britt Frank (21:50):
So I think there's this trend in the zeitgeist. Now
that we talk about feelings,every feeling that I'm feeling
needs to be expressed inwhatever way I feel like, and my
triggers must be avoided, and Imust be comfortable no matter
what. And I appreciate thatwe're talking about feelings.
I'd rather do that than not. Ithink it's important to know
(22:10):
that our job is to lead ourfeelings and our parts, not to
be led by them.
I'll give you an So if I were toshow up at a meditation class
and someone took my spot, thisis a real example. And again, my
I love humanity is now replacedby that person is sitting in my
spot. That's my spot. So I'mhaving that thought. That's a
(22:33):
part of me.
That's a snarky part that wantswhat she wants. I can observe
that thought. I can notice it. Icould tell that part of me.
Yeah.
That's a little bit true. It's abummer that she's sitting in our
spot. Also true, we're in classand there's plenty of spots.
That is me not trying to changethat part. I'm not saying, you
should be grateful that we caneven be in a class right now.
(22:55):
I'm just saying, yeah. I hearyou thought. I hear part of me.
Gotcha. You're probably a littlebit right.
And now I am going to make adecision on behalf of the team
of my parts, and not every partgets to have what they want when
they want it. Just like a familyor a company. A competent CEO
will take employees' feelingsand thoughts into consideration,
(23:17):
but the leader of a largeorganization knows you can't
make everybody happy in everyinstance every time, and we have
to make decisions on behalf ofthe group. Not everybody gets to
have everything they want allthe time. That's chaos.
That's not leadership. That'snot efficiency. And we can treat
our minds with the same skillthat leaders treat companies, or
I should say qualified leaders,competent leaders treat
(23:40):
companies.
Daniel Williams (23:41):
Right. I have a question for you, and it's the
relationship we have. Maybe youcan give us some examples of
what you have with technologybecause you use the term
efficiency, and we keep gettingthese incredible tools, these AI
tools, these other platformsthat make things just go faster
and faster, but then I can't bealone. I suddenly see, but I
(24:06):
feel even more overwhelmed, youknow, or I feel even more, you
know, pressed here or, okay,let's go do that, or I just have
additional time to think about,oh my gosh. What should I be
doing right now?
You know? So what what's yourrelationship with technology,
and then what's some advice youcan give us how we can work with
(24:27):
all these incredible tools thatwe have but not make us more
overwhelmed with things?
Britt Frank (24:33):
I'm a fan of AI, and I don't see its its
potential for problems and theoverwhelming nature of, well,
which tool do I use? And whichtechnology do I use? And how do
I learn it? And so, again,working in health care is an
overwhelming task regardless ofwhat century you're in, what
tools are available to you. So Ithink when it comes to our tech,
(24:57):
one a good question to ask iswhat are my choices?
Because if you are beingmandated to use a particular
type of software, you're notgonna have decision fatigue, but
you're gonna need to learn howto use it. If you're told use
whatever you want, you might getdecision fatigue. So if we're
gonna answer the question, whatdo I do? Whether it's about tech
or overwhelm or burnout orwhatever, we have to start with,
(25:21):
can we make a list of three tofive choices? They don't have to
be good.
We don't have to like them. Butlet's start by identifying a
menu of options. Just a veryactive listing choices can
deactivate an overwhelmed brain.Of those choices, what are we
absolutely not willing to do?That's gonna narrow it down even
(25:41):
further.
And then once you have a choicethat's reasonable, then I call
this a micro yes. Break thatdown into as many pieces as it
takes to get a tiny little winunder your belts. If it's a it's
a a micro yes is taking a stepso small you feel silly doing
it. That's how you know it's amicro yes.
Daniel Williams (25:59):
Okay. One last question about the book. What's
your favorite part about it?What is in it like for somebody
who's, oh, this soundsinteresting. I might get this.
What would be your one pitch topeople? This is something that
just lights me up when I thinkabout it. Maybe it's a case
study. Maybe it's an anecdote.Maybe it's a tool.
(26:19):
What's something you wanna sharewith us about Align Your Mind?
Britt Frank (26:22):
Oh, I love this question. So what I love about
the book is that it puts intojust a general nonclinical
population this idea that yourmind is made of parts. This is
not a trendy idea. It's not myidea. It has been around since
humans painted on Polaris.
The idea that part of me wantsto do this thing, but part of me
(26:44):
wants to do that thing. It's inour language. It's in, you know,
every major culture has aversion of it. And so I love
that align your mind takessomething so universal that's
been around for so long that noone's ever heard of. Like, parts
work is the greatest idea aboutconsciousness that no one's ever
heard of.
And so I love that I got tocontribute to the body of work
(27:06):
that normalizes that humans arecomplex and have a multiverse
inside us. It doesn't make uscrazy. It makes us human.
Daniel Williams (27:16):
I love that. Alright. Well, Britt Frank,
thank you so much for joining usagain, and it's been wonderful
to have you on here. Britt's newbook is Align Your Mind. I've
got it here releasing on05/13/2025.
By the time y'all hear this, itwill be in your local
bookstores. It will also be onthose online bookstores.
(27:40):
Wherever you get your books,please reach out. Look for it.
It's a wonderful book.
Britt, thank you for joining usagain.
Britt Frank (27:47):
Thanks for having me. It's so good to see you
again.
Daniel Williams (27:49):
Alright. Everybody, that is gonna do it
for this episode of MGMAInsights podcast. I will put
direct links to several, localbooksellers here to me in the
Denver area, but also some ofthose national sites as well.
So, again, thank you all forlistening to the MGMA Insights
(28:10):
podcast.
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