280: Celebrating Neurodivergence and Authenticity with Sheldon Gay

In this episode of Embracing Intensity, I’m thrilled to welcome Sheldon Gay, host of the I Must Be Buggin’ podcast. Sheldon brings his insightful perspective on navigating life as a late-identified gifted and neurodivergent individual. His podcast and work are dedicated to amplifying underrepresented voices and empowering others to embrace their unique identities.

We explore the challenges and beauty of being true to oneself in a world that often misunderstands intensity, neurodivergence, and giftedness. Sheldon’s passion for self-discovery, emotional depth, and compassionate communication shines through in this powerful conversation.

About Sheldon:

Sheldon Gay is the host of the I Must Be Buggin’ podcast, where he delves into topics of identity, giftedness, and neurodivergence through the lens of being Black, underrepresented, and gifted. His mission is to create a space for self-awareness, acceptance, and growth, while helping others see and embrace their unique strengths.

Sheldon’s background as a late-identified gifted and neurodivergent individual has fueled his passion for helping others on their journey of self-discovery. He brings a thoughtful, empathetic approach to conversations on identity, culture, and the power of authenticity.

In This Episode:

• Navigating Identity as a Late-Identified Neurodivergent Individual – Sheldon shares his journey of discovering his giftedness and neurodivergence later in life.

• Ask vs. Guess Culture – A deep dive into communication styles, cultural nuances, and how self-awareness can help bridge differences.

• The Power of Self-Discovery – Reflections on how shadow work and embracing authenticity can lead to freedom from shame and guilt.

• Intensity and Emotional Depth – Exploring how Sheldon’s intellectual curiosity and emotional intensity shape his interactions and relationships.

• Cultural Expectations and Exceptionalism – Discussing the pressures faced by marginalized communities and how giftedness intersects with cultural identity.

• Truth with Compassion – The importance of sharing truth in ways that create connection and understanding rather than division.

Resources & Links:

• Sheldon’s Website: Sheldon Gay is Buggin

• Listen to the I Must Be Buggin’ podcast

• Learn more about Sheldon’s speaking engagements

• Explore his neuroaffirming and anti-racist merchandise

• Join the Embracing Intensity Community 

• Connect with Aurora: Embracing Intensity

Sheldon’s thoughtful reflections and passion for empowering others provide invaluable insights for anyone navigating their own journey of self-discovery and authenticity. Tune in for an engaging and inspiring conversation!

Listen now and share your thoughts with us! 🎧✨

Episode Transcript

Sheldon (00:00):
generally we don't do well as a society making space for,

(00:04):
authentic emotions, no matter how youidentify, from a gender perspective.
But again, especially, when youthink about how, people might expect
a black man to show up, it doesget to be a bit of a challenge.

Aurora (00:22):
Welcome to the Embracing Intensity podcast.
I'll be sharing interviews and tips forgifted, creative, twice exceptional,
and outside the box thinkers whouse their fire in a positive way.
My name is Aurora Remember Holtzman.
After years of feeling too much, Ifinally realized that intensity is
the source of my greatest power.

(00:43):
Now, instead of beating myselfup about not measuring up to
my own self imposed standards.
I'm on a mission to help people embracetheir own intensity and befriend their
brains so they can share their giftswith the world through the Embracing
Intensity community, coaching, educationalassessment, and other tools to help you
use your fire without getting burned.

(01:05):
You can join us at embracingintensity.
com.
Hello.
Today, I'm super thrilled to bring youa conversation with Sheldon gay host
of the, I must be bugging podcast.
Sheldon dives, deep into topics likeneurodivergence identity and authenticity.

(01:29):
All with a thoughtful, compassionate lens.
In our conversation, we exploreeverything from navigating intensity as
a late identified gifted individual tocultural nuances, like ask versus guesss,
communication, styles, and culture.
It's a powerful discussionyou won't want to miss.
But before we jump in.
I wanted to share why thisepisode is dropping a day early.

(01:53):
On Monday, I'll be going dark on the metaplatforms as a part of the movement to
step back from it for at least that day.
This aligns with the themesfor my latest blog post.
Should I delete my social media accounts?
Where I explore how to navigatethe challenges of digital
platforms while staying authenticand connected to community.
You can find it on my website.
If you're curious.

(02:14):
As I step back fromsocial media for the day.
I'd love to invite you to join me inthe embracing intensity community.
A space free from the noise anddistractions of traditional platforms.
It's a place where you can connect deeplywith others who understand your journey
and celebrate your unique intensity.
As Sheldon says at theend of this interview,
" I think this community is definitelyone where the people who are in

(02:36):
it, if we were to engage with eachother more, it would amplify the
goodness that's already there."
I invite you to share in the communityand interact over the next couple of weeks
and see if we can bring that momentum toincreasing engagement on the platform.
One place we've had really great engagingconversations has been on our live calls,
and I'm happy to share that this weekI'm hosting a free live call as a part

(02:58):
of my new ignite, your power live series.
It will be on harnessingthe power of your intensity.
Saturday, January 25th, 2025.
At 10:00 AM Pacific, you can alsoget the free workbook on harnessing
the power of your intensity on [e-mail] slash join.

(03:21):
This call is perfect for anyone who'sever felt too much or struggled to
channel their intensity instead of toningthemselves down or tuning themselves out.
It's also a preview of what's to comein my upcoming mastermind group, where
we'll meet weekly to dive deeper intocollaboration, goal setting, and growth.
Join us at community.

(03:41):
Embracing intensity.com/events.
I'm also working on our upcomingspeaker series, but there'll be fewer
this year so that I can focus onmore in-person events and interview
podcast episodes like this one.
I'm super excited for all the connectionand growth we're building this year,
both online and hopefully in person.

(04:02):
Enjoy.
Welcome to Embracing Intensity.
I am so thrilled to finallyhave Sheldon Gay on the podcast.
Welcome Sheldon.

Sheldon (04:13):
Hey, I'm excited to be here.
This is, one of my favorite, spaces.
You are one of my favorite people.
Thank you for having me.

Aurora (04:21):
Back at ya!
Just for those of you who don'tknow, Sheldon is the host of the
I Must Be Buggin podcast, and youcan tell them what that stands for.

Sheldon (04:31):
Mm hmm.
Yeah, so, I must be buggin where thebuggin is B U G N, it stands for black,
unidentified, underrepresented, gifted,and otherwise neurodivergent, and so it
is both a statement of the experienceof, looking around and wondering if
the world is, like, am I the am Ithe one who doesn't make any sense?

(04:51):
Am I buggin and then it's alsoan affirmation of who I am,
accepting myself and saying no,like, You know, I must be, Black,
unidentified, gifted, and otherwise,neurodivergent, and just accepting
and affirming that part of myself.

Aurora (05:07):
Awesome.
And I don't know how far back,I don't even know if it's
been a full year, has it?
You can't even follow me.

Sheldon (05:14):
Yeah, yeah.
So like, yeah, it's, it's, it must havebeen, I've, so my podcast is officially,
I've been going for more than a year.
I think I told you that you andyour work was actually a piece of
my gifted self discovery journey.
And so I at least knewabout you prior to that.

(05:35):
I don't remember exactly when we firststarted, you know, whatever kind of
communicating when we kind of e met.
But, yeah, my podcast, yeah, it's,it's wild to me to think that it's
been, you know, more than a year.

Aurora (05:46):
Yeah.
Well, I think you had commented orsomething on, on Instagram and I clicked,
I was like, I think I followed youback, but I didn't really register yet.
Then you commented and I clicked on it.
I was like, Oh, what's this?
And then I totally bingedyour whole podcast.
The funny thing is that even thoughI have a podcast, I don't listen
to as many podcasts as I'd like.

(06:08):
I don't necessarily have theattention span for a lot of them.
But I found that yours kept me engagedand you just talk about really deep,
important topics and are very thoughtful.
I think I've listened to them all.
Was Matt's the last one.

Sheldon (06:22):
Yes, I'm cooking up some stuff now.
So, be on the lookout for, the next one,obviously, our conversation, will be
something else for our folks to chew on.
But, I've got some cool stuff on the way.

Aurora (06:34):
Awesome.
And it's funny because my friendLana was listening to that one
and she's like, I just want to bein a room talking to these guys.

Sheldon (06:40):
Yeah, we got to figure out a way to get a few of us in the same space
because I think that would be such a dope.
You know, just jam session as it were.

Aurora (06:49):
Yeah, I was thinking about that actually locally
doing some panel type discussion
yeah.
That would be a fun thing to do.
Yeah.
Tell me a little bit moreabout yourself and what you
are intensely passionate about

Sheldon (07:03):
What am I intensely passionate about?
I mean shoot, you know,we could be here for days.
A little bit more about me.
You know, late identified, right?
So a couple of years ago I kind of hadthis aha moment where I was reflecting
on my life across, you know, my career,relationships, family, all these different

(07:23):
things, or I was like, something's therethat I can't quite put my hands on, right?
I think about Neo in the beginningof the matrix where he's like, this
world doesn't seem 100 percent real.
There's something else there.
I started doing, a lot of work,particularly, you know, some
shadow work and out of the shadows,as it were popped giftedness.

(07:45):
I was like, Oh, shoot.
Okay, you know, This issomething that could apply to me.
Right.
You know, I was reading books likeliving with intensity and watching
all the, Linda Silverman videos,like all so many different things.
Like I said, catching some of your work.
The resonance was just undeniable.
And so.
It made me reflect back on my yearsof, like I said, I was born in Philly,

(08:07):
spent a lot of my life in the DC area.
My mom moved us down there.
One of the main reasons is so thatI could have access to, some of the
best schools here in the country.
Reflecting on that journey through thoseschools and how I showed up there and
how those schools showed up for me.
How I showed up, in romanticrelationships, whether it be

(08:27):
my, former marriage, right?
And, just thinking to myself,okay, a lot of this stuff
makes a whole lot more sense.
And so I've spent the last year notjust talking about my self discovery
journey, but certainly talking abouthow other people can, do that same
work and receive that same, freedomfrom these feelings of shame guilt

(08:52):
and, all the negative thoughts, right.
Just doing some of that shadow work, ata high level, to be able to then move
through the world more authentically.
And so, you know, to that end, a thingthat I'm super deeply, deeply passionate
about is people and giving them access.
To, self discovery and self awarenessand that gets me in trouble.

(09:16):
It's always gotten me in trouble.
I was having a conversationwith someone the other day.
I've said this in other spaces rightbefore I realized that I was gifted.
I discovered that I was an empath, right?
And, you know, one of the ways that thathappens is because I can see past people's
masks and I can see who they really are.
And again, there's beauty in that, right?
To be able to not see the pieces wherethey feel broken or not necessarily not

(09:42):
see them, but like not be caught up inthe places where they feel broken, not
be caught up in the places where They'renot able to love themselves and to
really just see them as their true self.
And so there's a lot ofbeauty in that, but then that
becomes a scary thing, right?
People put a lot of work, a lot ofenergy, a lot of resources into,

(10:06):
their mask And so if you're seenpast that, it gets super scary.
And sometimes, yeah, thatchases some people away.
And so, I still remain super,super passionate about that.
And last thing I'll say on this is thatone of the things I try to read to myself.
Every day, I have a vision boardand one of the things that's in
this vision board is the statementthat I say, the truth deserves the

(10:27):
light, but with compassion, right?
So I'm always just trying to remindmyself that, as much as I want
to show people their truth thatI need to make sure that there's
compassion there for where they are.
So.

Aurora (10:40):
Absolutely.
And I think that's one of our commonvalues in terms of the truth and with
compassion because I think it's soeasy to think it's one or the other
where it's like, I'm a truth teller.
I'm just going to say it like it is.
Absolutely.
And, that conversation recently came upabout, Ask culture versus guess culture.
And it was funny because it was,conversation on Tik TOK, which by the

(11:03):
time this comes out, might not even be

Sheldon (11:06):
right,

Aurora (11:07):
But the guy who was arguing for, guess culture was talking about
how, it was polite and friendlyand all this stuff, and I'm like,
as somebody who is 100 percent askculture, there is a way to do it in
a way that is thoughtful and kind.
In fact, I think it's more kindthan trying to make someone

(11:28):
guess at what you need and want.
But it can be seen as rude if peoplearen't used to that directness.

Sheldon (11:37):
And sorry, just to make sure that I'm on the same page, can you just
clarify for me what that specificallyrefers to so that I make sure that I'm
tracking because I think I know whatyou're talking about, but, yeah, go ahead.

Aurora (11:48):
Oh, yeah, absolutely.
I think I first heard it with Catiosauruswho was on the podcast talking about,
neurodivergent intimacy but yeah,it's a concept, and it's cultural
too, a lot of different cultureshave more degree of ask versus guess.
So like for the Midwest, for example, theywere saying is more of a guess culture

(12:08):
where you're expected to anticipate needs.
And if you don't ask directly,like if someone's over at your
house, then you offer them food,it's cultural expectations.
When you have someone who is of a guessculture where it's rude to directly
ask for things With someone who'sfrom a culture where It's rude not to

(12:33):
directly ask It can be tensions betweenthose people and and of course from a
neurodivergent perspective Ask cultureis more neurodivergent friendly because
We're not expected to read into cues tothe same degree or, read people's minds.

(12:54):
And I find it funny because.
Even though, as a neurodivergentperson myself, it's ADHD, and it's not
necessarily that I can't read cues.
Absolutely can.
In fact, I'm better atit than many people.
Like you said, I lean towardsthe empath thing myself.
But there are times when I might not.
notice or might not pay attention or someof the more basic things go unnoticed.

(13:18):
So the things that people assumeare super basic, those are the
ones I'm probably going to miss.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
No, no.
It's the complex stuff thatI'm going to get, you know?

Sheldon (13:27):
Yeah.

Aurora (13:28):
And so, that was for me in my first marriage.
He was much more guess culture andI was much more ask and it took me
years to get him to directly saywhat it was that he wanted because
I'm like, I'm not a mind reader.

Sheldon (13:42):
Yeah.
No, no.
Thank you for that clarification.
yeah cause you've made e a coupleof really, really good points.
And, you know, what I'll add kind ofsort of append to that is really just
that, yeah, I think it's super, superimportant for, this is why self awareness
is so powerful to me because it's notso much about, determining who is more

(14:03):
right, right, like, is ask culturebetter than guess culture or whatever,
as much as it is about realizing what'shappening within, within me, what's
my lived experience, and what is thattelling me about this scenario, and
then finding my way to get my need met.
I can definitely say that there arepeople even just this morning, My
aunt, to be honest, I'm not a hundredpercent sure whether she wants help.

(14:26):
So there's an event, like a family event,not this weekend, but the next weekend.
And, essentially I offered to help.
I messaged her, it was 10 dayslater, she messaged me back and
still didn't ask for anything.
And so I was just like, okay, if it's10 days later and you're just messaging
me, I assume you don't need anything,but if you do, just let me know.
Right.
And.

(14:47):
Then she messaged me back doesn'tsay, you know, yeah, I still
need help or I might need help.
She just says, well, Ihad a whole lot going on.
And I'm like, okay, but do you need help?
Because otherwise, I don'tknow what's going on.
Right.
And so this is just a simple exampleof, a way that could easily derail.
Right.

(15:07):
Because I could get really frustratedbecause in my mind, I'm like,
just tell me if you need help.
Right?
And on the other end, she could haveher own narrative around what it is.
But if we're both aware of just ourneeds, I can just say, hey, look.
You know, here's what would behelpful for me, or if I don't hear
from you by this day, I will assumethat you don't need anything.

(15:29):
And then I will, I'm letting youknow that I'm going to move on
to doing other things, right?
And that's a way for me to expressmy need without trampling on her.
But I think, again, that's why,like I said, self awareness
is super, super important.
And I think as neurodivergentfolks, it can be really hard to.
realize what's happening because a lotof the ways in which we're asked to move

(15:53):
through the world, even though we may havea preference for more direct culture, it
requires us to play the guessing game,
right?
And so separating those twothings out about like, what is
my actual authentic way of being?
What is my real need?
And all that kind ofstuff can get muddied.
And then again, that gets frustrated.
And so that creates thecycle that we don't want.

(16:16):
So anyway, I know we can go ononto that for a million days,
but thank you for clarifyingthat and bringing that topic up.

Aurora (16:22):
Absolutely.
And one of the things they broughtup is sometimes if you just even say,
it's okay to say no, when you ask,
that can be helpful,
but for me, an example, when I was, my oldschool that I was at for like 14 years, I
realized on the surface, it looked very.
Smooth, but with the pandemic andeverything, a lot of stuff came out and it

(16:45):
was very much a guess culture when I leftthat environment, it was just exhausting.
Like I can navigate it, but it wasexhausting because I was worried about
what other people were thinking or,you know, like if I was talking to
someone and it wasn't a good time, theywouldn't just come out and tell me, you
know, It's like you gotta come anyway.

Sheldon (17:06):
Yeah, sorry, really quickly just the last little thing because
it just popped in my mind becauseit's it's such a great example.
And the other challenge aboutthat as well is going back
to what I was saying earlier.
If people aren't aware and acceptingof who they are, if you say to
them, hey, like, you're not tellingme exactly what you want, right?

(17:29):
It can cause a defensive reaction becausethey're not able to own that, right?
And just say, yeah, yeah, yeah,like, I, you know, again, this
is my angle that I'm coming from.
Just even what you talked aboutas it relates to just tell me
that you want me to leave, right?
For them, because again, it's notabout this owning of who I am.
It becomes a, you're trying to tellme that I, I'm kicking you out.

(17:52):
And it's like, no, no, no, I'm nottelling you that you're kicking me out.
I'm just saying that you, whatever,you've maxed your capacity, your bandwidth
for right now, which is fine, right?
We can come back to thisdiscussion or whatever.
But like, Right now I'm sensingsomething different and I would
rather you just tell me that wecan both be happy in the moment.
Right.
But, I think, like I said, that'swhere a lot of these unnecessary.

(18:15):
Escalations can come from.

Aurora (18:17):
Well, absolutely.
And over the years I have learnedto be hyper aware of cues and trying
to, be like, is this a good time?
Or, you know, stuff like that.
But there's just times when withmy ADHD, I don't pick up on those.
Cause I'm just so focused on whatit is that I'm trying to get at.

Sheldon (18:31):
So I

Aurora (18:32):
really appreciated the people.
Like I had one gal who was, kind ofopposite from me on the neuro spectrum.
But she was able to just directly saylike, you know, not a good time, come
back later or, you know, whatever.
And I'm like, great.
I'll connect later.
Yes.

Sheldon (18:46):
Yes.

Aurora (18:47):
Anyway.

Sheldon (18:47):
So,

Aurora (18:50):
circling back, tell me a little bit about your own
personal brand of intensity.
What does intensity look like for you?

Sheldon (19:00):
Well, I mean, you just got a taste of it, right?
My brand of intensity is, reallywanting to get into the nooks and
crannies of how things work, which,with my undergrad degree in mechanical
engineering that worked well, right?
Like, you know, from anengineering perspective, really
understanding how things work.
makes you a really greatproblem solver, right?

(19:21):
And that's good and fineand well in that scenario.
In some scenarios, not so much, but Itend to be someone, when it comes to, you
know, intensities that, that intellectualcuriosity is, is very much so there.
Emotional Right.
That's definitely, there, whichagain, you know, aligns with this

(19:42):
whole thing about being an empath.
And I think, well, actually,I know you and I've had this
conversation before, right?
As a black man, sometimes that canbe a challenge because the way that I
show up confidently kind of flies inthe face of, these caricatures that
people consciously or otherwise haveabout who I might be when I show up,

(20:04):
like I said, in front of them, I'm notjust someone who, can say I'm sad, but
I can get real complex about it andreally know, all the workings of it.
And so, where many of us again,whether they be gifted or otherwise
neurodivergent, are familiarwith this, discomfort that many

(20:27):
people have around complexities.
Again, emotional complexity, canbe even more challenging for folks.
Because just generally we don't dowell as a society making space for,
authentic emotions, no matter how youidentify, from a gender perspective.
But again, especially, when youthink about how, people might expect

(20:51):
a black man to show up, it doesget to be a bit of a challenge.
I wouldn't necessarily put this inmy top three or top four, but there's
definitely a, You know, imaginational,thing there because I'm always, you know,
I, I love a good idea, and being a serialentrepreneur that may be evident, right?

(21:11):
I've told people I've lived many differentlives, like I look back and I'm like,
oh, I tried this, I built that, whatever.
That's because anytime there's areally cool idea, I'm down to take
a shot, see what might come from it.
I think, generally speaking, all thosethings in relationship with me is going
to manifest as, me sharing my voice.

(21:34):
Me probably asking you somequestions that may make you feel
uncomfortable because of how.
The intellectual curiosity plays inthe emotional curiosity plays in and
how something you said may have sparkeda really cool idea and I'm like, Hmm.
And so that's how my intensitywould tend to show up.

(21:56):
I'm not sure if that's how you were askingthe question, but that's how I took it.
So

Aurora (21:59):
So how do you think that your intensity affected you growing up?

Sheldon (22:03):
Dang, I just took that breath like that because I was thinking about
my childhood a little bit earlier.
I will just say that, yeah, I think
This is why I'm so passionate andadamant as well about people not hiding,
neurodivergence from their child, right?

(22:25):
And whether or not you use a label, thatis a separate discussion for me, right?
Because for me, What's most importantis that you not try to pretend that the
ways in which your child is showing updifferently don't exist, I think people
overuse gaslight in this day and age.

(22:47):
What I don't want is for people tospend time trying to explain away the
ways that a child is showing up oreven project their own insecurities or
their own feelings onto how the childis showing up and manifesting shame.
Actually, just what popped into my mind,I was on the bus going to New York the

(23:10):
other day, and there was a young motherthat was on there, and she had her young
daughter, who, I don't know, at most waslike three years old, probably not even,
and instead of having a conversationwith the child in a way that, basically
the child was just being a kid, right?

(23:31):
Like kind of rolling around the chair,looking around and playing with things
on the chair, and for me, there wasan opportunity to one, just be like,
that's a kid being a kid, right?
But instead like words such as,She was on a video call with

(23:52):
somebody FaceTime or whatever.
It was like, well, I'm gonnagive them the phone because They
want to be a bad kid right now.
And it was like is that theway to communicate that?
Are they being a bad kid or they'rea little kid on a bus with Stuff they

(24:15):
may have never seen they're just beinga kid it wasn't like they were running
up and down the aisles screaming therewas an opportunity to do something
different and I share that story becausewhat a lot of folks end up doing is.
because something makesthem feel uncomfortable.
They won't say, I don't likehow you're making me feel.
I don't like how you'remaking me think about myself.

(24:36):
Right.
Cause maybe even some of thosebehaviors they saw, they noticed
from their childhood and maybe theyweren't allowed to behave that way.
Right.
And so instead of having, like I said,a conversation about, how do I create
a safe space, you know, in a welcomingspace for you while also providing
guidance, it's these projections.

(24:56):
That, as I joked when I spokeat a school recently, add, at
least five therapy sessions tothat child's future life, right?
So, in my childhood, this is my roundaboutway of saying my childhood was filled
with a lot of things that I don't likelooking back on, if I'm being honest.
It's just people telling me,indirectly or directly that.

(25:17):
There was something not right about me,something odd, something weird, something
just too much, particularly just toomuch, asking too many questions, knowing
too much, I've spoken about this on oneof my podcast episodes, particularly,
like I said, in the black community,and other, melanated, communities, this
idea that a child should be, seen andnot heard, bumps up directly against

(25:43):
A gifted child's way of being, right?
What do you mean?
If I know an answer, why wouldI not give you that answer?
If I, have a question about how the world,is working, that's not making sense to me.
It's not me, Trying to cut you offat the knees or make you look bad.
It's me not being able toreconcile Reality, right?

(26:08):
And so a lot of my childhood bumpedup against my intensities in that way
and so Again, as I reflect back I sawa lot of the coping mechanisms that
I put into place that as I'm likein my early 40s I had to be like wow
like that was a big part of My selfdiscovery journey was the grief Right?

(26:31):
Like, going through and realizing theways in which, I really Put myself
in a box just to be able to make itto the next day without losing it.
So, Yeah, hopefully that's my answer

Aurora (26:46):
Yeah Absolutely, and you already kind of answered this question and I know
you have an entire podcast about this Butwhat are some specific cultural factors
that affected how you expressed yourself?

Sheldon (26:57):
Yeah, I mean again, I think bumping up against, you know,
being seen and not heard, there arecultural factors as it relates to,
as well, the, the exceptionalism,you know, you know, I definitely have
talked about this and, you know, atleast a couple of episodes, right?
One of the things that I mentionedis this sort of dichotomous experience

(27:22):
in marginalized communities where,only a few quote unquote get out.
If you're somebody who's kind ofon that track, if people are seeing
something in you that seems likeyou could be the one to get out and
particularly someone who might be ableto look out and support your community,
your family first, but certainly,you know, your broader community.

(27:45):
Well, that puts a lot of pressure on you.
Right?
So again, to whatever extentyou may be comfortable with
that, some people embrace it.
Some people, You know, I hear abouta lot of folks who, for example,
a Caribbean and their parentstell them, the only acceptable

(28:07):
professions are whatever, like doctor.
engineer, lawyer, right?
Like that's it.
If you're not one of those things, notjust maybe you'll make a little bit
less money and sorry for that, but it'sjust like your life is not acceptable.
And again, whether or not I have thecapacity to do those things is not so much

(28:27):
important if I'm not interested in them.
And so these are things that wethen have to grapple with, because
again, as you're a child, as you'regrowing, as you're kind of finding
your way in the world, the idea.
That not just a parent, but potentiallyyour entire community, you might
be letting down or that might beshunning you because you chose to do.

(28:50):
I don't know.
Maybe you really care about,cleaning, and you wanted to
start a cleaning business, right?
Fine.
But.
Not if everybody says you should,nobody's going to make, you
know, all the different things.
Like I said, we could, we could havea whole conversation about that.
Right.
But like, that brings alot of extra weight to it.

(29:11):
And like I said, particularly as a gifted.
Child, where you may demonstrate somethings early on, that are, you know, quote
unquote exceptional that could bring,a lot of things, to the space again.
And on the flip side, who do youthink you are kind of energy?
Some people who may have not hadthose same opportunities, right?

(29:35):
So, again, there's so many differentways in which this stuff plays out.
I think the last thing that I'll justsay, and feel free to follow up with
additional questions, but one of thethings as well is moving outside of my
culture and then thinking about being in,the broader culture, these schools that my
mom sent me to were predominantly white.
Right.

(29:55):
And so you show up in these spaces.
And again, you flying in the faceof what a lot of people expect.
Right.
And what does that mean, how doyou find, again, we're all looking
for community we're all lookingfor connection, so you're wanting
to fit in, to some extent, but.
If fitting in means adapting and movingin a way that cuts off a piece of who

(30:23):
you are, what does that look like?
And again, I can't tell you how manytimes me showing up in a class as a
gifted boy, you know, little blackboy who's like, Knows his stuff really
irritated clearly irritated people.
A lot of gifted folks deal withthat Like I said in general, but

(30:44):
this is an extra layer of consciousor otherwise Racism, you know,
let me call it what it is, right?
You show up in these spaces.
You've got to deal with that.
You just want to be inschool like that's it.
You don't want to haveto be like fighting.
You don't want to feel like MLK, right?
Fighting the good fightjust to go to school.

(31:05):
That's.
A dynamic that a lot of us have to figureout how to navigate Those are some things
that come to mind when I think about thecultural aspects of navigating my world

Aurora (31:17):
so Tell me about a time.
You felt like you had to toneyourself down or tune yourself out

Sheldon (31:22):
I mean the what I'm laughing at is there were many times where I Should
have the question is whether or not I did.
You know, So and and sorry,we still talking about school.
We just talk about just generally in life

Aurora (31:37):
in general.

Sheldon (31:38):
Okay.
Yeah Yeah, so let me just I'll justsay this Let me move out of the
schooling, perspective and bring it intorelationships perspective That may be
in friendships or romantic relationswhenever I say relationship I mean it
like super literal and how we relateto each other but One of the things
I have become quite, aware of is how.

(32:01):
If we talk about romantic relationshipscan be very awkward to be with someone who
seems like has quote unquote all theanswers, right, particularly if you're
someone who doesn't feel that way,it can expose insecurities you didn't
even realize that you had, I thinkthat's probably the key point there.

(32:21):
Right.
And again that applies to,you know, parents to friends
to whatever right if you are.
Feeling really good aboutyourself and how you're showing
up and all that kind of stuff.
And then somebody shows up whoexposes this piece of you, right,
that is, maybe needs a little bitwork on these, but this is a little

(32:41):
bit more awareness or whatever it is.
If you've not done the work to make peacewith your ego right now, that becomes.
a point of contention.
And so for me, I know that, you know,again, going back to my vision board,
one of the things I remind myselfevery day is that, one, I acknowledge
the fact that I'm intense, right?

(33:02):
But two, I also forgive myself for allthe times where I did shrink myself
into a box and pretend like, you know,If there were like five other things
that I knew about a topic, or if I didknow, I was familiar with how that thing
worked I might have not said anythingbecause I know if I said something

(33:23):
there, well, here's another thing thatSheldon knows, here's another thing that
Sheldon's good at, here's another, right?
And so that is definitely experiencethat I've gone through really
recognizing again, all those ways inwhich I shrunk, and that is very much
so not how I'm looking to operate now.
I am looking to do that,again, going back to this thing
about compassion piece, right?

(33:44):
Like, being mindful of, you know, kindof assessing the space to, to see,
okay, like, if I'm sharing this, thisstuff with people, how might this,
you know, make them uncomfortable?
And again, not, I'm going to share mystuff right but how do I do it from

(34:07):
a space where if somebody if it makesif it's clear that somebody's feeling
some, you know, some type of way thatI can affirm that piece of them that's
tender, right that I can acknowledge thatthat might again make you know whatever
whatever it is like I said it's it'svery situational or whatever but like,
how do I make space for the fact that.

(34:30):
Again, there's a human being acrossfrom me that I want to, to relate to
and to assure while at the same time,honoring myself because I cannot put
other people before myself anymore.
That just doesn't work for me.
I did it for years, years, years, years.
It didn't win me any prizes, you know?
So but yeah, , a lot of spaces,it's really about, like, shrinking.

(34:53):
That's where I felt that.

Aurora (34:54):
Yeah.
Well, and I think that comes down to the,when you were talking about the way you
bring those things up or the way you talkabout those things comes down to that
truth, truth with compassion concept.
Right.
And I think that's one of thethings in a lot of our discourse.
Around the world right now is that Ifeel like people are forgetting the
compassion piece and they're justlike this truth This is my truth.

(35:19):
This is the truth this and if youdon't agree with me And it's like this
divisiveness and and it's like it'snot just about truth But also about the
fact that if you don't speak it withcompassion, if you don't speak it with
a reflection on how it's going to bereceived, it's not just like, this is the

(35:40):
truth and you need to accept it or not.
It's that people aren't going to listen.
They're not going to hear yourtruth if you don't present it
in a way that they can be heard.
And that's something, you know, beingin a broken education system for so
long that I've had to really, youknow, get good at is, is sharing
truth in a way that's actually heard.

(36:00):
And I think you do areally good job of that.

Sheldon (36:03):
Thank you.
Thank you.
Yeah, no, I just, the last thing I'llsay is like, you're, you're absolutely
right that you know, again, tapping intothat, that truth with compassion is a,
is, is, and it's, it's being mindful ofthe fact that what's my objective here?
My objective is, To be heard, if myobjective is to, whatever, help us
kind of get to, if we're solving aproblem together, if my objective

(36:26):
is for us to have the most contextand information to be able to do
that, then it's incumbent upon me tohold on to my piece of what that is.
And a part of that is, like Isaid, how am I, you know, showing
up with compassion and humility?
And you know, I can never controlhow someone receives that.
That's a separate, you know, Youknow thing but I can at least I think

(36:51):
about it in this way How do I dothings that future Sheldon will still
be proud of like that's you know So

Aurora (37:00):
absolutely and there's definitely a factor that no matter how kindly you
put something or how respectful youare There's certain people aren't going
to hear it from certain people And I

Sheldon (37:11):
I

Aurora (37:11):
think I saw that Really played out.
With my friend alexander.
I was telling you about who has theThe now I'm blanking on her podcast,
but but yeah, she just, we have verysimilar ways of communication, but
there was a period of time therewhere like, the things she was saying
were being completely misinterpreted.
And it was very, very clearthat it was a race issue.

(37:33):
And it was like, like not like thethings that I, I might say the same
thing and be heard in a way thatshe, people were, not everyone, but
there were people who were just.
willfully misinterpretingher because of that.
And it's frustrating.
But I do, I do feel like the way thatyou present things on your podcast and

(37:56):
the way that you communicate is, is heardprobably more because of how you present
it and making sure, you know, there arealways going to be those people who are
going to be willfully misinterpreting.
So, can you think about atime when you felt like your
intensity felt out of control?

Sheldon (38:15):
Out of control.
So the, the, the thought, thethought here is because there are,
you know incidents that I can thinkabout that overwhelmed people.
It's the out of control framingthat I'm like, well, I mean,
was that out of control?
Was that just, you know, a lot for someoneto digest, which, you know, again, as

(38:38):
part of my self awareness journey around,I think, you know, I mean, I know that
I've said this on my podcast, and Ithink, again, we've had this conversation
that part of my self discovery journeyas well was this realization that
not everybody had the same capacity.
And what does that mean?
Like, what does that mean?
Not just, you know, if you say thatto some people, it can just seem like
you're just like, oh, you're betterthan me, you have more than me.

(38:59):
And it's like, well, no, no, no.
Like, functionally, if I have, whatever,a hundred oranges to give, And most people
have let's even just say 50 like let'sjust even do that right but like I have
100 oranges to give if you ask me togive you know you know 20 of my oranges

(39:21):
that's very different for me that's okay20 oranges but 20 out of a yes somebody
with 50 if you talk to me to 20 that feelsa lot like More intense for them, right?
That's almost half ofwhat they have, right?
And so I bring that up to say that,you know, There were times when, you

(39:44):
know, I think about going back toschool the school that I always talk
about, and I always mention the namebecause I love the school, and I say
it's the one school that I never hadto feel like I had to carve any part
of myself out it's Lowell School in D.
C., and I had the opportunity tosee some of my old, like, teacher
reports or whatever, right?

(40:06):
And it was very clear to me in readingthem that my intensity around space,
because I used to want, like, the biggestthing I wanted to be was an astronaut.
And for those who are familiar SallyRide was the first woman in space.
She wrote a book called To Space and Back.
And I read that book from cover to back,I don't know how many times in my life.

(40:29):
And so in the teacher reports, It'stalking about Sheldon basically is
reading this book and talking aboutthis book and talking about space again.
And I know that experience, right?
I, I can kind of take myself back thereand think about those times when it was
is this the time to really be bringingspace, you know, or bringing this book
up to like, how many, you know, bookreports are, you know what I mean?

(40:52):
Like how many projectscan you do on space?
And so that is like a time that I thinkabout where, You know again, maybe
that was quote unquote out of control.
But the compassionate part of me aswell just says that, you know, what
would be good in that scenario andwhat Lowell tended to do is not tell me

(41:19):
something's wrong with my love of space,but to validate and redirect, right?
Like, Yeah, space is really cool.
Or, you know, that's sucha really interesting topic.
How about we talk about, you know, oneof the reports talking about us learning
about Native American history, whatever.
It's like, okay, well, how aboutwe talk about this for now, right?

(41:40):
And to, you know, to whatever extentthat may, may or not work easily.
But the, the key part is, like I said,from the compassionate piece is to not let
shame enter the space around how you'reshowing up, if that, that makes sense.
And hopefully that is that fits thebill, you know, out of control incident.

Aurora (42:02):
Yeah.
So tell me a little bit abouthow you use your fire for good.

Sheldon (42:09):
Yeah.
I mean, I, I mean this work that I do,the work we do, right, it's not easy.
I am increasingly aware of how much workstill needs be done around making people
comfortable with the word neurodivergentand not just outside of our neurodivergent
communities but certainly within.

(42:29):
The other day, for example, saw apost where someone was questioning
whether schizophrenia could beconcluded as a neurodivergence and it
turned into this whole, discussion.
And for me,

Aurora (42:42):
like, yeah, of course,

Sheldon (42:47):
So, Right.
So for me, my fire, a few yearsago, my fire would have been to
get in them comments and start,you know, yeah, done people, right?
Like, duh, how could this, youknow, all these kinds of things.
Where I'm at now, I at least try tostart with, you know, helping people

(43:09):
be curious about, you know, Theirthoughts and why, why would this not be?
How could you not come to that conclusion?
Right?
But my fire is really about speakingword to, to, to, to the truth, right?
Like, again, one of the things I tryto read to myself every day is the

(43:29):
Audre Lorde quote, which basicallysays my silence won't save me.
Right?
There is so much that I have to say.
There's so many thingsthat I'm passionate about.
And it seems that, again, that one of mygifts is this ability to speak to topics
and to make them, you know, digestibleand relatable and all that kind of stuff.

(43:50):
And instead of being afraid that it'sgoing to lose me friends, instead
of, you know, being afraid thatIt is going to be overwhelming or
out of control for people, right?
I am very much so taking that fireand saying, look, you know, we get we
get one run, at least one consciousrun here in this earthly plane, like,
you know, whether you believe in yourincarnation and all that fun stuff,

(44:13):
again, separate conversation, but oneconscious run right on this earthly plane.
And so I'm going to use whatever time Ihave to speak, you know, truth to power.
And again, as much as I can.
with, with compassion.
So yeah, that, that's reallyyou know, how I'm using my fire.

Aurora (44:35):
Awesome.
Yes.
And you do a fantastic job of it.

Sheldon (44:38):
Thank you.
Thank you.

Aurora (44:40):
So what do you think has helped you the most with harnessing
the power of your intensity?

Sheldon (44:45):
What I think the most, the most, the most, definitely my
own work to love and accept myself.
It all starts with me.
If I don't get up, you know, out of mybed and into the world from a frame of
mind that I'm worthy of love, regardlessof what happens that day, right?

(45:11):
Regardless of how many wins I bring,you know, like it starts there.
And that was not an easy journey becauseagain, of all the things that we've
already discussed that you've got to kindof unlearn and, and, and work through.
I hesitated because beyond that, Iwould say externally, it's community.
It's absolutely community.

(45:31):
I tell people like these onlinecommunities, whether they be gifted
specific or just more broadlyneurodivergent literally saved my life
because this past year, I, you know,essentially, you know, I had some
really big losses, like some of thebiggest losses that I could ever have
all within, you know, a year's time.
And I'm sitting here.

(45:54):
Now, where you, someone even wants totalk to me, like, you know, that, even
beyond any other, other things that Ikind of have going on in my life, like,
the fact that somebody even wants tohear my voice around stuff is because,
community said to me, invalidated, heySheldon, like, we like you, we want you
here, your voice is meaningful, yourpresence brings, you know, light to this

(46:15):
space, right and, The mirroring of youaren't the only like you're not the only,
you know, version of the light beingthat you are right and so you don't have
to feel alone and isolated and alien.
Right.
So yeah, again, itdefinitely starts within me.

(46:37):
But, but community isdefinitely like externally.
That's the critical piece.

Aurora (46:43):
Absolutely.
And before we started recording, we weretalking a little bit about how both of us
were looking at starting more in personcommunity as well as the online community,
which I think is really important.
I think we're moving that way right now.
I mean, obviously, I'm still continuingthe online community because most
of my platform is worldwide, butdefinitely having more in person

(47:05):
local stuff is great as well.
Are there any personal habitsthat have helped you to use
your fire in a positive way?

Sheldon (47:11):
Yeah, I think, I think again, that vision board is, I mean, it sounds,
I mean, possibly like cliche or whatever.
I mean, it's somebody readingwords off of the screen, right?
Like that sort of functionally is whatit is, but I can tell you, you know,
I had gotten away from it a at thebeginning of the year and I felt it.

(47:35):
I felt it.
And so the last couple of daysI've been much more intentional
about getting back in there.
And what, beyond sort of thediscipline of consistency and
power of consistency, right?
These reminders of what is itthat I'm looking to focus on?
What is it, what I'm, I'm lookingto remind myself about myself.

(47:57):
Is super, super powerful, you know,in it, you know, I not only affirm who
I am, you know, I'm forgiving myselffor things that maybe, you know, the
the work of showing up as your bestself is a, is an ongoing journey.
It's not like, Oh, I figured it out.
And I never think of those things again.

(48:18):
The whisper, it might might godown to a whisper, but it's never
Completely gone, particularly, youknow, maybe you see that family member
or that friend or you're in that, youknow, uncomfortable scenario again.
Right.
And so that that whisperat least comes up.
And so for me, that isreally, really core.

(48:39):
And it also reminds me againabout how I want to show up for
other people show up in spaces.
That is, you know, Super, super critical.
It's like I said, anytime, you know,there's an opportunity for conflict,
even as I mentioned earlier, talking tomy aunt, like, a few years ago, I might

(48:59):
have, again, I might have just been like,look, dude, like, I'm trying to help if
you don't want, you know what I mean,like, I would have just had a different
energy about it, but, reminding myselfabout the future Sheldon that I'm always
kind of wanting to make sure is goingto be good with, oh, dang, like, Did
you have to talk to your aunt that way?
Right?
Like, avoiding that and saying, okay,she may be happy with how I respond.

(49:23):
Like I said, that's notsomething I can control.
I'm not talking about people pleasing,but what I am saying is, is that if
I can still be proud of the fact thatI honored her needs, and I honored my
needs, and I spoke, you know, clearly andauthentically, like, that's the part that,
you know I can own and like I said, doingthat daily of reminding myself of what

(49:46):
that looks like and what that means is,has been really, really helpful for me.
And so I think that like bleeds intoany other kind of routines, which
I'm not big on routines in general.
Like I'm, as people say, people askme, like you know, a phrase that
applies to me is structured chaos.
Right.
Like it's, I'm not a complete anarchist.

(50:08):
But I am someone who, youknow, taps into the fact that
control is often an illusion.
And so how do I just put structurearound what that looks like so that
I don't ruminate on the fact thatI don't control anything, right?
So.
Yeah,

Aurora (50:28):
absolutely.
Getting towards the end here.
Okay.
How do you help others use their own fire?

Sheldon (50:36):
It's a great question.
So the, the way that I do thatis by really helping people see
themselves I think about ways inwhich I can offer people a safe
space to explore who they are to havewho they are mirrored back to them.

(50:57):
I think one of the big, the biggestthings that can be a challenge for folks
in leveraging their power, leveragingtheir fire, you know, leveraging their
authenticity is that a lot of times the,the love, the care, the, the admiration
that we feel for them, is not spoken.

(51:18):
And it goes back, like right now,I'm honestly having this, this whole
thing about the ask versus guessconversation from earlier, right?
Because, you know, I 100 percent believethat you should give people their
flowers while they're here, right?
Because there are way too manytimes where people say, Oh, they

(51:42):
should know that I love them.
They should know that Ithink that they're smarter.
They should know.
But it's like, did you say that?
Right?
How did you make that explicit?
So for me, a big part of me helping peopledo that is as much as possible, speaking
that as explicitly as I can, as oftenas I can, you know, even though it may

(52:05):
make people feel uncomfortable, but likespeaking to that as much as, as, as I can.
And then again, creating a space whereto whatever level they may be comfortable
that it's safe to explore that.
You know, I, it, itreminds me of the thing.
One of the things I read every day isa phrase that says love is not love
does not require a perfect process.

(52:27):
Right.
And, and I say that becauseagain, Somebody may trip up.
They may say something that doesn'tnecessarily align exactly with how you
would have wanted it said, but it doesn'tmean that love can't exist in that space.
And I think that's what alot of people are afraid of.
And so if I create a space wherepeople realize, Oh, I can say

(52:49):
something and Sheldon will know myheart or at least trust my heart and
we can find a way to work through it.
Then I can just be much more free.
I can, you know, put my fire andlet my light shine or however
you want to think about it rightmuch more freely in this space.
And then that gives meconfidence to do that elsewhere.

(53:09):
So, yeah, just like I said,you know, affirming people.
helping them to see how, you know,they're not giving themselves the
credit maybe that they deserve.
And then like I said, just creatinga safe space to, to navigate all
of it is, is how I think abouthow I help people with their life.

(53:31):
But they're fire.
I'm sorry.

Aurora (53:32):
Absolutely.
So is there anything else youwould like to share with the
embracing intensity audience?

Sheldon (53:38):
Look, I, I say to folks, you know, you know, again, love yourself.
Be super, super curious aboutyourself, embrace that journey.
I'm giving you a little bit of apreview of one of my next episodes.
However, again, when this comes out,how this comes out, that'll determine.
And when you ever get a chance tolisten to it, that'll determine it.
But, you know, one of the episodesthat I'm working on, you know, is

(54:00):
this discussion around ego and thisdelicate balance between, you know,
what does healthy ego look like?
It means being able to loveyourself and, and recognize, you
know, who you are in, you know,humbly put that out into the world.
But it also means realizing thatthis concept of self is also a

(54:23):
construct and not being so tied toexactly what that can look like.
And so that's important because.
Loving yourself as well, particularlyover time, means accepting that what that
looks like can change and not feelingafraid of letting that change happen.
You know, appreciating theera that it may have been and

(54:46):
embracing the one that's to come.
And this is where joycan really, really exist.
And consistent joy, right, can existbecause a lot of where a lot of
that stuff, like where joy is, is.
stripped from a space isbecause of the fear of loss.
because of the, the defensivenessaround this persona that you've created.

(55:11):
You're like, well, I'msupposed to have been this.
I was supposed to do this.
I was spoke, people see meas that, you know, whatever,
all these different things.
And when you both acknowledgethat, yeah, maybe I serve those
roles but also potentially let goof that to say, I can no longer do
it or I can't do it in that way.
You can be a lot more free to be joyousand to find solutions for how you still

(55:37):
tap into what ultimately is the thingyou're looking for, which is connection.
And so, yeah, I would just say, youknow, continue that journey and if
you are curious about, you know,how I speak about it, you know.
Come on over to the podcastand, and, and join me there.

Aurora (55:55):
absolutely.
And on that note of connection andcommunity, I did want to circle
back to something we talked aboutbefore we started recording, which
is the community online and how I wasmentioning my own community is on mighty
networks, which is off Facebook oroff, you know, general social media.
And it's hard to get people onthere, engaging on that platform,

(56:16):
but more and more with all thechanges happening on social media.
People are talking aboutgetting off those platforms.

Sheldon (56:23):
And

Aurora (56:23):
so I've, I've been working on, on how do we get more engagement in there?
There's so many amazing people in there.
Every time people join it's just sucha diverse, wonderful group of people.
But one of the things that I mentioned,I think you had talked about hosting
in groups and then not getting much.
Interaction and I think whathappens is someone will come in
and they'll be Oh, this is awesome.

(56:44):
Let me make a post and then they don'tget a huge amount of interaction.
And then after a while, they kindof Peter out and then the next
person comes in and it's like,

Sheldon (56:52):
yeah,

Aurora (56:52):
I need this like critical mass of people to come at one time and start
interacting with each other's posts.
So like my friend is.
Started doing that a little bit.
I have a few more.
So this is my invitation our audiencesay, come join us in the community, which
is community dot embracing intensity.
com we'll be having, monthly meetupsaround my ignite your power course.

(57:18):
I'll be having live calls probably less.
Than I did last year because I alsowant to do some in person stuff, but I
also want to get the engagement goingon in the Mighty Networks platform
itself, because I think, I actuallyreally like the interface I feel like
it has some similarities in terms ofthe way it's laid out to Facebook,

(57:38):
but without the ads and without the,like, People outside, you know, it's
much more calm and peaceful, but I likethat you can, you know, make posts.
You can comment directlyon those different threads.
There's different sections.
So I don't know the way I likeit a lot better than some Say
discord, which to me is just chaos.

(58:00):
It's just like one thingafter another, after another,
after another, it's just like,

Sheldon (58:04):
yeah.
And

Aurora (58:05):
same with like extensive group chats because group chats, I
just get lost in the thread, right?
It's just like one long thread.
And so what I like about that platformis it, you can bake a post and then
people can comment on that post.
And then another, you know,so it's, it keeps things.
organized in a way that works for my brainand a way that things like discord don't

(58:27):
because it's just to me just too, toomuch of a barrage of information at once.
So I want to encourage folks tocome join the conversation there.
And I recently posted my own recentblog about the social media stuff
and, and how I'm navigating all thechanges that make people want to leave.
Because obviously as content creators, Wedon't really have the luxury of leaving,

(58:51):
but also I feel like, you know, it'skind of my place to stick around and keep
the platforms, you know, at least ourlittle corner of it, more positive, so.

Sheldon (59:03):
Mm-hmm . Mm-hmm . Mm-hmm . Mm-hmm
. Aurora: Yeah.
Yeah.
Sorry, I don't know if there's a, let mejust say this before in, in case there's
not an opportunity to say this as well.
If you won.
Certainly.
Listen, as I mentioned,community is so important.
It can be so powerful.
I think this community is definitelyone where the people who are in

(59:25):
it, if we were engaging with eachother more, it would amplify the
goodness that's already there.
As well I wanted to just say aswell, if you are someone who.
If you want a voice like me at yourorganization, speaking about giftedness
or neurodivergence in general, or,you know, any of the things that I've

(59:48):
spoken to already you can go to mywebsite, which is sheldongayisbuggin.
com.
And then also check out some cool merchIf you can see it or not, but, I've
got some really cool neuroaffirmingand you know, anti racist and, and all
that good fun stuff merch there, soplease feel free to, to check it out,

Aurora (01:00:06):
and that kind of circles back to my final question, which is how
can they find out more about you?
Oh,

Sheldon (01:00:11):
good.
I wasn't, I wasn't 100 percent sure, butyeah, so they can find me right there.
And actually one thing I forgot isthere as well I know some people, you
know, Don't have a podcast like appthat they listen to but you can actually
listen to the podcast directly youcan find out about my speaking you can
find out about the merch you can findout about the podcast and I generally

(01:00:32):
post as well like this interview atsome point will appear there Right.
And so you can also check out anyinterviews that I've done as well.
So

Aurora (01:00:43):
awesome.
Well, thank you so much forfinally, we got this interview.

Sheldon (01:00:48):
We've

Aurora (01:00:49):
been talking about it,

Sheldon (01:00:50):
but yeah, I'm glad we've got, we've had the chance to do it.

Aurora (01:00:53):
Yeah.
So glad to have you andlook forward to sharing.

Sheldon (01:00:57):
Yes.

Aurora (01:01:13):
Looking for ways to embrace your own intensity.
Join our embracing [e-mail] where
you'll meet a growing group of like-mindedpeople who get what it's like to be gifted
and intense and are committed to creatinga supportive community as well as access
to our courses and tools to help youuse your fire without getting burned.

(01:01:37):
There's also a pay what you canoption through our Patreon where
you can increase your pledgeto help sustain the podcast or.
Or join us at a rate thatbetter fits your needs.
You can also sign up for my freeHarnessing the Power of Your
Intensity, a self regulationworkbook for gifted, creative, and
twice exceptional adults and teens.

(01:01:57):
All links can be found in the shownotes or on EmbracingIntensity.
com.