April 11, 2025 • 54 mins
Join us for a special re-release of a profound conversation with Kate Northrup, renowned author of "Do Less," an expert in creating easeful financial business strategies, and a NSI coach. This episode remains one of our most beloved, resonating deeply with many who grapple with the concept of rest in a culture that glorifies constant productivity as the path to success and abundance.
In this re-release, Elisabeth, Jennifer, and Kate explore how embracing rest and scaling back can promote significant business and financial growth, challenging the myth that more work equals more success. They candidly share personal experiences of burnout, forced breaks, and the surprising transformations they discovered when prioritizing rest. Kate introduces her insightful metaphor of treating rest as "active rest," akin to a cover crop that nourishes and prepares the soil for future growth—a concept pivotal for clients navigating dysregulation from rest.
Our society's ingrained belief that our worth is tied to productivity has led to widespread dysregulation, burnout, and dissatisfaction. Through this episode, we aim to dismantle this programming and advocate that doing less can lead to greater well-being and productivity. Just as the Earth cycles through seasons, so too should our lives. We are all interconnected after all.
If you’re looking to regulate your nervous system and allow for more rest, be sure to check out this episode!
Topics discussed in this episode:
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The domino effect of dysregulation, from hypervigilance to burnout
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The impact of insufficient sleep on the nervous system
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Kate's embodied experience that revealed doing more is not always better
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How pulling back and resting led to more growth for Trauma Rewired
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Rethinking rest: the concept of active rest
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Two strategies Kate uses to integrate rest into her business for sustainable growth
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Overcoming limiting beliefs to dismantle the productivity-driven system we’ve been conditioned to follow
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Understanding how rest can feel dysregulating and how to navigate it if it does
Join Kate’s free live 3-day Good With Money workshop on April 17th, 22nd and 24th here: katenorthrup.com/TR
If you attend and decide to join Relaxed Money through our link, you'll get an exclusive one hour private kickoff training with Elisabeth and Jennifer, to prepare your nervous system before the program starts. Here is the link to join: katenorthrop.com/tr
Head to Kate Northrup’s website here: https://katenorthrup.com/
Connect with Kate Northrup on Instagram here: https://www.instagram.com/katenorthrup
Learn more about the Neuro-Somatic Intelligence Coaching program and sign up for the next cohort now! https://www.neurosomaticintelligence.com
Get started training your nervous system with our FREE 2-week offer on the Brain Based Membership site: https://www.rewiretrial.com
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Foreign.
Welcome back to Trauma Rewired. Today we're bringing you one of our most
popular episodes, one that resonated so deeply with our listeners
that we knew it deserved a re release. We're revisiting our
conversation with Kate Northrup on rest, a topic that
for so many of us is deeply tied to trauma
(00:21):
capacity and worthiness. If you've ever struggled to
slow down, if rest feels unsafe or
unproductive, or if your nervous system is stuck in survival mode,
this episode is for you. Kay is not only the author of Do Less,
she's an expert in creating easeful financial business strategies.
And she's an NSI certified coach who deeply understands how
(00:44):
our nervous system shapes our ability to rest, receive and
regulate. That's what makes her work so different. She doesn't just teach people how to
make money, she helps them rewire their relationship to money. So that
financial well being isn't just about numbers in a bank account. It's
about safety, stability and capacity. And that's why we
have to tell you about her upcoming workshop. It is free and it's live.
(01:06):
It's called the Good with Money three day experience, happening April
17th, 22nd and 24th. And this isn't just
about money. It's about healing the way you relate to it so you can
feel more ease, more trust expansion in your life. And make
sure to sign in@Katenorthrup.com
because if you end up deciding to do her Relaxed Money program and you've
(01:29):
joined through that link, you'll also get some special bonuses, including
a teaching that I did for her Relaxed Money program on the neurosomatics
of money and some surprise bonuses from us. This
is an incredible opportunity to experience firsthand how nervous system
regulation can completely change your financial reality. So whether you're
new to this episode or listening again for deeper integration, we invite you to
(01:52):
settle in, take a deep breath, and soak in some of Kate's brilliance as
we explore the deep connection between rest,
capacity and abundance.
So I'd love for you to just tell us a little bit about yourself, Kate,
and why this topic is so important to you. Like, why did you write a
whole book on doing less and helping people find more
(02:14):
ease more rest? Yeah, you know, it's so funny.
Like in this moment I'm just really noticing I'm kind of
emotional, which is so interesting and
unusual at the beginning of a podcast. But I think that
like this is such a full circle moment because
when I wrote Do Less, it came out in 2019,
(02:36):
of course I had Heard of the nervous system. I mean, I'm here
on planet Earth. I really didn't
know what I know now. I didn't know about
how trauma lives in the body. I didn't know about
overworking patterns and trauma. I didn't know about
productivity as a trauma response. I didn't know
(02:58):
what you ladies know, what you folks, your whole thing is about.
And I remember my coach at the
time, Ra Goddess, in the end of 2019. So
my book had been out nine months. I had written it. You know, it
takes a long time for books to come out. So I finished it at the
end of 2018. No, 2017. Oh, my God, 2017. It's like
(03:20):
100 years ago. And she handed me this book called
Patriarchy stress disorder by Dr. Valerie Rain.
And as my friend Megan Watterson says, I just read the title of
the book, and, like, my heart fell out of my butt. I was just like,
oh, my God, this is literally everything.
And it was like this whole. It was like me seeing the
(03:42):
Matrix all of a sudden and realizing that
the reason I wrote Do Less is
because of the deeper trauma
patterning in my own lineage and in
womankind, but also humankind around
productivity and basically running. Because
(04:03):
we have been so programmed to be afraid
to be still and to be afraid to feel.
And so what so, so cool about that is, well,
a. I'm working on another book that actually directly incorporates it. But
in retrospect, what I realized is my first book, Money A Love
Story, and my second book, Do Less, the curriculum that I
(04:26):
teach in them, so many of the exercises that I teach in them
work because they actually do work to
heal the nervous system. I just didn't know that. And so it's such
a testament, I think, to the wisdom of. Of our
bodies that, like those came
through me as part of my own healing journey. Even
(04:48):
though no one told me, oh, this is how
you heal the nervous system. Productivity can very much be
a trauma response. Obsession with achievement, you know, all of those
things. And so that's kind of the bigger
picture of my own work around that. But I
will say, just from a personal perspective, you know, I come
(05:10):
from a long line of overwhelming working women. And,
you know, I watched my. I watched my granny.
Her granny's life motto was,
don't ask for a lighter pack. Ask for a stronger back.
And she was the oldest North American woman to ever climb to
Mount Everest Base Camp at the age of 84. My
(05:33):
mom spent most of her career just really
in go mode. My dad as well, and all My whole family. And
so I wrote Do Less sort of as this healing
manual for myself and hopefully for my
daughters and hopefully to open up a
possibility for more lives that are allowed to
(05:54):
have people be instead of do. Oh, I love
that. Or in addition. I'll say in addition.
Yeah, totally. In addition is a great way to put it. And I
love that so much and can relate so much to coming from a
lineage of workaholics
who really just. It was modeled
(06:16):
so much and it becomes so deeply woven into
our neural architecture, into our nervous system, to only feel safe
with that level of productivity. And I do want to
talk a little bit about stress physiologically and the importance
of rest from a physical and from a nervous system
perspective. Because I think it helps people to understand and
(06:37):
deconstruct some of that when you know, know kind of what's going on in the
body. And just like you were saying, you know, we used to think of trauma
as this psychological phenomenon and now we know it's, it's
physiological, it's experienced through the body, through the nervous
system. And stress is a huge component
of that experience. It's a root cause of disease and mental health
(06:58):
decline. And when we experience a stressor or
a threat, our body's primary goal is our
survival. And it's ancient, kind of complicated
and pretty brilliant way to do that is through our stress response system that
mobilizes our resources, it prepares us for action, and it's
adaptive. But if it is occurring chronically,
(07:20):
that's a problem. And so these responses, these stress responses
that happen in our body, they are a necessary part of everyday
life. And we're not looking for a life without activation.
Nervous system regulation isn't that for flat line of
being calm or Zen all the time. But it's really that ability to
modulate between these states to get activated when it's appropriate
(07:42):
and then to be able to rest and recover and adapt.
But when we're facing that overwhelm all
of the time, we can't respond anymore to the stress. There's
no escape. We're constantly suppressing and repressing our
body's natural stress relief and regulation. Actions like movement
or vocalization or crying or shaking, these emotional response
(08:04):
responses that help us regulate. And then we get stuck in states of
hypervigilance, constantly scanning the environment or our
relationships, looking for threat. And we're having that stress
reaction over and over again inside of our body. And it's just
not meant to be long term. And I think too
it's important for people to Understand that, like stress is stress, our survival
(08:26):
mind doesn't distinguish between social threat or a
physical threat, or doing this podcast or having a meeting.
Our nervous system is just taking in all of this information all
the time from our sensory systems about our external environment
and our internal environment, our balance, our orientation,
knowing where our body is in space. And if that information
(08:48):
is unclear or blurry or inaccurate, that's already
enough to initiate a stress response, because I might fall,
I might hurt myself, I can't make an accurate prediction. And then these
signals all of the time are coming in through our nervous
system, making it up to our brainstem and then to our limbic system,
where they're interpreted by many different areas of the brain.
(09:10):
The amygdala working with the hypothalamus to turn our emotions
into our physical experience. And we start to have that fear response
through the HPA axis. And now we have all of these hormones,
adrenaline and cortisol, moving through the
body. And if this keeps going all of the time,
and we're in that dysregulated state. We talked about this
(09:33):
in our burnout episode, but just a little bit condensed so that people
have this information as we dive into the mindset and the beliefs
and the cultural aspects. When we have too much cortisol
all of the time, it keeps us in a state of high alert or a
low grade survival response. So it doesn't let the body shift back
into a parasympathetic state. And then it becomes really difficult to
(09:55):
sleep or to rest. That just doesn't feel safe. And
it's this chemical or hormonal obstacle to rest.
And when we have that, that's what's
called adrenal sensitivity, too much cortisol all of the time, and then that
leads to those health outcomes like diabetes or muscle weakness,
osteoporosis. And then over time, we can also
(10:18):
lose our ability to produce cortisol because our system doesn't have the
resources for that. And then we can move into adrenal burnout or
fatigue. So that's when the adrenal glands can't keep creating
cortisol. We don't have the resources anymore. And then
we start to move into an adrenaline response. So now instead of having
cortisol in our system all the time, we're actually running on adrenaline. And
(10:41):
that pushes us into an even higher level of
hypervigilance, a heightened level of survival, because
adrenaline is our short term survival hormone. And so you get
a big inflammatory response that can lead to autoimmune.
Lots of disease state in the body and it pushes your system into this
strained level, this very high stress level all of the
(11:02):
time. And then eventually we move into full blown
adrenal burnout where our system can't produce adrenaline either. And that's
when it's going to flip us into chronic fatigue where we don't have the energy
to keep going because our metabolism is in a deficit, our
cortisol production is in a deficit, our adrenaline production is in a
deficit. So there's really nothing left in our body to
(11:25):
create energy on demand. And so you're left in this constant
state of fatigue or malaise, like you
just can't have the energy to do anything anymore.
And that's when we really move into that deep burnout and
illness. Chronic sleep disturbances can be such a big
problem for so many reasons too. Like, there's an importance of rest,
(11:47):
is what I'm learning is that I need to rest a little bit throughout the
day so that at the end of the day I'm not just looking to totally
offload my entire day and have this big expectation of like,
oh, and now I'm going to go to sleep. And so what
I really think about too, because from the burnout and functional freeze
conversation, one of the things that came up for us was that a lot of
(12:08):
times we can engage in activities that we think may be
restful or refueling, but actually it depletes us a little
bit more as we go on. And I really think about
for rest being my new horizon. I really think about the
integration that I lose when I don't get a good night's sleep
and how that really has big effects on,
(12:30):
on my cognitive health and really even my emotional well
being the next day. And when we think about after we work out
and we intentionally stress our bodies through weight training or aerobic
activity, and then we need rest time on the back end of
that so that we don't harm ourselves any further so
we don't get injured. And so it's that
(12:51):
same, it's that integration that gives us that positive adaptation
and resilience that also happens when we sleep and that slowing
down that needs to happen. And so like four, some of the
cognitive health when we sleep, part of our brain's integration
process is coming up with solutions that we might have for
some potentially complex problems in our lives. And for
(13:13):
anyone who suffered with insomnia or maybe moms that don't
sleep for those first couple of years of their children's lives
is also who I think of. And I was diagnosed with insomnia at a pretty
early age. And I know how difficult it is
after many nights of sleep to not be able to come out of the brain
fog, for the emotional piece to have more rumination
(13:35):
on more negative thoughts versus positive experiences that I'm
having. And sleep is crucial for memory
consolidation, for learning. And, you know, the brain
also relieves itself of, like, many toxins throughout the night. And
I think for the. For the emotional piece, that recalling of negative
experiences, it also drives depression. It,
(13:57):
like, drives depression and even an increase in mood swings. And
I definitely have experienced that on top of,
like, it can get hard to parse out, like, what's complex trauma,
what's insomnia, what's my neurodivergence? And it just
becomes this, like, overwhelming piece of, like,
wow, this is pretty overwhelming. So I'm interested to know,
(14:19):
Kate, from your perspective, what comes up for you when we talk about
rest and recovery and, like, what it's been like in your journey and. And
how you came into the place of rest and recovery. Serves my
business. It serves my relationships well. What
happened is I'm glad you brought up new motherhood for
me. I was the total achiever
(14:41):
type. Academic pressure, early
success in business, yada, yada, yada. And then
I got pregnant with my first daughter, and I have
never been so tired in my life. And
people kept saying, oh, just wait until the second trimester. You'll have this
huge energy burst. But that never happened. And I was
(15:04):
sleeping, like, 14 hours a day. It was very
bizarre to have been such a physically
mentally capable person and suddenly be taken
out. And then my daughter was born. I had quite a
traumatic experience with her birth, and then she was really
sick. So the first year of her life, it just
(15:26):
continued. And she had severe eczema and sometimes
would be waking up every night, every 10 minutes,
screaming and scratching herself. And her sheets were bloody
all the time. I mean, it was like, this was not what was on the
literature in terms of motherhood. Everyone else was like,
oh, it's the best time of my life. And I was like, it's
(15:48):
like a horror movie at my house. And I couldn't sleep.
I had severe postpartum insomnia.
And it was the first time in my life that
I had a problem that I couldn't
overcome by being smarter or more
capable or working harder. None of the
(16:10):
usual solutions that I had worked.
And yet a year into my daughter's
first year of life. So we sat with our
accountant and we looked at our
numbers, and despite having worked less than half
the amount I had ever worked in my adult life. That
(16:32):
year we had made more money than we ever had before, and our. Our income
source was our business. So it wasn't like there was some other. This was
like, if I wasn't working, there wasn't me and my husband
running together. And it was such a light bulb moment for
me because while I would not go through that year again if you
paid me, it was awful. I thought, huh, that's
(16:55):
so interesting. I have been working my
entire adult life as though the number of
hours and the amount of effort is the
most important thing and actually what ended up happening. And,
you know, there's. There's so many changes that happen in the maternal brain
and obviously nervous system all connected, but
(17:17):
I had become instantly focused on only what
mattered because the survival of my child
depended on it. And I had zero
fucks to give and zero energy for
anything extraneous nothing. And
as a result, that ended up being a very good
(17:38):
business strategy. And I thought, wow, okay, so if I could make more money
than ever before, working less than half the amount while completely
distracted, you know, not distracted, but while completely devoted to
keeping this baby alive and like, vaguely staying
sane. And on some days that was not. That was debatable, like, in
terms of my mental health really suffered. I thought, well, maybe during
(18:01):
less difficult years there could be some things that
I could point to or look back at and research
as effective strategies. And, you know, I'm happy to walk through what
some of those were, but that was my own experience, really realizing,
oh, more is not necessarily always better.
And it was my own body and my daughter's
(18:23):
body that brought me home to that truth. And I'm so
grateful because nothing teaches us a lesson
like an embodied experience. Wow.
Yeah, that is really inspiring for me to hear about
as I'm like, in this own place of. My own place of
navigating, not doing more all of the time, and
(18:45):
just allowing the seeds that are planted some space and air
to breathe and grow. And what a beautiful
example of that from your experience.
And I do think it's really
the most powerful experiences we have are those experiential
times where that's enough to start to shift
(19:08):
the paradigm inside of us and be like, oh, maybe there's something else
totally possible. And just total side
note, I relate to your daughter so much. I was also born with
eczema all over, so I feel that it's still how
my nervous system communicates to me sometimes when my stress load is
too high. And as you were talking about that
(19:30):
beautiful shift in your business. I was thinking
too, it is a place where I'm navigating in my own life and
how it's a real deconstruction and it's a
challenge coming from a complex trauma background because
so much of the patterning that happens for someone with
developmental trauma is to be in this state of
(19:50):
hyper vigilance all the time. There's real changes to our brain.
Our amygdala actually changes in size and we're perceiving,
we're more sensitive, our alarm detector is more sensitive to
threat. We have less ability to put on that
parasympathetic brake, less vagal tone. And there's just
this felt sense inside of the body a lot of
(20:12):
times that it's not safe. Rest is this really
vulnerable state and there's a letting go of control
and a certain amount of presence. And our brains are just so
primed for that threat that there is a huge component
of this that's continuously working with my nervous system to create that
felt sense of safety inside and then to starting to work
(20:35):
with regulating the HPA axis because then as I'm
perceiving threat all the time now I do have that adrenaline and
cortisol which is going to keep me in a more of a high alert, keep
triggering the F responses in my body. And then
inside it feels like I need to run, I need to fight.
And so navigating that I think
(20:56):
it's so important to have the cognitive shifts and then
couple it with practical tools, strategies to
work directly with the nervous system and start to re pattern that at that
neurological level. Because that
deep nervous system pattern, just like you were talking about, about seeing the
trauma pattern that have been driving your behavior, it really comes out
(21:18):
everywhere, right? It impacts us physically, but also emotionally and
cognitively. It changes our relationships, how we show up at work.
And so it's such a layered topic to
dive into for sure. When I think of the lack of safety
to rest in business, I really think about the podcast
actually. And Kate, what you were going back to, one of the things that we
(21:40):
learned here as we were experiencing so much growth
with trauma rewired, it felt like we needed to deliver and deliver and
deliver and deliver and keep delivering and delivering and depleting
ourselves. And we learned, I think it was, we Learned in season
2, we took like a 12 week break and we experienced massive
growth and we were like, oh my God, we're not really
(22:03):
even doing anything. And it goes back to the seeds being
planted and it Was like, oh, now we've learned. And now we actually
take two breaks a year because we're like, let's capitalize
on the rest and the growth. Because there's a matrix there.
Like you're talking about this matrix that you can finally get
this measurable experience of. Like when you step out of it
(22:25):
and you're like, oh, I've been playing the wrong
game. I've been programmed into a game that's
not letting me win. And as soon as you can start to unplug from that
a little bit and then you get into like these new awarenesses of
like, oh, that's not real. What is real to
my success? My growth is resting and
(22:47):
pulling away from this. And then it serves our regulation as we've
come to learn, just really serves the podcast. And like there's so
many different types of rest that we need. We need that cognitive and
mental rest which for me that comes in times of like
silence or maybe some gentle music, grounding, being
in nature. And there's this idea of emotional rest
(23:10):
and I think self care can fall into that. Getting into
emotional expression and practices, being witnessed,
feeling heard, feeling seen, leading also into social rest. People go
to social media thinking that like, oh, I'll get social connection,
I'll get the rest that I need. But social media is so activating and really
leads to more deprivation.
(23:32):
And then of course we have the physical rest that
we all need. And passive and active
is are different components of physical rest. And that could be like
napping or stretching. And for people who
have ADHD or any other neuro type of neurodivergence,
the research is showing that the sleep deprivation that occurs
(23:54):
in neurodivergent people is even higher than
the neurotypical individuals because
there's delays in circadian rhythm and there's
changes in melatonin production. And that's like a crucial chemical that our body
needs for healthy sleep. But there's also an increased likelihood
of someone with a neurodivergence having a medication
(24:16):
and medication induced sleep issues. Maybe someone's
on a stimulant or a psychotropic medication that's commonly
prescribed and those don't really support the success
in non disturbed sleep cycle. Hey,
trauma rewired listeners, we have something really special for you.
We are so proud to align as affiliates with Kate
(24:38):
Northrup's work because she brings real deep nervous system
education into all of her programs. This just isn't another
mindset or money coaching program. This is about rewiring
your relationship with money at the brain, body and
emotional level so that you can actually feel ease,
safety and abundance. That's why we're not just recommending
(25:00):
this, we're attending it. KAIT is hosting a free live
workshop, the Good with Money three day experience, on April
17th, 22nd and 24th, and we want you to join
us. Over these three days, you'll experience powerful
money healing practices and start shifting your nervous system's
relationship with money immediately. And because we deeply
(25:22):
believe in this work, we're also offering a special bonus. If you attend the free
workshop and decide to join Relaxed Money through our link
kate northrup.comtr you'll get an
exclusive one hour kickoff training with me and Jennifer. And this
will be a private session just for our community to prepare your nervous system
before the program starts so that you have the capacity
(25:44):
to fully integrate this work. And you'll also find teachings
from me throughout the program. But to access this
bonus, you need to register through the link
katenorthrup.comtr and when you do this,
you're not only supporting yourself, but you're also supporting this podcast,
allowing us to bring you powerful conversations every week.
(26:05):
So if you're ready to shift your relationship with money in a deeply embodied
way, join us for Good with
money@katenorthrup.com tr. We cannot wait to
do this work alongside of you. Well, I really want to speak to
the seasons and cycles because
what was such a game changer for me was
(26:26):
understanding similar, you know, not dissimilar to when I
discovered the majesty of the nervous system.
I tapped into our innate
seasonality and cyclicality as humans
around that same time that I discovered that
we had made more money, but I had worked less.
(26:48):
But what was so fascinating, per, I
love this example of you taking this 12 week
break and your podcast growing even
more. Because what we know is that we
as humans are animals, which
means we are nature. We don't hang out in nature. We
(27:10):
don't need to connect with nature. We are
nature. And so the same principles that
govern trees and flowers and squirrels
and grass and weather patterns, like, they govern
our bodies as well. Which is why grounding practices and
all the data around, you know, earthing and being out in nature, we
(27:33):
are instantly activating a parasympathetic
response. Obviously it's more nuanced. Nuanced than that, but like going
home literally to activate,
accessing the outdoors, even if it's just a little sliver
of light through an open window, like that is our
true nature. And so when I started to look
(27:54):
at okay, well, if I had a beautiful rose,
I wouldn't be like bashing
it or berating it for not being in bloom all
year long. Roses have a season, we know that they
blame have a season. There's a season for planting, there's a season
for, for sprouting, there's a season for being a little
(28:16):
blossom, there's a season for being in full bloom, and then there's
a season for going back to seed. And there, there is a
season for the pause. And then I started
learning about regenerative agriculture and the
metaphors for how we run businesses are
so ripe and rich and fertile. And one thing,
(28:38):
and you're talking about passive rest versus active rest
for those of us who do
have a history of trauma and quite frankly, like, I don't
really know if anybody doesn't. So for those of us who are human
listening to this vodcast, one thing that I've
noticed is that just as you were talking about Jennifer,
(29:01):
just resting is not necessarily
immediately available because being still can
actually activate our hyper vigilance and it doesn't
necessarily feel safe. And I know I've been through many, many periods
of time in my life where that was the case. And I wish I had
known what I know now, but I know it now, so that's good.
(29:22):
And the piece that really like I have brought in
is this idea of planting cover crops.
So for regenerative farmers, they know that the most
important element in the success of
their crops, of the fertility of what they're growing,
is the quality of the soil, specifically the
(29:44):
topsoil, the humus and the root word of human. And
humus is the same and it means of the ground.
And so I just love anything etymology
and anything that can really remind us of the truth. So I think a
lot about our nervous system regulation as
our own soil and our ability to access
(30:06):
the richness of our lived experience as like an increased
fertility in our soil. And what
regenerative farmers know is that there's a season
to plant cover crops. And cover crops
are things that you are planting that are you are not going
to sell, but the act of growing
(30:29):
them so they're not going to market, they're not cash crops, but the act
of growing them actually nutrients
and regenerates the soil. So for me
as an entrepreneur and what I love to share is for people
who have businesses or just really, it's really
anybody, it doesn't have to be just entrepreneurs to think about what are the COVID
(30:51):
crops in our life? What are those times
when we're doing something that actually does
allow our brain to go into a different
state, allows our body to go into a different state where
we're not trying to monetize it. And it
actually is providing the benefits of active
(31:14):
rest and renutrienting our
bodies, renutrienting our soil to improve our
soil quality. So, you know, I have a friend who does a lot of
knitting. She doesn't sell her knitting. Her. She makes money a totally different way.
Right. Coloring with my kids, doing different like
stretching techniques, like what are. I mean other people call
(31:37):
this hobbies. But I
really, you know, I know so many achievement
oriented people who just really don't have any hobbies. And then they get excited about
a hobby and then they try to turn it into a business, which is
fine, but it really then is no longer a cover
crop. Then it's activating a whole other part of ourselves. And I love
(31:59):
making money. I think there's so much value in that. It's. I think it could
be sacred. And I love to think about COVID
crops in our life as a way to bring in
active rest that's deeply regulating, that
also allows us to wind
down so that maybe more passive rest is
(32:20):
more accessible later. I love that so much.
Jennifer and I have been talking a lot with each other just about.
It's not just about taking things away, but bringing
things into that restore and replenish. One of the
things that has been really great for me in this season is I've been working
a lot with like my voice and singing and doing
(32:42):
vocal activation. And it gets to be just for me. It's not like something that
I'm going to do to create a course on or it's just
this. It has become quite spiritual and has
this huge impact on the health of my nervous system and working with
my vocal cords, but finding more things like that that
are just for the experience, for
(33:04):
the being in it and the creativity. I think it's
really, really, really, really important. And you
mentioned a bit ago too, when you were talking about the time
with your daughter, that there were strategies or things
that you saw in terms of the business. Would you speak to that a little
bit about some of the things that you saw? Well, okay, there's so many things,
(33:27):
but first I want to just say, and I'm sure you've talked about this
before on previous episodes, but I want to highlight that there
was something you said, Jennifer, to really get
that when we
are dysregulated
and overworking and exhausting
(33:48):
ourselves as a trauma response
There are specific oppressive systems that really
benefit from that. And for some of my people,
it's very activating in a good way. Like, it kind of lights this
fire in their belly to feel like,
oh, rest is actually revolutionary.
(34:11):
So maybe I actually can do this
to dismantle within myself these
structures and systems that actually do keep people
disempowered. So I wanted to say that because it's like a bigger.
It's very personal, but it's also macro. And I believe we can all really
contribute to that on a micro level. And so with that,
(34:33):
the two things that I want to point to are, number one,
because I had
zero time and zero
energy, I had no
ability to focus on anything that was not
absolutely necessary in that first year of
(34:54):
parenthood. And that sucked. But it was such a gift
because it helped me to, by accident,
really apply Pareto's principle. And Pareto's principle
says that 20% of our actions will cause
80% of our results. And I think actually, if you do
the math on a lot of businesses or a lot of workplaces, it's actually closer
(35:17):
to 5% of what we do actually creates
95% of the results. So if you think about, for you
to, you know, these podcast episodes and, like, devoting yourself
and pouring your hearts and your presence into them and the way this show has
taken off, right. People are
connecting to the resonance
(35:38):
and the magnetism of
presence in you too, versus
and obviously the depth of knowledge and incredible research that goes
into it. That level of magnetism
and depth is available because
you are taking those periods of rest both active and passive.
(36:00):
And it allows the podcast to be part of that
20% or 15% or 10, five, whatever,
that then leads to all these results. I mean, I know nothing
about your two businesses, but for most people I know, including myself, there's
a lot we could just literally stop
doing. And so after that first
(36:22):
year when I kind of, like, could pull my head above the water and
things weren't so, like, emergent all the time, I
did do an analysis and I looked at, okay,
if I look at all my biggest wins in business, you know, getting my
first book published, these various, like, higher
income spikes, these moments of increased visibility
(36:44):
that allowed our platform to grow, things like that. And I looked at
what had directly contributed to those things. It was
only two kinds of tasks for me. One
was connecting with people, and two was creating content.
And so I was like, if I look at my calendar and I want everyone
listening to do this, no matter what your career, if you are
(37:06):
A stay at home parent. This still applies. There
are 20% of the things that I do that create
80% of the connection with my children. They do not
include, like having perfect birthday parties
or, you know, like, we do so much
shit that doesn't matter. And so for everyone listening,
(37:28):
identify an area of your life that you would like to
enhance and look at what are all the
tasks that I do in this area? What are
my biggest wins in this area? And then draw a line
from the things that are your biggest wins to the task
that directly results in that win.
(37:51):
And then take a line and cross out all the other tasks
that are not identified. And you'll find you have a lot more time
available. But here's what's so important about the work that's discussed
here in the work at NSI and all of the work you do, then
it's like, yeah, okay, so cognitively I can know
that I can eliminate 80% of the test, but I feel
(38:14):
freaking unsafe when I do that. And so that's
where then we do that deeper work of learning to
find safety in our bodies. Because no amount of
items checked off on a to do list is ever going to ultimately
make you feel safe, complete and whole or successful.
So that was thing number one. And so 80, 20 rule.
(38:37):
Most people have heard of it, but the question is, are
you using it? And then the thing number two that made
a huge difference for me is beginning to see
my month seasonally and cyclically
and my projects in our company seasonally and
cyclically. So because we live in a patriarchy and
(38:59):
we are, you know, the focus is on that which is
visible is valuable, we
forget that actually in the
year here on planet Earth we have a
springtime and a summertime, which is the seasons
of visible growth and external expression. So
(39:21):
beautiful. That's the solar, that's the masculine, that's
the young. We also have the
seasons of autumn and winter, which are the
times for the invisible, the
stuff that you really can't see, that is
equally as valuable and necessary
(39:43):
in order to have a
fertile, vibrant spring and summer. We
must have the season where everything's falling off the
trees, where it's a little sad, where it's kind of
dark. And then we need the season of winter where
it's just still and
(40:04):
gray. And I started to see how
in my business I had hyper focused
on spring and summer activities and had not given
credence or time to autumn and
winter activities. And I created something I call the upward cycle of
success, where I named
(40:26):
each of Those periods of time for a
business. So the springtime energy is emergence, time of new
beginnings. The summertime energy is visibility,
the time of launching, the time of being out there. The autumn
energy is the time of culmination, crossing.
T's dotting. I's doing analytics,
(40:49):
tidying things up, gathering your nuts so you can go into
hibernation, which I like to call the fertile
void. And that time where my first pregnancy
also really taught me, in the first trimester of a
pregnancy, you don't really look like you're
pregnant. And in our culture you're not supposed to tell
(41:11):
anybody. However, you have made every
single organ of a human body, so it looks
like nothing is happening. But during that time I was like,
my mind is completely blown. In this period
of time, I have like made a liver
and made a heart and I didn't have to put it on my to
(41:33):
do list or think about it at all. And in fact, if you asked me
how to do it, I would have no idea. And that was
just this incredible experience example of how
the wisdom of nature really knows. And we need
to follow the lead of the wisdom of nature, of the blueprint
of our bodies, as opposed to trying to
(41:55):
overlay this false linear
idea of constant growth and
constant production. And so I really
started to work with, not only on a more micro level, my own
menstrual cycle and the lunar cycle to guide what was going
to be the energy I was going to lead with in any given week. Then
(42:17):
also to really look at the macro of my company and say,
okay, we've got spring and summer energy down. We're
never going to. We're so programmed for that. We don't need to worry about it.
It's the autumn and the winter energy that we need to
build in time for. So we actually really shifted the way we do
project management to build in those times. And
(42:39):
as a result, it keeps getting better and better. We just
keep doing fewer things and making more money. It freaking blows
my mind. That's so beautiful. And there was something
you spoke to Kate that I want us to talk a little bit about because
I think it's really important, which is the deconstruction of systems of
oppression that are inside of us and that we do
(43:02):
perpetuate when we stay in these cycles. And that there is. You know,
Adrienne Maree Brown's work on this was a huge
inspiration for me and really reframing looking at
rest as an act of rebellion. And I would love to
just hear more of your thoughts on that. Because I love to talk about
it. Yeah. You know, I, of course, learned about the way
(43:23):
beliefs live in our. In our brains
and nervous systems from you. And one of the
things that I love to have people ask in my
programs is when we're looking at limiting beliefs.
For example, my productivity
determines my worth could be a limiting
(43:45):
belief. So when we look at that, I really love to have people ask
the question, who benefits from me believing this?
You know, and it's like, oh, white
capitalist, toxic patriarchy. You know, and just as
a reminder, that does not exist outside
of us. I mean, it does, and it also exists inside of
(44:08):
us. So I think, for me, it's been really helpful to
not see the problem as external
and instead really work with. Or in addition
to really work with. Okay, what are the ways that
that programming lives in Me and I have
two little girls. They're six and eight. And so it's very
(44:32):
present. How I live
is modeling and literally
ingraining their nervous systems with what is
safe and what is not safe. Safe. And,
you know, just this one simple, simple example, I
have a real, like, my default is to do too much. I
(44:55):
wrote do less because I need it. And so
I have this little daughter. She's so
headstrong. She's amazing. And I was describing to her a week
that we're going to have this summer, and I was like, it's going to be
so fun. We're going to be on this road trip, and we're going to visit
this person and this person. Then we're going to go over here, and then we're
(45:16):
going to do this. And I was, like, so excited. And I look at her
little face, and she just started to cry. And I was like, oh, my gosh,
what's going on? And she goes, mama, it's too
much. It's too much. It sounds like too much. That
sounds really tiring. And she's in kindergarten,
so I was like, oh, my
(45:38):
gosh. Okay, great. So out of all those things that
I listed, what would you. What sounds
like the one you would want to do? And she told me. And so we're
focusing on that because I'm really realizing
I don't want to sweep them up in my
trauma response doing. I don't want that to be
(46:01):
what they imprint as. This is what's required to
be a good woman. This is what's required to be a good friend. This is.
I have to stay on some kind of treadmill
sprinting in order to stay relevant or, you know, I mean, it's
like, and so I think we
can undo the patterning
(46:22):
and dismantle the systems in small,
seemingly insignificant moments, like deciding your
summer plan. It doesn't always have to, you know, just lying
down on the floor in the middle of your workday for five minutes or doing
a neuro tool is a revolutionary act.
And just the fact that it gives us space
(46:44):
between stimulus and response to be able to choose,
how am I going to be in this moment? That
is, every single time we do that, we are calling
our power back. That is our. I mean, the way I think of it,
I don't know what your frameworks are, but I see that as my connection
with the divine. I see that as my connection with source with a
(47:08):
capital S. And every time I do it, it's like a little
prayer. And I just can feel, you know,
And I do it too, like, on behalf of my
grandmothers who didn't have that.
They didn't know this stuff. This was not available. This
information was not available. And in very different
(47:30):
ways they lived trapped in their
own paradigms. It was a different time. And
it's like, I see very directly
the ways that we do heal seven generations
forward and seven generations back when we
interrupt in ourselves the patterning and when we
(47:52):
have the courage to say, like, what might
be possible. Is there something else
available here? And I'm somebody who loves to
put my attention and focus to the degree that I can
on building out new possibilities
as opposed to railing against the systems that exist.
(48:14):
Like, okay, well, the best way for me to
dismantle a system is to unravel it in myself
and to dream into what else could be
birthed. So that's an invitation for
all of us on where we want to put our attention as well. I
love that. I really love so much of what you said because I think I'm
(48:37):
one of these people, as I've gone along
deprogramming and busting out through some of this matrix, that
I'm really someone who likes to buck the system. I'm someone who wants
to go against what's happening out
there. I love what you said about just laying down in the floor and taking
a nap for five minutes out of the day. We call it visual reset in
(48:58):
the NSI world. But I've got a sleep mask right next to my desk right
here. Because If I've got five, 10, maybe 20
minutes out of the day, I'm just gonna lay down with my sleep mask,
put on some beats, something soothing, maybe a
meditation. I might even if it's okay. Like, depending on the temperature, go outside
and lay down on the ground for 20 minutes and, like, do
(49:20):
nothing. And that's one of the ways that I sort of empty my. My
bucket out as I move throughout the day. And, like, I love to play
little nap roulette if I've got the space in my day. It's like,
I've got a few hours here. What could happen? What could happen?
Could I fall asleep for hours? And so a couple of the other things
that have really helped me is I've invested in Block Blue Light. I love that
(49:43):
company. I love their glasses. I've got a full spectrum table lamp that
I use at night to read in that has helped me so much
because I have a visual deficit in my nervous system, and that visual
deficit is causing threat in my nervous system day,
just as the day goes on. So between the visual reset and the block
blue light, my eye fatigue has gone down so
(50:05):
much. That's helping me rest and it's helping me stay
productive in the ways that I feel good about being
productive. Yeah. And you know, what's really important to
know as well is that the data does not
actually show that more hours
worked equals better results. So I just want to be
(50:28):
really clear about, like, taking four hours of
our day to, you know, fill
some of the sleep deficit is actually the best use of our
time. Because what we see in the data is that when we
are well rested, as you said, our cognitive
abilities, our creativity, our. Our ability
(50:50):
to integrate memory and create connections between
seemingly disconnected, like, we are
superheroes when we are well rested. And
three hours working when you are well rested could
very easily take you, like, 12
hours when you're exhausted. So just to be
(51:11):
super clear, this idea that, oh, I'll sleep when
I'm dead, or. Or it's a good idea to sacrifice sleep
or rest in order to get things done is
scientifically inaccurate. It doesn't work. I would
just love to dip into what you were talking about
there of, like, it's not necessarily true that the more we
(51:33):
do, the more benefit we get. And I think that that can
happen in business, in work, when we're
suddenly like, okay, well, you know, I heard this podcast and
people say to do less or whatever, and then it can actually really
kick up a lot of fear patterning and stress patterning.
That's unnecessary, which is why I love cover crops. It's like, you
(51:55):
can quote, unquote, stay busy. Like, you can
do active rest, Right? It's not busy, but it's active rest.
Like I remember I had a coach who I adore, and
I think this was a great assignment, but she assigned to me.
It was many years ago, long before I knew any of this stuff,
to sit in a room for an hour and do
(52:18):
nothing. It was. It was brutal. It was
brutal. And if I knew now what I know, then
I would have taken that in smaller doses.
Yeah, I know. I mean, I have a lot of clients and myself too.
Same thing. Like, we hear all this stuff about meditation is so great. And. And
it is. It does have great benefits, and we have to dose
(52:40):
it appropriately. And a nervous system that's in a state of
dysregulation, having all these intense feelings and stress
hormones, it can be really activating to try to
sit still, to even to feel the internal sensations of your body.
Too much, too fast. All of this can really be
overwhelming. And so it's about calibrating at that right dose or
(53:02):
finding other ways, like you said, cover crops or kind of moving
meditations, mindfulness while you're doing other things, so that
our system has the ability to get some movement, to get
some regulation and practice being present in
the moment, getting out of those racing thought loops without.
I'm going to sit in this room and have everything that I'm feeling
(53:26):
get turned up really loud and try to then shame myself
for not being able to do it. Okay, I would love to know a little
more. Like, where can people find you if they want to work with you more?
Any closing thoughts? Yeah, closing thoughts would
just be that, you know, our worth is not determined by our
productivity, and we really are
(53:48):
infinitely inherently worthy and we
could never do anything to undo that.
Amen. Thank you, Kate. Thanks for joining us.
Thank you so much. It was an absolute pleasure.
This podcast is for informational and educational purposes
only and should not be considered medical or psychological advice.
(54:11):
We often discuss lived experiences through traumatic events
and sensitive topics that deal with complex developmental and
systemic trauma that may be unsettling for some listeners.
This podcast is not intended to replace professional medical
advice. If you are in the United States and you or someone you know
is struggling with their mental health and is in immediate danger, please call
(54:32):
911 for specific services relating to mental health,
please see the full disclaimer in the show notes.
Foreign.
Welcome back to Trauma Rewired. Today we're bringing you one of our most
popular episodes, one that resonated so deeply with our listeners
that we knew it deserved a re release. We're revisiting our
conversation with Kate Northrup on rest, a topic that
for so many of us is deeply tied to trauma
(00:21):
capacity and worthiness. If you've ever struggled to
slow down, if rest feels unsafe or
unproductive, or if your nervous system is stuck in survival mode,
this episode is for you. Kay is not only the author of Do Less,
she's an expert in creating easeful financial business strategies.
And she's an NSI certified coach who deeply understands how
(00:44):
our nervous system shapes our ability to rest, receive and
regulate. That's what makes her work so different. She doesn't just teach people how to
make money, she helps them rewire their relationship to money. So that
financial well being isn't just about numbers in a bank account. It's
about safety, stability and capacity. And that's why we
have to tell you about her upcoming workshop. It is free and it's live.
(01:06):
It's called the Good with Money three day experience, happening April
17th, 22nd and 24th. And this isn't just
about money. It's about healing the way you relate to it so you can
feel more ease, more trust expansion in your life. And make
sure to sign in@Katenorthrup.com
because if you end up deciding to do her Relaxed Money program and you've
(01:29):
joined through that link, you'll also get some special bonuses, including
a teaching that I did for her Relaxed Money program on the neurosomatics
of money and some surprise bonuses from us. This
is an incredible opportunity to experience firsthand how nervous system
regulation can completely change your financial reality. So whether you're
new to this episode or listening again for deeper integration, we invite you to
(01:52):
settle in, take a deep breath, and soak in some of Kate's brilliance as
we explore the deep connection between rest,
capacity and abundance.
So I'd love for you to just tell us a little bit about yourself, Kate,
and why this topic is so important to you. Like, why did you write a
whole book on doing less and helping people find more
(02:14):
ease more rest? Yeah, you know, it's so funny.
Like in this moment I'm just really noticing I'm kind of
emotional, which is so interesting and
unusual at the beginning of a podcast. But I think that
like this is such a full circle moment because
when I wrote Do Less, it came out in 2019,
(02:36):
of course I had Heard of the nervous system. I mean, I'm here
on planet Earth. I really didn't
know what I know now. I didn't know about
how trauma lives in the body. I didn't know about
overworking patterns and trauma. I didn't know about
productivity as a trauma response. I didn't know
(02:58):
what you ladies know, what you folks, your whole thing is about.
And I remember my coach at the
time, Ra Goddess, in the end of 2019. So
my book had been out nine months. I had written it. You know, it
takes a long time for books to come out. So I finished it at the
end of 2018. No, 2017. Oh, my God, 2017. It's like
(03:20):
100 years ago. And she handed me this book called
Patriarchy stress disorder by Dr. Valerie Rain.
And as my friend Megan Watterson says, I just read the title of
the book, and, like, my heart fell out of my butt. I was just like,
oh, my God, this is literally everything.
And it was like this whole. It was like me seeing the
(03:42):
Matrix all of a sudden and realizing that
the reason I wrote Do Less is
because of the deeper trauma
patterning in my own lineage and in
womankind, but also humankind around
productivity and basically running. Because
(04:03):
we have been so programmed to be afraid
to be still and to be afraid to feel.
And so what so, so cool about that is, well,
a. I'm working on another book that actually directly incorporates it. But
in retrospect, what I realized is my first book, Money A Love
Story, and my second book, Do Less, the curriculum that I
(04:26):
teach in them, so many of the exercises that I teach in them
work because they actually do work to
heal the nervous system. I just didn't know that. And so it's such
a testament, I think, to the wisdom of. Of our
bodies that, like those came
through me as part of my own healing journey. Even
(04:48):
though no one told me, oh, this is how
you heal the nervous system. Productivity can very much be
a trauma response. Obsession with achievement, you know, all of those
things. And so that's kind of the bigger
picture of my own work around that. But I
will say, just from a personal perspective, you know, I come
(05:10):
from a long line of overwhelming working women. And,
you know, I watched my. I watched my granny.
Her granny's life motto was,
don't ask for a lighter pack. Ask for a stronger back.
And she was the oldest North American woman to ever climb to
Mount Everest Base Camp at the age of 84. My
(05:33):
mom spent most of her career just really
in go mode. My dad as well, and all My whole family. And
so I wrote Do Less sort of as this healing
manual for myself and hopefully for my
daughters and hopefully to open up a
possibility for more lives that are allowed to
(05:54):
have people be instead of do. Oh, I love
that. Or in addition. I'll say in addition.
Yeah, totally. In addition is a great way to put it. And I
love that so much and can relate so much to coming from a
lineage of workaholics
who really just. It was modeled
(06:16):
so much and it becomes so deeply woven into
our neural architecture, into our nervous system, to only feel safe
with that level of productivity. And I do want to
talk a little bit about stress physiologically and the importance
of rest from a physical and from a nervous system
perspective. Because I think it helps people to understand and
(06:37):
deconstruct some of that when you know, know kind of what's going on in the
body. And just like you were saying, you know, we used to think of trauma
as this psychological phenomenon and now we know it's, it's
physiological, it's experienced through the body, through the nervous
system. And stress is a huge component
of that experience. It's a root cause of disease and mental health
(06:58):
decline. And when we experience a stressor or
a threat, our body's primary goal is our
survival. And it's ancient, kind of complicated
and pretty brilliant way to do that is through our stress response system that
mobilizes our resources, it prepares us for action, and it's
adaptive. But if it is occurring chronically,
(07:20):
that's a problem. And so these responses, these stress responses
that happen in our body, they are a necessary part of everyday
life. And we're not looking for a life without activation.
Nervous system regulation isn't that for flat line of
being calm or Zen all the time. But it's really that ability to
modulate between these states to get activated when it's appropriate
(07:42):
and then to be able to rest and recover and adapt.
But when we're facing that overwhelm all
of the time, we can't respond anymore to the stress. There's
no escape. We're constantly suppressing and repressing our
body's natural stress relief and regulation. Actions like movement
or vocalization or crying or shaking, these emotional response
(08:04):
responses that help us regulate. And then we get stuck in states of
hypervigilance, constantly scanning the environment or our
relationships, looking for threat. And we're having that stress
reaction over and over again inside of our body. And it's just
not meant to be long term. And I think too
it's important for people to Understand that, like stress is stress, our survival
(08:26):
mind doesn't distinguish between social threat or a
physical threat, or doing this podcast or having a meeting.
Our nervous system is just taking in all of this information all
the time from our sensory systems about our external environment
and our internal environment, our balance, our orientation,
knowing where our body is in space. And if that information
(08:48):
is unclear or blurry or inaccurate, that's already
enough to initiate a stress response, because I might fall,
I might hurt myself, I can't make an accurate prediction. And then these
signals all of the time are coming in through our nervous
system, making it up to our brainstem and then to our limbic system,
where they're interpreted by many different areas of the brain.
(09:10):
The amygdala working with the hypothalamus to turn our emotions
into our physical experience. And we start to have that fear response
through the HPA axis. And now we have all of these hormones,
adrenaline and cortisol, moving through the
body. And if this keeps going all of the time,
and we're in that dysregulated state. We talked about this
(09:33):
in our burnout episode, but just a little bit condensed so that people
have this information as we dive into the mindset and the beliefs
and the cultural aspects. When we have too much cortisol
all of the time, it keeps us in a state of high alert or a
low grade survival response. So it doesn't let the body shift back
into a parasympathetic state. And then it becomes really difficult to
(09:55):
sleep or to rest. That just doesn't feel safe. And
it's this chemical or hormonal obstacle to rest.
And when we have that, that's what's
called adrenal sensitivity, too much cortisol all of the time, and then that
leads to those health outcomes like diabetes or muscle weakness,
osteoporosis. And then over time, we can also
(10:18):
lose our ability to produce cortisol because our system doesn't have the
resources for that. And then we can move into adrenal burnout or
fatigue. So that's when the adrenal glands can't keep creating
cortisol. We don't have the resources anymore. And then
we start to move into an adrenaline response. So now instead of having
cortisol in our system all the time, we're actually running on adrenaline. And
(10:41):
that pushes us into an even higher level of
hypervigilance, a heightened level of survival, because
adrenaline is our short term survival hormone. And so you get
a big inflammatory response that can lead to autoimmune.
Lots of disease state in the body and it pushes your system into this
strained level, this very high stress level all of the
(11:02):
time. And then eventually we move into full blown
adrenal burnout where our system can't produce adrenaline either. And that's
when it's going to flip us into chronic fatigue where we don't have the energy
to keep going because our metabolism is in a deficit, our
cortisol production is in a deficit, our adrenaline production is in a
deficit. So there's really nothing left in our body to
(11:25):
create energy on demand. And so you're left in this constant
state of fatigue or malaise, like you
just can't have the energy to do anything anymore.
And that's when we really move into that deep burnout and
illness. Chronic sleep disturbances can be such a big
problem for so many reasons too. Like, there's an importance of rest,
(11:47):
is what I'm learning is that I need to rest a little bit throughout the
day so that at the end of the day I'm not just looking to totally
offload my entire day and have this big expectation of like,
oh, and now I'm going to go to sleep. And so what
I really think about too, because from the burnout and functional freeze
conversation, one of the things that came up for us was that a lot of
(12:08):
times we can engage in activities that we think may be
restful or refueling, but actually it depletes us a little
bit more as we go on. And I really think about
for rest being my new horizon. I really think about the
integration that I lose when I don't get a good night's sleep
and how that really has big effects on,
(12:30):
on my cognitive health and really even my emotional well
being the next day. And when we think about after we work out
and we intentionally stress our bodies through weight training or aerobic
activity, and then we need rest time on the back end of
that so that we don't harm ourselves any further so
we don't get injured. And so it's that
(12:51):
same, it's that integration that gives us that positive adaptation
and resilience that also happens when we sleep and that slowing
down that needs to happen. And so like four, some of the
cognitive health when we sleep, part of our brain's integration
process is coming up with solutions that we might have for
some potentially complex problems in our lives. And for
(13:13):
anyone who suffered with insomnia or maybe moms that don't
sleep for those first couple of years of their children's lives
is also who I think of. And I was diagnosed with insomnia at a pretty
early age. And I know how difficult it is
after many nights of sleep to not be able to come out of the brain
fog, for the emotional piece to have more rumination
(13:35):
on more negative thoughts versus positive experiences that I'm
having. And sleep is crucial for memory
consolidation, for learning. And, you know, the brain
also relieves itself of, like, many toxins throughout the night. And
I think for the. For the emotional piece, that recalling of negative
experiences, it also drives depression. It,
(13:57):
like, drives depression and even an increase in mood swings. And
I definitely have experienced that on top of,
like, it can get hard to parse out, like, what's complex trauma,
what's insomnia, what's my neurodivergence? And it just
becomes this, like, overwhelming piece of, like,
wow, this is pretty overwhelming. So I'm interested to know,
(14:19):
Kate, from your perspective, what comes up for you when we talk about
rest and recovery and, like, what it's been like in your journey and. And
how you came into the place of rest and recovery. Serves my
business. It serves my relationships well. What
happened is I'm glad you brought up new motherhood for
me. I was the total achiever
(14:41):
type. Academic pressure, early
success in business, yada, yada, yada. And then
I got pregnant with my first daughter, and I have
never been so tired in my life. And
people kept saying, oh, just wait until the second trimester. You'll have this
huge energy burst. But that never happened. And I was
(15:04):
sleeping, like, 14 hours a day. It was very
bizarre to have been such a physically
mentally capable person and suddenly be taken
out. And then my daughter was born. I had quite a
traumatic experience with her birth, and then she was really
sick. So the first year of her life, it just
(15:26):
continued. And she had severe eczema and sometimes
would be waking up every night, every 10 minutes,
screaming and scratching herself. And her sheets were bloody
all the time. I mean, it was like, this was not what was on the
literature in terms of motherhood. Everyone else was like,
oh, it's the best time of my life. And I was like, it's
(15:48):
like a horror movie at my house. And I couldn't sleep.
I had severe postpartum insomnia.
And it was the first time in my life that
I had a problem that I couldn't
overcome by being smarter or more
capable or working harder. None of the
(16:10):
usual solutions that I had worked.
And yet a year into my daughter's
first year of life. So we sat with our
accountant and we looked at our
numbers, and despite having worked less than half
the amount I had ever worked in my adult life. That
(16:32):
year we had made more money than we ever had before, and our. Our income
source was our business. So it wasn't like there was some other. This was
like, if I wasn't working, there wasn't me and my husband
running together. And it was such a light bulb moment for
me because while I would not go through that year again if you
paid me, it was awful. I thought, huh, that's
(16:55):
so interesting. I have been working my
entire adult life as though the number of
hours and the amount of effort is the
most important thing and actually what ended up happening. And,
you know, there's. There's so many changes that happen in the maternal brain
and obviously nervous system all connected, but
(17:17):
I had become instantly focused on only what
mattered because the survival of my child
depended on it. And I had zero
fucks to give and zero energy for
anything extraneous nothing. And
as a result, that ended up being a very good
(17:38):
business strategy. And I thought, wow, okay, so if I could make more money
than ever before, working less than half the amount while completely
distracted, you know, not distracted, but while completely devoted to
keeping this baby alive and like, vaguely staying
sane. And on some days that was not. That was debatable, like, in
terms of my mental health really suffered. I thought, well, maybe during
(18:01):
less difficult years there could be some things that
I could point to or look back at and research
as effective strategies. And, you know, I'm happy to walk through what
some of those were, but that was my own experience, really realizing,
oh, more is not necessarily always better.
And it was my own body and my daughter's
(18:23):
body that brought me home to that truth. And I'm so
grateful because nothing teaches us a lesson
like an embodied experience. Wow.
Yeah, that is really inspiring for me to hear about
as I'm like, in this own place of. My own place of
navigating, not doing more all of the time, and
(18:45):
just allowing the seeds that are planted some space and air
to breathe and grow. And what a beautiful
example of that from your experience.
And I do think it's really
the most powerful experiences we have are those experiential
times where that's enough to start to shift
(19:08):
the paradigm inside of us and be like, oh, maybe there's something else
totally possible. And just total side
note, I relate to your daughter so much. I was also born with
eczema all over, so I feel that it's still how
my nervous system communicates to me sometimes when my stress load is
too high. And as you were talking about that
(19:30):
beautiful shift in your business. I was thinking
too, it is a place where I'm navigating in my own life and
how it's a real deconstruction and it's a
challenge coming from a complex trauma background because
so much of the patterning that happens for someone with
developmental trauma is to be in this state of
(19:50):
hyper vigilance all the time. There's real changes to our brain.
Our amygdala actually changes in size and we're perceiving,
we're more sensitive, our alarm detector is more sensitive to
threat. We have less ability to put on that
parasympathetic brake, less vagal tone. And there's just
this felt sense inside of the body a lot of
(20:12):
times that it's not safe. Rest is this really
vulnerable state and there's a letting go of control
and a certain amount of presence. And our brains are just so
primed for that threat that there is a huge component
of this that's continuously working with my nervous system to create that
felt sense of safety inside and then to starting to work
(20:35):
with regulating the HPA axis because then as I'm
perceiving threat all the time now I do have that adrenaline and
cortisol which is going to keep me in a more of a high alert, keep
triggering the F responses in my body. And then
inside it feels like I need to run, I need to fight.
And so navigating that I think
(20:56):
it's so important to have the cognitive shifts and then
couple it with practical tools, strategies to
work directly with the nervous system and start to re pattern that at that
neurological level. Because that
deep nervous system pattern, just like you were talking about, about seeing the
trauma pattern that have been driving your behavior, it really comes out
(21:18):
everywhere, right? It impacts us physically, but also emotionally and
cognitively. It changes our relationships, how we show up at work.
And so it's such a layered topic to
dive into for sure. When I think of the lack of safety
to rest in business, I really think about the podcast
actually. And Kate, what you were going back to, one of the things that we
(21:40):
learned here as we were experiencing so much growth
with trauma rewired, it felt like we needed to deliver and deliver and
deliver and deliver and keep delivering and delivering and depleting
ourselves. And we learned, I think it was, we Learned in season
2, we took like a 12 week break and we experienced massive
growth and we were like, oh my God, we're not really
(22:03):
even doing anything. And it goes back to the seeds being
planted and it Was like, oh, now we've learned. And now we actually
take two breaks a year because we're like, let's capitalize
on the rest and the growth. Because there's a matrix there.
Like you're talking about this matrix that you can finally get
this measurable experience of. Like when you step out of it
(22:25):
and you're like, oh, I've been playing the wrong
game. I've been programmed into a game that's
not letting me win. And as soon as you can start to unplug from that
a little bit and then you get into like these new awarenesses of
like, oh, that's not real. What is real to
my success? My growth is resting and
(22:47):
pulling away from this. And then it serves our regulation as we've
come to learn, just really serves the podcast. And like there's so
many different types of rest that we need. We need that cognitive and
mental rest which for me that comes in times of like
silence or maybe some gentle music, grounding, being
in nature. And there's this idea of emotional rest
(23:10):
and I think self care can fall into that. Getting into
emotional expression and practices, being witnessed,
feeling heard, feeling seen, leading also into social rest. People go
to social media thinking that like, oh, I'll get social connection,
I'll get the rest that I need. But social media is so activating and really
leads to more deprivation.
(23:32):
And then of course we have the physical rest that
we all need. And passive and active
is are different components of physical rest. And that could be like
napping or stretching. And for people who
have ADHD or any other neuro type of neurodivergence,
the research is showing that the sleep deprivation that occurs
(23:54):
in neurodivergent people is even higher than
the neurotypical individuals because
there's delays in circadian rhythm and there's
changes in melatonin production. And that's like a crucial chemical that our body
needs for healthy sleep. But there's also an increased likelihood
of someone with a neurodivergence having a medication
(24:16):
and medication induced sleep issues. Maybe someone's
on a stimulant or a psychotropic medication that's commonly
prescribed and those don't really support the success
in non disturbed sleep cycle. Hey,
trauma rewired listeners, we have something really special for you.
We are so proud to align as affiliates with Kate
(24:38):
Northrup's work because she brings real deep nervous system
education into all of her programs. This just isn't another
mindset or money coaching program. This is about rewiring
your relationship with money at the brain, body and
emotional level so that you can actually feel ease,
safety and abundance. That's why we're not just recommending
(25:00):
this, we're attending it. KAIT is hosting a free live
workshop, the Good with Money three day experience, on April
17th, 22nd and 24th, and we want you to join
us. Over these three days, you'll experience powerful
money healing practices and start shifting your nervous system's
relationship with money immediately. And because we deeply
(25:22):
believe in this work, we're also offering a special bonus. If you attend the free
workshop and decide to join Relaxed Money through our link
kate northrup.comtr you'll get an
exclusive one hour kickoff training with me and Jennifer. And this
will be a private session just for our community to prepare your nervous system
before the program starts so that you have the capacity
(25:44):
to fully integrate this work. And you'll also find teachings
from me throughout the program. But to access this
bonus, you need to register through the link
katenorthrup.comtr and when you do this,
you're not only supporting yourself, but you're also supporting this podcast,
allowing us to bring you powerful conversations every week.
(26:05):
So if you're ready to shift your relationship with money in a deeply embodied
way, join us for Good with
money@katenorthrup.com tr. We cannot wait to
do this work alongside of you. Well, I really want to speak to
the seasons and cycles because
what was such a game changer for me was
(26:26):
understanding similar, you know, not dissimilar to when I
discovered the majesty of the nervous system.
I tapped into our innate
seasonality and cyclicality as humans
around that same time that I discovered that
we had made more money, but I had worked less.
(26:48):
But what was so fascinating, per, I
love this example of you taking this 12 week
break and your podcast growing even
more. Because what we know is that we
as humans are animals, which
means we are nature. We don't hang out in nature. We
(27:10):
don't need to connect with nature. We are
nature. And so the same principles that
govern trees and flowers and squirrels
and grass and weather patterns, like, they govern
our bodies as well. Which is why grounding practices and
all the data around, you know, earthing and being out in nature, we
(27:33):
are instantly activating a parasympathetic
response. Obviously it's more nuanced. Nuanced than that, but like going
home literally to activate,
accessing the outdoors, even if it's just a little sliver
of light through an open window, like that is our
true nature. And so when I started to look
(27:54):
at okay, well, if I had a beautiful rose,
I wouldn't be like bashing
it or berating it for not being in bloom all
year long. Roses have a season, we know that they
blame have a season. There's a season for planting, there's a season
for, for sprouting, there's a season for being a little
(28:16):
blossom, there's a season for being in full bloom, and then there's
a season for going back to seed. And there, there is a
season for the pause. And then I started
learning about regenerative agriculture and the
metaphors for how we run businesses are
so ripe and rich and fertile. And one thing,
(28:38):
and you're talking about passive rest versus active rest
for those of us who do
have a history of trauma and quite frankly, like, I don't
really know if anybody doesn't. So for those of us who are human
listening to this vodcast, one thing that I've
noticed is that just as you were talking about Jennifer,
(29:01):
just resting is not necessarily
immediately available because being still can
actually activate our hyper vigilance and it doesn't
necessarily feel safe. And I know I've been through many, many periods
of time in my life where that was the case. And I wish I had
known what I know now, but I know it now, so that's good.
(29:22):
And the piece that really like I have brought in
is this idea of planting cover crops.
So for regenerative farmers, they know that the most
important element in the success of
their crops, of the fertility of what they're growing,
is the quality of the soil, specifically the
(29:44):
topsoil, the humus and the root word of human. And
humus is the same and it means of the ground.
And so I just love anything etymology
and anything that can really remind us of the truth. So I think a
lot about our nervous system regulation as
our own soil and our ability to access
(30:06):
the richness of our lived experience as like an increased
fertility in our soil. And what
regenerative farmers know is that there's a season
to plant cover crops. And cover crops
are things that you are planting that are you are not going
to sell, but the act of growing
(30:29):
them so they're not going to market, they're not cash crops, but the act
of growing them actually nutrients
and regenerates the soil. So for me
as an entrepreneur and what I love to share is for people
who have businesses or just really, it's really
anybody, it doesn't have to be just entrepreneurs to think about what are the COVID
(30:51):
crops in our life? What are those times
when we're doing something that actually does
allow our brain to go into a different
state, allows our body to go into a different state where
we're not trying to monetize it. And it
actually is providing the benefits of active
(31:14):
rest and renutrienting our
bodies, renutrienting our soil to improve our
soil quality. So, you know, I have a friend who does a lot of
knitting. She doesn't sell her knitting. Her. She makes money a totally different way.
Right. Coloring with my kids, doing different like
stretching techniques, like what are. I mean other people call
(31:37):
this hobbies. But I
really, you know, I know so many achievement
oriented people who just really don't have any hobbies. And then they get excited about
a hobby and then they try to turn it into a business, which is
fine, but it really then is no longer a cover
crop. Then it's activating a whole other part of ourselves. And I love
(31:59):
making money. I think there's so much value in that. It's. I think it could
be sacred. And I love to think about COVID
crops in our life as a way to bring in
active rest that's deeply regulating, that
also allows us to wind
down so that maybe more passive rest is
(32:20):
more accessible later. I love that so much.
Jennifer and I have been talking a lot with each other just about.
It's not just about taking things away, but bringing
things into that restore and replenish. One of the
things that has been really great for me in this season is I've been working
a lot with like my voice and singing and doing
(32:42):
vocal activation. And it gets to be just for me. It's not like something that
I'm going to do to create a course on or it's just
this. It has become quite spiritual and has
this huge impact on the health of my nervous system and working with
my vocal cords, but finding more things like that that
are just for the experience, for
(33:04):
the being in it and the creativity. I think it's
really, really, really, really important. And you
mentioned a bit ago too, when you were talking about the time
with your daughter, that there were strategies or things
that you saw in terms of the business. Would you speak to that a little
bit about some of the things that you saw? Well, okay, there's so many things,
(33:27):
but first I want to just say, and I'm sure you've talked about this
before on previous episodes, but I want to highlight that there
was something you said, Jennifer, to really get
that when we
are dysregulated
and overworking and exhausting
(33:48):
ourselves as a trauma response
There are specific oppressive systems that really
benefit from that. And for some of my people,
it's very activating in a good way. Like, it kind of lights this
fire in their belly to feel like,
oh, rest is actually revolutionary.
(34:11):
So maybe I actually can do this
to dismantle within myself these
structures and systems that actually do keep people
disempowered. So I wanted to say that because it's like a bigger.
It's very personal, but it's also macro. And I believe we can all really
contribute to that on a micro level. And so with that,
(34:33):
the two things that I want to point to are, number one,
because I had
zero time and zero
energy, I had no
ability to focus on anything that was not
absolutely necessary in that first year of
(34:54):
parenthood. And that sucked. But it was such a gift
because it helped me to, by accident,
really apply Pareto's principle. And Pareto's principle
says that 20% of our actions will cause
80% of our results. And I think actually, if you do
the math on a lot of businesses or a lot of workplaces, it's actually closer
(35:17):
to 5% of what we do actually creates
95% of the results. So if you think about, for you
to, you know, these podcast episodes and, like, devoting yourself
and pouring your hearts and your presence into them and the way this show has
taken off, right. People are
connecting to the resonance
(35:38):
and the magnetism of
presence in you too, versus
and obviously the depth of knowledge and incredible research that goes
into it. That level of magnetism
and depth is available because
you are taking those periods of rest both active and passive.
(36:00):
And it allows the podcast to be part of that
20% or 15% or 10, five, whatever,
that then leads to all these results. I mean, I know nothing
about your two businesses, but for most people I know, including myself, there's
a lot we could just literally stop
doing. And so after that first
(36:22):
year when I kind of, like, could pull my head above the water and
things weren't so, like, emergent all the time, I
did do an analysis and I looked at, okay,
if I look at all my biggest wins in business, you know, getting my
first book published, these various, like, higher
income spikes, these moments of increased visibility
(36:44):
that allowed our platform to grow, things like that. And I looked at
what had directly contributed to those things. It was
only two kinds of tasks for me. One
was connecting with people, and two was creating content.
And so I was like, if I look at my calendar and I want everyone
listening to do this, no matter what your career, if you are
(37:06):
A stay at home parent. This still applies. There
are 20% of the things that I do that create
80% of the connection with my children. They do not
include, like having perfect birthday parties
or, you know, like, we do so much
shit that doesn't matter. And so for everyone listening,
(37:28):
identify an area of your life that you would like to
enhance and look at what are all the
tasks that I do in this area? What are
my biggest wins in this area? And then draw a line
from the things that are your biggest wins to the task
that directly results in that win.
(37:51):
And then take a line and cross out all the other tasks
that are not identified. And you'll find you have a lot more time
available. But here's what's so important about the work that's discussed
here in the work at NSI and all of the work you do, then
it's like, yeah, okay, so cognitively I can know
that I can eliminate 80% of the test, but I feel
(38:14):
freaking unsafe when I do that. And so that's
where then we do that deeper work of learning to
find safety in our bodies. Because no amount of
items checked off on a to do list is ever going to ultimately
make you feel safe, complete and whole or successful.
So that was thing number one. And so 80, 20 rule.
(38:37):
Most people have heard of it, but the question is, are
you using it? And then the thing number two that made
a huge difference for me is beginning to see
my month seasonally and cyclically
and my projects in our company seasonally and
cyclically. So because we live in a patriarchy and
(38:59):
we are, you know, the focus is on that which is
visible is valuable, we
forget that actually in the
year here on planet Earth we have a
springtime and a summertime, which is the seasons
of visible growth and external expression. So
(39:21):
beautiful. That's the solar, that's the masculine, that's
the young. We also have the
seasons of autumn and winter, which are the
times for the invisible, the
stuff that you really can't see, that is
equally as valuable and necessary
(39:43):
in order to have a
fertile, vibrant spring and summer. We
must have the season where everything's falling off the
trees, where it's a little sad, where it's kind of
dark. And then we need the season of winter where
it's just still and
(40:04):
gray. And I started to see how
in my business I had hyper focused
on spring and summer activities and had not given
credence or time to autumn and
winter activities. And I created something I call the upward cycle of
success, where I named
(40:26):
each of Those periods of time for a
business. So the springtime energy is emergence, time of new
beginnings. The summertime energy is visibility,
the time of launching, the time of being out there. The autumn
energy is the time of culmination, crossing.
T's dotting. I's doing analytics,
(40:49):
tidying things up, gathering your nuts so you can go into
hibernation, which I like to call the fertile
void. And that time where my first pregnancy
also really taught me, in the first trimester of a
pregnancy, you don't really look like you're
pregnant. And in our culture you're not supposed to tell
(41:11):
anybody. However, you have made every
single organ of a human body, so it looks
like nothing is happening. But during that time I was like,
my mind is completely blown. In this period
of time, I have like made a liver
and made a heart and I didn't have to put it on my to
(41:33):
do list or think about it at all. And in fact, if you asked me
how to do it, I would have no idea. And that was
just this incredible experience example of how
the wisdom of nature really knows. And we need
to follow the lead of the wisdom of nature, of the blueprint
of our bodies, as opposed to trying to
(41:55):
overlay this false linear
idea of constant growth and
constant production. And so I really
started to work with, not only on a more micro level, my own
menstrual cycle and the lunar cycle to guide what was going
to be the energy I was going to lead with in any given week. Then
(42:17):
also to really look at the macro of my company and say,
okay, we've got spring and summer energy down. We're
never going to. We're so programmed for that. We don't need to worry about it.
It's the autumn and the winter energy that we need to
build in time for. So we actually really shifted the way we do
project management to build in those times. And
(42:39):
as a result, it keeps getting better and better. We just
keep doing fewer things and making more money. It freaking blows
my mind. That's so beautiful. And there was something
you spoke to Kate that I want us to talk a little bit about because
I think it's really important, which is the deconstruction of systems of
oppression that are inside of us and that we do
(43:02):
perpetuate when we stay in these cycles. And that there is. You know,
Adrienne Maree Brown's work on this was a huge
inspiration for me and really reframing looking at
rest as an act of rebellion. And I would love to
just hear more of your thoughts on that. Because I love to talk about
it. Yeah. You know, I, of course, learned about the way
(43:23):
beliefs live in our. In our brains
and nervous systems from you. And one of the
things that I love to have people ask in my
programs is when we're looking at limiting beliefs.
For example, my productivity
determines my worth could be a limiting
(43:45):
belief. So when we look at that, I really love to have people ask
the question, who benefits from me believing this?
You know, and it's like, oh, white
capitalist, toxic patriarchy. You know, and just as
a reminder, that does not exist outside
of us. I mean, it does, and it also exists inside of
(44:08):
us. So I think, for me, it's been really helpful to
not see the problem as external
and instead really work with. Or in addition
to really work with. Okay, what are the ways that
that programming lives in Me and I have
two little girls. They're six and eight. And so it's very
(44:32):
present. How I live
is modeling and literally
ingraining their nervous systems with what is
safe and what is not safe. Safe. And,
you know, just this one simple, simple example, I
have a real, like, my default is to do too much. I
(44:55):
wrote do less because I need it. And so
I have this little daughter. She's so
headstrong. She's amazing. And I was describing to her a week
that we're going to have this summer, and I was like, it's going to be
so fun. We're going to be on this road trip, and we're going to visit
this person and this person. Then we're going to go over here, and then we're
(45:16):
going to do this. And I was, like, so excited. And I look at her
little face, and she just started to cry. And I was like, oh, my gosh,
what's going on? And she goes, mama, it's too
much. It's too much. It sounds like too much. That
sounds really tiring. And she's in kindergarten,
so I was like, oh, my
(45:38):
gosh. Okay, great. So out of all those things that
I listed, what would you. What sounds
like the one you would want to do? And she told me. And so we're
focusing on that because I'm really realizing
I don't want to sweep them up in my
trauma response doing. I don't want that to be
(46:01):
what they imprint as. This is what's required to
be a good woman. This is what's required to be a good friend. This is.
I have to stay on some kind of treadmill
sprinting in order to stay relevant or, you know, I mean, it's
like, and so I think we
can undo the patterning
(46:22):
and dismantle the systems in small,
seemingly insignificant moments, like deciding your
summer plan. It doesn't always have to, you know, just lying
down on the floor in the middle of your workday for five minutes or doing
a neuro tool is a revolutionary act.
And just the fact that it gives us space
(46:44):
between stimulus and response to be able to choose,
how am I going to be in this moment? That
is, every single time we do that, we are calling
our power back. That is our. I mean, the way I think of it,
I don't know what your frameworks are, but I see that as my connection
with the divine. I see that as my connection with source with a
(47:08):
capital S. And every time I do it, it's like a little
prayer. And I just can feel, you know,
And I do it too, like, on behalf of my
grandmothers who didn't have that.
They didn't know this stuff. This was not available. This
information was not available. And in very different
(47:30):
ways they lived trapped in their
own paradigms. It was a different time. And
it's like, I see very directly
the ways that we do heal seven generations
forward and seven generations back when we
interrupt in ourselves the patterning and when we
(47:52):
have the courage to say, like, what might
be possible. Is there something else
available here? And I'm somebody who loves to
put my attention and focus to the degree that I can
on building out new possibilities
as opposed to railing against the systems that exist.
(48:14):
Like, okay, well, the best way for me to
dismantle a system is to unravel it in myself
and to dream into what else could be
birthed. So that's an invitation for
all of us on where we want to put our attention as well. I
love that. I really love so much of what you said because I think I'm
(48:37):
one of these people, as I've gone along
deprogramming and busting out through some of this matrix, that
I'm really someone who likes to buck the system. I'm someone who wants
to go against what's happening out
there. I love what you said about just laying down in the floor and taking
a nap for five minutes out of the day. We call it visual reset in
(48:58):
the NSI world. But I've got a sleep mask right next to my desk right
here. Because If I've got five, 10, maybe 20
minutes out of the day, I'm just gonna lay down with my sleep mask,
put on some beats, something soothing, maybe a
meditation. I might even if it's okay. Like, depending on the temperature, go outside
and lay down on the ground for 20 minutes and, like, do
(49:20):
nothing. And that's one of the ways that I sort of empty my. My
bucket out as I move throughout the day. And, like, I love to play
little nap roulette if I've got the space in my day. It's like,
I've got a few hours here. What could happen? What could happen?
Could I fall asleep for hours? And so a couple of the other things
that have really helped me is I've invested in Block Blue Light. I love that
(49:43):
company. I love their glasses. I've got a full spectrum table lamp that
I use at night to read in that has helped me so much
because I have a visual deficit in my nervous system, and that visual
deficit is causing threat in my nervous system day,
just as the day goes on. So between the visual reset and the block
blue light, my eye fatigue has gone down so
(50:05):
much. That's helping me rest and it's helping me stay
productive in the ways that I feel good about being
productive. Yeah. And you know, what's really important to
know as well is that the data does not
actually show that more hours
worked equals better results. So I just want to be
(50:28):
really clear about, like, taking four hours of
our day to, you know, fill
some of the sleep deficit is actually the best use of our
time. Because what we see in the data is that when we
are well rested, as you said, our cognitive
abilities, our creativity, our. Our ability
(50:50):
to integrate memory and create connections between
seemingly disconnected, like, we are
superheroes when we are well rested. And
three hours working when you are well rested could
very easily take you, like, 12
hours when you're exhausted. So just to be
(51:11):
super clear, this idea that, oh, I'll sleep when
I'm dead, or. Or it's a good idea to sacrifice sleep
or rest in order to get things done is
scientifically inaccurate. It doesn't work. I would
just love to dip into what you were talking about
there of, like, it's not necessarily true that the more we
(51:33):
do, the more benefit we get. And I think that that can
happen in business, in work, when we're
suddenly like, okay, well, you know, I heard this podcast and
people say to do less or whatever, and then it can actually really
kick up a lot of fear patterning and stress patterning.
That's unnecessary, which is why I love cover crops. It's like, you
(51:55):
can quote, unquote, stay busy. Like, you can
do active rest, Right? It's not busy, but it's active rest.
Like I remember I had a coach who I adore, and
I think this was a great assignment, but she assigned to me.
It was many years ago, long before I knew any of this stuff,
to sit in a room for an hour and do
(52:18):
nothing. It was. It was brutal. It was
brutal. And if I knew now what I know, then
I would have taken that in smaller doses.
Yeah, I know. I mean, I have a lot of clients and myself too.
Same thing. Like, we hear all this stuff about meditation is so great. And. And
it is. It does have great benefits, and we have to dose
(52:40):
it appropriately. And a nervous system that's in a state of
dysregulation, having all these intense feelings and stress
hormones, it can be really activating to try to
sit still, to even to feel the internal sensations of your body.
Too much, too fast. All of this can really be
overwhelming. And so it's about calibrating at that right dose or
(53:02):
finding other ways, like you said, cover crops or kind of moving
meditations, mindfulness while you're doing other things, so that
our system has the ability to get some movement, to get
some regulation and practice being present in
the moment, getting out of those racing thought loops without.
I'm going to sit in this room and have everything that I'm feeling
(53:26):
get turned up really loud and try to then shame myself
for not being able to do it. Okay, I would love to know a little
more. Like, where can people find you if they want to work with you more?
Any closing thoughts? Yeah, closing thoughts would
just be that, you know, our worth is not determined by our
productivity, and we really are
(53:48):
infinitely inherently worthy and we
could never do anything to undo that.
Amen. Thank you, Kate. Thanks for joining us.
Thank you so much. It was an absolute pleasure.
This podcast is for informational and educational purposes
only and should not be considered medical or psychological advice.
(54:11):
We often discuss lived experiences through traumatic events
and sensitive topics that deal with complex developmental and
systemic trauma that may be unsettling for some listeners.
This podcast is not intended to replace professional medical
advice. If you are in the United States and you or someone you know
is struggling with their mental health and is in immediate danger, please call
(54:32):
911 for specific services relating to mental health,
please see the full disclaimer in the show notes.
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