August 7, 2023 • 40 mins
In this rebroadcast episode, ADJUSTED welcomes Chris Moore, Managing Partner at Insure National. Chris shares his thoughts on what employers can do to help attract and retain employees.
Season 5 is brought to you by Berkley Industrial Comp. This episode is hosted by Greg Hamlin and guest co-host Matt Yehling, Directory of Claims at Midwest Employers Casualty.
Visit the Berkley Industrial Comp blog for more!
Got questions? Send them to marketing@berkindcomp.com
For music inquiries, contact Cameron Runyan at camrunyan9@gmail.com
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Greg Hamlin (00:12):
Hello, everybody and welcome to adjusted. I'm
your host, Greg Hanlon coming atyou from beautiful Birmingham,
Alabama and Berkley industrialcomp. And I'm excited that
you're here to join us for oneof our rebroadcast. In this
episode, I had the opportunityto talk with Chris Moore
managing partner at insurernational. And we talked about
(00:33):
what causes some employees tostay and what causes others to
lead. And this is another onethat's near and dear to my heart
as and one of the reasons wepicked this one to rebroadcast
throughout my career, one of thethings that I've had to tackle
and manage has been how to bringstability to a Claims
Department. And obviously, oneof the things that causes some
(00:55):
of the greatest struggle withina department is turnover. And so
we tackled this topic together.
And it was interesting to hearfrom Chris's point of view, who
works on the staffing side,evaluating what those factors
are. So I hope you'll enjoy thisepisode and have a few takeaways
of what your organization can doto help your employees stay
(01:17):
versus losing them. Well,welcome everyone to adjust it.
I'm your host, Greg Hanloncoming at you from beautiful
Birmingham, Alabama, andBerkeley industrial cop, and
with me is my co host for theday. That yelling, Matt, you
want introduce yourself.
Matthew Yehling (01:36):
Hello, everyone. This is Matt Yaling.
I'm coming from St. Louis,Missouri along the banks of the
Big Muddy Mississippi River.
Welcome.
Greg Hamlin (01:46):
Glad to have you, Matt. Matt's with MEC, one of
our fellow Berkeley companies.
So if you've listened to a fewof these before, you've heard us
team up and do a few of these.
And he offers an interestingperspective coming from an
excess carrier. So it's alwaysgood to have a couple different
viewpoints with us for the dayas our special guest, Chris
Moore, who's managing partner atinsurer national. Chris, do you
(02:09):
want to introduce yourself foreverybody?
Chris Moore (02:11):
Yeah, my name is Chris Moore. I am based out of
Dallas, Texas. So right indowntown born and raised here,
and I am one of the owners hereat International.
Greg Hamlin (02:22):
Excellent. We're glad to have you, Chris. The
topic we want to tackle today iswhy do some employees stay and
what causes them to leave? And Ithink people in the industry
right now I've seen a lot ofchange in general. We've talked
about it in some of the otherepisodes, I think the COVID
caused a lot of people toreevaluate their priorities. And
so we've seen a lot of shiftinggoing on in the industry and
(02:43):
outside of it. But I thoughtwe'd start by you just talking a
little bit, Chris, about how didyou end up in the insurance
industry?
Chris Moore (02:50):
Yeah, so it's actually an interesting story.
So I spent about seven years andIT staffing back in my early
days. And at the time, my bossis the one that hired me
actually met the original ownerof international on a plane. And
at the time we did it, we didall contracts and contract to
hire staffing for differentindustries across the board. And
they had met on the plane andshe was looking to grow her
(03:12):
business. She was only doingdirect hire, and she was like, I
want to grow this into adifferent division and new
contracts contract to hire. Longstory short, my boss is like, I
know what my old boss is like, Iknow a guy that can might be
able to help you out. Weconnected on Utah of all places
we met in the middle because I'min Dallas, and she's in
California. I met for honestlyprobably a whole day and just
(03:33):
kind of got to know each otherlooked at the vision of what she
was wanting to do. You know,honestly, I fell in love with
her and kind of urges passionfor the industry. She has an
insurance background. And yeah,just kind of long story short,
that's how I got in and startedup our Dallas office in this new
division. About a year, year andfour months ago now. So it feels
(03:53):
like a month ago, but it's beena year already a year. So it's
been a fun ride. But that's kindof how I got into insurance. I
guess I stumbled upon it.
Greg Hamlin (04:02):
I think that's how most of us most of us got here.
What was your just out ofcuriosity? What was your
background in college? What didyou study?
Chris Moore (04:09):
I played basketball at Tulane University down in New
Orleans. I got a degree in mediaarts. My whole goal was to start
my own business. I didn't knowwhat. But basically, I wanted to
handle all the communicationsand marketing and digital stuff
myself. I minored in web design.
So I wanted to kind of take myweb design experience and create
my own website, my own business.
(04:31):
And but yeah, I didn't, I guessI'm kind of running my own
business. I'm not doing any ofthe marketing or digital stuff.
And then I fell into sales,basically my whole careers, how
it ended up professionally. Butyeah, that's kind of my college
background, I guess, if youwill. That's awesome. What
Greg Hamlin (04:45):
did you play in college?
Chris Moore (04:47):
So I was a shooting guard. So I always tell the
story. I was at Tulane two yearsbefore Hurricane Katrina for the
insurance people and two yearsafter Hurricane Katrina so
Orleans was a Have a night andday place after and before. So
it was pretty quite, it waspretty crazy time. But you know,
it was an experiential. It'sneedless to say,
Greg Hamlin (05:09):
I went to Indiana University. So it's a big
basketball school and we're notwe die for somebody could shoot
right now we've had some great,great teams, but we haven't had
good shooting in probably six oreight years or so
Chris Moore (05:21):
which is rare for people from Indiana because
that's right. And it drivespeople crazy
Greg Hamlin (05:26):
in the state.
Matthew Yehling (05:28):
Where you're happy with the recent outcome,
Chris?
Chris Moore (05:31):
Well, I can there's two ways I can go about this. My
bracket was busted. So no, I'm amassive Texas Tech fan. So
because Kansas is in the big 12I was rooting for them. So I
didn't really care who won. Butthey won. So I guess I was happy
about it. But it was a greatgame to watch. So I was happy
about just it was a good game.
Unknown (05:50):
Yeah. Good game.
Greg Hamlin (05:53):
I'm always rooting for the big 10 Once we get to
the tournament, but we seem tobe the conference everybody goes
through to get to thechampionship, but we can't
figure out a winner that youwant.
Matthew Yehling (06:02):
Yeah. You'll figure it out. We'll get there.
In Chris, for those that listento this podcast that don't know
ensure national, why don't youintroduce the what you do for
them and what the organizationdoes for the insurance industry?
Chris Moore (06:15):
Yeah, so International is basically a
national staffing firm. Our solefocus is the insurance industry.
So we partner with insuranceorganizations of all sizes all
over the country. And basicallywhat we do is we help them find
talent for direct hire, contractcontract to hire and insurance
consulting. So I think one ofour benefits that we like to
(06:36):
explain to organizations is ourwhole network of people are from
the insurance world already. Butwe're also trying to find folks,
which I think is a bigchallenge, which we may get into
later, but that aren't from theinsurance world and get them
into the insurance industry tohelp kind of fill a gap that
we're seeing in that world. Butyeah, that's basically our sole
focus and how we help thoseorganizations and kind of just
(06:56):
pitch that as a unique sellingpoint, I guess, if you will, to
these insurance companies.
Greg Hamlin (07:01):
And do you guys do all lines, then?
Chris Moore (07:03):
Yes, yeah. So basically anything if you're an
insurance company, you have anin house litigation team, you
have a IT team, if you havemarketing, sales, claims
underwriting, if you're aninsurance company, our sole
focus is kind of focusing inthat space. That's
Greg Hamlin (07:18):
fantastic. So now, did you I know you were
mentioning you went to Dallas,or that you're from Dallas, and
that you so did you start theoffices in Dallas? With Yeah,
sure. So what was that like?
Chris Moore (07:31):
Yeah, so I've never I've been in an organization
where I was sent to another cityto start up with, I guess, the
office, but I was more on thesales side. So I was going out
getting a business, but theoperations, the finances, all
that stuff, I didn't see whatwas going on behind the scenes.
So this is kind of my firstglimpse into all that type of
stuff. I saw financials withthat company, and I kind of
(07:52):
looked at them. But it'sinteresting, because I know
staffing. I've been through alot of situations and I've been
doing it for a while. So Iunderstand the business. But as
you start diving into actuallyopening a business putting money
down of your own money to investin it to get it is it was a was
fun. And but now to see thegrowth of it. It's actually
pretty cool. But yeah, we had anoffice in California Chelsea on
(08:13):
the owner of internationalstarted in Florida, she moved
out to California with herhusband, so we have an office
and basically Boca Raton,Florida, kind of Dana Point area
in California, and then nowDallas, Texas. So we can come to
cover essentially all regionsall time zones in the US.
Greg Hamlin (08:29):
That's great. It seems like everybody's got an
office in Florida, in theinsurance industry.
Matthew Yehling (08:38):
What's the most rewarding part of running your
own organization?
Chris Moore (08:43):
You know, it's funny, we started this a year
and it's literally December of2020 is when we opened it. And
then I made my first hire inMarch, just trying to get
business. And so my firstemployee has been here literally
months, a little over a monthnow. And we now have seven in
our office. So I think therewarding part is seeing and my
focus with a lot of people thatwe bring in or you know, younger
(09:05):
professionals that have someprofessional experience, not
necessarily in recruiting, itdoesn't have to be but I've been
through the professional ranks.
But also we are seeing kids outof college as well. And training
them and kind of coaching themand seeing the progression that
they've done in the last year iskind of the most rewarding for
me because I like seeing peoplegrow very fast, selfishly, it
kind of makes me feel like I'mdoing the right thing because
they're doing the right thing.
(09:27):
And they pick up on things veryquickly. But just watching the
office grow, how fast it'sgrown, but also seeing our
employees being rewarded for thehard work we put in because
recruiting is not easy. It's alot of time, a lot of effort and
you're dealing with a lot ofpeople and so just seeing their
growth and seeing them havinghaving fun. I've been in their
shoes, so I took pieces I didn'tlike and I took pieces that I
(09:48):
did like and I kind of mold ofthat and kind of try to create a
culture here that we're tryingto build and make people wanted
to be a part of because I thinkthat's the biggest thing in
selling an organization is theculture and do you like working
with the people and all thatGood stuff. So, yeah, just the
growth of the employees so farto date is kind of the most
rewarding thing right now.
Greg Hamlin (10:06):
That's great. So I know, in your industry, you're
talking about recruiting and theand the challenges of that we're
in the middle of what's beingdubbed the great resignation.
And so that's been talked abouta lot, because there's just
people changing jobs. We've evencompanies with good cultures,
especially ones that don't havegood cultures are seeing it, but
everybody's having to deal withit a little bit. As one whole
(10:28):
generation retires. And thenwe've had a lot, just a lot of
changes. In your opinion, how dowe get here? How do we get to a
place where all at once we'reseeing so much movement?
Chris Moore (10:38):
Yeah, there's a there's a big shift, obviously,
the pandemic COVID is what did Ithink three years ago, I think
we can all agree, unless you areleadership, and you had leaders
in different regions of the USzoom wasn't really a thing,
teams wasn't really a thing. Itwas in person, you're in office.
And I think what happened, thepandemic forced everybody, you
know, companies, whether theywere ready or not to send
(10:59):
everybody home to work remote,there were challenges around it,
if you weren't a really good ITcompany, and could do things
virtually, there was a lot ofsetup and headaches with that.
But I think it also on the flipside employees, because they
were getting to work from home,which I don't think was a thing
really couple years ago as well.
Some companies had hybridmodels, but the organization's
the bigger ones that we've seentoday, really were in office
(11:19):
Monday through Friday, eight tofive. And once those employees
started getting to work fromhome, they started seeing how
much flexibility they hadworking from home. And I think
it was, it was something wherethere's a big shift in that
year, two years that we've hadand COVID. And basically,
employees are realizing kind ofa I don't wanna say they have
the power, that's probably notthe right word. But the cards
are kind of in their hands andare saying, Okay, what
(11:40):
organizations are going to fitmy like my criteria, you know,
whether it's work from home, ora hybrid schedule, or better pay
is it better benefits? I don'tknow what that looks like. And I
think it's funny, if employershad the answer, we wouldn't be
having this issue. But I thinkthat's the gold question. I
guess, if you can figure outwhat these employees want in a
job, you can start trying toretain some of these folks and
(12:02):
keep them around, but alsoemploy them and make sure they
stick. But it's funny, becausemy previous jobs with Qualtrics.
And they're all customerexperience and employee
experience surveys. So I learneda lot from that industry, just
in how important it is for theemployee to have a great
experience working for anorganization, whether it's a
remote, you go through apandemic, are they going to
stick around because you know,they liked their manager,
(12:22):
they're not burnt out, all thattype of stuff plays into the end
of the whole scheme of is thisperson going to stick around?
Are they going to leave us andgo somewhere else? But it's an
interesting conversation, justbecause I think it's been a big
shift in the way who's incontrol, basically. And right
now, I think a lot of employeesare in control. And they can
determine, you know, like Isaid, what they're what the
requirements are and where theywant to go work. And if a
(12:44):
company doesn't match it, theyhave other jobs, they can go
look for some Yeah, it's thatit's the question that I don't
think anybody has the answer toright now. And I wish I did,
because I really have to hire alot of people.
Matthew Yehling (12:56):
If you could tell the C suite of an org and
insurance organization, anythingto help retain talent, what
would be your top three items,you'd tell an organization for
talent retention?
Chris Moore (13:08):
Yeah, great question. So we've talked to a
lot of candidates, and I'm gonnacall them candidates, mostly
employees. But you know, wetalked to a lot of people for
opportunities. And I think thethree biggest things they're
looking for are flexibility. Sowhether that's a hybrid model,
you know, if they're in office,or work from home 100%.
Secondly, it's going to be a lotof sign on bonuses, or some type
of bonuses throughout theircareer that they're paid out on,
(13:30):
and then also just the exploitexperience as a whole. So, you
know, working, I think that'sthe challenging part is working,
virtually, you're not going tohave that social interaction
that face to face, it's allgoing to be virtual, but how
does that person feelingimportant within the
organization, how are theycontributing, and seeing their
contributions go to work,instead of just being like, you
sit in that desk, you do yourjob eight to five, and then you
(13:50):
go home, and you may getrewarded a little bit, but that
kind of goes to Hey, the cardsin the hand have changed a
little bit. And I would saythose are probably the top three
things that we're hearing fromemployees that they want in a
new opportunity. And I thinkorganizations are having to
adjust to that a little bit andcoming up with creative ways to
kind of keep those peopleengaged, or more, hire them and
(14:11):
put those in offer letters andthings of that nature.
Greg Hamlin (14:14):
I think you hit on some really important things
there. And I can think of my ownjourney to be where I am now.
And when I started my career,you know, one of the places I
worked I often felt like myemployee number I had to log in
every day and 0140409 and I feltlike that's pretty much what I
was to the company was thatnumber and as long as my work
(14:35):
product was getting pumped out,life was good. And I was as
mobile as a laptop or a monitor.
There wasn't really much thoughtof the fact that I was a human
being that had a family and haddesires of my own and had ideas
that could help them you know,the there wasn't really
interested in that and so youknow, I think that's a
challenge.
Chris Moore (14:55):
It is and and going back to my younger my first job
and just being an ad I alwayshad the mindset of someone could
take your job. And I thinknowadays, it's flipped, where
it's like, now the company islike, we need people to find the
right person. And don't get mewrong, someone can always take
your job no matter where you'rein. But I think that mindset now
is like, Oh, if I don't perform,someone's going to take my job,
(15:18):
it alleviates some of thestress. And then I honestly
think it's gonna help peopleperform better. You know, if
they're gonna get a job, like,obviously, you're gonna perform,
but if they're bummed out, whenthey're not happy, and they're
mistreated by their manager,they're gonna they're gonna
leave ship really quickly.
Greg Hamlin (15:32):
I absolutely agree with everything you said there,
I think there's a lot that wecan do better to make sure
people feel like they're part ofthe team. And we've got some
work to do. And that's for sure.
Yeah, that's for sure.
Matthew Yehling (15:42):
I'm, I'm in zero 11, eight man.
Greg Hamlin (15:49):
We both have scars.
Yeah. You know, we
Matthew Yehling (15:53):
talked about this last year with one of
Greg's employees about, youknow, in the claims industry,
Greg and I both work in claims,obviously, for an insurance
carrier. So kind of shift in thediscussion to claims that
there's a customer service focusthat we are adapting more
regularly now. So how do we findstaff for those positions? And
(16:15):
how do you guys help us findstaff for those positions?
Chris Moore (16:18):
Yeah, so it's funny, I've actually, there's
some interesting concepts I'veheard talking to, you know,
different claims leaders to theworkers comp, it could be PNC,
whatever it may look like. Andthey're looking at different
ways to do service type ofroles, because there are certain
they're obviously as a servicetype of role and claims, and a
lot of them looking at likesocial workers, or previous
customers, grants professionalsthat aren't from the insurance
(16:40):
world, and bringing them in andhelping them get them licensed
and all that good stuff to kindof move them into the insurance
world. Typically, if you're aCSR, customer service rep or
social worker probably could getthem a little more money if we
can get them licensed. And itwas an interesting concept that
I had with a few conversationswith some companies that we're
looking to try to help themwith, because they came to us
that, hey, we typically justhire a customer service rep or a
(17:01):
claims adjuster who has serviceexperience, but we're trying to
figure out a way to bring inyounger professionals into the
industry to kind of help havethem mold them into our way and
how we want them to fit into ourorganization or culture, but
then only someone that's goingto stick around for a while. And
I think one of the things thatthey had brought up to us, which
I thought was prettyinteresting. Looking at it from
a social worker standpoint, itwas always having conversations
(17:23):
with people, they're alwayshandling some different types of
situations, you can always thinkon their feet, but also just a
customer service rep that, youknow, may work at American
Airlines or something like that,that may want to switch careers
and go into this world wherethey'll train them up on
everything, no, get themlicensed, it really helped them
kind of bring in a diverse groupof people and help them train
them in the claims world. But onthe flip side, as a employer,
(17:45):
you have to be able to take thetime and understand it's gonna
take time to get people rampedup. But you have to put that
time in to make sure thatsomeone is going to work out and
stick around. Because if youjust bring him in and throw him
into the fire, you know, peopleare gonna get burnt out if they
have a good work ethic, andthey're gonna go somewhere else.
And you literally just trainthem to go and pay them to go be
a great class or their company.
And it was an interestingconcept that I never thought of,
(18:07):
but just trying to think of waysto bring people from different
organizations or differentindustries into the claims world
and help like the claimsadjuster start helping these
organizations with differenttalents.
Greg Hamlin (18:19):
I've seen that play out in our company quite a bit
where we've had some reallygreat success with bringing
people and we we hired a flightattendant at one point, she was
amazing, we've hired a customerservice person from, you know,
grocery store that was reallyknown for their white glove, you
know, care of their. And so Ithink those skills are
transferable and you're hittingon something that's important
(18:40):
because we were facing the otherbuzzword is the silver tsunami,
all the baby boomers areretiring. And there's not enough
people to fill those spots if wedon't get creative. And I've
seen the challenge. And I don'tknow, if you have Matt, where
sometimes if we put a lot oftime and energy, we take a model
where we're only looking atrecent college grads, we can end
up putting a lot of time andeffort into people that
(19:01):
constantly leave. And you know,after three to five years,
they're ready for the next thingor they're not sure that this is
what they wanted to do. But bythe time you've invested a year
of your time to train them, youknow, it's like now you'd be
starting all the way back over.
They were just getting to thepoint they were helpful. So I
think you do need to look a lotof different ways and have a
nice popery like as a group ofdifferent skill sets from
(19:22):
different places.
Chris Moore (19:24):
I think, you know, Chelsea, she started
international because as youmentioned, she saw kind of a gap
in that world where the talentgap is what we call it on our
side is you have the folks whoare retiring 30% of the
workforce is going to beretiring and Pandemic actually
push people out sooner. What I'mjust gonna go ahead and retire,
you know, there's no I don'tknow what the future holds. And
(19:45):
so that was that number probablyincreased a little bit, but then
you have some of those, youknow, the middle generation that
are now getting promoted intonew roles, but what is that
younger generation coming in?
And I've been in severalindustries. Previously before
this, I was at Uber where we didtrucking for Uber and Uber for
trucking and the truckingshortage drivers. It's there's a
gap. The younger talent does notwant to go be a trucker. The
younger talent isn't justfalling into the insurance world
(20:07):
because it's sexy. It'sinsurances. So it's, I look at
it, I want technology, I wantcool gadgets. And I want all
this. And, you know, I thinkthey're trying to get there with
insurtechs. And, you know,evolving and some of the
technology to make it kind ofcool some of the marketing with
the bigger like state farms andbring in named people that you
may recognize on TV, and itconnects with that brand. But
yeah, it's a challenge to bringin younger people that
(20:29):
understand that we want toinvest in this person, but also,
are they going to be around for10 years? Are they going to,
they're going to leave on usafter a year or two. And we just
spent all that time, as youmentioned, training them, and
now they're gonna they're agreat employee at another
company. We just lost all thismoney. So I think that's the
it's a challenge. And it's noteasy. And like I said earlier on
if if I had the answer, Iprobably making a lot more money
(20:50):
and providing a lot of adviceand consulting to companies, but
I don't unfortunately,
Matthew Yehling (20:56):
what's your opinion on? I mean, we talked
about the great resignations,and silver tsunami, but you
know, for those, those youngpeople that we are bringing in,
why did they leave? So quickly?
You know, what can we do as anorganization? And what can other
organizations do to retain them?
I know, you said, but what haveyou seen successfully happen,
(21:18):
you know, maybe, and thencounter that, like, what, what
generally keeps people to leavewhat keeps them staying, you
know, in your, in your opinion,and what you've experienced?
Chris Moore (21:26):
Yeah, so I think a few things. So on our end, you
know, as I mentioned early on,we do a lot in the contract
contract to hire for theinsurance world. So we employ
people and place them on aproject, they're employed by
insure nationals that areactually our employee, we're
taking on all the risk andeverything of that nature by
putting this person on aproject, but my job is to keep
that person retained for ourcustomer. And, you know, it's
(21:47):
not as easy to keep a contractorif you're gonna go to a full
time job. And so it's actually alittle harder to keep those
people interested. So juststaying engaged with them, and
honestly, communicating withthem, not to the point where
you're annoying, like a used carsalesman, but also not. Um, so
you're going to want to makesure that you're keeping in
touch with them and giving themupdates and feedback from how
their performance is doing, howthings are working out there.
But also engaging them in termsof, hey, if you're doing well,
(22:09):
let's let's talk about some typeof raise, or a bonus, or some
sort of that nature to make surethat their efforts that they're
putting in are being noticed, Ithink the biggest thing working
from home, you can feel likeyou're on an island, and a lot
of our jobs are remote. I mean,when you're on an island, you
don't know if you're doinggreat, you don't know if you're
doing bad. And a lot of times,you can get A Surprise Phone
Call that you weren't expecting,and it doesn't work out. But
(22:30):
also on the flip side, you get asurprise call to say, Hey, I
took another opportunity. Andall you have to do is look
yourself in the mirror, likewhat could we have done better.
So to your point, you know,making sure that the employee is
happy, making sure that you'redoing performance reviews with
and making sure you'reunderstanding how you can help
them proceed in their career,because I think a lot of it is
burnt out, I think a lot ofpeople just maybe aren't happy.
But sometimes it is just money.
I don't want to say it's alwaysabout money. But if another type
(22:51):
of job comes crawling, or youknow knocking at the door, and
it's offering you a lot moremoney, anybody in the right
mind, you're gonna considerthat. Um, however, if they're
happy in their current job, theylike their management, they like
the team, they like the workthat's being noticed from you
know, they're being you know, Iguess rewarded for their hard
work, it's gonna make it a lotharder for that person to leave.
And they'll second guess leavingversus just being like, Okay,
(23:12):
I'm out of here, if I'm just anumber to your guys points, I'm
gonna go somewhere where I feelvalued. And any interview,
someone's gonna make you feelvalid value, they're gonna be
like, Oh, you're amazing, wewant you here, they're gonna try
to sell you come. So when youyou're really looking for that
type of feedback. If a recruitercalls you and gives you that
feedback, you're gonna, you'regoing to kind of steer toward
that if you're not getting itfrom your current employee, kind
(23:34):
of like dating, I guess, if youwill?
Greg Hamlin (23:37):
No, I think you're making a great point. And it
reminds me when I was about 10years ago, I was working for a
company that went through areorg. And my team was assigned
in Boston, Massachusetts, so andI was in Cincinnati at the time,
so I had to manage them remotelybefore managing people remotely
was a thing. You know, so I'dread a book on I was trying to
figure out like how to do thisbecause it was all new. And one
(23:58):
of the things I learned earlyon, and I think it's easy to
forget, we really should do itall the time was just build in
time, like I would schedule timewith my people every week, even
if it was just to check in andtalk, make the watercooler talk
that isn't happening naturally.
Make sure it's happening.
Because if you don't do thoselittle things, two things
happen. You don't build thoserelationships. But the other
(24:20):
thing and people don't feelwanted are part of the team. But
I think that other piece you hiton is so important feedback that
there has to be a regularchannel. If the only time I hear
from my boss is when I'm introuble, then that's not good.
But if we're talking every week,and there's already something
set up or every two weeks,there's already something set up
then when there is some kind ofdifficult conversation. There's
(24:41):
already a challenge channel forthat. Yeah, and we're talking
all the time anyway. And I'mgetting positive feedback also
Chris Moore (24:49):
broken down when you have a lot of Congress that
communication with youremployees and when you don't, if
you're not going to get thatconversation and I think when
you build a relationship whereit's easier for them to come you
say hey, I got a call about Thisinterview, I had an interview
with coming, I'm reallyconsidering it like, and it's
almost like what I wanted tobring this to your attention to
I like it here, but is thereinstead of just being like, hey,
peace, I'm out, it's like, atthat point, you can go save it
(25:11):
and say, Hey guys, we have thisemployee, that's amazing. She
has an offer on the table, sheinformed me because I have a
relationship with my employee,we need to keep her or him. What
can we do to do this? And youknow, from that standpoint,
like, what do you need to stayhere from us and we can, I can't
guarantee let's go try to makethis happen and gives you some
time to save that employeeversus the other way where you
don't communicate with them, youdon't have a relationship, and
that's when they jump ship andgo somewhere else. So I think
(25:34):
that's a great point, justhaving that communication open
dialogue with your employees isbig, especially in a virtual
environment.
Matthew Yehling (25:39):
I had a similar example where I had an employee
and she was she was a greatemployee was with us for a
little over a year. And she sheherself had a young family and
one had had come from a largecarrier and wanted to work
remote, where she had been doingwith the prior carrier. And at
the time, this is pretty COVIDWe we did not allow remote work.
And she left. And after she leftI heard through the grapevine
(26:03):
that all she was asking for wasone day of remote work. And I
said, If I would have known thatwe would have made that happen.
But the communication didn't,didn't make its way through the
appropriate channels until shehad already made the decision
and accepted another offer. So Imean, I agree with what Greg and
what you were saying, Chris, aswell, like, you know,
communication is key. So many ofour problems boil down, I feel
(26:27):
like to communication betweenthe parties when we're talking
about workers comp plans, orwhen we're talking about
employee relationship issues andthings. So I mean, I would
encourage you, if you're anemployee out there to like, have
that conversation with yoursupervisor, because as managers,
you know, we get into these allthese situations where we're
texting, or we're emailing ouremployees, and you're like, did
you really touch base with them?
You have that one on oneconversation with your employer
(26:50):
this week, or today? Or when wasthe last time you actually
talked to him? And it's like aLago message. And now I'm like,
yeah, just kind of roll back andlike laugh a little bit. I'm
like, no, like, you need to callthem and have a conversation.
And it doesn't always have to beabout work. Like you were
saying, Greg have a conversationabout their life or what's going
on in their situation. DuringCOVID. I made it a point to call
everyone in my department, youknow, I tried to do it monthly,
(27:12):
but when you have, you know, 45people, it was like, Okay, well,
I'm spending anywhere from 20 to30 minutes on each call. So, you
know, but I was pretty goodabout every six weeks, or every
eight weeks, I funneled throughthe list. And I had a checklist
of like, who I called, and I puta date back sort of like when I
last spoke to him and and hadthat kind of conversation more
more of the Connect conversationthan, Hey, what's this month's
(27:33):
results look like? Or how manyclaims that were settling or
closing, then that was anotherconversation. But I think that
communication breakdowncontinues to exist, we need to
be better about that industrywide talking with our staff.
Chris Moore (27:49):
I don't want to say people are lazy, but I think the
virtual stuff has caused somelaziness and to that, just
emailing, oh, yeah, touch basewith them. Or if you're in an
office, it's like, hey, go talkto Chris or go talk to Matt, and
you haven't, then you would goand do it versus just being like
how things going. And it's like,it's not a touch point, really,
it's less personable. And that'swhen people just feel like
they're on an island. And it'salready hard as it is virtually
(28:10):
to do stuff like that. But soyeah, it's a great point.
Greg Hamlin (28:13):
We talked a lot about what what causes people to
stay? And what are some thingswe can do to keep them? And I
think you've kind of talkedabout this some Chris, but just
to make sure we've covered it.
What are some of the things thatyou feel like when you've seen
people leave? Because obviouslyyou're trying to get people
placed different places, whenyou see people leave? Or you
have a company that you'reworking with? It's had problems
with people leaving? What aresome of the things that drive
(28:35):
that?
Chris Moore (28:37):
Yeah, so I think one of the big things I'm seeing
right now is obviously after thepandemic, or during the
pandemic, I should say a lot ofthere's tons of layoffs, tons of
furloughs, tons of peopleleaving. And what happened was
now things are relaxing a littlebit, and people now companies
are trying to employ. And sothey're trying to employ either
people back that they let go, orthey're trying to find new
(28:58):
talent to fill seats. And sowhat's happening is just because
they had a pandemic projectsdidn't necessarily stop, they
may have got delay, but now theyhave delivery dates. And so
what's happening is they'rebringing these people in, and
they're not hiring enoughpeople. So more work is getting
put on the people that they'rebringing in, that are fresh
hires, and literally six monthsin their birth time. If there's
(29:18):
not enough help here, I'm gonnago to another company that may
be a little smaller who theworkload may not be there. I
mean, even on top of that, ifyou're making the person go into
work, because there are somecompanies we partner with, like
they have to be an office hybridmodels or even sometimes hard.
So when you're putting that muchwork on somebody to the point,
it causes them to burnout very,very fast. So you know, making
sure that you have enoughemployees to you know, spread
(29:40):
out the workload, so thatthey're not getting burned out
because they will leave veryfast. Secondly, the thing that
always comes up is always pay.
If another company comes to paymore, they're going to consider
that especially with theuncertainty of the pandemic, um,
you never know it could alwayshappen again, who knows what
could happen at this point, andso you know, they're gonna take
another higher paying offportunity Just because there's
still some uncertainty, but alsothey probably were let go and
(30:03):
didn't have a job for a year. Soif someone's going to come
calling, they need a job to paythe bills. But if someone's
going to pay more money, they'rereally going to consider that
opportunity. And then lastly, Ikind of touched on it the work
from home, obviously, if youbreak it down and work from home
is number one, Monday throughFriday, then you kind of go to
the hybrid model, if they have ahybrid model, somewhat
considerate, if it's flexible totheir schedule, and not like you
(30:23):
have to be your Monday,Wednesday, Friday, but if you're
like, if you do come into theoffice two days a week, we don't
care what days they are, just bein the office, and you have to
be there all day, as muchflexibility as you can provide
that that employee, the better.
So I would say those are thethree things that I'm hearing,
you know, everybody has theirreasons, and everybody's
probably heard everything. Butthat's kind of what I'm hearing
on my end, just from theindustry as a whole why people
(30:44):
would leave, you know, from anopportunity, you know,
Matthew Yehling (30:46):
and a company works with you guys. And you
have a, you know, you'rebasically taking on the
employment responsibility, youknow, how are you guys getting
them up in trained and notoverwhelming them? How do you,
you know, how do you guys workhere, that own problem that you
just said, you know, as aproblem for new hires?
Chris Moore (31:03):
Good question. So obviously, a lot of the
onboarding still falls on or notthe onboarding, onboarding is
all on us the training and allthat falls on whatever customer
we've replaced that candidate.
Wait, however, you know,obviously, we do all of our
poor, I make my recruiters touchbase with them, we have kind of
an acronym that we utilizeinternally that basically the
first thing you do in themorning is if you have an
(31:23):
employee working on a customer,one of our projects, you're
touching base with them, Iwouldn't say it's every day,
maybe two times a week just seeshow things are going any
questions, how's the work been?
We want to get a pulse on howthings are going. And there's
certain ways we approach that.
So going back to my point, youdon't sound like a used car
salesman, you're gettingannoying, because again, these
people are working and they havea job now and they have projects
that they're working on. Thelast thing they want to do is
(31:45):
have a conversation with therecruiter that doesn't make
sense. But we have ways weapproach those conversations and
make sure things are going wellon top of that we actually have
an account, we have a ton ofpeople that right now. And going
back to my point where theworkload is just being poured
over top of them. And people areputting in a ton of hours, you
know, it's stressful. So webasically rolled out a bonus
plan to them. So any hours thatthey work over 40 hours a week,
(32:06):
they will be incentivized inadditional amount of money.
That's not necessarily overtime.
But you know, because they'reyou don't really qualify for the
overtime piece based on how muchthey make. But we're just taking
money out of our pocket to rollit out to help our customer
because, one, I believe theydeserve it. But we got to come
up with creative ways internallyon how we engage and retain our
(32:27):
employees, for our customers,because they're relying on that
person to do the job. And, youknow, don't get me wrong, we
still get called surprise callsall the time, no matter how many
times we touch base somebody, nomatter how much money we pay
them that they're leaving foranother opportunity. So that's
the nature of the beast. Andit's always been that way in the
10 years, I've been doing this,it's just how can you save, you
know, that law of thirds, kindof that little piece of the pie
(32:49):
that you know, that are on thefence? How can you save those
people and make sure they'rehappy? And whether that's money
or hybrid model or figuring outto your point? Do you just need
a day a week? Let me go to mycustomer see if they're flexible
with that, in today's world,they probably are. So it's a
little bigger conversation thanwhat it was three years ago. But
yeah, that's that's that's someof the things that we do just on
our end from a creativestandpoint, or try to
Greg Hamlin (33:10):
want to think what's hard from a claims
perspective. And that you'veprobably seen this too, is I
don't know that people whoaren't in the industry really
understand that it's a conveyorbelt that's running all the
time, you know, like it runs,whether there are you're fully
staffed or not, the claims aregetting reported, and they need
to be handled, they need to beinvestigated, bills need to be
paid. And so it's kind ofsometimes like that Lucille Ball
(33:33):
Chocolate Factory thing whereyou've got, you know, it just
keeps common. And so I think oneof the challenges that I've seen
on our end is just making surethat we're prepared for the fact
that if somebody resignstomorrow, what are we what's our
plan that we're going to have inplace so that the rest of the
team isn't getting overloaded?
Because especially if you'retalking about bringing somebody
in without experience, orsomebody from another industry,
(33:56):
it may take them three months toa year before, they're actually
really adding help? Because theygot to get licensed, they got to
learn the industry, or they gotto learn the systems. So there's
a lot of challenges involved inthat man. Is there anything
you'd want to add to that?
Matthew Yehling (34:12):
I think you hit on and I, I do have one
question. Just final finalquestion for me. And I know you
have a final question to Gregbut, you know, we see these
industries in claims. I don'tsee it as often I do
occasionally when I get out inan audit, where there's the
foosball table and popcornmachine and they bring in
doughnuts and they have thebasketball court. And I know
(34:32):
you're Chris, you're abasketball player. And is that
helpful for staff retention? Howmuch of it is the atmosphere
like it maybe COVID blew thisall up? Because people don't
want to be in the building asmuch anymore but how much is it
the environment that contributesto you know, the feel and look
and yes,
Chris Moore (34:51):
yeah, so in my early days, I loved it. I was
like, this is pretty cool. Likethat's one of the reasons why I
left my IT staffing job for asoftware job because The company
I went to Qualtrics had anamazing, it was the coolest
office ever seen coolestenvironment, they had drinks,
snack food, all that. And Inever had that I was like, Oh,
this is an experience I've neverhad before. What I'm seeing
today is the younger generation,they don't care about that
(35:13):
stuff, I think the pandemic blewit up, they want flexibility,
they want remote work, wherethey can run to the grocery
store, whenever they ask, andstill put in their hours, the
younger generation works laterinto the night versus having to
get up earlier. So it's kind oflike, Hey, as long as you're
getting your work done, youknow, and you're not putting me
in a box where I have to besomewhere eight to five, which
is the professional world. Andthat's what I was raised on is
(35:34):
you know, kind of that military,you know, structure type of
thing. And that's what I'm knownfor. But I think these this
younger generation coming in isI want flexibility. I want to be
able to work from home, I don'twant someone just micromanaging
me, I guess, if you will, butalso someone who's gonna provide
me leadership and get me to thenext level in my career. And so
yeah, it's a I think the officeenvironment kind of blew up a
(35:54):
little bit. However, if you dohave people coming into the
office, no one's gonna want togo sit in a cubicle, it's not
going to, you're it's gonna beawkward, you got to have some
type of space, that's an Iguess, inviting, but you know,
our office, we do the snacks andstuff like that, but I don't, I
don't do it. Because I thinkit's going to, like attracts
people to our company more andless, probably for me, so I can
(36:16):
drink Dr. Peppers all day. Andhe's, my employees like it too.
And it goes really fast. So aslong as it's going fast, I know
they like it. But I don't thinkthat's the thing that's gonna
keep them here to be honest withyou. So put it like, yeah,
you're gonna have to have somepeople coming to the office, you
got to have some type of coolenvironment. And if you're going
to do a hybrid model, have otherpeople in the office with that
person, because you don't wantpeople coming in on Thursday,
(36:36):
the only person there on theirfloor, and then it's like, Why?
Why am I here? So make surethere have some social
interaction as well. That'sgreat.
Matthew Yehling (36:43):
What are you building?
Greg Hamlin (36:45):
I think that's the number one takeaway is we know,
we need to look at that and makesure we're being mindful that
and of course, is always anissue.
Chris Moore (36:52):
Especially basketball court. That's what I
took away. Great.
Greg Hamlin (36:58):
Well, Chris, as we wrap things up, one of the
things I'm doing this season isthere's just I felt like in
general, the last three yearshave been hard for everybody in
different ways. And it's hardnot to turn on the TV and hear
some pretty negative stuff,whether it's you know, wars that
are going on or COVID disease,one of the things I wanted to
focus on this year is some ofthe good things that are going
on, because I really believethey're out there. We just had
(37:20):
our sixth kid and I wouldn'thave done that it was
intentional, crazy, butintentional. Because I really do
believe that this world is worthworth BNN. So, Chris, if you
could I'd love it if you couldshare a memory of a time that
you were truly happy. And whatwere you doing? And who are you
with?
Chris Moore (37:37):
Yeah, so it was probably my honeymoon to be
honest with you. I was with mywife. I'm a huge I love the
beach. I'm not a cold weatherguy being in Texas, oh, and ice
in the mountains. And that's notme. I love the heat and the
beach and the ocean. So youknow, my wife and I went on our
honeymoon. And they got theygave me time to get away from
everything. I'm usually alwayson event we get on other
(37:58):
vacations, I'm always having mycomputer, she gives me a hard
time I'm at the beach and I'mlike computer open and I'm
answering emails. And to methat's still relaxing, I'm not
in an office, but we're gonnaspend time together, get off of
your computers. But at thattime, that week we had together
I literally turned it off. Andthat's that's hard for me. But I
got to spend time with her. Itwas super relaxing. You know, I
(38:19):
came back to a crap show. But itis and that's why I usually try
to work. But honestly, justgetting away turning off for a
while was with my wife, youknow, we had probably the best
trip we've ever had. And it wasjust fun in general. And it got
away from you know, even then itwas there was a lot of stuff
going on in the world. And youknow, we just got away and had a
(38:40):
good time. And we try to mimicthat but as we've gotten older
just isn't the same. And so thatthat always on my mind, every
trip we go on, I try to that'sthe bar and we just haven't been
able to surpass that yet. And Ialways bring that up when I talk
to people about you know, what'syour favorite trip, or this
isn't kind of a time where youwere happy in your life? Yep.
Again, we were honeymooners andjust married, so it was even
better. But yeah, it was just agood time all around. And that's
(39:01):
the vivid memory that sticks inmy head. That's awesome.
Matthew Yehling (39:05):
I Be Where Your Feet are. That's what we would
say I had some friends andthat's where we push each other.
So if you're at work, be whereyour feet are. If you're at
home, beware your feet or ifyou're on the beach, you know be
where your feet are. So I liketo manage that. I'm sure someone
much brighter than me said it. Ijust feel the quote.
Greg Hamlin (39:25):
Hey, man, I'm gonna keep that one I think I don't
think we could end it anybetter. So I think that's a good
message to wrap things up withis remember to be where your
feet are. And Chris, appreciateyou joining us. We had a great
conversation today. Just remindpeople again, if they want to
follow us on the blog, itreleases on the off weeks
Hello, everybody and welcome to adjusted. I'm
your host, Greg Hanlon coming atyou from beautiful Birmingham,
Alabama and Berkley industrialcomp. And I'm excited that
you're here to join us for oneof our rebroadcast. In this
episode, I had the opportunityto talk with Chris Moore
managing partner at insurernational. And we talked about
(00:33):
what causes some employees tostay and what causes others to
lead. And this is another onethat's near and dear to my heart
as and one of the reasons wepicked this one to rebroadcast
throughout my career, one of thethings that I've had to tackle
and manage has been how to bringstability to a Claims
Department. And obviously, oneof the things that causes some
(00:55):
of the greatest struggle withina department is turnover. And so
we tackled this topic together.
And it was interesting to hearfrom Chris's point of view, who
works on the staffing side,evaluating what those factors
are. So I hope you'll enjoy thisepisode and have a few takeaways
of what your organization can doto help your employees stay
(01:17):
versus losing them. Well,welcome everyone to adjust it.
I'm your host, Greg Hanloncoming at you from beautiful
Birmingham, Alabama, andBerkeley industrial cop, and
with me is my co host for theday. That yelling, Matt, you
want introduce yourself.
Matthew Yehling (01:36):
Hello, everyone. This is Matt Yaling.
I'm coming from St. Louis,Missouri along the banks of the
Big Muddy Mississippi River.
Welcome.
Greg Hamlin (01:46):
Glad to have you, Matt. Matt's with MEC, one of
our fellow Berkeley companies.
So if you've listened to a fewof these before, you've heard us
team up and do a few of these.
And he offers an interestingperspective coming from an
excess carrier. So it's alwaysgood to have a couple different
viewpoints with us for the dayas our special guest, Chris
Moore, who's managing partner atinsurer national. Chris, do you
(02:09):
want to introduce yourself foreverybody?
Chris Moore (02:11):
Yeah, my name is Chris Moore. I am based out of
Dallas, Texas. So right indowntown born and raised here,
and I am one of the owners hereat International.
Greg Hamlin (02:22):
Excellent. We're glad to have you, Chris. The
topic we want to tackle today iswhy do some employees stay and
what causes them to leave? And Ithink people in the industry
right now I've seen a lot ofchange in general. We've talked
about it in some of the otherepisodes, I think the COVID
caused a lot of people toreevaluate their priorities. And
so we've seen a lot of shiftinggoing on in the industry and
(02:43):
outside of it. But I thoughtwe'd start by you just talking a
little bit, Chris, about how didyou end up in the insurance
industry?
Chris Moore (02:50):
Yeah, so it's actually an interesting story.
So I spent about seven years andIT staffing back in my early
days. And at the time, my bossis the one that hired me
actually met the original ownerof international on a plane. And
at the time we did it, we didall contracts and contract to
hire staffing for differentindustries across the board. And
they had met on the plane andshe was looking to grow her
(03:12):
business. She was only doingdirect hire, and she was like, I
want to grow this into adifferent division and new
contracts contract to hire. Longstory short, my boss is like, I
know what my old boss is like, Iknow a guy that can might be
able to help you out. Weconnected on Utah of all places
we met in the middle because I'min Dallas, and she's in
California. I met for honestlyprobably a whole day and just
(03:33):
kind of got to know each otherlooked at the vision of what she
was wanting to do. You know,honestly, I fell in love with
her and kind of urges passionfor the industry. She has an
insurance background. And yeah,just kind of long story short,
that's how I got in and startedup our Dallas office in this new
division. About a year, year andfour months ago now. So it feels
(03:53):
like a month ago, but it's beena year already a year. So it's
been a fun ride. But that's kindof how I got into insurance. I
guess I stumbled upon it.
Greg Hamlin (04:02):
I think that's how most of us most of us got here.
What was your just out ofcuriosity? What was your
background in college? What didyou study?
Chris Moore (04:09):
I played basketball at Tulane University down in New
Orleans. I got a degree in mediaarts. My whole goal was to start
my own business. I didn't knowwhat. But basically, I wanted to
handle all the communicationsand marketing and digital stuff
myself. I minored in web design.
So I wanted to kind of take myweb design experience and create
my own website, my own business.
(04:31):
And but yeah, I didn't, I guessI'm kind of running my own
business. I'm not doing any ofthe marketing or digital stuff.
And then I fell into sales,basically my whole careers, how
it ended up professionally. Butyeah, that's kind of my college
background, I guess, if youwill. That's awesome. What
Greg Hamlin (04:45):
did you play in college?
Chris Moore (04:47):
So I was a shooting guard. So I always tell the
story. I was at Tulane two yearsbefore Hurricane Katrina for the
insurance people and two yearsafter Hurricane Katrina so
Orleans was a Have a night andday place after and before. So
it was pretty quite, it waspretty crazy time. But you know,
it was an experiential. It'sneedless to say,
Greg Hamlin (05:09):
I went to Indiana University. So it's a big
basketball school and we're notwe die for somebody could shoot
right now we've had some great,great teams, but we haven't had
good shooting in probably six oreight years or so
Chris Moore (05:21):
which is rare for people from Indiana because
that's right. And it drivespeople crazy
Greg Hamlin (05:26):
in the state.
Matthew Yehling (05:28):
Where you're happy with the recent outcome,
Chris?
Chris Moore (05:31):
Well, I can there's two ways I can go about this. My
bracket was busted. So no, I'm amassive Texas Tech fan. So
because Kansas is in the big 12I was rooting for them. So I
didn't really care who won. Butthey won. So I guess I was happy
about it. But it was a greatgame to watch. So I was happy
about just it was a good game.
Unknown (05:50):
Yeah. Good game.
Greg Hamlin (05:53):
I'm always rooting for the big 10 Once we get to
the tournament, but we seem tobe the conference everybody goes
through to get to thechampionship, but we can't
figure out a winner that youwant.
Matthew Yehling (06:02):
Yeah. You'll figure it out. We'll get there.
In Chris, for those that listento this podcast that don't know
ensure national, why don't youintroduce the what you do for
them and what the organizationdoes for the insurance industry?
Chris Moore (06:15):
Yeah, so International is basically a
national staffing firm. Our solefocus is the insurance industry.
So we partner with insuranceorganizations of all sizes all
over the country. And basicallywhat we do is we help them find
talent for direct hire, contractcontract to hire and insurance
consulting. So I think one ofour benefits that we like to
(06:36):
explain to organizations is ourwhole network of people are from
the insurance world already. Butwe're also trying to find folks,
which I think is a bigchallenge, which we may get into
later, but that aren't from theinsurance world and get them
into the insurance industry tohelp kind of fill a gap that
we're seeing in that world. Butyeah, that's basically our sole
focus and how we help thoseorganizations and kind of just
(06:56):
pitch that as a unique sellingpoint, I guess, if you will, to
these insurance companies.
Greg Hamlin (07:01):
And do you guys do all lines, then?
Chris Moore (07:03):
Yes, yeah. So basically anything if you're an
insurance company, you have anin house litigation team, you
have a IT team, if you havemarketing, sales, claims
underwriting, if you're aninsurance company, our sole
focus is kind of focusing inthat space. That's
Greg Hamlin (07:18):
fantastic. So now, did you I know you were
mentioning you went to Dallas,or that you're from Dallas, and
that you so did you start theoffices in Dallas? With Yeah,
sure. So what was that like?
Chris Moore (07:31):
Yeah, so I've never I've been in an organization
where I was sent to another cityto start up with, I guess, the
office, but I was more on thesales side. So I was going out
getting a business, but theoperations, the finances, all
that stuff, I didn't see whatwas going on behind the scenes.
So this is kind of my firstglimpse into all that type of
stuff. I saw financials withthat company, and I kind of
(07:52):
looked at them. But it'sinteresting, because I know
staffing. I've been through alot of situations and I've been
doing it for a while. So Iunderstand the business. But as
you start diving into actuallyopening a business putting money
down of your own money to investin it to get it is it was a was
fun. And but now to see thegrowth of it. It's actually
pretty cool. But yeah, we had anoffice in California Chelsea on
(08:13):
the owner of internationalstarted in Florida, she moved
out to California with herhusband, so we have an office
and basically Boca Raton,Florida, kind of Dana Point area
in California, and then nowDallas, Texas. So we can come to
cover essentially all regionsall time zones in the US.
Greg Hamlin (08:29):
That's great. It seems like everybody's got an
office in Florida, in theinsurance industry.
Matthew Yehling (08:38):
What's the most rewarding part of running your
own organization?
Chris Moore (08:43):
You know, it's funny, we started this a year
and it's literally December of2020 is when we opened it. And
then I made my first hire inMarch, just trying to get
business. And so my firstemployee has been here literally
months, a little over a monthnow. And we now have seven in
our office. So I think therewarding part is seeing and my
focus with a lot of people thatwe bring in or you know, younger
(09:05):
professionals that have someprofessional experience, not
necessarily in recruiting, itdoesn't have to be but I've been
through the professional ranks.
But also we are seeing kids outof college as well. And training
them and kind of coaching themand seeing the progression that
they've done in the last year iskind of the most rewarding for
me because I like seeing peoplegrow very fast, selfishly, it
kind of makes me feel like I'mdoing the right thing because
they're doing the right thing.
(09:27):
And they pick up on things veryquickly. But just watching the
office grow, how fast it'sgrown, but also seeing our
employees being rewarded for thehard work we put in because
recruiting is not easy. It's alot of time, a lot of effort and
you're dealing with a lot ofpeople and so just seeing their
growth and seeing them havinghaving fun. I've been in their
shoes, so I took pieces I didn'tlike and I took pieces that I
(09:48):
did like and I kind of mold ofthat and kind of try to create a
culture here that we're tryingto build and make people wanted
to be a part of because I thinkthat's the biggest thing in
selling an organization is theculture and do you like working
with the people and all thatGood stuff. So, yeah, just the
growth of the employees so farto date is kind of the most
rewarding thing right now.
Greg Hamlin (10:06):
That's great. So I know, in your industry, you're
talking about recruiting and theand the challenges of that we're
in the middle of what's beingdubbed the great resignation.
And so that's been talked abouta lot, because there's just
people changing jobs. We've evencompanies with good cultures,
especially ones that don't havegood cultures are seeing it, but
everybody's having to deal withit a little bit. As one whole
(10:28):
generation retires. And thenwe've had a lot, just a lot of
changes. In your opinion, how dowe get here? How do we get to a
place where all at once we'reseeing so much movement?
Chris Moore (10:38):
Yeah, there's a there's a big shift, obviously,
the pandemic COVID is what did Ithink three years ago, I think
we can all agree, unless you areleadership, and you had leaders
in different regions of the USzoom wasn't really a thing,
teams wasn't really a thing. Itwas in person, you're in office.
And I think what happened, thepandemic forced everybody, you
know, companies, whether theywere ready or not to send
(10:59):
everybody home to work remote,there were challenges around it,
if you weren't a really good ITcompany, and could do things
virtually, there was a lot ofsetup and headaches with that.
But I think it also on the flipside employees, because they
were getting to work from home,which I don't think was a thing
really couple years ago as well.
Some companies had hybridmodels, but the organization's
the bigger ones that we've seentoday, really were in office
(11:19):
Monday through Friday, eight tofive. And once those employees
started getting to work fromhome, they started seeing how
much flexibility they hadworking from home. And I think
it was, it was something wherethere's a big shift in that
year, two years that we've hadand COVID. And basically,
employees are realizing kind ofa I don't wanna say they have
the power, that's probably notthe right word. But the cards
are kind of in their hands andare saying, Okay, what
(11:40):
organizations are going to fitmy like my criteria, you know,
whether it's work from home, ora hybrid schedule, or better pay
is it better benefits? I don'tknow what that looks like. And I
think it's funny, if employershad the answer, we wouldn't be
having this issue. But I thinkthat's the gold question. I
guess, if you can figure outwhat these employees want in a
job, you can start trying toretain some of these folks and
(12:02):
keep them around, but alsoemploy them and make sure they
stick. But it's funny, becausemy previous jobs with Qualtrics.
And they're all customerexperience and employee
experience surveys. So I learneda lot from that industry, just
in how important it is for theemployee to have a great
experience working for anorganization, whether it's a
remote, you go through apandemic, are they going to
stick around because you know,they liked their manager,
(12:22):
they're not burnt out, all thattype of stuff plays into the end
of the whole scheme of is thisperson going to stick around?
Are they going to leave us andgo somewhere else? But it's an
interesting conversation, justbecause I think it's been a big
shift in the way who's incontrol, basically. And right
now, I think a lot of employeesare in control. And they can
determine, you know, like Isaid, what they're what the
requirements are and where theywant to go work. And if a
(12:44):
company doesn't match it, theyhave other jobs, they can go
look for some Yeah, it's thatit's the question that I don't
think anybody has the answer toright now. And I wish I did,
because I really have to hire alot of people.
Matthew Yehling (12:56):
If you could tell the C suite of an org and
insurance organization, anythingto help retain talent, what
would be your top three items,you'd tell an organization for
talent retention?
Chris Moore (13:08):
Yeah, great question. So we've talked to a
lot of candidates, and I'm gonnacall them candidates, mostly
employees. But you know, wetalked to a lot of people for
opportunities. And I think thethree biggest things they're
looking for are flexibility. Sowhether that's a hybrid model,
you know, if they're in office,or work from home 100%.
Secondly, it's going to be a lotof sign on bonuses, or some type
of bonuses throughout theircareer that they're paid out on,
(13:30):
and then also just the exploitexperience as a whole. So, you
know, working, I think that'sthe challenging part is working,
virtually, you're not going tohave that social interaction
that face to face, it's allgoing to be virtual, but how
does that person feelingimportant within the
organization, how are theycontributing, and seeing their
contributions go to work,instead of just being like, you
sit in that desk, you do yourjob eight to five, and then you
(13:50):
go home, and you may getrewarded a little bit, but that
kind of goes to Hey, the cardsin the hand have changed a
little bit. And I would saythose are probably the top three
things that we're hearing fromemployees that they want in a
new opportunity. And I thinkorganizations are having to
adjust to that a little bit andcoming up with creative ways to
kind of keep those peopleengaged, or more, hire them and
(14:11):
put those in offer letters andthings of that nature.
Greg Hamlin (14:14):
I think you hit on some really important things
there. And I can think of my ownjourney to be where I am now.
And when I started my career,you know, one of the places I
worked I often felt like myemployee number I had to log in
every day and 0140409 and I feltlike that's pretty much what I
was to the company was thatnumber and as long as my work
(14:35):
product was getting pumped out,life was good. And I was as
mobile as a laptop or a monitor.
There wasn't really much thoughtof the fact that I was a human
being that had a family and haddesires of my own and had ideas
that could help them you know,the there wasn't really
interested in that and so youknow, I think that's a
challenge.
Chris Moore (14:55):
It is and and going back to my younger my first job
and just being an ad I alwayshad the mindset of someone could
take your job. And I thinknowadays, it's flipped, where
it's like, now the company islike, we need people to find the
right person. And don't get mewrong, someone can always take
your job no matter where you'rein. But I think that mindset now
is like, Oh, if I don't perform,someone's going to take my job,
(15:18):
it alleviates some of thestress. And then I honestly
think it's gonna help peopleperform better. You know, if
they're gonna get a job, like,obviously, you're gonna perform,
but if they're bummed out, whenthey're not happy, and they're
mistreated by their manager,they're gonna they're gonna
leave ship really quickly.
Greg Hamlin (15:32):
I absolutely agree with everything you said there,
I think there's a lot that wecan do better to make sure
people feel like they're part ofthe team. And we've got some
work to do. And that's for sure.
Yeah, that's for sure.
Matthew Yehling (15:42):
I'm, I'm in zero 11, eight man.
Greg Hamlin (15:49):
We both have scars.
Yeah. You know, we
Matthew Yehling (15:53):
talked about this last year with one of
Greg's employees about, youknow, in the claims industry,
Greg and I both work in claims,obviously, for an insurance
carrier. So kind of shift in thediscussion to claims that
there's a customer service focusthat we are adapting more
regularly now. So how do we findstaff for those positions? And
(16:15):
how do you guys help us findstaff for those positions?
Chris Moore (16:18):
Yeah, so it's funny, I've actually, there's
some interesting concepts I'veheard talking to, you know,
different claims leaders to theworkers comp, it could be PNC,
whatever it may look like. Andthey're looking at different
ways to do service type ofroles, because there are certain
they're obviously as a servicetype of role and claims, and a
lot of them looking at likesocial workers, or previous
customers, grants professionalsthat aren't from the insurance
(16:40):
world, and bringing them in andhelping them get them licensed
and all that good stuff to kindof move them into the insurance
world. Typically, if you're aCSR, customer service rep or
social worker probably could getthem a little more money if we
can get them licensed. And itwas an interesting concept that
I had with a few conversationswith some companies that we're
looking to try to help themwith, because they came to us
that, hey, we typically justhire a customer service rep or a
(17:01):
claims adjuster who has serviceexperience, but we're trying to
figure out a way to bring inyounger professionals into the
industry to kind of help havethem mold them into our way and
how we want them to fit into ourorganization or culture, but
then only someone that's goingto stick around for a while. And
I think one of the things thatthey had brought up to us, which
I thought was prettyinteresting. Looking at it from
a social worker standpoint, itwas always having conversations
(17:23):
with people, they're alwayshandling some different types of
situations, you can always thinkon their feet, but also just a
customer service rep that, youknow, may work at American
Airlines or something like that,that may want to switch careers
and go into this world wherethey'll train them up on
everything, no, get themlicensed, it really helped them
kind of bring in a diverse groupof people and help them train
them in the claims world. But onthe flip side, as a employer,
(17:45):
you have to be able to take thetime and understand it's gonna
take time to get people rampedup. But you have to put that
time in to make sure thatsomeone is going to work out and
stick around. Because if youjust bring him in and throw him
into the fire, you know, peopleare gonna get burnt out if they
have a good work ethic, andthey're gonna go somewhere else.
And you literally just trainthem to go and pay them to go be
a great class or their company.
And it was an interestingconcept that I never thought of,
(18:07):
but just trying to think of waysto bring people from different
organizations or differentindustries into the claims world
and help like the claimsadjuster start helping these
organizations with differenttalents.
Greg Hamlin (18:19):
I've seen that play out in our company quite a bit
where we've had some reallygreat success with bringing
people and we we hired a flightattendant at one point, she was
amazing, we've hired a customerservice person from, you know,
grocery store that was reallyknown for their white glove, you
know, care of their. And so Ithink those skills are
transferable and you're hittingon something that's important
(18:40):
because we were facing the otherbuzzword is the silver tsunami,
all the baby boomers areretiring. And there's not enough
people to fill those spots if wedon't get creative. And I've
seen the challenge. And I don'tknow, if you have Matt, where
sometimes if we put a lot oftime and energy, we take a model
where we're only looking atrecent college grads, we can end
up putting a lot of time andeffort into people that
(19:01):
constantly leave. And you know,after three to five years,
they're ready for the next thingor they're not sure that this is
what they wanted to do. But bythe time you've invested a year
of your time to train them, youknow, it's like now you'd be
starting all the way back over.
They were just getting to thepoint they were helpful. So I
think you do need to look a lotof different ways and have a
nice popery like as a group ofdifferent skill sets from
(19:22):
different places.
Chris Moore (19:24):
I think, you know, Chelsea, she started
international because as youmentioned, she saw kind of a gap
in that world where the talentgap is what we call it on our
side is you have the folks whoare retiring 30% of the
workforce is going to beretiring and Pandemic actually
push people out sooner. What I'mjust gonna go ahead and retire,
you know, there's no I don'tknow what the future holds. And
(19:45):
so that was that number probablyincreased a little bit, but then
you have some of those, youknow, the middle generation that
are now getting promoted intonew roles, but what is that
younger generation coming in?
And I've been in severalindustries. Previously before
this, I was at Uber where we didtrucking for Uber and Uber for
trucking and the truckingshortage drivers. It's there's a
gap. The younger talent does notwant to go be a trucker. The
younger talent isn't justfalling into the insurance world
(20:07):
because it's sexy. It'sinsurances. So it's, I look at
it, I want technology, I wantcool gadgets. And I want all
this. And, you know, I thinkthey're trying to get there with
insurtechs. And, you know,evolving and some of the
technology to make it kind ofcool some of the marketing with
the bigger like state farms andbring in named people that you
may recognize on TV, and itconnects with that brand. But
yeah, it's a challenge to bringin younger people that
(20:29):
understand that we want toinvest in this person, but also,
are they going to be around for10 years? Are they going to,
they're going to leave on usafter a year or two. And we just
spent all that time, as youmentioned, training them, and
now they're gonna they're agreat employee at another
company. We just lost all thismoney. So I think that's the
it's a challenge. And it's noteasy. And like I said earlier on
if if I had the answer, Iprobably making a lot more money
(20:50):
and providing a lot of adviceand consulting to companies, but
I don't unfortunately,
Matthew Yehling (20:56):
what's your opinion on? I mean, we talked
about the great resignations,and silver tsunami, but you
know, for those, those youngpeople that we are bringing in,
why did they leave? So quickly?
You know, what can we do as anorganization? And what can other
organizations do to retain them?
I know, you said, but what haveyou seen successfully happen,
(21:18):
you know, maybe, and thencounter that, like, what, what
generally keeps people to leavewhat keeps them staying, you
know, in your, in your opinion,and what you've experienced?
Chris Moore (21:26):
Yeah, so I think a few things. So on our end, you
know, as I mentioned early on,we do a lot in the contract
contract to hire for theinsurance world. So we employ
people and place them on aproject, they're employed by
insure nationals that areactually our employee, we're
taking on all the risk andeverything of that nature by
putting this person on aproject, but my job is to keep
that person retained for ourcustomer. And, you know, it's
(21:47):
not as easy to keep a contractorif you're gonna go to a full
time job. And so it's actually alittle harder to keep those
people interested. So juststaying engaged with them, and
honestly, communicating withthem, not to the point where
you're annoying, like a used carsalesman, but also not. Um, so
you're going to want to makesure that you're keeping in
touch with them and giving themupdates and feedback from how
their performance is doing, howthings are working out there.
But also engaging them in termsof, hey, if you're doing well,
(22:09):
let's let's talk about some typeof raise, or a bonus, or some
sort of that nature to make surethat their efforts that they're
putting in are being noticed, Ithink the biggest thing working
from home, you can feel likeyou're on an island, and a lot
of our jobs are remote. I mean,when you're on an island, you
don't know if you're doinggreat, you don't know if you're
doing bad. And a lot of times,you can get A Surprise Phone
Call that you weren't expecting,and it doesn't work out. But
(22:30):
also on the flip side, you get asurprise call to say, Hey, I
took another opportunity. Andall you have to do is look
yourself in the mirror, likewhat could we have done better.
So to your point, you know,making sure that the employee is
happy, making sure that you'redoing performance reviews with
and making sure you'reunderstanding how you can help
them proceed in their career,because I think a lot of it is
burnt out, I think a lot ofpeople just maybe aren't happy.
But sometimes it is just money.
I don't want to say it's alwaysabout money. But if another type
(22:51):
of job comes crawling, or youknow knocking at the door, and
it's offering you a lot moremoney, anybody in the right
mind, you're gonna considerthat. Um, however, if they're
happy in their current job, theylike their management, they like
the team, they like the workthat's being noticed from you
know, they're being you know, Iguess rewarded for their hard
work, it's gonna make it a lotharder for that person to leave.
And they'll second guess leavingversus just being like, Okay,
(23:12):
I'm out of here, if I'm just anumber to your guys points, I'm
gonna go somewhere where I feelvalued. And any interview,
someone's gonna make you feelvalid value, they're gonna be
like, Oh, you're amazing, wewant you here, they're gonna try
to sell you come. So when youyou're really looking for that
type of feedback. If a recruitercalls you and gives you that
feedback, you're gonna, you'regoing to kind of steer toward
that if you're not getting itfrom your current employee, kind
(23:34):
of like dating, I guess, if youwill?
Greg Hamlin (23:37):
No, I think you're making a great point. And it
reminds me when I was about 10years ago, I was working for a
company that went through areorg. And my team was assigned
in Boston, Massachusetts, so andI was in Cincinnati at the time,
so I had to manage them remotelybefore managing people remotely
was a thing. You know, so I'dread a book on I was trying to
figure out like how to do thisbecause it was all new. And one
(23:58):
of the things I learned earlyon, and I think it's easy to
forget, we really should do itall the time was just build in
time, like I would schedule timewith my people every week, even
if it was just to check in andtalk, make the watercooler talk
that isn't happening naturally.
Make sure it's happening.
Because if you don't do thoselittle things, two things
happen. You don't build thoserelationships. But the other
(24:20):
thing and people don't feelwanted are part of the team. But
I think that other piece you hiton is so important feedback that
there has to be a regularchannel. If the only time I hear
from my boss is when I'm introuble, then that's not good.
But if we're talking every week,and there's already something
set up or every two weeks,there's already something set up
then when there is some kind ofdifficult conversation. There's
(24:41):
already a challenge channel forthat. Yeah, and we're talking
all the time anyway. And I'mgetting positive feedback also
Chris Moore (24:49):
broken down when you have a lot of Congress that
communication with youremployees and when you don't, if
you're not going to get thatconversation and I think when
you build a relationship whereit's easier for them to come you
say hey, I got a call about Thisinterview, I had an interview
with coming, I'm reallyconsidering it like, and it's
almost like what I wanted tobring this to your attention to
I like it here, but is thereinstead of just being like, hey,
peace, I'm out, it's like, atthat point, you can go save it
(25:11):
and say, Hey guys, we have thisemployee, that's amazing. She
has an offer on the table, sheinformed me because I have a
relationship with my employee,we need to keep her or him. What
can we do to do this? And youknow, from that standpoint,
like, what do you need to stayhere from us and we can, I can't
guarantee let's go try to makethis happen and gives you some
time to save that employeeversus the other way where you
don't communicate with them, youdon't have a relationship, and
that's when they jump ship andgo somewhere else. So I think
(25:34):
that's a great point, justhaving that communication open
dialogue with your employees isbig, especially in a virtual
environment.
Matthew Yehling (25:39):
I had a similar example where I had an employee
and she was she was a greatemployee was with us for a
little over a year. And she sheherself had a young family and
one had had come from a largecarrier and wanted to work
remote, where she had been doingwith the prior carrier. And at
the time, this is pretty COVIDWe we did not allow remote work.
And she left. And after she leftI heard through the grapevine
(26:03):
that all she was asking for wasone day of remote work. And I
said, If I would have known thatwe would have made that happen.
But the communication didn't,didn't make its way through the
appropriate channels until shehad already made the decision
and accepted another offer. So Imean, I agree with what Greg and
what you were saying, Chris, aswell, like, you know,
communication is key. So many ofour problems boil down, I feel
(26:27):
like to communication betweenthe parties when we're talking
about workers comp plans, orwhen we're talking about
employee relationship issues andthings. So I mean, I would
encourage you, if you're anemployee out there to like, have
that conversation with yoursupervisor, because as managers,
you know, we get into these allthese situations where we're
texting, or we're emailing ouremployees, and you're like, did
you really touch base with them?
You have that one on oneconversation with your employer
(26:50):
this week, or today? Or when wasthe last time you actually
talked to him? And it's like aLago message. And now I'm like,
yeah, just kind of roll back andlike laugh a little bit. I'm
like, no, like, you need to callthem and have a conversation.
And it doesn't always have to beabout work. Like you were
saying, Greg have a conversationabout their life or what's going
on in their situation. DuringCOVID. I made it a point to call
everyone in my department, youknow, I tried to do it monthly,
(27:12):
but when you have, you know, 45people, it was like, Okay, well,
I'm spending anywhere from 20 to30 minutes on each call. So, you
know, but I was pretty goodabout every six weeks, or every
eight weeks, I funneled throughthe list. And I had a checklist
of like, who I called, and I puta date back sort of like when I
last spoke to him and and hadthat kind of conversation more
more of the Connect conversationthan, Hey, what's this month's
(27:33):
results look like? Or how manyclaims that were settling or
closing, then that was anotherconversation. But I think that
communication breakdowncontinues to exist, we need to
be better about that industrywide talking with our staff.
Chris Moore (27:49):
I don't want to say people are lazy, but I think the
virtual stuff has caused somelaziness and to that, just
emailing, oh, yeah, touch basewith them. Or if you're in an
office, it's like, hey, go talkto Chris or go talk to Matt, and
you haven't, then you would goand do it versus just being like
how things going. And it's like,it's not a touch point, really,
it's less personable. And that'swhen people just feel like
they're on an island. And it'salready hard as it is virtually
(28:10):
to do stuff like that. But soyeah, it's a great point.
Greg Hamlin (28:13):
We talked a lot about what what causes people to
stay? And what are some thingswe can do to keep them? And I
think you've kind of talkedabout this some Chris, but just
to make sure we've covered it.
What are some of the things thatyou feel like when you've seen
people leave? Because obviouslyyou're trying to get people
placed different places, whenyou see people leave? Or you
have a company that you'reworking with? It's had problems
with people leaving? What aresome of the things that drive
(28:35):
that?
Chris Moore (28:37):
Yeah, so I think one of the big things I'm seeing
right now is obviously after thepandemic, or during the
pandemic, I should say a lot ofthere's tons of layoffs, tons of
furloughs, tons of peopleleaving. And what happened was
now things are relaxing a littlebit, and people now companies
are trying to employ. And sothey're trying to employ either
people back that they let go, orthey're trying to find new
(28:58):
talent to fill seats. And sowhat's happening is just because
they had a pandemic projectsdidn't necessarily stop, they
may have got delay, but now theyhave delivery dates. And so
what's happening is they'rebringing these people in, and
they're not hiring enoughpeople. So more work is getting
put on the people that they'rebringing in, that are fresh
hires, and literally six monthsin their birth time. If there's
(29:18):
not enough help here, I'm gonnago to another company that may
be a little smaller who theworkload may not be there. I
mean, even on top of that, ifyou're making the person go into
work, because there are somecompanies we partner with, like
they have to be an office hybridmodels or even sometimes hard.
So when you're putting that muchwork on somebody to the point,
it causes them to burnout very,very fast. So you know, making
sure that you have enoughemployees to you know, spread
(29:40):
out the workload, so thatthey're not getting burned out
because they will leave veryfast. Secondly, the thing that
always comes up is always pay.
If another company comes to paymore, they're going to consider
that especially with theuncertainty of the pandemic, um,
you never know it could alwayshappen again, who knows what
could happen at this point, andso you know, they're gonna take
another higher paying offportunity Just because there's
still some uncertainty, but alsothey probably were let go and
(30:03):
didn't have a job for a year. Soif someone's going to come
calling, they need a job to paythe bills. But if someone's
going to pay more money, they'rereally going to consider that
opportunity. And then lastly, Ikind of touched on it the work
from home, obviously, if youbreak it down and work from home
is number one, Monday throughFriday, then you kind of go to
the hybrid model, if they have ahybrid model, somewhat
considerate, if it's flexible totheir schedule, and not like you
(30:23):
have to be your Monday,Wednesday, Friday, but if you're
like, if you do come into theoffice two days a week, we don't
care what days they are, just bein the office, and you have to
be there all day, as muchflexibility as you can provide
that that employee, the better.
So I would say those are thethree things that I'm hearing,
you know, everybody has theirreasons, and everybody's
probably heard everything. Butthat's kind of what I'm hearing
on my end, just from theindustry as a whole why people
(30:44):
would leave, you know, from anopportunity, you know,
Matthew Yehling (30:46):
and a company works with you guys. And you
have a, you know, you'rebasically taking on the
employment responsibility, youknow, how are you guys getting
them up in trained and notoverwhelming them? How do you,
you know, how do you guys workhere, that own problem that you
just said, you know, as aproblem for new hires?
Chris Moore (31:03):
Good question. So obviously, a lot of the
onboarding still falls on or notthe onboarding, onboarding is
all on us the training and allthat falls on whatever customer
we've replaced that candidate.
Wait, however, you know,obviously, we do all of our
poor, I make my recruiters touchbase with them, we have kind of
an acronym that we utilizeinternally that basically the
first thing you do in themorning is if you have an
(31:23):
employee working on a customer,one of our projects, you're
touching base with them, Iwouldn't say it's every day,
maybe two times a week just seeshow things are going any
questions, how's the work been?
We want to get a pulse on howthings are going. And there's
certain ways we approach that.
So going back to my point, youdon't sound like a used car
salesman, you're gettingannoying, because again, these
people are working and they havea job now and they have projects
that they're working on. Thelast thing they want to do is
(31:45):
have a conversation with therecruiter that doesn't make
sense. But we have ways weapproach those conversations and
make sure things are going wellon top of that we actually have
an account, we have a ton ofpeople that right now. And going
back to my point where theworkload is just being poured
over top of them. And people areputting in a ton of hours, you
know, it's stressful. So webasically rolled out a bonus
plan to them. So any hours thatthey work over 40 hours a week,
(32:06):
they will be incentivized inadditional amount of money.
That's not necessarily overtime.
But you know, because they'reyou don't really qualify for the
overtime piece based on how muchthey make. But we're just taking
money out of our pocket to rollit out to help our customer
because, one, I believe theydeserve it. But we got to come
up with creative ways internallyon how we engage and retain our
(32:27):
employees, for our customers,because they're relying on that
person to do the job. And, youknow, don't get me wrong, we
still get called surprise callsall the time, no matter how many
times we touch base somebody, nomatter how much money we pay
them that they're leaving foranother opportunity. So that's
the nature of the beast. Andit's always been that way in the
10 years, I've been doing this,it's just how can you save, you
know, that law of thirds, kindof that little piece of the pie
(32:49):
that you know, that are on thefence? How can you save those
people and make sure they'rehappy? And whether that's money
or hybrid model or figuring outto your point? Do you just need
a day a week? Let me go to mycustomer see if they're flexible
with that, in today's world,they probably are. So it's a
little bigger conversation thanwhat it was three years ago. But
yeah, that's that's that's someof the things that we do just on
our end from a creativestandpoint, or try to
Greg Hamlin (33:10):
want to think what's hard from a claims
perspective. And that you'veprobably seen this too, is I
don't know that people whoaren't in the industry really
understand that it's a conveyorbelt that's running all the
time, you know, like it runs,whether there are you're fully
staffed or not, the claims aregetting reported, and they need
to be handled, they need to beinvestigated, bills need to be
paid. And so it's kind ofsometimes like that Lucille Ball
(33:33):
Chocolate Factory thing whereyou've got, you know, it just
keeps common. And so I think oneof the challenges that I've seen
on our end is just making surethat we're prepared for the fact
that if somebody resignstomorrow, what are we what's our
plan that we're going to have inplace so that the rest of the
team isn't getting overloaded?
Because especially if you'retalking about bringing somebody
in without experience, orsomebody from another industry,
(33:56):
it may take them three months toa year before, they're actually
really adding help? Because theygot to get licensed, they got to
learn the industry, or they gotto learn the systems. So there's
a lot of challenges involved inthat man. Is there anything
you'd want to add to that?
Matthew Yehling (34:12):
I think you hit on and I, I do have one
question. Just final finalquestion for me. And I know you
have a final question to Gregbut, you know, we see these
industries in claims. I don'tsee it as often I do
occasionally when I get out inan audit, where there's the
foosball table and popcornmachine and they bring in
doughnuts and they have thebasketball court. And I know
(34:32):
you're Chris, you're abasketball player. And is that
helpful for staff retention? Howmuch of it is the atmosphere
like it maybe COVID blew thisall up? Because people don't
want to be in the building asmuch anymore but how much is it
the environment that contributesto you know, the feel and look
and yes,
Chris Moore (34:51):
yeah, so in my early days, I loved it. I was
like, this is pretty cool. Likethat's one of the reasons why I
left my IT staffing job for asoftware job because The company
I went to Qualtrics had anamazing, it was the coolest
office ever seen coolestenvironment, they had drinks,
snack food, all that. And Inever had that I was like, Oh,
this is an experience I've neverhad before. What I'm seeing
today is the younger generation,they don't care about that
(35:13):
stuff, I think the pandemic blewit up, they want flexibility,
they want remote work, wherethey can run to the grocery
store, whenever they ask, andstill put in their hours, the
younger generation works laterinto the night versus having to
get up earlier. So it's kind oflike, Hey, as long as you're
getting your work done, youknow, and you're not putting me
in a box where I have to besomewhere eight to five, which
is the professional world. Andthat's what I was raised on is
(35:34):
you know, kind of that military,you know, structure type of
thing. And that's what I'm knownfor. But I think these this
younger generation coming in isI want flexibility. I want to be
able to work from home, I don'twant someone just micromanaging
me, I guess, if you will, butalso someone who's gonna provide
me leadership and get me to thenext level in my career. And so
yeah, it's a I think the officeenvironment kind of blew up a
(35:54):
little bit. However, if you dohave people coming into the
office, no one's gonna want togo sit in a cubicle, it's not
going to, you're it's gonna beawkward, you got to have some
type of space, that's an Iguess, inviting, but you know,
our office, we do the snacks andstuff like that, but I don't, I
don't do it. Because I thinkit's going to, like attracts
people to our company more andless, probably for me, so I can
(36:16):
drink Dr. Peppers all day. Andhe's, my employees like it too.
And it goes really fast. So aslong as it's going fast, I know
they like it. But I don't thinkthat's the thing that's gonna
keep them here to be honest withyou. So put it like, yeah,
you're gonna have to have somepeople coming to the office, you
got to have some type of coolenvironment. And if you're going
to do a hybrid model, have otherpeople in the office with that
person, because you don't wantpeople coming in on Thursday,
(36:36):
the only person there on theirfloor, and then it's like, Why?
Why am I here? So make surethere have some social
interaction as well. That'sgreat.
Matthew Yehling (36:43):
What are you building?
Greg Hamlin (36:45):
I think that's the number one takeaway is we know,
we need to look at that and makesure we're being mindful that
and of course, is always anissue.
Chris Moore (36:52):
Especially basketball court. That's what I
took away. Great.
Greg Hamlin (36:58):
Well, Chris, as we wrap things up, one of the
things I'm doing this season isthere's just I felt like in
general, the last three yearshave been hard for everybody in
different ways. And it's hardnot to turn on the TV and hear
some pretty negative stuff,whether it's you know, wars that
are going on or COVID disease,one of the things I wanted to
focus on this year is some ofthe good things that are going
on, because I really believethey're out there. We just had
(37:20):
our sixth kid and I wouldn'thave done that it was
intentional, crazy, butintentional. Because I really do
believe that this world is worthworth BNN. So, Chris, if you
could I'd love it if you couldshare a memory of a time that
you were truly happy. And whatwere you doing? And who are you
with?
Chris Moore (37:37):
Yeah, so it was probably my honeymoon to be
honest with you. I was with mywife. I'm a huge I love the
beach. I'm not a cold weatherguy being in Texas, oh, and ice
in the mountains. And that's notme. I love the heat and the
beach and the ocean. So youknow, my wife and I went on our
honeymoon. And they got theygave me time to get away from
everything. I'm usually alwayson event we get on other
(37:58):
vacations, I'm always having mycomputer, she gives me a hard
time I'm at the beach and I'mlike computer open and I'm
answering emails. And to methat's still relaxing, I'm not
in an office, but we're gonnaspend time together, get off of
your computers. But at thattime, that week we had together
I literally turned it off. Andthat's that's hard for me. But I
got to spend time with her. Itwas super relaxing. You know, I
(38:19):
came back to a crap show. But itis and that's why I usually try
to work. But honestly, justgetting away turning off for a
while was with my wife, youknow, we had probably the best
trip we've ever had. And it wasjust fun in general. And it got
away from you know, even then itwas there was a lot of stuff
going on in the world. And youknow, we just got away and had a
(38:40):
good time. And we try to mimicthat but as we've gotten older
just isn't the same. And so thatthat always on my mind, every
trip we go on, I try to that'sthe bar and we just haven't been
able to surpass that yet. And Ialways bring that up when I talk
to people about you know, what'syour favorite trip, or this
isn't kind of a time where youwere happy in your life? Yep.
Again, we were honeymooners andjust married, so it was even
better. But yeah, it was just agood time all around. And that's
(39:01):
the vivid memory that sticks inmy head. That's awesome.
Matthew Yehling (39:05):
I Be Where Your Feet are. That's what we would
say I had some friends andthat's where we push each other.
So if you're at work, be whereyour feet are. If you're at
home, beware your feet or ifyou're on the beach, you know be
where your feet are. So I liketo manage that. I'm sure someone
much brighter than me said it. Ijust feel the quote.
Greg Hamlin (39:25):
Hey, man, I'm gonna keep that one I think I don't
think we could end it anybetter. So I think that's a good
message to wrap things up withis remember to be where your
feet are. And Chris, appreciateyou joining us. We had a great
conversation today. Just remindpeople again, if they want to
follow us on the blog, itreleases on the off weeks
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