November 13, 2025 • 43 mins
A rushed doctor visit, a push for weight loss meds, and a simple question about sleep spiral into a bigger truth: our healthcare system is built for billing codes, not people. We share what it feels like to chase rest through a maze of referrals, to be offered a prescription for the wrong problem, and to long for the old-school visit where a doctor sat down, listened, and connected the dots.
That frustration sets the stage for the week’s political whiplash. We unpack the shutdown theater that cost workers paychecks and put safety nets at risk while inching the ACA back onto the chopping block. If leadership planned to cave, why inflict the pain? We pull apart the optics of “strategy,” the empty promise of replacements for Obamacare, and the downstream consequences for anyone who relies on guaranteed coverage and preexisting condition protections.
Then the headlines shift: the Epstein files resurface old truths about power and impunity. Does any of it move minds? Maybe not—but it matters for survivors, for accountability, and for understanding how institutions slow-walk the stories that define public memory. And just when it’s all too heavy, we land on something tender and real: Jimmy Kimmel’s 22-minute tribute to his friend and bandleader, Cleto. It’s a masterclass in showing up—proof that masculinity can be love, loyalty, and bringing your people with you when success finally arrives. We talk chosen family over DNA, the kind of friend who flies in for your surgery, and why care—not outrage—is the only strategy that scales.
If this resonates, tap follow, share with a friend who needs it, and leave a quick review. Then text someone you love. Show up. That’s the whole point.
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Music By Geovane Bruno, Moments, 3481
Editing by Team A-J
Host, Carmen Lezeth
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Carmen Lezeth (00:00):
Hey everyone, welcome to All About the Joy.
This is Culture and Consequencewith Carmen and Andrea.
Hey, what's up, Andrea?
How are you doing?
I'm good.
I'm good.
How are you?
Because normally in ourconversations, I would say what
I anyway, it doesn't matter.
Okay.
Let's start that over.
I had a uh a doctor'sappointment this morning, and I
(00:26):
love this doctor, I really do.
Um, but they're all pushingthose weight loss things.
Oh, the uh the GLP ones orwhatever, you know, and they're
pushing it?
I don't know, she's pushing it,but I like so I was like, you
know what?
I'm just I'm so stressed outbecause I really want to get
(00:48):
back to that place of running orwhatever, you know, because you
have that little kind ofconversation, but you can't talk
to them about anything otherthan what the visit is for,
because then you have to it'ssuch aren't like I want to go
back to the day where you can goto the doctors.
Like I remember Dr.
Umger, who is my favoritedoctor, he's since retired.
But I would go get my GYN fromhim.
(01:08):
I would, you know, and it wouldbe one visit, and he would
you'd go in early, you'd getyour blood work from somebody
else in the office.
He would have you sit in hisactual office, not in the room,
but in his office, and he wouldbe like, So what's going on?
Okay, let's go do the exam.
Like, and that feels like itwas so long ago.
Andrea (01:30):
It's so different from, I mean, I don't think I've ever
had that exactly, but I have haddoctors that spend a little
more time with you.
But yeah, if there's, you know,a lot of times what I do
throughout the year I've starteddoing is like I keep a list of
all of my, you know, what, youknow, my shoulder's doing this
and waking up at this time everynight.
You know, I have all of mythings, right?
(01:50):
Like my ear hurts sometimes,you know.
Um, and so I go in with my listand they're like, oh, well,
that's you'd have to seesomebody else for that, and we'd
have to schedule anotherappointment for this.
Carmen Lezeth (02:02):
It's like, yeah, yeah, because they they won't
talk to you about like all Isaid to her was I was having
issues sleeping.
And I mean, not that I meantfor this to be the conversation,
but it's gonna be theconversation that'll and you had
mentioned something that you'vebeen doing, and so I was like,
oh, maybe I can try that.
And that's like, you know what?
Let's set up a different com uha different appointment for
(02:24):
that.
And I'm like, you know, soyeah, so I I had mentioned, I'm
like, I can't sleep, and when Ican't sleep very well, and it's
really changed a lot.
I've always been a lightsleeper, but this is a little
bit beyond.
Um, and so when I don't sleepwell, I can't, I don't eat well
because then I don't work outwell, you know what I mean?
(02:44):
And I'm in that weird cycle,yeah, you know, um, and then I'm
so tired by the end of thewhatever, let's say the week of
not sleeping, that then I sleepreally well.
I wake up the next morning, I'mlike, yes, and then it just
deteriorates.
So, but it was so she was justlike, Well, you know, there's a
lot of um uh weight loss drugsnow available.
(03:05):
And I'm like, I'm I'm nottaking, I'm not gonna take
weight loss.
Like, that's not the firstanswer I want to hear.
Well, and how's that like howis it related?
I don't know.
Well, because I because I amshe's trying to say without
saying because we can't have theconversation.
Right.
You know what I mean?
Like I'm 25, I've alreadyadmitted this, so I don't care.
I'm like 25, 30 poundsoverweight.
(03:26):
Um, and so I need to lose thatweight.
And that's fair.
I mean, I feel like I've beenin that struggle with the
thyroid medication, and I'vejust been, and I'm I'm I'm still
not settled.
And after the surgery, I swearto God, they everyone keeps
telling me that that surgery didnot mess up my thyroid, but I
didn't have a problem with mythyroid before then.
Andrea (03:48):
Yeah, you have no, they don't know that.
Carmen Lezeth (03:50):
Nobody has nobody knows that.
None of them will they're like,no, no, those are two separate
things.
I'm like, nobody invaded mybody before.
Like Dr.
Andrea (04:01):
Gardeck with metal in your body now, right?
Like, I'm sorry, you have metalin your body now, like
something's different.
Carmen Lezeth (04:08):
I don't know.
I mean, again, I'm not trying,but I'm just saying all of this
went like my hip is great, buteverything else feels like
whatever.
Anyway, so I'm just so I saidto her, said I don't wanna, I
don't wanna take any medicationbecause I have a sleep problem.
Like I'm not trying to be me.
unknown (04:27):
Right.
Carmen Lezeth (04:28):
And I honestly, and again, I'm not against it.
I don't know if you saw theshow.
We Cynthia talked about itbecause she's been on it, and
I'm I'm all for people doing it,but I don't think that should
be my first.
I don't think I I don't thinkbeing 25 pounds overweight is
the reason why I'm not sleeping.
I think it's something else.
And anyways, I just was kind oflike I left there kind of sad,
(04:49):
you know.
Like, I'm so tired of ourhealth insurance in this
country.
I'm tired the way in which wewe are patients, you know.
And she's a great doctor.
My doctor is an amazing doctor,and even I was just like
disappointed.
Andrea (05:06):
Well, yeah, I mean, they're they're they're bound by
the system that they're in,right?
Like they have like the billingis like we have to put this
code in for your visit.
You know what I mean?
Like that's why you have tohave another visit for something
else, or else they literallycan't get paid.
I mean, it's just it's such afucking mess.
Carmen Lezeth (05:22):
It's our health insurance situation is
problematic, which leads us intoour first topic of
conversation, which is that, youknow, the Democrats caved,
right?
They so we so we're not gonnaprobably have Obamacare after
this year.
I mean, what do you think?
What do you how do you feelabout what happened with the
shutdown?
Andrea (05:42):
Um, well, how do I feel about it?
I'm gonna try to be reallymeasured.
Um you don't have to be.
I think look, I think numberone, I will say not a lot of
good options were there, right?
Um however, if this is where wewere gonna end up, what was the
(06:07):
fucking point?
Exactly.
Carmen Lezeth (06:10):
I don't even need to be here.
You could just have the show onyour own.
That's what I was gonna say.
What was the point?
Andrea (06:15):
Yeah, and it's like I I know what the point was.
I understand that they had astrategy in terms of the timing
of it all, right?
Um the strategy fucking blows,and Chuck Schumer is a weak
dipshit ago, should have beengone years ago, but I agree.
I agree.
Uh but it it's just I don'tknow, you know what I mean?
(06:41):
Like, whatever we just did ashow last week where it was
like, this was a good week,okay.
You know what I mean?
And it's like you just knew, Iknew, you knew, like, we're
gonna come back next week, andsome fucked up shit is gonna
have happened.
At least four fucked up thingsare gonna have happened, and
it's gonna just be completelydeflating.
And you know, like I said, I wemay have ended up here anyway.
(07:04):
I don't really think thatRepublicans would have been
like, okay, okay, you got us,you know, but uh I don't know.
Uh it just seems like if thisis where you were gonna go, then
why did you know uh people endup with without two whole
paychecks?
Why did you know SNAP benefitsgo away, which I don't think
(07:27):
even have been restored yet?
Nope.
You know what I mean?
Like it's just you put peoplethrough all of this pain for
absolutely nothing and to lookso fucking weak that people want
your head on a platter now.
Carmen Lezeth (07:39):
Right.
Andrea (07:40):
Good job.
Carmen Lezeth (07:41):
Yeah, exactly.
And you know, this idea thatsomehow they're playing chess.
I'm like, can I just saypoliticians don't know how to
play chess?
I'm just gonna tell you rightnow, they don't.
I don't care who it is.
There's no chess game beingplayed here, you know.
Um, I feel the same way.
I feel really deflated.
I'm really sad because I thinkit's not just my insurance
policy, whatever, I don't care.
(08:01):
I'm just kind of like, ingeneral, the I don't want to say
this word because it sounds soold-fashioned even to me, but I
don't know what other wordencompasses it, but like
shenanigans between bothparties.
Like, like the fact that theRepublicans want to shut down
Obamacare and have nothing tomotherfucking replace it, and
(08:21):
have never had even concepts ofa plan for Obamacare or anything
to help people have insurancein this country, is just be like
the hatred of Barack Obama isso deep.
Someone wrote on Facebook waslike, you know what, just change
it to Trump care.
Obama's not gonna give a fuck.
Just change it to Trump careand he'll be happy and we can
(08:43):
all keep it and we can move on.
And I was like, you know what?
It's true.
Andrea (08:48):
It's not just the hatred of Obama, it's the hatred of
poor people.
They they want you to die.
I mean, it's not even like theydon't care, they actually
actively want you to die.
And I believe thatwholeheartedly.
Carmen Lezeth (09:02):
Okay, I don't believe that wholeheartedly, but
I can see where you're goingwith it.
But I think that makes me sadon the Republican side.
Like, what I don't understandwhy you guys are being so evil
to accept what you just said.
And then the other part of itis the Democrats, you know, I
don't know where along the linethey thought that it was going
(09:24):
to be easy.
Do you know what I mean?
Like, so why get into the fightto begin with?
And you know what's worse?
As people went out and voted indroves last week and said, we
want the fight, we believe inyou, we're gonna do this, we're
in it to win it, you know, andand they caved.
Andrea (09:42):
So that's why they waited.
They waited until after theelection.
Yay, and then and then, youknow, uh flights started getting
canceled.
Right.
And with money started to beaffected by it, and here we are.
Here we are.
And I'm not like I'm not afull-fledged conspiracy
(10:06):
theorist.
I'm really not.
I'm not.
Uh, but it does more than I am.
I am definitely not aconspiracy.
I mean, it's just like you hearall of the stuff like both
parties are the same, and Idon't believe that.
I really don't.
But you do have to wonder atthe upper echelons, it's like
what are you doing?
(10:27):
Who are you serving?
Because it's not us.
Carmen Lezeth (10:30):
It's not us.
Andrea (10:31):
And if this is the decision making, if this is the
strategy, even the way, youknow, I mean, it's it's been
talked about a lot, like whoactually ended up voting yes,
and right, you know, people whoare not going to be re-elected
in the next term, right?
Carmen Lezeth (10:44):
They're already right, or I I couldn't believe
Tim Kane.
I'm like, you're HillaryClinton's running mate.
What are you doing?
I couldn't believe that.
Andrea (10:54):
I couldn't believe that.
Well, I mean, yeah, he's uh Iwould not to excuse at all
because I don't, but likeVirginia is trackful of federal
workers, so he had like a youknow, an out, I guess, right?
To say, like, I all, you know,most of my state works for the
federal government and has justmissed two paychecks.
So he was but again, they allhave excuses.
(11:16):
I mean, that's kind of whatwe're saying.
Well I get into the fight then.
Why?
That's what I'm saying, is likethe they chose people to say
yes, to vote yes for specificreasons.
Right.
So people who are retiring, thepeople who weren't up for
election, people had who had aneasy way to say, well, this is
why, you know.
Carmen Lezeth (11:33):
Um well, but on the on the bright side of
things, we had to then make surethere was no more excuses for
the dumbass house speaker,what's his name?
Johnson.
Whatever, whatever.
Johnson not to um what how doyou say it?
Oh my god, I'm I'm so devoid ofcoffee right now because I had
(11:54):
this doctor's appointment.
unknown (11:56):
Like, I can't.
Carmen Lezeth (11:57):
The congresswoman was finally brought into
office, sworn into office afterall the bullshittery, and now
the floodgates of XD files andemails are are coming out, and I
guess that's the upside.
How are you feeling aboutthose?
Andrea (12:14):
You know, I've been thinking about because I've been
reading through them as onedoes.
Um like so uh what my my myinitial response is like I don't
fucking care.
Like we already knew all ofthis shit.
Well, we knew it.
Yeah, I wanted to you know it'sit's meaningful to the victims,
(12:40):
I believe, maybe.
Um it's uh illuminating interms of uh understanding what
the New York Times was sittingon for so long, and how many uh
the various people who felt likethey wanted and needed to
consult with, who at that pointwas already a convicted
(13:03):
pedophile, convicted in 2011,and a lot of these emails are
from like the you know 16, 17,when Trump was in office.
So that's all interesting, butI don't think it moves any
needles whatsoever.
Because I don't know, I thinkit's what's an easy to find out.
(13:24):
Like everyone is still in theirplaces that they were, right?
You've got the Trump cultistswho like they don't they don't
care.
It doesn't I don't know.
I think some of them arecaring.
Uh it doesn't seem like it, butand then the people who find
him useful who are probablyactually in the Epstein files
themselves, and so that mightmake a difference at some point
if we get them all, but and thenthe people who are sort of like
(13:47):
where we are, where it's like,yeah, fucking duh, you know,
does nobody remember the Grahamby the Pussy, you know, video
before he was elected?
Carmen Lezeth (13:54):
Like we don't know how I don't know how
Christians could get past that,but then again, Christians.
But here's something I thoughtwas interesting.
I saw where they said that BillClinton had never been to the
island.
Yeah, I thought that wasinteresting, um, because they
were saying all along that BillClinton had whatever.
And I'm like, I was alwayssaying to myself, if Bill
Clinton had actually done, theywould have already put that out.
(14:16):
They would have put that outday one.
Andrea (14:18):
Yeah, if Clinton was if they had any dirt on Clinton,
that would have been out like adecade a long time ago.
Carmen Lezeth (14:26):
Yeah, but I mean who knows?
Who knows?
Because they're going throughit and reading it and whatever.
But I this is just such a sadplace that our country's at.
It's so weird that this is whatwe're discussing, that we have
such a person in office thateven mingled in this stuff, that
even had an association withthis man, that even has pictures
(14:48):
at parties, and like before allthis, like everything about
Donald Trump is bad.
It's always been bad.
Just vile.
Vile.
Andrea (14:58):
On every level on every level.
It's it's um it's aneye-opening era for the
concentration.
Carmen Lezeth (15:06):
How did people get so sucked into him?
Seriously, if you could pleasespeak on behalf of all white
people.
How is it?
No, I'm being, you know what?
I'm only kidding.
But I'm saying, I really don'tunderstand if we just go back to
the basics of the beginning,not this election, but the
beginning.
He's creepy.
Well, he's weird.
Andrea (15:27):
He is okay.
So he he had that show, right?
Oh, you're right.
You know what?
I'm sorry, that gave him adifferent right, I forgot.
And you know, people love aperson who's on, people love a
celebrity.
Um, and then there's like thewhole pretty large faction,
apparently, of people who justabsolutely hated that there was
(15:51):
a black man in the White House,and he rang their bell
permission because he did thebirther thing.
Carmen Lezeth (15:58):
He was on that whole birther thing, and yeah,
um, yeah.
He was like all about BarackObama and he he was sending
people to Hawaii or something,all these investigators never
got that either.
Um, about yeah, and so he gavethem permission.
I forgot about the show, thereality show, which reality
shows are not actually realityshows, but it's like the idea
(16:21):
that people were believingeverything that was happening,
but I guess that was the point.
Even that they've like the factthat he was like a successful
businessman, he's never been asuccessful businessman.
That is not actually true, youknow.
Wait, wait, wait.
Actually, you know what?
Let me back up.
That's not true.
We gotta give Trump some creditbecause he has been an
incredible businessman in officenow because he's making so much
(16:47):
money off the griff of beingpresident of the United States.
Yeah, so if there's ever been atime in his life that he has
been brilliant as a businessman,it is right now.
Andrea (16:57):
Right.
Well, yeah, he's a he's successa successful grifter.
Carmen Lezeth (17:01):
But I mean him and his family.
And let's not let's not takehis daughter out of this,
whatever her name is, andbecause they're the ones who are
totally making tons of money.
Andrea (17:10):
Yeah, definitely.
So I mean What's the daughter'sname again?
I forgot.
Ivanka.
Carmen Lezeth (17:15):
Oh, yeah, right.
Ivanka.
Let's move on to something thatactually really broke my heart
this week and I sent it to you,and that was Jimmy Kimmel, his
friend Cleto died, who was alsothe band leader of his show.
And uh actually, today is JimmyKimmel's birthday, which so
weird.
Yeah, so weird.
Yeah, I sent you that video andI wanted to talk a little bit
(17:37):
more about friendships becausefor those of you who don't know,
on his monologue the day after,which I believe was on the
12th, if you haven't seen it, Ithink everyone should see this
monologue that he did.
It was like 22 minutes long,and it wasn't just that you end
up crying with him, you couldsee the love.
(17:57):
I mean, and he just, anyways,what did you think about it?
Because I know you're not ahuge Jimmy Kimmel watcher or fan
or whatever, but who thoughtwho thought we would be doing
like two episodes of JimmyKimmel in the show, you know?
Andrea (18:11):
Yeah, I mean, I don't I don't watch any of the late
night shows.
Um, and I didn't know who Clitowas.
I did I obviously didn't knowthat his father was also in the
band, which was so lovely.
Like that part of it, what youknow, when he talked about that,
like being able to help his dadget back to music and have them
(18:32):
be able to be together and andthat his mom was there and his
mom comes to the show every day,every every night, come to the
show.
I mean, it was just reallymoving.
And um it just, you know, likeI I think I saw some something
somewhere else and I after I hadwatched it, you know, and
someone said, This is whatmasculinity is, right?
(18:54):
Sort of bring it back to someof the stuff that floats around
out there, the masculinitycrisis, the male loneliness
crisis, and whatever.
Like you don't have to have acrisis if you're just a fucking
normal, caring person with goodfriends and happy relationships.
Carmen Lezeth (19:09):
I mean, you know, you're talking about Scott
Galloway, let's just be open andhonest about it on the podcast
pivot, right?
Andrea (19:17):
Like you said, the love, the great love, and the and and
what came through was just likethis enduring the power of
friendship, you know, and itjust made me think of all of my
friends.
I don't have really friendsthat I like grow up with, but
you know, I grew up as an adultwith you and you know, some of
(19:37):
my other friends, and howimpactful and joyful it is to
have those people in your lifeand how important it is, I
think, for your own sanity andand your own growth and all of
those things.
I mean, it was just a really,really lovely, lovely tribute.
Carmen Lezeth (19:56):
It was a lovely tribute.
And I, you know, for me, andI'm gonna I I don't want to
embarrass you, but I think thethe proof, not that people have
to prove their friendship, butwhen it happens, when you have a
moment and you step up or youdon't, really is kind of
telling.
And I think what was beautifulwas when Jimmy Kimmel said there
was no jealousy, no jealousywhatsoever.
(20:18):
Like he was because becauseClito was making it before he
was, right?
With the Paul Abdul thing andwhatever else.
And then all of a sudden JimmyKimmel got this show.
And because their friendshipwas so seamless, there was no
jealousy.
But Jimmy Kimmel was also like,this is my people.
I have to, he has to be theband leader.
I have to help his dad.
(20:39):
I have to make there wasn't aquestion in it, you know.
And I kind of was thinkingabout um my surgery.
And when you came and you,yeah, I mean, I I know we talk
about it in a funny way, but I Iwant to share this with people
because I think it's animportant thing to understand.
Like you, you we were laughingbecause your family was like,
Go, please go for two weeks, go,because you were like telling
(21:01):
them Carmen is sick, blah, blah,blah, whatever, and I'm gonna
go stay with her, whatever.
And they were being reallyfunny, like, please, mom, go.
But but you did come out hereand you stayed with me for two
weeks when I was having surgerybecause I don't have anybody out
here and I don't have a husbandor whatever, and thank you,
Jesus.
But you know what I'm saying.
And I think what wasinteresting is like I I don't
(21:27):
even remember asking you.
I remember telling you I'mgonna have this surgery, blah,
blah, blah, whatever.
And you were just like, okay,when is it?
I'm gonna be there, da-da-da,whatever.
What do you need?
Da-da-da-da.
And I I think that is far moreimportant for people to
understand that when you havefriendships like that, you need
to understand how blessed youare.
You have to understand that isreal wealth.
(21:49):
I have known people with somuch money who don't have
anybody that they could turn to.
So they would talk to theperson that they hired.
You know what I'm talkingabout.
Andrea (21:59):
I do.
That's what my greatobservation is there is nobody
around this person or thesepeople who they are not paying
to be there.
Yeah.
Carmen Lezeth (22:08):
And and Sue, if you have one friend, I I don't
care if it's on Zoom or whateverit is you do, like you should
be so thankful that you havepeople in your life that will
just talk to you because theywant to talk to you because and
they want to be there for you,you know?
Right.
But that that's kind of what Iwas thinking about.
And I also wanted to stressbecause I think it's really
important.
Um, if I go before you, I Iwould like this.
(22:31):
I want to see not just I wantthe the tears were real.
I want to, I just want to putthat out there.
Andrea (22:39):
Like No Dan, no Dan.
We talked about this.
I have to watch Field of Dreamsand ET and all that's gonna
suck if you do that then,though.
Carmen Lezeth (22:52):
I'm actually gonna say that you know what,
since you've never seen them,that will just piss me off that
you do it after I die.
I'm just saying that'll justpiss me off more.
Like now you do it.
But it was beautiful.
And I also want to talk aboutthe thing of family, because if
there's ever been evidence tome, and I know most people don't
believe this, I know, DNA don'tmean jack shit.
(23:14):
The tears he was the way he wasfeeling, that was his brother.
And I was like, oh my god, Idon't know.
I don't know how you feel aboutthat, but I'll just over the
whole thing.
Andrea (23:26):
You know, I mean, we both have people in our families
for various reasons that we donot talk to.
And um, you know, we havepeople who we do, but uh, you
know, you go out in the worldand you find your people.
And those people are yourfamily.
Carmen Lezeth (23:44):
And I I always say it this way, like, and
people get mad because theydon't have an answer.
But what if, God forbid, peoplein your family you found out
that through some accident orwhatever, through DNA, that they
had been switched at birth?
Does this mean like all of asudden you don't love your
daughter as much?
Right.
Or all of a sudden you don'tlove your father or whatever it
is.
Like those stories haveactually happened.
(24:04):
So I think more important thanDNA is the relationships and the
history and the way in whichyour relationship has evolved,
you know.
That's not to discount theblood thing.
It's just not how I grew up.
I I just don't have thatexperience.
Andrea (24:18):
So I mean, I'm you know, I have my blood family with me,
but like I I also have my bloodfamily not with me.
Carmen Lezeth (24:27):
But it's toxic, right?
Like that's what I'm talkingabout.
Like, if if someone is abusingyou verbally or abusing you
physically when you hear, and Iknow it's hard.
I know it's a hard thing towalk away.
I know it's hard to walk awayfrom family, whatever, but no
one should be treated badly justbecause you're blood related.
Like, that's not a good enoughexcuse, not to me.
It's not any excuse.
Andrea (24:48):
I mean, look, I'm I'm brutal about it, and I think you
are somewhat, maybe not quiteas much as me, but like when I'm
done, I'm done.
Like, I don't care who you are.
Like you're out, and we likeyou are literally dead to me.
You think you're worse than Iam with that?
Um, I mean, we might be equalbecause you, you know, you do
(25:10):
you do cut people out.
Carmen Lezeth (25:13):
Yeah.
But but I don't even think it'sabout cutting people.
Well, I mean, it is cuttingpeople out, but I think it's
also, I mean, I think the phraseI said when I finally was like,
I'm done.
I can't do this anymore, is Isaid, I I am just a better
person without all of you in mylife.
And I it you guys are wonderfulpeople, whatever, but you're
(25:33):
just not wonderful to me.
And I get it.
There's no way of fixing thatriff, you know.
And the thing is, is it's not amean thing.
It's just like at some pointyou make a decision that if
you're not being your best self,if you're not happy, if you're
not finding a way through it, ifpeople are living in guilt, I
can't fix that.
I can't, I can't fix that.
(25:54):
That has nothing to do with meand everything to do about you.
And so that's how I did it.
It's not really about evenlike, it's not about hate or
whatever.
It's like I need to be my bestself, and I'm not my best self
when the people who are quoteunquote DNA related to me are
supposedly in my life for allthe wrong reasons.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So it's a weird thing.
But Jimmy Kimmel, I I just Ijust love him.
(26:17):
But I want to get back to youdissing Scott Galloway because
that's what you were doing.
Um, please.
So do you do you okay?
So people who don't know, ScottGalloway is on a podcast called
Pivot.
It's with Karen Swisher.
Um it's pretty big time now,but I used to listen to them
back in the day, and um, I don'tlisten to him anymore, but he's
(26:40):
all over the place because he'sgot a book and he always talks
about masculinity and men.
And there are some things hesays that are good, I think.
But it always seems to go backto blaming women and not having
money.
I don't know.
It just seems like it alwaysgoes back to that.
Andrea (26:57):
Well, there you have it.
I mean, do you listen to him?
You don't I don't know.
I know who he is.
I used I think I don't know ifI followed him on Twitter way,
way back, but yeah, and thenstopped and I realized.
Yeah, like I used to follow himon Twitter, and then somewhere
along the lines, he's like, Ijust noticed a little bit of a
turn, right?
Where I was like, that seemsoff.
(27:18):
And then it started to get moreand more like that.
So I I stopped following himand I don't I've never listened
to his podcast, but um I think Ikind of get the gist more or
less of what he's saying, andand I just uh I mean, look,
money is important.
I know people, you know, um theability to make money is is
(27:40):
important.
Uh I think blaming that on, youknow.
Carmen Lezeth (27:46):
He tries not to, like he tries not to, but that's
actually what he's saying.
And um, I think one of thethings that he does really well
is that he lets men know thatit's okay to be men.
I don't even know what to say.
What does that mean?
Well, I mean, because I thinkhe is trying to say that we are
in a culture now that to be aman means to be something else.
(28:11):
But he's saying it's okay tocry, it's okay to do all these,
telling men it's okay to be allthese things, you're still a
man.
Um, but then he says thingslike, um, but the inability for
a man to graduate from collegeand not be able to get a job,
that is detrimental to theirlike manlyhood or something.
And it's like, bitch, it's hardfor all of us to get a job.
(28:33):
Like, I don't know.
Or he'll say things like, youknow, um, when a man can't have
a girlfriend or a woman or theycan't find the right spouse,
that somehow that's alsodiminishing men being men.
And I'm like, oh my God, it's aweird.
I know, I know you're about togo off on me.
I'm just giving you little kindof ideas of what he says, but
(28:54):
that's why he's getting somepushback.
Now, in the same respects, hehas gotten some pushback, and
he'll say things like, you know,I am gonna consider that
because I appreciate getting thefeedback and I didn't think
about it that way or whatever.
But that's also part of hisshtick, right?
I mean, it's and I give himcredit for it.
I give him credit for it.
I think that he's trying tohelp men, particularly white
(29:17):
men.
You know what I mean?
He's trying to help men findtheir footing in this new
landscape.
And I can appreciate that.
I know.
I know, I know, I know.
I'm just telling you what Ithink he's trying to do because
it's look at there is a problemwith white men.
There is a problem with that'sgonna be a clip somewhere.
(29:39):
White men are having a toughtime of it in the political
climate and the economicclimate, whatever.
I'm just saying they're havinga hard time, Andrea, dealing
with women, people of color.
I don't know, they're going tobecome the minority.
I don't know.
I'm just telling you, I'mtrying to speak.
(29:59):
For Scott Galloway, in the waythat he's coming across.
That's his whole point is totry to help men find themselves
or something.
Speaker 3 (30:10):
I'm sorry.
Andrea (30:11):
There's a lot going on there.
I don't even know where tostart.
I don't even know where tostart.
Um, white men are doing prettyokay for themselves, I think.
Carmen Lezeth (30:20):
Uh no, there's all these black people who are
taking their jobs and all theseminorities taking their jobs.
Andrea (30:28):
But like I mean, uh, I don't even, I'm tongue-tied.
It's so okay, but but wait,wait, wait.
Carmen Lezeth (30:36):
But before you go off, yeah, you do know that
there is something that haschanged over the years, like
regarding it's not as easybefore, right?
Before white men used to beable to just, they would put on
a tie and they could get a job.
Now they actually have tocompete with other people.
(30:56):
That's why it feels hard tothem because they have to
compete with other people ofcolor who are, if not as
qualified, but probably morequalified than they are.
And don't get me started withblack women.
Do you know what I mean?
Like, I am just speaking andtrying to defend Scott Galloway.
That's all I'm doing and hisreasoning.
Andrea (31:20):
Um, you don't believe that at all?
It's not that I don't believethat.
It's just like, oh, so sorry,baby.
Do you want a cookie and aglass of milk?
I mean, what the fuck?
Are they little infants?
Are they fucking toddlers thatneed to be coddled?
Like, I am sorry.
No, no, not getting marble manperson.
(31:44):
Like, yeah, this is what it is.
Carmen Lezeth (31:49):
Right.
But that is uncomfortable ordifficult for them to
understand.
And so they're walking throughthat maze.
Look at, I am just, I look it,I here's what I'll say.
From my perspective as a BlackLatina woman, um, I do see that
there's difficulties, especiallywith, I'll say with my
(32:10):
counterparts of white women whokeep thinking there is some need
to overdo it with theunderstanding of what's
happening, you know, with blackwomen or whatever, right?
There's kind of this like, nowwe've gone from hating black
women to now thinking blackwomen are on a pedestal.
You know what I mean?
And so there's that weird,like, just all we want is
(32:32):
equality.
We don't need to be, you know,revered so crazy.
Like, we don't need all that.
So there, I do think there's ashift because I remember growing
up, Andrea, and thinking thatwhite people were the beauty
standard.
They were, and that straighthair was the only way to go.
And you know what I mean?
(32:52):
Like, and oh, like people wouldsay to me, like, Carmen, you're
not really black.
You're not really black.
That was a compliment fromthem.
They thought that was acompliment, you know.
All I'm saying is there is ashift.
Whether you, I mean, we canmock Scott Galloway all we want.
There is something happening.
I know.
Go ahead.
Yeah, um, I mean, so muchtrouble for this recording.
Andrea (33:14):
There is a shift.
Um, there are a lot of shiftshappening right now for a lot of
people.
Uh, and most of those peopleare not in the enviable position
that white men are in.
And I understand they might behaving some fear.
(33:36):
Okay.
Um I guess I don't my my um uhmy feeling about it is like just
don't be a dick, right?
Like it's not that hard.
Be a good person, have someempathy, feel your feelings.
Carmen Lezeth (33:58):
I know, but are you not having empathy right now
for the look it if you hadgrown up your entire life?
Let's pretend you did not growup in California, you did not
grow up around people who aremexicano with immigrants, like
you have a very differentbackground than most people,
okay?
So let's pretend you grew up uhas a white man in Kentucky.
(34:19):
I'm just saying, okay, or Iowaor any of these other places.
Yeah, yeah.
And you were always seen assomebody who was manly and smart
and brilliant and whatever,regardless of whether it was
true or not.
Regardless.
I mean, you were just alwaysseen as look at I I actually
understand that.
I understand feeling like allof a sudden, now you're okay.
(34:43):
You know what?
I'll I'll I'll do it this way.
When I was at school at UVM, Iremember walking into my first
biology class and I walked intothis auditorium, and the entire
auditorium was all white.
There was, there was no otherperson of color in that room.
And I remember because I walkedin from the bottom, you know
(35:06):
what I mean?
Like I didn't come from thetop.
I had gotten lost, and I walkedin like the same way the
professor was.
And I remember looking up, andit was like everything else in
my life, right?
Like when I danced or whatever,or when I was in Color Guard
Jump Corps, it was always thesame thing.
So it wasn't as alarming, butit was it was there and it was
noticeable, and I'll neverforget it.
I don't think most white peoplehave ever walked into a room
(35:32):
full of just black people, justfull of people of color.
And if they have, they rememberit.
And it was scary, or I don'tknow if the right, that's not
the right word, scary, or it waswhatever it was.
It was an acknowledgement.
And that's why when you see afew people who are going to like
Howard, who are white or youknow, Asian or whatever, it's
(35:53):
kind of interesting to see theirpoint of view.
It's kind of beautiful becausethat's what we want as a world
where people are fine.
I'm just saying, if you havelived your entire life never
experiencing what it's like towalk into a room and you're
being the only one out, and nowall of a sudden, everything you
do every day is you have a blackpresident, you have, you know
(36:14):
what I mean?
Like all of a sudden that mustbe jarring.
I'm not saying you have to be adick about it.
I'm saying it must be jarringto have to now change what you
thought about yourself in theworld.
Andrea (36:28):
Be nice.
I acknowledge that there'sprobably a sense of loss.
Okay.
And that's about the best I cando.
My my my world view is not islike is is not that how do I
explain it?
Like there is enough.
(36:51):
There is enough for all of us,right?
Just because it was a blackpresident doesn't mean that's a
loss of power for anyone.
I don't know.
Carmen Lezeth (37:02):
Intellectually, you and I get it.
You you and I we we get that,but that doesn't take away from
some white man in Kentucky whofeels a certain way because he
doesn't understand that.
It doesn't, and it's changinghis masculinity.
I think the problem is reallythe definition of masculinity
has changed, you know.
(37:22):
Um, and I think more men needto understand that the reason
why, like I was talking to Billyabout this, like gay men, the
reason why women tend to connectwith gay men is because they
are in touch with all sides ofwho they are.
They're not confused.
You know what I mean?
It's not like this makes youmasculine, this makes you
(37:43):
feminine, and this makes youwhatever.
It like, and I'm not talkingfor all gay men, some gay men
suck.
Okay, you know what I mean?
Like, I'm just just likeanybody else, but I'm saying
that that overall idea is thereason why I I tend to really
have no problem hanging out withsomebody who's so in touch with
every single part of them.
Like that would be the perfectman if he was straight.
Andrea (38:06):
Like I was in touch with him.
I mean, I I um I clearly have areal problem with um coddling
people.
Like, okay, yeah, you've alwaysbeen like that though.
I know.
Oh no, yes, I'm not a coddler.
Like uh we all have things thatare hard for us, and most of
the rest of us, all of the restof us, have to get over it and
(38:28):
deal with it.
And guess what, bitch?
So do you?
Like that's that's the way Ifeel about it.
Carmen Lezeth (38:34):
Yeah, you've never been a coddler.
That's a good way to do it.
Yeah, you don't really, yeah,yeah.
Andrea (38:39):
I'm not I even like I like they're grown men.
Carmen Lezeth (38:43):
So that's what Scott Galloway is doing, I
guess.
That's that's the rub, is thecoddling and not the like I want
to say man up.
Like actually, like uh, but Ithink it's hard.
Look at I want to be assensitive as possible.
I don't know.
I know for me growing up, itwas really hard.
And it's still hard, but it'sless hard because now I
(39:06):
understand so much more abouthow things are not actually my
fault.
Andrea (39:10):
Yeah.
Carmen Lezeth (39:11):
Like what where I always felt like the problem
was me.
Like, and I can't explain topeople what it feels like to
think, oh, because I'm black orI'm Latina, I'm not good enough.
I don't know how to explainwhat it feels like to grow up
thinking like, well, there'snothing I can do about it, but
(39:31):
I'm because I'm black andLatina, so I'm never gonna be
enough.
Whether it's uh getting aloneor trying to get a job or
whatever it is, like just that'sinfused in your essence.
And I can only imagine thereverses happening for white
men.
That's all I'm trying to say.
Not that they don't thinkthey're good enough, because I
(39:52):
don't think we ever gonna getthere, but that they are having
a conflict with understandingthey are not the be-all end-all
in society right now.
And I don't think it's easy forpeople to accept people of
color.
Andrea (40:07):
They want to, but I don't think they really can do
it.
Yeah, I mean, I think thatthere is, I've said this for a
long time, like it's like thethe the last gasp of a dying
monster, right?
Like I think some of that iswhat what we are experiencing
now.
Um uh but I just I just can'texcuse it.
(40:29):
I just can't.
Did you think I was excusing?
Carmen Lezeth (40:32):
No, no, no, I'm not trying to excuse you are,
but like I'm just acknowledgingit.
Like, I just um I'm notexcusing it.
I think the I'm not a fan ofScott Galloway either, but I
like that he's at least no oneelse is mentioning the problem.
He may not be mentioning it inthe way in which I think might
be more helpful to them, um, buthe is talking about it.
(40:53):
And it's one of my frustrationsthat I've had with so many of
my friends um who are white, whowere not talking.
Like, I don't need you to talkto me about what's happening
with race relations or politics.
I need you to go talk to yourwhite friends.
It's kind of that same thing.
Like, the problem isn't overhere, the problem is you need to
explain that having a blackpresident actually was not that
(41:16):
big of a deal.
It's a long time coming.
And don't get me started withthe woman thing.
Like, you know, having a womanpresident that's a whole other
thing, but yeah.
I'm sorry.
Oh, do we have to notice thetime?
No, just kidding.
unknown (41:33):
I'm sorry.
Carmen Lezeth (41:34):
We're all over the place today.
All this to say Jimmy Kimmelwas amazing, and um I I think
that's what brought this up isyou said that's what a man is.
Andrea (41:43):
Well, yeah, so like somebody else said that that's
masculinity, right?
Like that's good, solidfriendship, family, love, joy,
bringing your people along withyou when you're successful.
Carmen Lezeth (41:55):
Yes, yes, which I'm sure, I'm sure people like
Elon Musk and Mark Zuckerbergand all the like, what's the
guy, Tim Basil's?
Tim Basil's?
I don't know what his name is.
Jeff.
Jeff, whatever, a billionairemotherfucker.
I'm sure he brings them alongtoo.
Andrea (42:11):
Like I'm sure they do.
And not your cronies, like, youknow.
Real friends, right?
If you have any.
If you don't, that's a problem.
Yeah.
Carmen Lezeth (42:21):
So everyone's homework is to uh figure out who
Scott, what's his name?
Galloway is.
Uh check out what's going onwith Jimmy Kimmel.
That's more important.
Go check out Jimmy Kimmel's uhbeautiful uh I don't know, it
was really well done.
Uh and it was uh, I think itwas November 12th's monologue.
(42:41):
And yeah, keep reading up onthe Epstein files.
I don't really think you needto keep reading up on them.
Andrea (42:48):
You don't need to keep reading on them.
Call your friends.
Carmen Lezeth (42:51):
Call your friends, especially your white
male friends.
Make sure they're okay.
I'm being more compassionate.
I'm just saying.
She's not a coddler.
That is the truth, though.
All right, everyone.
Thank you so much.
And uh remember, at the end ofthe day, it really is all about
the joy.
We'll see you next week.
(43:12):
Bye.
That was a weird episode.
Thanks for stopping by.
All about the joy.
Be better and stay beautiful,folks.
Have a sweet day.
Hey everyone, welcome to All About the Joy.
This is Culture and Consequencewith Carmen and Andrea.
Hey, what's up, Andrea?
How are you doing?
I'm good.
I'm good.
How are you?
Because normally in ourconversations, I would say what
I anyway, it doesn't matter.
Okay.
Let's start that over.
I had a uh a doctor'sappointment this morning, and I
(00:26):
love this doctor, I really do.
Um, but they're all pushingthose weight loss things.
Oh, the uh the GLP ones orwhatever, you know, and they're
pushing it?
I don't know, she's pushing it,but I like so I was like, you
know what?
I'm just I'm so stressed outbecause I really want to get
(00:48):
back to that place of running orwhatever, you know, because you
have that little kind ofconversation, but you can't talk
to them about anything otherthan what the visit is for,
because then you have to it'ssuch aren't like I want to go
back to the day where you can goto the doctors.
Like I remember Dr.
Umger, who is my favoritedoctor, he's since retired.
But I would go get my GYN fromhim.
(01:08):
I would, you know, and it wouldbe one visit, and he would
you'd go in early, you'd getyour blood work from somebody
else in the office.
He would have you sit in hisactual office, not in the room,
but in his office, and he wouldbe like, So what's going on?
Okay, let's go do the exam.
Like, and that feels like itwas so long ago.
Andrea (01:30):
It's so different from, I mean, I don't think I've ever
had that exactly, but I have haddoctors that spend a little
more time with you.
But yeah, if there's, you know,a lot of times what I do
throughout the year I've starteddoing is like I keep a list of
all of my, you know, what, youknow, my shoulder's doing this
and waking up at this time everynight.
You know, I have all of mythings, right?
(01:50):
Like my ear hurts sometimes,you know.
Um, and so I go in with my listand they're like, oh, well,
that's you'd have to seesomebody else for that, and we'd
have to schedule anotherappointment for this.
Carmen Lezeth (02:02):
It's like, yeah, yeah, because they they won't
talk to you about like all Isaid to her was I was having
issues sleeping.
And I mean, not that I meantfor this to be the conversation,
but it's gonna be theconversation that'll and you had
mentioned something that you'vebeen doing, and so I was like,
oh, maybe I can try that.
And that's like, you know what?
Let's set up a different com uha different appointment for
(02:24):
that.
And I'm like, you know, soyeah, so I I had mentioned, I'm
like, I can't sleep, and when Ican't sleep very well, and it's
really changed a lot.
I've always been a lightsleeper, but this is a little
bit beyond.
Um, and so when I don't sleepwell, I can't, I don't eat well
because then I don't work outwell, you know what I mean?
(02:44):
And I'm in that weird cycle,yeah, you know, um, and then I'm
so tired by the end of thewhatever, let's say the week of
not sleeping, that then I sleepreally well.
I wake up the next morning, I'mlike, yes, and then it just
deteriorates.
So, but it was so she was justlike, Well, you know, there's a
lot of um uh weight loss drugsnow available.
(03:05):
And I'm like, I'm I'm nottaking, I'm not gonna take
weight loss.
Like, that's not the firstanswer I want to hear.
Well, and how's that like howis it related?
I don't know.
Well, because I because I amshe's trying to say without
saying because we can't have theconversation.
Right.
You know what I mean?
Like I'm 25, I've alreadyadmitted this, so I don't care.
I'm like 25, 30 poundsoverweight.
(03:26):
Um, and so I need to lose thatweight.
And that's fair.
I mean, I feel like I've beenin that struggle with the
thyroid medication, and I'vejust been, and I'm I'm I'm still
not settled.
And after the surgery, I swearto God, they everyone keeps
telling me that that surgery didnot mess up my thyroid, but I
didn't have a problem with mythyroid before then.
Andrea (03:48):
Yeah, you have no, they don't know that.
Carmen Lezeth (03:50):
Nobody has nobody knows that.
None of them will they're like,no, no, those are two separate
things.
I'm like, nobody invaded mybody before.
Like Dr.
Andrea (04:01):
Gardeck with metal in your body now, right?
Like, I'm sorry, you have metalin your body now, like
something's different.
Carmen Lezeth (04:08):
I don't know.
I mean, again, I'm not trying,but I'm just saying all of this
went like my hip is great, buteverything else feels like
whatever.
Anyway, so I'm just so I saidto her, said I don't wanna, I
don't wanna take any medicationbecause I have a sleep problem.
Like I'm not trying to be me.
unknown (04:27):
Right.
Carmen Lezeth (04:28):
And I honestly, and again, I'm not against it.
I don't know if you saw theshow.
We Cynthia talked about itbecause she's been on it, and
I'm I'm all for people doing it,but I don't think that should
be my first.
I don't think I I don't thinkbeing 25 pounds overweight is
the reason why I'm not sleeping.
I think it's something else.
And anyways, I just was kind oflike I left there kind of sad,
(04:49):
you know.
Like, I'm so tired of ourhealth insurance in this
country.
I'm tired the way in which wewe are patients, you know.
And she's a great doctor.
My doctor is an amazing doctor,and even I was just like
disappointed.
Andrea (05:06):
Well, yeah, I mean, they're they're they're bound by
the system that they're in,right?
Like they have like the billingis like we have to put this
code in for your visit.
You know what I mean?
Like that's why you have tohave another visit for something
else, or else they literallycan't get paid.
I mean, it's just it's such afucking mess.
Carmen Lezeth (05:22):
It's our health insurance situation is
problematic, which leads us intoour first topic of
conversation, which is that, youknow, the Democrats caved,
right?
They so we so we're not gonnaprobably have Obamacare after
this year.
I mean, what do you think?
What do you how do you feelabout what happened with the
shutdown?
Andrea (05:42):
Um, well, how do I feel about it?
I'm gonna try to be reallymeasured.
Um you don't have to be.
I think look, I think numberone, I will say not a lot of
good options were there, right?
Um however, if this is where wewere gonna end up, what was the
(06:07):
fucking point?
Exactly.
Carmen Lezeth (06:10):
I don't even need to be here.
You could just have the show onyour own.
That's what I was gonna say.
What was the point?
Andrea (06:15):
Yeah, and it's like I I know what the point was.
I understand that they had astrategy in terms of the timing
of it all, right?
Um the strategy fucking blows,and Chuck Schumer is a weak
dipshit ago, should have beengone years ago, but I agree.
I agree.
Uh but it it's just I don'tknow, you know what I mean?
(06:41):
Like, whatever we just did ashow last week where it was
like, this was a good week,okay.
You know what I mean?
And it's like you just knew, Iknew, you knew, like, we're
gonna come back next week, andsome fucked up shit is gonna
have happened.
At least four fucked up thingsare gonna have happened, and
it's gonna just be completelydeflating.
And you know, like I said, I wemay have ended up here anyway.
(07:04):
I don't really think thatRepublicans would have been
like, okay, okay, you got us,you know, but uh I don't know.
Uh it just seems like if thisis where you were gonna go, then
why did you know uh people endup with without two whole
paychecks?
Why did you know SNAP benefitsgo away, which I don't think
(07:27):
even have been restored yet?
Nope.
You know what I mean?
Like it's just you put peoplethrough all of this pain for
absolutely nothing and to lookso fucking weak that people want
your head on a platter now.
Carmen Lezeth (07:39):
Right.
Andrea (07:40):
Good job.
Carmen Lezeth (07:41):
Yeah, exactly.
And you know, this idea thatsomehow they're playing chess.
I'm like, can I just saypoliticians don't know how to
play chess?
I'm just gonna tell you rightnow, they don't.
I don't care who it is.
There's no chess game beingplayed here, you know.
Um, I feel the same way.
I feel really deflated.
I'm really sad because I thinkit's not just my insurance
policy, whatever, I don't care.
(08:01):
I'm just kind of like, ingeneral, the I don't want to say
this word because it sounds soold-fashioned even to me, but I
don't know what other wordencompasses it, but like
shenanigans between bothparties.
Like, like the fact that theRepublicans want to shut down
Obamacare and have nothing tomotherfucking replace it, and
(08:21):
have never had even concepts ofa plan for Obamacare or anything
to help people have insurancein this country, is just be like
the hatred of Barack Obama isso deep.
Someone wrote on Facebook waslike, you know what, just change
it to Trump care.
Obama's not gonna give a fuck.
Just change it to Trump careand he'll be happy and we can
(08:43):
all keep it and we can move on.
And I was like, you know what?
It's true.
Andrea (08:48):
It's not just the hatred of Obama, it's the hatred of
poor people.
They they want you to die.
I mean, it's not even like theydon't care, they actually
actively want you to die.
And I believe thatwholeheartedly.
Carmen Lezeth (09:02):
Okay, I don't believe that wholeheartedly, but
I can see where you're goingwith it.
But I think that makes me sadon the Republican side.
Like, what I don't understandwhy you guys are being so evil
to accept what you just said.
And then the other part of itis the Democrats, you know, I
don't know where along the linethey thought that it was going
(09:24):
to be easy.
Do you know what I mean?
Like, so why get into the fightto begin with?
And you know what's worse?
As people went out and voted indroves last week and said, we
want the fight, we believe inyou, we're gonna do this, we're
in it to win it, you know, andand they caved.
Andrea (09:42):
So that's why they waited.
They waited until after theelection.
Yay, and then and then, youknow, uh flights started getting
canceled.
Right.
And with money started to beaffected by it, and here we are.
Here we are.
And I'm not like I'm not afull-fledged conspiracy
(10:06):
theorist.
I'm really not.
I'm not.
Uh, but it does more than I am.
I am definitely not aconspiracy.
I mean, it's just like you hearall of the stuff like both
parties are the same, and Idon't believe that.
I really don't.
But you do have to wonder atthe upper echelons, it's like
what are you doing?
(10:27):
Who are you serving?
Because it's not us.
Carmen Lezeth (10:30):
It's not us.
Andrea (10:31):
And if this is the decision making, if this is the
strategy, even the way, youknow, I mean, it's it's been
talked about a lot, like whoactually ended up voting yes,
and right, you know, people whoare not going to be re-elected
in the next term, right?
Carmen Lezeth (10:44):
They're already right, or I I couldn't believe
Tim Kane.
I'm like, you're HillaryClinton's running mate.
What are you doing?
I couldn't believe that.
Andrea (10:54):
I couldn't believe that.
Well, I mean, yeah, he's uh Iwould not to excuse at all
because I don't, but likeVirginia is trackful of federal
workers, so he had like a youknow, an out, I guess, right?
To say, like, I all, you know,most of my state works for the
federal government and has justmissed two paychecks.
So he was but again, they allhave excuses.
(11:16):
I mean, that's kind of whatwe're saying.
Well I get into the fight then.
Why?
That's what I'm saying, is likethe they chose people to say
yes, to vote yes for specificreasons.
Right.
So people who are retiring, thepeople who weren't up for
election, people had who had aneasy way to say, well, this is
why, you know.
Carmen Lezeth (11:33):
Um well, but on the on the bright side of
things, we had to then make surethere was no more excuses for
the dumbass house speaker,what's his name?
Johnson.
Whatever, whatever.
Johnson not to um what how doyou say it?
Oh my god, I'm I'm so devoid ofcoffee right now because I had
(11:54):
this doctor's appointment.
unknown (11:56):
Like, I can't.
Carmen Lezeth (11:57):
The congresswoman was finally brought into
office, sworn into office afterall the bullshittery, and now
the floodgates of XD files andemails are are coming out, and I
guess that's the upside.
How are you feeling aboutthose?
Andrea (12:14):
You know, I've been thinking about because I've been
reading through them as onedoes.
Um like so uh what my my myinitial response is like I don't
fucking care.
Like we already knew all ofthis shit.
Well, we knew it.
Yeah, I wanted to you know it'sit's meaningful to the victims,
(12:40):
I believe, maybe.
Um it's uh illuminating interms of uh understanding what
the New York Times was sittingon for so long, and how many uh
the various people who felt likethey wanted and needed to
consult with, who at that pointwas already a convicted
(13:03):
pedophile, convicted in 2011,and a lot of these emails are
from like the you know 16, 17,when Trump was in office.
So that's all interesting, butI don't think it moves any
needles whatsoever.
Because I don't know, I thinkit's what's an easy to find out.
(13:24):
Like everyone is still in theirplaces that they were, right?
You've got the Trump cultistswho like they don't they don't
care.
It doesn't I don't know.
I think some of them arecaring.
Uh it doesn't seem like it, butand then the people who find
him useful who are probablyactually in the Epstein files
themselves, and so that mightmake a difference at some point
if we get them all, but and thenthe people who are sort of like
(13:47):
where we are, where it's like,yeah, fucking duh, you know,
does nobody remember the Grahamby the Pussy, you know, video
before he was elected?
Carmen Lezeth (13:54):
Like we don't know how I don't know how
Christians could get past that,but then again, Christians.
But here's something I thoughtwas interesting.
I saw where they said that BillClinton had never been to the
island.
Yeah, I thought that wasinteresting, um, because they
were saying all along that BillClinton had whatever.
And I'm like, I was alwayssaying to myself, if Bill
Clinton had actually done, theywould have already put that out.
(14:16):
They would have put that outday one.
Andrea (14:18):
Yeah, if Clinton was if they had any dirt on Clinton,
that would have been out like adecade a long time ago.
Carmen Lezeth (14:26):
Yeah, but I mean who knows?
Who knows?
Because they're going throughit and reading it and whatever.
But I this is just such a sadplace that our country's at.
It's so weird that this is whatwe're discussing, that we have
such a person in office thateven mingled in this stuff, that
even had an association withthis man, that even has pictures
(14:48):
at parties, and like before allthis, like everything about
Donald Trump is bad.
It's always been bad.
Just vile.
Vile.
Andrea (14:58):
On every level on every level.
It's it's um it's aneye-opening era for the
concentration.
Carmen Lezeth (15:06):
How did people get so sucked into him?
Seriously, if you could pleasespeak on behalf of all white
people.
How is it?
No, I'm being, you know what?
I'm only kidding.
But I'm saying, I really don'tunderstand if we just go back to
the basics of the beginning,not this election, but the
beginning.
He's creepy.
Well, he's weird.
Andrea (15:27):
He is okay.
So he he had that show, right?
Oh, you're right.
You know what?
I'm sorry, that gave him adifferent right, I forgot.
And you know, people love aperson who's on, people love a
celebrity.
Um, and then there's like thewhole pretty large faction,
apparently, of people who justabsolutely hated that there was
(15:51):
a black man in the White House,and he rang their bell
permission because he did thebirther thing.
Carmen Lezeth (15:58):
He was on that whole birther thing, and yeah,
um, yeah.
He was like all about BarackObama and he he was sending
people to Hawaii or something,all these investigators never
got that either.
Um, about yeah, and so he gavethem permission.
I forgot about the show, thereality show, which reality
shows are not actually realityshows, but it's like the idea
(16:21):
that people were believingeverything that was happening,
but I guess that was the point.
Even that they've like the factthat he was like a successful
businessman, he's never been asuccessful businessman.
That is not actually true, youknow.
Wait, wait, wait.
Actually, you know what?
Let me back up.
That's not true.
We gotta give Trump some creditbecause he has been an
incredible businessman in officenow because he's making so much
(16:47):
money off the griff of beingpresident of the United States.
Yeah, so if there's ever been atime in his life that he has
been brilliant as a businessman,it is right now.
Andrea (16:57):
Right.
Well, yeah, he's a he's successa successful grifter.
Carmen Lezeth (17:01):
But I mean him and his family.
And let's not let's not takehis daughter out of this,
whatever her name is, andbecause they're the ones who are
totally making tons of money.
Andrea (17:10):
Yeah, definitely.
So I mean What's the daughter'sname again?
I forgot.
Ivanka.
Carmen Lezeth (17:15):
Oh, yeah, right.
Ivanka.
Let's move on to something thatactually really broke my heart
this week and I sent it to you,and that was Jimmy Kimmel, his
friend Cleto died, who was alsothe band leader of his show.
And uh actually, today is JimmyKimmel's birthday, which so
weird.
Yeah, so weird.
Yeah, I sent you that video andI wanted to talk a little bit
(17:37):
more about friendships becausefor those of you who don't know,
on his monologue the day after,which I believe was on the
12th, if you haven't seen it, Ithink everyone should see this
monologue that he did.
It was like 22 minutes long,and it wasn't just that you end
up crying with him, you couldsee the love.
(17:57):
I mean, and he just, anyways,what did you think about it?
Because I know you're not ahuge Jimmy Kimmel watcher or fan
or whatever, but who thoughtwho thought we would be doing
like two episodes of JimmyKimmel in the show, you know?
Andrea (18:11):
Yeah, I mean, I don't I don't watch any of the late
night shows.
Um, and I didn't know who Clitowas.
I did I obviously didn't knowthat his father was also in the
band, which was so lovely.
Like that part of it, what youknow, when he talked about that,
like being able to help his dadget back to music and have them
(18:32):
be able to be together and andthat his mom was there and his
mom comes to the show every day,every every night, come to the
show.
I mean, it was just reallymoving.
And um it just, you know, likeI I think I saw some something
somewhere else and I after I hadwatched it, you know, and
someone said, This is whatmasculinity is, right?
(18:54):
Sort of bring it back to someof the stuff that floats around
out there, the masculinitycrisis, the male loneliness
crisis, and whatever.
Like you don't have to have acrisis if you're just a fucking
normal, caring person with goodfriends and happy relationships.
Carmen Lezeth (19:09):
I mean, you know, you're talking about Scott
Galloway, let's just be open andhonest about it on the podcast
pivot, right?
Andrea (19:17):
Like you said, the love, the great love, and the and and
what came through was just likethis enduring the power of
friendship, you know, and itjust made me think of all of my
friends.
I don't have really friendsthat I like grow up with, but
you know, I grew up as an adultwith you and you know, some of
(19:37):
my other friends, and howimpactful and joyful it is to
have those people in your lifeand how important it is, I
think, for your own sanity andand your own growth and all of
those things.
I mean, it was just a really,really lovely, lovely tribute.
Carmen Lezeth (19:56):
It was a lovely tribute.
And I, you know, for me, andI'm gonna I I don't want to
embarrass you, but I think thethe proof, not that people have
to prove their friendship, butwhen it happens, when you have a
moment and you step up or youdon't, really is kind of
telling.
And I think what was beautifulwas when Jimmy Kimmel said there
was no jealousy, no jealousywhatsoever.
(20:18):
Like he was because becauseClito was making it before he
was, right?
With the Paul Abdul thing andwhatever else.
And then all of a sudden JimmyKimmel got this show.
And because their friendshipwas so seamless, there was no
jealousy.
But Jimmy Kimmel was also like,this is my people.
I have to, he has to be theband leader.
I have to help his dad.
(20:39):
I have to make there wasn't aquestion in it, you know.
And I kind of was thinkingabout um my surgery.
And when you came and you,yeah, I mean, I I know we talk
about it in a funny way, but I Iwant to share this with people
because I think it's animportant thing to understand.
Like you, you we were laughingbecause your family was like,
Go, please go for two weeks, go,because you were like telling
(21:01):
them Carmen is sick, blah, blah,blah, whatever, and I'm gonna
go stay with her, whatever.
And they were being reallyfunny, like, please, mom, go.
But but you did come out hereand you stayed with me for two
weeks when I was having surgerybecause I don't have anybody out
here and I don't have a husbandor whatever, and thank you,
Jesus.
But you know what I'm saying.
And I think what wasinteresting is like I I don't
(21:27):
even remember asking you.
I remember telling you I'mgonna have this surgery, blah,
blah, blah, whatever.
And you were just like, okay,when is it?
I'm gonna be there, da-da-da,whatever.
What do you need?
Da-da-da-da.
And I I think that is far moreimportant for people to
understand that when you havefriendships like that, you need
to understand how blessed youare.
You have to understand that isreal wealth.
(21:49):
I have known people with somuch money who don't have
anybody that they could turn to.
So they would talk to theperson that they hired.
You know what I'm talkingabout.
Andrea (21:59):
I do.
That's what my greatobservation is there is nobody
around this person or thesepeople who they are not paying
to be there.
Yeah.
Carmen Lezeth (22:08):
And and Sue, if you have one friend, I I don't
care if it's on Zoom or whateverit is you do, like you should
be so thankful that you havepeople in your life that will
just talk to you because theywant to talk to you because and
they want to be there for you,you know?
Right.
But that that's kind of what Iwas thinking about.
And I also wanted to stressbecause I think it's really
important.
Um, if I go before you, I Iwould like this.
(22:31):
I want to see not just I wantthe the tears were real.
I want to, I just want to putthat out there.
Andrea (22:39):
Like No Dan, no Dan.
We talked about this.
I have to watch Field of Dreamsand ET and all that's gonna
suck if you do that then,though.
Carmen Lezeth (22:52):
I'm actually gonna say that you know what,
since you've never seen them,that will just piss me off that
you do it after I die.
I'm just saying that'll justpiss me off more.
Like now you do it.
But it was beautiful.
And I also want to talk aboutthe thing of family, because if
there's ever been evidence tome, and I know most people don't
believe this, I know, DNA don'tmean jack shit.
(23:14):
The tears he was the way he wasfeeling, that was his brother.
And I was like, oh my god, Idon't know.
I don't know how you feel aboutthat, but I'll just over the
whole thing.
Andrea (23:26):
You know, I mean, we both have people in our families
for various reasons that we donot talk to.
And um, you know, we havepeople who we do, but uh, you
know, you go out in the worldand you find your people.
And those people are yourfamily.
Carmen Lezeth (23:44):
And I I always say it this way, like, and
people get mad because theydon't have an answer.
But what if, God forbid, peoplein your family you found out
that through some accident orwhatever, through DNA, that they
had been switched at birth?
Does this mean like all of asudden you don't love your
daughter as much?
Right.
Or all of a sudden you don'tlove your father or whatever it
is.
Like those stories haveactually happened.
(24:04):
So I think more important thanDNA is the relationships and the
history and the way in whichyour relationship has evolved,
you know.
That's not to discount theblood thing.
It's just not how I grew up.
I I just don't have thatexperience.
Andrea (24:18):
So I mean, I'm you know, I have my blood family with me,
but like I I also have my bloodfamily not with me.
Carmen Lezeth (24:27):
But it's toxic, right?
Like that's what I'm talkingabout.
Like, if if someone is abusingyou verbally or abusing you
physically when you hear, and Iknow it's hard.
I know it's a hard thing towalk away.
I know it's hard to walk awayfrom family, whatever, but no
one should be treated badly justbecause you're blood related.
Like, that's not a good enoughexcuse, not to me.
It's not any excuse.
Andrea (24:48):
I mean, look, I'm I'm brutal about it, and I think you
are somewhat, maybe not quiteas much as me, but like when I'm
done, I'm done.
Like, I don't care who you are.
Like you're out, and we likeyou are literally dead to me.
You think you're worse than Iam with that?
Um, I mean, we might be equalbecause you, you know, you do
(25:10):
you do cut people out.
Carmen Lezeth (25:13):
Yeah.
But but I don't even think it'sabout cutting people.
Well, I mean, it is cuttingpeople out, but I think it's
also, I mean, I think the phraseI said when I finally was like,
I'm done.
I can't do this anymore, is Isaid, I I am just a better
person without all of you in mylife.
And I it you guys are wonderfulpeople, whatever, but you're
(25:33):
just not wonderful to me.
And I get it.
There's no way of fixing thatriff, you know.
And the thing is, is it's not amean thing.
It's just like at some pointyou make a decision that if
you're not being your best self,if you're not happy, if you're
not finding a way through it, ifpeople are living in guilt, I
can't fix that.
I can't, I can't fix that.
(25:54):
That has nothing to do with meand everything to do about you.
And so that's how I did it.
It's not really about evenlike, it's not about hate or
whatever.
It's like I need to be my bestself, and I'm not my best self
when the people who are quoteunquote DNA related to me are
supposedly in my life for allthe wrong reasons.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So it's a weird thing.
But Jimmy Kimmel, I I just Ijust love him.
(26:17):
But I want to get back to youdissing Scott Galloway because
that's what you were doing.
Um, please.
So do you do you okay?
So people who don't know, ScottGalloway is on a podcast called
Pivot.
It's with Karen Swisher.
Um it's pretty big time now,but I used to listen to them
back in the day, and um, I don'tlisten to him anymore, but he's
(26:40):
all over the place because he'sgot a book and he always talks
about masculinity and men.
And there are some things hesays that are good, I think.
But it always seems to go backto blaming women and not having
money.
I don't know.
It just seems like it alwaysgoes back to that.
Andrea (26:57):
Well, there you have it.
I mean, do you listen to him?
You don't I don't know.
I know who he is.
I used I think I don't know ifI followed him on Twitter way,
way back, but yeah, and thenstopped and I realized.
Yeah, like I used to follow himon Twitter, and then somewhere
along the lines, he's like, Ijust noticed a little bit of a
turn, right?
Where I was like, that seemsoff.
(27:18):
And then it started to get moreand more like that.
So I I stopped following himand I don't I've never listened
to his podcast, but um I think Ikind of get the gist more or
less of what he's saying, andand I just uh I mean, look,
money is important.
I know people, you know, um theability to make money is is
(27:40):
important.
Uh I think blaming that on, youknow.
Carmen Lezeth (27:46):
He tries not to, like he tries not to, but that's
actually what he's saying.
And um, I think one of thethings that he does really well
is that he lets men know thatit's okay to be men.
I don't even know what to say.
What does that mean?
Well, I mean, because I thinkhe is trying to say that we are
in a culture now that to be aman means to be something else.
(28:11):
But he's saying it's okay tocry, it's okay to do all these,
telling men it's okay to be allthese things, you're still a
man.
Um, but then he says thingslike, um, but the inability for
a man to graduate from collegeand not be able to get a job,
that is detrimental to theirlike manlyhood or something.
And it's like, bitch, it's hardfor all of us to get a job.
(28:33):
Like, I don't know.
Or he'll say things like, youknow, um, when a man can't have
a girlfriend or a woman or theycan't find the right spouse,
that somehow that's alsodiminishing men being men.
And I'm like, oh my God, it's aweird.
I know, I know you're about togo off on me.
I'm just giving you little kindof ideas of what he says, but
(28:54):
that's why he's getting somepushback.
Now, in the same respects, hehas gotten some pushback, and
he'll say things like, you know,I am gonna consider that
because I appreciate getting thefeedback and I didn't think
about it that way or whatever.
But that's also part of hisshtick, right?
I mean, it's and I give himcredit for it.
I give him credit for it.
I think that he's trying tohelp men, particularly white
(29:17):
men.
You know what I mean?
He's trying to help men findtheir footing in this new
landscape.
And I can appreciate that.
I know.
I know, I know, I know.
I'm just telling you what Ithink he's trying to do because
it's look at there is a problemwith white men.
There is a problem with that'sgonna be a clip somewhere.
(29:39):
White men are having a toughtime of it in the political
climate and the economicclimate, whatever.
I'm just saying they're havinga hard time, Andrea, dealing
with women, people of color.
I don't know, they're going tobecome the minority.
I don't know.
I'm just telling you, I'mtrying to speak.
(29:59):
For Scott Galloway, in the waythat he's coming across.
That's his whole point is totry to help men find themselves
or something.
Speaker 3 (30:10):
I'm sorry.
Andrea (30:11):
There's a lot going on there.
I don't even know where tostart.
I don't even know where tostart.
Um, white men are doing prettyokay for themselves, I think.
Carmen Lezeth (30:20):
Uh no, there's all these black people who are
taking their jobs and all theseminorities taking their jobs.
Andrea (30:28):
But like I mean, uh, I don't even, I'm tongue-tied.
It's so okay, but but wait,wait, wait.
Carmen Lezeth (30:36):
But before you go off, yeah, you do know that
there is something that haschanged over the years, like
regarding it's not as easybefore, right?
Before white men used to beable to just, they would put on
a tie and they could get a job.
Now they actually have tocompete with other people.
(30:56):
That's why it feels hard tothem because they have to
compete with other people ofcolor who are, if not as
qualified, but probably morequalified than they are.
And don't get me started withblack women.
Do you know what I mean?
Like, I am just speaking andtrying to defend Scott Galloway.
That's all I'm doing and hisreasoning.
Andrea (31:20):
Um, you don't believe that at all?
It's not that I don't believethat.
It's just like, oh, so sorry,baby.
Do you want a cookie and aglass of milk?
I mean, what the fuck?
Are they little infants?
Are they fucking toddlers thatneed to be coddled?
Like, I am sorry.
No, no, not getting marble manperson.
(31:44):
Like, yeah, this is what it is.
Carmen Lezeth (31:49):
Right.
But that is uncomfortable ordifficult for them to
understand.
And so they're walking throughthat maze.
Look at, I am just, I look it,I here's what I'll say.
From my perspective as a BlackLatina woman, um, I do see that
there's difficulties, especiallywith, I'll say with my
(32:10):
counterparts of white women whokeep thinking there is some need
to overdo it with theunderstanding of what's
happening, you know, with blackwomen or whatever, right?
There's kind of this like, nowwe've gone from hating black
women to now thinking blackwomen are on a pedestal.
You know what I mean?
And so there's that weird,like, just all we want is
(32:32):
equality.
We don't need to be, you know,revered so crazy.
Like, we don't need all that.
So there, I do think there's ashift because I remember growing
up, Andrea, and thinking thatwhite people were the beauty
standard.
They were, and that straighthair was the only way to go.
And you know what I mean?
(32:52):
Like, and oh, like people wouldsay to me, like, Carmen, you're
not really black.
You're not really black.
That was a compliment fromthem.
They thought that was acompliment, you know.
All I'm saying is there is ashift.
Whether you, I mean, we canmock Scott Galloway all we want.
There is something happening.
I know.
Go ahead.
Yeah, um, I mean, so muchtrouble for this recording.
Andrea (33:14):
There is a shift.
Um, there are a lot of shiftshappening right now for a lot of
people.
Uh, and most of those peopleare not in the enviable position
that white men are in.
And I understand they might behaving some fear.
(33:36):
Okay.
Um I guess I don't my my um uhmy feeling about it is like just
don't be a dick, right?
Like it's not that hard.
Be a good person, have someempathy, feel your feelings.
Carmen Lezeth (33:58):
I know, but are you not having empathy right now
for the look it if you hadgrown up your entire life?
Let's pretend you did not growup in California, you did not
grow up around people who aremexicano with immigrants, like
you have a very differentbackground than most people,
okay?
So let's pretend you grew up uhas a white man in Kentucky.
(34:19):
I'm just saying, okay, or Iowaor any of these other places.
Yeah, yeah.
And you were always seen assomebody who was manly and smart
and brilliant and whatever,regardless of whether it was
true or not.
Regardless.
I mean, you were just alwaysseen as look at I I actually
understand that.
I understand feeling like allof a sudden, now you're okay.
(34:43):
You know what?
I'll I'll I'll do it this way.
When I was at school at UVM, Iremember walking into my first
biology class and I walked intothis auditorium, and the entire
auditorium was all white.
There was, there was no otherperson of color in that room.
And I remember because I walkedin from the bottom, you know
(35:06):
what I mean?
Like I didn't come from thetop.
I had gotten lost, and I walkedin like the same way the
professor was.
And I remember looking up, andit was like everything else in
my life, right?
Like when I danced or whatever,or when I was in Color Guard
Jump Corps, it was always thesame thing.
So it wasn't as alarming, butit was it was there and it was
noticeable, and I'll neverforget it.
I don't think most white peoplehave ever walked into a room
(35:32):
full of just black people, justfull of people of color.
And if they have, they rememberit.
And it was scary, or I don'tknow if the right, that's not
the right word, scary, or it waswhatever it was.
It was an acknowledgement.
And that's why when you see afew people who are going to like
Howard, who are white or youknow, Asian or whatever, it's
(35:53):
kind of interesting to see theirpoint of view.
It's kind of beautiful becausethat's what we want as a world
where people are fine.
I'm just saying, if you havelived your entire life never
experiencing what it's like towalk into a room and you're
being the only one out, and nowall of a sudden, everything you
do every day is you have a blackpresident, you have, you know
(36:14):
what I mean?
Like all of a sudden that mustbe jarring.
I'm not saying you have to be adick about it.
I'm saying it must be jarringto have to now change what you
thought about yourself in theworld.
Andrea (36:28):
Be nice.
I acknowledge that there'sprobably a sense of loss.
Okay.
And that's about the best I cando.
My my my world view is not islike is is not that how do I
explain it?
Like there is enough.
(36:51):
There is enough for all of us,right?
Just because it was a blackpresident doesn't mean that's a
loss of power for anyone.
I don't know.
Carmen Lezeth (37:02):
Intellectually, you and I get it.
You you and I we we get that,but that doesn't take away from
some white man in Kentucky whofeels a certain way because he
doesn't understand that.
It doesn't, and it's changinghis masculinity.
I think the problem is reallythe definition of masculinity
has changed, you know.
(37:22):
Um, and I think more men needto understand that the reason
why, like I was talking to Billyabout this, like gay men, the
reason why women tend to connectwith gay men is because they
are in touch with all sides ofwho they are.
They're not confused.
You know what I mean?
It's not like this makes youmasculine, this makes you
(37:43):
feminine, and this makes youwhatever.
It like, and I'm not talkingfor all gay men, some gay men
suck.
Okay, you know what I mean?
Like, I'm just just likeanybody else, but I'm saying
that that overall idea is thereason why I I tend to really
have no problem hanging out withsomebody who's so in touch with
every single part of them.
Like that would be the perfectman if he was straight.
Andrea (38:06):
Like I was in touch with him.
I mean, I I um I clearly have areal problem with um coddling
people.
Like, okay, yeah, you've alwaysbeen like that though.
I know.
Oh no, yes, I'm not a coddler.
Like uh we all have things thatare hard for us, and most of
the rest of us, all of the restof us, have to get over it and
(38:28):
deal with it.
And guess what, bitch?
So do you?
Like that's that's the way Ifeel about it.
Carmen Lezeth (38:34):
Yeah, you've never been a coddler.
That's a good way to do it.
Yeah, you don't really, yeah,yeah.
Andrea (38:39):
I'm not I even like I like they're grown men.
Carmen Lezeth (38:43):
So that's what Scott Galloway is doing, I
guess.
That's that's the rub, is thecoddling and not the like I want
to say man up.
Like actually, like uh, but Ithink it's hard.
Look at I want to be assensitive as possible.
I don't know.
I know for me growing up, itwas really hard.
And it's still hard, but it'sless hard because now I
(39:06):
understand so much more abouthow things are not actually my
fault.
Andrea (39:10):
Yeah.
Carmen Lezeth (39:11):
Like what where I always felt like the problem
was me.
Like, and I can't explain topeople what it feels like to
think, oh, because I'm black orI'm Latina, I'm not good enough.
I don't know how to explainwhat it feels like to grow up
thinking like, well, there'snothing I can do about it, but
(39:31):
I'm because I'm black andLatina, so I'm never gonna be
enough.
Whether it's uh getting aloneor trying to get a job or
whatever it is, like just that'sinfused in your essence.
And I can only imagine thereverses happening for white
men.
That's all I'm trying to say.
Not that they don't thinkthey're good enough, because I
(39:52):
don't think we ever gonna getthere, but that they are having
a conflict with understandingthey are not the be-all end-all
in society right now.
And I don't think it's easy forpeople to accept people of
color.
Andrea (40:07):
They want to, but I don't think they really can do
it.
Yeah, I mean, I think thatthere is, I've said this for a
long time, like it's like thethe the last gasp of a dying
monster, right?
Like I think some of that iswhat what we are experiencing
now.
Um uh but I just I just can'texcuse it.
(40:29):
I just can't.
Did you think I was excusing?
Carmen Lezeth (40:32):
No, no, no, I'm not trying to excuse you are,
but like I'm just acknowledgingit.
Like, I just um I'm notexcusing it.
I think the I'm not a fan ofScott Galloway either, but I
like that he's at least no oneelse is mentioning the problem.
He may not be mentioning it inthe way in which I think might
be more helpful to them, um, buthe is talking about it.
(40:53):
And it's one of my frustrationsthat I've had with so many of
my friends um who are white, whowere not talking.
Like, I don't need you to talkto me about what's happening
with race relations or politics.
I need you to go talk to yourwhite friends.
It's kind of that same thing.
Like, the problem isn't overhere, the problem is you need to
explain that having a blackpresident actually was not that
(41:16):
big of a deal.
It's a long time coming.
And don't get me started withthe woman thing.
Like, you know, having a womanpresident that's a whole other
thing, but yeah.
I'm sorry.
Oh, do we have to notice thetime?
No, just kidding.
unknown (41:33):
I'm sorry.
Carmen Lezeth (41:34):
We're all over the place today.
All this to say Jimmy Kimmelwas amazing, and um I I think
that's what brought this up isyou said that's what a man is.
Andrea (41:43):
Well, yeah, so like somebody else said that that's
masculinity, right?
Like that's good, solidfriendship, family, love, joy,
bringing your people along withyou when you're successful.
Carmen Lezeth (41:55):
Yes, yes, which I'm sure, I'm sure people like
Elon Musk and Mark Zuckerbergand all the like, what's the
guy, Tim Basil's?
Tim Basil's?
I don't know what his name is.
Jeff.
Jeff, whatever, a billionairemotherfucker.
I'm sure he brings them alongtoo.
Andrea (42:11):
Like I'm sure they do.
And not your cronies, like, youknow.
Real friends, right?
If you have any.
If you don't, that's a problem.
Yeah.
Carmen Lezeth (42:21):
So everyone's homework is to uh figure out who
Scott, what's his name?
Galloway is.
Uh check out what's going onwith Jimmy Kimmel.
That's more important.
Go check out Jimmy Kimmel's uhbeautiful uh I don't know, it
was really well done.
Uh and it was uh, I think itwas November 12th's monologue.
(42:41):
And yeah, keep reading up onthe Epstein files.
I don't really think you needto keep reading up on them.
Andrea (42:48):
You don't need to keep reading on them.
Call your friends.
Carmen Lezeth (42:51):
Call your friends, especially your white
male friends.
Make sure they're okay.
I'm being more compassionate.
I'm just saying.
She's not a coddler.
That is the truth, though.
All right, everyone.
Thank you so much.
And uh remember, at the end ofthe day, it really is all about
the joy.
We'll see you next week.
(43:12):
Bye.
That was a weird episode.
Thanks for stopping by.
All about the joy.
Be better and stay beautiful,folks.
Have a sweet day.
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