January 18, 2025 • 56 mins
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The Journey of Sunshine: Embracing My Past and Shaping My Future
In this inaugural episode of 'Becoming Sunshine,' the host, who goes by the name Sunshine, opens up about her past as a dancer and the impactful decade she spent in the industry. She discusses the cultural stigma and societal challenges she faced, the life lessons learned, and the personal growth experienced. Sunshine shares her motivation behind launching this podcast to inspire others, reclaiming her identity, and controlling her narrative before misconceptions arise. This heartfelt episode aims to provide an authentic look into her journey, aiming to change societal narratives about marginalized communities and empower women to embrace their past while pursuing their future.
00:00 Introduction to Becoming Sunshine
00:29 Revealing My Background
01:53 The Stigma and Trolls
03:42 Identity and Acceptance
05:19 Navigating Relationships
08:34 Entering the Club World
11:00 Challenges and Realities of Club Life
13:41 Social Dynamics and Isolation
17:17 Struggles and Growth
26:31 Finding a Way Out
28:53 Healing and Moving On
29:50 Shifting Perspectives on Social Connections
31:07 The Impact of Club Culture
32:32 New Beginnings and Personal Growth
34:58 Challenging Societal Stigmas
39:49 The Complexity of the Adult Entertainment Industry
49:55 Empowerment and Future Aspirations
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Madeline (00:00):
Welcome to Becoming Sunshine.
For those of you that know me,you know that sunshine has been
an alias of mine for almost adecade now, and sunshine also is
me becoming my highest self, andthat's what this podcast is
about.
I'm here to help you understandyourself better, and maybe learn
(00:21):
some more about myself along theway.
Thanks so much for joining me.
I'm excited.
Hey friends.
Welcome back to becomingSunshine.
Today's episode is about a topicI wasn't planning on discussing
just yet.
It's not something I reallywanted to come out about just
(00:42):
yet and I think for a fewreasons.
I felt that my podcasts and myplatform needed to be successful
before I came out about mybackground and I wanted it to be
known for something else justbecause of the cultural and
societal stigma about it, and Ididn't want that to overshadow
(01:05):
what I'm trying to do here.
I also didn't want my podcast tobecome just all about that
because that's not what this isabout this is about healing,
this is about transformation,this is about lessons I've
learned, but I also haverealized this part of my life is
a really big part of my life,and if I don't share it, it's a
(01:26):
disservice to y'all and also tomyself.
I'm a lot more interesting thanI've let on and I have a lot
more depth than I've let on, andalso a lot of my wisdom comes
from my backgrounds.
I can't just pretend that almosta decade of my life or a big
part of that decade didn't shapeme into the person I am and the
(01:47):
values and everything that Ihave, and also too I feel like I
need to control the narrative.
I've already started to gettrolls in my DMs, and commenting
on my podcast page on Instagramand stuff, leaving mean
comments, trying to shame me formy background.
I know that there's going to beinternet trolls regardless, but
(02:10):
I don't ever want people tothink I'm ashamed of who I am or
where I came from, and also Idon't want people to think I'm
hiding anything or beinginauthentic because that's like
the whole brand.
Everybody in my life that I careabout, knows about my background
and they accept me.
They love me, so it's just likewhy should I care about what
(02:32):
anyone else thinks or what theirperception might be?
Sharing this part of my storywill inspire other people to
share their story and theirbackground.
I think there's this societalstigma for a reason.
A lot of people like me haven'tcome out about their background,
and I think people only knowfrom what they've seen in pop
(02:54):
culture, and more often than notwhat you see in pop culture is
not reality.
If I can inspire anybody or helpchange the narrative then I want
to.
Part of this podcast and thisbrand is about changing the
narrative for marginalizedcommunities like the one I'm
about to talk about, and I feelcoming out about it now before
(03:17):
my brand blows up is probably abetter idea than being outed
later or thinking I was tryingto hide something.
Now when mean girls and meanboys, not men, boys comment on
my stuff, I will have alreadyaddressed it, so they'll just
look like the mean bullies thatthey are.
(03:38):
Anyways, not to be super crypticor whatever.
The title of the podcastBecoming Sunshine, it's all
about me becoming my highestself, like enlightened,
whatever.
That's where I get the Sunshine,but Sunshine is also me
reclaiming the name Sunshine.
I've gone by Sunshine, it's beenan alias that I have had for
(04:00):
almost a decade and I talk aboutthat in the intro so it's not
like that cryptic, but it's notsomething that most people would
probably pick up on if theydon't know me personally.
I was a dancer at of club and mystage name was Sunshine, and I
don't know why this is so hardfor me to talk about, everybody
(04:21):
in my life that I'm close toknows about my background.
They love and accept me.
I feel like Sunshine has becomepart of my identity at this
point, and taking that into mynext chapter is something that's
important to me.
I never want to feel shame aboutwhere I come from or things that
(04:42):
I've been through, becauseeverything that I've gone
through has made me who I am,and also I'm tired of people
trying to use my backgroundagainst me.
People have used it to sabotagemy relationships, and I will be
damned if anyone tries to use mybackground to sabotage my brand,
because this isn't just aboutme.
(05:03):
This is about helping others,and if I can be brave and talk
about this and squash anypotential problems in the future
about it, then I'm going to doit.
I'm going to have the courage.
When it comes to dating, I'vealways been honest about my
background.
I don't lie to guys and I don'ttry to hide this part of my life
(05:26):
from them.
It's not something that I leadwith when I first meet people
just because of this societalstigma, and it's just not worth
the drama or the judgment.
If this isn't someone that'sgoing to be in my life.
I think it's a protective thing.
It's not anyone's businessunless it needs to be their
business.
(05:46):
Unless I care about them and Ithink I'm going to have them in
my life long-term or at least inany real capacity or in any
major way.
It's not like, I lie to theseguys about my background or what
I do for work.
It's not like they don't know,but usually it's the stigma or
(06:07):
the stereotype, or just the lackof information or knowledge
about it, that kind of makesguys feel insecure.
People in their ear will use thestigma and stereotype against
me, and be like"Oh, you can'ttrust her","She manipulates guys
(06:27):
for a living","She lies to guysfor a living","She gets guys to
fall in love with her everynight", Of course she doesn't
really care about you","Ofcourse she doesn't really like
you", and I always think that'sso funny because if I can get
anyone to just fall in love withme every night, why would I need
you?
Why would I want you to fall inlove with me?
Obviously I'm choosing youobviously there's not a lack of
(06:48):
options for me, despite whatpeople might want to think.
I'm choosing to date you andgive you my time when I don't
need to, so it's just silly thatpeople use that as an excuse.
Girls, like disgruntled exeshave used that kind of stuff in
guys' ears, or they've you knowjust been like"Oh, you don't
(07:13):
know about her background","Youdon't know what she's done","You
don't know, blah, blah, blah,blah, blah","Her morals","Her
values are blah, blah, blah,blah, blah".
First of all, what I do for workand how I've chosen to support
myself over the years has neverbeen a reflection of my
character, and also yeah, thereis this stigma for a reason.
There is a stereotype for areason.
There are girls that fit thatstereotype, but stereotypes are
(07:34):
not everybody.
I definitely don't work the sameor carry myself as maybe some of
the other girls.
I am very much about myprinciples and my morals and
that carries over into the waythat I work, into the way that I
date.
I don't carry myself one way inone atmosphere and then behave
(07:55):
differently in another, I'm veryconsistent throughout.
I think that's why my friendsand family value me so much and
appreciate me so much.
I think it can be argued that ifI was dating a healed man, it
wouldn't matter what outsidethird-party perspective, or
people in their ear were sayingabout me and my background.
(08:17):
A healed man should judge me onour time together and my values
and the person that I am.
He shouldn't be able to beinfluenced by what someone else
says about me that doesn't evenknow me, or what someone else
thinks about my background thatdoesn't know anyone in the
industry or anything about theindustry.
I guess a little bit ofbackground and how I got into
this.
I think it's prettystraightforward and pretty
(08:40):
cliche honestly, like the brokecollege student and just wanting
to make money.
My roommate actually got me intoit.
I had only really done it acouple of times, and then my
life started to radically shiftwhen I was 20 years old.
One thing about club life, Ifeel like that world is a
(09:06):
totally separate world.
It's almost like an underworld,I guess you could say in a lot
of ways, and not to be superdramatic, but I almost feel like
Persephone who was taken downinto the underworld and I'm
finally coming back, or like ahero's journey how they have to
go into the underworld and comeback.
(09:27):
Honestly, that's how I feel.
I feel like I was taken into theunderworld for a decade and I'm
finally coming back.
I really feel like it is anotherworld, and part of how I got
into that world is because theoutside world wasn't very kind
to me before.
This is hard to talk about, butI'll do my best without getting
(09:49):
emotional.
The outside world really wasn'tkind to me, and so that kind of
became my world for a reallylong time.
It's easy to get stuck in thatworld.
I found new friendships, newfriends, new family in that
world, and for the first time,in a long time, I felt like I
found people that understood meand had gone through similar
(10:10):
things.
Obviously some of that I readinto a little bit too much, and
I think a lot of it has to dowith getting into that world
when you're really young.
There's a really big differencebetween people who get into that
world, women who get into thatworld in their later twenties or
early thirties or something,versus women that get into it
when they're like 18, 19 20.
(10:32):
You have to think about thatenvironment.
It's probably one of the mosttoxic environments you can be
in, and if you're trying toessentially grow up, like
through adulthood in thatenvironment, you're still
establishing your sense of selfworth and figuring out who you
are and trying to do that inthat really toxic environment is
(10:58):
definitely going to take a toll.
I think a lot of girls start tohave an identity crisis when
they work in that type ofindustry.
It's very cutthroat.
It's very aesthetic based.
Honestly, there's a lot ofthings about it that I think
teach you how real life works.
It's real life shrunk down intoa miniature version.
(11:20):
The themes and stuff that comesup it's like real life and real
world themes that we don'treally talk about, or we pretend
don't exist.
A lot of the dynamics at playare what are at play in real
life.
So how I got into it, the worldwasn't very kind to me.
Something happened to me when Iwas 20 years old that was pretty
(11:42):
traumatic, and I ended up losingall my friends, my job, and a
big part of myself, like a bigpart of my soul honestly, and
that's kinda when I fell intothis world and this lifestyle.
I was super isolated.
The first two years I was inthis world and I was working at
(12:03):
a club.
I didn't even talk to anybody atthe club.
I would just go and work andthen leave.
It was because one of the girlsthat got me into it, she was
like, don't trust the othergirls.
Don't become friends with theother girls, which is valid.
Trust me, but also too, no oneteaches you how to be a dancer.
No one teaches you the game, andit takes time to figure out.
(12:23):
If you don't have people thatput you on, or teach you, or
people that already know andfriends that can help you, it's
going to take you a lot longerto figure shit out.
You're gonna make a lot ofmistakes.
A lot of traumatic stuff isprobably going to happen.
We call those girls babystrippers, a lot of the early
mistakes that you make and earlythings that happen are just
(12:45):
being unaware, not knowing yourworth or whatever.
Then you figure shit out and youstart making money.
Real money, and a lot of timesgirls that get into this
industry, they've never seenreal money before they didn't
come from money and it's fastmoney.
if you don't have any kind ofbackground, any kind of
financial literacy, it'sdefinitely easy to get sucked up
(13:07):
into that world and to get lost.
A lot of girls start to have anidentity crisis around about
year two.
I've seen it happen to so manygirls that happened to myself,
because the more you get suckedinto this world, the more you
lose touch with reality outside.
For years, my only socialconnections were in the club.
(13:27):
I didn't have any friendsoutside of the club.
I didn't really have anyconnections outside of the club
other than my family, of course,but my family doesn't leave
here.
We are close, but I don't talkto my family members on a
day-to-day basis about my life.
That's something that's reallydangerous, not having outside
ties because you start to losetouch with reality and what's
(13:47):
real.
That's how a lot of girls fallinto situations, or they start
to befriend other girls at theclub and thinking that these
girls are their sisters or theirreally good friends, and it's
just like at the end of the day,there's no real friends at the
strip club, trust me.
These girls will screw you over,stab you in the back, betray you
(14:12):
for a customer, for money everysingle time.
For years I put up with stuff.
I put up with that from peoplethat I thought were my best
friends and I would make excusesfor these girls.
I'd be like,"Oh we're all hereto make money, blah, blah,
blah", but at the end of theday, for me to call some of my
friend their values and myvalues should be aligned, and
(14:34):
those values shouldn't changeonce we get to the club.
That's not a real friendship.
That is a colleague or a clubacquaintance, and someone you
make money with.
Making money with someoneshouldn't be the basis for
friendship.
Convenience, proximity, politicsshouldn't be the basis for a
(14:55):
friendship, it's not.
Also too, a lot of things startto become normalized that aren't
normal.
My social world started to getreally small, and of course,
after everything happened, whenI was in college and my social
circle went away.
I didn't really have much of asocial circle to begin with, but
(15:16):
the club culture is just so oddcompared to other social norms,
like when normal civilians willsay they hang out with their
friends all the time.
My friends at the club, we wouldnever hang out outside of work.
We started to but it wasn'tnormal, like it had to be an
event, it was weird.
We would see each other all thetime at work and would feel like
(15:37):
we're hanging out and we'resuper close, but a lot of times
you're so tired because that jobis so physically, emotionally,
spiritually exhausting thatyou're either recovering from
the job when you're not working,you're working on your body,
you're in the gym, you're atbeauty appointments because you
have to stay at this peak levelphysically and aesthetically.
(16:02):
That rivals a full-time job inand of itself.
I started to develop this sortof social anxiety for years.
Especially when I got sick.
I had no social interactionsother than inside the club, and
I feel like when I did develop aconnection with someone outside
the club, I put so much value onthat connection.
(16:25):
For example, if there was a guyI was seeing.
It was so easy for him to takeadvantage of that situation
because he could be doingwhatever while I was at work and
I had no idea.
He could be running around withother girls.
There was even a guy, he had awhole other girlfriend behind my
back and I had no idea because Ihad no other social ties.
(16:46):
I didn't have anyone out seeinghim with this other girl able to
tell me and be like,"Hey girlhe's running around behind your
back".
There was none of that.
I just was so clueless for solong, also I think I felt this
person was my tie to reality.
I just put so much value in thatrelationship, even if it wasn't
(17:07):
good for me, because I hadisolated myself so much for so
many years, and that's also areally dangerous position to put
yourself in.
it wasn't all bad, obviouslythis career path has given me a
lot.
It's introduced me to a lot ofpeople I probably never would've
met.
It's given me a lot ofopportunities I probably never
(17:29):
would have had.
If I had done things a differentway, I'd have a different life
and maybe it would have beenbetter.
Maybe it would've been worse,but I wouldn't be the person
that I am and everything happensfor a reason.
I feel like I am such a positiveperson and I have so much light
in me, that's what they call meSunshine.
I'm very spiritual, and it'scrazy that the universe, God,
(17:53):
put me in this place for solong, which is a very low
vibrational place.
Unfortunately it attracts lowvibrational people for the most
part, a lot of the people thatgo there are sad.
They're missing something.
They're looking for something,and it's definitely shaped the
way I have viewed men over theyears.
(18:15):
How could it not, it attractsmen in their worst moments, a
lot of the time.
When you start to see that nightafter night, and that's all you
see, you start to get a certainlens and it's really hard, so
obviously dating has beendifficult.
Of course, that's not always thecase.
Guys go there to entertainclients, or they go there to
(18:37):
celebrate a bachelor party orsomething.
So it's not always these lowvibrational dudes, or these sad
dudes, or guys that are unhappyin their marriages, or looking
for something, or needvalidation.
Honestly, more often than notit's guys that just need someone
to talk to you and some form ofintimacy.
I don't mean physical intimacy,maybe sometimes, like they
(18:59):
honestly just need a hug.
A lot of times, it's theconnection that these guys go
there for because they don'thave that honestly.
A lot of money comes in and outof these places, especially at
the more high end clubs.
A lot of the clientele is CEOs,entrepreneurs, business owners,
lawyers, doctors, surgeons.
They're not bums.
(19:20):
They're not typical strip clubguy.
I hate when guys come in thereand they're like, I'm not your
average strip club guy.
I'm like, babe, this place isn'tfor average strip club guys,
like in order to have any typeof fun here, you have to have
the disposable income in orderto do so.
Strip clubs, especially high endclubs are designed for men who
(19:43):
it's part of their lifestyle,and they get pleasure and
enjoyment out of spoiling womenand taking care of women.
Sometimes guys are, they'relooking for something else, but
more often than not it'sentertainment, and these are the
types of places that cater tothat type of man.
It's just crazy for society tolook down on women in these
(20:03):
industries, or say that it's acop out or anybody could get
naked, and it's just more oftenthan not the guys that are
coming into these types ofestablishments are the same type
of guys that don't even takemeetings.
You couldn't even get access tothese guys, and now these guys
are paying these women to mentorthem or give them advice or talk
to them, or have a conversationwith them.
(20:26):
For anyone to not see the powerin that role or that position,
it's pretty silly to me, but Idon't know, maybe people have
never thought about it that wayand that's why I feel like it's
important that this stuff istalked about by someone that
actually knows that world andcan shed some light on the
(20:46):
reality.
It's not what you see on TV.
It's not always the in popculture.
Of course, there's the stigmaand the stereotype for a reason,
but most of the women in thereare some of the most ambitious
women that I've ever met.
A lot of them use this as astepping stone and go on to open
businesses or they're supportingtheir families.
(21:07):
In order for you to make it inthis world, and to not have this
world chew you up and spit youout, you have to have a certain
type of character and a certainlevel of grit, and most girls
can't cut it in there.
They don't make it.
Honestly, I joke, I say that Iswim with the sharks every day,
like I'm in the shark tank andif you can make it in that
(21:28):
world, you can make it anywhere.
Unless you're born into wealthor you come about it some other
way.
This is really one of the bestways to wield your power as a
woman, and get ahead.
We don't have to participate inthe patriarchy.
We don't have to participate inthe gender pay gap.
(21:48):
I don't know why that's bad.
Of course there's definitelysome toxic things that go with
the industry.
Of course, there's definitelysome very dark themes that go
on.
At the end of the day, you'reall competing for the bag.
You're all competing againsteach other and being in that
environment every day isdefinitely difficult to
(22:10):
navigate.
I don't like competing againstother women.
A lot of the times, it's noteven your looks, of course your
looks help and it's definitelyeasy to get sucked into that as
well.
Thinking you always have to beworking on something.
You always have to be getting asurgery, you always have to be
getting some kind of a aesthetictreatment done like lasers or
(22:31):
preserving your youth.
I think a lot of times, a lot ofthe early trends, a lot of
things that trend first are inthe club A lot of girls that are
in the club are into theseaesthetic things before the rest
of the girls are, and it'sbecause you have to take such
good care of yourself.
You have to get your nails done,you have to get your lashes
done, you have to get your browsdone, you have to get your hair
done, you have to be in peakphysical shape, you have to have
(22:55):
nice teeth, you have to have anice body.
A lot of girls get their bodiesdone.
A lot of girls get their teethdone.
A lot of girls get their facesdone.
It's such a cutthroatcompetitive world, which
honestly is not great for yourpsyche either, especially when
you're young and you're tryingto establish your sense of self
worth, and you feel like youalways have to be changing
yourself or ever improvingyourself.
(23:17):
Girls that get into it a littlebit later, in their later
twenties, early thirties, theykinda are already established in
who they are, and they're not aseasily influenced or swayed.
That's definitely something thatneeds to be addressed and have
some light shut on.
I have friends that started whenthey were 18.
I have friends that started whenthey were 28, and it's just
completely different.
When you're 18 or whatever, youdon't know the game, you don't
(23:39):
know what's going on.
You don't have friends that gotyou into it.
You honestly, we're probably ina really bad situation, and you
got into it out of desperation.
Then you start to figure stuffout, your situation changes, and
then you stay in it because yousee the opportunity that it's
going to give you.
That it's going to get you whereyou want to go.
A lot of times when women getinto it later, in their later
(23:59):
twenties, early thirties, theygo in with a plan.
They go on with friends.
They know who they are, theyimmediately start making money,
they have an exit strategy.
It's just a completely differentdynamic, so I think we should
give grace and the girls thatgot onto it early should give
themselves a lot of gracebecause it's easy to pass
judgment or be like, why wereyou in this so long?
Why were you doing this for somany years?
(24:21):
Why blah, blah, blah, blah, andit's just these are babies that
got into it.
They didn't even know who theywere and they're thrown into
this toxic environment that's socutthroat, and it takes a while
to figure shit out.
I've met a lot of people that Iprobably wouldn't have
otherwise.
I was connected with people thathave moved my life in huge ways.
(24:44):
I was shown a different way tolive.
I grew up pretty average.
My parents made sure we hadeverything we needed, but we
were middle-class I never wasexposed to real levels of wealth
before.
I never seen that before.
I'd never been on a privateplane before.
I'd never known anyone that hadmade hundreds of millions of
(25:06):
dollars.
I didn't know anyone withgenerational wealth.
I never lived this luxuriouslifestyle before I got into this
world.
Once I was in this world, I wasable to have access to it.
I was able to see a differentlife for myself, and to want a
different life for myself, andto be inspired to want more for
myself, and to see what'spossible.
(25:26):
I also was connected to myfunctional medicine doctor
through someone that I met inthat world.
I never would have got better, Inever would have learned all
these things about myself and mybody if I hadn't had these
connections on these resources.
I'm very grateful.
The club has given me a lot, butit also has taken probably just
(25:47):
as much, if not more from me.
Like I said, I developed reallybad social anxiety for a long
time, because my only socialinteractions were in the club,
as someone else, as Sunshine.
For a long time I struggledbecause I felt like everyone
loves Sunshine, everybody likedSunshine, but people didn't
(26:09):
really like Madeline, and sofiguring that out, finding my
identity again, after that andespecially after battling a
chronic illness and dealing withthat, that was a whole other
thing in itself.
I wasn't the person I was beforeI got sick.
I wasn't the person I was when Iwas sick, and then I had to
figure out who that was after.
(26:31):
I finally started to heal a lotof this and find real motivation
to get out.
I had been trying to get out ofthe club for a long time.
I was trying to figure out whatI was passionate about, what I
wanted to do.
There were so many differentthings I tried to pursue.
Everyone's like,"Oh go into realestate","Oh, go into
pharmaceutical sales","Go intoXYZ".
(26:52):
You're so good at sales, youshould do X, Y, Z", and so of
course, the natural pipeline isthey try to get into some type
of sales.
I took all these differentcourses, took all these
different tests, and I realizedthis isn't really what I want to
do.
I stayed in the club, becausefor a long time, a lot of my
friends were there, I was makingreally good money and I felt
like until I figured out what Iwas passionate about, I wasn't
(27:14):
going to leave.
I wasn't just going to pursuesomething else.
I understand that logic, I do.
I think for a long time I wasway too comfortable in that
world, and I was ignorant to theworld outside.
I didn't have a lot of outsidefriends.
I didn't have a lot of outsideconnections.
For a long time, I really hidmyself in that world and I think
(27:36):
part of that was because of fearand limiting beliefs, and
because of core wounds that Ihadn't healed yet.
I have such core wounds aroundbeing seen.
I know it sounds crazy.
How can you get up on a stagewith the hardly any clothes on
and be in the spotlight and doall these things, where most
(27:58):
people could never be thatvulnerable and couldn't perform
the way that these girls do.
I don't know, maybe because I'vealways been a performer and an
entertainer, it just didn't feelsuper unnatural to me, or maybe
you just get used to it and youget desensitized, but also too,
it's not really me.
I'm never too far away frommyself when I'm at work, but at
(28:21):
the end of the day, that's notme.
That's a persona, that'sSunshine.
That's not Madeline, and so I'mnot really being seen and
showing up authentically andgenuinely as myself.
It's like this character.
I feel like for a long time, Iwas hiding behind this
character.
Especially because like I said,I had been hurt in my personal
(28:41):
life and I think for a long timeI didn't really want to be
Madeline anymore.
It was just easier to beSunshine, which is really sad
when I think about it.
I've done so much healing andnow I love Madeline.
I'll always be grateful forSunshine and the things that I
got from that world, and thetime that I needed that persona
to help me get through life.
(29:04):
As I started to get older, Istarted to heal a little bit.
I started to make moreconnections outside the club and
I started to get uncomfortablein the club.
I think that's when thingsreally started to shift for me,
and also too it just took me along time to figure out what I
wanted to do.
As I started to get more clarityaround that too, I was more
(29:26):
motivated to get out and moreexcited for this next chapter.
The universe makes youuncomfortable, otherwise you
would never move.
You would never change.
Things have never changed.
A lot of my club relationshipswent away.
The environment started to getreally uncomfortable for me.
I started to meet people andmake connections outside of the
club that meant so much to me,and I wanted to be able to spend
(29:49):
more time with them.
As I started to take steps awayfrom the club and spend less
time at the club, I started tofeel different in my body.
There was this constant level ofexhaustion working there and it
started to go away.
I felt like I was so drainedsocially from how much it takes
at the club that once I wasn'tdoing that anymore, I was able
(30:12):
to enjoy being social outside ofthe club.
As an entertainer you're gettingpaid for your time, you're
getting paid for your attention,and so I think it starts to warp
your brain a little bit and youdon't want to do things unless
you're getting paid for yourtime and attention.
It starts to become a part ofthe culture, not wanting to do
stuff.
There's these memes are reelsI've seen about dancers that are
(30:34):
funny, but it's so true.
It really becomes part of thelifestyle.
Like inside outside the club,you start to get paid to party.
You don't want to go placesunless you're getting paid.
If you're going to a party, ifyou're going to a dinner, if
you're going to something, and Ithink that definitely starts to
skew your brain a little bit.
(30:55):
You start to get this weirdsense of entitlement and just
this false sense of reality, andalso you start to lose the joy
of just being social becauseit's just like a job.
I don't know if that is the casefor a lot of entertainers
outside of the sex worker,industry.
Sex workers is basically anumbrella term for anyone in the
(31:17):
adult industry, whether that'sonly fans, whether that's
dancers, whether that's pornstars, whether that's whatever.
Even outside of that, I thinkmaybe anyone in entertainment,
like when you do it for aliving, it's starts to skew
things for you.
You don't want to do stuffunless you're getting paid for
your time.
That's the way I felt for a longtime.
(31:39):
I just was like, why would I goto this?
Why would I do this when I couldjust go to work and get paid to
party instead.
I didn't see the value in socialconnection, social interactions
for a really long time.
When the club world started toget uncomfortable for me, I was
forced to start to make newconnections outside of the club,
and I think that's what reallystarted to change my brain and
(32:02):
shift things for me.
I met someone that I reallydeveloped strong feelings for,
and obviously he wasn't coolwith me working at the club.
A lot of guys, obviously aren'tgoing to be cool with it.
Honestly, I probably wouldn't becool with it.
I don't want to date someonethat entertains other men, other
women for a living.
(32:23):
Especially in that intimate of asetting, it's just not really
something that I would becomfortable with, so I can't
really blame them.
I started to go out with thisguy more.
I took a step back from the cluband I started to really envision
this new life for myself.
This level of exhaustion Iconstantly had from working all
these crazy hours went away.
(32:44):
My body started to feel better.
This job is so physicallyexhausting, you're wearing these
crazy seven inch platform heels.
You're dancing, you're walkingaround, you're contorting
yourself.
It's hard, my back hurts, myknees hurts, my hips are
probably so out of alignment.
I'm pretty sure I have aposterior pelvic tilt because of
working in this industry for somany years.
(33:05):
I started to go out with himsocially and I started to put
myself into social situationsand I finally felt like I was
able to enjoy myself.
I was able to enjoy that part oflife again, and I feel like it
had been almost 10 years since Ifelt that before.
I started to feel like my oldself again, who I was before
started dancing.
The more I spent time with himand the more I spent time
(33:26):
outside of the club world, themore I really wanted to just be
in the real world full time.
I'm so grateful for thatconnection and for him showing
me this world that wasn't kindto me before, a lot has changed.
I've changed a lot since then,and I started to be excited
(33:48):
about a new life and a newfuture.
I hadn't really wanted this newlife enough for me to really
take the steps to move my lifeout of that world.
In the past year, my life hascompletely changed.
It's almost unrecognizable.
I have this whole new careerpath.
I have a whole new socialcircle.
I have all new goals and I feelmore myself than I have in
(34:12):
probably a decade.
I feel like I'm finally steppinginto the highest version of
myself and who I've always beenmeant to be.
Although I'm grateful for allthe lessons and everything I
learned in that world.
I'm just so excited for thisnext chapter, and I know that a
lot of the lessons andeverything I integrated from
(34:32):
that world and that life arewhat is going to propel me
forward and get me where I needto go, but that world and that
life just doesn't really fitanymore.
I'm just really grateful to thisperson, and also just to myself
for how hard I've worked,because it's scary doing
something different.
It definitely hasn't been easygetting over my social anxiety,
(34:54):
and believing myself, steppinginto this new version, this new
timeline.
Part of what I want to do withthis podcast is change the
narrative.
I feel like there's thissocietal stigma and these
stereotypes.
Of course, some of them arethere for a reason.
There's definitely some girlsthat live up to the stereotype
for sure, but I think thebiggest part is the stigma is
(35:15):
because it's a female dominatedfield.
Yes, there are male strip clubs,but those guys don't make nearly
the same amount of money becausewomen don't spend nearly the
same amount of money as guys doin these types of
establishments.
In this world, like I said,these very powerful men, not
(35:37):
always, there's definitely somebeta males that come in there
and they come in there becausethey think they can have some
power and they act some type ofway, but that's a totally
separate thing.
I could talk about that onfuture episodes, but these super
powerful guys come into mydomain where I work, and then I
have the local star power, I'mthe one with power, and I think
(36:01):
that's why there's a stigma.
I think if men could make thesame kind of money doing the
same types of things, therewouldn't be a stigma at all.
Men just don't like when womenhave power and when women are
able to wield their power in anyway over men, and I'm not saying
that these girls aremanipulative or doing anything
(36:21):
wrong.
They are embracing a power thatthey have and men don't like
that stuff.
It makes men uncomfortable.
Obviously not the men that arein there.
They love that, eat that stuffup.
That's why they're there, butsociety doesn't like it, the
patriarchy doesn't like it.
This honestly goes back from thebeginning.
Jesus and his number one,disciple, Mary Magdalen, the
(36:45):
disciple of all disciples,there's different
interpretations, but MaryMagdalen was basically the
female entity, the feminineenergy to the male masculine
energy that was Jesus.
They were basically doing thesame thing and a lot of her work
was erased from the Bible.
(37:05):
She's still mentioned in there,but a lot of her work is not in
there, and a part of it isbecause she had a lot of power
and she associated with womenthat were sinners, and anything
that has to do with sacredsexuality, anything that has to
do with women in power, anythingthat has to do with high
priestesses and what they weredoing.
(37:27):
Any time in history when womenhad real power, It was violently
erased from history books.
A lot of high priestesses werecalled witches and the whole
Salem witch hunt was abouttaking power away from women,
taking land away from women,taking resources away from
women.
(37:47):
There's just so many instancesin our history where women had
power and they had to bedemonized somehow, and they had
to have their power strippedaway from them.
I think that's why this wholeindustry is stigmatized.
We have made so much progress asa collective.
We've come so far.
We are so woke now as acollective and we're still so
(38:09):
behind in this one particularindustry this one particular
sector, when it comes to womenusing their bodies or using
their feminine energy to getahead.
The whole Trad Wife trend andthe Pilates Princess, stay at
home wife, stay at homegirlfriend thing is just so
(38:30):
glorified, and it's like thesewomen aren't even in their
feminine energy.
They're in their masculineenergy and they're being
performative.
The fifties housewife was not inher feminine energy.
She was being performative andcatering to and working for a
man, her man.
It's just if you're not workingfor yourself, you're working for
your man.
I think men would prefer it thatway.
(38:51):
They don't want us to be workingfor ourselves, so of course the
Pilates Princess, the Trad Wife,that stuff is going to be
glorified and any woman who'sout there trying to make her own
money, and support herself isgoing to be demonized.
It's also crazy to me that guyshave tried to call me a gold
digger when I make my own moneyand I don't need anything from
(39:13):
them.
Anything that I require Iprovide for myself.
I don't need any man foranything that I'm going to have
in this life.
I'm going to get it myself.
Of course, I would love a manfor his companionship, for his
inspiration, for his leadership,but I don't need you, and then
the women that are just stay athome whatever, that don't have
(39:36):
their own ambitions, that don'twork, that are just with them
for the lifestyle that they canprovide.
Those women are not called golddiggers.
I'm just confused on thatnarrative.
It doesn't really make sense tome, but anyways.
People saying that being an onlyfans girl or being a dancer or
being a porn star or beingwhatever is taking the easy way
(39:57):
out or a cop out, but what iseasy about being naked or being
next to naked and beingvulnerable and having to perform
and be entertaining at the sametime, no matter how you're
feeling that day.
No matter what's going on withyou internally, you could be
having a bad day, you could begoing through a breakup, you
could be sick and you still haveto be hot.
(40:19):
You still have to be charming.
You still have to beperformative.
I can't speak so much for theseother women in other parts of
the industry, the adultentertainment industry, but as a
dancer, what is easy aboutcompeting against a hundred
other women every night, stayingin peak physical condition,
keeping yourself to a certainaesthetic at all times.
(40:40):
Keeping up with your beautyappointments.
When you're not working, you'reat an appointment, or you're out
at the gym, or you're going totherapy to make sure you're
healed enough to even do thisjob and integrate everything
that goes on and everything youhave to deal with mentally.
The mental toll, and emotionaltoll that this job takes, it's
just crazy, but anyways what iseasy about having to profile a
(41:01):
room every night.
Every night you're starting fromnegative.
You start from negative and youhave to build up from negative.
How many people go to work everyday, potentially working the
entire shift with less moneythan they came with.
It doesn't matter how good youare at your job, sometimes it's
just not your night.
This isn't the type of job thatyou can just go through the
(41:22):
motions.
If your energy is off, you'renot going to make money.
It doesn't matter if you're thehottest girl in the club.
If your energy's off.
It's just a waste of time, andyou're not going to make money
and you're going to leavenegative.
Imagine going to work all nightand leaving negative, it happens
even to some of the top girls.
I think that's why a lot of thegirls are very spiritual and
very in tune with themselvesbecause you have to be.
(41:43):
You have to be so aware of yourenergy and what you're bringing
into the club every night, andyou have to be also so aware of
everyone else's energy aroundyou and how you're engaging with
that energy and how it'sengaging with you.
Being able to sit in a room andprofile people and immediately
look at a guy and be able toknow this guy looks like he's
going to spend money.
(42:04):
Most of the time it's not eventhe guys that you would expect.
There's body language that youhave to pick up on.
Of course, the way a guy'sclothes fit him, but a lot of
times guys that are trying tolook like they have money, don't
actually have money.
The guys that are flexing arenever the ones that spend money.
The guys that talk about howmuch money they have, are never
the ones that have money.
Wealth whispers.
That is one of the biggestthings if you don't know that,
(42:25):
you'll learn that in the club,but yeah, it's just very minute
details.
The way someone's clothes fitthem, the material of their
clothes, the way their bodylanguage is, how relaxed they
are, what drink they ordered,how they walk into the club,
their body language when theywalk into the club, how fast
they sit down, where they sitdown, there's just so many
things.
It's so calculated and it's socerebral.
(42:46):
The skills that I havedeveloped, you cannot teach.
You can not teach these skills.
The amount of CEOs and businessowners that talk to me and they
think that I've gone to businessschool just because of
everything that I know andeverything that I've learned.
Of course I have invested in mycraft.
I probably read more salesbooks, books on personal
development, and books on humaninteraction and communication
(43:09):
and interpersonal relationshipsthen most people, but also it's
a lot of on the job skills thatI've learned.
So what's easy about competingagainst a hundred different
girls, immediately having toprofile everyone in the room.
Then having to sell yourself,sell the room, you have to
(43:29):
quickly build instant rapportwith these guys, you have to
build an instant connection.
You have to figure out whythey're really there.
You have to cater to that.
You have to chameleon yourpersonality to cater to this
person.
You have to be what thisperson's looking for.
You have to mold yourpersonality, your sales pitch,
(43:50):
your demeanor to what thisperson is looking for and what
they're needing that night.
You have to deal with a lot ofrejection also, and you have to
be able to bounce backimmediately.
If you get rejected, you can letthat ruin your entire night.
No, you got to dust yourself offand put yourself back out there
and try again.
There's also a whole group ofmen that come there just to be
mean to women.
Men that have no real power,just come in there to feel like
(44:13):
they have some sense of powerand literally are there to be
mean to you and to try to breakyou down.
Especially on those days whenyou're already having a horrible
day, and you really don't wantto be there, but you force
yourself to be there, and thenthere's this guy that has just
come in there to be mean to youand break you down, and you have
to deal with it and keep itmoving.
What is easy about that?
People saying that girls arejust selling their bodies or
(44:38):
dirty or whatever, but thinkabout it logically.
The whole goal of being a danceris selling your time and selling
as much of your time as you can.
So if you were dirty or you'regiving the guy why he wants
immediately, he's not going tocontinue to spend money.
That's not the way that you getcustomers or guys to spend money
(45:01):
on you and invest in you formonths on end for years on end.
You have to be strategic.
You have to be cerebral.
You have to cater to theirpsyche for hours on end.
You have to have a really goodmouthpiece.
You have to be really good atconversating.
You have to be really good atcommunicating.
Bulding instant rapport,competing with a hundred other
goals, and using sales andpsychological techniques while
(45:26):
also being sexy, witty andcharming.
I don't personally know a lot ofpeople that could just do that
and could thrive at that and Idon't think that's the cop-out
or the easy way out.
I don't think there's anythingeasy about that.
I think it's a lot easier to sitat a desk, or crunch some
numbers or do whatever.
I'm not trying to look down onanyone that does that, I'm not
(45:48):
trying to look down on anyonethat's a stay at home Trad Wife
or a Pilates Princess orwhatever.
It's just girls in the industrydon't talk shit about these
people, so why is everyonetalking shit about us?
It's just weird.
I think a lot of it is becausethey probably couldn't do it.
These women are ambitious, thesewomen are working for
themselves, these women areincredibly intelligent.
Not all of them of course, butthere's a good number of them.
(46:12):
Half the time I'm smarter thanthe guys that I talked to you in
the club and me acting like I'mnot as smart as I am or dumbing
myself down, or allowing myselfto be underestimated, that's
strategic.
I don't mind beingunderestimated.
I don't mind guys thinking thatthey're smarter than me.
Gauging that, what men are goingto value my brain and my
(46:32):
intelligence, and what men aregoing to value other things, and
playing up either part.
I don't want to emasculatesomeone and mess up my own
money.
Having to learn to cater todifferent personalities and
different situations at the dropof a hat is definitely not an
easy skill to learn, but again,people usually hate up.
I'm really not criticized byanyone doing more than me.
(46:55):
I would never trade places witha lot of the people that are
talking shit about me, or wantto make their assumptions about
me and my background and whatI've done.
I've made mistakes in my life.
Everybody has, but I've owned upto everything and everything
that's happened and everythingthat I've gone through has made
me the person that I am.
I have learned so much about menin this world through this
(47:18):
career path, because I've spentthousands of hours talking to
men and analyzing and assessingmen.
A lot of it has helped me in myrelationships for sure.
It's crazy to me that men wantto say that dancers wouldn't be
good girlfriends or wouldn't beloyal.
That doesn't even make any sensebecause we see men in their
(47:39):
worst moments all the time,night after night, and also
we've interacted and engagedwith so many different men.
When we do meet a good man andwe are with a good man, why
would we mess that up?
I'm not out needing validationor attention.
I get plenty of validation andattention.
When I'm not at work, I'mwearing the biggest baggies
clothes.
I have no makeup on, my hair isnot done.
(48:01):
I don't want to be perceived.
I'm like, please leave me alone.
You don't ever have to worryabout me.
You don't have to worry aboutwhose eyes are on me because my
eyes are always going to be onmy man.
You don't have to worry about menot being loyal because I've had
to engage and spend time with somany different men, so if I meet
a good one and I find a goodone, I know I got a good one.
(48:23):
I don't need to question it.
I don't need to fumble himbecause I didn't know what else
is out there.
I know what's out there and I'mnot worried about any other guy.
I'm only worried about my guy.
That argument doesn't even makeany sense.
It probably comes out ofinsecurity.
Obviously, I've learned a lotand I'm still learning, but I
(48:43):
know that like I'm probably wayahead of the game.
I know a lot more than theaverage girl when it comes to
the male psyche, and also thingsthat work on guys or the way I
have to treat or deal with guysat the club, is not the way I'm
trying to deal with my man.
If I have to treat him like acustomer, why would I want him,
(49:05):
why would I date him?
If I had to manipulate a guythat I'm dating, I'm not dating
that guy.
That's gross.
That grosses me out.
If you're acting like acustomer, or I have to treat you
like a customer in order for youto act right?
You might as well be a customer.
I want to man that is nothinglike the men that I have to
engage with at work, becausemost of the time, the guys that
(49:28):
come into the club are sad, andthey're missing something in
their life.
That's just not someone that Iwant to build a life with.
No offense to these men, but Idon't want to engage
romantically with someone that'sunhappy, with someone that's
sad, with someone that's missingsomething in their lives,
someone that doesn't know whothey are, someone that's lost.
Guys never had to worry about mefalling in love with someone
(49:50):
while I'm at work if I'm datingsomeone.
It's just funny to me, honestly.
I know that was a lot andthere's honestly so many more
things I could get into withthis and I'll probably make
future episodes on it.
I'm still figuring out what Iwant to share and what feels
appropriate, because again Idon't want this entire podcast
(50:13):
to be about my past, because I'mreally trying to step into my
future and into this newtimeline.
That's the part that I want toshed the light on.
Of course the lessons from mybackground are what made me who
I am, and have given me thiswisdom.
Without this world that has beensuch a big part of my life for
(50:33):
so long, I wouldn't be theperson that I am.
I wouldn't have the wisdom thatI do.
I've spent tens of thousands ofhours in conversation with top
businessmen, entrepreneurs, andthat's why I have the mind that
I do.
Figuring out different psychesand diving into the male psyche,
and diving into differentdynamics amongst the girls.
(50:56):
I have pretty high level skillswhen it comes to interpersonal
relationships and communication,because of the world that I've
been in.
That's why I have all of thisdepth and this wisdom and that's
why I wanted to come out andtalk about it and share, but
again I don't want my past toovershadow my future.
(51:18):
I'm not trying to use my pastfor clout, or attention to get
my platform where it wants togo.
I'm coming out about this nowbecause I want to control the
narrative and I want to addressit before I get big and before
other people try to come outabout it before I'm ready and
(51:38):
shame me for it.
This took a lot of bravery, so Ireally appreciate everyone for
listening and for being therefor me.
I hope that me coming out andtalking about my past inspires
other women like me to not beashamed of where they come from,
and to come out and pursue theirnext venture, and to not be
(52:02):
afraid of their past coming backto haunt them or tear them down.
Not to be so self-important, butif I could just wedge the door
open for these girls, the girlsafter me can shatter the
ceiling.
Not that I'm this liketrailblazer for sex workers or
trailblazer for the hoe's orsomething, and also I say hoes,
(52:23):
reclaiming that word too.
I'm not a hoe and none of thesegirls are hoes.
I think that the narrativeshifts, when more people like me
come forward and force it toshift and they force it to
change.
I have friends in other parts ofthe adult entertainment
industry.
I'm not an expert on any of theother ones by any means, but
(52:44):
with people hating on only fansgirls, it's just those girls are
business women at the end of theday, and they are smart.
They're making so much money,and it's not just about being
hot.
It's about psychology and it'sabout marketability, and these
women are using what they'vebeen given to their advantage.
(53:05):
These women are investing inthemselves and investing in
their future.
I don't think that's somethingthat we should ever look down
on.
Women that are taking orcreating opportunities for
themselves, that's amazing.
I think that more women and morepeople in general should be like
that.
Seizing opportunities foryourself to move your life
forward and not being dependenton anyone else, and having the
(53:28):
resources then to give back,give back to your family, give
back to your community and tobuild a legacy for yourself,
that's amazing.
I don't think that's anything weshould ever hate on.
Again, I think it comes fromjealousy.
I think it comes from thepatriarchy.
I think it comes from otherwomen that wish they could do
the same thing that aren't, andinstead of hating on each other,
why don't we just learn fromeach other and inspire each
(53:49):
other to be better.
Those are just my thoughts.
Anyways, this was reallydifficult for me to record and I
probably didn't even addresseverything that I wanted to
address.
I'm sure there'll be futureepisodes on this, but this was
just my first little coming outepisode, I guess you could say.
I'm really proud of myself forsharing this.
(54:11):
I know everyone in my circlealready knows, but I've never
publicly spoken out about mybackground.
I hope that this reaches theright people and it helps the
right people.
I'm excited for this new chapterand everything to come.
I really appreciate everyonethat's supported me and everyone
that encouraged me to recordthis episode because I was
(54:32):
really scared, and I'm realizingevery day that there's really
nothing to be afraid of in thislife.
Being fully yourself and beingauthentic is really the only way
you're going to get where youwant to go.
If you like this episode, if youlike my podcast, if you like
what I'm trying to do, pleaseshare this.
Like it, subscribe, leave areview.
It really does help me.
(54:53):
I really just want this to beable to reach and help as many
people as possible, and itreally means the world to me.
Thanks guys, love you, bye.
Welcome to Becoming Sunshine.
For those of you that know me,you know that sunshine has been
an alias of mine for almost adecade now, and sunshine also is
me becoming my highest self, andthat's what this podcast is
about.
I'm here to help you understandyourself better, and maybe learn
(00:21):
some more about myself along theway.
Thanks so much for joining me.
I'm excited.
Hey friends.
Welcome back to becomingSunshine.
Today's episode is about a topicI wasn't planning on discussing
just yet.
It's not something I reallywanted to come out about just
(00:42):
yet and I think for a fewreasons.
I felt that my podcasts and myplatform needed to be successful
before I came out about mybackground and I wanted it to be
known for something else justbecause of the cultural and
societal stigma about it, and Ididn't want that to overshadow
(01:05):
what I'm trying to do here.
I also didn't want my podcast tobecome just all about that
because that's not what this isabout this is about healing,
this is about transformation,this is about lessons I've
learned, but I also haverealized this part of my life is
a really big part of my life,and if I don't share it, it's a
(01:26):
disservice to y'all and also tomyself.
I'm a lot more interesting thanI've let on and I have a lot
more depth than I've let on, andalso a lot of my wisdom comes
from my backgrounds.
I can't just pretend that almosta decade of my life or a big
part of that decade didn't shapeme into the person I am and the
(01:47):
values and everything that Ihave, and also too I feel like I
need to control the narrative.
I've already started to gettrolls in my DMs, and commenting
on my podcast page on Instagramand stuff, leaving mean
comments, trying to shame me formy background.
I know that there's going to beinternet trolls regardless, but
(02:10):
I don't ever want people tothink I'm ashamed of who I am or
where I came from, and also Idon't want people to think I'm
hiding anything or beinginauthentic because that's like
the whole brand.
Everybody in my life that I careabout, knows about my background
and they accept me.
They love me, so it's just likewhy should I care about what
(02:32):
anyone else thinks or what theirperception might be?
Sharing this part of my storywill inspire other people to
share their story and theirbackground.
I think there's this societalstigma for a reason.
A lot of people like me haven'tcome out about their background,
and I think people only knowfrom what they've seen in pop
(02:54):
culture, and more often than notwhat you see in pop culture is
not reality.
If I can inspire anybody or helpchange the narrative then I want
to.
Part of this podcast and thisbrand is about changing the
narrative for marginalizedcommunities like the one I'm
about to talk about, and I feelcoming out about it now before
(03:17):
my brand blows up is probably abetter idea than being outed
later or thinking I was tryingto hide something.
Now when mean girls and meanboys, not men, boys comment on
my stuff, I will have alreadyaddressed it, so they'll just
look like the mean bullies thatthey are.
(03:38):
Anyways, not to be super crypticor whatever.
The title of the podcastBecoming Sunshine, it's all
about me becoming my highestself, like enlightened,
whatever.
That's where I get the Sunshine,but Sunshine is also me
reclaiming the name Sunshine.
I've gone by Sunshine, it's beenan alias that I have had for
(04:00):
almost a decade and I talk aboutthat in the intro so it's not
like that cryptic, but it's notsomething that most people would
probably pick up on if theydon't know me personally.
I was a dancer at of club and mystage name was Sunshine, and I
don't know why this is so hardfor me to talk about, everybody
(04:21):
in my life that I'm close toknows about my background.
They love and accept me.
I feel like Sunshine has becomepart of my identity at this
point, and taking that into mynext chapter is something that's
important to me.
I never want to feel shame aboutwhere I come from or things that
(04:42):
I've been through, becauseeverything that I've gone
through has made me who I am,and also I'm tired of people
trying to use my backgroundagainst me.
People have used it to sabotagemy relationships, and I will be
damned if anyone tries to use mybackground to sabotage my brand,
because this isn't just aboutme.
(05:03):
This is about helping others,and if I can be brave and talk
about this and squash anypotential problems in the future
about it, then I'm going to doit.
I'm going to have the courage.
When it comes to dating, I'vealways been honest about my
background.
I don't lie to guys and I don'ttry to hide this part of my life
(05:26):
from them.
It's not something that I leadwith when I first meet people
just because of this societalstigma, and it's just not worth
the drama or the judgment.
If this isn't someone that'sgoing to be in my life.
I think it's a protective thing.
It's not anyone's businessunless it needs to be their
business.
(05:46):
Unless I care about them and Ithink I'm going to have them in
my life long-term or at least inany real capacity or in any
major way.
It's not like, I lie to theseguys about my background or what
I do for work.
It's not like they don't know,but usually it's the stigma or
(06:07):
the stereotype, or just the lackof information or knowledge
about it, that kind of makesguys feel insecure.
People in their ear will use thestigma and stereotype against
me, and be like"Oh, you can'ttrust her","She manipulates guys
(06:27):
for a living","She lies to guysfor a living","She gets guys to
fall in love with her everynight", Of course she doesn't
really care about you","Ofcourse she doesn't really like
you", and I always think that'sso funny because if I can get
anyone to just fall in love withme every night, why would I need
you?
Why would I want you to fall inlove with me?
Obviously I'm choosing youobviously there's not a lack of
(06:48):
options for me, despite whatpeople might want to think.
I'm choosing to date you andgive you my time when I don't
need to, so it's just silly thatpeople use that as an excuse.
Girls, like disgruntled exeshave used that kind of stuff in
guys' ears, or they've you knowjust been like"Oh, you don't
(07:13):
know about her background","Youdon't know what she's done","You
don't know, blah, blah, blah,blah, blah","Her morals","Her
values are blah, blah, blah,blah, blah".
First of all, what I do for workand how I've chosen to support
myself over the years has neverbeen a reflection of my
character, and also yeah, thereis this stigma for a reason.
There is a stereotype for areason.
There are girls that fit thatstereotype, but stereotypes are
(07:34):
not everybody.
I definitely don't work the sameor carry myself as maybe some of
the other girls.
I am very much about myprinciples and my morals and
that carries over into the waythat I work, into the way that I
date.
I don't carry myself one way inone atmosphere and then behave
(07:55):
differently in another, I'm veryconsistent throughout.
I think that's why my friendsand family value me so much and
appreciate me so much.
I think it can be argued that ifI was dating a healed man, it
wouldn't matter what outsidethird-party perspective, or
people in their ear were sayingabout me and my background.
(08:17):
A healed man should judge me onour time together and my values
and the person that I am.
He shouldn't be able to beinfluenced by what someone else
says about me that doesn't evenknow me, or what someone else
thinks about my background thatdoesn't know anyone in the
industry or anything about theindustry.
I guess a little bit ofbackground and how I got into
this.
I think it's prettystraightforward and pretty
(08:40):
cliche honestly, like the brokecollege student and just wanting
to make money.
My roommate actually got me intoit.
I had only really done it acouple of times, and then my
life started to radically shiftwhen I was 20 years old.
One thing about club life, Ifeel like that world is a
(09:06):
totally separate world.
It's almost like an underworld,I guess you could say in a lot
of ways, and not to be superdramatic, but I almost feel like
Persephone who was taken downinto the underworld and I'm
finally coming back, or like ahero's journey how they have to
go into the underworld and comeback.
(09:27):
Honestly, that's how I feel.
I feel like I was taken into theunderworld for a decade and I'm
finally coming back.
I really feel like it is anotherworld, and part of how I got
into that world is because theoutside world wasn't very kind
to me before.
This is hard to talk about, butI'll do my best without getting
(09:49):
emotional.
The outside world really wasn'tkind to me, and so that kind of
became my world for a reallylong time.
It's easy to get stuck in thatworld.
I found new friendships, newfriends, new family in that
world, and for the first time,in a long time, I felt like I
found people that understood meand had gone through similar
(10:10):
things.
Obviously some of that I readinto a little bit too much, and
I think a lot of it has to dowith getting into that world
when you're really young.
There's a really big differencebetween people who get into that
world, women who get into thatworld in their later twenties or
early thirties or something,versus women that get into it
when they're like 18, 19 20.
(10:32):
You have to think about thatenvironment.
It's probably one of the mosttoxic environments you can be
in, and if you're trying toessentially grow up, like
through adulthood in thatenvironment, you're still
establishing your sense of selfworth and figuring out who you
are and trying to do that inthat really toxic environment is
(10:58):
definitely going to take a toll.
I think a lot of girls start tohave an identity crisis when
they work in that type ofindustry.
It's very cutthroat.
It's very aesthetic based.
Honestly, there's a lot ofthings about it that I think
teach you how real life works.
It's real life shrunk down intoa miniature version.
(11:20):
The themes and stuff that comesup it's like real life and real
world themes that we don'treally talk about, or we pretend
don't exist.
A lot of the dynamics at playare what are at play in real
life.
So how I got into it, the worldwasn't very kind to me.
Something happened to me when Iwas 20 years old that was pretty
(11:42):
traumatic, and I ended up losingall my friends, my job, and a
big part of myself, like a bigpart of my soul honestly, and
that's kinda when I fell intothis world and this lifestyle.
I was super isolated.
The first two years I was inthis world and I was working at
(12:03):
a club.
I didn't even talk to anybody atthe club.
I would just go and work andthen leave.
It was because one of the girlsthat got me into it, she was
like, don't trust the othergirls.
Don't become friends with theother girls, which is valid.
Trust me, but also too, no oneteaches you how to be a dancer.
No one teaches you the game, andit takes time to figure out.
(12:23):
If you don't have people thatput you on, or teach you, or
people that already know andfriends that can help you, it's
going to take you a lot longerto figure shit out.
You're gonna make a lot ofmistakes.
A lot of traumatic stuff isprobably going to happen.
We call those girls babystrippers, a lot of the early
mistakes that you make and earlythings that happen are just
(12:45):
being unaware, not knowing yourworth or whatever.
Then you figure shit out and youstart making money.
Real money, and a lot of timesgirls that get into this
industry, they've never seenreal money before they didn't
come from money and it's fastmoney.
if you don't have any kind ofbackground, any kind of
financial literacy, it'sdefinitely easy to get sucked up
(13:07):
into that world and to get lost.
A lot of girls start to have anidentity crisis around about
year two.
I've seen it happen to so manygirls that happened to myself,
because the more you get suckedinto this world, the more you
lose touch with reality outside.
For years, my only socialconnections were in the club.
(13:27):
I didn't have any friendsoutside of the club.
I didn't really have anyconnections outside of the club
other than my family, of course,but my family doesn't leave
here.
We are close, but I don't talkto my family members on a
day-to-day basis about my life.
That's something that's reallydangerous, not having outside
ties because you start to losetouch with reality and what's
(13:47):
real.
That's how a lot of girls fallinto situations, or they start
to befriend other girls at theclub and thinking that these
girls are their sisters or theirreally good friends, and it's
just like at the end of the day,there's no real friends at the
strip club, trust me.
These girls will screw you over,stab you in the back, betray you
(14:12):
for a customer, for money everysingle time.
For years I put up with stuff.
I put up with that from peoplethat I thought were my best
friends and I would make excusesfor these girls.
I'd be like,"Oh we're all hereto make money, blah, blah,
blah", but at the end of theday, for me to call some of my
friend their values and myvalues should be aligned, and
(14:34):
those values shouldn't changeonce we get to the club.
That's not a real friendship.
That is a colleague or a clubacquaintance, and someone you
make money with.
Making money with someoneshouldn't be the basis for
friendship.
Convenience, proximity, politicsshouldn't be the basis for a
(14:55):
friendship, it's not.
Also too, a lot of things startto become normalized that aren't
normal.
My social world started to getreally small, and of course,
after everything happened, whenI was in college and my social
circle went away.
I didn't really have much of asocial circle to begin with, but
(15:16):
the club culture is just so oddcompared to other social norms,
like when normal civilians willsay they hang out with their
friends all the time.
My friends at the club, we wouldnever hang out outside of work.
We started to but it wasn'tnormal, like it had to be an
event, it was weird.
We would see each other all thetime at work and would feel like
(15:37):
we're hanging out and we'resuper close, but a lot of times
you're so tired because that jobis so physically, emotionally,
spiritually exhausting thatyou're either recovering from
the job when you're not working,you're working on your body,
you're in the gym, you're atbeauty appointments because you
have to stay at this peak levelphysically and aesthetically.
(16:02):
That rivals a full-time job inand of itself.
I started to develop this sortof social anxiety for years.
Especially when I got sick.
I had no social interactionsother than inside the club, and
I feel like when I did develop aconnection with someone outside
the club, I put so much value onthat connection.
(16:25):
For example, if there was a guyI was seeing.
It was so easy for him to takeadvantage of that situation
because he could be doingwhatever while I was at work and
I had no idea.
He could be running around withother girls.
There was even a guy, he had awhole other girlfriend behind my
back and I had no idea because Ihad no other social ties.
(16:46):
I didn't have anyone out seeinghim with this other girl able to
tell me and be like,"Hey girlhe's running around behind your
back".
There was none of that.
I just was so clueless for solong, also I think I felt this
person was my tie to reality.
I just put so much value in thatrelationship, even if it wasn't
(17:07):
good for me, because I hadisolated myself so much for so
many years, and that's also areally dangerous position to put
yourself in.
it wasn't all bad, obviouslythis career path has given me a
lot.
It's introduced me to a lot ofpeople I probably never would've
met.
It's given me a lot ofopportunities I probably never
(17:29):
would have had.
If I had done things a differentway, I'd have a different life
and maybe it would have beenbetter.
Maybe it would've been worse,but I wouldn't be the person
that I am and everything happensfor a reason.
I feel like I am such a positiveperson and I have so much light
in me, that's what they call meSunshine.
I'm very spiritual, and it'scrazy that the universe, God,
(17:53):
put me in this place for solong, which is a very low
vibrational place.
Unfortunately it attracts lowvibrational people for the most
part, a lot of the people thatgo there are sad.
They're missing something.
They're looking for something,and it's definitely shaped the
way I have viewed men over theyears.
(18:15):
How could it not, it attractsmen in their worst moments, a
lot of the time.
When you start to see that nightafter night, and that's all you
see, you start to get a certainlens and it's really hard, so
obviously dating has beendifficult.
Of course, that's not always thecase.
Guys go there to entertainclients, or they go there to
(18:37):
celebrate a bachelor party orsomething.
So it's not always these lowvibrational dudes, or these sad
dudes, or guys that are unhappyin their marriages, or looking
for something, or needvalidation.
Honestly, more often than notit's guys that just need someone
to talk to you and some form ofintimacy.
I don't mean physical intimacy,maybe sometimes, like they
(18:59):
honestly just need a hug.
A lot of times, it's theconnection that these guys go
there for because they don'thave that honestly.
A lot of money comes in and outof these places, especially at
the more high end clubs.
A lot of the clientele is CEOs,entrepreneurs, business owners,
lawyers, doctors, surgeons.
They're not bums.
(19:20):
They're not typical strip clubguy.
I hate when guys come in thereand they're like, I'm not your
average strip club guy.
I'm like, babe, this place isn'tfor average strip club guys,
like in order to have any typeof fun here, you have to have
the disposable income in orderto do so.
Strip clubs, especially high endclubs are designed for men who
(19:43):
it's part of their lifestyle,and they get pleasure and
enjoyment out of spoiling womenand taking care of women.
Sometimes guys are, they'relooking for something else, but
more often than not it'sentertainment, and these are the
types of places that cater tothat type of man.
It's just crazy for society tolook down on women in these
(20:03):
industries, or say that it's acop out or anybody could get
naked, and it's just more oftenthan not the guys that are
coming into these types ofestablishments are the same type
of guys that don't even takemeetings.
You couldn't even get access tothese guys, and now these guys
are paying these women to mentorthem or give them advice or talk
to them, or have a conversationwith them.
(20:26):
For anyone to not see the powerin that role or that position,
it's pretty silly to me, but Idon't know, maybe people have
never thought about it that wayand that's why I feel like it's
important that this stuff istalked about by someone that
actually knows that world andcan shed some light on the
(20:46):
reality.
It's not what you see on TV.
It's not always the in popculture.
Of course, there's the stigmaand the stereotype for a reason,
but most of the women in thereare some of the most ambitious
women that I've ever met.
A lot of them use this as astepping stone and go on to open
businesses or they're supportingtheir families.
(21:07):
In order for you to make it inthis world, and to not have this
world chew you up and spit youout, you have to have a certain
type of character and a certainlevel of grit, and most girls
can't cut it in there.
They don't make it.
Honestly, I joke, I say that Iswim with the sharks every day,
like I'm in the shark tank andif you can make it in that
(21:28):
world, you can make it anywhere.
Unless you're born into wealthor you come about it some other
way.
This is really one of the bestways to wield your power as a
woman, and get ahead.
We don't have to participate inthe patriarchy.
We don't have to participate inthe gender pay gap.
(21:48):
I don't know why that's bad.
Of course there's definitelysome toxic things that go with
the industry.
Of course, there's definitelysome very dark themes that go
on.
At the end of the day, you'reall competing for the bag.
You're all competing againsteach other and being in that
environment every day isdefinitely difficult to
(22:10):
navigate.
I don't like competing againstother women.
A lot of the times, it's noteven your looks, of course your
looks help and it's definitelyeasy to get sucked into that as
well.
Thinking you always have to beworking on something.
You always have to be getting asurgery, you always have to be
getting some kind of a aesthetictreatment done like lasers or
(22:31):
preserving your youth.
I think a lot of times, a lot ofthe early trends, a lot of
things that trend first are inthe club A lot of girls that are
in the club are into theseaesthetic things before the rest
of the girls are, and it'sbecause you have to take such
good care of yourself.
You have to get your nails done,you have to get your lashes
done, you have to get your browsdone, you have to get your hair
done, you have to be in peakphysical shape, you have to have
(22:55):
nice teeth, you have to have anice body.
A lot of girls get their bodiesdone.
A lot of girls get their teethdone.
A lot of girls get their facesdone.
It's such a cutthroatcompetitive world, which
honestly is not great for yourpsyche either, especially when
you're young and you're tryingto establish your sense of self
worth, and you feel like youalways have to be changing
yourself or ever improvingyourself.
(23:17):
Girls that get into it a littlebit later, in their later
twenties, early thirties, theykinda are already established in
who they are, and they're not aseasily influenced or swayed.
That's definitely something thatneeds to be addressed and have
some light shut on.
I have friends that started whenthey were 18.
I have friends that started whenthey were 28, and it's just
completely different.
When you're 18 or whatever, youdon't know the game, you don't
(23:39):
know what's going on.
You don't have friends that gotyou into it.
You honestly, we're probably ina really bad situation, and you
got into it out of desperation.
Then you start to figure stuffout, your situation changes, and
then you stay in it because yousee the opportunity that it's
going to give you.
That it's going to get you whereyou want to go.
A lot of times when women getinto it later, in their later
(23:59):
twenties, early thirties, theygo in with a plan.
They go on with friends.
They know who they are, theyimmediately start making money,
they have an exit strategy.
It's just a completely differentdynamic, so I think we should
give grace and the girls thatgot onto it early should give
themselves a lot of gracebecause it's easy to pass
judgment or be like, why wereyou in this so long?
Why were you doing this for somany years?
(24:21):
Why blah, blah, blah, blah, andit's just these are babies that
got into it.
They didn't even know who theywere and they're thrown into
this toxic environment that's socutthroat, and it takes a while
to figure shit out.
I've met a lot of people that Iprobably wouldn't have
otherwise.
I was connected with people thathave moved my life in huge ways.
(24:44):
I was shown a different way tolive.
I grew up pretty average.
My parents made sure we hadeverything we needed, but we
were middle-class I never wasexposed to real levels of wealth
before.
I never seen that before.
I'd never been on a privateplane before.
I'd never known anyone that hadmade hundreds of millions of
(25:06):
dollars.
I didn't know anyone withgenerational wealth.
I never lived this luxuriouslifestyle before I got into this
world.
Once I was in this world, I wasable to have access to it.
I was able to see a differentlife for myself, and to want a
different life for myself, andto be inspired to want more for
myself, and to see what'spossible.
(25:26):
I also was connected to myfunctional medicine doctor
through someone that I met inthat world.
I never would have got better, Inever would have learned all
these things about myself and mybody if I hadn't had these
connections on these resources.
I'm very grateful.
The club has given me a lot, butit also has taken probably just
(25:47):
as much, if not more from me.
Like I said, I developed reallybad social anxiety for a long
time, because my only socialinteractions were in the club,
as someone else, as Sunshine.
For a long time I struggledbecause I felt like everyone
loves Sunshine, everybody likedSunshine, but people didn't
(26:09):
really like Madeline, and sofiguring that out, finding my
identity again, after that andespecially after battling a
chronic illness and dealing withthat, that was a whole other
thing in itself.
I wasn't the person I was beforeI got sick.
I wasn't the person I was when Iwas sick, and then I had to
figure out who that was after.
(26:31):
I finally started to heal a lotof this and find real motivation
to get out.
I had been trying to get out ofthe club for a long time.
I was trying to figure out whatI was passionate about, what I
wanted to do.
There were so many differentthings I tried to pursue.
Everyone's like,"Oh go into realestate","Oh, go into
pharmaceutical sales","Go intoXYZ".
(26:52):
You're so good at sales, youshould do X, Y, Z", and so of
course, the natural pipeline isthey try to get into some type
of sales.
I took all these differentcourses, took all these
different tests, and I realizedthis isn't really what I want to
do.
I stayed in the club, becausefor a long time, a lot of my
friends were there, I was makingreally good money and I felt
like until I figured out what Iwas passionate about, I wasn't
(27:14):
going to leave.
I wasn't just going to pursuesomething else.
I understand that logic, I do.
I think for a long time I wasway too comfortable in that
world, and I was ignorant to theworld outside.
I didn't have a lot of outsidefriends.
I didn't have a lot of outsideconnections.
For a long time, I really hidmyself in that world and I think
(27:36):
part of that was because of fearand limiting beliefs, and
because of core wounds that Ihadn't healed yet.
I have such core wounds aroundbeing seen.
I know it sounds crazy.
How can you get up on a stagewith the hardly any clothes on
and be in the spotlight and doall these things, where most
(27:58):
people could never be thatvulnerable and couldn't perform
the way that these girls do.
I don't know, maybe because I'vealways been a performer and an
entertainer, it just didn't feelsuper unnatural to me, or maybe
you just get used to it and youget desensitized, but also too,
it's not really me.
I'm never too far away frommyself when I'm at work, but at
(28:21):
the end of the day, that's notme.
That's a persona, that'sSunshine.
That's not Madeline, and so I'mnot really being seen and
showing up authentically andgenuinely as myself.
It's like this character.
I feel like for a long time, Iwas hiding behind this
character.
Especially because like I said,I had been hurt in my personal
(28:41):
life and I think for a long timeI didn't really want to be
Madeline anymore.
It was just easier to beSunshine, which is really sad
when I think about it.
I've done so much healing andnow I love Madeline.
I'll always be grateful forSunshine and the things that I
got from that world, and thetime that I needed that persona
to help me get through life.
(29:04):
As I started to get older, Istarted to heal a little bit.
I started to make moreconnections outside the club and
I started to get uncomfortablein the club.
I think that's when thingsreally started to shift for me,
and also too it just took me along time to figure out what I
wanted to do.
As I started to get more clarityaround that too, I was more
(29:26):
motivated to get out and moreexcited for this next chapter.
The universe makes youuncomfortable, otherwise you
would never move.
You would never change.
Things have never changed.
A lot of my club relationshipswent away.
The environment started to getreally uncomfortable for me.
I started to meet people andmake connections outside of the
club that meant so much to me,and I wanted to be able to spend
(29:49):
more time with them.
As I started to take steps awayfrom the club and spend less
time at the club, I started tofeel different in my body.
There was this constant level ofexhaustion working there and it
started to go away.
I felt like I was so drainedsocially from how much it takes
at the club that once I wasn'tdoing that anymore, I was able
(30:12):
to enjoy being social outside ofthe club.
As an entertainer you're gettingpaid for your time, you're
getting paid for your attention,and so I think it starts to warp
your brain a little bit and youdon't want to do things unless
you're getting paid for yourtime and attention.
It starts to become a part ofthe culture, not wanting to do
stuff.
There's these memes are reelsI've seen about dancers that are
(30:34):
funny, but it's so true.
It really becomes part of thelifestyle.
Like inside outside the club,you start to get paid to party.
You don't want to go placesunless you're getting paid.
If you're going to a party, ifyou're going to a dinner, if
you're going to something, and Ithink that definitely starts to
skew your brain a little bit.
(30:55):
You start to get this weirdsense of entitlement and just
this false sense of reality, andalso you start to lose the joy
of just being social becauseit's just like a job.
I don't know if that is the casefor a lot of entertainers
outside of the sex worker,industry.
Sex workers is basically anumbrella term for anyone in the
(31:17):
adult industry, whether that'sonly fans, whether that's
dancers, whether that's pornstars, whether that's whatever.
Even outside of that, I thinkmaybe anyone in entertainment,
like when you do it for aliving, it's starts to skew
things for you.
You don't want to do stuffunless you're getting paid for
your time.
That's the way I felt for a longtime.
(31:39):
I just was like, why would I goto this?
Why would I do this when I couldjust go to work and get paid to
party instead.
I didn't see the value in socialconnection, social interactions
for a really long time.
When the club world started toget uncomfortable for me, I was
forced to start to make newconnections outside of the club,
and I think that's what reallystarted to change my brain and
(32:02):
shift things for me.
I met someone that I reallydeveloped strong feelings for,
and obviously he wasn't coolwith me working at the club.
A lot of guys, obviously aren'tgoing to be cool with it.
Honestly, I probably wouldn't becool with it.
I don't want to date someonethat entertains other men, other
women for a living.
(32:23):
Especially in that intimate of asetting, it's just not really
something that I would becomfortable with, so I can't
really blame them.
I started to go out with thisguy more.
I took a step back from the cluband I started to really envision
this new life for myself.
This level of exhaustion Iconstantly had from working all
these crazy hours went away.
(32:44):
My body started to feel better.
This job is so physicallyexhausting, you're wearing these
crazy seven inch platform heels.
You're dancing, you're walkingaround, you're contorting
yourself.
It's hard, my back hurts, myknees hurts, my hips are
probably so out of alignment.
I'm pretty sure I have aposterior pelvic tilt because of
working in this industry for somany years.
(33:05):
I started to go out with himsocially and I started to put
myself into social situationsand I finally felt like I was
able to enjoy myself.
I was able to enjoy that part oflife again, and I feel like it
had been almost 10 years since Ifelt that before.
I started to feel like my oldself again, who I was before
started dancing.
The more I spent time with himand the more I spent time
(33:26):
outside of the club world, themore I really wanted to just be
in the real world full time.
I'm so grateful for thatconnection and for him showing
me this world that wasn't kindto me before, a lot has changed.
I've changed a lot since then,and I started to be excited
(33:48):
about a new life and a newfuture.
I hadn't really wanted this newlife enough for me to really
take the steps to move my lifeout of that world.
In the past year, my life hascompletely changed.
It's almost unrecognizable.
I have this whole new careerpath.
I have a whole new socialcircle.
I have all new goals and I feelmore myself than I have in
(34:12):
probably a decade.
I feel like I'm finally steppinginto the highest version of
myself and who I've always beenmeant to be.
Although I'm grateful for allthe lessons and everything I
learned in that world.
I'm just so excited for thisnext chapter, and I know that a
lot of the lessons andeverything I integrated from
(34:32):
that world and that life arewhat is going to propel me
forward and get me where I needto go, but that world and that
life just doesn't really fitanymore.
I'm just really grateful to thisperson, and also just to myself
for how hard I've worked,because it's scary doing
something different.
It definitely hasn't been easygetting over my social anxiety,
(34:54):
and believing myself, steppinginto this new version, this new
timeline.
Part of what I want to do withthis podcast is change the
narrative.
I feel like there's thissocietal stigma and these
stereotypes.
Of course, some of them arethere for a reason.
There's definitely some girlsthat live up to the stereotype
for sure, but I think thebiggest part is the stigma is
(35:15):
because it's a female dominatedfield.
Yes, there are male strip clubs,but those guys don't make nearly
the same amount of money becausewomen don't spend nearly the
same amount of money as guys doin these types of
establishments.
In this world, like I said,these very powerful men, not
(35:37):
always, there's definitely somebeta males that come in there
and they come in there becausethey think they can have some
power and they act some type ofway, but that's a totally
separate thing.
I could talk about that onfuture episodes, but these super
powerful guys come into mydomain where I work, and then I
have the local star power, I'mthe one with power, and I think
(36:01):
that's why there's a stigma.
I think if men could make thesame kind of money doing the
same types of things, therewouldn't be a stigma at all.
Men just don't like when womenhave power and when women are
able to wield their power in anyway over men, and I'm not saying
that these girls aremanipulative or doing anything
(36:21):
wrong.
They are embracing a power thatthey have and men don't like
that stuff.
It makes men uncomfortable.
Obviously not the men that arein there.
They love that, eat that stuffup.
That's why they're there, butsociety doesn't like it, the
patriarchy doesn't like it.
This honestly goes back from thebeginning.
Jesus and his number one,disciple, Mary Magdalen, the
(36:45):
disciple of all disciples,there's different
interpretations, but MaryMagdalen was basically the
female entity, the feminineenergy to the male masculine
energy that was Jesus.
They were basically doing thesame thing and a lot of her work
was erased from the Bible.
(37:05):
She's still mentioned in there,but a lot of her work is not in
there, and a part of it isbecause she had a lot of power
and she associated with womenthat were sinners, and anything
that has to do with sacredsexuality, anything that has to
do with women in power, anythingthat has to do with high
priestesses and what they weredoing.
(37:27):
Any time in history when womenhad real power, It was violently
erased from history books.
A lot of high priestesses werecalled witches and the whole
Salem witch hunt was abouttaking power away from women,
taking land away from women,taking resources away from
women.
(37:47):
There's just so many instancesin our history where women had
power and they had to bedemonized somehow, and they had
to have their power strippedaway from them.
I think that's why this wholeindustry is stigmatized.
We have made so much progress asa collective.
We've come so far.
We are so woke now as acollective and we're still so
(38:09):
behind in this one particularindustry this one particular
sector, when it comes to womenusing their bodies or using
their feminine energy to getahead.
The whole Trad Wife trend andthe Pilates Princess, stay at
home wife, stay at homegirlfriend thing is just so
(38:30):
glorified, and it's like thesewomen aren't even in their
feminine energy.
They're in their masculineenergy and they're being
performative.
The fifties housewife was not inher feminine energy.
She was being performative andcatering to and working for a
man, her man.
It's just if you're not workingfor yourself, you're working for
your man.
I think men would prefer it thatway.
(38:51):
They don't want us to be workingfor ourselves, so of course the
Pilates Princess, the Trad Wife,that stuff is going to be
glorified and any woman who'sout there trying to make her own
money, and support herself isgoing to be demonized.
It's also crazy to me that guyshave tried to call me a gold
digger when I make my own moneyand I don't need anything from
(39:13):
them.
Anything that I require Iprovide for myself.
I don't need any man foranything that I'm going to have
in this life.
I'm going to get it myself.
Of course, I would love a manfor his companionship, for his
inspiration, for his leadership,but I don't need you, and then
the women that are just stay athome whatever, that don't have
(39:36):
their own ambitions, that don'twork, that are just with them
for the lifestyle that they canprovide.
Those women are not called golddiggers.
I'm just confused on thatnarrative.
It doesn't really make sense tome, but anyways.
People saying that being an onlyfans girl or being a dancer or
being a porn star or beingwhatever is taking the easy way
(39:57):
out or a cop out, but what iseasy about being naked or being
next to naked and beingvulnerable and having to perform
and be entertaining at the sametime, no matter how you're
feeling that day.
No matter what's going on withyou internally, you could be
having a bad day, you could begoing through a breakup, you
could be sick and you still haveto be hot.
(40:19):
You still have to be charming.
You still have to beperformative.
I can't speak so much for theseother women in other parts of
the industry, the adultentertainment industry, but as a
dancer, what is easy aboutcompeting against a hundred
other women every night, stayingin peak physical condition,
keeping yourself to a certainaesthetic at all times.
(40:40):
Keeping up with your beautyappointments.
When you're not working, you'reat an appointment, or you're out
at the gym, or you're going totherapy to make sure you're
healed enough to even do thisjob and integrate everything
that goes on and everything youhave to deal with mentally.
The mental toll, and emotionaltoll that this job takes, it's
just crazy, but anyways what iseasy about having to profile a
(41:01):
room every night.
Every night you're starting fromnegative.
You start from negative and youhave to build up from negative.
How many people go to work everyday, potentially working the
entire shift with less moneythan they came with.
It doesn't matter how good youare at your job, sometimes it's
just not your night.
This isn't the type of job thatyou can just go through the
(41:22):
motions.
If your energy is off, you'renot going to make money.
It doesn't matter if you're thehottest girl in the club.
If your energy's off.
It's just a waste of time, andyou're not going to make money
and you're going to leavenegative.
Imagine going to work all nightand leaving negative, it happens
even to some of the top girls.
I think that's why a lot of thegirls are very spiritual and
very in tune with themselvesbecause you have to be.
(41:43):
You have to be so aware of yourenergy and what you're bringing
into the club every night, andyou have to be also so aware of
everyone else's energy aroundyou and how you're engaging with
that energy and how it'sengaging with you.
Being able to sit in a room andprofile people and immediately
look at a guy and be able toknow this guy looks like he's
going to spend money.
(42:04):
Most of the time it's not eventhe guys that you would expect.
There's body language that youhave to pick up on.
Of course, the way a guy'sclothes fit him, but a lot of
times guys that are trying tolook like they have money, don't
actually have money.
The guys that are flexing arenever the ones that spend money.
The guys that talk about howmuch money they have, are never
the ones that have money.
Wealth whispers.
That is one of the biggestthings if you don't know that,
(42:25):
you'll learn that in the club,but yeah, it's just very minute
details.
The way someone's clothes fitthem, the material of their
clothes, the way their bodylanguage is, how relaxed they
are, what drink they ordered,how they walk into the club,
their body language when theywalk into the club, how fast
they sit down, where they sitdown, there's just so many
things.
It's so calculated and it's socerebral.
(42:46):
The skills that I havedeveloped, you cannot teach.
You can not teach these skills.
The amount of CEOs and businessowners that talk to me and they
think that I've gone to businessschool just because of
everything that I know andeverything that I've learned.
Of course I have invested in mycraft.
I probably read more salesbooks, books on personal
development, and books on humaninteraction and communication
(43:09):
and interpersonal relationshipsthen most people, but also it's
a lot of on the job skills thatI've learned.
So what's easy about competingagainst a hundred different
girls, immediately having toprofile everyone in the room.
Then having to sell yourself,sell the room, you have to
(43:29):
quickly build instant rapportwith these guys, you have to
build an instant connection.
You have to figure out whythey're really there.
You have to cater to that.
You have to chameleon yourpersonality to cater to this
person.
You have to be what thisperson's looking for.
You have to mold yourpersonality, your sales pitch,
(43:50):
your demeanor to what thisperson is looking for and what
they're needing that night.
You have to deal with a lot ofrejection also, and you have to
be able to bounce backimmediately.
If you get rejected, you can letthat ruin your entire night.
No, you got to dust yourself offand put yourself back out there
and try again.
There's also a whole group ofmen that come there just to be
mean to women.
Men that have no real power,just come in there to feel like
(44:13):
they have some sense of powerand literally are there to be
mean to you and to try to breakyou down.
Especially on those days whenyou're already having a horrible
day, and you really don't wantto be there, but you force
yourself to be there, and thenthere's this guy that has just
come in there to be mean to youand break you down, and you have
to deal with it and keep itmoving.
What is easy about that?
People saying that girls arejust selling their bodies or
(44:38):
dirty or whatever, but thinkabout it logically.
The whole goal of being a danceris selling your time and selling
as much of your time as you can.
So if you were dirty or you'regiving the guy why he wants
immediately, he's not going tocontinue to spend money.
That's not the way that you getcustomers or guys to spend money
(45:01):
on you and invest in you formonths on end for years on end.
You have to be strategic.
You have to be cerebral.
You have to cater to theirpsyche for hours on end.
You have to have a really goodmouthpiece.
You have to be really good atconversating.
You have to be really good atcommunicating.
Bulding instant rapport,competing with a hundred other
goals, and using sales andpsychological techniques while
(45:26):
also being sexy, witty andcharming.
I don't personally know a lot ofpeople that could just do that
and could thrive at that and Idon't think that's the cop-out
or the easy way out.
I don't think there's anythingeasy about that.
I think it's a lot easier to sitat a desk, or crunch some
numbers or do whatever.
I'm not trying to look down onanyone that does that, I'm not
(45:48):
trying to look down on anyonethat's a stay at home Trad Wife
or a Pilates Princess orwhatever.
It's just girls in the industrydon't talk shit about these
people, so why is everyonetalking shit about us?
It's just weird.
I think a lot of it is becausethey probably couldn't do it.
These women are ambitious, thesewomen are working for
themselves, these women areincredibly intelligent.
Not all of them of course, butthere's a good number of them.
(46:12):
Half the time I'm smarter thanthe guys that I talked to you in
the club and me acting like I'mnot as smart as I am or dumbing
myself down, or allowing myselfto be underestimated, that's
strategic.
I don't mind beingunderestimated.
I don't mind guys thinking thatthey're smarter than me.
Gauging that, what men are goingto value my brain and my
(46:32):
intelligence, and what men aregoing to value other things, and
playing up either part.
I don't want to emasculatesomeone and mess up my own
money.
Having to learn to cater todifferent personalities and
different situations at the dropof a hat is definitely not an
easy skill to learn, but again,people usually hate up.
I'm really not criticized byanyone doing more than me.
(46:55):
I would never trade places witha lot of the people that are
talking shit about me, or wantto make their assumptions about
me and my background and whatI've done.
I've made mistakes in my life.
Everybody has, but I've owned upto everything and everything
that's happened and everythingthat I've gone through has made
me the person that I am.
I have learned so much about menin this world through this
(47:18):
career path, because I've spentthousands of hours talking to
men and analyzing and assessingmen.
A lot of it has helped me in myrelationships for sure.
It's crazy to me that men wantto say that dancers wouldn't be
good girlfriends or wouldn't beloyal.
That doesn't even make any sensebecause we see men in their
(47:39):
worst moments all the time,night after night, and also
we've interacted and engagedwith so many different men.
When we do meet a good man andwe are with a good man, why
would we mess that up?
I'm not out needing validationor attention.
I get plenty of validation andattention.
When I'm not at work, I'mwearing the biggest baggies
clothes.
I have no makeup on, my hair isnot done.
(48:01):
I don't want to be perceived.
I'm like, please leave me alone.
You don't ever have to worryabout me.
You don't have to worry aboutwhose eyes are on me because my
eyes are always going to be onmy man.
You don't have to worry about menot being loyal because I've had
to engage and spend time with somany different men, so if I meet
a good one and I find a goodone, I know I got a good one.
(48:23):
I don't need to question it.
I don't need to fumble himbecause I didn't know what else
is out there.
I know what's out there and I'mnot worried about any other guy.
I'm only worried about my guy.
That argument doesn't even makeany sense.
It probably comes out ofinsecurity.
Obviously, I've learned a lotand I'm still learning, but I
(48:43):
know that like I'm probably wayahead of the game.
I know a lot more than theaverage girl when it comes to
the male psyche, and also thingsthat work on guys or the way I
have to treat or deal with guysat the club, is not the way I'm
trying to deal with my man.
If I have to treat him like acustomer, why would I want him,
(49:05):
why would I date him?
If I had to manipulate a guythat I'm dating, I'm not dating
that guy.
That's gross.
That grosses me out.
If you're acting like acustomer, or I have to treat you
like a customer in order for youto act right?
You might as well be a customer.
I want to man that is nothinglike the men that I have to
engage with at work, becausemost of the time, the guys that
(49:28):
come into the club are sad, andthey're missing something in
their life.
That's just not someone that Iwant to build a life with.
No offense to these men, but Idon't want to engage
romantically with someone that'sunhappy, with someone that's
sad, with someone that's missingsomething in their lives,
someone that doesn't know whothey are, someone that's lost.
Guys never had to worry about mefalling in love with someone
(49:50):
while I'm at work if I'm datingsomeone.
It's just funny to me, honestly.
I know that was a lot andthere's honestly so many more
things I could get into withthis and I'll probably make
future episodes on it.
I'm still figuring out what Iwant to share and what feels
appropriate, because again Idon't want this entire podcast
(50:13):
to be about my past, because I'mreally trying to step into my
future and into this newtimeline.
That's the part that I want toshed the light on.
Of course the lessons from mybackground are what made me who
I am, and have given me thiswisdom.
Without this world that has beensuch a big part of my life for
(50:33):
so long, I wouldn't be theperson that I am.
I wouldn't have the wisdom thatI do.
I've spent tens of thousands ofhours in conversation with top
businessmen, entrepreneurs, andthat's why I have the mind that
I do.
Figuring out different psychesand diving into the male psyche,
and diving into differentdynamics amongst the girls.
(50:56):
I have pretty high level skillswhen it comes to interpersonal
relationships and communication,because of the world that I've
been in.
That's why I have all of thisdepth and this wisdom and that's
why I wanted to come out andtalk about it and share, but
again I don't want my past toovershadow my future.
(51:18):
I'm not trying to use my pastfor clout, or attention to get
my platform where it wants togo.
I'm coming out about this nowbecause I want to control the
narrative and I want to addressit before I get big and before
other people try to come outabout it before I'm ready and
(51:38):
shame me for it.
This took a lot of bravery, so Ireally appreciate everyone for
listening and for being therefor me.
I hope that me coming out andtalking about my past inspires
other women like me to not beashamed of where they come from,
and to come out and pursue theirnext venture, and to not be
(52:02):
afraid of their past coming backto haunt them or tear them down.
Not to be so self-important, butif I could just wedge the door
open for these girls, the girlsafter me can shatter the
ceiling.
Not that I'm this liketrailblazer for sex workers or
trailblazer for the hoe's orsomething, and also I say hoes,
(52:23):
reclaiming that word too.
I'm not a hoe and none of thesegirls are hoes.
I think that the narrativeshifts, when more people like me
come forward and force it toshift and they force it to
change.
I have friends in other parts ofthe adult entertainment
industry.
I'm not an expert on any of theother ones by any means, but
(52:44):
with people hating on only fansgirls, it's just those girls are
business women at the end of theday, and they are smart.
They're making so much money,and it's not just about being
hot.
It's about psychology and it'sabout marketability, and these
women are using what they'vebeen given to their advantage.
(53:05):
These women are investing inthemselves and investing in
their future.
I don't think that's somethingthat we should ever look down
on.
Women that are taking orcreating opportunities for
themselves, that's amazing.
I think that more women and morepeople in general should be like
that.
Seizing opportunities foryourself to move your life
forward and not being dependenton anyone else, and having the
(53:28):
resources then to give back,give back to your family, give
back to your community and tobuild a legacy for yourself,
that's amazing.
I don't think that's anything weshould ever hate on.
Again, I think it comes fromjealousy.
I think it comes from thepatriarchy.
I think it comes from otherwomen that wish they could do
the same thing that aren't, andinstead of hating on each other,
why don't we just learn fromeach other and inspire each
(53:49):
other to be better.
Those are just my thoughts.
Anyways, this was reallydifficult for me to record and I
probably didn't even addresseverything that I wanted to
address.
I'm sure there'll be futureepisodes on this, but this was
just my first little coming outepisode, I guess you could say.
I'm really proud of myself forsharing this.
(54:11):
I know everyone in my circlealready knows, but I've never
publicly spoken out about mybackground.
I hope that this reaches theright people and it helps the
right people.
I'm excited for this new chapterand everything to come.
I really appreciate everyonethat's supported me and everyone
that encouraged me to recordthis episode because I was
(54:32):
really scared, and I'm realizingevery day that there's really
nothing to be afraid of in thislife.
Being fully yourself and beingauthentic is really the only way
you're going to get where youwant to go.
If you like this episode, if youlike my podcast, if you like
what I'm trying to do, pleaseshare this.
Like it, subscribe, leave areview.
It really does help me.
(54:53):
I really just want this to beable to reach and help as many
people as possible, and itreally means the world to me.
Thanks guys, love you, bye.
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