August 24, 2025 • 45 mins
In this episode of Café con Pam, Pam chats with Abigail Vera, a super inspiring 17-year-old from Imperial, California, who turned her struggles with mental health and bullying into something totally unique—a board game all about navigating the ups and downs of high school.
Abigail opens up about what it was like being the eldest daughter in a Mexican American family, why talking about mental health matters (especially in Latino households), and how creating “High School: The Game” has helped her—and others—start real conversations about what teens actually go through.
This episode is all about breaking stigmas, finding confidence, and celebrating creativity in the Latinx community.
Check out today's sponsor Savvy Ladies, a nonprofit organization dedicated to helping women like YOU take control of your financial future. They offer free resources, webinars, and my favorite: a free financial helpline where you can connect one-on-one with trusted financial experts. Visit www.savvyladies.org today and connect with the financial helpline to get the personalized support you deserve. Your journey to financial independence starts here.
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*The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the views of BMO. BMO sponsors the podcast but does not influence or endorse the specific discussions or viewpoints shared herein. BMO Bank N.A. Member FDIC*
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/cafe-con-pam--6348411/support.
Abigail opens up about what it was like being the eldest daughter in a Mexican American family, why talking about mental health matters (especially in Latino households), and how creating “High School: The Game” has helped her—and others—start real conversations about what teens actually go through.
This episode is all about breaking stigmas, finding confidence, and celebrating creativity in the Latinx community.
Check out today's sponsor Savvy Ladies, a nonprofit organization dedicated to helping women like YOU take control of your financial future. They offer free resources, webinars, and my favorite: a free financial helpline where you can connect one-on-one with trusted financial experts. Visit www.savvyladies.org today and connect with the financial helpline to get the personalized support you deserve. Your journey to financial independence starts here.
Check out BMO here
Do you want to support our show and get ad-free episodes? Join our Supporters Club here.
Follow Abigail on all things social:
Website 10% off with code STAYSHINING
Follow Cafe con Pam on all things social:
Get on the waitlist for Un Verano con Self Love
Subscribe on YouTube
Listen to Cafe con Pam
Take our Calladita Culture®️ Quiz
Get your business on El Mercadito
Learn more about Pam
To support the show, an easy way to do it is to leave a review. Your feedback definitely helps other listeners connect and see if this is a podcast they could resonate with. To make it easy for you, here are some quick questions to think about when you’re leaving a review:
- What do you love about the show?
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- Social media. Follow @cafeconpampodcast on Instagram and Facebook.
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*The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the views of BMO. BMO sponsors the podcast but does not influence or endorse the specific discussions or viewpoints shared herein. BMO Bank N.A. Member FDIC*
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/cafe-con-pam--6348411/support.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
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financial freedom can start today. Welcome back to Kavakombam the
(02:28):
bilingual Podcastorias Sin sansa ELOI. We have a conversation with
Sara a A. Yail is an artist, entrepreneur and creative
visionary who's loved storytelling, board games, film, and so much
more since as long as she can remember. Her biggest
inspirations are her friends and family, which is always trying
(02:50):
to make laugh. She came up with the idea for
this board game in a summer when she was just
sixteen years old, and this conversation with Abigail is first,
I think she's the youngest guest we've ever had a
Kava Kampam, so she's still not even eighteen years old.
And I was like, is your mom gonna be there?
(03:13):
And the mom was like, no, she can do the interview,
which she did amazing, And I think she's so inspiring
because at such a young age. We talked about what
it was like for her to deal with school bullying,
We talked about mental health. We talked about how she
turned her struggle into this amazing board game that she
(03:37):
created and now it's ready for you to purchase. So
I think this is a conversation if you have young
people in your life, definitely something you can listen to
and tune in to. We don't necessarily talk about We
don't go deep into the bullying that happened, so I
don't think I need to do a trigger warning around it,
though we do talk that she was being bothered and
(04:02):
how she turned this challenge and what she was dealing
with into something awesome that helps others and can support
other people's mental health, which I think it's amazing. You've
seen in Mass. Here's my conversation with Abigail. But Abigail,
(04:25):
welcome to Capa Combine.
Speaker 1 (04:26):
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (04:27):
How are you doing this morning? How's your mental health?
Speaker 1 (04:30):
I'm doing good. Yeah, I think I'm just still tired
because I'm not used to waking up early. I know.
Speaker 2 (04:38):
I saw the seven o'clock listeners, and I saw the
booking come in the calendar invite at seven, and I
was like, Okay, she must be an early bird.
Speaker 1 (04:57):
It was just the best time that we could schedule for.
But it's not that I'm an early word at home.
Speaker 2 (05:04):
It's like the only way I could, the only time
I could. Yeah, okay. So the first question we always
we start with is what is your heritage.
Speaker 1 (05:13):
I am a Mexican, Mexican American because of where I live,
but Mexican in my blood.
Speaker 2 (05:20):
Nice. And you're in California, you're nail Center.
Speaker 1 (05:23):
Yes, well right now, I'm an Imperial Okay.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
So I love your story because you not only decided
to speak out and speak up about mental health, which
is something that, especially in Latino families, is kind of
taboo still, you know, like, yes, I started Kava Kombam
(05:49):
back in twenty sixteen, and my friend Priscilla She. Her
Instagram name is the Humble Therapist. She I asked her
to come to Kavakampam to talk about mental health once
a month because to me, mental health was so important
and people listening my friends would tell me you're such
(06:15):
a privileged girl because you get to talk about mental health.
We don't do that. We just go to work or
noire or whatever it is. And I was like, oh,
how sad. No, And this is back in twenty sixteen.
(06:35):
Since then, things have changed, thankfully to the better. We're
not quite I don't think at that place where you know,
Latinos can freely talk about mental health, especially men, I think.
But I love that you decided to not only say
I'm struggling with this, but also you created a game. Yeah,
(06:58):
how long did you deal with that? Without telling anyone?
Speaker 1 (07:03):
With my mental health struggles for for at least a year,
And I know that it was It wasn't mainly because
of the quote that culture of of like, oh that's
it's not real, or like let's not talk about that,
or like like not like or like like that's why
(07:24):
I was always like I always felt like okay, like
I shouldn't say anything or like I maybe I'm not
going through anything. This is nothing real or like. And
it's until like I started learning, like from school and
stuff like that I was going through something and like
I needed to speak out about it. So it was
a few years, yeah, I would say, because I was
around twelve when I really was hitting me more.
Speaker 2 (07:48):
Oh my gosh, I mean that's young. So here's the data.
There's a Confidence Code for girls study that was done
and between eight and fourteen years old, girls confidence levels
drop by thirty percent. And you were twelve, Yes, and
(08:10):
so it proves this study true that between eight and
fourteen girls confidence drops, mental health challenges start appearing, and
are overall well beaten, just kind of goes down the drain. Yes,
(08:30):
And could we say that it's probably worse if you
don't have a space to talk about.
Speaker 1 (08:37):
Yes, it definitely is, because when I felt like I
couldn't talk to anyone about it, I was just going
through it on my own. And it's psychological torture on
its own, telling yourself that you're not that it's not
real totally.
Speaker 2 (08:52):
So what did you do?
Speaker 1 (08:54):
Well? What made me speak up about it was that
because this was during the pandemic or no yeah, and
so we were on Zoom and so they would do
mental health chickens. My school would do like mental health
chickens like that. We would fill out a Google form
and seeing like have you felt how have you felt
in the past week, and have you felt sad? Mad?
(09:17):
I'm anxious, And then I would fill out the things
and then I was really and it said like if
you clicked more than one of anxious or mad in
the last one, then then you should talk to the counselor.
And I did click off a lot, and so I
realized that I was like wait, Like that kind of
made me realize like, oh, this is something real and
(09:39):
I need to talk about it. So I come in
contact with the counselor. I didn't tell my parents about
it at first, and then until I met with a
counselor and she told me that I needed therapy and everything.
And then that's when I told my parents about it.
And at first, like they were kind of shocked, but
they were supportive the whole way through.
Speaker 2 (09:59):
Do you have some yes, what number are you?
Speaker 1 (10:03):
I'm the first, I'm the oldest.
Speaker 2 (10:05):
You're the eldest daughter. Yeah, welcome to the eldest daughter life.
I'm an eldest daughter, and I it's hard. It's hard
to because you have to break the barrier, you know,
you have to yes be the first in so many ways.
And how was it for you first to be seen
(10:31):
to literally someone tell you, know, what you're going through
is not in your head, what you're going through, You're
not making it up, what you're going through is real.
How was that for you?
Speaker 1 (10:41):
Well, that it was definitely it was really like overwhelming,
a little bit like shocking. I mean I was already
like I was going through a lot of emotions, and
I just felt like, Okay, well now I have this
other thing that I have to burden people with. And
so I've always like thought of like people and I'm
not so much of like what I'm going through. I
(11:02):
always thought like what now, what are people gonna think
of me?
Speaker 2 (11:05):
Now?
Speaker 1 (11:06):
What are like now? What's what's gonna happen now? Or
like and why I'm why am I going through this?
Why am I feeling this? And but I mean at
least I felt like at least there was a name
to put on it. And even now I still struggle,
like with those same thoughts of like it's not real
or like you're not. I'm not because they're like just
(11:27):
like stop, like shut up, like about those things. Like
it's just like it's just your your brain. You're telling
yourself things to get attention, to get attention. My brain
tells me that, and and it's really hard because it's
like it says like, oh, like you're just doing this
to get attention, right, Like you're just faking it just
so you could you could get an attention right and
(11:50):
people to talk to you. And it's just like it's
obviously that's not the truth. But it's what has what
I struggle with like a lot.
Speaker 2 (12:01):
How do you overcome it?
Speaker 1 (12:03):
I just every day I have to like tell myself
that that it is real, and I have to just
like I have to say it out a lot a
lot of times, or like just like talk to other
people about how I feel and just saying like this
is what I'm going through and like and and like
just the people that I trust and and just seeing
that that that it's it's not the end of the world.
(12:27):
It's if it is something that like it's that I
can overcome it and I can't go I can I
can still live functionally. I just have to work a
little harder than most people.
Speaker 2 (12:39):
Did you deal with bullying?
Speaker 1 (12:41):
Yes?
Speaker 2 (12:43):
Were you afraid to talk about mental health and and
then maybe be like oh mass my one most.
Speaker 1 (12:50):
Then yes, because I was. I think that's actually partly
why I my mental health went down was because of
the bully. Of course, I had a lot of toxic
friendships growing up, and and I would always again, I
would always guesslight myself and going like like oh, these
are your friends, these these people care about you, or
(13:12):
these they're they're just like it's your fault. You're the
one that's that's being bad.
Speaker 2 (13:17):
Like I would tell my gosh, sometimes.
Speaker 1 (13:21):
Yeah, And I would be like telling myself like you know,
like like I need to fix it, I need to
do something better. I need to and I need to
be a better friend. Why am I being selfish? Like
and like and so, And really what it was is
like they would they they would always be they would
never care about what I had to say. They would
(13:43):
like we would always just do whatever they wanted to do,
and when I would say anything, they would just like
they would ignore me or just look at me weird,
like as if I said something weird. If I try
to stay try to include myself in the conversation. It's
not like I would try to talk just about myself.
I would hear what they were talking about, and I
was trying to like add something to it. Like they're
(14:06):
saying like, oh, we went to the pool, and it's like, oh, yeah,
I went to the pool too. I did this right.
But then they would like shut me down, or I
would say a joke and they would pretend like they
didn't get it, or I would I would feel overwhelmed
a lot, and like I would start crying, and then
they would immediately just try to get me to shut out.
They would be like like like like, calm down, Abby,
calm down, it's not a big deal. Just just be cool,
(14:26):
like stop crying, and like and and so I was
already like kind of like being conditioned like to like
you can't show your emotions, yeah, to shove it down.
And so and then like they would always constantly like
make fun of me, like saying like your family's weird
(14:48):
or you're and they would say like or they would
say like, oh, well we're like we're two years older
than because one of them was two years older than
me and she was like, oh, well, I'm well I'm
more mature than you, so I know more than you.
It's like I'm ten in your twelve and so, but
(15:09):
I'm sure you're more mature than me, right and so
and she would be like like, oh, yeah, you're or
like I know more, I have more experience in my life,
so you don't know what you're talking about, or you're
just done or like and these ones I had inside
and outside of school, it was just like.
Speaker 2 (15:30):
Kind of a lover yeah, because you live in a
relatively small town.
Speaker 1 (15:34):
Now, yes, so everyone knows each other. See.
Speaker 2 (15:40):
So when you finally went to that counselor, and the
counselor was like, no, yes, there's something happening. What did
you do with the friendships?
Speaker 1 (15:54):
Well, those I I for sure I had let go
of them. And how was that for you?
Speaker 2 (16:00):
Did you see that?
Speaker 1 (16:03):
Well, it was hard because what happened was that we
moved away to like we're still stayed in the same
county we've always been, but we've moved to like different
cities within the same in Pero Valley. So back then
I was living in the smallest town in Hopeville. So
that's why we all knew each other and everything, and
so and there was this moment like where I had
(16:25):
actually told them how I was feeling, like. I was saying, like,
I feel ignored. I feel like you're being like you've
say mean things to me, and then's that and then
one of them she just one of them, she didn't
say anything, she just kind of stayed quiet. And then
the other one that hurt me the most, she just
said like, oh, well, that's not our problem.
Speaker 2 (16:44):
Wow. Yeah, And You're like, well, then you're not my friend.
Speaker 1 (16:49):
Exactly, and so like that's why. That's when I decided
to let go. And I was like, yeah, I just
like I'm not gonna already try to fix things, and
they just and it's like, okay, it's not your problem.
Then you're not my problem either.
Speaker 2 (17:03):
So it was easier now, Yeah, I was a little easier.
Speaker 1 (17:07):
But it was still hard because then I felt like
because then I didn't have anyone else, I didn't have
any friends, and then you moved, yeah, and so I
was like I was I felt really lonely because I
felt like the only friends I ever had weren't really my.
Speaker 2 (17:20):
Friends and then like all of them and you have
no friends.
Speaker 1 (17:23):
Yeah, and that was really hard for me, and I
think all of that because of the anxiety that they
would cause me, and like the the self confidence lowering,
so much of like me thinking that I was the
problem and like I was doing something wrong or if
something annoying, because they would always like think like I
was annoying, or like because I was more like outgoing,
(17:46):
I guess, and like I would always I was always
having like organized plans like oh, let's do this, like
this is a fun activity we could do together, and
they would never listen to me. And so I was like, Okay,
well I'm weird.
Speaker 2 (17:57):
Yeah, I'm just not good people.
Speaker 1 (17:59):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (18:00):
No, But forty percent of teen girls feel extremely confident
that they can make new friends compared to fifty five
percent of teen boys. So and this is a binary study,
(18:22):
but girls are eighteen percent less likely than boys to
define themselves as confident. And this is a confidence study.
So it's all about confidence. But I think it goes
back to the mental health known like, yes, one in
four high school boys think they would have a successful
career in math or economics compared to one in seven
(18:45):
high school girls. And I would argue, based on what
you're telling me that there's so many other pressures that
girls go through that may you know, weave that into
into the the reality of it. This is this is interesting.
(19:06):
Dads are twenty six percent more likely to accurately estimate
their child's confidence and moms. Now, I don't know who
they surveyed, right, So I don't know if we could
say that this is true for Latino parents because usually
dads don't talk. I don't know. Oh, dads are significantly
(19:29):
better at evaluating their son's confidence and moms are at
evaluating their daughters. The error for moms is even more
pronounced when their daughters have low confidence. Wow. The low
confidence gap leads to women not to finding confidence and
valuing it well enough for themselves. Biases don't lessen as
they age, leading moms to continue to expect more from
(19:52):
their daughters as they expect as they were expected of them.
So it's this trick effect because moms, women have this
expectation and they almost put the pressure on their daughters
and they inaccurately. I would say you're doing fine, when
(20:13):
in reality you're not.
Speaker 1 (20:14):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (20:16):
And so as you are dealing with this, you move,
you find yourself without friends. You have to make new friends.
When does the game start? When do you get the
idea of like, let me start this game.
Speaker 1 (20:31):
This was last year, exactly last year, last summer. I've
always really liked board games, which is one thing that
again past my own toxic friends, they didn't want to
play those board games with me. But now I have
friends who do want me to play board games with me.
And so there's one of my best friends. We really
(20:53):
liked the Game of Life.
Speaker 2 (20:55):
Such a long game. Yeah, you can play that the
game for hours.
Speaker 1 (21:00):
Yeah. And my friend really liked that game. She was
always like, she always would come, she would come to
my house and say, oh, let's play a game of Life.
Let's play the Game of Life. But after a while
we kind of got bored, like we already knew all
the cards, we already knew like how it went. And
so I was like, what if I made something that
was more realistic and relatable to us? And so that's
(21:21):
what I came up with high school, the game Nice.
And so that's when I thought like I wanted to
make something that first of all, that was more realistic.
So in the sense of I didn't want I did.
There were some critiques I had about the Game of Life, like,
for example, that the the currency was money, right, and
(21:41):
that the way to win is to have the most money. Yes,
And so if you really think about that in perspective
of life, then it's teaching kids that life is about
getting the most.
Speaker 2 (21:51):
Money, only about money.
Speaker 1 (21:53):
Yeah, yeah, And like to me, it's like, well, money
is important obviously, like for the central things, right, but
money is not going to buy you happiness, right, It's
not going to bring you as much really, it is
not going to guarantee you joy in life. And so
it's and it's and winning in life isn't having money.
(22:16):
To me, winning in life is having the most happiness
and being most fulfilled and successful in life is your
mental health and how and the people that you have
around you, right, that's being successful in life. And so
that's when I changed in my high school the game.
So the currency is happiness, and especially like especially because
(22:38):
if it's high school, then high schoolers are broke. So
there's obviously what it makes sense to make it money.
So I had happiness so because and that's where the
mental health ties in. So the person with the most
happiness tokens or little tokens, And the person with the
most happiness tokens is the one who wins the game,
(22:58):
and so there's the different things in the game. So
there's like I made it in a way that it
was also relatable to teenagers, like I wanted to make
something that was funny. Also like it's it's really like
interactive and like fun but also like not taking itself
too seriously and like it's just like it's just like
(23:20):
it's it's a funny way of seeing but it's if
you really look at it, it's like real experiences that
high schoolers go through, and like there's different decision making
and events, and then there's classes. There's all these different
things that are involved in it.
Speaker 2 (23:35):
Where you within the game.
Speaker 1 (23:37):
Within the game, yeah, and so for example, there's the classes.
You get to see your grades and then and like
and then if you fail classes a certain amount of
classes and you get a referral, okay, and then three
referrals send you to the continuation school, so you flunk
high school basically, yeah, and then you stay there for
(23:59):
three turns, so that's why. Yeah, and then you can
get referrals also from like behavior things, so like there's
bad decisions that cause also that those things. So like
for example, a lot of there's like a lot of
real topics that I wanted to also make sure that
I don't like like the taboo. Like there's like around
(24:20):
a lot of like talking about these things. So that's
why I wanted to make sure to put it in there.
So there's a lot of talk about drugs and vaping
and team pregnancy, and and there's there's just like a
different things, but those are like the main bigger topics
that shock most people, and and I include those because
(24:43):
it's real and like, that's what high schoolers are doing,
and that's what's going on right now. We need to know,
like what's what's happening with high schoolers nowadays. And it's
important also like for high schoolers when when they play
the game, to really see like the effect of their decisions,
because because when you make bad decisions in the game,
you lose happiness.
Speaker 2 (25:04):
You lose your tokens.
Speaker 1 (25:06):
Yeah, okay, And then there's good decisions. And then with
good decisions, like for example, there's ones like oh you
volunteer to help out the community, or like oh you,
you you tutor someone in their math homework or something,
and then or like oh you, there's one other one
that says you've got a scholarship and things like that,
(25:29):
and like those give you happiness because those are good things, right,
they and then there's event cards where those are like randomized.
Some of them are good, some of them are bad.
It just depends what you get. And that represents the
things in life that you can't control. Okay, So those
are either good or bad, and they're just things that
it doesn't matter what kinds of this kind of person
(25:51):
you are, just it could happen to anyone. Like, so
there's different things, like there's a lot of references also
to like Mexican culture, like the Mexican American culture. I've
because I've had other people like play it, like from
we went to LA for a gaming event, and there
was people there that are not Hispanic, right, and they
(26:14):
noticed that there was a lot of Hispanic influence in it.
Speaker 2 (26:17):
Nice. Do they like it?
Speaker 1 (26:19):
Yeah? So that was nice because it's relatable to everyone
in high school, but it's especially relatable to Hispanics in
high school.
Speaker 2 (26:27):
Good. We need games that talk to us.
Speaker 1 (26:29):
Yeah, exactly. And and so there's for example, there's another
section in the game. This is something that my friend
came up with with relationships, so people can get into relationships.
They can choose to have a boyfriend or girlfriend and
they pick randomly, they picked the top two cards of
the pile of the boyfriend or girlfriend, and then they
(26:51):
have to pick one person. And they have like stats,
like they say, like this person's this tall, and they're
this age in this grade and they like to do
this and and it has a picture of them in
a name and everything. Okay, And there's different there's different,
Like it's a variety of there's good ones and bad ones.
Some that it just depends on your taste. But but
(27:15):
there's but there's a lot of Hispanic characters in there.
I have a lot of like Hispanic last names in them. Good,
Like there's yeah, so there's a lot of like there's
some ones that are that are not right but for
but a lot of them, like at least half of
them are Hispanic characters.
Speaker 2 (27:33):
How long did it take for you to create the game?
Speaker 1 (27:35):
It took me two months and.
Speaker 2 (27:38):
You were in summer break. Yeah, so is that all
you did?
Speaker 1 (27:42):
Yeah, for my summer break, that was the whole thing.
Speaker 2 (27:45):
And you were sixteen years old. Yes, were you ever
like I want to go outside and do summer things
instead of like like putting brain power into making this thing.
Speaker 1 (27:57):
I did do summer things, right, like I hang out
with my friends and everything. But I mean also like
when my friends would come over, I would ask them like, oh,
do you have any ideas? And like now because especially
with that best friend that that inspired me kind of
to make it with her, like she helped me write
a lot of the cards, and so like we would
(28:18):
have like sleepovers or we would get together over the
summer and we would just like write fun We would
write the cards together and like make the characters and
it was really fun. Like we would come up with
like like funny ones and like but making sure that
they were like relatable also at the same time, and
like again, like this was a game that I made
(28:40):
just for fun.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
Really for sure, but now you're selling it.
Speaker 1 (28:43):
Yeah, and I never expected to for it to be
a thing, and now it's like like yeah, and so
now and I'm really excited about it. I really, I
really like what how I really I like to talk
about it and if it was obvious, but it's it's
really fun, honestly, Like I really enjoy it. And like
(29:07):
even like like my friends when they when they come
to our house, like oh, let's play high school the
game like nice and like even when I because I
would take it to school also, like almost every day
I would just take it, carrying around that box all
around school and just to have people ask me what
it was also smart marketing. Yeah, and then every time
(29:30):
I had like these certain classmates, like they would always
say like like can we play? Can we play? And
like I would just like set it up because it
was almost like a free period, so we would just like, huh,
we would just play all like all class and they
even learned it so that they could play all within
the span of the class period. Because sometimes we weren't
able to finish, but they got a rhythm to it
(29:50):
and they were able to finish it every time.
Speaker 2 (29:54):
Huh. So I wanted to give you another stat because
you talk about teams pregnancy. There was The University of
Washington did a study based on a national survey of
oney seven hundred and nineteen teens. So it's not huge,
it's not a huge survey, but their ages the seventeen
(30:16):
hundred teens were ages fifteen to nineteen, and this is
the first population level education of the that they study
the effectiveness of both abstinence only and comprehensive sex education programs.
So what the results showed is that it's not harmful
(30:37):
to teach teenagers about birth control in addition to abstinence.
And what the study found is that comprehensive sex ed
reduces teen pregnancy. And so I love that you include
this conversation in the game because it's real and it's
something that happens. And data shows that the more we
(30:59):
talk about things that we don't talk about, the less
taboo they become, the more aware we become about them,
just like mental health, just like substance abuse, just like
teen pregnancy. And so well done. Thank You's awesome. So
(31:20):
how was it were your parents for them to be like,
you're making a game?
Speaker 1 (31:25):
What? Honestly, they weren't surprised because I've always I've always
been the kind to to do that. I've actually made
another game before that. I had made it with one
of my friends and I had so that's why I
was like, Oh, let's just make another game, just like
a casual thing, right, like, oh, yeah, I'm just gonna
make a whole other board game.
Speaker 2 (31:46):
Nice.
Speaker 1 (31:47):
But it was yeah, like I had told my mom, like, oh,
I'm making this board game. And like I will show
her like, oh, look I finished the design for the board.
She was like, oh that's nice and like and then
I told her like like I asked her if we
could print it out, like we could make have it made,
and she said yes, and so like we invested in
making it and so like again, it was just going
to be a one time purchase. It was just going
(32:07):
to be like to have it for my friends. But
one day I brought it to school, like the first day.
And then I brought it to school and there it
was the finals week day, so it was like we
had already finished testing, so we were just like they
(32:28):
were making gingerbread houses. I think it was like a
little contest. So so the vice principal and like some
other school officials they had came into so they could
judge the the Gingerbird contest. But then they saw what
we were doing over there that I was playing the
game with some of my classmates, and they saw like
what's that, Like I've never seen that before, and and
(32:49):
then that's when it all started. And that's when like
I said like, oh, yeah I made it, and they're
like you made it. I was like, yeah, I made it,
and so and so then they were saying like and
especially they got really excited out it features the local schools.
Speaker 2 (33:04):
So they're in the game, very local game.
Speaker 1 (33:07):
Yeah. So then they really liked that that there's like oh, hey,
that's Central, that's us, Like that's that's our school, and
like I was like yeah and like and so that's
when the vice principal she would be like, no, I
want to buy this nice and she said like I'll
buy you. I'll buy some from you, and like how
much is it? How much is it? I'll buy it
from you. Just come by my office and I'll give
(33:27):
you the money. And and I was like wow. And
and that's when I was like why I was never
planning to sell it. And then that's when it all started.
She encouraged me to just push through, and I and
I we immediately like we I came home and I
was like guess what, guess what happened? Like and and
that's when all this happened. And I would have never
imagined that, like I would be having a business now
(33:48):
and like that I'm I'm and like I would be
like pursuing this, like I'm actually like considering this as
a full time thing, like this is something that I
really enjoy.
Speaker 2 (34:01):
So the principal says, or the vice principal says, I
want to buy this, and you're like, okay, you came
into parents. What was the next step that how did
you figure out how to make it into a business.
Speaker 1 (34:15):
Well, the first step we were for sure, like my
parents were like, okay, well, for sure, we have to
make it legal because that way like nobody steals it.
So for we started looking for immediately, we started looking
for a lawyer. And so we found a lawyer that
was like especially for board games and everything, and so we.
Speaker 2 (34:31):
Went, yeah, that's awesome, yeah.
Speaker 1 (34:35):
Because it was like for intellectual property, right, but he
was like especially like interested in board games and like
experienced and that, so that was awesome. So that was
really cool. And so he was from San Diego. So
we met there, like I skipped the day of school
just to go over there, and they excuse me, so
(34:55):
my mom explained, and so we met and then we
just like talked about like you know, like the copyright
issues and everything, and so I had to change some
things in the game, like some of the cards, some
of the pictures because of the copyright. Yes, Enten says,
then I had so once I had everything like change
(35:15):
and legalized and we put it the game high School
the game, we have it listen in process for trademark
nice trademarked, and then more recently I have the I
put the board, the actual board and the process for
copyright like nice.
Speaker 2 (35:33):
Do you think you're gonna be like, is this the
thing that you'll do as you continue to grow up?
Just create games? Board games?
Speaker 1 (35:42):
Yeah? I think so. I mean, I know, I know,
and like it's something that that came up so just
like so randomly right like that I was not expecting.
But I mean really it came out of out of
me because it's something that I enjoyed doing and I
like to to create. That's that's my favorite thing to do,
(36:02):
is to create. And I mean that's that's the main
I feel like God wasted all the talent on that,
and then he didn't give me any sports abilities or
anything like that because because with that, I'm really bad.
So you just put all of the new things.
Speaker 2 (36:22):
Yeah, did you ever feel like because you had created
the other game and you are an avid board game player,
so that gives you some element of awareness and knowledge
on the topic, But did you ever think like I
(36:42):
don't know how to make a game or was it
just something so that came to you so naturally?
Speaker 1 (36:48):
Honestly, it came naturally to me. I never. I didn't
really do much research. I mean, all I did was
just like I looked at the game of Life, and
I was like, Okay, what elements from this can I use?
And then what can I change? And then I thought,
I wrote. I got a piece of paper. I actually
wrote down a piece of paper, and I was like,
what are all the things I have to do with
(37:08):
high school? Like? What are all the things that are
in high school? And then I started writing, Okay, there's classes, right,
and then there's events, there's this happens, and that happens,
and and then I decide, okay, what can I how
can I make that into a game?
Speaker 2 (37:21):
Nice?
Speaker 1 (37:22):
And so then that's that's how I started. And actually
the actual game, like making the game, like the whole
concept and all the rules and everything, that took me
two days.
Speaker 2 (37:33):
Look at you, it's awesome. So who is a game for?
Speaker 1 (37:37):
Who?
Speaker 2 (37:37):
Is so I know it's it says thirteen plus, yes,
but it is for high schoolers? Is this for families?
It around and and play it because as I was
looking at it and looking at the cards for the
relationships and like the life things that could happen, it
made me think that besides the fun of playing, and
(38:03):
I love the description of like relive your worst years,
get ready to relive the worst days of your life
in this hilarious new twist to a realistic high school experience,
balance greats, relationships, sports, and make the right or wrong
decisions as you roll the dice and the race towards
graduation careful though you don't want to end up repeating
(38:24):
the semester. Collect happiness tokens along the way, and win
by being the less depressed the better. So I would
think that if I play this with if I'm a
high schooler and I play this with parents, not only
is it fun to kind of like, you know, explore
(38:48):
but and have fun with the game, but also engaging
conversation exactly because maybe parents can be like, wait, this
is happening, you know, like, yes, these are the conversations
that you're having or this is something that you're around. Yes,
And it might just open the door in a gentle,
(39:11):
fun different way for parents to have the conversation.
Speaker 1 (39:16):
Yes, for sure, and that's definitely like what we had
thought of, like because it's not only for high schoolers,
it's also for parents, right, so for parents to see
and then also for educators as well, for schools to
see also, and so they can see like like okay,
like this is what kids are going through. How can
we help them or how can we start conversations with them?
(39:38):
Because one thing is that I feel like adults have
a lot of trouble talking to kids and like to
relate to them and actually get to them and they
them listen to them, and so this is a great
way so that they feel comfortable with the game. This
is something that it's not just like all the adults
forced it on me. This is made by someone one
of their peers, Right, I made a game for my peers,
(40:00):
And so they get all the jokes, they get the
the humor, and they get the stuff that is happening.
So then with that they're more open to talking about
those subjects when it's not presented in such a serious
like way of like oh, you're in trouble, like almost
like oh, we're gonna talk about this because because we
think you're doing it or something, or like it's more
(40:24):
of just like like let's talk about it, and that's
it's definitely it's to start conversations for sure. And and
that's the main selling point, like that's a lot of
things that that's the main thing that has gotten the
school's attention was that they can use that as a
teaching tool as well.
Speaker 2 (40:41):
For sure. That's awesome. So tell us all the places
and spaces where we can find the game or we
can connect with to buy it, to connect with you,
et cetera, et cetera.
Speaker 1 (40:53):
So I have on hsdegame dot com. That's where I'm
selling it currently. We're working on getting it soon too,
Amazon and other places, but right now it's currently on
my my personal website hsthegame dot com and uh and
there on the website, I have also some other videos,
like some other interviews as well and things that that
(41:19):
like just talking about a little bit more about the
story behind this and and but on there is directly
it's a really simple process to just buy the game
and and actually like for your listeners, we have a
ten percent off discount code stay Shining. Yeah, and then
(41:40):
we have an instagram that's at high school Underscore the game, Okay,
and and so that's where we've been posting like updates,
and so that's where we're gonna post like once we're
in stock, because right now it's a pre order, but
we already ordered Inventor. We're just waiting for it to come,
so we should expect it around September, like the beginning
(42:04):
of September, so amazing. So that's when we're gonna get
in the more so than people who pre order, they're
already getting kind of like a discount price. So right
now it's a fifty dollars and what else. Let's see
so I have we're posting it on there, and then
eventually we might make a TikTok something like that since
(42:27):
we're just starting off. But right now it's the Instagram
and then the website. That's our main streams that we have.
Speaker 2 (42:35):
Amazing, this is awesome, super cool. So we'll have all
the links in the show notes and make sure you
get your pre orders. Use the code stach Shining get
ten percent off. We'll have that code there as well.
It's amazing. The less depressed the better, that's funny. I'm
(42:56):
looking at the website, soil, thank you for coming, tom Bum,
thank you for having me. Yeah, anything you want to
share that I didn't ask.
Speaker 1 (43:09):
Not I think I think we went through most of it.
Speaker 2 (43:11):
Yeah, yeah, for sure. Well this is awesome. Congratulations. I
was so excited when I met you through Imperial Valley
as BBC actually and they did an interview with you
and you've been working with them, so I was like,
wait a minute, high schooler created a board game, let's go.
(43:32):
And so also I want to give a shout out
to the team at Imperial Valley.
Speaker 1 (43:36):
Yes, the big help for sure.
Speaker 2 (43:40):
Okay, well, thank you for coming to cambum.
Speaker 1 (43:43):
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (43:48):
One of the listeners. If this podcast has ever inspired you,
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(44:10):
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(44:30):
there so we can work together if you feel called
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Let's bring conversations like this to more other people. Of course,
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(02:28):
bilingual Podcastorias Sin sansa ELOI. We have a conversation with
Sara a A. Yail is an artist, entrepreneur and creative
visionary who's loved storytelling, board games, film, and so much
more since as long as she can remember. Her biggest
inspirations are her friends and family, which is always trying
(02:50):
to make laugh. She came up with the idea for
this board game in a summer when she was just
sixteen years old, and this conversation with Abigail is first,
I think she's the youngest guest we've ever had a
Kava Kampam, so she's still not even eighteen years old.
And I was like, is your mom gonna be there?
(03:13):
And the mom was like, no, she can do the interview,
which she did amazing, And I think she's so inspiring
because at such a young age. We talked about what
it was like for her to deal with school bullying,
We talked about mental health. We talked about how she
turned her struggle into this amazing board game that she
(03:37):
created and now it's ready for you to purchase. So
I think this is a conversation if you have young
people in your life, definitely something you can listen to
and tune in to. We don't necessarily talk about We
don't go deep into the bullying that happened, so I
don't think I need to do a trigger warning around it,
though we do talk that she was being bothered and
(04:02):
how she turned this challenge and what she was dealing
with into something awesome that helps others and can support
other people's mental health, which I think it's amazing. You've
seen in Mass. Here's my conversation with Abigail. But Abigail,
(04:25):
welcome to Capa Combine.
Speaker 1 (04:26):
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (04:27):
How are you doing this morning? How's your mental health?
Speaker 1 (04:30):
I'm doing good. Yeah, I think I'm just still tired
because I'm not used to waking up early. I know.
Speaker 2 (04:38):
I saw the seven o'clock listeners, and I saw the
booking come in the calendar invite at seven, and I
was like, Okay, she must be an early bird.
Speaker 1 (04:57):
It was just the best time that we could schedule for.
But it's not that I'm an early word at home.
Speaker 2 (05:04):
It's like the only way I could, the only time
I could. Yeah, okay. So the first question we always
we start with is what is your heritage.
Speaker 1 (05:13):
I am a Mexican, Mexican American because of where I live,
but Mexican in my blood.
Speaker 2 (05:20):
Nice. And you're in California, you're nail Center.
Speaker 1 (05:23):
Yes, well right now, I'm an Imperial Okay.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
So I love your story because you not only decided
to speak out and speak up about mental health, which
is something that, especially in Latino families, is kind of
taboo still, you know, like, yes, I started Kava Kombam
(05:49):
back in twenty sixteen, and my friend Priscilla She. Her
Instagram name is the Humble Therapist. She I asked her
to come to Kavakampam to talk about mental health once
a month because to me, mental health was so important
and people listening my friends would tell me you're such
(06:15):
a privileged girl because you get to talk about mental health.
We don't do that. We just go to work or
noire or whatever it is. And I was like, oh,
how sad. No, And this is back in twenty sixteen.
(06:35):
Since then, things have changed, thankfully to the better. We're
not quite I don't think at that place where you know,
Latinos can freely talk about mental health, especially men, I think.
But I love that you decided to not only say
I'm struggling with this, but also you created a game. Yeah,
(06:58):
how long did you deal with that? Without telling anyone?
Speaker 1 (07:03):
With my mental health struggles for for at least a year,
And I know that it was It wasn't mainly because
of the quote that culture of of like, oh that's
it's not real, or like let's not talk about that,
or like like not like or like like that's why
(07:24):
I was always like I always felt like okay, like
I shouldn't say anything or like I maybe I'm not
going through anything. This is nothing real or like. And
it's until like I started learning, like from school and
stuff like that I was going through something and like
I needed to speak out about it. So it was
a few years, yeah, I would say, because I was
around twelve when I really was hitting me more.
Speaker 2 (07:48):
Oh my gosh, I mean that's young. So here's the data.
There's a Confidence Code for girls study that was done
and between eight and fourteen years old, girls confidence levels
drop by thirty percent. And you were twelve, Yes, and
(08:10):
so it proves this study true that between eight and
fourteen girls confidence drops, mental health challenges start appearing, and
are overall well beaten, just kind of goes down the drain. Yes,
(08:30):
And could we say that it's probably worse if you
don't have a space to talk about.
Speaker 1 (08:37):
Yes, it definitely is, because when I felt like I
couldn't talk to anyone about it, I was just going
through it on my own. And it's psychological torture on
its own, telling yourself that you're not that it's not
real totally.
Speaker 2 (08:52):
So what did you do?
Speaker 1 (08:54):
Well? What made me speak up about it was that
because this was during the pandemic or no yeah, and
so we were on Zoom and so they would do
mental health chickens. My school would do like mental health
chickens like that. We would fill out a Google form
and seeing like have you felt how have you felt
in the past week, and have you felt sad? Mad?
(09:17):
I'm anxious, And then I would fill out the things
and then I was really and it said like if
you clicked more than one of anxious or mad in
the last one, then then you should talk to the counselor.
And I did click off a lot, and so I
realized that I was like wait, Like that kind of
made me realize like, oh, this is something real and
(09:39):
I need to talk about it. So I come in
contact with the counselor. I didn't tell my parents about
it at first, and then until I met with a
counselor and she told me that I needed therapy and everything.
And then that's when I told my parents about it.
And at first, like they were kind of shocked, but
they were supportive the whole way through.
Speaker 2 (09:59):
Do you have some yes, what number are you?
Speaker 1 (10:03):
I'm the first, I'm the oldest.
Speaker 2 (10:05):
You're the eldest daughter. Yeah, welcome to the eldest daughter life.
I'm an eldest daughter, and I it's hard. It's hard
to because you have to break the barrier, you know,
you have to yes be the first in so many ways.
And how was it for you first to be seen
(10:31):
to literally someone tell you, know, what you're going through
is not in your head, what you're going through, You're
not making it up, what you're going through is real.
How was that for you?
Speaker 1 (10:41):
Well, that it was definitely it was really like overwhelming,
a little bit like shocking. I mean I was already
like I was going through a lot of emotions, and
I just felt like, Okay, well now I have this
other thing that I have to burden people with. And
so I've always like thought of like people and I'm
not so much of like what I'm going through. I
(11:02):
always thought like what now, what are people gonna think
of me?
Speaker 2 (11:05):
Now?
Speaker 1 (11:06):
What are like now? What's what's gonna happen now? Or
like and why I'm why am I going through this?
Why am I feeling this? And but I mean at
least I felt like at least there was a name
to put on it. And even now I still struggle,
like with those same thoughts of like it's not real
or like you're not. I'm not because they're like just
(11:27):
like stop, like shut up, like about those things. Like
it's just like it's just your your brain. You're telling
yourself things to get attention, to get attention. My brain
tells me that, and and it's really hard because it's
like it says like, oh, like you're just doing this
to get attention, right, Like you're just faking it just
so you could you could get an attention right and
(11:50):
people to talk to you. And it's just like it's
obviously that's not the truth. But it's what has what
I struggle with like a lot.
Speaker 2 (12:01):
How do you overcome it?
Speaker 1 (12:03):
I just every day I have to like tell myself
that that it is real, and I have to just
like I have to say it out a lot a
lot of times, or like just like talk to other
people about how I feel and just saying like this
is what I'm going through and like and and like
just the people that I trust and and just seeing
that that that it's it's not the end of the world.
(12:27):
It's if it is something that like it's that I
can overcome it and I can't go I can I
can still live functionally. I just have to work a
little harder than most people.
Speaker 2 (12:39):
Did you deal with bullying?
Speaker 1 (12:41):
Yes?
Speaker 2 (12:43):
Were you afraid to talk about mental health and and
then maybe be like oh mass my one most.
Speaker 1 (12:50):
Then yes, because I was. I think that's actually partly
why I my mental health went down was because of
the bully. Of course, I had a lot of toxic
friendships growing up, and and I would always again, I
would always guesslight myself and going like like oh, these
are your friends, these these people care about you, or
(13:12):
these they're they're just like it's your fault. You're the
one that's that's being bad.
Speaker 2 (13:17):
Like I would tell my gosh, sometimes.
Speaker 1 (13:21):
Yeah, And I would be like telling myself like you know,
like like I need to fix it, I need to
do something better. I need to and I need to
be a better friend. Why am I being selfish? Like
and like and so, And really what it was is
like they would they they would always be they would
never care about what I had to say. They would
(13:43):
like we would always just do whatever they wanted to do,
and when I would say anything, they would just like
they would ignore me or just look at me weird,
like as if I said something weird. If I try
to stay try to include myself in the conversation. It's
not like I would try to talk just about myself.
I would hear what they were talking about, and I
was trying to like add something to it. Like they're
(14:06):
saying like, oh, we went to the pool, and it's like, oh, yeah,
I went to the pool too. I did this right.
But then they would like shut me down, or I
would say a joke and they would pretend like they
didn't get it, or I would I would feel overwhelmed
a lot, and like I would start crying, and then
they would immediately just try to get me to shut out.
They would be like like like like, calm down, Abby,
calm down, it's not a big deal. Just just be cool,
(14:26):
like stop crying, and like and and so I was
already like kind of like being conditioned like to like
you can't show your emotions, yeah, to shove it down.
And so and then like they would always constantly like
make fun of me, like saying like your family's weird
(14:48):
or you're and they would say like or they would
say like, oh, well we're like we're two years older
than because one of them was two years older than
me and she was like, oh, well, I'm well I'm
more mature than you, so I know more than you.
It's like I'm ten in your twelve and so, but
(15:09):
I'm sure you're more mature than me, right and so
and she would be like like, oh, yeah, you're or
like I know more, I have more experience in my life,
so you don't know what you're talking about, or you're
just done or like and these ones I had inside
and outside of school, it was just like.
Speaker 2 (15:30):
Kind of a lover yeah, because you live in a
relatively small town.
Speaker 1 (15:34):
Now, yes, so everyone knows each other. See.
Speaker 2 (15:40):
So when you finally went to that counselor, and the
counselor was like, no, yes, there's something happening. What did
you do with the friendships?
Speaker 1 (15:54):
Well, those I I for sure I had let go
of them. And how was that for you?
Speaker 2 (16:00):
Did you see that?
Speaker 1 (16:03):
Well, it was hard because what happened was that we
moved away to like we're still stayed in the same
county we've always been, but we've moved to like different
cities within the same in Pero Valley. So back then
I was living in the smallest town in Hopeville. So
that's why we all knew each other and everything, and
so and there was this moment like where I had
(16:25):
actually told them how I was feeling, like. I was saying, like,
I feel ignored. I feel like you're being like you've
say mean things to me, and then's that and then
one of them she just one of them, she didn't
say anything, she just kind of stayed quiet. And then
the other one that hurt me the most, she just
said like, oh, well, that's not our problem.
Speaker 2 (16:44):
Wow. Yeah, And You're like, well, then you're not my friend.
Speaker 1 (16:49):
Exactly, and so like that's why. That's when I decided
to let go. And I was like, yeah, I just
like I'm not gonna already try to fix things, and
they just and it's like, okay, it's not your problem.
Then you're not my problem either.
Speaker 2 (17:03):
So it was easier now, Yeah, I was a little easier.
Speaker 1 (17:07):
But it was still hard because then I felt like
because then I didn't have anyone else, I didn't have
any friends, and then you moved, yeah, and so I
was like I was I felt really lonely because I
felt like the only friends I ever had weren't really my.
Speaker 2 (17:20):
Friends and then like all of them and you have
no friends.
Speaker 1 (17:23):
Yeah, and that was really hard for me, and I
think all of that because of the anxiety that they
would cause me, and like the the self confidence lowering,
so much of like me thinking that I was the
problem and like I was doing something wrong or if
something annoying, because they would always like think like I
was annoying, or like because I was more like outgoing,
(17:46):
I guess, and like I would always I was always
having like organized plans like oh, let's do this, like
this is a fun activity we could do together, and
they would never listen to me. And so I was like, Okay,
well I'm weird.
Speaker 2 (17:57):
Yeah, I'm just not good people.
Speaker 1 (17:59):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (18:00):
No, But forty percent of teen girls feel extremely confident
that they can make new friends compared to fifty five
percent of teen boys. So and this is a binary study,
(18:22):
but girls are eighteen percent less likely than boys to
define themselves as confident. And this is a confidence study.
So it's all about confidence. But I think it goes
back to the mental health known like, yes, one in
four high school boys think they would have a successful
career in math or economics compared to one in seven
(18:45):
high school girls. And I would argue, based on what
you're telling me that there's so many other pressures that
girls go through that may you know, weave that into
into the the reality of it. This is this is interesting.
(19:06):
Dads are twenty six percent more likely to accurately estimate
their child's confidence and moms. Now, I don't know who
they surveyed, right, So I don't know if we could
say that this is true for Latino parents because usually
dads don't talk. I don't know. Oh, dads are significantly
(19:29):
better at evaluating their son's confidence and moms are at
evaluating their daughters. The error for moms is even more
pronounced when their daughters have low confidence. Wow. The low
confidence gap leads to women not to finding confidence and
valuing it well enough for themselves. Biases don't lessen as
they age, leading moms to continue to expect more from
(19:52):
their daughters as they expect as they were expected of them.
So it's this trick effect because moms, women have this
expectation and they almost put the pressure on their daughters
and they inaccurately. I would say you're doing fine, when
(20:13):
in reality you're not.
Speaker 1 (20:14):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (20:16):
And so as you are dealing with this, you move,
you find yourself without friends. You have to make new friends.
When does the game start? When do you get the
idea of like, let me start this game.
Speaker 1 (20:31):
This was last year, exactly last year, last summer. I've
always really liked board games, which is one thing that
again past my own toxic friends, they didn't want to
play those board games with me. But now I have
friends who do want me to play board games with me.
And so there's one of my best friends. We really
(20:53):
liked the Game of Life.
Speaker 2 (20:55):
Such a long game. Yeah, you can play that the
game for hours.
Speaker 1 (21:00):
Yeah. And my friend really liked that game. She was
always like, she always would come, she would come to
my house and say, oh, let's play a game of Life.
Let's play the Game of Life. But after a while
we kind of got bored, like we already knew all
the cards, we already knew like how it went. And
so I was like, what if I made something that
was more realistic and relatable to us? And so that's
(21:21):
what I came up with high school, the game Nice.
And so that's when I thought like I wanted to
make something that first of all, that was more realistic.
So in the sense of I didn't want I did.
There were some critiques I had about the Game of Life, like,
for example, that the the currency was money, right, and
(21:41):
that the way to win is to have the most money. Yes,
And so if you really think about that in perspective
of life, then it's teaching kids that life is about
getting the most.
Speaker 2 (21:51):
Money, only about money.
Speaker 1 (21:53):
Yeah, yeah, And like to me, it's like, well, money
is important obviously, like for the central things, right, but
money is not going to buy you happiness, right, It's
not going to bring you as much really, it is
not going to guarantee you joy in life. And so
it's and it's and winning in life isn't having money.
(22:16):
To me, winning in life is having the most happiness
and being most fulfilled and successful in life is your
mental health and how and the people that you have
around you, right, that's being successful in life. And so
that's when I changed in my high school the game.
So the currency is happiness, and especially like especially because
(22:38):
if it's high school, then high schoolers are broke. So
there's obviously what it makes sense to make it money.
So I had happiness so because and that's where the
mental health ties in. So the person with the most
happiness tokens or little tokens, And the person with the
most happiness tokens is the one who wins the game,
(22:58):
and so there's the different things in the game. So
there's like I made it in a way that it
was also relatable to teenagers, like I wanted to make
something that was funny. Also like it's it's really like
interactive and like fun but also like not taking itself
too seriously and like it's just like it's just like
(23:20):
it's it's a funny way of seeing but it's if
you really look at it, it's like real experiences that
high schoolers go through, and like there's different decision making
and events, and then there's classes. There's all these different
things that are involved in it.
Speaker 2 (23:35):
Where you within the game.
Speaker 1 (23:37):
Within the game, yeah, and so for example, there's the classes.
You get to see your grades and then and like
and then if you fail classes a certain amount of
classes and you get a referral, okay, and then three
referrals send you to the continuation school, so you flunk
high school basically, yeah, and then you stay there for
(23:59):
three turns, so that's why. Yeah, and then you can
get referrals also from like behavior things, so like there's
bad decisions that cause also that those things. So like
for example, a lot of there's like a lot of
real topics that I wanted to also make sure that
I don't like like the taboo. Like there's like around
(24:20):
a lot of like talking about these things. So that's
why I wanted to make sure to put it in there.
So there's a lot of talk about drugs and vaping
and team pregnancy, and and there's there's just like a
different things, but those are like the main bigger topics
that shock most people, and and I include those because
(24:43):
it's real and like, that's what high schoolers are doing,
and that's what's going on right now. We need to know,
like what's what's happening with high schoolers nowadays. And it's
important also like for high schoolers when when they play
the game, to really see like the effect of their decisions,
because because when you make bad decisions in the game,
you lose happiness.
Speaker 2 (25:04):
You lose your tokens.
Speaker 1 (25:06):
Yeah, okay, And then there's good decisions. And then with
good decisions, like for example, there's ones like oh you
volunteer to help out the community, or like oh you,
you you tutor someone in their math homework or something,
and then or like oh you, there's one other one
that says you've got a scholarship and things like that,
(25:29):
and like those give you happiness because those are good things, right,
they and then there's event cards where those are like randomized.
Some of them are good, some of them are bad.
It just depends what you get. And that represents the
things in life that you can't control. Okay, So those
are either good or bad, and they're just things that
it doesn't matter what kinds of this kind of person
(25:51):
you are, just it could happen to anyone. Like, so
there's different things, like there's a lot of references also
to like Mexican culture, like the Mexican American culture. I've
because I've had other people like play it, like from
we went to LA for a gaming event, and there
was people there that are not Hispanic, right, and they
(26:14):
noticed that there was a lot of Hispanic influence in it.
Speaker 2 (26:17):
Nice. Do they like it?
Speaker 1 (26:19):
Yeah? So that was nice because it's relatable to everyone
in high school, but it's especially relatable to Hispanics in
high school.
Speaker 2 (26:27):
Good. We need games that talk to us.
Speaker 1 (26:29):
Yeah, exactly. And and so there's for example, there's another
section in the game. This is something that my friend
came up with with relationships, so people can get into relationships.
They can choose to have a boyfriend or girlfriend and
they pick randomly, they picked the top two cards of
the pile of the boyfriend or girlfriend, and then they
(26:51):
have to pick one person. And they have like stats,
like they say, like this person's this tall, and they're
this age in this grade and they like to do
this and and it has a picture of them in
a name and everything. Okay, And there's different there's different,
Like it's a variety of there's good ones and bad ones.
Some that it just depends on your taste. But but
(27:15):
there's but there's a lot of Hispanic characters in there.
I have a lot of like Hispanic last names in them. Good,
Like there's yeah, so there's a lot of like there's
some ones that are that are not right but for
but a lot of them, like at least half of
them are Hispanic characters.
Speaker 2 (27:33):
How long did it take for you to create the game?
Speaker 1 (27:35):
It took me two months and.
Speaker 2 (27:38):
You were in summer break. Yeah, so is that all
you did?
Speaker 1 (27:42):
Yeah, for my summer break, that was the whole thing.
Speaker 2 (27:45):
And you were sixteen years old. Yes, were you ever
like I want to go outside and do summer things
instead of like like putting brain power into making this thing.
Speaker 1 (27:57):
I did do summer things, right, like I hang out
with my friends and everything. But I mean also like
when my friends would come over, I would ask them like, oh,
do you have any ideas? And like now because especially
with that best friend that that inspired me kind of
to make it with her, like she helped me write
a lot of the cards, and so like we would
(28:18):
have like sleepovers or we would get together over the
summer and we would just like write fun We would
write the cards together and like make the characters and
it was really fun. Like we would come up with
like like funny ones and like but making sure that
they were like relatable also at the same time, and
like again, like this was a game that I made
(28:40):
just for fun.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
Really for sure, but now you're selling it.
Speaker 1 (28:43):
Yeah, and I never expected to for it to be
a thing, and now it's like like yeah, and so
now and I'm really excited about it. I really, I
really like what how I really I like to talk
about it and if it was obvious, but it's it's
really fun, honestly, Like I really enjoy it. And like
(29:07):
even like like my friends when they when they come
to our house, like oh, let's play high school the
game like nice and like even when I because I
would take it to school also, like almost every day
I would just take it, carrying around that box all
around school and just to have people ask me what
it was also smart marketing. Yeah, and then every time
(29:30):
I had like these certain classmates, like they would always
say like like can we play? Can we play? And
like I would just like set it up because it
was almost like a free period, so we would just like, huh,
we would just play all like all class and they
even learned it so that they could play all within
the span of the class period. Because sometimes we weren't
able to finish, but they got a rhythm to it
(29:50):
and they were able to finish it every time.
Speaker 2 (29:54):
Huh. So I wanted to give you another stat because
you talk about teams pregnancy. There was The University of
Washington did a study based on a national survey of
oney seven hundred and nineteen teens. So it's not huge,
it's not a huge survey, but their ages the seventeen
(30:16):
hundred teens were ages fifteen to nineteen, and this is
the first population level education of the that they study
the effectiveness of both abstinence only and comprehensive sex education programs.
So what the results showed is that it's not harmful
(30:37):
to teach teenagers about birth control in addition to abstinence.
And what the study found is that comprehensive sex ed
reduces teen pregnancy. And so I love that you include
this conversation in the game because it's real and it's
something that happens. And data shows that the more we
(30:59):
talk about things that we don't talk about, the less
taboo they become, the more aware we become about them,
just like mental health, just like substance abuse, just like
teen pregnancy. And so well done. Thank You's awesome. So
(31:20):
how was it were your parents for them to be like,
you're making a game?
Speaker 1 (31:25):
What? Honestly, they weren't surprised because I've always I've always
been the kind to to do that. I've actually made
another game before that. I had made it with one
of my friends and I had so that's why I
was like, Oh, let's just make another game, just like
a casual thing, right, like, oh, yeah, I'm just gonna
make a whole other board game.
Speaker 2 (31:46):
Nice.
Speaker 1 (31:47):
But it was yeah, like I had told my mom, like, oh,
I'm making this board game. And like I will show
her like, oh, look I finished the design for the board.
She was like, oh that's nice and like and then
I told her like like I asked her if we
could print it out, like we could make have it made,
and she said yes, and so like we invested in
making it and so like again, it was just going
to be a one time purchase. It was just going
(32:07):
to be like to have it for my friends. But
one day I brought it to school, like the first day.
And then I brought it to school and there it
was the finals week day, so it was like we
had already finished testing, so we were just like they
(32:28):
were making gingerbread houses. I think it was like a
little contest. So so the vice principal and like some
other school officials they had came into so they could
judge the the Gingerbird contest. But then they saw what
we were doing over there that I was playing the
game with some of my classmates, and they saw like
what's that, Like I've never seen that before, and and
(32:49):
then that's when it all started. And that's when like
I said like, oh, yeah I made it, and they're
like you made it. I was like, yeah, I made it,
and so and so then they were saying like and
especially they got really excited out it features the local schools.
Speaker 2 (33:04):
So they're in the game, very local game.
Speaker 1 (33:07):
Yeah. So then they really liked that that there's like oh, hey,
that's Central, that's us, Like that's that's our school, and
like I was like yeah and like and so that's
when the vice principal she would be like, no, I
want to buy this nice and she said like I'll
buy you. I'll buy some from you, and like how
much is it? How much is it? I'll buy it
from you. Just come by my office and I'll give
(33:27):
you the money. And and I was like wow. And
and that's when I was like why I was never
planning to sell it. And then that's when it all started.
She encouraged me to just push through, and I and
I we immediately like we I came home and I
was like guess what, guess what happened? Like and and
that's when all this happened. And I would have never
imagined that, like I would be having a business now
(33:48):
and like that I'm I'm and like I would be
like pursuing this, like I'm actually like considering this as
a full time thing, like this is something that I
really enjoy.
Speaker 2 (34:01):
So the principal says, or the vice principal says, I
want to buy this, and you're like, okay, you came
into parents. What was the next step that how did
you figure out how to make it into a business.
Speaker 1 (34:15):
Well, the first step we were for sure, like my
parents were like, okay, well, for sure, we have to
make it legal because that way like nobody steals it.
So for we started looking for immediately, we started looking
for a lawyer. And so we found a lawyer that
was like especially for board games and everything, and so we.
Speaker 2 (34:31):
Went, yeah, that's awesome, yeah.
Speaker 1 (34:35):
Because it was like for intellectual property, right, but he
was like especially like interested in board games and like
experienced and that, so that was awesome. So that was
really cool. And so he was from San Diego. So
we met there, like I skipped the day of school
just to go over there, and they excuse me, so
(34:55):
my mom explained, and so we met and then we
just like talked about like you know, like the copyright
issues and everything, and so I had to change some
things in the game, like some of the cards, some
of the pictures because of the copyright. Yes, Enten says,
then I had so once I had everything like change
(35:15):
and legalized and we put it the game high School
the game, we have it listen in process for trademark
nice trademarked, and then more recently I have the I
put the board, the actual board and the process for
copyright like nice.
Speaker 2 (35:33):
Do you think you're gonna be like, is this the
thing that you'll do as you continue to grow up?
Just create games? Board games?
Speaker 1 (35:42):
Yeah? I think so. I mean, I know, I know,
and like it's something that that came up so just
like so randomly right like that I was not expecting.
But I mean really it came out of out of
me because it's something that I enjoyed doing and I
like to to create. That's that's my favorite thing to do,
(36:02):
is to create. And I mean that's that's the main
I feel like God wasted all the talent on that,
and then he didn't give me any sports abilities or
anything like that because because with that, I'm really bad.
So you just put all of the new things.
Speaker 2 (36:22):
Yeah, did you ever feel like because you had created
the other game and you are an avid board game player,
so that gives you some element of awareness and knowledge
on the topic, But did you ever think like I
(36:42):
don't know how to make a game or was it
just something so that came to you so naturally?
Speaker 1 (36:48):
Honestly, it came naturally to me. I never. I didn't
really do much research. I mean, all I did was
just like I looked at the game of Life, and
I was like, Okay, what elements from this can I use?
And then what can I change? And then I thought,
I wrote. I got a piece of paper. I actually
wrote down a piece of paper, and I was like,
what are all the things I have to do with
(37:08):
high school? Like? What are all the things that are
in high school? And then I started writing, Okay, there's classes, right,
and then there's events, there's this happens, and that happens,
and and then I decide, okay, what can I how
can I make that into a game?
Speaker 2 (37:21):
Nice?
Speaker 1 (37:22):
And so then that's that's how I started. And actually
the actual game, like making the game, like the whole
concept and all the rules and everything, that took me
two days.
Speaker 2 (37:33):
Look at you, it's awesome. So who is a game for?
Speaker 1 (37:37):
Who?
Speaker 2 (37:37):
Is so I know it's it says thirteen plus, yes,
but it is for high schoolers? Is this for families?
It around and and play it because as I was
looking at it and looking at the cards for the
relationships and like the life things that could happen, it
made me think that besides the fun of playing, and
(38:03):
I love the description of like relive your worst years,
get ready to relive the worst days of your life
in this hilarious new twist to a realistic high school experience,
balance greats, relationships, sports, and make the right or wrong
decisions as you roll the dice and the race towards
graduation careful though you don't want to end up repeating
(38:24):
the semester. Collect happiness tokens along the way, and win
by being the less depressed the better. So I would
think that if I play this with if I'm a
high schooler and I play this with parents, not only
is it fun to kind of like, you know, explore
(38:48):
but and have fun with the game, but also engaging
conversation exactly because maybe parents can be like, wait, this
is happening, you know, like, yes, these are the conversations
that you're having or this is something that you're around. Yes,
And it might just open the door in a gentle,
(39:11):
fun different way for parents to have the conversation.
Speaker 1 (39:16):
Yes, for sure, and that's definitely like what we had
thought of, like because it's not only for high schoolers,
it's also for parents, right, so for parents to see
and then also for educators as well, for schools to
see also, and so they can see like like okay,
like this is what kids are going through. How can
we help them or how can we start conversations with them?
(39:38):
Because one thing is that I feel like adults have
a lot of trouble talking to kids and like to
relate to them and actually get to them and they
them listen to them, and so this is a great
way so that they feel comfortable with the game. This
is something that it's not just like all the adults
forced it on me. This is made by someone one
of their peers, Right, I made a game for my peers,
(40:00):
And so they get all the jokes, they get the
the humor, and they get the stuff that is happening.
So then with that they're more open to talking about
those subjects when it's not presented in such a serious
like way of like oh, you're in trouble, like almost
like oh, we're gonna talk about this because because we
think you're doing it or something, or like it's more
(40:24):
of just like like let's talk about it, and that's
it's definitely it's to start conversations for sure. And and
that's the main selling point, like that's a lot of
things that that's the main thing that has gotten the
school's attention was that they can use that as a
teaching tool as well.
Speaker 2 (40:41):
For sure. That's awesome. So tell us all the places
and spaces where we can find the game or we
can connect with to buy it, to connect with you,
et cetera, et cetera.
Speaker 1 (40:53):
So I have on hsdegame dot com. That's where I'm
selling it currently. We're working on getting it soon too,
Amazon and other places, but right now it's currently on
my my personal website hsthegame dot com and uh and
there on the website, I have also some other videos,
like some other interviews as well and things that that
(41:19):
like just talking about a little bit more about the
story behind this and and but on there is directly
it's a really simple process to just buy the game
and and actually like for your listeners, we have a
ten percent off discount code stay Shining. Yeah, and then
(41:40):
we have an instagram that's at high school Underscore the game, Okay,
and and so that's where we've been posting like updates,
and so that's where we're gonna post like once we're
in stock, because right now it's a pre order, but
we already ordered Inventor. We're just waiting for it to come,
so we should expect it around September, like the beginning
(42:04):
of September, so amazing. So that's when we're gonna get
in the more so than people who pre order, they're
already getting kind of like a discount price. So right
now it's a fifty dollars and what else. Let's see
so I have we're posting it on there, and then
eventually we might make a TikTok something like that since
(42:27):
we're just starting off. But right now it's the Instagram
and then the website. That's our main streams that we have.
Speaker 2 (42:35):
Amazing, this is awesome, super cool. So we'll have all
the links in the show notes and make sure you
get your pre orders. Use the code stach Shining get
ten percent off. We'll have that code there as well.
It's amazing. The less depressed the better, that's funny. I'm
(42:56):
looking at the website, soil, thank you for coming, tom Bum,
thank you for having me. Yeah, anything you want to
share that I didn't ask.
Speaker 1 (43:09):
Not I think I think we went through most of it.
Speaker 2 (43:11):
Yeah, yeah, for sure. Well this is awesome. Congratulations. I
was so excited when I met you through Imperial Valley
as BBC actually and they did an interview with you
and you've been working with them, so I was like,
wait a minute, high schooler created a board game, let's go.
(43:32):
And so also I want to give a shout out
to the team at Imperial Valley.
Speaker 1 (43:36):
Yes, the big help for sure.
Speaker 2 (43:40):
Okay, well, thank you for coming to cambum.
Speaker 1 (43:43):
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (43:48):
One of the listeners. If this podcast has ever inspired you,
there are some ways you can support so we can
continue making this happen free ways. Leave a rating review
on your podcast app, of course, subscribe on YouTube, leave
a comment thumbs up, Share this episode with whoever you
think will enjoy it. If you feel called to support
(44:10):
us with a coffee a month, you can join the
Supporters Club. You get exclusive content, you get early releases,
two episodes, and so you can join. The link is
in the show notes. You can also check out my
work gova compum dot com, where you can find, of course,
all the episode notes and my body of work is
(44:30):
there so we can work together if you feel called
to as your handed Andy life coach. If you are
part of an organization, you can also hire me to speak.
Let's bring conversations like this to more other people. Of course,
let's stay connected on the socials at Kava Combum podcast
on all the places and spaces for listening. Oh I
is mass
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