From Feral to Free with Tara Mae

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Tara Mae (00:09):
I told Sandy, I was like, I'm gonna be so boring,
dude, this is gonna bore peopleto death. I feel like I'm so
much more interesting in personwhen I'm like, doing things with
talking about me is boring, but

Siobhan (00:20):
I don't think so, because, well, let's get into
it. Okay, because I don't knowyour story. Alright? So hey,
y'all welcome to this week'sepisode of Ducking. Realitea,
today in the pond with me is mygirl, Tara. Mae, welcome, Tara,
May. Hi.

Tara Mae (00:36):
Thanks for having me here. Shawn. Oh, I'm

Siobhan (00:38):
so excited to do this, because I know that you have an
interesting story, but I don'tknow it. I know you, and I feel
like I've gotten to know youreally well in the past, like,
year, probably year and a half,

Tara Mae (00:48):
yeah, maybe year and a half more, even over two years,
really, yeah,

Siobhan (00:54):
you have known Sandy for a long time from fireside,
and so when I was leaving there,you came on. And so we kind of
like we're ships in the night,but we've gotten to know each
other, because I've because I'vestill been so involved with
fireside and Sandy and I aresuch good friends, and so we've
gotten to work at differentevents. And you had so much fun
getting to know each other andworking together, yeah, and then
I just love your vibe. You'refucking hysterical. And then you

(01:21):
just are so honest about, like,you know, your kind of, your
path in life, and like, thethings that you struggle with,
and the things that you are goodat, and like, you know, you're
very self aware. And I alwayslove that in someone. And so
tell me a little bit about whoTara May is and how you got
here. Wow.

Tara Mae (01:40):
Thank you, Siobhan. I I really don't know where to
start. One of my favorite moviesis the jerk. So the first thing
that comes tomind is, you know, it's coming
Well, I was born a poor blackchild in my bestie Martin voice,
right? No, I, you know, like,That's comedy, because,

(02:07):
honestly, I don't know that Iknew who I was really, until
recently. I feel that, right? Ireally, really, like, about a
year and a half ago, sat downspeaking to Sandy, sat down with
Sandy and Jeff, my partner, andI was like, I think I'm a grown
up. Guys, like, I think I'mfinally a grown up. And mind

(02:29):
you, I've, like, raised childrento adulthood, and I'm like, I
think I'm a grown up finally,like, like, this great epiphany.
So I I think, honestly, I'mstill learning who I am, as I
hope we all are, you know what Imean, like, but, yeah, like, I'm
a very I'm an artistic person.

(02:51):
You know, I'm really into art.

Siobhan (02:53):
Did you grow up here in the Bay? I

Tara Mae (02:57):
did for the most part.
So I was born, I had like amilitary brat kind of family. So
my parents, Sandy knows thisstory, I don't know, but we
might come back to this. Butanyways, yeah, I was born in San
Jose, and then my parents, like,had their first little house in
Milpitas that didn't last long,because my parents really had a

(03:20):
hard time keeping their shittogether.

Unknown (03:26):
And so we ended up

Tara Mae (03:28):
in, like, Richmond, California, like, living in
like, you know, like the roughpart of Richmond, like Kennedy
Manor, like, hardcore Yeah. Likethe hood. Yeah, the hood. And
then, like, my parents, all thisis funny to me, so don't mind me

(03:48):
laughing, because it's funnythat I'm saying these things out
loud. But so my parents wererunning from like, child abuse

Unknown (03:54):
charges. Oh my gosh.

Siobhan (03:59):
No wonder we get along so well. Whenever I talk about
something like horrific in mylife, I'm always like, laughing
about it

Tara Mae (04:07):
so hard not to. It's like, I would I see people like,
cry about it and recount theirstories with tears. I feel so
bad because I just want to laughfor them, because I'm like, it's
kind of funny, like, I'm stillhere and they're really fucking
hilarious stories like soanyways, we're enrichment, and I

(04:27):
remember we have like this kindof weird, like family member,
ish, kind of person living aboveus, and police came to the
house, and my parents, nextthing I knew, the police came,
checked us for bruises andstuff. And then we, like my
parents, bought like this, liketrailer, and they parked it in
front of, like the apartment.
We, like me and my brother,would go eat TV dinners in there

(04:49):
and play in there and shit. Nextthing we knew, we packed it and
moved and ended up in Fargo,North Dakota.

Siobhan (05:00):
Yeah, and was that like running from the child abuse
stuff,

Tara Mae (05:03):
basically. So my mother and father later, I found
that their intention was to goto Canada. They were like, we're
moving to Canada. Crazy, right?
No, if I told, I told

Siobhan (05:16):
Sandy, why wouldn't they go to Mexico? It would be
warmer. I do.

Tara Mae (05:19):
I don't know my mother doesn't like heat, so that
probably my mother hated heat.
They were crazy, so that she waslike, I can't live. She probably
was like, I can't live in theheat. James, so she was like,
let's go to Canada then. And ourcar broke down in Bismarck,
North Dakota, and so we ended upliving in Fargo for like, a year
and a half. And I did my firstand second grade year in Fargo.

Siobhan (05:44):
Were your parents beating you?

Tara Mae (05:47):
Mostly my mother, my father was very much like. He
was very much like I don't wantto beat you,

Unknown (06:01):
but your mom

Tara Mae (06:02):
makes me and I gotta deal with her ass. So, you know,
he was like, the cool dad thatwas like, mom getting beat too.
Basically, he would, like, like,he'd be like, Look, I'm not
gonna hit you. And he'd make itsound like he was gonna hit you,
you know, like, like, literally,it was, kind of, it was comedy
like that. Kind of, it was likea Richard Pryor fucking comedy

(06:22):
movie,

Siobhan (06:23):
dude, no wonder you're so funny.

Tara Mae (06:26):
When people were like, where are you so funny? Dude,
I'm like, PTSD. It makes for thebest you think about like, the
best comedians are the mostlike, the people that have come
to terms with it all and arejust like, bro, I'm still here
and funny as shit,

Siobhan (06:45):
telling someone like, how I went on a date with a guy,
and it was right after Wilkedied, and I didn't think about
the fact that they would ask mewhat happened with my last
relationship. And so I was like,oh, like, so we're sitting with
just having a nice conversation.
Then he's like, so like, whathappened with your last
relationship? And I startedgiggling. And I was like, Oh, he

(07:07):
died. The guy is like, startingto giggle a little too. He's
like, Oh, that's funny. And Iwas like, No, and he's like, no.
But I laughed again, and I couldnot stop giggling, right? And I
was like, yeah, no, he just, hejust died one night, I don't
know. He just didn't wake up.
And he was like, Oh, my God,that's terrible. I'm like, I

(07:29):
know, right? He's missed everyshift.

Tara Mae (07:36):
People don't know how to react to it. Sometimes

Siobhan (07:38):
they're like, Yeah, and like, I don't want to comfort
you about my sad thing. Like,and then he's just looking at me
like, I'm crazy. And then, like,the next he calls me, like, a
couple days later, he's like,you want to go again? I was just
like, I don't know. And one ofmy friends is like, well, I'm
like, Dude, I could not stoplaughing about my dead
boyfriend. Like, that's a redflag. Like, I could see my own
red flag. Why would you want todate me? I Yeah, I

Tara Mae (08:03):
don't know. I would take that as a green flag. I
totally take that as a greenflag. I'd be like, That bitch
has got her shit together. Shetotally knows how to keep it
rolling. That

Siobhan (08:18):
guy didn't think that that was a flag. That's probably
a problem.

Tara Mae (08:21):
When he said, Do you want to go out? Like, you're
like, do you want to go out on

Unknown (08:27):
a date? Again, this guy's calling me.

Tara Mae (08:35):
It's so funny, because I've so often encountered like,
you know, people like, really,like, not knowing how to take
that like, reaction that wehave. And it's when people want
to sit there and they go on andsay, Oh, I'm so sorry. I even
stopped them before it even getsthere. I'm like, if we're
talking about this, let's noteven say sorry. It's all funny
to me. Yeah? Sometimes

Siobhan (08:54):
I'm like, oh yes, thank you. But let's get back to the
funny part. Yeah, the funny

Unknown (08:58):
let's get back to the funny part. Because there's so
many funny parts

Siobhan (09:05):
now you're in being beaten basically.

Tara Mae (09:10):
And then my dad, like, apparently, probably got sick of
the shit. I remember my parentshad this weird fight, throwing
stuff at each other and and thenmy dad just packed his shit
left. Oh, wow. And he took mylittle brother with him, because
I only had one little brother,he took him with him, and I was
stuck up there with my mother.
He was like, boys, go with boys.

(09:31):
Yes, very it was very much likethat. That's even how it's
explained to me. Yeah, my mom'sJapanese, so she was very much
like, Nope. That's how it goes.
Boys go with boys, and girlsstay with girls. And I was like,
but you're not nice. I don'twant to be a girl. Part of like,
part of very much like, why I'msuch a big tomboy. Now, I grew

(09:54):
up like my mom. Wanted a boyreally bad. She told me she
wanted a boy really bad. So shehad me first, then she had my
brother, and she like, doted onhim really hard. And then I was
like, I want to be a boy just topiss her off. Like, I remember
being like that when I was akid. And I was like, then I grew

(10:15):
up, and I was like, No, I likebeing just this way tough girl,
you know, kind of but, yeah, Igrew up with weird parents,
like, I can laugh at this. NowI'm going to say it because it's
funny as shit. And there's noI'm Holly. Will love this. I'm
50, I'm 50, and I can say itain't none you lied Right? Like,

(10:35):
so the funniest thing is that myparents literally met in a VA
psych ward. Oh, wow, which ishilarious, because I told Sandy
the story the first time. Shejust was like, what? And I was
like, yeah, that's why I'm me.
My dad had come back fromVietnam. My dad was like, this

(10:58):
super track star, basketballstar, went to Salesian High
School in Richmond. Grew up inpart of Chester village. Really
nice, affluent black family, youknow, not affluent in terms of
rich, but they were very theyjust took care of they worked
really hard, and they really hadpride in what they had. They had

(11:19):
a home that they had bought fortheir family and children to
raise and all that stuff. So mydad was, like, he was baby boy,
and he was like, so good ateverything. It was really
handsome, and they called himbaby brother. So when it came
time, you know, he got all theselike scholarships to go wherever
we wanted to go. And one ofthose scholarships was to West

(11:42):
Point. Oh, okay. And instead ofgoing to all the other coolest
places, he could have gone andhe decided to go into the
military, not even West Point,he just went into the military
and got drafted over to Vietnamand ended up there, yeah. So
imagine being like, baby boy,track star, basketball star,
like, doted on, like, spoiled,and then you go to Vietnam,

(12:03):
what's the first thing you'redoing drugs? And that's what he
did. So he came back strung outon heroin. And a

Siobhan (12:10):
lot of those guys did because it was also, like,
served up to them over there,yeah, yeah, yeah, which I think
a lot of people don't realize orknow anymore, right? Because
there's not as many vets. Imean, there, there's a like, I
don't know, when I was a kid,you saw the VA vet, like, the
vets everywhere, right? And,like, you heard their stories.

(12:31):
Or maybe it's just I had unclesthat were there, and so I

Tara Mae (12:34):
would, maybe that's what it was. Maybe it's because
we had people directly relatedto us who experienced it, and so
we, you know, maybe we were justmore keen to what we were, what
was out there, to hear about it.
But yeah, and then my mother,she was in the military, and she
got kicked out, because back inthe 73 this is about 73 and a
7273 beginning of 73 she gotkicked out. She was, she got

(13:00):
caught messing around with awoman. Oh, and so that was like,
you know, you get out skis,you're mental so, oh, wow. And
that was how my parents cametogether. And so that was the
beginning of some crazy stuff.
We're we we are in Fargo, and Ithink I'm stuck there with my
mom forever. And then finally,my dad, somehow, I don't even

(13:20):
know how, because I blacked outa lot of this stuff. And then we
ended up back here in Oakland,and I well, it was Emeryville.
We landed in Emeryville and Iwent to school. I got to be
stable in school for once in mylife, from third grade to eighth
grade, which was a really greatexperience for me, yeah, and

(13:41):
Emeryville was a veryinteresting place. It was really
small and developing, okay? Andso there were a lot of different
cultures that came togetherthere. And I was a little mixed
girl, you know, Japanese andblack and white. And there were
like, Pakistani kids next doorto me and the Sikh children

(14:02):
across the street and the, youknow, the Latino families, and
it was in the bunch of mixedfamilies. Emeryville was great
for me. It was like, somewherethat I finally felt like, Wow. I
kind of feel like, I feelcomfortable here, right, you
know? So that was, that wascool. Emeryville.

Siobhan (14:21):
Nice, yeah, yeah, cuz, and then you don't and because,
over it's so diverse, it feelssafer. I'm sure it

Tara Mae (14:27):
did. It did feel safe, yeah, it felt it for the like I
said, for the first time in mylife, it felt like I had a home.
You know, I got teased a lot inschool because we were really
poor, like a lot of us were, youknow, but, and my mom was a
really mean alcoholic, and sheused to cut my hair and do mean
things make me wear her oldclothes, like, like, you don't

(14:47):
need to be cute. You need to beworried about going to school.
Like, have to wear bell bottomsthat she pull out of her closet,
like, like, so I got teasedincessantly, but it really made
me tough. Yeah, it made mestrong, and it made me focus on
things that were important, likebeing a nice kid,

Siobhan (15:04):
yeah, do you think that's where you got your love
of passion? And, like, makingyour own clothes too is a
necessity,

Tara Mae (15:11):
really? Yeah, having to figure out ways to make the
stuff look cool, or at leastlike feel good and authentic to
me, right? So, you know, likecutting up clothing and like
doing stuff, I'd get in troublefor it too. Like, she'd be like,
Why is this cut up? And I'd belike, I ripped it when I jumped
over a fence. It's like, youknow, like making up anything,

(15:34):
but yeah, it definitely, like,clothing is huge to me, because,
like, it just, yeah, I loveclothing, and it's not even
about, like, designer labels andstuff, because I'm the chick
that'll, like, buy a secondhandcoach person,

Unknown (15:46):
run it through the dirt just to be a bitch and do the
wrong

Tara Mae (15:51):
thing to it, like, throw my gum wrappers in it.
Yeah, whatever. But, yeah,

Siobhan (15:57):
yeah. So did your parents get back together then?

Tara Mae (16:00):
So they did get back together, and they stayed, we
stayed in Emeryville for that,like, the five year chunk nice.
And then when I was about 12,they decided to split up. So by
12, like I was in seventh grade,I was actually a year ahead
because they skipped, I skippedkindergarten. I probably got on
my kindergarten teacher's nerveso bad, it's like, all she does

(16:23):
is read and she won't take naps,and she corrects me all the
time. Oh, no. So they were like,she needs to go the first grade,
yeah? So it wasn't like Ivaliantly skipped kindergarten,
sure.

Siobhan (16:34):
Well, if you were reading all the time, you
probably were just ahead of theother kids.

Tara Mae (16:37):
Yeah, exactly. I had a crazy Japanese mom at home,
like, you know, Tiger Mom. Yes,totally. So, yeah. So they, they
split up when I was 12, and thenit was weird, because he was
kind of around in and out forlike, a couple of years, and
then at 14, they really justsplit, split. But I was with my

(16:59):
mom for that time, and she was,you know, very emotionally
abusive, very physicallyabusive. It was, it wasn't a
good time. Yeah, she was alsostruggling through her own
alcoholism and mental mentalhealth stuff that was
undiagnosed. And, you know, tobe fair, she didn't, I don't

(17:20):
think she had the resources oreven knew the wherewithal what
to do, right?

Siobhan (17:23):
Yeah, because when you're in it, it's hard to know
that you're in it sometimes. AndI think people lose that. Like,
I know when I was in some of thedarkest times, like I didn't
know I was in those dark times,like I thought I was doing okay.
I thought I was like, pulling itoff right, and I was very much
not right. And like, when Italked to friends and stuff
after that. They were like, youwere like, not even alive,
right? You weren't there. Theywere like, you were like, your

(17:45):
body was there, but nothingelse. And I was just like, Yeah,
I don't even and then, and thenI had to admit, like, there were
some things I don't remembereven being at, yeah, where I'm
like, I know I was there becauseI have the photos, I have the
keepsakes, I've no, almost nomemory of being there, right?
And I'm like, fuck. And I reallythought at the time, like I was
doing everything, right? Yeah,and I was so fucked that it was
just you can't see it. It's likethe forest through the trees

(18:07):
kind of thing, absolutely crazy.
And then if you, if no one'sever taught you about it or to
be aware of it, or,

Tara Mae (18:14):
yeah, she didn't have a great example. I get it, you
know, she came from her mother'sfrom Japan, spoke very little
English, even at the very so theend of her life, you know, I get
it, she didn't get all the Yeah.
So, you know, I know she didn'tknow, right? But

Siobhan (18:29):
it doesn't make it okay. It just makes it easier to
understand.

Tara Mae (18:32):
I think it also didn't help this. She like, was like,
I'm gonna find something to makeme feel grounded. I know I'll
become a Jehovah's Witness. Sothat didn't help. So I ended up
spending a nice chunk of mychildhood under the under that
bright or yellow book with theshiny red letters that my book
of Bible stories shit that theywow, I was so I was the kid on

(18:56):
top of being like poor and brokeand busted down, fucked up Afro
and weird little mixed kid,like, what are you like? I also
was like the kid that couldn'thave cupcakes and shit with
Halloween, that I couldn't dobirthdays and I couldn't do
anything, so I was justcelebrate anything. I was like,

(19:17):
so ostracized, and I had, like,so few friends, but my friends
were really good friends, and Iwas also friends with my
teachers. It wasn't a teacher'spet thing. It was like, You're
my teachers, and I hadfriendships, and I think that
that really saved me, because Iwasn't getting anything from

(19:39):
home. In that regard, everythingwas like you could do better.
You need to do better. If it wasa B, it should have been an A.
If it was an A, it should havebeen an A plus an extra credit,
you know, so I I learned thathaving a very small, tight
circle of friends is all right,yeah, you know, sometimes.

Siobhan (20:00):
I think it's better, because then you really know
each other and, like, have eachother where, if you like a huge
group that you kind of justfluttering kind of between, you
don't get that same support,

Tara Mae (20:08):
right, right? I don't.
I'm not, like, the fair weatherfriend, I'm the all the time
friend, yeah, like, I'm notgonna sit there and chat on the
phone with you all day long, butI guarantee you, like, when
there's something going downwith you. I'm right there, yeah,
but I won't support yourbullshit either, and I'll call
you out and just like I want youto do for me too. Like, you know
that, yeah, I'm that friend.

(20:31):
Like, if you want someone toblow smoke up your ass and
sunshine, don't call me

Siobhan (20:39):
when you go through such hard things, especially at
an early age, I think yourbullshit meter is just like,
almost non existent. It'sbusted, yeah? Like, you're just
like, like, that is not aproblem, right?

Tara Mae (20:51):
But did you die? Yeah, right. It's very like, but did
you die? No, shut the fuck up.
Yeah. And it sometimes feelscold, but it's also like, you
know, you just don't want towaste you've, you've spent so
much time in your life wastinggood energy on people who really
just want to suck up that energyand not do anything good with
it. So, you know, yeah, yeah.

Siobhan (21:16):
It's very much like, yeah. You're just like, I'm
Yeah, I just take it over there.
Like, I don't not mad at you forit, but I don't want it in my
aura.

Tara Mae (21:25):
Like, exactly your circus, your monkey.

Unknown (21:27):
This is a monkey free zone.

Tara Mae (21:33):
I don't like loose monkeys. Okay? I don't like
loose monkeys. So

Siobhan (21:41):
Did it get better in high school

Tara Mae (21:42):
or worse? Oh, that was the interesting part. So I went
from being like, really, reallysheltered by my mother, you
know, it was a very like home,do your chores, you know, do
your homework and wait to begiven orders, right from that.
And one day when I was 14 yearsold, I looked at her, she had
she was hitting me, and I said,You can't hit me anymore. And

(22:05):
she looked at me, she said, Oh,really. I said, You can't hit me
anymore. And then I she said,Okay. I said, I want to live
with my dad. She grabbed garbagebags, and she started shoving my
stuff in garbage bags. And Ihelped her. And I sat outside
and waited for my dad, and hecame and got me, but she had
talked so bad about she's like,he's a drug addict, he's

(22:26):
alcoholic. Well, I knew my daddrank, you know, had no idea she
wasn't lying. I had no idea shewasn't lying. So I literally got
picked up with garbage bags fromEmeryville, flats in Emeryville,
driven up to into the skylinehills. So I'm like, Man, my
dad's doing good. He lives inthe skyline hills, these nice

(22:49):
house, apartments. I'm 14 yearsold. I'm like, she talked all
that mess about my daddy. Andlook at my daddy up here, like
the Jeffersons. And so my fatherhad always made his living, kind
of being like a jack of alltrades maintenance man. So he
found himself a maintenancesupervisory position up there.
Had a, you know, his apartmentfor free, or whatever he was

(23:11):
balling up there. So it looked,I walk in and I sit down, and
he's like, if you wantcigarettes, there's some
cigarettes. Throws him. He'slike, there's beer in the
fridge. And, you know? And I waslike, what is happening? I was
like, did I just wake up inanother dimension? Like, wow,
yeah, because you're 14, andfrom the morning time to get my

(23:33):
ass beat until the evening time,I suddenly can have cigarettes
and a beer. I don't even, Inever even had those things, but
sure, I'll, yeah, I'll havethem, yeah, what

Siobhan (23:45):
14 year old's gonna be like, No, I'm okay. I'm like,

Tara Mae (23:47):
I just got my ass beat this morning. I'll take a
cigarette and a beer, you know?
Like, yeah. And it was like, Iwas like, my dad's so cool. Oh
my gosh. But I was like, Thisfeels weird though, too. Like,
yeah. So you can imagine, like,the mind fuckery,

Siobhan (24:03):
yeah, that's like a huge swing. It was like

Tara Mae (24:07):
in your universe. I don't know if anybody's read
Richard Wright, like black boy,the book Black Boy, but I
remember reading that book whenI was in seventh grade, and then
living that out right aftergoing, damn, I lived that book
like my dad was, like, doingcrazy stuff. He was like, he had

(24:28):
he I watched him OD on herointwice while he lived in that
apartment. I yeah, he hadhookers, though he was
lightweight, fucking. Like, itwas so redonkulous. But this is
also the same dude. Like, oncehe wasn't doing that anymore, he

(24:49):
would go to Chinatown and, like,because we moved down into
downtown Oakland and because hecouldn't afford it up there, you
know, he can't keep that livinggoing. He fucked his Shut up. We
ended up in downtown. Oakland,like the Peralta apartments on
14th and Jackson. I'm like, Man,I need to get a job, because
this man can't feel so workingat McDonald's at that 14th and

(25:09):
Jackson McDonald's. I'm 14,light on my work permit and
everything, but he used to gohis shop flip this same dude
that was like, lightweight

Unknown (25:16):
pimping bitches used to come home this stupid smile on
his face, and I'd be like, Whatare you doing? He's like, reach
into his pants, like, pull out awhole salmon shoplifted.

Tara Mae (25:39):
We might have to scratch allegedly, you know, no,
he's dead. We can talk about it.
He was the fun when I tell youthat man was hilarious. He was
crazy, AF, but he was so funny,like, I see why he drove my
mother crazy. But it was sofunny, so funny. It was funny
while it was going on, yeah, but

Siobhan (26:04):
yeah, I have an uncle like that. He was like, I don't,
I can't remember a time ofseeing him sober, like, ever,
ever. And he, like, lived in mygrandmother's basement. And
like, he just like, one timethat some of his the stories
about him are, like, there'ssome of my favorite I ever grew
up with. And I, like, at laterin life, met one of his
daughters who didn't grow upwith us, like you should. Like
she existed, you know, and likeshe like, you know, her story is

(26:27):
her story of why they left. Buthe was abusive and he was an
alcoholic, and you know, he,like, went AWOL from the army.
So many times they just stoppedcoming for

Unknown (26:37):
they gave up. They were just like, yeah, just stay home.
But

Siobhan (26:41):
when I met his daughter, like, I was telling
her some of the stories andtelling her, and I, like,
stopped myself at one point,because I'm like, laughing,
we're both laughing, and I waslike, listen, I just, I just
want you to know, like, I willalways, I'll tell you whatever
you want to know, like, aboutgrowing up with him. Like, but
all the stories gonna come from,like, a loving, fun place and,
like, because to me, he waslike, I'm like, mostly a nice
guy. I'm like, there was a fewspots where I saw that side of

(27:03):
him and it scared me. Like, Oh,this guy would, like, like,
right? Or could, you know, like,if he was far enough, drunk or
whatever, like, you know, therewas like, a line that I knew,
yeah, be aware of. But, yeah,other than that, like, he was
like, the most honest guy. Like,you gave him $100 he'd give you
bound to the penny back. Youknow what I mean, like, right?
He's super honest and kind andlike, but then also could say

(27:24):
some of the meanest shit. Like,I walked in one Thanksgiving,
and I was like, probably 13, andI had knee high boots on, and he
was like, Oh, your father'sworking all his fucking extra
hours to keep you off the pole.
And here you are looking likeyou're getting on one Oh, and I
just remember standing there,and I was like, what? And he's
like, What are you a hooker? AndI was like, I gotta go over
here. And, like, I was justlike, Oh my God. Like,

(27:59):
okay, say, excuse me, man,

Unknown (28:05):
like, I was just

Siobhan (28:06):
like, you know, I'll tell you all these stories with
like, humor and laughter, andI'm like, and she was like, no,
no. It's really nice to hearsomeone talk about him that way,
because I don't know him likethat, yeah. She's like, and he's
not my father. Like, he's not mydad. He's the man that gave
like, yeah, my father, right,right, all right. Well, as long
as you don't like, I'm like,because they're very funny to
me. I'm like, but they're alsofunny because he's not my dad,

(28:29):
that part, very aware of that.
And was like, Yeah, you know, Ijust want to be respectful of
the fact that if it was my dad,I don't know, I don't know,
yeah. And I was like, and I justwant to be cautious of that,
right? She was just like, No,no. It's really just, it's
funny, and she's like, and it'snice to hear someone talk about
him, like, in a good light,yeah, yeah. Like, yeah. That's,
I think, you know, people aremulti dimensional.

Tara Mae (28:50):
They are, and that part is, you know, I think a
huge part of growing as aperson, like realizing that,
like, I wish my mother couldhave looked at people in a multi
dimensional light, like, evenherself, like, you know, there's
and I think, I think I gotreally good at that, being able
to, I didn't think of it asmulti dimensional for a little

(29:13):
while. I thought I had, like,you know, d I d like, I was
like, why are there thesedifferent components and pieces
of me and, like, differentpersonalities, and I'm like, but
they're all the same person,like, and really, what it was I
learned how to just kind ofcompartmentalize these different
sets of strengths that thesedifferent parts of me have, you

(29:35):
know? And so, yeah, yeah, it'slike,

Siobhan (29:37):
code switching, right?
Like, yes, I didn't know codeswitching. Like, I mean, I knew
I I didn't know how to nameuntil I like, and then I was
like, Wait, doesn't everyone

Tara Mae (29:45):
do that? Everyone? I know people like to call it for
no, it's everyone. I was like,

Siobhan (29:49):
everyone does it because you do, you have a work
version and you have a homeversion. I'm like, that's
basically code switching. Yes.
I'm like, It's a survival

Tara Mae (29:56):
instinct people and people code switch all, every.
Days every gender. People codeswitch when they go to church.
People code switch when they goin public speaking forums. Like
every there's code switching ofall types. And, yeah,

Siobhan (30:09):
yeah. And I was just like, I didn't really. And then
I was like, Wait, but then somepeople say they don't, like, how
do you say everyone

Tara Mae (30:16):
does? And the ones that truly don't, I'm gonna tell
you they they're weird andinhuman to me. I'm just like,
you weird. You weird. In thatvoice too, you weird.

Siobhan (30:35):
It's gonna be hard, though, when you're watching
your dad killing himself andstruggling with an addiction.

Tara Mae (30:41):
Yeah, and I didn't know that that's what it was
exactly. It was such a hugelike, slam, like, boom. It was
like, reality. There was nolike, leading up to it. It was
like, my dad was doing crack andheroin and shit in the house and
offering it to me. I hadtonsillitis when I went to live
with him, and like, a week afterI lived with him, he offered me
that he's like, Oh, it'll numbit up. And like, you know, when

(31:04):
you have a parent that's like,doing that kind of stuff, and
it's, it's, can be really, I wasreally fortunate after his
second OD, within the time spanof about two months or less,
because it was all so fast andsuch a blur. My grandmother I
got put in a foster home. Oh,wow. Got put in a foster home.

(31:26):
And I really have blocked out alot of it, but I think it was
probably a week, a week, maybe aweek and a half, that I spent
there, and then my grandmothercame and got me, my father's
mother, OMA Chun, and my motheralways told me terrible things
about her, and so I was afraidof her. But when she came to get

(31:47):
me, and she was so sweet, I waslike, That can't be true. My
mother was so mean to me, Ican't imagine. Just didn't feel
right. And so it felt verynatural to find, you know, just
like I was very feral, you know,coming in, my grandmother was a
very proper, you know, woman,and very and so it was. I was

(32:08):
very feral coming from livingwith my parents who, like, let
me run around like a littlestray cat and barefoot and
fishing and climbing trees andnot taking baths, and, you know,
and grandma was, like, you cantake a bath, and I'm like,
Ducking when I want to, youknow, like, I was so feral.

Unknown (32:27):
Like, like,

Tara Mae (32:30):
So grandma always cared, right? Grandma was so
gentle with me. So she really,if it weren't for her, I'd be a
feral I don't even know if I'dbe alive. Quite frankly, she was
just a really wonderful, sweetinfluence of positive feminine
energy that showed me what itmeant to be strong and and

(32:52):
loving and firm and gentle, andif it needs to be, you know and
still love you. Grandma taughtme a lot about being human. I
didn't really feel human. I feltvery like I said the word feral
very much. My parents raised mefishing. We got fish take the

(33:16):
babies out, like we were crazychildren, like we were fucking
seriously feral children. Weused to fight like dogs. They'd
leave us in the car for like anhour to go in the grocery store,
and we'd fight in the car untilthey came back to weird
strangers were looking in thecar like we were feral. You
know? We grew around, grew uparound, a lot of violence and
screaming and hollering. So,yeah, you know? So grandma

(33:39):
mellowed me out.

Siobhan (33:41):
She was gave you probably your first real estate
of home

Tara Mae (33:45):
in my own room, my own bathroom, my own whole section
of the house, whole floor of theHouse, to myself. Oh, wow. I was
like, so like, can you imagine,like, all these switches that I
went from like, and then Ifinally land in this beautiful
three level home where I have myown room and all that, you know,

(34:05):
school and but in the midst allthat, what happens to a young,
feral girl, she got pregnant. Sounbeknownst to me, at 15, I had
become pregnant. Wow, and that'sso young. I didn't know nothing,
I didn't know nothing, and sograndma with her, I always

(34:28):
joking witchy cell. She used togo, Tara, are you pregnant? Oh,
I'd be like, No. Why would yousay that? She was like, and one
day, finally, she's like, I'mtaking you to the doctor. Took
me to Children's HospitalOakland. She's like, you're
pregnant, Jeremy. And I waslike, Why? Why do you keep
saying that? She said, It's yourhands, like old southern black

(34:50):
woman, she looked at my hands,and she said, It's your hands. I
said, What do you mean? What?
What? She's like I I'm justtelling you, right? So I'm sure
you know she. New signs. I wasvery tiny, though, and wasn't
showing I was still in a leotardand dance class and stuff. Girl,
she took me to Children'sHospital Oakland. Why? They said
I was seven months pregnant. 28weeks, seven months. Girl,

(35:11):
grandma was like, Well, youknow, there are certain options
that are not available now. AndI was like, by that point,
though, I felt like I had beenthrough a lot, and I was just, I
was like, I knew I couldn't takecare of this baby, right? And
Grandma told me, she said,people are gonna have a lot to

(35:33):
say about this, and you don'tmind none of it. She said,
You're not a bad girl becauseyou had a baby. She said, in
fact, the bad girls, they knowhow not to get pregnant. So I
thought that was so sweet.

Siobhan (35:49):
That is a sweet way to look at that.

Tara Mae (35:53):
So she said, there's gonna be people in the family
and everything that gotsomething to say about it. And I
want you to know I supportwhatever you choose to do for
this baby, because I know you'regonna make the right choice for
the baby. And we had a familyfriend who had briefly dated my
father because they grew uptogether and she couldn't have

(36:14):
children, and she came to me andoffered to do an open adoption.
She said, I would like to takecare. There's a whole long story
behind that that I won't go intoright now, but yeah, so she came
and she did an open adoption,and so I named a little girl,
and, you know, holidays andstuff, she'd come see me, you

(36:35):
know, but Grandma told me shewas really wise, and she said,
Tara, may I know it's gonna hurtyou, but you gonna need to stay
away. I know that everybody saidyou can visit and stuff, but she
said, for your heart, I thinkyou need to. And she said, you
don't want that woman to thinkyou gonna steal the baby back.

(36:55):
And I took that to heart, and Isaid, okay, and I did. So as the
years went on, I kind of backedaway more and more, and I'd get
pictures, but I'd, you know, Ijust didn't stay as connected,

Siobhan (37:07):
right? Yeah, I imagine that's extremely difficult to be
watching someone else. Reasonyour kid, you know, giving them
the life that you want to begiving

Tara Mae (37:17):
them, right? Like, right? Yeah. So, you know, that
was fucking crazy. It's a hardthing, yeah, all right, pretty
intense. But, you know, you keeppushing. I finished school, and,
you know, I worked and I went toschool, and I did all the things
and normal, you know,responsible kid tries to do.

(37:40):
And then 19, I got pregnantagain. It's like, I never
thought I was gonna have allthese
kids, you know, these thingshappen. And that one, I was
like, I'm not letting thishappen again. I'm gonna take
care of this baby. I'm gonna dowhatever I have to do. And I
grew myself up real good. And Igot an apartment, little studio

(38:00):
apartment, little, you know, andI met this guy, and we stayed
together for 10 years. I waseight months pregnant when I met
him, he was living, you know,like in this shared living
situation, and I was visiting myfriend who was there while I was
pregnant, and we just got along,and he was, like, the first guy
I'd met in a long time thatdidn't just try to, like, jump

(38:22):
my bones

Siobhan (38:23):
well being ate my

Unknown (38:25):
friends, I'm pregnant.

Tara Mae (38:28):
You still like me.
Okay, you cool, like, you don'twant to just do it to me. So.
And he was like, like, 10 yearsolder, almost 11 years older,
Oh, wow. But he was real younglooking, and he was, he was just
such a protector. He was sosweet and giant. He was like six
foot five, big, giant guy. Andhe just took such good care of
me, and I needed that in mylife. You know, my dad was six

(38:50):
foot five. I very much needed,like that six foot five, like
black man, to come and just belike everything my dad failed to
be, and then he ended up kind ofbeing that, and I kind of grew
out of that. After 10 years, wehad a really great time
together, but he was veryprotective, overly protective.
And as I grew as a woman and asperson, it just was like, this

(39:13):
doesn't really work for me. I'mI don't like that vibe over me
so well,

Siobhan (39:19):
because it goes from being it feels protective at
first, and then it goes tofeeling controlling that part.
And it's like, I don't know whenthat shifted, where it used to
feel good that you were watchingmy back, and now it feels like
you're telling me what I can andcan't do,

Tara Mae (39:32):
right, exactly, you know, exactly, yeah, yeah. It
became that, like, you know,even to the point of like, I
don't want you to cut your hair,or I want you to wear these
clothes, or, you know, like, allmy 20s, I kept extra weight on
me, like 3040, extra pounds onme, because I felt like when I
got attention from people, itwould just make him go crazy,

(39:54):
and they he'd go off on them inpublic. And I was like, if I'm
big, they won't pay attention tome. But it worked out that. It.
I still got the attention withthe long hair and big they
still, it didn't matter. Peoplewere still gonna look and do
whatever, and he would just it.
Just over the years, it nevergot better. And I'd be like, You
don't trust me. It's like, Itrust you. I don't trust them.
And I was like, I can't livelike this. Yep, anymore. Get me
out of here. Get me out of here.

(40:20):
And so we, you know, we ended uphaving another child together
and stuff, you know, during thecourse of that time, wonderful
child. That child is sowonderful. She's an angel. So
he, yeah, we, we had a greattime together, but we just kind
of, I outgrew that situation,you know, by the time I was 29 I
was like, I'm ready to lose allthis weight. I'm about to go
back to school. I'm ready to bea whole new person. I'm very

(40:42):
much like, shed the oldexoskeleton. Let's go with
something new all the time.
Yeah, you know, I get boredpretty easily with myself.

Siobhan (40:50):
Well, I think, like, if you're doing life right, you are
always evolving and learning andgrowing and becoming like, a
different, different version ofyourself, right? And like,
finding more things that you'reexcited about or interested in
or passionate about, yeah, Ithink that's important. And I
think sometimes you can do thatwith a person, and then
sometimes that person is likeblocking you from it, right? And

(41:10):
if they're growing with you andthey're growing, then it's
great. But if only one of you isgrowing, it kind of gets very
lopsided, very fast, very

Tara Mae (41:18):
quickly, and, you know, resentment and all the
stuff. So around 29 I left, andI, you know, I just, I'm a very
like, just go. So pack my stufflike a thief in the night kind
of thing, and laugh, yeah, youknow, to be fair, 29 year old me
was not graceful. I was justlike, I gotta go. And so was, it

(41:39):
was painful for him, and he wasupset for a few years, but to
this day, right now, he and Iare such good friends, and he's
a wonderful father and reallygood friend, great with my
current partner. Like, they getalong like, you know, it's good,
it's good So, but he understood,you know, over the years, we

(42:00):
took time to talk. He went totherapy. I went to therapy. We
grew as individuals, and we cameback together. We talked, we co
parented, you know, throughoutit all. And you know, he was a
good dude, you know, heunderstood that it wasn't it was
that I needed to keep growing,and that he had told me, I'm
gonna be this dude all the timefor the rest of my life. And I
was like, that, don't work forme, yep, and that's okay,

Siobhan (42:22):
yeah, and I you can eventually be friends, or, like,
if you can do it, if you cancatch it early enough and have
that conversation be like, Allright, bet you want to be the
same person, and I don't. Soyeah, like, let's walk away with
this. Walk away from this with,like, love and, like, the same
kind of love and care that wewalked into it. Yeah, it's so
hard for people.

Tara Mae (42:41):
It is because people get so wrapped up in, like, all
of the time they spent and allthat. And it's like, but that
was all to learn, right?
Sometimes people come into yourlife, as the old folks say, for
it, therefore it's a reason, aseason, some for a lifetime, but
very few for a lifetime. Youknow it's, it's for a short
time, most people, you're veryblessed if people end up being

(43:02):
the ones that get to stickaround with you for the long
haul and all that growth.
Everybody can't do that.

Siobhan (43:10):
Yeah, and it should be like, I wish people could accept
it more. Yeah, even myself.
Sometimes, you know, like, Iwill try to keep a relationship
going when I know I shouldn't bewhere I'm like, if I just let it
just kind of fizzle, yeah, youknow, like, instead of either
fighting for it when it's like,not being reciprocated, or just
being like, Okay, well, that's aperson that I'll only see in

(43:31):
these instances. And when I seethem, it's great. And then when
I don't, it's shouldn't be aproblem, right? You know? And I
try to lead that, because Ileave the same thing. I'm always
like, it's a lesson, a blessing,a reason, or a season. You see
you,

Tara Mae (43:45):
right? I saw your face. You were like, it's right,
yes,

Siobhan (43:49):
yeah, I say that a lot, and I'm like, it's because it's
true, like everything, and younever know which is going to be
which, and it's trying to figureout which is, which is, like
driving yourself

Tara Mae (43:58):
crazy. It's impossible. It's like us trying
to figure out how, the hows andwhens and all the things, like,
you know, when it comes to,like, manifesting things, you
know, like, you don't thinkabout the hows and the whens and
the what is gonna you're justlike, I know it's gonna happen.
I it's already mine. And I'mmore if you're moving in that
vein, and all of your energy,and you know, is moving in that

(44:20):
vein, you don't have to worryabout the hows and the whens and
the whys and the you know,right?

Siobhan (44:25):
Yeah, so where did you go after you left as a thief in
the night? Oh,

Tara Mae (44:31):
I was so crazy. I met this crazy, crazy boy from
Cleveland. I was bartend, and Ilost all this weight. I got
down, like, super tiny, like,size two. I thought it was so
cute. Girl, girl, I look like acrackhead. I look like a Q tip.
Everybody was like, girl, youall right, if I have no no
better, I think he was on drugs.
I'm like, Well, I'm not. I'mreally cute right now, because

(44:53):
that was fat for so long. I waslike, I don't know what's. Wrong
with them. They're justtripping. I'm really cute, but
when I look back at thosepictures, I'm like, Oh girl,
damn. So anyways, this I wasworking at this bowling alley
and bartending and this crazycock eyed white boy walks. No
joke, if I showed you a picture,you'd be like, Oh yeah,

(45:20):
cockeyedi was but you know, Iwas probably drinking a lot
behind the bar, and I didn'treally notice it until I went to
meet him

Unknown (45:28):
for coffee. You're also cocked. So he comes to

Tara Mae (45:33):
the bar, and apparently he went out and he
told me, he told me later, he'slike, I told my friends and his
friends, he said, I'm married. Ibartender. And then he did. He
did. He's like, he came back in.
He's like, Can I get yournumber? I was like, nope,
Ducking, give me yours. And twoweeks later, I had enough, and
that's when I left a thief, likea thief in the night. Moved in

(45:54):
with him. Oh, my God.

Unknown (46:00):
I moved in with him and his dog. He

Tara Mae (46:04):
had two dogs. One was Cujo and one, yeah. Anyways, I
was crazy. I was crazy. I wentthrough some crazy stuff, and I
ended up having another baby at30. Oh my gosh. So that's the
fourth eyed guy with thecockeyed guy with the cockeyed
Cleveland boy, and unbeknownstto me, like he was a complete

(46:27):
alcoholic. Of course, that's allI attract. You know, you grow up
with that. It looks normal. Soended up with the alcoholic like
snorty Boy that lied about itthe whole time, and, you know,
all the crazy stuff and beinggas lit, you know, to be made to

(46:48):
think you're crazy. Oh, you youstill like me doing coke because
your dad was crackhead. And I'mlike, You shouldn't say those
things around me.

Siobhan (46:57):
So probably okay that I think it's a, not a great thing
to be doing a

Tara Mae (47:01):
coke. I mean, really, especially if you feel like, if
I didn't lie about it, like,

Siobhan (47:05):
even if my dad wasn't a crackhead, right?

Tara Mae (47:08):
What makes you bro?
Like, he just, he was such a gaslighter. So after a few years of
that, not even a few years like,we ended up getting married, and
that was weird, I went down, Itold you, I went down the aisle
his mother handed me value

Siobhan (47:23):
right before I was like, freaking out about getting
married.

Tara Mae (47:25):
I wasn't externally, but internally, like I remember
being in the mirror fixing myhair and my dress, going, What
the are you doing? Why are youdoing this? If you just walked
away, nobody would die. But Ihad my daughters with me, and I
was like, You need to be anadult. You've gotten this far.
We're all the way in Cleveland.
And the we were in ShakerHeights, Ohio. I was like, it's

(47:46):
snowing. I guess you're gettingmarried and you're gonna have a
white Christmas right here. Andthat's what we did in December,
in December. So I knew it wasthe wrong thing to do, but I was
like, it's just, like, a tattoo.
I can get it covered up, I canget a divorce. I'll just get a
new tattoo. I was like, thisisn't, like, permanent,

Unknown (48:14):
not wrong,

Tara Mae (48:16):
you know? I was like, it's an experience. It's
something I'm doing, and that'swhat it did, and that's what it
was. And then about I want tosay, Oh, I remember after the
wedding, because we weretogether for like, about a year
and a half. And after thewedding, I think I stayed for
like, nine months, 10 months,and then, like a thief in the

(48:36):
night, once again, packed myshit, said goodbye to him in the
morning, took the kids toschool, and as soon as he was
gone, I went back home, packedmy van and wouldn't pick my kids
back

Unknown (48:46):
up from school, and left. Oh my God,

Tara Mae (48:49):
because I'm crazy and I don't, I don't just don't have
the patience if you didn't getit. Thus far, I'm leaving
because you don't get it, andI'm not doing this anymore. So
not the best way, but I'm out.
You know, would I do that now inmy life? At 50, no, no, but I
was that squirrely bitch, yeah?

Siobhan (49:08):
Well, at 3234 whatever, like, even your mid 30s, you're
still like,

Tara Mae (49:12):
so Oh, my goodness.
You think you're so grown nowyou do. Yeah, I thought it was
so grown. I thought it was sogrown, but yeah, so, you know, I
had a really interesting life ofand there's so much in between.
Girl We talking about anothertime, but you know it, I think
all of that made me someonethat's really adaptable, but it

(49:38):
takes, you know, it's taken me,for me to get older and need to
slow down, to want to, like,take the time and be more
mindful of how I navigateeverything was so survival. I
need, you know, so I'm just nowstarting to learn like you don't

(50:04):
have to run like you used torun. You don't have to do those
things. You can slow down andtake the time to think, right?
And, you know,

Siobhan (50:16):
figure out exactly what you want before you just take
off in the middle of the night,exactly

Tara Mae (50:22):
like that girl is so long gone for me. Like, I can't
even imagine being that way now.
But, like, it used to be reallyeasy for me to be that way, and
now I'm very much like, No, II've been living in a way in the
past, like, especially the lasttwo years or so, like, where I'm
just like, No, there's nothingto lose by just talk it out,
right? Me and Jeff, that's we'vebeen together 14 years, because

(50:45):
we made a deal very early onthat we instead of getting upset
as soon as something feelsfunny, just say, Hey, can we
talk for a minute and nobodytake anything personally.
Because, honestly, usually, whenyou think something, it's
usually not even that, and it'slike, oh, we just keep moving.
So we've never really even had areal argument, you know, ever,
because it's like, we just talkabout it. And I'm finding that

(51:05):
in my favorite relationships andfriendships, it's people that
feel comfortable coming to meand being like, hey, tear me or
a tea, you know, and it's like,boom. It's Oh no, or Yeah, it's,
do we just Hash it out in loveand peace? It doesn't matter if
it's gonna scratch a little. Itdon't matter.

Siobhan (51:28):
Just do it. Yeah, it's almost like not pulling the band
aid off. But it's almost likethe fact that you're willing to
have the conversation is morethan what the conversation's
about. Yeah, where it's like,oh, this person actually want
values me enough to be like,have you seen noticed this blind
spot? Or like, Hey, you're doingthis thing, and it kind of
pissing me off, right? I don'tthink you're trying to piss me

(51:50):
off, right? It's hurting myfeelings, and I know it's not
your job to like, protect myfeelings, but like, and I know
it's

Tara Mae (51:56):
not intention, right?
Yeah. And I think that what youjust said is huge to us learning
how to be received by saying,Hey, friend, I know it's not
intentional in my heart. I knowit's not intentional when you do
this. I just want you to knowthis is how it makes me feel.
And remember, there are only myfeelings. Feelings are just
things Right back, right, right.

(52:17):
So, you know, I just want to putit that, but it's that too, like
us figuring out how to bereceived, because I used to be
the bar key bitch, that was justlike, you do that, and I can't
say that. That pisses me off.
And it's like, no one hears you,even if you're right,

Siobhan (52:31):
right? Yeah, well, and it's like, you're blaming the
other person, right? Whereyou're like, you're doing this,
and it's and it's like, then youit just people get defensive,
and then

Tara Mae (52:39):
they can't, and why shouldn't they, when you're
coming at them like that, right?
Yeah, so.

Siobhan (52:44):
And it's about like, thinking that people have the
best intentions, yeah? Like, ifyou're friends, then you
shouldn't be assuming thatthey're trying to hurt you,
right? And if they do, right, ithappens and me, or maybe you
just don't vibe, like, andthat's okay, too. That part,
like, there are some people thatI like as people, but I know
when we like we just don't mixin whatever way, right? Or they

(53:06):
do something that just whatevergrates on a nerve of mine, and
I'm like, small dose, friend,or, you know, small

Tara Mae (53:12):
dose, I love that.
That's the small dose. Yeah,yeah.

Siobhan (53:15):
Like, okay, I can enjoy them as a person, but only in
small doses. And, like, I don'tneed them in my life more. It's
also appreciate them, yeah, butI appreciate that they're there,
yeah, you

Tara Mae (53:27):
still appreciate them authentically and sincerely,
just in small doses, because youknow, you know what you can do,
yeah, I know what you got inyou, yeah.

Siobhan (53:35):
And I think that that takes a while it does to learn.
It

Tara Mae (53:39):
does. And I'm still like, Girl, tuck it in. Tuck it
in. Hold on, yeah, let me gotuck that in. I'll be right
back. Guys. A little crazy flapin the ground back there for but

(54:03):
I think, you know, the crazylife. You know, we all have a
crazy life. Everybody's gotstuff the crate, the type of
crazy that I dealt with made me,you know, now that all my kids
are grown ups, and I've had afew years to like, like, find
myself, there was a minute whereI felt lost, and that's why I

(54:24):
came back to fireside. Duringthat time period, I was kind of,
like, scrubbing floorsincessantly, like a crazy
person, like, I ain't got nokids. What I'm gonna do Sandy
was, you know, just coming outof pandemic. And I was like,
and, you know, Loki had justpassed, and she called me, and I
was like, it was like, just theperfect moment to come back and

(54:47):
give my life to some thing thatmeant a lot to me and brought me
a great sense of purpose andvalue in the crazy. Skill set
that I have accumulated overtime, from working in mannequin
warehouses to being a schoolteacher and like, all the crazy

(55:08):
things I've done, you know, it'slike, where else could I put all
that to good use? Fireside isthe perfect place with Sandy and
yeah, you know,

Siobhan (55:17):
any events and the Yeah, the community outreach,
and yeah, and then you guys areon the cusp of opening up your
gallery, and so that's superexciting. So have you always
like it was art part of like,your healing? Has it always been
part of, like, is that what youwent through to kind of help
heal you? Because I think yousaid your mom was an artist.
Yeah, right. Mother was

Tara Mae (55:37):
a genius artist. She was like, multimedia. She
anything you could think of. Mymother could do. She could
create. She could sew, crochet,sculpt. She ran business from,
you know, a business from home,selling magnets, refrigerator
magnets, of all things made fromthis crazy vintage recipe, bread

(55:58):
dough that she learned from thiswoman, and she used to work for
and she, like, decided to go dothe business herself. Perfected
the clay so it would be lastlonger and everything. And ended
up there was a magnet store likeon the end of Pier 39 for many,
many, many years, decades even.
And her magnets bred. They looklike little sourdoughs and
little packages that were soldthere, and they get shipped

(56:20):
across the world. And we did allthe little vendor we used to go
to festival with the lake. I wasa vendor kid, a little feral
vendor kid running around so

Siobhan (56:31):
at home,

Tara Mae (56:34):
there was nothing my mother couldn't look at and
make, not make. Oh, wow. And soI ended up with that same mind
and talent. And so I doeverything from sculpting to,
you know, sewing and needlefelting like anything that I
think I want to learn. I justsit myself down and figure it

(56:54):
out, you know, so art's always,always been, always been a place
of peace for me. So being ableto, like, spend more time
creating again, you know, lifetakes that away from you, where
you have to, like, make moneyand take, you know, kids to go
to soccer or whatever the hellthey're doing, all these things

(57:16):
you don't get to so it's nicenow to be like, I can do these
things again, right? Yeah, I canjust play with clay like at two
o'clock in the morning, barefootin my kitchen, and make fake
olives like that, turn them intoearrings and whatever my little
crazy mind thinks of I can dothose things. Being doing the

(57:37):
gallery with Sandy is like fun,because I'm gonna do workshops
there, yeah, you know, I taughtworkshops at the Museum of
creative use, creative ofdesigning. You know, in San
Francisco Museum of design, Ialways forget the name, but
everything from like teachingpeople how to make floral head
crowns to faux terrazzo fingerbowl. So terrazzo is like a

(58:03):
stone. It's like stone that'slike laid in other it's hard to
describe. My brain can't do itright now. Yes, very mosaic ish
kind of vibes, but we do, I doit with polymer clay and teach
people how to do it, or they canjust bake it in their oven and
make their oven and make ringbowls. Oh, nice, you know,

(58:25):
whatever they want, but jewelry,you know, I've just always, I've
always, no matter what job Idid, whether it was in the
medical field, as a cliniccoordinator or medical records
clerk, whatever I was doing, Ialways was like, doing some side
hustle, like the chick thatsells earrings when she pulls up
to the PTA meeting, you knowwhat I mean? Like, always that

(58:45):
hustle is strong, right? ThatBay Area, hustle heart so, yeah,
yeah.

Siobhan (58:54):
When did you first start therapy? Like, did you
just one day think, like, hey,because you had mentioned, when
you were talking about yourstory, like you went you had
gone to therapy, he had gone totherapy. And so was that
something that, like, was easyfor you to be like, oh, I need
to go to therapy. It

Tara Mae (59:09):
was hard for me because I had some uncomfortable
experiences with therapy when Iwas younger my mother, you know,
being an alcoholic and a lot ofthe behaviors that go along with
that, like being a narcissistand things like that. Like,
there was a lot of for me, therewas a lot of shame about going
to therapy. When she would putme in therapy, it was very much,

(59:31):
very much felt like there wassomething wrong with me. But I'd
go to the therapist, and they'dbe like, you're such a nice kid,
you're you're really okay, andright? And then I'd get taken
out of that therapist, right?
And then get taken out of thattherapist and away from and I
wouldn't see him. And now, inretrospect, I realized my mother
wasn't hearing what she wantedto hear from those therapists.
Like your kids up and, you know,my they're like your kids pretty
fucking good, like and so that'swhy now I know as an adult why I

(59:56):
never got to go back to those,you know, right? So it was a
hard time for me. And I thinkabout about 15 years ago, I
decided to try to dabble goingback. It was real rocky. I
didn't feel comfortable withanybody. And about five years in
fooling around in and out of it,I found a really great therapist

(01:00:18):
who I still see, and I've seennow for 10 years, so I've really
had a chance to grow with them.
And it's really an interestingdynamic when you have a
therapist that has watched yougrow over the time span, and
watched you, like, with youngchildren all the way to no
children, and, you know, goinginto perimenopause, like,

(01:00:38):
watching me grow from all theseand being like, it's been a
decade, and I just, I recently,just started going back a couple
of months ago, and after notseeing for a year, and, you
know, hearing my therapist go,wow, we've been doing this for
10 years, right? Was a really,really powerful moment for me,

(01:00:59):
in the regard of, like,something, I stuck with
something, right? Yeah, andsomeone, and someone, and it's,
you know, it's, it's beenreally, really nice to have that
always know that it's there,yeah. And I'm not someone that
likes to go to therapy likeevery, every week, you know, I
go. I like to grow in between.
So I see my therapist once amonth, three weeks, you know, I

(01:01:21):
see you, and then three, threeand a half weeks go by, and I do
some growing and moving andnavigating through the world,
and I come on back and tell youhow it's going and get some
feedback. And, yeah,

Siobhan (01:01:32):
it's like having a checkup. Yeah, exactly, yeah. I
think, yeah. Like, when you'reworking through something, it's
good to go all the time. Butsome, I am a huge, like,
champion of taking breaks fromtherapy, yeah, and like, going
and being able to, like,integrate all that stuff and see
how you do on your own, but thenhaving that door to go back to
it, and, yeah, you know, followup with that same person and be
like, okay, like, here's thethings that we were working on,

(01:01:53):
and here's where I'm at. Andthen I, like, love a maintenance
visit. Like, yes, like, I'mgonna come see you every four
weeks or five weeks, or, like,check in, because not anything
major I'm working on right now.
And, yeah, and I think therapyis great. I think everyone
should go at least sometime,

Tara Mae (01:02:10):
at least sometime.
Yeah, it's really nice. Even ifyou could only do, like, a
quarterly, you know, check in,right? That would be well,

Siobhan (01:02:19):
because I think people forget to check in with
themselves about stuff so often,like, so you just get and, I
mean, I've done it, like, whereyou just running from kind of
one thing to the other, andyou're like, just surviving. And
you're like, Okay, here I justhave to get this done, and then
I just have to get through this,and then I can just, and then
you're just like, you'respinning, and you're going and
going, and you don't even checkin to see, like, how you feel
about any of it, right? And thenyou're like, way down this path.

(01:02:41):
And you're like, how did I gethere? How has it been this long?
And why do I feel like this?
Yeah, like, shouldn't I feelbetter if I'm all the way down
here? Yeah? And you're like,Fuck, I don't.

Tara Mae (01:02:51):
Therapy really does help you keep that focus for
yourself, that self care aspectof things. So,

Siobhan (01:03:02):
so what's what else is up for you for the next like,
now that you are kid free andyou have a good man and your
dog, you survive, so is it justfeel like, Does life feel easy
for you now, or, I mean,compared, I know it's like
comparison is a thief of joy.
And, yeah, I wonder like, is,Are you finally? Do you feel

(01:03:23):
like I'm settled and like do

Tara Mae (01:03:27):
for the most part?
Siobhan, I really do like. Ireally can say I feel the most
grounded and most in my own skinand comfortable in my own skin.
And the direction, like is notso important for me as the
journey. Yeah, you know what Imean? It's like direction can

(01:03:47):
change with the wind and withcircumstances alter things. And
you know, so staying flexible, Iused to be very rigid and get
very disappointed when thingswould change. And I'm really
still working on becoming muchmore flexible and flowy with,
you know, yeah, now that there'snot so much need for structure
in my life, like that. I stillrequire structure as a

(01:04:10):
Capricorn, though, but I muchprefer organized chaos to, like,
you know, having, like, somesuper regimented routine going
on. So really right now, I feellike I'm really focused on
learning to slow down formyself, and something Jeff has
helped me to learn over theyears, having more compassion

(01:04:37):
for myself. Because as much as Ididn't understand it before,
having compassion for myselfactually allows me to have more
compassion for other people.
Yeah, you know, I thought it wasselfish to have compassion for
myself because it would takeaway from what I could give to
other people. But it's

Siobhan (01:04:59):
really. Yeah, yeah, because you can't pour from an
empty cup, right? And if you'reholding yourself to one standard
and then everyone else toanother one, it's like, almost a
disservice to them too, yep,because, or like, you're harder
on yourself and easier on them,and then, like, it opens you up
to be, like, walked on or, like,right? Oh, she doesn't,

Tara Mae (01:05:20):
you know, I also have found that when I have these
exceedingly high expectations ofmyself, which my therapist or my
partner have had to point out tome, I also then have a tendency
to have them and put them onother people too in my mind. And
I again, you know, I foundmyself being so disappointed
because I'm like, what if Iwould think of that

(01:05:41):
automatically. Why wouldn't theythink of that automatically? And
then that's not fair to them,right? It's not fair to it's not
fair to anyone. So, like,learning, like I said, learning
to have more compassion formyself, you know, catching
myself when I say, Oh, youdumbass. Like, our nervous
system doesn't know thedifference. Parasympathetic
nervous system doesn't know thedifference between when we say

(01:06:02):
I'm a dumb ass to myself, or ifsomebody else says it's the same
thing. So really beingconscientious of that treatment
of myself and it being more, youknow, trying to slow down
because I've noticed like andbeing able to slow down I can, I
can just obviously think morelogically and more practically
and more mindfully, it's justsomething I never really

(01:06:22):
afforded myself with the lifethat I chose, having kids back
to back to back and, you know,all those things. But it does
very much feel like at 50, mylife is in a in a huge way,
starting all over again. Yeah,it feels very brand new, and in
a lot of ways very raw, but in alot of ways also very like,

(01:06:43):
strong and like. So it's a veryinteresting dichotomy of
feelings, yeah, because

Siobhan (01:06:49):
in some ways it's almost like you just graduated
college, because your kids areall like now, and they're like,
their own spaces and kind oftaking care of themselves. And
of course, you're still homebased for them, and still here
for them, but like, but they'repretty your job with them is
pretty much done now, like, andso you get to have all of this
new time that you own. And youknow,

Tara Mae (01:07:09):
it's so crazy, you know, because when you're your
30s, you're like, Man, I wouldjust go out and party. I'm like,
I want to stay home and playwith my crafty stuffs and paint.
And, yeah,

Siobhan (01:07:22):
the only problem is, we'll wrap it up. But the only
problem is, I'm not sure when itstopped

Tara Mae (01:07:26):
recording, so we might have to come back a lot of fun.
You made it really?

Siobhan (01:07:30):
Will you lean back just a little? Yeah, for sure, yeah.
So we just had some technicaldifficulties. I have been having
technical difficulties a lot thelast few episodes, like I have a
whole episode with Christos fromPark Street tavern, yeah, and
his mic. It was sounding greatin my headphones, and then when
I went to listen to it, itwasn't even on. Oh no. I mean,
it was, but for some reason, itjust didn't record, or my mic

(01:07:52):
didn't record. But I'm the onlyone you can hear. It was like a
glitch in the system, and it wassuch a weird thing. But like
these

Tara Mae (01:07:57):
little things, it's some stuff going on in the
universe, it is, and it's

Siobhan (01:08:01):
that time, but I also feel like it's stuff that I
would have it would have mademe, like, worry and quit and
question if I should still bedoing it. And that thought
hasn't crossed my mind at allstuff. So it's like, oh, okay,
wait a second. I hit anotherlevel. Okay, yeah, yes,
confidence and like, I just, Isent it to a couple of audio
guys that I knew, and a few ofthem looked at it, and they were

(01:08:23):
like, you'd have to go buyalmost, like, minute by minute
to fix it. And they're like, youknow, I could do it, but it'll
cost you a lot of money. Or Iwas just like, Yeah, I'm just
gonna ask him if we can redo itright? Like, there's no big
deal. Yeah. I mean, I'm like,you know, I'm sorry that I'm
have to, you know, ask for moreof your time. But also, like, we
get to hang out again. It's notthat terrible.

Tara Mae (01:08:42):
I love that, though, for you that you know, and I
love to hear that other people,for me, I gaged a lot, like, you
know, like, you know, a coupleof years ago that would have
freaked, like, made me flip myshit, or I would have lost my
shit a year ago over that, likethat, that growth Gage, where
you're like, man, just a fewmonths ago, you know, like, I
hear you, I hear you do thatlike a lot, when I we talk and

(01:09:03):
I'm like, I love that. You know,we do that for ourselves.

Siobhan (01:09:07):
Well, yeah, like, I want to acknowledge it in
myself. So like, one, I think ithelps someone else. And two, and
like, when you can admit it, itjust yeah, like, if that stuff
had happened, or, like, some ofthe other stuff that we were
talking about in our personallives. Like, if stuff like that
had happened six months or ayear ago, I would be beside
myself, right and even rightnow, like, my job, one of my

(01:09:27):
jobs ended, and it endedabruptly, and it kind of rocked
me and, like, upset me, and thenI was also like, but it's also a
gift from the universe. And thisis happening, and that's
happening, and I'm, like,concerned about where some of my
finances will have like fall,but I'm not worried, but not
worried, and for the it's and Isaying to you, I don't know,
maybe I'm just completelydelusional at this point in my

(01:09:50):
life. I don't think you are. Idon't think so. It's almost like
I every time I've trust theuniverse and followed my
intuition, it's been okay.

Tara Mae (01:09:56):
It sounds, you know, I know it sounds so hokey pokey
and hippie. Dippy, but god darnit, if it's not real and
provable, like we've lived it,yeah, we know it, and it's
really hard to deny that. If youknow it's hard to stay in that
mode, obviously, because beinghuman, but like, it's hard to

(01:10:17):
deny once you've seen it foryourself, experience for
yourself, that that's the bestway to

Siobhan (01:10:21):
go. And I think, and actually, this is but last point
before we wrap this up, becausehow did you or Where did you
keep the hope from? Because Ithink at one point, like in my
life, I lost a couple people,and I was just like, What's the
fucking point? And I kind ofgave up on a lot of stuff,
because I was like, none of thismatters. Like we all just
fucking die anyways. And like, Iremember, I became very, kind of

(01:10:43):
jaded, and I was just like,unmotivated to do some of the
things that you're supposed todo in life. Like, I It's when I
first dropped out of college andwas just like, I don't know what
I want to do, but I know, like,this isn't making me happy, it's
getting my anxiety worse. Like,I don't know where I'm going,
and I just need a minute to kindof catch my breath and figure
out what the fuck I'm gonna dowith my life. And, like, why

(01:11:04):
waste the money that I don'thave and my parents don't have
going to a school that I hate,right? But I and I kind of was
just like, nothing matters,because we just all die. So
like, I'm just gonna figure outwhat I'm

Tara Mae (01:11:16):
gonna laugh, yeah?

Siobhan (01:11:19):
And I was just like, I don't, you know. And then I,
like, didn't have a dream for mylife, because it was, like, I
couldn't get past the fact that,like, what? What's the point in
it? Like, why work so hard, ifit's all just gonna get taken
away? Yeah. And then I don'tknow where, like, I shook it,
you know, and I don't, but Ididn't shake it for a long time.
I still had a hard time, like,dreaming about what I wanted my
life to be, or what I felt likeI could dream about because,

(01:11:41):
like, what was I worth? Almost,yeah, like, and I think, like,
now, like, I actually, like,now, if 15 year old me, or 22
year old me, could see my lifenow, she'd be like, Bitch.
That's a dream.

Tara Mae (01:11:51):
That's right, we were, we wanted

Siobhan (01:11:54):
the dream. That was the dream that we couldn't even
admit we

Tara Mae (01:11:56):
had. We didn't even know we had.

Siobhan (01:11:59):
And, like, now I have all these other like, dreams and
hopes and desires to where mylife will go, and it's scarier.
It's scarier than not having it,because now it's like, I could
fail or whatever, but like, howdid you not lose any of that
hope? Because, like, the eardrumgrown up so much harder, and I
actually have two questions,yeah, maybe we'll do another one

(01:12:21):
another

Tara Mae (01:12:21):
day. I don't, I think, I don't know, hope, I don't
know. I think I got used tolosing things really young, and
so I just never looked at thingsas permanent in my life. I'm
very I've been told in by somepeople that I can be cold
because I'm very quick, and it'svery quick and very easy for me

(01:12:44):
to turn something off, shut itout, and be done with it. So I
just never when I really, reallylove somebody or something,
like, It's hardcore, like, Itake care of it. It's I'm
protecting that shit with mylife, right? But it's far and
few between, because I'm so I'vegotten used to it. So it was

(01:13:04):
easy. I think keeping hope forme was more so just, it wasn't
even about like I've got to keepthe keep hope, it was more so
just like, I'm so used to losingstuff, like I could just recomp
everything anyways, I'll restartall over again. It's just never
been a thing for me. I've leftall my belongings behind before
and been like, fuck it. I'llstart over. I don't care, you

(01:13:25):
know, just I have thatmentality, like I am not afraid
of letting go of everything andwaking up the next day in a new
place and starting from scrigeScratch.

Siobhan (01:13:36):
That's a superpower.
That's a superpower.

Tara Mae (01:13:40):
Man, I don't, it's not my favorite thing to do, but I
am not. You're not afraid, yeah,at all. And I think I find a lot
of people, like, miss out on,like, some serious opportunities
to get get a new thing, yes,because they're so scared. And
I'm just like, I have no fear. Ireally don't.

Siobhan (01:14:01):
Well, you have all the data to prove that you can redo,
you can do it, yes, and that'swhat that was. One of the
favorite, my favorite thingsthat a therapist told me one
time, like, she was like, Okay,I get that you are afraid of
this. And I get like, you might,you don't think you could do
this thing, but like, what arethree other things you never
thought you're gonna do? Andthen she was like, and how hard
was that? And I was like, youknow, when you walk through it,
and then she's like, okay, sodoesn't the data support that

(01:14:23):
you will get there? And I waslike, fuck you using logic on
me, the only thing that worksfor me, you know what I mean,
like, right? And I was like,Well, when you put it like that,
it's kind of like scientificthat it will work because, you
know, or the worst that happensis, I don't reach that goal, but
I land somewhere else, right,right? Right? One of my favorite
sayings is, reach for the moon,yeah. And if you miss maybe

(01:14:44):
you'll land on a

Tara Mae (01:14:45):
star. And I've always looked at things that way too.
Like for a long time, I'm like,I heard it when I was younger,
and it just always made sensewhen one door closes another one
opens, and when something elsefalls off that makes room for
something else. And I got older.
And did more reading and stuffabout that thought process and
mindfulness. And I was like,yeah, and then, you know, you
practice it enough times, like Isaid, it's undeniable. It's not,

(01:15:07):
you can't be that way all thetime, because, again, being
human is just hard as fuck. Butlike, when you when the times
that you found yourself in that,in that, that motion, that
momentum of just, like, beinggrateful and and like, no matter
what, I want to be good, thatthat's when it goes the best.

(01:15:27):
And I don't know how we ashumans, just, like, get off that
track. You

Siobhan (01:15:32):
know, I guess fuck it up all the time. We do. We
forget it, or, like, think thatwe're gonna out think it or
something.

Tara Mae (01:15:38):
Well, you know, honestly, to be fair, the world
is designed in such a way thesystem, you know, is designed in
such a way to distract us awayfrom that, that mentality and
mindset and makes things sodifficult that we get off track
of that gratitude and that, thatthat and moving in that
direction of, like, everything'sgood, everything's good, you
know, it, it really can be thatway, But it's so hard sometimes,

(01:16:01):
you know, so it's nice. And whatI've really enjoyed recently in
my life is that I've surroundedmyself and made a real,
hardcore, serious, mindfuldecision in my life, when people
can't rock in that, if I can'tgrow with you, no hard feelings,
but I don't fuck with you. Wecan say hi, I might even buy you

(01:16:23):
a beer. I'll smoke a cigarettewith you out in front of the
bar, but you're not coming to myhouse. We're not kicking it in
my space. Like you know, I needboundaries. I need to have that.
And so what I've done for myselfthat, and I feel like that's
changed a lot of things for me,because now I'm not, like,
having other people's energy andtheir negativity in my field.

Siobhan (01:16:47):
Of, yeah, well, especially you are very energy
sensitive. Like, you pick up ona lot of things. Like, I'm
fairly sensitive, but you aresuper sensitive. You are I
definitely like, yeah, yeah.
Like, I made someone's vibe waybefore and like, I got bad at,
like, I kind of ignored thattalent for a long time because
it used to freak me out. Itfreaked other people out. Like,
you know, I because I've alwaysbeen leaning towards the witchy

(01:17:11):
world, but I've always beenslightly afraid of it because it
feels like too much. Like, Idon't want to be the crazy old
lady now, that's my whole goal.
Is to be the crazy old lady inthe witch I'll be the crazy

Unknown (01:17:22):
Crone, yeah, the witchy Crone, yep. Or maybe the

Tara Mae (01:17:27):
beautiful witch, I know. Can we be like beautiful
witch? We'll be

Siobhan (01:17:30):
like Glenda witches.
Yes, good witch. I still want tobe a bad bitch, but

Tara Mae (01:17:37):
same too. I it's been a long time ignoring those
things, especially Jehovah'sWitness background, yeah, pray
it away, you know. But yeah, Ifeel like you and I probably are
in a space right now where we'recoming to terms with it, and to
come to terms with it, slowingourselves down a little and
giving ourselves a little moregrace, a little more compassion

(01:17:59):
and time for ourselves, andquiet is super important, and
I'm finding that when I don'tget that, that's when I'm grumpy
and I'm outside of myself. Yeah,so I think we need to start
working more of that time andfor ourselves. Oh, yeah, some
quiet so that we can hearourselves and feel ourselves.
Yeah,

Siobhan (01:18:17):
I used to not have any quiet, and I didn't realize it
till I had a friend come staywith me for a few weeks. She was
gonna she moved out here for alittle bit, and she one day said
to me, like, she was like, it'snever quiet here. And I was
like, and I didn't know what shemeant, like, but I sleep with a
sound machine, so there's noisein the background all night, and
then I'll get up and throw oneither the TV in the background,
or I'll throw on music or apodcast or an audible book. So I

(01:18:40):
always have like background,

Tara Mae (01:18:41):
but it's what you want. And so when I say quiet,
I'm glad you mentioned that,because when I say quiet, I'm
not talking about silence,sitting there meditating in the
middle of the room and silence.
I don't like dark rooms. I don'tlike dead silence. I need a
podcast. I need something goingon. That's what I call it's my
chosen type of sounds. Is quiet

Siobhan (01:18:59):
to me, right? No, that makes sense. But then I also
realized, like, I never hadsilence, yeah, and so then I
tried to, and I was like, Oh, myGod, silence makes me too like,
then there's too much room in myhead for thought. Like, I need
that background stuff just tohelp distract. I don't know it's
like, my 80s, like, yeah, Ineed, like, cushions, yeah. It's

(01:19:19):
like, I need, like, there, it'stoo loud. If there's nothing
else,

Tara Mae (01:19:22):
it's like bumpers you need, like, the background sound
is like bumpers for yourthoughts to, like, bounce off
of. So it's not like, yeah,totally and

Siobhan (01:19:30):
then, but I have started to try to meditate and
have quiet time, like, at leasta little bit, yeah, you know,
here and there. It's taken me awhile to get used to it. Now,
like, I can go for a walkwithout something, or I don't
like to, but I can, you can, butI'll be like, well, I shouldn't
be listening to that book rightnow. And, like, I could be
learning so much more right inthis moment,

Tara Mae (01:19:48):
but our brain does need that quiet. Yeah, I
usually, because as a Capricorn,I'm so go, go, go, go, go. And I
know you're a very Go, go, go,go, go person. So usually it's
like, I will dedicate. Hour timeto quiet and it's just the
water. Yeah? It's not like Icould hear music really, if I
was playing it anyway. You know,it's like, that's my quiet time.
You know, those? I take thosemoments as my go. Sometimes I'll

(01:20:11):
just go smoke a cigarette downby crab Cove, yeah, turn my
phone off 15 minutes, yeah, andjust go sit at crab Cove and
look at

Siobhan (01:20:19):
the birds. Yeah, that's it. Yeah, we're lucky that we
live in a beautiful place.

Tara Mae (01:20:23):
I know we could just walk to the beach. We're so
spoiled.

Siobhan (01:20:26):
All right. Well, I am gonna wrap this up. I do want to
have you back, because I do haveso many more questions. Just and
you're so fun and funny, and Ithink we should do a little
like, I don't know, maybe youcome on the touch of the Chism
one day, oh my god, a littlecrazy when there's four of us,
but we could do that, and itmight be so fun, you know, we'll
figure out some other creativestuff, because I can't wait to

(01:20:46):
see and be part of your classesat the new gallery that's
opening next door to fireside.
There's so many more thingshappening, and so thank you so
much for sharing your story withus. Terry,

Tara Mae (01:20:56):
may thank you for thanks for making this
comfortable and super fun. Ilook forward to hanging out with
you again. Yeah, all

Siobhan (01:21:02):
right, now let's go have another beer. Yeah, thank
you all for listening. Make sureyou find your joy today. Go
like, subscribe and follow us.
Give us a review. You'll findall of Tara May's art. I'll link
it in the show notes. So if youwant to support her, come out
and see us so we love you. Bye.
Bye.

All Episodes

Episode Transcript

Popular Podcasts

On Purpose with Jay Shetty

Ruthie's Table 4

The Joe Rogan Experience

.css-15opob5{left:0;position:absolute;top:0.8rem;} All Episodes

.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}From Feral to Free with Tara Mae

Episode Transcript

Popular Podcasts

.css-r6mb8g{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:1;overflow:hidden;}On Purpose with Jay Shetty

Ruthie's Table 4

The Joe Rogan Experience

All Episodes

From Feral to Free with Tara Mae

On Purpose with Jay Shetty