October 21, 2022 • 36 mins
In this episode I interview Children's mystery book writer, Sherrill Joseph. She is a retired K-12 literacy teacher. Her current work is The Botanic Hill Detectives Mysteries series, written for children ages 9-14. (Though I have to say, some adults will enjoy these as well) She has garnered multiple awards for these books. I won’t list them all but among these awards are: the Mom's Choice Book Awards, the Moonbeam Children's Book Awards, and a Reader’s Favorite Book award.
She says she has been inspired by the children she taught, and she uses her writing to stay connected with "kids who rock." Her stories present responsible, role-model children detective characters who provide readers with a fun mystery to solve and something to learn, while showing that being respectful and helpful citizens can be cool!
She lives in San Diego, California, in a 1928 Spanish Mission Revival bungalow. Her inspirations for her series include her historic neighborhood, the Nancy Drew mysteries she grew up reading, and her unique brain which includes lexical-gustatory synesthesia. We we talk about during the interview. To learn more about sherrill, check out her website at https://sherrilljoseph.com
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
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Maggie Lynch (00:14):
Hello, welcome to Dust Jackets, Conversations
with Authors. I'm Maggie Lynchand my guest today is children's
author SherrillJoseph. I firstmet Sherrill through the Authors
Guild online forums. When I wasstarting to write my own middle
grade books, I got to know her alittle more as part of the
middle grade writers section. Wenow meet once a month, a group
(00:37):
of us via zoom to share ourprogress our ideas and generally
support each other. So let mejust tell you a little bit about
Cheryl to get us started. She'sa retired K through 12 literacy
teacher. Her current work is thebotanic Hill detective mystery
series written for children agesnine to 14. So I have to say
(00:59):
some adults will enjoy these aswell. She has garnered multiple
awards for these books, I won'tlist them all. But among these
awards are the mom's choice BookAwards, the moonbeam Children's
Book Awards and a readersfavorite book award. I always
love those readers favorite onesbecause you know you're reaching
who you need to reach. She saysshe has been inspired by the
(01:20):
children she taught. And sheuses her writing to stay
connected with kids who rock. Ilove that phrase. Her stories
present responsible role modelchildren detective characters
who provide readers with a funmystery to solve, and something
to learn, while showing thatbeing respectful and helpful
citizens can be cool. She livesin San Diego, California in a
(01:45):
1928 Spanish mission revivalbungalow. Her inspirations for
her series include her historicneighborhood, the Nancy Drew
mysteries she grew up reading,and her unique brain, which
includes lexical gustatorysynesthesia. We'll talk about
that in a few minutes. Sowelcome, Cheryl, thank you so
(02:05):
much for being with us.
Sherrill Joseph (02:08):
Thank you, Maggie, this is quite an honor.
I really appreciate it.
Maggie Lynch (02:13):
So I have a few questions for you today. And
we'll just kind of work throughthem. And you know, feel free to
just talk about whatever youwant. So, I know you were a
teacher, could you talk aboutwhat grades you taught and how
long you taught.
Sherrill Joseph (02:32):
Well, I was a teacher in San Diego Unified
School District for 35 years. Iretired in 2013. During my
career, I taught every grade Kthrough 12. I moved around a lot
by choice. I just wanted toexperience different schools,
different socio-economic groups,different colleagues, you know,
(02:57):
all of the different subjects,different grades. But it turned
out my very favorite grade wasfifth. And so my last 10 years
of my career, I got to teachfourth and fifth grade. And I
loved it. So that was myteaching, and I love kids. And I
(03:18):
think you have to when you're ateacher. It's a calling. You're
not in it for the money. You'rein it because you want to do
something for children. Iprobably learned more from them
than they learned for me,however.
Maggie Lynch (03:31):
Wow. Well, I applaud you and all teachers.
Sherrill Joseph (03:35):
I think I'm a kid at heart. I think I've
always been a kid at heart. Andso I kind of felt like I fit
right in with them.
Maggie Lynch (03:41):
Well, that's great.
Sherrill Joseph (03:42):
I think I had more fun with them than I
probably did with adults. So youknow, it has worked out for me.
Maggie Lynch (03:51):
Well, that's perfect for someone who's
writing middle grade novels. Andso can you just kind of talk
about why you decided to startwriting books for children, and
particularly middle grade novelsas opposed to picture books,
which a lot of teachers startwith.
Sherrill Joseph (04:09):
Okay, yes. I fell in love with reading and
writing when I was about inabout fourth grade. And this is
the book that did it right here.
Maggie Lynch (04:21):
Oh,
Sherrill Joseph (04:23):
This is my Nancy Drew book. I have the
entire collection behind me inmy bookcase there. All the
copies, every copy. And this wasactually the first one that I
read as a kid. This was numberfive. By the way, the title is
the Secret Shadow Ranch. Andwhen I was reading that book, I
remember thinking I want towrite kids mystery books
(04:46):
someday. So that was sort of thethe seed that got planted when I
was about nine years old and infourth grade, and I never forgot
that. But then you know lifehappens and you go on, and you
have to make money, you know,get a real job. So I got my
(05:06):
teaching credential, andbasically I taught, got to
teach, literacy most of mycareer. And I also did some
curriculum editing. So I waspretty good at grammar and all
of that. In fact, I brandedmyself a grammar nerd very
proudly. So those were kind ofsome of the beginnings, but I
also was inspired by one of mystudents. A couple of years
(05:29):
before I retired in myclassroom, one of my students
one day, said to me...We weresitting around in a book club
group, we were reading this onebook, that was, I'm not going to
mention the title, but it was,it was pretty awful. It was like
a classic children's book redo.
And the redo was not very good,in my opinion, and the
(05:53):
children's opinion. And one ofmy students looked at me and
said (05:59):
Miss J, you could write a better book than this. Oh, my
gosh. And that made me reachback to my nine year old self,
and pull forward that desirethat goal I had to write
children's mystery books. And soright at that point, I started
thinking about who my characterscould be. And I knew my books
(06:23):
would be fashioned after sort ofNancy Drew and Hardy Boys kind
of mysteries, because I wantedto write good, solid clean books
for kids that would teach themsomething, but also maybe
provide role models for them.
And so those were the origins ofmy books.
Maggie Lynch (06:47):
Wow. And so let me tackle it before I forget about
it, that lexical gustatorysynesthesia thing. Just saying
it gets me tongue tied. So,could you explain to our
listeners exactly what thatmeans and how it impacts you as
a person and inspires yourwriting,
Sherrill Joseph (07:09):
Okay.
Synesthesia is considered amental ability, not a
disability. Interesting enough.
I suppose it can be a disabilityfor some people, but I have
what's called lexical gustatorysynesthesia. Synesthesia is
where you have extra connectionsor synapses in the brain, across
(07:32):
senses that aren't normallyconnected. So lexical gustatory,
the word gustatory, for example,means to taste. So when I hear
or see or read certain words, Itaste something. Sometimes it's,
(07:52):
it's like a full flavor in mymouth. Sometimes it's just a
little glimmer of flavors in theback of my tongue. And sometimes
I can even smell the food or thetaste. And I have always had
this my whole life. I have atwin sister, and I remember
(08:15):
saying to her one time, Sharon,your name makes me taste
peaches.
Maggie Lynch (08:21):
Oh, my goodness.
Sherrill Joseph (08:22):
You know, do you get that? You know, do you
have that? Do you ever have thathappen? And she goes, No, I
don't, I don't have that. Andshe kind of looked at me
strangely. I just thought, Ijust kind of assumed everybody
had it except maybe my twin. Forsome reason, I just thought
everybody had that. Or everybodydid that. And I just kind of,
(08:47):
you know, I never thought muchabout it. And then about two or
three years ago, I was on theinternet. And I ran across an
article on synesthesia, and Ithought, Oh, I wonder what that
is. And I started reading andlike a light bulb went off. Oh
my gosh, that's me. Oh, yeah. Isaw I finally had a label to
(09:08):
attach to this ability. And itis considered an extra sensory
ability. And there are somefamous people who have it. For
example, Van Gogh hadsynesthesia. Duke Ellington had
synesthesia. Billy Eilish, who'sthe current kind of rock star
(09:33):
has synesthesia. So I guess I'msort of in good company. I asked
my mother if she had, you know,she had anything like that. And
she said, No. And I asked her ifanybody in the family other than
me ever talked about anythinglike this? And she said, No. So
I didn't know where it camefrom. I'd like to think it came
from, you know, some great greatgreat grandmother ancestor back
(09:56):
then or something. But mostpeople have a really common
type, which you've probablyheard of, which is where you
hear music and it makes you seecolors.
Maggie Lynch (10:10):
Yeah, I have heard of that one. And I suppose
Billie Eilish has that
Sherrill Joseph (10:14):
that's the most common type. But my type
Gustatory, lexical gustatory, isvery rare. It's only something
like, point zero 2% of people inthe world have it. So it's very
rare, whereas the other typesare much more common. Maybe 2%
of the world have hassynesthesia and about 4% of them
(10:35):
have that color sound type, oryou see letters in color, you
know. And when I saiddisability, sometimes for some
people who are trying to read,that could be a problem for
them. So in that case, it couldmaybe be a disability. But mine
has done nothing but enhanced mylife. And I think it's made me
(10:55):
more creative.
Maggie Lynch (10:57):
Wow. So do you find are there certain words
that the taste isn't verypleasant, and so you avoid them?
Sherrill Joseph (11:05):
Oh, yeah. Yeah.
I was dating this one guy, yearsago. I went out with him a
couple times. And I finally hadto tell him that I'm sorry, I
can't see you anymore. He askedme why, and I said, because your
name makes me taste somethingreally gross.
Maggie Lynch (11:29):
I bet no one's ever had that kind of a turn
down before.
Sherrill Joseph (11:32):
Yeah, he thought I was nuts. But it's
very real for me, you know. And,of course, when I do school
visits, the first thing thatkids want to do is ask me, What
does my name make you taste, youknow? So what I do is, ahead of
time, I get the class roster.
And I write down what the kidsnames make me taste and some of
them are not pleasant. And I'llsay, I'm sorry, but your name
(11:54):
makes me taste something bad.
I'm sorry. But you know, I can'tcontrol it. It's just what it
is. Sure. So anyway, and then Igive that list to the teacher.
So I say your teacher alreadyhas the list. She'll let you
know later.
Maggie Lynch (12:11):
And how about your name? What does Sherrill make
you taste?
Sherrill Joseph (12:13):
Sherrill makes me taste cherry jelly.
Maggie Lynch (12:18):
Sherry jelly?
Sherrill Joseph (12:19):
Like cherry.
Oh, cherry the berry jelly.
Yeah. cherry jam or cherryjelly?
Maggie Lynch (12:26):
Well, that's pretty pleasant.
Sherrill Joseph (12:28):
Yeah, that's very pleasant. My sister, I have
a sister Carolyn, and her namemakes me taste popcorn. You
know, it's just in my mother'sname was Margaret and her name
made me taste brown sugar. Sothey're not all that pleasant.
Maggie Lynch (12:45):
That's amazing.
Like, let's get on to adifferent name, right sometimes?
Well, let's get a little moreinto your actual Series. I love
the location of the series,Botanic Hill. And I wonder is
that based on a real place thatyou know about or is it just
completely made up?
Sherrill Joseph (13:06):
It's based on where I live. I live in the area
of San Diego called North Park.
It's a neighborhood that wasstarted over 100 years ago. And
I also live, I'm kind ofsurrounded by historic
neighborhoods. There's anotherAnd so that's why I have to
write 26 books. My goal is toarea called Banker's Hill, which
is a little west of me. Andthat's the one that has a lot of
(13:27):
the street names, but we havesome of them here in North Park
because the streets go all theway through west to east. And,
you know, we have a NutmegStreet. here. We have a Palm
Street. Some of the street nameslike instead of Laurel Street,
which is one of the streets wewrite one for each street.
Maggie Lynch (13:48):
Wow. Well that's very clever. I think I remember
have here, I renamed it to LotusStreet because it sounds more
another mystery writer who didthat A to Z thing. What was her
exotic. And we have a MapleStreet, but I renamed it
Macadamia Street because itsounds more tropical. So you
know, that's what I did. And inmy first book I have a map. I
actually see if I could holdthis up. If it's visible here. I
(14:12):
can do it. I have a map that agraphic artist did for me of
Botanic Hill. And all the streetnames are listed right here,
right down here. So it's in BookOne if you have Book One. It
does not make it in EgyptianSecrets. The actual map and the
list of all the 26 streets A toZ books I plan towrite are
(14:35):
literally listed there.
name?
Sherrill Joseph (14:53):
Susan? Oh gosh, her name just went out of my
head. She just passed away ayear or two ago. And she got all
the way through Y before shepassed. But anyway, yeah, I know
who you're talking about.
Maggie Lynch (15:09):
So you have a ways to go there. Because you're on
book four, right?
Sherrill Joseph (15:13):
I might, yeah.
Number five is kind of cominginto my head now. Number four is
coming out this October.
Maggie Lynch (15:18):
Wow, so do these straight names, does each name
relate to something within yourbook, or is it just kind of a
way to, to have a startingpoint,
Sherrill Joseph (15:33):
It's how the books get launched. I just
randomly pick a street name. AndI'll tell you why I chose Nutmeg
Street in a minute as my firstone. I just randomly pick a name
off of the list of my 26. Andthen I put a colon. So that's
like the title, the street name,and then a colon. And then I
have a two word, littledescriptor that usually has some
(15:55):
kind of like a, I call it aspooky word like secrets, or
curse, or phantom, or, or dangeror something like that. There's
always that kind of aprovocative word in the
subtitle. But the books alwaysstart on that street. So chapter
one is always called Invitationon Nutmeg Street, or Eucalyptus
(16:19):
Street or Walnut Street, etc.
And so the children are at ahome or a business or wherever
it is on that particular street.
And then they either encounter amystery or they're invited,
they're told about a mystery andkind of were sent there on
purpose, because the personwants to hire them to solve the
(16:40):
mystery. So that's where thatcomes from.
Maggie Lynch (16:43):
Oh, great. Yeah.
And I know, in the one book thatI read, I was pleasantly
surprised that someone actuallyhired the children detectives,
to solve something for them. Idon't think I've seen that
anywhere in a chilren'sdetective series. You know,
usually they're solving littlethings around the neighborhood,
or, like Nancy Drew oftenencountered a question or
(17:04):
mystery.
Sherrill Joseph (17:05):
That was, ya know, that was sort of from
Nancy Drew as well. Because inchapter one of every Nancy Drew
book, you know, she stumblesupon a mystery. But then there's
always somebody to talk to aboutit. And, and then they say, you
know, would I really like you totry to help me with this, you
(17:25):
know, and so she's basicallyhired at that point to solve the
mystery. And then within thatchapter, she'll use the narrator
to mention, Nancy just finishedsolving the case of the you
know, whatever, you know. And sothat's where I got my idea to,
you know, number one, have thekids hired. And second, was to
(17:49):
say which one that they just gotdone solving. So I put that in
my first chapter, as well.
Maggie Lynch (17:55):
Yeah, I really love that whole invitation and
then someone kind of hiringthem. That was really wonderful.
Do you find that one of thethings? Again, I've only read
one book, I apologize. But I wasreally surprised by the amount
(18:18):
of research you do, you know,for the book, and I'm glad. I
wonder if for the other onesthat I haven't read that's the
same case. And as an adult, youknow, I actually learned some
things because it was ahistorical piece. Do you find
that children really lovelearning these intricate details
(18:38):
along the way?
Sherrill Joseph (18:39):
I do. Like my fifth graders that I had those
last 10 years, really, reallyloved history. And I had some
eyewitness, they're calledeyewitness books. They're sort
of large picture books that Ihad in my class library. I could
not keep any of the historicalones on the shelf. They were
(18:59):
always out. I used to say,who's got the World War Two book
right now, you know, I'd alwayshave to ask. The kids were
fascinated by history, andespecially history that they
hadn't learned yet, like WorldWar Two, you know, they hadn't
learned that yet. And they werealways asking me about World War
Two. And so I decided for BookFour I was going to write about
(19:23):
Pearl Harbor, the bombing ofPearl Harbor, the Japanese
internment camps. So all of thatis meshed into the mystery of
the book that's coming out thisOctober. And my birthday is
Pearl Harbor Day, by the way.
So, oh, my gosh, um, whatsomething that was another
little, little piece ofattachment that I had to that
(19:45):
topic. That goes way back, ofcourse, to my childhood, when
people would say, oh, you're aPearl Harbor baby. And I'm like,
What's that mean? You know, andso over time, I learned about
those things and I want the kidsto have know them, too. Once a
teacher always a teacher. That'spart of the answer to your
question, too. I just kind ofalways feel like I want to
(20:07):
impart something to kids thatthey might not get otherwise.
You know, so like in Book Two,
Eucalyptus Street (20:18):
Green Curse, I talk a little bit about old
Hollywood, because I love theold Hollywood movies. And so
there's a little aspect of thatin the story, too, you know. So
that's where that comes from.
And my fifth one is going tohave some elements of, I'm not
going to say who yet, but afamous American author from the
(20:39):
19th century. I'm going to havesome elements. I'm going to wrap
the mystery around thatparticular writer.
Maggie Lynch (20:50):
Oh, great. Well, I know when I was a child, anytime
I could learn something that noone else knew, was like, really
special. And I get that in everyone of your books, you can learn
something that most other peopledon't know. So you can even
impress your parents.
Sherrill Joseph (21:09):
Well, yeah, I've had some adults say, oh, I
really love your books, too,because I learned from them. And
then my child and I can have aconversation about her. Uh,
well, that's exactly what Iwant. You know, how that warms
my heart when I hear things likethat.
Maggie Lynch (21:24):
So, um, could you just tell us a little bit about
the primary characters? There'sa group of them. I think it's
four but I'm not sure. You know,kind of what are their
backgrounds? How did they meetand become friends?
Sherrill Joseph (21:37):
All right.
Well, I have four detectives,two girls and two boys. Kind of
all in Nancy Drew Hardy Boyskind of thing. And Lexi and
Lanie are twin brother andsister, and they live on Quinn
Street. And right behind themliterally sharing a fence from
around the block on Palm Streetis Mochi. But Mochi Kalani moved
(21:58):
to Los Alamitos, California whenhe was eight, from Hawaii. And
then there's a character namedRonnie Kumar, and she's from
India. She moved to Los Alamitoswhen she was five. And Lexi and
Ronnie are best friends andMochi and Lani are best friends.
(22:20):
So it didn't take the the fourof them long, of course, to
partner up. And they becamedetectives accidentally, because
when they were in Paris, Franceon vacation with the twins'
parents, a few years prior, theywere walking by a jewelry store
and out charged two thieves whohad just stolen a bunch of
(22:45):
diamond bracelets. And theyslammed right into the kids and
the diamonds, of course,scattered all over the street.
And the crowds came and thekids, and some of the members of
that crowd held the thieves downwhile the police were called.
And so the news kind of wentviral, of course. And so when
the kids came back toCalifornia, they were famous.
(23:08):
That's how the neighbors foundout that they were you know,
we're able to help the police.
And so that's where the startedgetting hired by their neighbors
at that point.
Maggie Lynch (23:21):
Oh, wow. Okay.
Yeah. And they're what age?
Sherrill Joseph (23:24):
They are all 13 years old, and they will be 13
years old forever, by the way.
Just like Nancy. Teens forever,they will be 13 forever. Yeah.
Maggie Lynch (23:35):
Well, that's, that's really cool. So books
happened in one year. Kind ofYeah. So something that struck
me while reading the book that Idid was how polite your
characters are. And I know youmade a comment earlier about how
you want them to be role models,and I found it unusual because
(23:59):
it seems that so many peopleportray children as, you know,
some of them kind of talk backor have tantrums or they get in
trouble. You know, part of thestory is them having to learn to
be more polite. So can you justtalk about why you chose that
and, and how polite they are?
Sherrill Joseph (24:20):
Well, of course I wanted role model characters,
so they weren't going to belittle hooligans, by any means.
But I modeled them after mystudents. You know, I had every
kind of student. There were, Ihad hooligans, all the way up to
these like little polite kidsthat could probably write, you
know, etiquette books. And mylast year of teaching, one
(24:43):
afternoon, I was sitting at myback table. I always had a few
kids stay after school who werejust like, their their friends
would come and they just playedaround the room or helped clean
up the room or whatever. And Iwas watching them one day and I
realized how polite they were toeach other. How much they really
cared about each other asfriends. And as classmates,
(25:03):
these were kids who were willingto do anything to help their
classmates. It was like we werea big family. And I remember
just watching them one afternoonthinking, I wish all kids could
be like this. Maybe it takesrole models for kids to embrace
their inner kindness, or todiscover that being kind is
(25:25):
going to get you a long way inthe world. And so I decided that
was why I wanted to bring thatout in my four characters. And
believe me, I've gotten slammedby that by some reviewers
saying (25:39):
"I don't know anyt kids like this." And I think how sad
that you don't know any kidslike this, ya know, because I
knew a lot of kids like that.
That's why I say kids rock. Iknew a lot of kids like that.
They could teach adults a fewthings about being polite and
respectful. And so that's why Ichose that aspect for my
characters.
Maggie Lynch (26:00):
Well, I think it's wonderful. Actually, I found it
really refreshing. And I haveknown some kids like that. I've
known the hooligans, too. Someof them are cousins.
Sherrill Joseph (26:12):
Adults too.
Maggie Lynch (26:13):
Right, right.
Sure. Exactly. Yeah, but I thinkthat's part of the coolness in
your books. It also gives kidswho are like that, polite and
caring you know, a bit of rockstar notoriety.
Sherrill Joseph (26:27):
Yes, because they have enough confidence in
themselves. Right? Yeah. Thenthey discover pretty soon that,
hey, instead of being teased,they're looked up to. So that's
what I'm trying to do with mykids. I'm trying to get the kids
to think, oh, you know, this canbe cool to act like that.
Maggie Lynch (26:46):
I love it. So I ask every author on the program
this, because we do have a lotof authors who watch or listen.
Can you talk about your writingprocess? Are you a pantser, or
plotter. or something inbetween?
Sherrill Joseph (27:02):
Mostly a pantser. Mostly, I started out
with book one trying to outline.
And I soon discovered that theoutline became a mess. I was
pulling things out, I wasrearranging. And it was
frustrating me more thananything. So now what I do is, I
come up with the kind of kernelof the idea of the mystery. I'm
(27:26):
not, I'm often not sure how it'sgoing to end when I first start
to write. I allow for thecreative process to take over. I
also allow for my detectives totell me what to write. And that
might sound strange. But whenI'm actually in the zone,
(27:46):
writing the story, I feel like Ikind of leave the planet and I
enter their world. And I feellike I'm sort of a bug on the
wall, listening to theirconversation. And I'm just like
the scribe, and I'm just writingit down. And I find that
absolutely thrilling. Andsometimes I'm not sure how the
chapter is going to end. Andthen suddenly, it just kind of
answers the questions. Like, Oh,that's really cool. I like how
(28:08):
they ended that. I give themcredit for it, you know? So in
the beginning I come up with thekernel of the idea. And then I
try to come up with a stop. AndI think about what are some
escapades that they could getinvolved in? And what are some
clues that I want to bring outto lead them to this magic end
(28:29):
of this mystery, which I'm notsure what it is yet. Then I try
to come up with 20 chaptertitles. And not everybody uses
chapter titles, but I found as ateacher, and I noticed my
students too, I liked it whenthere were chapter titles,
because it made it an easy placeto refer to in a book, to teach
and say, Oh, that chapter, youknow, number 10 , you know,
(28:52):
entitled so and so. And the kidswould know, they could go right
to it because of the chaptertitle. And it also is a hook for
kids. A chapter title can be ahook, like, oh, I want to read
this next one. Then you know,oh, to read the next one, read
the next one. But anyway, so Icome up with like 20 chapter
titles, and most get movedaround and some will get
(29:15):
deleted, some others get put ininstead. But that's what helps
me get through a book. So that'smore pantser than plotter, I'd
say.
Maggie Lynch (29:27):
I see what you mean. I understand all the
pantser parts because that'skind of how I work. But it's at
what point, you know, becauseyou said you kind of get them
started. But at what point doyou then start doing the chapter
titles and all of that. Is thatlike after a couple chapters or
(29:49):
is that more in the beginning?
Sherrill Joseph (29:50):
That's more in the beginning. Like I like I
said I just basically think ofwhat are some clean, fun
mischief they could get into ,see, that can lead them to a
clue. Or it's a clue that theywant to try to resolve and then
that clue takes them somewhere.
It gives them a destination. Sothose are sort of the way I work
(30:11):
it. And that, that helps me. I'ma visualizer. So that helps me
visualize what's going on. Andthat's, that's where I can get
my escapades in my chaptertitles from one to the other.
Maggie Lynch (30:26):
Yeah, so you kind of have an idea. You don't
outline at all, but you have anidea of what the escapades are
going to be. And the titlesreflect. Nice! So you do know
where you're moving forward? Doyou ever get to a point where
you say, you know, well, thetitle for number four, that's
not going to happen now and haveto change?
Sherrill Joseph (30:44):
Oh, absolutely.
Yeah. And if I had it down, likein a big, major, long outline,
like I did for my first book,and then I was starting crossing
out or writing arrows, I mean,literally on a piece of paper,
you know. Writing arrows andstuff like that frustrated me
with it. I'm not going to dothis anymore. I'm going to do
more of the pantser thing, youknow, where I'm just going to
try to put like, my outline nowis just my chapter titles. And
(31:08):
if an idea comes to me, I mightwrite a little note off to the
side of that, on that piece ofpaper. But I don't really plot
things out too much anymore. Ijust find that for my creative
process that doesn't work sowell.
Maggie Lynch (31:25):
Yeah. Yeah. I agree with you 100%. Because I'm
the same way. I'm probably alittle more involved in my
characters because I'm usuallythe protagonist in the story.
And so yes. So I'm kind offeeling what she's feeling and
doing what she's doing. And soI'm more connected than being a
(31:46):
fly on the wall. But you have somuch amazing information that I
can see how that fly on the wallthing is, is a better way to
approach it.
Sherrill Joseph (31:56):
I just want to mention, I do the research. I'm
really adamant about doing theresearch, because I don't want
to pass off information thatisn't true to kids.
Maggie Lynch (32:08):
Oh, that's really, yeah, very important.
Sherrill Joseph (32:11):
Yeah, very important, I think for kids.
Always make sure what you'resaying is true.
Maggie Lynch (32:16):
So you did talk about that you actually plan a
total of 26 of these books,which is quite a bit. Have you
thought about or even playedwith the idea of writing a
different series? Or do you kindof think, well, this is, you
know, the rest of my life here,
Sherrill Joseph (32:32):
This is literally the rest of my life. I
just, I'm really involved inthese characters and in the
stories, and I think that'swhere I'm going to stay.
Maggie Lynch (32:46):
Well, it makes sense. If I had to write 26
books in a series, it would bethe rest of my life as well.
Sherrill Joseph (32:52):
Some people really do three, four or five,
and then they're on to a newone. But this is , you know,
gonna last a while.
Maggie Lynch (32:58):
Oh, I think it's wonderful. Thank you! So we're
kind of getting towards the endof our time together. Can you
talk about if you have anyevents coming up, where you're
going to be in person, andparticularly if any of my
listeners live near you, theymay want tomeet you. Also any
(33:18):
virtual events that you may do?
Sherrill Joseph (33:20):
Okay, well, I've done a few book festivals
already. But I really enjoydoing school visits. And I have
one coming up in September, inabout three weeks, right here in
San Diego, a couple miles frommy house, which is great. It's
an in-person one. We didn't getto do too many of those the last
(33:41):
few years. But I also do virtualclass visits. And if anyone
wants to sign me up, you can goto my website,
sherilljoseph.com/school-visits.
And there's information thereand the little contact button.
(34:02):
And if you're in San Diego, youknow, we could probably arrange
an in-person thing. Anywhereelse, we probably could just do
it virtually. I've done virtualevents in Michigan and New York
and Washington DC and placeslike that. So it's really fun.
So we're not limited anymore bythat, and I do these for free,
(34:23):
by the way, because I don'tbelieve in charging teachers. As
I mentioned, I used to be oneand I used to put a lot of my
own money back into my classroomevery year. Even if there's a
PTA and they give you money, I'drather the teachers spend that
little bit of money they mightget on their own classroom and
(34:44):
their children with their kids'needs. Not on me. And so that's
what I do. And so I my reward isjust meeting kids.
Maggie Lynch (35:00):
That's very generous of you. And I'm sure a
lot of teachers will thank youfor that.
Sherrill Joseph (35:06):
Well, to me, it's the only way to go. It just
makes the most sense to me to dothat, right. Yeah.
Maggie Lynch (35:12):
So you said that you have your fourth book coming
out in October? Do you have abig launch plan for that or
something that listeners shouldknow about? Like, any special
deals or anything like that?
Sherrill Joseph (35:27):
I believe I'll be in the Cozy Mystery Village,
I'm going to have somethingaround that time. I'm not sure
how many of them are actuallyconnected into social media, you
know, that can be readilyavailable right now. I have a
newsletter. If people want tosubscribe to my newsletter,
(35:48):
which issherrilljoseph.com/newsletter. I
always put my information inthere as to where I'm going to
be. I have a new section aswell, an event section. I
usually put it in the eventssection. You could go to my
websitesherrilljoseph.com/events. It's
there as well. So I would try topost things in advance so
(36:10):
readers know where I am and cantune in.
Maggie Lynch (36:14):
Perfect! Well, thank you so much for being my
guest today, Sherrill. And thankyou, listeners, for tuning in.
As always, I will put all ofSherrill's contact information
for her website and social mediain the show notes associated
with us. Her website is easy toremember. It is
(36:34):
sherrilljoseph.com. This hasbeen Dust Jackets: Conversations
with Authors. See you next time.
Hello, welcome to Dust Jackets, Conversations
with Authors. I'm Maggie Lynchand my guest today is children's
author SherrillJoseph. I firstmet Sherrill through the Authors
Guild online forums. When I wasstarting to write my own middle
grade books, I got to know her alittle more as part of the
middle grade writers section. Wenow meet once a month, a group
(00:37):
of us via zoom to share ourprogress our ideas and generally
support each other. So let mejust tell you a little bit about
Cheryl to get us started. She'sa retired K through 12 literacy
teacher. Her current work is thebotanic Hill detective mystery
series written for children agesnine to 14. So I have to say
(00:59):
some adults will enjoy these aswell. She has garnered multiple
awards for these books, I won'tlist them all. But among these
awards are the mom's choice BookAwards, the moonbeam Children's
Book Awards and a readersfavorite book award. I always
love those readers favorite onesbecause you know you're reaching
who you need to reach. She saysshe has been inspired by the
(01:20):
children she taught. And sheuses her writing to stay
connected with kids who rock. Ilove that phrase. Her stories
present responsible role modelchildren detective characters
who provide readers with a funmystery to solve, and something
to learn, while showing thatbeing respectful and helpful
citizens can be cool. She livesin San Diego, California in a
(01:45):
1928 Spanish mission revivalbungalow. Her inspirations for
her series include her historicneighborhood, the Nancy Drew
mysteries she grew up reading,and her unique brain, which
includes lexical gustatorysynesthesia. We'll talk about
that in a few minutes. Sowelcome, Cheryl, thank you so
(02:05):
much for being with us.
Sherrill Joseph (02:08):
Thank you, Maggie, this is quite an honor.
I really appreciate it.
Maggie Lynch (02:13):
So I have a few questions for you today. And
we'll just kind of work throughthem. And you know, feel free to
just talk about whatever youwant. So, I know you were a
teacher, could you talk aboutwhat grades you taught and how
long you taught.
Sherrill Joseph (02:32):
Well, I was a teacher in San Diego Unified
School District for 35 years. Iretired in 2013. During my
career, I taught every grade Kthrough 12. I moved around a lot
by choice. I just wanted toexperience different schools,
different socio-economic groups,different colleagues, you know,
(02:57):
all of the different subjects,different grades. But it turned
out my very favorite grade wasfifth. And so my last 10 years
of my career, I got to teachfourth and fifth grade. And I
loved it. So that was myteaching, and I love kids. And I
(03:18):
think you have to when you're ateacher. It's a calling. You're
not in it for the money. You'rein it because you want to do
something for children. Iprobably learned more from them
than they learned for me,however.
Maggie Lynch (03:31):
Wow. Well, I applaud you and all teachers.
Sherrill Joseph (03:35):
I think I'm a kid at heart. I think I've
always been a kid at heart. Andso I kind of felt like I fit
right in with them.
Maggie Lynch (03:41):
Well, that's great.
Sherrill Joseph (03:42):
I think I had more fun with them than I
probably did with adults. So youknow, it has worked out for me.
Maggie Lynch (03:51):
Well, that's perfect for someone who's
writing middle grade novels. Andso can you just kind of talk
about why you decided to startwriting books for children, and
particularly middle grade novelsas opposed to picture books,
which a lot of teachers startwith.
Sherrill Joseph (04:09):
Okay, yes. I fell in love with reading and
writing when I was about inabout fourth grade. And this is
the book that did it right here.
Maggie Lynch (04:21):
Oh,
Sherrill Joseph (04:23):
This is my Nancy Drew book. I have the
entire collection behind me inmy bookcase there. All the
copies, every copy. And this wasactually the first one that I
read as a kid. This was numberfive. By the way, the title is
the Secret Shadow Ranch. Andwhen I was reading that book, I
remember thinking I want towrite kids mystery books
(04:46):
someday. So that was sort of thethe seed that got planted when I
was about nine years old and infourth grade, and I never forgot
that. But then you know lifehappens and you go on, and you
have to make money, you know,get a real job. So I got my
(05:06):
teaching credential, andbasically I taught, got to
teach, literacy most of mycareer. And I also did some
curriculum editing. So I waspretty good at grammar and all
of that. In fact, I brandedmyself a grammar nerd very
proudly. So those were kind ofsome of the beginnings, but I
also was inspired by one of mystudents. A couple of years
(05:29):
before I retired in myclassroom, one of my students
one day, said to me...We weresitting around in a book club
group, we were reading this onebook, that was, I'm not going to
mention the title, but it was,it was pretty awful. It was like
a classic children's book redo.
And the redo was not very good,in my opinion, and the
(05:53):
children's opinion. And one ofmy students looked at me and
said (05:59):
Miss J, you could write a better book than this. Oh, my
gosh. And that made me reachback to my nine year old self,
and pull forward that desirethat goal I had to write
children's mystery books. And soright at that point, I started
thinking about who my characterscould be. And I knew my books
(06:23):
would be fashioned after sort ofNancy Drew and Hardy Boys kind
of mysteries, because I wantedto write good, solid clean books
for kids that would teach themsomething, but also maybe
provide role models for them.
And so those were the origins ofmy books.
Maggie Lynch (06:47):
Wow. And so let me tackle it before I forget about
it, that lexical gustatorysynesthesia thing. Just saying
it gets me tongue tied. So,could you explain to our
listeners exactly what thatmeans and how it impacts you as
a person and inspires yourwriting,
Sherrill Joseph (07:09):
Okay.
Synesthesia is considered amental ability, not a
disability. Interesting enough.
I suppose it can be a disabilityfor some people, but I have
what's called lexical gustatorysynesthesia. Synesthesia is
where you have extra connectionsor synapses in the brain, across
(07:32):
senses that aren't normallyconnected. So lexical gustatory,
the word gustatory, for example,means to taste. So when I hear
or see or read certain words, Itaste something. Sometimes it's,
(07:52):
it's like a full flavor in mymouth. Sometimes it's just a
little glimmer of flavors in theback of my tongue. And sometimes
I can even smell the food or thetaste. And I have always had
this my whole life. I have atwin sister, and I remember
(08:15):
saying to her one time, Sharon,your name makes me taste
peaches.
Maggie Lynch (08:21):
Oh, my goodness.
Sherrill Joseph (08:22):
You know, do you get that? You know, do you
have that? Do you ever have thathappen? And she goes, No, I
don't, I don't have that. Andshe kind of looked at me
strangely. I just thought, Ijust kind of assumed everybody
had it except maybe my twin. Forsome reason, I just thought
everybody had that. Or everybodydid that. And I just kind of,
(08:47):
you know, I never thought muchabout it. And then about two or
three years ago, I was on theinternet. And I ran across an
article on synesthesia, and Ithought, Oh, I wonder what that
is. And I started reading andlike a light bulb went off. Oh
my gosh, that's me. Oh, yeah. Isaw I finally had a label to
(09:08):
attach to this ability. And itis considered an extra sensory
ability. And there are somefamous people who have it. For
example, Van Gogh hadsynesthesia. Duke Ellington had
synesthesia. Billy Eilish, who'sthe current kind of rock star
(09:33):
has synesthesia. So I guess I'msort of in good company. I asked
my mother if she had, you know,she had anything like that. And
she said, No. And I asked her ifanybody in the family other than
me ever talked about anythinglike this? And she said, No. So
I didn't know where it camefrom. I'd like to think it came
from, you know, some great greatgreat grandmother ancestor back
(09:56):
then or something. But mostpeople have a really common
type, which you've probablyheard of, which is where you
hear music and it makes you seecolors.
Maggie Lynch (10:10):
Yeah, I have heard of that one. And I suppose
Billie Eilish has that
Sherrill Joseph (10:14):
that's the most common type. But my type
Gustatory, lexical gustatory, isvery rare. It's only something
like, point zero 2% of people inthe world have it. So it's very
rare, whereas the other typesare much more common. Maybe 2%
of the world have hassynesthesia and about 4% of them
(10:35):
have that color sound type, oryou see letters in color, you
know. And when I saiddisability, sometimes for some
people who are trying to read,that could be a problem for
them. So in that case, it couldmaybe be a disability. But mine
has done nothing but enhanced mylife. And I think it's made me
(10:55):
more creative.
Maggie Lynch (10:57):
Wow. So do you find are there certain words
that the taste isn't verypleasant, and so you avoid them?
Sherrill Joseph (11:05):
Oh, yeah. Yeah.
I was dating this one guy, yearsago. I went out with him a
couple times. And I finally hadto tell him that I'm sorry, I
can't see you anymore. He askedme why, and I said, because your
name makes me taste somethingreally gross.
Maggie Lynch (11:29):
I bet no one's ever had that kind of a turn
down before.
Sherrill Joseph (11:32):
Yeah, he thought I was nuts. But it's
very real for me, you know. And,of course, when I do school
visits, the first thing thatkids want to do is ask me, What
does my name make you taste, youknow? So what I do is, ahead of
time, I get the class roster.
And I write down what the kidsnames make me taste and some of
them are not pleasant. And I'llsay, I'm sorry, but your name
(11:54):
makes me taste something bad.
I'm sorry. But you know, I can'tcontrol it. It's just what it
is. Sure. So anyway, and then Igive that list to the teacher.
So I say your teacher alreadyhas the list. She'll let you
know later.
Maggie Lynch (12:11):
And how about your name? What does Sherrill make
you taste?
Sherrill Joseph (12:13):
Sherrill makes me taste cherry jelly.
Maggie Lynch (12:18):
Sherry jelly?
Sherrill Joseph (12:19):
Like cherry.
Oh, cherry the berry jelly.
Yeah. cherry jam or cherryjelly?
Maggie Lynch (12:26):
Well, that's pretty pleasant.
Sherrill Joseph (12:28):
Yeah, that's very pleasant. My sister, I have
a sister Carolyn, and her namemakes me taste popcorn. You
know, it's just in my mother'sname was Margaret and her name
made me taste brown sugar. Sothey're not all that pleasant.
Maggie Lynch (12:45):
That's amazing.
Like, let's get on to adifferent name, right sometimes?
Well, let's get a little moreinto your actual Series. I love
the location of the series,Botanic Hill. And I wonder is
that based on a real place thatyou know about or is it just
completely made up?
Sherrill Joseph (13:06):
It's based on where I live. I live in the area
of San Diego called North Park.
It's a neighborhood that wasstarted over 100 years ago. And
I also live, I'm kind ofsurrounded by historic
neighborhoods. There's anotherAnd so that's why I have to
write 26 books. My goal is toarea called Banker's Hill, which
is a little west of me. Andthat's the one that has a lot of
(13:27):
the street names, but we havesome of them here in North Park
because the streets go all theway through west to east. And,
you know, we have a NutmegStreet. here. We have a Palm
Street. Some of the street nameslike instead of Laurel Street,
which is one of the streets wewrite one for each street.
Maggie Lynch (13:48):
Wow. Well that's very clever. I think I remember
have here, I renamed it to LotusStreet because it sounds more
another mystery writer who didthat A to Z thing. What was her
exotic. And we have a MapleStreet, but I renamed it
Macadamia Street because itsounds more tropical. So you
know, that's what I did. And inmy first book I have a map. I
actually see if I could holdthis up. If it's visible here. I
(14:12):
can do it. I have a map that agraphic artist did for me of
Botanic Hill. And all the streetnames are listed right here,
right down here. So it's in BookOne if you have Book One. It
does not make it in EgyptianSecrets. The actual map and the
list of all the 26 streets A toZ books I plan towrite are
(14:35):
literally listed there.
name?
Sherrill Joseph (14:53):
Susan? Oh gosh, her name just went out of my
head. She just passed away ayear or two ago. And she got all
the way through Y before shepassed. But anyway, yeah, I know
who you're talking about.
Maggie Lynch (15:09):
So you have a ways to go there. Because you're on
book four, right?
Sherrill Joseph (15:13):
I might, yeah.
Number five is kind of cominginto my head now. Number four is
coming out this October.
Maggie Lynch (15:18):
Wow, so do these straight names, does each name
relate to something within yourbook, or is it just kind of a
way to, to have a startingpoint,
Sherrill Joseph (15:33):
It's how the books get launched. I just
randomly pick a street name. AndI'll tell you why I chose Nutmeg
Street in a minute as my firstone. I just randomly pick a name
off of the list of my 26. Andthen I put a colon. So that's
like the title, the street name,and then a colon. And then I
have a two word, littledescriptor that usually has some
(15:55):
kind of like a, I call it aspooky word like secrets, or
curse, or phantom, or, or dangeror something like that. There's
always that kind of aprovocative word in the
subtitle. But the books alwaysstart on that street. So chapter
one is always called Invitationon Nutmeg Street, or Eucalyptus
(16:19):
Street or Walnut Street, etc.
And so the children are at ahome or a business or wherever
it is on that particular street.
And then they either encounter amystery or they're invited,
they're told about a mystery andkind of were sent there on
purpose, because the personwants to hire them to solve the
(16:40):
mystery. So that's where thatcomes from.
Maggie Lynch (16:43):
Oh, great. Yeah.
And I know, in the one book thatI read, I was pleasantly
surprised that someone actuallyhired the children detectives,
to solve something for them. Idon't think I've seen that
anywhere in a chilren'sdetective series. You know,
usually they're solving littlethings around the neighborhood,
or, like Nancy Drew oftenencountered a question or
(17:04):
mystery.
Sherrill Joseph (17:05):
That was, ya know, that was sort of from
Nancy Drew as well. Because inchapter one of every Nancy Drew
book, you know, she stumblesupon a mystery. But then there's
always somebody to talk to aboutit. And, and then they say, you
know, would I really like you totry to help me with this, you
(17:25):
know, and so she's basicallyhired at that point to solve the
mystery. And then within thatchapter, she'll use the narrator
to mention, Nancy just finishedsolving the case of the you
know, whatever, you know. And sothat's where I got my idea to,
you know, number one, have thekids hired. And second, was to
(17:49):
say which one that they just gotdone solving. So I put that in
my first chapter, as well.
Maggie Lynch (17:55):
Yeah, I really love that whole invitation and
then someone kind of hiringthem. That was really wonderful.
Do you find that one of thethings? Again, I've only read
one book, I apologize. But I wasreally surprised by the amount
(18:18):
of research you do, you know,for the book, and I'm glad. I
wonder if for the other onesthat I haven't read that's the
same case. And as an adult, youknow, I actually learned some
things because it was ahistorical piece. Do you find
that children really lovelearning these intricate details
(18:38):
along the way?
Sherrill Joseph (18:39):
I do. Like my fifth graders that I had those
last 10 years, really, reallyloved history. And I had some
eyewitness, they're calledeyewitness books. They're sort
of large picture books that Ihad in my class library. I could
not keep any of the historicalones on the shelf. They were
(18:59):
always out. I used to say,who's got the World War Two book
right now, you know, I'd alwayshave to ask. The kids were
fascinated by history, andespecially history that they
hadn't learned yet, like WorldWar Two, you know, they hadn't
learned that yet. And they werealways asking me about World War
Two. And so I decided for BookFour I was going to write about
(19:23):
Pearl Harbor, the bombing ofPearl Harbor, the Japanese
internment camps. So all of thatis meshed into the mystery of
the book that's coming out thisOctober. And my birthday is
Pearl Harbor Day, by the way.
So, oh, my gosh, um, whatsomething that was another
little, little piece ofattachment that I had to that
(19:45):
topic. That goes way back, ofcourse, to my childhood, when
people would say, oh, you're aPearl Harbor baby. And I'm like,
What's that mean? You know, andso over time, I learned about
those things and I want the kidsto have know them, too. Once a
teacher always a teacher. That'spart of the answer to your
question, too. I just kind ofalways feel like I want to
(20:07):
impart something to kids thatthey might not get otherwise.
You know, so like in Book Two,
Eucalyptus Street (20:18):
Green Curse, I talk a little bit about old
Hollywood, because I love theold Hollywood movies. And so
there's a little aspect of thatin the story, too, you know. So
that's where that comes from.
And my fifth one is going tohave some elements of, I'm not
going to say who yet, but afamous American author from the
(20:39):
19th century. I'm going to havesome elements. I'm going to wrap
the mystery around thatparticular writer.
Maggie Lynch (20:50):
Oh, great. Well, I know when I was a child, anytime
I could learn something that noone else knew, was like, really
special. And I get that in everyone of your books, you can learn
something that most other peopledon't know. So you can even
impress your parents.
Sherrill Joseph (21:09):
Well, yeah, I've had some adults say, oh, I
really love your books, too,because I learned from them. And
then my child and I can have aconversation about her. Uh,
well, that's exactly what Iwant. You know, how that warms
my heart when I hear things likethat.
Maggie Lynch (21:24):
So, um, could you just tell us a little bit about
the primary characters? There'sa group of them. I think it's
four but I'm not sure. You know,kind of what are their
backgrounds? How did they meetand become friends?
Sherrill Joseph (21:37):
All right.
Well, I have four detectives,two girls and two boys. Kind of
all in Nancy Drew Hardy Boyskind of thing. And Lexi and
Lanie are twin brother andsister, and they live on Quinn
Street. And right behind themliterally sharing a fence from
around the block on Palm Streetis Mochi. But Mochi Kalani moved
(21:58):
to Los Alamitos, California whenhe was eight, from Hawaii. And
then there's a character namedRonnie Kumar, and she's from
India. She moved to Los Alamitoswhen she was five. And Lexi and
Ronnie are best friends andMochi and Lani are best friends.
(22:20):
So it didn't take the the fourof them long, of course, to
partner up. And they becamedetectives accidentally, because
when they were in Paris, Franceon vacation with the twins'
parents, a few years prior, theywere walking by a jewelry store
and out charged two thieves whohad just stolen a bunch of
(22:45):
diamond bracelets. And theyslammed right into the kids and
the diamonds, of course,scattered all over the street.
And the crowds came and thekids, and some of the members of
that crowd held the thieves downwhile the police were called.
And so the news kind of wentviral, of course. And so when
the kids came back toCalifornia, they were famous.
(23:08):
That's how the neighbors foundout that they were you know,
we're able to help the police.
And so that's where the startedgetting hired by their neighbors
at that point.
Maggie Lynch (23:21):
Oh, wow. Okay.
Yeah. And they're what age?
Sherrill Joseph (23:24):
They are all 13 years old, and they will be 13
years old forever, by the way.
Just like Nancy. Teens forever,they will be 13 forever. Yeah.
Maggie Lynch (23:35):
Well, that's, that's really cool. So books
happened in one year. Kind ofYeah. So something that struck
me while reading the book that Idid was how polite your
characters are. And I know youmade a comment earlier about how
you want them to be role models,and I found it unusual because
(23:59):
it seems that so many peopleportray children as, you know,
some of them kind of talk backor have tantrums or they get in
trouble. You know, part of thestory is them having to learn to
be more polite. So can you justtalk about why you chose that
and, and how polite they are?
Sherrill Joseph (24:20):
Well, of course I wanted role model characters,
so they weren't going to belittle hooligans, by any means.
But I modeled them after mystudents. You know, I had every
kind of student. There were, Ihad hooligans, all the way up to
these like little polite kidsthat could probably write, you
know, etiquette books. And mylast year of teaching, one
(24:43):
afternoon, I was sitting at myback table. I always had a few
kids stay after school who werejust like, their their friends
would come and they just playedaround the room or helped clean
up the room or whatever. And Iwas watching them one day and I
realized how polite they were toeach other. How much they really
cared about each other asfriends. And as classmates,
(25:03):
these were kids who were willingto do anything to help their
classmates. It was like we werea big family. And I remember
just watching them one afternoonthinking, I wish all kids could
be like this. Maybe it takesrole models for kids to embrace
their inner kindness, or todiscover that being kind is
(25:25):
going to get you a long way inthe world. And so I decided that
was why I wanted to bring thatout in my four characters. And
believe me, I've gotten slammedby that by some reviewers
saying (25:39):
"I don't know anyt kids like this." And I think how sad
that you don't know any kidslike this, ya know, because I
knew a lot of kids like that.
That's why I say kids rock. Iknew a lot of kids like that.
They could teach adults a fewthings about being polite and
respectful. And so that's why Ichose that aspect for my
characters.
Maggie Lynch (26:00):
Well, I think it's wonderful. Actually, I found it
really refreshing. And I haveknown some kids like that. I've
known the hooligans, too. Someof them are cousins.
Sherrill Joseph (26:12):
Adults too.
Maggie Lynch (26:13):
Right, right.
Sure. Exactly. Yeah, but I thinkthat's part of the coolness in
your books. It also gives kidswho are like that, polite and
caring you know, a bit of rockstar notoriety.
Sherrill Joseph (26:27):
Yes, because they have enough confidence in
themselves. Right? Yeah. Thenthey discover pretty soon that,
hey, instead of being teased,they're looked up to. So that's
what I'm trying to do with mykids. I'm trying to get the kids
to think, oh, you know, this canbe cool to act like that.
Maggie Lynch (26:46):
I love it. So I ask every author on the program
this, because we do have a lotof authors who watch or listen.
Can you talk about your writingprocess? Are you a pantser, or
plotter. or something inbetween?
Sherrill Joseph (27:02):
Mostly a pantser. Mostly, I started out
with book one trying to outline.
And I soon discovered that theoutline became a mess. I was
pulling things out, I wasrearranging. And it was
frustrating me more thananything. So now what I do is, I
come up with the kind of kernelof the idea of the mystery. I'm
(27:26):
not, I'm often not sure how it'sgoing to end when I first start
to write. I allow for thecreative process to take over. I
also allow for my detectives totell me what to write. And that
might sound strange. But whenI'm actually in the zone,
(27:46):
writing the story, I feel like Ikind of leave the planet and I
enter their world. And I feellike I'm sort of a bug on the
wall, listening to theirconversation. And I'm just like
the scribe, and I'm just writingit down. And I find that
absolutely thrilling. Andsometimes I'm not sure how the
chapter is going to end. Andthen suddenly, it just kind of
answers the questions. Like, Oh,that's really cool. I like how
(28:08):
they ended that. I give themcredit for it, you know? So in
the beginning I come up with thekernel of the idea. And then I
try to come up with a stop. AndI think about what are some
escapades that they could getinvolved in? And what are some
clues that I want to bring outto lead them to this magic end
(28:29):
of this mystery, which I'm notsure what it is yet. Then I try
to come up with 20 chaptertitles. And not everybody uses
chapter titles, but I found as ateacher, and I noticed my
students too, I liked it whenthere were chapter titles,
because it made it an easy placeto refer to in a book, to teach
and say, Oh, that chapter, youknow, number 10 , you know,
(28:52):
entitled so and so. And the kidswould know, they could go right
to it because of the chaptertitle. And it also is a hook for
kids. A chapter title can be ahook, like, oh, I want to read
this next one. Then you know,oh, to read the next one, read
the next one. But anyway, so Icome up with like 20 chapter
titles, and most get movedaround and some will get
(29:15):
deleted, some others get put ininstead. But that's what helps
me get through a book. So that'smore pantser than plotter, I'd
say.
Maggie Lynch (29:27):
I see what you mean. I understand all the
pantser parts because that'skind of how I work. But it's at
what point, you know, becauseyou said you kind of get them
started. But at what point doyou then start doing the chapter
titles and all of that. Is thatlike after a couple chapters or
(29:49):
is that more in the beginning?
Sherrill Joseph (29:50):
That's more in the beginning. Like I like I
said I just basically think ofwhat are some clean, fun
mischief they could get into ,see, that can lead them to a
clue. Or it's a clue that theywant to try to resolve and then
that clue takes them somewhere.
It gives them a destination. Sothose are sort of the way I work
(30:11):
it. And that, that helps me. I'ma visualizer. So that helps me
visualize what's going on. Andthat's, that's where I can get
my escapades in my chaptertitles from one to the other.
Maggie Lynch (30:26):
Yeah, so you kind of have an idea. You don't
outline at all, but you have anidea of what the escapades are
going to be. And the titlesreflect. Nice! So you do know
where you're moving forward? Doyou ever get to a point where
you say, you know, well, thetitle for number four, that's
not going to happen now and haveto change?
Sherrill Joseph (30:44):
Oh, absolutely.
Yeah. And if I had it down, likein a big, major, long outline,
like I did for my first book,and then I was starting crossing
out or writing arrows, I mean,literally on a piece of paper,
you know. Writing arrows andstuff like that frustrated me
with it. I'm not going to dothis anymore. I'm going to do
more of the pantser thing, youknow, where I'm just going to
try to put like, my outline nowis just my chapter titles. And
(31:08):
if an idea comes to me, I mightwrite a little note off to the
side of that, on that piece ofpaper. But I don't really plot
things out too much anymore. Ijust find that for my creative
process that doesn't work sowell.
Maggie Lynch (31:25):
Yeah. Yeah. I agree with you 100%. Because I'm
the same way. I'm probably alittle more involved in my
characters because I'm usuallythe protagonist in the story.
And so yes. So I'm kind offeeling what she's feeling and
doing what she's doing. And soI'm more connected than being a
(31:46):
fly on the wall. But you have somuch amazing information that I
can see how that fly on the wallthing is, is a better way to
approach it.
Sherrill Joseph (31:56):
I just want to mention, I do the research. I'm
really adamant about doing theresearch, because I don't want
to pass off information thatisn't true to kids.
Maggie Lynch (32:08):
Oh, that's really, yeah, very important.
Sherrill Joseph (32:11):
Yeah, very important, I think for kids.
Always make sure what you'resaying is true.
Maggie Lynch (32:16):
So you did talk about that you actually plan a
total of 26 of these books,which is quite a bit. Have you
thought about or even playedwith the idea of writing a
different series? Or do you kindof think, well, this is, you
know, the rest of my life here,
Sherrill Joseph (32:32):
This is literally the rest of my life. I
just, I'm really involved inthese characters and in the
stories, and I think that'swhere I'm going to stay.
Maggie Lynch (32:46):
Well, it makes sense. If I had to write 26
books in a series, it would bethe rest of my life as well.
Sherrill Joseph (32:52):
Some people really do three, four or five,
and then they're on to a newone. But this is , you know,
gonna last a while.
Maggie Lynch (32:58):
Oh, I think it's wonderful. Thank you! So we're
kind of getting towards the endof our time together. Can you
talk about if you have anyevents coming up, where you're
going to be in person, andparticularly if any of my
listeners live near you, theymay want tomeet you. Also any
(33:18):
virtual events that you may do?
Sherrill Joseph (33:20):
Okay, well, I've done a few book festivals
already. But I really enjoydoing school visits. And I have
one coming up in September, inabout three weeks, right here in
San Diego, a couple miles frommy house, which is great. It's
an in-person one. We didn't getto do too many of those the last
(33:41):
few years. But I also do virtualclass visits. And if anyone
wants to sign me up, you can goto my website,
sherilljoseph.com/school-visits.
And there's information thereand the little contact button.
(34:02):
And if you're in San Diego, youknow, we could probably arrange
an in-person thing. Anywhereelse, we probably could just do
it virtually. I've done virtualevents in Michigan and New York
and Washington DC and placeslike that. So it's really fun.
So we're not limited anymore bythat, and I do these for free,
(34:23):
by the way, because I don'tbelieve in charging teachers. As
I mentioned, I used to be oneand I used to put a lot of my
own money back into my classroomevery year. Even if there's a
PTA and they give you money, I'drather the teachers spend that
little bit of money they mightget on their own classroom and
(34:44):
their children with their kids'needs. Not on me. And so that's
what I do. And so I my reward isjust meeting kids.
Maggie Lynch (35:00):
That's very generous of you. And I'm sure a
lot of teachers will thank youfor that.
Sherrill Joseph (35:06):
Well, to me, it's the only way to go. It just
makes the most sense to me to dothat, right. Yeah.
Maggie Lynch (35:12):
So you said that you have your fourth book coming
out in October? Do you have abig launch plan for that or
something that listeners shouldknow about? Like, any special
deals or anything like that?
Sherrill Joseph (35:27):
I believe I'll be in the Cozy Mystery Village,
I'm going to have somethingaround that time. I'm not sure
how many of them are actuallyconnected into social media, you
know, that can be readilyavailable right now. I have a
newsletter. If people want tosubscribe to my newsletter,
(35:48):
which issherrilljoseph.com/newsletter. I
always put my information inthere as to where I'm going to
be. I have a new section aswell, an event section. I
usually put it in the eventssection. You could go to my
websitesherrilljoseph.com/events. It's
there as well. So I would try topost things in advance so
(36:10):
readers know where I am and cantune in.
Maggie Lynch (36:14):
Perfect! Well, thank you so much for being my
guest today, Sherrill. And thankyou, listeners, for tuning in.
As always, I will put all ofSherrill's contact information
for her website and social mediain the show notes associated
with us. Her website is easy toremember. It is
(36:34):
sherrilljoseph.com. This hasbeen Dust Jackets: Conversations
with Authors. See you next time.
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