March 6, 2024 • 45 mins
Known for her stellar performances in film and TV hits including Antwone Fisher, I Am Legend, and Eureka, Salli Richardson-Whitfield is more than just a celebrated actress. As an award-winning director of shows like Queen Sugar, Blackish, Winning Time: The Rise of the Lakers Dynasty, and The Gilded Age, she's also a behind-the-camera force in the entertainment industry. And in this captivating conversation with Carol, Salli reveals a side seldom publicly seen: that of a wise and compassionate mother of two. Salli shares her invaluable parenting insights in this episode, emphasizing the importance of honesty in acknowledging our parenting strengths and limitations. Through candid anecdotes and reflections, she tells us how she has maintained the delicate balance between her thriving career and active family life. Tune in for a lively exchange filled with relatable stories and a healthy dose of wisdom that will resonate with parents everywhere.
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Follow us at @GroundControlParenting and on groundcontrolparenting.com
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Episode Transcript
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(00:04):
Hello, and welcome to Ground ControlParenting, a blog and now a podcast
created for parents raising black and brownchildren. I'm the creator and your host,
Carol Sutton Lewis. In this podcastseries, I talk with some really
interesting people about the joy and thejob of parenting. Today, I am
so happy to have the amazing actress, director, and producer Sally Richardson Woodfield
(00:25):
join us today. Sally has animpressive decades long career in Hollywood. She
starred as an actress in numerous filmsand series, including features like I Am
Legend and Twine Fisher and The GreatWhite Height. In television, she's known
for starring in the sci fi originalseries Eureka as well as Stitchers, and
for providing the voice of Alyssa Mazain the popular Disney series Gargoyles, changing
(00:49):
gears to a role behind the camera. Sally now has a really impressive career
as an award winning director and producer. Her extensive directing resume includes such shows
as Queen Sugar, The Scandal,Lethal Weapons, Shadow Hunters, Dear White
People, Luke Cage Black. Thisis only a partial list, there's so
many. She is the director andexecutive producer of the HBO smash series The
(01:11):
Gilded Age, which I love,and the HBO basketball drama Winning Time,
Rise of the Lakers Dynasty, andall of this is part of her overall
production deal with HBO Max. SoSally's been very busy and very successful.
She is married to the wonderful actorand author Dendre Whitfield, and they have
a daughter, Parker, who's nineteen, a freshman is Spelman College, and
(01:34):
a son, Dre. Welcome toground Control Parenting, Sally. Oh,
thank you so much for having me. I'm so happy to have you here
today. So when I first metyou many many many years ago, you
were your young actress bursting onto theHollywood scene, and now you are running
things, and not only are youtaking care of business at work, but
you are successfully focused on the homefront as well. As You and your
(01:56):
husband have talked extensively about how you'veworked to create your loving marriage and family.
So I'm excited to talk with youabout your parenting philosophy. So let's
get started, and I'd love tostart with how you were raised, because
I always talk about parents needing toraise the children that they have, not
the ones they were, So it'sreally interesting to hear about how you were
(02:16):
raised, where you were raised,and what your family life was. Like.
Oh, that's such an interesting youknow how Okay, Like, let
me think about this and now getmy mother and father angry at me.
Oh, you know, my parentswere you know, got divorced and I
(02:36):
think I was about third grade orsomething like that. And this is in
Chicago. I grew up in Chicagoin High Park, went to the University
of Chicago laboratory schools there. Myfather worked at the University of Chicago.
So so, and then when myparents divorced, my father moved very close.
(03:02):
And then when you know, becauseof divorce, you know, sometimes
finances aren't the same. My mothereventually couldn't stay in that one apartment we
were in, and she moved intothe same building that my father was in.
So I was in like a fewfloors below. So I was able
to for a long time until myfather got remarried. I was able to
(03:23):
kind of go from apartment to apartmentand then I'd go to my father's office
after school. So in that respect, I still had, like, you
know, my dad was very present. Although you know, divorce is never
the best thing in the world becauseI still remember when my father said he
(03:46):
was leaving the house, and Ido think that that's part of the reason
my husband. My husband comes from, you know, a kind of,
as they would say, broken homekind of thing too. So I think
that that is part of the reasonwe kind of made this decision that we
were going to push through. Andwe've been able to stay married because,
you know, sometimes it kind offollows that your parents were divorced, you
(04:10):
get divorced, and we've you know, knock on wood that way. But
we've been together twenty six years now, so that's great. I think about
how I was raised. I thinkit's I'm pretty close to the same mother
that I had, although I grewup in a time where people were spanked,
(04:31):
and you know, I don't.We don't do that with our children,
and I think it's worked well forus. What were your parents' expectations
of you? I mean, howhow did they convey these two your your
fathers are working with the University ofChicago. You're in a university town,
you went to the lab school.Did they have high expectations for you academically?
(04:54):
I mean, and how did theyconvey them to you? Yes?
Obviously things were expected of me.You know, they're spending a lot of
money on my education. Although again, like I said, I was not
at that time. I was justnot the best student in the world.
I was, although I did maintaina certain grade point average because mostly because
(05:16):
I was an athlete at the time, you had to get a certain like
I had to get a certain gradepoint averature or I think that was the
main thing that kept me in line, is that I wanted to do the
things I wanted to do at school, and I had to do well enough
to stay there. And it's it'sweird because my mother also worked at Chicago
State University, so and they bothhave their masters. You know, you
(05:40):
would I would have thought they wouldbe more focused on really watching what I
was doing in school. But I'dhave to say that there was a more
laid back approach that I don't havewith my children. And I think,
you know, it's like the Ithink that because I think I needed a
heavier hand. I needed people watchingme a little more closely with my grades
(06:05):
rather than you know, of course, if you're called I was in trouble,
they you know, I was alwayson punishment about my grades. It
wasn't like they were ignoring me oranything. Although my children probably would say
I drive them crazy. You know, if you bring home a bee,
Now I'm like, okay, butI don't really understand this bee. I'm
(06:28):
expecting I'm you know, and I'mexpecting a four point four grade point average.
So but you know, sometimes wedo with our kids what we didn't
get from our parents, you know, or what we may have thought we
needed from our parents. Although somethingmust have worked because it's switched. As
I've gotten older and in what Ido now as a director producer, I
(06:56):
have become a great student and Ihave a great work. So something worked
out. Well, you know,it's funny. I was just having this
conversation with one of my children,who was the child that I definitely had
to lean on a lot to makesure that he understood our expectations and met
them. Because, as I'm surewas the case when you were growing up,
(07:19):
you could people could see the potentialin you, like I could see
the potential in my son, butthey, for whatever reason, he wasn't
meeting it as well as we'd haveliked. Fast forward, when he went
off to college, I was basicallylike, you're on your own now and
sounds like once you found something youreally wanted to focus on and study,
(07:40):
you went to it. I meansimilarly, he got to college and he's
like, oh, now I getto study what I want. I'm good.
So you hope that you do enough. With my daughter at Spelman this
year, I don't feel like Ihave to micromanage that in any way.
I think she knows what she needsto do to study, and you know
(08:00):
it's her. She's only had herfirst semester and she knows what classes that
aren't her favorite, but she's stilldoing what she needs to do. So
I feel very comfortable that she isself sufficient and I've done what I was
supposed to do, although I dostill call and go how's it going?
You know, all three of minehave gone through college now, and yeah,
(08:22):
I'm with you one hundred percent.So just I want to back up
a minute, ask a couple ofquestions, like, just out of curiosity,
what was your sport that you weredoing in high school? I was
on the basketball team, love,but I was also on the tennis team
for a while. But basketball waslike I played from you know, like
sixth grade, our same team basicallybecause lab went from nursery school through high
(08:46):
school. So but by sixth gradewe had all been playing together for years.
I think we landed undefeated, andbut yeah, absolutely loved it.
It's part of the reason I didn'tdo as much theater because it would bump
up against my basketball schedule and Ihadn't really found that that was going to
be where I was going. ButI also my basketball. I really take
(09:09):
that into work. I'm a verycompetitive person and it's part of my work
epic honestly, to be like thebest at what I'm doing and one to
win and like be two evers coming, you know, after me, So
it's worth you know. I've hadsome conversations with other guests, one in
(09:31):
particular teacher who was an athlete,and she talked a lot about how sports
really helped her process learning in thatin sports, every competition, somebody wins,
somebody loses, and you're going tolose. I mean there's no sport
where you win every single time inyour entire life. And as soon as
(09:52):
you lose, you get together andyou figure out what you did wrong and
how you can do better the nexttime. And we it was kind of
a lie. H Bulb went offwhen I was listening to her. I
did not participate in sports as achild. I danced and did other stuff.
But that lesson of sports where youtake the loss. You don't like
it, but you take it,and you don't take it. You don't
(10:13):
go home and cry and curl upin a ball. You take it and
you figure out what's the next thing. I mean, that's so valuable if
we could, if we could sortof shift that over to learning, Like
if you fail something, it's notyou, there's something wrong with you,
it's just that you know. Youneed to figure out what's wrong and keep
going. So I know I've readthat you are a product of an interracial
(10:35):
marriage and that your father's white,your mom is African American. Can you
talk a little bit about how yourparents talk to you about identity and whether
there was any kind of tension atall with respect to your perspective on your
identity. That's such a funny thingfor me. I look back, and
my problem with the race and beingconfronted with it really happened as I got
(11:01):
older. I as a young kidgrowing up in Hyde Park. Luckily it
was a as far as you know, because Chicago can be very segregated,
but there was something about that Universityof Chicago area campus. There were a
lot of mixed marriages or you know, more than probably they were in the
country in this little area. Andalso I think something about being raised like
(11:28):
your mom being black, and mygrandmother lived with me and my uncle lived
with us for a while. Ijust know, I knew my father was
white and that is what it is, and I was with his white side
of the family when you know,we would go visit them. But I've
always felt very much black. Thatwas just my experience. That's just who
(11:52):
I knew I was. My motheris a black woman, so I was
a black woman. Were their timeis where people mentioned about my you know,
being light skin or something. Youknow, you always get that,
oh you think you're better than me, and I, you know, I
was just that kid, like Ihave no idea, no I you know,
it just it was just my reality. So I didn't And then as
(12:16):
I got older, you know,people say dumb stuff to you, like,
oh, what do you what's yournationality? I always knew I was
like black, and they're like what, but oh, but you speak so
well, but you're so pretty.There has to be something mixed. It's
like you even know what they're No, no, yeah, you you can't.
You can't be just black. You'vegot to be something else. But
(12:39):
I think that that is why Ieven held on more to my blackness,
because that was so ridiculous. Andlater on I've had to you know,
my father and I had to haveconversations because he didn't understand why why aren't
you but you are part white?Like it almost It was hurting him and
I had to sort of playing tohim, this is my reality in life,
(13:01):
walking through life. I'm a blackwoman because that's how people treat me.
That's just how I feel my mother, and it's nothing against him.
I love my white side, butI have to function through reality and through
my life. And me pretending orthat I am not the black woman that
(13:22):
people see me as or that Ifeel that I am, it's going to
cause me more harm than good.Do you have any siblings? I have
three brothers, both of you know, from half brothers from my parents getting
remarried. So I have a brotherfrom my mother's second marriage. She looks
very much like me, and thenmy and then I have two white brothers,
(13:45):
you know, Mayr Chad and Johnwhen I tell people these are my
brothers and go okay, okay,So fast forward you and you've already started
to talk about this. You're youhave a baby, you have your daughter.
When your daughter was born, didyou have a sense of what your
parenting style would be? I mean, did you feel as if you were
(14:07):
going to parent away from the waythat you've been parented to some degree or
towards it, or did you comewith fully formed notions as to how we
were going to parent her through life. I don't. I don't think I
came with a fully formed notion.I think that like most others, we
just sort of roll with it.But I did know my husband and I
(14:28):
did discuss that we would not belike doing corporal punishment, like there would
be no spanking. And I thinkthat you know, that was important to
us. And tell me a littlebit about how that worked out. I
mean, I didn't. We didn'tdeclare it, but we ended up really
not doing it much. But butI was certainly spanked as a child.
(14:52):
Do you were you spanked as achild? Absolutely, both of my you
know, yes, yeah, bothof my my husband and I we were
and I think, you know,and that's nothing against that was during that
time period of life, and Idon't think it's the best method I've been
able to instill enough fear in themwithout touching them. Then I just didn't
(15:15):
feel like it was necessary. AndI think that and maybe it's I wasn't.
You know. My mother was ayoung mother. You know, people
got married very young. I wasan older mom, and I just felt
that when I had that little babyin my arms, there was no way
that I could hurt her in thatway and touch her in that way.
(15:37):
And that did mean that you don'tget on, you know, on punishment
and things taken away from you,and all of that seems to have worked,
because you know, I love mytwo is now and I go everybody
seems to be okay and on theirway and nice people, expectful people.
So I just didn't think it wasand sout that I also, you know,
(16:00):
when I think about I wanted tobe very present with my kids.
I also, you know, Idon't think my mother is the most huggy,
huggy kissy person when I look back. You know, my mother and
I are very good friends, butwe don't necessarily talk all the time.
(16:21):
My daughter now at college that's somethingI wanted to be a little different.
You know, my daughter and Italk every single day, and it's something
I've wanted both of my parents.And it's not that we're not close.
You know, I love my parents. I love talking to them, but
I find that we don't talk alot, and I wanted to really want
(16:41):
to change that with my children.Uh just watched her a different relationship,
you know. I think it's reallyimportant that you do talk with her,
and some it's so easy to dothat. Now. My youngest lives in
Japan, and people say, oh, my goodness, how is he doing?
And I can tell you because wetalk all the time thanks to FaceTime
(17:03):
and texting. I mean, itis very comforting to be able to just
lay eyes on or just hear yourchild's voice, even if it's just for
a few minutes. Thanks to moderntechnology, the connecting, the ability to
connect even when they're far away.But I think that a lot of my
parents is great. Well is differentfor my mother's only because it's also a
different time. You know, whenI grew up, you didn't, you
(17:26):
know. There are many things thatI talked to my daughter about that my
mother didn't necessarily have some of thoseconversations with me, but that's nothing against
her parenting. During that time,you didn't maybe talk about these things,
you know, you didn't talk aboutdating men and drugs as much. It
wasn't as open as it is now. And my daughter and I, I
(17:49):
really we have and hopefully with myson too, But it's you know,
that's dad seems to be getting alittle closer now that he's you know,
in those teenage years. But mydaughter really feels she comes to me about
everything, and especially at this agein nineteen, I always say, you
(18:10):
can come to me about everything.That doesn't mean that I'm not going to
be disappointed for a moment about something, but I would like ill still have
give you my honest opinion, hopefullywithout judgment, and give you the advice
that you need. A lot oftimes I give you my advice. This
is what I would do, thisis what I encourage you to do.
(18:33):
But you have to make your owndecision. And I think that's why she's
will to talk to me. That'sreally great. My oldest is in her
early thirties, and I tell youit's a wonderful challenge to parent older children
because the older they get two thingshappen. They are very independently minded,
and they focus, they look atthings through their own perspective. And then
(18:56):
I don't know about you, butI don't remember much about what I was
thinking when I was ten, butI remember pretty vividly what I was thinking
about when I would say twenty eight. I mean, it sounds really good
the way that you say to yourdaughter, here's what I would do.
You decide what you would do,and just keep hold on to that,
because sometimes it gets harder as theyget older not to say don't do that.
(19:17):
There's definitely times when I'm going listen, I was, I lived exactly
what you're going through right now.Please trust me that I know what I'm
telling you is right. Again,you have to do what you want to
do. But I'm telling you rightnow that if you just do what I'm
(19:41):
telling you to do, it's goingto work out better for you. But
what can you do? We'll beright back after these messages, Welcome back
to the show. I knew thatI wanted to talk to you about sort
of your life, your life asa working mom and raising your kids.
But as I began to look thewonderful thing about interviewing people who are public
(20:03):
figures is that you can find thingsabout them before you talk to them.
And I've discovered this amazing series ofvideos, and I discovered your husband's book
that he wrote, Mail to Men, I mean, about growing men out
and becoming a man. And he'sjust been so wonderfully eloquent about how he
(20:25):
wants to leave this legacy not onlyfor his own son, but for men
everywhere. And both of you talkvery candidly about your relationship growing over time,
and you're working together on it.And as I would hear you talk
in these conversations about moving through thepain and filling in love and compassion,
it struck me that while that isa wonderful prescription for a solid marriage,
(20:49):
it's also a really important approach forparenting. Because I don't know if you
have discovered this as much as Ihave, but when you are parenting your
child, you really it's so much. There is so much self reflection that's
necessary, I mean, in orderto present to them a solid parenting.
I mean, you have to.For example, if you did something when
(21:12):
you were growing up, not whatyour parents did, but something that you
did that you want to do differently, it's really important that you resolved all
that in yourself before you try totalk to your kids about it. So
the kind of work that you guyshave done on your relationship has that influence
or impacted the way that you parent. I think that everything for me is
(21:32):
just being honest with myself and honestwith my children, and always being willing
to apologize probably not the best apologizerto my husband, but with my kids,
because we can't be perfect and weare who we are and we respond
(21:56):
the way we respond, which sometimescan be hurtful to them. But I'm
always willing to come back in theroom and go, hey, I'm sorry,
shouldn't yelled that, you shouldn't haveresponded that way. And I just
feel like that's the best for me, that's the best approach. I don't
(22:18):
know if I've healed everything that aremy issues, but I know what my
issues are. You know, sometimesnot every I don't know. I may
be wrong. I don't think everythingis healable, but you can know what
the problems are and why you areresponding a certain way, and when I
(22:38):
respond that way, which is notmaybe the most appropriate, I can then
apologize for it and go yes,you're absolutely right. You're absolutely right.
I wasn't, and I'm okay.Like most of our I think we grew
up with our parents. They didn'tfeel like they needed to apologize to us
about anything, And you know,it's you know, you get that the
(23:00):
best I could, I did thebest I could, Like, yeah you
did, but your best may nothave been right all the time, and
it's okay to say, you knowwhat, I was wrong at that time,
or maybe, guess what, maybeit wasn't the best you could have
done. You know, there aretimes when we are selfish as just beings,
(23:25):
as a person, and we're selfishwith our children, and so maybe,
yeah, you're right, it wasn'tthe best I could do, and
I made that decision for myself sometimes. But I think being willing to be
wrong and apologizing for it goes along way with your children, you know,
I think that is so wise.People get very defensive about parenting because
(23:48):
there's no rule book and they feelas if they have to answer for the
way that they are. And ifyour ego is wrapped up in whatever you're
doing, you can't really step backand apologize, because you know you want
to be that mom that is alwaysright, or that dad that you know
doesn't get challenged. But it's somuch more effective if you can just take
a beat and say to your child, you know that I didn't do right
(24:12):
now. The interesting thing is youhave to you have to say that to
your child. What you don't wantyour child to expect that of you.
I mean every time that you reprimmandthem, they can't come back and say,
because guess what, sometimes I'm notI'm not sorry, and you in
trouble, right, but it wasn'tlike I didn't do it in an appropriate
(24:33):
way. You can still be introuble that I didn't need to curse you
out, you know what I mean? Right like? But you know you
know? And and then we haveto again, we have to accept the
things that My daughter and I literallywere just talking last night, and she's
expressed this before because she's starting toget a little interested in what I do
(24:59):
as a director. And I go, well, you've had all this time
to come sit on set with meand see what I do. And she
goes, I think that I wasa bit resentful of it and didn't want
to have anything to do with itfor a little while because it took you
away from me, and I thought, or I have been under this illusion
that I had balanced it better thanI think I must have for her,
(25:23):
and then it hurt her when,especially when I started directing. Once I
started directing, I was gone alot because it took me out of the
country for long spans of time,like it feels like there was a few
years. I was definitely gone allthe time, you know, I was
balancing back and forth. And Ithought that it didn't affect them as much
(25:49):
as or at least her. Myson hasn't talked about it too much.
I think I've been home a littlebit more lately with him. But last
night I was going, I amso sorry. I thought I thought you
were okay, and it's not.I don't know if I would have done
it differently. You know, Istill listen to what I do. I
(26:11):
want her to know you're supposed todo it. You know, you want
to find the things that you lovetoo as a person, And unfortunately that
took me away from home. Butthen I go, I did something right,
because you're okay. You know,it seems like she's going to be
She's very strong, confident, notthat she hasn't ever insecurities. But you
(26:32):
know, yeah, it makes mesad that like she missed me being there
all the time. But what canyou you know, I can't. I
had to like the bills to bepaid, and there's stuff to have,
and I don't know what to do, you know, right, And you
were pursuing a passion that helped you. It motivated you and lifted your spirit.
(26:52):
I mean it wasn't just your working. You were doing something that you
really wanted to do. So Iwill tell you that that's I can tell
you the same version of that story, but the total opposite. I did
a lot of nonprofit work, butI fundamentally spent a lot of time at
home with my kids. Surprisingly considering, I thought I would have this different
career, but I ended up spendinga lot of time with them and the
last one. So there's a sevenyear gap between the oldest and the last
(27:17):
one, and so by the lastone, I was kind of done with
the whole. I mean it wasa lot and I think they get a
different parent. Yeah, right,exactly. And I remember that when he
was in either kindergarten or first grade, I missed library reading. I was
supposed to come and read the bookat library and I didn't show up.
(27:40):
I didn't have a good excuse exceptit fell off my calendar and I was
doing something else. But it wasone of those classic horrible situations where everybody's
waiting and you know, the mom'snot showing up and so, and I
never showed up. He's twenty fournow. I still hear and I know
I mean, and we joke aboutit, but I know I heard him
from and I really wanted to say, look, you understand, I am
(28:03):
here so much that this is notsupposed to make you feel this way,
because you know I do so much. But that thing, I mean,
that's the thing that he remembers,and I get it because it was it
was a sad moment that he thoughthis mother had abandoned him. But they
hang on to those things, likemy daughter. You know, it's like,
oh, and Dre came, youwere all with him. I'm like,
yeah, but you're what you're notremembering is that, you know,
(28:27):
there's a four year difference. Inursed my daughter for more than two years,
and she would never take a bottle. So that's tell you that I
wore that kid on me. Sheco slept with me, So she slept
with me with the first for you, I mean like she was on me,
(28:49):
and I'm like, you don't reallyremember how much you were with your
mother. But of course that's whyI felt like she hadn't enough baby for
me to be gone. But absolutely, you know, it's hey, nobody
can do it completely right, No, And being a stay at home mom
is fantastic. But at the sametime, I'm happy that my daughter knows
(29:14):
that she can have a career too. It's so complicated. It's very complicated.
I mean I was doing things,but I was not working, and
I worried that my daughter was nothaving the role model. I mean,
I'm an attorney and I wasn't practicing, and I was worried that she would
think that her role. Her rolewas to sort of grow up and get
(29:36):
married and have children and that waspretty much. And so sometime in high
school, I said, you know, it's really important that you understand that
women work really hard outside the home. And I really hope that you're not
looking at me and saying, youknow, this is what women do and
that you're you're aspiring to do this. And she said, I don't know
(29:57):
how this is going to sound Iactually don't think much about what you're doing
when I'm trying to figure out whati want to do. And I said,
okay, I've won. I guessthat's the right answer. Although you
know, my daughter is always likeone. She wants to be married and
she wants to have children, andshe would like not to be working when
(30:22):
she has her kids, you know, or at least made to be home
for a little while. So Idon't know, I just encourage her.
I go with and you know,make sure who you marry, and you
know, you grow together enough sothat when it is time for you to
have your children, you can't takethat time off if you want to.
(30:45):
We have so many dreams for ourchildren, right. I just I'm like,
okay, my career, because younever know what's going to happen in
life, and that you may haveto take care of yourself and leave you
and then you've been at home allthese years and now you have no work
to get how do you do?Like? So you got to make sure.
But that's my you know, thatis me coming from a divorced mother
(31:07):
who had to take care of herself. I could have probably laid back a
bit and let my husband take careof things more. But I always had
that fear of not like being strandedon my own, so I always had
to work. And so I'm like, okay, just be careful, you
to do both. So you know, I definitely am reacting a little bit
from how I was raised. Sosome degree, you really think that you're
(31:30):
such a strong influence, and youfind out that you're an influence, but
not quite as strong as you thought. So, but I think as strong.
I I look at my mother,and now at this age, I
feel my mother and me a lotmore. As I've gotten older, I
can hear things come out of mymouth that sound like my mother. I
look at my daughter, although we'redifferent, she's very much me and I
(31:59):
the same. Although I didn't seemto have the work ethic when I was
younger, I do have my mother'swork ethic now. And I see my
daughter growing into me too, SoI think we I think you have more
of influenced Carol than you're giving yourselfcredit for. Maybe, so she's doing
(32:20):
great, So I'd love to takesome credit. Take credit for it.
Now, tell me a little bitabout your travels. I mean, how
did it work? Just the management. I've always interested about how people manage
very busy lives of a lot oftravel. How did you manage spending time
out of the country. I mean, obviously you have a good partnership with
your husband. Did you guys tagteam on hanging out with the kids somehow
(32:45):
or another. It kind of organicallyworked out that when I had to be
gone for you know, a fewmonths or something, that like it would
fall sometime during the summer, orit fell a little bit over the holidays,
(33:07):
or he happened to not be workingat that time when I had to
go, and when I came backand he needed to go out of town,
I just happened to be home.I was also very lucky that I
had my cousin who worked for usat the time. If both of us
had to be gone, she washere, and I felt very comfortable with
(33:30):
her because she's a family member andshe loves my kids. You know,
I think Kimmy, my cousin,Kimmy saved us a lot. And then
my mom would come in town andfor some reason, like we were really
going to both be gone for along time, but a lot of the
times, for some reason, myhusband just happened to have that free time
(33:51):
when I was gone. And Ido think that looking back, Andre made
some big sacrifices for me in jobsthat he didn't accept because he saw what
was happening with my directing and howthings were changing for me, and things
were growing so rapidly that he kindof took the back seat and let me
(34:15):
do what I needed to do togrow. Wow, that's great. So
I want to wrap up this partby asking you a question I love to
ask very successful working people, andthat is what about parenting has made you
a better director? And what aboutdirecting has made you a better parent?
(34:35):
Listen? They at work, I'mdefinitely I can be boss lady and I
can be mom. You know,probably sometimes a little too much mom on
set, but I think that youknow, I use my micromanaging skills both
at home and both as directing.I think that, you know, directing
(35:00):
has helped me more as a personand probably as a mom at home,
just because I found this, trulyfound this inner strength and grew so much
by becoming a director and just sortof finding myself through that. And I
think that that confidence can only begood for my children. So I think
(35:22):
those are the similar things. Andwhen I have younger actors and you know,
and it's on set, I definitelydo probably feel like mom to them.
And I'm sure that when people aren'tdoing wrong, they're like, why
is this woman talking to me like, you know, like a mother,
(35:43):
going that is exactly that, Thatis not what I told you, And
I told you this five times.And I'm sure they're sick hearing me talk
like that. But then you cango back to them and say I'm sorry.
They don't get as sorry at work, only only I think that what
(36:07):
my husband sometimes me being ahead ofeverything at work actually causes more conflict when
I get home because I'm used totelling you what needs to be done and
you're doing it. There are noquestions, there's no I didn't have time,
There's just this is it's a dictatorshipmore and coming home I can be
(36:31):
very much that same person I askedto do this? Are you going to
do this? And I'm noting andsending things? Can you make sure this
is done? And there are timesmy husband is like, yeah, I'm
not your assistant. You know.I have to relax a little bit when
I get home. So I saidthat was a last, But I have
one quick follow up, not tothat, but a slightly different question about
(36:54):
raising kids in Hollywood. Your childrenseem your daughter's off at spell then they
seem lovely and grounded. How toughwas it to kind of instill values,
family values when you're in the sortof glitz and glamour of Hollywood. You
know what, it hasn't been abig deal in our house. We don't
(37:15):
walk through life like that ourselves.You know, most of our friends may
be in the business, but likewe're just kind of regular people. I'm
not a big go to every event. I'm not getting every you know.
I think that if I was moreon the scene, it would be a
(37:38):
thing. She's gone to the youknow, she's been going to schools with
the kids of all these famous people, and it's not a big deal to
her. It's kind of how shegrew up with these same people. And
I mean, I think you arewho your parents are. It doesn't impress
her absolutely, And again she seesthat mom is not doing the most.
(38:01):
So it's not I don't know,it hasn't been. I really think it's.
My husband's from New York, I'mfrom Chicago. I'm very much who
you see here, and that's whomy kids are. It's not they're very
grounded, they're very nice, kindkids. And nobody's doing anything. I
(38:22):
always say, you're not doing anythingweird. You're just kind of normal kids.
I mean, raising normal normal inthe air quotes kids these days is
a blessing. When I say normal, you know, it's just no,
no, I know what you meannormal because you're a nice person, Like
you're not right, like there's nothingand knock on, would like I just
(38:45):
go, okay, thank god,we're not having to deal with, you
know, certain things, like bigproblems. We've been able so far avoid
huge problems in the teenage. Youof course, my son is you know,
it's just freshman year in high school. We still got to get him
through, you know, graduate.But he you know, I don't know,
(39:07):
they've blistened enough, and they seemto have good value, you know.
M h Well, I mean,like you said, children are reflection
of their parents. So kudos toyou guys for doing the work. And
Sally, I'm so happy to hearthis. I had imagined all these questions.
(39:28):
I sort of figured I knew someof the answers, and you have
just validated all that I have seenabout how grounded you are and how impressive
it is to watch you make thispivot into this world in which you are
shining so brightly. So thank youso much, Thank you so much for
joining me, and good luck withyour daughter in her freshman year. And
(39:50):
how impressive that, by the way, that she's at Spelman, because that
sisterhood is unrivaled from what I understand, So she's in good hands. Yes,
and we were very excited. SoI'm going to wrap it up here.
Thank you so much, but Ihave to ask you to play the
GCP Lightning Round four quick questions,and the first one is do you have
a favorite poem or saying something thatyou'd like to say a lot? I
(40:14):
pretty much, you know, withmy kids and in life, I always
say to be brave, Just bebrave. I talk to my children about
that a lot, and a lotof you know about being brave is that
you may be fearful of what you'regoing into. You may fear that you
(40:35):
don't know how to do it,or it's new, or it's uncomfortable,
and you just have to push throughit. And that doesn't mean you're not
going to have the fear. Butyou have to be you have to be
brave in life to make mistakes tosucceed. Bravery is very important. Oh
that's so good. Be brave,simple and good. Okay, children's books,
(40:58):
if you can remember any either thattwo favorite ones, either you remember
growing up reading, or any thatyour children liked in particular. Okay,
I'm gonna tell you too from me, And they're going to be the oddest
things in the world. So,growing up, for some reason, I
had the hardest time really learning howto read, just struggle, and then
(41:20):
once I did, like all ofa sudden, I passed everybody I So
I used to read Green Eggs andHam at some point was like the only
book I could read. It wasthe weirdest thing, and I would just
read it over and over and over. I have no idea, like why
that was the book. And thenI had this obsession later on with Cinderella.
(41:42):
And I don't know if it wasturmoil in my life growing up and
wanting to be saved or saved bysome handsome prince, but I was obsessed
with Cinderella. I'd write my ownCinderella books, I had my barbies,
I'd play Cinderella. I don't know. It was a very odd fascination that
I had with the Cinderella story.So those are very two different books.
(42:07):
I have no idea why, butthere you go. No, but I
like the Cinderella fascination because ultimately yourescued yourself. So yeah, and so
tell me about a mom moment.And you may have already when you said
you're willing to apologize but and do. But is there any mom moment that
(42:29):
you can think of that you justlove to do over. I mean,
I can tell you I wished Ihad made that library meeting with my son,
but that I would love to doover. I don't know. I
think that I missed my daughter's eighthgrade graduation because I was I was out
(42:50):
of the country working. But whenI think about big moments, that's the
only one that I wasn't in townfor. But I don't know, no
complete redos, but that would beone I definitely missed. I've always been
able to be lucky to get backin time to get you the direct.
Okay, we're going to go shoppingfor homecoming and prom Okay, mom's going
(43:13):
to be home for that. I'vealready let him know at work, so
it's been I've been there for mostof the stuff. Good good, And
So to wrap it up, what'sa moment you knew you nailed it as
a mom, you just got itright? Oh, I nailed it?
Huh Oh gosh. I think Idon't think it's a moment, but I
(43:35):
do think that right now where mydaughter is and I know I'm talking a
lot about my daughter, I thinkI'm just kind of engrossed in her life
right now because knowledge, I thinkthat like just kind of now what's going
on in her life. I've kindof nailed it a good place for our
communication. And then when I thinkabout my son general, I feel like
(44:00):
I've nailed it with him because whenmy son gets up in the morning before
he leaves, when he comes inthe door, he always comes straight to
me and gives me the biggest hugand kiss and I love you, Mom.
If I'm washing dishes or cooking,he comes behind me and hugs me
(44:23):
and kisses me on the back ofmy head. When we're out with his
friends, he still comes and givesme a big hug and a kiss.
He's just so loving and just loveshis mom, and it just makes me
so happy. That is that's agreat answer. And as the mother of
two boys, both of whom haveno trouble in their twenties giving me the
(44:47):
biggest hug ever in front of theirfriends, I know that feels really good.
And they did that through their teenageyears. Yes, that is nailing
it because there's so many parents thathave the separation in teen world, but
it's very nice when it doesn't haveto happen. So that was a great
answer. Sally. Thank you somuch for being with us today. I
(45:07):
really appreciate it. It's been greatfun and wonderful to see you. Okay,
thank you for having me. Ihope everyone listening enjoyed this conversation that
you'll come back for more. Pleasesubscribe, rate, and review where you
find your podcasts and tell your friends. For more parenting info and advice,
please check out the ground Control Parentingwebsite at wwwgroundcontrolparenting dot com. You can
(45:30):
also find us on Facebook and Instagramat ground Control Parenting and on LinkedIn under
Carol Sutton Lewis. Until the nexttime, take care and thanks for listening.
Hello, and welcome to Ground ControlParenting, a blog and now a podcast
created for parents raising black and brownchildren. I'm the creator and your host,
Carol Sutton Lewis. In this podcastseries, I talk with some really
interesting people about the joy and thejob of parenting. Today, I am
so happy to have the amazing actress, director, and producer Sally Richardson Woodfield
(00:25):
join us today. Sally has animpressive decades long career in Hollywood. She
starred as an actress in numerous filmsand series, including features like I Am
Legend and Twine Fisher and The GreatWhite Height. In television, she's known
for starring in the sci fi originalseries Eureka as well as Stitchers, and
for providing the voice of Alyssa Mazain the popular Disney series Gargoyles, changing
(00:49):
gears to a role behind the camera. Sally now has a really impressive career
as an award winning director and producer. Her extensive directing resume includes such shows
as Queen Sugar, The Scandal,Lethal Weapons, Shadow Hunters, Dear White
People, Luke Cage Black. Thisis only a partial list, there's so
many. She is the director andexecutive producer of the HBO smash series The
(01:11):
Gilded Age, which I love,and the HBO basketball drama Winning Time,
Rise of the Lakers Dynasty, andall of this is part of her overall
production deal with HBO Max. SoSally's been very busy and very successful.
She is married to the wonderful actorand author Dendre Whitfield, and they have
a daughter, Parker, who's nineteen, a freshman is Spelman College, and
(01:34):
a son, Dre. Welcome toground Control Parenting, Sally. Oh,
thank you so much for having me. I'm so happy to have you here
today. So when I first metyou many many many years ago, you
were your young actress bursting onto theHollywood scene, and now you are running
things, and not only are youtaking care of business at work, but
you are successfully focused on the homefront as well. As You and your
(01:56):
husband have talked extensively about how you'veworked to create your loving marriage and family.
So I'm excited to talk with youabout your parenting philosophy. So let's
get started, and I'd love tostart with how you were raised, because
I always talk about parents needing toraise the children that they have, not
the ones they were, So it'sreally interesting to hear about how you were
(02:16):
raised, where you were raised,and what your family life was. Like.
Oh, that's such an interesting youknow how Okay, Like, let
me think about this and now getmy mother and father angry at me.
Oh, you know, my parentswere you know, got divorced and I
(02:36):
think I was about third grade orsomething like that. And this is in
Chicago. I grew up in Chicagoin High Park, went to the University
of Chicago laboratory schools there. Myfather worked at the University of Chicago.
So so, and then when myparents divorced, my father moved very close.
(03:02):
And then when you know, becauseof divorce, you know, sometimes
finances aren't the same. My mothereventually couldn't stay in that one apartment we
were in, and she moved intothe same building that my father was in.
So I was in like a fewfloors below. So I was able
to for a long time until myfather got remarried. I was able to
(03:23):
kind of go from apartment to apartmentand then I'd go to my father's office
after school. So in that respect, I still had, like, you
know, my dad was very present. Although you know, divorce is never
the best thing in the world becauseI still remember when my father said he
(03:46):
was leaving the house, and Ido think that that's part of the reason
my husband. My husband comes from, you know, a kind of,
as they would say, broken homekind of thing too. So I think
that that is part of the reasonwe kind of made this decision that we
were going to push through. Andwe've been able to stay married because,
you know, sometimes it kind offollows that your parents were divorced, you
(04:10):
get divorced, and we've you know, knock on wood that way. But
we've been together twenty six years now, so that's great. I think about
how I was raised. I thinkit's I'm pretty close to the same mother
that I had, although I grewup in a time where people were spanked,
(04:31):
and you know, I don't.We don't do that with our children,
and I think it's worked well forus. What were your parents' expectations
of you? I mean, howhow did they convey these two your your
fathers are working with the University ofChicago. You're in a university town,
you went to the lab school.Did they have high expectations for you academically?
(04:54):
I mean, and how did theyconvey them to you? Yes?
Obviously things were expected of me.You know, they're spending a lot of
money on my education. Although again, like I said, I was not
at that time. I was justnot the best student in the world.
I was, although I did maintaina certain grade point average because mostly because
(05:16):
I was an athlete at the time, you had to get a certain like
I had to get a certain gradepoint averature or I think that was the
main thing that kept me in line, is that I wanted to do the
things I wanted to do at school, and I had to do well enough
to stay there. And it's it'sweird because my mother also worked at Chicago
State University, so and they bothhave their masters. You know, you
(05:40):
would I would have thought they wouldbe more focused on really watching what I
was doing in school. But I'dhave to say that there was a more
laid back approach that I don't havewith my children. And I think,
you know, it's like the Ithink that because I think I needed a
heavier hand. I needed people watchingme a little more closely with my grades
(06:05):
rather than you know, of course, if you're called I was in trouble,
they you know, I was alwayson punishment about my grades. It
wasn't like they were ignoring me oranything. Although my children probably would say
I drive them crazy. You know, if you bring home a bee,
Now I'm like, okay, butI don't really understand this bee. I'm
(06:28):
expecting I'm you know, and I'mexpecting a four point four grade point average.
So but you know, sometimes wedo with our kids what we didn't
get from our parents, you know, or what we may have thought we
needed from our parents. Although somethingmust have worked because it's switched. As
I've gotten older and in what Ido now as a director producer, I
(06:56):
have become a great student and Ihave a great work. So something worked
out. Well, you know,it's funny. I was just having this
conversation with one of my children,who was the child that I definitely had
to lean on a lot to makesure that he understood our expectations and met
them. Because, as I'm surewas the case when you were growing up,
(07:19):
you could people could see the potentialin you, like I could see
the potential in my son, butthey, for whatever reason, he wasn't
meeting it as well as we'd haveliked. Fast forward, when he went
off to college, I was basicallylike, you're on your own now and
sounds like once you found something youreally wanted to focus on and study,
(07:40):
you went to it. I meansimilarly, he got to college and he's
like, oh, now I getto study what I want. I'm good.
So you hope that you do enough. With my daughter at Spelman this
year, I don't feel like Ihave to micromanage that in any way.
I think she knows what she needsto do to study, and you know
(08:00):
it's her. She's only had herfirst semester and she knows what classes that
aren't her favorite, but she's stilldoing what she needs to do. So
I feel very comfortable that she isself sufficient and I've done what I was
supposed to do, although I dostill call and go how's it going?
You know, all three of minehave gone through college now, and yeah,
(08:22):
I'm with you one hundred percent.So just I want to back up
a minute, ask a couple ofquestions, like, just out of curiosity,
what was your sport that you weredoing in high school? I was
on the basketball team, love,but I was also on the tennis team
for a while. But basketball waslike I played from you know, like
sixth grade, our same team basicallybecause lab went from nursery school through high
(08:46):
school. So but by sixth gradewe had all been playing together for years.
I think we landed undefeated, andbut yeah, absolutely loved it.
It's part of the reason I didn'tdo as much theater because it would bump
up against my basketball schedule and Ihadn't really found that that was going to
be where I was going. ButI also my basketball. I really take
(09:09):
that into work. I'm a verycompetitive person and it's part of my work
epic honestly, to be like thebest at what I'm doing and one to
win and like be two evers coming, you know, after me, So
it's worth you know. I've hadsome conversations with other guests, one in
(09:31):
particular teacher who was an athlete,and she talked a lot about how sports
really helped her process learning in thatin sports, every competition, somebody wins,
somebody loses, and you're going tolose. I mean there's no sport
where you win every single time inyour entire life. And as soon as
(09:52):
you lose, you get together andyou figure out what you did wrong and
how you can do better the nexttime. And we it was kind of
a lie. H Bulb went offwhen I was listening to her. I
did not participate in sports as achild. I danced and did other stuff.
But that lesson of sports where youtake the loss. You don't like
it, but you take it,and you don't take it. You don't
(10:13):
go home and cry and curl upin a ball. You take it and
you figure out what's the next thing. I mean, that's so valuable if
we could, if we could sortof shift that over to learning, Like
if you fail something, it's notyou, there's something wrong with you,
it's just that you know. Youneed to figure out what's wrong and keep
going. So I know I've readthat you are a product of an interracial
(10:35):
marriage and that your father's white,your mom is African American. Can you
talk a little bit about how yourparents talk to you about identity and whether
there was any kind of tension atall with respect to your perspective on your
identity. That's such a funny thingfor me. I look back, and
my problem with the race and beingconfronted with it really happened as I got
(11:01):
older. I as a young kidgrowing up in Hyde Park. Luckily it
was a as far as you know, because Chicago can be very segregated,
but there was something about that Universityof Chicago area campus. There were a
lot of mixed marriages or you know, more than probably they were in the
country in this little area. Andalso I think something about being raised like
(11:28):
your mom being black, and mygrandmother lived with me and my uncle lived
with us for a while. Ijust know, I knew my father was
white and that is what it is, and I was with his white side
of the family when you know,we would go visit them. But I've
always felt very much black. Thatwas just my experience. That's just who
(11:52):
I knew I was. My motheris a black woman, so I was
a black woman. Were their timeis where people mentioned about my you know,
being light skin or something. Youknow, you always get that,
oh you think you're better than me, and I, you know, I
was just that kid, like Ihave no idea, no I you know,
it just it was just my reality. So I didn't And then as
(12:16):
I got older, you know,people say dumb stuff to you, like,
oh, what do you what's yournationality? I always knew I was
like black, and they're like what, but oh, but you speak so
well, but you're so pretty.There has to be something mixed. It's
like you even know what they're No, no, yeah, you you can't.
You can't be just black. You'vegot to be something else. But
(12:39):
I think that that is why Ieven held on more to my blackness,
because that was so ridiculous. Andlater on I've had to you know,
my father and I had to haveconversations because he didn't understand why why aren't
you but you are part white?Like it almost It was hurting him and
I had to sort of playing tohim, this is my reality in life,
(13:01):
walking through life. I'm a blackwoman because that's how people treat me.
That's just how I feel my mother, and it's nothing against him.
I love my white side, butI have to function through reality and through
my life. And me pretending orthat I am not the black woman that
(13:22):
people see me as or that Ifeel that I am, it's going to
cause me more harm than good.Do you have any siblings? I have
three brothers, both of you know, from half brothers from my parents getting
remarried. So I have a brotherfrom my mother's second marriage. She looks
very much like me, and thenmy and then I have two white brothers,
(13:45):
you know, Mayr Chad and Johnwhen I tell people these are my
brothers and go okay, okay,So fast forward you and you've already started
to talk about this. You're youhave a baby, you have your daughter.
When your daughter was born, didyou have a sense of what your
parenting style would be? I mean, did you feel as if you were
(14:07):
going to parent away from the waythat you've been parented to some degree or
towards it, or did you comewith fully formed notions as to how we
were going to parent her through life. I don't. I don't think I
came with a fully formed notion.I think that like most others, we
just sort of roll with it.But I did know my husband and I
(14:28):
did discuss that we would not belike doing corporal punishment, like there would
be no spanking. And I thinkthat you know, that was important to
us. And tell me a littlebit about how that worked out. I
mean, I didn't. We didn'tdeclare it, but we ended up really
not doing it much. But butI was certainly spanked as a child.
(14:52):
Do you were you spanked as achild? Absolutely, both of my you
know, yes, yeah, bothof my my husband and I we were
and I think, you know,and that's nothing against that was during that
time period of life, and Idon't think it's the best method I've been
able to instill enough fear in themwithout touching them. Then I just didn't
(15:15):
feel like it was necessary. AndI think that and maybe it's I wasn't.
You know. My mother was ayoung mother. You know, people
got married very young. I wasan older mom, and I just felt
that when I had that little babyin my arms, there was no way
that I could hurt her in thatway and touch her in that way.
(15:37):
And that did mean that you don'tget on, you know, on punishment
and things taken away from you,and all of that seems to have worked,
because you know, I love mytwo is now and I go everybody
seems to be okay and on theirway and nice people, expectful people.
So I just didn't think it wasand sout that I also, you know,
(16:00):
when I think about I wanted tobe very present with my kids.
I also, you know, Idon't think my mother is the most huggy,
huggy kissy person when I look back. You know, my mother and
I are very good friends, butwe don't necessarily talk all the time.
(16:21):
My daughter now at college that's somethingI wanted to be a little different.
You know, my daughter and Italk every single day, and it's something
I've wanted both of my parents.And it's not that we're not close.
You know, I love my parents. I love talking to them, but
I find that we don't talk alot, and I wanted to really want
(16:41):
to change that with my children.Uh just watched her a different relationship,
you know. I think it's reallyimportant that you do talk with her,
and some it's so easy to dothat. Now. My youngest lives in
Japan, and people say, oh, my goodness, how is he doing?
And I can tell you because wetalk all the time thanks to FaceTime
(17:03):
and texting. I mean, itis very comforting to be able to just
lay eyes on or just hear yourchild's voice, even if it's just for
a few minutes. Thanks to moderntechnology, the connecting, the ability to
connect even when they're far away.But I think that a lot of my
parents is great. Well is differentfor my mother's only because it's also a
different time. You know, whenI grew up, you didn't, you
(17:26):
know. There are many things thatI talked to my daughter about that my
mother didn't necessarily have some of thoseconversations with me, but that's nothing against
her parenting. During that time,you didn't maybe talk about these things,
you know, you didn't talk aboutdating men and drugs as much. It
wasn't as open as it is now. And my daughter and I, I
(17:49):
really we have and hopefully with myson too, But it's you know,
that's dad seems to be getting alittle closer now that he's you know,
in those teenage years. But mydaughter really feels she comes to me about
everything, and especially at this agein nineteen, I always say, you
(18:10):
can come to me about everything.That doesn't mean that I'm not going to
be disappointed for a moment about something, but I would like ill still have
give you my honest opinion, hopefullywithout judgment, and give you the advice
that you need. A lot oftimes I give you my advice. This
is what I would do, thisis what I encourage you to do.
(18:33):
But you have to make your owndecision. And I think that's why she's
will to talk to me. That'sreally great. My oldest is in her
early thirties, and I tell youit's a wonderful challenge to parent older children
because the older they get two thingshappen. They are very independently minded,
and they focus, they look atthings through their own perspective. And then
(18:56):
I don't know about you, butI don't remember much about what I was
thinking when I was ten, butI remember pretty vividly what I was thinking
about when I would say twenty eight. I mean, it sounds really good
the way that you say to yourdaughter, here's what I would do.
You decide what you would do,and just keep hold on to that,
because sometimes it gets harder as theyget older not to say don't do that.
(19:17):
There's definitely times when I'm going listen, I was, I lived exactly
what you're going through right now.Please trust me that I know what I'm
telling you is right. Again,you have to do what you want to
do. But I'm telling you rightnow that if you just do what I'm
(19:41):
telling you to do, it's goingto work out better for you. But
what can you do? We'll beright back after these messages, Welcome back
to the show. I knew thatI wanted to talk to you about sort
of your life, your life asa working mom and raising your kids.
But as I began to look thewonderful thing about interviewing people who are public
(20:03):
figures is that you can find thingsabout them before you talk to them.
And I've discovered this amazing series ofvideos, and I discovered your husband's book
that he wrote, Mail to Men, I mean, about growing men out
and becoming a man. And he'sjust been so wonderfully eloquent about how he
(20:25):
wants to leave this legacy not onlyfor his own son, but for men
everywhere. And both of you talkvery candidly about your relationship growing over time,
and you're working together on it.And as I would hear you talk
in these conversations about moving through thepain and filling in love and compassion,
it struck me that while that isa wonderful prescription for a solid marriage,
(20:49):
it's also a really important approach forparenting. Because I don't know if you
have discovered this as much as Ihave, but when you are parenting your
child, you really it's so much. There is so much self reflection that's
necessary, I mean, in orderto present to them a solid parenting.
I mean, you have to.For example, if you did something when
(21:12):
you were growing up, not whatyour parents did, but something that you
did that you want to do differently, it's really important that you resolved all
that in yourself before you try totalk to your kids about it. So
the kind of work that you guyshave done on your relationship has that influence
or impacted the way that you parent. I think that everything for me is
(21:32):
just being honest with myself and honestwith my children, and always being willing
to apologize probably not the best apologizerto my husband, but with my kids,
because we can't be perfect and weare who we are and we respond
(21:56):
the way we respond, which sometimescan be hurtful to them. But I'm
always willing to come back in theroom and go, hey, I'm sorry,
shouldn't yelled that, you shouldn't haveresponded that way. And I just
feel like that's the best for me, that's the best approach. I don't
(22:18):
know if I've healed everything that aremy issues, but I know what my
issues are. You know, sometimesnot every I don't know. I may
be wrong. I don't think everythingis healable, but you can know what
the problems are and why you areresponding a certain way, and when I
(22:38):
respond that way, which is notmaybe the most appropriate, I can then
apologize for it and go yes,you're absolutely right. You're absolutely right.
I wasn't, and I'm okay.Like most of our I think we grew
up with our parents. They didn'tfeel like they needed to apologize to us
about anything, And you know,it's you know, you get that the
(23:00):
best I could, I did thebest I could, Like, yeah you
did, but your best may nothave been right all the time, and
it's okay to say, you knowwhat, I was wrong at that time,
or maybe, guess what, maybeit wasn't the best you could have
done. You know, there aretimes when we are selfish as just beings,
(23:25):
as a person, and we're selfishwith our children, and so maybe,
yeah, you're right, it wasn'tthe best I could do, and
I made that decision for myself sometimes. But I think being willing to be
wrong and apologizing for it goes along way with your children, you know,
I think that is so wise.People get very defensive about parenting because
(23:48):
there's no rule book and they feelas if they have to answer for the
way that they are. And ifyour ego is wrapped up in whatever you're
doing, you can't really step backand apologize, because you know you want
to be that mom that is alwaysright, or that dad that you know
doesn't get challenged. But it's somuch more effective if you can just take
a beat and say to your child, you know that I didn't do right
(24:12):
now. The interesting thing is youhave to you have to say that to
your child. What you don't wantyour child to expect that of you.
I mean every time that you reprimmandthem, they can't come back and say,
because guess what, sometimes I'm notI'm not sorry, and you in
trouble, right, but it wasn'tlike I didn't do it in an appropriate
(24:33):
way. You can still be introuble that I didn't need to curse you
out, you know what I mean? Right like? But you know you
know? And and then we haveto again, we have to accept the
things that My daughter and I literallywere just talking last night, and she's
expressed this before because she's starting toget a little interested in what I do
(24:59):
as a director. And I go, well, you've had all this time
to come sit on set with meand see what I do. And she
goes, I think that I wasa bit resentful of it and didn't want
to have anything to do with itfor a little while because it took you
away from me, and I thought, or I have been under this illusion
that I had balanced it better thanI think I must have for her,
(25:23):
and then it hurt her when,especially when I started directing. Once I
started directing, I was gone alot because it took me out of the
country for long spans of time,like it feels like there was a few
years. I was definitely gone allthe time, you know, I was
balancing back and forth. And Ithought that it didn't affect them as much
(25:49):
as or at least her. Myson hasn't talked about it too much.
I think I've been home a littlebit more lately with him. But last
night I was going, I amso sorry. I thought I thought you
were okay, and it's not.I don't know if I would have done
it differently. You know, Istill listen to what I do. I
(26:11):
want her to know you're supposed todo it. You know, you want
to find the things that you lovetoo as a person, And unfortunately that
took me away from home. Butthen I go, I did something right,
because you're okay. You know,it seems like she's going to be
She's very strong, confident, notthat she hasn't ever insecurities. But you
(26:32):
know, yeah, it makes mesad that like she missed me being there
all the time. But what canyou you know, I can't. I
had to like the bills to bepaid, and there's stuff to have,
and I don't know what to do, you know, right, And you
were pursuing a passion that helped you. It motivated you and lifted your spirit.
(26:52):
I mean it wasn't just your working. You were doing something that you
really wanted to do. So Iwill tell you that that's I can tell
you the same version of that story, but the total opposite. I did
a lot of nonprofit work, butI fundamentally spent a lot of time at
home with my kids. Surprisingly considering, I thought I would have this different
career, but I ended up spendinga lot of time with them and the
last one. So there's a sevenyear gap between the oldest and the last
(27:17):
one, and so by the lastone, I was kind of done with
the whole. I mean it wasa lot and I think they get a
different parent. Yeah, right,exactly. And I remember that when he
was in either kindergarten or first grade, I missed library reading. I was
supposed to come and read the bookat library and I didn't show up.
(27:40):
I didn't have a good excuse exceptit fell off my calendar and I was
doing something else. But it wasone of those classic horrible situations where everybody's
waiting and you know, the mom'snot showing up and so, and I
never showed up. He's twenty fournow. I still hear and I know
I mean, and we joke aboutit, but I know I heard him
from and I really wanted to say, look, you understand, I am
(28:03):
here so much that this is notsupposed to make you feel this way,
because you know I do so much. But that thing, I mean,
that's the thing that he remembers,and I get it because it was it
was a sad moment that he thoughthis mother had abandoned him. But they
hang on to those things, likemy daughter. You know, it's like,
oh, and Dre came, youwere all with him. I'm like,
yeah, but you're what you're notremembering is that, you know,
(28:27):
there's a four year difference. Inursed my daughter for more than two years,
and she would never take a bottle. So that's tell you that I
wore that kid on me. Sheco slept with me, So she slept
with me with the first for you, I mean like she was on me,
(28:49):
and I'm like, you don't reallyremember how much you were with your
mother. But of course that's whyI felt like she hadn't enough baby for
me to be gone. But absolutely, you know, it's hey, nobody
can do it completely right, No, And being a stay at home mom
is fantastic. But at the sametime, I'm happy that my daughter knows
(29:14):
that she can have a career too. It's so complicated. It's very complicated.
I mean I was doing things,but I was not working, and
I worried that my daughter was nothaving the role model. I mean,
I'm an attorney and I wasn't practicing, and I was worried that she would
think that her role. Her rolewas to sort of grow up and get
(29:36):
married and have children and that waspretty much. And so sometime in high
school, I said, you know, it's really important that you understand that
women work really hard outside the home. And I really hope that you're not
looking at me and saying, youknow, this is what women do and
that you're you're aspiring to do this. And she said, I don't know
(29:57):
how this is going to sound Iactually don't think much about what you're doing
when I'm trying to figure out whati want to do. And I said,
okay, I've won. I guessthat's the right answer. Although you
know, my daughter is always likeone. She wants to be married and
she wants to have children, andshe would like not to be working when
(30:22):
she has her kids, you know, or at least made to be home
for a little while. So Idon't know, I just encourage her.
I go with and you know,make sure who you marry, and you
know, you grow together enough sothat when it is time for you to
have your children, you can't takethat time off if you want to.
(30:45):
We have so many dreams for ourchildren, right. I just I'm like,
okay, my career, because younever know what's going to happen in
life, and that you may haveto take care of yourself and leave you
and then you've been at home allthese years and now you have no work
to get how do you do?Like? So you got to make sure.
But that's my you know, thatis me coming from a divorced mother
(31:07):
who had to take care of herself. I could have probably laid back a
bit and let my husband take careof things more. But I always had
that fear of not like being strandedon my own, so I always had
to work. And so I'm like, okay, just be careful, you
to do both. So you know, I definitely am reacting a little bit
from how I was raised. Sosome degree, you really think that you're
(31:30):
such a strong influence, and youfind out that you're an influence, but
not quite as strong as you thought. So, but I think as strong.
I I look at my mother,and now at this age, I
feel my mother and me a lotmore. As I've gotten older, I
can hear things come out of mymouth that sound like my mother. I
look at my daughter, although we'redifferent, she's very much me and I
(31:59):
the same. Although I didn't seemto have the work ethic when I was
younger, I do have my mother'swork ethic now. And I see my
daughter growing into me too, SoI think we I think you have more
of influenced Carol than you're giving yourselfcredit for. Maybe, so she's doing
(32:20):
great, So I'd love to takesome credit. Take credit for it.
Now, tell me a little bitabout your travels. I mean, how
did it work? Just the management. I've always interested about how people manage
very busy lives of a lot oftravel. How did you manage spending time
out of the country. I mean, obviously you have a good partnership with
your husband. Did you guys tagteam on hanging out with the kids somehow
(32:45):
or another. It kind of organicallyworked out that when I had to be
gone for you know, a fewmonths or something, that like it would
fall sometime during the summer, orit fell a little bit over the holidays,
(33:07):
or he happened to not be workingat that time when I had to
go, and when I came backand he needed to go out of town,
I just happened to be home.I was also very lucky that I
had my cousin who worked for usat the time. If both of us
had to be gone, she washere, and I felt very comfortable with
(33:30):
her because she's a family member andshe loves my kids. You know,
I think Kimmy, my cousin,Kimmy saved us a lot. And then
my mom would come in town andfor some reason, like we were really
going to both be gone for along time, but a lot of the
times, for some reason, myhusband just happened to have that free time
(33:51):
when I was gone. And Ido think that looking back, Andre made
some big sacrifices for me in jobsthat he didn't accept because he saw what
was happening with my directing and howthings were changing for me, and things
were growing so rapidly that he kindof took the back seat and let me
(34:15):
do what I needed to do togrow. Wow, that's great. So
I want to wrap up this partby asking you a question I love to
ask very successful working people, andthat is what about parenting has made you
a better director? And what aboutdirecting has made you a better parent?
(34:35):
Listen? They at work, I'mdefinitely I can be boss lady and I
can be mom. You know,probably sometimes a little too much mom on
set, but I think that youknow, I use my micromanaging skills both
at home and both as directing.I think that, you know, directing
(35:00):
has helped me more as a personand probably as a mom at home,
just because I found this, trulyfound this inner strength and grew so much
by becoming a director and just sortof finding myself through that. And I
think that that confidence can only begood for my children. So I think
(35:22):
those are the similar things. Andwhen I have younger actors and you know,
and it's on set, I definitelydo probably feel like mom to them.
And I'm sure that when people aren'tdoing wrong, they're like, why
is this woman talking to me like, you know, like a mother,
(35:43):
going that is exactly that, Thatis not what I told you, And
I told you this five times.And I'm sure they're sick hearing me talk
like that. But then you cango back to them and say I'm sorry.
They don't get as sorry at work, only only I think that what
(36:07):
my husband sometimes me being ahead ofeverything at work actually causes more conflict when
I get home because I'm used totelling you what needs to be done and
you're doing it. There are noquestions, there's no I didn't have time,
There's just this is it's a dictatorshipmore and coming home I can be
(36:31):
very much that same person I askedto do this? Are you going to
do this? And I'm noting andsending things? Can you make sure this
is done? And there are timesmy husband is like, yeah, I'm
not your assistant. You know.I have to relax a little bit when
I get home. So I saidthat was a last, But I have
one quick follow up, not tothat, but a slightly different question about
(36:54):
raising kids in Hollywood. Your childrenseem your daughter's off at spell then they
seem lovely and grounded. How toughwas it to kind of instill values,
family values when you're in the sortof glitz and glamour of Hollywood. You
know what, it hasn't been abig deal in our house. We don't
(37:15):
walk through life like that ourselves.You know, most of our friends may
be in the business, but likewe're just kind of regular people. I'm
not a big go to every event. I'm not getting every you know.
I think that if I was moreon the scene, it would be a
(37:38):
thing. She's gone to the youknow, she's been going to schools with
the kids of all these famous people, and it's not a big deal to
her. It's kind of how shegrew up with these same people. And
I mean, I think you arewho your parents are. It doesn't impress
her absolutely, And again she seesthat mom is not doing the most.
(38:01):
So it's not I don't know,it hasn't been. I really think it's.
My husband's from New York, I'mfrom Chicago. I'm very much who
you see here, and that's whomy kids are. It's not they're very
grounded, they're very nice, kindkids. And nobody's doing anything. I
(38:22):
always say, you're not doing anythingweird. You're just kind of normal kids.
I mean, raising normal normal inthe air quotes kids these days is
a blessing. When I say normal, you know, it's just no,
no, I know what you meannormal because you're a nice person, Like
you're not right, like there's nothingand knock on, would like I just
(38:45):
go, okay, thank god,we're not having to deal with, you
know, certain things, like bigproblems. We've been able so far avoid
huge problems in the teenage. Youof course, my son is you know,
it's just freshman year in high school. We still got to get him
through, you know, graduate.But he you know, I don't know,
(39:07):
they've blistened enough, and they seemto have good value, you know.
M h Well, I mean,like you said, children are reflection
of their parents. So kudos toyou guys for doing the work. And
Sally, I'm so happy to hearthis. I had imagined all these questions.
(39:28):
I sort of figured I knew someof the answers, and you have
just validated all that I have seenabout how grounded you are and how impressive
it is to watch you make thispivot into this world in which you are
shining so brightly. So thank youso much, Thank you so much for
joining me, and good luck withyour daughter in her freshman year. And
(39:50):
how impressive that, by the way, that she's at Spelman, because that
sisterhood is unrivaled from what I understand, So she's in good hands. Yes,
and we were very excited. SoI'm going to wrap it up here.
Thank you so much, but Ihave to ask you to play the
GCP Lightning Round four quick questions,and the first one is do you have
a favorite poem or saying something thatyou'd like to say a lot? I
(40:14):
pretty much, you know, withmy kids and in life, I always
say to be brave, Just bebrave. I talk to my children about
that a lot, and a lotof you know about being brave is that
you may be fearful of what you'regoing into. You may fear that you
(40:35):
don't know how to do it,or it's new, or it's uncomfortable,
and you just have to push throughit. And that doesn't mean you're not
going to have the fear. Butyou have to be you have to be
brave in life to make mistakes tosucceed. Bravery is very important. Oh
that's so good. Be brave,simple and good. Okay, children's books,
(40:58):
if you can remember any either thattwo favorite ones, either you remember
growing up reading, or any thatyour children liked in particular. Okay,
I'm gonna tell you too from me, And they're going to be the oddest
things in the world. So,growing up, for some reason, I
had the hardest time really learning howto read, just struggle, and then
(41:20):
once I did, like all ofa sudden, I passed everybody I So
I used to read Green Eggs andHam at some point was like the only
book I could read. It wasthe weirdest thing, and I would just
read it over and over and over. I have no idea, like why
that was the book. And thenI had this obsession later on with Cinderella.
(41:42):
And I don't know if it wasturmoil in my life growing up and
wanting to be saved or saved bysome handsome prince, but I was obsessed
with Cinderella. I'd write my ownCinderella books, I had my barbies,
I'd play Cinderella. I don't know. It was a very odd fascination that
I had with the Cinderella story.So those are very two different books.
(42:07):
I have no idea why, butthere you go. No, but I
like the Cinderella fascination because ultimately yourescued yourself. So yeah, and so
tell me about a mom moment.And you may have already when you said
you're willing to apologize but and do. But is there any mom moment that
(42:29):
you can think of that you justlove to do over. I mean,
I can tell you I wished Ihad made that library meeting with my son,
but that I would love to doover. I don't know. I
think that I missed my daughter's eighthgrade graduation because I was I was out
(42:50):
of the country working. But whenI think about big moments, that's the
only one that I wasn't in townfor. But I don't know, no
complete redos, but that would beone I definitely missed. I've always been
able to be lucky to get backin time to get you the direct.
Okay, we're going to go shoppingfor homecoming and prom Okay, mom's going
(43:13):
to be home for that. I'vealready let him know at work, so
it's been I've been there for mostof the stuff. Good good, And
So to wrap it up, what'sa moment you knew you nailed it as
a mom, you just got itright? Oh, I nailed it?
Huh Oh gosh. I think Idon't think it's a moment, but I
(43:35):
do think that right now where mydaughter is and I know I'm talking a
lot about my daughter, I thinkI'm just kind of engrossed in her life
right now because knowledge, I thinkthat like just kind of now what's going
on in her life. I've kindof nailed it a good place for our
communication. And then when I thinkabout my son general, I feel like
(44:00):
I've nailed it with him because whenmy son gets up in the morning before
he leaves, when he comes inthe door, he always comes straight to
me and gives me the biggest hugand kiss and I love you, Mom.
If I'm washing dishes or cooking,he comes behind me and hugs me
(44:23):
and kisses me on the back ofmy head. When we're out with his
friends, he still comes and givesme a big hug and a kiss.
He's just so loving and just loveshis mom, and it just makes me
so happy. That is that's agreat answer. And as the mother of
two boys, both of whom haveno trouble in their twenties giving me the
(44:47):
biggest hug ever in front of theirfriends, I know that feels really good.
And they did that through their teenageyears. Yes, that is nailing
it because there's so many parents thathave the separation in teen world, but
it's very nice when it doesn't haveto happen. So that was a great
answer. Sally. Thank you somuch for being with us today. I
(45:07):
really appreciate it. It's been greatfun and wonderful to see you. Okay,
thank you for having me. Ihope everyone listening enjoyed this conversation that
you'll come back for more. Pleasesubscribe, rate, and review where you
find your podcasts and tell your friends. For more parenting info and advice,
please check out the ground Control Parentingwebsite at wwwgroundcontrolparenting dot com. You can
(45:30):
also find us on Facebook and Instagramat ground Control Parenting and on LinkedIn under
Carol Sutton Lewis. Until the nexttime, take care and thanks for listening.
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