October 23, 2025 • 41 mins
What happens when you weaken a tumor’s favorite fuel and time chemotherapy to hit at its most vulnerable moment? We sit down at the Anti-Cancer Institute with Dr. Robert Hoffman and Chihiro Hozumi to unpack a practical, evidence-backed model combining a low-methionine diet, methioninase, and standard chemo for aggressive, recurrent breast cancer. Chihiro’s story begins with invasive lobular carcinoma—hard to detect, quick to spread—and a recurrence so deep and wide that surgery seemed off the table. Her turnaround came from aligning treatment with biology: strict methionine restriction, enzymatic depletion using methioninase, and a carefully chosen chemo plan that delivered roughly 95% tumor reduction in three months.
We explore why methionine addiction is a real metabolic choke point in many cancers, how reducing this essential amino acid can make tumors less resilient, and why adding methioninase compounds the effect. Dr. Hoffman explains the science and the standards he expects: published data, mechanisms, and reproducibility. Chihiro shares the human side—the early missteps with protein-rich foods, the fear while waiting for chemo to start, and the discipline that followed. After response, the plan didn’t stop: she stayed on a low-methionine diet, continued methioninase, and moved to maintenance with a targeted cell-cycle inhibitor and close PET surveillance.
Access and culture matter too. Japan now leads in integrating methionine restriction into oncology practice, with supportive clinicians, advanced imaging like Met-PET, and a growing patient cohort. That ecosystem, paired with rigorous documentation, points to a repeatable paradigm: starve the tumor’s metabolic crutch, strike with chemo for maximum synergy, and maintain pressure to keep recurrence at bay. It’s not a silver bullet; it’s a disciplined, data-driven strategy that patients can actually follow.
If this conversation helps you rethink your plan—or offers hope where options feel thin—share it with someone who needs it. Subscribe for more evidence-based stories, leave a review to help others find us, and tell us: what’s the one change you’re ready to make today?
Intro for podcast
information about subscriptions
Here is the link for Sunday's 4 pm Pacific time Zoom meeting
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_01 (00:03):
Okay.
Well, hello, and welcome back tothe Healthy Living Podcast.
I'm your host, Joe Grumbine, andI have with me a couple of very
special guests.
And I'm actually recording thisfrom the Anti-Cancer Institute
in San Diego with Dr.
Robert Hoffman and ShihiroAzumi.
(00:25):
All right, I get your last nameright.
Wonderful.
Shahiro's in from Japan.
Um, I just got back from anotherappointment with Dr.
Song, and I thought, wow, thisis a perfect uh uh opportunity
to sit and have a conversation.
And Shahiro, I really want totalk to you a bit because you
know you are a big part of allof this.
(00:47):
And you know, when we have ourSunday calls, uh, you know,
you're the one coordinating thisall the way from Japan.
SPEAKER_03 (00:53):
Right, right.
SPEAKER_01 (00:54):
And so we got big time zone differences, language
issues, we got all these things,and yet we we make this
beautiful call happen.
And you're one of the key uhelements of this group and your
story.
Um, you're overcoming cancer,using the low methionine diet,
methionine is um, and and andgoing from you being told you
(01:18):
had to have radical surgery toyou don't have a tumor anymore.
SPEAKER_03 (01:25):
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (01:25):
Um what a beautiful story, and uh it really helps
those of us who are trying toget a word out and and and share
with people when we havemultiple points of view,
multiple stories, multipleexperiences, but certain things
in common that really makes thisa powerful message.
And then, of course, we gotRobert Hoffman here who you know
(01:47):
is instrumental in uh not onlythe discovery of cancer's
addiction to methionine, um, andand and creating methionine A's,
making it available to peoplewho need it, starting the
anti-cancer institute and andand working relentlessly for you
know most of your life on thiswork.
It's like, and we're all sittinghere together in the same room.
(02:09):
I just am excited.
Robert, how are you doing today?
SPEAKER_02 (02:13):
I'm doing I'm doing good, Joe.
Um happy to have thisdiscussion.
SPEAKER_01 (02:17):
Yeah, me too.
It's um, you know, we we it'sfunny because sometimes I I go
back and I listen to episodesand I think it sounds like I'm
kind of repeating myself.
But you know, each time we delveinto another little slice of
this, another nuance, anotherangle.
And you're right, it's a drumbeat.
Like it's a drum beat.
The thing is, like, if you don'trepeat yourself in the world
(02:40):
anymore, you just get passedright on by.
But if you can repeat yourselfin a way that is genuine, um
heartfelt, uh uh emphatic, umaccurate, you know, Robert, you
hold us to a high standard, youknow.
(03:01):
It's like a lot of times peoplewant to say things because they
saw something or they feltsomething or they read
something, and and we we we saythings as though they're true
because we think they're true orwe want them to be true.
SPEAKER_03 (03:14):
Right, right.
SPEAKER_01 (03:15):
But Robert comes back and he goes, show me the
evidence, right?
Show me the paper.
I want to see this, I want tosee who found it, how did they
find it, what were they lookingfor, who paid them?
Um, you know, what how do theydo their work?
You know, let's let's evaluatethis, not just I noticed a thing
and there are this is what itwas.
(03:37):
And I think that's huge becauseI know a lot of doctors, even
who are adamant about their workand they're they're passionate
about these things they do, butyou know, they're working off of
anecdotal evidence like most ofus, you know, when we're
experiencing things, and thenthey make a statement as though
maybe they have more evidencethan they do, and then people
(03:59):
go, Oh, I heard this from thisguy, and so I believe it, and so
I do it.
And maybe they put themselves ata risk that is unwarranted, or
maybe they don't do a thing thatthey should do because it is
warranted.
And uh Shahiro, I'd like tolearn a little bit more about
you.
Um, you know, I you're on everymeeting, um, you organize these
(04:22):
things, you you I know yourbackstory.
Why don't you share briefly withthe listeners your backstory?
SPEAKER_00 (04:29):
Sure.
Um uh my can I I'm a coun cancerpatient.
Right.
And then uh I don't know whichyear, you know, I haven't 2018.
I had a uh mastectomy of the uhleft left uh breast because my
cancer was detected by uh Japanhealth check, like an ERE health
(04:52):
check.
And then all of a sudden my uhresult says you gotta go to see
a breast surgeon.
And then I went there and then,oh my god, you know, I have a
cancer.
Right.
And I contacted the uh Dr.
Hoffman.
I I had a cancer.
SPEAKER_01 (05:09):
How did you know Dr.
Hoffman?
SPEAKER_00 (05:11):
Uh before that, I have been helping him.
SPEAKER_01 (05:14):
Oh okay.
SPEAKER_00 (05:15):
Mm-hmm.
Yes.
SPEAKER_01 (05:16):
So you guys had a had uh a work.
SPEAKER_00 (05:19):
Yes, already jobs.
SPEAKER_01 (05:21):
But I was fortunate for you.
SPEAKER_00 (05:22):
Right, right.
SPEAKER_01 (05:25):
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (05:26):
Then he has uh uh so many uh uh uh uh conference,
like a cancer conference.
He's been attending it.
He has a lot of uh uh surgeon,doctor, council doctor.
He knows so many high-rank youknow doctors in Japan.
He picked uh most uh great uh uhbreast cancer uh doctor.
(05:51):
Uh that's uh Japan uh cancercenter, cancer main center.
SPEAKER_01 (05:59):
He's a connected guy.
SPEAKER_00 (06:00):
Right, and he's a chief called the breast surgeon.
Okay, and uh when he saw that,okay, I gotta do your surgery.
And uh uh when I uh uh inhospitalized only 10 days I got
a surgery.
Wow, and then that time mycancer type is ILC.
SPEAKER_03 (06:18):
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (06:19):
Uh invasive lobular uh carcinoma.
Okay, that doesn't make the uhlamp.
Okay, it's like a gradual it'sspread under the skin.
Okay, so very difficult todetect.
Yeah, so when my cancer is uhconsiderably considerably rare
cancer, okay, uh among thebreast cancer, and then that's
(06:43):
why it's very uh difficult todetect because it doesn't make a
right, it doesn't do what minedid come on this way, it just
kind of spreads like a slimemold.
Yeah, so slime mold.
Yeah, that that's why I thedoctor at the I mean Tsuki, I
mean Japan cancer center at themain hospital says uh looks like
(07:06):
that your diameter is a fourcentimeter, but after the
surgery, they said diameter waseight centimeters.
You know, cancer was spread it.
So uh I took the micaseptomy,right?
Then I didn't do the uh chemoafter that.
SPEAKER_03 (07:22):
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (07:22):
Uh I then I had a uh hormone broker for three years.
And every year I went to acheck, Yarry checked, mm-hmm and
checked, and checked the 30year.
SPEAKER_01 (07:37):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (07:37):
Uh the my doctor's.
SPEAKER_01 (07:39):
They had markers that you were able to do.
Right, right.
SPEAKER_00 (07:42):
And then marker was like a normal range and the MR
uh C T contrast CT, no problem.
You know, 30 year, he said, Oh,Miss Ozuni, congratulations, you
have no cancer.
Came back.
Okay, right.
But uh, you know, uh, I havesome kind of uh irritation, my
(08:04):
uh under the armhole.
SPEAKER_04 (08:06):
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (08:06):
And then he said, Oh, yeah, let me let me take the
uh some tissue out.
Yeah, then the result came, ohsorry, you had uh cancer.
SPEAKER_01 (08:17):
Oh shit.
Oh what a nightmare, right?
You're good, you're good.
Nope, you're not good.
SPEAKER_00 (08:23):
Then I was I was kind of shocked.
Yeah, cried and called Dr.
Hogman.
Yeah, and then right there, youknow, you gotta be matching
restricted to diet.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
And then I uh started and thenafter that, I mean uh up eight
uh 2018, I took uh uh all of mycancer out.
SPEAKER_03 (08:47):
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (08:48):
So Dr.
Hogman told me, being tellingme, you gotta be restricted to
Matron in food, Metronin food,don't eat the Metonian food.
But I didn't, I never listenedthere.
Right, most people don't knowbecause I took it.
Yeah, yeah.
That's like, you know, Joe,unbelievable.
I was so regret.
SPEAKER_01 (09:08):
Yeah, of course.
SPEAKER_00 (09:10):
I eat the eggs, I was taking it and then eat.
SPEAKER_01 (09:13):
I eat sardines every day.
SPEAKER_00 (09:15):
Yeah, then uh lunch, you know, like a hamburger,
sushi, you know, like the Koreanbarbecue.
Yeah, three years, normal food Iate.
Then the result of that, uh mycancer was really deep and big
and spread.
And doctors said, I'm not ableto do a surgery because too deep
(09:35):
and too wide, otherwise I can'ttake all your meat out, tissue
out.
Yeah, so I have to do a chemo.
Same chemo.
Just like choke.
SPEAKER_01 (09:46):
Yeah, just like choke.
Actually, chemo, right?
Yeah, then uh but shrink it downand then go after it.
Yeah, yeah.
That's what they were gonna dofrom me.
SPEAKER_00 (09:54):
That that that time I was like hoping uh I got the
chemo, then I uh transferred myuh hospital from main, main, I
mean Tokyo downtown hospital touh near my living place.
And that's also Dr.
Hokman introduced me the newdoctor in our hospital, yeah.
(10:17):
Okay, and then now he's seeingme and he is a very, very nice
doctor, too.
SPEAKER_01 (10:22):
Yeah, and then uh listen to you.
SPEAKER_00 (10:25):
Right.
Then you know I learned a lot ofthings because uh December 28th,
I had a cancer found outsentence from the doctor.
SPEAKER_03 (10:37):
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (10:37):
I got a cancer, right?
SPEAKER_03 (10:39):
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (10:40):
Then uh I started a very, very, very strict material
restricted diet.
SPEAKER_03 (10:47):
Uh huh.
SPEAKER_00 (10:47):
I don't eat anything, you know, other than
cabbages, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Or Chinese cabbages, you know,something like that.
Almost like a two.
Then unfortunately, my chemoonly started, uh, was able to
start March 27th.
SPEAKER_03 (11:03):
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (11:04):
That means January, February, almost like a March.
I have no nothing.
I was so scared because mycancer is spreading.
And it starts moving fast andthen starts to grow.
It's crazy.
So I have to depend on themethane.
Right.
Oh, and right away, you know,like January, uh, I I I get the
(11:24):
methanease from the Dr.
Hogman and a very strictmetalinum restricted diet.
Right.
Then finally, my uh chemo startsMarch 27th, and I have a
picture, and then uh I share toeverybody.
Okay.
And then there was a huge likeuh meatball, you know, like a
(11:45):
well and deep, and it comes intomy uh neck, you know, ring
float, something like that.
Then after the uh March 27started, like a Dr.
Ruby scene, Adrian scene, threemonths, and then a doctor said,
Okay, let's take a look at thehow your cancer and a drug, I
mean chemo is working.
And then he took uh uh CT.
SPEAKER_03 (12:08):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (12:09):
90, I should say 95% gone.
SPEAKER_03 (12:12):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (12:13):
Unbelievable.
SPEAKER_03 (12:14):
Yeah, unbelievable.
SPEAKER_00 (12:15):
Just like mine, yeah.
You know, gone.
Yeah, only three months.
Right.
Chemo, and I read, I have a uhbenefit of the I can access to
uh lots of uh Dr.
Hoffmann's paper.
SPEAKER_01 (12:28):
Right, right.
Cancer and you're doing yourresearch and learning.
SPEAKER_00 (12:32):
And then uh one of his students uh had a uh I mean
paper regarding to a doxerrubicine and a methylase.
Okay, and then they have agraph, uh like a graph and
showing it if only doxorubicinethis much of the maybe I should
say 20 percent reduction of acancer to more drinkage, but uh
(12:57):
uh doxerubicine and a methanetogether, yeah, five times uh I
mean synergy effect.
SPEAKER_01 (13:05):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (13:07):
Oh this is a uh kind of science, yeah.
You know, oh my god, I was solucky I didn't know the
mechanism of the how it works,right?
But people don't know it, youknow, and then people I I had so
many Japanese cancer patientsbecause I'm kind of facilitating
(13:30):
the salonies, right?
Right, right.
And many uh Japanese cancerpatients who come to us and I
try to explain to a Metonianrestricted diet what yeah, I
can't I can't eat the protein,right?
Then everybody said everyeverybody said, Yeah, because
(13:52):
they thought I know they thoughtthey need to eat protein.
That's why everybody makes yoursystem makes your body happy,
right?
Yeah, I I have to get the uhenergy, my body gets stronger.
Yeah, that means I have to eatthe protein.
That's why uh I mean, uh one ofa lawyer who has uh colon cancer
(14:13):
spread it to the lung, you know,keeping eating and chicken,
chicken, chicken, chicken,chicken, chicken, everything.
SPEAKER_03 (14:20):
Exactly.
SPEAKER_00 (14:21):
Then all of a sudden, a couple months, all the
uh cancer got the power or theenergy power, right?
It spread.
Then it's really spreading it.
Right, those people come comingto us, then uh already almost
too late at that point.
SPEAKER_01 (14:37):
Yes, you know, you're right on the edge of just
like me.
I was right on the edge ofalmost too late.
SPEAKER_00 (14:42):
Yeah, too late because the chemo itself
couldn't really know more goodeffect in that kind of stage of
the case.
So that's that's why uh just alittle bit, you know.
I bring back my story to uh uhthree months later, uh Dr.
(15:04):
Rubicine, uh chemo almost likeuh my cancer goes almost like a
95%.
It's gone, I can't see itanymore.
SPEAKER_03 (15:12):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (15:13):
In a little bit I can see it.
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (15:15):
Kind of like me.
I got a little bit left over.
SPEAKER_00 (15:18):
Then another three months because Jap Japan uh
cancer chemotherapy is sixmonths.
SPEAKER_03 (15:23):
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (15:23):
Three months, Dr.
Rubisine Adrian, and uhDosetaxa.
Uh-huh.
Three uh then six months, and uhuh I have to uh I have to uh
talk to the senior breastsurgeon, and then uh I got the
PET scam, like FDG PET scan.
And still the senior breastsurgeon want to operate the
(15:47):
cars, that's surgery.
SPEAKER_01 (15:48):
They still want to do it.
That's like with me, theradiation.
They want to get on thecalories.
I'm like, what the heck?
SPEAKER_02 (15:54):
What's wrong with that?
They want to do right.
Understandable.
SPEAKER_00 (16:00):
You know, doctor, the first things what but uh I
didn't really say to him, but uhwow, that's oh, your case.
Uh chemo works so well.
You your cancer not reallyresponding to the chemo, uh
chemo, but uh your case was veryunusual, right?
SPEAKER_03 (16:18):
He says, uh huh.
SPEAKER_00 (16:19):
They also have to be true.
Then I didn't say anythingbecause you know I don't want to
dispute him or whatever.
I have extra, you know, right uhthings I care.
They don't hear anything.
So uh especially uh my ILC inbasically lobla carcinoma is a
(16:40):
very, very bad uh response to achemo.
Only uh less than 10 people outof 100.
SPEAKER_03 (16:46):
Wow.
SPEAKER_00 (16:47):
So he was really amazed.
Then I said, uh uh, I don't wantto open up the uh uh my body to
do it because I already had amastectomy, so I already had a
big you know surgery.
Yeah, yeah.
So uh I told uh a doctor, Dr.
Hobo, what should I do?
I don't want to do the surgery,but no, no cancer was detected
(17:10):
in a pack, but still my surgeonwanted to do it.
Then I he said he he gave me avery good uh uh warning.
Yeah, okay.
Tell him I would like to post apoem.
SPEAKER_01 (17:21):
Yeah, yeah, that's what I did.
I said the same thing, I got aspawn.
Let's just watch it for a while.
SPEAKER_00 (17:25):
Yeah, that's a good word.
SPEAKER_01 (17:27):
Yeah, that's just we're observing right now.
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (17:30):
And then young doctor, also one another young
doctor, that's my real doctor,says, you know, even you have a
surgery, cancer comes back.
SPEAKER_03 (17:39):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (17:40):
So that's that means if I can monitor very closely,
yeah uh uh in detail, probably Ican I don't need to do a
surgery.
Uh surgery couldn't do thecouldn't 100%, you know, because
of I know the cancer uh uhlittle little little little
(18:01):
micro cancer.
It comes back.
SPEAKER_01 (18:05):
Cancer in you anyways, right?
SPEAKER_00 (18:07):
So I decided, you know, to tell I postopone.
Then I didn't uh I was avoidingdoing uh my surgery.
SPEAKER_03 (18:16):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (18:16):
Then I spoke to my doctor, how my how are you gonna
do my surgery?
So okay, I have to capture likea 30 or 30 or 40 minutes, you
know, like uh under the arm andthe left side and open up
everything like a fish.
Oh then take the all the tissueout.
SPEAKER_01 (18:33):
Oh no, no, no, no, no, no.
SPEAKER_00 (18:35):
I was able to avoid surgery.
SPEAKER_01 (18:39):
Wow.
SPEAKER_00 (18:39):
Yeah, that's amazing.
That's why if we know themechanism of the cancer, right,
and then how uh chemo and uhmetoning restricted diet and the
methanease works, right?
So I was the one I really Dr.
Hoffman saved me.
Yeah, otherwise, I LC, if I stayon only chemo, right?
SPEAKER_01 (19:00):
You wouldn't have solved it the same way.
SPEAKER_00 (19:02):
And then my uh cancer has uh easy to uh go to
the brain, lung, yeah, and lymphnodes.
SPEAKER_01 (19:10):
Yeah, mine too.
It wants to do the same things,yeah.
It's easier, and it starts righthere.
It's like it's got an easy,yeah, right, easy way to go to
all those places.
It's like right there.
unknown (19:20):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (19:20):
So um let that happen.
SPEAKER_00 (19:23):
Right.
That's why I thought I have touh poke, I have to share how the
cancer works and how we canprevent or we can shrink
treatment.
SPEAKER_02 (19:37):
So why why don't you tell what happened then after
your chemo?
SPEAKER_00 (19:41):
After chemo?
SPEAKER_02 (19:42):
Yeah.
You went on your maintenancechemo.
SPEAKER_00 (19:45):
Yeah.
Then after that, uh this iscritical, in my opinion.
Yes, I think so.
Uh after that dollars to uh uhmy chemo was 2022.
Okay.
And today it was 2025, right?
Almost three years.
Yeah.
And I had a uh I mean uh FDGpest every six months or every
(20:10):
eight months, you know.
Then so far nothing was uhdetected in that machine.
SPEAKER_04 (20:15):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (20:16):
And then my doctor says, I am going to give you uh
the uh uh uh uh molecularinhibitor.
SPEAKER_03 (20:25):
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (20:25):
Uh that's uh uh kind of a uh new drug, but uh it I
can get it.
So I'm called targeted therapy.
SPEAKER_01 (20:34):
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (20:35):
Uh-huh.
SPEAKER_01 (20:35):
Kind of like an immunotherapy sort of thing.
SPEAKER_00 (20:38):
No, it's a hormone inhibitory targeting some
targeting of some kind ofenzymes, maybe important.
Okay, whatever, you know, cancercancer, cancer need of this
anything.
SPEAKER_02 (20:52):
It's not an okay, got it.
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (20:54):
And then I've been take taking a since uh chemo.
Since chemo, I'm taking uh themaintenance chemo that's uh
already taking uh just a pill,not having to get an infusion.
SPEAKER_02 (21:07):
You're gonna at some point gonna discuss with
doctors.
Oh absolutely.
SPEAKER_00 (21:11):
That's kind of that's inhibiting uh blocking uh
cycle uh S1 and G, whatever, youknow.
SPEAKER_03 (21:19):
We hope.
SPEAKER_00 (21:20):
Yeah, that that's the medication.
SPEAKER_01 (21:22):
It it's kind of uh I mean it's still on your infusion
cycle.
You're still on your diet, andyou're still on the methionase.
So essentially what's happeningin chemo.
Right.
So what happens is you got thesetumor cells or these the
potential for them, your geneticcode is already they're there.
(21:42):
Yeah, you've got these cellsthat are like if the environment
is right, they start growing.
Right.
But what we do is we come in andwe say, Okay, well, I see your
weakness.
You would need these pathwaysopen, you need these hormones to
activate the hormone, you needthis block within restriction,
(22:03):
take a molecular some sort ofmaintenance chemo that can be
almost any kind.
And that's an octa oxidativestress that says if they even
get started at all, it knocksthem back down.
So all of those things togethercreate this place where they
really, unless you mess up or itdrastically mutates and changes
(22:27):
the way it operates, which itdoesn't really have the ability
to do because it's not stronganymore.
SPEAKER_00 (22:34):
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (22:34):
Well, you know, I mean anything could happen, but
I mean that's right, Joe.
SPEAKER_00 (22:38):
I really think if you eat the methionine like a
protein a lot, you know, cancerwill come back very easily.
SPEAKER_01 (22:45):
And it wants to, yeah, very easy because looking
for that.
SPEAKER_00 (22:48):
That's a environment, right?
But the cancer environment isvery uh like like it to the
cancer, right?
Grow and copy the DNA, spread,you know, and and it learns
fast.
SPEAKER_01 (23:02):
So the second, if it comes back, it's gonna be ten
times harder to beat than it wasthat first time.
Well, it there's a good chanceof that, and and and so every
grain face it more that's thehardest thing for the patients,
I think, because that's wherethey recall when you go through
when you got a giant lumpsticking on your neck, you got
your attention, like you'll dowhatever it takes, but then all
(23:25):
of a sudden you start feelinggood, and your skin comes back
clean, and you're like, Well,you know, you know, I feel good,
and we'll just you know, it'sreally easy to forget, and I
think that that's a big part ofour message is you know, um,
once somebody has cancer, you'rechanged for life, and you can't
(23:45):
pretend you're not, changed forlife, yeah, and and so you're
that's hard to for some peopleto it's difficult, and and it's
almost impossible for somepeople because it's true, it
requires a um a dedication, itrequires uh a willpower, it
requires you know to live.
A will to live, exactly.
(24:07):
A spirit, yes.
SPEAKER_02 (24:09):
Um, and a lot of people they don't have it.
SPEAKER_01 (24:12):
They yeah, I think they they uh neglect it or they
uh take it for granted.
SPEAKER_02 (24:18):
Or they just don't have it.
SPEAKER_01 (24:20):
Yeah.
So to to beat cancer, right?
The most important thing is yourspirit.
100%.
I I believe that's really thething that this group really has
in common, the core group thatshows up every week.
Look at look at Gene.
Yeah, amazing.
I mean, he's on it 20 hours aday.
Exactly.
And I don't agree with him abouteverything he says at all, I
(24:42):
know, but it doesn't matter.
I go, the guy is alive 16 yearslater, and he's 82 years old.
No, he's gonna be 85 at 15 yearsold.
85 years old, and frankly, he'slived longer with 16 years of
cancer than most people I knowthat never got cancer.
SPEAKER_02 (25:01):
So he at this age, the projected lifespan is less
than 16.
Exactly.
SPEAKER_01 (25:06):
So, you know, I I I I listen to him and I see his
spirit now.
That's the thing that to meScott has we are that in contact
in coming, oh, absolutely.
Scott's a lot younger, and he'sgot you know, he's closer to my
age, I think, and younger thanme.
SPEAKER_02 (25:22):
A couple years older than you.
SPEAKER_01 (25:24):
Oh, older than me.
Okay, well, regardless, we're Iknow we're more walking in the
same bracket.
So he's got that same sort oflong-term outlook, the spirit.
But he's there, you know, hethinks it through, he listens,
he's he's right, he got and hedoes it.
And he does take the action.
He got himself to Japan, he gotthat Met Pitt.
He went and, you know, when adoctor doesn't tell you what you
(25:46):
need to hear, you go and now nowanother opinion, and another
one, and another one.
We gotta get him on maintenance.
SPEAKER_02 (25:52):
Yes.
And so he's and he's working onthat target for Dr.
Song.
Good, good.
I'm I'm I'm worried about him.
SPEAKER_01 (25:59):
Well, we gotta, like you said, we gotta come up with
that end game, you know.
You come up with the immediateneed, and then you come up with
the the finish of it, and thenonce you're finished, you start
all over again, yeah, and yougotta go, how do we keep it
finished?
SPEAKER_02 (26:15):
Yeah, I like to say, I think uh, you know, you want a
paradigm or a model.
I think Chihiro is a greatparadigm.
Um, she got primary cancer,breast cancer, did the standard
therapy, got a mastectomy,cancer, and she thought she's
through with it, as most peoplethink.
SPEAKER_03 (26:36):
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (26:37):
And it recurred as it generally does a very severe
lymph node metastasis, and shewent on methionine-free diet,
lomothionine diet, methionase,and chemo.
SPEAKER_03 (26:50):
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (26:50):
And three months of one course of chemo, three
months of another course ofchemo, and then went on
maintenance chemo, staying onthe lomothionine diet, staying
on the methionase, and committedto doing this thing for life.
Right.
So if all the patients could dofollow this paradigm, this
(27:12):
model, it would be great.
SPEAKER_01 (27:14):
I would love to see the contrast between that group
against all the others.
SPEAKER_02 (27:18):
In this paradigm, oh, yeah, in this paradigm.
In this paradigm.
SPEAKER_00 (27:23):
Usually I think uh this way.
Uh you are you wanted to eat abeef or chick, you know,
chicken, whatever.
You are you are attempt like atendency, I mean attempting, you
know, like uh uh want to eat,but uh I'm always thinking I
don't want to do again thechemo.
SPEAKER_03 (27:41):
Right.
I get it, I get it.
I'm right there going.
SPEAKER_02 (27:44):
The chemo is so toxic, but much more toxic is is
the cancer.
Exactly.
It's much more toxic than thechemo.
That's right.
SPEAKER_01 (27:54):
That but the diet is the one thing that is
unpleasant, but it's not toxic.
SPEAKER_02 (28:00):
Right.
And the diet actually is not sobad.
It's not so bad.
There's so many deliciousthings.
Yeah, you can put it out in thediet.
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (28:09):
You can you can keep it good, like you just get
creative, you learn how to howto how to do it right.
And you know, when you do decideto have the little beans, you
take double your methioninase,yeah, and and and you overcome
it, and you don't do it everyday, and you don't do it even,
you know.
Some of these guys take off twodays a week.
I don't take off any days aweek.
(28:29):
No, no, no, and if I have aweek, if I eat some beans or if
I eat an egg, I would not alwaysdouble that methioninase up, and
then for many days later, I donothing.
Like, I like if I if I feel likeI need to get a little extra
nutrition and I need to get alittle extra something, and I
will, I'll break and have an eggonce in a great while, and then
(28:52):
for the next two weeks, I don't,I am like religious, and I
double the methanease.
No problem.
That's it, but that's as far asI go off the chart, you know,
and that's just normal commonsense.
Yeah, but but when you gotpeople that are like, Well, we
do it for some days and thenother days we just eat normal.
I'm like, well, that's likespinning that revolver and
(29:14):
going, Well, most days itdoesn't go off, but every once
in a while once in a while itdoes.
So, yeah, go ahead, go ahead.
So, so Robert, you know, I thinkyou're you're spot on.
I think that um I would love tostart.
I know you're collecting data,you're writing reports and and
publishing these things.
(29:36):
I can't wait to see my casestudy come out.
It'll come out in a coupleweeks.
I'm looking forward to it sovery much.
SPEAKER_02 (29:41):
Right around the first.
SPEAKER_01 (29:42):
I love it.
And then I've got a number ofdoctors that I can't wait to
see.
That's right.
That's right.
You talk.
SPEAKER_03 (29:52):
Thank you, thank you.
SPEAKER_01 (29:55):
Thank you.
Live action here at the AntiCancer Institute.
You bet.
Love it.
SPEAKER_02 (30:03):
Who's that for this one?
SPEAKER_00 (30:05):
This is uh thermal feature.
SPEAKER_02 (30:11):
Thank you very much.
That's fantastic.
Thank you, sir.
SPEAKER_01 (30:16):
So Robert, why don't you share with our listeners
kind of Shahiro's role?
She came out here for a weekwith what is it that we're doing
here?
SPEAKER_02 (30:26):
Okay, so we have a branch in Japan.
Branch in this company.
It's called Anti-Cancer Japan.
Right.
And Chihiro runs it.
Oh, right.
Good job.
And and I'll tell you right now,we have more methionase patients
from Japan than we do fromAmerica.
Wow.
And Chihiro is working veryclosely with the group that has
(30:48):
the MedPet.
Oh, beautiful.
SPEAKER_01 (30:51):
So what a beauty that you got the people
participating more have accessto this advanced scanning that
we don't even look here.
SPEAKER_02 (30:59):
This is so critical that the doctor there, Dr.
Sato, he tells his patients, goon methionics.
We don't have such a doctorhere.
Dr.
Castro tells some of thepatients.
Well, he at least is acceptingof it.
SPEAKER_01 (31:17):
When I met him and I'm very close, very close.
I told him about that.
He said, okay.
The other doctors are like,whatever.
No, he's he very much.
Even Dr.
SPEAKER_02 (31:26):
Song is like, okay, I don't know.
It's okay.
Yeah, yeah.
He's a female guy.
Exactly.
We we get what we want from himand a million times more.
Absolutely.
So um, so uh Chihiro's a keyperson in Japan.
Wonderful.
And uh Japan is so accepting ofuh methionine restriction being
(31:54):
part of cancer treatment, it'sspreading and spreading.
That's by Dr.
Sadio.
And also another doctor uhcalled uh uh what's his name?
Uh I forgot his name.
The peritoneal surgeon.
Oh Yoni Mura.
Yonimura.
Dr.
Yoni Mura, who is very differentfrom Dr.
(32:16):
Sado.
He's a surgeon that operates onpeople that are sent basically
sent to hospice.
Got it.
He saves them.
Okay.
They have all this taskuses inthere.
SPEAKER_01 (32:27):
Those are the guys that are generally open to
outside the box treatments.
SPEAKER_02 (32:31):
Right, right.
He's he's an outlier like Dr.
Son.
Right, right.
He operates on people the othersurgeons won't operate on.
Yeah.
And and then he gets a lot ofcriticism.
Right.
But um, so some of those peoplenow are going on methionine
restriction, and some of themare doing pretty good.
Well, maybe Japan is the doorwayfor the paradigm.
Japan is in the lead now.
(32:53):
The world lead of methioninerestriction.
Right.
And a large part of that is dueto Tihiro.
Wonderful.
And Dr.
Sado, Dr.
Yuri Mura.
SPEAKER_01 (33:02):
Um so you're making the methionine is here and
shipping it there, or is itbeing made there as well?
SPEAKER_02 (33:07):
No, we make it here.
It's not easy to make a joke.
Yeah, I know.
SPEAKER_01 (33:10):
In fact, as far as I know, you guys are the ones that
make it, right?
SPEAKER_02 (33:13):
And if and Chihiro helps with the shipment, she's
always on the phone to fit.
But that's instrumental.
It gets there within 24 hours.
SPEAKER_01 (33:25):
Oh, beautiful.
SPEAKER_00 (33:26):
What I say 36 hours.
SPEAKER_01 (33:28):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
But still, I mean, that's a longflight.
And uh, you know, you're able tokeep it protected for that
moment of time, and that'sthat's amazing.
It doesn't need much protection,but there we are.
SPEAKER_00 (33:41):
I I yeah, right.
SPEAKER_01 (33:43):
Couldn't be more impressed.
Well, we're we're blastedthrough time.
I, you know, I try to keep thesekind of to a half hour or so.
We're probably a little overthat.
But Shakira, do you have any uhspecific message for our
listeners?
Such a special energy.
SPEAKER_00 (33:59):
Actually, I have been uh taking care or
supporting a cancer patient whohas no more treatment.
Then uh doctor already uh saidno more, you know, and then they
don't know what to do, right?
Because if they they have beendoing a chemo, but the chemo uh
(34:22):
uh cannot really uh can onlytake so much sometimes, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (34:26):
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (34:26):
Well, and but some you can probably take a lot more
than these doctors are willingto give.
Probably song, yeah, giving younow four more cycles.
Yeah, where the doctors at atIrvine said you've got three
maxed out at three, and nowyou're uh you've already gone
through.
SPEAKER_01 (34:44):
Yeah, so and he was talking about the possibility,
if needed, of going further.
So, you know, that's it.
SPEAKER_02 (34:50):
Yeah, as long as he doesn't care about what's in the
guidelines, he cares about you.
Right.
Get rid of this cancer, do whatit takes.
Exactly.
SPEAKER_00 (35:00):
So, I mean, I I tried to like to uh send like uh
chemo uh and then methioninerestriction, yes, and methionine
uh methanase, or or thedegrading of methionine.
All three parts are critical.
That's all three parts had somuch synergy effect that nobody
knows about that's why uh somany people are looking for the
(35:23):
second opinion because they haveno way.
SPEAKER_02 (35:25):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (35:26):
They are that's why they go to Dr.
SPEAKER_02 (35:28):
Sato, then they go to Sato Castro.
SPEAKER_00 (35:31):
Yeah, yeah.
Then Dr.
Sato said, okay, you take thismethanase.
SPEAKER_02 (35:36):
Yeah, and then he does a lot of other things
chemoimmunotherapy and specialradiation, not the not the stuff
that burns you to death.
Right, right, right.
There's all kinds of ways to dothis.
Absolutely, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (35:48):
So that's what we we don't need to give up.
SPEAKER_02 (35:51):
Right.
We have a way never give up.
Well, there's some what thatthere was one patient that that
the wife called me.
They talked about it a littlebit on the on the Zoom last
time.
He he's he got lung cancer allover his body, brain.
Yeah.
He said, Should I give himivermectin?
And I said, I don't think it'llhelp.
SPEAKER_01 (36:12):
No.
Yeah, ivermectin is is kind ofan adjunct that goes it is and
nothing would help.
SPEAKER_02 (36:18):
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (36:18):
The patient is gonna he's when it gets over the line
over a certain thing, it's apoint where it's eating you
faster than you can give itanything.
And it's gotta get can't let itget there.
No, exactly.
That's the key.
We can't let it get there, andit you see it coming, you know.
It generally look at that poorguy, uh uh Peter.
SPEAKER_02 (36:40):
Right?
Oh, he's got I know, I know, Idon't know.
I don't know.
The opiates, I know opioids,whatever.
Fortunately, I think he may havecan you try the Lupron?
No, yeah, okay, okay.
SPEAKER_01 (36:54):
No spirit.
Yeah, well, I think he'sthinking about it, and I think I
he talks to me, and I'm I'm kindof trying to encourage that
fire.
He sees me going through with mychemo, and I'm still helping
him.
Yeah, and and I tell him, I go,I'm I'm having a rough day, but
look, I'm still talking to you.
So, you know, exactly, Joe.
(37:14):
Consider what I'm saying, youknow.
And so I'm doing everything inmy power to, you know, to keep
him.
Yeah, you know, but the problemis a lot of us we come to this
point, we say, Well, I'm gonnatry.
He was down in Mexico gettingsome herbal treatment, and it's
not that those things can't behelpful, they just don't work
most of the time.
You're not gonna make a dream.
(37:35):
Well, the thing is, is whathappens is the one guy out of 40
or one guy out of 400 that getsa result from something like
that is they're not talking.
They might have beenspontaneous, might not be.
SPEAKER_02 (37:48):
I don't know.
We don't know most of it.
We don't know most of theanswer.
That's not what we base our ourour our strategy on.
It's not the one out of 400,it's a lot of things.
SPEAKER_01 (37:57):
But the other one is that these guys hear because
they they're saying the thingthey want to hear that says when
you can eat a piece of fruit andyou will cancer will go away.
And it's like, okay, well, maybeyou ate a piece of fruit and
your cancer went away, but thetwo don't necessarily one didn't
cause the other.
But I don't believe they wentaway.
Well, and there you go.
(38:17):
And I and then for whateverthing, we just don't know.
And what we're doing here, we'redocumenting, we're testing,
we're we're we're we'refollowing protocols that that we
keep watching work, we'resharing our information of these
things that work, and we'rewe're we're we're building the
the the body of work that says,well, now there's 400 people
(38:39):
that we've have similar resultsdoing a similar thing.
And they all were in a situationwhere they were, if the
trajectory hadn't changed, it'dall be gone by now.
Yeah.
And I think that's imperativefor us to look at like what
happens if we didn't do what wedid.
We already know that curve.
(39:00):
Well, we can't prove it, but wecan sure know it.
We watch it happen over and overagain.
So, well, guys, I I just am sograteful to be part of this
community.
And I'm glad to be able tocontribute to it.
Um Shahiro.
So grateful to you.
Thank you for all your photos upthere.
Exactly, exactly.
And my lovely wife over here,who you can't see, she's
(39:22):
standing behind me helpingeverything we do, and and she
gives me a lot of strength.
So all right.
Well, this has been anotherepisode of the Healthy Living
Podcast.
I'm your host, Joe Grumbine, andwe will see you next time.
SPEAKER_03 (39:37):
Great.
SPEAKER_01 (39:38):
This was a
Okay.
Well, hello, and welcome back tothe Healthy Living Podcast.
I'm your host, Joe Grumbine, andI have with me a couple of very
special guests.
And I'm actually recording thisfrom the Anti-Cancer Institute
in San Diego with Dr.
Robert Hoffman and ShihiroAzumi.
(00:25):
All right, I get your last nameright.
Wonderful.
Shahiro's in from Japan.
Um, I just got back from anotherappointment with Dr.
Song, and I thought, wow, thisis a perfect uh uh opportunity
to sit and have a conversation.
And Shahiro, I really want totalk to you a bit because you
know you are a big part of allof this.
(00:47):
And you know, when we have ourSunday calls, uh, you know,
you're the one coordinating thisall the way from Japan.
SPEAKER_03 (00:53):
Right, right.
SPEAKER_01 (00:54):
And so we got big time zone differences, language
issues, we got all these things,and yet we we make this
beautiful call happen.
And you're one of the key uhelements of this group and your
story.
Um, you're overcoming cancer,using the low methionine diet,
methionine is um, and and andgoing from you being told you
(01:18):
had to have radical surgery toyou don't have a tumor anymore.
SPEAKER_03 (01:25):
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (01:25):
Um what a beautiful story, and uh it really helps
those of us who are trying toget a word out and and and share
with people when we havemultiple points of view,
multiple stories, multipleexperiences, but certain things
in common that really makes thisa powerful message.
And then, of course, we gotRobert Hoffman here who you know
(01:47):
is instrumental in uh not onlythe discovery of cancer's
addiction to methionine, um, andand and creating methionine A's,
making it available to peoplewho need it, starting the
anti-cancer institute and andand working relentlessly for you
know most of your life on thiswork.
It's like, and we're all sittinghere together in the same room.
(02:09):
I just am excited.
Robert, how are you doing today?
SPEAKER_02 (02:13):
I'm doing I'm doing good, Joe.
Um happy to have thisdiscussion.
SPEAKER_01 (02:17):
Yeah, me too.
It's um, you know, we we it'sfunny because sometimes I I go
back and I listen to episodesand I think it sounds like I'm
kind of repeating myself.
But you know, each time we delveinto another little slice of
this, another nuance, anotherangle.
And you're right, it's a drumbeat.
Like it's a drum beat.
The thing is, like, if you don'trepeat yourself in the world
(02:40):
anymore, you just get passedright on by.
But if you can repeat yourselfin a way that is genuine, um
heartfelt, uh uh emphatic, umaccurate, you know, Robert, you
hold us to a high standard, youknow.
(03:01):
It's like a lot of times peoplewant to say things because they
saw something or they feltsomething or they read
something, and and we we we saythings as though they're true
because we think they're true orwe want them to be true.
SPEAKER_03 (03:14):
Right, right.
SPEAKER_01 (03:15):
But Robert comes back and he goes, show me the
evidence, right?
Show me the paper.
I want to see this, I want tosee who found it, how did they
find it, what were they lookingfor, who paid them?
Um, you know, what how do theydo their work?
You know, let's let's evaluatethis, not just I noticed a thing
and there are this is what itwas.
(03:37):
And I think that's huge becauseI know a lot of doctors, even
who are adamant about their workand they're they're passionate
about these things they do, butyou know, they're working off of
anecdotal evidence like most ofus, you know, when we're
experiencing things, and thenthey make a statement as though
maybe they have more evidencethan they do, and then people
(03:59):
go, Oh, I heard this from thisguy, and so I believe it, and so
I do it.
And maybe they put themselves ata risk that is unwarranted, or
maybe they don't do a thing thatthey should do because it is
warranted.
And uh Shahiro, I'd like tolearn a little bit more about
you.
Um, you know, I you're on everymeeting, um, you organize these
(04:22):
things, you you I know yourbackstory.
Why don't you share briefly withthe listeners your backstory?
SPEAKER_00 (04:29):
Sure.
Um uh my can I I'm a coun cancerpatient.
Right.
And then uh I don't know whichyear, you know, I haven't 2018.
I had a uh mastectomy of the uhleft left uh breast because my
cancer was detected by uh Japanhealth check, like an ERE health
(04:52):
check.
And then all of a sudden my uhresult says you gotta go to see
a breast surgeon.
And then I went there and then,oh my god, you know, I have a
cancer.
Right.
And I contacted the uh Dr.
Hoffman.
I I had a cancer.
SPEAKER_01 (05:09):
How did you know Dr.
Hoffman?
SPEAKER_00 (05:11):
Uh before that, I have been helping him.
SPEAKER_01 (05:14):
Oh okay.
SPEAKER_00 (05:15):
Mm-hmm.
Yes.
SPEAKER_01 (05:16):
So you guys had a had uh a work.
SPEAKER_00 (05:19):
Yes, already jobs.
SPEAKER_01 (05:21):
But I was fortunate for you.
SPEAKER_00 (05:22):
Right, right.
SPEAKER_01 (05:25):
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (05:26):
Then he has uh uh so many uh uh uh uh conference,
like a cancer conference.
He's been attending it.
He has a lot of uh uh surgeon,doctor, council doctor.
He knows so many high-rank youknow doctors in Japan.
He picked uh most uh great uh uhbreast cancer uh doctor.
(05:51):
Uh that's uh Japan uh cancercenter, cancer main center.
SPEAKER_01 (05:59):
He's a connected guy.
SPEAKER_00 (06:00):
Right, and he's a chief called the breast surgeon.
Okay, and uh when he saw that,okay, I gotta do your surgery.
And uh uh when I uh uh inhospitalized only 10 days I got
a surgery.
Wow, and then that time mycancer type is ILC.
SPEAKER_03 (06:18):
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (06:19):
Uh invasive lobular uh carcinoma.
Okay, that doesn't make the uhlamp.
Okay, it's like a gradual it'sspread under the skin.
Okay, so very difficult todetect.
Yeah, so when my cancer is uhconsiderably considerably rare
cancer, okay, uh among thebreast cancer, and then that's
(06:43):
why it's very uh difficult todetect because it doesn't make a
right, it doesn't do what minedid come on this way, it just
kind of spreads like a slimemold.
Yeah, so slime mold.
Yeah, that that's why I thedoctor at the I mean Tsuki, I
mean Japan cancer center at themain hospital says uh looks like
(07:06):
that your diameter is a fourcentimeter, but after the
surgery, they said diameter waseight centimeters.
You know, cancer was spread it.
So uh I took the micaseptomy,right?
Then I didn't do the uh chemoafter that.
SPEAKER_03 (07:22):
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (07:22):
Uh I then I had a uh hormone broker for three years.
And every year I went to acheck, Yarry checked, mm-hmm and
checked, and checked the 30year.
SPEAKER_01 (07:37):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (07:37):
Uh the my doctor's.
SPEAKER_01 (07:39):
They had markers that you were able to do.
Right, right.
SPEAKER_00 (07:42):
And then marker was like a normal range and the MR
uh C T contrast CT, no problem.
You know, 30 year, he said, Oh,Miss Ozuni, congratulations, you
have no cancer.
Came back.
Okay, right.
But uh, you know, uh, I havesome kind of uh irritation, my
(08:04):
uh under the armhole.
SPEAKER_04 (08:06):
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (08:06):
And then he said, Oh, yeah, let me let me take the
uh some tissue out.
Yeah, then the result came, ohsorry, you had uh cancer.
SPEAKER_01 (08:17):
Oh shit.
Oh what a nightmare, right?
You're good, you're good.
Nope, you're not good.
SPEAKER_00 (08:23):
Then I was I was kind of shocked.
Yeah, cried and called Dr.
Hogman.
Yeah, and then right there, youknow, you gotta be matching
restricted to diet.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
And then I uh started and thenafter that, I mean uh up eight
uh 2018, I took uh uh all of mycancer out.
SPEAKER_03 (08:47):
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (08:48):
So Dr.
Hogman told me, being tellingme, you gotta be restricted to
Matron in food, Metronin food,don't eat the Metonian food.
But I didn't, I never listenedthere.
Right, most people don't knowbecause I took it.
Yeah, yeah.
That's like, you know, Joe,unbelievable.
I was so regret.
SPEAKER_01 (09:08):
Yeah, of course.
SPEAKER_00 (09:10):
I eat the eggs, I was taking it and then eat.
SPEAKER_01 (09:13):
I eat sardines every day.
SPEAKER_00 (09:15):
Yeah, then uh lunch, you know, like a hamburger,
sushi, you know, like the Koreanbarbecue.
Yeah, three years, normal food Iate.
Then the result of that, uh mycancer was really deep and big
and spread.
And doctors said, I'm not ableto do a surgery because too deep
(09:35):
and too wide, otherwise I can'ttake all your meat out, tissue
out.
Yeah, so I have to do a chemo.
Same chemo.
Just like choke.
SPEAKER_01 (09:46):
Yeah, just like choke.
Actually, chemo, right?
Yeah, then uh but shrink it downand then go after it.
Yeah, yeah.
That's what they were gonna dofrom me.
SPEAKER_00 (09:54):
That that that time I was like hoping uh I got the
chemo, then I uh transferred myuh hospital from main, main, I
mean Tokyo downtown hospital touh near my living place.
And that's also Dr.
Hokman introduced me the newdoctor in our hospital, yeah.
(10:17):
Okay, and then now he's seeingme and he is a very, very nice
doctor, too.
SPEAKER_01 (10:22):
Yeah, and then uh listen to you.
SPEAKER_00 (10:25):
Right.
Then you know I learned a lot ofthings because uh December 28th,
I had a cancer found outsentence from the doctor.
SPEAKER_03 (10:37):
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (10:37):
I got a cancer, right?
SPEAKER_03 (10:39):
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (10:40):
Then uh I started a very, very, very strict material
restricted diet.
SPEAKER_03 (10:47):
Uh huh.
SPEAKER_00 (10:47):
I don't eat anything, you know, other than
cabbages, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Or Chinese cabbages, you know,something like that.
Almost like a two.
Then unfortunately, my chemoonly started, uh, was able to
start March 27th.
SPEAKER_03 (11:03):
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (11:04):
That means January, February, almost like a March.
I have no nothing.
I was so scared because mycancer is spreading.
And it starts moving fast andthen starts to grow.
It's crazy.
So I have to depend on themethane.
Right.
Oh, and right away, you know,like January, uh, I I I get the
(11:24):
methanease from the Dr.
Hogman and a very strictmetalinum restricted diet.
Right.
Then finally, my uh chemo startsMarch 27th, and I have a
picture, and then uh I share toeverybody.
Okay.
And then there was a huge likeuh meatball, you know, like a
(11:45):
well and deep, and it comes intomy uh neck, you know, ring
float, something like that.
Then after the uh March 27started, like a Dr.
Ruby scene, Adrian scene, threemonths, and then a doctor said,
Okay, let's take a look at thehow your cancer and a drug, I
mean chemo is working.
And then he took uh uh CT.
SPEAKER_03 (12:08):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (12:09):
90, I should say 95% gone.
SPEAKER_03 (12:12):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (12:13):
Unbelievable.
SPEAKER_03 (12:14):
Yeah, unbelievable.
SPEAKER_00 (12:15):
Just like mine, yeah.
You know, gone.
Yeah, only three months.
Right.
Chemo, and I read, I have a uhbenefit of the I can access to
uh lots of uh Dr.
Hoffmann's paper.
SPEAKER_01 (12:28):
Right, right.
Cancer and you're doing yourresearch and learning.
SPEAKER_00 (12:32):
And then uh one of his students uh had a uh I mean
paper regarding to a doxerrubicine and a methylase.
Okay, and then they have agraph, uh like a graph and
showing it if only doxorubicinethis much of the maybe I should
say 20 percent reduction of acancer to more drinkage, but uh
(12:57):
uh doxerubicine and a methanetogether, yeah, five times uh I
mean synergy effect.
SPEAKER_01 (13:05):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (13:07):
Oh this is a uh kind of science, yeah.
You know, oh my god, I was solucky I didn't know the
mechanism of the how it works,right?
But people don't know it, youknow, and then people I I had so
many Japanese cancer patientsbecause I'm kind of facilitating
(13:30):
the salonies, right?
Right, right.
And many uh Japanese cancerpatients who come to us and I
try to explain to a Metonianrestricted diet what yeah, I
can't I can't eat the protein,right?
Then everybody said everyeverybody said, Yeah, because
(13:52):
they thought I know they thoughtthey need to eat protein.
That's why everybody makes yoursystem makes your body happy,
right?
Yeah, I I have to get the uhenergy, my body gets stronger.
Yeah, that means I have to eatthe protein.
That's why uh I mean, uh one ofa lawyer who has uh colon cancer
(14:13):
spread it to the lung, you know,keeping eating and chicken,
chicken, chicken, chicken,chicken, chicken, everything.
SPEAKER_03 (14:20):
Exactly.
SPEAKER_00 (14:21):
Then all of a sudden, a couple months, all the
uh cancer got the power or theenergy power, right?
It spread.
Then it's really spreading it.
Right, those people come comingto us, then uh already almost
too late at that point.
SPEAKER_01 (14:37):
Yes, you know, you're right on the edge of just
like me.
I was right on the edge ofalmost too late.
SPEAKER_00 (14:42):
Yeah, too late because the chemo itself
couldn't really know more goodeffect in that kind of stage of
the case.
So that's that's why uh just alittle bit, you know.
I bring back my story to uh uhthree months later, uh Dr.
(15:04):
Rubicine, uh chemo almost likeuh my cancer goes almost like a
95%.
It's gone, I can't see itanymore.
SPEAKER_03 (15:12):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (15:13):
In a little bit I can see it.
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (15:15):
Kind of like me.
I got a little bit left over.
SPEAKER_00 (15:18):
Then another three months because Jap Japan uh
cancer chemotherapy is sixmonths.
SPEAKER_03 (15:23):
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (15:23):
Three months, Dr.
Rubisine Adrian, and uhDosetaxa.
Uh-huh.
Three uh then six months, and uhuh I have to uh I have to uh
talk to the senior breastsurgeon, and then uh I got the
PET scam, like FDG PET scan.
And still the senior breastsurgeon want to operate the
(15:47):
cars, that's surgery.
SPEAKER_01 (15:48):
They still want to do it.
That's like with me, theradiation.
They want to get on thecalories.
I'm like, what the heck?
SPEAKER_02 (15:54):
What's wrong with that?
They want to do right.
Understandable.
SPEAKER_00 (16:00):
You know, doctor, the first things what but uh I
didn't really say to him, but uhwow, that's oh, your case.
Uh chemo works so well.
You your cancer not reallyresponding to the chemo, uh
chemo, but uh your case was veryunusual, right?
SPEAKER_03 (16:18):
He says, uh huh.
SPEAKER_00 (16:19):
They also have to be true.
Then I didn't say anythingbecause you know I don't want to
dispute him or whatever.
I have extra, you know, right uhthings I care.
They don't hear anything.
So uh especially uh my ILC inbasically lobla carcinoma is a
(16:40):
very, very bad uh response to achemo.
Only uh less than 10 people outof 100.
SPEAKER_03 (16:46):
Wow.
SPEAKER_00 (16:47):
So he was really amazed.
Then I said, uh uh, I don't wantto open up the uh uh my body to
do it because I already had amastectomy, so I already had a
big you know surgery.
Yeah, yeah.
So uh I told uh a doctor, Dr.
Hobo, what should I do?
I don't want to do the surgery,but no, no cancer was detected
(17:10):
in a pack, but still my surgeonwanted to do it.
Then I he said he he gave me avery good uh uh warning.
Yeah, okay.
Tell him I would like to post apoem.
SPEAKER_01 (17:21):
Yeah, yeah, that's what I did.
I said the same thing, I got aspawn.
Let's just watch it for a while.
SPEAKER_00 (17:25):
Yeah, that's a good word.
SPEAKER_01 (17:27):
Yeah, that's just we're observing right now.
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (17:30):
And then young doctor, also one another young
doctor, that's my real doctor,says, you know, even you have a
surgery, cancer comes back.
SPEAKER_03 (17:39):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (17:40):
So that's that means if I can monitor very closely,
yeah uh uh in detail, probably Ican I don't need to do a
surgery.
Uh surgery couldn't do thecouldn't 100%, you know, because
of I know the cancer uh uhlittle little little little
(18:01):
micro cancer.
It comes back.
SPEAKER_01 (18:05):
Cancer in you anyways, right?
SPEAKER_00 (18:07):
So I decided, you know, to tell I postopone.
Then I didn't uh I was avoidingdoing uh my surgery.
SPEAKER_03 (18:16):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (18:16):
Then I spoke to my doctor, how my how are you gonna
do my surgery?
So okay, I have to capture likea 30 or 30 or 40 minutes, you
know, like uh under the arm andthe left side and open up
everything like a fish.
Oh then take the all the tissueout.
SPEAKER_01 (18:33):
Oh no, no, no, no, no, no.
SPEAKER_00 (18:35):
I was able to avoid surgery.
SPEAKER_01 (18:39):
Wow.
SPEAKER_00 (18:39):
Yeah, that's amazing.
That's why if we know themechanism of the cancer, right,
and then how uh chemo and uhmetoning restricted diet and the
methanease works, right?
So I was the one I really Dr.
Hoffman saved me.
Yeah, otherwise, I LC, if I stayon only chemo, right?
SPEAKER_01 (19:00):
You wouldn't have solved it the same way.
SPEAKER_00 (19:02):
And then my uh cancer has uh easy to uh go to
the brain, lung, yeah, and lymphnodes.
SPEAKER_01 (19:10):
Yeah, mine too.
It wants to do the same things,yeah.
It's easier, and it starts righthere.
It's like it's got an easy,yeah, right, easy way to go to
all those places.
It's like right there.
unknown (19:20):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (19:20):
So um let that happen.
SPEAKER_00 (19:23):
Right.
That's why I thought I have touh poke, I have to share how the
cancer works and how we canprevent or we can shrink
treatment.
SPEAKER_02 (19:37):
So why why don't you tell what happened then after
your chemo?
SPEAKER_00 (19:41):
After chemo?
SPEAKER_02 (19:42):
Yeah.
You went on your maintenancechemo.
SPEAKER_00 (19:45):
Yeah.
Then after that, uh this iscritical, in my opinion.
Yes, I think so.
Uh after that dollars to uh uhmy chemo was 2022.
Okay.
And today it was 2025, right?
Almost three years.
Yeah.
And I had a uh I mean uh FDGpest every six months or every
(20:10):
eight months, you know.
Then so far nothing was uhdetected in that machine.
SPEAKER_04 (20:15):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (20:16):
And then my doctor says, I am going to give you uh
the uh uh uh uh molecularinhibitor.
SPEAKER_03 (20:25):
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (20:25):
Uh that's uh uh kind of a uh new drug, but uh it I
can get it.
So I'm called targeted therapy.
SPEAKER_01 (20:34):
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (20:35):
Uh-huh.
SPEAKER_01 (20:35):
Kind of like an immunotherapy sort of thing.
SPEAKER_00 (20:38):
No, it's a hormone inhibitory targeting some
targeting of some kind ofenzymes, maybe important.
Okay, whatever, you know, cancercancer, cancer need of this
anything.
SPEAKER_02 (20:52):
It's not an okay, got it.
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (20:54):
And then I've been take taking a since uh chemo.
Since chemo, I'm taking uh themaintenance chemo that's uh
already taking uh just a pill,not having to get an infusion.
SPEAKER_02 (21:07):
You're gonna at some point gonna discuss with
doctors.
Oh absolutely.
SPEAKER_00 (21:11):
That's kind of that's inhibiting uh blocking uh
cycle uh S1 and G, whatever, youknow.
SPEAKER_03 (21:19):
We hope.
SPEAKER_00 (21:20):
Yeah, that that's the medication.
SPEAKER_01 (21:22):
It it's kind of uh I mean it's still on your infusion
cycle.
You're still on your diet, andyou're still on the methionase.
So essentially what's happeningin chemo.
Right.
So what happens is you got thesetumor cells or these the
potential for them, your geneticcode is already they're there.
(21:42):
Yeah, you've got these cellsthat are like if the environment
is right, they start growing.
Right.
But what we do is we come in andwe say, Okay, well, I see your
weakness.
You would need these pathwaysopen, you need these hormones to
activate the hormone, you needthis block within restriction,
(22:03):
take a molecular some sort ofmaintenance chemo that can be
almost any kind.
And that's an octa oxidativestress that says if they even
get started at all, it knocksthem back down.
So all of those things togethercreate this place where they
really, unless you mess up or itdrastically mutates and changes
(22:27):
the way it operates, which itdoesn't really have the ability
to do because it's not stronganymore.
SPEAKER_00 (22:34):
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (22:34):
Well, you know, I mean anything could happen, but
I mean that's right, Joe.
SPEAKER_00 (22:38):
I really think if you eat the methionine like a
protein a lot, you know, cancerwill come back very easily.
SPEAKER_01 (22:45):
And it wants to, yeah, very easy because looking
for that.
SPEAKER_00 (22:48):
That's a environment, right?
But the cancer environment isvery uh like like it to the
cancer, right?
Grow and copy the DNA, spread,you know, and and it learns
fast.
SPEAKER_01 (23:02):
So the second, if it comes back, it's gonna be ten
times harder to beat than it wasthat first time.
Well, it there's a good chanceof that, and and and so every
grain face it more that's thehardest thing for the patients,
I think, because that's wherethey recall when you go through
when you got a giant lumpsticking on your neck, you got
your attention, like you'll dowhatever it takes, but then all
(23:25):
of a sudden you start feelinggood, and your skin comes back
clean, and you're like, Well,you know, you know, I feel good,
and we'll just you know, it'sreally easy to forget, and I
think that that's a big part ofour message is you know, um,
once somebody has cancer, you'rechanged for life, and you can't
(23:45):
pretend you're not, changed forlife, yeah, and and so you're
that's hard to for some peopleto it's difficult, and and it's
almost impossible for somepeople because it's true, it
requires a um a dedication, itrequires uh a willpower, it
requires you know to live.
A will to live, exactly.
(24:07):
A spirit, yes.
SPEAKER_02 (24:09):
Um, and a lot of people they don't have it.
SPEAKER_01 (24:12):
They yeah, I think they they uh neglect it or they
uh take it for granted.
SPEAKER_02 (24:18):
Or they just don't have it.
SPEAKER_01 (24:20):
Yeah.
So to to beat cancer, right?
The most important thing is yourspirit.
100%.
I I believe that's really thething that this group really has
in common, the core group thatshows up every week.
Look at look at Gene.
Yeah, amazing.
I mean, he's on it 20 hours aday.
Exactly.
And I don't agree with him abouteverything he says at all, I
(24:42):
know, but it doesn't matter.
I go, the guy is alive 16 yearslater, and he's 82 years old.
No, he's gonna be 85 at 15 yearsold.
85 years old, and frankly, he'slived longer with 16 years of
cancer than most people I knowthat never got cancer.
SPEAKER_02 (25:01):
So he at this age, the projected lifespan is less
than 16.
Exactly.
SPEAKER_01 (25:06):
So, you know, I I I I listen to him and I see his
spirit now.
That's the thing that to meScott has we are that in contact
in coming, oh, absolutely.
Scott's a lot younger, and he'sgot you know, he's closer to my
age, I think, and younger thanme.
SPEAKER_02 (25:22):
A couple years older than you.
SPEAKER_01 (25:24):
Oh, older than me.
Okay, well, regardless, we're Iknow we're more walking in the
same bracket.
So he's got that same sort oflong-term outlook, the spirit.
But he's there, you know, hethinks it through, he listens,
he's he's right, he got and hedoes it.
And he does take the action.
He got himself to Japan, he gotthat Met Pitt.
He went and, you know, when adoctor doesn't tell you what you
(25:46):
need to hear, you go and now nowanother opinion, and another
one, and another one.
We gotta get him on maintenance.
SPEAKER_02 (25:52):
Yes.
And so he's and he's working onthat target for Dr.
Song.
Good, good.
I'm I'm I'm worried about him.
SPEAKER_01 (25:59):
Well, we gotta, like you said, we gotta come up with
that end game, you know.
You come up with the immediateneed, and then you come up with
the the finish of it, and thenonce you're finished, you start
all over again, yeah, and yougotta go, how do we keep it
finished?
SPEAKER_02 (26:15):
Yeah, I like to say, I think uh, you know, you want a
paradigm or a model.
I think Chihiro is a greatparadigm.
Um, she got primary cancer,breast cancer, did the standard
therapy, got a mastectomy,cancer, and she thought she's
through with it, as most peoplethink.
SPEAKER_03 (26:36):
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (26:37):
And it recurred as it generally does a very severe
lymph node metastasis, and shewent on methionine-free diet,
lomothionine diet, methionase,and chemo.
SPEAKER_03 (26:50):
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (26:50):
And three months of one course of chemo, three
months of another course ofchemo, and then went on
maintenance chemo, staying onthe lomothionine diet, staying
on the methionase, and committedto doing this thing for life.
Right.
So if all the patients could dofollow this paradigm, this
(27:12):
model, it would be great.
SPEAKER_01 (27:14):
I would love to see the contrast between that group
against all the others.
SPEAKER_02 (27:18):
In this paradigm, oh, yeah, in this paradigm.
In this paradigm.
SPEAKER_00 (27:23):
Usually I think uh this way.
Uh you are you wanted to eat abeef or chick, you know,
chicken, whatever.
You are you are attempt like atendency, I mean attempting, you
know, like uh uh want to eat,but uh I'm always thinking I
don't want to do again thechemo.
SPEAKER_03 (27:41):
Right.
I get it, I get it.
I'm right there going.
SPEAKER_02 (27:44):
The chemo is so toxic, but much more toxic is is
the cancer.
Exactly.
It's much more toxic than thechemo.
That's right.
SPEAKER_01 (27:54):
That but the diet is the one thing that is
unpleasant, but it's not toxic.
SPEAKER_02 (28:00):
Right.
And the diet actually is not sobad.
It's not so bad.
There's so many deliciousthings.
Yeah, you can put it out in thediet.
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (28:09):
You can you can keep it good, like you just get
creative, you learn how to howto how to do it right.
And you know, when you do decideto have the little beans, you
take double your methioninase,yeah, and and and you overcome
it, and you don't do it everyday, and you don't do it even,
you know.
Some of these guys take off twodays a week.
I don't take off any days aweek.
(28:29):
No, no, no, and if I have aweek, if I eat some beans or if
I eat an egg, I would not alwaysdouble that methioninase up, and
then for many days later, I donothing.
Like, I like if I if I feel likeI need to get a little extra
nutrition and I need to get alittle extra something, and I
will, I'll break and have an eggonce in a great while, and then
(28:52):
for the next two weeks, I don't,I am like religious, and I
double the methanease.
No problem.
That's it, but that's as far asI go off the chart, you know,
and that's just normal commonsense.
Yeah, but but when you gotpeople that are like, Well, we
do it for some days and thenother days we just eat normal.
I'm like, well, that's likespinning that revolver and
(29:14):
going, Well, most days itdoesn't go off, but every once
in a while once in a while itdoes.
So, yeah, go ahead, go ahead.
So, so Robert, you know, I thinkyou're you're spot on.
I think that um I would love tostart.
I know you're collecting data,you're writing reports and and
publishing these things.
(29:36):
I can't wait to see my casestudy come out.
It'll come out in a coupleweeks.
I'm looking forward to it sovery much.
SPEAKER_02 (29:41):
Right around the first.
SPEAKER_01 (29:42):
I love it.
And then I've got a number ofdoctors that I can't wait to
see.
That's right.
That's right.
You talk.
SPEAKER_03 (29:52):
Thank you, thank you.
SPEAKER_01 (29:55):
Thank you.
Live action here at the AntiCancer Institute.
You bet.
Love it.
SPEAKER_02 (30:03):
Who's that for this one?
SPEAKER_00 (30:05):
This is uh thermal feature.
SPEAKER_02 (30:11):
Thank you very much.
That's fantastic.
Thank you, sir.
SPEAKER_01 (30:16):
So Robert, why don't you share with our listeners
kind of Shahiro's role?
She came out here for a weekwith what is it that we're doing
here?
SPEAKER_02 (30:26):
Okay, so we have a branch in Japan.
Branch in this company.
It's called Anti-Cancer Japan.
Right.
And Chihiro runs it.
Oh, right.
Good job.
And and I'll tell you right now,we have more methionase patients
from Japan than we do fromAmerica.
Wow.
And Chihiro is working veryclosely with the group that has
(30:48):
the MedPet.
Oh, beautiful.
SPEAKER_01 (30:51):
So what a beauty that you got the people
participating more have accessto this advanced scanning that
we don't even look here.
SPEAKER_02 (30:59):
This is so critical that the doctor there, Dr.
Sato, he tells his patients, goon methionics.
We don't have such a doctorhere.
Dr.
Castro tells some of thepatients.
Well, he at least is acceptingof it.
SPEAKER_01 (31:17):
When I met him and I'm very close, very close.
I told him about that.
He said, okay.
The other doctors are like,whatever.
No, he's he very much.
Even Dr.
SPEAKER_02 (31:26):
Song is like, okay, I don't know.
It's okay.
Yeah, yeah.
He's a female guy.
Exactly.
We we get what we want from himand a million times more.
Absolutely.
So um, so uh Chihiro's a keyperson in Japan.
Wonderful.
And uh Japan is so accepting ofuh methionine restriction being
(31:54):
part of cancer treatment, it'sspreading and spreading.
That's by Dr.
Sadio.
And also another doctor uhcalled uh uh what's his name?
Uh I forgot his name.
The peritoneal surgeon.
Oh Yoni Mura.
Yonimura.
Dr.
Yoni Mura, who is very differentfrom Dr.
(32:16):
Sado.
He's a surgeon that operates onpeople that are sent basically
sent to hospice.
Got it.
He saves them.
Okay.
They have all this taskuses inthere.
SPEAKER_01 (32:27):
Those are the guys that are generally open to
outside the box treatments.
SPEAKER_02 (32:31):
Right, right.
He's he's an outlier like Dr.
Son.
Right, right.
He operates on people the othersurgeons won't operate on.
Yeah.
And and then he gets a lot ofcriticism.
Right.
But um, so some of those peoplenow are going on methionine
restriction, and some of themare doing pretty good.
Well, maybe Japan is the doorwayfor the paradigm.
Japan is in the lead now.
(32:53):
The world lead of methioninerestriction.
Right.
And a large part of that is dueto Tihiro.
Wonderful.
And Dr.
Sado, Dr.
Yuri Mura.
SPEAKER_01 (33:02):
Um so you're making the methionine is here and
shipping it there, or is itbeing made there as well?
SPEAKER_02 (33:07):
No, we make it here.
It's not easy to make a joke.
Yeah, I know.
SPEAKER_01 (33:10):
In fact, as far as I know, you guys are the ones that
make it, right?
SPEAKER_02 (33:13):
And if and Chihiro helps with the shipment, she's
always on the phone to fit.
But that's instrumental.
It gets there within 24 hours.
SPEAKER_01 (33:25):
Oh, beautiful.
SPEAKER_00 (33:26):
What I say 36 hours.
SPEAKER_01 (33:28):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
But still, I mean, that's a longflight.
And uh, you know, you're able tokeep it protected for that
moment of time, and that'sthat's amazing.
It doesn't need much protection,but there we are.
SPEAKER_00 (33:41):
I I yeah, right.
SPEAKER_01 (33:43):
Couldn't be more impressed.
Well, we're we're blastedthrough time.
I, you know, I try to keep thesekind of to a half hour or so.
We're probably a little overthat.
But Shakira, do you have any uhspecific message for our
listeners?
Such a special energy.
SPEAKER_00 (33:59):
Actually, I have been uh taking care or
supporting a cancer patient whohas no more treatment.
Then uh doctor already uh saidno more, you know, and then they
don't know what to do, right?
Because if they they have beendoing a chemo, but the chemo uh
(34:22):
uh cannot really uh can onlytake so much sometimes, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (34:26):
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (34:26):
Well, and but some you can probably take a lot more
than these doctors are willingto give.
Probably song, yeah, giving younow four more cycles.
Yeah, where the doctors at atIrvine said you've got three
maxed out at three, and nowyou're uh you've already gone
through.
SPEAKER_01 (34:44):
Yeah, so and he was talking about the possibility,
if needed, of going further.
So, you know, that's it.
SPEAKER_02 (34:50):
Yeah, as long as he doesn't care about what's in the
guidelines, he cares about you.
Right.
Get rid of this cancer, do whatit takes.
Exactly.
SPEAKER_00 (35:00):
So, I mean, I I tried to like to uh send like uh
chemo uh and then methioninerestriction, yes, and methionine
uh methanase, or or thedegrading of methionine.
All three parts are critical.
That's all three parts had somuch synergy effect that nobody
knows about that's why uh somany people are looking for the
(35:23):
second opinion because they haveno way.
SPEAKER_02 (35:25):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (35:26):
They are that's why they go to Dr.
SPEAKER_02 (35:28):
Sato, then they go to Sato Castro.
SPEAKER_00 (35:31):
Yeah, yeah.
Then Dr.
Sato said, okay, you take thismethanase.
SPEAKER_02 (35:36):
Yeah, and then he does a lot of other things
chemoimmunotherapy and specialradiation, not the not the stuff
that burns you to death.
Right, right, right.
There's all kinds of ways to dothis.
Absolutely, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (35:48):
So that's what we we don't need to give up.
SPEAKER_02 (35:51):
Right.
We have a way never give up.
Well, there's some what thatthere was one patient that that
the wife called me.
They talked about it a littlebit on the on the Zoom last
time.
He he's he got lung cancer allover his body, brain.
Yeah.
He said, Should I give himivermectin?
And I said, I don't think it'llhelp.
SPEAKER_01 (36:12):
No.
Yeah, ivermectin is is kind ofan adjunct that goes it is and
nothing would help.
SPEAKER_02 (36:18):
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (36:18):
The patient is gonna he's when it gets over the line
over a certain thing, it's apoint where it's eating you
faster than you can give itanything.
And it's gotta get can't let itget there.
No, exactly.
That's the key.
We can't let it get there, andit you see it coming, you know.
It generally look at that poorguy, uh uh Peter.
SPEAKER_02 (36:40):
Right?
Oh, he's got I know, I know, Idon't know.
I don't know.
The opiates, I know opioids,whatever.
Fortunately, I think he may havecan you try the Lupron?
No, yeah, okay, okay.
SPEAKER_01 (36:54):
No spirit.
Yeah, well, I think he'sthinking about it, and I think I
he talks to me, and I'm I'm kindof trying to encourage that
fire.
He sees me going through with mychemo, and I'm still helping
him.
Yeah, and and I tell him, I go,I'm I'm having a rough day, but
look, I'm still talking to you.
So, you know, exactly, Joe.
(37:14):
Consider what I'm saying, youknow.
And so I'm doing everything inmy power to, you know, to keep
him.
Yeah, you know, but the problemis a lot of us we come to this
point, we say, Well, I'm gonnatry.
He was down in Mexico gettingsome herbal treatment, and it's
not that those things can't behelpful, they just don't work
most of the time.
You're not gonna make a dream.
(37:35):
Well, the thing is, is whathappens is the one guy out of 40
or one guy out of 400 that getsa result from something like
that is they're not talking.
They might have beenspontaneous, might not be.
SPEAKER_02 (37:48):
I don't know.
We don't know most of it.
We don't know most of theanswer.
That's not what we base our ourour our strategy on.
It's not the one out of 400,it's a lot of things.
SPEAKER_01 (37:57):
But the other one is that these guys hear because
they they're saying the thingthey want to hear that says when
you can eat a piece of fruit andyou will cancer will go away.
And it's like, okay, well, maybeyou ate a piece of fruit and
your cancer went away, but thetwo don't necessarily one didn't
cause the other.
But I don't believe they wentaway.
Well, and there you go.
(38:17):
And I and then for whateverthing, we just don't know.
And what we're doing here, we'redocumenting, we're testing,
we're we're we're we'refollowing protocols that that we
keep watching work, we'resharing our information of these
things that work, and we'rewe're we're we're building the
the the body of work that says,well, now there's 400 people
(38:39):
that we've have similar resultsdoing a similar thing.
And they all were in a situationwhere they were, if the
trajectory hadn't changed, it'dall be gone by now.
Yeah.
And I think that's imperativefor us to look at like what
happens if we didn't do what wedid.
We already know that curve.
(39:00):
Well, we can't prove it, but wecan sure know it.
We watch it happen over and overagain.
So, well, guys, I I just am sograteful to be part of this
community.
And I'm glad to be able tocontribute to it.
Um Shahiro.
So grateful to you.
Thank you for all your photos upthere.
Exactly, exactly.
And my lovely wife over here,who you can't see, she's
(39:22):
standing behind me helpingeverything we do, and and she
gives me a lot of strength.
So all right.
Well, this has been anotherepisode of the Healthy Living
Podcast.
I'm your host, Joe Grumbine, andwe will see you next time.
SPEAKER_03 (39:37):
Great.
SPEAKER_01 (39:38):
This was a
Popular Podcasts
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Ruthie's Table 4
For more than 30 years The River Cafe in London, has been the home-from-home of artists, architects, designers, actors, collectors, writers, activists, and politicians. Michael Caine, Glenn Close, JJ Abrams, Steve McQueen, Victoria and David Beckham, and Lily Allen, are just some of the people who love to call The River Cafe home. On River Cafe Table 4, Rogers sits down with her customers—who have become friends—to talk about food memories. Table 4 explores how food impacts every aspect of our lives. “Foods is politics, food is cultural, food is how you express love, food is about your heritage, it defines who you and who you want to be,” says Rogers. Each week, Rogers invites her guest to reminisce about family suppers and first dates, what they cook, how they eat when performing, the restaurants they choose, and what food they seek when they need comfort. And to punctuate each episode of Table 4, guests such as Ralph Fiennes, Emily Blunt, and Alfonso Cuarón, read their favourite recipe from one of the best-selling River Cafe cookbooks. Table 4 itself, is situated near The River Cafe’s open kitchen, close to the bright pink wood-fired oven and next to the glossy yellow pass, where Ruthie oversees the restaurant. You are invited to take a seat at this intimate table and join the conversation. For more information, recipes, and ingredients, go to https://shoptherivercafe.co.uk/ Web: https://rivercafe.co.uk/ Instagram: www.instagram.com/therivercafelondon/ Facebook: https://en-gb.facebook.com/therivercafelondon/ For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iheartradio app, apple podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.com
The Joe Rogan Experience
The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.