Secret Nutrient Dense Food Options: Nutrivore Wisdom with Dr. Sarah Ballantyne

Ever been tempted by the cookie diet or wondered if you could actually snooze better after a bowl of lettuce? Dr. Sarah Ballantyne, a former improv comedian turned science communicator and Nutrivore dietary philosophy creator, joins us for an episode where humor meets health. She shares her personal narrative, from wrestling with disordered eating to the joy of reintroducing peanuts into her diet after over a decade. Balancing family and personal passions isn't easy, but Sarah's approach to nutrition—eschewing the idea of bad foods—could be your next life hack.

Prepare to have your food biases challenged as we champion the nutritional underdogs like potatoes and mangoes. We'll discuss why the contents of your pantry, including canned clam liquid and lettuce, might be the unsung heroes of your diet. Sarah's insights from her book "Nutrivore" peel back the curtain on the health impacts of various foods on our lifespan, giving us plenty to ponder and potentially debunking some of those health trends you've heard about. Plus, get ready for practical tips on boosting your nutrient intake without spending a fortune.

As we wrap up, we plunge into the myths surrounding farmed fish, and Sarah serves up a hearty portion of facts to counter the fears. Legumes get their moment in the spotlight, as we learn how to enjoy their benefits without the bloat. If you're curious about which nuts to nibble for brain health or how much calcium you really need to keep PMS at bay, then this is the episode for you. And because we love a bit of fun, we'll part with a chuckle over our favorite diet fads and share a blooper or two from our improv days. Tune in for an episode brimming with wit and wisdom that'll feed both your brain and your belly.

You can find Dr. Sarah

https://www.instagram.com/drsarahballantyne/?hl=en
https://www.tiktok.com/@drsarahballantyne
https://nutrivore.com/

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You can find us on social media here:
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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hey, liam, liam, hi, Guess what.

Speaker 2 (00:03):
Chicken butt yes, yeah, good night everybody,
that's the end of the show.

Speaker 1 (00:09):
Okay, but you know what?
Today is going to be an extraspecial episode.
You want to know why.
You want to know why you wantto know why.

Speaker 2 (00:17):
Does it have something to do with the guest
we have on?

Speaker 1 (00:21):
It does have something to do with the guest
we have on.
Do you know what it is?
No guest we have on.

Speaker 2 (00:40):
It does have something to do with the guest
we have on.
Do you know what it is?
No, we have ex-improv actressdr sarah ballantyne on the show.
How did you know that?
I know everything.
I don't think I've ever beenless surprised by anything.

Speaker 3 (00:47):
To be perfectly honest with you, that like
totally tracks.
Yep, I was a professionalimproviser up until the pandemic
.
Up until the pandemic.

Speaker 2 (00:54):
So that shit's recent .

Speaker 3 (00:56):
Oh yeah, no, and my husband and I were on a team
together, so it was like ashared hobby.
Our team was called the awkwardselfies awkward selfies.

Speaker 2 (01:08):
Yeah, I feel like it's usually more punny.
I feel like the improv thingsare usually more punny um, I I
it.

Speaker 3 (01:17):
I don't know.
It was like an inside jokething, right, how did?

Speaker 2 (01:21):
you get like what, how's how?

Speaker 3 (01:23):
um.
So my uh, my husband, we bothwere like theater kids in high
school yeah and then my husbandhad done some theater in grad
school as well.
Um, I was too busy doinggraduate school to have hobbies
like theater.
Um, but he's an astrophysicistso you know they have different

(01:44):
kinds of schedules okay um, yeah, um, and so I was a few years
ago, we had already been, welive in atlanta and we'd already
been here for a few years andlike, met nobody, like we had no
friends and so what does one do, but start an improv?
well, how else do you makefriends?
Honestly, we went to.
We started off by going toclasses, so we started off by

(02:06):
like, and we went on differentnights of the week because we,
like, had little kids at thetime, so we we needed child care
.
And then we ended up like agroup ended up forming out of
his class and they needed, theyneeded one more.
And because I had been to alltheir shows like, because I was
the supportive wife, they werelike hey, sarah, come and join

(02:28):
us.
And then we performed out of afew different local theaters For
, like, you know, 25 peopleSometimes.
Sometimes we'd have like.

Speaker 2 (02:39):
I still don't know why we're called the awkward
selfies, though I'm waiting forthe Just okay, so.

Speaker 3 (02:46):
So in part because we would always take a selfie
awkwardly at the beginning of ashow before we had the moniker,
and then it became a shtick thatwe would always take, like we
would run out to the audienceand take selfies awkwardly with
audience members.
So it's, it was just one ofthose.

(03:07):
You had to be there, liam isbasically what I'm saying.

Speaker 2 (03:12):
I will accept you had to be there.
That's a fine Okay.

Speaker 1 (03:14):
All right, well, now I guess we'll do future guests
Don't underestimate what I know.

Speaker 3 (03:21):
I am impressed.
So if we want to jump into bigbooty, let me know.

Speaker 2 (03:27):
We have murderer on our like.
If someone's gonna pop on,you're gonna have some deep,
dark shit for them.
Um so yeah, but okay.
So, but you should probablyalso introduce yourself and like
what people know you for on thesocial media since your current
profession.

Speaker 3 (03:43):
Yes, my current, my current profession, uh, so, um,
I would say I don't know if youguys think of yourselves as
science communicators, do you?
Because that's kind of how Ithink of myself as a science
communicator in health andnutrition topics.
Um, but I also if, in thatspace, I'm creating something
new which is called nutravor,which is simply the goal of

(04:06):
getting all of the nutrients ourbodies need from the foods we
eat.
I think of it as a dietaryphilosophy rather than a diet,
but that has become the guidingprinciple for all of the content
that I create now, and it'skind of like halfway in between
diet and anti-diet kind of.

(04:28):
It's kind of like halfway inbetween diet and anti-diet.
So it is an education thathelps us improve diet quality,
but without labeling any food asgood or bad.

Speaker 2 (04:31):
So it's kind of like you'd say that a lot it's not a
diet.
I like it's on your book, it's,you know, like your social
media it's not a diet there's nofood you have to eat.
There's no food you have toavoid yeah, except raw milk
which is oh okay, we've got,we've got over that so many
times give you tuberculosis wedon't need to go over the

(04:52):
disclaimer just just adisclaimer disclaimer I also
like also maybe don't eat foodsyou're allergic to or foods
maybe.

Speaker 1 (05:00):
I mean, if you're allergic to peanuts and you want
to have some peanuts, I'm notgoing to blame you.

Speaker 3 (05:06):
That's fair, but keep an epi pen handy so I avoided
peanuts for a long, long time,for like 12 years, and part of
my personal journey in buildingnutribor has been addressing my
own disordered eating patternsand kind of like overcoming my
own food fears.
So I was like happily filmingsome TikTok in the woods talking

(05:29):
about exactly this topic whenit occurred to me that I still
hadn't tried peanuts and I waslike why is there this one food
that I haven't reintroduced backinto?

Speaker 2 (05:38):
my diet.
We've heard some sad stories.
That's like the saddest storyI've ever heard.

Speaker 3 (05:44):
I'm afraid of them, right, I'm afraid that maybe I
have an allergy.
So I, on a weekend, just incase, I tried a little bit, felt
fine, tried a little bit more,felt fine and I am on the
biggest peanut kick.
It's been like months now.
I eat them every single daybecause they are the.

Speaker 2 (06:01):
They're the best, they're the best nut, they're
versatile, they're cheap,they're nutritious, they've got
protein carbs.
What I heard here was.

Speaker 1 (06:11):
You went out into the woods on a spirit journey.
You found your spirit animal inthe form of a peanut.

Speaker 3 (06:17):
Yes, yes, this is exactly what happened A squirrel
came and talked to me and saidwhat are you doing?

Speaker 2 (06:25):
Yeah, and said you should go back to improv Did you
perchance sample some of themushrooms out there.

Speaker 3 (06:33):
I forage mushrooms all the time, rob.
I am a huge amateur forager.
Now I like to sample ediblemushrooms.
This is kind of my favoritething is the ones that don't
roll the dice every time youtake.
In the woods where I foragethere's Amanita muscaria, which
is like it's the red one withthe white polka dots.

(06:54):
That is in like all the fairytale books.

Speaker 1 (06:55):
Right.

Speaker 3 (06:56):
And Amanita muscaria is a hallucinogenic mushroom,
but it also has amatoxin whichdestroys your liver, and it's
not.
It's not good.
It also is like a slowin whichdestroys your liver.
That's not good.
It's not good.
It also is like a slow like youhave no symptoms, no symptoms,
no symptoms and then your liverfailure.

Speaker 1 (07:13):
So it's a nasty one, so it's the perfect one to put
in children's books.
Yeah right.

Speaker 3 (07:18):
Right, Well, okay, so have you ever heard?
This is the mushroom that theSanta Claus comes from?
Okay, so have you ever heard?
This is the mushroom that theSanta Claus comes from.
So reindeer in Northern Europewould eat these mushrooms and
then their kidneys process theamatoxin, and so their urine
would contain the good stuffthat makes you hallucinate, but

(07:41):
not the amatoxin.

Speaker 2 (07:42):
So people Do you have to drink it or breathe it?
What are we doing here?

Speaker 3 (07:47):
or just eat the yellow snow.

Speaker 2 (07:50):
And yes, I would definitely go with snow covered
in urine as opposed to drinkingit straight.
Where are you growing up in?

Speaker 1 (07:57):
canada.
The first thing you're taughtwhen you're like two, two months
old is don't don't eat theyellow snow but then you don't
hallucinate.

Speaker 2 (08:05):
And where's the fun in that?

Speaker 3 (08:08):
well, it's only very specifically reindeer,
post-consuming amanita muscariamushrooms um, but anyways, you
roll the dice every time.
You eat these.
Every once in a while, there'smore amatoxin than hallucinogen
and you, you you, you, you biteit.
Uh, but this is one of thoseones that, like college kids,
will do Apparently.
I don't know, it's been a longtime since I was last in college

(08:31):
.

Speaker 2 (08:32):
Well, I know most of your book is about
hallucinogenic mushrooms, butwhat's the rest of it is is
what's what's the core, what'sthe core theme of of, of not
just your book.
You know your social mediasLike what's the core theme of,
not just your book, your socialmedias, what are you doing?

Speaker 3 (08:47):
So I think I would say my overall goal is to make
people feel good about the foodsthat they're already eating,
that are health-promoting, foodsthat they maybe don't realize
are health-promoting, the foodsyou already eat, that you
already enjoy, that are alreadyaccessible and affordable to you
, that are actually great foryou, foods that diet culture has

(09:12):
demonized.
I would say that's my numberone goal, and then, underneath
that is then maybe add a littleinspiration to add something
else, some new foods that arestill accessible and affordable
to you and still cater to yourflavor preferences, but that
will up your nutrient intakeeven more or fill in a
nutritional gap.

Speaker 1 (09:29):
What do you think number three under that is
taking walks through the woods?

Speaker 2 (09:33):
I see a lot of those videos, what, what would you say
, both of you.
But, like I say, like you, youdo this a lot.
So, like, what do you think islike the most demonized?
Like whole food, what do youlike because I'm sure you're
around this a lot for me, I feellike it has to be the potato.
I don't know like I think,because we're so anti-carb, it
might be potatoes.
I also kind of want to saymango, because I see a lot of

(09:55):
people like the anti-sugar groupand that's also carbs.
So I feel like potato and sugarare up there for me.
What do you guys think?
What do you guys?

Speaker 3 (10:02):
think so.
I, I mean, I definitely agree.
I feel like everybody loves tohate potatoes um.
I feel like oats nowadays.
I feel like everywhere I turnsomeone is saying oats are
peasant food and oats are fullof phytates and dave uh dave
asprey, I'll name names.
Fuck that guy, go ahead um Ialso feel like on the more

(10:27):
conventionally I am on this,like iceberg lettuce redemption
arc right now, like let's allappreciate the lowly iceberg
lettuce for its impressivenutritional value right crunchy
water or like nutritionalcardboard, like there's.
Everyone likes to dunk oniceberg lettuce, but it's
actually, when you do the math,it has more nutrients per
calorie than celery and everyonewants to elevate celery to like

(10:50):
miracle food status, buticeberg lettuce we should be
making iceberg lettuce Juice.

Speaker 2 (10:56):
Yeah, no, that's not what I said that's, that's not.
I know A whole iceberg lettucelike a whole head and just put
it in a glass.
That's the new, that I think Icould sell that as a trend.

Speaker 3 (11:09):
I feel like I could sell that as a trend.
Have you heard of lacto-carium?

Speaker 2 (11:14):
No.

Speaker 3 (11:15):
Also known as lettuce opium.

Speaker 2 (11:17):
Lettuce opium.
I like it so far, but no Soundsfamiliar.

Speaker 3 (11:22):
So lettuce all varieties of lettuce have this
phytonutrient calledlacto-carium, and it's actually
a little class of differentphytonutrients that have
analgesic properties.
They are mildly sedating andthey have been shown in clinical
trials where they isolate itand give it as a supplement.
They've been shown to improvesleep quality and architecture.

Speaker 1 (11:42):
Right.

Speaker 3 (11:42):
sleep are a quality and architecture right, and so
there is a trend of drinkinglettuce water before bed,
thinking that that that's not inany way going to give you
enough to carry him for that butthat is where that trend comes
from.
It comes from like there is areal compound in lettuce but it
takes like three heads oflettuce to get enough to have
any kind of effect.

Speaker 1 (12:01):
Okay, well, when we do two and a half.

Speaker 2 (12:04):
So that's it, when rob and I do our our full-on arc
and we go like full griftermode, we're gonna bring you back
on so we can figure out likeall the little, like little
things like that you know, sothat we know what to like kind
of sell.
I think that'll be reallyuseful you.

Speaker 3 (12:18):
You can actually buy lettuce seed extract as a
supplement now and uh, at dosesthat are similar to what they've
used in clinical trials.
So I'm sure I could give yousome citations of clinical
trials with like 30 people toback that one.

Speaker 2 (12:36):
Okay, well, I need to get into this topic because I
have something here.
So you have on Nutrivor.
Like it's kind of right, socorrect me if I'm wrong here.
But like it's a list of themost nutrient dense foods and
you kind of like list themore.
Like it's kind of right, socorrect me if I'm wrong here but
like it's a list of the mostnutrient dense foods and you
kind of like list them, listthem out.
You know the most, like themost nutrient dense foods,
lesser nutrient dense foods, andso you know, why don't you
maybe like what are like the top?

(12:57):
You know, maybe give us sometop 10 nutrient dense foods.
We're quizzing you on your ownbook.

Speaker 3 (13:02):
OK, that's fine.
So the single top most nutrientdense food is canned clam
liquid, which we are not.
Again, we're not starting acanned clam liquid drinking
trend out of this one Right now.

Speaker 2 (13:17):
Right now, we're not Right.

Speaker 1 (13:19):
No, we'll wait until you're gone, and then we don't
have to give you any of theroyalties.

Speaker 2 (13:22):
But wait, it's just the liquid, or it's the clams as
well?

Speaker 3 (13:26):
Clams are extremely nutrient dense but the liquid
has so much dissolved nutritionin it but it's also it only has
like five calories per cup.
So in the math when we calculatenutrient density, nutrient
density is defined as nutrientsper calorie, which means that
you have to divide by the energydensity of the food.

(13:47):
So a low energy density fooddoes not have to have a ton of
nutrients in order to have areally high nutrient density.
That's how canned clam liquidgets there, so that one cup
serving also has 500% of thedaily value of vitamin B12.
And then it has some other youknow other less levels of
vitamins and minerals and it'sgot some protein in it, kind of
similar to like broth, like afew grams um.

(14:10):
So it's really like that b12because clams are like one of
the most concentrated foodsources of b12.
That and five calories per cup,that drive that math up to be
so incredibly impressive.
It's not objectively a ton ofnutrients per serving, but it is
the type of thing that if youwere like to make linguine with
clam sauce or clam chowder ordrink Clamato juice, or us

(14:34):
Canadians like Caesars I don'tknow, Do you Americans drink
Caesars?

Speaker 1 (14:40):
It always seems like they don't know what we're
talking about when we just sayCaesars.

Speaker 2 (14:43):
No, I don't know.
Yeah, I'm not sure.
I know, little Caesars, is thatnutrient dense?

Speaker 3 (14:48):
Apparently, caesars, though, were invented in a bar
in New York, so I don't know whythis is such a Canadian
cocktail.
Anyways, it uses Clamato juice,so that is why I mentioned it.
But yeah, like it's a greatthing to incorporate, but again,
it's not.
I don't want us to call it asuperfood, but all of the foods

(15:08):
in the top 10 kind of fit thatsame pattern.
They're all very low energydensity foods, so garden cress
is like the second most nutrientdense food, because I've always
heard water cress is like upthere in nutrient density.
Yes, it's like number seven,like it is way way up, garden
cress beats it.
Yes, it's like number seven, itis way way up, garden Crest
beats it.
Garden Crest has just highervitamin and mineral content.
It's also have you ever triedit?

(15:29):
You kind of have to find it ina farmer's market.
It is like Watercress andArugula's like angry big sister,
like so spicy it is like allthe peppery of Arugula, like
times a hundred.

Speaker 1 (15:44):
I don't like really.
Ar garden crest is over 9 000are there okay?

Speaker 2 (15:51):
what else is there?
Any like drinks, maybe in the?

Speaker 3 (15:54):
coffee, coffee is is like way up there.
I don't I know I came with goodnews again.

Speaker 1 (16:01):
It's like, yeah, I've seen, I'm flipping through this
.
I saw coffee was like the topof several different charts in
here yes, I always like to leadwith the good news.

Speaker 3 (16:10):
Um, so coffee actually has a little bit of b
vitamins.
I don't think we we know that,but it's also really high in
polyphenols.
Right like the chlorogenic acidis a polyphenol, and then it
has some cool like cow oil andcafestol.
I don't know if I'm pronouncingthose correctly, so we'll just
pretend that I am nobody elsewe'll go in and just jump in
later these really cool, likeantioxidants that it has um and

(16:36):
uh, yeah, a little bit of bvitamins, and if you're drinking
it black, uh, one or twocalories per cup.
So that's also how it gets suchimpressive math.
And then a lot of leafy greens,right?
So, like chard rainbow chard isway up there Turnip greens,

(16:58):
mustard greens, collard greens.

Speaker 1 (16:59):
Almost everything else in the top 10 list is a
leafy vegetable, but PaulSaladino has told me to avoid
the greens.

Speaker 2 (17:02):
The greens, they've got oxalates and other words.

Speaker 3 (17:09):
Do we want to bust oxalates as a myth, have you?

Speaker 1 (17:14):
done this before.

Speaker 2 (17:15):
Hold on.
Before we do that, is there anyother drinks?
Like you know, maybe that'slike number 10 in there that
maybe like are a little weirdthat are there.

Speaker 3 (17:28):
So are you going to ask me about Rockstar Energy
drinks?
Is this what you're asking me?

Speaker 2 (17:36):
Hold on one second here.
I just got to drink my top 10.
One of my top 10 most nutrientdense foods.
It was getting warm, I had toget to it so it's not cold when
I go.
So it's cold when I go to it.

Speaker 3 (17:51):
I forget.

Speaker 2 (17:51):
You are stirring your day right now.

Speaker 3 (17:54):
So, fascinatingly enough, because it is so
incredibly, it's because you'redrinking.
I'm assuming you're drinkingthe diet version, so it has
almost 20 calories per can.

Speaker 2 (18:03):
Thank you very much.

Speaker 3 (18:10):
And so very, very low calorie because it uses
artificial sweeteners.
But it's also it's basically aB vitamin supplement with some
caffeine.
That's basically what energydrinks are.
So when you do the math you endup at a very high score because
again, it's like packed full ofB vitamins Caffeine's not in
the score, sadly, but packedfull of B vitamins for very low
energy density.
So you can just think of it asa B vitamin supplement in liquid

(18:31):
form.

Speaker 2 (18:32):
I will think of it.

Speaker 3 (18:33):
Is it tasty?
Are you enjoying drinking it?

Speaker 2 (18:35):
I have the silver ice variety.
I am a bit of a connoisseurwhen it comes to your energy
drinks here.

Speaker 1 (18:40):
I'm sorry, but their lemonade one is tops.

Speaker 2 (18:44):
I think this would be vintage 2016,.
If I'm correct, I could bewrong on that.
I'm not sure which vineyard theice comes from.
I'm assuming the ice is justgrown and then they harvest it
and make it silver and put it init's non-GMO ice as well.

Speaker 3 (19:01):
Right, you got to make sure you've got that it
depends on the variety.

Speaker 2 (19:05):
Some some they have to be gmo in order to survive
the climate.
It depends on where they'regrown and the altitude.

Speaker 1 (19:11):
There's a lot of fancy terms we have to make
climate change resistant ice yes, exactly right that.

Speaker 2 (19:17):
You know.
That's the heart of the issue.
But also what I like to thinkof is that when I go for one of
these, I'm going to have one ofthe the top 10 most nutrient
dense foods and you know, I'mgoing to feel better about
myself.

Speaker 3 (19:28):
I'm so glad that I could make you feel good about a
food that you already enjoy.

Speaker 1 (19:33):
I'm sure somebody right now stuck over here with
my, my Sprite with children'scough syrup in it, oh yeah.

Speaker 2 (19:41):
So it's.
It's.
It's a flavor of Sprite, butlike it tastes like cough syrup
in it.
Oh yeah, so it's a flavor ofSprite, but it tastes like cough
syrup apparently.

Speaker 1 (19:47):
Yeah, it's new flavor Sprite, chill cherry lime, and
I'm like this tastes like Spritewith a splash of cough syrup in
it, which.

Speaker 2 (19:56):
I love I'm going to be honest.
I love NyQuil.
It's so good.

Speaker 3 (19:58):
Okay, so I'm old enough that when I was a kid,
the coughs and maybe this is aCanadian thing too cough syrup
was green and tasted vile.
Did you have this cough syrupwhen you were a kid, rob?

Speaker 1 (20:09):
Like the Buckley's type stuff.

Speaker 3 (20:11):
It was a Tessa, tessam, tessa, something I don't
think.
I remember that I'll have tolike text my mom and be like
what was that?
Vile green cough syrup we hadto have when I was a kid?
Yeah, vile green cough syrup wehad to have when I was a kid.
Uh, yeah, I don't.
I wouldn't willingly consumethat flavor ever, doesn't matter

(20:32):
what it's mixed with no, thecherry is where it's at like.

Speaker 2 (20:35):
If I was, you know, if I was in I you know what's it
called scissor, I think, asthey call it, or lean is the
other term, where basically youdrink, you mix with cough syrup.
I'm not saying I've ever donethat, but I'm saying that the
idea of it doesn't soundhorrible.
I don't know if it's in top 10most nutrient-dense foods, but
anyway.

Speaker 3 (20:54):
I don't know that I have complete enough nutrition
data to be able to calculate anutrition score for you.

Speaker 2 (20:58):
I don't see scissor on your list, sarah, I'm a
little disappointed.

Speaker 3 (21:01):
Yeah, sadly, sarah, I'm a little disappointed yeah,
sadly I have the same challengethat all nutrient profiling
methods have is, that is uh,incomplete data right.

Speaker 2 (21:08):
Yes, yeah, that's true, but I would okay.
So people have here's the thingI found especially doing
tiktoks.
People have a very shortattention span, so I'd love to
get into a little bit, just likebecause you talk about a lot,
like you were just sayingearlier how people already are,
help them feel better about thefoods they're already eating,
but also, like, introduce maybesome other foods.

(21:28):
So, like I don't know, I'd loveto get your take on some of,
like your, your favorite foods,the foods you talk a lot, you
know that are higher up on thenutrient density score, that
people maybe don't realize.
And then, just like you know afew that like, hey, I want to
talk about this.
People really like that, likeyou know what are some little
things we all can do here, weall enjoy.

Speaker 3 (21:50):
So I think probably the three foods that I talk
about the most often are likejust vegetables in general, I
think I don't think that's asurprise.

Speaker 2 (22:03):
I don't think anybody's shocked Wait,
vegetables are good.

Speaker 3 (22:05):
Right, vegetables are good.
They're nutrient, dense Wait, Ididn't-.

Speaker 2 (22:07):
But they have sugar.
There's some carnivores outthere that probably disagree.

Speaker 3 (22:12):
There is certainly some people who demonize
vegetables, but I think that thereason why I talk about that is
because the average Americanconsumption is about 1.6
servings per day, and scientificstudies show that our benefits
are maximized at somewherebetween three and five servings
per day.

Speaker 2 (22:31):
So there's like a lot of room for improvement in
terms of how much vegetables 1.6is higher than I thought, if
I'm being perfectly honest, butgo ahead.

Speaker 3 (22:38):
Well, I am single-handedly bringing up that
average.
So yeah me and my like, 14servings per day are definitely-
.

Speaker 1 (22:44):
Oh, wait, wait, wait, wait.
Was that the canadian averageor the american?

Speaker 3 (22:47):
average, I was I was yeah, it was celsius uh, and I
want freedom units here, please.

Speaker 2 (22:55):
Thank you very much.

Speaker 3 (22:56):
Okay, go ahead, um and then uh.
The other one I talk about alot is fruit, but I think there
is a lot of fear about fruit.

Speaker 2 (23:04):
Can you dispel some of that and tell people they're
dumb?
I mean, I'll tell peoplethey're dumb, but you go ahead
and give their reasons.

Speaker 3 (23:11):
I would say it is normal to be afraid of fruit
because there's a lot of mixedmessages coming from diet
culture that make you think thatthe sugar in fruit is going to
be equally as bad as the sugarin soda or candy, and the
science shows that it'sabsolutely not true that we
actually there's some healthoutcomes for which fruit

(23:32):
actually has a bigger impactthan vegetables or whole grains
or legumes, especially thingslike colon cancer.
But also it's fruits reallygood for metabolic health in
general.
So cardiovascular disease, typetwo diabetes and studies show
that eating two or threeservings of fruit per day is

(23:53):
vastly superior for our overallhealth and long-term health than
eating none.

Speaker 2 (23:57):
What is a serving?
Can you just give people realquick, like what's a serving?

Speaker 3 (24:01):
A serving is one cup, measured, chopped, which
translates to a fruit about thesize of your fist.
I actually really like the fistbecause I probably have teeny,
tiny, like I have really smallhands, but I'm also not the
tallest of people I love thefist as a visual approximation,
because it actually builds inscale Right.

(24:22):
So like if you're a biggerperson on average, you're going
to have bigger hands.
There's obviously a lot ofvariability.
You might be able to fit yourwhole hand in your mouth, so
that means a serving of fruitfor you.
Rob is one bite a massive, hugebite um so but I like.

(24:42):
I like that because you canbasically scale down for kids
that way.
Just think of a serving asbeing about the size of their
fist.
Um, you can scale up for a sixand a half foot tall person,
like I maybe know, of one or twoum, or for someone like me, it
scales very well.

Speaker 2 (25:03):
And so two to three of those a day is where we see
kind of the most benefit.

Speaker 3 (25:06):
That's the like sweet spot.
So some studies show that abovethree servings per day like, if
you look at all, causemortality or cardiovascular
disease risk, you kind of see itlevel out.
So you just got no additionalbenefit.
Above there are a couple ofstudies that start to show like
a loss of benefit above threeservings per day.
So it's like not, so you justgot no additional benefit.
Above there are a couple ofstudies that start to show like
a loss of benefit above threeservings per day.
So it's like not.
So you see more of like au-shaped dose response where you

(25:27):
have like that sweet spot isthat because you're excluding
other things that could behealthy by adding like more?
certainly yeah you're gettingthe benefit from the fruit, but
you could be getting morebenefit from vegetables or
legumes or whatever else um,there is a there is a little bit
of research uh with fruit, whenyour fructose intakes gets to
like 100 grams per day, showingthat that can have some

(25:49):
metabolic uh harm as well.
So there is also the like uhexcess fructose, so you don't
recommend fruit fruititariandiets or just basically only
fruit I would.
I would say, the science wouldsupport a more diverse diet than
that as being optimal.

Speaker 1 (26:09):
That's the nice, that's the canadian answer.
Right there, liam, give him theamerican answer?

Speaker 2 (26:14):
the american answer is don't do that stupid shit,
I'm sorry.
Any super restrictive diet I'mfully against.
I don't care if it'sfruititarian or carnivore, um,
okay, so, yeah, um, so you know,I kind of wanted to talk about
one thing too.
I know I'm just jumping to shitlike, please, you know, you can
always just jump in.
You put me on the spot, do it Iremember so, like I always like

(26:35):
the the university of michigansorry, my wife just got home, my
dogs are freaking out, um andthe university of michigan, uh,
did a study where they looked atlike 4 800 foods and they're
like how much, how many minutesthey take away or add to your
life, which I just thought waslike an interest, because that's
just something people can belike.

Speaker 3 (26:51):
Okay, I don't really understand food, but I know
minutes and I know life becauseof your first tiktok audit.
So, yes, I know exactly whatstudy you're talking about.

Speaker 2 (26:59):
I just found it interesting, but, like of all
the food groups, I thought itwas interesting.
The time that they the mosttime added to your life,
according to them, was nuts andseeds, which I thought was kind
of interesting, because I wouldalways assume it was like
vegetables which vegetables?
Obviously, good you know.
But it seemed like more timewas added through nuts and seeds
and even like fatty fish.

Speaker 3 (27:27):
What do you?
What are your thoughts?
What do you got?
What do you think?
So I don't think this iscontrary to other science.
So what they did was reallyinteresting was they kind of
converted a decrease inall-cause mortality to an extra
minutes of life.
But there are lots of studiesthat measure this just by
looking at reductions inall-cause mortality, so just a
general indicator of health andlongevity.
We're kind of capturing a wholepile of different health
possibilities as well as justlike lifespan in that
measurement.
And so vegetables tend toreduce all-cause mortality by

(27:51):
like 20 to 25% sort of maximally.
So if you're eating that threeto five servings, that's kind of
like the amount of benefit youcan expect, and an ounce of nut
seeds and peanuts will reduceall cause mortality more in that
like 30 to 40% range.
So I think there's some thingsthat nuts and seeds give us

(28:15):
nutritionally that we really arenot like.
Vitamin E is one of the mostcommon nutrient shortfalls and
as a fat soluble antioxidantlike it's kind of special,
whereas a lot of water solubleantioxidants, right like vitamin
C, but also like polyphenols,can kind of make up for each
other, whereas we don't reallyhave a lot of fat soluble

(28:38):
antioxidants in our bodies.
So vitamin E doesn't have asmany other nutrients that can uh
like make up the differencefunctionally for us.
So I think a large part of itis vitamin E, um the fiber in
nuts and seeds has been shown togrow uh really important
probiotic species of bacteria inour gut microbiomes in a lot of

(29:01):
different studies.
So, I think there's definitely agut microbiome aspect there,
and then heart healthy fats,right.
So I think, right, my nuts andseeds tend to be high in oleic
acid, but as well asalpha-linolenic acid and
linoleic acid, so all fats thatwe know improve cardiovascular

(29:22):
disease risk, so I think it'skind of that combination of
nutrients that we're notnecessarily getting from other
places.
What's fascinating, though, isthe benefits of nuts and seeds
caps out at about an ounce perday, whereas with vegetables oh,
so you're saying?

Speaker 2 (29:35):
my half jar of peanut butter isn't-.

Speaker 3 (29:38):
It's equivalent to health-wise is two tablespoons
once you.
Once you hit two tablespoons,any extra is is not actually
still it's an excuse to have twotablespoons of peanut butter
every day exactly.
It would benefit your health.

Speaker 2 (29:54):
It would be vastly superior to no peanut butter and
can you tell people like, hey,listen we, but guys, buddy out
there, todd Todd.
We know that peanuts are alegume, but like we classify
things with, like you know, Okay, I have a.

Speaker 3 (30:10):
I have a.
I have a soapbox.
I need to get on right now.

Speaker 2 (30:13):
Yes, please.

Speaker 3 (30:14):
Okay, so there are botanical definitions, which is
fascinating.
Botany is a great.
Thank you, charles Darwin.
We understand botany.
It's fascinating.
It tells us something about theevolution of the thing.
It's great.
Botany is a full, legit science.

(30:34):
It is not nutritional sciences.
Nutritional sciencescategorizes foods based on their
nutrient profiles, based on thetypes of nutrients they contain
.
So we group foods togetherbased on their nutrition.
So banana is a tropical fruit,strawberries are a berry, so we
are going to categorize tomatoesare a vegetable.

Speaker 2 (30:56):
They are a vegetable.

Speaker 3 (30:59):
Cucumbers are a vegetable and peanuts are a nut
Squash pumpkin.
And this all has to do withgrouping foods together based on
the nutrients they contain,because it's nutritional
sciences and we want tounderstand the nutrient
contribution that foods make toour bodies.
Thank, you.
Not the flour part that grew tothe thing.

Speaker 1 (31:19):
I see that people use the botanical definitions and I
, I like I just start throwingit at them that well, you guess
you better stop callingstrawberries a berry and I guess
you better start callingcucumbers a berry right or
pumpkin pumpkin is a berrysquash yep, uh, it drives me so

(31:40):
crazy when people do like this,I do like, oh, sneaky veggies,
and like half of those arefruits, like shut the hell up.

Speaker 3 (31:48):
Okay, it's my most viral video was about tomatoes
being a vegetable and not afruit and people get pit.

Speaker 2 (31:56):
Why?
Why are you all so angry?
It's like, okay, I'm notgetting into it, we got shit to
get to I know why people like tobe right on the internet.

Speaker 3 (32:04):
I think, yeah, I think you're right people.
Yeah, I like to be right.

Speaker 1 (32:07):
People like to show that they're better than you
yeah, I think that's just whatit is and being technically
right is the best part of beingright like you know, like I want
to be technically and I thinksome people just like to do the
um, actually, um, actuallyexcuse me, excuse me actually
tomatoes I can't tell you howmany times I've started to type

(32:29):
a comment well actually and thenbeen like, no, don't do that.

Speaker 3 (32:33):
Back up, back up, back up, back up, and then
instead find some otherconstructive way to add okay.

Speaker 2 (32:40):
But getting back to it here, though, I want to know,
like, what are some like commonfoods that you can see at the
store that you can add into yourdiet, If maybe you have some
more affordable options, maybejust there's some options that
just are more common that peoplejust might not think about.
They're like oh, I could addthat to my diet and that would
be a net benefit for me.
I could add that to my diet andthat would be a net benefit for

(33:00):
me.

Speaker 3 (33:01):
So, um like, let's just stick with the most
affordable stuff, because Ithink that's accessible for
everyone.

Speaker 1 (33:06):
Yes, frozen mixed vegetables.
Yes.

Speaker 3 (33:10):
Frozen mixed vegetables.
You can throw them intoanything, or you can just steam
them Some of them that you canthrow the whole bag in the
microwave and cook them that way.
Um, and not only does that giveyou more vegetables, you can
get some that are pre seasonedwith different sauces.
Right, you can get them thatare going to taste good.
So not only is that going tohelp you eat more vegetables,
but it's also going to help youeat a wider variety of

(33:33):
vegetables, which is kind ofseparately beneficial compared
to just eating enough vegetablesright, because I think a lot of
people get caught up in likewhat's the best food or the most
like kind of nutrient densefood which I get.

Speaker 2 (33:43):
Like it's totally interesting and fascinating.
You made a whole thing about it.
That's cool.
But like I think you would youagree right that like diversity
is kind of the key here and justgetting different sources.
So like the mixed vegetablesthat Canada especially
affordability, yeah, where $100will get your grocery bag about

(34:04):
this big, whenever I make avideo everybody's like in Canada
that'll be $10,000.
I'm like it was a jar of peanutbutter.

Speaker 3 (34:09):
Every time I go home to visit family and I go to the
grocery store, I'm like havesticker shock.
Yeah, when we moved to America,we definitely, in terms of our
grocery bills, made an upgradefor sure.
Yeah, and I grew up onVancouver Island, so we had like
island effect prices on top ofCanadian prices oh, wow.

(34:34):
Yeah, this is Liam's like islandeffect.
There's no bridge, so all thestuff has to come over on a boat
.
Wait, what's an island?
What it's?
Because there's no bridge, soall the stuff has to come over
on a boat wait, what's an islandthat's surrounded by lava.

Speaker 1 (34:45):
Right, yes, correct, yes, okay, good yeah, that was
it, except in canada we calllava ice and you can only cross
it by jumping from couch cushionto couch cushion.

Speaker 2 (34:59):
Don't touch the lava, okay, but what are some other
things that people can add totheir diet?

Speaker 3 (35:05):
that's only available Canned fish Canned fish Canned
fish.

Speaker 2 (35:08):
But tuna has all the mercury in it.
I'm not going to die, it doesnot.

Speaker 3 (35:12):
So the selenium health benefit value of mercury
is about 20, which means that ithas roughly 20 times more
selenium than mercury.
So that selenium binds to themercury in the tuna and prevents
it from being absorbed intoyour body.
And also because mercury bindsirreversibly to selenium and the
way mercury hurts us is bybinding with selenium based
proteins in our body.

(35:33):
It's already bound, can't, evenif it is absorbed, can't, can't
, do anything.
I'm literally pointing to myhead head.
It's because we have like 25different seleno enzymes in our
brain that protect our brainfrom oxidative damage.
That's why mercury poisoningcauses so many neurological
symptoms.
Um, but I felt like I needed toexplain why I'm pointing to my
head when I'm talking about tunafish for all those listening.

Speaker 2 (35:56):
She was pointing to her head if you didn't, if you
didn't catch that so I think,people, like we always hear,
like salmon and like fattierfish, which like obviously, yeah
, those are great, I'm notknocking those.

Speaker 3 (36:07):
But I think people kind of poo-poo your salmons,
your tilapias, like you know,like those other fish that are
just like, oh, they're justprotein and that's it, or
something people poo-pooing myfish, yeah so, albert's, I mean
the fatty fish are great becausethey have those long-chain
omega-3 fatty acidseicosapentaenoic acid and
docosahexaenoic acid which arethe omega-3s that have all the

(36:31):
benefits to cardiovascularhealth, immune health and
neurological health.
They reduce risk of Alzheimer'sdisease and heart disease and
all kinds of good stuff.
So, yeah, I mean fatty fish aregreat, but there have been
studies that look at white fishspecifically and show that
they're basically equally asbeneficial for cardiovascular
outcomes, for cognitive outcomesand for all cause mortality.

(36:54):
And that's even white fishstill has some mega threes,
right Like it's yeah it doesn'thave as much, but it still is
providing those healthy fats.
Even tilapia has those healthyfats.
But also it's the quality ofthe protein.
So there have been some studiesgranted, they're like human gut

(37:14):
models rather than actualhumans, but when they compare
different protein sources andhow that impacts the gut
microbiome.
To get us back to gut bacteriabecause that's one of my
favorite side tangents to go on,actually really beneficial for
increasing microbial diversityin the gut and growth of
keystone species.
So, and fishes, typically, evenyour like most boring white

(37:40):
fish, your tilapia is going tobe two to three times more
nutrient dense than chicken orpork or beef.
So it's also going to have a lotmore vitamins and minerals in
addition to protein.

Speaker 1 (37:52):
See, I grew up on a lot of white fish.
So, people, if you want to growup like me which I know you do-
dig into your white fish, yourfish and chips, your fish and
poutine.

Speaker 2 (38:02):
And people always and we've talked about poo-poo fish
I always see it like peoplelike don't eat tilapia, they
just eat shit, like that's likethey eat just horrible food, or
you know, they just give themwhatever and that's why you
shouldn't eat them.
And then they'll turn aroundand eat pork Right.

Speaker 3 (38:43):
Right, that's fair.
Whatever meets the regulations.
Um but um, when fish are growninto dirty of water, they don't
survive.
Has anyone tried to keep fishalive in a fish tank?
It is extremely challenging.
This is fair.
You spend a lot, a lot of timeat the pet store replacing fish
before the kids come home fromschool, yep.
So uh, just scale that toaquaculture and and have an
understanding for like it'sactually quite a sophisticated
science to grow fish, and notjust that but when things eat

(39:07):
something, they break it downjust the same we do and it
becomes the base components.

Speaker 1 (39:12):
You're not eating the garbage in the fish.
You're eating the componentsthat got broken down into.

Speaker 2 (39:19):
I hear that a lot from like the keto carnivore
side.
Like you, you you eat what yourfood ate.
Like they always say that a lotand I'm like I mean I guess I
can kind of see the connectionsbut I'm not so sure that tracks
like the one for one there uh, Imean I, I see the argument for
something like grass-fed beef,where there like is a little bit

(39:40):
more nutrition in the meat thanthan grain fed, and that has to
do with the.

Speaker 3 (39:45):
They're getting more nutrition from grass than
they're getting from corn orwhatever.
Um, but I I think that's takinglike you are what you eat,
first of all, far too literally,and then also turning it into a
, a chain of events that doesn'tquite follow.

Speaker 2 (40:00):
It seems to make it confusing on purpose, so that
you can then like kind of getthem to follow, like oh, so I
got to follow you to find outwhat I should eat.
It kind of feels like.

Speaker 3 (40:08):
it kind of feels like but before you're saying I
should be more confusing in mycontent, and that is how I will.

Speaker 2 (40:13):
That's how you get more following for sure, but
before we move on to fish, thething I always see like even
it's just like like I I work ata hospital and when I say I go
to school for nutrition, I talkabout things.
They're always like I only everbuy wild caught.
I never get the farm raisedstuff because that's garbage,
like I heard that multiple times.
Can you give us like a littlebit on just like, tell people

(40:33):
it's maybe okay to kill likefarm it's absolutely.

Speaker 3 (40:38):
There's actually been a couple of studies where they
give people farm-raised salmonand then have them do like
different types of cognitivetests after, like before or
after, or they do a pre-serumcholesterol panel and like
post-serum cholesterol panel andshow that eating like
farm-raised salmon a couple oftimes a week improves health
outcomes.
So they've actually done thisin clinical trials.

(41:00):
Um, so we know farm-raisedsalmon does improve health.
Um, but if we just look at itnutritionally, there's a little
bit more nutrition in wildcaught, for sure, but uh, farmed
is still incredibly nutrientdense, like it's.
Depending on the type of fish,the differences can be anywhere
between zero.

(41:21):
Like catfish is like identicalbetween farmed and wild, to I
think.
Um, some of the types of salmonare like 50 60 percent higher
in wild versus farmed.
But your, your baseline number,you're like farmed salmon,
you're you're the thing you'recomparing it against is already
now like four times higher thanchicken breast, right?
So like we're comparing awesometo awesomer.

Speaker 2 (41:45):
Awesomer, I should have started with a different.
No, I like awesomer, I preferawesomer.
We go with that.

Speaker 3 (41:52):
Awesomer to awesomest .
So all of the myths that areout there about farmed salmon
are very easily disproved byknowing anything about how
they're raised.
There's mandatory withdrawalperiods for the antibiotics that
are used, so that there is noresidue measurable in the meat,
and different antibiotics havedifferent mandatory withdrawal

(42:15):
periods periods, and in northamerica and europe we don't like
we've got so much, uh likesupervision over that industry
that there haven't been cases of, uh, people breaking those
regulations for a very, verylong time.
Um, I think the other mythabout farmed fish is that the
food color added the acid andit's added to the feed um, it is

(42:40):
the exact same.
It's usually even added to thefeed in the form of red algae.
It's usually not even isolatedastaxanthin that's added to
their feed.
It is the exact same thing thatwild salmon are getting in
their diet like biomagnified.

Speaker 1 (42:54):
Yeah, to isolate it would be just an extra process
that they have to pay for.

Speaker 3 (42:58):
And the whole reason why farm salmon isn't quite the
same vibrant pink is becauseit's an extremely expensive
ingredient.
So they're adding as much asthey need to to make it
appealing enough for us to buyit, but not as much as what
would be like make it the samecolor as wild, because it
doesn't change what we'rewilling to buy or how much we're

(43:19):
willing to pay for it, for howmuch more money it costs them in
the feed.

Speaker 1 (43:22):
So that's just economics and then with the one,
more is the uh, the sea liceand the parasites and stuff in
the farmed salmon and like thepeople who complain about that
have never gone fishing.

Speaker 3 (43:39):
Correct yeah, because as a fisherman and who picture,
I'm going to let you two talkover each other.

Speaker 2 (43:45):
I'm just going to sit over here and drink my rock
star.

Speaker 1 (43:46):
Yeah, we'll talk over each other, liam, will have a
drink.
As a fisherman I can tell youI've pulled out a lot of fish
that have had worms and otherthings in them, like it's way
more common in wild fish, wherethey aren't treated yes, um.

Speaker 3 (44:04):
So I was going to say the same thing because I also
grew up.
I grew up fishing.
I grew up really poor, so welike fished and foraged for,
like that's just canada, rightbut also, yes, that's what
happens when you you grow up incanada on an island where you
have island effect prices um forgroceries but it's terrible go
ahead.
It's just so much lava.
So, um, so I was going to saythere are.

(44:27):
There have been some fisherieslike the.
The fisheries in scotland havehad a few different sea lice
outbreaks that have made thenews.
That's where, like those reallydisturbing pictures come from
on the internet and, like they,they have had this challenge
like recurring and there is whenyou have those outbreaks in
fish farms, you have thepotential for extra spillover

(44:49):
into the wild population.
So like that is a challenge andlike absolutely that needs to
be fixed and I think we can'tjudge an entire industry based
on an unusual situation in onearea of the world that people
are trying to solve.
But I think that is being usedas the photography to support

(45:09):
this myth that's being spreadthat, like all, fish farms
everywhere are infested with sealice and that's why they're
pouring chemicals into the water.

Speaker 2 (45:17):
It always seems the more affordable option gets
demonized.
That's why they're pouringchemicals into the water.
It always seems the moreaffordable option gets demonized
.
When are we going to get to thepoint where caviar is terrible
for you because it's got a bunchof shit in it, or something
like that?
Can we get to that?

Speaker 3 (45:28):
Wait, no, that's already happened.
I'm sorry, liam, you missed2016 caviar gate.

Speaker 2 (45:38):
I want, like foie gras or whatever, to get like
demonized and not like my beansand oats Wait foie gras has been
demonized.

Speaker 3 (45:45):
It's been made illegal most of the world.

Speaker 2 (45:48):
Is it?
Yes, I don't know fancy shit.
Okay, listen, I don't knowanything about anything that
costs over $5 per.

Speaker 3 (45:56):
Foie gras.
So the way foie gras wastraditionally made was they
force-fed ducks and goose to thepoint where they had, like
non-alcoholic, fatty liverdisease.
That's why that's why theirlivers had so much fat content,
and so they.
It was like animal cruelty, soit's been made illegal.

Speaker 1 (46:12):
That's good I like that.
Yeah, there's only a couplecountries left that can do it
interesting.

Speaker 2 (46:18):
Well see, now I feel better.
Yeah, I like the fancy stuffgets fucking taken down.

Speaker 3 (46:24):
Fuck you rich people anyway uh, you're right, though,
that I think this is a a bigchallenge.
In like diet culture, wellnesscommunity is, the bar is
constantly being raised as towhat you have to do to be like
following the rules of beinghealthy, and it's always like
the next more expensive thingalways the next more expensive

(46:45):
thing now it's the three hundreddollar a month supplement on
top of your next more expensivething, the three thousand dollar
special bamboo mattress oh, thematch up.

Speaker 2 (46:55):
Guys, I'm at the hole .
It's so ridiculous wait.

Speaker 3 (46:58):
So is it comfortable?
I'm just, I'm just asking for afriend.

Speaker 2 (47:02):
How would I know I'm not going to pay $3,000 for a
mattress?

Speaker 3 (47:08):
I'm just wondering if I could sell out and get one
for free.

Speaker 2 (47:12):
Probably.

Speaker 1 (47:15):
Just tell them that Bobby sent you.

Speaker 3 (47:18):
That would work.
That would work.
Okay, okay, okay, that wouldwork.

Speaker 2 (47:21):
Okay, okay, okay.
Enough with the rich people.
What else, what else?
Okay, I want to get to mylegumes.
I want my legumes to be onthere.

Speaker 3 (47:28):
Okay, Sorry.
The next one, after frozenmixed vegetables and canned fish
, is dried beans.
I mean canned beans are finetoo, but dried beans are way
cheaper, which is why I'mfocusing on dried beans.
They just take a little bit offorethought because you have to
put them in some water to soakbefore you cook them.
I mean, you can do the rapidcook, but the rapid cook is not
even that rapid right.

Speaker 2 (47:47):
So right, yeah.
I think you don't want to, justsuck a ton of lectins and
whatever, because that's always.
I always found that interesting.
They demonize beans because oflectins, but that's like, just
like, yeah, don't eat raw beans.

Speaker 3 (47:57):
But if you properly prepare the beans, you basically
reduce the lectins by 95 to 100percent, depending on the bean.

Speaker 2 (48:04):
Ok, yeah, does it matter?
Like any beans, like it does,like pretty much any of them, it
doesn't matter.

Speaker 3 (48:22):
Any and yes any beans .
So like kidney beans, pintobeans, black beans, chickpeas,
lentils, they all are ourdensest sources of fiber, so
they're the most fiber peramount of food that you're going
to get and we're talking aboutgut health, I know fiber, gut
health good, yes, fiber.
Check Pro column.
So fiber, gut health good, yes,fiber Check, check Pro column.
But also so legumes are themost nutrient-dense starchy
foods.
So of any sort of likeslow-burning starches, if you're

(48:44):
going to compare that to wholegrains or you're going to
compare that to root vegetables,on average legumes win by a
factor of two or three,especially over whole grains.
Whole grains are reallygenerally pretty underwhelming
nutritionally and just in termsof like vitamins and minerals.
They obviously are stillbeneficial.
They've still got really goodfiber, but compared to a legume

(49:05):
like legumes are always going tobeat out just about any whole
grain in terms of vitamins,minerals and antioxidant
polyphenols going to be veryhigh in legumes and to go back
to the gut microbiome so muchscience showing benefits of
legumes like so much.

Speaker 1 (49:23):
Legumes are so underrated.

Speaker 2 (49:25):
They're so underrated .
I just love them so much.

Speaker 3 (49:28):
I feel like you either grew up with legumes as a
cultural food and it's one ofyour staples, or you have no
idea how to eat them or makethem.

Speaker 1 (49:42):
Or you have never eaten fiber and you try them
once and they give you thatsuper gas, and then the limerick
becomes the truth.
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (49:53):
Going from zero to 100 in fiber.
Man, that is a lot.
Fiber is definitely an ease upslowly, nutrient for sure, we
talk about that a lot.

Speaker 2 (50:03):
Yeah, so much.

Speaker 3 (50:05):
Well wait, liam, did you say you eat 100 grams of
fiber per day?

Speaker 2 (50:08):
I can easily eat one to 150, for sure Not every day,
I wouldn't say it's like everyday, but like when I get my like
five fiber wraps or stuff whereI have cheesy pudding in the
morning with berries and then Ihave my bean, like you know,
super chill.
I make a lot of chilies, likepotatoes as well.

Speaker 3 (50:23):
So I feel really proud of hitting 50 regularly,
like I feel, like I well, I alsoeat 3500 calories a day, so
it's a lot easier that's almost.
That's dumb.
Yeah, I'm eating the samepercentage of my diet right,
exactly, I'm sure, percentagewise it's probably about the
same.

Speaker 1 (50:40):
Yeah, my, my dietary index usually around 70.

Speaker 2 (50:44):
Wow, yeah, yeah I mean you just gotta, you gotta
get there slowly, like I alwayssay, like add a few berries, add
, add a few, like you know,these little things.

Speaker 1 (50:55):
Oh, okay, so then what's it then?

Speaker 2 (50:57):
you were talking about whole grains, though, and
they're a little underwhelming.
So like can you give us alittle deal on just like whole
grains?
Like how, what to shoot forwhat we're looking at?

Speaker 3 (51:14):
Like I don't.
I think there way.
I kind of think of, I think ofgrains, root vegetables and
legumes as like the starchy foodgroup.
So they're all going to give usslow burning starches and I
think they're prettyinterchangeable within those.
So I I'm not I'm not soconvinced by the science and
whole grains to kind of thinklike these are a must food but

(51:34):
they're definitely a beneficialfood and they're definitely
great budget stretching food.
So I'm like not anti-grain butI'm not like whole grain.
Rah, rah, rah.
Does that make sense?

Speaker 2 (51:43):
Yeah, you don't have, you know you?
Yeah, you don't need to set,you don't need to set aside
these into my diet.

Speaker 3 (51:50):
Yeah.
So I feel like if you'regetting legumes and root
vegetables as you're gettingthose fiber dense, slow burning
starchy foods, slow burningcarbohydrate right, the starchy
foods.
I think those are prettyinterchangeable with grains.
I think grains are greatbecause they're cheap and
obviously whole grains are theones that are associated with

(52:10):
health benefit and refinedgrains not Not so much.

Speaker 2 (52:13):
Is there any like specific whole grains, like
maybe oats or barley overwhatever, or just kind of just
doesn't matter too?

Speaker 3 (52:20):
much Oats and barley are like the special ones
because they have a type offiber called beta-glucan, which
is the type of soluble fiberthat has been so strongly
associated with reducedcardiovascular disease risk like
not just lowering cholesterolbut actually translating to
lower cardiovascular diseaseincidence.
And also that's the type offiber that has been shown to

(52:42):
improve blood sugar regulation.
So people have shown that ifyou add oat fiber to a meal that
it blunts the blood sugarresponse to that meal.
So oats, kind of like for sureall of the benefits of oats uh,
that you've heard from yourcardiologist are true uh, so
what about all the negativethings?

Speaker 2 (53:02):
spent it from the shirtless guy in the grocery
store those?

Speaker 1 (53:05):
those are not true but the shirtless guy is
shirtless in a grocery store.
How can you be lying to?

Speaker 2 (53:12):
But I've heard phytic acid and, oh God, glyphosate.

Speaker 3 (53:17):
Did you know that phytic acid is nearly chemically
identical to myoinositol, whichyou can get as a supplement for
improving blood sugarregulation, and that there have
been some studies where theyactually give people phytic acid
as a supplement and show thatit increases markers of bone
mineralization, so potentiallycould be therapeutic for

(53:40):
osteoporosis?
Uh, that it has been shown umto I think it was.
Oh gosh, I'm trying to rememberI think it was type 2 diabetes,
but I'm trying to rememberexactly what the study was like.
There have been studies wherethey give people phytic acid as
a supplement, so you need tosend me that.

Speaker 2 (53:56):
I need to do that, I will send you, yeah.

Speaker 3 (53:59):
So there have been a couple of clinical trials where
they like give people phyticacid as a supplement and show
that it's good it is.
So whatever the monomer is thatmyo-ion acetal and phytic acid
are based on.
Myo-ion acetal is five of themas a as a polymer, and phytic
acid is six, so that like it'sjust got one extra of whatever
that base molecule is yeah, yeah, so no, I think phytic acid is

(54:24):
actually beneficial for us yeah,get your oats.

Speaker 2 (54:28):
I I hate the demonization votes, been just
really annoying me anyway Before.
So I want to make sure, beforewe get to like the end of it,
cause I were going to get ontolike an hour here I want some
fun facts.
I like all your little funfacts, okay, and so the one I
remember that I want to, I wantto bring up cause I remember it
and I like it was that like thepolyphenols that are like found

(54:49):
in berries can maybe help reduce, like delayed onset muscle
soreness, like I remember thatone.
I like that.
I like that as a fun fact.

Speaker 3 (55:02):
Also the beetolines in beets and rainbow chard can
do the same thing and I'veactually been shown.
They've done studies where theygive people like beetroot juice
.
It's usually like theequivalent of like one serving a
day for a couple of weeks andthen they'll have them do
something like a marathon andthen they'll come back the next
day for like a recovery workoutand so their recovery workout
they'll have like lower markersof muscle damage, but then

(55:23):
they'll like run their recovery5k faster, so they have like way
better muscle recoveryafterwards.
So beets also do the same thing.
Anthocyanins it seems to belike a pain killing in addition
to antioxidants.
Beetalain seems to be more likeanti-inflammatory, so different
.
So both.
So I would just say like beetsand berries in a smoothie.

(55:45):
Have you ever tried thattogether?
They're quite good, they're anice combination.

Speaker 2 (55:48):
They work together well, it'd be a fun color.
At least it is, it is.

Speaker 3 (55:55):
The flavors.
The flavors melt Like I feel,like the flavors go together.
So yeah, so beetolene is alsosuper, super good for for muscle
repair.
Other fun ones I'm just goingto bring this one, Cause this is
my like.

Speaker 2 (56:08):
My favorite one is yeah, that's what I want.
I want the.
I want the good fun ones.
Yes, so, calcium.

Speaker 3 (56:14):
We all know calcium for bones right Like calcium
electrolytic.

Speaker 2 (56:17):
Bones and teeth Right .
Yes.

Speaker 3 (56:19):
Did you know that calcium intake is, like, almost
exactly correlated with theseverity of PMS symptoms, and
people who menstruate who eatmore calcium have a much lower
chance of having PMS?
Well, Liam doesn't woman, so hedefinitely didn't know that but

(56:40):
presumably shall be at somepoint relevant in your life.
You shall be supporting child.

Speaker 2 (56:48):
I shall be supporting child?
I don't think so.

Speaker 1 (56:54):
Did you for a split second.
You forgot you had a child,didn't you?

Speaker 2 (56:56):
no, I just like the way she phrased it.
I'm gonna phrase it that fromnow I shall be supporting child
soon.
Um, yeah, okay.
So calc, okay.
So what are what are calciumsources and foods?
I leafy greens, yes, soactually leafy greens and
cruciferous vegetables.

Speaker 3 (57:11):
Dairy products, uh, canned fish with the bones, like
sardines, and canned salmon.

Speaker 2 (57:15):
Oh, because you need the bones.

Speaker 1 (57:17):
So the bones?

Speaker 2 (57:17):
of my enemies are giving me calcium.

Speaker 1 (57:20):
Yes.

Speaker 2 (57:21):
Yes, they are.

Speaker 3 (57:23):
Why do you think I have the ax?

Speaker 1 (57:25):
Liam.

Speaker 3 (57:27):
This is where the man versus bear conversation really
needs to go.

Speaker 2 (57:33):
Okay so I like that.
Okay so calcium okay so calcium, berries, polyphenols,
anthocyanins, all that stuff,what, what, what else, what,
what, any um?

Speaker 3 (57:41):
so, uh, there is some research to show that b
vitamins not getting enough aswe age uh dramatically speeds up
age-related cognitive decline.
Um, and it looks like it's notnecessarily directly tied to
dietary intake.
Apparently, we don't absorb itas well, so we actually need
more as we get older.

Speaker 2 (58:01):
So you should be drinking more Rockstar Energy
drinks.

Speaker 3 (58:04):
Does there be 12 in there?

Speaker 2 (58:06):
What?
There's 100% of the value ofB12.

Speaker 3 (58:10):
There you go, so that'll do.

Speaker 2 (58:16):
That'll do pig that'll do.
I don't know what form.
Is there anything like peoplealways talk about the form?

Speaker 3 (58:21):
probably cyanocobalamin.
Yes, it's, usuallycyanocobalamin.

Speaker 2 (58:25):
Is that like less absorbable, like what's I know?

Speaker 3 (58:29):
it has to be like.
So the methylcobalamin that'sin, like the fancy B vitamins is
like already the active form.
So the methylated form is theactive form and for people who
have like gene variants of MTHFRthat slightly reduce
methylation, taking the active,like the methylated forms of B
vitamins, can lead to a betterlike symptom improvement, so

(58:54):
better energy and stuff likethat, compared to the non-active
forms.

Speaker 2 (58:59):
I like it.
Is that what you got?
Any, anything else, anythingelse.
I like the fun.
I like the fun, facts Okay.

Speaker 3 (59:06):
I'm just trying to think of fun ones that aren't
female anatomy specific.
I obviously have a different,different things that resonate
with me so well.
So protein as we age, sosarcopenia sucks.

(59:27):
It's terrible.
Did you know that females losean average of 10% of their
muscle just in theperimenopausal period?
You probably didn't know this,because this is not relevant to
you at all Slight slightlyrelevant to me.
I don't like it, uh.
So yeah, sarcopenia like justjust just accelerates during
that transition between um timeswhere your body could make a

(59:52):
baby and times when your bodycan't.
So protein resistance Proteintimes where your body could make
a baby and times when your bodycan't.
So protein resistance, protein.
So, fascinatingly, the like 1.6grams per kilogram body weight
per day, like that we see beingso beneficial for athletes, that
number gets to be reallybeneficial again for menopausal
females and males over over theage of 60 whoa, whoa, whoa.

Speaker 1 (01:00:17):
You used kilograms there.
You're gonna have to dumb itdown for leo.

Speaker 2 (01:00:19):
I heard the kilograms .
I was waiting for the freedomunits transition but that's fine
, what is I have?

Speaker 3 (01:00:25):
so it's 2.2 kilograms per freedom pounds per sorry.

Speaker 2 (01:00:31):
2.2 units 2.2 freedom units per kilogram.

Speaker 3 (01:00:36):
Yes, okay, so 0.73, because that's so much better I
would say, yeah, point.

Speaker 2 (01:00:42):
I just say like round , like 0.7 grams per pound, of
pound for freedom, unit damn ityeah, it's actually 0.7.

Speaker 3 (01:00:48):
It's actually 0.72, repeating 0.72 repeating 0.72.

Speaker 2 (01:00:51):
repeating freedom unit per.

Speaker 3 (01:00:53):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:00:55):
For freedom unit.

Speaker 3 (01:00:56):
So I'm so glad, I'm so glad we converted.
Yeah, okay, another, anotherfun one.
So did you know that on anygiven day, 16% of the world have
a headache?
I think that's just like swaps,so much sucks uh and that um

(01:01:20):
magnesium, like insufficientdietary magnesium could be a key
driver I know that's somethingwe're.

Speaker 2 (01:01:27):
We're falling short on as well, right?

Speaker 3 (01:01:28):
magnesium intake yeah it's like 66 of us don't get
enough dietary magnesium.
Uh, and that's not evenaccounting for things like how
stress can uh increase magnesiumexcretion, so it might actually
increase our our dietary needfor magnesium okay, interesting.
Uh, I'm in trouble stress tendsto like send the kidneys on
overdrive, so we tend to loseelectrolytes when we're when

(01:01:50):
we're stressed, and then we alsouh, we burn through vitamin C
really quickly when we'restressed.

Speaker 2 (01:01:54):
So what I would say?
Is calm down and eat beans.
That's my takeaway from thatCalm down and relax.

Speaker 1 (01:02:00):
Calm down, chew your food and eat your beans, I know
pumpkin seeds super high inmagnesium.

Speaker 3 (01:02:08):
I know Everything that's green because magnesium
is the middle of a chlorophyll,so if it's green it's going to
have magnesium.
So, yeah, green foods ingeneral, because chlorophyll and
hemoglobin have pretty much thesame structure, but chlorophyll
has magnesium at the center andhemoglobin has iron at the

(01:02:30):
center.

Speaker 2 (01:02:31):
Okay, oh, and can you give us some backups?
Oh, shoot, before you go.
Can you give us some backups?
Oh, shoot Before you, beforeyou go, give you some backups on
the greens powders, cause we'realways like against them and we
need, we need your help.

Speaker 3 (01:02:41):
Oh, um, okay.
So here's my thing with thegreens powders.
I I feel like, um, for somepeople they can be a really
great tool for increasingvegetable consumption, but
there's nothing magical aboutthem.
And the thing that's reallydeceiving about how they're
marketed is, if you actually dothe calculation for the fresh
equivalent, most of those greenspowder supplements a scoop or

(01:03:03):
two scoops or whatever it isthat they say you need will
translate to a half, to maybeone serving of fresh vegetables.
So there's some like where theserving's bigger, where it might
be two servings, but it's notlike there's this idea that if
you have that scoop of greenspowders it's meeting your like
fruit.
Yeah, I always see that onescoop is like 8000 vegetables or
something like it's falling sofar short, so like the fresh

(01:03:27):
equivalent is actually reallyunderwhelming and they're also
typically three to 10 times moreexpensive than it would be to
go buy the fresh vegetables.
But I do see that there is likea person who that can be a
really useful tool for, and Iwouldn't want to demonize it for
that person.
I just think that the waythey're marketed as like the be

(01:03:50):
all and end all of nutrition isvery deceiving.

Speaker 1 (01:03:54):
Okay, good Sounds good.
Deceiving.
Okay, good Sounds good to me.
Now, where can everyone findyou?
So they can go complain aboutyour views on greens powder.

Speaker 2 (01:04:03):
Greens, powders and tomatoes are fruit and all that
stuff, come yell at me abouttomatoes being a fruit.

Speaker 3 (01:04:10):
I would enjoy that conversation.
I am at Dr Sarah Ballantyne,almost all the social media
places TikTok, youtube,instagram, facebook Threads and
Pinterest so I think that's tome those are all the good places
because that's where I am.

Speaker 1 (01:04:25):
This is a good social media place.

Speaker 3 (01:04:31):
I have a couple of favorites.
I do play favorites with socialmedia platforms, that's for
sure.
There's some good I feel likethere's some good people on the
social medias, if you can findyour right corner.

Speaker 2 (01:04:44):
They're good.
There's good people.
They're just drowned out byeverybody else's problem, and
those people are the ones thatget a much bigger platform.
So that's what we deal with.
Fun, and those people are theones that get a much bigger
platform.
So that's what we deal with.

Speaker 3 (01:04:57):
Fun.
I mean, you have seen theamount of content that I put out
and the complete lack ofvirality of anything I've ever
done.
So, yeah, I would love to havemy videos have more reach.

Speaker 2 (01:05:11):
No, here's the thing you give people decent good
advice about, just like nutrientdensity and how to get things,
but no, you just got to yellabout how vegetables are
terrible for you.
That's how.
That's how you go viral.
That's the one.
That's one way.

Speaker 1 (01:05:24):
Yeah, and the other way is um, and I actually kind
of want to do this is organizeeverybody to.
I actually kind of want to dothis is organize everybody to
share everybody's post to theirstories, cause I've found that
to be like the number one way,particularly on Instagram.

Speaker 3 (01:05:41):
I'm in.

Speaker 1 (01:05:42):
It's kind of on TikTok, but on Instagram sharing
to stories is a killer thing.

Speaker 2 (01:05:49):
Like Liam, got big on Instagram conveniently the same
time that me and dr ids bothshared his video yeah, dr is a
whole video on it specifically,and that's really why, yeah,
like, and then it kind of tookoff after that, yeah okay, well,
uh, I'm, I'm, I'm in.

Speaker 3 (01:06:06):
So just just, uh, let let me know when the plan that
hits go and and all ourlisteners out there share our
stuff to your stories.

Speaker 1 (01:06:18):
It's one of the best ways you can help, or hit that
repost button, I'm going to tryanything at this point?

Speaker 3 (01:06:25):
Yes, and then my website is Nutrivorcom.
That's where there's tons ofdeep dive articles about what
nutrients do in the body and howthey're linked with various
health concerns, and then whatfoods have what nutrients.
And I have a new book, nutrivorthe Radical New Science for
Getting the Nutrients you Needfrom the Foods you Eat coming
out May 14th.

Speaker 1 (01:06:47):
Which is like now.
Wait, when is this going to air?
This will air on the 16th.

Speaker 3 (01:06:56):
So it's out, it's out , go get it.

Speaker 1 (01:06:57):
It's out, it's available.
I already got a copy.

Speaker 3 (01:07:03):
Um, yes, so you're I, I you're good.
Um, you can still leave me areview.
Uh, on on, on the the, theplaces that have reviews, though
.
Uh, rob, and you just have to,per FTC guidelines, say I
received an advanced copy fromthe publisher so yeah, it's
available.

Speaker 1 (01:07:20):
I mostly get to read it during camping season because
then you know you sit aroundthe fire and you just have a
good book and this looks like agood book.

Speaker 3 (01:07:28):
Again.
You're going to really enjoythe story about Lord Byron at
the beginning of chapter one andhow he was the father of fad
diets.
He was the one who started the.
All you have to do is this,this thing and then you'll lose
weight.

Speaker 2 (01:07:43):
Do you have a favorite fad diet before we go?
Mine's the cookie diet, whereyou had the cookie that you
drank with water and the cookiehad something in it that would
expand in your stomach and thenit filled up your stomach really
big and then you weren't hungry.
That was my favorite becauseyou got to eat cookies and lose
weight and that was their wholething and I was like that's
fucking genius, that's so smartuh, that okay.

Speaker 3 (01:08:03):
So I I I think that because I have bought into so
many fad diets over the years, Ifeel like, uh, my favorite fad
diet is not fad diets like.
My favorite fad diet is likethe mediterranean diet, because
that's the real one with science.
Do you know what I mean?
Like I feel like I've I'vebought into too much of too many
of them to be able to like havea tongue and cheek answer to

(01:08:25):
that question.
I think if I had a tongue andcheek answer to that question it
would sound very disingenuousmy favorite diet is the raw
chicken diet the raw chickendiet uh, that's just rolling the
dice for salmonella everysingle day.

Speaker 2 (01:08:41):
Yeah, exactly but you got to be primal like our
ancestors okay dr sarah, I thinkeverybody understands.
Go get your rock star zeros,grab that book and don't be your
worst okay, liam, liam, show usyour improv skills.

Speaker 1 (01:08:54):
Player off here.
Come on, player off.
What do you don't?
I have?

Speaker 2 (01:08:59):
to do that like a visual thing.
Nobody what?
I don't know what you're saying, what's going where?

Speaker 3 (01:09:07):
you gotta, you gotta sing a song oh shit, just make
it up on the spot, on On thespot.

Speaker 2 (01:09:13):
Come on, that is how I don't have improv skills, dr
Sarah, that's what makes itgreat.
She's the gal, she's the onethat will make you all smile.
I don't know how to rhyme.
Enjoy your life.
Damn, that didn't even rhyme.
Fuck, I got nothing.

Speaker 1 (01:09:29):
I got nothing.