June 3, 2025 • 23 mins
Max Galash takes us on a fascinating journey through the rapidly evolving cryptocurrency landscape as CEO of Coinchange, a global crypto brokerage and asset management platform with offices in Warsaw and Toronto.
Having pivoted from a direct-to-consumer approach following the collapse of major players like Celsius and BlockFi, CoinChange now focuses exclusively on B2B relationships with crypto operators, exchanges, neobanks, and payment platforms. What sets them apart in this emerging space is their multi-manager investment approach – rather than simply offering tokenized T-bills like many competitors, they employ various managers deploying different trading strategies to create customized, principle-protected structured products.
The conversation provides remarkable insight into how stablecoins are revolutionizing global payments, especially in emerging markets where access to USD-denominated products is limited. "Stablecoins are a bridge between banking, trading, exchanges, crypto and remittances," Max explains, highlighting their crucial role in enabling global settlements within seconds. His prediction that blockchain will become the backbone of settlement networks rather than remaining consumer-facing technology aligns with moves by financial giants like BlackRock and JP Morgan, who are already settling billions through private blockchains.
Ready to understand how cryptocurrency is reshaping global finance? Listen now to hear Max's complete insights and predictions for this transformative industry.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Welcome to the Leaders in Payments podcast,
where we talk to C-level leadersfrom across the payments
landscape.
We'll be discussing theproducts and services that
impact the payment space today,as well as trends and
predictions for the future ofpayments.
We will also hear stories fromour guests about their journeys
to the top.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Hello and welcome to the Leaders in Payments podcast.
I'm your host, greg Myers, andon today's show we have a very
special guest, max Galosh.
Hopefully I got that right.
You can correct me if I waswrong.
He is the CEO of CoinChange.
So, max, welcome to the show.
Speaker 3 (00:32):
Thanks for having me, Greg.
I appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Absolutely so, if you don't mind, tell our audience a
little bit about yourself,maybe where you were born, where
you grew up, where you went toschool, a few things like that.
Speaker 3 (00:41):
Okay, yeah, I'll give you a background on myself and
the business.
I was born in Belarus, so it'sa far outreach on Eastern Europe
, the USSR bloc, so I guesswe're Russian Italian as well.
I lived in Italy for a bit.
I went to school at UFTUniversity of Toronto.
I graduated as electrical andcomputer engineer.
I worked in investment bankingfor a couple of years I worked
at the SAP Consulting, so it's aglobal tech consulting firm in
(01:05):
Germany.
I had my own startups all alongsince I was probably 17.
I sold one business.
It was a cannabis automationplatform, so kind of a
seed-to-sale platform.
Early in the days, in 2011, Ihad a small VC venture fund
pre-seed venture fund with about10 million AUM.
We mostly focused on social andgame five businesses back then.
(01:25):
For the last five years I'mworking on my own crypto company
called CoinChange.
It's a pretty much a brokerageand asset management platform,
so we've raised about $10million.
We're about 50 people.
We're pretty global.
Office in Warsaw and office inToronto Licenses in Europe,
Canada and the US.
We facilitate somewhat on andoff ramp transactions.
Warsaw, an office in Toronto.
Licenses in Europe, Canada andthe US.
Watham as well.
So we facilitate somewhat onand off ramp transactions,
(01:50):
crypto to fiat and, primarily,as the core and foundation of
the business, is the assetmanagement, so providing
structured investment productsto B2B clients and the market
Through our app.
There's different ways todistribution app API, fund, SMA
model.
The essence of that is amulti-manager investment
management platform.
Speaker 2 (02:10):
Okay, okay, and so who is your typical customer?
Speaker 3 (02:13):
B2B primarily.
So it's a crypto operators,exchanges, neobanks, payment
platforms, wallets so we don'treally offer D2C.
We started as a D2C platform aswell back in the day.
So there was a few other bigones like Celsius, blockfi, and
they're all gone.
They're all bankrupt.
They're all been wiped out bythe market.
There was like a gray theycalled it a shadow banking so
(02:34):
pretty much taken outcollateralized, not
uncollateralized, unsecuredloans on the balance sheet and
then working with them in theway that they deem appropriate,
deemed appropriate to generate anew return.
It was all black box and prettymuch clients were left hanging
back when she hit the fan andthe market exploded in 2020
after a few big bankruptcies,and then FTX happened as well,
so that's kind of cleaned up thesystem.
(02:55):
But we started retail and wewere a part of that retail wave
when the market was going up andthen we had to reposition the
business and find a new customer.
So pivoted the business towardsB2B.
So provided more transparency,licensing, visibility into the
business for the B2B clients andthey act as distributors quite
often to their retail clients.
So it's a B2B to C model.
(03:16):
You can think about it as aninfrastructure or a SaaS model.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
Okay.
And how do you go to market?
Do you have a direct sales teamthrough partnership channels?
How do you go to market?
Do you have a direct sales teamthrough partnership channels?
How do you go to market?
Speaker 3 (03:25):
Mostly partnership channels.
Yeah, events, partnershipchannels.
We'll do some research reports.
It's all pretty much for now,at least at our scale.
It's all high-touch businesses,so there's no fully automated
way for you to actually plug andplay.
I mean there is, but peopleusually have a lot of questions
about the investment products.
Right, it's what are the risks,what's the compliance, what's
the regulatory about it?
(03:46):
How do we sell it to our endclient?
How do we explain it to the endclient?
So there's always a bit of ahandholding Along the first
touch point of theimplementation and the
activation.
There's usually a bit of workthat needs to be done by the
team.
Speaker 2 (03:58):
What does that timeframe look like, from first
touch to activation?
Speaker 3 (04:02):
The clients that really want to and want to
integrate directly as a smartcontract, let's say, because we
have a smart contract endpointsas well for them.
So smart contracts eliminatesyour back office and mid-office
primarily, so kind of operationsdown on chain by a code rather
than by people.
So it's pretty quick.
I mean we'll give them theendpoints and they integrate it
within two, three weeks, Even ifthey know whether they're
(04:24):
looking for actively managedportfolios as an example, right,
and they know what they'regetting.
But the clients that have noidea or have never sold
investment products and justlooking to introduce them, let's
say payment platforms, right,they're trying to diversify over
their merchants kind of anovernight interest or his
savings account or investmentproduct, depending on their risk
profile.
They will have a lot ofdiligence and exploration
(04:51):
because they're stilldiscovering the products and
they're talking to the othervendors.
So those ones can take up tosix months.
So depending on the need andthe proficiency of the client or
the partner, it can be eitherfrom a couple of weeks to six
months.
On average I would say it's two, three months.
You can just take the middlepoint.
Speaker 2 (05:02):
Okay, and when you say sort of the B2B, are there
like specific verticals or canit be basically any B2B company?
Speaker 3 (05:10):
No, for us it's all crypto related.
They have to have a crypto ontheir balance sheet, so it has
to be an exchange or a paymentplatform that uses stable coins
for crypto, or a wallet that youcan use a self-custody wallet
to hold your crypto.
So there's different cryptooperators, fintech operators
that we go after.
We're not going to go after thelogistics business, a trucking
(05:31):
business or a plumping business,so they have to have some
crypto on their balance sheet tobe able to offer that product
to their clients.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
Okay, and it sounds like it's truly global.
Yeah, primarily emergingmarkets.
Speaker 3 (05:43):
So we're not licensed by SEC for the asset management
business in the US.
We only offer on an off-ramp inthe US.
So as an MSB Canada, we're alsooffering as an MSB on an
off-ramp and some SaaS solutionswant the client to distribute
the end product and they'refully liable for the marketing
and custody of that asset.
But emerging markets Europewe're full of license for that.
(06:04):
Emerging markets LaTown we'refull of license for that.
So there are regions where wego directly to B2B and can act
as an asset manager and someregions we can also act as a
technology provider.
But we're not actively sellingin the US Canada, uk, as an
example, mostly emerging marketsbecause they have a problem to
access USD-denominated productsof that nature and they have a
(06:29):
primarily for payments.
So those fintechs that alreadygot a bit of a market share in
the payments or stablecoinwallets, they're looking to
diversify and introduce newproducts.
So in the US the market is alittle different and there's
also better access totraditional products in the USD
world.
So I don't have to name them.
But not only TBLs, but moneymarkets, overnight products in
(06:51):
the banks and so forth.
So the need is more in theemerging markets right now, so
that's where we focus.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
Okay, and how would you say you differentiate
yourself from your competitorsout there?
Speaker 3 (07:03):
There's not so many competitors right now.
This niche is pretty new.
So I mean we don't resell aT-bill.
So a lot of people, a lot ofbusinesses that started two
years back, as an example, whenFTX collapsed, after businesses
that started two years back asan example when FTX collapsed,
after that they started offeringtokenized T-bill.
They'll take a dollar, they'llgo through a BlackRock or some
other asset manager and sendthem the dollar.
Then they have some systems torepresent a value, a unit value
(07:27):
for you and it's on chain.
But it's all T-bills.
It's a pretty simple product wedo.
We offer a multi-managerapproach so we have different
managers actively managing theassets on our accounts on
different venues, right?
So meaning that they willutilize different trading
strategies, options, marketneutral basis trade strategies
and based on those we cancomprise portfolios and those
(07:49):
portfolios we offer to the B2Bclient that will be reselling
and we can structure a portfolioin different ways.
So principle-protected noprinciple-protected Drawdowns,
volatility of the portfolio canbe customized per client.
So primarily, quite a lot ofpayments platforms.
They will go to theprinciple-protected type
structure product.
So they want to make sure thatthey put $100 and take $100 back
(08:11):
and they don't want to reallybe evaluating the strategies
that are.
Maybe they're high-performing,low-performing we just want to
make sure that the principal isprotected and we have a target
return rate of return for thatproduct.
So let's see, we'll say 5%, 7%on stablecoins as a target
return, with some down, but noprincipal protection.
So they'll see the fluctuationof the return because there are
(08:34):
some breakdowns of the market,neutral strategies, but the
principal will be protected.
So they can always take that$100 back and if they want
liquidity, daily or weekly, soit also can be built in.
But usually it's either weeklyliquidity, because nobody's
going to put a dollar for a dayand then take it out tomorrow.
Usually it's at least a week.
So that's the differentiationfactor.
So usually it's at least a week.
(09:00):
So that's the differentiationfactor.
So we don't really resellsomebody's else t-bill or credit
.
There's a lot of private creditthat's coming on chain as well.
So let's say somebody innigeria needs a factoring for
their iphone import business.
They'll ask the depositors inthe us that will stable coin.
They'll give them some kind ofatoken representation of that.
They'll move usd to niger,nigeria for the business and it
all encapsuled into theblockchain.
So that's a private credit.
There's quite a few privatecredit platforms as well, so
they also pay you on your USDdeposits very much of a factor.
(09:23):
So that's also different.
But there's other methods likethat that exist to generate
yield on the stablecoins, butvery different to what our
multi-manager approach is.
So I don't see directcompetitors who do exactly what
we do, but there are others thatprovide yield on stable coins
or other assets through privatecredit and TBLs.
Speaker 2 (09:42):
Okay, okay.
Well, when you step back andlook at the industry as a whole
and obviously you can answerthis through the lens of what
you guys do where do you see theindustry headed in the next,
say, three to five years?
Speaker 3 (09:52):
I'll tell you where it is right now.
Where do you see the industryheaded in the next say, three to
five years?
I'll tell you where it is rightnow.
First, I think the real usecase, the only real use case
right now, is payments, so instable coins.
So stable coins is pretty muchtokenized dollar.
So everybody talks abouttokenization but nothing really
tokenized except a dollar likeUSDT has been around for 12
years.
Usdc has been around for sevenyears and they're actively used
in remittances, cross-borderpayments, trading on an off-ramp
(10:15):
.
So when you want to get into thecrypto economy, you'll buy a
stable coin.
You're not going to buy aDogecoin to go into the crypto
economy.
You'll buy a stable coin.
Then you go on exchange andthen you buy a token that you
want To get in.
You'll buy a stable coinbecause you're going to use your
credit card or ACH to get in.
So it's kind of a bridge.
Stablecoin is a bridge betweenbanking and trading and
exchanges and crypto andremittances.
(10:36):
As I mentioned, because we workon the emerging markets, we see
a lot of that happening.
It's already embedded andthere's a lot of abstractions
because blockchain has gas fees,it has wallets that you have to
manage on chain.
So it has a lot of abstractions.
People already like Circle.
They already built a lot oflayers of abstraction so the
fintech can easily integratethrough an API circle wallet for
USDC payments and initiate apayment globally settling in
(10:58):
seconds, going global right.
So very good for emittance andcross-border.
So right now the payments isthe only use case and it's
growing really fast and there'sa lot of platforms globally that
support that use case.
Big ones like BVNK is anexample, and smaller ones like
the original lemon, let's say,in Argentina.
But the future of that?
A lot of people are lookinginto the issuance of financial
(11:21):
products and chain.
So tokenizing something is notreally cool because it's already
issued on the real world, italready has distribution in the
real world through real, throughmerchants, through the existing
channels, and then just bringit on chain enabling the
settlement seven days a week,365 a year.
It doesn't really add a lot ofvalue but a lot of hope is for
(11:45):
that.
Eventually financial productscan be issued on chain as well.
So meaning that if it's issuedon chain, it's fully redeemable
on chain.
It's fully legal as well.
You can enforce it through thecourt and that's already
happening in chain.
It's fully legal as well.
You can enforce it through thecourt and it's already happening
in Singapore and Dubai.
They're already testingdifferent real estate issuance
on chain, not tokenizationissuance, debt issuance on chain
.
So if you're a business, youcan come tokenizing it, but
(12:10):
going on a chain directlyissuing it there without
replicating the offline world,so yeah, so those things.
I think that tokenization iskind of a big thing, but the use
case hasn't really been yetfound except stablecoins and
payments.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
Do you see a day when I go to the dry cleaners and I
pay with stable coin to get mylaundry?
Speaker 3 (12:29):
Yeah, you just won't notice that you do it right now.
Right, you don't pay cash.
Right, you pay with a creditcard and you don't really take
it out.
It's in your phone.
So just this.
I think that blockchain itselfis not really a consumer product
, is not really a consumerproduct.
It's going to be a backbone ofthe settlement network, rather
than a crypto NFT app or somesort of a consumer-facing.
(12:52):
It's all going to be USDanyways, or a currency that
represents it, but the tokenizedassets will exist on the
blockchain.
That's the backbone of that.
Even BlackRock right now Ispoke to them recently they do
about a billion dollars ofsettlements and tokenization a
day.
So they have their own on theBiddle, they have their own
tokens they will call it Biddleand they already do some
settlements with their partnersand brokers on their own
(13:14):
blockchain.
Same happens for the.
Jp Morgan has their ownblockchain as well, so they
already do it internally.
Just in the grand scheme ofthings, it's still a very small
right Kind of risk-free for themflow, small risk-free for them
flow that they're settling.
But eventually it's going to bemore the problem right now with
them that they're discussing,let's say, jp Morgan and
BlackRock and the others.
How do we bridge together ourclosed ecosystems?
(13:35):
Because they have closedblockchains?
It's not an open blockchainbecause you have to have
compliance and there's a lot oflayers of compliance and
regulation, primarily around thefinancial services.
So they're thinking, okay, howdo we really marry them together
and talk to each other so theycan talk to each other?
Not like databases talk to eachother, but actual blockchain?
Speaker 2 (13:50):
Well, let's switch gears a little bit and talk
about you, maybe walk us throughyour career journey, how you
got to where you are today.
Speaker 3 (13:59):
Yeah, I mean, I've been in tech for all my life.
I started a couple ofbusinesses, as I mentioned.
One of them has been acquiredsince 2017.
And I started to buy Bitcoin in2018.
So it was pretty simple.
I took a sabbatical and there'sDublin and crypto and it went
from 2000 to 20 in 2017.
I remember that was my kind ofwave when I started buying.
Then it crashed to 3000 in 2018.
(14:20):
And, yeah, I kind of stickedaround, but I didn't like the
experience.
I could buy it from thoseexisting brokers that existed.
There was a lot of hidden feesand a lot of complexity and at
the same time, I was usingTransferWise.
It's called wisecom.
You probably know Wise, kind ofa neo-bank, but primarily for
the cross-border payments.
So it was really clean.
They showed you the rates,everything very transparent.
(14:41):
So we wanted to build somethinglike that first.
That was kind of the coinchange journey when we started
in 2019.
We thought about it, did allthe market analysis.
We knew from the productperspective, the steps we needed
to take.
So 2020, we started buildingthat.
2021, we only took it to marketand it already had the asset
management component, but onlyon DeFi rails, very different to
what we did.
So that was the journey, how Igot into the coin change.
(15:02):
So trying to change thebrokerage business pretty much
in Canada.
But then we realized it wassaturated.
It was raised to the bottomcompression of fees, a lot of
regulation, hard to go global.
So we always pivoted towardsthe DeFi yield platform, right
again within the application,and then we pivoted to the asset
management of B2B businesses.
We are right now multi-managingB2B business.
(15:24):
So we also have a hedge fund, afully licensed hedge fund in
Gibraltar, where we serviceinstitutional clients, primarily
family offices.
I've always been theentrepreneur Since I was a small
kid.
I was on the parking lots, Iwas acting as a parking
superintendent looking for theneighbor cars, getting paid a
little bit.
I was also collecting freebottles and hourglass bottles
(15:44):
and taking them to the beerstore to get some cash for the
ice cream.
So yeah, it was kind of theresince I was a little kid.
And then eventually you do moreand more and more and out of
snowball something doesn't workout quite often, right?
You just have to have anability to learn from those
missteps and try to self-correctfor the next step.
I think the venture is.
(16:05):
I mean, there's very brutalstatistics that it's only like
three or four percent of thestartups actually succeed right
or get big right.
So most of them fail or stay asa family-owned business right.
That barely pays for the familybills.
Not an easy journey.
You definitely, if you're ableto self-reflect and learn, and
that's probably interesting tohave such a career.
Speaker 2 (16:26):
Okay, well, what are some things you're passionate
about?
Maybe one work-related passionand one personal passion.
Speaker 3 (16:31):
Reading would be probably a personal passion.
My family have their kids.
It's my passion too my kids, mywife obviously, and the work
passion in work.
I mean also reading.
Yeah, I like reading aboutwhat's happening in the industry
and what's happening in myniche right Small world,
probably.
If happening in the industryand what's happening in my niche
right, small world, probably.
(16:52):
If you talk about theday-to-day, I would say hiring
people, that's also prettyimportant and I liked doing that
finding the right people thatprobably have the right skill
set for the problem.
So that's also that I try tospend more time on and analyzing
people you have and theefficiency of that mechanism
that exists.
I would say those things.
Speaker 2 (17:10):
Okay.
So if someone comes to you, max, and they're maybe looking at
building a career in financialservices or fintech, or even
payments, with your experienceand since you said you liked
hiring people curious, whatadvice would you give them to be
successful in this industry,successful in their careers in
(17:31):
fintech, if they choose to gointo that?
Speaker 3 (17:33):
How do they approach employment opportunity right or
starting their own business?
Speaker 2 (17:37):
No more on the employment side in crypto or in
fintech in general.
Just fintech in general.
Crypto is a little different.
Speaker 3 (17:44):
It's a pretty nascent industry.
So a lot of things that welooked at is you don't have to
have a past experience directpast experience, right and
crypto Like at least five yearswhen we started.
Anyone right now you cancross-pollinate your experience
of Tread5 to crypto prettyeasily, especially on the
investment management side andin payments.
So I think, approaching theemployer and going to the
interview what we look at atleast what we like when people
(18:06):
don't really.
First of all, I mean you haveto have a deep understanding of
your domain.
So, depending on what exactlyyou're hired for is it risk, is
it compliance, Is it marketresearch, is it financial
product engineering you have tohave a certain deep expertise or
real direct knowledge,experience of that.
Second of all, I think you haveto be able to challenge.
(18:29):
It's also not easy to challengepeople or you have to be ready
to be challenged.
So it's important because a lotof people don't want to be
challenged or don't want tochallenge the others right.
So we always kind of fosterthat, so not to follow but to
challenge, right.
So that's when you actually getsome granularity and everybody
can ask any question for anyonethe question manual primarily
(18:50):
for the most part.
So that's important.
So we're going to test thatright.
Then we think it's importantand I think the work ethics is
important.
You won't know until you start,but you try to find okay, do you
do any extracurricular?
If people do sports usually aprofessional, like
semi-professional sports orvarsity sports you know that
they don're going to have tohire me, they're going to be
more professionally roundedethically to do the job rather
than, let's say, they've neverdone nothing, no charity sports,
(19:12):
and you've got to question alittle bit.
So you want to have thatprofessional ethics checked on.
That's about it.
And then you try, and thenusually you want to identify
quickly if it works out ordoesn't, not to invest too much
in the candidate that's notgoing to work out.
So usually we do about threemonths.
We try to evaluate within thefirst three months.
Speaker 2 (19:34):
Okay, great Well, thanks for sharing that.
Obviously, we've covered yourbackground the company kind of
the industry.
Is there anything else you'dlike to do before we wrap up?
Speaker 3 (19:44):
I think regulatory is an important part in crypto
right now, especially with Trumpright at the White House.
I mean crypto industry had areally big hope right for the
change.
I think it happened, either forthe worse, right, it's hard to
say yet.
I mean generally the markets.
I mean really unpredictableright now with everything that
happened.
So there's definitely a lot ofstill unpredictability.
(20:05):
But at least we can really seeon the regulatory side of the
bills that they're passing theregulation that's right now been
reviewed.
There was an operation chokepoint too before in the last two
administrations and it wasreally challenging to get a
banking relationship with acrypto company, even for the
corporate bank I'm not sayingthe list, I mean the client side
of that.
So right now we can see it'sdefinitely flexing up, so
(20:28):
there's more opportunities forbusinesses to open up bank
accounts and to service theirclients.
We see that stablecoin bill iscoming as well.
That's great news.
The biggest stablecoin in theworld is USD.
None of the other stablecoin.
Mexican-based stablecoin wasissued.
Euro stablecoin was issued.
Nothing is close to that andit's good for the US because it
(20:52):
does penetrate emerging marketssubstantially and most of that
collateral under the stable coingoes to the T-bill.
So I think Tether is theseventh largest purchaser of
American T-bills globally.
So some crazy numbers, right.
So it's not a country, just abusiness.
But they issued $150 billionstable coins coins and I think
$120 billion is in T-bills somevery big numbers.
So I think the regulation isimportant.
So crypto was like that andright now it seems like we're on
(21:12):
the right track.
So I think this is veryimportant for the operators to
understand as well.
There's going to be probablystill a black market and a
regulated market.
Always there's a black marketin anything, right?
So crypto is not an exclusion.
There's always a black marketto service certain people in
certain flows.
But it's going to be moredeviated than before, because
before it was all kind of gray.
(21:32):
Right now it's going to be aclear distinction between the
white regulated players and theblack unregulated players.
Speaker 2 (21:42):
So I think that's an important item to consider for
the clients and for theoperators.
So do you see the changes inthe regulatory environment
around crypto in the US.
Speaker 3 (21:51):
Does that affect the global market?
Not really.
I think Europe is already ontheir way to Mika.
Mika is like a unified cryptoregulation across Europe.
It has been delayed, delayed,delayed in different
jurisdictions.
Dubai is doing their own thingwith Vara.
Singapore is doing their ownthing with VARA.
Singapore is doing their ownthing with their VASP
registration.
So I think it's stillsegregated.
But I think it's good for theUS businesses to come back,
because a lot of US businesseswent offshore.
(22:13):
A lot of US businesses went toDubai and to the other
jurisdictions where they couldeasily operate.
So I think more clarity comesto market, more banking
relationships open up, morebusinesses are going to be
relocated back to the US Becauseit's still the largest of the
best capital markets in theworld, right?
Speaker 2 (22:27):
Okay, well, max, anything else before we go?
Speaker 3 (22:30):
No, we can't wait at all.
Speaker 2 (22:33):
Okay, great, great.
Well, thank you so much forbeing on the show today.
Speaker 3 (22:37):
I know your time is very valuable, so I really
appreciate you being here.
Thanks a lot I appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (22:41):
Thanks a lot, I appreciate it.
Thanks for having me Absolutely, and to all you listeners out
there.
Speaker 1 (22:45):
I thank you for your time as well, and until the next
story, thank you for joining usthis week on the Leaders in
Payments podcast.
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Welcome to the Leaders in Payments podcast,
where we talk to C-level leadersfrom across the payments
landscape.
We'll be discussing theproducts and services that
impact the payment space today,as well as trends and
predictions for the future ofpayments.
We will also hear stories fromour guests about their journeys
to the top.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Hello and welcome to the Leaders in Payments podcast.
I'm your host, greg Myers, andon today's show we have a very
special guest, max Galosh.
Hopefully I got that right.
You can correct me if I waswrong.
He is the CEO of CoinChange.
So, max, welcome to the show.
Speaker 3 (00:32):
Thanks for having me, Greg.
I appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Absolutely so, if you don't mind, tell our audience a
little bit about yourself,maybe where you were born, where
you grew up, where you went toschool, a few things like that.
Speaker 3 (00:41):
Okay, yeah, I'll give you a background on myself and
the business.
I was born in Belarus, so it'sa far outreach on Eastern Europe
, the USSR bloc, so I guesswe're Russian Italian as well.
I lived in Italy for a bit.
I went to school at UFTUniversity of Toronto.
I graduated as electrical andcomputer engineer.
I worked in investment bankingfor a couple of years I worked
at the SAP Consulting, so it's aglobal tech consulting firm in
(01:05):
Germany.
I had my own startups all alongsince I was probably 17.
I sold one business.
It was a cannabis automationplatform, so kind of a
seed-to-sale platform.
Early in the days, in 2011, Ihad a small VC venture fund
pre-seed venture fund with about10 million AUM.
We mostly focused on social andgame five businesses back then.
(01:25):
For the last five years I'mworking on my own crypto company
called CoinChange.
It's a pretty much a brokerageand asset management platform,
so we've raised about $10million.
We're about 50 people.
We're pretty global.
Office in Warsaw and office inToronto Licenses in Europe,
Canada and the US.
We facilitate somewhat on andoff ramp transactions.
Warsaw, an office in Toronto.
Licenses in Europe, Canada andthe US.
Watham as well.
So we facilitate somewhat onand off ramp transactions,
(01:50):
crypto to fiat and, primarily,as the core and foundation of
the business, is the assetmanagement, so providing
structured investment productsto B2B clients and the market
Through our app.
There's different ways todistribution app API, fund, SMA
model.
The essence of that is amulti-manager investment
management platform.
Speaker 2 (02:10):
Okay, okay, and so who is your typical customer?
Speaker 3 (02:13):
B2B primarily.
So it's a crypto operators,exchanges, neobanks, payment
platforms, wallets so we don'treally offer D2C.
We started as a D2C platform aswell back in the day.
So there was a few other bigones like Celsius, blockfi, and
they're all gone.
They're all bankrupt.
They're all been wiped out bythe market.
There was like a gray theycalled it a shadow banking so
(02:34):
pretty much taken outcollateralized, not
uncollateralized, unsecuredloans on the balance sheet and
then working with them in theway that they deem appropriate,
deemed appropriate to generate anew return.
It was all black box and prettymuch clients were left hanging
back when she hit the fan andthe market exploded in 2020
after a few big bankruptcies,and then FTX happened as well,
so that's kind of cleaned up thesystem.
(02:55):
But we started retail and wewere a part of that retail wave
when the market was going up andthen we had to reposition the
business and find a new customer.
So pivoted the business towardsB2B.
So provided more transparency,licensing, visibility into the
business for the B2B clients andthey act as distributors quite
often to their retail clients.
So it's a B2B to C model.
(03:16):
You can think about it as aninfrastructure or a SaaS model.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
Okay.
And how do you go to market?
Do you have a direct sales teamthrough partnership channels?
How do you go to market?
Do you have a direct sales teamthrough partnership channels?
How do you go to market?
Speaker 3 (03:25):
Mostly partnership channels.
Yeah, events, partnershipchannels.
We'll do some research reports.
It's all pretty much for now,at least at our scale.
It's all high-touch businesses,so there's no fully automated
way for you to actually plug andplay.
I mean there is, but peopleusually have a lot of questions
about the investment products.
Right, it's what are the risks,what's the compliance, what's
the regulatory about it?
(03:46):
How do we sell it to our endclient?
How do we explain it to the endclient?
So there's always a bit of ahandholding Along the first
touch point of theimplementation and the
activation.
There's usually a bit of workthat needs to be done by the
team.
Speaker 2 (03:58):
What does that timeframe look like, from first
touch to activation?
Speaker 3 (04:02):
The clients that really want to and want to
integrate directly as a smartcontract, let's say, because we
have a smart contract endpointsas well for them.
So smart contracts eliminatesyour back office and mid-office
primarily, so kind of operationsdown on chain by a code rather
than by people.
So it's pretty quick.
I mean we'll give them theendpoints and they integrate it
within two, three weeks, Even ifthey know whether they're
(04:24):
looking for actively managedportfolios as an example, right,
and they know what they'regetting.
But the clients that have noidea or have never sold
investment products and justlooking to introduce them, let's
say payment platforms, right,they're trying to diversify over
their merchants kind of anovernight interest or his
savings account or investmentproduct, depending on their risk
profile.
They will have a lot ofdiligence and exploration
(04:51):
because they're stilldiscovering the products and
they're talking to the othervendors.
So those ones can take up tosix months.
So depending on the need andthe proficiency of the client or
the partner, it can be eitherfrom a couple of weeks to six
months.
On average I would say it's two, three months.
You can just take the middlepoint.
Speaker 2 (05:02):
Okay, and when you say sort of the B2B, are there
like specific verticals or canit be basically any B2B company?
Speaker 3 (05:10):
No, for us it's all crypto related.
They have to have a crypto ontheir balance sheet, so it has
to be an exchange or a paymentplatform that uses stable coins
for crypto, or a wallet that youcan use a self-custody wallet
to hold your crypto.
So there's different cryptooperators, fintech operators
that we go after.
We're not going to go after thelogistics business, a trucking
(05:31):
business or a plumping business,so they have to have some
crypto on their balance sheet tobe able to offer that product
to their clients.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
Okay, and it sounds like it's truly global.
Yeah, primarily emergingmarkets.
Speaker 3 (05:43):
So we're not licensed by SEC for the asset management
business in the US.
We only offer on an off-ramp inthe US.
So as an MSB Canada, we're alsooffering as an MSB on an
off-ramp and some SaaS solutionswant the client to distribute
the end product and they'refully liable for the marketing
and custody of that asset.
But emerging markets Europewe're full of license for that.
(06:04):
Emerging markets LaTown we'refull of license for that.
So there are regions where wego directly to B2B and can act
as an asset manager and someregions we can also act as a
technology provider.
But we're not actively sellingin the US Canada, uk, as an
example, mostly emerging marketsbecause they have a problem to
access USD-denominated productsof that nature and they have a
(06:29):
primarily for payments.
So those fintechs that alreadygot a bit of a market share in
the payments or stablecoinwallets, they're looking to
diversify and introduce newproducts.
So in the US the market is alittle different and there's
also better access totraditional products in the USD
world.
So I don't have to name them.
But not only TBLs, but moneymarkets, overnight products in
(06:51):
the banks and so forth.
So the need is more in theemerging markets right now, so
that's where we focus.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
Okay, and how would you say you differentiate
yourself from your competitorsout there?
Speaker 3 (07:03):
There's not so many competitors right now.
This niche is pretty new.
So I mean we don't resell aT-bill.
So a lot of people, a lot ofbusinesses that started two
years back, as an example, whenFTX collapsed, after businesses
that started two years back asan example when FTX collapsed,
after that they started offeringtokenized T-bill.
They'll take a dollar, they'llgo through a BlackRock or some
other asset manager and sendthem the dollar.
Then they have some systems torepresent a value, a unit value
(07:27):
for you and it's on chain.
But it's all T-bills.
It's a pretty simple product wedo.
We offer a multi-managerapproach so we have different
managers actively managing theassets on our accounts on
different venues, right?
So meaning that they willutilize different trading
strategies, options, marketneutral basis trade strategies
and based on those we cancomprise portfolios and those
(07:49):
portfolios we offer to the B2Bclient that will be reselling
and we can structure a portfolioin different ways.
So principle-protected noprinciple-protected Drawdowns,
volatility of the portfolio canbe customized per client.
So primarily, quite a lot ofpayments platforms.
They will go to theprinciple-protected type
structure product.
So they want to make sure thatthey put $100 and take $100 back
(08:11):
and they don't want to reallybe evaluating the strategies
that are.
Maybe they're high-performing,low-performing we just want to
make sure that the principal isprotected and we have a target
return rate of return for thatproduct.
So let's see, we'll say 5%, 7%on stablecoins as a target
return, with some down, but noprincipal protection.
So they'll see the fluctuationof the return because there are
(08:34):
some breakdowns of the market,neutral strategies, but the
principal will be protected.
So they can always take that$100 back and if they want
liquidity, daily or weekly, soit also can be built in.
But usually it's either weeklyliquidity, because nobody's
going to put a dollar for a dayand then take it out tomorrow.
Usually it's at least a week.
So that's the differentiationfactor.
So usually it's at least a week.
(09:00):
So that's the differentiationfactor.
So we don't really resellsomebody's else t-bill or credit
.
There's a lot of private creditthat's coming on chain as well.
So let's say somebody innigeria needs a factoring for
their iphone import business.
They'll ask the depositors inthe us that will stable coin.
They'll give them some kind ofatoken representation of that.
They'll move usd to niger,nigeria for the business and it
all encapsuled into theblockchain.
So that's a private credit.
There's quite a few privatecredit platforms as well, so
they also pay you on your USDdeposits very much of a factor.
(09:23):
So that's also different.
But there's other methods likethat that exist to generate
yield on the stablecoins, butvery different to what our
multi-manager approach is.
So I don't see directcompetitors who do exactly what
we do, but there are others thatprovide yield on stable coins
or other assets through privatecredit and TBLs.
Speaker 2 (09:42):
Okay, okay.
Well, when you step back andlook at the industry as a whole
and obviously you can answerthis through the lens of what
you guys do where do you see theindustry headed in the next,
say, three to five years?
Speaker 3 (09:52):
I'll tell you where it is right now.
Where do you see the industryheaded in the next say, three to
five years?
I'll tell you where it is rightnow.
First, I think the real usecase, the only real use case
right now, is payments, so instable coins.
So stable coins is pretty muchtokenized dollar.
So everybody talks abouttokenization but nothing really
tokenized except a dollar likeUSDT has been around for 12
years.
Usdc has been around for sevenyears and they're actively used
in remittances, cross-borderpayments, trading on an off-ramp
(10:15):
.
So when you want to get into thecrypto economy, you'll buy a
stable coin.
You're not going to buy aDogecoin to go into the crypto
economy.
You'll buy a stable coin.
Then you go on exchange andthen you buy a token that you
want To get in.
You'll buy a stable coinbecause you're going to use your
credit card or ACH to get in.
So it's kind of a bridge.
Stablecoin is a bridge betweenbanking and trading and
exchanges and crypto andremittances.
(10:36):
As I mentioned, because we workon the emerging markets, we see
a lot of that happening.
It's already embedded andthere's a lot of abstractions
because blockchain has gas fees,it has wallets that you have to
manage on chain.
So it has a lot of abstractions.
People already like Circle.
They already built a lot oflayers of abstraction so the
fintech can easily integratethrough an API circle wallet for
USDC payments and initiate apayment globally settling in
(10:58):
seconds, going global right.
So very good for emittance andcross-border.
So right now the payments isthe only use case and it's
growing really fast and there'sa lot of platforms globally that
support that use case.
Big ones like BVNK is anexample, and smaller ones like
the original lemon, let's say,in Argentina.
But the future of that?
A lot of people are lookinginto the issuance of financial
(11:21):
products and chain.
So tokenizing something is notreally cool because it's already
issued on the real world, italready has distribution in the
real world through real, throughmerchants, through the existing
channels, and then just bringit on chain enabling the
settlement seven days a week,365 a year.
It doesn't really add a lot ofvalue but a lot of hope is for
(11:45):
that.
Eventually financial productscan be issued on chain as well.
So meaning that if it's issuedon chain, it's fully redeemable
on chain.
It's fully legal as well.
You can enforce it through thecourt and that's already
happening in chain.
It's fully legal as well.
You can enforce it through thecourt and it's already happening
in Singapore and Dubai.
They're already testingdifferent real estate issuance
on chain, not tokenizationissuance, debt issuance on chain
.
So if you're a business, youcan come tokenizing it, but
(12:10):
going on a chain directlyissuing it there without
replicating the offline world,so yeah, so those things.
I think that tokenization iskind of a big thing, but the use
case hasn't really been yetfound except stablecoins and
payments.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
Do you see a day when I go to the dry cleaners and I
pay with stable coin to get mylaundry?
Speaker 3 (12:29):
Yeah, you just won't notice that you do it right now.
Right, you don't pay cash.
Right, you pay with a creditcard and you don't really take
it out.
It's in your phone.
So just this.
I think that blockchain itselfis not really a consumer product
, is not really a consumerproduct.
It's going to be a backbone ofthe settlement network, rather
than a crypto NFT app or somesort of a consumer-facing.
(12:52):
It's all going to be USDanyways, or a currency that
represents it, but the tokenizedassets will exist on the
blockchain.
That's the backbone of that.
Even BlackRock right now Ispoke to them recently they do
about a billion dollars ofsettlements and tokenization a
day.
So they have their own on theBiddle, they have their own
tokens they will call it Biddleand they already do some
settlements with their partnersand brokers on their own
(13:14):
blockchain.
Same happens for the.
Jp Morgan has their ownblockchain as well, so they
already do it internally.
Just in the grand scheme ofthings, it's still a very small
right Kind of risk-free for themflow, small risk-free for them
flow that they're settling.
But eventually it's going to bemore the problem right now with
them that they're discussing,let's say, jp Morgan and
BlackRock and the others.
How do we bridge together ourclosed ecosystems?
(13:35):
Because they have closedblockchains?
It's not an open blockchainbecause you have to have
compliance and there's a lot oflayers of compliance and
regulation, primarily around thefinancial services.
So they're thinking, okay, howdo we really marry them together
and talk to each other so theycan talk to each other?
Not like databases talk to eachother, but actual blockchain?
Speaker 2 (13:50):
Well, let's switch gears a little bit and talk
about you, maybe walk us throughyour career journey, how you
got to where you are today.
Speaker 3 (13:59):
Yeah, I mean, I've been in tech for all my life.
I started a couple ofbusinesses, as I mentioned.
One of them has been acquiredsince 2017.
And I started to buy Bitcoin in2018.
So it was pretty simple.
I took a sabbatical and there'sDublin and crypto and it went
from 2000 to 20 in 2017.
I remember that was my kind ofwave when I started buying.
Then it crashed to 3000 in 2018.
(14:20):
And, yeah, I kind of stickedaround, but I didn't like the
experience.
I could buy it from thoseexisting brokers that existed.
There was a lot of hidden feesand a lot of complexity and at
the same time, I was usingTransferWise.
It's called wisecom.
You probably know Wise, kind ofa neo-bank, but primarily for
the cross-border payments.
So it was really clean.
They showed you the rates,everything very transparent.
(14:41):
So we wanted to build somethinglike that first.
That was kind of the coinchange journey when we started
in 2019.
We thought about it, did allthe market analysis.
We knew from the productperspective, the steps we needed
to take.
So 2020, we started buildingthat.
2021, we only took it to marketand it already had the asset
management component, but onlyon DeFi rails, very different to
what we did.
So that was the journey, how Igot into the coin change.
(15:02):
So trying to change thebrokerage business pretty much
in Canada.
But then we realized it wassaturated.
It was raised to the bottomcompression of fees, a lot of
regulation, hard to go global.
So we always pivoted towardsthe DeFi yield platform, right
again within the application,and then we pivoted to the asset
management of B2B businesses.
We are right now multi-managingB2B business.
(15:24):
So we also have a hedge fund, afully licensed hedge fund in
Gibraltar, where we serviceinstitutional clients, primarily
family offices.
I've always been theentrepreneur Since I was a small
kid.
I was on the parking lots, Iwas acting as a parking
superintendent looking for theneighbor cars, getting paid a
little bit.
I was also collecting freebottles and hourglass bottles
(15:44):
and taking them to the beerstore to get some cash for the
ice cream.
So yeah, it was kind of theresince I was a little kid.
And then eventually you do moreand more and more and out of
snowball something doesn't workout quite often, right?
You just have to have anability to learn from those
missteps and try to self-correctfor the next step.
I think the venture is.
(16:05):
I mean, there's very brutalstatistics that it's only like
three or four percent of thestartups actually succeed right
or get big right.
So most of them fail or stay asa family-owned business right.
That barely pays for the familybills.
Not an easy journey.
You definitely, if you're ableto self-reflect and learn, and
that's probably interesting tohave such a career.
Speaker 2 (16:26):
Okay, well, what are some things you're passionate
about?
Maybe one work-related passionand one personal passion.
Speaker 3 (16:31):
Reading would be probably a personal passion.
My family have their kids.
It's my passion too my kids, mywife obviously, and the work
passion in work.
I mean also reading.
Yeah, I like reading aboutwhat's happening in the industry
and what's happening in myniche right Small world,
probably.
If happening in the industryand what's happening in my niche
right, small world, probably.
(16:52):
If you talk about theday-to-day, I would say hiring
people, that's also prettyimportant and I liked doing that
finding the right people thatprobably have the right skill
set for the problem.
So that's also that I try tospend more time on and analyzing
people you have and theefficiency of that mechanism
that exists.
I would say those things.
Speaker 2 (17:10):
Okay.
So if someone comes to you, max, and they're maybe looking at
building a career in financialservices or fintech, or even
payments, with your experienceand since you said you liked
hiring people curious, whatadvice would you give them to be
successful in this industry,successful in their careers in
(17:31):
fintech, if they choose to gointo that?
Speaker 3 (17:33):
How do they approach employment opportunity right or
starting their own business?
Speaker 2 (17:37):
No more on the employment side in crypto or in
fintech in general.
Just fintech in general.
Crypto is a little different.
Speaker 3 (17:44):
It's a pretty nascent industry.
So a lot of things that welooked at is you don't have to
have a past experience directpast experience, right and
crypto Like at least five yearswhen we started.
Anyone right now you cancross-pollinate your experience
of Tread5 to crypto prettyeasily, especially on the
investment management side andin payments.
So I think, approaching theemployer and going to the
interview what we look at atleast what we like when people
(18:06):
don't really.
First of all, I mean you haveto have a deep understanding of
your domain.
So, depending on what exactlyyou're hired for is it risk, is
it compliance, Is it marketresearch, is it financial
product engineering you have tohave a certain deep expertise or
real direct knowledge,experience of that.
Second of all, I think you haveto be able to challenge.
(18:29):
It's also not easy to challengepeople or you have to be ready
to be challenged.
So it's important because a lotof people don't want to be
challenged or don't want tochallenge the others right.
So we always kind of fosterthat, so not to follow but to
challenge, right.
So that's when you actually getsome granularity and everybody
can ask any question for anyonethe question manual primarily
(18:50):
for the most part.
So that's important.
So we're going to test thatright.
Then we think it's importantand I think the work ethics is
important.
You won't know until you start,but you try to find okay, do you
do any extracurricular?
If people do sports usually aprofessional, like
semi-professional sports orvarsity sports you know that
they don're going to have tohire me, they're going to be
more professionally roundedethically to do the job rather
than, let's say, they've neverdone nothing, no charity sports,
(19:12):
and you've got to question alittle bit.
So you want to have thatprofessional ethics checked on.
That's about it.
And then you try, and thenusually you want to identify
quickly if it works out ordoesn't, not to invest too much
in the candidate that's notgoing to work out.
So usually we do about threemonths.
We try to evaluate within thefirst three months.
Speaker 2 (19:34):
Okay, great Well, thanks for sharing that.
Obviously, we've covered yourbackground the company kind of
the industry.
Is there anything else you'dlike to do before we wrap up?
Speaker 3 (19:44):
I think regulatory is an important part in crypto
right now, especially with Trumpright at the White House.
I mean crypto industry had areally big hope right for the
change.
I think it happened, either forthe worse, right, it's hard to
say yet.
I mean generally the markets.
I mean really unpredictableright now with everything that
happened.
So there's definitely a lot ofstill unpredictability.
(20:05):
But at least we can really seeon the regulatory side of the
bills that they're passing theregulation that's right now been
reviewed.
There was an operation chokepoint too before in the last two
administrations and it wasreally challenging to get a
banking relationship with acrypto company, even for the
corporate bank I'm not sayingthe list, I mean the client side
of that.
So right now we can see it'sdefinitely flexing up, so
(20:28):
there's more opportunities forbusinesses to open up bank
accounts and to service theirclients.
We see that stablecoin bill iscoming as well.
That's great news.
The biggest stablecoin in theworld is USD.
None of the other stablecoin.
Mexican-based stablecoin wasissued.
Euro stablecoin was issued.
Nothing is close to that andit's good for the US because it
(20:52):
does penetrate emerging marketssubstantially and most of that
collateral under the stable coingoes to the T-bill.
So I think Tether is theseventh largest purchaser of
American T-bills globally.
So some crazy numbers, right.
So it's not a country, just abusiness.
But they issued $150 billionstable coins coins and I think
$120 billion is in T-bills somevery big numbers.
So I think the regulation isimportant.
So crypto was like that andright now it seems like we're on
(21:12):
the right track.
So I think this is veryimportant for the operators to
understand as well.
There's going to be probablystill a black market and a
regulated market.
Always there's a black marketin anything, right?
So crypto is not an exclusion.
There's always a black marketto service certain people in
certain flows.
But it's going to be moredeviated than before, because
before it was all kind of gray.
(21:32):
Right now it's going to be aclear distinction between the
white regulated players and theblack unregulated players.
Speaker 2 (21:42):
So I think that's an important item to consider for
the clients and for theoperators.
So do you see the changes inthe regulatory environment
around crypto in the US.
Speaker 3 (21:51):
Does that affect the global market?
Not really.
I think Europe is already ontheir way to Mika.
Mika is like a unified cryptoregulation across Europe.
It has been delayed, delayed,delayed in different
jurisdictions.
Dubai is doing their own thingwith Vara.
Singapore is doing their ownthing with VARA.
Singapore is doing their ownthing with their VASP
registration.
So I think it's stillsegregated.
But I think it's good for theUS businesses to come back,
because a lot of US businesseswent offshore.
(22:13):
A lot of US businesses went toDubai and to the other
jurisdictions where they couldeasily operate.
So I think more clarity comesto market, more banking
relationships open up, morebusinesses are going to be
relocated back to the US Becauseit's still the largest of the
best capital markets in theworld, right?
Speaker 2 (22:27):
Okay, well, max, anything else before we go?
Speaker 3 (22:30):
No, we can't wait at all.
Speaker 2 (22:33):
Okay, great, great.
Well, thank you so much forbeing on the show today.
Speaker 3 (22:37):
I know your time is very valuable, so I really
appreciate you being here.
Thanks a lot I appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (22:41):
Thanks a lot, I appreciate it.
Thanks for having me Absolutely, and to all you listeners out
there.
Speaker 1 (22:45):
I thank you for your time as well, and until the next
story, thank you for joining usthis week on the Leaders in
Payments podcast.
Make sure you visit our websiteat leadersinpaymentscom, where
you can subscribe to the showand where you'll find our show
notes.
If you enjoyed listening,please share on your social
channels as well.
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On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.
Ridiculous History
History is beautiful, brutal and, often, ridiculous. Join Ben Bowlin and Noel Brown as they dive into some of the weirdest stories from across the span of human civilization in Ridiculous History, a podcast by iHeartRadio.