September 29, 2025 • 21 mins
Bridging the gap between Treasury, Accounts Receivable, and Accounts Payable represents the critical "last mile" in financial automation. John Rubenetti, President of B2B Payments at Deluxe, reveals how leading organizations are connecting these traditionally siloed functions to create seamless, intelligent financial ecosystems.
The challenge isn't implementing individual automation solutions—it's connecting them. "The friction shows up in the handoffs," Rubenetti explains. When data and money flow through disconnected systems, finance leaders lose visibility and control. True transformation happens when organizations align technology, people, and processes to create end-to-end financial workflows.
Many CFOs underestimate the complexity of integration. They may believe they understand departmental processes but miss critical dependencies or manual workarounds. Data quality becomes another stumbling block—if information isn't clean today, automation won't deliver promised insights. Rubenetti advises starting with a clear vision, taking a phased approach, and choosing partners who understand both the technology and change management aspects.
The conversation explores how modern thinking must accompany modern tools. While dashboards provide visibility, embedding intelligence directly into workflows creates transformative value. Instead of merely reporting numbers, advanced systems prioritize actions, handle exceptions through AI, and trigger automated responses—shifting from static reporting to dynamic decision support.
Rubenetti highlights three significant B2B payment trends: mid-market automation (where 70% still lack automated AP/AR processes), enhanced security (as "fraud thrives in manual processes"), and payment modernization. Despite technological advances, paper checks remain surprisingly prevalent, particularly among small and mid-sized businesses who value the detailed information that accompanies them.
Deluxe has evolved far beyond its reputation as "the check company" to become a comprehensive payments and data organization. Their solutions now span the entire financial ecosystem—from treasury management to merchant services—helping businesses move money faster, safer, and more efficiently while maintaining the data integrity essential for strategic decision-making.
Ready to complete your financial automation journey? Start by mastering the basics before pursuing flashier technologies. The foundation you build today will determine your success tomorrow.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_00 (00:01):
Welcome to this special four-part series titled
Modern Finance, sponsored byDeluxe, where we explore the
future of financial automation.
From Treasury to accountspayable and receivable, we're
diving into how AI andintelligent automation are
transforming every corner offinance.
In each episode, you'll hearfrom leaders at Deluxe who are
(00:23):
driving innovation anddelivering real-world results.
Whether you're navigatingcompliance, fighting fraud, or
connecting the financial dots,this series is packed with
insights you won't want to miss.
SPEAKER_02 (00:36):
Hello, everyone, and welcome to the Leaders in
Payments Podcast.
I'm your host, Greg Myers.
This episode is part of ourfour-part series titled Modern
Finance and is being brought toyou by Deluxe.
We kicked off the series with afascinating episode with Yoges
Jay Aprokassam from Deluxe,where we discuss how AI is
influencing the paymentsecosystem and specifically
treasury management.
(00:57):
In the second episode, I spokewith Pat Moy about accounts
receivable automation.
In the third episode, I spokewith Steve Bookberger and
Heather Daywood about accountspayable automation.
Today I'm honored to have as ourvery special guest, John
Rubenetti, the president of B2BPayments at Deluxe.
We're going to be talking aboutthe last mile of automation,
modern tools versus modernthinking, and some B2B payment
(01:19):
trends.
So, John, thank you so much forbeing here and welcome to the
show.
Greg, thanks for having me.
SPEAKER_01 (01:24):
Really appreciate the opportunity.
SPEAKER_02 (01:26):
Absolutely.
So let's get started by talkinga little bit about you and
Deluxe.
So if you don't mind, tell ouraudience a little bit about
yourself, maybe where you grewup, where you went to school,
where you currently live, a fewthings like that.
SPEAKER_01 (01:37):
Sure, sure.
So I am originally from NewJersey, spent my whole life
there for this deluxeopportunity.
18 months ago, moved down toAtlanta.
So I've been in Atlanta for alittle bit.
It's a little uh littledifferent than New Jersey, but
it's been really great.
I've really enjoyed my time downhere.
I went to school in New Jersey,did my undergrad at Montclair
(01:58):
State, did my master's at SetonHall.
So I'm kind of Jersey JerseyJersey.
So but it's been good.
I've been in payments for 20plus years.
Uh started my career at AmericanExpress on the commercial card
side, then in the B2B payments,then I moved on the banking
side, spent time at CitizensBank and the treasure uh running
treasury sales for their uhbusiness banking and commercial
(02:20):
enterprise banking.
Then went on to the other sideof payments, which is the
merchant side of the business atuh Bank of America merchant
services, first data jointventure.
Did that for about five years,and then five years when FISERF
bought First Data, had theopportunity to move over to
FISERF.
So it was a good time, and thenuh moved over to Deluxe, which
(02:42):
kind of compassed all of myexperience and bank contacts and
selling into banks and managingbanks relationships.
So it's been fun, it's been anice ride and uh made a lot of
friends along the way.
SPEAKER_02 (02:55):
Great, great.
So for those who may not befamiliar, can you give us a
quick overview of what deluxedoes and the role it plays in
the payments and financialecosystem?
Sure.
SPEAKER_01 (03:04):
Because yeah, do you know what deluxe is a company
that a lot of people know thename and know us as the check
company, but they don't know,you know, or realize how big of
a role we actually do play inpayments.
And um, we work with a littleover 4,000 or almost 4,000 banks
and a little over 300,000businesses to help them move
(03:25):
money.
And whether that's automatedpayables, automated receivables,
whether it's running theirlockbox operations, whether it's
paying by check, utilizing ourdata tools to go after and win
new customers for our financialinstitutions, or whether it's
paying and accepting creditcards, right?
Those are our businesses that atthe end of the day, our job at
(03:46):
deluxe is to really makepayments faster, safer, and
easier to use so that ourclients can then go ahead and
service their customers moreeffectively.
Okay.
Well, if you don't mind, tell usabout your role today at deluxe.
So my role as president of B2Bpayments, I oversee our sales,
our go-to-market, our lockboxoperation for our customers, our
(04:08):
digital payables and receivablessolutions.
So basically, I manage the bankrelationships, manage our client
relationships.
We go to the we go to market twoways.
We go one through the banks thatsell our products to their
customers, and then we do alsogo direct to some of the larger
lockbox providers.
Think about utilities like youknow, Comcast and American
(04:28):
Express and Synchrony, and thoseare our big customers that uh we
do their lockbox for.
So that's it.
So I spent a lot of time infront of our customers talking
about what they need and what'schanging in the uh in the
payment space, and a lot of timein the markets.
So yeah, it's been exciting.
SPEAKER_02 (04:44):
Okay, great.
So let's dive into the topic athand, the last mile of
automation.
So bridging treasury, AR, andAP.
And we've talked about thetreasury function in AI.
We talked about automatingaccounts receivable, we talked
about automating accountspayable.
So to set the stage for thisconversation, how do you define
the last mile of automationacross Treasury AR and AP?
SPEAKER_01 (05:08):
Yeah, so when I talk about the last mile, I'm I'm
thinking about taking the goodwork that we've done and
automating AP and AR andTreasury and then actually
connecting it.
I think a lot of companies do areal good job of finding a
solution, right?
But the friction that shows upin the handoffs, right?
How the receivables data getsinto the ERP system or how
(05:32):
payments get reconciled byTreasury or how AP forecasts,
right?
I think that gets lost.
So I think the last mile in mymind is about stitching those
pieces together so that data andthe money flow seamlessly, and
that gives finance leaders thevisibility into the cash and the
ability to act on it real time.
(05:54):
I mean, that's what the lastmile in my mind is.
SPEAKER_02 (05:56):
Okay.
So let's assume a company startsdown this path of integrating
Treasury, AR, and AP into onekind of unified financial
ecosystem.
What is the key to thismodernization being successful?
SPEAKER_01 (06:08):
From my perspective, it's alignment, right?
The key is alignment, right?
Alignment between the technologythat you're selecting, the
people that are utilizing it,and the processes that they have
in place.
When you get those aligned,that's where it kind of can come
together.
I think all too often companiesinvest in a great tool, right?
But to get the groups to worktogether and get those teams to
(06:32):
interact together, that's thepiece that's kind of always
missing.
And I think a pitfall, right,that's out there is really
underestimating data, right?
And if the data is not coming inclean today or being consistent,
the automation is not gonnadeliver the insights that were
promised by the technology,right?
And I think the other piece thatis so important here is the
(06:54):
change management, right?
The finance teams are busytoday.
So if the rollout of this iseither disruptive, right, or too
complex, the adoption's gonnalag, right?
And so I think the companiesthat are successful are the ones
that start out with a good,clear vision of the outcomes
that they want.
They take a phased approachbecause that's not always that
(07:16):
easy to kind of have thatpatience, right?
And then they choose the rightpartners that can help them
integrate and adopt along theway.
And so those three things arecritical to success.
SPEAKER_02 (07:27):
Okay.
And you mentioned alignment.
So how does deluxe help withthat?
SPEAKER_01 (07:30):
So I think it's more about our approach to it and
where what we don't do is justtake a product and jam it in.
What we try to do is ask thequestions who's using it.
Let's talk to those users,right?
How you approach thatconversation is just as
important as the tool you have,right?
The tool, like I said, is onlyone piece.
It's understanding how it'sgoing to be used, it's
(07:52):
understanding how they do thingstoday, and it's understanding
how that change managementprocess works.
So we coach through that and wehave kind of that approach with
our customers.
SPEAKER_02 (08:02):
Okay.
And you did mention one sort ofcommon pitfall, but are there
other things that they shouldwatch out for?
SPEAKER_01 (08:07):
Look, I think making sure they truly understand,
right?
A lot of times a CFO can say,Oh, yeah, I know what AP does, I
know what AR does.
And there are a few steps thatthey may have not understood
fully, right?
So really understanding thewhole, you know, start-to-end
process and kind of what happensin between, that's a pitfall
that sometimes they think, ohyeah, you know, that's easy for
(08:29):
AP to automate.
And it's really not because theyhave some annual processes that
they may not know about.
They have a spreadsheet thatthey use and that that's not
really effective or known.
And so it's really uncoveringwhat the true process is and the
different touch points.
SPEAKER_02 (08:45):
Okay.
Well, let's talk about moderntools versus modern thinking.
So, what modern tools doesdeluxe offer for this
modernization or automationexperience to CFOs and other
financial leaders?
SPEAKER_01 (08:57):
Yeah, well, and I'm glad you guys have done a real
good job at highlighting severalof our solutions, right?
But first and foremost, it'sreceivables 360 plus, right?
Which is AI-powered cashapplication solution.
It is really modern and reallygaining a lot of momentum in the
marketplace.
We have our integrated payablesolution through the deluxe
(09:17):
payment exchange.
We launched our acquisition ofJPMorgan Chase's check match.
And so we've combined into onenetwork to basically digitize
the delivery of checks throughdirectly to lockboxes.
And so we're really, reallyexcited about that.
And then I think merchantservices, which is helping
(09:38):
businesses manage their paymentsseamlessly and accept payments.
So I think those are the thingsthat we're really excited about.
But I kind of said this before,it's beyond the tools, it's
about the kind of modernthinking and the modern
go-to-market that we're thinkingabout.
So I'm talking to my peers likeBrian Mahane, who leads merchant
(09:58):
services, is how do we worktogether?
How do we come together?
How do we talk about oursolutions better to show that
they integrate as part of aconnected kind of ecosystem,
right?
That provides that bettervisibility.
And our receivables platform, wehave the ability to bring the
merchant data in and bring allthe ACH and the wire, right?
So when you can bring all thosepayments together and talk about
(10:19):
it in that way, that's what Ithink gives us that advantage.
SPEAKER_02 (10:23):
Okay.
Yeah, that's a great segue tothe next question.
So, from a modern thinkingperspective, how do you coach
financial leaders to move fromsort of that dashboard mentality
to more of an embeddeddecisioning as just an example?
SPEAKER_01 (10:37):
It's a great point, right?
Because some of these solutionsare like, oh, we'll give you a
dashboard.
And dashboards are great, right?
And I love them.
I think they're the first stepthat give you that visibility,
but it's that modern thinking,that thinking of, you know,
embedded decisioning, right?
That's the next step and makingsure embedding that into your
workflow, right?
And understanding the workflowso that you can not only improve
(10:59):
it, right, but give them whatthey're looking for.
I think what happens withdashboards is you get stuck
staring at the numbers, but notnecessarily having that insight
real time to make decisions.
So again, instead of justopening the dashboard, right,
and seeing those numbers,ideally you want someone to have
the embedded decisioning inthere, right?
(11:20):
Where you can prioritize whichones to work on, where you can
take exceptions and use AI tostart allowing those exceptions
to go through, where you canwork on the more complex ones,
right?
Where you can identify where toprioritize payments and what
that does for your cash flow,right?
Or even trigger a payment on theAP side, right?
(11:41):
Those are the things that areembedded.
You know, that takes a dashboardand really makes it take it to
the next level.
And so when they can look atthat dashboard and have the
embedded decisioning in there,it gives them the opportunity to
shift from just looking atreports to really having
automation that drives theoutcomes which they want, which
is better visibility into theircache and what to do with it.
SPEAKER_02 (12:04):
So it's really a mindset difference, right?
It's kind of going from a staticdisplay to understanding what's
going on behind the numbers.
Exactly.
SPEAKER_01 (12:13):
That's the piece that really separates a company
who buys a solution, right,versus someone who kind of
really understands the processand what the solution's solving
for.
unknown (12:23):
Okay.
SPEAKER_02 (12:23):
Well, how does a CFO or a company know that they've
been successful integratingthese functions into one system?
Are there KPIs or otherindicators that really define
success?
SPEAKER_01 (12:33):
I think that the clearest signs of success show
up on both the efficiency sideand the insight side, right?
So on the efficiency side,you'll see faster cash
application, you'll see lowerDSO, you'll see reduced manual
touches, right?
And a smoother reconciliation.
And then on the insight side, aCFO is going to get real-time
view of their cash, you know,and drive better forecasting,
(12:57):
right?
I think, you know, if I'm a CFO,if I can answer the question of
where is my cash today and whatshould I do with it, that's when
you'll see and know that theintegration is working because
you'll be able to kind of makethose decisions so much easier
and it'll be better for yourbusiness long term.
SPEAKER_02 (13:14):
Okay.
For this last section, I'd liketo focus on some trends in the
marketplace when it comes to B2Bpayments.
And you laid them out realnicely in a recent interview.
So I wanted to walk throughthose with you.
Trend number one, and we'vetalked a lot about this
automating AP and AR.
So kind of what a few of thepast episodes have been about,
but where do you see the biggestopportunity in that space?
SPEAKER_01 (13:36):
Yeah, look, I think the biggest opportunity is in
that middle market space.
I think often it's in that spaceand through the bank partners,
right?
This is where banks, regionalbanks, and even the larger banks
have really a stronghold on thatmid-market customer base, right?
And largely the large corporateshave already heavily invested in
(13:56):
automation and that, but themid-sized companies, they're
still wrestling with you knowmanual processes, paper checks,
spreadsheets, right?
Even systems that are notworking together.
They're just siloed, right?
So they add one system to helpwith one thing, add another to
help another, but they're notreally talking.
And I think, like I said, thebanks are really in a perfect
(14:17):
position to help deliver theautomation to that segment.
And I think for deluxe, we playright into that, right?
And so we provide those toolslike 360, like deluxe payment
exchange, like deluxe paymentnetwork, so that they can take
them to market quickly.
And that's where we see kind ofthe greatest near-term lift is
helping those mid-marketcompanies, letting the banks
(14:39):
kind of score that point withthem on getting them to focus on
other things for their financialinstitution, not these
processes.
So I think there's a really bigopportunity in that mid-market
space for the banks.
SPEAKER_02 (14:52):
Okay.
Trend number two, security andfraud.
I mean, it can't get any biggerthan that one from a trend
perspective, right?
And we've only briefly duringthis series touched on it.
So how does automating AR and APhelp reduce fraud?
SPEAKER_01 (15:05):
Aaron Powell Well, look, I think everybody is well
aware that fraud thrives inmanual processes, right?
That that's that's just where itis.
Paper checks, email approvals,spreadsheets that you know the
AP and AR groups pass around,right?
But when you automate there, youstart to build controls, you
build your audit trails, you youhave digital approvals, right?
You have bank rate encryption inthings, right?
(15:27):
And AI can flag things,anomalies for you before
payments go out, right?
So those kind of things reducethe opportunity for bad actors,
but it also gives a CFO peace ofmind because the system is
actually working in thebackground, right, to protect
not only their cash, but theirdata.
And so that's the biggest thingI could say, right?
(15:48):
Fraud thrives on those manualprocesses, and we have to get
them out for their sake.
unknown (15:55):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (15:55):
I'm still amazed there's so many companies that
still have so many manualprocesses and write checks and
have those kind of manual walkdown the hall, have someone sign
off on something.
It just seems like we should beway past that, but I know we're
really not.
SPEAKER_01 (16:11):
No, you know what?
It's when I tell people, youknow, what I'm responsible for,
and they're like, people arestill paying by checks.
And I'm like, yeah, they are.
And small businesses andmid-sized companies are even
higher, right?
Because they're still, they wantthat detail, they want that data
to come with it.
And that's why we feel likewe're in a really good position
at deluxe because we have thatdata for them.
(16:33):
We have the ability to bringthat in and help automate that
stuff for them.
So I'd like checks to slowlymove and me be the one to help
move them, not not the other wayaround.
So, but yeah, I thought we'd befarther along.
There's just until I thinkthey're really fully integrated,
that's when you have the abilityto do that.
Otherwise, if you're doing itone-off, people are that's
(16:54):
sometimes just the easier way todo it because it's the way
they've always done it.
SPEAKER_02 (16:57):
Yep, yep, absolutely.
So the last trend, trend numberthree, is payment modernization.
And you've talked about that inthe past.
So, can you explain what thatmeans and why it's so relevant
to the ARAP automation?
SPEAKER_01 (17:10):
Yeah, it's kind of a little bit about what I was just
talking about, right?
So payment modernization isgiving businesses more choice,
speed, and transparency abouthow the money moves, right?
Where everyone's talking aboutreal-time payments, FedNow, ACH,
deluxe payment exchange, right?
All those rails need to be partof the mix, right?
And if you're an ARAP or AR,that means the automation needs
(17:33):
to be flexible enough.
So if you're doing more checkstoday, you need that ability.
And maybe you'll go to lesschecks down the road, but if you
don't have the ability to haveall of those payment rails kind
of integrated into one solution,that's the modernization you
need to start to maximize theefficiency and the types, right?
(17:54):
And the data that comes alongwith it.
I always say modernizationmatters just because it's not
just about moving the moneyfaster, it's about making sure
that the data travels with it sothat finance has the ability to
make better decisions.
And that's the piece where Ithink we need to get to is that
modernization piece of havingthose things in one place so
that you can make betterdecisions on what you're doing.
SPEAKER_02 (18:15):
Okay.
So, John, this has been a greatdiscussion so far.
If there's one key insight orpiece of advice you want
Treasury and finance leaders totake away from this
conversation, what would thatbe?
SPEAKER_01 (18:26):
You know, I get this a lot, and my answer is it's
always very similar, right?
I think so many people, and wedo in our personal lives, right?
They look at shiny objects orthe new thing.
Who wants the new iPhone?
Who wants, you know, you go getthe new iPhone and you don't
even know how to use the iPhonethat you had, right?
And so I'm a big fan of focusingon the basics, right?
(18:47):
And automate first.
That way you can take advantageof all these wonderful things
and AI that's part of it.
You know, stat I like to share,right, is 70% of mid-market
companies do not have anautomated AP or AR process,
right?
So from my perspective, theycan't even think about AI and
those kind of things until theyget that done.
(19:08):
So, you know, it may not be sexyfor a lot of people, but I can
promise you it's effective andit gets you to where you need to
be so that you can take the nextstep.
But stick into the basics, don'tget wowed by the well, you can
do all this AI.
You can't do AI unless you havedata and you have a place to go.
And so I'm just a big fan ofjust the basics.
(19:29):
Do the basics really well,automate that first.
That's my advice to bankers thatare out there that are talking
to mid-market customers, havethis conversation.
And if you're a mid-marketcompany, have the conversation
with your organization.
Trust me, they're all doingthings that they know they
shouldn't be doing, and there'sways to do them better.
So they actually welcome theopportunity to talk about it.
(19:50):
They're not as scared as peopleused to be about because
everyone's using it themselves.
And so it's a different time,it's not like you're
introducing, you know, anautomation process that no one
heard of, right?
So they're aware of it.
And so don't be scared of it.
Have the conversation.
SPEAKER_02 (20:04):
Okay.
Well, is there anything else youwanted to cover before we wrap
up the show?
SPEAKER_01 (20:08):
You know, look, I think I would want to reiterate
what I started out with, right?
Which is many people know deluxeas the check company.
And, you know, if you read ourtagline, we're a payments and
data company, and we havetransitioned over the last five
years, but a lot of peoplehaven't followed that
transition.
And when you look at what we'redoing in the automated payables
and receivab space and theautomation deluxe payment
(20:30):
exchange, and that taking thepost office and mail out and
automating and digitizing checksinto lockboxes, that's the kind
of stuff that we're doing atdeluxe.
And people want to understandthat because we're about much
more than just checks, and we'rereally helping businesses and
banks automate all the payablesand receivables processes.
(20:52):
So I think that's my message forfolks we're not the deluxe that
you think you know.
SPEAKER_02 (20:57):
Okay, great, John.
I think that's a great way towrap up.
So thanks so much for being onthe show today.
I know your time's veryvaluable, so I really appreciate
you being here.
SPEAKER_01 (21:04):
Greg, thank you for having me.
Appreciate the opportunity.
SPEAKER_02 (21:07):
Absolutely.
And to all you listeners outthere, I thank you for your time
as well.
And until the next story.
SPEAKER_00 (21:12):
Thank you for listening to today's episode.
If you'd like more informationon the transformative potential
of AI and automation in modernfinance, please visit
www.delux.com slash receivableshyphen management slash cash
hyphen application.
Welcome to this special four-part series titled
Modern Finance, sponsored byDeluxe, where we explore the
future of financial automation.
From Treasury to accountspayable and receivable, we're
diving into how AI andintelligent automation are
transforming every corner offinance.
In each episode, you'll hearfrom leaders at Deluxe who are
(00:23):
driving innovation anddelivering real-world results.
Whether you're navigatingcompliance, fighting fraud, or
connecting the financial dots,this series is packed with
insights you won't want to miss.
SPEAKER_02 (00:36):
Hello, everyone, and welcome to the Leaders in
Payments Podcast.
I'm your host, Greg Myers.
This episode is part of ourfour-part series titled Modern
Finance and is being brought toyou by Deluxe.
We kicked off the series with afascinating episode with Yoges
Jay Aprokassam from Deluxe,where we discuss how AI is
influencing the paymentsecosystem and specifically
treasury management.
(00:57):
In the second episode, I spokewith Pat Moy about accounts
receivable automation.
In the third episode, I spokewith Steve Bookberger and
Heather Daywood about accountspayable automation.
Today I'm honored to have as ourvery special guest, John
Rubenetti, the president of B2BPayments at Deluxe.
We're going to be talking aboutthe last mile of automation,
modern tools versus modernthinking, and some B2B payment
(01:19):
trends.
So, John, thank you so much forbeing here and welcome to the
show.
Greg, thanks for having me.
SPEAKER_01 (01:24):
Really appreciate the opportunity.
SPEAKER_02 (01:26):
Absolutely.
So let's get started by talkinga little bit about you and
Deluxe.
So if you don't mind, tell ouraudience a little bit about
yourself, maybe where you grewup, where you went to school,
where you currently live, a fewthings like that.
SPEAKER_01 (01:37):
Sure, sure.
So I am originally from NewJersey, spent my whole life
there for this deluxeopportunity.
18 months ago, moved down toAtlanta.
So I've been in Atlanta for alittle bit.
It's a little uh littledifferent than New Jersey, but
it's been really great.
I've really enjoyed my time downhere.
I went to school in New Jersey,did my undergrad at Montclair
(01:58):
State, did my master's at SetonHall.
So I'm kind of Jersey JerseyJersey.
So but it's been good.
I've been in payments for 20plus years.
Uh started my career at AmericanExpress on the commercial card
side, then in the B2B payments,then I moved on the banking
side, spent time at CitizensBank and the treasure uh running
treasury sales for their uhbusiness banking and commercial
(02:20):
enterprise banking.
Then went on to the other sideof payments, which is the
merchant side of the business atuh Bank of America merchant
services, first data jointventure.
Did that for about five years,and then five years when FISERF
bought First Data, had theopportunity to move over to
FISERF.
So it was a good time, and thenuh moved over to Deluxe, which
(02:42):
kind of compassed all of myexperience and bank contacts and
selling into banks and managingbanks relationships.
So it's been fun, it's been anice ride and uh made a lot of
friends along the way.
SPEAKER_02 (02:55):
Great, great.
So for those who may not befamiliar, can you give us a
quick overview of what deluxedoes and the role it plays in
the payments and financialecosystem?
Sure.
SPEAKER_01 (03:04):
Because yeah, do you know what deluxe is a company
that a lot of people know thename and know us as the check
company, but they don't know,you know, or realize how big of
a role we actually do play inpayments.
And um, we work with a littleover 4,000 or almost 4,000 banks
and a little over 300,000businesses to help them move
(03:25):
money.
And whether that's automatedpayables, automated receivables,
whether it's running theirlockbox operations, whether it's
paying by check, utilizing ourdata tools to go after and win
new customers for our financialinstitutions, or whether it's
paying and accepting creditcards, right?
Those are our businesses that atthe end of the day, our job at
(03:46):
deluxe is to really makepayments faster, safer, and
easier to use so that ourclients can then go ahead and
service their customers moreeffectively.
Okay.
Well, if you don't mind, tell usabout your role today at deluxe.
So my role as president of B2Bpayments, I oversee our sales,
our go-to-market, our lockboxoperation for our customers, our
(04:08):
digital payables and receivablessolutions.
So basically, I manage the bankrelationships, manage our client
relationships.
We go to the we go to market twoways.
We go one through the banks thatsell our products to their
customers, and then we do alsogo direct to some of the larger
lockbox providers.
Think about utilities like youknow, Comcast and American
(04:28):
Express and Synchrony, and thoseare our big customers that uh we
do their lockbox for.
So that's it.
So I spent a lot of time infront of our customers talking
about what they need and what'schanging in the uh in the
payment space, and a lot of timein the markets.
So yeah, it's been exciting.
SPEAKER_02 (04:44):
Okay, great.
So let's dive into the topic athand, the last mile of
automation.
So bridging treasury, AR, andAP.
And we've talked about thetreasury function in AI.
We talked about automatingaccounts receivable, we talked
about automating accountspayable.
So to set the stage for thisconversation, how do you define
the last mile of automationacross Treasury AR and AP?
SPEAKER_01 (05:08):
Yeah, so when I talk about the last mile, I'm I'm
thinking about taking the goodwork that we've done and
automating AP and AR andTreasury and then actually
connecting it.
I think a lot of companies do areal good job of finding a
solution, right?
But the friction that shows upin the handoffs, right?
How the receivables data getsinto the ERP system or how
(05:32):
payments get reconciled byTreasury or how AP forecasts,
right?
I think that gets lost.
So I think the last mile in mymind is about stitching those
pieces together so that data andthe money flow seamlessly, and
that gives finance leaders thevisibility into the cash and the
ability to act on it real time.
(05:54):
I mean, that's what the lastmile in my mind is.
SPEAKER_02 (05:56):
Okay.
So let's assume a company startsdown this path of integrating
Treasury, AR, and AP into onekind of unified financial
ecosystem.
What is the key to thismodernization being successful?
SPEAKER_01 (06:08):
From my perspective, it's alignment, right?
The key is alignment, right?
Alignment between the technologythat you're selecting, the
people that are utilizing it,and the processes that they have
in place.
When you get those aligned,that's where it kind of can come
together.
I think all too often companiesinvest in a great tool, right?
But to get the groups to worktogether and get those teams to
(06:32):
interact together, that's thepiece that's kind of always
missing.
And I think a pitfall, right,that's out there is really
underestimating data, right?
And if the data is not coming inclean today or being consistent,
the automation is not gonnadeliver the insights that were
promised by the technology,right?
And I think the other piece thatis so important here is the
(06:54):
change management, right?
The finance teams are busytoday.
So if the rollout of this iseither disruptive, right, or too
complex, the adoption's gonnalag, right?
And so I think the companiesthat are successful are the ones
that start out with a good,clear vision of the outcomes
that they want.
They take a phased approachbecause that's not always that
(07:16):
easy to kind of have thatpatience, right?
And then they choose the rightpartners that can help them
integrate and adopt along theway.
And so those three things arecritical to success.
SPEAKER_02 (07:27):
Okay.
And you mentioned alignment.
So how does deluxe help withthat?
SPEAKER_01 (07:30):
So I think it's more about our approach to it and
where what we don't do is justtake a product and jam it in.
What we try to do is ask thequestions who's using it.
Let's talk to those users,right?
How you approach thatconversation is just as
important as the tool you have,right?
The tool, like I said, is onlyone piece.
It's understanding how it'sgoing to be used, it's
(07:52):
understanding how they do thingstoday, and it's understanding
how that change managementprocess works.
So we coach through that and wehave kind of that approach with
our customers.
SPEAKER_02 (08:02):
Okay.
And you did mention one sort ofcommon pitfall, but are there
other things that they shouldwatch out for?
SPEAKER_01 (08:07):
Look, I think making sure they truly understand,
right?
A lot of times a CFO can say,Oh, yeah, I know what AP does, I
know what AR does.
And there are a few steps thatthey may have not understood
fully, right?
So really understanding thewhole, you know, start-to-end
process and kind of what happensin between, that's a pitfall
that sometimes they think, ohyeah, you know, that's easy for
(08:29):
AP to automate.
And it's really not because theyhave some annual processes that
they may not know about.
They have a spreadsheet thatthey use and that that's not
really effective or known.
And so it's really uncoveringwhat the true process is and the
different touch points.
SPEAKER_02 (08:45):
Okay.
Well, let's talk about moderntools versus modern thinking.
So, what modern tools doesdeluxe offer for this
modernization or automationexperience to CFOs and other
financial leaders?
SPEAKER_01 (08:57):
Yeah, well, and I'm glad you guys have done a real
good job at highlighting severalof our solutions, right?
But first and foremost, it'sreceivables 360 plus, right?
Which is AI-powered cashapplication solution.
It is really modern and reallygaining a lot of momentum in the
marketplace.
We have our integrated payablesolution through the deluxe
(09:17):
payment exchange.
We launched our acquisition ofJPMorgan Chase's check match.
And so we've combined into onenetwork to basically digitize
the delivery of checks throughdirectly to lockboxes.
And so we're really, reallyexcited about that.
And then I think merchantservices, which is helping
(09:38):
businesses manage their paymentsseamlessly and accept payments.
So I think those are the thingsthat we're really excited about.
But I kind of said this before,it's beyond the tools, it's
about the kind of modernthinking and the modern
go-to-market that we're thinkingabout.
So I'm talking to my peers likeBrian Mahane, who leads merchant
(09:58):
services, is how do we worktogether?
How do we come together?
How do we talk about oursolutions better to show that
they integrate as part of aconnected kind of ecosystem,
right?
That provides that bettervisibility.
And our receivables platform, wehave the ability to bring the
merchant data in and bring allthe ACH and the wire, right?
So when you can bring all thosepayments together and talk about
(10:19):
it in that way, that's what Ithink gives us that advantage.
SPEAKER_02 (10:23):
Okay.
Yeah, that's a great segue tothe next question.
So, from a modern thinkingperspective, how do you coach
financial leaders to move fromsort of that dashboard mentality
to more of an embeddeddecisioning as just an example?
SPEAKER_01 (10:37):
It's a great point, right?
Because some of these solutionsare like, oh, we'll give you a
dashboard.
And dashboards are great, right?
And I love them.
I think they're the first stepthat give you that visibility,
but it's that modern thinking,that thinking of, you know,
embedded decisioning, right?
That's the next step and makingsure embedding that into your
workflow, right?
And understanding the workflowso that you can not only improve
(10:59):
it, right, but give them whatthey're looking for.
I think what happens withdashboards is you get stuck
staring at the numbers, but notnecessarily having that insight
real time to make decisions.
So again, instead of justopening the dashboard, right,
and seeing those numbers,ideally you want someone to have
the embedded decisioning inthere, right?
(11:20):
Where you can prioritize whichones to work on, where you can
take exceptions and use AI tostart allowing those exceptions
to go through, where you canwork on the more complex ones,
right?
Where you can identify where toprioritize payments and what
that does for your cash flow,right?
Or even trigger a payment on theAP side, right?
(11:41):
Those are the things that areembedded.
You know, that takes a dashboardand really makes it take it to
the next level.
And so when they can look atthat dashboard and have the
embedded decisioning in there,it gives them the opportunity to
shift from just looking atreports to really having
automation that drives theoutcomes which they want, which
is better visibility into theircache and what to do with it.
SPEAKER_02 (12:04):
So it's really a mindset difference, right?
It's kind of going from a staticdisplay to understanding what's
going on behind the numbers.
Exactly.
SPEAKER_01 (12:13):
That's the piece that really separates a company
who buys a solution, right,versus someone who kind of
really understands the processand what the solution's solving
for.
unknown (12:23):
Okay.
SPEAKER_02 (12:23):
Well, how does a CFO or a company know that they've
been successful integratingthese functions into one system?
Are there KPIs or otherindicators that really define
success?
SPEAKER_01 (12:33):
I think that the clearest signs of success show
up on both the efficiency sideand the insight side, right?
So on the efficiency side,you'll see faster cash
application, you'll see lowerDSO, you'll see reduced manual
touches, right?
And a smoother reconciliation.
And then on the insight side, aCFO is going to get real-time
view of their cash, you know,and drive better forecasting,
(12:57):
right?
I think, you know, if I'm a CFO,if I can answer the question of
where is my cash today and whatshould I do with it, that's when
you'll see and know that theintegration is working because
you'll be able to kind of makethose decisions so much easier
and it'll be better for yourbusiness long term.
SPEAKER_02 (13:14):
Okay.
For this last section, I'd liketo focus on some trends in the
marketplace when it comes to B2Bpayments.
And you laid them out realnicely in a recent interview.
So I wanted to walk throughthose with you.
Trend number one, and we'vetalked a lot about this
automating AP and AR.
So kind of what a few of thepast episodes have been about,
but where do you see the biggestopportunity in that space?
SPEAKER_01 (13:36):
Yeah, look, I think the biggest opportunity is in
that middle market space.
I think often it's in that spaceand through the bank partners,
right?
This is where banks, regionalbanks, and even the larger banks
have really a stronghold on thatmid-market customer base, right?
And largely the large corporateshave already heavily invested in
(13:56):
automation and that, but themid-sized companies, they're
still wrestling with you knowmanual processes, paper checks,
spreadsheets, right?
Even systems that are notworking together.
They're just siloed, right?
So they add one system to helpwith one thing, add another to
help another, but they're notreally talking.
And I think, like I said, thebanks are really in a perfect
(14:17):
position to help deliver theautomation to that segment.
And I think for deluxe, we playright into that, right?
And so we provide those toolslike 360, like deluxe payment
exchange, like deluxe paymentnetwork, so that they can take
them to market quickly.
And that's where we see kind ofthe greatest near-term lift is
helping those mid-marketcompanies, letting the banks
(14:39):
kind of score that point withthem on getting them to focus on
other things for their financialinstitution, not these
processes.
So I think there's a really bigopportunity in that mid-market
space for the banks.
SPEAKER_02 (14:52):
Okay.
Trend number two, security andfraud.
I mean, it can't get any biggerthan that one from a trend
perspective, right?
And we've only briefly duringthis series touched on it.
So how does automating AR and APhelp reduce fraud?
SPEAKER_01 (15:05):
Aaron Powell Well, look, I think everybody is well
aware that fraud thrives inmanual processes, right?
That that's that's just where itis.
Paper checks, email approvals,spreadsheets that you know the
AP and AR groups pass around,right?
But when you automate there, youstart to build controls, you
build your audit trails, you youhave digital approvals, right?
You have bank rate encryption inthings, right?
(15:27):
And AI can flag things,anomalies for you before
payments go out, right?
So those kind of things reducethe opportunity for bad actors,
but it also gives a CFO peace ofmind because the system is
actually working in thebackground, right, to protect
not only their cash, but theirdata.
And so that's the biggest thingI could say, right?
(15:48):
Fraud thrives on those manualprocesses, and we have to get
them out for their sake.
unknown (15:55):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (15:55):
I'm still amazed there's so many companies that
still have so many manualprocesses and write checks and
have those kind of manual walkdown the hall, have someone sign
off on something.
It just seems like we should beway past that, but I know we're
really not.
SPEAKER_01 (16:11):
No, you know what?
It's when I tell people, youknow, what I'm responsible for,
and they're like, people arestill paying by checks.
And I'm like, yeah, they are.
And small businesses andmid-sized companies are even
higher, right?
Because they're still, they wantthat detail, they want that data
to come with it.
And that's why we feel likewe're in a really good position
at deluxe because we have thatdata for them.
(16:33):
We have the ability to bringthat in and help automate that
stuff for them.
So I'd like checks to slowlymove and me be the one to help
move them, not not the other wayaround.
So, but yeah, I thought we'd befarther along.
There's just until I thinkthey're really fully integrated,
that's when you have the abilityto do that.
Otherwise, if you're doing itone-off, people are that's
(16:54):
sometimes just the easier way todo it because it's the way
they've always done it.
SPEAKER_02 (16:57):
Yep, yep, absolutely.
So the last trend, trend numberthree, is payment modernization.
And you've talked about that inthe past.
So, can you explain what thatmeans and why it's so relevant
to the ARAP automation?
SPEAKER_01 (17:10):
Yeah, it's kind of a little bit about what I was just
talking about, right?
So payment modernization isgiving businesses more choice,
speed, and transparency abouthow the money moves, right?
Where everyone's talking aboutreal-time payments, FedNow, ACH,
deluxe payment exchange, right?
All those rails need to be partof the mix, right?
And if you're an ARAP or AR,that means the automation needs
(17:33):
to be flexible enough.
So if you're doing more checkstoday, you need that ability.
And maybe you'll go to lesschecks down the road, but if you
don't have the ability to haveall of those payment rails kind
of integrated into one solution,that's the modernization you
need to start to maximize theefficiency and the types, right?
(17:54):
And the data that comes alongwith it.
I always say modernizationmatters just because it's not
just about moving the moneyfaster, it's about making sure
that the data travels with it sothat finance has the ability to
make better decisions.
And that's the piece where Ithink we need to get to is that
modernization piece of havingthose things in one place so
that you can make betterdecisions on what you're doing.
SPEAKER_02 (18:15):
Okay.
So, John, this has been a greatdiscussion so far.
If there's one key insight orpiece of advice you want
Treasury and finance leaders totake away from this
conversation, what would thatbe?
SPEAKER_01 (18:26):
You know, I get this a lot, and my answer is it's
always very similar, right?
I think so many people, and wedo in our personal lives, right?
They look at shiny objects orthe new thing.
Who wants the new iPhone?
Who wants, you know, you go getthe new iPhone and you don't
even know how to use the iPhonethat you had, right?
And so I'm a big fan of focusingon the basics, right?
(18:47):
And automate first.
That way you can take advantageof all these wonderful things
and AI that's part of it.
You know, stat I like to share,right, is 70% of mid-market
companies do not have anautomated AP or AR process,
right?
So from my perspective, theycan't even think about AI and
those kind of things until theyget that done.
(19:08):
So, you know, it may not be sexyfor a lot of people, but I can
promise you it's effective andit gets you to where you need to
be so that you can take the nextstep.
But stick into the basics, don'tget wowed by the well, you can
do all this AI.
You can't do AI unless you havedata and you have a place to go.
And so I'm just a big fan ofjust the basics.
(19:29):
Do the basics really well,automate that first.
That's my advice to bankers thatare out there that are talking
to mid-market customers, havethis conversation.
And if you're a mid-marketcompany, have the conversation
with your organization.
Trust me, they're all doingthings that they know they
shouldn't be doing, and there'sways to do them better.
So they actually welcome theopportunity to talk about it.
(19:50):
They're not as scared as peopleused to be about because
everyone's using it themselves.
And so it's a different time,it's not like you're
introducing, you know, anautomation process that no one
heard of, right?
So they're aware of it.
And so don't be scared of it.
Have the conversation.
SPEAKER_02 (20:04):
Okay.
Well, is there anything else youwanted to cover before we wrap
up the show?
SPEAKER_01 (20:08):
You know, look, I think I would want to reiterate
what I started out with, right?
Which is many people know deluxeas the check company.
And, you know, if you read ourtagline, we're a payments and
data company, and we havetransitioned over the last five
years, but a lot of peoplehaven't followed that
transition.
And when you look at what we'redoing in the automated payables
and receivab space and theautomation deluxe payment
(20:30):
exchange, and that taking thepost office and mail out and
automating and digitizing checksinto lockboxes, that's the kind
of stuff that we're doing atdeluxe.
And people want to understandthat because we're about much
more than just checks, and we'rereally helping businesses and
banks automate all the payablesand receivables processes.
(20:52):
So I think that's my message forfolks we're not the deluxe that
you think you know.
SPEAKER_02 (20:57):
Okay, great, John.
I think that's a great way towrap up.
So thanks so much for being onthe show today.
I know your time's veryvaluable, so I really appreciate
you being here.
SPEAKER_01 (21:04):
Greg, thank you for having me.
Appreciate the opportunity.
SPEAKER_02 (21:07):
Absolutely.
And to all you listeners outthere, I thank you for your time
as well.
And until the next story.
SPEAKER_00 (21:12):
Thank you for listening to today's episode.
If you'd like more informationon the transformative potential
of AI and automation in modernfinance, please visit
www.delux.com slash receivableshyphen management slash cash
hyphen application.
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