January 30, 2025 • 55 mins
This week my coach Dean Wicks comes on the show to talk all about coaching me to run 58 consecutive marathons. We dive into the nutrition, periodisation and so much more around this world first event and what it takes to train an athlete for this.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
It's legit.
Welcome back to the man that Canwith Lockie Stewart Today.
This one is one that peoplehave been DMing me a lot about
and I've just been saying holdout, hold out, hold out, we're
going.
And then Wixie Dean Wix, mycoach and mate, is on the show.
So, wixie, firstly thanks forgiving us your time on a rainy
(00:21):
Friday morning.
Thank you, mate, good to behere, and if we didn't have your
beautiful wife as your chieftechnical officer, we might have
had a DNS on this one.
Yeah, yeah, we're in bigtrouble.
Speaker 2 (00:32):
And our second podcast guest from Dolby.
Speaker 1 (00:34):
from my research I've done yeah, you've done some
research there.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Second, from Dolby putting it on the map About 320
NRL games between the two of us.
Not too bad at all.
Speaker 1 (00:46):
That's how it was 320 nrl games between the boys.
I like that one.
That's the, that's the moneyshot.
But, mate, so good to have youon there, on there, on here.
Uh, it's going to be a goodyarn.
Obviously we're going to diveinto, I guess, training me for
58 marathons and stuff, becausepeople have questions that they
ask me a lot that I just Iprobably could have a stab at
(01:09):
answering, but I think you'rethe man for the job for that.
But I also want to just helpother people who are aspiring to
run marathons or looking forguidance to answer some of those
questions.
But before we do, can we get abit of a background on Wixie?
Mate, you've obviously grown upin Dolby, as you mentioned.
Yep, you've done a lot ofendurance sports and that's sort
(01:30):
of your forte.
Now, what led you to that point, like what took you or got you
interested in that back in theday?
Endurance sports.
Speaker 2 (01:41):
Yeah, mate, long story short, I guess, guess,
probably a pretty normal blokefrom the darling downs, just
like yourself, love playingfooty, grew up playing that.
Would have loved to make it asa footy player, like most kids
growing up in you know, dalby,toowoomba etc.
But just never good enough.
Um got signed by burley bears,their cup squad.
When I was 19, had a cup ofcoffee with the burley bears as
(02:04):
soon as some Titans boys got cutback from Titans.
I was, I was gone um and thenso always, yeah, grew up, love
playing sports and then just anormal sort of late teenager and
early 20 year old kid, probablydrinking too many beers and
getting up to mischief with theboys.
And then I think it like youhit that point mid to mid to
(02:24):
early 20s where you see onegroup of mates going one way and
they're rolling home at 5 6 amsaturday, sunday nights.
And then I live with one of mybest mates still to this day
jack his name is.
I think you met him before thebloke I sort of cruise around
and do all my marathons with andhe sort of changed his
lifestyle and was getting up atfive in the morning and riding
(02:45):
his bike for a couple hours.
So I sort of saw him going oneway, I saw the boys going the
other way and I decided to kindof go that way and, you know,
enjoy a active, healthylifestyle, um.
So I sort of became obsessedwith endurance sports, started
with triathlon.
Um, I've got a pretty addictivepersonality, which I think like
(03:06):
pretty common, for you knowpeople that can get good at
things, which is a good thing,but can also be a bad thing.
So you know sprint triathlonswhich take an hour, turned into
olympic distance and then halfironmans.
And then, you know, when Ifirst met my wife now lauren, I
was doing sprint distancetriathlon so she'd only have to
wait for me for an hour and then, a year after that, ironman's
(03:27):
and you're out there all day.
So, yeah, that's sort of whatmade me fall in love with
endurance sports.
And then I think just thesimplicity out of it's the best
part.
Like you know, anyone can getgood at it, because you get out
what you put in with the sport.
If you're willing to work andwork smartly over months, years,
(03:49):
months and years, you getreally fit.
Pretty much that's what I lovedabout it.
And then just fell in love withrunning through triathlon just
because I guess I got I excelledin that discipline of the sport
more, so that makes you like ita bit better.
Just because you get good atsomething.
Obviously that's rewarding, andjust the simplicity of running
(04:09):
is what I fall in love with.
Like you know, if it doesn'tmatter if you're just on
holidays or whatever, you've gota pair of shoes, you can get in
a training session, which iswhich is the best part, when
triathlons are a bit of a painin the ass in terms you need
your bike and swim pool, etc.
So, yeah, fell in love withrunning through triathlon and
particularly long distance stuff.
So now I'm just out runningmarathons, having fun doing that
(04:29):
and then coaching a lot ofpeople along the way.
Speaker 1 (04:34):
That's a cool progression.
What do you feel?
An interesting one for me islike when you hit that fork in
the road and some mates weregoing some way one direction and
obviously Jack as, as youmentioned, was sort of going
down a different direction.
What was it that made yougravitate more to the early
mornings and putting in the workthere, as opposed to rolling in
at the early morning?
Speaker 2 (04:54):
oh, it's a tough one to say like you can, when
there's a group of friends tooand I might have been early 20s
at the time and some of theolder boys in the group are
probably, you know, 30, early30s and you know there's nothing
wrong with what they're doing.
But I would look at them in away and be like I don't really
want to be doing this 10 yearsfrom now when I'm 32.
You know, I want somethingdifferent in my life and I think
(05:15):
nearly at the time you get youfeel guilty for that right.
You're like you know he's agood bloke, he's a great mate
and there's nothing wrong withwhat he's doing, and I half felt
guilt that I had to pull myselfback from you know that that
group of friends that's probablytoo much drinking, drugs and
partying.
Go the other way with the, withthe mate that loves getting up
and you know, putting on lycraas a 23 year old, believe it or
(05:36):
not, wasn't cool back then,lucky you know also now.
It's cool to be a runner inthose days, shaving your legs
and riding uh, riding a pushy,particularly from a boat from
dolby, isn't the coolest thingto do.
Speaker 1 (05:47):
I can just see you cutting laps out by the dolby
devils in with your shaved legsand lycra on.
Speaker 2 (05:53):
What a sight I was, uh fortunate on the gold coast
at this point.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
So yeah, there would have been no shaving legs, uh,
or riding in lycra anywhere inthe dolby, that's for sure mate,
I remember I did the um malulabar try, just like as a team,
and I remember the dude who wasdoing the bike leg.
I gave him so much shit forwearing lycra and shaving his
legs because I was like, mate,what the fuck are you doing?
And now, look, to be fair, Ishaved my legs back in the day
(06:17):
or I clipped them and I'dprobably get back into it just
to look.
Look a little bit better as Iget older, you know, yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:23):
Yeah, mate, but yeah, a few funny stories about Laka.
There's always a part where amutual friend of ours is a good
example Petey Styling, he got abike and he got bike riding with
me a year or so back to get fit.
Yeah, and Petey for thelisteners to paint the picture
he's about as blokey of a blokeas it gets Concrete.
(06:47):
You know, when I shake his handI feel like you know 10 of a
man.
Um, he's, you know, he'sworking his ass off in 40 degree
heat and I'm here behind acomputer real blokey bloke.
But I've got him out on doingsome training rides on a bike
and he would refuse to wearlycra.
Nah, can't do it, can't pull itoff.
I talk about three rides wherethe bloke is so sore.
You know everything going ondownstairs.
(07:07):
Because that's why you wearLycra it's to protect the goods.
And he had me cave in andfinally got the Lycra on.
He's like mate, I should havedone this ages ago.
Speaker 1 (07:16):
Mate, can you send me some photos of that?
Speaker 2 (07:18):
Yeah, I probably could find some.
Yes.
Speaker 1 (07:21):
Needed to get in some googe scoop, but once I guess
needed to get in some goochgroup he's.
But just side note on pete he'sone of the most genuinely great
blokes I've ever met.
Like when I used to train himin the gym he there was never a
day where he was not happy to bethere and he was just so stoked
if you'd smash him on a squador whatever.
He's still smiling and you'relike how you doing pete?
He's like man, I'm just I'mhappy I was.
(07:42):
I've never, ever trained anyonewho's been happy the whole time
.
Yeah, we did this 12 hour walka few years back overnight.
His ankles are not good eitheryeah, obviously his ankles are
busted and the poor bastard issame thing like I was like mate,
you don't need to do this.
Like you don't have anything toprove, you go home.
He's like, nah, I'm just gonnakeep going, just kept toddling
(08:05):
along.
I was like, once again, he'sjust grateful to be there and be
able to do things.
So I learned a lot from him,just in his outlook on life yeah
, yeah, me too, real mentor ofmine.
Speaker 2 (08:15):
Just the way he treats people, how successful he
is and his beautiful family.
He's, yeah, good guy and a goodsort of role model to look up
to, that's for sure.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
But maybe he should take a few things out of your
book and when you get him on thebike so he doesn't have the
sore, sore nether region thereyou should have trust me earlier
, man.
Speaker 2 (08:31):
It would have been a lot smoother transition for him
yeah, but it's really I.
Speaker 1 (08:36):
I find it admirable that you were able to do that at
a young age.
I think I had that fork in theroad moment, but I didn't go the
right way.
I think deep down I wanted topursue the health stuff and
wanted to do that.
But I just to your point.
It is hard to distance yourselffrom mates and it's nothing
against them, it's just likewhat you're interested in and
(08:57):
where you see yourself going.
So it took me a couple of yearsto get back around to that
before I started going.
Look, this is what I actuallygenuinely enjoy and this is what
I prioritize.
This is how I want to be.
So that's what I'm going to do,and I probably did that, maybe
not too long after that 25, sonot that much older, but I wish
I definitely did it a lotearlier yeah, but I think you
(09:18):
need to make those mistakes toget to that point too.
Speaker 2 (09:20):
Right like, you know how good of a feeling is it when
you get out on a sunday morningfor your long run and you feel
a million bucks, you're ready torock.
And you see that person justget out of the cab from a town
and I just think, oh, I'm soglad I'm not you don't get me
wrong doing it every now andagain.
I'm still on board for that.
You know you've got tocelebrate your wins and have a
good time as well, but you knowit's so easy to fall into the
(09:42):
trap of doing that every weekendand then you're sort of your
constant state of health is justtired all week, drunk weekends,
tired all week.
And that's just for me.
Wasn't the, you know, the mostappealing way to live through
your 30s, 40s and the rest ofyour life?
Speaker 1 (09:58):
definitely, and especially like as a husband and
you know you've got goals andambitions and as a like you need
to.
There are some and if you lookat like not partying as a
sacrifice, and that's asacrifice that needs to be paid
for that but when you obviouslywere moving into the marathons
and stuff, like did you have anybig goals or ambitions that you
wanted to achieve with that?
(10:19):
Or do you still have big goalsand ambitions that you want to
achieve there?
Like whether it's a sub, Idon't know, two-hour 45 or what
are you chasing?
Yeah for sure.
Speaker 2 (10:28):
I think, and depending on the pitch, like I'm
not like a good athlete by anymeans, I've kind of just ripped
in over the years and doneenough work that I've kind of
got decent at something.
And my first proper marathon Idid.
So I'd only ever run a marathonoff the bike in an Ironman.
So I think that set me upnicely, that, not that ever
(10:48):
jumping on a marathon start lineis easy.
It's still daunting, but you'relike shit, I don't have to ride
180k bike before this.
This is, this is a dream and I'mdone by.
I'm done by nine for a coffeeand brekkie with the missus and
I can be at the pub by 12 for abeer.
This, this is where it's at.
Um, yeah, yeah.
First one, I wanted to run asub three on my first attempt,
(11:08):
um, sunny coast marathon and I'mlike I had no idea if I'd be
able to do it um, and just wentout at 4 15s as a sub three just
to see when the wheels wouldfall off.
And they didn't fall off, whichwas good.
I think around 258 that daylast year I ran, ran my PB at
Noosa Marathon.
I ran a 2.50, so four minutesper K.
(11:29):
Well, 3.59 is four minutes per Kright along that line.
And then this year my goal wassub 2.45, and I only had a disc
in my back 10 days before GoldCoast Marathon.
So that's been that.
Got sidetracked a bit, but nextyear I'll get back at it doing
Ballarat Marathon and, yeah,anything around that two-hour 45
mark would be good.
(11:49):
Beautiful thing about endurancesports.
It's a bit of an old man's gametoo.
Mate.
Like what are you?
You're younger than me, lach,you're 33?
.
Speaker 1 (11:56):
Yeah, 33.
Speaker 2 (11:57):
I look old.
Speaker 1 (11:58):
It's all buggery, though the grays are everywhere
we, we're babies.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
It's probably like 40 years old, peak endurance age.
So just yeah, see what I can doin my body over the next five
years.
Set myself the goal, see howquick I can get.
Whether that gets down to 230sor whatever, it doesn't really
matter, it's just mysatisfaction and my goals and
pushing yourself is good fun.
Speaker 1 (12:20):
I've got two questions.
So first one what does it feellike holding four minute Ks for
that, or 415 for an entiremarathon?
Like for context for people, ifyou're a bit of a runner or
you're trying to understand whatthis could possibly feel like
and obviously, fitness you'vetrained for this but even just
for me thinking about running415s for 42 kilometers, it
(12:42):
sounds like hell on earth, likedefinitely something I'd love to
work towards.
But what does that feel likementally, knowing that most
people can't even hold that pacefor a kilometer or two and
you're doing that 42 times over,yeah, and the second question
that probably could lead into itis the injury.
Like a lot of people worry aboutdoing any kind of exercise
(13:04):
because of injury.
It might take them time offwork or whatever.
So from your, I guess,experience with the injury that
you had, what are you going tochange in your programming and
what do you feel maybe led tothat as well?
So if we could go to the firstone, what's it like running that
pace and then hit the injury?
Talk after that.
Speaker 2 (13:21):
Yeah, well, when you're standing on the marathon
line, you're prepared for it.
Right, you got to put in thework to to do that.
So you know, when I ran my pblast year at noosa, um me, my
mate, jack, we our biggestsession we did was six by five k
at four minute pace, so 30k,where the intervals at that pace
and that was our biggestworkout, say, three weeks before
(13:43):
on tired legs in a marathonbuild.
So it's probably those sessionsthat give you the confidence,
knowing that you know that dayin training when you've probably
got 100k in your legs for theweek, you can, you can hold it
for 30k.
It's a, it's more of a mentalthing, like when I'm staying on
the, when I'm staying on thestart line three weeks and now
I'm fresh.
You know, I've got my fastshoes on, I've got all the carbs
on board, I'll be able to dothis.
(14:05):
So yeah, marathon pace aretricky.
Once, really like the first 20kshould feel easy.
You know you're like you it's,it's hard, but like if you're
not over the top.
And then they always say therace starts at about 30k, which
is the truth, and that 30k youstart hurting and you're just
like and it's it's, it's halfmental at that point too.
Like you, you know even thebest in the world, I guarantee
(14:26):
like their head's telling themto quit.
The whole time it's kind ofjust fighting that voice in your
head saying you know, slow downa little bit, mate, no one's
going to care if you run oneminute slower.
And you're constantly liketrying to push that to the side
and fight it, which is half thebattle.
And that's, I think.
Um, I think that's, uh,something you learn, just
(14:46):
putting yourself in the firingand doing races and just getting
better at dealing with thosenegative thoughts.
Um, yeah, marathons arerollercoaster too, because you
feel you might feel absolutelyshit at 30k and by 35 you're
feeling good again and by 40 ondeath's door.
So it's just riding the peachand valley and just just hanging
in there.
But yeah, every race you dothere's not one that goes past
the thing like why the hell am Idoing this?
(15:06):
Like you, this is, this is grim.
And then you know two hoursafter you decide that was, that
was the best when's the next one?
let's go again.
So, um, yeah, I guess that'swhat it feels like it sucks, but
it's like it sucks, but it'smanageable.
Really, it's only that lasthalf an hour that really hurts,
yeah, and in terms of trainingand avoiding injury, it's like
it sucks, but it's manageable.
Really, it's only that lasthalf an hour that really hurts,
yeah, and in terms of trainingand avoiding injury, it's just
(15:28):
being smart with yourprogression in the sport.
You know like there would havebeen years where I was running
50k, bumped up to 70k, to 80 to100.
It doesn't happen overnight, soyou can't.
You just gotta train to whereyou're at, ability wise in that
build and not overreach that.
And if you're smart about yourtraining and you progress slowly
(15:49):
over the years, then your bodycan do some pretty cool shit and
it will get stronger and adaptand you won't break down.
It's just when you don't trainas smart, that's when the issues
sort of happen.
Speaker 1 (15:59):
That's one thing that I've learned a lot from you and
I'm glad you didn't pull myhead in, but you sort of did in
a nice way when I first reachedout to you.
Obviously one of the reasonswhy I approached you to see if
you would be able to train mewas I've followed your Strava
and stuff for years like a weirdlittle stalker in a way, and
(16:23):
I've just always seen different,like variations in your
training and the speeds thatyou're running, but then also
like your slower runs and Ialways see like heart rate and
I'm into all the data and it'sbeen so consistent that I'm like
this guy.
One is like I also love how youlive your lifestyle.
Like we're talking about itbefore with your wife.
Like you got a very familyorientated lifestyle.
(16:45):
You still enjoy a beer.
So it's not like you're talkingabout it before with your wife.
Like you got a very familyorientated lifestyle.
You still enjoy a beer.
So it's not like you're goingto make me sacrifice things that
are important to me to do thatand you sort of relate to a lot
of the stuff.
But then you've also got theruns on the board.
I know you said you're nottalented, from the data that I
see of you.
I think you're very talented inthe speeds that you're running
and all of that, and it's likewhat I aspire to do.
(17:05):
And then I was like, right, I'mgoing to hit you up because I
can't program for myself.
As you obviously found out, Iwas just trying to hammer it
every session and I've improvedmore in the last seven or eight
weeks now with you than I had intwo years of like.
Obviously I've been running fora long while but like literally
(17:26):
my speeds have increased and myheart rates lowered, which I'd
been trying to do, but I justfelt like I had to do more hard
sessions than I did easysessions.
And now at the moment, the wayyou're programming it, every
time I see my heart rate likehit this new low zone or my
speed improve, I'm like what thehell is going on?
Speaker 2 (17:43):
like, yeah, this is impressive stuff and you
probably don't even realize howfit you're getting.
Like you know, maybe week byweek you won't realize, and I
could see how fit you're getting, but when you're in it's your
body and you're inside you don'tfeel like you're getting that
much better.
And then all of a sudden youlook back from when we started
together two months.
You're like holy shit, ithappened quick, even though I
didn't feel that way.
Speaker 1 (18:03):
Yeah, and that's what's blown my mind.
Like, literally, eight weeks isnot a big amount.
Like, when I talk to peopleabout working with you, I'm like
, yeah, I think it was seven orsix weeks and then eight weeks
and it's not that big a deal.
But I'm like fuck and hell.
I've like dropped fuck and hell.
I've gained some pace anddropped the heart rate, so my
(18:23):
efficiency is improving and it'swhat everyone who's wanting to
get better at their running istrying to do.
But we definitely feel you haveto work harder every day.
And it's not that I'm notworking hard in the programming
that you're doing, but it's justlike a lot of the time it's
time on legs and getting good atthat.
So we, I guess, dive into alittle bit around the training
(18:46):
block that we've just completedand what we were trying to
achieve and everything like that, just so people could
understand.
Because there's definitely inthe beginning I was like I don't
think I'm doing enough hardrunning, but I trusted you
because you've got the runs onthe board and now I'm like I'd
listen to anything that you said.
Yeah, even like food dude.
You're like educating me aroundeating.
Speaker 2 (19:05):
Yeah, um, which has been game changing yeah, yeah, I
mean food is so big they'recaught.
Well, in triathlon they caughtthe fourth discipline because,
like, if you don't have enoughcalories I guess, to to train
and live, then you're just notgoing to get better.
Like, food's so important, like, and you probably know now, if
you go in the morning run youcan feel if you didn't eat
enough the day before and thedays you do you feel so much
better.
(19:25):
So you know, I would argue it'dbe a lot.
I'd always rather overeat alittle bit and feel good the
next day to train forperformance, as opposed to under
eat maybe, like, if I ever gettell by my wife my belly's got a
little bit bigger.
I'm pumped because if I cankeep, a little bit on me,
because otherwise you, just youknow, you break down and you get
so little.
So, yeah, food is so big when itcomes to endurance sports and
(19:48):
people just don't realize howmuch they have to eat.
You know, like it's it's.
It's one of the best partsabout endurance sports, because
when I sit down for dinner, Ieat so much food, but it's also
like sometimes like oh, oh,that's enough, I don't eat
anymore.
Yeah, but yeah, in terms of yourblock mate, I knew I was
excited to train you because Alike you've got wheels, I knew
like you can run fast, likeyou've got a good athletic
(20:10):
ability, so you've got thepotential there and I'd looked
at what the training you'redoing.
I just knew, like because youhadn't trained properly like
endurance athlete before, you'regoing to get better really
quickly.
Um, and a lot of coaching inthe endurance aspect is actually
pulling people back, likeespecially maybe people like
yourself coming from a bit of acrossfit background like those
workouts are if you're notleaving the, you know, if you're
(20:32):
not leaving the room spewing 10times and you feel like what
have I done?
When endurance is the opposite,like if I ever give you a
workout that you can't complete,that's bad coaching by me,
because I want to give you justenough training every day that
you get a stimulus that yourbody can adapt from, but not too
much, so the next day you canback it up and train again.
So, nearly like on an intervalsession, for example, I'm far
(20:53):
better at giving you two repsless and you're feeling a little
bit tired, but good, and thenext day you can get up for your
run when it'd be easy for me tohand me it till you can't walk.
But then if you can't run forthree days after you know what
was that better than doing a bitless and then be able to back
it up?
You know, that's the answers.
Whoever does the mostconsistently gets better.
So, like, intensity control isthe biggest piece of the puzzle
(21:14):
in terms of training and that'sprobably the biggest mistake
that a lot of people gettinginto running make is that they
just run hard all the time.
You know they probably theynever run easy, so they're never
really training like developingaerobically, but then they're
never running hard enough toactually get faster.
They kind of pick that middleground where it feels like you
know, maybe your heart rate's at160, you've had a decent
(21:34):
workout, like you feel likeyou've done something, but
you're never like going easy oryou're never going hard enough
to get better because you'realways tired, because you're
always in that sort of middlezone, if that makes sense, yeah,
yeah and I guess yeah.
Going back to your training,the way I think when we started
together, I think the words Iused to you, which I know you
didn't like and I didn't mean tooffend you- no, it was fine,
(21:58):
you were starting to do somecrazy shit already, Like I think
did you do a back-to-backmarathon?
Speaker 1 (22:02):
Yeah, I did back-to-back marathons and like
three halves and shit yeah.
Speaker 2 (22:05):
Yeah, you were already doing some crazy stuff.
And I remember, like you know,I've been running for a lot
longer than you and I'd look atthat and I'd be like there's no
chance I'm doing that.
That would wipe me for weeks.
And I was, you were doing it.
I think my words were like weneed to earn the right for you
(22:26):
to do that first.
That's exactly what you said tome.
Yeah, yeah, I know, um, becauseyou, you know you would do.
You'd run back-to-backmarathons and put together 110k
run week, but then the next twoweeks you'd only run 20 or 30k.
So I look at that from, you know, a whole holistic perspective.
I'm like, well, you would havebeen better off structuring your
week so you can run as muchvolume as possible without doing
anything crazy.
And instead of doing one big110K week and then being so
(22:46):
cooked you had to run 20 thenext day.
What if you ran 90K those threerun weeks?
All of a sudden, you banked anextra.
You know 150 kilometres andyou're in a hot run.
You're far fitter than that andit also stressed me out you
doing that stuff this early onthat you were at the point when
I started with you, four monthsfrom the challenge that you
can't afford to get injured.
Now, mate, like you, you know,if you're not a stress, you're
(23:07):
doing back-to-back marathons.
Before I started coaching andyou were on the soil over 10
weeks like that would have beenhard for you then to start from
scratch.
Yeah, and all of a sudden yourun literally around the world
10 weeks from now and you've hadyour leg in a leg in a boot,
you know.
So that was I'm glad I got youwhen I did, because I would have
hate for you to got hurt andyour body not even be able to
get there.
So yep, so yeah, I guess Iguess what we did with you
(23:28):
lockers, we.
I looked at your week and I'mlike I want to structure this
bloke's week like I know he's, Iknow he can run fast, I know
he's a hard worker, so I want tostructure his week so he can
run as much volume as possibleand handle the load and back it
up week after week after weekafter week.
So I think when we startedtogether the month prior, you
were averaging about 55kilometres a week, which I think
(23:49):
I said to you like that'sprobably a bare minimum to do a
marathon in general, I'm like,mate, this is a big goal.
We need to get you doing somebig boy K's here.
And so, yeah, we juststructured your week that like
what's your three biggest thingsyou're going to do in a week?
We've got your long run, whichis probably the most important
for you, giving you a run ofmarathons.
We're going to give you oneinterval session a week and
(24:09):
although, like, you could justjog around all week for the goal
you're doing, but you getreally good bang for buck out of
a session, as long as we'resmart about it, not overdo it
it's going to get you fitterreally quickly.
And then, mentally for you likeyou love a session, like you'll
always message me after.
But, mate, that was so much fun.
Yeah, even like thepsychological part of that was
really good for you, because tohave a session in the middle of
(24:30):
the week that you look forwardto, that's worth its weight in
gold.
Because if you, if you, werejust jogging for seven days
straight, you get bored of thatpretty quickly and you wouldn't
enjoy this process.
So so, yeah, we had your longrun, your session, and then we
had your medium long run.
So they're your, they're yourthree most demanding sessions.
We've got over your weeks.
How can we do that?
So you go into each sessionfeeling your best and performing
and being able to absorb thetraining.
(24:51):
So for us that was a mediumlong run on a monday tuesday was
pretty chilled.
Wednesday a session thursday,friday pretty chilled, sad.
The huge long run sunday off.
So you get back to mondayfeeling good again.
So I guess we just structuredyour week that those big days,
those easy days, which are justimportant as the big days,
because on those easy days ifyou go too hard on that you're
(25:12):
going to cook yourself for thenext day.
So structure your week in a waythat you could handle running
more volume consistently thatyou've ever done before.
And and in doing that we builtyou up from 70 to 80 to 90 to
100 to up to 110Ks a week.
That last week there.
And you'd feel each week readyto rock for the next one, like
I'd be worried if you weren'ttired because you're running a
(25:32):
lot.
You should feel tired but youweren't injured and you're ready
to attack the next week.
So yeah, that's how we broke itdown, like it would have been
easy for me just to startthrowing 110K run weeks out.
Yeah, and just say here you go,mate, good luck, yeah, good
luck.
But the wheels could fall offpretty quickly and that would
have stressed me, because that'son me then.
So it was getting you to apoint that you're running big
(25:56):
volume, but safely and smartly.
And, yeah, a big part of thatwas, I guess, building that up
slowly and just intensitycontrol yeah, and that's what I
enjoyed when you said to me,like you've got to earn the
right.
Speaker 1 (26:10):
I always say that to people that I coach in the gym
and things like that.
I hear wax, that man, I did notknow that no, but it's great
because I say to people but assoon as you said that, it sort
of slapped me out of this likeromanticized idea of just
fucking crushing big runs orwhatever world I was living in,
and I was like that's probablytrue.
And it also reminded me isexactly why I reached out to you
(26:33):
, because, even though Iunderstand programming for not
marathons but like fitness, Iwas like I'll be able to do this
myself and just been like okay,well, if I really want to do
this properly, I need someonewho one is going to call me on
my shit.
Two, if I, you know, get youlike if we work together, I have
to trust you.
I can't just, like you know, dododgies on the side and end up
(26:58):
injured.
It's like I've got to trust theprocess.
And then, three, the approacharound just building slowly for
me was like okay, makes, like Iunderstand that now that I've
snapped out of this likefairyland place, um, and then
obviously the results have comeoff the back of that and I think
that's a really importantpeople for this, uh, who are
listening.
Is the the purpose of getting acoach one?
(27:20):
It just means you don't have tothink about the programming,
you just do the programming,which I love because I've got a
lot of other things going on.
Two, it's like you need to betold what you need to hear, not
what you want to hear, all thetime to get the best results.
And the other thing that I'vereally enjoyed about working
with you, dean, is that we talkpretty much every day, which is
awesome.
You'll be on my data or myWhoop or Strava or wherever the
(27:44):
stuff's going.
Speaker 2 (27:45):
I pester the people I coach mate.
I pester them.
Speaker 1 (27:49):
There was one that even Amy was like fuck, you're
all in strife here.
We just got off a plane in LAor something, and it was like 7
pm at night and you text me thiswas probably our second week
working together and you're likemate, um, haven't done your run
yet.
And I was like one you, you,I'm tracking my time zones, bro,
but I've just got off a planeand I was because you sent me
(28:11):
that I got off the plane at 7 pmor 8 pm at night, like late as,
and I went for a run andbecause it's where we were was
not like ideal, I was just likerunning laps of this small block
to get the run done.
And for me, I was like, okay,this is perfect, because this is
the accountability that I need,to make sure that I'm, you know
, prepped because, the hardwork's now, like really the runs
(28:31):
are celebration and likeobviously it's going to be
fucking hard but like that's thecelebration of what we're doing
now.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
Yeah yeah, definitely , and I I was honestly never
worried about you with everdoing a run.
To be honest, I could tellpretty quickly you've got the
same mindset as me that, likeI've had coaches before and if
that runs on that bit of paper,there is zero chance I'm missing
it, zero chance.
It would drive me so crazy tolet someone down, and that is a
good thing 95% of the times, but5 percent it's not because I
(28:58):
want to also want to know ifyou're feeling shit and I need
to pull you back the next day.
So if I ever saw you didn'thave a run done, I'm not
thinking locky's been lazy, notdoing it, I'm thinking shit, is
he sick or is he injured?
So I would have been stressed.
Did I push him too hard twodays before any session?
He can't run today and he's nottelling me.
So, yeah, I think that's morewhy because I know you think
like me and even little things,like I would message you after
(29:20):
every long run just to see howyou're feeling.
But I know you wouldn't tell meif you were smashed up and then
I'd see on your Instagramstories that you say your ankles
are sore and I'd be like theseankles hurt.
So I had to get on there andjust put some feelings out, like
, mate, how are you feeling?
No niggles, that's just memaking sure that your body's in
a good place.
Yeah, because it's good toalways want to get the work done
.
But, like I've made the mistakebefore, you don't just have to
(29:42):
get done what's on paper.
If you've got something, ifyou're not feeling good, you can
pull things back for a few daysbecause in the long run that's
going to be what's good for you.
Speaker 1 (29:49):
Yeah, now my ankles have given me grief for about
five years.
Yeah, okay, as soon as I'vedone that, they're good.
But if I'm, for whatever youknow, running late on time for
whatever reason and I'll juststart running the first
kilometer or two is not ideal,but then it settles in.
Speaker 2 (30:11):
it's good to go so, and that's probably one of the
biggest challenges with marathontraining, long distance
endurance sports in general,because it's deciphering between
being sore and being injured,because you know, in a marathon
build, my legs never feel good,ever you should feel tired you
know, people like coach freakout like, oh don't know if, if I
can do this, I'm a bit tiredand I'm like, well, you're tired
(30:32):
or you're injured because youshould feel tired, you're
training for a marathon.
But then you also need to knowtoo where it's.
It's tipped over that point andthere's something that needs to
be addressed.
So it's always trying to getthat fine line going and that's
where it's important for anathlete and a coach to
communicate.
So you actually know.
Speaker 1 (30:48):
You know how that person's feeling and that's
another thing I was broke downhere to touch on is you've been
really adamant on heart rates?
Yeah, like I think, a lot ofpeople myself included under
utilized heart rate training.
Yeah, because it does allow youto sort of accommodate for
fatigue and things like that.
So if I'm feeling cooked, um, Ijust still still sit in those
(31:12):
zones, so my, my speed may dropoff a little bit, but I'm still,
I guess, essentially the samework ethic.
Speaker 2 (31:17):
If you're taking into account, though, the fatigue
yeah, yeah, definitely heartrate, like it's just really
useful for intensity control andit's really good for probably
newer athletes.
You're, you're at the point nowwhere, like I'd be confident
with you not to look at it asmuch, or like even for me, now I
know I can just go out and runat five minute k pace and my
heart rate's gonna be under 140.
(31:38):
So I'm all good, look back onit after, but I don't really
need to.
But it's more intensity controlbecause, like a new athlete,
you might give them a run, aneasy run, and their heart rate's
170 the whole time.
They think they're going easy,but I've got proof that it
wasn't.
It was really hard and it'simportant in places like
Brisbane, for example, becauseit's the worst place in the
world to you know, 25 degree 99humidity on on your runs of a
(31:59):
morning, yeah, and you got tofactor that in that.
That just makes it harder.
So if you, I'm just like, ifit's, if it's 30 degrees, mate,
just slow down.
Who cares?
Like no one, no one cares aboutyour strava time, really, apart
from you, like just back it off.
Your heart rate might be 15beats higher for the same pace
as yesterday because it's 10degrees hotter.
So it's just a good way ofcontrolling intensity and making
(32:20):
sure someone is not overdoingit.
And that's also a good datapoint for me to like look, I can
look back through your traininghistory and be like look at
this, this run, this run, fourweeks apart, exact same pace.
Your heart rate's 15 beatslower.
I've got clear data that you'reabsorbing the training well and
getting a lot fitter.
Um, so it's just a good metricto have the pros use heart rate.
(32:40):
And then lactate's really big inthe endurance space.
Um, heart rate's just a lotmore easy, I guess.
To more practical, I'm notgoing to get you to rip out a
lactate monitor and put dripblood on it like the pros do,
but they they generally use amixture between the two.
Um and then rpe is obviouslyreally important too.
As I said to you, like, mate,if you're feeling tired, just
back pace off.
You know, on the days you'refeeling good, you've got a
(33:02):
license to pick it up a bit, butyou just gotta be smart about
that yep, yeah, there's, there'sso much that goes into it.
Speaker 1 (33:09):
But once again, for people listening, like if you're
considering whether you'redoing your first marathon or
half, or even if you're a moreexperienced runner like the
benefit of having a coach for meand I, you know, I have coaches
in business and in other areasof my life as well, so it just
makes sense to have it in animportant area, especially
because the one thing I reallylove as well just not have to
(33:31):
not having to think about it Iliterally open the app yeah,
have a bit of a chin way to youand just do what it says, like
just yeah, it's that easy andthen I can focus my
decision-making on other thingsin life as well, which is a
game-changer.
Speaker 2 (33:44):
For sure, for sure, mate.
And it's even good for me as acoach to have a coach too,
because I'm an over-thinker andI'll start thinking about I want
to do more, and it's nice justto have someone stepping back
from the outside not emotionally, you know, and be like mate,
you know, not emotionally, youknow, and be like mate, you know
, that was something dumb to do,you know.
Just do this and just, yeah,put trust in someone.
Speaker 1 (34:03):
So, yeah, agreed, mate, even the other thing I
wanted to touch on was likefueling while you're running.
We obviously you mentioned, andone of the other passes that
you gave me was like a pizza.
The night before the long runI've been smoking pizzas like
left, right and centre.
Are you freaked out when?
Speaker 2 (34:22):
I yeah, which is, trust me.
You better eat good food asmuch as you can.
But sometimes when you've got a40k run the next day and you're
going to burn 3 000 calories,it's going to be fucking hard to
eat that with chicken and saladand feel good the next day.
You just need to smash a pizzaand I would argue from a health
(34:42):
perspective you'd be far betteroff eating that pizza and
creating your body a little bitof inflammation, but going into
your run the next day with allthose calories stored that you
can use, as opposed to going inunder-fuelled and killing
yourself.
So it's like and even if you'reeating those bad meals, 95% of
the time you're still eating theright things.
But you know, sometimes youneed to get that calorie-dense
(35:03):
quick food.
And generally that's aroundworkouts too.
You know.
Before and after workouts, youknow, know where your beats
needs calories.
Speaker 1 (35:09):
So yeah, it's nutrition is so important when
it comes to endurance sports andjust even like the gels and I
know you've sort of said, for meit's like 60 grams of carbs an
hour, if it's a bit hotter oryou know a bit more intense
session, up to 90 grams, yeah,um, and it's literally day and
night since I've been doing that, like I've just bought, bought
(35:30):
the gels that feel good for myguts but the difference in
output and how I feel in it andthat obviously then makes it
easier mentally to to get thesession done, whereas before I
literally run multiple marathonswith no nutrition before when
you first told me that man, likeI nearly fell off my chair.
Speaker 2 (35:47):
I was kind of happy in a way because I knew what a
difference a simple thing willmake.
Is you just fueling your arms?
I'm like that's going to makeyou know, Like how much percent
difference would it be?
Like you know, 20%, 30%,performance bump, just you know
it sounds silly now that you'redoing it, but Easy Dude, even
shoes Like you're recommendingme getting some shoes with
(36:07):
carbon, carbon um yeah, whateverthey're trainers.
Do you feel that was thedifference, wasn't it?
Speaker 1 (36:15):
oh, dude, way easy.
You feel like I felt like I wasrunning at 5, 45 pace like
super slow, but then I'm sittingaround 507 and you're like,
okay, that's, I'm happy withthat yeah, mate, the the biggest
legend you'll love this thebiggest legend in australian
running, this bloke called stevemonaghetti, yeah, so have you.
Speaker 2 (36:33):
Have you heard of brett robinson before?
I have, yeah, so he's got a.
The ultra man.
Right, is he there?
He's our.
He's australia's best marathonrunner, so he's okay.
He's from melbourne.
He's got the australian recordfor the marathon, which I
believe is mid 20, 2007 minutes,so three, so three-minute kick
pace.
Yep, and that's these days with, you know, $470 Alpha Flies.
(36:54):
He's sponsored by Nike, youknow.
Yeah, he's probably got asponsorship for it.
But the bloke's record, he beatSteve Monaghetti.
He might be in his 60s now.
Brett beat his record by 20seconds or something and this
bloke I think it was like 30years ago ripped a 207 marathon
pre-Super Shoes only had a sipof water on the course.
(37:14):
What the hell?
It's such a legend.
Everyone looks at his time likesurely that's like a 203 or
something.
Surely.
At least Just no food, justripped a glass of water.
You know whatever shoes theywere in back then 40 years ago
and just ripped a glass of water.
You know whatever shoes theywere in back then 40 years ago
and just ripped the 207.
Speaker 1 (37:33):
He's the man.
Fuck, that is ridiculously fastyeah.
Speaker 2 (37:36):
So all these sort of evolvements in technology now
make a huge difference.
Like fueling is a big one, andthen the shoe technology is so
big.
Now, like studies show, shoescan give you like five to seven
seconds a k of free speed,depending on how fast you're
going.
Or even if you were to run atthe same pace but you had a good
pair of shoes on, you'reworking less hard to hold that
same pace.
You're burning less energy, sothat's an advantage.
(37:58):
And then it beats up your legs.
When you've got a good pair ofshoes on, your legs are more
protected and it beats up yourlegs less.
So it's not only a cheat code.
The Kenyans can before say theycould run 200K a week.
Maybe now their bodies canhandle running 250Ks a week
because they've got these shoesthat help them run more.
And then that's an extra 5% aswell.
So, yeah, it's pretty coolstuff.
Speaker 1 (38:19):
It's crazy and all of these things I wouldn't have
been looking at had you not.
Speaker 2 (38:24):
Yeah, and it's even common with people I coach Like
they don't think about changingtheir shoes.
You know, know, so oftensomeone will get a niggle and I
look at their training like theyhaven't progressed or done
anything differently and I'llshoot a mess, say, hey, when was
the last time you got a newpair of shoes?
And I'll be like two years ago.
And you're like, oh, theydidn't, they wouldn't even think
of that.
And they get themselves a newpair of shoes that support that
(38:46):
foot better and they feel rightas ray again.
So that's something like foryou through this challenge, like
you know, you're gonna have todefinitely think about,
especially now that you'rerunning over 100k every week.
But you burn through shoesquickly.
Like you know, they're meant tolast 500k.
That's a new pair of shoes forevery four weeks now, every four
or five weeks.
Speaker 1 (39:04):
So yeah, that's not fun, yeah, not funny sponsor
though, as that asics superblast.
Please give me them.
Give me that's um, but what wasI gonna say next?
Yeah, what do you feel likebased on, obviously, my
(39:24):
programming and even just theconversations we've had?
Are there any things that youfeel I haven't considered well
or probably should be looking ata bit more in the lead up to
doing this challenge?
Speaker 2 (39:36):
So we're talking pre you actually doing the event.
Speaker 1 (39:39):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (39:40):
I think the next step for you would be like we're
going to have to increase it involume a little bit more and see
how you handle that.
We'll get you up to 120 130 andmaybe if we get to that it's
too much, we have to pull youback.
But we're gonna pick it up abit.
But I think we're gonna have towithout you sort of knowing it.
I wanted to get you in themindset of introducing some
(40:00):
doubles in your training.
So if you're running in themorning like mate, can you get
on the bike of an afternoon?
Yeah, and that is just like.
That's just an easy way to bankmore aerobic stimulus and
training without beating yourbody up.
But now we're at the point itwould actually be safer for me
as a coach to see if you're opento doing a few double run days
and although it's an extra runor two a week, you could argue
(40:21):
it's safer.
Maybe, for example, right nowwe're doing 110 Ks a week For me
to increase your volume.
We're not going to increaseyour long run any longer.
You know volume.
We're not going to increaseyour long run any longer.
You know your last long run youripped a marathon pretty much.
I don't want to really increaseyour mid, medium long run from
two hours because that's goingto beat you up so much.
So instead of making all yourruns so long and they're getting
really demanding on for you Icould argue as a coach you might
(40:41):
be better off doing 60 minutesof a morning and 30 minutes of
an afternoon, and that 90minutes broken up is going to be
a lot less of a stress on yourbody from a physiological
perspective, but you're buildingmore k's in the legs.
I think that will probably bethe next step to see if you're
open to, you know, add in one,maybe double run day a week and
then build it up to two if yourbody can absorb that.
(41:03):
So that'll probably be the nextstep, because even if we could
just chuck an extra, you knowtwo half an hour runs at the end
of a training day, uh, that's,that's an extra 12k a week and
it's, it's.
You know, it's nothing really.
So that will probably be ournext thing we look at
interesting.
I'm looking forward to it youdon't look, you don't look.
Uh, pumped to get the door fora second run in the day, do you?
(41:25):
no, but that it's, I'll do it,but it's just yeah, yeah well,
it's either that or continuingto extend the runs you're doing
now when you're already doing,you know pretty much a three.
Last week you did three hourrun, hour 45 run, an hour 15 run
, trying to progress those a bit.
You're doing like three bigruns a week.
(41:45):
You know it's a lot.
It's a lot when, if you, if youeven on your recovery day, if
you done two.
So if you went out for two 8keasy runs on your recovery day,
that's it.
That's a light day becauseneither of them are big things
to do, but you'll bank 16k forthat day, which is a lot of
running.
So something like that.
We'll have a combo about it.
Speaker 1 (42:03):
Though yeah, I think I like the idea of doing doubles
just because it's aninconvenience and I think I'm
going to be sewing like there'sgoing to be so many things that
go wrong.
I got a call from our motorhomecompany yesterday afternoon
being like oh, just needed toconfirm that you know that your
shower's not going to work, yourtoilet's not going to work and
the amenities of the motorhomearen't going to work because
(42:25):
it's winter, everything willfreeze over, you're in sub-zero
and I was like nice that wouldhave been.
I should have thought of that.
I didn't think about that, butthat the whole reason why we got
a motorhome was, yeah, so youcould have a fucking motorhome,
not have to get accommodations,and now I've got to get your
caravan pass, booked and stuff.
So there's going to be thingslike that that keep popping up.
That inconvenience, the wholeexperience.
(42:46):
I think that's going to be agood way to train, train for
that as well how are you feelingabout all the logistic and
planning side of that?
Speaker 2 (42:55):
because we actually haven't even spoke about that.
Right, we'd speak about yourtraining and and probably in
general, more life, yeah, lifein general, me and you but
because that stuff fascinates metoo, like I think that is,
that's such a big piece of thepuzzle it's the most stressful
part are you gonna have a physioon speed dial or, you know,
(43:16):
help professional, because Ithink that would be could be
good yes, so to come, I've gotto get my heart checked, like I
want to have my.
Speaker 1 (43:25):
I'm getting my bloods done.
I'm getting my heart testedjust to do a before and after.
Yeah, and then kathleen, mysister-in-law she's a physio, so
she does physio regularly, butthen when we're over there, um,
lskd and a few other people arehelping me get get some people
that will give me a tune up sortof every couple of days.
I'm feeling like when my body'sgoing to be that.
(43:45):
I remember when I rode 30marathons in a row my body was
pretty tired that it didn'tenjoy the heavy treatment.
It was more like light rubswere beneficial.
Yeah, so I'm trying to go infeeling good with that.
But the most stressful partabout the whole thing like you
make the program it's super easyfor me, which is awesome.
(44:06):
Uh, we've been fortunate to getsome great sponsors and now
it's just the pr side of thingsand obviously deliverables that
I've got for for those, andobviously we've now locked in
the route.
So you know, we had it lockedin and then one of our flights
got cancelled from hawaii, whichmeant we had to reroute the
whole freaking thing within likea six hour period.
(44:27):
So we got that done and thenit's now just knowing that if
anything goes wrong, like wemiss a day or something, I'm
either going to have to do adouble to get back on track,
because we've got 15 grand worthof flights booked that I can't
obviously miss.
So there's like a lot ofpressure that I'm thinking about
, because I've got peopleinvested in it and I've put a
(44:48):
heap of cash into it.
But that is part of the journeyI'm thinking about because I've
got people invested in it andI've put a heap of cash into it.
But that is part of the journey.
I'm lucky, liam Excitement, mybrother-in-law he's good at
logistics and all of that, sohe'll, you know, once he gets
back from Melbourne, he'll takeover all of that yeah cool.
Speaker 2 (45:03):
And food, like you don't want to rely on gas
station, you know whatever theysell in market like are you
gonna have you know what's yourplan?
Speaker 1 (45:14):
not walmart, costco, so yeah, so I've uh got an idea
of what we're gonna eat.
I'll probably I should probablysend that to you probably
understand it better.
But one thing that you've beenon me about is eating, and prior
to training with you, I waseating.
Probably I wasn't tracking toomuch, but just based off what I
knew I ate.
I was was eating around 2,000cals a day, so I definitely
wasn't eating enough.
Yeah, at the moment I'm doingabout 3,700, which feels like
(45:38):
I'm eating all day and I'm stilltrying to build that up a bit
more.
Speaker 2 (45:41):
Have you lost weight, though, or you've managed to
keep it on.
Speaker 1 (45:45):
I'm very skinny man, but I'm still sitting around 83
kilos.
Speaker 2 (45:52):
Which is still big for an endurance athlete that
they lock, which is onlyimportant because, as a bigger
body, your body produces moreheat.
It takes more calories tofunction.
As you know, like myself, I'm87 kilos because I'm so bloody
tall, so you've got to actuallytake in a lot more food because
you're so much bigger than thethe standard, you know, 60 kilo
(46:12):
marathon runner wouldn't it begood to be 60 kilos and run a
marathon?
Speaker 1 (46:17):
it'd feel nice, wouldn't it?
But I'm just like.
Speaker 2 (46:19):
Oh, you know, I want to be, I want to be able to rip
a marathon, but also, you know,hopefully bench press, more than
me, misses.
Still, you know it'd be good toget that fine line, which I
probably don't.
I hope she doesn't listen tothis.
Speaker 1 (46:31):
I could be in trouble yeah, I'm sure she will listen
to that for sure.
Um, but no, food wise, yeah,we'll have that sorted.
And and the crew's going to bemaking sure that while I'm
running they're doing costcotrips because, depending on the
size of the van, like the vansare decent size, but we'll we're
going up to seattle three daysearlier so we can make sure it's
(46:52):
all set up and ready to rumble.
Um so, and then I've got, uh,you know, saps.
Speaker 2 (46:59):
I've got like leg sleeves, whether they work or
not, like that would just begood to flush the legs after
each run yeah, I wonder if youget yourself a pair of norma
texter, just to kick the feet up, I got them, man, yeah, yeah,
yeah, because even like how muchdoes it help?
I don't know the answer, buteven if mentally you're telling
yourself it helps, that can be abenefit.
Or even, like, I love thembecause it just forces me to sit
(47:21):
down on my ass for an hour andeat food.
Even that might be the benefitof it.
Speaker 1 (47:32):
That's literally.
What I do is like I'll when I'mhaving dinner or whatever I'll
just whack them on and slowlyrip through some food so yeah, I
think exciting that, yeah, it'sall, it's all all come together
.
So now, yeah, just injury freeuntil yeah, till we uh head off
in four or five weeks and thenI'm in mexico and then kick it
off yeah, very good, yeah, it'llbe an adjustment as well.
Getting back into that coldweather, coming from here I
(47:54):
think it's.
Speaker 2 (47:55):
I personally feel it's going to be nicer running
in the cold oh, mate, you'redoing a lot of your train block
in brisbane, like for peoplelistening out there that haven't
been in brisbane before, it'sgot to be the worst place to be
a runner, like.
You know like how sad it iswhen you've got a long run on a
Sunday.
You check the weather out.
You're like it's going to be 26by 6 am.
So then you're like, what's theweather at 4?
(48:15):
It might be 23, but it's 99%humidity.
It's like, oh, this is grim.
Speaker 1 (48:21):
This is grim.
I started at 4.30 last week andI was cooking Like yeah.
It's not good, it's not ideal.
Speaker 2 (48:28):
But then, like, yeah, once you get to a cooler
climate, you know, having allthat, both mentally and
physically, will be a huge asset.
Like you know, ideal marathonconditions they say it's three
to eight degrees.
So you know, my next marathonin Ballarat can get to eight
degrees in April, which would beperfect.
But the benefit would be me.
I'll be training through aQueensland summer, you know, and
(48:50):
then cruise on down toMelbourne for an eight-degree
race, and then that should feel,you know, a huge difference, a
huge difference.
Speaker 1 (48:58):
Yeah, and you're aiming for a sub 2.45, then 2.45
?
Speaker 2 (49:02):
Yeah, 2.45 would be good, that'd be about 3.55.
Do you think like I?
When I ran my 2, my 250, I wasin good nick.
But like this year, before Igot injured, I put in so much
better training, I was so muchfitter.
And marathon is just a cruelgame because you've got to have
things fall in place.
You've got to feel good, notget injured, have good weather
(49:24):
on the day, not be sick.
I DNF'd at Noosa this year too.
I woke up the morning of therace sick as a dog.
I'm just like, oh.
And then I'm just like you'rejust gonna tell no one that
you're sick.
You're gonna just get on thatstart line and see what happens
um 25k and seeing stars losingme legs.
The wheels just fell off andended up in the medic.
(49:44):
That was this year.
So I went, I hit a dnf and thengot injured before before
goldie.
So you've got to be lucky andyou know, have things go your
way and be healthy, and that'sall a part of it.
When you're pushing the limittoo, you know like you're going
to get sick and you're going topick up little niggles.
There's just no way around it.
It's just doing your best totrain smartly that you minimise
(50:04):
that stuff and be smart when ithappens, so you can get on top
of it really quickly and notjust ignore it.
Speaker 1 (50:12):
Yeah, 100% For people who are looking for coaching.
They can all.
Obviously, for everyonelistening in the show notes,
I'll link your Instagram andwhatnot and people can reach out
to you there.
But what does it look like?
I guess the process withworking with you, because I know
you always have like you onlywork with X amount of people at
a time, but if people arewanting some coaching, what does
(50:33):
that look like?
Speaker 2 (50:34):
Mate.
Yeah, so definitely looking formore athletes.
Coaching is my passion.
I love it.
I'm both a nutritionist and arun coach, which is the double
winner.
The running boom is so big now.
What's that, mate?
Speaker 1 (50:46):
I said, it's one of the best things about you as
well, as you're a nutritionistas well.
Speaker 2 (50:49):
Yeah, yeah, which is good, and I thought it would
always be more nutrition.
But because of the running burnhow big running is at the moment
it's just fallen in my lap thatI've got a lot more run clients
than nutrition, but they do gohand in hand too, so you kind of
get the best of both worlds onthat.
But yeah, if anyone wants a runcoach like I've got blokes, I
coach boys and girls.
I've got, you know, a femaleathlete I coach trying to get
(51:11):
better.
You know running for a highrocks event.
She wants to turn pro on that.
I've got this bloody blokerunning 58 marathons in 58 days
across the world.
You know I've got a nice kidI'm coaching that wants to run a
20-minute 5K.
He's fun to coach.
(51:32):
Like, honestly, people from allwalks of life like and I find
coaching someone to achieve agoal way more satisfying than me
doing it myself like there'snothing better than um, being at
the finish line to a marathon,wherever it is, and seeing
someone do what they thoughtthey could never do and like
that moment for me is like why Icoach and, well, hopefully, do
it for the next 20 years.
So, yeah, if you ever to coach,it doesn't matter how big or
small.
It's never a one-size-fits-allpolicy, right, like it's your.
(51:56):
The way I'd program for you,which is through an app in
Training Peaks, is real specificto what your goals are.
You know there might be ifyou're someone that's trying to
run a sub-three-hour marathon,I'm going to coach and treat
them very differently to someonethat wants to complete a
marathon.
You know what's their workstress like have they got kids?
You know there's so manyfactors that go into the way I'd
(52:18):
program for someone.
So, yeah, mate, get in touch.
I'll drop you my website.
My official business islaunching.
It's called Rise Coaching.
Yeah, which is good.
Yeah, uh, I've been coachingfor a while now, but I need the
missus to give me a kick up theass to finally, you know, get
put all the pieces togetherwhich I'm not, which I'm not
(52:38):
good at.
I don't like talking aboutmyself or taking photos of
myself or promoting myself.
Yeah, yeah, the website.
We'll put it up so everyone cansee that.
Yeah, if anyone wants anycoaching, reach out and we can
have a bit of a deeperconversation as to what their
goals are.
Big or small, it doesn't matter.
Um, and yeah, I just lovehelping people, mate it's
(52:59):
awesome man.
Speaker 1 (52:59):
You're definitely the man for the for the job, like
dean wicks everyone and deanI've worked with a number of
coaches over the years, fromcrossfit to rugby to um, even
just for 5k and when I did theobstacle course racing and your
hands down, the mostprofessional person I've worked
with.
Like when I say professional,you deliver with great
programming all around, fuckinggood bloke.
(53:21):
You check in regularly for theaccountability and you give me
the kick up the ass that I need.
But then it's just, it's alsoenjoyable, which for me, is like
this perfect storm that allowsme to want to keep doing it,
because I think, if any of thoseare off, for me it's like oh,
maybe I need more accountability, or maybe I need a bit more fun
, or maybe I need to kick up theass, and you've delivered on
that.
You know above and beyond.
(53:41):
So for me it's just, honestly,the best investment, and I also
just enjoy talking shit with youas well.
It's good fun.
Speaker 2 (53:47):
Thank you, mate, can shit with you as well.
It's good fun.
Thank you, mate, I appreciatethat and yeah, I think that's
probably my biggest strength asa coach.
Like you know, you can getcoaches that are very high level
, elite athletes, but it doesn'tmean they're the best coach,
because they don't understandwhat it's like as much for a
person to.
You know work nine hour days,have kids.
You know blokes are coach.
They got a wedding on theweekend.
Well, I'm going to change theirscheduling so they can get their
long run done on a Saturdaymorning so they can have a beer
(54:09):
for their mate's wedding andkick their feet up on the Sunday
.
Like you need to, because I'm anormal person myself.
You need to sort of be able tosee both sides of like the elite
outcomes and progressing as anathlete, but also just be a
normal person and a good blokeand realise that.
You know you've got to beflexible with people and get it
to fit in with their lifestyle,because if they don't enjoy
(54:30):
doing it and they're not goingto stick at it for weeks, months
and years, then they're nevergoing to achieve the goals that
they could.
So you've got to find thatbalance between pushing them,
but also, you know, making surethey enjoy the process along the
way, because if they don'tenjoy it, then you know what's
the point in even doing this.
Speaker 1 (54:46):
Exactly right, dean.
Thanks so much for your time,mate, and for everyone listening
.
If you got value from thisepisode, make sure you share it
on your socials, leave a ratingand review and, as always, do
something today to be better fortomorrow and go check out Wixie
.
Thanks for having me, mate.
It's legit.
Welcome back to the man that Canwith Lockie Stewart Today.
This one is one that peoplehave been DMing me a lot about
and I've just been saying holdout, hold out, hold out, we're
going.
And then Wixie Dean Wix, mycoach and mate, is on the show.
So, wixie, firstly thanks forgiving us your time on a rainy
(00:21):
Friday morning.
Thank you, mate, good to behere, and if we didn't have your
beautiful wife as your chieftechnical officer, we might have
had a DNS on this one.
Yeah, yeah, we're in bigtrouble.
Speaker 2 (00:32):
And our second podcast guest from Dolby.
Speaker 1 (00:34):
from my research I've done yeah, you've done some
research there.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Second, from Dolby putting it on the map About 320
NRL games between the two of us.
Not too bad at all.
Speaker 1 (00:46):
That's how it was 320 nrl games between the boys.
I like that one.
That's the, that's the moneyshot.
But, mate, so good to have youon there, on there, on here.
Uh, it's going to be a goodyarn.
Obviously we're going to diveinto, I guess, training me for
58 marathons and stuff, becausepeople have questions that they
ask me a lot that I just Iprobably could have a stab at
(01:09):
answering, but I think you'rethe man for the job for that.
But I also want to just helpother people who are aspiring to
run marathons or looking forguidance to answer some of those
questions.
But before we do, can we get abit of a background on Wixie?
Mate, you've obviously grown upin Dolby, as you mentioned.
Yep, you've done a lot ofendurance sports and that's sort
(01:30):
of your forte.
Now, what led you to that point, like what took you or got you
interested in that back in theday?
Endurance sports.
Speaker 2 (01:41):
Yeah, mate, long story short, I guess, guess,
probably a pretty normal blokefrom the darling downs, just
like yourself, love playingfooty, grew up playing that.
Would have loved to make it asa footy player, like most kids
growing up in you know, dalby,toowoomba etc.
But just never good enough.
Um got signed by burley bears,their cup squad.
When I was 19, had a cup ofcoffee with the burley bears as
(02:04):
soon as some Titans boys got cutback from Titans.
I was, I was gone um and thenso always, yeah, grew up, love
playing sports and then just anormal sort of late teenager and
early 20 year old kid, probablydrinking too many beers and
getting up to mischief with theboys.
And then I think it like youhit that point mid to mid to
(02:24):
early 20s where you see onegroup of mates going one way and
they're rolling home at 5 6 amsaturday, sunday nights.
And then I live with one of mybest mates still to this day
jack his name is.
I think you met him before thebloke I sort of cruise around
and do all my marathons with andhe sort of changed his
lifestyle and was getting up atfive in the morning and riding
(02:45):
his bike for a couple hours.
So I sort of saw him going oneway, I saw the boys going the
other way and I decided to kindof go that way and, you know,
enjoy a active, healthylifestyle, um.
So I sort of became obsessedwith endurance sports, started
with triathlon.
Um, I've got a pretty addictivepersonality, which I think like
(03:06):
pretty common, for you knowpeople that can get good at
things, which is a good thing,but can also be a bad thing.
So you know sprint triathlonswhich take an hour, turned into
olympic distance and then halfironmans.
And then, you know, when Ifirst met my wife now lauren, I
was doing sprint distancetriathlon so she'd only have to
wait for me for an hour and then, a year after that, ironman's
(03:27):
and you're out there all day.
So, yeah, that's sort of whatmade me fall in love with
endurance sports.
And then I think just thesimplicity out of it's the best
part.
Like you know, anyone can getgood at it, because you get out
what you put in with the sport.
If you're willing to work andwork smartly over months, years,
(03:49):
months and years, you getreally fit.
Pretty much that's what I lovedabout it.
And then just fell in love withrunning through triathlon just
because I guess I got I excelledin that discipline of the sport
more, so that makes you like ita bit better.
Just because you get good atsomething.
Obviously that's rewarding, andjust the simplicity of running
(04:09):
is what I fall in love with.
Like you know, if it doesn'tmatter if you're just on
holidays or whatever, you've gota pair of shoes, you can get in
a training session, which iswhich is the best part, when
triathlons are a bit of a painin the ass in terms you need
your bike and swim pool, etc.
So, yeah, fell in love withrunning through triathlon and
particularly long distance stuff.
So now I'm just out runningmarathons, having fun doing that
(04:29):
and then coaching a lot ofpeople along the way.
Speaker 1 (04:34):
That's a cool progression.
What do you feel?
An interesting one for me islike when you hit that fork in
the road and some mates weregoing some way one direction and
obviously Jack as, as youmentioned, was sort of going
down a different direction.
What was it that made yougravitate more to the early
mornings and putting in the workthere, as opposed to rolling in
at the early morning?
Speaker 2 (04:54):
oh, it's a tough one to say like you can, when
there's a group of friends tooand I might have been early 20s
at the time and some of theolder boys in the group are
probably, you know, 30, early30s and you know there's nothing
wrong with what they're doing.
But I would look at them in away and be like I don't really
want to be doing this 10 yearsfrom now when I'm 32.
You know, I want somethingdifferent in my life and I think
(05:15):
nearly at the time you get youfeel guilty for that right.
You're like you know he's agood bloke, he's a great mate
and there's nothing wrong withwhat he's doing, and I half felt
guilt that I had to pull myselfback from you know that that
group of friends that's probablytoo much drinking, drugs and
partying.
Go the other way with the, withthe mate that loves getting up
and you know, putting on lycraas a 23 year old, believe it or
(05:36):
not, wasn't cool back then,lucky you know also now.
It's cool to be a runner inthose days, shaving your legs
and riding uh, riding a pushy,particularly from a boat from
dolby, isn't the coolest thingto do.
Speaker 1 (05:47):
I can just see you cutting laps out by the dolby
devils in with your shaved legsand lycra on.
Speaker 2 (05:53):
What a sight I was, uh fortunate on the gold coast
at this point.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
So yeah, there would have been no shaving legs, uh,
or riding in lycra anywhere inthe dolby, that's for sure mate,
I remember I did the um malulabar try, just like as a team,
and I remember the dude who wasdoing the bike leg.
I gave him so much shit forwearing lycra and shaving his
legs because I was like, mate,what the fuck are you doing?
And now, look, to be fair, Ishaved my legs back in the day
(06:17):
or I clipped them and I'dprobably get back into it just
to look.
Look a little bit better as Iget older, you know, yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:23):
Yeah, mate, but yeah, a few funny stories about Laka.
There's always a part where amutual friend of ours is a good
example Petey Styling, he got abike and he got bike riding with
me a year or so back to get fit.
Yeah, and Petey for thelisteners to paint the picture
he's about as blokey of a blokeas it gets Concrete.
(06:47):
You know, when I shake his handI feel like you know 10 of a
man.
Um, he's, you know, he'sworking his ass off in 40 degree
heat and I'm here behind acomputer real blokey bloke.
But I've got him out on doingsome training rides on a bike
and he would refuse to wearlycra.
Nah, can't do it, can't pull itoff.
I talk about three rides wherethe bloke is so sore.
You know everything going ondownstairs.
(07:07):
Because that's why you wearLycra it's to protect the goods.
And he had me cave in andfinally got the Lycra on.
He's like mate, I should havedone this ages ago.
Speaker 1 (07:16):
Mate, can you send me some photos of that?
Speaker 2 (07:18):
Yeah, I probably could find some.
Yes.
Speaker 1 (07:21):
Needed to get in some googe scoop, but once I guess
needed to get in some goochgroup he's.
But just side note on pete he'sone of the most genuinely great
blokes I've ever met.
Like when I used to train himin the gym he there was never a
day where he was not happy to bethere and he was just so stoked
if you'd smash him on a squador whatever.
He's still smiling and you'relike how you doing pete?
He's like man, I'm just I'mhappy I was.
(07:42):
I've never, ever trained anyonewho's been happy the whole time
.
Yeah, we did this 12 hour walka few years back overnight.
His ankles are not good eitheryeah, obviously his ankles are
busted and the poor bastard issame thing like I was like mate,
you don't need to do this.
Like you don't have anything toprove, you go home.
He's like, nah, I'm just gonnakeep going, just kept toddling
(08:05):
along.
I was like, once again, he'sjust grateful to be there and be
able to do things.
So I learned a lot from him,just in his outlook on life yeah
, yeah, me too, real mentor ofmine.
Speaker 2 (08:15):
Just the way he treats people, how successful he
is and his beautiful family.
He's, yeah, good guy and a goodsort of role model to look up
to, that's for sure.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
But maybe he should take a few things out of your
book and when you get him on thebike so he doesn't have the
sore, sore nether region thereyou should have trust me earlier
, man.
Speaker 2 (08:31):
It would have been a lot smoother transition for him
yeah, but it's really I.
Speaker 1 (08:36):
I find it admirable that you were able to do that at
a young age.
I think I had that fork in theroad moment, but I didn't go the
right way.
I think deep down I wanted topursue the health stuff and
wanted to do that.
But I just to your point.
It is hard to distance yourselffrom mates and it's nothing
against them, it's just likewhat you're interested in and
(08:57):
where you see yourself going.
So it took me a couple of yearsto get back around to that
before I started going.
Look, this is what I actuallygenuinely enjoy and this is what
I prioritize.
This is how I want to be.
So that's what I'm going to do,and I probably did that, maybe
not too long after that 25, sonot that much older, but I wish
I definitely did it a lotearlier yeah, but I think you
(09:18):
need to make those mistakes toget to that point too.
Speaker 2 (09:20):
Right like, you know how good of a feeling is it when
you get out on a sunday morningfor your long run and you feel
a million bucks, you're ready torock.
And you see that person justget out of the cab from a town
and I just think, oh, I'm soglad I'm not you don't get me
wrong doing it every now andagain.
I'm still on board for that.
You know you've got tocelebrate your wins and have a
good time as well, but you knowit's so easy to fall into the
(09:42):
trap of doing that every weekendand then you're sort of your
constant state of health is justtired all week, drunk weekends,
tired all week.
And that's just for me.
Wasn't the, you know, the mostappealing way to live through
your 30s, 40s and the rest ofyour life?
Speaker 1 (09:58):
definitely, and especially like as a husband and
you know you've got goals andambitions and as a like you need
to.
There are some and if you lookat like not partying as a
sacrifice, and that's asacrifice that needs to be paid
for that but when you obviouslywere moving into the marathons
and stuff, like did you have anybig goals or ambitions that you
wanted to achieve with that?
(10:19):
Or do you still have big goalsand ambitions that you want to
achieve there?
Like whether it's a sub, Idon't know, two-hour 45 or what
are you chasing?
Yeah for sure.
Speaker 2 (10:28):
I think, and depending on the pitch, like I'm
not like a good athlete by anymeans, I've kind of just ripped
in over the years and doneenough work that I've kind of
got decent at something.
And my first proper marathon Idid.
So I'd only ever run a marathonoff the bike in an Ironman.
So I think that set me upnicely, that, not that ever
(10:48):
jumping on a marathon start lineis easy.
It's still daunting, but you'relike shit, I don't have to ride
180k bike before this.
This is, this is a dream and I'mdone by.
I'm done by nine for a coffeeand brekkie with the missus and
I can be at the pub by 12 for abeer.
This, this is where it's at.
Um, yeah, yeah.
First one, I wanted to run asub three on my first attempt,
(11:08):
um, sunny coast marathon and I'mlike I had no idea if I'd be
able to do it um, and just wentout at 4 15s as a sub three just
to see when the wheels wouldfall off.
And they didn't fall off, whichwas good.
I think around 258 that daylast year I ran, ran my PB at
Noosa Marathon.
I ran a 2.50, so four minutesper K.
(11:29):
Well, 3.59 is four minutes per Kright along that line.
And then this year my goal wassub 2.45, and I only had a disc
in my back 10 days before GoldCoast Marathon.
So that's been that.
Got sidetracked a bit, but nextyear I'll get back at it doing
Ballarat Marathon and, yeah,anything around that two-hour 45
mark would be good.
(11:49):
Beautiful thing about endurancesports.
It's a bit of an old man's gametoo.
Mate.
Like what are you?
You're younger than me, lach,you're 33?
.
Speaker 1 (11:56):
Yeah, 33.
Speaker 2 (11:57):
I look old.
Speaker 1 (11:58):
It's all buggery, though the grays are everywhere
we, we're babies.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
It's probably like 40 years old, peak endurance age.
So just yeah, see what I can doin my body over the next five
years.
Set myself the goal, see howquick I can get.
Whether that gets down to 230sor whatever, it doesn't really
matter, it's just mysatisfaction and my goals and
pushing yourself is good fun.
Speaker 1 (12:20):
I've got two questions.
So first one what does it feellike holding four minute Ks for
that, or 415 for an entiremarathon?
Like for context for people, ifyou're a bit of a runner or
you're trying to understand whatthis could possibly feel like
and obviously, fitness you'vetrained for this but even just
for me thinking about running415s for 42 kilometers, it
(12:42):
sounds like hell on earth, likedefinitely something I'd love to
work towards.
But what does that feel likementally, knowing that most
people can't even hold that pacefor a kilometer or two and
you're doing that 42 times over,yeah, and the second question
that probably could lead into itis the injury.
Like a lot of people worry aboutdoing any kind of exercise
(13:04):
because of injury.
It might take them time offwork or whatever.
So from your, I guess,experience with the injury that
you had, what are you going tochange in your programming and
what do you feel maybe led tothat as well?
So if we could go to the firstone, what's it like running that
pace and then hit the injury?
Talk after that.
Speaker 2 (13:21):
Yeah, well, when you're standing on the marathon
line, you're prepared for it.
Right, you got to put in thework to to do that.
So you know, when I ran my pblast year at noosa, um me, my
mate, jack, we our biggestsession we did was six by five k
at four minute pace, so 30k,where the intervals at that pace
and that was our biggestworkout, say, three weeks before
(13:43):
on tired legs in a marathonbuild.
So it's probably those sessionsthat give you the confidence,
knowing that you know that dayin training when you've probably
got 100k in your legs for theweek, you can, you can hold it
for 30k.
It's a, it's more of a mentalthing, like when I'm staying on
the, when I'm staying on thestart line three weeks and now
I'm fresh.
You know, I've got my fastshoes on, I've got all the carbs
on board, I'll be able to dothis.
(14:05):
So yeah, marathon pace aretricky.
Once, really like the first 20kshould feel easy.
You know you're like you it's,it's hard, but like if you're
not over the top.
And then they always say therace starts at about 30k, which
is the truth, and that 30k youstart hurting and you're just
like and it's it's, it's halfmental at that point too.
Like you, you know even thebest in the world, I guarantee
(14:26):
like their head's telling themto quit.
The whole time it's kind ofjust fighting that voice in your
head saying you know, slow downa little bit, mate, no one's
going to care if you run oneminute slower.
And you're constantly liketrying to push that to the side
and fight it, which is half thebattle.
And that's, I think.
Um, I think that's, uh,something you learn, just
(14:46):
putting yourself in the firingand doing races and just getting
better at dealing with thosenegative thoughts.
Um, yeah, marathons arerollercoaster too, because you
feel you might feel absolutelyshit at 30k and by 35 you're
feeling good again and by 40 ondeath's door.
So it's just riding the peachand valley and just just hanging
in there.
But yeah, every race you dothere's not one that goes past
the thing like why the hell am Idoing this?
(15:06):
Like you, this is, this is grim.
And then you know two hoursafter you decide that was, that
was the best when's the next one?
let's go again.
So, um, yeah, I guess that'swhat it feels like it sucks, but
it's like it sucks, but it'smanageable.
Really, it's only that lasthalf an hour that really hurts,
yeah, and in terms of trainingand avoiding injury, it's like
it sucks, but it's manageable.
Really, it's only that lasthalf an hour that really hurts,
yeah, and in terms of trainingand avoiding injury, it's just
(15:28):
being smart with yourprogression in the sport.
You know like there would havebeen years where I was running
50k, bumped up to 70k, to 80 to100.
It doesn't happen overnight, soyou can't.
You just gotta train to whereyou're at, ability wise in that
build and not overreach that.
And if you're smart about yourtraining and you progress slowly
(15:49):
over the years, then your bodycan do some pretty cool shit and
it will get stronger and adaptand you won't break down.
It's just when you don't trainas smart, that's when the issues
sort of happen.
Speaker 1 (15:59):
That's one thing that I've learned a lot from you and
I'm glad you didn't pull myhead in, but you sort of did in
a nice way when I first reachedout to you.
Obviously one of the reasonswhy I approached you to see if
you would be able to train mewas I've followed your Strava
and stuff for years like a weirdlittle stalker in a way, and
(16:23):
I've just always seen different,like variations in your
training and the speeds thatyou're running, but then also
like your slower runs and Ialways see like heart rate and
I'm into all the data and it'sbeen so consistent that I'm like
this guy.
One is like I also love how youlive your lifestyle.
Like we're talking about itbefore with your wife.
Like you got a very familyorientated lifestyle.
(16:45):
You still enjoy a beer.
So it's not like you're talkingabout it before with your wife.
Like you got a very familyorientated lifestyle.
You still enjoy a beer.
So it's not like you're goingto make me sacrifice things that
are important to me to do thatand you sort of relate to a lot
of the stuff.
But then you've also got theruns on the board.
I know you said you're nottalented, from the data that I
see of you.
I think you're very talented inthe speeds that you're running
and all of that, and it's likewhat I aspire to do.
(17:05):
And then I was like, right, I'mgoing to hit you up because I
can't program for myself.
As you obviously found out, Iwas just trying to hammer it
every session and I've improvedmore in the last seven or eight
weeks now with you than I had intwo years of like.
Obviously I've been running fora long while but like literally
(17:26):
my speeds have increased and myheart rates lowered, which I'd
been trying to do, but I justfelt like I had to do more hard
sessions than I did easysessions.
And now at the moment, the wayyou're programming it, every
time I see my heart rate likehit this new low zone or my
speed improve, I'm like what thehell is going on?
Speaker 2 (17:43):
like, yeah, this is impressive stuff and you
probably don't even realize howfit you're getting.
Like you know, maybe week byweek you won't realize, and I
could see how fit you're getting, but when you're in it's your
body and you're inside you don'tfeel like you're getting that
much better.
And then all of a sudden youlook back from when we started
together two months.
You're like holy shit, ithappened quick, even though I
didn't feel that way.
Speaker 1 (18:03):
Yeah, and that's what's blown my mind.
Like, literally, eight weeks isnot a big amount.
Like, when I talk to peopleabout working with you, I'm like
, yeah, I think it was seven orsix weeks and then eight weeks
and it's not that big a deal.
But I'm like fuck and hell.
I've like dropped fuck and hell.
I've gained some pace anddropped the heart rate, so my
(18:23):
efficiency is improving and it'swhat everyone who's wanting to
get better at their running istrying to do.
But we definitely feel you haveto work harder every day.
And it's not that I'm notworking hard in the programming
that you're doing, but it's justlike a lot of the time it's
time on legs and getting good atthat.
So we, I guess, dive into alittle bit around the training
(18:46):
block that we've just completedand what we were trying to
achieve and everything like that, just so people could
understand.
Because there's definitely inthe beginning I was like I don't
think I'm doing enough hardrunning, but I trusted you
because you've got the runs onthe board and now I'm like I'd
listen to anything that you said.
Yeah, even like food dude.
You're like educating me aroundeating.
Speaker 2 (19:05):
Yeah, um, which has been game changing yeah, yeah, I
mean food is so big they'recaught.
Well, in triathlon they caughtthe fourth discipline because,
like, if you don't have enoughcalories I guess, to to train
and live, then you're just notgoing to get better.
Like, food's so important, like, and you probably know now, if
you go in the morning run youcan feel if you didn't eat
enough the day before and thedays you do you feel so much
better.
(19:25):
So you know, I would argue it'dbe a lot.
I'd always rather overeat alittle bit and feel good the
next day to train forperformance, as opposed to under
eat maybe, like, if I ever gettell by my wife my belly's got a
little bit bigger.
I'm pumped because if I cankeep, a little bit on me,
because otherwise you, just youknow, you break down and you get
so little.
So, yeah, food is so big when itcomes to endurance sports and
(19:48):
people just don't realize howmuch they have to eat.
You know, like it's it's.
It's one of the best partsabout endurance sports, because
when I sit down for dinner, Ieat so much food, but it's also
like sometimes like oh, oh,that's enough, I don't eat
anymore.
Yeah, but yeah, in terms of yourblock mate, I knew I was
excited to train you because Alike you've got wheels, I knew
like you can run fast, likeyou've got a good athletic
(20:10):
ability, so you've got thepotential there and I'd looked
at what the training you'redoing.
I just knew, like because youhadn't trained properly like
endurance athlete before, you'regoing to get better really
quickly.
Um, and a lot of coaching inthe endurance aspect is actually
pulling people back, likeespecially maybe people like
yourself coming from a bit of acrossfit background like those
workouts are if you're notleaving the, you know, if you're
(20:32):
not leaving the room spewing 10times and you feel like what
have I done?
When endurance is the opposite,like if I ever give you a
workout that you can't complete,that's bad coaching by me,
because I want to give you justenough training every day that
you get a stimulus that yourbody can adapt from, but not too
much, so the next day you canback it up and train again.
So, nearly like on an intervalsession, for example, I'm far
(20:53):
better at giving you two repsless and you're feeling a little
bit tired, but good, and thenext day you can get up for your
run when it'd be easy for me tohand me it till you can't walk.
But then if you can't run forthree days after you know what
was that better than doing a bitless and then be able to back
it up?
You know, that's the answers.
Whoever does the mostconsistently gets better.
So, like, intensity control isthe biggest piece of the puzzle
(21:14):
in terms of training and that'sprobably the biggest mistake
that a lot of people gettinginto running make is that they
just run hard all the time.
You know they probably theynever run easy, so they're never
really training like developingaerobically, but then they're
never running hard enough toactually get faster.
They kind of pick that middleground where it feels like you
know, maybe your heart rate's at160, you've had a decent
(21:34):
workout, like you feel likeyou've done something, but
you're never like going easy oryou're never going hard enough
to get better because you'realways tired, because you're
always in that sort of middlezone, if that makes sense, yeah,
yeah and I guess yeah.
Going back to your training,the way I think when we started
together, I think the words Iused to you, which I know you
didn't like and I didn't mean tooffend you- no, it was fine,
(21:58):
you were starting to do somecrazy shit already, Like I think
did you do a back-to-backmarathon?
Speaker 1 (22:02):
Yeah, I did back-to-back marathons and like
three halves and shit yeah.
Speaker 2 (22:05):
Yeah, you were already doing some crazy stuff.
And I remember, like you know,I've been running for a lot
longer than you and I'd look atthat and I'd be like there's no
chance I'm doing that.
That would wipe me for weeks.
And I was, you were doing it.
I think my words were like weneed to earn the right for you
(22:26):
to do that first.
That's exactly what you said tome.
Yeah, yeah, I know, um, becauseyou, you know you would do.
You'd run back-to-backmarathons and put together 110k
run week, but then the next twoweeks you'd only run 20 or 30k.
So I look at that from, you know, a whole holistic perspective.
I'm like, well, you would havebeen better off structuring your
week so you can run as muchvolume as possible without doing
anything crazy.
And instead of doing one big110K week and then being so
(22:46):
cooked you had to run 20 thenext day.
What if you ran 90K those threerun weeks?
All of a sudden, you banked anextra.
You know 150 kilometres andyou're in a hot run.
You're far fitter than that andit also stressed me out you
doing that stuff this early onthat you were at the point when
I started with you, four monthsfrom the challenge that you
can't afford to get injured.
Now, mate, like you, you know,if you're not a stress, you're
(23:07):
doing back-to-back marathons.
Before I started coaching andyou were on the soil over 10
weeks like that would have beenhard for you then to start from
scratch.
Yeah, and all of a sudden yourun literally around the world
10 weeks from now and you've hadyour leg in a leg in a boot,
you know.
So that was I'm glad I got youwhen I did, because I would have
hate for you to got hurt andyour body not even be able to
get there.
So yep, so yeah, I guess Iguess what we did with you
(23:28):
lockers, we.
I looked at your week and I'mlike I want to structure this
bloke's week like I know he's, Iknow he can run fast, I know
he's a hard worker, so I want tostructure his week so he can
run as much volume as possibleand handle the load and back it
up week after week after weekafter week.
So I think when we startedtogether the month prior, you
were averaging about 55kilometres a week, which I think
(23:49):
I said to you like that'sprobably a bare minimum to do a
marathon in general, I'm like,mate, this is a big goal.
We need to get you doing somebig boy K's here.
And so, yeah, we juststructured your week that like
what's your three biggest thingsyou're going to do in a week?
We've got your long run, whichis probably the most important
for you, giving you a run ofmarathons.
We're going to give you oneinterval session a week and
(24:09):
although, like, you could justjog around all week for the goal
you're doing, but you getreally good bang for buck out of
a session, as long as we'resmart about it, not overdo it
it's going to get you fitterreally quickly.
And then, mentally for you likeyou love a session, like you'll
always message me after.
But, mate, that was so much fun.
Yeah, even like thepsychological part of that was
really good for you, because tohave a session in the middle of
(24:30):
the week that you look forwardto, that's worth its weight in
gold.
Because if you, if you, werejust jogging for seven days
straight, you get bored of thatpretty quickly and you wouldn't
enjoy this process.
So so, yeah, we had your longrun, your session, and then we
had your medium long run.
So they're your, they're yourthree most demanding sessions.
We've got over your weeks.
How can we do that?
So you go into each sessionfeeling your best and performing
and being able to absorb thetraining.
(24:51):
So for us that was a mediumlong run on a monday tuesday was
pretty chilled.
Wednesday a session thursday,friday pretty chilled, sad.
The huge long run sunday off.
So you get back to mondayfeeling good again.
So I guess we just structuredyour week that those big days,
those easy days, which are justimportant as the big days,
because on those easy days ifyou go too hard on that you're
(25:12):
going to cook yourself for thenext day.
So structure your week in a waythat you could handle running
more volume consistently thatyou've ever done before.
And and in doing that we builtyou up from 70 to 80 to 90 to
100 to up to 110Ks a week.
That last week there.
And you'd feel each week readyto rock for the next one, like
I'd be worried if you weren'ttired because you're running a
(25:32):
lot.
You should feel tired but youweren't injured and you're ready
to attack the next week.
So yeah, that's how we broke itdown, like it would have been
easy for me just to startthrowing 110K run weeks out.
Yeah, and just say here you go,mate, good luck, yeah, good
luck.
But the wheels could fall offpretty quickly and that would
have stressed me, because that'son me then.
So it was getting you to apoint that you're running big
(25:56):
volume, but safely and smartly.
And, yeah, a big part of thatwas, I guess, building that up
slowly and just intensitycontrol yeah, and that's what I
enjoyed when you said to me,like you've got to earn the
right.
Speaker 1 (26:10):
I always say that to people that I coach in the gym
and things like that.
I hear wax, that man, I did notknow that no, but it's great
because I say to people but assoon as you said that, it sort
of slapped me out of this likeromanticized idea of just
fucking crushing big runs orwhatever world I was living in,
and I was like that's probablytrue.
And it also reminded me isexactly why I reached out to you
(26:33):
, because, even though Iunderstand programming for not
marathons but like fitness, Iwas like I'll be able to do this
myself and just been like okay,well, if I really want to do
this properly, I need someonewho one is going to call me on
my shit.
Two, if I, you know, get youlike if we work together, I have
to trust you.
I can't just, like you know, dododgies on the side and end up
(26:58):
injured.
It's like I've got to trust theprocess.
And then, three, the approacharound just building slowly for
me was like okay, makes, like Iunderstand that now that I've
snapped out of this likefairyland place, um, and then
obviously the results have comeoff the back of that and I think
that's a really importantpeople for this, uh, who are
listening.
Is the the purpose of getting acoach one?
(27:20):
It just means you don't have tothink about the programming,
you just do the programming,which I love because I've got a
lot of other things going on.
Two, it's like you need to betold what you need to hear, not
what you want to hear, all thetime to get the best results.
And the other thing that I'vereally enjoyed about working
with you, dean, is that we talkpretty much every day, which is
awesome.
You'll be on my data or myWhoop or Strava or wherever the
(27:44):
stuff's going.
Speaker 2 (27:45):
I pester the people I coach mate.
I pester them.
Speaker 1 (27:49):
There was one that even Amy was like fuck, you're
all in strife here.
We just got off a plane in LAor something, and it was like 7
pm at night and you text me thiswas probably our second week
working together and you're likemate, um, haven't done your run
yet.
And I was like one you, you,I'm tracking my time zones, bro,
but I've just got off a planeand I was because you sent me
(28:11):
that I got off the plane at 7 pmor 8 pm at night, like late as,
and I went for a run andbecause it's where we were was
not like ideal, I was just likerunning laps of this small block
to get the run done.
And for me, I was like, okay,this is perfect, because this is
the accountability that I need,to make sure that I'm, you know
, prepped because, the hardwork's now, like really the runs
(28:31):
are celebration and likeobviously it's going to be
fucking hard but like that's thecelebration of what we're doing
now.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
Yeah yeah, definitely , and I I was honestly never
worried about you with everdoing a run.
To be honest, I could tellpretty quickly you've got the
same mindset as me that, likeI've had coaches before and if
that runs on that bit of paper,there is zero chance I'm missing
it, zero chance.
It would drive me so crazy tolet someone down, and that is a
good thing 95% of the times, but5 percent it's not because I
(28:58):
want to also want to know ifyou're feeling shit and I need
to pull you back the next day.
So if I ever saw you didn'thave a run done, I'm not
thinking locky's been lazy, notdoing it, I'm thinking shit, is
he sick or is he injured?
So I would have been stressed.
Did I push him too hard twodays before any session?
He can't run today and he's nottelling me.
So, yeah, I think that's morewhy because I know you think
like me and even little things,like I would message you after
(29:20):
every long run just to see howyou're feeling.
But I know you wouldn't tell meif you were smashed up and then
I'd see on your Instagramstories that you say your ankles
are sore and I'd be like theseankles hurt.
So I had to get on there andjust put some feelings out, like
, mate, how are you feeling?
No niggles, that's just memaking sure that your body's in
a good place.
Yeah, because it's good toalways want to get the work done
.
But, like I've made the mistakebefore, you don't just have to
(29:42):
get done what's on paper.
If you've got something, ifyou're not feeling good, you can
pull things back for a few daysbecause in the long run that's
going to be what's good for you.
Speaker 1 (29:49):
Yeah, now my ankles have given me grief for about
five years.
Yeah, okay, as soon as I'vedone that, they're good.
But if I'm, for whatever youknow, running late on time for
whatever reason and I'll juststart running the first
kilometer or two is not ideal,but then it settles in.
Speaker 2 (30:11):
it's good to go so, and that's probably one of the
biggest challenges with marathontraining, long distance
endurance sports in general,because it's deciphering between
being sore and being injured,because you know, in a marathon
build, my legs never feel good,ever you should feel tired you
know, people like coach freakout like, oh don't know if, if I
can do this, I'm a bit tiredand I'm like, well, you're tired
(30:32):
or you're injured because youshould feel tired, you're
training for a marathon.
But then you also need to knowtoo where it's.
It's tipped over that point andthere's something that needs to
be addressed.
So it's always trying to getthat fine line going and that's
where it's important for anathlete and a coach to
communicate.
So you actually know.
Speaker 1 (30:48):
You know how that person's feeling and that's
another thing I was broke downhere to touch on is you've been
really adamant on heart rates?
Yeah, like I think, a lot ofpeople myself included under
utilized heart rate training.
Yeah, because it does allow youto sort of accommodate for
fatigue and things like that.
So if I'm feeling cooked, um, Ijust still still sit in those
(31:12):
zones, so my, my speed may dropoff a little bit, but I'm still,
I guess, essentially the samework ethic.
Speaker 2 (31:17):
If you're taking into account, though, the fatigue
yeah, yeah, definitely heartrate, like it's just really
useful for intensity control andit's really good for probably
newer athletes.
You're, you're at the point nowwhere, like I'd be confident
with you not to look at it asmuch, or like even for me, now I
know I can just go out and runat five minute k pace and my
heart rate's gonna be under 140.
(31:38):
So I'm all good, look back onit after, but I don't really
need to.
But it's more intensity controlbecause, like a new athlete,
you might give them a run, aneasy run, and their heart rate's
170 the whole time.
They think they're going easy,but I've got proof that it
wasn't.
It was really hard and it'simportant in places like
Brisbane, for example, becauseit's the worst place in the
world to you know, 25 degree 99humidity on on your runs of a
(31:59):
morning, yeah, and you got tofactor that in that.
That just makes it harder.
So if you, I'm just like, ifit's, if it's 30 degrees, mate,
just slow down.
Who cares?
Like no one, no one cares aboutyour strava time, really, apart
from you, like just back it off.
Your heart rate might be 15beats higher for the same pace
as yesterday because it's 10degrees hotter.
So it's just a good way ofcontrolling intensity and making
(32:20):
sure someone is not overdoingit.
And that's also a good datapoint for me to like look, I can
look back through your traininghistory and be like look at
this, this run, this run, fourweeks apart, exact same pace.
Your heart rate's 15 beatslower.
I've got clear data that you'reabsorbing the training well and
getting a lot fitter.
Um, so it's just a good metricto have the pros use heart rate.
(32:40):
And then lactate's really big inthe endurance space.
Um, heart rate's just a lotmore easy, I guess.
To more practical, I'm notgoing to get you to rip out a
lactate monitor and put dripblood on it like the pros do,
but they they generally use amixture between the two.
Um and then rpe is obviouslyreally important too.
As I said to you, like, mate,if you're feeling tired, just
back pace off.
You know, on the days you'refeeling good, you've got a
(33:02):
license to pick it up a bit, butyou just gotta be smart about
that yep, yeah, there's, there'sso much that goes into it.
Speaker 1 (33:09):
But once again, for people listening, like if you're
considering whether you'redoing your first marathon or
half, or even if you're a moreexperienced runner like the
benefit of having a coach for meand I, you know, I have coaches
in business and in other areasof my life as well, so it just
makes sense to have it in animportant area, especially
because the one thing I reallylove as well just not have to
(33:31):
not having to think about it Iliterally open the app yeah,
have a bit of a chin way to youand just do what it says, like
just yeah, it's that easy andthen I can focus my
decision-making on other thingsin life as well, which is a
game-changer.
Speaker 2 (33:44):
For sure, for sure, mate.
And it's even good for me as acoach to have a coach too,
because I'm an over-thinker andI'll start thinking about I want
to do more, and it's nice justto have someone stepping back
from the outside not emotionally, you know, and be like mate,
you know, not emotionally, youknow, and be like mate, you know
, that was something dumb to do,you know.
Just do this and just, yeah,put trust in someone.
Speaker 1 (34:03):
So, yeah, agreed, mate, even the other thing I
wanted to touch on was likefueling while you're running.
We obviously you mentioned, andone of the other passes that
you gave me was like a pizza.
The night before the long runI've been smoking pizzas like
left, right and centre.
Are you freaked out when?
Speaker 2 (34:22):
I yeah, which is, trust me.
You better eat good food asmuch as you can.
But sometimes when you've got a40k run the next day and you're
going to burn 3 000 calories,it's going to be fucking hard to
eat that with chicken and saladand feel good the next day.
You just need to smash a pizzaand I would argue from a health
(34:42):
perspective you'd be far betteroff eating that pizza and
creating your body a little bitof inflammation, but going into
your run the next day with allthose calories stored that you
can use, as opposed to going inunder-fuelled and killing
yourself.
So it's like and even if you'reeating those bad meals, 95% of
the time you're still eating theright things.
But you know, sometimes youneed to get that calorie-dense
(35:03):
quick food.
And generally that's aroundworkouts too.
You know.
Before and after workouts, youknow, know where your beats
needs calories.
Speaker 1 (35:09):
So yeah, it's nutrition is so important when
it comes to endurance sports andjust even like the gels and I
know you've sort of said, for meit's like 60 grams of carbs an
hour, if it's a bit hotter oryou know a bit more intense
session, up to 90 grams, yeah,um, and it's literally day and
night since I've been doing that, like I've just bought, bought
(35:30):
the gels that feel good for myguts but the difference in
output and how I feel in it andthat obviously then makes it
easier mentally to to get thesession done, whereas before I
literally run multiple marathonswith no nutrition before when
you first told me that man, likeI nearly fell off my chair.
Speaker 2 (35:47):
I was kind of happy in a way because I knew what a
difference a simple thing willmake.
Is you just fueling your arms?
I'm like that's going to makeyou know, Like how much percent
difference would it be?
Like you know, 20%, 30%,performance bump, just you know
it sounds silly now that you'redoing it, but Easy Dude, even
shoes Like you're recommendingme getting some shoes with
(36:07):
carbon, carbon um yeah, whateverthey're trainers.
Do you feel that was thedifference, wasn't it?
Speaker 1 (36:15):
oh, dude, way easy.
You feel like I felt like I wasrunning at 5, 45 pace like
super slow, but then I'm sittingaround 507 and you're like,
okay, that's, I'm happy withthat yeah, mate, the the biggest
legend you'll love this thebiggest legend in australian
running, this bloke called stevemonaghetti, yeah, so have you.
Speaker 2 (36:33):
Have you heard of brett robinson before?
I have, yeah, so he's got a.
The ultra man.
Right, is he there?
He's our.
He's australia's best marathonrunner, so he's okay.
He's from melbourne.
He's got the australian recordfor the marathon, which I
believe is mid 20, 2007 minutes,so three, so three-minute kick
pace.
Yep, and that's these days with, you know, $470 Alpha Flies.
(36:54):
He's sponsored by Nike, youknow.
Yeah, he's probably got asponsorship for it.
But the bloke's record, he beatSteve Monaghetti.
He might be in his 60s now.
Brett beat his record by 20seconds or something and this
bloke I think it was like 30years ago ripped a 207 marathon
pre-Super Shoes only had a sipof water on the course.
(37:14):
What the hell?
It's such a legend.
Everyone looks at his time likesurely that's like a 203 or
something.
Surely.
At least Just no food, justripped a glass of water.
You know whatever shoes theywere in back then 40 years ago
and just ripped a glass of water.
You know whatever shoes theywere in back then 40 years ago
and just ripped the 207.
Speaker 1 (37:33):
He's the man.
Fuck, that is ridiculously fastyeah.
Speaker 2 (37:36):
So all these sort of evolvements in technology now
make a huge difference.
Like fueling is a big one, andthen the shoe technology is so
big.
Now, like studies show, shoescan give you like five to seven
seconds a k of free speed,depending on how fast you're
going.
Or even if you were to run atthe same pace but you had a good
pair of shoes on, you'reworking less hard to hold that
same pace.
You're burning less energy, sothat's an advantage.
(37:58):
And then it beats up your legs.
When you've got a good pair ofshoes on, your legs are more
protected and it beats up yourlegs less.
So it's not only a cheat code.
The Kenyans can before say theycould run 200K a week.
Maybe now their bodies canhandle running 250Ks a week
because they've got these shoesthat help them run more.
And then that's an extra 5% aswell.
So, yeah, it's pretty coolstuff.
Speaker 1 (38:19):
It's crazy and all of these things I wouldn't have
been looking at had you not.
Speaker 2 (38:24):
Yeah, and it's even common with people I coach Like
they don't think about changingtheir shoes.
You know, know, so oftensomeone will get a niggle and I
look at their training like theyhaven't progressed or done
anything differently and I'llshoot a mess, say, hey, when was
the last time you got a newpair of shoes?
And I'll be like two years ago.
And you're like, oh, theydidn't, they wouldn't even think
of that.
And they get themselves a newpair of shoes that support that
(38:46):
foot better and they feel rightas ray again.
So that's something like foryou through this challenge, like
you know, you're gonna have todefinitely think about,
especially now that you'rerunning over 100k every week.
But you burn through shoesquickly.
Like you know, they're meant tolast 500k.
That's a new pair of shoes forevery four weeks now, every four
or five weeks.
Speaker 1 (39:04):
So yeah, that's not fun, yeah, not funny sponsor
though, as that asics superblast.
Please give me them.
Give me that's um, but what wasI gonna say next?
Yeah, what do you feel likebased on, obviously, my
(39:24):
programming and even just theconversations we've had?
Are there any things that youfeel I haven't considered well
or probably should be looking ata bit more in the lead up to
doing this challenge?
Speaker 2 (39:36):
So we're talking pre you actually doing the event.
Speaker 1 (39:39):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (39:40):
I think the next step for you would be like we're
going to have to increase it involume a little bit more and see
how you handle that.
We'll get you up to 120 130 andmaybe if we get to that it's
too much, we have to pull youback.
But we're gonna pick it up abit.
But I think we're gonna have towithout you sort of knowing it.
I wanted to get you in themindset of introducing some
(40:00):
doubles in your training.
So if you're running in themorning like mate, can you get
on the bike of an afternoon?
Yeah, and that is just like.
That's just an easy way to bankmore aerobic stimulus and
training without beating yourbody up.
But now we're at the point itwould actually be safer for me
as a coach to see if you're opento doing a few double run days
and although it's an extra runor two a week, you could argue
(40:21):
it's safer.
Maybe, for example, right nowwe're doing 110 Ks a week For me
to increase your volume.
We're not going to increaseyour long run any longer.
You know volume.
We're not going to increaseyour long run any longer.
You know your last long run youripped a marathon pretty much.
I don't want to really increaseyour mid, medium long run from
two hours because that's goingto beat you up so much.
So instead of making all yourruns so long and they're getting
really demanding on for you Icould argue as a coach you might
(40:41):
be better off doing 60 minutesof a morning and 30 minutes of
an afternoon, and that 90minutes broken up is going to be
a lot less of a stress on yourbody from a physiological
perspective, but you're buildingmore k's in the legs.
I think that will probably bethe next step to see if you're
open to, you know, add in one,maybe double run day a week and
then build it up to two if yourbody can absorb that.
(41:03):
So that'll probably be the nextstep, because even if we could
just chuck an extra, you knowtwo half an hour runs at the end
of a training day, uh, that's,that's an extra 12k a week and
it's, it's.
You know, it's nothing really.
So that will probably be ournext thing we look at
interesting.
I'm looking forward to it youdon't look, you don't look.
Uh, pumped to get the door fora second run in the day, do you?
(41:25):
no, but that it's, I'll do it,but it's just yeah, yeah well,
it's either that or continuingto extend the runs you're doing
now when you're already doing,you know pretty much a three.
Last week you did three hourrun, hour 45 run, an hour 15 run
, trying to progress those a bit.
You're doing like three bigruns a week.
(41:45):
You know it's a lot.
It's a lot when, if you, if youeven on your recovery day, if
you done two.
So if you went out for two 8keasy runs on your recovery day,
that's it.
That's a light day becauseneither of them are big things
to do, but you'll bank 16k forthat day, which is a lot of
running.
So something like that.
We'll have a combo about it.
Speaker 1 (42:03):
Though yeah, I think I like the idea of doing doubles
just because it's aninconvenience and I think I'm
going to be sewing like there'sgoing to be so many things that
go wrong.
I got a call from our motorhomecompany yesterday afternoon
being like oh, just needed toconfirm that you know that your
shower's not going to work, yourtoilet's not going to work and
the amenities of the motorhomearen't going to work because
(42:25):
it's winter, everything willfreeze over, you're in sub-zero
and I was like nice that wouldhave been.
I should have thought of that.
I didn't think about that, butthat the whole reason why we got
a motorhome was, yeah, so youcould have a fucking motorhome,
not have to get accommodations,and now I've got to get your
caravan pass, booked and stuff.
So there's going to be thingslike that that keep popping up.
That inconvenience, the wholeexperience.
(42:46):
I think that's going to be agood way to train, train for
that as well how are you feelingabout all the logistic and
planning side of that?
Speaker 2 (42:55):
because we actually haven't even spoke about that.
Right, we'd speak about yourtraining and and probably in
general, more life, yeah, lifein general, me and you but
because that stuff fascinates metoo, like I think that is,
that's such a big piece of thepuzzle it's the most stressful
part are you gonna have a physioon speed dial or, you know,
(43:16):
help professional, because Ithink that would be could be
good yes, so to come, I've gotto get my heart checked, like I
want to have my.
Speaker 1 (43:25):
I'm getting my bloods done.
I'm getting my heart testedjust to do a before and after.
Yeah, and then kathleen, mysister-in-law she's a physio, so
she does physio regularly, butthen when we're over there, um,
lskd and a few other people arehelping me get get some people
that will give me a tune up sortof every couple of days.
I'm feeling like when my body'sgoing to be that.
(43:45):
I remember when I rode 30marathons in a row my body was
pretty tired that it didn'tenjoy the heavy treatment.
It was more like light rubswere beneficial.
Yeah, so I'm trying to go infeeling good with that.
But the most stressful partabout the whole thing like you
make the program it's super easyfor me, which is awesome.
(44:06):
Uh, we've been fortunate to getsome great sponsors and now
it's just the pr side of thingsand obviously deliverables that
I've got for for those, andobviously we've now locked in
the route.
So you know, we had it lockedin and then one of our flights
got cancelled from hawaii, whichmeant we had to reroute the
whole freaking thing within likea six hour period.
(44:27):
So we got that done and thenit's now just knowing that if
anything goes wrong, like wemiss a day or something, I'm
either going to have to do adouble to get back on track,
because we've got 15 grand worthof flights booked that I can't
obviously miss.
So there's like a lot ofpressure that I'm thinking about
, because I've got peopleinvested in it and I've put a
(44:48):
heap of cash into it.
But that is part of the journeyI'm thinking about because I've
got people invested in it andI've put a heap of cash into it.
But that is part of the journey.
I'm lucky, liam Excitement, mybrother-in-law he's good at
logistics and all of that, sohe'll, you know, once he gets
back from Melbourne, he'll takeover all of that yeah cool.
Speaker 2 (45:03):
And food, like you don't want to rely on gas
station, you know whatever theysell in market like are you
gonna have you know what's yourplan?
Speaker 1 (45:14):
not walmart, costco, so yeah, so I've uh got an idea
of what we're gonna eat.
I'll probably I should probablysend that to you probably
understand it better.
But one thing that you've beenon me about is eating, and prior
to training with you, I waseating.
Probably I wasn't tracking toomuch, but just based off what I
knew I ate.
I was was eating around 2,000cals a day, so I definitely
wasn't eating enough.
Yeah, at the moment I'm doingabout 3,700, which feels like
(45:38):
I'm eating all day and I'm stilltrying to build that up a bit
more.
Speaker 2 (45:41):
Have you lost weight, though, or you've managed to
keep it on.
Speaker 1 (45:45):
I'm very skinny man, but I'm still sitting around 83
kilos.
Speaker 2 (45:52):
Which is still big for an endurance athlete that
they lock, which is onlyimportant because, as a bigger
body, your body produces moreheat.
It takes more calories tofunction.
As you know, like myself, I'm87 kilos because I'm so bloody
tall, so you've got to actuallytake in a lot more food because
you're so much bigger than thethe standard, you know, 60 kilo
(46:12):
marathon runner wouldn't it begood to be 60 kilos and run a
marathon?
Speaker 1 (46:17):
it'd feel nice, wouldn't it?
But I'm just like.
Speaker 2 (46:19):
Oh, you know, I want to be, I want to be able to rip
a marathon, but also, you know,hopefully bench press, more than
me, misses.
Still, you know it'd be good toget that fine line, which I
probably don't.
I hope she doesn't listen tothis.
Speaker 1 (46:31):
I could be in trouble yeah, I'm sure she will listen
to that for sure.
Um, but no, food wise, yeah,we'll have that sorted.
And and the crew's going to bemaking sure that while I'm
running they're doing costcotrips because, depending on the
size of the van, like the vansare decent size, but we'll we're
going up to seattle three daysearlier so we can make sure it's
(46:52):
all set up and ready to rumble.
Um so, and then I've got, uh,you know, saps.
Speaker 2 (46:59):
I've got like leg sleeves, whether they work or
not, like that would just begood to flush the legs after
each run yeah, I wonder if youget yourself a pair of norma
texter, just to kick the feet up, I got them, man, yeah, yeah,
yeah, because even like how muchdoes it help?
I don't know the answer, buteven if mentally you're telling
yourself it helps, that can be abenefit.
Or even, like, I love thembecause it just forces me to sit
(47:21):
down on my ass for an hour andeat food.
Even that might be the benefitof it.
Speaker 1 (47:32):
That's literally.
What I do is like I'll when I'mhaving dinner or whatever I'll
just whack them on and slowlyrip through some food so yeah, I
think exciting that, yeah, it'sall, it's all all come together
.
So now, yeah, just injury freeuntil yeah, till we uh head off
in four or five weeks and thenI'm in mexico and then kick it
off yeah, very good, yeah, it'llbe an adjustment as well.
Getting back into that coldweather, coming from here I
(47:54):
think it's.
Speaker 2 (47:55):
I personally feel it's going to be nicer running
in the cold oh, mate, you'redoing a lot of your train block
in brisbane, like for peoplelistening out there that haven't
been in brisbane before, it'sgot to be the worst place to be
a runner, like.
You know like how sad it iswhen you've got a long run on a
Sunday.
You check the weather out.
You're like it's going to be 26by 6 am.
So then you're like, what's theweather at 4?
(48:15):
It might be 23, but it's 99%humidity.
It's like, oh, this is grim.
Speaker 1 (48:21):
This is grim.
I started at 4.30 last week andI was cooking Like yeah.
It's not good, it's not ideal.
Speaker 2 (48:28):
But then, like, yeah, once you get to a cooler
climate, you know, having allthat, both mentally and
physically, will be a huge asset.
Like you know, ideal marathonconditions they say it's three
to eight degrees.
So you know, my next marathonin Ballarat can get to eight
degrees in April, which would beperfect.
But the benefit would be me.
I'll be training through aQueensland summer, you know, and
(48:50):
then cruise on down toMelbourne for an eight-degree
race, and then that should feel,you know, a huge difference, a
huge difference.
Speaker 1 (48:58):
Yeah, and you're aiming for a sub 2.45, then 2.45
?
Speaker 2 (49:02):
Yeah, 2.45 would be good, that'd be about 3.55.
Do you think like I?
When I ran my 2, my 250, I wasin good nick.
But like this year, before Igot injured, I put in so much
better training, I was so muchfitter.
And marathon is just a cruelgame because you've got to have
things fall in place.
You've got to feel good, notget injured, have good weather
(49:24):
on the day, not be sick.
I DNF'd at Noosa this year too.
I woke up the morning of therace sick as a dog.
I'm just like, oh.
And then I'm just like you'rejust gonna tell no one that
you're sick.
You're gonna just get on thatstart line and see what happens
um 25k and seeing stars losingme legs.
The wheels just fell off andended up in the medic.
(49:44):
That was this year.
So I went, I hit a dnf and thengot injured before before
goldie.
So you've got to be lucky andyou know, have things go your
way and be healthy, and that'sall a part of it.
When you're pushing the limittoo, you know like you're going
to get sick and you're going topick up little niggles.
There's just no way around it.
It's just doing your best totrain smartly that you minimise
(50:04):
that stuff and be smart when ithappens, so you can get on top
of it really quickly and notjust ignore it.
Speaker 1 (50:12):
Yeah, 100% For people who are looking for coaching.
They can all.
Obviously, for everyonelistening in the show notes,
I'll link your Instagram andwhatnot and people can reach out
to you there.
But what does it look like?
I guess the process withworking with you, because I know
you always have like you onlywork with X amount of people at
a time, but if people arewanting some coaching, what does
(50:33):
that look like?
Speaker 2 (50:34):
Mate.
Yeah, so definitely looking formore athletes.
Coaching is my passion.
I love it.
I'm both a nutritionist and arun coach, which is the double
winner.
The running boom is so big now.
What's that, mate?
Speaker 1 (50:46):
I said, it's one of the best things about you as
well, as you're a nutritionistas well.
Speaker 2 (50:49):
Yeah, yeah, which is good, and I thought it would
always be more nutrition.
But because of the running burnhow big running is at the moment
it's just fallen in my lap thatI've got a lot more run clients
than nutrition, but they do gohand in hand too, so you kind of
get the best of both worlds onthat.
But yeah, if anyone wants a runcoach like I've got blokes, I
coach boys and girls.
I've got, you know, a femaleathlete I coach trying to get
(51:11):
better.
You know running for a highrocks event.
She wants to turn pro on that.
I've got this bloody blokerunning 58 marathons in 58 days
across the world.
You know I've got a nice kidI'm coaching that wants to run a
20-minute 5K.
He's fun to coach.
(51:32):
Like, honestly, people from allwalks of life like and I find
coaching someone to achieve agoal way more satisfying than me
doing it myself like there'snothing better than um, being at
the finish line to a marathon,wherever it is, and seeing
someone do what they thoughtthey could never do and like
that moment for me is like why Icoach and, well, hopefully, do
it for the next 20 years.
So, yeah, if you ever to coach,it doesn't matter how big or
small.
It's never a one-size-fits-allpolicy, right, like it's your.
(51:56):
The way I'd program for you,which is through an app in
Training Peaks, is real specificto what your goals are.
You know there might be ifyou're someone that's trying to
run a sub-three-hour marathon,I'm going to coach and treat
them very differently to someonethat wants to complete a
marathon.
You know what's their workstress like have they got kids?
You know there's so manyfactors that go into the way I'd
(52:18):
program for someone.
So, yeah, mate, get in touch.
I'll drop you my website.
My official business islaunching.
It's called Rise Coaching.
Yeah, which is good.
Yeah, uh, I've been coachingfor a while now, but I need the
missus to give me a kick up theass to finally, you know, get
put all the pieces togetherwhich I'm not, which I'm not
(52:38):
good at.
I don't like talking aboutmyself or taking photos of
myself or promoting myself.
Yeah, yeah, the website.
We'll put it up so everyone cansee that.
Yeah, if anyone wants anycoaching, reach out and we can
have a bit of a deeperconversation as to what their
goals are.
Big or small, it doesn't matter.
Um, and yeah, I just lovehelping people, mate it's
(52:59):
awesome man.
Speaker 1 (52:59):
You're definitely the man for the for the job, like
dean wicks everyone and deanI've worked with a number of
coaches over the years, fromcrossfit to rugby to um, even
just for 5k and when I did theobstacle course racing and your
hands down, the mostprofessional person I've worked
with.
Like when I say professional,you deliver with great
programming all around, fuckinggood bloke.
(53:21):
You check in regularly for theaccountability and you give me
the kick up the ass that I need.
But then it's just, it's alsoenjoyable, which for me, is like
this perfect storm that allowsme to want to keep doing it,
because I think, if any of thoseare off, for me it's like oh,
maybe I need more accountability, or maybe I need a bit more fun
, or maybe I need to kick up theass, and you've delivered on
that.
You know above and beyond.
(53:41):
So for me it's just, honestly,the best investment, and I also
just enjoy talking shit with youas well.
It's good fun.
Speaker 2 (53:47):
Thank you, mate, can shit with you as well.
It's good fun.
Thank you, mate, I appreciatethat and yeah, I think that's
probably my biggest strength asa coach.
Like you know, you can getcoaches that are very high level
, elite athletes, but it doesn'tmean they're the best coach,
because they don't understandwhat it's like as much for a
person to.
You know work nine hour days,have kids.
You know blokes are coach.
They got a wedding on theweekend.
Well, I'm going to change theirscheduling so they can get their
long run done on a Saturdaymorning so they can have a beer
(54:09):
for their mate's wedding andkick their feet up on the Sunday
.
Like you need to, because I'm anormal person myself.
You need to sort of be able tosee both sides of like the elite
outcomes and progressing as anathlete, but also just be a
normal person and a good blokeand realise that.
You know you've got to beflexible with people and get it
to fit in with their lifestyle,because if they don't enjoy
(54:30):
doing it and they're not goingto stick at it for weeks, months
and years, then they're nevergoing to achieve the goals that
they could.
So you've got to find thatbalance between pushing them,
but also, you know, making surethey enjoy the process along the
way, because if they don'tenjoy it, then you know what's
the point in even doing this.
Speaker 1 (54:46):
Exactly right, dean.
Thanks so much for your time,mate, and for everyone listening
.
If you got value from thisepisode, make sure you share it
on your socials, leave a ratingand review and, as always, do
something today to be better fortomorrow and go check out Wixie
.
Thanks for having me, mate.
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