October 15, 2023 • 10 mins
Sue & Simon talk about the latest productivity trends. They discuss:
- The need to constantly evolve Productivity and have a robust roadmap
- Moving the Non-Value Add and Task & Process time into Customer
- Every Second Counts - The new book from ReThink
- The Rethink Forum on 12th September 2024
To find out more download the ReThink Whitepapers
#theproductivityexperts
Register for the 2025 Productivity Forum
Find us in the Top 50 Productivity Podcasts
Connect to Simon on LinkedIn
Follow ReThink on LinkedIn
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to the Productivity Podcast.
Sue's back with us for somemore productivity insights.
Hi, sue.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
Hello.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
And we're going to talk about productivity
evolution.
So do you want to explain a bitmore?
Put some meat on the bone.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Well, we all know that the world's changing all
the time and businesses have tobe changing in line with that as
well too.
And it's so much easier if youcan keep making constant changes
, whether it's to customer offerand then keeping your operating
model in line with it, or kindof always looking for those
improvements in your operation,because you're always having to
look for cost savings and thingsas things go along.
(00:37):
So it's much easier to do thatin ongoing, regular small steps
where you're planning ahead,rather than find yourself
perhaps in a bit of a difficulttime, maybe not going as far as
a crisis, but then suddenlyhaving to look for big changes.
And it can be easy to just donothing for a while to think,
right, we've delivered a wholeload of stuff, we can sit back
(00:58):
for a while, and I think that'squite a dangerous strategy
because it's so easy to getcaught out.
So constant change I think ifyou're not moving forward
slightly all the time, you'reprobably moving backwards
against the competition.
There's only a limit.
There's only so long you cancarry on doing that.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
And technology moves quickly in some areas.
In other areas it seems tolinger around, and I'll probably
use things like electronicshelfage labels, rfid.
There was a whole wave ofpeople getting excited about
tunnel payment at checkouts andthings, and, granted, there's
some great case studies nowabout electronic shelfage labels
(01:35):
and lots of certainly fashionorganizations using RFID, but it
wasn't the tidal wave of changethat was talked about five, six
years ago.
It's taken five, six years forpeople to really get on with it,
which I suppose is a case inpoint of if you wait and wait
and wait, then there's a load ofother stuff you could be
(01:56):
getting on with and I assumesome of that's cost that hinders
that.
And I assume the technology getsquicker and better and cheaper
and therefore the cost drops asit becomes more openly
accessible to the market.
But have you got any examplesof where you've seen people do
good kind of continual change?
Speaker 2 (02:14):
Yeah, I suppose one of the clients that we had
actually set themselves sometargets and they did it from an
efficiency study.
So an efficiency study is onewhere we do laps of the
operation and from that werecord the proportion of time
that's spent on the differentactivities that happen.
So some of that will benon-value add time, so also
known as lost and unproductivetime, but also time on different
(02:38):
aspects.
So how long are they spendingon admin versus doing other
things?
And actually that organizationset themselves some top line
targets to move activity out ofboth non-value add and then the
essential tasks that they haveto do into customer time.
And that's an organization thatfor them spending more time
with customer add value.
(02:58):
It's a very sales orientatedbusiness and because they
started, did started with ameasure and then set themselves
targets to move it then gavethem a very clear view about
when they were then assessingany operational change they
could make.
They could then say, well, howmuch is this going to move the
dial for us?
And I always find efficiencystudy is a really great place to
(03:19):
start when you're looking atthese things, because we've got
some really good benchmarks now.
So if you're talking about inwarehousing, the amount of time
people spend actually picking orputting stock away versus
moving.
So whether it's trucking orwhether it's walking on foot,
that's really insightful.
And then things like retail.
We've got it on how long peopleare spending on handling stock.
(03:44):
What's the ratio of?
Does most of your delivery goout first time?
So I am spending a lot of timeon replenishment because that
suggests that you're not puttingyour way first thing.
So the fact that we canbenchmark those things gives
some people some really clearplaces to start, as well as kind
of the observations and thingsthat we make.
Speaker 1 (04:03):
And we've done a previous episode, haven't we
around efficiency study.
People want to dig into that inmore detail and activity study
and role study and predetermineMTM analysis.
So I think there's two thingsto pick up on there.
So one, it's not necessarilyall about cost saving, maybe
reapportioning costs.
And two, I think there's amassive art in the whole taking
(04:26):
it out of task and process ornon-value add and putting it in
customer.
I think it's quite easy to takeit out of task and process but
almost increasing non-value addby stealth.
So there are ways that you'veseen people have done a good job
in terms of making sure itdoesn't go and dropping to the
non-value add.
Speaker 2 (04:46):
I think it starts right back at the beginning.
So a lot of businesses have aproductivity roadmap, which is
kind of what I refer to, theother business having to some
clear targets.
So in an ideal world, aproductivity roadmap will look
at quick wins, things you'lldeliver this year.
But the power of it is you'llbe looking at things that you
have to do the work for now todeliver next year.
(05:07):
So I think the places that getit right, where they're able to
put these changes in that don'tdeliver a lot of non-value add,
is one they've got a reasonableunderstanding of what the size
of the change will be.
So, for example, if I save asecond on something that I do
not very often, it doesn't addup too much.
Is it really worth doing thatchange?
If I save a second on somethingbut it's, for example, time
(05:30):
between customers and it I can'tdo anything else with that time
, it potentially just drops intodead time.
So the part that the peoplewho've got a really good
understanding of what a changewill deliver for them and then
how that relates to their salarybudgets and kind of how their
model works, then I thinkthey're the ones that do best
(05:51):
and you really get to that byone, having a clear
understanding of what you'redoing rather than grabbing at a
headline, because some of thesechanges can look like glitzy and
exciting and when you look atwhat they really deliver in
terms of realizable benefit, itmight not be that.
So one that got that a realclear eye on where the money's
spent and what they could freeup and.
(06:14):
And the other thing is thatthey're probably doing quite a
bit of testing and learningbefore they start.
So how can you put it intopractice, learn from it, tweak
it before you go to a fullrollout, because once things are
in full rollout, to change itis obviously much harder than if
it's just in a testing stage.
Speaker 1 (06:31):
And it touches on a couple of chapters in the book,
doesn't it?
So I know we've launched thebook at the productivity forum.
Lots of people there well,everybody that came about a copy
.
Lots of requests for copies.
Since, do you want to justtouch on the book again?
Briefly, just for those thatweren't aware of it.
Speaker 2 (06:49):
Yes, so it's intended to be something that you dip
into.
It's based around the ten mostfrequently asked questions we
get, and one of the chapters isabout productivity roadmaps, so
it's intended that you can readabout it, get some background.
This case studies in there.
This quick wins tells you howyou can tackle it.
So hopefully it's somethingthat's a very practical guide
(07:11):
for people that are facingreal-time challenges, and
whether that's something that'sa kind of an in-your-face now
challenge or whether that's Iknow that I need to do
continuous improvement.
I think for all thosesituations it will hopefully be
something that's helpful.
Speaker 1 (07:27):
A design that you can kind of pick it up, put it down
, jump in for a chapter that'srelevant at the time.
It's not a kind of cradle tograve read.
Speaker 2 (07:34):
No, no, it's not a start.
At the end, and what you waythrough, they're independent
chapters, so you can just dip inand out as you see fit.
Speaker 1 (07:41):
And if people want to copy.
Speaker 2 (07:43):
At the moment they'll need to contact us and soon
it's going to be available viaAmazon.
So it's kind of a week or soaway from that Brilliant.
Speaker 1 (07:52):
And then 12th September 2024 is now the
confirmed date for theProductivity Forum next year,
back at the National ConferenceCentre in Birmingham, which is
adjacent to the motorcyclemuseum.
So nice and easy for planes,trains, automobiles, maybe not
bikes, maybe not walking, butlots of people already
registered from last year.
(08:12):
So I think we're 70 plusalready and we were just
slightly over a hundred lastyear.
So registration links on thewebsite.
If you want to come open tokind of anybody use in a
customer-facing organisation.
There'll be people from contactcentres, hospitality, retail
warehousing logistics.
So, again, building the agendaquite a way out, but, as we
(08:34):
found last year, the kind ofseats get booked up early.
So if you need any more details, look on the website or drop me
your sewer note and we'll takeit from there.
So Productivity Robupscontinually, tweaks and changes,
trying to take it out ofnon-value add and essential task
and process time, the artsgoing back into customer or
(08:59):
saving.
So lots to think about, I'msure, for every organisation,
because, as you said at thestart, it's a turbulent time,
but then, if you look back, itprobably always has been and
always will be.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
And the clever thing is if you can link it to your
budgeting cycle.
So our experience as bigorganisations is that as budget
time rolls around, every yearyou'll be asked for some savings
.
So actually, if you startscrambling around then to find
things, you probably won't bemaking your best decisions if
you're a few months ahead ofthat.
So you've got a stream of triedand tested solutions, plus
(09:31):
you've got an ITA and actuallynext year somebody's going to
ask me the question again.
It really helps you do thingsin a much better way and be more
streamlined and avoid knee-jerkchanges that perhaps aren't the
best for the business.
Speaker 1 (09:44):
Yeah, and I think as a minimum I'd always work on the
principle I need to absorb wageinflation through initiatives.
Yeah, whether you're payingnational living wage or above,
and if you're paying above,you've always got to keep the
gap.
So that would be kind of mymind's safe.
I was in that role at themoment.
Speaker 2 (10:02):
And I guess you always know what the inflation
headline number is.
It's always news.
Every month it gets reported,whether it goes up, down or
stays the same.
So again, the inflation numberis often a good guide to where
salary changes might be.
They're usually in the samesort of ballpark there might be
a bit higher if it's lowinflation, there might be a bit
(10:23):
lower if it's high inflation.
But that's usually the sort offigure that you're looking for,
isn't it?
Speaker 1 (10:28):
Yeah, absolutely brilliant.
So great insights again andwe'll be back soon with another
episode.
Thanks, akbye.
Welcome to the Productivity Podcast.
Sue's back with us for somemore productivity insights.
Hi, sue.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
Hello.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
And we're going to talk about productivity
evolution.
So do you want to explain a bitmore?
Put some meat on the bone.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Well, we all know that the world's changing all
the time and businesses have tobe changing in line with that as
well too.
And it's so much easier if youcan keep making constant changes
, whether it's to customer offerand then keeping your operating
model in line with it, or kindof always looking for those
improvements in your operation,because you're always having to
look for cost savings and thingsas things go along.
(00:37):
So it's much easier to do thatin ongoing, regular small steps
where you're planning ahead,rather than find yourself
perhaps in a bit of a difficulttime, maybe not going as far as
a crisis, but then suddenlyhaving to look for big changes.
And it can be easy to just donothing for a while to think,
right, we've delivered a wholeload of stuff, we can sit back
(00:58):
for a while, and I think that'squite a dangerous strategy
because it's so easy to getcaught out.
So constant change I think ifyou're not moving forward
slightly all the time, you'reprobably moving backwards
against the competition.
There's only a limit.
There's only so long you cancarry on doing that.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
And technology moves quickly in some areas.
In other areas it seems tolinger around, and I'll probably
use things like electronicshelfage labels, rfid.
There was a whole wave ofpeople getting excited about
tunnel payment at checkouts andthings, and, granted, there's
some great case studies nowabout electronic shelfage labels
(01:35):
and lots of certainly fashionorganizations using RFID, but it
wasn't the tidal wave of changethat was talked about five, six
years ago.
It's taken five, six years forpeople to really get on with it,
which I suppose is a case inpoint of if you wait and wait
and wait, then there's a load ofother stuff you could be
(01:56):
getting on with and I assumesome of that's cost that hinders
that.
And I assume the technology getsquicker and better and cheaper
and therefore the cost drops asit becomes more openly
accessible to the market.
But have you got any examplesof where you've seen people do
good kind of continual change?
Speaker 2 (02:14):
Yeah, I suppose one of the clients that we had
actually set themselves sometargets and they did it from an
efficiency study.
So an efficiency study is onewhere we do laps of the
operation and from that werecord the proportion of time
that's spent on the differentactivities that happen.
So some of that will benon-value add time, so also
known as lost and unproductivetime, but also time on different
(02:38):
aspects.
So how long are they spendingon admin versus doing other
things?
And actually that organizationset themselves some top line
targets to move activity out ofboth non-value add and then the
essential tasks that they haveto do into customer time.
And that's an organization thatfor them spending more time
with customer add value.
(02:58):
It's a very sales orientatedbusiness and because they
started, did started with ameasure and then set themselves
targets to move it then gavethem a very clear view about
when they were then assessingany operational change they
could make.
They could then say, well, howmuch is this going to move the
dial for us?
And I always find efficiencystudy is a really great place to
(03:19):
start when you're looking atthese things, because we've got
some really good benchmarks now.
So if you're talking about inwarehousing, the amount of time
people spend actually picking orputting stock away versus
moving.
So whether it's trucking orwhether it's walking on foot,
that's really insightful.
And then things like retail.
We've got it on how long peopleare spending on handling stock.
(03:44):
What's the ratio of?
Does most of your delivery goout first time?
So I am spending a lot of timeon replenishment because that
suggests that you're not puttingyour way first thing.
So the fact that we canbenchmark those things gives
some people some really clearplaces to start, as well as kind
of the observations and thingsthat we make.
Speaker 1 (04:03):
And we've done a previous episode, haven't we
around efficiency study.
People want to dig into that inmore detail and activity study
and role study and predetermineMTM analysis.
So I think there's two thingsto pick up on there.
So one, it's not necessarilyall about cost saving, maybe
reapportioning costs.
And two, I think there's amassive art in the whole taking
(04:26):
it out of task and process ornon-value add and putting it in
customer.
I think it's quite easy to takeit out of task and process but
almost increasing non-value addby stealth.
So there are ways that you'veseen people have done a good job
in terms of making sure itdoesn't go and dropping to the
non-value add.
Speaker 2 (04:46):
I think it starts right back at the beginning.
So a lot of businesses have aproductivity roadmap, which is
kind of what I refer to, theother business having to some
clear targets.
So in an ideal world, aproductivity roadmap will look
at quick wins, things you'lldeliver this year.
But the power of it is you'llbe looking at things that you
have to do the work for now todeliver next year.
(05:07):
So I think the places that getit right, where they're able to
put these changes in that don'tdeliver a lot of non-value add,
is one they've got a reasonableunderstanding of what the size
of the change will be.
So, for example, if I save asecond on something that I do
not very often, it doesn't addup too much.
Is it really worth doing thatchange?
If I save a second on somethingbut it's, for example, time
(05:30):
between customers and it I can'tdo anything else with that time
, it potentially just drops intodead time.
So the part that the peoplewho've got a really good
understanding of what a changewill deliver for them and then
how that relates to their salarybudgets and kind of how their
model works, then I thinkthey're the ones that do best
(05:51):
and you really get to that byone, having a clear
understanding of what you'redoing rather than grabbing at a
headline, because some of thesechanges can look like glitzy and
exciting and when you look atwhat they really deliver in
terms of realizable benefit, itmight not be that.
So one that got that a realclear eye on where the money's
spent and what they could freeup and.
(06:14):
And the other thing is thatthey're probably doing quite a
bit of testing and learningbefore they start.
So how can you put it intopractice, learn from it, tweak
it before you go to a fullrollout, because once things are
in full rollout, to change itis obviously much harder than if
it's just in a testing stage.
Speaker 1 (06:31):
And it touches on a couple of chapters in the book,
doesn't it?
So I know we've launched thebook at the productivity forum.
Lots of people there well,everybody that came about a copy
.
Lots of requests for copies.
Since, do you want to justtouch on the book again?
Briefly, just for those thatweren't aware of it.
Speaker 2 (06:49):
Yes, so it's intended to be something that you dip
into.
It's based around the ten mostfrequently asked questions we
get, and one of the chapters isabout productivity roadmaps, so
it's intended that you can readabout it, get some background.
This case studies in there.
This quick wins tells you howyou can tackle it.
So hopefully it's somethingthat's a very practical guide
(07:11):
for people that are facingreal-time challenges, and
whether that's something that'sa kind of an in-your-face now
challenge or whether that's Iknow that I need to do
continuous improvement.
I think for all thosesituations it will hopefully be
something that's helpful.
Speaker 1 (07:27):
A design that you can kind of pick it up, put it down
, jump in for a chapter that'srelevant at the time.
It's not a kind of cradle tograve read.
Speaker 2 (07:34):
No, no, it's not a start.
At the end, and what you waythrough, they're independent
chapters, so you can just dip inand out as you see fit.
Speaker 1 (07:41):
And if people want to copy.
Speaker 2 (07:43):
At the moment they'll need to contact us and soon
it's going to be available viaAmazon.
So it's kind of a week or soaway from that Brilliant.
Speaker 1 (07:52):
And then 12th September 2024 is now the
confirmed date for theProductivity Forum next year,
back at the National ConferenceCentre in Birmingham, which is
adjacent to the motorcyclemuseum.
So nice and easy for planes,trains, automobiles, maybe not
bikes, maybe not walking, butlots of people already
registered from last year.
(08:12):
So I think we're 70 plusalready and we were just
slightly over a hundred lastyear.
So registration links on thewebsite.
If you want to come open tokind of anybody use in a
customer-facing organisation.
There'll be people from contactcentres, hospitality, retail
warehousing logistics.
So, again, building the agendaquite a way out, but, as we
(08:34):
found last year, the kind ofseats get booked up early.
So if you need any more details, look on the website or drop me
your sewer note and we'll takeit from there.
So Productivity Robupscontinually, tweaks and changes,
trying to take it out ofnon-value add and essential task
and process time, the artsgoing back into customer or
(08:59):
saving.
So lots to think about, I'msure, for every organisation,
because, as you said at thestart, it's a turbulent time,
but then, if you look back, itprobably always has been and
always will be.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
And the clever thing is if you can link it to your
budgeting cycle.
So our experience as bigorganisations is that as budget
time rolls around, every yearyou'll be asked for some savings
.
So actually, if you startscrambling around then to find
things, you probably won't bemaking your best decisions if
you're a few months ahead ofthat.
So you've got a stream of triedand tested solutions, plus
(09:31):
you've got an ITA and actuallynext year somebody's going to
ask me the question again.
It really helps you do thingsin a much better way and be more
streamlined and avoid knee-jerkchanges that perhaps aren't the
best for the business.
Speaker 1 (09:44):
Yeah, and I think as a minimum I'd always work on the
principle I need to absorb wageinflation through initiatives.
Yeah, whether you're payingnational living wage or above,
and if you're paying above,you've always got to keep the
gap.
So that would be kind of mymind's safe.
I was in that role at themoment.
Speaker 2 (10:02):
And I guess you always know what the inflation
headline number is.
It's always news.
Every month it gets reported,whether it goes up, down or
stays the same.
So again, the inflation numberis often a good guide to where
salary changes might be.
They're usually in the samesort of ballpark there might be
a bit higher if it's lowinflation, there might be a bit
(10:23):
lower if it's high inflation.
But that's usually the sort offigure that you're looking for,
isn't it?
Speaker 1 (10:28):
Yeah, absolutely brilliant.
So great insights again andwe'll be back soon with another
episode.
Thanks, akbye.
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