Episode 13 - Reframing Talk Therapy with Psychedelics

In Episode 13, Natalie and Chelsea sit down with Allie Runkle, a Psychodynamic Therapist specializing in Ketamine Assisted Therapy, to talk about her background and practice, the resurgence of Psychedelic Assisted Therapy, and its application to treat PTSD and/or other mood disorders. In this episode, you will hear how medical professionals like Allie are using ketamine or other psychedelics to reframe “traditional therapy,” who can benefit from psychedelic therapy, how they work and are changing the way people think about and experience therapy.  

Show Notes:

Hosts:  

Natalie M.

Chelsea M.

Timestamps:

**00:00** - Introduction

**05:03** - Natalie ask’s Allie to tell us about her background, education, credentials, and how she got into ketamine assisted therapy.

**18:17** - Allie discusses her personal experience with ketamine assisted therapy.

**24:00** - Allie discusses taking care of herself and having integrity within her profession so that she can help others and hold space for them. 

**28:46** - Allie starts to go into detail on what ketamine assisted therapy requires. 

**31:25** - Allie describes the importance of “set & setting” during ketamine assisted therapy. 

**34:57** - Allie describes how ketamine is administered for therapy.

**37:37** - Natalie asks Allie how someone qualifies for ketamine assisted therapy and how many sessions one typically needs to go through. 

**45:46** - Chelsea asks Allie what the post-Ketamine assisted therapy session protocol is.

**47:06** - Break

**47:28** - Natalie asks Allie to explain what “neuroplasticity” is.

**55:51** - Natalie asks Allie who would be a good candidate for ketamine assisted therapy.

**59:58** - Allie talks about “integration” and that this is where the reframe of this therapy really comes into play. 

**1:05:44** - Natalie asks Allie specifically about what happens if a person's problem is that they dissociate, how does Ketamine therapy help them.

**1:07:45** - Chelsea kicks off a conversation with Allie around the perception that using assistance (ketamine or otherwise) to achieve healing in therapy is like taking some sort of short cut.

**1:15:27** - Natalie kicks off a conversation with Allie around Psilocybin and MDMA, how they’re different/similar to Ketamine and if they’re on the same trajectory as Ketamine for therapy. 

**1:28:44** - Allie discusses trying to make her practice accessible to clients from a wide range of financial backgrounds. 

**1:15:** - End of Episode

**1:37:24** - Stay Tuned

**1:38:19** - Outro

Key Takeaways:

1. “Fixed Mindset”: Belief that abilities, talents, and traits are fixed or inherent and cannot be significantly changed.

2. “Growth Mindset”: Belief that abilities, talents, and traits can be developed and improved through effort and learning.

3. **Tips for Cultivating a Growth Mindset**

Self-Awareness

-Identify Your Fixed Mindset Triggers

-Reflect

Change Your Language

-Switch Your Language

-Embrace Constructive Feedback

Reframe Challenges and Setbacks

-Stretch Goals

-Reframe Failures

Embrace Feedback and Prioritize Learning Over Validation

-Constructive Criticism

-Encourage Open Dialogue

-Value the Process

-Focus on Yourself

Additional Resources:

https://www.allierunkel.com/

@allierunkeltherapycove on IG

Connect with Us:

- The Daily Reframe Website

- Instagram

- TikTok

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