November 14, 2025 • 47 mins
In this intimate and unfiltered episode of The Sober Butterfly Podcast, host Nadine Mulvina opens up about her journey of celibacy in sobriety — from chaotic, alcohol-fueled hookups to a life anchored in self-respect, clarity, and peace.
Before getting sober, sex often felt like a search for connection that always ended in disconnection. Nadine reflects on how alcohol served as a social lubricant, helping her lower inhibitions while deepening her emotional void. She dives into her two distinct hoe phases — from college party culture to navigating machismo in Mexico City — and how those experiences shaped her understanding of intimacy, self-worth, and addiction to limerence.
Now, nearly a year into her second celibacy era, Nadine shares the unexpected benefits of celibacy in sobriety — including heightened clarity, confidence, creativity, and spiritual grounding. With humor and honesty, she explores what happens when you stop seeking validation through sex and start nurturing a genuine relationship with yourself.
This episode is for anyone who’s re-evaluating their relationship with love, lust, or loneliness — and wants to rediscover intimacy beyond the physical.
💫 Episode Highlights
00:00 — Introduction: The Sex List Revelation
00:33 — Celibacy in Sobriety: A New Journey
01:06 — Sex Before Sobriety: Chaos and Alcohol
04:33 — The Hoe Phase: Reclaiming Self
06:08 — Heartbreak and the Hoe Phase
06:49 — College and Party Life
09:45 — Mexico City: Machismo and Heartbreak
16:57 — Therapy and Realizations
18:45 — The First Year of Sobriety
21:36 — Second Celibacy Era
24:07 — Breaking Patterns and Embracing Sobriety
25:42 — Building a Sober Toolbox
26:17 — Contentment and Self-Discovery
27:21 — Navigating Relationships and Self-Worth
35:24 — The Benefits of Celibacy in Sobriety
46:37 — Final Thoughts and Reflections
🧠 Key Takeaways
- How alcohol shaped unhealthy sexual patterns and emotional dependency
- The cultural influence of machismo in Mexico City on dating and self-esteem
- Why celibacy can be an empowering choice for those in recovery
- How to recognize and break addictive relationship patterns (limerence)
- The surprising benefits of celibacy in sobriety: clarity, confidence, creativity, and peace
- Relearning intimacy through self-connection rather than external validation
🔗 Resources Mentioned
🎥 YouTube Video: Sober Sexpert Tawny Lara on Sex in Sobriety
🦋 Connect with Nadine & The Sober Butterfly
🎧 Listen to more episodes: thesoberbutterfly.com/podcast
💌 Subscribe on Substack for behind-the-scenes reflections: thesoberbutterfly.substack.com
📸 Follow on Instagram: @the.soberbutterflypodcast
💬 Join the conversation using #CelibacyInSobriety #TheSoberButterflyPodcast #SoberWellness
Please note that this episode may contain paid endorsements and advertisements for products and services. Individuals on the show may have a direct or indirect financial interest in products or services refereed to in this episode.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
the-sober-butterfly_3_11-13- (00:00):
so the other day I was catching up
with a friend and somehow my sexlist came up.
You know the list we're alladults here.
Anyway, I shared my list withhim.
Wait, I thought there'd be more,he was like, oh, that's not too
bad.
I thought there'd be more, firstof all, that's not a compliment,
(00:21):
that's an insult.
But honestly, I can't even bemad because before sobriety,
like Nadine pre sobriety, shewas outside.
She was outside.
We've talked about it on theshow.
But in sobriety, things havechanged quite a lot, which
brings me to today's topic,celibacy in sobriety, why I
(00:43):
chose it, what I've learned fromit, and honestly how it's helped
me heal, and ways that I did notexpect.
the-sober-butterfly_4_11- (00:52):
Let's get into it.
Welcome to the Sober ButterflyPodcast.
I am Nadine, your host, andtoday as mentioned, I'm going to
be talking all about celibacy insobriety.
the-sober-butterfly_5_11-13 (01:05):
All right, let's open the episode.
Talking about sex Beforesobriety,, I would like to set
the scene and offer somecontext.
My life my sex life.
I'll say before sobriety waschaotic, just like everything
else actually in my life.
At that time, there wereeuphoric highs and.
Bottomless lows, and I haveshared this before, but I'll say
(01:29):
it again I seriously cannotthink of a single time where I
hooked up with someone for thefirst time without being under
the influence of something.
And I've shared specifically inthe episode with Tawny, the
silver sex expert.
I'll plug it in the show notesfor you guys in case you missed
(01:50):
it.
But we openly discussed thisidea of like how, if you have
any sexual trauma or if you haveany sexual insecurities, which a
lot of us do have.
And then specifically her and Ishare this common thread of body
dysmorphia and not necessarilyfeeling very confident in our
bodies and those insecuritiesvery much.
(02:12):
Show up in our intimaterelationships.
And so alcohol for me acted likea social lubricant of sorts to
where I could really have moreof an outof body experience and
show up in the bedroom bolderand braver in ways that I just
normally could not, and like tobe honest with you guys, let's
really go there.
(02:33):
Like I would use alcohol as away to get my freak on, not like
a freak off, not like Diddystyle, but get my freak on.
'cause I felt very likeself-conscious about, for
example, like my number, likethat sexist that I have that
running record in my phone.
I've had that for years andevery time I had to add like a
new body to that list, I wouldfeel very self-conscious about
(02:54):
it.
So alcohol, I felt, gave mepermission to lower my
inhibitions, lower my threshold,and just say, fuck it.
Because I wanted to fuck thatperson, but like I needed or
felt like I needed an excuse togo there.
So alcohol really served me inthat capacity until it no longer
served me in that capacity untilI realized that.
(03:16):
I was actually cravingconnection, but just settling
for sex.
I wanted the steak.
And I was like, literally,accepting baby shrimps.
I thought that the physicalintimacy would feel the
emotional emptiness that I felt.
For a long time, but of courseit never did.
Like that physical connectioncannot supplement an emotional
(03:40):
void.
In fact, I would say it deepensit, it worsens it.
And the wild thing is when Ilook back, I can see how often
I.
Conflated the chaos forchemistry.
Like I thought the more dramaticsomething was, the more
passionate the more real it was.
(04:00):
And I still kind of strugglewith that if I'm being honest
with you guys to this day.
Love bombing is my love languageto a certain extent.
Like I am part of the problem.
So yeah, confusing intensity forintimacy was a common narrative
or theme in my life at thattime.
And.
Something that I consistentlyhave to check in with myself
(04:21):
about because I know this aboutmyself and it's something that
even though I'm now sober, I'mstill not like immune to that.
So yeah, it's an ongoingprocess.
the-sober-butterfly_6_11- (04:33):
Let's talk about the HO phase, because
we've all had one., Maybe morethan one in our lives.
And if you haven't had a wholephase, what are you doing?
What are you doing?
Like you should totally have awhole phase in your life.
I like to think of the hoves aslike a reclaiming of self, like
a homecoming.
You realizing that you don'thave to adhere to whatever
(04:55):
societal pressures or conform tothe norms of what a woman should
be the virtuous, pious.
Virgin or whatever, I grew up inthe church, so very clear
archetypes in terms of what awoman should and should not be,
what a lady should and shouldnot be, I should say.
(05:16):
And for a long time I subscribedto those beliefs.
And then there was a point intime where I no longer could
quell the fact that I was a verysexual being.
We're mammals of the end of theday.
Okay.
Lemme talk about the criterionfor having a ho phase because
there usually are like commontraits or like catalysts that
spark this ho phase.
(05:37):
I'm like a socialanthropologist.
Like I can think of definingtimes where my friends have also
had ho phases and usually whatpredates a whole phase is like a
major heartbreak.
Like you are just heartbrokenand that could be because you
just got out of a relationshipor you could just be sick of it.
Like you could just be so sickof men because they were just so
(05:59):
disappointing.
That's another predecessor, orlike precursor, I should say, to
the whole phase where it's likeyou are just so over these men.
So anyway, two very distinct hophases and both situations
included me being heartbrokenover a man.
And another common ground hereis like neither of those men
(06:22):
that I'm referencing or thinkingof were my man.
They weren't actually myboyfriend, which is actually one
of the most heinous.
Humiliating genre of heartbreak.
I was just always boy crazy andsad about.
Some flavor of the month andthen I get over it and the best
way I would get over it was toget under someone else.
Like I would actually recitethat with my friends.
(06:44):
Another one bites the dust.
Let's go to the bars.
We'll find another player.
Like it's fine.
I realized, upon graduation,that I had never actually had a
boyfriend, like a real boyfriendin college.
So all four and a half years ofme being a student at FAMU I
never really had a serioussteady boyfriend.
Now was that by choice or bydesign?
(07:07):
It's hard to say, the ratio.
Between men and women, like itwas predominantly female campus.
I forgot the statistics,, butlet's say it was like 60 40 or
65, 35.
Like it was pretty noticeable interms of the gap between the men
and women.
So like that first of all, madeit extremely advantageous for
the men.
(07:27):
And then also I was a partygirl.
There were very specificarchetypes of people in college
and I was easily classified as aparty girl.
But here's the thing, there'salso different types of party
girls.
Like I was the party girl thatwould pass out.
Like even though I was outside,I wouldn't be able to Continue
to go to all the after moves andthen be ready to hook up with
(07:48):
anyone.
Like I was mostly like passedout on a couch, like there are
many photos of me passed out oncouches and like my friends
hanging out still and meliterally blackout.
So like I wasn't the girlhooking up.
There are girls who like, partyand then they're like DTF.
In college, I wasn't like theDTFI wasn't down to fuck.
I was like down to pass out,pass the fuck out.
(08:09):
That's what I would do.
So I didn't have a label ofbeing quote like a ho, but I
definitely had like my sneakylinks.
I had my people that like Icould call if I wanted to.
But yeah, it was a very specialtime.
So it it wasn't catastrophic.
Like my whole phase in collegewas just like a culmination of
just different people, randomhookups here and there.
(08:31):
Spring break always I thinkevery spring break I hooked up
with someone.
College, Jesus.
Just like thinking about howgross that is.
Anyway, so like that was collegeand then the other phase I had
was 2021 yeah, that oneobviously more recent, but a lot
(08:54):
more dark.
Like it wasn't a fun ho phase,like college was like fun and
flirty and freeing.
2021 COVID ho phase was sad.
Like I'll be honest, I washeartbroken over a man, who
wasn't my boyfriend.
And he said to me, let's just befriends.
(09:16):
And I heard, oh, you hate me andyou wanna ruin my life.
So I did what any emotionallyunregulated girl would do.
With a drinking problem and Iturned to my ride or die, which
was alcohol.
And while the world was inlockdown, I was a fuera, which
(09:40):
is Spanish for outside.
I was going out all the freakingtime, so in the start of 2021, I
had been in Mexico City for sixmonths or so.
So I already had an establishedfriend group at that time and
like I was going out.
All the time meeting randomguys, usually friends of
friends.
And like the scene in MexicoCity is just so crazy.
the-sober-butterfly_7_11-13- (10:01):
If you've ever spent time in Latin
America you know that machismoenergy I'm talking about, like
it's very real.
It's everywhere.
It's in dating, it's innightlife.
Even casual conversations.
And if you don't know whatmachismo energy is, it's like
this hyper masculine culturewhere men are encouraged to
(10:22):
chase and women are expected tobe, I guess, flattered by that.
Personally, I will be honest andshare the privilege that I
received as an outsider in thisenvironment.
Was the benefit of like neverhaving to pay for anything like
that is a foreign concept I feellike, to American men,
(10:44):
especially in 2025, and maybeit's regional depending on where
you live.
In other parts of the countrywhere I've spent some time
Florida, Georgia, like theSouth, men are more inclined to
want to just cover the bill.
But up north I find that a lotof men, even if they got it,
like even if they have it, it'snot customary for them to pay a
(11:07):
bill.
For every single person atbrunch, for example, or at
dinner or at the club, that isthe norm there.
I never paid for anything,imagine you pull up and you're
seated with 20 people andthere's hookahs and everyone's
eating and drinking and likeshots of mezcal literally
limitless items.
Just like racking up.
And the bill is just taken careof, the men would get together
(11:30):
and split the bell for everyone.
And it was like amazing.
I'm not gonna lie, I loved thatpart.
But obviously that comes withconditions.
There was no such thing as afree.
Hookah.
They would cover the bill andlike I didn't have to hook up
with anyone.
That wasn't the expectation.
I wanna be clear about that.
But now I'm fucked up.
Now I've been drinking, youknow, 15 shots of mezcal maybe
(11:54):
that's an exaggeration.
Maybe that's not, and I am,obliterated.
I'm not in my.
Right state of mind.
Of course.
And this guy is, whisperingsweet things in my ear, and I
think he's cute and he has alike accent.
And now we're going to theafters.
That's another thing aboutMexico City.
There is always an after move.
(12:15):
The after parties were so muchfun, if this sounds like I'm
romanticizing my drinking, I'mnot but I did have good times.
I won't lie, like I wouldn'thave been outside for so long if
I was miserable the entire time.
So there were definitely goodmoments.
The ones I can recall.
And at the time as someone whowas heartbroken over a man who
wasn't even my man, which by theway, That rejection really
(12:37):
fucked up my psyche in manyways.
And I realize now it was allego.
That whole situation was ego.
Like it was not love.
Like I thought I was lovesick.
No, my ego was fractured becauseit was already really frail and
it didn't take much to break itwhen it was basically in
shambles to begin with.
And it's because I just.
(12:59):
Attached so much of my worth tomy physical appearance at the
time, and like I just couldn'tunderstand why a man wouldn't
want to date me, and so I actedout in a way that I thought was
a small win.
And I felt like I was seekingvalidation in some kind of way.
And that machisma culture that Iwas in made that really easy for
(13:19):
me.
Like everywhere I went, I wascatcalled, I was offered drinks,
I was told I was beautiful.
And also imagine like I'm ablack girl, like I think there
are more black people in MexicoCity.
But there was a time I'm a lisgirly, so like I probably have
this list somewhere in my notesapp, but I would keep like a
running tally of every blackperson that I saw in Mexico
City.
Over the course of me livingthere for a year, I really
(13:42):
should go look to see if I stillhave that.
But it wasn't a lot.
It was definitely under 50.
And I've heard since, you know,COVID, there are a lot more
black people that live in MexicoCity and I love that because.
Mexico City, hands down easily.
My favorite city in the world,like I would live there again in
a heartbeat, but something I didmiss was like more diversity in
terms of like black people ifI'm being real.
(14:03):
So anyway, as a black girl, Idefinitely stood out and like I
felt like a lot of the men, oh,one thing, fucking Mexican men
do very well.
Like maybe this is more justlike speaking to that machismo
culture.
Sweet.
Nothings, oh my God, these men,the most poetic in the world.
(14:23):
If I go to my WhatsApp, I'llprobably find like messages of
like men professing theirdeepest, most profound love.
Like you would think that wewere star cross lovers, like we
knew each other.
Many past lives like it wasgiving that level of you are my
person.
And that for someone who is justso broken, was music to my ears?
That's what I needed to hear.
And you know, the first timethat happens to you and you know
(14:46):
you fall for it, shame on you.
The second, third, five, 10,15th time that happens.
Girl, it's on you now.
Like that surface level teryfrom a man who you know is not
emotionally available or maybeeven.
Available period, because a lotof men in Mexico City that I met
(15:07):
at that time were living doublelives.
Okay.
Definitely had a wife and kidsat home, like that type of deal.
I did not know that when theywere courting me, of course.
But I would come to find outbecause the gossip that the
gossiping in Mexico City likethat's next level, I miss these
girls.
I miss Mexico clearly.
Anyway I would learn all ofthese men's profile after the
(15:28):
fact.
And with time I did get a littlebit more discerning around okay,
I know I heard about this man.
I'm not gonna hook up with him,but I was definitely outside is
the point I'm making.
Like I was hooking up with menwho were whispering.
As mentioned, sweet.
Nothing's in my ear and I wasfalling for it partly, but then
there was a point in time whereI just didn't care anymore.
And that's where the whole phasereally came to life.
(15:50):
Like when you just don't give afuck anymore because of X, Y, Z.
Like I could point the fingerand say it was the heartbreak,
but the reality was, no, it wasme.
I was broken.
And I was using men as.
A way to fill that void, but itwasn't working.
And alcohol of course, played ahuge role in that.
(16:10):
However, there were just so manymoments where I woke up the next
morning, like in someone else'sbed, and I'm just like, uh, I
hate this.
I hate this feeling.
I don't wanna be here.
Whether the guy wants to pursuesomething with me or not this
doesn't feel good for me.
And at the time I was lying tomyself and you know, saying that
I felt empowered.
I was reclaiming my body, myconfidence, my freedom.
(16:32):
But looking back, it's soobvious that I was operating
from a place of lack.
Like I was drinking too much.
I was sleeping too little.
I was confusing that maleattention for self-esteem.
The irony is that in a culturewhere men are taught to
dominate, I thought playingtheir game would make me
powerful.
Instead, it made me disconnectedfrom my body, from my intuition,
(16:56):
from myself.
And when I finally admitted tomy therapist that I was going
home with strangers, strangemen, basically, blackout drunk,
she didn't shame me, And at thistime she kept asking me like
what my relationship withalcohol was.
That was like one reoccurringquestion.
But right before, like I wouldsay one of my rock bottoms, I've
(17:19):
had more than one.
It was after I had a a bender ofsorts, I'll call it.
It was definitely a bender.
It wasn't a bender of sorts.
It was a bender.
It was 20, like four plus hoursof me being awake, partying,
drinking.
I hooked up with someone and wejust kept going, like into the
(17:40):
next day.
And when I told her about that,like I, oh.
It kind of sucks actually.
I'm getting like a visceralfeeling in my body, like how I
felt after that day of nonstoppartying and like mixing drugs.
(18:00):
And like when I told her aboutthe next day, I was still wired.
Anyway, when I reported that tomy therapist, I remember in my
body just like how.
Disgusted I felt with myself andhow empty I felt.
I did not care.
If I lived or died, like I, Ijust did not care.
I felt so sick and ashamed ofmyself and I remember my
(18:22):
therapist just said to me like,you are not broken.
You're lonely.
And that's when somethingshifted, I think that's when I
realized that I wasn't beingliberated.
I was just completely lost.
the-sober-butterfly_8_11-13- (18:38):
so after that terrible experience,
I honestly didn't wanna be inMexico anymore.
Like I felt like it was time tocome home.
And I shortly thereafter, movedback to New York and then got
sober that summer and during myfirst year of sobriety.
My therapist suggested that Itake a break from dating not
(19:00):
forever, it was just a longenough to actually sit with
myself.
Because here's the thing guys,When you get sober, that is
layer one.
That's step one.
That is a big step, like notgonna minimize that huge,
amazing here are your flowers,but that's really where the work
begins.
And like most people don'trealize that myself included.
(19:21):
So phase one was like, okay, I'mnot gonna drink, but like then
who am I?
Who are you without your copingskills?
And trust me when I say alcoholwas my main coping mechanism or
tool that I would reach for.
And.
I did not love the idea of justsitting with myself sober.
(19:43):
The thought of being alone, likeactually really alone, terrified
me because if I wasn't chasingsomething or someone, then I had
to sit with my feelings, and theearly sobriety feelings were
pretty loud.
I did it, you know, I've talkedabout it on the show, and then I
(20:03):
entered what I would call likemy.
Conscious cleanse era.
So for the entire first year ofmy sobriety, my sober
anniversary date is July 5th,2021.
So that entire first year I waslike not dating, like I wasn't
even on the apps.
I wasn't going to dinner.
I wasn't late night textinganyone.
(20:24):
I really genuinely spent thattime in therapy.
I was journaling, I wastraveling, and really just
learning for the first time whatit means to like self-soothe,
not rely on outside things tohelp me process my internal
feelings.
And that was not an easyprocess.
There were definitely nightswhere I felt lonely.
(20:45):
But I did start to notice somepatterns and specifically how
often I used attention asvalidation or how I confuse
attraction with likecompatibility.
That first year of celibacyreally helped me break down the
addiction of the high.
Of being wanted.
(21:06):
And a lot of that stems fromdaddy issues you know, feeling
like I need to prove my worth orthat external validation for men
you know, textbook daddy issuesover here.
So after about a year of takingthat break I received clearance
from my therapist to startdating again, and I decided to
do that.
So I got back on the apps, I gotinto a relationship.
(21:29):
And so that broke the firstsober celibacy era I'll call it.
Fast forward to now, and I'mactually coming up to.
A year of celibacy again.
This time though, it was lessintentional.
This time it was less planned.
If I'm being honest, after mylast situation ended, I just did
(21:53):
not have the emotional bandwidthto date.
Like I needed a detox and mylast situationship ended
officially, I would sayofficially ended in like
February of this year, but Ihadn't actually seen him since
November of last year.
So November of 24 was the lasttime I saw him, but we dragged
(22:16):
it out until January, Februaryof this year.
So once that ended.
And I've talked about it on theshow.
Listen to my 2024 dating wrappedepisode, my favorite episode
from last year.
I've gotten some real hate fromthat episode from men.
By the way, who listened to thatepisode, who were featured on
that episode.
(22:37):
That's another story.
But he's not one of the men Ireceived tape for from, I should
say, he was the best sex I everhad.
So imagine having the best sexyou've ever had and like that
not working out.
So like that, just to reallygive you a clear picture, like
the best s sex and the last sexI ever had was with this guy.
And.
Yeah, so after that I justneeded a break.
(23:00):
I just needed a detox.
That coupled with my highfunctioning depression this
year, I was just like, whoa.
It's been a time, it's been ayear and this time it feels
different because it's not thatI'm avoiding connection.
I'm just not forcing it.
And I think that is a cleardistinction.
In therapy, I also learned thatI myself can be a bit avoidant.
(23:25):
I can be emotionally avoidant.
I like to choose people who areemotionally unavailable so that
I can blame'em.
But it's the flags are on thefield, like it's very clear,
these red flags, you can spotthem from a mile away, babe.
Like you're choosing these menwho are telling you straight up
that they are not looking foranything serious and you're
(23:48):
hearing challenge accepted.
I will be the exception to thisrule that you've clearly laid
out for me.
So that was something I wasdoing.
And then like chasing that, likeI like to chase too, like I like
that external validation frommen as mentioned.
I feel like I have to earn love.
I hope it's clear to you now.
Like all of these things arecoming together, right?
This is my situation in life.
So like I'm trying to breakthose patterns and this time,
(24:11):
this go now I have more sobertime under my belt.
I've learned a lot more thingsabout myself as mentioned as I
just shared with you.
And this time I'm, like I said,I'm not like avoiding
connection.
I'm just not forcing it.
There's a piece that comes withnot performing, or not
pretending or not participatingin the prove your worth,
(24:33):
Olympics, or campaigning as Ilike to call it, like
campaigning, vote for me, pickme like, no, that energy is ugh,
disgusting, first of all, butalso it's just not necessary.
I am content.
I think that's the keydifference, like that first go
in CE celibacy.
In that first year of sobriety,like everything was new, right?
(24:54):
Like I needed to completelyrelearn who I am without alcohol
or substances, right?
Like I, I was a baby basically.
And then I, you know, achieved alot of firsts since that first
year of getting sober.
And that first year of celibacy,like having sex sober once
(25:15):
again.
Hadn't done that before Thesewere all like big milestones for
me and now that I have thosemilestones under my belt, I feel
like I've built up a lot moretools in my like metaphorical,
sober toolbox, right?
To where I feel.
I can reach for things in mytime of need, and quite
(25:36):
literally in my sober toolboxlike it's a metaphorical
toolbox, but it can also be aphysical one.
And I've been wanting to puttogether a physical sober
toolbox.
So I'm gonna do that now thatI'm talking about it.
On the show.
So holding myself accountablehere, but what would I put in my
real, like tangible, sobertoolbox?
(25:57):
I would fucking put a vibrator.
Your girl will put a vibrator inthere, and I recommend that you
do that too, because my vibratorhas never failed to find my
clitoris.
You know what I mean?
It has a nine out of 10 successrate for making me, you know, so
I.
I literally have all of thesetools at my disposal, I'll call
them.
(26:17):
And yeah, so I feel like I'm socontent with myself, not just
like physically content withmyself, but also just like
content with my own company.
Like I've never been.
Someone who needed someone elseto do stuff with.
I've always been game to go eatat a restaurant by myself or go
to the movies by myself ortravel the world by myself.
It baffles me that people don'tdo things by themselves.
(26:40):
But I think the key differenceis like now I'm like, if I go
somewhere.
I'm not going with theexpectation of I'm gonna meet my
future husband here.
'cause I think that's a chopI've definitely fallen in.
I'm like the eternal optimist Istill believe in love like where
the hell is my husband?
Like seriously, it's ghetto outhere come.
(27:02):
But in the meantime, while I'mwaiting, I'm gonna have a good
time.
And if there's no one to have agood time with, that's cool.
And I have a lot morediscernment now around like how
I spend my time because I'm socool with my own.
Company, like maybe a little toogood with my own company, if I'm
being honest.
Like I don't know if it'shealthy.
There was a man in my apartmentyesterday.
(27:23):
We were watching a movietogether and it was literally a
Netflix and chill situation.
Like from my end there was likeno vibes there.
He was trying, but veryrespectfully, not trying too
hard, which I appreciate.
Like he didn't try and kiss my.
Lips, but he was like kissing myhands and stuff and holding my
hands, which is fine.
(27:44):
But while he was here I waslike, why is there a man here?
Like, why the hell is there aman here?
Like I think I'm more on some.
Friendship tip and like goingback to even like the guy in
Chicago that I saw a coupleweeks ago, that's why we're
calling him the guy in Chicago.
He and I like, we didn't havesex obviously.
I'm telling you, I'm stillcoming up to my one year of
(28:05):
celibacy, like next week.
I think it would be a year.
Officially, I have to lookthrough my albums to when I went
to Sonoma to see that guy lastyear.
But anyway I realized, I'm like.
Dude, this is so much growth forme'cause he's here and I feel
like it's not a question of doeshe like me?
(28:27):
He does to answer the question.
But it's more of a do I likehim?
I'm jumping, I'm sorry.
I went from the Chicago guy tothe guy here last night.
It, this applies to both men.
Okay.
The guy who I watch a moviewith, we watch Frankenstein
here.
He's someone who I've gone onsome dates with, but actually, I
thought he was like a little tooslow to the kiss.
(28:48):
Like we have not kissed, we'vegone on three or four dates,
mostly daytime situations.
So I'm like maybe theenvironment didn't call for it
or he didn't feel like it wasappropriate, but like last night
could have been his chance tomake a move.
But I'm actually really glad hedidn't because I don't know if I
like him.
That's the thing.
I don't know if I like him andthat is so much growth for me
because I am actuallyquestioning my feelings in this.
(29:10):
Like it's not about him.
It's about me.
Do I like him?
And I don't know, like he hasn'tdone anything yet for me to say
I don't like him.
And he's done some things thatI'm like, oh, I like that he
does that, but do I like him?
Questionable.
Same for Chicago guy.
Like Chicago guy.
I literally wrote a pros andcons list for him, and his pros
right now are outweighing hiscons, but.
(29:33):
I don't know if I like him.
And when I was debriefing withsome of my girlfriends, one
girlfriend, Kay in particularwas like, I'm so proud of you.
Well first she was like, I don'tthink you like him.
Multiple people have told methat.
And I'm like, well, it's noteven that I don't like him as
I'm like reporting like how theweekend went or like how my
correspondence has gone with himsince.
I'm like, it's not that I don'tlike him, it's just that like I
don't think he's done anythingyet to make me like him and.
(29:58):
I like that.
For me, I really like thatenergy for me, and she was like,
I'm so proud of you that youlike.
Don't seem to be pressed orphased.
I forgot the word she used, butthat was the essence of what she
was talking about.
She's you're so chill right now.
Who is she?
I'm like, yeah, she is fouryears sober.
That's who she is.
Like I, it's not that I don'tgive a fuck, but like I just
(30:19):
think there's so much pressurewe put on ourselves as women to
have it all figured out and it'slike a big part of it is not
really up to us.
Yes, I can do things.
On my end to try to attract adecent partner for myself, and
I'm doing those things.
I could be doing it better.
I could be putting myself outthere more, but I'm content.
(30:40):
I'm just content in life and I'mnot gonna let all of these
societal pressures around likebiological clocks and, feeling
like I have to have it allfigured out by my next birthday,
which is 35, which is like nowI'm literally going to be in my
mid thirties.
I'm already technically in mymid thirties at 34, but you
know, I can kind of skirt like,do you guys know when you do
(31:01):
this demographic thing?
Sidebar every now and then Ihave to fill in those like
demographic things.
If I'm signing up for somethingand it's like they appropriate
the different age groups and Iam still checking.
I know this 18 to 34 is like abig group, so now I'm afraid to
go to the next level, but I'mnot actually afraid because I
heard something yesterday that Iwill share with you, which is if
(31:22):
you're not aging, you're dying.
You're dead.
You know?
So like it is truly a gift to begetting older.
So like I have to remember thatI'm not afraid of aging.
I'm going to age with grace.
I'm doing that.
Quitting alcohol has helped.
Significantly with slowing downsome of the negative impact I
was putting on my body andeverything in my life at the
(31:44):
time.
So anyway back to this, I'm notafraid of aging.
I'm like, whatever, dude.
If I'm supposed to get marriedand have kids, then that will
happen.
Okay.
But me stressing over here.
It's not gonna help thesituation.
Me settling for someone simplybecause I am scared of being
alone or I'm lonely, is nothelping anyone because let me
(32:06):
tell you guys, I have never feltmore alone than when I've been
in some relationships, okay?
I've never felt more.
Disconnected for myself, thembeing in a relationship with
someone that I had no businessbeing with.
So reminding myself of that andalso.
Gratitude, like taking inventoryof all of the things that I have
(32:28):
or things that I've prayed forand like really sitting in this
present moment and beinggrateful for that and expressing
that.
Like literally giving the praiseand giving the glory to God or
what?
This is obviously taking manytests and turns here I am
preaching now, but just thinkingabout like where you are in life
and like thinking about how muchworse it could be.
Also just thinking about howmuch God has protected me from
(32:50):
men that I thought I desperatelywanted to be with, that I prayed
for.
I prayed for all my knees.
God, please gimme this man.
I'm so grateful.
He was like, no girl, no,Nadine, sit down, go to bed.
You don't need this, man.
I'm so thankful for that.
So what do I look like settlingat 34?
That's the reframe.
(33:10):
I'm like, why would I settle fora man?
What?
If you're not adding orcontributing value to my life,
and I don't care how that soundslike I, I mean that in so many
different aspects.
But if you're not adding value,then I don't have time for you.
Like I'm enjoying myself.
Please don't disrupt my peacelike I am quite content until my
(33:32):
husband shows up.
So yeah, I'm just feeling reallygood about waking up, calm and
not checking my phone firstthing in the morning, and my
nervous system not being in thislike fight or flirt mode 24 7.
It is blissfully quiet overhere.
(33:53):
And yeah, I have my toolbox, soI'm good.
I'm good until someone shows mewhy it would be good.
And I think that's another piecethat I learned.
My therapist recites this aswell, so we'll not take credit
for this, but she says to kindof neatly wrap the whole phase
to like the celibacy phase oflife, like with a bow.
She says, when women open theirlegs, they open their heart.
(34:19):
When women open their legs, theyopen their heart.
Now.
Is that sexist?
Probably.
Do I agree with her?
Yes.
Uh, for myself personally, I'verealized from lived experience
when I over my legs, all of asudden I develop feelings for
these men.
Now, some people can have.
(34:39):
Completely emotionless sex.
And I think I've done that too,but it's also not like as good
because I'm not like excited bythe person.
Like for me, a big part ofgetting my freak on or getting
like super wet is when I'm likeactually attracted to someone,
whether that be physically,emotionally.
Intellectually, spiritually,like all four, like all of those
(34:59):
things, makes it even better.
So like the more I like someone,usually the better, better the
sex is.
And like I just haven't beenexcited by anyone.
So it's like, why would I startto spiral over a man that I'm
not even excited by?
So yeah, I'm gonna be celibatefor I guess an indefinite period
of time.
And that's okay.
the-sober-butterfly_2_11- (35:20):
Okay, winding down this episode of the
Soap Butterfly.
I wanna talk about the benefitsof celibacy in sobriety.
A very quick breakdown, just incase you're not convinced, I
mean, I'm not actually trying toconvince you.
Do what you want, girl.
I recommended earlier that youshould have a hoe phase.
Remember that.
So definitely not out herepreaching that we should be
(35:42):
celibate.
I just wanna share the benefitsthat I've experienced in case
there are any lingeringquestions.
So before I get into the deepstuff, I'll start with the most
obvious.
I have so much more time.
Time being the greatest currencyin life.
(36:03):
I didn't realize actually howmuch of my mental and emotional
energy was being spent on menmen who were just like
undeserving of that energy, If Iwasn't like with him in person,
I was thinking about him.
I mean, limerence is real.
I've talked about limerence.
That's actually what promptedthe first period of celibacy
(36:27):
anyway.
I was always thinking about aman, And when you stop, you
know, texting, analyzing,scrutinizing, every word you've
ever said and overthinking that,waiting, hoping, plotting your
life just opens up tenfold.
You can reclaim so much time, somany hours, days.
(36:49):
Years of your life, you'rereclaiming that time.
And it's more than that.
When I became celibate insobriety, I learned how to be in
a relationship with myself.
Okay.
And it's not like the cornyself-love era way people talk
about online.
Really being in a relationshipwith myself, learning my
(37:12):
patterns, confronting myloneliness, understanding what
my body and spirit actuallyneed, and not just what my ego
was craving or calling.
When you remove sex from theequation and sometimes even
dating, you start to seeyourself and other people so
(37:35):
much more clearly.
Without all of the distractions.
'cause that's what they can beat times, like the talking phase
or the late night dopamine hits.
You can't really hide behind thefantasy.
And then you can start to seemaybe like your triggers or your
desires or your avoidanttendencies.
(37:56):
You see the truth and insobriety that kind of like
clarity is gold because whenyou've spent years numbing,
whether that be alcohol or withattention, even.
Being clear and grounded feelslike very revolutionary.
So the first benefit I would sayis clarity.
The second thing I noticed wasconfidence and not the sexy
(38:20):
confidence I used to chase fromthat external validation I've
talked about, but a more quiet,more grounded content kind.
The kind that.
Says, you know, I don't need tobe chosen to be valuable or feel
valuable.
And when I stopped performingfemininity for male attention or
(38:42):
male approval, I started to dothings just for the sake of
doing them for me.
I know groundbreaking.
A great example of that would belike my fashion choices, like I
think I'm actually way morefashionable.
Now that I've decent men in mylife I wear what makes me feel
good and I love when like myfemale students especially
(39:04):
compliment my outfits.
I'm like, oh my God, a teenagerthinks I look good.
That is like the highest form ofapproval, the highest form of
compliment in my opinion.
Anyway my confidence has evenshown up in like other aspects
of my life, even with.
Work.
And like my creativity, likethinking through this podcast,
(39:27):
sharing what I want to, becauseI want to create things that
feel aligned, not because I'mtrying to impress someone, not
working from a place of fear.
Oh my God, I can't talk aboutthis man, because there's a
chance he can hear about it.
I could give a fuck if a manhears about it.
Like in fact, I want you to hearabout it.
Like you should get to know theroomie.
So that kind of confidencereally like radiates
(39:49):
differently.
And I think like taking a break,a detox for men is a great way
to find that piece, especiallyif you're more performative like
me.
And like I've shared, I've beenin the past.
Next step.
I have energy.
And by the way, these are not inany particular order.
Like all of these are keylearnings or key discoveries I
(40:11):
should say, i'm like, oh my God,are just so relevant and so real
energy.
Sexual energy is creativeenergy.
It's a life force energy.
And when you stop giving it awayto people who don't pour back
into you.
You are naturally channelingthat energy elsewhere.
(40:32):
And for me, that energy has goneinto creative projects like the
Sober Butterfly.
I have more stamina to create,to plan, to travel, to dream.
And I think the celibacyhonestly has just made me more
focused.
Back to the clarity piece andnot obsessing over men who are
(40:52):
not my man.
And like all of the things areconnected, right?
The confidence to not feel likeI have to prove my worth.
Like everything is connected, soyeah, that energy that I'm now
conserving or redistributing toother parts of my life feels
powerful and it is a truebenefit Because it's giving me
(41:17):
the momentum to examine otheraspects of my life or other
areas of my life that I'veavoided or haven't given as much
care and attention to, which hashelped me actually bringing me
to my next benefit.
Healing.
It's helped me heal It's reallyhelped with healing because
celibacy in sobriety has createda space for me to actually feel.
(41:38):
When I used to numb and Irealized how often I was using
sex as a coping mechanism aswell to distract, to
self-soothe, to escape, likethose are the three common
themes I used alcohol for aswell.
So when that option was gone, Ihad no choice but to sit with my
emotions to cry, to reflect, tothink things out in therapy
(42:00):
instead of in bed with someonewho couldn't handle me sober.
So like those hoe phases I usedto have when I was drinking.
I have no doubt could havefollowed me into my sobriety,
which is why I'm so gratefulthat I used my first year of
sobriety to also detox menbecause addiction replacement is
(42:20):
real, guys and once I learnedhow to have sex sober and how
amazing it actually feels toorgasm and just the intensity of
that shared energy when you arenot under the influence of a
substance like that, oh, likesober sex.
If somebody had just told me howamazing sex would feel sober
(42:42):
once you actually like.
Like the person and like youhave that deep connection.
If somebody had warned me ortold me about that, I probably
would've, you know, gotten sobersooner.
I feel like we should probably,as sober people, like we should
use that as our way to attractnew members into our community.
(43:02):
Join us because the sex is liketruly mind boggling.
And I think had I discoveredthat.
Too soon in my recovery journeyand my sober time, I don't know,
maybe I would've used that asaddiction.
Potentially, that could havebecome an unhealthy coping
(43:24):
skill.
I know that in aa, in liketraditional recovery spaces,
they don't recommend dating orhaving, I guess, sex as well for
your first year, but more sobecause if it goes.
Badly then that could obviouslyexponentially increase your risk
of relapse.
So like I get that piece, butI'm also wondering now if
they're like, oh no, if theydiscover how good sex is in
(43:46):
sobriety, like they might becomeaddicted to it and then we're
gonna have too many members inour like sex AA group.
Okay.
How did we get here?
Healing.
Yeah, And I would say the last,like I.
Benefit, and this is not anexhaustive list, so not the last
benefit of celibacy in sobriety,but more so like the biggest
(44:09):
impact would be, I would say,like the connection piece, like
the spiritual side of it.
Celibacy has this way ofconnecting you with your
intuition, and then when you'renot entangled with someone
else's energy you begin to startto hear your own voice again.
You make decisions faster, youtrust yourself more.
You start to realize that likethat piece that you've been
(44:31):
searching for in other people isactually inside of you.
It's been there the hoe time,and I truly believe that being
celibate in sobriety hassharpened my intuition.
It's made me more discerning,not just in love, but in life,
who I let near me, like thatenergy I allow myself to consume
and where I'm placing my energy.
(44:53):
All of that is in connection to,yes, sobriety, but beyond that,
like celibacy, truly like takingtime to get to know myself, and
that's ultimately what it is.
I think for me, like thecelibacy is like using that
timeframe to get to know mebetter.
I am not.
(45:13):
Going to join a convent.
I'm not gonna be celibate forthe rest of my life.
Like I wanna be clear, I'm notwaiting before marriage.
Like I'm not that girl.
So like in case I wasn't clear,in case I wasn't clear, like I'm
not waiting to get marriedbecause like I said, in these
conditions, in these times thatwe live in 2025 in the city that
(45:35):
I live.
I think this is actually for thegirlies everywhere.
It's hard.
You think I'm gonna wait until Iget married to have sex again.,
If anything, I'm like salivatingat the mouth of romanticizing
sober sex in my mind.
I'm like, wait, why am Isalivate?
Why am I salivate?
Just going back to how amazingsex feels.
Sober, but okay.
(45:56):
I lost.
I am still celibate.
I'm gonna at least make it to myone year, dammit.
Which is like next week.
And like I said, there's just noone I'm excited about enough
right now to be like spiralingover, because inevitably that's
probably what's gonna happen ifI hook up with them and it
doesn't work out.
No, that's bleak.
That's bleak.
I'm not that girl.
I'm an eternal optimist.
(46:16):
Remember like I actually believethat it's all gonna work out and
I'm gonna.
Lay with an amazing person next,and it'll be because it's a
connection that we've built andI feel like they see me and
value me and want me and loveme.
Okay.
(46:37):
I'm ending the show.
I'm ending the show.
Yeah.
Guys, thank you so much forlistening to today's episode of
the Sopa Butterfly Podcast.
You thought you were coming justto hear about celibacy and
sobriety and you got a hoelesson on the hoe phase.
So you're welcome.
the-sober-butterfly_22_11-07 (46:57):
if you have fun today, please rate
and review the Soap of Butterflyon Spotify or Apple.
It helps more people find theshow and yeah.
Until next Friday, stay cozy.
Stay grounded.
And remember, you don't need to,you don't need a drink to feel
like you don't need a drink thismonth or any month.
(47:18):
You just need good snacks, goodlighting, and good boundaries.
See you guys next week.
Bye.
so the other day I was catching up
with a friend and somehow my sexlist came up.
You know the list we're alladults here.
Anyway, I shared my list withhim.
Wait, I thought there'd be more,he was like, oh, that's not too
bad.
I thought there'd be more, firstof all, that's not a compliment,
(00:21):
that's an insult.
But honestly, I can't even bemad because before sobriety,
like Nadine pre sobriety, shewas outside.
She was outside.
We've talked about it on theshow.
But in sobriety, things havechanged quite a lot, which
brings me to today's topic,celibacy in sobriety, why I
(00:43):
chose it, what I've learned fromit, and honestly how it's helped
me heal, and ways that I did notexpect.
the-sober-butterfly_4_11- (00:52):
Let's get into it.
Welcome to the Sober ButterflyPodcast.
I am Nadine, your host, andtoday as mentioned, I'm going to
be talking all about celibacy insobriety.
the-sober-butterfly_5_11-13 (01:05):
All right, let's open the episode.
Talking about sex Beforesobriety,, I would like to set
the scene and offer somecontext.
My life my sex life.
I'll say before sobriety waschaotic, just like everything
else actually in my life.
At that time, there wereeuphoric highs and.
Bottomless lows, and I haveshared this before, but I'll say
(01:29):
it again I seriously cannotthink of a single time where I
hooked up with someone for thefirst time without being under
the influence of something.
And I've shared specifically inthe episode with Tawny, the
silver sex expert.
I'll plug it in the show notesfor you guys in case you missed
(01:50):
it.
But we openly discussed thisidea of like how, if you have
any sexual trauma or if you haveany sexual insecurities, which a
lot of us do have.
And then specifically her and Ishare this common thread of body
dysmorphia and not necessarilyfeeling very confident in our
bodies and those insecuritiesvery much.
(02:12):
Show up in our intimaterelationships.
And so alcohol for me acted likea social lubricant of sorts to
where I could really have moreof an outof body experience and
show up in the bedroom bolderand braver in ways that I just
normally could not, and like tobe honest with you guys, let's
really go there.
(02:33):
Like I would use alcohol as away to get my freak on, not like
a freak off, not like Diddystyle, but get my freak on.
'cause I felt very likeself-conscious about, for
example, like my number, likethat sexist that I have that
running record in my phone.
I've had that for years andevery time I had to add like a
new body to that list, I wouldfeel very self-conscious about
(02:54):
it.
So alcohol, I felt, gave mepermission to lower my
inhibitions, lower my threshold,and just say, fuck it.
Because I wanted to fuck thatperson, but like I needed or
felt like I needed an excuse togo there.
So alcohol really served me inthat capacity until it no longer
served me in that capacity untilI realized that.
(03:16):
I was actually cravingconnection, but just settling
for sex.
I wanted the steak.
And I was like, literally,accepting baby shrimps.
I thought that the physicalintimacy would feel the
emotional emptiness that I felt.
For a long time, but of courseit never did.
Like that physical connectioncannot supplement an emotional
(03:40):
void.
In fact, I would say it deepensit, it worsens it.
And the wild thing is when Ilook back, I can see how often
I.
Conflated the chaos forchemistry.
Like I thought the more dramaticsomething was, the more
passionate the more real it was.
(04:00):
And I still kind of strugglewith that if I'm being honest
with you guys to this day.
Love bombing is my love languageto a certain extent.
Like I am part of the problem.
So yeah, confusing intensity forintimacy was a common narrative
or theme in my life at thattime.
And.
Something that I consistentlyhave to check in with myself
(04:21):
about because I know this aboutmyself and it's something that
even though I'm now sober, I'mstill not like immune to that.
So yeah, it's an ongoingprocess.
the-sober-butterfly_6_11- (04:33):
Let's talk about the HO phase, because
we've all had one., Maybe morethan one in our lives.
And if you haven't had a wholephase, what are you doing?
What are you doing?
Like you should totally have awhole phase in your life.
I like to think of the hoves aslike a reclaiming of self, like
a homecoming.
You realizing that you don'thave to adhere to whatever
(04:55):
societal pressures or conform tothe norms of what a woman should
be the virtuous, pious.
Virgin or whatever, I grew up inthe church, so very clear
archetypes in terms of what awoman should and should not be,
what a lady should and shouldnot be, I should say.
(05:16):
And for a long time I subscribedto those beliefs.
And then there was a point intime where I no longer could
quell the fact that I was a verysexual being.
We're mammals of the end of theday.
Okay.
Lemme talk about the criterionfor having a ho phase because
there usually are like commontraits or like catalysts that
spark this ho phase.
(05:37):
I'm like a socialanthropologist.
Like I can think of definingtimes where my friends have also
had ho phases and usually whatpredates a whole phase is like a
major heartbreak.
Like you are just heartbrokenand that could be because you
just got out of a relationshipor you could just be sick of it.
Like you could just be so sickof men because they were just so
(05:59):
disappointing.
That's another predecessor, orlike precursor, I should say, to
the whole phase where it's likeyou are just so over these men.
So anyway, two very distinct hophases and both situations
included me being heartbrokenover a man.
And another common ground hereis like neither of those men
(06:22):
that I'm referencing or thinkingof were my man.
They weren't actually myboyfriend, which is actually one
of the most heinous.
Humiliating genre of heartbreak.
I was just always boy crazy andsad about.
Some flavor of the month andthen I get over it and the best
way I would get over it was toget under someone else.
Like I would actually recitethat with my friends.
(06:44):
Another one bites the dust.
Let's go to the bars.
We'll find another player.
Like it's fine.
I realized, upon graduation,that I had never actually had a
boyfriend, like a real boyfriendin college.
So all four and a half years ofme being a student at FAMU I
never really had a serioussteady boyfriend.
Now was that by choice or bydesign?
(07:07):
It's hard to say, the ratio.
Between men and women, like itwas predominantly female campus.
I forgot the statistics,, butlet's say it was like 60 40 or
65, 35.
Like it was pretty noticeable interms of the gap between the men
and women.
So like that first of all, madeit extremely advantageous for
the men.
(07:27):
And then also I was a partygirl.
There were very specificarchetypes of people in college
and I was easily classified as aparty girl.
But here's the thing, there'salso different types of party
girls.
Like I was the party girl thatwould pass out.
Like even though I was outside,I wouldn't be able to Continue
to go to all the after moves andthen be ready to hook up with
(07:48):
anyone.
Like I was mostly like passedout on a couch, like there are
many photos of me passed out oncouches and like my friends
hanging out still and meliterally blackout.
So like I wasn't the girlhooking up.
There are girls who like, partyand then they're like DTF.
In college, I wasn't like theDTFI wasn't down to fuck.
I was like down to pass out,pass the fuck out.
(08:09):
That's what I would do.
So I didn't have a label ofbeing quote like a ho, but I
definitely had like my sneakylinks.
I had my people that like Icould call if I wanted to.
But yeah, it was a very specialtime.
So it it wasn't catastrophic.
Like my whole phase in collegewas just like a culmination of
just different people, randomhookups here and there.
(08:31):
Spring break always I thinkevery spring break I hooked up
with someone.
College, Jesus.
Just like thinking about howgross that is.
Anyway, so like that was collegeand then the other phase I had
was 2021 yeah, that oneobviously more recent, but a lot
(08:54):
more dark.
Like it wasn't a fun ho phase,like college was like fun and
flirty and freeing.
2021 COVID ho phase was sad.
Like I'll be honest, I washeartbroken over a man, who
wasn't my boyfriend.
And he said to me, let's just befriends.
(09:16):
And I heard, oh, you hate me andyou wanna ruin my life.
So I did what any emotionallyunregulated girl would do.
With a drinking problem and Iturned to my ride or die, which
was alcohol.
And while the world was inlockdown, I was a fuera, which
(09:40):
is Spanish for outside.
I was going out all the freakingtime, so in the start of 2021, I
had been in Mexico City for sixmonths or so.
So I already had an establishedfriend group at that time and
like I was going out.
All the time meeting randomguys, usually friends of
friends.
And like the scene in MexicoCity is just so crazy.
the-sober-butterfly_7_11-13- (10:01):
If you've ever spent time in Latin
America you know that machismoenergy I'm talking about, like
it's very real.
It's everywhere.
It's in dating, it's innightlife.
Even casual conversations.
And if you don't know whatmachismo energy is, it's like
this hyper masculine culturewhere men are encouraged to
(10:22):
chase and women are expected tobe, I guess, flattered by that.
Personally, I will be honest andshare the privilege that I
received as an outsider in thisenvironment.
Was the benefit of like neverhaving to pay for anything like
that is a foreign concept I feellike, to American men,
(10:44):
especially in 2025, and maybeit's regional depending on where
you live.
In other parts of the countrywhere I've spent some time
Florida, Georgia, like theSouth, men are more inclined to
want to just cover the bill.
But up north I find that a lotof men, even if they got it,
like even if they have it, it'snot customary for them to pay a
(11:07):
bill.
For every single person atbrunch, for example, or at
dinner or at the club, that isthe norm there.
I never paid for anything,imagine you pull up and you're
seated with 20 people andthere's hookahs and everyone's
eating and drinking and likeshots of mezcal literally
limitless items.
Just like racking up.
And the bill is just taken careof, the men would get together
(11:30):
and split the bell for everyone.
And it was like amazing.
I'm not gonna lie, I loved thatpart.
But obviously that comes withconditions.
There was no such thing as afree.
Hookah.
They would cover the bill andlike I didn't have to hook up
with anyone.
That wasn't the expectation.
I wanna be clear about that.
But now I'm fucked up.
Now I've been drinking, youknow, 15 shots of mezcal maybe
(11:54):
that's an exaggeration.
Maybe that's not, and I am,obliterated.
I'm not in my.
Right state of mind.
Of course.
And this guy is, whisperingsweet things in my ear, and I
think he's cute and he has alike accent.
And now we're going to theafters.
That's another thing aboutMexico City.
There is always an after move.
(12:15):
The after parties were so muchfun, if this sounds like I'm
romanticizing my drinking, I'mnot but I did have good times.
I won't lie, like I wouldn'thave been outside for so long if
I was miserable the entire time.
So there were definitely goodmoments.
The ones I can recall.
And at the time as someone whowas heartbroken over a man who
wasn't even my man, which by theway, That rejection really
(12:37):
fucked up my psyche in manyways.
And I realize now it was allego.
That whole situation was ego.
Like it was not love.
Like I thought I was lovesick.
No, my ego was fractured becauseit was already really frail and
it didn't take much to break itwhen it was basically in
shambles to begin with.
And it's because I just.
(12:59):
Attached so much of my worth tomy physical appearance at the
time, and like I just couldn'tunderstand why a man wouldn't
want to date me, and so I actedout in a way that I thought was
a small win.
And I felt like I was seekingvalidation in some kind of way.
And that machisma culture that Iwas in made that really easy for
(13:19):
me.
Like everywhere I went, I wascatcalled, I was offered drinks,
I was told I was beautiful.
And also imagine like I'm ablack girl, like I think there
are more black people in MexicoCity.
But there was a time I'm a lisgirly, so like I probably have
this list somewhere in my notesapp, but I would keep like a
running tally of every blackperson that I saw in Mexico
City.
Over the course of me livingthere for a year, I really
(13:42):
should go look to see if I stillhave that.
But it wasn't a lot.
It was definitely under 50.
And I've heard since, you know,COVID, there are a lot more
black people that live in MexicoCity and I love that because.
Mexico City, hands down easily.
My favorite city in the world,like I would live there again in
a heartbeat, but something I didmiss was like more diversity in
terms of like black people ifI'm being real.
(14:03):
So anyway, as a black girl, Idefinitely stood out and like I
felt like a lot of the men, oh,one thing, fucking Mexican men
do very well.
Like maybe this is more justlike speaking to that machismo
culture.
Sweet.
Nothings, oh my God, these men,the most poetic in the world.
(14:23):
If I go to my WhatsApp, I'llprobably find like messages of
like men professing theirdeepest, most profound love.
Like you would think that wewere star cross lovers, like we
knew each other.
Many past lives like it wasgiving that level of you are my
person.
And that for someone who is justso broken, was music to my ears?
That's what I needed to hear.
And you know, the first timethat happens to you and you know
(14:46):
you fall for it, shame on you.
The second, third, five, 10,15th time that happens.
Girl, it's on you now.
Like that surface level teryfrom a man who you know is not
emotionally available or maybeeven.
Available period, because a lotof men in Mexico City that I met
(15:07):
at that time were living doublelives.
Okay.
Definitely had a wife and kidsat home, like that type of deal.
I did not know that when theywere courting me, of course.
But I would come to find outbecause the gossip that the
gossiping in Mexico City likethat's next level, I miss these
girls.
I miss Mexico clearly.
Anyway I would learn all ofthese men's profile after the
(15:28):
fact.
And with time I did get a littlebit more discerning around okay,
I know I heard about this man.
I'm not gonna hook up with him,but I was definitely outside is
the point I'm making.
Like I was hooking up with menwho were whispering.
As mentioned, sweet.
Nothing's in my ear and I wasfalling for it partly, but then
there was a point in time whereI just didn't care anymore.
And that's where the whole phasereally came to life.
(15:50):
Like when you just don't give afuck anymore because of X, Y, Z.
Like I could point the fingerand say it was the heartbreak,
but the reality was, no, it wasme.
I was broken.
And I was using men as.
A way to fill that void, but itwasn't working.
And alcohol of course, played ahuge role in that.
(16:10):
However, there were just so manymoments where I woke up the next
morning, like in someone else'sbed, and I'm just like, uh, I
hate this.
I hate this feeling.
I don't wanna be here.
Whether the guy wants to pursuesomething with me or not this
doesn't feel good for me.
And at the time I was lying tomyself and you know, saying that
I felt empowered.
I was reclaiming my body, myconfidence, my freedom.
(16:32):
But looking back, it's soobvious that I was operating
from a place of lack.
Like I was drinking too much.
I was sleeping too little.
I was confusing that maleattention for self-esteem.
The irony is that in a culturewhere men are taught to
dominate, I thought playingtheir game would make me
powerful.
Instead, it made me disconnectedfrom my body, from my intuition,
(16:56):
from myself.
And when I finally admitted tomy therapist that I was going
home with strangers, strangemen, basically, blackout drunk,
she didn't shame me, And at thistime she kept asking me like
what my relationship withalcohol was.
That was like one reoccurringquestion.
But right before, like I wouldsay one of my rock bottoms, I've
(17:19):
had more than one.
It was after I had a a bender ofsorts, I'll call it.
It was definitely a bender.
It wasn't a bender of sorts.
It was a bender.
It was 20, like four plus hoursof me being awake, partying,
drinking.
I hooked up with someone and wejust kept going, like into the
(17:40):
next day.
And when I told her about that,like I, oh.
It kind of sucks actually.
I'm getting like a visceralfeeling in my body, like how I
felt after that day of nonstoppartying and like mixing drugs.
(18:00):
And like when I told her aboutthe next day, I was still wired.
Anyway, when I reported that tomy therapist, I remember in my
body just like how.
Disgusted I felt with myself andhow empty I felt.
I did not care.
If I lived or died, like I, Ijust did not care.
I felt so sick and ashamed ofmyself and I remember my
(18:22):
therapist just said to me like,you are not broken.
You're lonely.
And that's when somethingshifted, I think that's when I
realized that I wasn't beingliberated.
I was just completely lost.
the-sober-butterfly_8_11-13- (18:38):
so after that terrible experience,
I honestly didn't wanna be inMexico anymore.
Like I felt like it was time tocome home.
And I shortly thereafter, movedback to New York and then got
sober that summer and during myfirst year of sobriety.
My therapist suggested that Itake a break from dating not
(19:00):
forever, it was just a longenough to actually sit with
myself.
Because here's the thing guys,When you get sober, that is
layer one.
That's step one.
That is a big step, like notgonna minimize that huge,
amazing here are your flowers,but that's really where the work
begins.
And like most people don'trealize that myself included.
(19:21):
So phase one was like, okay, I'mnot gonna drink, but like then
who am I?
Who are you without your copingskills?
And trust me when I say alcoholwas my main coping mechanism or
tool that I would reach for.
And.
I did not love the idea of justsitting with myself sober.
(19:43):
The thought of being alone, likeactually really alone, terrified
me because if I wasn't chasingsomething or someone, then I had
to sit with my feelings, and theearly sobriety feelings were
pretty loud.
I did it, you know, I've talkedabout it on the show, and then I
(20:03):
entered what I would call likemy.
Conscious cleanse era.
So for the entire first year ofmy sobriety, my sober
anniversary date is July 5th,2021.
So that entire first year I waslike not dating, like I wasn't
even on the apps.
I wasn't going to dinner.
I wasn't late night textinganyone.
(20:24):
I really genuinely spent thattime in therapy.
I was journaling, I wastraveling, and really just
learning for the first time whatit means to like self-soothe,
not rely on outside things tohelp me process my internal
feelings.
And that was not an easyprocess.
There were definitely nightswhere I felt lonely.
(20:45):
But I did start to notice somepatterns and specifically how
often I used attention asvalidation or how I confuse
attraction with likecompatibility.
That first year of celibacyreally helped me break down the
addiction of the high.
Of being wanted.
(21:06):
And a lot of that stems fromdaddy issues you know, feeling
like I need to prove my worth orthat external validation for men
you know, textbook daddy issuesover here.
So after about a year of takingthat break I received clearance
from my therapist to startdating again, and I decided to
do that.
So I got back on the apps, I gotinto a relationship.
(21:29):
And so that broke the firstsober celibacy era I'll call it.
Fast forward to now, and I'mactually coming up to.
A year of celibacy again.
This time though, it was lessintentional.
This time it was less planned.
If I'm being honest, after mylast situation ended, I just did
(21:53):
not have the emotional bandwidthto date.
Like I needed a detox and mylast situationship ended
officially, I would sayofficially ended in like
February of this year, but Ihadn't actually seen him since
November of last year.
So November of 24 was the lasttime I saw him, but we dragged
(22:16):
it out until January, Februaryof this year.
So once that ended.
And I've talked about it on theshow.
Listen to my 2024 dating wrappedepisode, my favorite episode
from last year.
I've gotten some real hate fromthat episode from men.
By the way, who listened to thatepisode, who were featured on
that episode.
(22:37):
That's another story.
But he's not one of the men Ireceived tape for from, I should
say, he was the best sex I everhad.
So imagine having the best sexyou've ever had and like that
not working out.
So like that, just to reallygive you a clear picture, like
the best s sex and the last sexI ever had was with this guy.
And.
Yeah, so after that I justneeded a break.
(23:00):
I just needed a detox.
That coupled with my highfunctioning depression this
year, I was just like, whoa.
It's been a time, it's been ayear and this time it feels
different because it's not thatI'm avoiding connection.
I'm just not forcing it.
And I think that is a cleardistinction.
In therapy, I also learned thatI myself can be a bit avoidant.
(23:25):
I can be emotionally avoidant.
I like to choose people who areemotionally unavailable so that
I can blame'em.
But it's the flags are on thefield, like it's very clear,
these red flags, you can spotthem from a mile away, babe.
Like you're choosing these menwho are telling you straight up
that they are not looking foranything serious and you're
(23:48):
hearing challenge accepted.
I will be the exception to thisrule that you've clearly laid
out for me.
So that was something I wasdoing.
And then like chasing that, likeI like to chase too, like I like
that external validation frommen as mentioned.
I feel like I have to earn love.
I hope it's clear to you now.
Like all of these things arecoming together, right?
This is my situation in life.
So like I'm trying to breakthose patterns and this time,
(24:11):
this go now I have more sobertime under my belt.
I've learned a lot more thingsabout myself as mentioned as I
just shared with you.
And this time I'm, like I said,I'm not like avoiding
connection.
I'm just not forcing it.
There's a piece that comes withnot performing, or not
pretending or not participatingin the prove your worth,
(24:33):
Olympics, or campaigning as Ilike to call it, like
campaigning, vote for me, pickme like, no, that energy is ugh,
disgusting, first of all, butalso it's just not necessary.
I am content.
I think that's the keydifference, like that first go
in CE celibacy.
In that first year of sobriety,like everything was new, right?
(24:54):
Like I needed to completelyrelearn who I am without alcohol
or substances, right?
Like I, I was a baby basically.
And then I, you know, achieved alot of firsts since that first
year of getting sober.
And that first year of celibacy,like having sex sober once
(25:15):
again.
Hadn't done that before Thesewere all like big milestones for
me and now that I have thosemilestones under my belt, I feel
like I've built up a lot moretools in my like metaphorical,
sober toolbox, right?
To where I feel.
I can reach for things in mytime of need, and quite
(25:36):
literally in my sober toolboxlike it's a metaphorical
toolbox, but it can also be aphysical one.
And I've been wanting to puttogether a physical sober
toolbox.
So I'm gonna do that now thatI'm talking about it.
On the show.
So holding myself accountablehere, but what would I put in my
real, like tangible, sobertoolbox?
(25:57):
I would fucking put a vibrator.
Your girl will put a vibrator inthere, and I recommend that you
do that too, because my vibratorhas never failed to find my
clitoris.
You know what I mean?
It has a nine out of 10 successrate for making me, you know, so
I.
I literally have all of thesetools at my disposal, I'll call
them.
(26:17):
And yeah, so I feel like I'm socontent with myself, not just
like physically content withmyself, but also just like
content with my own company.
Like I've never been.
Someone who needed someone elseto do stuff with.
I've always been game to go eatat a restaurant by myself or go
to the movies by myself ortravel the world by myself.
It baffles me that people don'tdo things by themselves.
(26:40):
But I think the key differenceis like now I'm like, if I go
somewhere.
I'm not going with theexpectation of I'm gonna meet my
future husband here.
'cause I think that's a chopI've definitely fallen in.
I'm like the eternal optimist Istill believe in love like where
the hell is my husband?
Like seriously, it's ghetto outhere come.
(27:02):
But in the meantime, while I'mwaiting, I'm gonna have a good
time.
And if there's no one to have agood time with, that's cool.
And I have a lot morediscernment now around like how
I spend my time because I'm socool with my own.
Company, like maybe a little toogood with my own company, if I'm
being honest.
Like I don't know if it'shealthy.
There was a man in my apartmentyesterday.
(27:23):
We were watching a movietogether and it was literally a
Netflix and chill situation.
Like from my end there was likeno vibes there.
He was trying, but veryrespectfully, not trying too
hard, which I appreciate.
Like he didn't try and kiss my.
Lips, but he was like kissing myhands and stuff and holding my
hands, which is fine.
(27:44):
But while he was here I waslike, why is there a man here?
Like, why the hell is there aman here?
Like I think I'm more on some.
Friendship tip and like goingback to even like the guy in
Chicago that I saw a coupleweeks ago, that's why we're
calling him the guy in Chicago.
He and I like, we didn't havesex obviously.
I'm telling you, I'm stillcoming up to my one year of
(28:05):
celibacy, like next week.
I think it would be a year.
Officially, I have to lookthrough my albums to when I went
to Sonoma to see that guy lastyear.
But anyway I realized, I'm like.
Dude, this is so much growth forme'cause he's here and I feel
like it's not a question of doeshe like me?
(28:27):
He does to answer the question.
But it's more of a do I likehim?
I'm jumping, I'm sorry.
I went from the Chicago guy tothe guy here last night.
It, this applies to both men.
Okay.
The guy who I watch a moviewith, we watch Frankenstein
here.
He's someone who I've gone onsome dates with, but actually, I
thought he was like a little tooslow to the kiss.
(28:48):
Like we have not kissed, we'vegone on three or four dates,
mostly daytime situations.
So I'm like maybe theenvironment didn't call for it
or he didn't feel like it wasappropriate, but like last night
could have been his chance tomake a move.
But I'm actually really glad hedidn't because I don't know if I
like him.
That's the thing.
I don't know if I like him andthat is so much growth for me
because I am actuallyquestioning my feelings in this.
(29:10):
Like it's not about him.
It's about me.
Do I like him?
And I don't know, like he hasn'tdone anything yet for me to say
I don't like him.
And he's done some things thatI'm like, oh, I like that he
does that, but do I like him?
Questionable.
Same for Chicago guy.
Like Chicago guy.
I literally wrote a pros andcons list for him, and his pros
right now are outweighing hiscons, but.
(29:33):
I don't know if I like him.
And when I was debriefing withsome of my girlfriends, one
girlfriend, Kay in particularwas like, I'm so proud of you.
Well first she was like, I don'tthink you like him.
Multiple people have told methat.
And I'm like, well, it's noteven that I don't like him as
I'm like reporting like how theweekend went or like how my
correspondence has gone with himsince.
I'm like, it's not that I don'tlike him, it's just that like I
don't think he's done anythingyet to make me like him and.
(29:58):
I like that.
For me, I really like thatenergy for me, and she was like,
I'm so proud of you that youlike.
Don't seem to be pressed orphased.
I forgot the word she used, butthat was the essence of what she
was talking about.
She's you're so chill right now.
Who is she?
I'm like, yeah, she is fouryears sober.
That's who she is.
Like I, it's not that I don'tgive a fuck, but like I just
(30:19):
think there's so much pressurewe put on ourselves as women to
have it all figured out and it'slike a big part of it is not
really up to us.
Yes, I can do things.
On my end to try to attract adecent partner for myself, and
I'm doing those things.
I could be doing it better.
I could be putting myself outthere more, but I'm content.
(30:40):
I'm just content in life and I'mnot gonna let all of these
societal pressures around likebiological clocks and, feeling
like I have to have it allfigured out by my next birthday,
which is 35, which is like nowI'm literally going to be in my
mid thirties.
I'm already technically in mymid thirties at 34, but you
know, I can kind of skirt like,do you guys know when you do
(31:01):
this demographic thing?
Sidebar every now and then Ihave to fill in those like
demographic things.
If I'm signing up for somethingand it's like they appropriate
the different age groups and Iam still checking.
I know this 18 to 34 is like abig group, so now I'm afraid to
go to the next level, but I'mnot actually afraid because I
heard something yesterday that Iwill share with you, which is if
(31:22):
you're not aging, you're dying.
You're dead.
You know?
So like it is truly a gift to begetting older.
So like I have to remember thatI'm not afraid of aging.
I'm going to age with grace.
I'm doing that.
Quitting alcohol has helped.
Significantly with slowing downsome of the negative impact I
was putting on my body andeverything in my life at the
(31:44):
time.
So anyway back to this, I'm notafraid of aging.
I'm like, whatever, dude.
If I'm supposed to get marriedand have kids, then that will
happen.
Okay.
But me stressing over here.
It's not gonna help thesituation.
Me settling for someone simplybecause I am scared of being
alone or I'm lonely, is nothelping anyone because let me
(32:06):
tell you guys, I have never feltmore alone than when I've been
in some relationships, okay?
I've never felt more.
Disconnected for myself, thembeing in a relationship with
someone that I had no businessbeing with.
So reminding myself of that andalso.
Gratitude, like taking inventoryof all of the things that I have
(32:28):
or things that I've prayed forand like really sitting in this
present moment and beinggrateful for that and expressing
that.
Like literally giving the praiseand giving the glory to God or
what?
This is obviously taking manytests and turns here I am
preaching now, but just thinkingabout like where you are in life
and like thinking about how muchworse it could be.
Also just thinking about howmuch God has protected me from
(32:50):
men that I thought I desperatelywanted to be with, that I prayed
for.
I prayed for all my knees.
God, please gimme this man.
I'm so grateful.
He was like, no girl, no,Nadine, sit down, go to bed.
You don't need this, man.
I'm so thankful for that.
So what do I look like settlingat 34?
That's the reframe.
(33:10):
I'm like, why would I settle fora man?
What?
If you're not adding orcontributing value to my life,
and I don't care how that soundslike I, I mean that in so many
different aspects.
But if you're not adding value,then I don't have time for you.
Like I'm enjoying myself.
Please don't disrupt my peacelike I am quite content until my
(33:32):
husband shows up.
So yeah, I'm just feeling reallygood about waking up, calm and
not checking my phone firstthing in the morning, and my
nervous system not being in thislike fight or flirt mode 24 7.
It is blissfully quiet overhere.
(33:53):
And yeah, I have my toolbox, soI'm good.
I'm good until someone shows mewhy it would be good.
And I think that's another piecethat I learned.
My therapist recites this aswell, so we'll not take credit
for this, but she says to kindof neatly wrap the whole phase
to like the celibacy phase oflife, like with a bow.
She says, when women open theirlegs, they open their heart.
(34:19):
When women open their legs, theyopen their heart.
Now.
Is that sexist?
Probably.
Do I agree with her?
Yes.
Uh, for myself personally, I'verealized from lived experience
when I over my legs, all of asudden I develop feelings for
these men.
Now, some people can have.
(34:39):
Completely emotionless sex.
And I think I've done that too,but it's also not like as good
because I'm not like excited bythe person.
Like for me, a big part ofgetting my freak on or getting
like super wet is when I'm likeactually attracted to someone,
whether that be physically,emotionally.
Intellectually, spiritually,like all four, like all of those
(34:59):
things, makes it even better.
So like the more I like someone,usually the better, better the
sex is.
And like I just haven't beenexcited by anyone.
So it's like, why would I startto spiral over a man that I'm
not even excited by?
So yeah, I'm gonna be celibatefor I guess an indefinite period
of time.
And that's okay.
the-sober-butterfly_2_11- (35:20):
Okay, winding down this episode of the
Soap Butterfly.
I wanna talk about the benefitsof celibacy in sobriety.
A very quick breakdown, just incase you're not convinced, I
mean, I'm not actually trying toconvince you.
Do what you want, girl.
I recommended earlier that youshould have a hoe phase.
Remember that.
So definitely not out herepreaching that we should be
(35:42):
celibate.
I just wanna share the benefitsthat I've experienced in case
there are any lingeringquestions.
So before I get into the deepstuff, I'll start with the most
obvious.
I have so much more time.
Time being the greatest currencyin life.
(36:03):
I didn't realize actually howmuch of my mental and emotional
energy was being spent on menmen who were just like
undeserving of that energy, If Iwasn't like with him in person,
I was thinking about him.
I mean, limerence is real.
I've talked about limerence.
That's actually what promptedthe first period of celibacy
(36:27):
anyway.
I was always thinking about aman, And when you stop, you
know, texting, analyzing,scrutinizing, every word you've
ever said and overthinking that,waiting, hoping, plotting your
life just opens up tenfold.
You can reclaim so much time, somany hours, days.
(36:49):
Years of your life, you'rereclaiming that time.
And it's more than that.
When I became celibate insobriety, I learned how to be in
a relationship with myself.
Okay.
And it's not like the cornyself-love era way people talk
about online.
Really being in a relationshipwith myself, learning my
(37:12):
patterns, confronting myloneliness, understanding what
my body and spirit actuallyneed, and not just what my ego
was craving or calling.
When you remove sex from theequation and sometimes even
dating, you start to seeyourself and other people so
(37:35):
much more clearly.
Without all of the distractions.
'cause that's what they can beat times, like the talking phase
or the late night dopamine hits.
You can't really hide behind thefantasy.
And then you can start to seemaybe like your triggers or your
desires or your avoidanttendencies.
(37:56):
You see the truth and insobriety that kind of like
clarity is gold because whenyou've spent years numbing,
whether that be alcohol or withattention, even.
Being clear and grounded feelslike very revolutionary.
So the first benefit I would sayis clarity.
The second thing I noticed wasconfidence and not the sexy
(38:20):
confidence I used to chase fromthat external validation I've
talked about, but a more quiet,more grounded content kind.
The kind that.
Says, you know, I don't need tobe chosen to be valuable or feel
valuable.
And when I stopped performingfemininity for male attention or
(38:42):
male approval, I started to dothings just for the sake of
doing them for me.
I know groundbreaking.
A great example of that would belike my fashion choices, like I
think I'm actually way morefashionable.
Now that I've decent men in mylife I wear what makes me feel
good and I love when like myfemale students especially
(39:04):
compliment my outfits.
I'm like, oh my God, a teenagerthinks I look good.
That is like the highest form ofapproval, the highest form of
compliment in my opinion.
Anyway my confidence has evenshown up in like other aspects
of my life, even with.
Work.
And like my creativity, likethinking through this podcast,
(39:27):
sharing what I want to, becauseI want to create things that
feel aligned, not because I'mtrying to impress someone, not
working from a place of fear.
Oh my God, I can't talk aboutthis man, because there's a
chance he can hear about it.
I could give a fuck if a manhears about it.
Like in fact, I want you to hearabout it.
Like you should get to know theroomie.
So that kind of confidencereally like radiates
(39:49):
differently.
And I think like taking a break,a detox for men is a great way
to find that piece, especiallyif you're more performative like
me.
And like I've shared, I've beenin the past.
Next step.
I have energy.
And by the way, these are not inany particular order.
Like all of these are keylearnings or key discoveries I
(40:11):
should say, i'm like, oh my God,are just so relevant and so real
energy.
Sexual energy is creativeenergy.
It's a life force energy.
And when you stop giving it awayto people who don't pour back
into you.
You are naturally channelingthat energy elsewhere.
(40:32):
And for me, that energy has goneinto creative projects like the
Sober Butterfly.
I have more stamina to create,to plan, to travel, to dream.
And I think the celibacyhonestly has just made me more
focused.
Back to the clarity piece andnot obsessing over men who are
(40:52):
not my man.
And like all of the things areconnected, right?
The confidence to not feel likeI have to prove my worth.
Like everything is connected, soyeah, that energy that I'm now
conserving or redistributing toother parts of my life feels
powerful and it is a truebenefit Because it's giving me
(41:17):
the momentum to examine otheraspects of my life or other
areas of my life that I'veavoided or haven't given as much
care and attention to, which hashelped me actually bringing me
to my next benefit.
Healing.
It's helped me heal It's reallyhelped with healing because
celibacy in sobriety has createda space for me to actually feel.
(41:38):
When I used to numb and Irealized how often I was using
sex as a coping mechanism aswell to distract, to
self-soothe, to escape, likethose are the three common
themes I used alcohol for aswell.
So when that option was gone, Ihad no choice but to sit with my
emotions to cry, to reflect, tothink things out in therapy
(42:00):
instead of in bed with someonewho couldn't handle me sober.
So like those hoe phases I usedto have when I was drinking.
I have no doubt could havefollowed me into my sobriety,
which is why I'm so gratefulthat I used my first year of
sobriety to also detox menbecause addiction replacement is
(42:20):
real, guys and once I learnedhow to have sex sober and how
amazing it actually feels toorgasm and just the intensity of
that shared energy when you arenot under the influence of a
substance like that, oh, likesober sex.
If somebody had just told me howamazing sex would feel sober
(42:42):
once you actually like.
Like the person and like youhave that deep connection.
If somebody had warned me ortold me about that, I probably
would've, you know, gotten sobersooner.
I feel like we should probably,as sober people, like we should
use that as our way to attractnew members into our community.
(43:02):
Join us because the sex is liketruly mind boggling.
And I think had I discoveredthat.
Too soon in my recovery journeyand my sober time, I don't know,
maybe I would've used that asaddiction.
Potentially, that could havebecome an unhealthy coping
(43:24):
skill.
I know that in aa, in liketraditional recovery spaces,
they don't recommend dating orhaving, I guess, sex as well for
your first year, but more sobecause if it goes.
Badly then that could obviouslyexponentially increase your risk
of relapse.
So like I get that piece, butI'm also wondering now if
they're like, oh no, if theydiscover how good sex is in
(43:46):
sobriety, like they might becomeaddicted to it and then we're
gonna have too many members inour like sex AA group.
Okay.
How did we get here?
Healing.
Yeah, And I would say the last,like I.
Benefit, and this is not anexhaustive list, so not the last
benefit of celibacy in sobriety,but more so like the biggest
(44:09):
impact would be, I would say,like the connection piece, like
the spiritual side of it.
Celibacy has this way ofconnecting you with your
intuition, and then when you'renot entangled with someone
else's energy you begin to startto hear your own voice again.
You make decisions faster, youtrust yourself more.
You start to realize that likethat piece that you've been
(44:31):
searching for in other people isactually inside of you.
It's been there the hoe time,and I truly believe that being
celibate in sobriety hassharpened my intuition.
It's made me more discerning,not just in love, but in life,
who I let near me, like thatenergy I allow myself to consume
and where I'm placing my energy.
(44:53):
All of that is in connection to,yes, sobriety, but beyond that,
like celibacy, truly like takingtime to get to know myself, and
that's ultimately what it is.
I think for me, like thecelibacy is like using that
timeframe to get to know mebetter.
I am not.
(45:13):
Going to join a convent.
I'm not gonna be celibate forthe rest of my life.
Like I wanna be clear, I'm notwaiting before marriage.
Like I'm not that girl.
So like in case I wasn't clear,in case I wasn't clear, like I'm
not waiting to get marriedbecause like I said, in these
conditions, in these times thatwe live in 2025 in the city that
(45:35):
I live.
I think this is actually for thegirlies everywhere.
It's hard.
You think I'm gonna wait until Iget married to have sex again.,
If anything, I'm like salivatingat the mouth of romanticizing
sober sex in my mind.
I'm like, wait, why am Isalivate?
Why am I salivate?
Just going back to how amazingsex feels.
Sober, but okay.
(45:56):
I lost.
I am still celibate.
I'm gonna at least make it to myone year, dammit.
Which is like next week.
And like I said, there's just noone I'm excited about enough
right now to be like spiralingover, because inevitably that's
probably what's gonna happen ifI hook up with them and it
doesn't work out.
No, that's bleak.
That's bleak.
I'm not that girl.
I'm an eternal optimist.
(46:16):
Remember like I actually believethat it's all gonna work out and
I'm gonna.
Lay with an amazing person next,and it'll be because it's a
connection that we've built andI feel like they see me and
value me and want me and loveme.
Okay.
(46:37):
I'm ending the show.
I'm ending the show.
Yeah.
Guys, thank you so much forlistening to today's episode of
the Sopa Butterfly Podcast.
You thought you were coming justto hear about celibacy and
sobriety and you got a hoelesson on the hoe phase.
So you're welcome.
the-sober-butterfly_22_11-07 (46:57):
if you have fun today, please rate
and review the Soap of Butterflyon Spotify or Apple.
It helps more people find theshow and yeah.
Until next Friday, stay cozy.
Stay grounded.
And remember, you don't need to,you don't need a drink to feel
like you don't need a drink thismonth or any month.
(47:18):
You just need good snacks, goodlighting, and good boundaries.
See you guys next week.
Bye.
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