July 12, 2023 • 33 mins
Siblings Hương, Karin Hạnh, Hedda Hiếu, and Benjamin Hoàng Nguyễn grew up together in the San Francisco Bay Area in a boisterous Vietnamese American family. In 2019, their father, Nguyễn Khánh Hưng, a first-generation immigrant from Việt Nam, passed away. To pay tribute to their father, the siblings participated in our 3rd Annual Mỹ Việt Story Slam in 2022 with their spoken word piece, “Ngày Về Của Bố” (roughly, “The Day of Dad’s Return”), a reflection on grief and Vietnamese mourning rituals. In this special episode of Vietnamese Boat People, the Nguyễn siblings are at the helm as our first-ever guest hosts. They’ve brought their group dynamic and conversational style to Vietnamese Boat People’s format, in order to delve into their father’s life, legacy, who he was, and his unique and multifaceted experiences.
The siblings also host a podcast called Growing Up Nguyễn, a story of 4 siblings holding onto our identity while fulfilling our parents’ dreams: the blessings and challenges of being Nguyễn in America.
Episode Credits: Executive Producer: Tracey Nguyễn Mang Associate Producer: Saoli Nguyễn VBP theme music: Clarity, Paulina Vo Other music: Broken Bowl, POLLYANNA MAXIM; Joy in the Little Things, SAYURI HAYASHI EGNELL “Ngày Về Của Bố”: courtesy of Hương, Karin Hạnh, Hedda Hiếu, and Benjamin Hoàng Nguyễn
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:01):
What would always drive us to the library.
And while I would be picking out some kids books,
it would be some kind of audio tape in Spanish and some textbook that he was starting to read just to get the basics down and be able to practice it and being in the car with him,
that's all you would hear all the time.
Like the audio tape recording of like and then like you practicing the response and like repeating what they say.
(00:28):
But I think that was like the thing about bol to just being a lifelong learner because who would think to learn yet another language?
You have already tried to learn German live in Germany.
You learned English,
now you live in America and now he's pushing himself to be self taught in being able to speak Spanish.
(00:55):
You're listening to stories of the Vietnamese Boat people.
Hi,
I'm Tracy.
We,
me and welcome back.
Hi,
(01:15):
I'm Xiao Ling.
We associate producer for Vietnamese Boat people.
I'm here to introduce an episode that builds on the season six theme of stories of individuals uncovering the lives that their parents once lived.
But this one's a little different.
It's something we've never really done before on our show.
This episode features four guest hosts,
Karen Ha Heda.
(01:36):
Hu,
Ben Hung and Heng.
Together these siblings produce a podcast called Growing Up Nguyen.
They have now collaborated with us to make this special episode of Vietnamese Boat people.
If you saw our third Annual Me Story Slam in 2022 you might remember Karen and Hung as two of our featured storytellers.
they represented growing up win in the first group submission we ever received and Spoiler Alert,
(02:01):
they also won the Audience Choice Award that year in their story slam piece titled or the Day of Dad's return,
Karen and Hung performed a poem about their late father.
The piece eulogized his life and spoke on the impact his death had on their family.
Since his passing,
the four siblings have been on a journey together to learn more about the man who raised them.
(02:25):
Like many of our parents and grandparents.
He was an immigrant who worked multiple jobs to support his family,
but he was so much more than that.
And I think you'll know why once you hear his Children talk about him.
Welcome to growing up Wyn,
a story of four siblings holding on to our identity while fulfilling our parents' dreams.
(02:48):
I'm I'm Karen Hunt,
I'm Hannah and I'm Ben Huang.
These are the blessings and challenges of growing up in America.
Our dad who we call ball is named and he was born in the 19 fifties in Nam,
(03:12):
in Vietnam.
And around 19 years old,
he went to Germany for school.
And then about five years later,
he reunited with some of his siblings in Austin,
Texas.
And then a couple of years down the line,
he eventually settled in Oakland,
California and raised his family there.
A K A,
(03:32):
the four of us.
I think what's funny though is out of all of the stories that I've heard,
Mo tell,
I feel like,
I don't know too much about what his life was like in Vietnam.
But I do know that.
No,
his dad was in the civil service and his mom was a merchant and they had a store which just sell,
(03:54):
sold everyday goods that was part of the downstairs of their house.
And Mo was one of nine kids.
He was the second out of nine,
but he's the first son.
Emphasis on the son.
Right?
First son,
I know what that pressure is like.
I know I know your struggle but I just,
(04:18):
I just remembered that my aunt told me a story of when Bo was in school,
I think probably elementary or middle school.
The teacher had asked in if anyone had any.
And usually that means I got you at home,
which usually means like mouse.
But in this context,
it means like muscle or like the,
(04:40):
I guess bicep muscle.
Yeah,
because it's supposed to look like,
you know,
a rat popping out the roundedness and like a tail,
you know,
because the tail is supposed to be like the,
the crease that you get from the muscle and ball had confidently raised his hand.
It was like I do and everyone's like,
ok,
show us,
show us,
he,
he didn't have one,
he didn't have,
he don't,
(05:02):
his confidence in his early years was through the roof,
I guess when he was 19,
he was,
he did go to Germany and in from July to August of 1970 he stayed with the Winkler family.
We know because um Karen,
the mother of the host family,
(05:23):
the Winkler family,
she sent us a,
an image of he,
he had written a note in their guest book for his stay.
And that was kind of like a cool piece of history that we came across and that she shared with us after his passing.
Um But we also know that he went to Rhine Main University of Applied Sciences or we,
(05:52):
which is a trade school for mechanical engineering,
which he graduated from in 1975.
But it was very cool to just hear about that history.
And I know it must have been a really,
I mean,
I can't even say,
I know,
I think it's hard to imagine what that must have been like to go from Vietnam to Germany.
(06:13):
Just an entirely different culture,
a different country,
a different language and to be completely alone.
And it's nice that the Winkler family opened their homes to host people that just first landed in Germany and they didn't know anyone.
I know firsthand that car and gave bo such a like a immersive experience in just the 4 to 6 weeks that he stayed with them.
(06:41):
I parallel that to the time that I went to Germany about like 2011 or 12.
I was going to Germany to study German.
I was staying,
going to be living in the country for about six weeks.
But before at the beginning of my stay,
I also went to Karen's house up,
up in,
um to kind of get my bearings together.
(07:03):
And it's kind of the exact same experience that we had.
Right.
We just started in a new country,
foreign language and we stayed with someone to give us a little bit of uh,
a lay of the land.
And she really got to know me.
I mean,
first,
as a motherly figure,
she brought me tea knowing I was jet lagged and didn't let me sleep.
It made me stay awake until we spend time.
So,
you know,
she was that that kind of nurturing aspect of her.
(07:25):
So she has that built in we had conversations and once it kind of came out,
I'm enjoying cooking and food.
We read recipes together in German,
of course,
went to the grocery stores,
reading like all the signs in the stores in German.
So I was practicing the language and,
and that's how I got a little bit more comfortable speaking German.
I just remember being in the kitchen while we were cooking and it,
(07:48):
and it just hit me like this is exactly what did like years ago in the 19 seventies and here I am in her kitchen doing the same exact thing.
I,
I wonder what his topic was.
How did she connect with him?
Maybe we just do kind of everyday things like learning the German culture and etiquette.
I also know that Bo likes history.
(08:10):
I don't know if he was into history at that time,
but I do think that that's something that he enjoys talking about.
So I feel like that probably start either started with the Winklers or,
uh,
it was something he's already interested in.
So I'm,
I'm guessing history was probably a topic that,
um,
Karen Eckert and will probably had together.
I think about his Germany time and how it was just so significant to him.
(08:32):
I mean,
he's,
we visited their house at least twice now too.
I mean,
in addition to the time that I was there,
we've gone together as a whole family too.
That's how important they are to be in his life.
And I would say another factor that just speaks to how instrumental they are.
Hatton and I Hatton's her English name is Karen or Karen and my English name is,
(08:57):
and we are both named after the host mom and then I'm named after the host daughter.
And Huang was actually supposed to be almost named Eckert.
And our mom was like,
whoa,
whoa,
whoa,
that.
And she ended up having a complicated delivery and Huang was named after the doctor instead.
(09:17):
So his name is Benjamin.
But I mean,
just to name your kids after the family of someone else,
I feel like that speaks volumes to who you hope that your kids grow up to be.
Like,
I mean,
I think he was so proud of the to be like a part of the family that as we got older,
(09:43):
he really wanted us to go back and visit the host family.
And so I remember on this one trip,
we did a family uh like vacation.
Yeah,
to in like 2014.
And um so I,
I think the plan was like all of us were going to go with mother first to visit her relatives for a few days and then what was going to meet up with us later?
(10:05):
And we were going to be like,
ok,
the time and the place is like this Hamburg train station at like noon or something and that was going to be on the way for us to like this is just a meet up spot and this is the time.
So we waited and he waited and like none of us saw him,
we were like all like scanning the train aisles and being like running the platform.
(10:27):
Yeah,
like,
yeah,
just like did not see him.
And then so because he didn't show we were like,
ok,
we just eventually we got to go,
we gotta get a move on.
So we hopped on to the train station onto the train at the train station hoping that he was going to be at house.
And as it turns out like he was actually waiting at the bus stop in Lubeck for us.
(10:51):
And he was like,
oh,
yeah.
Yeah,
come,
come this way.
This is the best way.
And we were like,
oh my God,
we're waiting for you for like two hours.
We're definitely concerned and he was just like,
no,
no,
I remember the way.
Yeah,
obviously he arrived at the right train stop,
the right bus stop.
And he was like,
no,
we're going to go this many bus stops in.
And then so he like a his memory is impeccable at that time because like to remember and to keep it in his memory was uh because that,
(11:19):
that's how important they were to him.
I wonder if we remember if we go back when we go back?
I don't think I,
I can't read German from Germany though.
He then made the move to Texas and he graduated with a Bachelor of Arts degree in German literature actually in 1978.
(11:48):
Yeah,
I think it was just hard even though he had lived with Karen and learned the German language and did a degree in mechanical engineering,
which is probably a more universal language to work with numbers and math and calculations.
It was just still hard because you still have to know the language to be in like work in the workplace.
So it probably made sense for him to reconnect with his family or some of his siblings in Austin,
(12:13):
Texas.
But then again,
he faced another language barrier and it was English this time.
Yeah.
Oh my God.
Speaking of like that English barrier,
I guess this is like one of those cool points in time where you're like,
I feel like my path kind of paralleled my parents in a little bit because I remember for myself um I was going through graduate school and then I didn't pass my exams on the first time around and my dad was there for me um like physically,
(12:38):
like because he showed up on the day of my exam and then uh I didn't pass,
I was obviously very disappointed,
very heartbroken because I put so much time,
so much effort into this,
like one piece that should mark the end of my three years.
And uh it yeah,
beyond devastated.
And he was like,
it's OK.
Like you can just try again.
Then he told me about how he also needed to pass the to fl which is like that English proficiency exam for when you go to like,
(13:05):
I guess university and he didn't pass it the first time either.
And a that surprised me.
And then b he told me,
like,
I passed it on the second time and that was like,
really important.
It's ok to pick yourself up,
uh,
study hard and then try again.
I mean,
in the moment it wasn't like the most reassuring thing in the world because I was like,
oh my God,
this is really daunting.
Like I have to do this all over again,
(13:26):
all this stress and I have like,
all these nerves,
but I think it was just that reassurance that he gave me,
I think shows up as a parent comforting their child on,
it's ok to just mess up some time and,
and forgive yourself and then,
you know,
move forward.
I know that living in Texas wasn't that easy though.
(13:49):
Right.
Yeah,
he had,
was it a one bedroom or two bedroom?
I mean,
it doesn't matter.
There was still at least seven of them living in a small place that they had to share and I think most of them went to school too.
Right?
Other brothers and sisters.
Yeah,
most of them went to school also worked because there was just not enough money to go around.
(14:11):
So I remember him talking about like,
those odd jobs that he had,
which I think also speaks to what you're saying about.
Like,
when you think that your parent has just supernatural kind of like abilities as just somebody else and then you realize that they have gone through a lot and just learning about his odd jobs as being like a janitor or him telling us about like flipping burgers at Burger King.
(14:34):
Like you think that flipping burgers is like,
really easy,
right?
But instead on one of the first days that he worked there,
which knowing very little English people were shouting orders at him and you know,
when you're going through a drive through,
it's like a muffled and he was like,
what,
what do you want?
And they're like,
no tomatoes and he's like double tomatoes.
(14:58):
Um,
and learning about that,
I think he was a janitor at one point.
I think I said,
and I remember him telling us about how he would have like a late night shift and then you weren't allowed to stay at the school.
So you would have to commute home very late and then would have to come back in early school.
(15:20):
Right.
Yeah.
For school early in the morning.
Then one time he,
even though it wasn't allowed,
he,
you know,
try to sleep at the school so that he could,
it happened a couple of times.
He was like,
ok,
just for this one time.
If I just sleep here,
then I can.
And then,
uh,
but eventually,
like,
I guess it was just a couple of times and then he got,
he got,
he got caught and,
yeah.
Yeah,
(15:41):
I don't know when,
but we all relocated to Seattle,
Washington eventually.
Right.
Or in that area in the Washington State.
From my understanding wasn't there for a very long period of time.
I think he had trouble finding a job still.
And just,
I remember him talking about how he knew the pathways very well around a man's house because that's just what he would do all day.
(16:07):
He would walk those trails because he had nothing else to do.
And I was like,
oh,
ok.
You know,
it's one of those moments where you learn something new about your parent because you never think about,
like,
your parent being unemployed or having that struggle because,
you know,
you're so focused on who you are,
like,
right now and where,
where he was supporting you at.
(16:29):
But I think that's also when he had an interview with Boeing.
Right.
Yeah.
Yeah,
I remember that.
Um,
he had an interview with Boeing and,
um,
went through the interview process,
I guess his resume checked out,
like,
his education credentials checked out.
And so,
like,
ok,
well,
um,
the only thing we're missing right now is,
you know,
like a visa or a green card.
Do you have that?
(16:50):
And he was like,
oh,
yeah.
Yeah,
I do.
And he left the office,
um,
and never came back because he was like,
I know I don't have a green card and then he eventually did make his way down to California.
I'm trying to think if it was for a job or for the girl.
It was probably for the lady first.
(17:11):
Our mom got married.
That green card.
So that's about,
let's see,
late 19 eighties.
We were all born in the nineties they were introduced by or who we call is paternal grandfather's cousin.
She introduced them and they ended up getting married.
(17:35):
I asked my aunt because for one of my high school classes called marriage and family,
we were supposed to ask how our parents met.
So I talked to my about it and she said at the time,
she had three suitors,
one drank too much.
The other one didn't buy,
which is like gambled too much.
And the third one was lazy and the lazy one was the least bad out of all of those three.
(18:03):
And so that's why she went with MOL.
How did you know he's late?
Like,
what was the measure of that?
Like,
I'm not 100% sure.
But I know she told me that one of the first times that he came to visit her,
she had asked him to pick up a very specific pair of tailoring scissors because my aunt ran a tailoring shop back then.
(18:25):
And it's one of those small ones that are handheld.
She asked Bol to bring some and he didn't.
And she was like,
OK,
it's not that big a deal,
but I think it just became kind of like a bigger thing later where things would sometimes just be missing when you asked him for it.
So maybe that's what she associates with being lazy or forgetful.
(18:46):
I don't know.
Ok.
I see,
because to me,
I was living in Oakland so I guess he chose to stay in Oakland too as their place and he got a job using his mechanical engine degree,
but he worked at a cow.
Right.
And he was an architect and doing the container cranes.
And you mean the Oakland dinosaurs?
(19:08):
Yeah,
the Oakland dinosaurs.
He was always pretty proud of that.
I feel like he's like,
yeah,
I worked on that whenever we would go to Jack London,
he'd be like,
yeah,
I help with that.
His other job was supporting man in her tailoring shop.
He was kind of doing the front desk.
(19:29):
He would be taking in the,
the orders for tailoring and uh he,
he was counting cash.
He was,
you know,
I think that's where we get it from.
He's,
he learned how to count cash quick.
I always remember him telling us too that by the 19 nineties,
that was when Manhattan were born.
(19:51):
And so he would always bring them in the car with him so that he could ride car pool to San Francisco to any clients that I had across the bridge.
That's why he had kids.
Yeah,
because that was the cheapest way to get car.
(20:12):
He also worked at the toll for the Bay Bridge and he always,
but he always worked at night shift.
And I remember he said that like,
it was,
it was always so hard because it was so cold and it was also like,
barely anyone was going at the night shift.
And so it was hard not to fall asleep.
But I remember that would always,
(20:33):
my,
him would sew him or make him some,
some warm clothes so he would stay warm in the cold.
Oh,
that's true love right there.
But I think I'm sure he probably got tired of that.
So he just went back to school.
Right.
Yeah,
I mean,
it was hard.
Right.
Like to do that in the wee hours of the night and then helping me out with the shop in the daytime.
(20:58):
It's like it's a juggling act.
Like you're not having enough time with the kids.
Um,
I don't know how financially that was working out.
But,
yeah,
he did go to take some classes and there was a teacher who had talked about real estate and property management.
So,
Bo went in that direction so,
so that he could have a little bit more free time with us.
(21:18):
And in that work meant that he was working with a lot of Spanish speakers.
Um,
those were a lot of the people that were fixing houses and,
um,
doing repairs at the time.
And so he picked up Spanish.
Well,
he didn't just pick up Spanish but he learned Spanish,
um,
through his work with the people and then also through a lot of library C DS and tapes.
(21:42):
Yeah,
I remember always,
what would always drive us to the library and,
well,
I would be picking out some kids books.
It would be some kind of audio tape in Spanish and some textbook that he was starting to read just to get the basics down and be able to practice it and being in the car with him,
that's all you would hear all the time.
Like the audio tape recording of like and then like you practicing the response and like repeating what they say.
(22:11):
But I think that was like the thing about bol to just being a lifelong learner because who would think to learn yet another language?
You have already tried to learn German live in Germany.
You learned English,
now you live in America and now he's pushing himself to be self taught in being able to speak Spanish.
(22:32):
You know,
I think as a a follow was encouraging us to education,
whether it was in school and then outside of school because we all try to pick up Spanish um likable.
I mean,
I went to Germany to pick up some German.
So definitely,
yeah,
he influenced us if you've heard this song before.
(22:59):
I'm sorry if you've heard this multiple times.
How many souls,
how many bodies October 10th?
2019.
This was the third time I was part of God's final plan.
I walked into a mask and walked out with a,
a headband to identify that I am the daughter.
And there in the coffin lies my father in Vietnam wearing white,
symbolizes grief and loss.
(23:20):
But in America,
we wear black.
A sign our cultures have crossed friends and family walk up to the altar with incense to honor my father.
One incense,
one bow,
infinite smoke rises with infinite prayers.
Incense perfume reminds me that funerals are a community affair.
It's a sad song.
It's an old song.
Our tears remind us there were blessings.
It's a song written long ago to guide us with expressing and professing chapel doors closed.
(23:46):
The choir warms the room.
Now his fancier no longer a saint name for a soul.
Returning home life in Oakland was only on loan one down 99 to go 100 days of prayers to companion his soul home.
Vietnamese hymns and prayers embrace me.
My ancestors and elders surround me for grieving these community.
(24:14):
When back hip or Bo's best friend from childhood years came and um he came to us when or after Bo died,
he came to our house.
I mean,
first of all,
this guy is in Hawaii and the minute he heard about Bos passing,
he was here in like,
you know,
24 48 hours.
That's just a testament to how close their friendship is.
(24:36):
And of course,
there was a lot of stories to go around about Bol.
But the one I remember most vividly is the one about bo and back hip skipping school because I remember sometimes,
you know,
when we're sick we still,
I mean,
unless you were like,
(24:56):
you know,
super contagious or out cold with a fever,
we were still going to school,
right?
Like,
yeah,
mental health day is not a thing.
Like you go to school and here is this,
I'm all skipping school on purpose and to add to that they weren't just skipping school to hang out under the bridge.
They were hanging out on the bridge and drinking.
(25:17):
Johnny Walker.
Oh my God.
That's a bad boy right there.
So he's not a great student.
Um,
and not a good son because apparently those Johnny Walkers are from Baz Merchant Little Shop.
(25:39):
I think one of Mo's brothers was the one who said that they had noticed that sometimes the alcohol was missing or something.
It just disappeared and no one knew where,
but basically raised us to be everything that he was not as a high schooler,
elementary school or did not know.
(26:01):
And that's why she sent him away to Germany.
But will really did so much for us.
I think when he became a father,
I think that really changed his kind of outlook on life.
And I think he thought about what his values were and I feel really grateful that it became the fact that he wanted to be a family man.
(26:24):
I feel like he invested a lot in each and every one of us,
encouraging us in our hobbies,
encouraging us in our education.
And so I think it was very cool that it came to a point where his old high school friend introduced him to,
which kind of brought it kind of like full circle because he was able to reconnect with his former high school students.
(26:49):
Why do you know a little bit about them?
I know that they went to the same high school and he's just a little bit older.
Um But you know,
I think a lot of them are based in San Jose and SOCAL area,
but there's people across the US.
And I don't know,
I think they,
they always host like get togethers every year and in each of those get togethers,
(27:13):
they were,
you know,
able to talk about their experiences and just talk about being in school and have,
I don't know this shared connection,
how they were refugees or immigrants coming here to the US.
It's probably very nice to have a deep connection with people about having all these shared experiences and being able to talk to people that used to know back in the day.
(27:35):
What's also amazing is that they all fundraise for schools together and schools for back in Vietnam,
creating scholarships.
Because actually not only did we create little scholarships for students in Vietnam but also for students here actually at our,
our elementary school because we want to make sure that other students have the same ability to attend school in the same way that we've all went through the school systems here and how it's benefited us.
(28:00):
So he really wanted to make those scholarships available to,
to others as well.
Oh,
did you know?
Well,
after had passed and we were going through his files and his papers.
Do you guys remember that?
Uh Bo was raising three other kids other than us,
he's giving money to them every month.
(28:23):
Come again.
He is giving money for,
for these three kids to have scholarships in other countries.
So that's oh my gosh.
He never told us that he was raising three other kids.
OK.
This is a secret that he kept from us.
(28:45):
Shout out to our,
our kids.
Well,
when you think of that,
I also remember how like Boel loved babies and like when we would go to church or something like that,
when there would be a baby around,
he'd be like,
oh hi,
I'm trying to like wave at it and stuff like that.
(29:06):
But overall,
I think Boel really liked kids and I it actually brings me back to I visited Mexico recently and I have a lot of memories of being there with Mole because he went with me for a for a week before leaving me there for the summer.
(29:28):
It was like fine.
He,
he dropped me off so I could learn Spanish with a host family again,
kind of paralleling his experience of living in Germany with a host family.
And he thought it was a great idea for me to stay with a host family in Mexico to study Spanish.
But he stayed there for a week with me before he departed.
(29:51):
And one of the things we did was we visited the anthropology museum.
And I always remember some teenage boys approached us and wanted to take a picture with us and keep in mind this is about 10 years ago.
(30:11):
So there was definitely no Vietnamese people in Mexico,
not a lot of Asian people.
So we definitely stood out and I knew that was why they wanted to take a picture with us.
I was cringing on the inside did not want to was turning to ball to say,
you know,
maybe we should go and then he was so enthusiastic and he jumped in there and was like,
(30:34):
oh,
like come on in and doing different poses and like telling them to switch out so different boys could come in and take the photo with us.
And I was like,
do you think we're a celebrity?
Like what is going on?
I was so embarrassed,
but it also made me think of mol differently because he was used to being different and he was really proud of that.
(31:00):
He had such a unique experience of being an immigrant coming from Vietnam.
It was a windy road going from Vietnam.
To Germany,
to the US.
And I think that it is hard to do,
but ultimately,
(31:22):
it's been great being able to explore his story and understand a different side of our dad that we usually think about.
And I just want to thank the Vietnamese Boat People podcast for letting us tell this story.
It reminds us that our dad like so many other immigrants are everyday superheroes.
(31:43):
Indeed.
Yeah.
If you want to gain a deeper understanding of your parents or your family's migration story,
check out the Vietnamese boat people conversation kit.
It's a deck of cards with questions and prompts in English and Vietnamese designed to help you start the dialogue with your loved ones.
(32:03):
Learn more at vitamins spoke people dot org forward slash share.
You can preserve your story by sharing it on our journeys,
map,
explore the beta version and contribute your story by visiting vide spoke people dot org forward slash journeys.
For more.
Follow us on Instagram at Vietnamese boat people and look for details under episode 51 to learn about Growing Up win.
(32:28):
Follow them on Instagram at Growing Up WW is spelled Nguyen.
I'm Tracy me and thank you for listening.
If you enjoy the show and want to support our mission,
please consider making a tax deductible donation on our website.
(32:50):
Your support helps independent shows like ours continue to amplify stories from our community and please take a moment to rate us and provide us feedback wherever you listen to the podcast.
What would always drive us to the library.
And while I would be picking out some kids books,
it would be some kind of audio tape in Spanish and some textbook that he was starting to read just to get the basics down and be able to practice it and being in the car with him,
that's all you would hear all the time.
Like the audio tape recording of like and then like you practicing the response and like repeating what they say.
(00:28):
But I think that was like the thing about bol to just being a lifelong learner because who would think to learn yet another language?
You have already tried to learn German live in Germany.
You learned English,
now you live in America and now he's pushing himself to be self taught in being able to speak Spanish.
(00:55):
You're listening to stories of the Vietnamese Boat people.
Hi,
I'm Tracy.
We,
me and welcome back.
Hi,
(01:15):
I'm Xiao Ling.
We associate producer for Vietnamese Boat people.
I'm here to introduce an episode that builds on the season six theme of stories of individuals uncovering the lives that their parents once lived.
But this one's a little different.
It's something we've never really done before on our show.
This episode features four guest hosts,
Karen Ha Heda.
(01:36):
Hu,
Ben Hung and Heng.
Together these siblings produce a podcast called Growing Up Nguyen.
They have now collaborated with us to make this special episode of Vietnamese Boat people.
If you saw our third Annual Me Story Slam in 2022 you might remember Karen and Hung as two of our featured storytellers.
they represented growing up win in the first group submission we ever received and Spoiler Alert,
(02:01):
they also won the Audience Choice Award that year in their story slam piece titled or the Day of Dad's return,
Karen and Hung performed a poem about their late father.
The piece eulogized his life and spoke on the impact his death had on their family.
Since his passing,
the four siblings have been on a journey together to learn more about the man who raised them.
(02:25):
Like many of our parents and grandparents.
He was an immigrant who worked multiple jobs to support his family,
but he was so much more than that.
And I think you'll know why once you hear his Children talk about him.
Welcome to growing up Wyn,
a story of four siblings holding on to our identity while fulfilling our parents' dreams.
(02:48):
I'm I'm Karen Hunt,
I'm Hannah and I'm Ben Huang.
These are the blessings and challenges of growing up in America.
Our dad who we call ball is named and he was born in the 19 fifties in Nam,
(03:12):
in Vietnam.
And around 19 years old,
he went to Germany for school.
And then about five years later,
he reunited with some of his siblings in Austin,
Texas.
And then a couple of years down the line,
he eventually settled in Oakland,
California and raised his family there.
A K A,
(03:32):
the four of us.
I think what's funny though is out of all of the stories that I've heard,
Mo tell,
I feel like,
I don't know too much about what his life was like in Vietnam.
But I do know that.
No,
his dad was in the civil service and his mom was a merchant and they had a store which just sell,
(03:54):
sold everyday goods that was part of the downstairs of their house.
And Mo was one of nine kids.
He was the second out of nine,
but he's the first son.
Emphasis on the son.
Right?
First son,
I know what that pressure is like.
I know I know your struggle but I just,
(04:18):
I just remembered that my aunt told me a story of when Bo was in school,
I think probably elementary or middle school.
The teacher had asked in if anyone had any.
And usually that means I got you at home,
which usually means like mouse.
But in this context,
it means like muscle or like the,
(04:40):
I guess bicep muscle.
Yeah,
because it's supposed to look like,
you know,
a rat popping out the roundedness and like a tail,
you know,
because the tail is supposed to be like the,
the crease that you get from the muscle and ball had confidently raised his hand.
It was like I do and everyone's like,
ok,
show us,
show us,
he,
he didn't have one,
he didn't have,
he don't,
(05:02):
his confidence in his early years was through the roof,
I guess when he was 19,
he was,
he did go to Germany and in from July to August of 1970 he stayed with the Winkler family.
We know because um Karen,
the mother of the host family,
(05:23):
the Winkler family,
she sent us a,
an image of he,
he had written a note in their guest book for his stay.
And that was kind of like a cool piece of history that we came across and that she shared with us after his passing.
Um But we also know that he went to Rhine Main University of Applied Sciences or we,
(05:52):
which is a trade school for mechanical engineering,
which he graduated from in 1975.
But it was very cool to just hear about that history.
And I know it must have been a really,
I mean,
I can't even say,
I know,
I think it's hard to imagine what that must have been like to go from Vietnam to Germany.
(06:13):
Just an entirely different culture,
a different country,
a different language and to be completely alone.
And it's nice that the Winkler family opened their homes to host people that just first landed in Germany and they didn't know anyone.
I know firsthand that car and gave bo such a like a immersive experience in just the 4 to 6 weeks that he stayed with them.
(06:41):
I parallel that to the time that I went to Germany about like 2011 or 12.
I was going to Germany to study German.
I was staying,
going to be living in the country for about six weeks.
But before at the beginning of my stay,
I also went to Karen's house up,
up in,
um to kind of get my bearings together.
(07:03):
And it's kind of the exact same experience that we had.
Right.
We just started in a new country,
foreign language and we stayed with someone to give us a little bit of uh,
a lay of the land.
And she really got to know me.
I mean,
first,
as a motherly figure,
she brought me tea knowing I was jet lagged and didn't let me sleep.
It made me stay awake until we spend time.
So,
you know,
she was that that kind of nurturing aspect of her.
(07:25):
So she has that built in we had conversations and once it kind of came out,
I'm enjoying cooking and food.
We read recipes together in German,
of course,
went to the grocery stores,
reading like all the signs in the stores in German.
So I was practicing the language and,
and that's how I got a little bit more comfortable speaking German.
I just remember being in the kitchen while we were cooking and it,
(07:48):
and it just hit me like this is exactly what did like years ago in the 19 seventies and here I am in her kitchen doing the same exact thing.
I,
I wonder what his topic was.
How did she connect with him?
Maybe we just do kind of everyday things like learning the German culture and etiquette.
I also know that Bo likes history.
(08:10):
I don't know if he was into history at that time,
but I do think that that's something that he enjoys talking about.
So I feel like that probably start either started with the Winklers or,
uh,
it was something he's already interested in.
So I'm,
I'm guessing history was probably a topic that,
um,
Karen Eckert and will probably had together.
I think about his Germany time and how it was just so significant to him.
(08:32):
I mean,
he's,
we visited their house at least twice now too.
I mean,
in addition to the time that I was there,
we've gone together as a whole family too.
That's how important they are to be in his life.
And I would say another factor that just speaks to how instrumental they are.
Hatton and I Hatton's her English name is Karen or Karen and my English name is,
(08:57):
and we are both named after the host mom and then I'm named after the host daughter.
And Huang was actually supposed to be almost named Eckert.
And our mom was like,
whoa,
whoa,
whoa,
that.
And she ended up having a complicated delivery and Huang was named after the doctor instead.
(09:17):
So his name is Benjamin.
But I mean,
just to name your kids after the family of someone else,
I feel like that speaks volumes to who you hope that your kids grow up to be.
Like,
I mean,
I think he was so proud of the to be like a part of the family that as we got older,
(09:43):
he really wanted us to go back and visit the host family.
And so I remember on this one trip,
we did a family uh like vacation.
Yeah,
to in like 2014.
And um so I,
I think the plan was like all of us were going to go with mother first to visit her relatives for a few days and then what was going to meet up with us later?
(10:05):
And we were going to be like,
ok,
the time and the place is like this Hamburg train station at like noon or something and that was going to be on the way for us to like this is just a meet up spot and this is the time.
So we waited and he waited and like none of us saw him,
we were like all like scanning the train aisles and being like running the platform.
(10:27):
Yeah,
like,
yeah,
just like did not see him.
And then so because he didn't show we were like,
ok,
we just eventually we got to go,
we gotta get a move on.
So we hopped on to the train station onto the train at the train station hoping that he was going to be at house.
And as it turns out like he was actually waiting at the bus stop in Lubeck for us.
(10:51):
And he was like,
oh,
yeah.
Yeah,
come,
come this way.
This is the best way.
And we were like,
oh my God,
we're waiting for you for like two hours.
We're definitely concerned and he was just like,
no,
no,
I remember the way.
Yeah,
obviously he arrived at the right train stop,
the right bus stop.
And he was like,
no,
we're going to go this many bus stops in.
And then so he like a his memory is impeccable at that time because like to remember and to keep it in his memory was uh because that,
(11:19):
that's how important they were to him.
I wonder if we remember if we go back when we go back?
I don't think I,
I can't read German from Germany though.
He then made the move to Texas and he graduated with a Bachelor of Arts degree in German literature actually in 1978.
(11:48):
Yeah,
I think it was just hard even though he had lived with Karen and learned the German language and did a degree in mechanical engineering,
which is probably a more universal language to work with numbers and math and calculations.
It was just still hard because you still have to know the language to be in like work in the workplace.
So it probably made sense for him to reconnect with his family or some of his siblings in Austin,
(12:13):
Texas.
But then again,
he faced another language barrier and it was English this time.
Yeah.
Oh my God.
Speaking of like that English barrier,
I guess this is like one of those cool points in time where you're like,
I feel like my path kind of paralleled my parents in a little bit because I remember for myself um I was going through graduate school and then I didn't pass my exams on the first time around and my dad was there for me um like physically,
(12:38):
like because he showed up on the day of my exam and then uh I didn't pass,
I was obviously very disappointed,
very heartbroken because I put so much time,
so much effort into this,
like one piece that should mark the end of my three years.
And uh it yeah,
beyond devastated.
And he was like,
it's OK.
Like you can just try again.
Then he told me about how he also needed to pass the to fl which is like that English proficiency exam for when you go to like,
(13:05):
I guess university and he didn't pass it the first time either.
And a that surprised me.
And then b he told me,
like,
I passed it on the second time and that was like,
really important.
It's ok to pick yourself up,
uh,
study hard and then try again.
I mean,
in the moment it wasn't like the most reassuring thing in the world because I was like,
oh my God,
this is really daunting.
Like I have to do this all over again,
(13:26):
all this stress and I have like,
all these nerves,
but I think it was just that reassurance that he gave me,
I think shows up as a parent comforting their child on,
it's ok to just mess up some time and,
and forgive yourself and then,
you know,
move forward.
I know that living in Texas wasn't that easy though.
(13:49):
Right.
Yeah,
he had,
was it a one bedroom or two bedroom?
I mean,
it doesn't matter.
There was still at least seven of them living in a small place that they had to share and I think most of them went to school too.
Right?
Other brothers and sisters.
Yeah,
most of them went to school also worked because there was just not enough money to go around.
(14:11):
So I remember him talking about like,
those odd jobs that he had,
which I think also speaks to what you're saying about.
Like,
when you think that your parent has just supernatural kind of like abilities as just somebody else and then you realize that they have gone through a lot and just learning about his odd jobs as being like a janitor or him telling us about like flipping burgers at Burger King.
(14:34):
Like you think that flipping burgers is like,
really easy,
right?
But instead on one of the first days that he worked there,
which knowing very little English people were shouting orders at him and you know,
when you're going through a drive through,
it's like a muffled and he was like,
what,
what do you want?
And they're like,
no tomatoes and he's like double tomatoes.
(14:58):
Um,
and learning about that,
I think he was a janitor at one point.
I think I said,
and I remember him telling us about how he would have like a late night shift and then you weren't allowed to stay at the school.
So you would have to commute home very late and then would have to come back in early school.
(15:20):
Right.
Yeah.
For school early in the morning.
Then one time he,
even though it wasn't allowed,
he,
you know,
try to sleep at the school so that he could,
it happened a couple of times.
He was like,
ok,
just for this one time.
If I just sleep here,
then I can.
And then,
uh,
but eventually,
like,
I guess it was just a couple of times and then he got,
he got,
he got caught and,
yeah.
Yeah,
(15:41):
I don't know when,
but we all relocated to Seattle,
Washington eventually.
Right.
Or in that area in the Washington State.
From my understanding wasn't there for a very long period of time.
I think he had trouble finding a job still.
And just,
I remember him talking about how he knew the pathways very well around a man's house because that's just what he would do all day.
(16:07):
He would walk those trails because he had nothing else to do.
And I was like,
oh,
ok.
You know,
it's one of those moments where you learn something new about your parent because you never think about,
like,
your parent being unemployed or having that struggle because,
you know,
you're so focused on who you are,
like,
right now and where,
where he was supporting you at.
(16:29):
But I think that's also when he had an interview with Boeing.
Right.
Yeah.
Yeah,
I remember that.
Um,
he had an interview with Boeing and,
um,
went through the interview process,
I guess his resume checked out,
like,
his education credentials checked out.
And so,
like,
ok,
well,
um,
the only thing we're missing right now is,
you know,
like a visa or a green card.
Do you have that?
(16:50):
And he was like,
oh,
yeah.
Yeah,
I do.
And he left the office,
um,
and never came back because he was like,
I know I don't have a green card and then he eventually did make his way down to California.
I'm trying to think if it was for a job or for the girl.
It was probably for the lady first.
(17:11):
Our mom got married.
That green card.
So that's about,
let's see,
late 19 eighties.
We were all born in the nineties they were introduced by or who we call is paternal grandfather's cousin.
She introduced them and they ended up getting married.
(17:35):
I asked my aunt because for one of my high school classes called marriage and family,
we were supposed to ask how our parents met.
So I talked to my about it and she said at the time,
she had three suitors,
one drank too much.
The other one didn't buy,
which is like gambled too much.
And the third one was lazy and the lazy one was the least bad out of all of those three.
(18:03):
And so that's why she went with MOL.
How did you know he's late?
Like,
what was the measure of that?
Like,
I'm not 100% sure.
But I know she told me that one of the first times that he came to visit her,
she had asked him to pick up a very specific pair of tailoring scissors because my aunt ran a tailoring shop back then.
(18:25):
And it's one of those small ones that are handheld.
She asked Bol to bring some and he didn't.
And she was like,
OK,
it's not that big a deal,
but I think it just became kind of like a bigger thing later where things would sometimes just be missing when you asked him for it.
So maybe that's what she associates with being lazy or forgetful.
(18:46):
I don't know.
Ok.
I see,
because to me,
I was living in Oakland so I guess he chose to stay in Oakland too as their place and he got a job using his mechanical engine degree,
but he worked at a cow.
Right.
And he was an architect and doing the container cranes.
And you mean the Oakland dinosaurs?
(19:08):
Yeah,
the Oakland dinosaurs.
He was always pretty proud of that.
I feel like he's like,
yeah,
I worked on that whenever we would go to Jack London,
he'd be like,
yeah,
I help with that.
His other job was supporting man in her tailoring shop.
He was kind of doing the front desk.
(19:29):
He would be taking in the,
the orders for tailoring and uh he,
he was counting cash.
He was,
you know,
I think that's where we get it from.
He's,
he learned how to count cash quick.
I always remember him telling us too that by the 19 nineties,
that was when Manhattan were born.
(19:51):
And so he would always bring them in the car with him so that he could ride car pool to San Francisco to any clients that I had across the bridge.
That's why he had kids.
Yeah,
because that was the cheapest way to get car.
(20:12):
He also worked at the toll for the Bay Bridge and he always,
but he always worked at night shift.
And I remember he said that like,
it was,
it was always so hard because it was so cold and it was also like,
barely anyone was going at the night shift.
And so it was hard not to fall asleep.
But I remember that would always,
(20:33):
my,
him would sew him or make him some,
some warm clothes so he would stay warm in the cold.
Oh,
that's true love right there.
But I think I'm sure he probably got tired of that.
So he just went back to school.
Right.
Yeah,
I mean,
it was hard.
Right.
Like to do that in the wee hours of the night and then helping me out with the shop in the daytime.
(20:58):
It's like it's a juggling act.
Like you're not having enough time with the kids.
Um,
I don't know how financially that was working out.
But,
yeah,
he did go to take some classes and there was a teacher who had talked about real estate and property management.
So,
Bo went in that direction so,
so that he could have a little bit more free time with us.
(21:18):
And in that work meant that he was working with a lot of Spanish speakers.
Um,
those were a lot of the people that were fixing houses and,
um,
doing repairs at the time.
And so he picked up Spanish.
Well,
he didn't just pick up Spanish but he learned Spanish,
um,
through his work with the people and then also through a lot of library C DS and tapes.
(21:42):
Yeah,
I remember always,
what would always drive us to the library and,
well,
I would be picking out some kids books.
It would be some kind of audio tape in Spanish and some textbook that he was starting to read just to get the basics down and be able to practice it and being in the car with him,
that's all you would hear all the time.
Like the audio tape recording of like and then like you practicing the response and like repeating what they say.
(22:11):
But I think that was like the thing about bol to just being a lifelong learner because who would think to learn yet another language?
You have already tried to learn German live in Germany.
You learned English,
now you live in America and now he's pushing himself to be self taught in being able to speak Spanish.
(22:32):
You know,
I think as a a follow was encouraging us to education,
whether it was in school and then outside of school because we all try to pick up Spanish um likable.
I mean,
I went to Germany to pick up some German.
So definitely,
yeah,
he influenced us if you've heard this song before.
(22:59):
I'm sorry if you've heard this multiple times.
How many souls,
how many bodies October 10th?
2019.
This was the third time I was part of God's final plan.
I walked into a mask and walked out with a,
a headband to identify that I am the daughter.
And there in the coffin lies my father in Vietnam wearing white,
symbolizes grief and loss.
(23:20):
But in America,
we wear black.
A sign our cultures have crossed friends and family walk up to the altar with incense to honor my father.
One incense,
one bow,
infinite smoke rises with infinite prayers.
Incense perfume reminds me that funerals are a community affair.
It's a sad song.
It's an old song.
Our tears remind us there were blessings.
It's a song written long ago to guide us with expressing and professing chapel doors closed.
(23:46):
The choir warms the room.
Now his fancier no longer a saint name for a soul.
Returning home life in Oakland was only on loan one down 99 to go 100 days of prayers to companion his soul home.
Vietnamese hymns and prayers embrace me.
My ancestors and elders surround me for grieving these community.
(24:14):
When back hip or Bo's best friend from childhood years came and um he came to us when or after Bo died,
he came to our house.
I mean,
first of all,
this guy is in Hawaii and the minute he heard about Bos passing,
he was here in like,
you know,
24 48 hours.
That's just a testament to how close their friendship is.
(24:36):
And of course,
there was a lot of stories to go around about Bol.
But the one I remember most vividly is the one about bo and back hip skipping school because I remember sometimes,
you know,
when we're sick we still,
I mean,
unless you were like,
(24:56):
you know,
super contagious or out cold with a fever,
we were still going to school,
right?
Like,
yeah,
mental health day is not a thing.
Like you go to school and here is this,
I'm all skipping school on purpose and to add to that they weren't just skipping school to hang out under the bridge.
They were hanging out on the bridge and drinking.
(25:17):
Johnny Walker.
Oh my God.
That's a bad boy right there.
So he's not a great student.
Um,
and not a good son because apparently those Johnny Walkers are from Baz Merchant Little Shop.
(25:39):
I think one of Mo's brothers was the one who said that they had noticed that sometimes the alcohol was missing or something.
It just disappeared and no one knew where,
but basically raised us to be everything that he was not as a high schooler,
elementary school or did not know.
(26:01):
And that's why she sent him away to Germany.
But will really did so much for us.
I think when he became a father,
I think that really changed his kind of outlook on life.
And I think he thought about what his values were and I feel really grateful that it became the fact that he wanted to be a family man.
(26:24):
I feel like he invested a lot in each and every one of us,
encouraging us in our hobbies,
encouraging us in our education.
And so I think it was very cool that it came to a point where his old high school friend introduced him to,
which kind of brought it kind of like full circle because he was able to reconnect with his former high school students.
(26:49):
Why do you know a little bit about them?
I know that they went to the same high school and he's just a little bit older.
Um But you know,
I think a lot of them are based in San Jose and SOCAL area,
but there's people across the US.
And I don't know,
I think they,
they always host like get togethers every year and in each of those get togethers,
(27:13):
they were,
you know,
able to talk about their experiences and just talk about being in school and have,
I don't know this shared connection,
how they were refugees or immigrants coming here to the US.
It's probably very nice to have a deep connection with people about having all these shared experiences and being able to talk to people that used to know back in the day.
(27:35):
What's also amazing is that they all fundraise for schools together and schools for back in Vietnam,
creating scholarships.
Because actually not only did we create little scholarships for students in Vietnam but also for students here actually at our,
our elementary school because we want to make sure that other students have the same ability to attend school in the same way that we've all went through the school systems here and how it's benefited us.
(28:00):
So he really wanted to make those scholarships available to,
to others as well.
Oh,
did you know?
Well,
after had passed and we were going through his files and his papers.
Do you guys remember that?
Uh Bo was raising three other kids other than us,
he's giving money to them every month.
(28:23):
Come again.
He is giving money for,
for these three kids to have scholarships in other countries.
So that's oh my gosh.
He never told us that he was raising three other kids.
OK.
This is a secret that he kept from us.
(28:45):
Shout out to our,
our kids.
Well,
when you think of that,
I also remember how like Boel loved babies and like when we would go to church or something like that,
when there would be a baby around,
he'd be like,
oh hi,
I'm trying to like wave at it and stuff like that.
(29:06):
But overall,
I think Boel really liked kids and I it actually brings me back to I visited Mexico recently and I have a lot of memories of being there with Mole because he went with me for a for a week before leaving me there for the summer.
(29:28):
It was like fine.
He,
he dropped me off so I could learn Spanish with a host family again,
kind of paralleling his experience of living in Germany with a host family.
And he thought it was a great idea for me to stay with a host family in Mexico to study Spanish.
But he stayed there for a week with me before he departed.
(29:51):
And one of the things we did was we visited the anthropology museum.
And I always remember some teenage boys approached us and wanted to take a picture with us and keep in mind this is about 10 years ago.
(30:11):
So there was definitely no Vietnamese people in Mexico,
not a lot of Asian people.
So we definitely stood out and I knew that was why they wanted to take a picture with us.
I was cringing on the inside did not want to was turning to ball to say,
you know,
maybe we should go and then he was so enthusiastic and he jumped in there and was like,
(30:34):
oh,
like come on in and doing different poses and like telling them to switch out so different boys could come in and take the photo with us.
And I was like,
do you think we're a celebrity?
Like what is going on?
I was so embarrassed,
but it also made me think of mol differently because he was used to being different and he was really proud of that.
(31:00):
He had such a unique experience of being an immigrant coming from Vietnam.
It was a windy road going from Vietnam.
To Germany,
to the US.
And I think that it is hard to do,
but ultimately,
(31:22):
it's been great being able to explore his story and understand a different side of our dad that we usually think about.
And I just want to thank the Vietnamese Boat People podcast for letting us tell this story.
It reminds us that our dad like so many other immigrants are everyday superheroes.
(31:43):
Indeed.
Yeah.
If you want to gain a deeper understanding of your parents or your family's migration story,
check out the Vietnamese boat people conversation kit.
It's a deck of cards with questions and prompts in English and Vietnamese designed to help you start the dialogue with your loved ones.
(32:03):
Learn more at vitamins spoke people dot org forward slash share.
You can preserve your story by sharing it on our journeys,
map,
explore the beta version and contribute your story by visiting vide spoke people dot org forward slash journeys.
For more.
Follow us on Instagram at Vietnamese boat people and look for details under episode 51 to learn about Growing Up win.
(32:28):
Follow them on Instagram at Growing Up WW is spelled Nguyen.
I'm Tracy me and thank you for listening.
If you enjoy the show and want to support our mission,
please consider making a tax deductible donation on our website.
(32:50):
Your support helps independent shows like ours continue to amplify stories from our community and please take a moment to rate us and provide us feedback wherever you listen to the podcast.
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