March 22, 2023 • 52 mins
REMINDER: Open Floor will be moving to the Crossover feed starting next week so please subscribe and join us there!
Mannix is joined again by Rohan Nadkarni and Chris Herring to break down how the MVP race between Nikola Jokić & Joel Embiid has gotten even closer, if the Lakers are really a contender with Anthony Davis missing crucial games, the failure of Michael Jordan during his tenure as the owner of the Charlotte Hornets as he looks to sell the team, and what the Grizzlies will look like going forward with the return of Ja Morant
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
And we are back a crossover, open floor collaboration. Chris Mannix,
Chris Herring, Rohan not Garnie, still live from his basement.
I can't help myself with that. I can't. Every time
I see you pop up on the video screen in
what looks like a college dorm, I have to comment
(00:21):
on it. I'm sorry, man, I have to. I mean,
you are looking like you're coming from a TA black site.
I just want to point that out in front of
a black possible like I don't. Oh, I didn't realize
you're on some kind of collacoration Okay, yeah, still decorating,
still decorating curtains of this office. But you know, you
(00:44):
get the tank top going on with the with the
crappy blue curtain behind you. It's like, what are we
what are we doing? What are we doing here? You're
a grown man, Come on clean it up? Um? All right,
So Roan, you led last week's podcast and you hit
some substantive media topics. That's not what I do when
(01:05):
I'm leaving this ship. I go for the lowest of
low hanging fruit, the cabinet for listeners. So on this episode,
we are going to get into the MVP debate. We're
gonna talk about the state of the Lakers, and I'm
gonna ask the question, is Michael Jordan's legacy tainted by
what appears to be the end of his decade plus
(01:27):
run as majority owner of the Charlotte Hornets. So let's
start with the MVP vote, because look, if this has
been a toxic debate for weeks and weeks, months and
months now, you know I wrote about this, well, no,
I mean it's more toxic now that it's ever been before.
And I wrote about this on Tuesday on si dot
(01:49):
com and kind of the aftermath of Doc Rivers kind
of being asked about it before Monday night's game and
sort of lamenting how if you support one guy you
and have to seemingly hate the others, Right, And we're
talking about what is effectively a three player race at
this point between Nicola Yokis, the two time Raining MVP,
Joel Embiid, the two time Raining runner up, and jannat
(02:12):
ten to Coompo has got a couple of MVPs on
his mantle as well. So you know, we'll get into
the toxicity of it and why that's the case in
a minute. But is your vote fellas, and we'll start
with you herring real or mythical. Is your vote still
up for grabs as we enter the final two and
a half weeks of the regular season. Well, unless I
(02:33):
get a notification soon that I don't have a vote,
I did have one last year, a real one, so
I'm expecting to be asked to do it again. It's
still up for grabs. And I'll say that as someone
that as of about a month maybe a little bit
less than a month and a half ago, I think
I even wrote that it was looking like this was
(02:54):
going to be a third straight MVP for Yoki. And obviously,
when you talk about the run that just as of
last night, the Sixers lost for the first time in
nine games, and at the same time that the Nuggets
I think have lost six out of eight, and you know,
(03:15):
took the last couple of minutes to win those last
you know, those two that they actually did get, one
of which was against the Pistons. So Yokis has still
performed well statistically in those games. But just the nature
of why I think we were seeing the race shake
out the way it was was like the Nuggets were dominating.
Yokich has been dominant and was dominating it, maybe a
(03:37):
higher level than he had the last couple of years.
And you know, the Sixers were good, even though on
Bead was dominant too, And so it wasn't stunning to
me that, you know that once we saw things come
together the way they had, that Yokich kind of had
built up a lead, so to speak. It's tightened just
because the Sixers have played much better and the Nuggets
(04:01):
have played much worse. It's kind of what always happens.
It kind of feels like more of a traditional race,
so to speak, because of the fact that the you know,
the teams are playing the way they're playing, and I
think it's getting more attention. Add into that now what
you're talking about about the toxicity of it, and I
don't think the race is tightening because of that, but
(04:21):
it has kind of forced people who might not have
even really taken notice of what was happening with the
MVP race to look at it and say, h like,
why was yok It's the favorite? And by that I
mean fans, by the way, but why was yok It's
such a favorite when embiid was putting up these numbers?
And then add to that, the fact that you know
that the Sixers went on a nice run and the
(04:41):
Nuggets had a slide, So it's it's been interesting, frustrating.
I think it's it's kind of interesting timing too, for
all of it to happen at the same time. But
in a nutshell, despite the toxicity, I'm excited that there's
a race to be had, as opposed to it being
kind of a runaway the way it started to feel
at one point last year and even the year before that,
(05:03):
when there are a lot of injuries. So this is
what we should want. It's for the last few weeks
to matter beyond teams tanking to try to get a
certain opponent or teams tanking to get a draft pick.
Like it's it's a year full of parody, and I
think that the MVP race is not parody because it's
just two or three guys. But I'm excited that we've
got a tight enough race to actually talk about that matters. Yeah,
(05:25):
I don't have a vote. I guess it's because I'm
not named Chris. I don't know what's going on there
to reach out to someone at the NBA, but I'll
say that my votes definitely up for grabs. I think,
like a lot of people, I have a front runner,
I think, and I think my front runner has changed
throughout the course of the season. Something that bothers me
so much about the discourse around this award. I think
we're really kicked it off this year was you know,
(05:48):
ESPN does that straw poll of reporters for MVP, and
Yokich was the runaway leader the last time to the
straw poll, which was it's been a couple of months now,
and I think there was a lot of backlash. Why
is yoki so far out in front? Why is he
a near unanimous And that kind of kicked off a
(06:08):
whole new round of arguments. And I think those same
people who add Yokich number one runaway at that point,
I bet a lot of people have changed their minds.
And that's okay. That's how the race should go. The
more evidence you get, the more data points you collect,
the more you watch, the better information you have and
the better decision you make. And I think there was
a point where Yokich was my front runner. I don't
(06:29):
think that's the case anymore. And I just think that
we need to like make it okay to change your
mind about the MVP over the course of a season.
For some reason, it feels like if you champion a guy,
like last year, I wrote a big story. I mean Mannix,
you wrote an Embide story. I wrote a Yokic story.
I think we both made good arguments. And you know,
because I listed why I think Yoki should win and
(06:50):
compared him to Embide in certain categories. It's like you
get put into a camp and it's like you don't
think Embide's good at this, And it's like, I'm not
insulting a player by saying he's the second or third
best player in the NBA. You know what I mean.
Not to mention, we also do our top one hundred
rankings where we put Janness near the top. You know,
we put in Bead over certain people. So my votes
(07:10):
definitely up for grabs. I'm sure I'll write an awards
column towards the end of the season and that will
be my final decision by then. But I think it's
we need to make it normal to change your mind
about the MVP over the course of the season. Well, look,
minds have changed over the last three months. If you
go back to that first ESPN straw pole, Jason Tatum
(07:30):
was the leader of Matt straw Pool. A couple of
months later, in mid February, it was Nikola Yokes And
there are reasons for that. I mean, Nikoliokech at that
point was posting ridiculous numbers, averaging close to a triple double,
which he still is leading in all the major advanced
statistics categories, and Denver was the top team in the
Western Conference by a considerable amount. Those are all pretty
(07:53):
elemental criteria for positioning a guy as the front runner
for MVP. But things I've changed in the last month.
That's why my vote right now is completely up for grabs.
I mean, in the last month, I don't think Yokich
has taken a step back, But to Chris's point, the
Nuggets have. I mean, they lost four straight in mid March.
As we record this, they've lost five of their last seven.
(08:15):
They still have a pretty strong grip on the top
seed in the West. But you know, this is a
tough time, at least for the MVP vote. For yokis
to have his team be struggling, because while this team struggles,
his defensive deficiencies get highlighted. And that's always been the
anti Yokis argument that, as marvelous as he is offensively,
(08:37):
defensively sucks especially compared to you know, Joel Embiid and
Janace ten to coompo. So it certainly opened the door.
And while Yoki and the Nuggets have struggled, you've seen
Embiid go off for what ten straight games of thirty
plus points, including thirty seven on Monday. Janis as played great.
The Bucks had a fifteen game winning streak since that
(08:57):
last straw poll was put out, So yeah, I think
it has tightened considerably. And if the vote was taken
today with that straw poll, I think you'd see some
very different results. And like for me, the last two
and a half weeks are going to be impactful here.
If the Nuggets take off in the last two and
a half weeks and Yokis plays great, they win the
(09:19):
Western Conference by like seven gamestead of the three and
a half they're up by right now, that's going to
register for me. If Mbiad continues to play well and
the Sixers continue to win, something about those ten games
that you know, Mbiad has been on a tear, eight
of them Philadelphia has won, so that means something. And
the Sixers right now, I think are percentage points behind
(09:41):
Boston for that number two seed in the East. Same
thing with Yannis. I mean, look, I think you have
to give Yannas credit for not just playing outstanding, but
having the Bucks with the best record in the NBA,
despite the fact that Chris Middleton has played twenty seven games.
Like everybody else has a pretty great co star or two,
whether it's James Harden and Tyrese Maxie in Philadelphia, You've
(10:04):
got you know, Jamal Murray, Michael Porter Junior, Aaron Gordon
in Philadelphia. I mean, look, Jannis isn't surrounded by stumble bumps,
but most of the best attributes of his best teammates,
but most of the best best teammates are defense right
like Brook Lopez right now is the front runner for
defensive Player of the Year. Drew Holliday good playmaker, All Star,
(10:27):
but I think known as much for he does defensively
as Way does offensively. Yannis is number two, has been
out for more than half the season, and that to
me is something hearing that that should not be overlooked.
I just can I just say something real quick, by
the way, while we're on the topic of these three guys.
So the Nuggets are playing the Bucks and Sixers back
(10:47):
to back next week. It should be a huge deal
for the NBA. We don't need to get into this
whole thing, but the NBA, it's like refusal to counter
program against the NCAA tournament to me is embarrassing. The
Nuggets and Bucks are playing on March twenty fifth, which
is a Saturday. It should be an ABC primetime game
and sin it's being shoved on too NBA TV, and
(11:08):
it just bothers me that they are willing to be
subservient to the NCAA tournament. It's like, this is ridiculous.
Stop doing this. I don't care how popular the tournament is.
That game deserves to be like sent to as big
of an audience as possible, or don't schedule that game
for me. Yeah, the NCAA Tournament, I think it's in
March every single year. I think we know that's gonna happen. Yeah,
(11:31):
and uh and Michael Malone complained about it the first
time as far as when I'm pretty sure when it
was going to be back. Yeah. Yeah. Johannese and Yokis
matching up against each other the last four MVPs have
gone to those two guys, and you know they're playing
it in a back to back scenario, and it just
(11:52):
it didn't make sense, and I thought it was wise
to call out. I think Rohan is right on that
point too. Um. Yeah, every everything Chris said is accurate
from the standpoint of why this is not an open
shut case. First of all, you have three guys that
are essentially I guess, two guys averaging thirty plus for
(12:13):
teams that are still in the hunt for a top
seed or at least kind of sniffing around that area.
Like you said, one of whom has missed his co
star for the vast majority of the season, and even
when he had him for the first part of that,
the first chunk of those games was not good. He
was not healthy and you could kind of tell it.
And Embiid was playing without Maxie for what was it,
(12:36):
a month and a half without Hardened for a month.
Harden probably should have been an All Star. He wasn't
there for a month. So even with regards to where
Philly is standings wise, you know, if he'd had his
full complement of guy as, you could make the argument
that they would have been higher up in the standings
and be kept them afloat at a time where they
very easily could have, you know, been further down in
(12:57):
the standings. What I think for me with Yokich, because
Chris made this point as well, Yokis just played fine.
It's not like he's been terrible through this rough stretch
for Denver. But what I will say is one it
seems to validate. I think there's no way it couldn't
validate the idea that wow, this defense is really bad
and that Yokis doesn't look good in it when they
(13:18):
are the worst defense in the league over those seven
eight games that they've struggled, but also because they've been
in a number of close games throughout that time too
that they've lost. One of the things that sometimes gets
criticized with Yokich is that, Okay, he's only averaging twenty
five points, twenty six points whatever in the midst of
averaging these triple doubles while other guys are going out
(13:39):
and getting thirty five and forty every other night. That
doesn't bother me until I start to watch some of
these close games and some of these close losses to
bad teams where Yoki finishes with fewer shots than I
think he could take in those games. He is historically efficient.
So when you've got games which Mom Murray is just
(14:00):
shooting really really really poorly, or other guys Bruce Brown,
for instance, has been really poor um since having a
great first half of the season, it makes me feel
like Yoki could maybe be a little bit more aggressive
than he's been. And uh So that's something that even
as he puts up great statistics in those games and
plays very well from a traditional standpoint, I'd like to
(14:23):
see him maybe take on more of like the sort
of stuff that you think of with an MVP. He's
wired to be unselfish, but there are times I wish
he'd be more selfish, And it's something that's made me
think about that a little bit more. Just as the
race Titans and as we get to the end of
the season, he pump fakes out a way too many threes.
He's got him. He needs to be more willing shooter.
I could not agree with you more, Chris. That's Rowan's
(14:45):
next piece for Nuggets dot Com coming out. What is it?
I can't talk about NBA players now without writing for
the team Nuggets. Nuggets in Heat Nuggets in heat. Okay,
mister Tatum is my MVP. Okay, yeah he was everybody
at Jason Datum as everybody. Yeah, alright, alright, yeah that
(15:07):
was easy. Um, all right newsletter? Okay, yeah, I think
I think people in Boston like me. Are you kidding me?
I could clapboard out there on a regular basis. Let's
talk about the Lakers. Last week, I made the bold
proclamation that the Lakers are going to win the Western Conference.
They then went out and laid nag against Houston and
(15:29):
lost at the buzzer to Dallas. Great prediction by me. Um.
They did rebound to beat the uh vaunted Orlando Magic
and have a pretty good stretch of games coming up
where we're gonna figure out exactly who they are as
they still wait for Lebron James to come back. So
with what we know about the Laker actually, before I
(15:49):
get into like the contender pretender stuff, Look, Anthony Davis
needed to play in that Houston game. I know other
people have written it, other people talked about it. I
know what the Lakers are doing. Like Anthony Dave is
like he's basically a glass menagerie out there, Like you know,
he won bump, but he's gonna fall apart. And I
know the Lakers are very leery of that. But if
(16:09):
Anthony Davis plays in that game against Houston, the Lakers win.
It's as simple as that. The Rockets, I know they
had a moment last week, would they beat Boston, they
beat La But if Anthony Davis plays, they win. And
you know, when they went out in that game, my
first thought was, man, you know, this feels like the
type of game that could They'll be looking back on saying, man,
we're like the seventh seed. If we had to win,
(16:31):
we'd be six and out of the play in Like.
That's a game they will probably live to regret. So
they also probably regret the Dallas game where they melted
down down the stretch with their free throws as well.
But anyway, I digress. Where the Lakers are right now.
Do you look at them, Rohan as contenders or pretenders
(16:53):
in the Western Conference? I just don't know in what
other world this team would be considered a contender when
they're in eleventh place in the conference. They're not even
in the plan as of today. Their best player now
has had years of being injured during critical importions of
(17:16):
the season and not able to play. And this foot injury,
we don't even really know what it is, but it's
serious enough to keep him out of all these important games.
Their second best player, to your point, as important and
dires season as these games are, is not in a
position to play back to backs. I've been I'll hold
my hand up and say I didn't think the trade
(17:39):
that they made at the deadline would move the needle
as much as it did for them. I think those
players have been much better fits than I thought they would.
The defense has been better than I thought it would
even without Lebron. In this stretch since the Mavericks game,
they're six and five. That's pretty good considering how quickly
the team has historically fallen apart without him during his
years in Los Angeles. But I know that there's some
(18:01):
concern about the top of this conference. You know, could
they beat the Kings, Could they beat the Nuggets? The
Sons have their own injury issues. I just think when
push comes to sub we've seen now for a couple
of years in a row. I don't know that I
can count on the health of Lebron and Anthony Davis.
I still't think in a playoff series. They're going to
(18:22):
have issues defensively, particularly in the backcourt, and I just
I understand the poll to call them a contender. I
definitely think a first round match between them and the Kings,
for example, would be fascinating to watch. I don't know
who I would pick, but the idea that they could
last four rounds, I just don't see it happening. So
(18:43):
I have to go pretender. Just there's an overwhelming amount
of evidence other than like, your argument for contender is
like they have Lebron, which is a really good argument,
but I'm just not seeing. Oh, it's more than just
they have Lebron. They have Lebron in a conference that
doesn't have a two thousand and sixteen to twenty twenty Warriors.
(19:03):
They have Lebron and a D in a conference where
if you were picking a team with top two players,
you'd probably still pick them if they were both healthy
going into the postseason. So you know, there are a
lot of reasons. And you mentioned where they stand in
in the standings right now, and yeah, they're in eleventh place,
but they're one game back in the lost column sixth,
(19:24):
So like this is the kind of thing that by
the time people listen to this podcast, the Lakers could
be in you know, seventh in that moment. But Harry,
what's your take on a contender pretender for the Lakers.
I mean, it's it's not the easiest call. Um. I
think I would lean closer to contender just because what
(19:45):
here's my reason though, like what it's done. Just say,
by the way, Rohan is like if we did heat
contender pretender, he'd say heat or contender. Just I literally
wrote a story about the Eat being pretenders, an I'll
send you the lake. Don't worry. You must have missed out,
so I'm not. I'm not coming down decidedly like all
(20:06):
their contenters, no question. But the thing is with how
well they've performed, And by that I don't necessarily mean
winslasses because we're talking already about the fact that they
lose games because you know, Anthony Davis sits out. So
the whole of the team is kind of what I'm
focused on. And if they're healthy enough by the time
(20:27):
that Lebron gets back, they've already since the trade deadline.
I was looking at this tweet from Trevor Lane from
Lakers Nation ninth in net rating, first in defensive efficiency
ninth and pace number one and free throws attempted number
one and opponent's free throws attempted, meaning that they've limited those.
(20:51):
It's a team. They've managed to do this without Lebron
and for the most part without Lebron, and so if
you add him to that and it clicks, and it
I mean, we only what did we get one game
of that with Lebron playing with the new guys on
this team. I think we got one game of it,
so we didn't see enough to know. Do I think
it's really likely? No? But is it more likely that
(21:13):
they could really beat a good team in the first round?
They could maybe take down the Kings in the first
round and then be competitive in the second round. Which
at that point, if you're able to do that, if
you're able to get to the Conference semis and get
to a six seven game series, by definition, aren't you
(21:35):
kind of a contender at least to win the conference?
Like I don't think it's that far fetched. It doesn't
mean that it's an automatic thing for them. There's questions, certainly.
I wonder too as we sit and talk about them
and the Kings. The Kings might also blow the doors
off them just because of how much offense they have
and how fast they are. They have a lot of
They have literally the most cohesion in the league compared
(21:57):
to the Lakers that might have the least centering them
and maybe the Suns. But I would say the Lakers
because they had a package trade that you know, swapped
in and out three or four people. So I think
that the potential is there. It's Lebron, So I'm not
willing to just say that they're not contenders based on
the profile that they put together without him, and then
(22:18):
they're gonna add him to it as well. Yeah, I'm
gonna stick with my original prediction that the Lakers win
the West. I'm not backing down one bit from that.
The Mavericks game bothered me more than the Rockets game.
Like the Rockets game, you you can kind of put
your finger to and say, you didn't have a D
(22:39):
that's why you lost. The Mavericks game, they did have
a D. He didn't play great. They you know, brick
free throws down the stretch. You gotta beat Dallas at home,
you gotta um. It was also the third or fourth
time this year who Anthony Davis credit to him but
he's had to after a lossment like that was my fault,
Like that's like he didn't play well. Not a great
(23:00):
season for him, he didn't play well in that one.
But I'm still buying the Lakers airing. You mentioned some
of the statistics. They're jumping up in a lot of
key categories. But look, when we record this next week,
I don't know what my opinion is going to be.
Because you look at the schedule and you've got a
game on Wednesday against the Durant less Suns that should
(23:22):
be winnable at home, even though Phoenix is still pretty
good without Kevin Durant. Then you play Oklahoma City, which
is motivated solely by getting Shaye Guilt at Alexander on
the All NBA team, and that's about it. You got
them at home. Then you've got back to back Patrick
Beverley Revenge Tour games against the Bulls, so you've you've
(23:45):
got winnable games, like they should come out of this
next four game stretch with three wins, Like they should
beat the Bulls a couple of times. They should beat
Oklahoma City at home. Maybe you beat Phoenix in a
toss up type of game. But to me, This next
stretch is gonna be really telling about the state of
the Lakers. I think even if they come out five hundred,
that's not good enough over these next four games. But
(24:06):
if they win three of the next four, chances are
we record this next week, they're sitting in the seventh
seat at worse at that point, because they'll have a
win over the Thunder, they'll you'll gain some ground on
maybe Utah. Like I just I'm still buying into the
Lakers despite a debacle of a week last week where
they lost some some very winnable games. That's and look
(24:29):
it all clearly is contingental Lebron being healthy. But I
think they still have enough to get into the play in,
And if Lebron is playing in the play in, I'm
gonna buy them all day long. That's if they get
the ones. See if they have to play the Nuggets,
and then I still think they can beat the Nuggets.
(24:49):
They but the fact that you and a lot of
other people would think that they can, and if that's
the case, the discourse around MVP and how that turns
out would oh, the the the negative or anti Yoki
contingent would be loud and probably right like Look, that's
a different conversation. But you know, if Yokich flames out
(25:13):
early in the playoffs and not just first round, he
flames out in the second round, you know, the critics
of him will have a valid argument to make. That's
that's a conversation we'll get into, and we all agree
that the the funniest outcome would be embiad winning the
MVP and losing in the second round. Yes, because MBAT
(25:36):
supporters conveniently never mentioned the fact that Yoki has been
to a conference finals and EMBAT hasn't correct em beat
and the Sixers lost to the vaunted Atlanta Hawks a
couple of years ago. Um in the conference What do
you mean the Hawks has been great since then? Yeah, yeah,
they're tearing it up, tearing it up. A lot of
stability that front office too, and the coaching match Ye
(25:58):
John Moren, John Morant, he is back, most likely, it seems.
On Wednesday in the Grizzlies game against Houston. It will
have been nine games that John Morant, well, he will
have been suspended for the full eight games. It'll be
nine games that he will have missed since the incident
(26:18):
in the Denver nightclub where he flashed a gun, eight
game suspension by the NBA. He was available on Monday,
did not play. There need to be some kind of
ramp up for Morant where he gets out there. The
Grizzlies have had some problems since then, Brandon Clark done
for the season, Achilles tear, Dylan Brooks still a great
defensive player, but as volatile, perhaps as he's ever been.
(26:43):
So herring. With Morant scheduled to return on Wednesday and
the Grizzlies still in that second place ish position battling Sacramento,
is this season still salvageable in Memphis? Uh? Yeah, But
(27:04):
I mean, obviously you can tell by the tone in
which I answered that how I feel Steven Adams like
becomes massive for them, and it doesn't sound like they're
expecting them back until maybe right before the season's over
or you know, right at the start of the playoffs.
It's a team that offensive rebounding matters a whole lot too,
(27:25):
and also that we've thought of, you know, the Grizzlies
historically being like this GrITT and grind franchise. Obviously, Jock
can jump over buildings and stuff like that, but they
are still a physical, annoying pest of a team between
Jaren Jackson, Steven Adams, even you know, Dylan Brooks certainly
has that reputation. He also has a reputation from other things.
(27:47):
But I just don't see them getting very far. I
think Brandon Clark and Steven Adams being out becomes too
big of a problem. We know that they've won a
ton of games, you know, twenty and five or whatever
they were last year without jaw tysh Jones is going
to bring it every night and and be a you know,
the best backup in the league and fill in for job.
(28:07):
But it's I just don't see it if they don't
have the physicality that they've had. I mean, I think
that that frankly, between the physicality and also their athleticism
is part of why even when jack went down last
year against the Warriors, that they were able to win
that massive blowout game and I think maybe even take
one other game from the Warriors. I just don't see
(28:30):
it if Steven Adams isn't right or if he's not healthy.
So I'm willing to give them a slight chance, but
to me, it just feels like it was too uneven
of a season. I think at one point, they were
actually my favorite to come out of the West. But
it feels like too much has happened since then. I
hope I'm wrong. I hope that they're interesting. I hope
that they're compelling. I hope that Jaw is still his
(28:51):
normal self as far as his ability. But it just
kind of feels like there's been too much swirling above
this team. On top of the fact that as all
this was happening, Brandon Clark is out for the season
and Steven Adams isn't right. Yeah, I will say I've
been impressed. They've won six of their last seven, I believe,
which is pretty good. All of those obviously without Morant,
(29:12):
they've typically played well without him. My bigger concern with them,
I think is, you know, we talked about this after
the trade deadline. I just don't know that they did
enough to upgrade their roster. The Brady Clark injury hurts
a lot. He was really really good for them in
the playoffs last year, Like he came in and really
changed some of those playoff games against both the Wolves
(29:33):
and the Warriors. But I just look at their rotation, like,
are we gonna get a like serious all Domin minutes
in the playoffs. Are we gonna get serious con charm
minutes in the playoffs? David Roddy just going through their rotation.
I mean, I think they have a top five when
Adams is healthy. That's as good as kind of any
top five in the league. They have a really good
(29:53):
starting lineup. Dylan Brooks, as annoying as he is, I'm
enjoying the Dylan Brooks experience overall. I think we can
more unsanitized villains like him in the league. But I
just don't think they have enough shooting. And when they
lose a guy like Kyle Anderson like they did in
the offseason they traded away d'y Anthony Mountain, Like, who
(30:13):
are who are there? You're gonna need a seventh guy
at least in the playoffs. They have Tyas s Jones,
Like is it gonna be Luke Kennard? Like, wh Who's
gonna play in the front court? You know Xavier Tillman,
I think his minutes going down to the playoffs. We
know Jaren Jackson Junior is gonna be in foul trouble,
So like, are you counting on Aldama to pick up
major minutes in a Round three playoff game. I just
(30:34):
don't see it happening. So to me, my questions really
come down to the youth of their rotation and the
fact that they're shooting is just I don't think good
enough when the game slows down. I think Luke Knar
has been good for them. He's playing what twenty twenty
five minutes a game, shooting like forty eight percent from three,
(30:54):
So he's kind of been as advertised. He's just not
the kind of two way player that they were looking
to get, whether it was Ojan and Obe Bridges in Brooklyn,
Michael Bridges in Brooklyn, like, he just is what he is.
He can space the floor and give you spot minutes.
I actually think they are the most vulnerable of the
(31:17):
top three seeds to lose early Sacramento. They don't defend anybody,
but they have great continuity, great chemistry. They've either played
the most games together with their lineup or top five
in the NBA in that category Denver. If they're fully healthy,
(31:38):
I think they'll be fine the next couple of weeks.
I mean, that's the team i'd want to play if
I was a six seven, eight seed. Yeah, you've got
to contend with job but if Steven Adams continues to
be out, and look, they're not saying Steven Adams is
definitely going to be back in a few weeks. They're
basically saying they gonna reevaluate him in a few weeks.
So that's not encouraging. And Clark row on to your point,
(32:00):
he was invaluable to them in the playoffs, a strong
role player last year. I mean, you gotta still contend
with Morant and deal with Dillon Brooks defense, And yeah,
they've been great against the Warriors this year, but I'd
want to play them in the first round because yeah,
look they're a great defensive team overall, but they still
don't defend the three point line incredibly well and their
(32:20):
half court offense is average league average at this point.
So I just I'd want to play them in the
first round. And we still don't know what Morant's gonna
be like, Like I tend to believe he's gonna be
fine when he comes back. He's gonna be the John
Morant that we've seen all season long. If you watch
the game on Monday, he was just bathed in adoration
when he walked onto the floor by the Memphis crowd.
(32:43):
He's gonna be re embraced by everyone there. So I
think it's gonna be fine individually as far as Morant goes.
But they've just suffered too many loss that's been too
combustible this season for me to believe in them. I look.
I mean, we could say it's about the bottom of
the Western Conferent with anybody, But if it's Warriors, Clippers, Lakers, Mavericks,
(33:04):
the teams that are in that mix for that six, seven,
eight seed right now, if I was them, I'd want
to play Memphis in the first round. A tough place
to play in Memphis. FedEx Forum is bumping in the playoffs,
that's for sure. But um, I don't. I'd want to
play that team, probably more than I want to play Denver,
and more than I want to play Sacramento. I'll let
(33:25):
go that. I do think. I do think that they
are gonna be vulnerable in the playoffs and it's gonna
be fascinating to watch that play out. I really hope
we get a Warriors Grizzlies first round matchup. I'm pulling
hard for that. Adam, So the Warriors, if the league
is reasy to have, Yeah, yeah, Warriors. He to have
Wiggins back for them. We have no idea what's going
(33:48):
on with him. But if they don't have Wiggins back,
they'll lose. Just like they've lost one every game against
Memphis this season, they'll they'll lose that series too without
Andrew Wiggins. Last thing I want to talk about. It
was reported by ESPN this week that Michael Jordan is
uh it seems like moving towards selling his majority steak
(34:08):
in the Charlotte Hornets. It seems like Jordan will stay
on as a majority owner, but he will transfer what
the majority of his shares his steak in the team
to two of the minority owners of the Hornets. Jordan
bought the team from Bob Johnson back in twenty ten
for the price of a hot dog. Comparatively speaking, like
(34:30):
one hundred and seventy five million dollars. That team's probably
gonna have a valuation of in the neighbor of three billion,
mostly two and a half three billion. Oh my goodness,
it doesn't matter, it doesn't matter, it doesn't matter. I
mean the Phoenix Suns. I know they're in Phoenix and
that's a nice destination, but what was their valuation? Four billion? Like,
(34:52):
come on, like that, Oh my goodness, the Hornets will
get a three billion valuation um under Jordan's leadership. The
Hornets have done nothing, Like They've had what two or
three first round appearances, They've drafted poorly. They've got a
reputation for being really cheap there. I mean, their practice
(35:14):
facility is in their arena, Like it's one of the worst,
if not the worst practice facilities in the entire NBA.
Right now, Herring does this is Michael Jordan's stewardship ownership
of the Hornets, Does that diminish him at all? Like
he's always gonna be, you know, Michael Jordan greatest player
of all time arguably, But it has been a abject
(35:36):
failure in Charlotte. If this is the end of the
road for Jordan, it has been a failure. And without
knowing the outcome of the draft lottery, it's not like
the future is very bright, like LaMelo ball is there.
You know, said recently he's happy in Charlotte. He's probably
just happy to get that next contract in Charlotte. Then
we'll see what happens. But they're bad and outside of
(35:59):
hitting a lot and getting Victor Wemba yama I don't
see a pathway to them getting better anytime soon. I
just can't really. To me, they're two relatively separate things
in the same way that like Magic Johnson not being
a model executive, And you take that however you want.
(36:20):
I mean, actually is a model executive, but not from
an NBA standpoint. I mean, you know, it's a great businessman,
I think, not a very great late night talk show host.
I just think that they're two two both t oo
and two separate things. For me, I do think, and
(36:42):
the most I marry those things in my mind is
the idea of like, yo, Michael would hate playing for
this team, and so maybe there is something to be
said for that, of like how can't you manage it better?
But also, we've watched people be coaching flameoutse we've watched
Phil Jackson be an executive flameout. I already mentioned Magic Johnson.
Most people don't have a second act as far as this,
(37:04):
I mean, pat Riley has been obviously wildly successful, but
most most people really aren't good two aspects of the
same thing, if you could really call it that. The
frustrations that I would have if I'm a fan, is that,
like you said, the team has been cheap. I think
we all think of Michael Jordan as just being this
(37:27):
uber wealthy owner because, like you know, there are very
few athletes that have ever touched that stratosphere of money.
The reality is, there's a reason that very few athletes
have touched a stresspere of money. They don't have it
to buy a team. So it's like the reality for
why he might be cheap or why the team might
operate in a cheap fashion relative to everybody else, is
(37:48):
that he's not Steve Balmber. You know, it's it's you know,
it's different, but that that's always herring. That's always the
high end of it, right, Steve Bombers richer than everybody,
But like Michael George net worth is two point one
billion dollars according to Forbes. Um he's got a seemingly
endless revenue stream with the Jordan brand. Um he's gotten,
(38:10):
he's got the cash. Like, I don't believe that he's
less wealthy than Tilman for Teita in Houston. I don't
believe he's maybe all right, but how about this, I
don't believe he's less wealthy than Wick Grosbeck in Boston.
Like I just don't believe it. Okay, I think he's
(38:31):
got the cash and for whatever reason, he refused to
spend it. Not just on payroll, which is one thing,
like you don't have to just go out there and
bloat your payroll because that doesn't always work. But I
mentioned the facilities which are awful. Like you, you guys
have been down to Charlotte and gone to their arena
(38:53):
and walked onto their practice floor which is small. I'd
never been in their weight room, but I read about
it being small as well. From what I read like,
there's plans to do to build a new PRAX facility
in the future somewhere in Charlotte. But in the ten
plus years Jordans owned this team, they have not broken
ground on that up until this point. And that matters,
(39:14):
and so too, doesn't matters that Jordan's never really hired
a expensive, high profile head coach. It's been like Steve
Clifford seventeen times and you know you've you've had James
brego in there again. Don't have to splurge on coach.
(39:35):
I thought he got a raw deal at the end,
but they didn't spend on head coach. When you talk
to people down there, they do have one of the
thinner front offices in terms of scouting department and personnel.
That they have not invested in a lot of assets
when it comes to the front office, and that which
(39:58):
is kind of well known around the league at this point.
That's on Jordan, Like every team wants to have a
bunch of people that work there. Jordan elected not to spend.
Now he's done some good things. I mean, Adam Silver
would be quick to tell you that, you know what,
five six years ago, Jordan was heavily influential in the
CBA negotiations because he was really able to bridge the
(40:18):
gap between player and owner, because who else could do
it better than Michael Jordan. So he has that in
his positive column, But you can't get past the fact
that a guy with billions of dollars refused to invest
much of it in his team, and that I think
(40:39):
has been a negative for Jordan and continues to prevent
the Hornets from really becoming any kind of destination. Like, yeah,
players make you a destination, and if LaMelo Ball becomes
a superstar, he will attract free agents to come down
there and play with him. But players know who has
great facilities, They know as the beautiful practice facility. They
know who has the great arena, They know all these things,
(41:02):
and Charlotte has not built that kind of infrastructure in
the city, and that after a decade or what thirteen
years now, that falls on Michael Jordan. Yeah, I mean
there's some stuff too that just you know, I thought
it was smart of them too. Obviously, in hindsight, was
smart of them to decide not to because the Kimball
(41:24):
walker thing was such a big deal of like, well,
this is the biggest star you've had, are you gonna
let them walk? And they made the decision to do that,
and they knew, they knew his knee was questionable. They knew, right.
I think the challenge is that they just haven't drafted
well enough, which probably does get back to the point
you were just making about how much are you investing
(41:47):
in your front office to really find great players at
that level or kind of under every rock, behind every
tree sort of thing. They haven't hit on enough of those.
They've made some bad, really bad calls. The Nick Batoum
contract for them was brutal, but also man um You know,
when you have a good roster around guys, you're asking
(42:08):
guys to do a little bit less than you know,
if you have a bad roster, you're asking everybody to
do a little bit more or a lot more. And uh,
you know, Nick Batoum bounced right back right after that.
He was good before that. So it a lot of
it points to what you're saying, Chris, I agree. Well,
look Rohan, um Roan, let me let me just throw
some some some facts out there, please, the resume of
(42:31):
the Jordan led front office, Um, just a few of them.
They got a bunch of assets for Bismack Biombo back
in twenty eleven. Um that didn't work out. They drafted
Shay Gildas Alexander would up trading him for Miles Bridges,
which before Bridges had his recent incident with domestic violence
(42:51):
that wasn't didn't look that bad. But right now Shane
Guilds Alexander is looking like an all NBA guard and
Bridges not with the team. They drafted Frank Kaminski over
Miles Turner and Devin Booker and a recent draft pick
James bout Knight. He's athletic. That's about it at this point.
So like, yeah, would would they have drafted better if
(43:13):
they had a deeper front office if they put more
people around Mitch Cupchack, who look as a great reputation
as a general manager from his time with the Lakers.
But would they have done better, I don't know, but
they didn't. They didn't put these pieces around their top
executives in the front office, and the result has been
a decade or more of mostly bad decisions made when
(43:37):
it comes to personnel. And I don't even mention Gordon
Hayward and that you know, absurd contract that got them nowhere. Yeah,
to me, this discussion just comes back to what it
really shows is your en quote success really does not
translate to you being a good front office executive. That's
what it comes down to. When you have, like you said,
(43:58):
probably most Steeple's greatest player of all time, just unable
to do anything coherent, And like you said, he's been cheap.
He's also there's times where he's been the bridge to players.
There's other times where I think players have gotten into
it with him when it comes to collective bargaining stuff
and have been an upset with where he stood on
certain issues. So yeah, I think it'll frankly, in the
(44:18):
long run, be better for his legacy that he's stepping
away now instead of kind of just presiding over this
for a long time, and you know, people just remembering
him as a cheap owner, and you know, a new
generation of players being like, why is this team so bad? Like,
if anything, he should have gotten off the ship earlier.
You know, good for him for cashing out, But I
think legacy wise, long run, this is probably the right
(44:40):
move just to get stop being associated with this as
quickly as possible. But yeah, there's really just no rhyme
or reason to what makes a great front office executive.
And I think we're seeing that with Michael Jordan, where
I think you could argue what made him great as
a player is what makes him not good as an executive.
It's just like, hey, do this better. I was able
(45:00):
to do it right. We kind of saw that to
an extent in the Last Dance as well. So I'm
not worried about his legacy, taking a hint it is.
I'm more so just you know, the NBA, it just
has these franchises that feel like a black hole sometimes,
you know what I mean, It's like, what did just
a waste of time? Charlotte has been largely I mean
(45:21):
and as I say that, sometimes that's how they're runs,
because that's how they're run, Like Oklahoma City is not
a destination. But the Thunder have been a functional franchise
for you know, more than a decade now because they're
extremely well run because Clay Bennett went out there and
hired Sam Presty and told him he could do whatever
the hell he wants. And Presty has built that team
into at one winner and now has it on a
(45:44):
path to being another. Like I look, there are always
gonna be some guys that don't want to play in
Oklahoma City or Charlotte or Milwaukee. That's just gonna happen.
It's just the way it goes. But like when Lebron
was in Cleveland, guys wanted to play with him, like
you know, when you just go you players want to
be in winning situation as much as anything they do,
(46:04):
and Charlotte has never shown that they can operate like
a winning situation. I mean, Mike, Frankly, Michael Jordan's tenure
with the Wizards as a player was better than Michael
Jordan's tenure with the Hornets as an owner, Like it
was like he has it just hasn't it hasn't worked
(46:24):
out at all. It's depressing, and you were right just
having been to Charlotte, it's um yeah, man, I'm I'm
very fascinating to see if anyone can turn it around there.
At this point, you can be turned around. You just look,
everything can be turned. All you have to do is
look at like Team x's draft history. That's what I
(46:48):
always look at. What I'm evaluating, how a team got there.
That's what always boils down to, like, if you draft well,
you are not going to be in this shitty situation.
If you draft poorly, you were going to find yourself
in this situation. It's as simple as that. And I
mentioned just some of them, like if they had draft
Devin Booker over Frank Kaminski, where would they be? If
they had held on to Shay Gildas Alexander, where would
they be? Like I'm gonna add this into just because
(47:13):
I remember seeing the reports about it. Then it kind
of went away after Wolds reported it, the Miles Bridges stuff.
If they bring that guy back, Like, yeah, I think
they floated that out there. They floated it. I hope
it was just a trial balloon. But like, if they
bring him back and they continue to suck, they'll deserve it.
(47:33):
Like I'm not an advocate of people not getting second chances,
but I'm telling you right now, just as we sit
with the job Morant thing and we're like, what can
actually be learned in a week, essentially that whole thing
with the Miles Bridges thing, I hope he's gotten help
more than anything. I hope that the woman that he
(47:55):
was with has gotten help and everything that she needs
first and foremost. But I don't like that that was
just such an ugly thing, and it was very publicized,
like what was said and what allegedly happened, what essentially
did happen given the way he pleaded So um, I
you know, I just I would hate to see them,
(48:19):
whether it's under Michael or anybody else. We're so desperate
to win that we're gonna go bring him back. I
don't know, what do you think? Do you think Miles
Bridges belong? Like I actually think Myles Bridges should get
another opportunity at some point, Like he will have effectively
served a one year suspension out of the NBA, not
making a dollar. Whenever he comes back, the NBA's probably
(48:41):
gonna slap him with a twenty five game suspension for
what he pled to. So, like, I feel like a
season and a half is a proportionate response to what
Myles Bridges did in terms of punish bad. I don't
believe Myles Bridge should be exiled from the NBA forever. Okay,
so then if that, if that's the case, like maybe
(49:01):
that's fair. I'm not I'll be real with you and
saying that I'm not exactly sure what his penalty should
look like. I haven't really thought that far ahead. I
know that floating it in the middle of the first
season that he's out felt inappropriate to me. It did,
Oh yeah, and they knew that, Like, believe me when
that when that was put out there, I think he
had Bridges show up at a game in Los Angeles,
(49:21):
right he was sitting in the stands um. I think
they they felt the backlash at that point and okay, yeah,
because we haven't heard a thing about it since then,
and that You're right, it does kind of feel that way.
I think he at some point, assuming that he I
hope he does put in some work, get some sort
of counseling, um, meaningful counseling for him. To me, when
(49:45):
I say that there should be real, real things, real
steps taken here. I don't think that you, like who,
who's gonna feel comfortable giving that dude like a long
contract after that? So if nobody talking, nobody, Okay, So
so maybe we'll have to see what it looks like.
Maybe it's Charlotte, maybe it's not. Maybe it would make
more sense for Charlotte to be the team because this
(50:06):
was the team that kind of raised him. I don't
know how that works, but I just know it left
a really bad taste in my mouth from from the
trial balloon aspect of it was very ugly, and it
tells you also the direction in which the team seem
to be leaning that they've infloated in the first place. Yeah,
what what Miles Bridges did was abhorrence and what he
(50:28):
pled to was awful. Um. I just a question I
would ask, is what what is an appropriate punishment for that?
Um it's a fair question, a fair question. He was
in line for a max contract, didn't get it. He
has missed this entire season, He's going to miss a
chunk of next season. I look, I feel like that's proportional.
(50:52):
I feel like that's a reasonable punishment. Now, who will
sign him. I don't know. He's not going to get
more than like a one year deal this point. It's
gonna be a show me type of deal from whether
Charlotte or somebody else. I think Charlotte will still retain
his rights even going into next year. He's didn't play,
so they have matching rights on bridges. But it feels
(51:12):
like if he does come back, he will be with
Charlotte on a very short term deal. That that then
we'll see what happens when it comes to that, Fellows.
Good stuff, Rohan. Next week you can go back to
discussing like the Jazz and why they've been able to
surge despite Lowry Marketing's injury. Listen, big win for Will
(51:35):
Vardy against his former ball club the other night. How
about the Utah Jazz. We're gonna have to the Celtics,
keep skidding. We'll have to talk about them next week too,
because that's an interesting story going into the playoffs. Good stuff, guys.
We will do it again next week. WHOA whoa will
(52:00):
ho
And we are back a crossover, open floor collaboration. Chris Mannix,
Chris Herring, Rohan not Garnie, still live from his basement.
I can't help myself with that. I can't. Every time
I see you pop up on the video screen in
what looks like a college dorm, I have to comment
(00:21):
on it. I'm sorry, man, I have to. I mean,
you are looking like you're coming from a TA black site.
I just want to point that out in front of
a black possible like I don't. Oh, I didn't realize
you're on some kind of collacoration Okay, yeah, still decorating,
still decorating curtains of this office. But you know, you
(00:44):
get the tank top going on with the with the
crappy blue curtain behind you. It's like, what are we
what are we doing? What are we doing here? You're
a grown man, Come on clean it up? Um? All right,
So Roan, you led last week's podcast and you hit
some substantive media topics. That's not what I do when
(01:05):
I'm leaving this ship. I go for the lowest of
low hanging fruit, the cabinet for listeners. So on this episode,
we are going to get into the MVP debate. We're
gonna talk about the state of the Lakers, and I'm
gonna ask the question, is Michael Jordan's legacy tainted by
what appears to be the end of his decade plus
(01:27):
run as majority owner of the Charlotte Hornets. So let's
start with the MVP vote, because look, if this has
been a toxic debate for weeks and weeks, months and
months now, you know I wrote about this, well, no,
I mean it's more toxic now that it's ever been before.
And I wrote about this on Tuesday on si dot
(01:49):
com and kind of the aftermath of Doc Rivers kind
of being asked about it before Monday night's game and
sort of lamenting how if you support one guy you
and have to seemingly hate the others, Right, And we're
talking about what is effectively a three player race at
this point between Nicola Yokis, the two time Raining MVP,
Joel Embiid, the two time Raining runner up, and jannat
(02:12):
ten to Coompo has got a couple of MVPs on
his mantle as well. So you know, we'll get into
the toxicity of it and why that's the case in
a minute. But is your vote fellas, and we'll start
with you herring real or mythical. Is your vote still
up for grabs as we enter the final two and
a half weeks of the regular season. Well, unless I
(02:33):
get a notification soon that I don't have a vote,
I did have one last year, a real one, so
I'm expecting to be asked to do it again. It's
still up for grabs. And I'll say that as someone
that as of about a month maybe a little bit
less than a month and a half ago, I think
I even wrote that it was looking like this was
(02:54):
going to be a third straight MVP for Yoki. And obviously,
when you talk about the run that just as of
last night, the Sixers lost for the first time in
nine games, and at the same time that the Nuggets
I think have lost six out of eight, and you know,
(03:15):
took the last couple of minutes to win those last
you know, those two that they actually did get, one
of which was against the Pistons. So Yokis has still
performed well statistically in those games. But just the nature
of why I think we were seeing the race shake
out the way it was was like the Nuggets were dominating.
Yokich has been dominant and was dominating it, maybe a
(03:37):
higher level than he had the last couple of years.
And you know, the Sixers were good, even though on
Bead was dominant too, And so it wasn't stunning to
me that, you know that once we saw things come
together the way they had, that Yokich kind of had
built up a lead, so to speak. It's tightened just
because the Sixers have played much better and the Nuggets
(04:01):
have played much worse. It's kind of what always happens.
It kind of feels like more of a traditional race,
so to speak, because of the fact that the you know,
the teams are playing the way they're playing, and I
think it's getting more attention. Add into that now what
you're talking about about the toxicity of it, and I
don't think the race is tightening because of that, but
(04:21):
it has kind of forced people who might not have
even really taken notice of what was happening with the
MVP race to look at it and say, h like,
why was yok It's the favorite? And by that I
mean fans, by the way, but why was yok It's
such a favorite when embiid was putting up these numbers?
And then add to that, the fact that you know
that the Sixers went on a nice run and the
(04:41):
Nuggets had a slide, So it's it's been interesting, frustrating.
I think it's it's kind of interesting timing too, for
all of it to happen at the same time. But
in a nutshell, despite the toxicity, I'm excited that there's
a race to be had, as opposed to it being
kind of a runaway the way it started to feel
at one point last year and even the year before that,
(05:03):
when there are a lot of injuries. So this is
what we should want. It's for the last few weeks
to matter beyond teams tanking to try to get a
certain opponent or teams tanking to get a draft pick.
Like it's it's a year full of parody, and I
think that the MVP race is not parody because it's
just two or three guys. But I'm excited that we've
got a tight enough race to actually talk about that matters. Yeah,
(05:25):
I don't have a vote. I guess it's because I'm
not named Chris. I don't know what's going on there
to reach out to someone at the NBA, but I'll
say that my votes definitely up for grabs. I think,
like a lot of people, I have a front runner,
I think, and I think my front runner has changed
throughout the course of the season. Something that bothers me
so much about the discourse around this award. I think
we're really kicked it off this year was you know,
(05:48):
ESPN does that straw poll of reporters for MVP, and
Yokich was the runaway leader the last time to the
straw poll, which was it's been a couple of months now,
and I think there was a lot of backlash. Why
is yoki so far out in front? Why is he
a near unanimous And that kind of kicked off a
(06:08):
whole new round of arguments. And I think those same
people who add Yokich number one runaway at that point,
I bet a lot of people have changed their minds.
And that's okay. That's how the race should go. The
more evidence you get, the more data points you collect,
the more you watch, the better information you have and
the better decision you make. And I think there was
a point where Yokich was my front runner. I don't
(06:29):
think that's the case anymore. And I just think that
we need to like make it okay to change your
mind about the MVP over the course of a season.
For some reason, it feels like if you champion a guy,
like last year, I wrote a big story. I mean Mannix,
you wrote an Embide story. I wrote a Yokic story.
I think we both made good arguments. And you know,
because I listed why I think Yoki should win and
(06:50):
compared him to Embide in certain categories. It's like you
get put into a camp and it's like you don't
think Embide's good at this, And it's like, I'm not
insulting a player by saying he's the second or third
best player in the NBA. You know what I mean.
Not to mention, we also do our top one hundred
rankings where we put Janness near the top. You know,
we put in Bead over certain people. So my votes
(07:10):
definitely up for grabs. I'm sure I'll write an awards
column towards the end of the season and that will
be my final decision by then. But I think it's
we need to make it normal to change your mind
about the MVP over the course of the season. Well, look,
minds have changed over the last three months. If you
go back to that first ESPN straw pole, Jason Tatum
(07:30):
was the leader of Matt straw Pool. A couple of
months later, in mid February, it was Nikola Yokes And
there are reasons for that. I mean, Nikoliokech at that
point was posting ridiculous numbers, averaging close to a triple double,
which he still is leading in all the major advanced
statistics categories, and Denver was the top team in the
Western Conference by a considerable amount. Those are all pretty
(07:53):
elemental criteria for positioning a guy as the front runner
for MVP. But things I've changed in the last month.
That's why my vote right now is completely up for grabs.
I mean, in the last month, I don't think Yokich
has taken a step back, But to Chris's point, the
Nuggets have. I mean, they lost four straight in mid March.
As we record this, they've lost five of their last seven.
(08:15):
They still have a pretty strong grip on the top
seed in the West. But you know, this is a
tough time, at least for the MVP vote. For yokis
to have his team be struggling, because while this team struggles,
his defensive deficiencies get highlighted. And that's always been the
anti Yokis argument that, as marvelous as he is offensively,
(08:37):
defensively sucks especially compared to you know, Joel Embiid and
Janace ten to coompo. So it certainly opened the door.
And while Yoki and the Nuggets have struggled, you've seen
Embiid go off for what ten straight games of thirty
plus points, including thirty seven on Monday. Janis as played great.
The Bucks had a fifteen game winning streak since that
(08:57):
last straw poll was put out, So yeah, I think
it has tightened considerably. And if the vote was taken
today with that straw poll, I think you'd see some
very different results. And like for me, the last two
and a half weeks are going to be impactful here.
If the Nuggets take off in the last two and
a half weeks and Yokis plays great, they win the
(09:19):
Western Conference by like seven gamestead of the three and
a half they're up by right now, that's going to
register for me. If Mbiad continues to play well and
the Sixers continue to win, something about those ten games
that you know, Mbiad has been on a tear, eight
of them Philadelphia has won, so that means something. And
the Sixers right now, I think are percentage points behind
(09:41):
Boston for that number two seed in the East. Same
thing with Yannis. I mean, look, I think you have
to give Yannas credit for not just playing outstanding, but
having the Bucks with the best record in the NBA,
despite the fact that Chris Middleton has played twenty seven games.
Like everybody else has a pretty great co star or two,
whether it's James Harden and Tyrese Maxie in Philadelphia, You've
(10:04):
got you know, Jamal Murray, Michael Porter Junior, Aaron Gordon
in Philadelphia. I mean, look, Jannis isn't surrounded by stumble bumps,
but most of the best attributes of his best teammates,
but most of the best best teammates are defense right
like Brook Lopez right now is the front runner for
defensive Player of the Year. Drew Holliday good playmaker, All Star,
(10:27):
but I think known as much for he does defensively
as Way does offensively. Yannis is number two, has been
out for more than half the season, and that to
me is something hearing that that should not be overlooked.
I just can I just say something real quick, by
the way, while we're on the topic of these three guys.
So the Nuggets are playing the Bucks and Sixers back
(10:47):
to back next week. It should be a huge deal
for the NBA. We don't need to get into this
whole thing, but the NBA, it's like refusal to counter
program against the NCAA tournament to me is embarrassing. The
Nuggets and Bucks are playing on March twenty fifth, which
is a Saturday. It should be an ABC primetime game
and sin it's being shoved on too NBA TV, and
(11:08):
it just bothers me that they are willing to be
subservient to the NCAA tournament. It's like, this is ridiculous.
Stop doing this. I don't care how popular the tournament is.
That game deserves to be like sent to as big
of an audience as possible, or don't schedule that game
for me. Yeah, the NCAA Tournament, I think it's in
March every single year. I think we know that's gonna happen. Yeah,
(11:31):
and uh and Michael Malone complained about it the first
time as far as when I'm pretty sure when it
was going to be back. Yeah. Yeah. Johannese and Yokis
matching up against each other the last four MVPs have
gone to those two guys, and you know they're playing
it in a back to back scenario, and it just
(11:52):
it didn't make sense, and I thought it was wise
to call out. I think Rohan is right on that
point too. Um. Yeah, every everything Chris said is accurate
from the standpoint of why this is not an open
shut case. First of all, you have three guys that
are essentially I guess, two guys averaging thirty plus for
(12:13):
teams that are still in the hunt for a top
seed or at least kind of sniffing around that area.
Like you said, one of whom has missed his co
star for the vast majority of the season, and even
when he had him for the first part of that,
the first chunk of those games was not good. He
was not healthy and you could kind of tell it.
And Embiid was playing without Maxie for what was it,
(12:36):
a month and a half without Hardened for a month.
Harden probably should have been an All Star. He wasn't
there for a month. So even with regards to where
Philly is standings wise, you know, if he'd had his
full complement of guy as, you could make the argument
that they would have been higher up in the standings
and be kept them afloat at a time where they
very easily could have, you know, been further down in
(12:57):
the standings. What I think for me with Yokich, because
Chris made this point as well, Yokis just played fine.
It's not like he's been terrible through this rough stretch
for Denver. But what I will say is one it
seems to validate. I think there's no way it couldn't
validate the idea that wow, this defense is really bad
and that Yokis doesn't look good in it when they
(13:18):
are the worst defense in the league over those seven
eight games that they've struggled, but also because they've been
in a number of close games throughout that time too
that they've lost. One of the things that sometimes gets
criticized with Yokich is that, Okay, he's only averaging twenty
five points, twenty six points whatever in the midst of
averaging these triple doubles while other guys are going out
(13:39):
and getting thirty five and forty every other night. That
doesn't bother me until I start to watch some of
these close games and some of these close losses to
bad teams where Yoki finishes with fewer shots than I
think he could take in those games. He is historically efficient.
So when you've got games which Mom Murray is just
(14:00):
shooting really really really poorly, or other guys Bruce Brown,
for instance, has been really poor um since having a
great first half of the season, it makes me feel
like Yoki could maybe be a little bit more aggressive
than he's been. And uh So that's something that even
as he puts up great statistics in those games and
plays very well from a traditional standpoint, I'd like to
(14:23):
see him maybe take on more of like the sort
of stuff that you think of with an MVP. He's
wired to be unselfish, but there are times I wish
he'd be more selfish, And it's something that's made me
think about that a little bit more. Just as the
race Titans and as we get to the end of
the season, he pump fakes out a way too many threes.
He's got him. He needs to be more willing shooter.
I could not agree with you more, Chris. That's Rowan's
(14:45):
next piece for Nuggets dot Com coming out. What is it?
I can't talk about NBA players now without writing for
the team Nuggets. Nuggets in Heat Nuggets in heat. Okay,
mister Tatum is my MVP. Okay, yeah he was everybody
at Jason Datum as everybody. Yeah, alright, alright, yeah that
(15:07):
was easy. Um, all right newsletter? Okay, yeah, I think
I think people in Boston like me. Are you kidding me?
I could clapboard out there on a regular basis. Let's
talk about the Lakers. Last week, I made the bold
proclamation that the Lakers are going to win the Western Conference.
They then went out and laid nag against Houston and
(15:29):
lost at the buzzer to Dallas. Great prediction by me. Um.
They did rebound to beat the uh vaunted Orlando Magic
and have a pretty good stretch of games coming up
where we're gonna figure out exactly who they are as
they still wait for Lebron James to come back. So
with what we know about the Laker actually, before I
(15:49):
get into like the contender pretender stuff, Look, Anthony Davis
needed to play in that Houston game. I know other
people have written it, other people talked about it. I
know what the Lakers are doing. Like Anthony Dave is
like he's basically a glass menagerie out there, Like you know,
he won bump, but he's gonna fall apart. And I
know the Lakers are very leery of that. But if
(16:09):
Anthony Davis plays in that game against Houston, the Lakers win.
It's as simple as that. The Rockets, I know they
had a moment last week, would they beat Boston, they
beat La But if Anthony Davis plays, they win. And
you know, when they went out in that game, my
first thought was, man, you know, this feels like the
type of game that could They'll be looking back on saying, man,
we're like the seventh seed. If we had to win,
(16:31):
we'd be six and out of the play in Like.
That's a game they will probably live to regret. So
they also probably regret the Dallas game where they melted
down down the stretch with their free throws as well.
But anyway, I digress. Where the Lakers are right now.
Do you look at them, Rohan as contenders or pretenders
(16:53):
in the Western Conference? I just don't know in what
other world this team would be considered a contender when
they're in eleventh place in the conference. They're not even
in the plan as of today. Their best player now
has had years of being injured during critical importions of
(17:16):
the season and not able to play. And this foot injury,
we don't even really know what it is, but it's
serious enough to keep him out of all these important games.
Their second best player, to your point, as important and
dires season as these games are, is not in a
position to play back to backs. I've been I'll hold
my hand up and say I didn't think the trade
(17:39):
that they made at the deadline would move the needle
as much as it did for them. I think those
players have been much better fits than I thought they would.
The defense has been better than I thought it would
even without Lebron. In this stretch since the Mavericks game,
they're six and five. That's pretty good considering how quickly
the team has historically fallen apart without him during his
years in Los Angeles. But I know that there's some
(18:01):
concern about the top of this conference. You know, could
they beat the Kings, Could they beat the Nuggets? The
Sons have their own injury issues. I just think when
push comes to sub we've seen now for a couple
of years in a row. I don't know that I
can count on the health of Lebron and Anthony Davis.
I still't think in a playoff series. They're going to
(18:22):
have issues defensively, particularly in the backcourt, and I just
I understand the poll to call them a contender. I
definitely think a first round match between them and the Kings,
for example, would be fascinating to watch. I don't know
who I would pick, but the idea that they could
last four rounds, I just don't see it happening. So
(18:43):
I have to go pretender. Just there's an overwhelming amount
of evidence other than like, your argument for contender is
like they have Lebron, which is a really good argument,
but I'm just not seeing. Oh, it's more than just
they have Lebron. They have Lebron in a conference that
doesn't have a two thousand and sixteen to twenty twenty Warriors.
(19:03):
They have Lebron and a D in a conference where
if you were picking a team with top two players,
you'd probably still pick them if they were both healthy
going into the postseason. So you know, there are a
lot of reasons. And you mentioned where they stand in
in the standings right now, and yeah, they're in eleventh place,
but they're one game back in the lost column sixth,
(19:24):
So like this is the kind of thing that by
the time people listen to this podcast, the Lakers could
be in you know, seventh in that moment. But Harry,
what's your take on a contender pretender for the Lakers.
I mean, it's it's not the easiest call. Um. I
think I would lean closer to contender just because what
(19:45):
here's my reason though, like what it's done. Just say,
by the way, Rohan is like if we did heat
contender pretender, he'd say heat or contender. Just I literally
wrote a story about the Eat being pretenders, an I'll
send you the lake. Don't worry. You must have missed out,
so I'm not. I'm not coming down decidedly like all
(20:06):
their contenters, no question. But the thing is with how
well they've performed, And by that I don't necessarily mean
winslasses because we're talking already about the fact that they
lose games because you know, Anthony Davis sits out. So
the whole of the team is kind of what I'm
focused on. And if they're healthy enough by the time
(20:27):
that Lebron gets back, they've already since the trade deadline.
I was looking at this tweet from Trevor Lane from
Lakers Nation ninth in net rating, first in defensive efficiency
ninth and pace number one and free throws attempted number
one and opponent's free throws attempted, meaning that they've limited those.
(20:51):
It's a team. They've managed to do this without Lebron
and for the most part without Lebron, and so if
you add him to that and it clicks, and it
I mean, we only what did we get one game
of that with Lebron playing with the new guys on
this team. I think we got one game of it,
so we didn't see enough to know. Do I think
it's really likely? No? But is it more likely that
(21:13):
they could really beat a good team in the first round?
They could maybe take down the Kings in the first
round and then be competitive in the second round. Which
at that point, if you're able to do that, if
you're able to get to the Conference semis and get
to a six seven game series, by definition, aren't you
(21:35):
kind of a contender at least to win the conference?
Like I don't think it's that far fetched. It doesn't
mean that it's an automatic thing for them. There's questions, certainly.
I wonder too as we sit and talk about them
and the Kings. The Kings might also blow the doors
off them just because of how much offense they have
and how fast they are. They have a lot of
They have literally the most cohesion in the league compared
(21:57):
to the Lakers that might have the least centering them
and maybe the Suns. But I would say the Lakers
because they had a package trade that you know, swapped
in and out three or four people. So I think
that the potential is there. It's Lebron, So I'm not
willing to just say that they're not contenders based on
the profile that they put together without him, and then
(22:18):
they're gonna add him to it as well. Yeah, I'm
gonna stick with my original prediction that the Lakers win
the West. I'm not backing down one bit from that.
The Mavericks game bothered me more than the Rockets game.
Like the Rockets game, you you can kind of put
your finger to and say, you didn't have a D
(22:39):
that's why you lost. The Mavericks game, they did have
a D. He didn't play great. They you know, brick
free throws down the stretch. You gotta beat Dallas at home,
you gotta um. It was also the third or fourth
time this year who Anthony Davis credit to him but
he's had to after a lossment like that was my fault,
Like that's like he didn't play well. Not a great
(23:00):
season for him, he didn't play well in that one.
But I'm still buying the Lakers airing. You mentioned some
of the statistics. They're jumping up in a lot of
key categories. But look, when we record this next week,
I don't know what my opinion is going to be.
Because you look at the schedule and you've got a
game on Wednesday against the Durant less Suns that should
(23:22):
be winnable at home, even though Phoenix is still pretty
good without Kevin Durant. Then you play Oklahoma City, which
is motivated solely by getting Shaye Guilt at Alexander on
the All NBA team, and that's about it. You got
them at home. Then you've got back to back Patrick
Beverley Revenge Tour games against the Bulls, so you've you've
(23:45):
got winnable games, like they should come out of this
next four game stretch with three wins, Like they should
beat the Bulls a couple of times. They should beat
Oklahoma City at home. Maybe you beat Phoenix in a
toss up type of game. But to me, This next
stretch is gonna be really telling about the state of
the Lakers. I think even if they come out five hundred,
that's not good enough over these next four games. But
(24:06):
if they win three of the next four, chances are
we record this next week, they're sitting in the seventh
seat at worse at that point, because they'll have a
win over the Thunder, they'll you'll gain some ground on
maybe Utah. Like I just I'm still buying into the
Lakers despite a debacle of a week last week where
they lost some some very winnable games. That's and look
(24:29):
it all clearly is contingental Lebron being healthy. But I
think they still have enough to get into the play in,
And if Lebron is playing in the play in, I'm
gonna buy them all day long. That's if they get
the ones. See if they have to play the Nuggets,
and then I still think they can beat the Nuggets.
(24:49):
They but the fact that you and a lot of
other people would think that they can, and if that's
the case, the discourse around MVP and how that turns
out would oh, the the the negative or anti Yoki
contingent would be loud and probably right like Look, that's
a different conversation. But you know, if Yokich flames out
(25:13):
early in the playoffs and not just first round, he
flames out in the second round, you know, the critics
of him will have a valid argument to make. That's
that's a conversation we'll get into, and we all agree
that the the funniest outcome would be embiad winning the
MVP and losing in the second round. Yes, because MBAT
(25:36):
supporters conveniently never mentioned the fact that Yoki has been
to a conference finals and EMBAT hasn't correct em beat
and the Sixers lost to the vaunted Atlanta Hawks a
couple of years ago. Um in the conference What do
you mean the Hawks has been great since then? Yeah, yeah,
they're tearing it up, tearing it up. A lot of
stability that front office too, and the coaching match Ye
(25:58):
John Moren, John Morant, he is back, most likely, it seems.
On Wednesday in the Grizzlies game against Houston. It will
have been nine games that John Morant, well, he will
have been suspended for the full eight games. It'll be
nine games that he will have missed since the incident
(26:18):
in the Denver nightclub where he flashed a gun, eight
game suspension by the NBA. He was available on Monday,
did not play. There need to be some kind of
ramp up for Morant where he gets out there. The
Grizzlies have had some problems since then, Brandon Clark done
for the season, Achilles tear, Dylan Brooks still a great
defensive player, but as volatile, perhaps as he's ever been.
(26:43):
So herring. With Morant scheduled to return on Wednesday and
the Grizzlies still in that second place ish position battling Sacramento,
is this season still salvageable in Memphis? Uh? Yeah, But
(27:04):
I mean, obviously you can tell by the tone in
which I answered that how I feel Steven Adams like
becomes massive for them, and it doesn't sound like they're
expecting them back until maybe right before the season's over
or you know, right at the start of the playoffs.
It's a team that offensive rebounding matters a whole lot too,
(27:25):
and also that we've thought of, you know, the Grizzlies
historically being like this GrITT and grind franchise. Obviously, Jock
can jump over buildings and stuff like that, but they
are still a physical, annoying pest of a team between
Jaren Jackson, Steven Adams, even you know, Dylan Brooks certainly
has that reputation. He also has a reputation from other things.
(27:47):
But I just don't see them getting very far. I
think Brandon Clark and Steven Adams being out becomes too
big of a problem. We know that they've won a
ton of games, you know, twenty and five or whatever
they were last year without jaw tysh Jones is going
to bring it every night and and be a you know,
the best backup in the league and fill in for job.
(28:07):
But it's I just don't see it if they don't
have the physicality that they've had. I mean, I think
that that frankly, between the physicality and also their athleticism
is part of why even when jack went down last
year against the Warriors, that they were able to win
that massive blowout game and I think maybe even take
one other game from the Warriors. I just don't see
(28:30):
it if Steven Adams isn't right or if he's not healthy.
So I'm willing to give them a slight chance, but
to me, it just feels like it was too uneven
of a season. I think at one point, they were
actually my favorite to come out of the West. But
it feels like too much has happened since then. I
hope I'm wrong. I hope that they're interesting. I hope
that they're compelling. I hope that Jaw is still his
(28:51):
normal self as far as his ability. But it just
kind of feels like there's been too much swirling above
this team. On top of the fact that as all
this was happening, Brandon Clark is out for the season
and Steven Adams isn't right. Yeah, I will say I've
been impressed. They've won six of their last seven, I believe,
which is pretty good. All of those obviously without Morant,
(29:12):
they've typically played well without him. My bigger concern with them,
I think is, you know, we talked about this after
the trade deadline. I just don't know that they did
enough to upgrade their roster. The Brady Clark injury hurts
a lot. He was really really good for them in
the playoffs last year, Like he came in and really
changed some of those playoff games against both the Wolves
(29:33):
and the Warriors. But I just look at their rotation, like,
are we gonna get a like serious all Domin minutes
in the playoffs. Are we gonna get serious con charm
minutes in the playoffs? David Roddy just going through their rotation.
I mean, I think they have a top five when
Adams is healthy. That's as good as kind of any
top five in the league. They have a really good
(29:53):
starting lineup. Dylan Brooks, as annoying as he is, I'm
enjoying the Dylan Brooks experience overall. I think we can
more unsanitized villains like him in the league. But I
just don't think they have enough shooting. And when they
lose a guy like Kyle Anderson like they did in
the offseason they traded away d'y Anthony Mountain, Like, who
(30:13):
are who are there? You're gonna need a seventh guy
at least in the playoffs. They have Tyas s Jones,
Like is it gonna be Luke Kennard? Like, wh Who's
gonna play in the front court? You know Xavier Tillman,
I think his minutes going down to the playoffs. We
know Jaren Jackson Junior is gonna be in foul trouble,
So like, are you counting on Aldama to pick up
major minutes in a Round three playoff game. I just
(30:34):
don't see it happening. So to me, my questions really
come down to the youth of their rotation and the
fact that they're shooting is just I don't think good
enough when the game slows down. I think Luke Knar
has been good for them. He's playing what twenty twenty
five minutes a game, shooting like forty eight percent from three,
(30:54):
So he's kind of been as advertised. He's just not
the kind of two way player that they were looking
to get, whether it was Ojan and Obe Bridges in Brooklyn,
Michael Bridges in Brooklyn, like, he just is what he is.
He can space the floor and give you spot minutes.
I actually think they are the most vulnerable of the
(31:17):
top three seeds to lose early Sacramento. They don't defend anybody,
but they have great continuity, great chemistry. They've either played
the most games together with their lineup or top five
in the NBA in that category Denver. If they're fully healthy,
(31:38):
I think they'll be fine the next couple of weeks.
I mean, that's the team i'd want to play if
I was a six seven, eight seed. Yeah, you've got
to contend with job but if Steven Adams continues to
be out, and look, they're not saying Steven Adams is
definitely going to be back in a few weeks. They're
basically saying they gonna reevaluate him in a few weeks.
So that's not encouraging. And Clark row on to your point,
(32:00):
he was invaluable to them in the playoffs, a strong
role player last year. I mean, you gotta still contend
with Morant and deal with Dillon Brooks defense, And yeah,
they've been great against the Warriors this year, but I'd
want to play them in the first round because yeah,
look they're a great defensive team overall, but they still
don't defend the three point line incredibly well and their
(32:20):
half court offense is average league average at this point.
So I just I'd want to play them in the
first round. And we still don't know what Morant's gonna
be like, Like I tend to believe he's gonna be
fine when he comes back. He's gonna be the John
Morant that we've seen all season long. If you watch
the game on Monday, he was just bathed in adoration
when he walked onto the floor by the Memphis crowd.
(32:43):
He's gonna be re embraced by everyone there. So I
think it's gonna be fine individually as far as Morant goes.
But they've just suffered too many loss that's been too
combustible this season for me to believe in them. I look.
I mean, we could say it's about the bottom of
the Western Conferent with anybody, But if it's Warriors, Clippers, Lakers, Mavericks,
(33:04):
the teams that are in that mix for that six, seven,
eight seed right now, if I was them, I'd want
to play Memphis in the first round. A tough place
to play in Memphis. FedEx Forum is bumping in the playoffs,
that's for sure. But um, I don't. I'd want to
play that team, probably more than I want to play Denver,
and more than I want to play Sacramento. I'll let
(33:25):
go that. I do think. I do think that they
are gonna be vulnerable in the playoffs and it's gonna
be fascinating to watch that play out. I really hope
we get a Warriors Grizzlies first round matchup. I'm pulling
hard for that. Adam, So the Warriors, if the league
is reasy to have, Yeah, yeah, Warriors. He to have
Wiggins back for them. We have no idea what's going
(33:48):
on with him. But if they don't have Wiggins back,
they'll lose. Just like they've lost one every game against
Memphis this season, they'll they'll lose that series too without
Andrew Wiggins. Last thing I want to talk about. It
was reported by ESPN this week that Michael Jordan is
uh it seems like moving towards selling his majority steak
(34:08):
in the Charlotte Hornets. It seems like Jordan will stay
on as a majority owner, but he will transfer what
the majority of his shares his steak in the team
to two of the minority owners of the Hornets. Jordan
bought the team from Bob Johnson back in twenty ten
for the price of a hot dog. Comparatively speaking, like
(34:30):
one hundred and seventy five million dollars. That team's probably
gonna have a valuation of in the neighbor of three billion,
mostly two and a half three billion. Oh my goodness,
it doesn't matter, it doesn't matter, it doesn't matter. I
mean the Phoenix Suns. I know they're in Phoenix and
that's a nice destination, but what was their valuation? Four billion? Like,
(34:52):
come on, like that, Oh my goodness, the Hornets will
get a three billion valuation um under Jordan's leadership. The
Hornets have done nothing, Like They've had what two or
three first round appearances, They've drafted poorly. They've got a
reputation for being really cheap there. I mean, their practice
(35:14):
facility is in their arena, Like it's one of the worst,
if not the worst practice facilities in the entire NBA.
Right now, Herring does this is Michael Jordan's stewardship ownership
of the Hornets, Does that diminish him at all? Like
he's always gonna be, you know, Michael Jordan greatest player
of all time arguably, But it has been a abject
(35:36):
failure in Charlotte. If this is the end of the
road for Jordan, it has been a failure. And without
knowing the outcome of the draft lottery, it's not like
the future is very bright, like LaMelo ball is there.
You know, said recently he's happy in Charlotte. He's probably
just happy to get that next contract in Charlotte. Then
we'll see what happens. But they're bad and outside of
(35:59):
hitting a lot and getting Victor Wemba yama I don't
see a pathway to them getting better anytime soon. I
just can't really. To me, they're two relatively separate things
in the same way that like Magic Johnson not being
a model executive, And you take that however you want.
(36:20):
I mean, actually is a model executive, but not from
an NBA standpoint. I mean, you know, it's a great businessman,
I think, not a very great late night talk show host.
I just think that they're two two both t oo
and two separate things. For me, I do think, and
(36:42):
the most I marry those things in my mind is
the idea of like, yo, Michael would hate playing for
this team, and so maybe there is something to be
said for that, of like how can't you manage it better?
But also, we've watched people be coaching flameoutse we've watched
Phil Jackson be an executive flameout. I already mentioned Magic Johnson.
Most people don't have a second act as far as this,
(37:04):
I mean, pat Riley has been obviously wildly successful, but
most most people really aren't good two aspects of the
same thing, if you could really call it that. The
frustrations that I would have if I'm a fan, is that,
like you said, the team has been cheap. I think
we all think of Michael Jordan as just being this
(37:27):
uber wealthy owner because, like you know, there are very
few athletes that have ever touched that stratosphere of money.
The reality is, there's a reason that very few athletes
have touched a stresspere of money. They don't have it
to buy a team. So it's like the reality for
why he might be cheap or why the team might
operate in a cheap fashion relative to everybody else, is
(37:48):
that he's not Steve Balmber. You know, it's it's you know,
it's different, but that that's always herring. That's always the
high end of it, right, Steve Bombers richer than everybody,
But like Michael George net worth is two point one
billion dollars according to Forbes. Um he's got a seemingly
endless revenue stream with the Jordan brand. Um he's gotten,
(38:10):
he's got the cash. Like, I don't believe that he's
less wealthy than Tilman for Teita in Houston. I don't
believe he's maybe all right, but how about this, I
don't believe he's less wealthy than Wick Grosbeck in Boston.
Like I just don't believe it. Okay, I think he's
(38:31):
got the cash and for whatever reason, he refused to
spend it. Not just on payroll, which is one thing,
like you don't have to just go out there and
bloat your payroll because that doesn't always work. But I
mentioned the facilities which are awful. Like you, you guys
have been down to Charlotte and gone to their arena
(38:53):
and walked onto their practice floor which is small. I'd
never been in their weight room, but I read about
it being small as well. From what I read like,
there's plans to do to build a new PRAX facility
in the future somewhere in Charlotte. But in the ten
plus years Jordans owned this team, they have not broken
ground on that up until this point. And that matters,
(39:14):
and so too, doesn't matters that Jordan's never really hired
a expensive, high profile head coach. It's been like Steve
Clifford seventeen times and you know you've you've had James
brego in there again. Don't have to splurge on coach.
(39:35):
I thought he got a raw deal at the end,
but they didn't spend on head coach. When you talk
to people down there, they do have one of the
thinner front offices in terms of scouting department and personnel.
That they have not invested in a lot of assets
when it comes to the front office, and that which
(39:58):
is kind of well known around the league at this point.
That's on Jordan, Like every team wants to have a
bunch of people that work there. Jordan elected not to spend.
Now he's done some good things. I mean, Adam Silver
would be quick to tell you that, you know what,
five six years ago, Jordan was heavily influential in the
CBA negotiations because he was really able to bridge the
(40:18):
gap between player and owner, because who else could do
it better than Michael Jordan. So he has that in
his positive column, But you can't get past the fact
that a guy with billions of dollars refused to invest
much of it in his team, and that I think
(40:39):
has been a negative for Jordan and continues to prevent
the Hornets from really becoming any kind of destination. Like, yeah,
players make you a destination, and if LaMelo Ball becomes
a superstar, he will attract free agents to come down
there and play with him. But players know who has
great facilities, They know as the beautiful practice facility. They
know who has the great arena, They know all these things,
(41:02):
and Charlotte has not built that kind of infrastructure in
the city, and that after a decade or what thirteen
years now, that falls on Michael Jordan. Yeah, I mean
there's some stuff too that just you know, I thought
it was smart of them too. Obviously, in hindsight, was
smart of them to decide not to because the Kimball
(41:24):
walker thing was such a big deal of like, well,
this is the biggest star you've had, are you gonna
let them walk? And they made the decision to do that,
and they knew, they knew his knee was questionable. They knew, right.
I think the challenge is that they just haven't drafted
well enough, which probably does get back to the point
you were just making about how much are you investing
(41:47):
in your front office to really find great players at
that level or kind of under every rock, behind every
tree sort of thing. They haven't hit on enough of those.
They've made some bad, really bad calls. The Nick Batoum
contract for them was brutal, but also man um You know,
when you have a good roster around guys, you're asking
(42:08):
guys to do a little bit less than you know,
if you have a bad roster, you're asking everybody to
do a little bit more or a lot more. And uh,
you know, Nick Batoum bounced right back right after that.
He was good before that. So it a lot of
it points to what you're saying, Chris, I agree. Well,
look Rohan, um Roan, let me let me just throw
some some some facts out there, please, the resume of
(42:31):
the Jordan led front office, Um, just a few of them.
They got a bunch of assets for Bismack Biombo back
in twenty eleven. Um that didn't work out. They drafted
Shay Gildas Alexander would up trading him for Miles Bridges,
which before Bridges had his recent incident with domestic violence
(42:51):
that wasn't didn't look that bad. But right now Shane
Guilds Alexander is looking like an all NBA guard and
Bridges not with the team. They drafted Frank Kaminski over
Miles Turner and Devin Booker and a recent draft pick
James bout Knight. He's athletic. That's about it at this point.
So like, yeah, would would they have drafted better if
(43:13):
they had a deeper front office if they put more
people around Mitch Cupchack, who look as a great reputation
as a general manager from his time with the Lakers.
But would they have done better, I don't know, but
they didn't. They didn't put these pieces around their top
executives in the front office, and the result has been
a decade or more of mostly bad decisions made when
(43:37):
it comes to personnel. And I don't even mention Gordon
Hayward and that you know, absurd contract that got them nowhere. Yeah,
to me, this discussion just comes back to what it
really shows is your en quote success really does not
translate to you being a good front office executive. That's
what it comes down to. When you have, like you said,
(43:58):
probably most Steeple's greatest player of all time, just unable
to do anything coherent, And like you said, he's been cheap.
He's also there's times where he's been the bridge to players.
There's other times where I think players have gotten into
it with him when it comes to collective bargaining stuff
and have been an upset with where he stood on
certain issues. So yeah, I think it'll frankly, in the
(44:18):
long run, be better for his legacy that he's stepping
away now instead of kind of just presiding over this
for a long time, and you know, people just remembering
him as a cheap owner, and you know, a new
generation of players being like, why is this team so bad? Like,
if anything, he should have gotten off the ship earlier.
You know, good for him for cashing out, But I
think legacy wise, long run, this is probably the right
(44:40):
move just to get stop being associated with this as
quickly as possible. But yeah, there's really just no rhyme
or reason to what makes a great front office executive.
And I think we're seeing that with Michael Jordan, where
I think you could argue what made him great as
a player is what makes him not good as an executive.
It's just like, hey, do this better. I was able
(45:00):
to do it right. We kind of saw that to
an extent in the Last Dance as well. So I'm
not worried about his legacy, taking a hint it is.
I'm more so just you know, the NBA, it just
has these franchises that feel like a black hole sometimes,
you know what I mean, It's like, what did just
a waste of time? Charlotte has been largely I mean
(45:21):
and as I say that, sometimes that's how they're runs,
because that's how they're run, Like Oklahoma City is not
a destination. But the Thunder have been a functional franchise
for you know, more than a decade now because they're
extremely well run because Clay Bennett went out there and
hired Sam Presty and told him he could do whatever
the hell he wants. And Presty has built that team
into at one winner and now has it on a
(45:44):
path to being another. Like I look, there are always
gonna be some guys that don't want to play in
Oklahoma City or Charlotte or Milwaukee. That's just gonna happen.
It's just the way it goes. But like when Lebron
was in Cleveland, guys wanted to play with him, like
you know, when you just go you players want to
be in winning situation as much as anything they do,
(46:04):
and Charlotte has never shown that they can operate like
a winning situation. I mean, Mike, Frankly, Michael Jordan's tenure
with the Wizards as a player was better than Michael
Jordan's tenure with the Hornets as an owner, Like it
was like he has it just hasn't it hasn't worked
(46:24):
out at all. It's depressing, and you were right just
having been to Charlotte, it's um yeah, man, I'm I'm
very fascinating to see if anyone can turn it around there.
At this point, you can be turned around. You just look,
everything can be turned. All you have to do is
look at like Team x's draft history. That's what I
(46:48):
always look at. What I'm evaluating, how a team got there.
That's what always boils down to, like, if you draft well,
you are not going to be in this shitty situation.
If you draft poorly, you were going to find yourself
in this situation. It's as simple as that. And I
mentioned just some of them, like if they had draft
Devin Booker over Frank Kaminski, where would they be? If
they had held on to Shay Gildas Alexander, where would
they be? Like I'm gonna add this into just because
(47:13):
I remember seeing the reports about it. Then it kind
of went away after Wolds reported it, the Miles Bridges stuff.
If they bring that guy back, Like, yeah, I think
they floated that out there. They floated it. I hope
it was just a trial balloon. But like, if they
bring him back and they continue to suck, they'll deserve it.
(47:33):
Like I'm not an advocate of people not getting second chances,
but I'm telling you right now, just as we sit
with the job Morant thing and we're like, what can
actually be learned in a week, essentially that whole thing
with the Miles Bridges thing, I hope he's gotten help
more than anything. I hope that the woman that he
(47:55):
was with has gotten help and everything that she needs
first and foremost. But I don't like that that was
just such an ugly thing, and it was very publicized,
like what was said and what allegedly happened, what essentially
did happen given the way he pleaded So um, I
you know, I just I would hate to see them,
(48:19):
whether it's under Michael or anybody else. We're so desperate
to win that we're gonna go bring him back. I
don't know, what do you think? Do you think Miles
Bridges belong? Like I actually think Myles Bridges should get
another opportunity at some point, Like he will have effectively
served a one year suspension out of the NBA, not
making a dollar. Whenever he comes back, the NBA's probably
(48:41):
gonna slap him with a twenty five game suspension for
what he pled to. So, like, I feel like a
season and a half is a proportionate response to what
Myles Bridges did in terms of punish bad. I don't
believe Myles Bridge should be exiled from the NBA forever. Okay,
so then if that, if that's the case, like maybe
(49:01):
that's fair. I'm not I'll be real with you and
saying that I'm not exactly sure what his penalty should
look like. I haven't really thought that far ahead. I
know that floating it in the middle of the first
season that he's out felt inappropriate to me. It did,
Oh yeah, and they knew that, Like, believe me when
that when that was put out there, I think he
had Bridges show up at a game in Los Angeles,
(49:21):
right he was sitting in the stands um. I think
they they felt the backlash at that point and okay, yeah,
because we haven't heard a thing about it since then,
and that You're right, it does kind of feel that way.
I think he at some point, assuming that he I
hope he does put in some work, get some sort
of counseling, um, meaningful counseling for him. To me, when
(49:45):
I say that there should be real, real things, real
steps taken here. I don't think that you, like who,
who's gonna feel comfortable giving that dude like a long
contract after that? So if nobody talking, nobody, Okay, So
so maybe we'll have to see what it looks like.
Maybe it's Charlotte, maybe it's not. Maybe it would make
more sense for Charlotte to be the team because this
(50:06):
was the team that kind of raised him. I don't
know how that works, but I just know it left
a really bad taste in my mouth from from the
trial balloon aspect of it was very ugly, and it
tells you also the direction in which the team seem
to be leaning that they've infloated in the first place. Yeah,
what what Miles Bridges did was abhorrence and what he
(50:28):
pled to was awful. Um. I just a question I
would ask, is what what is an appropriate punishment for that?
Um it's a fair question, a fair question. He was
in line for a max contract, didn't get it. He
has missed this entire season, He's going to miss a
chunk of next season. I look, I feel like that's proportional.
(50:52):
I feel like that's a reasonable punishment. Now, who will
sign him. I don't know. He's not going to get
more than like a one year deal this point. It's
gonna be a show me type of deal from whether
Charlotte or somebody else. I think Charlotte will still retain
his rights even going into next year. He's didn't play,
so they have matching rights on bridges. But it feels
(51:12):
like if he does come back, he will be with
Charlotte on a very short term deal. That that then
we'll see what happens when it comes to that, Fellows.
Good stuff, Rohan. Next week you can go back to
discussing like the Jazz and why they've been able to
surge despite Lowry Marketing's injury. Listen, big win for Will
(51:35):
Vardy against his former ball club the other night. How
about the Utah Jazz. We're gonna have to the Celtics,
keep skidding. We'll have to talk about them next week too,
because that's an interesting story going into the playoffs. Good stuff, guys.
We will do it again next week. WHOA whoa will
(52:00):
ho
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