April 14, 2024 • 63 mins
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She's back! Chelsea Station 59 we discuss The Lake Michigan Triangle, or simply the Michigan Triangle, which is an area of Lake Michigan where several disappearances, shipwrecks, and plane crashes have occurred under unexplained circumstances.
SOURCES
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lake_Michigan_Triangle
https://www.milwaukeemag.com/legend-lake-michigan-triangle/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker A (00:12):
Hello, my spooky friends.
I'm John, your host, and welcome to another
episode of Dairyland, the paranormal podcastthat covers everything spooky, creepy, and
mysterious in the midwest.
And again, I am blessed by another great
spooky guest, my spooky friend, Chelsea fromstation 59 podcast.
Speaker B (00:42):
Hello.
Speaker A (00:45):
All right.
So, Kelsey, thank you so much.
You are one of my first guests.
I've missed you.
Speaker B (00:52):
I have missed you, too.
Thank you so much for having me back on.
Speaker A (00:56):
Chelsea and I are from the midwest, and I love having my midwesterns on because
they are the greatest.
We have some great stories.
So, Chelsea, tell me about what you've beenworking on.
Any spooky things?
Speaker B (01:11):
Yes, I actually have a couple spooky things coming up here, so I've
obviously been working on the podcast.
I'm putting out my episodes on YouTube now, so
that's exciting.
But then next month, I am booked for an
investigation at Trans Allegheny LunaticAsylum, which I went to last year.
And I'm staying the whole night this time, soI'm very excited.
Speaker A (01:35):
Nice.
Speaker B (01:36):
And then over the summer, I am actually going to help host public event at
Missouri State Penitentiary.
Ooh, yeah.
Speaker A (01:46):
Yeah.
Speaker B (01:47):
I'm very excited.
Speaker A (01:48):
Acres of blood.
I did a thing on that.
A little episode on that.
That's crazy.
Yeah.
Speaker B (01:55):
I'm so excited.
Speaker A (01:58):
Well, that sounds awesome.
And again, my spooky friends, please check out
Chelsea's podcast, the station, station 59podcast, and check out all her events.
You're gonna love it.
Chelsea is great.
So she's awesome.
And one of these days, that's where all the
(02:18):
planes went and everything crashed.
And, you know, it's, like, really crazy,
right?
Speaker B (02:23):
I always thought as a child that.
That the Berita triangle was going to be more
of an issue in my life.
Speaker A (02:28):
Oh, really?
Speaker B (02:30):
I. Like, I just remember reading books about it and hearing about it on tv, and
I was like, oh, my God.
Like, that's how I'm going to go out.
I'm going to disappear in the bearded Bermudatriangle.
Speaker A (02:43):
There's Chelsea in her.
I just learned to fly.
I'm going over the la, la.
Oh, Chelsea, no. Whoa.
Speaker B (02:51):
Driving a boat and just vanish into thin air.
Speaker A (02:53):
Driving a boat.
La la la.
Look at my new boat, everybody go, great.
You know, the funny thing about the Bermuda
triangle.
Excuse me, is you don't hear about it much
anymore, right?Yeah, right.
Speaker B (03:10):
We just start avoiding it.
Speaker A (03:12):
I don't know.
We just.
I think it's sitting there getting ready forsomething.
I'll see.
I hate to **** the new boat.
Speaker B (03:22):
Never going on a cruise.
Speaker A (03:25):
Why is this cruise going the Bermuda Triangle?
Hello.
What are we doing?
The funny thing is about that is I was readingsome information and really, planes have been
get lost from time to time.
You know, there's some famous case, I think,
in Malaysia, whatever, from years ago.
But what pilots have said, it's virtually
(03:47):
impossible now to lose a plane becausesatellites, other redundancies, it's just
super, super, super hard.
Even a smaller plane or a boat has some type
of gps in it for sure.
So it would be like, pretty hard to do that.
And I'm like, well, we'll figure it out.
(04:09):
Chelsea and I will figure out a way to get
along.
Anyway, so one of the things I thought was
really interesting, not only that, Chelseathinks she's gonna get lost in a Bermuda
triangle.
By the way, what do you think is down there?
You think you're gonna get UFO's or is ithollow Earth or what do you think it is?
Speaker B (04:29):
I've always just assumed that there's like a massive whirlpool and it just
sucks everything into it.
Speaker A (04:35):
Yeah, that's it.
Speaker B (04:38):
Well, there's got to be something at the bottom of the whirlpool that's causing
it, obviously.
Speaker A (04:42):
Yeah, that's what I'm saying.
I like to look at it like there's a bunch of
Amazon women down there and they're king.
And I become king.
Okay.
That's a whole different fantasy.
Whoops.
Sorry about that, folks.
Anyway, no, I don't know what there really is.
(05:03):
You know what I'm saying?
Because the things that I heard, and youprobably heard when you were younger, UFO's,
right?UFO grabbed the ship.
Maybe you went to there was a vortex and youwound up in, I don't know, planet or there's
just.
It's gone.
(05:23):
Nobody has a clue where it is, right?Nobody has any idea.
And the funny thing was, Chelsea, I waslooking around at that, I was like, I wonder
if there's anything in the midwest like this,right?
There's something weird.
And here it is.
Our little teaser before we begin the show isthe Lake Michigan Triangle, or simply Michigan
(05:45):
triangle is an area of Lake Michigan whereseveral disappearances.
Shipwrecks.
There you go.
Plane crashes have occurred under unexplainedcircumstances.
I know.
Who have you.
I didn't hear about this before.
(06:05):
I was just poking around, looking around,
trying to find something.
Good topic for us.
How about you, Chelsea?Have you heard about this?
Speaker B (06:11):
I have not.
I know that the Great Lakes have a lot of
weird stuff and some legends around them, butI have not heard of the triangle before.
Speaker A (06:20):
Yeah, right.
Neither have I. Now I've been up to Door
county and if you go to Door county there's apart of it which I love the name, it's called
death's door and you go through it and if youever get a chance, please go up there.
It's absolutely gorgeous.
Also they have a thing about witches.
It's a lot of crazy paranormal stuff up there.
(06:42):
And I know a gentleman who I interviewed on
the show.
His name is Earl.
He's very nice.
If you ever go up there, I would tell you're
coming and see if you can get a discount.
Go on there.
Anything to help my friends out.
Am I still getting that?
So, you know, again, I just never thoughtabout that because in Door county, the reason
they call it death stores because it wasreally, really hard to navigate and there's
(07:05):
rocks and there's fallen trees and everything.
So back in the 18 hundreds, early 19 hundreds
where you had a wooden ship and there's astorm and you're trying to go through this.
It's virtually impossible to get through, notwithout hitting a rock.
So there's many, many shipwrecks in that areathat if you're a scuba diver, I don't know.
(07:25):
Are you a scuba diver at all, Chelsea?
Speaker B (07:27):
I am not.
I'm not even a good swimmer.
Speaker A (07:30):
I sink like a rock.
Yeah, we're, we're both, you know.
Wait a minute.
I'm not going out of that, that boat with you
because we'll both drown because we'll be theworst.
Speaker B (07:41):
One of us has to know how to swim if we're going on this adventure.
Speaker A (07:45):
All right, Chelsea, we need to take swimming lessons.
No, this south takes swimming lessons beforegoing to boat with Chelsea.
So anyway, there's this one indoor countywhere this preserved shipwreck so you could
actually go on a boat tour and you can hoverright over it and it's in the water from the,
(08:06):
I think 1718 hundreds.
Speaker B (08:09):
That's crazy.
Speaker A (08:10):
You just see it right there.
It's like you could almost touch it, which you
cannot touch it because then somebody willyell at you.
But if you go swimming, you go scuba diving.
You can go and you can take a look at it and
it's amazing.
You see pictures of it on the Internet and
you're like, whoa, that's crazy how long itis.
So let's start first with the history of theLake Michigan triangle.
(08:37):
So unidentified flying objects, UFO's orthey're called uaps.
Now.
I'm sorry, what does UAP stand for identified
aerial phenomena?
Speaker B (08:49):
Okay.
Speaker A (08:50):
The military gets involved and screws everything up.
Go away.
Anyway, also, USo's and unidentified submerged
objects have also alleged allegedly beenspotted in the area.
Now, this is how big it is, okay?The triangle.
(09:12):
The triangle stretches from London, Londingtonto Manitowoc.
So if you look at it as a map, it's kind ofbig, you know, compared to the Bermuda
triangle, it's kind of small.
It's just a certain area in the Caribbean, or
Caribbean, however you want to say it.
But it goes down to Benton harbor and back to
Ludington.
(09:32):
The first.
I was talking to Chelsea offline.
I have some friends who are tarot readers.
Maybe we'll do a live tarot reading aroundOctober or something.
When it comes a little spooky or somethinglike that, who knows, right?
Speaker B (09:45):
Be so fun.
Speaker A (09:47):
Yeah. I'm sure it would give us good news.
Like, there's no shadow man lurking in thecorner.
We're not.
Demons are infesting us, and we're like,
great.
That's why I'm having a bad day.
So, again, check Chelsea out.
All her things that she's been doing.
(10:08):
Station 59 and all the things coming up.
So let's get right into our topic.
Chelsea.
All right, this is really interesting to me
because when you think of a triangle andmysteriousness and all that, you know, stuff.
You think of what?The Bermuda triangle?
Right?That's the famous one.
(10:29):
Major.
Let's get right into it.
Unexplained event was the disappearance of afrench sailing ship, l'Greville, and her crew,
in the 17th century.
Starting with the sinking of Thomas Hume in
1891, shipwrecks and disappearances havebecome more frequent.
(10:50):
And believe it or not, the first reported UFOsighting was in 1913.
Speaker B (10:57):
Wow.
Speaker A (10:58):
Okay, now think about that for a second.
That's crazy, because, you know, it's early 19hundreds.
It's like, you think people would not rememberthat or recall this UFO, but, yeah, they saw a
UFO.
People have said that, and we'll kind of get
into that a little bit.
So, the frequency of disappearances,
(11:19):
shipwrecks, and plane crashes within the GreatLakes was first mentioned in the Jay Gurley's
1977 book, the Great Lakes Triangle.
Although the exact origin of the Michigan
triangle wasn't known at that time, laterauthors focused on occurrences in the Lake
Michigan, particularly those within the boundsof the triangle.
(11:41):
So, at first, they didn't know.
And now that we have all gps and we have all
this stuff, we can be like, there it is, rightthere.
Speaker B (11:48):
Wild.
Speaker A (11:49):
Yeah. And it's really interesting to me, too, that just a certain part, you know
what I mean?Because you said you were to Lake Michigan,
cracked and went to all the shipwrecks.
What did you find most interesting?
When you were kind of going to museums andeverything, I think it was.
Speaker B (12:08):
Just, like, how well preserved a lot of the shipwrecks are and how there's
still things in them that they're able tobring up and they're untouched, essentially.
Speaker A (12:18):
Yeah, exactly.
And you know why that is?
Is because there's no salt water.
It's cold.
You know, it's perfect conditions forpreserving a ship.
Right.
So that is awesome.
Yeah.
And then they also.
I remember, too, I was thinking of the museumtwo years ago, and I remember they had a
(12:39):
simulation at that time, if they still do,where you could take a tanker out of Lake
Michigan and you could steer it.
It was just like a 3d simulator.
And it was really harder than you thinkbecause you just turn the wheel just a little
bit.
You're like, right into the side of the canal.
Speaker B (12:58):
Oh, man.
I'd be terrible at it.
Speaker A (13:03):
It'd be like a pinball machine.
Oh, well.
But some experts have debated about the shapeand range of the triangle, which you're always
going to have one argued that the area is nota triangle, but a rectangle, which doesn't
come off the tongue.
Right, Chelsea.
It's the make Lake Michigan tri rectangle.
Speaker B (13:26):
Not the same ring to it.
Speaker A (13:28):
Yeah. It doesn't have the same marketing value.
I'm in marketing, so I'll be Lake Michiganrectangle.
Can we do a triangle or something?
Speaker B (13:36):
You know, can we just rework this a little bit?
Speaker A (13:39):
Cut out this.
Perfect.
Or they said an oblong shape, but again,doesn't work.
Lake Michigan oblong shape.
I don't know.
Right.
Speaker B (13:52):
Not quite as mysterious, I'd say.
Speaker A (13:55):
Mysterious.
So that encompasses most of all that they say
Lake Michigan.
So let's get in there.
So, in other words, there's a debate where itis and where, but they kind of know where it
is and it's a triangle.
But I just think how people.
You're like, well, maybe it's not a triangle.
I find that funny.
So, ligraphone was one of the earliest knownincidents in the Lake Michigan triangle and
(14:21):
the disappearance of the lgrathon and her crewon September 18, 1679.
Speaker B (14:30):
Wow.
Speaker A (14:31):
Yeah, I know, right? This is crazy.
So, Ligafon dark by the Le grand ble.
It's present day green bay.
Loaded up 12,000 pounds of furs.
That's a lot of furs.
Holy ****.
Wow.
Okay.
And set sail for Lake Erie.
However, the vessel never arrived at herdestination and no confirmed remnants of the
(14:59):
ship have ever been located.
Some assume that the ligraphone perished in a
storm.
Others have theorized that the Ottawas or
Potawatomis boarded her murdered crew and thenset her ablaze.
Rene Robert Chevy, ze de La Salle, ship'sbuilder, was convinced that.
(15:22):
I take French.
This is horrible.
I can make emails from people who speakFrench.
What are you doing?Was convinced that the pilot and crew sunk the
ship and made off with the Perth.
Okay, there's no substantial evidence for any
of these series, so let's talk about this fora second.
How would you sink a ship and take 12,000?What was it?
(15:45):
Pounds?Furs?
Explain that to me, Chelsea.
Speaker B (15:51):
If you have 12,000 friends and you each get, you give them each a pound and then
you make it your own city, and there you go.
Speaker A (16:04):
I love it.
Why did I think of that?
12,000 friends.
Oh, all right.
Well, fine.
Speaker B (16:11):
It'll only take a couple years.
It's fine.
Speaker A (16:13):
All right.
See, this is my whole thing.
Get the friends.
Speaker B (16:17):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker A (16:18):
There we go.
Perfect.
Yeah, it could have been Indians.
That would happen a lot, but it would mostly
happen in what Native Americans would, youknow, unfortunately, when they're starving and
all the things we stole, us bad white people,thank you very much.
From them, which belonged to them.
Now I feel bad.
Usually would do it on like, river flat boat.
(16:40):
So usually you would hear a lot of stories
where flat boat be coming down, and thenNative Americans would attack the boats and
take the furs so they wouldn't starve or, youknow, freeze to death in winter.
So. Okay, that's.
That's my two cent on that.
That's a whole nother podcast, too.
(17:01):
So there.
So, anything else on this before we move on tothe next ship?
Speaker B (17:08):
Hmm.
Speaker A (17:10):
12,000 friends is really good.
Speaker B (17:11):
Oh, thank you so much.
I, you know, full of ideas.
Not all of them are good, but they're ideas.
Speaker A (17:19):
We'll take it.
Awesome.
So let's move on to the next one.
The Thomas Hume.
I like to pronounce this.
Thank goodness.
May 21, 1891.
The schooners Thomas Hume and roses rose.
Rose Simmons set off from the port afterdropping the shipment Lombard, Chicago.
(17:40):
Both ships were supposed to return to theHackley Hume lumber mill in Muskegon, but
after encountering a squall, the crew of therose Simmons returned to Chicago until the
weather improved.
However, Thomas Hume continued on and
disappeared along with six sailors on boardHeckley Hume sent a vessel to search for the
(18:05):
schooner and offered a $300 reward, by theway, in the 18 hundreds.
That's a lot of money.
Speaker B (18:11):
Yes.
Speaker A (18:13):
But had no success in finding the ship.
Theories arose as to what happened to theThomas Hume, the most widely accepted that she
sank.
Some storm caused the rose Simmons to retreat
to Chicago.
Others included Charles Hackley believed that
another boat collided with and sunk theschooner.
So in other words, sunk, you know, everythinglike that.
(18:35):
And then the weird thing about this iseverything in the early.
Well, from the 16 hundreds to 18 hundreds hadto go if it was bigger than a bread box.
Look, I'm dating myself here.
Had to go on a ship.
So lumber, furs, cotton, you name it, had togo on a ship because the railways at that time
(19:00):
weren't that great.
Yeah, we definitely didn't have cars, and we
definitely didn't have, well, anything totransport it to where we needed to go.
Could you imagine that, Chelsea, how hard lifewould be?
You're just like, I just need some supplies,and you got to wait maybe a month.
Speaker B (19:19):
Yeah. My boyfriend and I were just talking the other day about, like, the wagon
trail going out west.
I'm like, we were thinking, just how would you
get through the mountains?Like, how did people pull that off with a
wagon?
Speaker A (19:34):
Yeah.
Speaker B (19:35):
Absolutely crazy.
Speaker A (19:36):
Absolutely.
And if you ever get a chance, there's some
authors out there, and there used to be a showon PBS where they would take a family, just a
normal family in today's world, and then putthem in the 18 hundreds.
Oh, my God.
Just to make breakfast.
Took like an hour.
Speaker B (19:55):
Yeah, I believe it.
Speaker A (19:56):
You had to go out, get the eggs from the, you know, wherever.
I don't know.
Maybe you have a farm, maybe you don't.
But you still got to go get eggs.
Then you got to figure out where the bacon
was.
By the way, you don't have a fridge.
You open the fridge and microwave anything.
You know, it was just insanity.
I mean, just like, women your age would haveto wear a dress and you have to wear a corset.
(20:17):
You'd have to make sure your hair is good, andyou, you know, it isn't.
Like I throw on a sweat top and somesweatpants, right?
My boyfriend are gonna go out and grab aburger or whatever.
It doesn't work.
Speaker B (20:30):
We have a. We have, like, a lit.
It's called living history farms.
And it's like.
It's.
I don't even know how to describe it, but it'slike an 18 hundreds village that you can go
visit.
And they have reenactments and all that.
And I took a field trip there in elementaryschool, and we had to go to the schoolhouse in
full period dress, and we had to live a schoolday in the 18 hundreds.
Speaker A (20:53):
Oh, how'd that go?
Speaker B (20:55):
It left an impression on me, for sure.
I liked my dress, at least.
Speaker A (21:04):
Oh, there you go.
I know.
So, in other words, like I said, this is noteasy.
And then if the ship sinks, you're.
Well, you're sold, right?
What are you gonna do?You're like, well, okay.
And I know.
It's so funny.
My kids will ***** about when, oh, I even gotmy package yet from Amazon.
(21:25):
And I always go, do you know what life used tobe like, kids.
Okay, I'll just go over here.
Yeah.
So forget it.
And again, mail not get anything.
So, like, if you sent someone, like, oh, myGod, I think my.
My husband died in world War one or something.
It isn't like someone calls you on your cell
phone or text you, I'm sorry, Chelsea.
(21:48):
You know, it's like months later, you find out
he's still alive.
Oh, ****.
I just got remarried.
Ah, **** it.
I want you to do awkward.
Awkward.
This is Bill Bell.
I'm glad we're not into that stuff.
So one of the things I think is really funny,too, is that nobody knows what happened.
(22:14):
So again, we still have no idea.
No one's found these ships to this day.
So now this is one is a little moreinteresting to me because this one happened in
2006.
Speaker B (22:26):
Oh.
Speaker A (22:27):
An A and T recovery employee discovered the sunken ship.
He says, this is really interesting whensearching for a lost United States Navy
aircraft.
So there was, like, all these people looking
for this aircraft, and they did find a ship.
(22:48):
And guess what they found the Thomas Hume one.
Speaker B (22:52):
No way.
Speaker A (22:54):
The other ship.
I don't know if they've ever found this, but
they did find it when they were looking for a.
Another aircraft that had crashed there.
So. And they said, this is crazy, that again,it was in perfect condition and has to come to
a storm and that it was intact.
(23:15):
But they think, too, that maybe it was rammed
into by another vessel.
Pirates.
On Lake Michigan.
So, yes, there were pirates.
Everyone thinks, you know, Johnny Depp andpirates of the Caribbean.
Yeah, look at that.
No, there were pirates on.
(23:36):
In Lake Michigan.
Who?
So the.
In words, they were looking.
The navy in 2006 was looking, and they found.
Whoops.
Hey, look what we found.
We found the Thomas Hume.
And, yeah, the fur wasn't there, by the way.
Speaker B (23:51):
Dang it.
Speaker A (23:52):
Thousand pounds of fur.
Anyway, so the next one is the Rosabella.
In 1863, the Rosabella was a two mastedschooner who used to transport materials to
the house of David in Benton Harbor.
I don't know what that is.
Between 1875 and 1926, she was found capsizedtwice.
(24:14):
I don't know how you could do that with nosigns of her crew.
Okay, so again, there's kind of a theme here.
With the exception, they did find the Thomas
Hume, which, not to confuse people, you know,a lot of people say, well, wait a minute, I
thought they didn't find it.
They did find it, but they, you know, it was
(24:34):
under, like, being rammed and stuff like that.
So there was something that went on with that
ship.
But most ships, they do not find, or nor do
they find that there's been mysteriouscircumstances.
So I didn't know this, that they started thisearly, but in 1875, a car ferry crossing the
(24:55):
lake discovered.
Why would you car ferry or crossing Lake
Michigan?I like to see where they're crossing.
Right. 1875.
Okay.
All right, I'll go with it.
The schooner floating upside down.
So they found this car ferry that's floatingupside down.
The ten man crew who departed the boat werenever found, probably drowned.
(25:20):
The ship was then turned over and returned tothe port of Milwaukee where she remained in
service.
So in other words, there was a car ferry,
which.
Okay, it flipped over the crew.
Ten man crew was never found, but they flippedit back over and it remained in service for
quite a while.
Speaker B (25:40):
Okay, we'll just find a new crew.
It's fine.
Speaker A (25:43):
By the way, ten people died on this thing, so let's go, guys.
Come on.
What are we doing?
Speaker B (25:48):
It's fine.
Don't worry about it.
Speaker A (25:49):
Yeah, so I didn't know 1875.
Okay, I got to go back and look at my history.
Would you go on a car ferry crossing LakeMichigan, Chelsea?
Speaker B (26:01):
I don't think I'd go on anything crossing Lake Michigan, to be so honest.
I went out just a little bit on Lake Michiganover the summer and there was a big 18
hundreds replica sailing ship.
And I was watching that thing just toss back
and forth and it was.
Speaker A (26:21):
Like, nope, nope, not for me.
Yeah, when I was a little, I was weird.
Chelsea and I were talking about this offline.
When I was about 14, I went on a fishing trip
with my father and my good buddy and we wentto Lake Michigan and we were in like the
middle of it where I couldn't see land and Iwas freaking out, you know, for quite a while.
(26:48):
So I got my bearings.
But, you know, if any of you people know what
that is?Dairyland, brightsmail.com.
Send me something.
Say, yeah, that's happened to me, too.
No, thanks.
And I saw this tank.
I was telling Chelsea, I saw this tanker.
It's like city just going past us.
And I'm like, ****, you know, yeah, no, I amnot doing that.
(27:12):
So in October of 1921, one of the things herewas, you know that fairy I was talking about?
Okay, for some reason, they decided thatthey're going to depart again, but this time,
they're going to put a load of potatoes on itand lumber.
I don't know what you're going with, goingwith this.
(27:35):
However, the ship's captain, Ed Johnson.
I love that name.
He refused to board it.
He was like, so remember they went to the port
of Milwaukee, and they were.
Now they're like, oh, let's not use for cars.
Maybe that wasn't the smartest thing.
Let's use it for a bunch of lumber and
potatoes and send it across Lake Michigan.
(27:55):
And then Ed Johnson, he was like, I said, he's
captain said, no, not going at it.
Because if you know anything about nautical or
people who have been on ships or lighthousesor something, a lot of nautical people are
very superstitious.
Chelsea, have you heard.
Have you ever done any stories on that?Maybe on a haunted lighthouse or a haunted
(28:17):
ship?And people are just like, you know.
Speaker B (28:20):
I have not yet.
I've been to a few lighthouses that had some.
Some vibes to them, but I haven't done anystories about that yet.
Speaker A (28:30):
So my question would be, would you ever be one?
I don't know.
What lighthouse conductor?
I don't know.
What do you call it because of the lighthouse?
I have no idea.
Would you ever be one of those people?
Just be out of the lighthouse for, like, ayear by yourself?
Speaker B (28:44):
If I was close enough to civilization because I don't like being in the
middle of nowhere.
It creeps me out.
Speaker A (28:54):
Why does it creep you out?
Speaker B (28:57):
This is so morbid.
I just.
I watch so much truth.
I watched so much true crime as a child.
I just feel like I need to be around a placewhere people can hear me scream.
In worst case scenario, that's pretty morbid.
Speaker A (29:12):
Okay, all right.
Okay. All right.
There we go.
Chelsea.
Chelsea just told us a very personal thing,and we'll go with that.
Okay, you know what?Now I got to do pranks on you.
Put on, like, Michael Myers Hollow Halloweenmask, and be like, yeah, I'll just.
Speaker B (29:36):
I'll cry.
I'll curl up in a ball and cry.
Speaker A (29:39):
Well, no, I feel bad I just said that.
That's good.
Speaker B (29:43):
Now I'm going to.
I'm going to give it right back to you.
Speaker A (29:46):
Thanks a lot.
I feel bad.
Okay.
Ed won't go on this yet.
Chelsea screaming her hat off.
It's his son later stated that Johnson.
Oh, boy.
Had a premonition that a disaster was about to
occur again.
Like, these guys are really superstitious.
(30:06):
You can read all these great tales, you know.
I would like to do, like, one on the Edmund
Fitzgerald famous.
It's a Gordon Lightfoot song, if you're into
old, good old rock and roll, kind of folksymusic.
Nobody really does understand that either.
But I remember in there, I would like to do an
episode on it that the crew was like,something's not right.
(30:29):
And they've crossed.
This is a huge tanker, and they crossed
numerous times, but they knew that day, like,something's not right.
But the.
The crew went aboard and they kept.
You know, they went and they haven't found it.
I don't think they found it.
I have to look it up.
Maybe they have, but I can't remember.
Do you remember anything, if they found EdmundFitzgerald, any?
Speaker B (30:51):
I don't remember if they found it or not.
But I do know a really interesting tidbit,because when I was doing my research for my
episode on Lake Superior, it kind of touchedon that.
And almost to the day, almost every singleyear, there's been a storm on the anniversary
of the sinking, a massive, massive storm.
Speaker A (31:14):
Interesting.
Speaker B (31:15):
Yeah.
Speaker A (31:16):
Huh. That's cool.
Wonder why that would be.
Wow.
Speaker B (31:21):
There's, like, something about wind patterns or whatever, but I think it's ghosts.
Speaker A (31:26):
Sure. Pyramid coming back.
I get it.
At a ship.
That's crazy.
Speaker B (31:31):
Yeah.
Speaker A (31:32):
The crew.
I could see this.
The crew could not convince Johnson andJohnson to board this ship and said, you know,
so they left without them.
Okay, bye, captain.
You know what?
Speaker B (31:46):
You.
Speaker A (31:47):
We have no clue, see? Like, what?
So they left, and days later.
Oh, boy, here we go.
The ship was found, capsized again.
No signs of her crew.
Oh, boy.
They didn't say how many, but I'm guessing ten
again.
So, like, 20 guys or gals or whoever was on
(32:08):
that ship are gone.
Jeez.
The captain's like, don't go aboard.
I feel.
Yeah, I'm doing whatever.
There's my voice of the creepy captain.
And they went, okay, see ya.
We're doing it anyway.
We need the money.
Goodbye.
Okay, now, one of the things they found was tothe stern when they found the ship again.
(32:30):
So they did find it again.
It capsized.
The stern was missing.
So it's kind of like if your steering wheel
and your car is missing, basically, it's like,indicating that there was a collision, but no
ship reported having an accident.
Speaker B (32:47):
Interesting.
Speaker A (32:48):
United States coast guard, which dragged the ship back into Racine harbor,
later determined there was no collision.
Hmm.
Right.
Interesting.
So what you were just saying about Edmund, theEdmund Fitzgerald in the storm, why is this
happening to this ship?
Speaker B (33:08):
Mm hmm.
Speaker A (33:09):
Right.
Like, same thing basically happened, you know,
capsized or just so.
I don't know.
Any theories?I love to hear them.
Speaker B (33:19):
I think the ship in a past life was not a good, a good ship.
And so he's his reincarnation now.
He's just gonna struggle.
Speaker A (33:29):
Yeah, exactly.
The ship did some bad juju on that ship.
Okay.
Speaker B (33:36):
Exactly.
He, like, bullied other ships in his, in his
last life.
And so they're like, you know what?
Speaker A (33:41):
Yeah.
Speaker B (33:42):
Capsize for you.
Speaker A (33:43):
Yeah.
Speaker B (33:43):
That's all you get.
Speaker A (33:44):
You're gonna capsize.
That's perfect.
I love it.
First of all, get 12,000 friends with the
first.
We got a lot of stuff going on.
So the next one is.
Yeah, this was George R. Adonner.
Oh, geez.
I just.
It just occurred to me, you know, the Donnerparty.
(34:05):
Whoops.
How you like to be like, I'm captain of a
ship.
That's your donner?
Yeah.
I'm not going out here.
No, thanks.
Good.
Thank.
George R. Donner was the captain of the Om
McFarland, a coal freighter.
On April 28, 1937, Donner's 58th birthday, the
(34:27):
ship picked up 9800 tons of coal.
Holy ****.
Coal.
That's a lot.
In Erie, Pennsylvania.
They just keep just loading these shabby.
I just put the **** on there.
I think it's too heavy.
Shut up.
We need to get this over here.
Speaker B (34:44):
No wonder we're not.
We're sinking all the time.
Speaker A (34:46):
No wonder we're sinking all the time.
Guys, stop with the 12,000 pounds of fur, the**** tons of coal.
That's a lot of **** coal.
Holy.
And then they traveled west through the lakes,found for Port Washington, Wisconsin.
The captain had spent hours on the bridgetracking the Om McGarlan through the ice flow.
So, boy, here we go.
(35:06):
When they reached Lake Michigan, Donner
retired to his cabin, instructing the crew toalert him once the ship neared her
destination.
3 hours later, when the vessel near port
Washington, the second mate went to Donner'scabin but found it had been locked from the
inside.
(35:27):
Oh. Assuming Donner had gone to the galley for
a snack, why would you assume that.
Okay.
He went to the gallery, but to no avail.
The crew then began an extensive search for
their captain, but it was futile.
They eventually broke down the door, which I
would have done in the first place, to thecabin, but didn't find a donner.
(35:50):
Donner.
Speaker B (35:50):
What?
Speaker A (35:51):
All right, this is kind of mean, but we get it.
Donner was too large to fit through the twoportholes in his room and showed no sign of
depression or suicidal thought.
Speaker B (36:06):
And it was his birthday.
Speaker A (36:07):
It was his birthday.
Local ports and ships searched for a donner in
the water, but no sign was ever found.
Okay, Chelsea, I'm putting your hat, mystery,
true crime hat on.
What happened to Donner?
Speaker B (36:24):
Let's see.
I think when he went to his room, he found one
of those, like, harry Potter styleinvisibility cloaks.
Speaker A (36:34):
Yep, yep.
Speaker B (36:34):
But then he couldn't figure out how to get it off.
Speaker A (36:36):
Right.
Speaker B (36:36):
And he just disappeared.
Speaker A (36:38):
Yeah. I love it.
That's perfect.
That's what happened.
He's like, it's my birthday.
I'm sick of these **** ship.
I'm gonna go and get a drink.
Oh, ****.
You're gonna see me.
Aha.
So here's the thing.
I think what he did, and it's in allseriousness, and then tell me if I'm right or
(36:59):
just a lunatic.
Don't tell me if I'm a lunatic, because I'm
like.
Anyway, I think what he did, he snuck out, got
a dinghy, which is a small boats, right?And just said, like, you know what?
I'm 58 years old.
I'm sick of this ****.
I got a bunch of smelly dudes.
I'm a bunch of **** coal.
I just gotta get out of here.
I want to be a violinist in the philharmonic,
(37:23):
and that's what I'm gonna do.
Speaker B (37:25):
So that makes perfect sense.
Speaker A (37:26):
See? Yeah. All the time.
Which they forgot to mention, by the way, he'splaying people.
Will you shut up?You're horrible.
And he's like, that's hurtful.
That's what I. I have no idea.
No. I could, like.
Right?
Speaker B (37:45):
That's. That's wild.
To disappear from a locked room.
Speaker A (37:50):
Correct.
Speaker B (37:50):
Is insane.
Speaker A (37:51):
And even if he took a so on tankers and stuff.
Yes, of course they have the different.
Not dinghies.
But what if I. What am I thinking of?A rescue boat or whatever you say, you know
what I mean?And maybe he did take, but in the middle of
Lake Michigan on a little boat, trying to getsomewhere.
Speaker B (38:13):
And you said there's ice floes and stuff like.
That's not a, that's not a good situation tobe in.
Speaker A (38:18):
Yeah. And it's, you know, even though it's a huge ship, it's not like they,
he could be like hiding in the boiler room orsomething and just be like sneaking around.
And then people are like, hey, where, where'scaptain?
Oh, I don't know.
You know, and why, why would he lock it?
(38:38):
Just, I don't know.
I think that's interesting.
I think it's an interesting case that the onlything I could think of is just maybe he got
sick of things and snuck out somehow andpeople didn't notice or he had people with him
working with him and saying like, hey, youknow, I got to get out of here.
Can you help me?But can't even see that, you know, your ice
(39:01):
flows trying to.
Yeah, I don't know, man.
Speaker B (39:04):
Maybe he was mad that nobody told him happy birthday.
And so he was like, well, screw you guys.
I'm, I'm out of here.
Speaker A (39:10):
Right? Where's my cake?
No one got.
Speaker B (39:13):
I thought this was my surprise party.
Speaker A (39:15):
Thanks a lot, guy.
You only turned 58 once.
Whatever.
I don't know.
It's just weird.
So this is our first airplane.
One.
Okay. 2501 Northwest Orient Airlines on the
evening of January 23, 1950.
(39:38):
Northwest Orient Airlines, excuse me.
Flight 25 51 carrying 55 passengers and threecrew from Lagarde, LaGuardia, excuse me.
Airport, New York City, four lagoon toMinneapolis.
Although a pre flight review of the weatherrevealed thunderstorms and possible squalls
(40:01):
along with, and a swole, if you guys want toknow, is basically like a really bad wind and
rain, you know, and you get caught in that.
In Lake Michigan, I would be peeing my pants
and probably something else and being like,God, just get me through this.
Right?It's nasty.
Along with the route of the flight, it was nota great concern to the crew.
(40:25):
Okay.
They're like, ah, we're over this.
Don't worry about it.
Boy, I don't know these so many people.
Anyway.
However, to avoid turbulence, Captain Robert
Lind requested to descend to an altitude of4000ft.
Wow, that's okay.
Yeah, that's low.
Speaker B (40:43):
That is very low.
Speaker A (40:45):
Instead of his assigned 6000ft, which is so low.
Okay.
On the aircraft.
As the aircraft, excuse me.
Approached Cleveland, Ohio.
I thought, they're going to Minneapolis.
Okay.
Lynn repeated the same request and it wasapproved that time.
So, you know, he's like, I want to go low.
After severe turbulence caused another plane
to fall 500ft.
(41:07):
Oh my gosh.
How do you like that?Well, I got stuck in an air pocket once and I
fell 100ft in a plane.
Yeah.
And it's like being in the elevator and theelevator goes out and it just, you just go
like that.
Speaker B (41:22):
I would lose it.
Speaker A (41:24):
Yeah, people lost it.
Yeah.
I was, like, sleeping.
I was, like, really tired, Chelsea, and I was
just like, sleep.
I had long business trip sleep and so I went,
what?You just, oh, my gosh.
Yeah, you're zero gravity.
You're falling like that.
Speaker B (41:41):
So I'm terrified of flying.
I do it all the time, but I'm so anxious the
entire time.
And just even turbulence, I'm like, oh, my
God.
Speaker A (41:49):
Yeah, 500ft.
That's a long.
So air traffic control instructed Lynn todescend to.
Okay, I don't know about these guys.
3500ft to avoid a collision with other
aircraft.
Speaker B (42:06):
Oh, my gosh.
Speaker A (42:07):
To which Lynn obliged.
Good for him.
Later, Lind and his co pilot decided to steersouth, an attempt to avoid the storm activity.
However, they inadvertently flew directly intoa squall line at 11:13 p.m.
The plane made its last radio transmission,requesting to descend to 2500ft.
(42:33):
The request was likely made because the crewwanted to drop below the clouds and obtain
more visual clarity.
However, air traffic control did not grant
them clearance because another plane wasdeparting from Milwaukee at that time.
So shortly after.
Afterwards, locals between Benton harbor and
(42:54):
South Haven reported hearing an aircraftflying low to the ground before whitneying a
flash of light over the lake.
Some witnesses reported hearing an explosion,
although it was hard to differentiate thesound from thundercloud.
By midnight, radio operatives realized thatthe plane was missing.
(43:18):
The next day, the coast Guard discovered anoil slick and partial debris approximately 18
miles northwest of Benton harbor.
In the following days, the search resulted in
the discovery of human remains such as, we'regetting in gold territory here.
So, kiddies, if you're listening, please donot listen to this.
(43:38):
And parents, if you have this on your, in yoursuv or your car and you have kids in the car,
you might want to pause and give yourself asass up.
So what human remains did they find?Ears, hands, bones and a seat armrest and
pieces of upholstery.
A pair of child's pants later identify those
(44:01):
of eight year old passenger.
Oh, Chester Shaffer.
A Chester.
Chester were also found.
Officials needed to temporarily.
That's such a cute clothes.
Close certain beaches due to the amount ofdebris washing ashore.
(44:22):
So you can imagine, hey, like, you know, youand your friend or whatever, walking along the
dog or whatever you got and be like, huh, thatlooks weird.
I don't know what that is.
And your dog comes back with a hand.
Speaker B (44:35):
Oh, my God.
Speaker A (44:38):
Okay. I have dark humor, so they just.
Speaker B (44:42):
That all I can think about is how horrific the impact had to be to make the
pieces that small, you know.
Speaker A (44:54):
That hit hard.
Speaker B (44:56):
Yeah.
Speaker A (44:56):
However, searchers have never been able to find any sizable amount of the plane
or its engine.
Speaker B (45:03):
Hmm.
Speaker A (45:04):
Most of the debris found was no larger than a person's hand.
That weird?
Speaker B (45:11):
That's crazy.
Speaker A (45:12):
That's weird.
So look at your hand.
You go, that's what they found.
Like, debris this side.
Weird.
Okay.
That means, bam.
That thing hit hard.
Yeah.
Authorities assume the aircraft crashed into
Lake Michigan.
Duh.
Evidence recovered suggests that the.
The plane likely hit the water in a forward,
(45:33):
downward to the left.
Forward, downward to the left at a high
velocity lap to a high velocity.
But that plane crash has never been determined
how it hit.
Most commonly accepted explanation is that
UFO's took it.
It took other people.
They cut them into little pieces.
No, I'm sorry.
(45:55):
The most common accepted explanation, that itwas a result of bad weather conditions.
Yeah.
Okay.
I like my UFO's, and they slice them up.
Is that the plane was struck by lightning.
Oh, boy.
However, none of the debris.
None of the debris.
Excuse me.
Had covered.
(46:16):
Had burn mark.
Speaker B (46:17):
Huh.
Speaker A (46:18):
All right, so before we get to the conspiracy stuff, what do you think?
Chelsea?What do you think happened?
Speaker B (46:25):
My actual first thought was aliens.
When they said they saw the big flash, I'm
like, that's them getting sucked up.
Speaker A (46:33):
Absolutely.
So you are right, because conspiracy theorists
have suggested that the plane was taken by aUFO, citing that the two police officers in
the area saw red lights hovering over the.
Over the lake for 2 hours.
Huh.
Lane disappear.
(46:55):
So there you go.
Aliens.
By the way, just really quick.
I don't know if you've heard about this story
about.
Again, this is go territory.
Don't have the kiddies.
Listen, have you heard about.
I think it is in Malaysia on the beach?There have been feet.
Human feet still in athletic footwear, likesneakers washing upon the shore.
(47:20):
You can look it up.
And you can.
Speaker B (47:21):
I have not heard about that.
Speaker A (47:23):
Go look that up.
Human feet washing on the shore.
Look that up.
Google it.
And you'll be like, what?And this has been like.
There's, like, a lot.
And I think people figured it out, but I'm not
really sure, but they were just like, soyou're walking on the beach and like, oh, hey,
man, there's a stinker.
I'm gonna pick it up.
And there's a foot inside of it.
It had been locked off like somebody just
(47:45):
been.
Speaker B (47:46):
They're just a foot concentrated serial killer.
Speaker A (47:51):
Sure. So do not go to that lighthouse, Chelsea.
I'm sure you have nice feet.
Speaker B (48:00):
They're all right, you know.
Speaker A (48:02):
All right.
Don't put them out to the camera.
We're getting it weird.
You don't want to see mine.
They're even more weird.
Speaker B (48:08):
No free fee.
Speaker A (48:10):
Yeah, yeah.
Come on.
That's extra people on my Patreon, by the way.
Anyway, here's the next story, unless you had
anything else to add.
Anything to us to add other than the plane
crash and it could be.
Speaker B (48:22):
UFO, but it's definitely aliens.
Speaker A (48:25):
Definitely aliens.
Speaker B (48:26):
Definitely.
Speaker A (48:27):
So the next one.
This is a little bit recent, I guess.
Don Shaler and Don Rodriguez.
On July 30, 1998, Don Scheller flew a two seat
arrow L. This is what's going to happen toChelsea.
Arrow L 39 Albatross, a high performancesingle engine jet often used by a. As a
(48:52):
military trainer by the eastern europeancountries.
Sheller or.
Yeah, Scheller.
A veteran pilot.
Okay, now, was planning on participating in
his first air show for the National CherryFestival in Traverse City, Michigan.
Yes, there is a national cherry festival stillgoing on in Traverse City, Michigan, if you
(49:12):
like to go it.
And you like cherries.
It's all about cherries.
Cherry pie, cherry jam, cherry jelly, whatever
the hell.
There you go.
So, something if you're looking to do for theweekend.
In the passenger seat was Donovan.
Donovan Rigus or Don Rodriguez, a flight
instructor at the north western MichiganCollege since the 1970s.
So these guys know what they're doing, right?We get that he's a veteran pilot.
(49:36):
He's been doing this for a long time.
He's a flight instructor.
Good old Don.
Ron.
At approximately 06:00 p.m.
Shealer radioed that he was 27 miles from the
Cherry Capital airport.
And when he departed from where he departed
from and was planning to return to theairport.
Soon afterward, flight controllers noticed thejet vanished from the radar.
(50:01):
They were unable to make contact withSchiller.
Coast Guard helicopters quickly begansearching the area, but found nothing.
The following day, a canadian cargo plane anda blue Angels C 130, fat Albert, joined the
search.
I have no idea what that means.
(50:23):
If you're familiar with the cartoon, with BillCosby.
Yeah.
Okay.
Military.
Their weird name.
Despite.
God, they're bored.
Despite scouring miles of land and water, noclues were found, and the search ended on July
9.
Okay.
(50:43):
All right.
So the cause of disappearance was never
determined.
Michigan state believe.
Police, excuse me, believe the aircraftcrashed into Lake Michigan, but are unsure
what caused this to happen.
The weather was calm, so there you go.
Both experienced pilots.
There you go.
(51:04):
And the aircraft was considered to be simpleand reliable.
The plane was also equipped with parachutesand ejection seats.
So that's kind of cool, right?So you're like, oh, ****, we're going down,
Jack.
Right?
Anyway, one witness reported hearing a planeflying overhead and then a loud, firework like
(51:28):
sound.
However, he never saw the plane.
Speaker B (51:32):
That's weird.
Speaker A (51:33):
That is weird.
Now, before I get to what they're trying to
look for, what do you think so far?UFO is right, obviously.
Speaker B (51:42):
Or like spontaneous implosion.
Speaker A (51:45):
That could be right.
I agree.
Later that year, an underwater search wasconducted using sonar technology.
It uncovered a 30 foot long object thatsearchers believed to be the plane.
The following year, divers confirmed theobject was a rock formation.
(52:07):
In 2008, another sonar research discovered apossible plane 450ft below the service.
It was next to a boat that sank in the 1950s.
However, a dive cannot be completed to confirm
the object was a plane as the diver, but wasnot certified past 400ft.
Speaker B (52:34):
Could you not get another diver?
Speaker A (52:36):
I can't.
You get another diver.
Like, I'm only 400, dude.
Oh, man.
No, we got it now.
Speaker B (52:43):
We'll never know.
Speaker A (52:44):
We will never know.
Oh, well, let's get a beer.
Speaker B (52:50):
See, that's got to be.
That's where the conspiracy theorists are
going to come in, because they know whathappened.
You know, and they're.
They're going to let us believe that's the
plane and it's another rock formation.
Speaker A (53:03):
We know who you are, Chelsea.
I know where you live.
We're coming.
All right, so let's get into some
explanations, right?
Speaker B (53:13):
Perfect.
Speaker A (53:13):
What's going on? Okay, the first one is natural causes.
Okay.
The Lake Michigan Shipwreck Research
association claims the triangle is a myth,contending that the triangle has no more
shipwrecks than the rest of the Great Lakes.
Also stated the number of shipwrecks within
(53:34):
the Great Lakes can be attributed to hightraffic over the lakes.
Okay.
Speaker B (53:42):
You said the same thing about that Bermuda triangle.
Speaker A (53:44):
Yeah. I don't know, guys.
That's not convincing.
It's not like a weather balloon.
We're onto you.
Many of the shipwrecks and the shipdisappearances in Lake Michigan have been
blamed on wind waves.
Okay.
The lake's elongated shape and position, itsshores are parallel and unheated, allowing the
(54:10):
formation of dangerous currents, includingriptides and long shore tides.
Additionally, the north south orientation,coupled with a regular wind pattern, allow
waves to reach great height.
Blah, blah, blah.
Bling, bling, blah, blah.
So it's basically them saying, yeah, man, it's
really windy out there, and there's big waves.
(54:32):
So that's why ships go down.
That's it, pal.
Another common theory is for the disappearance
is magnetic anomalies caused by a magneticdeclination.
Magnetic deviation.
Declination refers to the difference between
(54:52):
true north and magnetic north, which differsdepending on the location.
On average, Lake Michigan deviates four tofive degrees westward.
So in other words, you have a conference out,and you're like, okay, I'm going north.
Wait a minute.
That's not north.
This is.
No, that's north.
(55:12):
No, because 45 degrees off, if you're, like,in a ship can walk.
Speaker B (55:18):
Yeah.
Speaker A (55:19):
And it's really.
It's not as bad as if you were walking with,
let's say you went with your familyYellowstone, and you're four to five degrees
off of whatever you're looking for.
Yeah.
It's gonna throw you off, and it's gonna suck.
But you probably can figure it out.
You know, you probably be like, okay, thisdoesn't seem right.
(55:39):
Deviations are errors incurred in the compassby local magnetic field.
For example, if you were to hold a campus neara magnetic object, the needle would point
towards the object.
Although this would not be a problem in
vehicles with other navigational equipment, itcould cause confusion to inexperienced sailors
(56:02):
and pilots.
So I get it.
You know, if your inexperience is like, whoo,let's go out, have a party, grab a bunch of
beers, and go out.
Yeah, you're screwed.
But if you're going out with experiencedpeople, they should be like, it's 45 degrees.
I'm telling you.
Degrees.
I've been on this lake 50 million times.
I'm telling you.
Right.
(56:22):
So that doesn't explain the stories I've said
with experienced people having issues.
All right, so now let's get to what Chelsea
and I think what happened.
The paranormal.
Here we go.
Conspiracy theorists have blamed the triangle
on a negative energy vortex.
Thank you.
(56:43):
Energy vortexes are the idea that certainlocations emit sacred, powerful, and
transformational energy.
Although vortexes are typical, considered to
be promote positivity and healing, it'sclaimed that vortexes with negative energy
also exist.
(57:04):
These locations are purportedly sources of
danger and hostility.
Ley lines, which I've talked about.
I don't know if you talked about that at all,Chelsea.
Are areas of interest of ancient structuresand landmarks often cited as causes of energy
vortex.
According to ley line maps, one runs down the
(57:26):
middle of Lake Michigan.
Others attribute the triangles.
Supposed vortex to a prehistoric structureunder a Lake Michigan.
Discovered by archaeologists in 2007, the siteis often referred to as, wait for it.
North American Stonehenge.
Speaker B (57:45):
What?
Speaker A (57:47):
You can look at this.
It's on Google.
It's super interesting.
I'll put some up in my.
On my social sites and everything.
It looks like Stonehead.
I mean, dead ringer crazy.
It's a dead ringer for Stonehead.
Like, doesn't make any sense.
That's insane.
It was on an island, right?The Atlantis theory, you know, land is sunk.
(58:10):
Everybody knows that.
Right.
It's fascinating.
And you can, if you're a good diver and you
can go below 400ft, you can take a look atthis.
And people have said it's amazing just to makeothers believe the occurrences to be aliens.
Thank you.
UFO sightings.
Okay.
(58:31):
And look, come on.
We all know that's true.
Give me a break.
Men in black right here.
Men in black right here.
Come knocking at my door.
I don't care.
I'm ready for it.
Now, the author, which, if you haven't, if
you're in the paranormal and you haven't readthis author, please do or see some of his
movies.
(58:51):
Hp Lovecraft said, we live on a placid island
of ignorance in the midst of black seas ofinfinity, and it was not meant that we should
voyage far.
So that's it.
I love that, you know, that was awesome.
(59:12):
I love that.
I think it's really interesting because no oneknows what's going on.
No one's really sure.
Yeah.
I think it's a. To me, this is what I alwaysask my guests.
I believe it's real.
I believe there is a Lake Michigan triangle.
And I do believe it's a combination offactors.
Chelsea, what do you think?Yes or no?
Speaker B (59:33):
I don't know for sure what it is, but there's something weird going on, and I
think it does.
I think it's probably a combination of both
natural and supernatural.
Speaker A (59:43):
Mm hmm.
I agree.
Speaker B (59:45):
I totally like the natural being influenced by the supernatural.
Speaker A (59:49):
I totally agree.
I totally agree.
I think it's something.
Oh, boy.
Nobody will ever really know what's going on,but there's so many strange disappearances
that I'm not saying the paranormal is alwaysthe right explanation.
Right.
But sometimes it's like, I just don't know.
Speaker B (01:00:10):
Right, right.
Speaker A (01:00:11):
Oh, let's go with the mystery.
Right.
And that's.
That's the great thing about paranormal, is go
about having that mystery and not knowing.
You can't know everything.
Right.
Speaker B (01:00:21):
Right.
Speaker A (01:00:22):
Good to be like you know, this is really interesting.
So, Chelsea, thank you so much.
Speaker B (01:00:28):
Thank you for having me.
Speaker A (01:00:30):
I love you.
You're great.
It's been so much fun.
I love your ideas.
Great ideas.
I'm going to get 12,000 friends after this.
Speaker B (01:00:40):
Perfect.
Speaker A (01:00:42):
Hopefully you'll come with me and bring your boyfriend, of course.
And we will.
Your family, too.
I don't care.
We will take a ship across Lake Michigan with
12,000 furs and see what happens to us.
Speaker B (01:00:54):
Sign up for that.
Speaker A (01:00:56):
You promised me.
I got my audience here.
This is.
I just think that's great and everything.
And I just, you know, I love this.
I think, again, it shows the midwest is so
rich in history and paranormal and everything.
(01:01:17):
Before we go, just tell people again about
what you're doing this summer so they.
So they know and some of the things coming up
so they can go and visit you or take a look atit.
Speaker B (01:01:28):
Perfect. Well, I've got a lot of paranormal investigations coming up soon, so
I'm going to try to be posting about thoseover on my instagram, which is station 59
podcast, I think.
Yes.
I also am starting up my YouTube channel,which is at Chelsea Dan, and I'm going to be
trying to post videos there.
So.
(01:01:49):
Yeah.
Speaker A (01:01:49):
And I will always share as much as I can with, with each other.
You know, we have our little coven, so I willshare stuff.
Chelsea always likes to share my stuff becauseI think it's really good for my audience to
see.
One thing I have to do is I have to pip, I
have a Patreon now.
I'm trying to get out there.
Trying to pimp it.
That's the wrong word.
(01:02:11):
Okay, sorry, Chelsea.
That was no offense.
Yeah, so anyway, I'm trying to promote it.
There we go.
That's a better word.
Get that out.
So please go to my Patreon.
The only way you're going to see Chelsea and
me talking is on Patreon.
So listen to our great voices.
So if you want to see us live in action andsee that Chelsea has some great pictures that
(01:02:34):
she has up here, you are going to have to goto Patreon and you're going to have to check
it out.
It's only $3 to be a parascanis.
$3?Come on.
That's not even a thing of coffee anymore.
At least with me.
Starbucks.
And it's like $6 for a stupid.
Whatever I'm getting.
So, anyway, thank you so much, Chelsea.
(01:02:55):
I love to have you on again.
And I will do everything I can to follow you
and my spooky friends, you know.
So again, like we end every my episodes is say
hi to your ghost.
Hello, ghost.
Cause you never know, right?There might be a ghost.
And stay stupid.
Thanks, Chelsea.
Yay.
Speaker B (01:03:13):
Thank you.
Speaker A (01:03:14):
See ya.
Bye bye.
Hello, my spooky friends.
I'm John, your host, and welcome to another
episode of Dairyland, the paranormal podcastthat covers everything spooky, creepy, and
mysterious in the midwest.
And again, I am blessed by another great
spooky guest, my spooky friend, Chelsea fromstation 59 podcast.
Speaker B (00:42):
Hello.
Speaker A (00:45):
All right.
So, Kelsey, thank you so much.
You are one of my first guests.
I've missed you.
Speaker B (00:52):
I have missed you, too.
Thank you so much for having me back on.
Speaker A (00:56):
Chelsea and I are from the midwest, and I love having my midwesterns on because
they are the greatest.
We have some great stories.
So, Chelsea, tell me about what you've beenworking on.
Any spooky things?
Speaker B (01:11):
Yes, I actually have a couple spooky things coming up here, so I've
obviously been working on the podcast.
I'm putting out my episodes on YouTube now, so
that's exciting.
But then next month, I am booked for an
investigation at Trans Allegheny LunaticAsylum, which I went to last year.
And I'm staying the whole night this time, soI'm very excited.
Speaker A (01:35):
Nice.
Speaker B (01:36):
And then over the summer, I am actually going to help host public event at
Missouri State Penitentiary.
Ooh, yeah.
Speaker A (01:46):
Yeah.
Speaker B (01:47):
I'm very excited.
Speaker A (01:48):
Acres of blood.
I did a thing on that.
A little episode on that.
That's crazy.
Yeah.
Speaker B (01:55):
I'm so excited.
Speaker A (01:58):
Well, that sounds awesome.
And again, my spooky friends, please check out
Chelsea's podcast, the station, station 59podcast, and check out all her events.
You're gonna love it.
Chelsea is great.
So she's awesome.
And one of these days, that's where all the
(02:18):
planes went and everything crashed.
And, you know, it's, like, really crazy,
right?
Speaker B (02:23):
I always thought as a child that.
That the Berita triangle was going to be more
of an issue in my life.
Speaker A (02:28):
Oh, really?
Speaker B (02:30):
I. Like, I just remember reading books about it and hearing about it on tv, and
I was like, oh, my God.
Like, that's how I'm going to go out.
I'm going to disappear in the bearded Bermudatriangle.
Speaker A (02:43):
There's Chelsea in her.
I just learned to fly.
I'm going over the la, la.
Oh, Chelsea, no. Whoa.
Speaker B (02:51):
Driving a boat and just vanish into thin air.
Speaker A (02:53):
Driving a boat.
La la la.
Look at my new boat, everybody go, great.
You know, the funny thing about the Bermuda
triangle.
Excuse me, is you don't hear about it much
anymore, right?Yeah, right.
Speaker B (03:10):
We just start avoiding it.
Speaker A (03:12):
I don't know.
We just.
I think it's sitting there getting ready forsomething.
I'll see.
I hate to **** the new boat.
Speaker B (03:22):
Never going on a cruise.
Speaker A (03:25):
Why is this cruise going the Bermuda Triangle?
Hello.
What are we doing?
The funny thing is about that is I was readingsome information and really, planes have been
get lost from time to time.
You know, there's some famous case, I think,
in Malaysia, whatever, from years ago.
But what pilots have said, it's virtually
(03:47):
impossible now to lose a plane becausesatellites, other redundancies, it's just
super, super, super hard.
Even a smaller plane or a boat has some type
of gps in it for sure.
So it would be like, pretty hard to do that.
And I'm like, well, we'll figure it out.
(04:09):
Chelsea and I will figure out a way to get
along.
Anyway, so one of the things I thought was
really interesting, not only that, Chelseathinks she's gonna get lost in a Bermuda
triangle.
By the way, what do you think is down there?
You think you're gonna get UFO's or is ithollow Earth or what do you think it is?
Speaker B (04:29):
I've always just assumed that there's like a massive whirlpool and it just
sucks everything into it.
Speaker A (04:35):
Yeah, that's it.
Speaker B (04:38):
Well, there's got to be something at the bottom of the whirlpool that's causing
it, obviously.
Speaker A (04:42):
Yeah, that's what I'm saying.
I like to look at it like there's a bunch of
Amazon women down there and they're king.
And I become king.
Okay.
That's a whole different fantasy.
Whoops.
Sorry about that, folks.
Anyway, no, I don't know what there really is.
(05:03):
You know what I'm saying?
Because the things that I heard, and youprobably heard when you were younger, UFO's,
right?UFO grabbed the ship.
Maybe you went to there was a vortex and youwound up in, I don't know, planet or there's
just.
It's gone.
(05:23):
Nobody has a clue where it is, right?Nobody has any idea.
And the funny thing was, Chelsea, I waslooking around at that, I was like, I wonder
if there's anything in the midwest like this,right?
There's something weird.
And here it is.
Our little teaser before we begin the show isthe Lake Michigan Triangle, or simply Michigan
(05:45):
triangle is an area of Lake Michigan whereseveral disappearances.
Shipwrecks.
There you go.
Plane crashes have occurred under unexplainedcircumstances.
I know.
Who have you.
I didn't hear about this before.
(06:05):
I was just poking around, looking around,
trying to find something.
Good topic for us.
How about you, Chelsea?Have you heard about this?
Speaker B (06:11):
I have not.
I know that the Great Lakes have a lot of
weird stuff and some legends around them, butI have not heard of the triangle before.
Speaker A (06:20):
Yeah, right.
Neither have I. Now I've been up to Door
county and if you go to Door county there's apart of it which I love the name, it's called
death's door and you go through it and if youever get a chance, please go up there.
It's absolutely gorgeous.
Also they have a thing about witches.
It's a lot of crazy paranormal stuff up there.
(06:42):
And I know a gentleman who I interviewed on
the show.
His name is Earl.
He's very nice.
If you ever go up there, I would tell you're
coming and see if you can get a discount.
Go on there.
Anything to help my friends out.
Am I still getting that?
So, you know, again, I just never thoughtabout that because in Door county, the reason
they call it death stores because it wasreally, really hard to navigate and there's
(07:05):
rocks and there's fallen trees and everything.
So back in the 18 hundreds, early 19 hundreds
where you had a wooden ship and there's astorm and you're trying to go through this.
It's virtually impossible to get through, notwithout hitting a rock.
So there's many, many shipwrecks in that areathat if you're a scuba diver, I don't know.
(07:25):
Are you a scuba diver at all, Chelsea?
Speaker B (07:27):
I am not.
I'm not even a good swimmer.
Speaker A (07:30):
I sink like a rock.
Yeah, we're, we're both, you know.
Wait a minute.
I'm not going out of that, that boat with you
because we'll both drown because we'll be theworst.
Speaker B (07:41):
One of us has to know how to swim if we're going on this adventure.
Speaker A (07:45):
All right, Chelsea, we need to take swimming lessons.
No, this south takes swimming lessons beforegoing to boat with Chelsea.
So anyway, there's this one indoor countywhere this preserved shipwreck so you could
actually go on a boat tour and you can hoverright over it and it's in the water from the,
(08:06):
I think 1718 hundreds.
Speaker B (08:09):
That's crazy.
Speaker A (08:10):
You just see it right there.
It's like you could almost touch it, which you
cannot touch it because then somebody willyell at you.
But if you go swimming, you go scuba diving.
You can go and you can take a look at it and
it's amazing.
You see pictures of it on the Internet and
you're like, whoa, that's crazy how long itis.
So let's start first with the history of theLake Michigan triangle.
(08:37):
So unidentified flying objects, UFO's orthey're called uaps.
Now.
I'm sorry, what does UAP stand for identified
aerial phenomena?
Speaker B (08:49):
Okay.
Speaker A (08:50):
The military gets involved and screws everything up.
Go away.
Anyway, also, USo's and unidentified submerged
objects have also alleged allegedly beenspotted in the area.
Now, this is how big it is, okay?The triangle.
(09:12):
The triangle stretches from London, Londingtonto Manitowoc.
So if you look at it as a map, it's kind ofbig, you know, compared to the Bermuda
triangle, it's kind of small.
It's just a certain area in the Caribbean, or
Caribbean, however you want to say it.
But it goes down to Benton harbor and back to
Ludington.
(09:32):
The first.
I was talking to Chelsea offline.
I have some friends who are tarot readers.
Maybe we'll do a live tarot reading aroundOctober or something.
When it comes a little spooky or somethinglike that, who knows, right?
Speaker B (09:45):
Be so fun.
Speaker A (09:47):
Yeah. I'm sure it would give us good news.
Like, there's no shadow man lurking in thecorner.
We're not.
Demons are infesting us, and we're like,
great.
That's why I'm having a bad day.
So, again, check Chelsea out.
All her things that she's been doing.
(10:08):
Station 59 and all the things coming up.
So let's get right into our topic.
Chelsea.
All right, this is really interesting to me
because when you think of a triangle andmysteriousness and all that, you know, stuff.
You think of what?The Bermuda triangle?
Right?That's the famous one.
(10:29):
Major.
Let's get right into it.
Unexplained event was the disappearance of afrench sailing ship, l'Greville, and her crew,
in the 17th century.
Starting with the sinking of Thomas Hume in
1891, shipwrecks and disappearances havebecome more frequent.
(10:50):
And believe it or not, the first reported UFOsighting was in 1913.
Speaker B (10:57):
Wow.
Speaker A (10:58):
Okay, now think about that for a second.
That's crazy, because, you know, it's early 19hundreds.
It's like, you think people would not rememberthat or recall this UFO, but, yeah, they saw a
UFO.
People have said that, and we'll kind of get
into that a little bit.
So, the frequency of disappearances,
(11:19):
shipwrecks, and plane crashes within the GreatLakes was first mentioned in the Jay Gurley's
1977 book, the Great Lakes Triangle.
Although the exact origin of the Michigan
triangle wasn't known at that time, laterauthors focused on occurrences in the Lake
Michigan, particularly those within the boundsof the triangle.
(11:41):
So, at first, they didn't know.
And now that we have all gps and we have all
this stuff, we can be like, there it is, rightthere.
Speaker B (11:48):
Wild.
Speaker A (11:49):
Yeah. And it's really interesting to me, too, that just a certain part, you know
what I mean?Because you said you were to Lake Michigan,
cracked and went to all the shipwrecks.
What did you find most interesting?
When you were kind of going to museums andeverything, I think it was.
Speaker B (12:08):
Just, like, how well preserved a lot of the shipwrecks are and how there's
still things in them that they're able tobring up and they're untouched, essentially.
Speaker A (12:18):
Yeah, exactly.
And you know why that is?
Is because there's no salt water.
It's cold.
You know, it's perfect conditions forpreserving a ship.
Right.
So that is awesome.
Yeah.
And then they also.
I remember, too, I was thinking of the museumtwo years ago, and I remember they had a
(12:39):
simulation at that time, if they still do,where you could take a tanker out of Lake
Michigan and you could steer it.
It was just like a 3d simulator.
And it was really harder than you thinkbecause you just turn the wheel just a little
bit.
You're like, right into the side of the canal.
Speaker B (12:58):
Oh, man.
I'd be terrible at it.
Speaker A (13:03):
It'd be like a pinball machine.
Oh, well.
But some experts have debated about the shapeand range of the triangle, which you're always
going to have one argued that the area is nota triangle, but a rectangle, which doesn't
come off the tongue.
Right, Chelsea.
It's the make Lake Michigan tri rectangle.
Speaker B (13:26):
Not the same ring to it.
Speaker A (13:28):
Yeah. It doesn't have the same marketing value.
I'm in marketing, so I'll be Lake Michiganrectangle.
Can we do a triangle or something?
Speaker B (13:36):
You know, can we just rework this a little bit?
Speaker A (13:39):
Cut out this.
Perfect.
Or they said an oblong shape, but again,doesn't work.
Lake Michigan oblong shape.
I don't know.
Right.
Speaker B (13:52):
Not quite as mysterious, I'd say.
Speaker A (13:55):
Mysterious.
So that encompasses most of all that they say
Lake Michigan.
So let's get in there.
So, in other words, there's a debate where itis and where, but they kind of know where it
is and it's a triangle.
But I just think how people.
You're like, well, maybe it's not a triangle.
I find that funny.
So, ligraphone was one of the earliest knownincidents in the Lake Michigan triangle and
(14:21):
the disappearance of the lgrathon and her crewon September 18, 1679.
Speaker B (14:30):
Wow.
Speaker A (14:31):
Yeah, I know, right? This is crazy.
So, Ligafon dark by the Le grand ble.
It's present day green bay.
Loaded up 12,000 pounds of furs.
That's a lot of furs.
Holy ****.
Wow.
Okay.
And set sail for Lake Erie.
However, the vessel never arrived at herdestination and no confirmed remnants of the
(14:59):
ship have ever been located.
Some assume that the ligraphone perished in a
storm.
Others have theorized that the Ottawas or
Potawatomis boarded her murdered crew and thenset her ablaze.
Rene Robert Chevy, ze de La Salle, ship'sbuilder, was convinced that.
(15:22):
I take French.
This is horrible.
I can make emails from people who speakFrench.
What are you doing?Was convinced that the pilot and crew sunk the
ship and made off with the Perth.
Okay, there's no substantial evidence for any
of these series, so let's talk about this fora second.
How would you sink a ship and take 12,000?What was it?
(15:45):
Pounds?Furs?
Explain that to me, Chelsea.
Speaker B (15:51):
If you have 12,000 friends and you each get, you give them each a pound and then
you make it your own city, and there you go.
Speaker A (16:04):
I love it.
Why did I think of that?
12,000 friends.
Oh, all right.
Well, fine.
Speaker B (16:11):
It'll only take a couple years.
It's fine.
Speaker A (16:13):
All right.
See, this is my whole thing.
Get the friends.
Speaker B (16:17):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker A (16:18):
There we go.
Perfect.
Yeah, it could have been Indians.
That would happen a lot, but it would mostly
happen in what Native Americans would, youknow, unfortunately, when they're starving and
all the things we stole, us bad white people,thank you very much.
From them, which belonged to them.
Now I feel bad.
Usually would do it on like, river flat boat.
(16:40):
So usually you would hear a lot of stories
where flat boat be coming down, and thenNative Americans would attack the boats and
take the furs so they wouldn't starve or, youknow, freeze to death in winter.
So. Okay, that's.
That's my two cent on that.
That's a whole nother podcast, too.
(17:01):
So there.
So, anything else on this before we move on tothe next ship?
Speaker B (17:08):
Hmm.
Speaker A (17:10):
12,000 friends is really good.
Speaker B (17:11):
Oh, thank you so much.
I, you know, full of ideas.
Not all of them are good, but they're ideas.
Speaker A (17:19):
We'll take it.
Awesome.
So let's move on to the next one.
The Thomas Hume.
I like to pronounce this.
Thank goodness.
May 21, 1891.
The schooners Thomas Hume and roses rose.
Rose Simmons set off from the port afterdropping the shipment Lombard, Chicago.
(17:40):
Both ships were supposed to return to theHackley Hume lumber mill in Muskegon, but
after encountering a squall, the crew of therose Simmons returned to Chicago until the
weather improved.
However, Thomas Hume continued on and
disappeared along with six sailors on boardHeckley Hume sent a vessel to search for the
(18:05):
schooner and offered a $300 reward, by theway, in the 18 hundreds.
That's a lot of money.
Speaker B (18:11):
Yes.
Speaker A (18:13):
But had no success in finding the ship.
Theories arose as to what happened to theThomas Hume, the most widely accepted that she
sank.
Some storm caused the rose Simmons to retreat
to Chicago.
Others included Charles Hackley believed that
another boat collided with and sunk theschooner.
So in other words, sunk, you know, everythinglike that.
(18:35):
And then the weird thing about this iseverything in the early.
Well, from the 16 hundreds to 18 hundreds hadto go if it was bigger than a bread box.
Look, I'm dating myself here.
Had to go on a ship.
So lumber, furs, cotton, you name it, had togo on a ship because the railways at that time
(19:00):
weren't that great.
Yeah, we definitely didn't have cars, and we
definitely didn't have, well, anything totransport it to where we needed to go.
Could you imagine that, Chelsea, how hard lifewould be?
You're just like, I just need some supplies,and you got to wait maybe a month.
Speaker B (19:19):
Yeah. My boyfriend and I were just talking the other day about, like, the wagon
trail going out west.
I'm like, we were thinking, just how would you
get through the mountains?Like, how did people pull that off with a
wagon?
Speaker A (19:34):
Yeah.
Speaker B (19:35):
Absolutely crazy.
Speaker A (19:36):
Absolutely.
And if you ever get a chance, there's some
authors out there, and there used to be a showon PBS where they would take a family, just a
normal family in today's world, and then putthem in the 18 hundreds.
Oh, my God.
Just to make breakfast.
Took like an hour.
Speaker B (19:55):
Yeah, I believe it.
Speaker A (19:56):
You had to go out, get the eggs from the, you know, wherever.
I don't know.
Maybe you have a farm, maybe you don't.
But you still got to go get eggs.
Then you got to figure out where the bacon
was.
By the way, you don't have a fridge.
You open the fridge and microwave anything.
You know, it was just insanity.
I mean, just like, women your age would haveto wear a dress and you have to wear a corset.
(20:17):
You'd have to make sure your hair is good, andyou, you know, it isn't.
Like I throw on a sweat top and somesweatpants, right?
My boyfriend are gonna go out and grab aburger or whatever.
It doesn't work.
Speaker B (20:30):
We have a. We have, like, a lit.
It's called living history farms.
And it's like.
It's.
I don't even know how to describe it, but it'slike an 18 hundreds village that you can go
visit.
And they have reenactments and all that.
And I took a field trip there in elementaryschool, and we had to go to the schoolhouse in
full period dress, and we had to live a schoolday in the 18 hundreds.
Speaker A (20:53):
Oh, how'd that go?
Speaker B (20:55):
It left an impression on me, for sure.
I liked my dress, at least.
Speaker A (21:04):
Oh, there you go.
I know.
So, in other words, like I said, this is noteasy.
And then if the ship sinks, you're.
Well, you're sold, right?
What are you gonna do?You're like, well, okay.
And I know.
It's so funny.
My kids will ***** about when, oh, I even gotmy package yet from Amazon.
(21:25):
And I always go, do you know what life used tobe like, kids.
Okay, I'll just go over here.
Yeah.
So forget it.
And again, mail not get anything.
So, like, if you sent someone, like, oh, myGod, I think my.
My husband died in world War one or something.
It isn't like someone calls you on your cell
phone or text you, I'm sorry, Chelsea.
(21:48):
You know, it's like months later, you find out
he's still alive.
Oh, ****.
I just got remarried.
Ah, **** it.
I want you to do awkward.
Awkward.
This is Bill Bell.
I'm glad we're not into that stuff.
So one of the things I think is really funny,too, is that nobody knows what happened.
(22:14):
So again, we still have no idea.
No one's found these ships to this day.
So now this is one is a little moreinteresting to me because this one happened in
2006.
Speaker B (22:26):
Oh.
Speaker A (22:27):
An A and T recovery employee discovered the sunken ship.
He says, this is really interesting whensearching for a lost United States Navy
aircraft.
So there was, like, all these people looking
for this aircraft, and they did find a ship.
(22:48):
And guess what they found the Thomas Hume one.
Speaker B (22:52):
No way.
Speaker A (22:54):
The other ship.
I don't know if they've ever found this, but
they did find it when they were looking for a.
Another aircraft that had crashed there.
So. And they said, this is crazy, that again,it was in perfect condition and has to come to
a storm and that it was intact.
(23:15):
But they think, too, that maybe it was rammed
into by another vessel.
Pirates.
On Lake Michigan.
So, yes, there were pirates.
Everyone thinks, you know, Johnny Depp andpirates of the Caribbean.
Yeah, look at that.
No, there were pirates on.
(23:36):
In Lake Michigan.
Who?
So the.
In words, they were looking.
The navy in 2006 was looking, and they found.
Whoops.
Hey, look what we found.
We found the Thomas Hume.
And, yeah, the fur wasn't there, by the way.
Speaker B (23:51):
Dang it.
Speaker A (23:52):
Thousand pounds of fur.
Anyway, so the next one is the Rosabella.
In 1863, the Rosabella was a two mastedschooner who used to transport materials to
the house of David in Benton Harbor.
I don't know what that is.
Between 1875 and 1926, she was found capsizedtwice.
(24:14):
I don't know how you could do that with nosigns of her crew.
Okay, so again, there's kind of a theme here.
With the exception, they did find the Thomas
Hume, which, not to confuse people, you know,a lot of people say, well, wait a minute, I
thought they didn't find it.
They did find it, but they, you know, it was
(24:34):
under, like, being rammed and stuff like that.
So there was something that went on with that
ship.
But most ships, they do not find, or nor do
they find that there's been mysteriouscircumstances.
So I didn't know this, that they started thisearly, but in 1875, a car ferry crossing the
(24:55):
lake discovered.
Why would you car ferry or crossing Lake
Michigan?I like to see where they're crossing.
Right. 1875.
Okay.
All right, I'll go with it.
The schooner floating upside down.
So they found this car ferry that's floatingupside down.
The ten man crew who departed the boat werenever found, probably drowned.
(25:20):
The ship was then turned over and returned tothe port of Milwaukee where she remained in
service.
So in other words, there was a car ferry,
which.
Okay, it flipped over the crew.
Ten man crew was never found, but they flippedit back over and it remained in service for
quite a while.
Speaker B (25:40):
Okay, we'll just find a new crew.
It's fine.
Speaker A (25:43):
By the way, ten people died on this thing, so let's go, guys.
Come on.
What are we doing?
Speaker B (25:48):
It's fine.
Don't worry about it.
Speaker A (25:49):
Yeah, so I didn't know 1875.
Okay, I got to go back and look at my history.
Would you go on a car ferry crossing LakeMichigan, Chelsea?
Speaker B (26:01):
I don't think I'd go on anything crossing Lake Michigan, to be so honest.
I went out just a little bit on Lake Michiganover the summer and there was a big 18
hundreds replica sailing ship.
And I was watching that thing just toss back
and forth and it was.
Speaker A (26:21):
Like, nope, nope, not for me.
Yeah, when I was a little, I was weird.
Chelsea and I were talking about this offline.
When I was about 14, I went on a fishing trip
with my father and my good buddy and we wentto Lake Michigan and we were in like the
middle of it where I couldn't see land and Iwas freaking out, you know, for quite a while.
(26:48):
So I got my bearings.
But, you know, if any of you people know what
that is?Dairyland, brightsmail.com.
Send me something.
Say, yeah, that's happened to me, too.
No, thanks.
And I saw this tank.
I was telling Chelsea, I saw this tanker.
It's like city just going past us.
And I'm like, ****, you know, yeah, no, I amnot doing that.
(27:12):
So in October of 1921, one of the things herewas, you know that fairy I was talking about?
Okay, for some reason, they decided thatthey're going to depart again, but this time,
they're going to put a load of potatoes on itand lumber.
I don't know what you're going with, goingwith this.
(27:35):
However, the ship's captain, Ed Johnson.
I love that name.
He refused to board it.
He was like, so remember they went to the port
of Milwaukee, and they were.
Now they're like, oh, let's not use for cars.
Maybe that wasn't the smartest thing.
Let's use it for a bunch of lumber and
potatoes and send it across Lake Michigan.
(27:55):
And then Ed Johnson, he was like, I said, he's
captain said, no, not going at it.
Because if you know anything about nautical or
people who have been on ships or lighthousesor something, a lot of nautical people are
very superstitious.
Chelsea, have you heard.
Have you ever done any stories on that?Maybe on a haunted lighthouse or a haunted
(28:17):
ship?And people are just like, you know.
Speaker B (28:20):
I have not yet.
I've been to a few lighthouses that had some.
Some vibes to them, but I haven't done anystories about that yet.
Speaker A (28:30):
So my question would be, would you ever be one?
I don't know.
What lighthouse conductor?
I don't know.
What do you call it because of the lighthouse?
I have no idea.
Would you ever be one of those people?
Just be out of the lighthouse for, like, ayear by yourself?
Speaker B (28:44):
If I was close enough to civilization because I don't like being in the
middle of nowhere.
It creeps me out.
Speaker A (28:54):
Why does it creep you out?
Speaker B (28:57):
This is so morbid.
I just.
I watch so much truth.
I watched so much true crime as a child.
I just feel like I need to be around a placewhere people can hear me scream.
In worst case scenario, that's pretty morbid.
Speaker A (29:12):
Okay, all right.
Okay. All right.
There we go.
Chelsea.
Chelsea just told us a very personal thing,and we'll go with that.
Okay, you know what?Now I got to do pranks on you.
Put on, like, Michael Myers Hollow Halloweenmask, and be like, yeah, I'll just.
Speaker B (29:36):
I'll cry.
I'll curl up in a ball and cry.
Speaker A (29:39):
Well, no, I feel bad I just said that.
That's good.
Speaker B (29:43):
Now I'm going to.
I'm going to give it right back to you.
Speaker A (29:46):
Thanks a lot.
I feel bad.
Okay.
Ed won't go on this yet.
Chelsea screaming her hat off.
It's his son later stated that Johnson.
Oh, boy.
Had a premonition that a disaster was about to
occur again.
Like, these guys are really superstitious.
(30:06):
You can read all these great tales, you know.
I would like to do, like, one on the Edmund
Fitzgerald famous.
It's a Gordon Lightfoot song, if you're into
old, good old rock and roll, kind of folksymusic.
Nobody really does understand that either.
But I remember in there, I would like to do an
episode on it that the crew was like,something's not right.
(30:29):
And they've crossed.
This is a huge tanker, and they crossed
numerous times, but they knew that day, like,something's not right.
But the.
The crew went aboard and they kept.
You know, they went and they haven't found it.
I don't think they found it.
I have to look it up.
Maybe they have, but I can't remember.
Do you remember anything, if they found EdmundFitzgerald, any?
Speaker B (30:51):
I don't remember if they found it or not.
But I do know a really interesting tidbit,because when I was doing my research for my
episode on Lake Superior, it kind of touchedon that.
And almost to the day, almost every singleyear, there's been a storm on the anniversary
of the sinking, a massive, massive storm.
Speaker A (31:14):
Interesting.
Speaker B (31:15):
Yeah.
Speaker A (31:16):
Huh. That's cool.
Wonder why that would be.
Wow.
Speaker B (31:21):
There's, like, something about wind patterns or whatever, but I think it's ghosts.
Speaker A (31:26):
Sure. Pyramid coming back.
I get it.
At a ship.
That's crazy.
Speaker B (31:31):
Yeah.
Speaker A (31:32):
The crew.
I could see this.
The crew could not convince Johnson andJohnson to board this ship and said, you know,
so they left without them.
Okay, bye, captain.
You know what?
Speaker B (31:46):
You.
Speaker A (31:47):
We have no clue, see? Like, what?
So they left, and days later.
Oh, boy, here we go.
The ship was found, capsized again.
No signs of her crew.
Oh, boy.
They didn't say how many, but I'm guessing ten
again.
So, like, 20 guys or gals or whoever was on
(32:08):
that ship are gone.
Jeez.
The captain's like, don't go aboard.
I feel.
Yeah, I'm doing whatever.
There's my voice of the creepy captain.
And they went, okay, see ya.
We're doing it anyway.
We need the money.
Goodbye.
Okay, now, one of the things they found was tothe stern when they found the ship again.
(32:30):
So they did find it again.
It capsized.
The stern was missing.
So it's kind of like if your steering wheel
and your car is missing, basically, it's like,indicating that there was a collision, but no
ship reported having an accident.
Speaker B (32:47):
Interesting.
Speaker A (32:48):
United States coast guard, which dragged the ship back into Racine harbor,
later determined there was no collision.
Hmm.
Right.
Interesting.
So what you were just saying about Edmund, theEdmund Fitzgerald in the storm, why is this
happening to this ship?
Speaker B (33:08):
Mm hmm.
Speaker A (33:09):
Right.
Like, same thing basically happened, you know,
capsized or just so.
I don't know.
Any theories?I love to hear them.
Speaker B (33:19):
I think the ship in a past life was not a good, a good ship.
And so he's his reincarnation now.
He's just gonna struggle.
Speaker A (33:29):
Yeah, exactly.
The ship did some bad juju on that ship.
Okay.
Speaker B (33:36):
Exactly.
He, like, bullied other ships in his, in his
last life.
And so they're like, you know what?
Speaker A (33:41):
Yeah.
Speaker B (33:42):
Capsize for you.
Speaker A (33:43):
Yeah.
Speaker B (33:43):
That's all you get.
Speaker A (33:44):
You're gonna capsize.
That's perfect.
I love it.
First of all, get 12,000 friends with the
first.
We got a lot of stuff going on.
So the next one is.
Yeah, this was George R. Adonner.
Oh, geez.
I just.
It just occurred to me, you know, the Donnerparty.
(34:05):
Whoops.
How you like to be like, I'm captain of a
ship.
That's your donner?
Yeah.
I'm not going out here.
No, thanks.
Good.
Thank.
George R. Donner was the captain of the Om
McFarland, a coal freighter.
On April 28, 1937, Donner's 58th birthday, the
(34:27):
ship picked up 9800 tons of coal.
Holy ****.
Coal.
That's a lot.
In Erie, Pennsylvania.
They just keep just loading these shabby.
I just put the **** on there.
I think it's too heavy.
Shut up.
We need to get this over here.
Speaker B (34:44):
No wonder we're not.
We're sinking all the time.
Speaker A (34:46):
No wonder we're sinking all the time.
Guys, stop with the 12,000 pounds of fur, the**** tons of coal.
That's a lot of **** coal.
Holy.
And then they traveled west through the lakes,found for Port Washington, Wisconsin.
The captain had spent hours on the bridgetracking the Om McGarlan through the ice flow.
So, boy, here we go.
(35:06):
When they reached Lake Michigan, Donner
retired to his cabin, instructing the crew toalert him once the ship neared her
destination.
3 hours later, when the vessel near port
Washington, the second mate went to Donner'scabin but found it had been locked from the
inside.
(35:27):
Oh. Assuming Donner had gone to the galley for
a snack, why would you assume that.
Okay.
He went to the gallery, but to no avail.
The crew then began an extensive search for
their captain, but it was futile.
They eventually broke down the door, which I
would have done in the first place, to thecabin, but didn't find a donner.
(35:50):
Donner.
Speaker B (35:50):
What?
Speaker A (35:51):
All right, this is kind of mean, but we get it.
Donner was too large to fit through the twoportholes in his room and showed no sign of
depression or suicidal thought.
Speaker B (36:06):
And it was his birthday.
Speaker A (36:07):
It was his birthday.
Local ports and ships searched for a donner in
the water, but no sign was ever found.
Okay, Chelsea, I'm putting your hat, mystery,
true crime hat on.
What happened to Donner?
Speaker B (36:24):
Let's see.
I think when he went to his room, he found one
of those, like, harry Potter styleinvisibility cloaks.
Speaker A (36:34):
Yep, yep.
Speaker B (36:34):
But then he couldn't figure out how to get it off.
Speaker A (36:36):
Right.
Speaker B (36:36):
And he just disappeared.
Speaker A (36:38):
Yeah. I love it.
That's perfect.
That's what happened.
He's like, it's my birthday.
I'm sick of these **** ship.
I'm gonna go and get a drink.
Oh, ****.
You're gonna see me.
Aha.
So here's the thing.
I think what he did, and it's in allseriousness, and then tell me if I'm right or
(36:59):
just a lunatic.
Don't tell me if I'm a lunatic, because I'm
like.
Anyway, I think what he did, he snuck out, got
a dinghy, which is a small boats, right?And just said, like, you know what?
I'm 58 years old.
I'm sick of this ****.
I got a bunch of smelly dudes.
I'm a bunch of **** coal.
I just gotta get out of here.
I want to be a violinist in the philharmonic,
(37:23):
and that's what I'm gonna do.
Speaker B (37:25):
So that makes perfect sense.
Speaker A (37:26):
See? Yeah. All the time.
Which they forgot to mention, by the way, he'splaying people.
Will you shut up?You're horrible.
And he's like, that's hurtful.
That's what I. I have no idea.
No. I could, like.
Right?
Speaker B (37:45):
That's. That's wild.
To disappear from a locked room.
Speaker A (37:50):
Correct.
Speaker B (37:50):
Is insane.
Speaker A (37:51):
And even if he took a so on tankers and stuff.
Yes, of course they have the different.
Not dinghies.
But what if I. What am I thinking of?A rescue boat or whatever you say, you know
what I mean?And maybe he did take, but in the middle of
Lake Michigan on a little boat, trying to getsomewhere.
Speaker B (38:13):
And you said there's ice floes and stuff like.
That's not a, that's not a good situation tobe in.
Speaker A (38:18):
Yeah. And it's, you know, even though it's a huge ship, it's not like they,
he could be like hiding in the boiler room orsomething and just be like sneaking around.
And then people are like, hey, where, where'scaptain?
Oh, I don't know.
You know, and why, why would he lock it?
(38:38):
Just, I don't know.
I think that's interesting.
I think it's an interesting case that the onlything I could think of is just maybe he got
sick of things and snuck out somehow andpeople didn't notice or he had people with him
working with him and saying like, hey, youknow, I got to get out of here.
Can you help me?But can't even see that, you know, your ice
(39:01):
flows trying to.
Yeah, I don't know, man.
Speaker B (39:04):
Maybe he was mad that nobody told him happy birthday.
And so he was like, well, screw you guys.
I'm, I'm out of here.
Speaker A (39:10):
Right? Where's my cake?
No one got.
Speaker B (39:13):
I thought this was my surprise party.
Speaker A (39:15):
Thanks a lot, guy.
You only turned 58 once.
Whatever.
I don't know.
It's just weird.
So this is our first airplane.
One.
Okay. 2501 Northwest Orient Airlines on the
evening of January 23, 1950.
(39:38):
Northwest Orient Airlines, excuse me.
Flight 25 51 carrying 55 passengers and threecrew from Lagarde, LaGuardia, excuse me.
Airport, New York City, four lagoon toMinneapolis.
Although a pre flight review of the weatherrevealed thunderstorms and possible squalls
(40:01):
along with, and a swole, if you guys want toknow, is basically like a really bad wind and
rain, you know, and you get caught in that.
In Lake Michigan, I would be peeing my pants
and probably something else and being like,God, just get me through this.
Right?It's nasty.
Along with the route of the flight, it was nota great concern to the crew.
(40:25):
Okay.
They're like, ah, we're over this.
Don't worry about it.
Boy, I don't know these so many people.
Anyway.
However, to avoid turbulence, Captain Robert
Lind requested to descend to an altitude of4000ft.
Wow, that's okay.
Yeah, that's low.
Speaker B (40:43):
That is very low.
Speaker A (40:45):
Instead of his assigned 6000ft, which is so low.
Okay.
On the aircraft.
As the aircraft, excuse me.
Approached Cleveland, Ohio.
I thought, they're going to Minneapolis.
Okay.
Lynn repeated the same request and it wasapproved that time.
So, you know, he's like, I want to go low.
After severe turbulence caused another plane
to fall 500ft.
(41:07):
Oh my gosh.
How do you like that?Well, I got stuck in an air pocket once and I
fell 100ft in a plane.
Yeah.
And it's like being in the elevator and theelevator goes out and it just, you just go
like that.
Speaker B (41:22):
I would lose it.
Speaker A (41:24):
Yeah, people lost it.
Yeah.
I was, like, sleeping.
I was, like, really tired, Chelsea, and I was
just like, sleep.
I had long business trip sleep and so I went,
what?You just, oh, my gosh.
Yeah, you're zero gravity.
You're falling like that.
Speaker B (41:41):
So I'm terrified of flying.
I do it all the time, but I'm so anxious the
entire time.
And just even turbulence, I'm like, oh, my
God.
Speaker A (41:49):
Yeah, 500ft.
That's a long.
So air traffic control instructed Lynn todescend to.
Okay, I don't know about these guys.
3500ft to avoid a collision with other
aircraft.
Speaker B (42:06):
Oh, my gosh.
Speaker A (42:07):
To which Lynn obliged.
Good for him.
Later, Lind and his co pilot decided to steersouth, an attempt to avoid the storm activity.
However, they inadvertently flew directly intoa squall line at 11:13 p.m.
The plane made its last radio transmission,requesting to descend to 2500ft.
(42:33):
The request was likely made because the crewwanted to drop below the clouds and obtain
more visual clarity.
However, air traffic control did not grant
them clearance because another plane wasdeparting from Milwaukee at that time.
So shortly after.
Afterwards, locals between Benton harbor and
(42:54):
South Haven reported hearing an aircraftflying low to the ground before whitneying a
flash of light over the lake.
Some witnesses reported hearing an explosion,
although it was hard to differentiate thesound from thundercloud.
By midnight, radio operatives realized thatthe plane was missing.
(43:18):
The next day, the coast Guard discovered anoil slick and partial debris approximately 18
miles northwest of Benton harbor.
In the following days, the search resulted in
the discovery of human remains such as, we'regetting in gold territory here.
So, kiddies, if you're listening, please donot listen to this.
(43:38):
And parents, if you have this on your, in yoursuv or your car and you have kids in the car,
you might want to pause and give yourself asass up.
So what human remains did they find?Ears, hands, bones and a seat armrest and
pieces of upholstery.
A pair of child's pants later identify those
(44:01):
of eight year old passenger.
Oh, Chester Shaffer.
A Chester.
Chester were also found.
Officials needed to temporarily.
That's such a cute clothes.
Close certain beaches due to the amount ofdebris washing ashore.
(44:22):
So you can imagine, hey, like, you know, youand your friend or whatever, walking along the
dog or whatever you got and be like, huh, thatlooks weird.
I don't know what that is.
And your dog comes back with a hand.
Speaker B (44:35):
Oh, my God.
Speaker A (44:38):
Okay. I have dark humor, so they just.
Speaker B (44:42):
That all I can think about is how horrific the impact had to be to make the
pieces that small, you know.
Speaker A (44:54):
That hit hard.
Speaker B (44:56):
Yeah.
Speaker A (44:56):
However, searchers have never been able to find any sizable amount of the plane
or its engine.
Speaker B (45:03):
Hmm.
Speaker A (45:04):
Most of the debris found was no larger than a person's hand.
That weird?
Speaker B (45:11):
That's crazy.
Speaker A (45:12):
That's weird.
So look at your hand.
You go, that's what they found.
Like, debris this side.
Weird.
Okay.
That means, bam.
That thing hit hard.
Yeah.
Authorities assume the aircraft crashed into
Lake Michigan.
Duh.
Evidence recovered suggests that the.
The plane likely hit the water in a forward,
(45:33):
downward to the left.
Forward, downward to the left at a high
velocity lap to a high velocity.
But that plane crash has never been determined
how it hit.
Most commonly accepted explanation is that
UFO's took it.
It took other people.
They cut them into little pieces.
No, I'm sorry.
(45:55):
The most common accepted explanation, that itwas a result of bad weather conditions.
Yeah.
Okay.
I like my UFO's, and they slice them up.
Is that the plane was struck by lightning.
Oh, boy.
However, none of the debris.
None of the debris.
Excuse me.
Had covered.
(46:16):
Had burn mark.
Speaker B (46:17):
Huh.
Speaker A (46:18):
All right, so before we get to the conspiracy stuff, what do you think?
Chelsea?What do you think happened?
Speaker B (46:25):
My actual first thought was aliens.
When they said they saw the big flash, I'm
like, that's them getting sucked up.
Speaker A (46:33):
Absolutely.
So you are right, because conspiracy theorists
have suggested that the plane was taken by aUFO, citing that the two police officers in
the area saw red lights hovering over the.
Over the lake for 2 hours.
Huh.
Lane disappear.
(46:55):
So there you go.
Aliens.
By the way, just really quick.
I don't know if you've heard about this story
about.
Again, this is go territory.
Don't have the kiddies.
Listen, have you heard about.
I think it is in Malaysia on the beach?There have been feet.
Human feet still in athletic footwear, likesneakers washing upon the shore.
(47:20):
You can look it up.
And you can.
Speaker B (47:21):
I have not heard about that.
Speaker A (47:23):
Go look that up.
Human feet washing on the shore.
Look that up.
Google it.
And you'll be like, what?And this has been like.
There's, like, a lot.
And I think people figured it out, but I'm not
really sure, but they were just like, soyou're walking on the beach and like, oh, hey,
man, there's a stinker.
I'm gonna pick it up.
And there's a foot inside of it.
It had been locked off like somebody just
(47:45):
been.
Speaker B (47:46):
They're just a foot concentrated serial killer.
Speaker A (47:51):
Sure. So do not go to that lighthouse, Chelsea.
I'm sure you have nice feet.
Speaker B (48:00):
They're all right, you know.
Speaker A (48:02):
All right.
Don't put them out to the camera.
We're getting it weird.
You don't want to see mine.
They're even more weird.
Speaker B (48:08):
No free fee.
Speaker A (48:10):
Yeah, yeah.
Come on.
That's extra people on my Patreon, by the way.
Anyway, here's the next story, unless you had
anything else to add.
Anything to us to add other than the plane
crash and it could be.
Speaker B (48:22):
UFO, but it's definitely aliens.
Speaker A (48:25):
Definitely aliens.
Speaker B (48:26):
Definitely.
Speaker A (48:27):
So the next one.
This is a little bit recent, I guess.
Don Shaler and Don Rodriguez.
On July 30, 1998, Don Scheller flew a two seat
arrow L. This is what's going to happen toChelsea.
Arrow L 39 Albatross, a high performancesingle engine jet often used by a. As a
(48:52):
military trainer by the eastern europeancountries.
Sheller or.
Yeah, Scheller.
A veteran pilot.
Okay, now, was planning on participating in
his first air show for the National CherryFestival in Traverse City, Michigan.
Yes, there is a national cherry festival stillgoing on in Traverse City, Michigan, if you
(49:12):
like to go it.
And you like cherries.
It's all about cherries.
Cherry pie, cherry jam, cherry jelly, whatever
the hell.
There you go.
So, something if you're looking to do for theweekend.
In the passenger seat was Donovan.
Donovan Rigus or Don Rodriguez, a flight
instructor at the north western MichiganCollege since the 1970s.
So these guys know what they're doing, right?We get that he's a veteran pilot.
(49:36):
He's been doing this for a long time.
He's a flight instructor.
Good old Don.
Ron.
At approximately 06:00 p.m.
Shealer radioed that he was 27 miles from the
Cherry Capital airport.
And when he departed from where he departed
from and was planning to return to theairport.
Soon afterward, flight controllers noticed thejet vanished from the radar.
(50:01):
They were unable to make contact withSchiller.
Coast Guard helicopters quickly begansearching the area, but found nothing.
The following day, a canadian cargo plane anda blue Angels C 130, fat Albert, joined the
search.
I have no idea what that means.
(50:23):
If you're familiar with the cartoon, with BillCosby.
Yeah.
Okay.
Military.
Their weird name.
Despite.
God, they're bored.
Despite scouring miles of land and water, noclues were found, and the search ended on July
9.
Okay.
(50:43):
All right.
So the cause of disappearance was never
determined.
Michigan state believe.
Police, excuse me, believe the aircraftcrashed into Lake Michigan, but are unsure
what caused this to happen.
The weather was calm, so there you go.
Both experienced pilots.
There you go.
(51:04):
And the aircraft was considered to be simpleand reliable.
The plane was also equipped with parachutesand ejection seats.
So that's kind of cool, right?So you're like, oh, ****, we're going down,
Jack.
Right?
Anyway, one witness reported hearing a planeflying overhead and then a loud, firework like
(51:28):
sound.
However, he never saw the plane.
Speaker B (51:32):
That's weird.
Speaker A (51:33):
That is weird.
Now, before I get to what they're trying to
look for, what do you think so far?UFO is right, obviously.
Speaker B (51:42):
Or like spontaneous implosion.
Speaker A (51:45):
That could be right.
I agree.
Later that year, an underwater search wasconducted using sonar technology.
It uncovered a 30 foot long object thatsearchers believed to be the plane.
The following year, divers confirmed theobject was a rock formation.
(52:07):
In 2008, another sonar research discovered apossible plane 450ft below the service.
It was next to a boat that sank in the 1950s.
However, a dive cannot be completed to confirm
the object was a plane as the diver, but wasnot certified past 400ft.
Speaker B (52:34):
Could you not get another diver?
Speaker A (52:36):
I can't.
You get another diver.
Like, I'm only 400, dude.
Oh, man.
No, we got it now.
Speaker B (52:43):
We'll never know.
Speaker A (52:44):
We will never know.
Oh, well, let's get a beer.
Speaker B (52:50):
See, that's got to be.
That's where the conspiracy theorists are
going to come in, because they know whathappened.
You know, and they're.
They're going to let us believe that's the
plane and it's another rock formation.
Speaker A (53:03):
We know who you are, Chelsea.
I know where you live.
We're coming.
All right, so let's get into some
explanations, right?
Speaker B (53:13):
Perfect.
Speaker A (53:13):
What's going on? Okay, the first one is natural causes.
Okay.
The Lake Michigan Shipwreck Research
association claims the triangle is a myth,contending that the triangle has no more
shipwrecks than the rest of the Great Lakes.
Also stated the number of shipwrecks within
(53:34):
the Great Lakes can be attributed to hightraffic over the lakes.
Okay.
Speaker B (53:42):
You said the same thing about that Bermuda triangle.
Speaker A (53:44):
Yeah. I don't know, guys.
That's not convincing.
It's not like a weather balloon.
We're onto you.
Many of the shipwrecks and the shipdisappearances in Lake Michigan have been
blamed on wind waves.
Okay.
The lake's elongated shape and position, itsshores are parallel and unheated, allowing the
(54:10):
formation of dangerous currents, includingriptides and long shore tides.
Additionally, the north south orientation,coupled with a regular wind pattern, allow
waves to reach great height.
Blah, blah, blah.
Bling, bling, blah, blah.
So it's basically them saying, yeah, man, it's
really windy out there, and there's big waves.
(54:32):
So that's why ships go down.
That's it, pal.
Another common theory is for the disappearance
is magnetic anomalies caused by a magneticdeclination.
Magnetic deviation.
Declination refers to the difference between
(54:52):
true north and magnetic north, which differsdepending on the location.
On average, Lake Michigan deviates four tofive degrees westward.
So in other words, you have a conference out,and you're like, okay, I'm going north.
Wait a minute.
That's not north.
This is.
No, that's north.
(55:12):
No, because 45 degrees off, if you're, like,in a ship can walk.
Speaker B (55:18):
Yeah.
Speaker A (55:19):
And it's really.
It's not as bad as if you were walking with,
let's say you went with your familyYellowstone, and you're four to five degrees
off of whatever you're looking for.
Yeah.
It's gonna throw you off, and it's gonna suck.
But you probably can figure it out.
You know, you probably be like, okay, thisdoesn't seem right.
(55:39):
Deviations are errors incurred in the compassby local magnetic field.
For example, if you were to hold a campus neara magnetic object, the needle would point
towards the object.
Although this would not be a problem in
vehicles with other navigational equipment, itcould cause confusion to inexperienced sailors
(56:02):
and pilots.
So I get it.
You know, if your inexperience is like, whoo,let's go out, have a party, grab a bunch of
beers, and go out.
Yeah, you're screwed.
But if you're going out with experiencedpeople, they should be like, it's 45 degrees.
I'm telling you.
Degrees.
I've been on this lake 50 million times.
I'm telling you.
Right.
(56:22):
So that doesn't explain the stories I've said
with experienced people having issues.
All right, so now let's get to what Chelsea
and I think what happened.
The paranormal.
Here we go.
Conspiracy theorists have blamed the triangle
on a negative energy vortex.
Thank you.
(56:43):
Energy vortexes are the idea that certainlocations emit sacred, powerful, and
transformational energy.
Although vortexes are typical, considered to
be promote positivity and healing, it'sclaimed that vortexes with negative energy
also exist.
(57:04):
These locations are purportedly sources of
danger and hostility.
Ley lines, which I've talked about.
I don't know if you talked about that at all,Chelsea.
Are areas of interest of ancient structuresand landmarks often cited as causes of energy
vortex.
According to ley line maps, one runs down the
(57:26):
middle of Lake Michigan.
Others attribute the triangles.
Supposed vortex to a prehistoric structureunder a Lake Michigan.
Discovered by archaeologists in 2007, the siteis often referred to as, wait for it.
North American Stonehenge.
Speaker B (57:45):
What?
Speaker A (57:47):
You can look at this.
It's on Google.
It's super interesting.
I'll put some up in my.
On my social sites and everything.
It looks like Stonehead.
I mean, dead ringer crazy.
It's a dead ringer for Stonehead.
Like, doesn't make any sense.
That's insane.
It was on an island, right?The Atlantis theory, you know, land is sunk.
(58:10):
Everybody knows that.
Right.
It's fascinating.
And you can, if you're a good diver and you
can go below 400ft, you can take a look atthis.
And people have said it's amazing just to makeothers believe the occurrences to be aliens.
Thank you.
UFO sightings.
Okay.
(58:31):
And look, come on.
We all know that's true.
Give me a break.
Men in black right here.
Men in black right here.
Come knocking at my door.
I don't care.
I'm ready for it.
Now, the author, which, if you haven't, if
you're in the paranormal and you haven't readthis author, please do or see some of his
movies.
(58:51):
Hp Lovecraft said, we live on a placid island
of ignorance in the midst of black seas ofinfinity, and it was not meant that we should
voyage far.
So that's it.
I love that, you know, that was awesome.
(59:12):
I love that.
I think it's really interesting because no oneknows what's going on.
No one's really sure.
Yeah.
I think it's a. To me, this is what I alwaysask my guests.
I believe it's real.
I believe there is a Lake Michigan triangle.
And I do believe it's a combination offactors.
Chelsea, what do you think?Yes or no?
Speaker B (59:33):
I don't know for sure what it is, but there's something weird going on, and I
think it does.
I think it's probably a combination of both
natural and supernatural.
Speaker A (59:43):
Mm hmm.
I agree.
Speaker B (59:45):
I totally like the natural being influenced by the supernatural.
Speaker A (59:49):
I totally agree.
I totally agree.
I think it's something.
Oh, boy.
Nobody will ever really know what's going on,but there's so many strange disappearances
that I'm not saying the paranormal is alwaysthe right explanation.
Right.
But sometimes it's like, I just don't know.
Speaker B (01:00:10):
Right, right.
Speaker A (01:00:11):
Oh, let's go with the mystery.
Right.
And that's.
That's the great thing about paranormal, is go
about having that mystery and not knowing.
You can't know everything.
Right.
Speaker B (01:00:21):
Right.
Speaker A (01:00:22):
Good to be like you know, this is really interesting.
So, Chelsea, thank you so much.
Speaker B (01:00:28):
Thank you for having me.
Speaker A (01:00:30):
I love you.
You're great.
It's been so much fun.
I love your ideas.
Great ideas.
I'm going to get 12,000 friends after this.
Speaker B (01:00:40):
Perfect.
Speaker A (01:00:42):
Hopefully you'll come with me and bring your boyfriend, of course.
And we will.
Your family, too.
I don't care.
We will take a ship across Lake Michigan with
12,000 furs and see what happens to us.
Speaker B (01:00:54):
Sign up for that.
Speaker A (01:00:56):
You promised me.
I got my audience here.
This is.
I just think that's great and everything.
And I just, you know, I love this.
I think, again, it shows the midwest is so
rich in history and paranormal and everything.
(01:01:17):
Before we go, just tell people again about
what you're doing this summer so they.
So they know and some of the things coming up
so they can go and visit you or take a look atit.
Speaker B (01:01:28):
Perfect. Well, I've got a lot of paranormal investigations coming up soon, so
I'm going to try to be posting about thoseover on my instagram, which is station 59
podcast, I think.
Yes.
I also am starting up my YouTube channel,which is at Chelsea Dan, and I'm going to be
trying to post videos there.
So.
(01:01:49):
Yeah.
Speaker A (01:01:49):
And I will always share as much as I can with, with each other.
You know, we have our little coven, so I willshare stuff.
Chelsea always likes to share my stuff becauseI think it's really good for my audience to
see.
One thing I have to do is I have to pip, I
have a Patreon now.
I'm trying to get out there.
Trying to pimp it.
That's the wrong word.
(01:02:11):
Okay, sorry, Chelsea.
That was no offense.
Yeah, so anyway, I'm trying to promote it.
There we go.
That's a better word.
Get that out.
So please go to my Patreon.
The only way you're going to see Chelsea and
me talking is on Patreon.
So listen to our great voices.
So if you want to see us live in action andsee that Chelsea has some great pictures that
(01:02:34):
she has up here, you are going to have to goto Patreon and you're going to have to check
it out.
It's only $3 to be a parascanis.
$3?Come on.
That's not even a thing of coffee anymore.
At least with me.
Starbucks.
And it's like $6 for a stupid.
Whatever I'm getting.
So, anyway, thank you so much, Chelsea.
(01:02:55):
I love to have you on again.
And I will do everything I can to follow you
and my spooky friends, you know.
So again, like we end every my episodes is say
hi to your ghost.
Hello, ghost.
Cause you never know, right?There might be a ghost.
And stay stupid.
Thanks, Chelsea.
Yay.
Speaker B (01:03:13):
Thank you.
Speaker A (01:03:14):
See ya.
Bye bye.
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