February 6, 2024 • 40 mins
This is an encore episode while I focus on my teaching.
This week's guest is Becca Lory Hector.
I was very happy to have Becca on to discuss her dealing with autism. This allowed me to add another layer to my first show with Mark Harris who provided us with a baseline about autism through his short story, Mute, and the video series that he produced for parents, Interacting with Autism: A video-based resource.
Becca is totally in -- mind, body, and soul -- to help those who sit on the autistic spectrum. Be it her personal website, her training company, Truly Inclusive Leadership, or her podcast, The Info Dump Files, you'll find Becca reaching out her helping hand.
Note: Oftentimes, links are not available on platforms such as Apple, iHeart, etc.. They are available within this episode on our website at https://lifesaroadtrip.podbean.com
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Being disabled or having a chronic illness can feel like you're moving forward in reverse.
(00:21):
I'm your host Scott Martin.
Join me and my new friends in this underrepresented community as we talk about disrupting the
status quo and creating change within the world and within ourselves.
A life's a road trip.
Hop in.
Let's turn on some tunes and go.
(00:56):
With me in the passenger seat and managing the radio is Becca Lori Hector.
Becca was diagnosed on the autism spectrum as an adult and has since become a dedicated
autism and neurodiversity advocate, researcher, consultant, speaker and author.
With a focus on living and active positive life, her work includes autism and neurodiversity
consulting, autistic quality of life research, public speaking engagements as well as teaching
(01:22):
her course self-defined living a path to a quality autistic life and her related seminars.
Becca has published multiple articles and books about life on the autism spectrum with
the goal of spreading acceptance, building understanding and encouraging self-advocacy.
She spent four years supporting the autism community and the non-profit sector and her
(01:43):
work for grassroots organizations that provide resources and services directly to the individuals
on the autism spectrum, leaving open only to open her autism and neurodiversity consulting
business.
Hi Becca.
Hello, how are you?
I'm doing fine.
Before we get started on this road trip, I need to ask you a really pointed question.
(02:07):
Who is Sir Walter Underfoot?
Sir Walter Underfoot is my everything.
He is my emotional support animal and I really try to do a lot of things with him.
We spend a lot of time together and he has his own main character energy, let's say.
(02:28):
Interesting.
Now I want to get going into some of the deeper topics.
In the March 2021 issue of autism spectrum news and so folks know, a link will be available
on the Life's a Road Trip website, of course.
You wrote the following, autistic folks spend an inordinate amount of time discussing the
torture of labels on their clothes and a discussion about sensory issues right after we discuss
(02:52):
how much we load the grocery store, a hatred of tags and our clothes comes up.
It's amazing how something so small can invisibly create full body discomfort and yet it does.
A label left on can ruin an autistic's day and less time that it changed in routine.
With slow irritation building as the label scratches your bare skin, then the fidgeting
(03:14):
kicks in and sets the stage for the mother of all meltdowns if the label isn't cut off
and tossed immediately.
Could you go into giving us a better idea about life as an autistic person on different
parts of the spectrum?
Absolutely.
So I first need to say that's my experience right?
(03:36):
And that's an experience that I share with some folks on the spectrum but an experience
that I don't share with all folks on the spectrum right?
So they're really the big and most important thing that I would love anyone to leave with
is listening is that all autistic people are not alike.
Each one of us is different just like each human being out in the world is different.
(03:59):
And so we each have our own personal brand of autism and my personal brand of autism
came with a lot of sensory challenges.
I am a very sensory sensitive person.
And so for me, there was a lot of silent suffering.
There was a lot of moments in my life that were spent ruminating on tags on my clothes
(04:23):
because it was ruining my whole day and any other number of sensory issues.
But sensory is something that, sensory issues is something that's fairly common on the spectrum.
And for me, that's my biggest struggle with being an autistic person.
Next one, when I was doing a lot of research on their guests, I find some things that makes
(04:48):
me dig even further into that person.
And in the June 2021 edition of the same magazine, Autist and Spectrum News, you submitted a
story titled, Doing It My Autistic Way.
Why Being Self-Employed was the logical solution for me.
Tell us about your business, including self-defining, defined living, a path to quality autistic
(05:10):
life.
Yeah, so I really struggled with employment.
I struggled with employment a lot as someone who was undiagnosed.
To give you some idea and 15 years out working in the world, I did like a grand total of
13 different jobs.
And I mean like different jobs, like an executive assistant, but also working in commercial
(05:34):
construction.
Right?
So like really different.
And that's a lot of messy work history to have in our world the way that it exists right
now.
And so as when I received my diagnosis, which was when I was 36 years old, I realized that
the way that the corporate world and the way that the employment world period really functions
(05:58):
does not suit me at all.
It's like really a constant set of barriers for me rather than being something that's
sustainable that I can do to maintain my life.
Right?
So I was just having a roller coaster up between different employment.
So I would go in, I'd get the job, pass the interviews, start working, you know, in a
few months into it, I'd have the job completely, you know, I've learned it, I've mastered it,
(06:23):
I'm doing my job.
And then, you know, suddenly some kind of social issue that I don't understand comes
up and that's always when I started to have trouble and I either quit or get fired.
So with the understanding that I struggle with teamwork, right?
It seemed a lot easier for me to get the things done in my life, the way that I wanted to
(06:47):
do them once I got my diagnosis and I understood myself and our traditional nine to five, right?
It just isn't a picture for me that works.
And for me, the only option was to figure out how to work for myself.
And beyond that, I needed to figure out how to work remotely.
(07:09):
And that is well before COVID, right?
And then COVID came along and now here we all are sitting, working from home and many
of us have gone on to become entrepreneurs as a result and all kinds of things.
And it's not quite as rare as it was when I set out to do it.
And what's really interesting, I think, is that very recently I have actually taken a
job and I'm returning to working for somebody else.
(07:33):
And that's another transition that I'm going through in a moment.
Yeah.
So living on the spectrum, so obviously you were autistic when you were in your 20s,
but yet you didn't realize it.
So you would get caught in these rabbit holes of getting a job and finding out you were
(07:54):
coming up in the same problems time after time, is that correct?
Yeah.
Over and over again.
And it's really crazy.
It was almost like we do the 90 day mark for a reason in business.
Yeah.
And it was almost always around that 90 day mark that things would start happening.
I mean, the longest I ever held a job continuously was two years.
That was the max that I had ever stayed anywhere.
(08:17):
Yeah.
I have spoken with some, I guess, so far and we're talking about COVID and some of the
positive things that came about from it.
And that carries me over to your website.
Now I went to back to Lauri.com and again, this is going to be on the lives of road trip
website.
So people don't have to worry about it right now, but opening it up.
And here's a quote from Lewis Carroll right on the top.
(08:39):
I'm not strange, weird, off nor crazy.
My reality is just different from yours.
I love how you put that.
And I think it summarizes things so well, but yet the autism spectrum is so broad, then
it can mean even more because your dealing with autism is different from someone else's
(09:01):
because of that wide spectrum.
So what made you put that on the top?
Is it something about that statement?
I'm not crazy weird off and such from from Carol.
Yeah.
I think, you know, as an undiagnosed person, I lived a really uncomfortable life.
I, you know, it's not that I didn't realize something was different about me.
(09:25):
And it's not that I didn't realize that I was struggling or having challenges or the
people around me didn't realize that.
It's just that I didn't fit the picture of what we thought autism looked like in the
early 80s.
Right?
The early 80s, it looked like a non-speaking boy who was behaviorally aggressive, yelling
and screaming and hitting, right?
(09:52):
And certainly not so long with verbal capacity, right?
And in our world, when you are a little girl who doesn't talk a lot and is shy in the corner
and doesn't want to socialize, but always has their nose in a book, they say, Oh, what
a good little girl she is.
Okay.
Right?
Yeah.
So it was really a complicated time to grow up for me, right?
It was an odd, right?
Kind of underpinning.
But I was receiving a lot of misdiagnoses in that time.
(10:15):
And when you're walking around, you know, having all of these differences that no one
can name, they get other names.
They get names like strange, weird, odd, unique, right?
Right?
Right?
Right?
We give it all kinds of words like that.
And there's some really nasty ones we give with it too.
And that does a number on people's inner world and how they talk about themselves to themselves,
(10:39):
right?
Yeah.
And that's what part of this quote is about.
And I think also for me, the work of Lewis Carroll is between my mother and I.
And so it was also for that.
It really hit home with me.
I really love that because I've, gosh, what I mean, second month of doing this podcast
(11:00):
now, and I started for a different reason from where it's ending up with learning more
about the disability community.
I substitute teach and after reading your stuff, and I also had my very first guess was dealing
with talking about autism, what he's done to help the autistic community.
(11:21):
I run into more and more kids while I'm at school that seem to fit different areas and
realms and spectrums.
And it makes me more comfortable than or more softer place in my heart and even talking
with some of the other teachers about kids on what they're up on and what they're told.
I am proud to say that teachers nowadays are a prize more of how kids are and they do pay
(11:50):
attention to things.
And it just really helps.
Now, I found another piece and it's an article that you wrote.
It starts with thriving wall autistic, creating a quality self defined life.
I would imagine it.
This is something that came from when you started getting more into writing and creating
(12:13):
a website where it allowed you to want to reach out to people that are autistic and to provide
a little bit more self assurance to them.
Now, talk about more of what you got going in that website and what your feeling is and
what you were projecting through the website, please.
(12:35):
Yeah, sure.
So, you know, for me, you know, there's little a autism and there's big a autism, right?
So there's my personal life with autism, right?
And then there's my journey as an advocate and dealing with autism as a whole, right?
And looking at our community and our culture and all of those things.
(12:56):
And so in my journey, right, I started as much as many late diagnosed people do.
I got my diagnosis.
I was 36 and I said, well, I better start learning about it.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And I went on that journey.
And so for many of us, that first year post diagnosis is a really internal journey is about
(13:20):
kind of historically going back and saying, you know, where was the autism in all this?
And maybe it wasn't my fault and where were the adults and why wasn't someone taking care
of me?
And there's a lot of anger in that time.
Okay.
But after the first year, there's a desire to give back.
There was a desire to not have someone else.
That's fantastic.
Yeah.
It's just a desire to not have someone else, you know, be in that position.
(13:44):
So they don't have to feel uncomfortable like you were.
So paying it forward.
You know, that's what we all need to be doing.
And that's the type of guess I'm trying to find here.
And that's what I'm learning as I go on this venture myself.
Now under your frequently asked questions tab on that same website, you bring it up as
four answers to the most commonly asked questions.
And the first one is, and as I read these, if you would venture off into discussing these
(14:09):
a little bit more, it'd be appreciated.
Number one is, is self diagnosis valid?
Yes.
Self diagnosis is valid.
There are way too many barriers to a clinical diagnosis for us to not give validity to self
diagnosis.
The other piece of self diagnosis is that you don't exactly see people running, you know,
(14:34):
and jumping like lemmings to try and get their autism diagnosis.
So usually when folks find themselves questioning and really are finding themselves in a position
where maybe they want to go seek a diagnosis and they've self identified, right?
We really give credit to that because it's so much a personal journey, right?
(14:56):
And getting that diagnosis isn't as important as the self knowledge piece.
That just makes sense.
Yeah.
And it must be very helpful for the individual to come to some conclusions on their own as
well as from professionals.
And anything you can find.
I always say, you know, it's depending on how you arrive at that understanding about
(15:20):
yourself is really when you need to make that choice about whether or not you seek a diagnosis.
We just, for adults, we don't have a good set of supports and services that you're going
to get from your clinical diagnosis, right?
Like that piece of paper isn't going to really get you anything.
And so spending a lot of money for something that's not necessarily covered by insurance
(15:45):
can be a really unwise choice for someone who's probably already struggling with unemployment
or under employment.
How, you know, it's venturing off on where I was going to be going with this, but you
just hit on an important topic, I think, is what about insurance coverage?
Is there much that can be falling under your spectrum issues?
(16:09):
So the way that insurance is lined up right now, I can't speak to exactness of it.
I got my diagnosis a very long time ago.
And I do believe that more people are getting their diagnoses covered.
But here in the United States, it is incredibly difficult as an adult to get your health insurance
(16:32):
company to pay for your diagnosis in adulthood.
That is because everything in our government and in health insurance and in the medical
world moves really, really slow.
And it doesn't change as fast as our knowledge changes.
And so we know that autism is not something that pitters out in childhood.
(16:54):
We know now that it may be something that appears in childhood to people and can get
diagnosed then, but oftentimes we know that it's missed, right?
And so because of our history with sort of calling autism a childhood diagnosis, health
insurance is built around that.
So if you've got a kid, so under 18 that wants diagnosis that, they can get covered.
(17:20):
That's the game.
And anything beyond that is sort of working with public benefits and trying to get those
to work for you.
Wow.
So many hurdles.
Yeah.
Number two, under your FAQs, can I stop masking?
What is masking first?
Okay.
So masking is a term that we use in the autism world to talk about the behaviors that we
(17:46):
do to cover and to hide our natural autistic-ness, right?
So I'll give an example, right?
The really common one for people to think about when they think of autism is to think
about stimming and particularly flapping hands, right?
Flapping hands.
And what we did for a very long time was try to teach our children to quiet their hands,
(18:12):
right?
And to hold those stims inside and not release that energy and to hide that.
And what that did was create a whole bunch of adults who felt like their natural state
of being and their natural way of regulating is unacceptable out in the world.
And so it needs to be hidden.
And that takes a lot of work.
And we can live a lifetime doing that.
(18:33):
Some of us can live a lifetime masking ourselves so much that we lose who we are underneath.
And so that's what masking is.
And so the question, can I stop masking is something that a lot of us who get diagnosed
ask because as we're learning about ourselves, we figure out that we're not broken.
We're just different, right?
(18:54):
We just do things differently.
And so then it's like, well, then can I stop hiding all of it, right?
And that's a more layered question.
That's a nuanced question because it depends on how much of your life you spend masking
and how many years you spent doing it and do you mask in order to keep your job, for example,
and all those things.
(19:15):
And also it's a coping mechanism, not a healthy one that we developed really early on.
And it can often take us a very long time to feel safe enough to ditch it, right?
And so it's not a process we can rush either.
Wow.
That's something I never thought about that people, it's like someone from the LGBTQ community
(19:40):
coming out of the closet, but yet it's not just coming out of the closet.
You're hiding it from society because you know how you're going to be treated, but it's
also a coping mechanism, like you said, the masking.
It's a coping mechanism to survive in a world that's not built for you.
Huh.
Okay.
Number three, this was a good one.
I just last week I interviewed Vanessa Powell from All Ability Recruiting.
(20:04):
And we talked about this one and its disclosure should I?
And that's when you're applying for a position.
Go ahead.
Well, I talk about disclosure a lot these days from that employment place, but disclosure
can be thought about from any place, right?
So we can talk about it even from a parent's place.
(20:25):
They have to deal with disclosure and whether they want to tell people that their kid or
child got this diagnosis, right?
Or that they, you know, have this identity.
And so as the language is changing around autism, the question of disclosure comes off
a lot.
It's basically a question of is it safe to be my authentic self, right?
(20:47):
That's really the question.
Can I come out here?
Right?
And a lot of us are so grateful for our artistic identity when we get it because it is so impactful
to our quality of life that we genuinely are so happy to have solved the mystery that we
want to stand on our rooftop and tell everyone.
(21:09):
But we can't control the bias and stigma that other people carry with them.
And so often when we do that, we pay the price, right?
Go up bias.
They carry around it, right?
And we tend to be then the recipient of microaggressions and all kinds of other fun things.
So I think about the question of disclosure in a really personal way.
(21:30):
Really, you know, it's a, it is more than just a diagnosis.
It's really who you are.
And so what is it, what does it mean that people are asking you to tell them that, right?
Should you, right?
And my question is always, well, have they earned that information?
That's an interesting way to put it.
(21:53):
And it does come down to the individual.
Like you don't share your sex life with every Jojo, walking down the street because they
ask you.
Yeah.
Right.
Yeah.
So why is it something that why do they need to be sticking their nose in it other than
it could be just that you're different?
Right.
And if I choose to share it with you, right, that's really an act of trust, right?
(22:16):
That's an vulnerable act and you are trusting the other human being on the other side with
it, right?
And it's not respected that way at all.
And it's often turned against us.
It's often used as weaponized, I like to say, yeah, against us.
Wow.
And so no, it's not only safe to disclose, even though I would love to live in a world
where it is.
(22:37):
But that'd be fun.
All right.
Let's do a U turn on this one.
Number four, can I be autistic and happy?
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
A million times.
Yes.
Right.
But can you be happy?
100% of the time?
No.
Right.
That is just the way that the world is no human being can be happy 100% of the time.
(23:00):
Right.
That have some philosophical experience of sadness to experience joy.
Right.
And so we all have our balance of that in our lives.
But happiness is not out of reach for autistic people.
What makes us feel that way is the judgment that comes from the outside world about our
choices.
(23:21):
For example, many of us get judged about the things that bring us joy.
Right.
A lot of us, like, especially when I was growing up, we were, we talked about how much
we loved sitting and reading our world book in Cyclopedias, like in getting the new letter
and like how, right.
And that's autistic joy.
And then at the same time, all the people around us would say, how can that be fun for
(23:43):
you?
That's not fun.
Reading's not fun.
Learning's not fun.
Right.
Go out and play with your friends, which for autistics is not fun.
Right.
And so when your joy gets judged in that way, and then the way you express your joy gets
judged, aka flappy hands, any other of those things, it really becomes a clear message
(24:04):
from the outside world that you are not allowed to be happy.
Right.
Because your happiness is judged.
It's just another way for people to judge you.
So a lot of us end up living a life where we have isolated into our bedroom or into our
basement or any number of other places because what brings us joy, we can only experience
(24:26):
in privacy.
Right.
You put that quite well.
That's what's got to be flipped.
It's not whether or not we can experience it.
It's whether or not the world can let it go and understand that joy comes in lots of
packages.
The older I get, I think the more I question how humans really are, it's just a bit mind
(24:47):
boggling and very disappointing.
What we learn is we get older, at least from my perspective, you know, especially being
a quad amputee when I was in my mid 30s and seeing what life is like after and seeing
it from the other side of it.
So you have a second website and agency titled truly inclusive leadership.
(25:10):
Could you talk about that, please?
Absolutely.
So I've recently made a shift from the consulting that I was doing, which was very much based
on consulting organizations on their inclusivity practices and, you know, even working well
in one with autistic individuals and doing some coaching.
I have some courses that I teach, things like that.
(25:32):
But my passion for that kind of dwindled away.
And I was realizing that my energy was shifting and I wasn't really feeling as excited about
those things as I used to be.
And what was exciting me was what was happening over in employment land around the conversation
of DEI or diversity, equity and inclusion in terms of that conversation and how does
(25:57):
the greater disability community fit into that conversation, right?
And is that our end to getting some equity in the workplace?
And so that became really sort of this little little worm in my ear and I just was like,
hmm, I can't leave it alone.
I can't leave it alone.
And then as I started to express interest in it, I was getting a lot of engagement from
(26:19):
people around it.
So I just said, you know what, it's time to make this shift for myself.
I do a little pivot here.
And so it's not to say that the work that I did before or the work that's on my other
website is invalid or not useful or not up to date or any of that.
It is.
But I have shifted where I want to put my energy.
And so I am now working at a truly inclusive leadership.
(26:43):
My goal is to work with companies and organizations to help them really look at their companies
and their community culture and look at their policies and systems and from a really disabled
perspective, right?
So from that perspective and that I want to say accessibility, except that word has been
abused so much in our world right now, but from that accessibility place, right?
(27:08):
How do we create diversity, equity and inclusion for disabled people?
And the big part for me is that I've added the beyond to that for myself, which is belonging,
right?
Because I really feel like it's easy to see that DEI has been co-opted into a numbers
game.
And I really think that its purpose is to end up with that belonging, right?
(27:34):
So that our workplaces are open to people and that everyone feels like they belong there
and not just the crew that wears the right ties, right?
And so that's what I'm doing.
I'm really consulting with these companies and their HR departments to make sure that
we're thinking inclusion through the full life cycle of employees.
(27:55):
So not just that recruiting place, not just that interview place, but past that and all
the way through to retirement, right?
We need to be really counting our disability numbers.
There's just so many of us and you can enter our community at any time, right?
And so it is an ever growing community.
(28:18):
How are you feeling at the end of the day when as you're going after something, it's
coming from your heart, obviously back?
And so you're putting yourself out there, but how are you feeling at the end of the day
when things don't go so smoothly and you're running up against one brick wall after another?
You know, what's it like?
(28:41):
At this, I've been doing advocacy type things for 10 years now.
And I have seen the landscape change enough in the 10 years that I can take some moments
to myself and remember the way it used to be, right?
And say, okay, yes, this sucks, but I used to not even be able to get these phone calls
and I used to not be able to charge this rate and all of these things, right?
(29:03):
And I can resensor them all about that.
Oh, I see.
Okay, that's good.
Right.
Yeah.
But it's there are days when it's painful, right?
There are days when I'm the recipient of the microaggressions that I have yet to teach
them about, right?
Yeah.
And things like that.
And so there are days when it's hard and we look to each other on those days and say,
(29:24):
who else is out here advocating?
I'm having a crappy day.
Like, you know, did you see this article is really how we do it?
Wow.
I want to use that talking about your emotions to get it off into something you also do that
I think might be a bit of an emotional vent for you.
And that's called the info dump files.
(29:45):
And again, this links are going to be on the lives of Road Trip website, folks.
So talk about that.
I went in and I listened to a few episodes and it feels like to me that maybe you are
able to vent a little bit is that what this is for and what's the purpose of the info
dump files?
I love the name, by the way.
Thank you.
It really, so the idea of an info dump just for those of you out there who don't know,
(30:09):
Autistics are prone to them, though everyone can do them on occasion.
We tend to have our special topics.
And if you get us started talking about them, we can talk about them endlessly and really
not notice that you've paled out and stopped listening and all of those things and just
info dump on you until we've run out of oxygen.
And so that's kind of slang within the autism community.
(30:32):
Got it.
Thank you.
So, occasionally we'll say, are you okay with an info dump or about to info dump on you
about this?
Okay.
And we kind of use that term.
And so the name came from the idea of for the podcast, which came from my co-host Doug
Blutter at Optics and Personal Coach, who is a fantastic human being.
And he said, I really want to write a book with you and start categorizing and cataloging
(30:59):
all of the different special interests out there, or the spins out there, right?
Which are things like that people in our community really love, right?
So folks will have a really specialized interest in certain things that they info dump about.
And so our hope was to catalog that.
And then I said, Doug, we're both very busy.
(31:21):
And I'm a very tired person.
And the writing is a very, very sad endeavor to him.
So what if we live, you know, we do it live instead of interviewing people and writing
it up?
What if we do a podcast and we just capture it, you know, happening instead?
And he was like, all right, I'll do that with you.
See, that's what I'm saying.
Becca, that's what that's the gist of what I got from the episodes that I listened to.
(31:46):
You guys just sit down and just let's go.
Yeah.
Perfect.
It genuinely happens like this.
And we don't edit.
That's the other thing.
Unless somebody really stepped in it and they really want our help.
But really, we don't.
We don't edit because the point is we capture the video and the audio.
I put the video on YouTube and Doug takes care of his masterful audio stuff on the other
(32:09):
side.
But the reason is because once we get talking about our special interests and we start
empo dumping, the masking drops, it just naturally disappears and you get to see captured, right?
Autistic people in their natural environment, right?
Just being ourselves with each other, right?
And it's a window into autistic culture for a minute, right?
(32:31):
It's a window into how we connect and how we communicate with each other.
And what we've been able to do is say to each other, hey, did you see this cool person
over here?
Did you see that person's article?
Let's see if they want to come on and talk about their special interests, like not related
to their work because the whole purpose is that we capture the fun and that it feels
like fun because otherwise, who has the energy to do it?
(32:56):
Really?
To me, it sounds like if I was sitting around, well, I've done this many times, sitting
around at a pub drinking beers with my soccer friends and we start getting talking about
the game and the aspects of the theme and the tactical.
I hear you.
That's what you guys are doing with the info dump files.
It's just frickin' fending.
You guys should bring your couple of glasses of wine on with you sometime.
(33:19):
I didn't see you doing that.
It might get humble.
Oh, then it takes it in a different direction.
You're talking about not editing.
So taking things in a different direction, I want to get into wrapping up the show with
what I call the road trip roundup.
I'm going to be asking you five questions about doing road trips.
(33:40):
You and road trips.
Just be casual about it.
So first one, and I've changed this since when I started asking these questions because
some of the guests would answer that they didn't do fast food.
So I rephrased it and it goes like this.
Question number one, when road tripping, do you tend to do fast food or local diners?
Fast food, definitely.
(34:02):
Okay.
And what's your go to?
That was the original question.
What's your go to fast food?
I would've stuck with that question too.
Why are you helping people?
What's wrong with you?
You're driving in a car, eat some nuggets.
Hey, there you go.
So what's your go to?
My go to is McDonald's.
I think that's a very loyal autistic person.
I'm still loyal to chicken nuggets and fries.
(34:23):
And those were my go to as a kid and they're still my safe zone.
Oh, that's what the, okay.
Loyal to I was going to ask you, was it Ray Crock?
You were loyal to him.
Got it.
Okay.
Check it out.
Number two, what's your dream car for a road trip?
Now back to that can be something you have you've had or grew up with or would be really
(34:44):
cool to say rent for a day or two just for a road trip.
So what would you like?
I want you to dream car.
It's such a tough call for me.
So I'm currently sour on road trips because I just moved cross country.
So I've done it a lot and a lot of different vehicles and it's easier for me to tell you
the car.
I don't want to do it.
I want to do it again.
(35:07):
And that is a caravan, that van minivan thing.
Oh, okay.
Okay.
I will never ever do it again in my life.
It is, it was my real nightmare vehicle before I had to drive cross country in it and it
still is.
How was it moving cross country with pets?
Because I see you have, you've got one or two dogs.
I have four dogs.
Geez, lady.
(35:28):
And how many cats?
Six cats.
Dude, how did you get cross country with them?
Weren't you freaking out that you go in a, first of all, you have to find a hotel that
allows for pets, but my God, if one of them ever got away, oh my goodness.
Well, I actually vlogged the whole thing.
If you're interested, you can head to my YouTube channel and I did a whole vlog of our road
(35:51):
trip and you can see every thing, great thing that happened and every terrible thing that
I started out in an RV and ended up in a rented minivan.
All right.
Thanks for the chocolate.
That's one, one of the things I really like about doing this show is when somebody brings
up something funny like that.
So let's get into something a little, a little bit different.
(36:13):
What's the last cassette or CD that played while you're on a road trip?
Maybe what you might have been listening to on that one.
So well, I did a lot of back and forth on that, but I think my very favorite road trip
album ever is Village Old The Stranger.
Oh, classic.
Yeah.
Very good.
(36:35):
Nice one.
That's something to crank to and just, yeah, I could just see hands on a steering wheel
just cruising.
Yep.
That's a good cruising.
Good cruising album.
Okay.
All right.
Number four, Coke or Pepsi?
Coke, big time.
Boom.
Just straight out of the, yeah, straight out of the gate.
Okay.
(36:56):
Yep.
I'm drinking now Coke Zero.
Have you ever had Coke Zero?
I have.
I'm really a Coke classic and that's it.
Coke classic.
Also, you must have been pissed off when they back in the what, like 1986 or something like
that when they came out.
Yeah.
Okay.
All right.
Yeah.
I was definitely traumatized, but I'm glad that it has returned.
I always thought that that was such an advertising coup because I think they did it on purpose
(37:21):
just to get things started.
That's what my thought was.
Not a bad thought.
Yeah.
Why not?
You know, just stirred up.
Pepsi didn't have the balls to do it.
Why not?
It's true.
Okay.
All right.
Now here you take this last question wherever you want to go back.
Okay.
What's your favorite road trip memory?
Wow.
Okay.
My, it's sort of a road trip memory.
(37:44):
So my husband and I went on a trip for a honeymoon and we went to Scotland.
Oh, it was my favorite trip ever.
Nice.
We did a bus road trip to Loch Ness and that bus road trip was the funniest.
I mean, so many people were car sick on the bus.
(38:05):
Our driver was.
That's hilarious back.
I every for a few.
It was just like a silly, funny memory and I mean, locked up was really cool.
We didn't see her or anything like that.
But how cool to have gone to Loch Ness.
But the drive on the bus was definitely one of my favorite memories.
Yeah.
Were these people that everybody just signed up for a moment from different places around
(38:28):
the world?
Nobody knew each other.
Like two people together that knew each other and all paired up and that's about it.
Yeah.
Okay.
All right.
I'm sure you guys have to get to know each other.
That's interesting.
I've never met anyone that has ever gone and looked for Nessie.
Fascinating.
You're an interesting person.
(38:50):
I really like that.
That's really cool.
Hey, I want to us to wrap up, but I want you to stay on and pick each other brain a
little bit.
And right now I'm just going to say challenge, relax everybody and keep listen and thank
you very much.
Being disabled or having a chronic illness can feel like you're moving forward in reverse.
(00:21):
I'm your host Scott Martin.
Join me and my new friends in this underrepresented community as we talk about disrupting the
status quo and creating change within the world and within ourselves.
A life's a road trip.
Hop in.
Let's turn on some tunes and go.
(00:56):
With me in the passenger seat and managing the radio is Becca Lori Hector.
Becca was diagnosed on the autism spectrum as an adult and has since become a dedicated
autism and neurodiversity advocate, researcher, consultant, speaker and author.
With a focus on living and active positive life, her work includes autism and neurodiversity
consulting, autistic quality of life research, public speaking engagements as well as teaching
(01:22):
her course self-defined living a path to a quality autistic life and her related seminars.
Becca has published multiple articles and books about life on the autism spectrum with
the goal of spreading acceptance, building understanding and encouraging self-advocacy.
She spent four years supporting the autism community and the non-profit sector and her
(01:43):
work for grassroots organizations that provide resources and services directly to the individuals
on the autism spectrum, leaving open only to open her autism and neurodiversity consulting
business.
Hi Becca.
Hello, how are you?
I'm doing fine.
Before we get started on this road trip, I need to ask you a really pointed question.
(02:07):
Who is Sir Walter Underfoot?
Sir Walter Underfoot is my everything.
He is my emotional support animal and I really try to do a lot of things with him.
We spend a lot of time together and he has his own main character energy, let's say.
(02:28):
Interesting.
Now I want to get going into some of the deeper topics.
In the March 2021 issue of autism spectrum news and so folks know, a link will be available
on the Life's a Road Trip website, of course.
You wrote the following, autistic folks spend an inordinate amount of time discussing the
torture of labels on their clothes and a discussion about sensory issues right after we discuss
(02:52):
how much we load the grocery store, a hatred of tags and our clothes comes up.
It's amazing how something so small can invisibly create full body discomfort and yet it does.
A label left on can ruin an autistic's day and less time that it changed in routine.
With slow irritation building as the label scratches your bare skin, then the fidgeting
(03:14):
kicks in and sets the stage for the mother of all meltdowns if the label isn't cut off
and tossed immediately.
Could you go into giving us a better idea about life as an autistic person on different
parts of the spectrum?
Absolutely.
So I first need to say that's my experience right?
(03:36):
And that's an experience that I share with some folks on the spectrum but an experience
that I don't share with all folks on the spectrum right?
So they're really the big and most important thing that I would love anyone to leave with
is listening is that all autistic people are not alike.
Each one of us is different just like each human being out in the world is different.
(03:59):
And so we each have our own personal brand of autism and my personal brand of autism
came with a lot of sensory challenges.
I am a very sensory sensitive person.
And so for me, there was a lot of silent suffering.
There was a lot of moments in my life that were spent ruminating on tags on my clothes
(04:23):
because it was ruining my whole day and any other number of sensory issues.
But sensory is something that, sensory issues is something that's fairly common on the spectrum.
And for me, that's my biggest struggle with being an autistic person.
Next one, when I was doing a lot of research on their guests, I find some things that makes
(04:48):
me dig even further into that person.
And in the June 2021 edition of the same magazine, Autist and Spectrum News, you submitted a
story titled, Doing It My Autistic Way.
Why Being Self-Employed was the logical solution for me.
Tell us about your business, including self-defining, defined living, a path to quality autistic
(05:10):
life.
Yeah, so I really struggled with employment.
I struggled with employment a lot as someone who was undiagnosed.
To give you some idea and 15 years out working in the world, I did like a grand total of
13 different jobs.
And I mean like different jobs, like an executive assistant, but also working in commercial
(05:34):
construction.
Right?
So like really different.
And that's a lot of messy work history to have in our world the way that it exists right
now.
And so as when I received my diagnosis, which was when I was 36 years old, I realized that
the way that the corporate world and the way that the employment world period really functions
(05:58):
does not suit me at all.
It's like really a constant set of barriers for me rather than being something that's
sustainable that I can do to maintain my life.
Right?
So I was just having a roller coaster up between different employment.
So I would go in, I'd get the job, pass the interviews, start working, you know, in a
few months into it, I'd have the job completely, you know, I've learned it, I've mastered it,
(06:23):
I'm doing my job.
And then, you know, suddenly some kind of social issue that I don't understand comes
up and that's always when I started to have trouble and I either quit or get fired.
So with the understanding that I struggle with teamwork, right?
It seemed a lot easier for me to get the things done in my life, the way that I wanted to
(06:47):
do them once I got my diagnosis and I understood myself and our traditional nine to five, right?
It just isn't a picture for me that works.
And for me, the only option was to figure out how to work for myself.
And beyond that, I needed to figure out how to work remotely.
(07:09):
And that is well before COVID, right?
And then COVID came along and now here we all are sitting, working from home and many
of us have gone on to become entrepreneurs as a result and all kinds of things.
And it's not quite as rare as it was when I set out to do it.
And what's really interesting, I think, is that very recently I have actually taken a
job and I'm returning to working for somebody else.
(07:33):
And that's another transition that I'm going through in a moment.
Yeah.
So living on the spectrum, so obviously you were autistic when you were in your 20s,
but yet you didn't realize it.
So you would get caught in these rabbit holes of getting a job and finding out you were
(07:54):
coming up in the same problems time after time, is that correct?
Yeah.
Over and over again.
And it's really crazy.
It was almost like we do the 90 day mark for a reason in business.
Yeah.
And it was almost always around that 90 day mark that things would start happening.
I mean, the longest I ever held a job continuously was two years.
That was the max that I had ever stayed anywhere.
(08:17):
Yeah.
I have spoken with some, I guess, so far and we're talking about COVID and some of the
positive things that came about from it.
And that carries me over to your website.
Now I went to back to Lauri.com and again, this is going to be on the lives of road trip
website.
So people don't have to worry about it right now, but opening it up.
And here's a quote from Lewis Carroll right on the top.
(08:39):
I'm not strange, weird, off nor crazy.
My reality is just different from yours.
I love how you put that.
And I think it summarizes things so well, but yet the autism spectrum is so broad, then
it can mean even more because your dealing with autism is different from someone else's
(09:01):
because of that wide spectrum.
So what made you put that on the top?
Is it something about that statement?
I'm not crazy weird off and such from from Carol.
Yeah.
I think, you know, as an undiagnosed person, I lived a really uncomfortable life.
I, you know, it's not that I didn't realize something was different about me.
(09:25):
And it's not that I didn't realize that I was struggling or having challenges or the
people around me didn't realize that.
It's just that I didn't fit the picture of what we thought autism looked like in the
early 80s.
Right?
The early 80s, it looked like a non-speaking boy who was behaviorally aggressive, yelling
and screaming and hitting, right?
(09:52):
And certainly not so long with verbal capacity, right?
And in our world, when you are a little girl who doesn't talk a lot and is shy in the corner
and doesn't want to socialize, but always has their nose in a book, they say, Oh, what
a good little girl she is.
Okay.
Right?
Yeah.
So it was really a complicated time to grow up for me, right?
It was an odd, right?
Kind of underpinning.
But I was receiving a lot of misdiagnoses in that time.
(10:15):
And when you're walking around, you know, having all of these differences that no one
can name, they get other names.
They get names like strange, weird, odd, unique, right?
Right?
Right?
Right?
We give it all kinds of words like that.
And there's some really nasty ones we give with it too.
And that does a number on people's inner world and how they talk about themselves to themselves,
(10:39):
right?
Yeah.
And that's what part of this quote is about.
And I think also for me, the work of Lewis Carroll is between my mother and I.
And so it was also for that.
It really hit home with me.
I really love that because I've, gosh, what I mean, second month of doing this podcast
(11:00):
now, and I started for a different reason from where it's ending up with learning more
about the disability community.
I substitute teach and after reading your stuff, and I also had my very first guess was dealing
with talking about autism, what he's done to help the autistic community.
(11:21):
I run into more and more kids while I'm at school that seem to fit different areas and
realms and spectrums.
And it makes me more comfortable than or more softer place in my heart and even talking
with some of the other teachers about kids on what they're up on and what they're told.
I am proud to say that teachers nowadays are a prize more of how kids are and they do pay
(11:50):
attention to things.
And it just really helps.
Now, I found another piece and it's an article that you wrote.
It starts with thriving wall autistic, creating a quality self defined life.
I would imagine it.
This is something that came from when you started getting more into writing and creating
(12:13):
a website where it allowed you to want to reach out to people that are autistic and to provide
a little bit more self assurance to them.
Now, talk about more of what you got going in that website and what your feeling is and
what you were projecting through the website, please.
(12:35):
Yeah, sure.
So, you know, for me, you know, there's little a autism and there's big a autism, right?
So there's my personal life with autism, right?
And then there's my journey as an advocate and dealing with autism as a whole, right?
And looking at our community and our culture and all of those things.
(12:56):
And so in my journey, right, I started as much as many late diagnosed people do.
I got my diagnosis.
I was 36 and I said, well, I better start learning about it.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And I went on that journey.
And so for many of us, that first year post diagnosis is a really internal journey is about
(13:20):
kind of historically going back and saying, you know, where was the autism in all this?
And maybe it wasn't my fault and where were the adults and why wasn't someone taking care
of me?
And there's a lot of anger in that time.
Okay.
But after the first year, there's a desire to give back.
There was a desire to not have someone else.
That's fantastic.
Yeah.
It's just a desire to not have someone else, you know, be in that position.
(13:44):
So they don't have to feel uncomfortable like you were.
So paying it forward.
You know, that's what we all need to be doing.
And that's the type of guess I'm trying to find here.
And that's what I'm learning as I go on this venture myself.
Now under your frequently asked questions tab on that same website, you bring it up as
four answers to the most commonly asked questions.
And the first one is, and as I read these, if you would venture off into discussing these
(14:09):
a little bit more, it'd be appreciated.
Number one is, is self diagnosis valid?
Yes.
Self diagnosis is valid.
There are way too many barriers to a clinical diagnosis for us to not give validity to self
diagnosis.
The other piece of self diagnosis is that you don't exactly see people running, you know,
(14:34):
and jumping like lemmings to try and get their autism diagnosis.
So usually when folks find themselves questioning and really are finding themselves in a position
where maybe they want to go seek a diagnosis and they've self identified, right?
We really give credit to that because it's so much a personal journey, right?
(14:56):
And getting that diagnosis isn't as important as the self knowledge piece.
That just makes sense.
Yeah.
And it must be very helpful for the individual to come to some conclusions on their own as
well as from professionals.
And anything you can find.
I always say, you know, it's depending on how you arrive at that understanding about
(15:20):
yourself is really when you need to make that choice about whether or not you seek a diagnosis.
We just, for adults, we don't have a good set of supports and services that you're going
to get from your clinical diagnosis, right?
Like that piece of paper isn't going to really get you anything.
And so spending a lot of money for something that's not necessarily covered by insurance
(15:45):
can be a really unwise choice for someone who's probably already struggling with unemployment
or under employment.
How, you know, it's venturing off on where I was going to be going with this, but you
just hit on an important topic, I think, is what about insurance coverage?
Is there much that can be falling under your spectrum issues?
(16:09):
So the way that insurance is lined up right now, I can't speak to exactness of it.
I got my diagnosis a very long time ago.
And I do believe that more people are getting their diagnoses covered.
But here in the United States, it is incredibly difficult as an adult to get your health insurance
(16:32):
company to pay for your diagnosis in adulthood.
That is because everything in our government and in health insurance and in the medical
world moves really, really slow.
And it doesn't change as fast as our knowledge changes.
And so we know that autism is not something that pitters out in childhood.
(16:54):
We know now that it may be something that appears in childhood to people and can get
diagnosed then, but oftentimes we know that it's missed, right?
And so because of our history with sort of calling autism a childhood diagnosis, health
insurance is built around that.
So if you've got a kid, so under 18 that wants diagnosis that, they can get covered.
(17:20):
That's the game.
And anything beyond that is sort of working with public benefits and trying to get those
to work for you.
Wow.
So many hurdles.
Yeah.
Number two, under your FAQs, can I stop masking?
What is masking first?
Okay.
So masking is a term that we use in the autism world to talk about the behaviors that we
(17:46):
do to cover and to hide our natural autistic-ness, right?
So I'll give an example, right?
The really common one for people to think about when they think of autism is to think
about stimming and particularly flapping hands, right?
Flapping hands.
And what we did for a very long time was try to teach our children to quiet their hands,
(18:12):
right?
And to hold those stims inside and not release that energy and to hide that.
And what that did was create a whole bunch of adults who felt like their natural state
of being and their natural way of regulating is unacceptable out in the world.
And so it needs to be hidden.
And that takes a lot of work.
And we can live a lifetime doing that.
(18:33):
Some of us can live a lifetime masking ourselves so much that we lose who we are underneath.
And so that's what masking is.
And so the question, can I stop masking is something that a lot of us who get diagnosed
ask because as we're learning about ourselves, we figure out that we're not broken.
We're just different, right?
(18:54):
We just do things differently.
And so then it's like, well, then can I stop hiding all of it, right?
And that's a more layered question.
That's a nuanced question because it depends on how much of your life you spend masking
and how many years you spent doing it and do you mask in order to keep your job, for example,
and all those things.
(19:15):
And also it's a coping mechanism, not a healthy one that we developed really early on.
And it can often take us a very long time to feel safe enough to ditch it, right?
And so it's not a process we can rush either.
Wow.
That's something I never thought about that people, it's like someone from the LGBTQ community
(19:40):
coming out of the closet, but yet it's not just coming out of the closet.
You're hiding it from society because you know how you're going to be treated, but it's
also a coping mechanism, like you said, the masking.
It's a coping mechanism to survive in a world that's not built for you.
Huh.
Okay.
Number three, this was a good one.
I just last week I interviewed Vanessa Powell from All Ability Recruiting.
(20:04):
And we talked about this one and its disclosure should I?
And that's when you're applying for a position.
Go ahead.
Well, I talk about disclosure a lot these days from that employment place, but disclosure
can be thought about from any place, right?
So we can talk about it even from a parent's place.
(20:25):
They have to deal with disclosure and whether they want to tell people that their kid or
child got this diagnosis, right?
Or that they, you know, have this identity.
And so as the language is changing around autism, the question of disclosure comes off
a lot.
It's basically a question of is it safe to be my authentic self, right?
(20:47):
That's really the question.
Can I come out here?
Right?
And a lot of us are so grateful for our artistic identity when we get it because it is so impactful
to our quality of life that we genuinely are so happy to have solved the mystery that we
want to stand on our rooftop and tell everyone.
(21:09):
But we can't control the bias and stigma that other people carry with them.
And so often when we do that, we pay the price, right?
Go up bias.
They carry around it, right?
And we tend to be then the recipient of microaggressions and all kinds of other fun things.
So I think about the question of disclosure in a really personal way.
(21:30):
Really, you know, it's a, it is more than just a diagnosis.
It's really who you are.
And so what is it, what does it mean that people are asking you to tell them that, right?
Should you, right?
And my question is always, well, have they earned that information?
That's an interesting way to put it.
(21:53):
And it does come down to the individual.
Like you don't share your sex life with every Jojo, walking down the street because they
ask you.
Yeah.
Right.
Yeah.
So why is it something that why do they need to be sticking their nose in it other than
it could be just that you're different?
Right.
And if I choose to share it with you, right, that's really an act of trust, right?
(22:16):
That's an vulnerable act and you are trusting the other human being on the other side with
it, right?
And it's not respected that way at all.
And it's often turned against us.
It's often used as weaponized, I like to say, yeah, against us.
Wow.
And so no, it's not only safe to disclose, even though I would love to live in a world
where it is.
(22:37):
But that'd be fun.
All right.
Let's do a U turn on this one.
Number four, can I be autistic and happy?
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
A million times.
Yes.
Right.
But can you be happy?
100% of the time?
No.
Right.
That is just the way that the world is no human being can be happy 100% of the time.
(23:00):
Right.
That have some philosophical experience of sadness to experience joy.
Right.
And so we all have our balance of that in our lives.
But happiness is not out of reach for autistic people.
What makes us feel that way is the judgment that comes from the outside world about our
choices.
(23:21):
For example, many of us get judged about the things that bring us joy.
Right.
A lot of us, like, especially when I was growing up, we were, we talked about how much
we loved sitting and reading our world book in Cyclopedias, like in getting the new letter
and like how, right.
And that's autistic joy.
And then at the same time, all the people around us would say, how can that be fun for
(23:43):
you?
That's not fun.
Reading's not fun.
Learning's not fun.
Right.
Go out and play with your friends, which for autistics is not fun.
Right.
And so when your joy gets judged in that way, and then the way you express your joy gets
judged, aka flappy hands, any other of those things, it really becomes a clear message
(24:04):
from the outside world that you are not allowed to be happy.
Right.
Because your happiness is judged.
It's just another way for people to judge you.
So a lot of us end up living a life where we have isolated into our bedroom or into our
basement or any number of other places because what brings us joy, we can only experience
(24:26):
in privacy.
Right.
You put that quite well.
That's what's got to be flipped.
It's not whether or not we can experience it.
It's whether or not the world can let it go and understand that joy comes in lots of
packages.
The older I get, I think the more I question how humans really are, it's just a bit mind
(24:47):
boggling and very disappointing.
What we learn is we get older, at least from my perspective, you know, especially being
a quad amputee when I was in my mid 30s and seeing what life is like after and seeing
it from the other side of it.
So you have a second website and agency titled truly inclusive leadership.
(25:10):
Could you talk about that, please?
Absolutely.
So I've recently made a shift from the consulting that I was doing, which was very much based
on consulting organizations on their inclusivity practices and, you know, even working well
in one with autistic individuals and doing some coaching.
I have some courses that I teach, things like that.
(25:32):
But my passion for that kind of dwindled away.
And I was realizing that my energy was shifting and I wasn't really feeling as excited about
those things as I used to be.
And what was exciting me was what was happening over in employment land around the conversation
of DEI or diversity, equity and inclusion in terms of that conversation and how does
(25:57):
the greater disability community fit into that conversation, right?
And is that our end to getting some equity in the workplace?
And so that became really sort of this little little worm in my ear and I just was like,
hmm, I can't leave it alone.
I can't leave it alone.
And then as I started to express interest in it, I was getting a lot of engagement from
(26:19):
people around it.
So I just said, you know what, it's time to make this shift for myself.
I do a little pivot here.
And so it's not to say that the work that I did before or the work that's on my other
website is invalid or not useful or not up to date or any of that.
It is.
But I have shifted where I want to put my energy.
And so I am now working at a truly inclusive leadership.
(26:43):
My goal is to work with companies and organizations to help them really look at their companies
and their community culture and look at their policies and systems and from a really disabled
perspective, right?
So from that perspective and that I want to say accessibility, except that word has been
abused so much in our world right now, but from that accessibility place, right?
(27:08):
How do we create diversity, equity and inclusion for disabled people?
And the big part for me is that I've added the beyond to that for myself, which is belonging,
right?
Because I really feel like it's easy to see that DEI has been co-opted into a numbers
game.
And I really think that its purpose is to end up with that belonging, right?
(27:34):
So that our workplaces are open to people and that everyone feels like they belong there
and not just the crew that wears the right ties, right?
And so that's what I'm doing.
I'm really consulting with these companies and their HR departments to make sure that
we're thinking inclusion through the full life cycle of employees.
(27:55):
So not just that recruiting place, not just that interview place, but past that and all
the way through to retirement, right?
We need to be really counting our disability numbers.
There's just so many of us and you can enter our community at any time, right?
And so it is an ever growing community.
(28:18):
How are you feeling at the end of the day when as you're going after something, it's
coming from your heart, obviously back?
And so you're putting yourself out there, but how are you feeling at the end of the day
when things don't go so smoothly and you're running up against one brick wall after another?
You know, what's it like?
(28:41):
At this, I've been doing advocacy type things for 10 years now.
And I have seen the landscape change enough in the 10 years that I can take some moments
to myself and remember the way it used to be, right?
And say, okay, yes, this sucks, but I used to not even be able to get these phone calls
and I used to not be able to charge this rate and all of these things, right?
(29:03):
And I can resensor them all about that.
Oh, I see.
Okay, that's good.
Right.
Yeah.
But it's there are days when it's painful, right?
There are days when I'm the recipient of the microaggressions that I have yet to teach
them about, right?
Yeah.
And things like that.
And so there are days when it's hard and we look to each other on those days and say,
(29:24):
who else is out here advocating?
I'm having a crappy day.
Like, you know, did you see this article is really how we do it?
Wow.
I want to use that talking about your emotions to get it off into something you also do that
I think might be a bit of an emotional vent for you.
And that's called the info dump files.
(29:45):
And again, this links are going to be on the lives of Road Trip website, folks.
So talk about that.
I went in and I listened to a few episodes and it feels like to me that maybe you are
able to vent a little bit is that what this is for and what's the purpose of the info
dump files?
I love the name, by the way.
Thank you.
It really, so the idea of an info dump just for those of you out there who don't know,
(30:09):
Autistics are prone to them, though everyone can do them on occasion.
We tend to have our special topics.
And if you get us started talking about them, we can talk about them endlessly and really
not notice that you've paled out and stopped listening and all of those things and just
info dump on you until we've run out of oxygen.
And so that's kind of slang within the autism community.
(30:32):
Got it.
Thank you.
So, occasionally we'll say, are you okay with an info dump or about to info dump on you
about this?
Okay.
And we kind of use that term.
And so the name came from the idea of for the podcast, which came from my co-host Doug
Blutter at Optics and Personal Coach, who is a fantastic human being.
And he said, I really want to write a book with you and start categorizing and cataloging
(30:59):
all of the different special interests out there, or the spins out there, right?
Which are things like that people in our community really love, right?
So folks will have a really specialized interest in certain things that they info dump about.
And so our hope was to catalog that.
And then I said, Doug, we're both very busy.
(31:21):
And I'm a very tired person.
And the writing is a very, very sad endeavor to him.
So what if we live, you know, we do it live instead of interviewing people and writing
it up?
What if we do a podcast and we just capture it, you know, happening instead?
And he was like, all right, I'll do that with you.
See, that's what I'm saying.
Becca, that's what that's the gist of what I got from the episodes that I listened to.
(31:46):
You guys just sit down and just let's go.
Yeah.
Perfect.
It genuinely happens like this.
And we don't edit.
That's the other thing.
Unless somebody really stepped in it and they really want our help.
But really, we don't.
We don't edit because the point is we capture the video and the audio.
I put the video on YouTube and Doug takes care of his masterful audio stuff on the other
(32:09):
side.
But the reason is because once we get talking about our special interests and we start
empo dumping, the masking drops, it just naturally disappears and you get to see captured, right?
Autistic people in their natural environment, right?
Just being ourselves with each other, right?
And it's a window into autistic culture for a minute, right?
(32:31):
It's a window into how we connect and how we communicate with each other.
And what we've been able to do is say to each other, hey, did you see this cool person
over here?
Did you see that person's article?
Let's see if they want to come on and talk about their special interests, like not related
to their work because the whole purpose is that we capture the fun and that it feels
like fun because otherwise, who has the energy to do it?
(32:56):
Really?
To me, it sounds like if I was sitting around, well, I've done this many times, sitting
around at a pub drinking beers with my soccer friends and we start getting talking about
the game and the aspects of the theme and the tactical.
I hear you.
That's what you guys are doing with the info dump files.
It's just frickin' fending.
You guys should bring your couple of glasses of wine on with you sometime.
(33:19):
I didn't see you doing that.
It might get humble.
Oh, then it takes it in a different direction.
You're talking about not editing.
So taking things in a different direction, I want to get into wrapping up the show with
what I call the road trip roundup.
I'm going to be asking you five questions about doing road trips.
(33:40):
You and road trips.
Just be casual about it.
So first one, and I've changed this since when I started asking these questions because
some of the guests would answer that they didn't do fast food.
So I rephrased it and it goes like this.
Question number one, when road tripping, do you tend to do fast food or local diners?
Fast food, definitely.
(34:02):
Okay.
And what's your go to?
That was the original question.
What's your go to fast food?
I would've stuck with that question too.
Why are you helping people?
What's wrong with you?
You're driving in a car, eat some nuggets.
Hey, there you go.
So what's your go to?
My go to is McDonald's.
I think that's a very loyal autistic person.
I'm still loyal to chicken nuggets and fries.
(34:23):
And those were my go to as a kid and they're still my safe zone.
Oh, that's what the, okay.
Loyal to I was going to ask you, was it Ray Crock?
You were loyal to him.
Got it.
Okay.
Check it out.
Number two, what's your dream car for a road trip?
Now back to that can be something you have you've had or grew up with or would be really
(34:44):
cool to say rent for a day or two just for a road trip.
So what would you like?
I want you to dream car.
It's such a tough call for me.
So I'm currently sour on road trips because I just moved cross country.
So I've done it a lot and a lot of different vehicles and it's easier for me to tell you
the car.
I don't want to do it.
I want to do it again.
(35:07):
And that is a caravan, that van minivan thing.
Oh, okay.
Okay.
I will never ever do it again in my life.
It is, it was my real nightmare vehicle before I had to drive cross country in it and it
still is.
How was it moving cross country with pets?
Because I see you have, you've got one or two dogs.
I have four dogs.
Geez, lady.
(35:28):
And how many cats?
Six cats.
Dude, how did you get cross country with them?
Weren't you freaking out that you go in a, first of all, you have to find a hotel that
allows for pets, but my God, if one of them ever got away, oh my goodness.
Well, I actually vlogged the whole thing.
If you're interested, you can head to my YouTube channel and I did a whole vlog of our road
(35:51):
trip and you can see every thing, great thing that happened and every terrible thing that
I started out in an RV and ended up in a rented minivan.
All right.
Thanks for the chocolate.
That's one, one of the things I really like about doing this show is when somebody brings
up something funny like that.
So let's get into something a little, a little bit different.
(36:13):
What's the last cassette or CD that played while you're on a road trip?
Maybe what you might have been listening to on that one.
So well, I did a lot of back and forth on that, but I think my very favorite road trip
album ever is Village Old The Stranger.
Oh, classic.
Yeah.
Very good.
(36:35):
Nice one.
That's something to crank to and just, yeah, I could just see hands on a steering wheel
just cruising.
Yep.
That's a good cruising.
Good cruising album.
Okay.
All right.
Number four, Coke or Pepsi?
Coke, big time.
Boom.
Just straight out of the, yeah, straight out of the gate.
Okay.
(36:56):
Yep.
I'm drinking now Coke Zero.
Have you ever had Coke Zero?
I have.
I'm really a Coke classic and that's it.
Coke classic.
Also, you must have been pissed off when they back in the what, like 1986 or something like
that when they came out.
Yeah.
Okay.
All right.
Yeah.
I was definitely traumatized, but I'm glad that it has returned.
I always thought that that was such an advertising coup because I think they did it on purpose
(37:21):
just to get things started.
That's what my thought was.
Not a bad thought.
Yeah.
Why not?
You know, just stirred up.
Pepsi didn't have the balls to do it.
Why not?
It's true.
Okay.
All right.
Now here you take this last question wherever you want to go back.
Okay.
What's your favorite road trip memory?
Wow.
Okay.
My, it's sort of a road trip memory.
(37:44):
So my husband and I went on a trip for a honeymoon and we went to Scotland.
Oh, it was my favorite trip ever.
Nice.
We did a bus road trip to Loch Ness and that bus road trip was the funniest.
I mean, so many people were car sick on the bus.
(38:05):
Our driver was.
That's hilarious back.
I every for a few.
It was just like a silly, funny memory and I mean, locked up was really cool.
We didn't see her or anything like that.
But how cool to have gone to Loch Ness.
But the drive on the bus was definitely one of my favorite memories.
Yeah.
Were these people that everybody just signed up for a moment from different places around
(38:28):
the world?
Nobody knew each other.
Like two people together that knew each other and all paired up and that's about it.
Yeah.
Okay.
All right.
I'm sure you guys have to get to know each other.
That's interesting.
I've never met anyone that has ever gone and looked for Nessie.
Fascinating.
You're an interesting person.
(38:50):
I really like that.
That's really cool.
Hey, I want to us to wrap up, but I want you to stay on and pick each other brain a
little bit.
And right now I'm just going to say challenge, relax everybody and keep listen and thank
you very much.
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