#92Noon! LIVE From TCO! 9am Hour 4/16 Chris Finch, Alec Lewis

–PA is back at the TCO in Eagan and he’s joined by Wolves HC Chris FInch and the Athletic’s Alec Lewis.

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Man average. All I can sayis wow, I love it. Thady
gets a coming and clean up.Let's go. Let's go, everybody,

(00:29):
Let's go. Good morning. Wow. What that fun? Brother, That's
a fact. Shall we begin clearlywith the musical selection. It is soft

(01:30):
and warm, It is the QuietStorm, It is k F A N
and the Love Covenant. Nine tonow Radio from Twin Cities Orthopedics Performance Center,
home to your Minnesota Vikings, whohad a fair amount of their players
assemble yesterday for off season workouts.In fact, right now, members of
the Minnesota Vikings defense are in thefield house going through some preparatory drills for

(01:57):
conditioning and stuff like that. Soyou got Jack Griffin over there, and
you've got Blake Blake Cashman over there, and you've got a bunch of new
members of the Purple and Gold Covenanthere for the off season workout plan,
and that of course will include MinnesotaVikings head coach Kevin O'Connell, who will
join nine to noon today at elevenam. We have a coach's covenant today.

(02:21):
Chris Finch, coach of the MinnesotaTimberwolf, should be joining us very
very soon to put a preview onhis Battle and the contest and contests in
the playoff series coming up against thePhoenix Suns. So the Coach's Covenant begins
at nine with Chris Finch and continuesat eleven o'clock with Kevin O'Connell. Brett

(02:44):
Blake Moore is guiding the Great ShipLove Covenant. Nordo produces with yours Truley
Paul Allen here from Twin City's OrthopedicPerformance Center, and now we are very
happy to be joined by Minnesota Timberwolveshead coach Chris Finch. Curtis, you
have prize picks Daley Fantasy Made Easyand Second Harvest Heartland and two Harvest Dot

(03:06):
Org. Chris Paul Allen, Goodmorning, Hey Paul, how are you
doing pretty well? Thank you forthose who may have missed it. Chris
is on the board at Second HarvestHeartland and it's quite important to him professionally.
He's looking for ways to harvest somevictories against the Phoenix Sun Suns.
And before we talk about some matchupsand stuff like that, Coach, truly

(03:30):
man, great job by you guysthis year. You know, I know
the last one Sunday is the onesome will latch onto. But over the
totality of the season, and Iknow you have more work to do,
terrific work, but by you andyour staff, thank you very much,
appreciate it, Paul. It's beena great year certainly has taken another big

(03:53):
step forward, you know in termsof former identity, consistently performing at a
high level every night, young playersgetting better and better, you know.
So we got a great foundation tokeep building, and we're excited about this
playoff opportunity and you know, andand a chance to kind of push forward,

(04:15):
even you know, in a ina landscape that's not been as kind
to you know, to the Minnesota'sbasketball scene as we would like in the
last fears and years. But threeyears in a row in the playoffs,
you know, it's nothing that weshould take for granted. Yes, sir,
very well explained. And speaking ofthe Suns, I have some Phoenix
stunts Suns Steam that I know you'rejust dying to hear, right, my

(04:40):
intel and Steam into a playoff series, are you ready sure? In Phoenix's
last four losses, Grayson Allen isshooting thirty two and a robust four of
twenty nine from three I present thatasking how key is it to put Allen
on bad shooting game given the otherson whom they rely. Yeah, there's

(05:03):
no doubt about it. I meanthey you know, with the with Booker
and Durant in particular, now Billseemingly finding his grove. They got a
lot of guys that can create andmake their own shot. So anytime you
they're they're gonna be a handful.Anytime you can get a chance to affect
the guys that are in the supportingcast, you gotta do it. You

(05:24):
got we got to do a betterjob of that. He's he's done.
You know, he's done a goodjob of hurting us in our matchups with
him, and uh, we've gotto be more mindful. But we've paid
a lot of attention to the othersand sometimes these are the decisions that you
make, and we've gotten burned,no doubt. Uh. Secondly, is

(05:45):
it fair to say with the threehigh at times super high enders they start
Uh? Is it is it anabsolute that like with Booker, Durant and
Beale, that they all can't flourish, like at least one has to be
defended, say, into a badgame. Yeah, I think that's a

(06:05):
good assessment. And we've been ableto kind of impact one of them,
you know, one way or another. For most of the games we've played,
it's just been the overall group wherewe've really gotten hurt. Paul.
It starts the starts of the gameagainst Phoenix. All three times for us
have been a disaster for one reasonor another, and we had eleven turnovers

(06:30):
in that quarter on first quarter onSunday in Phoenix two weeks ago, we
started down fifteen nothing. So wejust with a team with that much firepower,
it is really hard to play frombehind because their shot making is such
so elite that even when you closethe gap to eight or seven or something

(06:51):
like this, you feel like you'rein striking distance. They can hit two
or three tough shots in a row, even if you play great defense on
them. Push that league back outto twelve fifteen and give themselves enough breathing
room. So we got tighten thegame up from the beginning, and to
me, we've not been able todo that. And it's excellent you said

(07:11):
that. I mean, the lasttime yet you guys beat Phoenix, you
outscored them thirty five to twenty fivein the first quarter, So I mean,
you know that this season. They'rea plus forty in first quarters of
games against you guys. So thefast start it may be cliche, but
like Saturday, I mean, withthat crowd and everything, it's a must
starting Saturday, right, no doubtabout it. It's it's you know,

(07:36):
it's playoffs. Of course, physicalityhas got to go up, the desperation's
got to go up. You know, we got to get that building and
that crowd into it right away withour intent and in the way that we're
gonna play from the jump. Andyou know, that's that's what we've played
and worked all season for, isto have this game to open the playoffs

(07:59):
at home to maintain I'll give yourselfan opportunity to create an advantage with home
court advantage and maintain that through aseries and through a run. So this
is what's come down to. Uh, do do you mind sharing the pros
and cons of like your big lineupsagainst Phoenix? How do you feel about
that? Well, you know,I think we got to do a better

(08:24):
job and I got to do abetter job of taking advantage of the big
lineup ball on the offense end ofthe floor. And there's different ways we
can do that. Obviously, wecan try to get the ball down and
side a little bit more. Wecertainly got to be bigger and better on
the offensive glass, kind of punishsome of those those lineups matchup wise on
the defensive end of the floor.We've got to be creative, you know,

(08:45):
we've got to. We've done agood job of kind of figuring out
games throughout the season, executing themfrom game to game, and we got
a little bit of a a libraryof things we feel like we could we
could do with our big lineup againsttheir lineup. Uh, they like to
play you know, small or morespread lineups with all the shooting that they

(09:07):
have. So we've got a weekto kind of brush it off those things,
get get good at them, andput them into play. How how
generally speaking, Chris is playoff officiatingcompared to say, the regular season,
it's quite different. I would say, you know, they they hold their
whistle for sure a lot more,but you know, to be far since

(09:30):
the All Star break they've been kindof refereeing that way anyway. They've kind
of I think held their whistle downthe stretch here at the last twenty five
games of the season. You know, you're not gonna play for fouls in
the playoffs, and nor should youexpect to play for fouls. And if
you're playing for fouls, you're notgonna you know, you're not. You're
probably playing the wrong in the wrongmindset. So you know, we gotta

(09:52):
we gotta be a little bit alittle tougher and a little better in our
finishing. Playing through contact initiated isinitiating smart contact at the defensive end of
the floor and being able to utilizemore physicality there for sure. And and
and off that, Chris Chris Finch, coach of the Minnesota Timberwolves, nine
to noon Wolves and Suns Sunday atSaturday at Target Center to begin the postseason.

(10:16):
That's super cool. When when whenwhen you watch back stuff or watch
games, and and and off thethe the foul calls or lack thereof,
Like when you're watching games or youwatch them back and you see all types
of players all over the league complainingabout fouls. How often are the players
telling the truth? How often arethe players? I mean, it's like

(10:41):
most things, I would say it'sprobably fifty to fifty, you know,
but yeah, it's it's referees anincredibly tough, incredibly tough job, particularly
in the game these days, withwith how fast it has become, you
know, how fluid it is now. You know, it's not as predict
of all these plays that happen areyou know, kind of oftentimes come out

(11:03):
of nowhere. So yeah, butwe can't be relying on that from time
for two more from some Booker ingame comments last season to beal the other
day plus plus more. I meanwe we we have a really physical series
coming here, don't we. Iwould hope. So that's what we need

(11:28):
to make it. We need tomake it a real physical series. Uh.
And we need to set the toneearly and often. And and did
did you feel Sunday? Like I'mwatching the game Sunday and granted they jumped
you, and you know, thenwe then we had some other things take
place, but like that, theycame out just incredibly physical, you know.
Is that something like you know,you'll show your guys and they'll be
like, yep, got it,yep, got it. Yeah, I

(11:52):
mean, we're gonna we have alot of different video sessions during this week.
Which is the benefit of having youknow, clinched the the playoffs,
being in the top six is youget a week to prepare the benefit of
being in the three position is youknow who you're preparing for, you know,
even for the week starts. Sothese guys will be given a lot

(12:13):
of different highly digestible messages and videosessions you know that we feel will point
to some things that we need todo to be successful in this series.
That's terrific. Last one and Nurkicefor the suns. I mean, I
guess i'd forgotten this. Yeah,you guys had Nurkic and Yolkic in Denver

(12:33):
like seven years ago. Why whydidn't that stick? I mean, that's
a pretty good one too. Well, it was we played it together,
you know. Actually we started theseason, I think we played the first
fifteen to twenty games, one atthe four, one at the five.
We played two big and as theseason then progress, Uh, it was

(12:54):
kind of about the time when everybodystarted playing more small lineups. Jokicic's emergence
was clear. Murcice was too goodof a player to be a backup,
you know, and Tim Conley atthe time, I know he it was
a very very difficult decision for himbecause I was there and we had a
lot of discussions about it. Asa staff to move on and trade him

(13:20):
to Portland for some picks and pieces, and uh he you know, he
flourished up there. You know,he got to the role where he could
actually start to become who he wasalways going to be. And then you
know, obviously with Jokich the restof his history, but there were we
were spoiled to have two really skilled, talented young bigs at the same time.

(13:43):
And you know he had to makea choice what what and and off
that. I mean, you spenta fair amount of time in Europe playing
and or coaching, but like likeEuropean bigs, I mean back to Demontes's
dad are Vetas Demontes is an elitepasser and you know we're talking about Nurkage
and Yokic. I mean, like, like how do they raise their bigs

(14:07):
to be such good passers. Well, a lot of their development structures when
they're young kids, it's all positionless, you know, so if a kid
is big, you know, theydon't just do big guy things with them.
They teach. You know, everybodydoes the same drills over and over
all the way through really up untilyou know they're about eighteen. Everyone does

(14:28):
the same post footwork, everyone doesthe same, perimeter handling, everybody does
the same you know, short sidedplaymaking things. It's so everybody whose skill
level is being brought along, youknow, at the same but at the
same time, and obviously people can, you know, a well rounded game
regardless of whatever I think sometimes,you know, at least when I was

(14:52):
growing up, I can't speak tohow it is now so much. But
when I was growing up and someonewas big, you planted them near the
basket, you tried to throw onthe ball, and you teach them a
jump book right, and the restof the skill lagged behind, you know,
until they were able to either haveit innately and get a chance to
show it or move to another environmentwhere somebody recognized and was able to bring

(15:13):
it out of them. But youknow, what I experienced when I was
in Europe was looking at a lotof the development structures, is that it's
kind of like everybody was treated likeyou are treated when you first learned to
play basketball. All the kids aredoing all the same thing, but they
just kept doing that all the waythrough to their you know, club professional

(15:33):
club structures. Man and and thenyou get a German big named Dirk Novitsky,
who's going to shoot a thousand threepointers a day and be like,
I'm never passing, I'm just I'mjust going to get to the basket,
then get to the line and shootthree pointers. And it worked beautifully for
that. Ahof Hey man, you'reterrific. Best of luck this weekend.
We'll talk next week. I appreciateit. Thanks. Letter by Chris Bench,

(15:56):
coach of the Minnesota Timberwalls. That'sthat's fantastic Men of the Wolves and
the Suns this weekend on k fA m Alan Horton on lead vocals,
So he'll be in studio nine tonoon a couple of days from now.
But when we return being a TwinCities Orthopedics performance center with a bunch of
the new players here and stuff.We have a football focus today, just

(16:18):
a week in small change in frontof the NFL Draft, and we begin
it with one of our very favorites, y a young Alec alec Lewis from
the Athletic and the Athletic dot Com. He joins us from the t CEO
Radio studios. When the radio showcontinues on FM one hundred point three k
f A n the fantafictech dot com. I want to give you shots for

(16:42):
a grand in your hand at theNational Cash Contest. Head to kfan dot
com enter the keyword fun for thishour. The keyword is fun. KFA
dot com keyword fun. Well like, Vikings Draft Party is back at us
Bank Stadium April twenty fifth, andyou can get your tickets now to party

(17:04):
on the field while taking in thefirst round of the NFL Draft. Get
your tickets today Vikings dot com slashDraft Party and can tune in for your
home for the Draft KFEN each dayleading up to the draft for your chances
to win your way in draft coverageon the fan, always present locally by
Pepstdraftthouse Pizza. Thanks for helping.Did you ask Koc any questions yesterday at

(17:47):
the press or? And good morning? Good morning? Yeah, great to
see you. By the way,Joe, I did I ask Koc any
questions? I don't remember asking questionwhich no, I definitely think. I
didn't think I would show up andnot ask the question. I mean by
law, I mean by the bythe law of the Journalism Ethics Code.
If you show up, you betterask a question, so or at least

(18:10):
try you have to excuse me.Yeah, get Kevin right. That's how
it goes. And I I whiffedin the t J. Hockinson press conference.
I went, I think, ohfor four with two strikeouts. He
trying to get the question in.But ultimately, what was the question?
It wasn't It wasn't great. Idon't think it was anything great. So
I don't know, but look itis it's the spring. Yeah, what's

(18:32):
the question. It's the spring andyou're not in You're not in full form.
So I don't. I don't.I don't beat myself up too much
about it. Yeah, that's whatI'd say. You go through your own
offseason workouts. I see what Ijust saw in that facility. You think
I could do it? I mean, well that This is Alec Lewis,

(18:52):
thank you. He's a card carryingmember of the Left Covenant and has been
since I pretty much since he arrivedfrom Aniston and Alabama. Uh. He
previously worked for the RedZone dot Org, attempted to join Miles Simmons with a
ProFootball talk dot com, but Floriowouldn't hire him. An NFL nonprofit you
say so? He he is withthe Athletic and you can follow him as

(19:14):
Nine to Noon does at ALCA underscoreLewis via the tweet machine, and we
indeed do thank him for helping andamplifying the presentation. Now, I'm Adam
Schefter, quite well respected, right, I've heard of him. Yeah,
he tweeted this morning or yesterday.I saw it this morning that he believes
Drake May is the preference of theMinnesota Vikings. Do you care to comment

(19:37):
on that? Do I care tocomment? Even if I don't care,
I should probably comment because I'm onthe rain now as an option. No.
I mean, look, I goingback to the combine, Drake Mays
a name that came up a lot, and you can make You can talk
about the Josh McCown connection and allof that, but I wouldn't. I
don't think I would go so sofar as to say, oh, them

(19:59):
hire Josh McCown to be their quarterbackcoach is an indication that they like Drake
May. I think the indications thatthey like Drake May are people inside the
building. Going back to last year, when his tape was honestly better than
this year, saw him as aguy with prototypical size and the type of
attributes that could benefit you in thearms race, that is quarterbacking in the

(20:21):
NFL, And so if they wereto like Drake May, it wouldn't surprise
me at all. The other thingand I this stuff is always hard to
get into externally, but talk toa lot of people within the industry who
rave about his leadership ability, justhis makeup. And that's the type of
stuff that I mean. I don'tknow if you can really assess it until
they get in the building, butthere would be a lot of reasons why

(20:41):
I think Drake May would make sense. But I mean they would probably reasons
they make sense for the patriots orfor the commanders or what have you.
Up top. So Adam Schefter isas credible as they come. What he
says I would listen to. Andso that's what I would say. So
with the way you feel or yourin tell obviously without oversharing or you know,

(21:03):
perhaps there's not an opportunity to overshare. But if it was metaphorically heaven
or hell, and you have tobe right with this. If you're wrong
with it, it's you and thebad guy. If you're right with it,
it's you and paradise. Would yousay Drake May is the preference of
the highest decision makers here. Wouldyou do you feel that I'm not going

(21:29):
to go as far as saying thatright now understood, I'm just not.
I it's possible. But I alsothink there is a lot to like with
Jaden Daniels tape, which is potentiallythe reason he might go number two.
And I say this speaking about whatthey think. I'm not like I like
jayd Natles tape, but I alsothink they would really like Daniels tape.
Jayden Daniels tape. JJ McCarthy ispretty pro ready. Like, I'll tell

(21:56):
you something interesting. I went Iwent back last night before where Josh McCown
got hired last year by the CarolinaPanthers to be their quarterbacks coach. He
was working with a company called UnderdogFantasy doing some video series where he just
assessed players tape. You can findthis stuff on YouTube. Why would Underdog
want somebody to analyze tape to evaluatequarterback prospects with an experienced mind. So

(22:23):
Josh mccownt there's like a forty minutehim breaking down Bryce Young, There's a
forty minute him breaking down c J. Stroud and I watched last night.
I've watched these a lot, becauseit gives me a pretty good indication of
what Josh McCown looks for. ButI rewatched CJ. Stroud for two reasons,
One to remind myself of what JoshMcCown looks for, but also to
remember what CJ. Stroud looked likeagainst Georgia and the College Football Playoff.

(22:48):
And what he looked like is apro ready quarterback by without a shadow of
a doubt, and Josh McCown madethat very clear. There are very few
guys in this class that look evenremotely close to that. JJ McCarthy is
probably one who is more of thepolished than probably even a Drake. Maybe
Again, I'd like to get tothe bottom of something that transpired yesterday nine

(23:10):
to noon, and I'd like toget to the root of it because you
and Nordo Matt, producer of thecon Erstwhile Juice Box, you guys got
together and did a noon to twoshow on Saturday, and it's fine work.
I mean, both both of youare high enders on the radio.
I really appreciate that, or youwouldn't. You wouldn't for one work at

(23:30):
Kfan and for the other to aidKfan. And the reason the reason I
asked, and what I want toget to the bottom of is I don't
know what happened to the producer overthe weekend, because he came back Monday
and now all of a sudden keepingeleven and twenty three and going best player
available was the modus Operendi and forthe first time an X amount of months.

(23:53):
I mean, I've heard from himand others glowing things said about Jade
and Daniels, but yesterday it washe's my fa favorite court is it in
the entire draft, including Caleb Williams? Yeah, my favorite of the group
because he's got by far I thinkthe largest total upside of the group,
which includes Caleb Williams. Yeah.Okay, so there it is. I

(24:14):
mean I'm like, well, wheredid all this come? I mean,
what happened? Well, so thenI started, you know, I started
tracing the tracks and it all followedthe trail. It led back to noon
to two. I don't know whathappened. I would just like it explain
to me if at all possible.Well, so the sticking at eleven and
twenty three, you know, we'retalking about it before yesterday's show. It's

(24:36):
like ten days in front of thedraft the ten takes out there. My
goal ultimately is that this team hasidentified somebody as Alec and I talked about
on Saturday, the guy versus aguy, which we discussed a bit yesterday
as well, Pa and Ken ofthe you know how how you know how?
How big is the gap between maybethe three guys that are going to
be potentially available in that two,three, four spot and how this front

(25:00):
office views those gaps and does itmean we get up to four and we
just get one of those guys becausewe think KOC can flourish with any of
them, or as Adam Schefter tweetedthat Drake May is their preferred guy,
maybe it's Jaden Daniels, but justin terms of being YouTube highlight reel guy
and getting closer to the draft,all we've talked about is JJ McCarthy.

(25:21):
It just makes sense here and thissteamrolling with him never ends. Drake May
is kind of the blue blood ofthe group, as he was talked about
in this position a year ago andhe still is. And then there's Jayden
Daniels who comes out of nowhere,and it's while he's got Malik neighbors,
he's got these badass wide receivers andhe's throwing to him. They're always fifteen
yards open. But the more youwatch in terms of highlights and the more
you read, it's like, Okay, I don't know who this guy is

(25:45):
off the field, I don't knowanything about him as a human. But
in terms of a guy with theelite high end athletic ability combined with the
fact that he might not be aspolished or as pro ready like, I
think that's maybe an a topic inconversations that put JJ above a guy like
Jayden. But I think if youjust stripped away all of expectations and moments
in that and you stripped away thedifference or idiosyncrasies in a system, and

(26:08):
you just said, I'm lining upthese four guys, who is the guy
that potentially athletically, skills wise abilitycan rise above all of them. I'm
just I'm getting down that road whereI think Jaden has the highest upside of
any of them. And my requestto you, young alec Is is for
you to channel your inner Dane Brugleror Mike Sando or Dan POMPEII the Beast

(26:33):
and analyze what he just said.Yeah, So here's what I'd say Jaden
Daniels, there there is a veryconcerning statistic that comes with his evaluation.
It's called pressure pressure to Sachary,and that's not why he left Arizona State.
No, No, there are otherdata points I think that that would
be concerning. But I'm just froma from a tape perspective. I'm just

(26:55):
gonna say that, excuse me,a tape and analytics perspective. Sure to
sacrate? How many times when youget pressured do you turn that into a
sack? Has proven to be alittle bit of a of a predictor of
quarterback success in the NFL. AndI believe, if I'm not mistaken,
that Jayden has the highest pressure tosacrate of all these quarterbacks, which is
concerning. There's no question about it. What would would of the the most

(27:18):
mentioned sex would Penix have the best? He would have the best? Yeah.
Now you could argue, is thatbecause he just gets rid of the
ball? So is that because he'swilling to throw it away he's afraid to
take hits? Okay, you can, you can skew this conversation however you
want it. But Jayden Daniels,everybody thinks about him in terms of highlights,
runner blaze it across the field,and he definitely has that, there's

(27:44):
no question about it. But healso has the the the pocket rhythm,
the the the pocket mechanics that youreally like. I think he doesn't have
the arm strength of a Drake Mayor maybe even a JJ McCarthy, but
but he is very He's very accomplishedin the pocket. He's very sharp in
the pocket. And when you thinkabout Kevin O'Connell and sticking on the rhythm

(28:08):
and the timing of the play,that's really where I start with this is
which of these guys are very capablein the pocket to execute the play the
way that Kevin O'Connell would want itcalled. And that's why I do think
about names like Jayden Daniels. Ithink about a name like JJ McCarthy because
he is pretty sharp, he ispretty polished. Drake May is probably more

(28:29):
of a we're gonna sit this guyfor a longer period of time because his
footwork needs work. But potentially thebenefit of a guy like Drake May,
with the size and with the ability, could could be transcendent among all three
of those. So it makes itreally tough. The reason I bring up
pressure to sack with Jaden Daniels isbecause I want to make it very clear,
for as much as I or thisteam might like a certain individual,

(28:52):
there is still a very high likelihoodand probability that it's not the right,
that it goes wrong, that theguy's not perfect. You just barely can
find surefire prospects at that position inthis in the draft. It just barely
ever happens, which is why CJ. Stroud is such an anomaly. If
if the Minnesota Vikings a week fromThursday, we're willing to give up picks

(29:17):
eleven, twenty three and next year'sfirst round draft pick, what what?
What percentage do you feel they willbe able to get to three, four,
or let's say five. Is ithigher than fifty percent for four or
five? It might be three isprobably it's going to be a little tougher

(29:38):
than that is what? What ismy opinion? Now? There's also there's
an alternative that say the Patriots thinkthat that they like they like JJ McCarthy,
and they could trade back to theycould trade back and then trade back
up to five or four, thenmaybe it makes them a little more likely
to move off off of it torecruit more picks. But like, I

(30:02):
think it's possible. I think it'sI think it's uh may potentially even like
more possible than not all right,three two, So you would say,
so it's more favored for it's thefavored scenario. Yes, I think,
wait, quaesiofam it's a sat inthis room with you, I think a
month and a half ago or whatever, or last week whenever. But he

(30:22):
said we have a preferred scenario.In my opinion, the preferred scenario is
to trade up and get the guywho sets you up long term. But
they've also said many times that anotherteam has to be complicit in that action,
and it's it's it's really hard tosay. The other thing that Nordo
and I talked about this weekend thatyou really have to watch is there are

(30:45):
teams like the Giants. Potentially thereare teams like the Broncos. There are
teams like the Las Vegas Raiders thatmight act a little more irrationally and you're
trying to be mindful of where they'rewilling to go, and that might may
drive the price up in the end, see the the Giants. I'm glad
you said that because I thought ofthis last night and I forgot to write
it down. The Giants going fromsix to four for a quarterback still puts

(31:10):
Arizona in a position to get thereceiver they cover correct Where eleven might house
you l s U two w Rtwo from LSU. It's not neighbors yet,
it's not going to get you theother guy or Marvin Harrison Junior.
So do I mean that those arethings that it's it's were you know at

(31:30):
this stage wouldn't get you next year? Is one? Either There's a lot
to balance there, that's true,but it would get you closer to what
that's And Jarry here's the element ofthat that I'd like people to think about
pretty heavily. Joe Shoan, who'sthe GM of the Giants, Like,
I mean, he's been there prettygood while and they won the playoff game

(31:51):
obviously here. But when you whenyou're in these positions as GM and head
coach and you've been in your joblonger how long I mean David Gean was
their GM within the last two Ithink it's two three years maybe, but
you have if your job security isin more question, then you there's more
likelihood that you act irrationally yeah,for the pressure of the present. It's

(32:13):
the Brandon Bean bit that you've thatyou brought up a month ago and have
written about and talked about, whereit's like the yeah, I mean,
we think it makes sense, butif it doesn't, I ain't going to
be here anyway. Correct And Ithink about it too. It's like a
Sean Payton, does he care aboutthe long term, overall five year window
health of the Broncos organization or doeshe want to win right now because he's

(32:34):
done this for a long time.So that that part of how the Vikings
try to assess what these other teamsmight or might not be willing to do
is central to me in the cruxof what ultimately happened. I think for
the first time and I can't rememberthe last time I went on a radio
station somewhere else around the country andactually argued with the host, but it

(32:57):
kind of happened yesterday with Altitude inDenver. And and I know when they
when Scott Hastings is one of theuh, one of the one of the
co hosts Now Scott, you knowit's I've known Scott for a while through
the NBA, and he's like theanalyst for the for the Denver Nuggets radio
network. So we're talking about Phoenixand the Wolves and them and and a
little NBA. But but and Idid that purposely out of the gate when

(33:22):
they welcome me in, welcome mein, thanks for having me, Scott,
oh goodie. Up here in thecornfields, we hook KD and Bradley
Beal And so I'm trying to killa little time there because I know what
these guys had up there sleeve.You know it's coming. Yeah. They
they wanted to regurgitate the JJ McCarthystuff, which they did. But where
we where we argued a little bit, where we bickered a little bit was

(33:45):
when we were talking about desperation andand he said the Vikings are more desperate
than than the Broncos. And I'mlike, well, we're in the same
fishbowl and the rocks are right nextto each other. You know, we're
under different rocks, but they're rightnext to each other. Pick eleven,
pick twelve. How in the hellcan you say the Vikings are more desperate
than the Denver Broncos. I'd likehim to explain it. He didn't really

(34:06):
explain it, And I'm like,all right, I mean you can.
I mean, we can go wecan go roster for roster here, man,
you can hit me with sir Tanand I'll come over to the top
of Jefferson and then this and thisand this. So like I'll ask you
which team, if it's vying fora quarterback, which team do you believe
is the more desperate team? MaybeI'm wrong, Oh that's easy for me.

(34:30):
I don't think it's a very goodquestion. Actually, I mean,
I ain't talking seventy percent to thirtyhere. I mean it may be two
noses hitting the wire together. Ikind of think the Vikings are more desperate.
Why because you have a GM anda head coach entering their third seasons,
whereas in in in Denver you havea guy who probably thinks he can

(34:52):
make it work with anybody in thewhole world, because that's the ego,
and he's also had success. Yeah, so what I mean, ultimately,
what is he have to lose?And I think you have a mean,
I could be right, I'd beinterested to hear what Norda says. But
I also think you have a fanbase that's really desperate. I think,
yeah, that's no question. Yeah, it's an interest I kind of flip

(35:13):
flopped as I was listening to I. I think I think it's actually the
the ego that you talked about,not only with Peyton, but with John
Elway. I think that makes thatentire situation much more desperate than the Minnesota
Vikings from you know, they absolutelywhiffed on the Russell Wilson thing. The
and and this this will sound ridiculousand is a Vikings fancket. No,

(35:35):
I'm not trying to make Kevin O'Connellsound like Bill Belichick, but those coaches
that they ran through there and satdown with and then what they ended up
with and he didn't even make theseason. No, it's embarrassment, right,
and and the long so the longlist of l's and then in combination,
you don't have a second round pickbecause you had to flip that for
your current head coach, who thatthe clock is ticking on that As a

(35:58):
Vikings fan, nobody wants to ina Super Bowl more as a Rube than
me, There's no doubt about that. However, I actually would say that
them winning it with Peyton and thegun for higher approach that they've kind of
taken with that organization over the lastbetter part of a decade. Now,
I think that makes them so muchmore desperate as an organization. George Peyton.
I wonder if he gets five hoursof sleep at night. I mean

(36:21):
that that situation is so bad withthe moves they've made in the last three
or four years, where you know, we we this team definitely needs a
QB and a lot of people askingquestions about how you could let Kirk go
without an answer and Quacy trying tobalance his own decisions with some of the
stuff that was left on his platefrom Spielman Spielman's era. The Broncos are
more desperate. I just think,and I don't think it's close. No's

(36:44):
that's probably fair. And this iswhy I don't. I mean, that's
a great radio question, but thisis why is I as why write I
think sometimes so I can just withinand think about it, all right?
Three two? No, I Ijust want to talk about I'm more interested
in, like who going to bemore rational? And that's where the Bronco
which maybe means they're more desperate becausethey have to act more out of desperation.

(37:07):
I don't know, it's it's it'sit's a very interesting talker I'd say,
well, that's where with the capitaladvantage though, going back in that
and I'm sure we've talked about it, Alex, is the idea that you
know, when the when the dustsettles and the Viking's helmet does not pop
up at pick three or pick four, no trade was consummated, and it's
the Broncos and they get JJ McCarthyand we're at us Bank Stadium. We're

(37:29):
all freaking sour well out a roomby night. But then when we find
out you want to talk about desperation, we have the capital advantage from not
only the additional first round pick thisyear, but if we're talking about future
equity, but if they go Sylvesterstallone backwards hat over the top at a
truck stop with a future first roundpick and they that's what they're going to

(37:51):
have to do. So that's wherethat desperation angle comes in. Where if
they truly believe that this class isas deep as it is and they they
actuallykip and jump us in the draft, that's where that desperation comes in because
they will have to pay more thanthe Vikings from an equity standpoint to get
up there. And so that's Ithink when we'll find out just how desperate

(38:12):
mister Peyton and company are. Yeah, I mean, and the reaction to
that, to me would be verylike to see the Vikings fan reaction.
That would be very interesting. Wouldwould the fan base be frustrated that the
Vikings didn't were willing to do more? Would? I mean? That to
me is where, well, they'llnever get the truth because they can get
the truth from a scribe and I'mgonna believe you, I'm gonna believe ban

(38:32):
I'm gonna believe Kevin or whomever.But it's still not from the source you
know about well we actually offered anyquestions exactly this, It would yeah,
you'd read that in a book fortyyears later, but you're not gonna get
it. I mean, but Ithink one get one could assume though,
if the Broncos give up twelve thisyear's three, next year's one, and

(38:52):
then maybe an extra day two pickwell, that would be more than even
if Quasi had offered his two firstand next year. Right now, I
think in two you would just assume, like whoa, we kind of got
kicked in the pants here. Wehad no idea that Peyton was going to
go that high and they did sothey can have JJ McCarthy. Then I
think I ended the interview by sayinghave fun with bow Nicks, and they

(39:14):
didn't laugh, and I think theyhung up on me. Alec Lewis with
the Athletic in the Athletic dot Comis that twin Citi's Orthopedics Performance Center with
yours Truley, Paul Allen and producermuch more about which to chat when we
return. We want to hear fromyou sen usor draft related talkbacks all day
long and if you're selected as ourdraft talk back of the day, doing

(39:37):
a pair of passage to the middleLight Vikings Draft Party. Fullest of details
head over to KFA dot com KeywordContest Draft coverage on the Fans presented locally
by Pep's Drafthouse Pizza and off whatBrett blakemore just shared the the the talkbacks
for the draft tickets are going totake place about thirty minutes from now,

(39:59):
so we we have our beloved Yafor a couple more segments than after that,
we pause and we will play backsome talkbacks and the victorious talkback via
the free iHeartRadio app and the babymicrophone and the thirty seconds to opine that
will take place beginning in the neighborhoodof ten seventeen. Best of luck to

(40:21):
you and file file reports or formulateopinions off really anything that we've talked about
today nine to noon, or specificallythese football intensive segments with Alec Lewis from
the Athletic and the Athletic dot Com. It's time for vikees bus. It's
vikes Bites presented by Thousand Hills LifetimeGrazed grass fed Beef. That's your problem.

(40:44):
You said it so seriously. Ijust wish. I don't know if
it's radio. Nobody can say.I know, but it's so funny,
don't We don't want a camera onus at all times? Oh yeah,
you definitely don't need it. ButThousand Hills Lifetime Grazed grass fed Beef.
By the way, you can goThousand Hills Lifetimegrazed dot com, learn about
regenerative agriculture. You can shop forelite beef or get it at your local

(41:07):
co op or Coburns. It's ThousandHills. I want to start here.
TJ. Hawkinson within the last dayor so talking about his ACL rehabilitation Alec,
and he noted you know he knowsKirby, and I assume that's just
from being back in Detroit, buthe doesn't believe there's any malice behind Kirby

(41:28):
Joseph's hit that put him in hiscurrent spot. However, he also wants
to league to do something about it. And it's something that we've always kind
of assumed and I've heard others sayit, and it sounds weird as a
non athlete, as a guy that'snot out there. He would rather have
a concussion than have to rehab hisknee for nine months. And here's what
he said. It's tough, itreally is. Hawkinson says, we're big

(41:51):
guys running through the middle of thefield. This is a business. I
don't think anyone goes out in thefield wanting to injure a player like that.
So I'm looking at the light ofthat and hoping that's not what the
intent was to injure a player inthat sense. But I think to have
it happen a couple of weeks laterwith Higbee, I think that's something the
league needs to look and see whatit can do. So a lot of
players down on the hip drop tacklethat was recently banderin the owners meetings.

(42:15):
John Harbaugh among the loudest about that, of course because Mark Andrews was placed
out of the mix because of thattackle. But from this standpoint, it
also got loud when Higbee went down. I just don't know what the league
can do as they continue to narrowthe spectrum upon which a defensive player can
hit an offensive player. Yeah,And we asked TJ yesterday like do you

(42:35):
have any and he's like, it'sjust kind of above my I mean,
it's for the league to figure out. It's a really complex question. If
you can't hit a defensive defenseless receiverup top and you can't hit him down
low. I mean, you're it'sa very tiny area which you can target
the player. But I mean Itotally understand his perspective, and I thought
he handled that really really well yesterday. Like you could tell when we first

(42:58):
asked him about it that he wasa little hesitant, like how much do
I really want to say? Andhe's like, you know, I I
And he, ultimately, I thinkfelt as if it would benefit everybody by
him just talking openly and honestly aboutit. And he said that his injury
was obviously brutal and terrible and andhe's still working kind of mentally, I
think, to to to recover fromit all. But he also said that

(43:21):
two weeks later, seeing Tyler Higbee, a guy he knows, suffer the
same injury the same way by thesame player, really got to him.
So yeah, it's it's a greatquestion in terms of what you can do
to to defensively weed out those typesof hits. And it's it's just hard
for me to think you can continueto shorten the area that you can target
and how and and defense still matteringin the in the game. It's it's

(43:45):
a really complex question. I sayit all the time. It's like,
yeah, guys get hurt a lotin this sport that is humans flying full
speed, crashing into each other.I mean, you're you're trying to prevent
something within a sport that's just almostI mean, it's just gonna it's there.
It's unpreventable. It is in somecases. Now, any vibe on

(44:07):
when he we can expect to seeTJ on the field, I mean we
still having like that first month ofthe season, that's what. That's what
every time he comes up, it'salways well, eventually TJ is going to
be healthy. It feels like that'snot opening day he would like to.
I mean, he said anything's possible. We talked about week one. He
said yesterday, anything's possible. Butthe reality is, given how much they

(44:29):
paid this guy and how important heis to what they want to do offensively,
they're gonna take it very methodically.And he raved honestly about the Vikings
health staff and the plan and allthat. And I thought that was interesting
because around the league there have beena lot of trainers and and and health
staffers have been deemed through a lotof these surveys rese years. But Tyler

(44:51):
Williams, who Kevin O'Connell brought overhere, has received a lot of rave
reviews. And TJ said that they'veworked really hand in hand with this.
I'd expect them to take it prettymethodically. If it was like week three
week four wouldn't surprise me at all. If somehow he pushes the envelope and
is there for week one, Idon't think. I would also say it's
the craziest thing in the world,and that's why the team needs to draft
brock Bowers. Wait wait till youget a load of the the early stages

(45:16):
of the Kevin O'Connell interview coming upabout an hour from now. Believe it
or not, brock Bowers makes theconversation, Hell yeah, literally, let's
put the four on the field,JJ, Addison, TJ and brock Bowers.
Let's go speaking of JJ, JustinJefferson not at voluntary workouts? Wasn't

(45:36):
at voluntary workouts a year ago?Big deal? No big deal? Can
you play the sound effect the murmur? Yeah, I mean it's one of
my favorites that you guys do.Uh, what was the question? Not
at No big deal matters absolutely noneto me that Justin Jefferson is not here
or now be here. No,will that matter to him? Uh?
What are you saying for the restof voluntary workouts? Something? Yeah,

(45:59):
I mean not a ton. Iwill say, you know, if they
end up drafting a quarterback, itreally would be nice for him to like
be here and build a relationship.But I'm also not naive to think that
like the contract matters to him andhis representatives. I would say, the
contract really matters his representatives. Buteven if Justin's not here, I'd expect
them to be and they draft aquarterback, I expect them to be in

(46:21):
contact. I expect them to becommunicating. You can make a big deal
out of Justin every time he walks, moves, has seen anywhere. I
just I'm not gonna make a bigdeal of it. This team really wants
him here, the staff really wantshim here, and as long as they
pay him what he deserves, hewill. I'd expect him to be here.
Vites Fites brought to you by athousand Hills. I saw this.

(46:42):
Now. You weren't covering the teamwhen this gentleman played for the Vikings,
but you had E. J.Henderson, and then you had Aaron Henderson
and Aaron Henderson a day or twoago via the Xbox slash Twitter machine.
Folks don't want to hear this,but as long as the Vike's locker room
is filled with nice guys, theyain't gonna win. Attitude reflects leadership,

(47:05):
and the Vikings are a nice,family oriented organization top to bottom. So
kind of the idea, and thishas popped around in my head at times,
kind of the idea where a teamor an organization in some ways can
adopt the mental and the philosophical vibeof a fan base. So the Vikings.

(47:28):
There are Vikings fans. We areardent, we love our team,
we want them to win every game. But are we going to show up
at people's doorsteps and get on thepicket line and stop watching if they go
seven to ten? The answer isno. So do you believe that just
this the Vikings fan base, nicepeople, the Vikings organization, terrific organization,

(47:51):
and he's right from top down,awesome people in the building. Is
that why the Vikings aren't winning moregames? So? When I covered the
Kansas City Royals for three years,GM was the guy Dayton Moore who had
won a World Series, been thereforever, and he I've never said this
publicly and I whatever, but heused to say sometimes off the mic,
like We've got way too many sonand laws in here. He's like,

(48:13):
we got way too many son andlaws in this clubhouse. I always thought
that was an interesting comment. I'mreading a book right now called Captain Class
that's really about like how a lotof these teams take up the makeup of
of the their their their captain,who typically the best teams, that captain's
a little Jerrymond greenish where they're willingto go off their rails where they're willing

(48:34):
to say some stuff and how alot of the most successful teams in history
have that type of guy, who'sbrash, who's who's not the most beloved
by the media or anybody. Soit's just like Andy Raid. No,
I mean, it's it's an interestingit's an interesting, uh thought process concept.
I mean, look, I II don't know. You win with
good players, Like that's what That'swhat I would say. So the more

(48:58):
good players you have, your yourorganization can give out candies at the door,
I don't really care. If you'vegot Patrick Mahones, you're probably gonna
win. Fikes. Bites provided byThousand Hills Lifetime grazed grass fed Beef.
This is nine to noon.