Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Wake that ass up in the morning.
Speaker 2 (00:02):
Breakfast Club Morning.
Speaker 3 (00:04):
Everybody is the j Envy, Jess Hilarious, Charlamage, the guy.
We are to Breakfast Club Lawn, LaRosa, phillid In for Jess.
And we got a special guest in the building. We
have Bozamus Saint John. Welcome back.
Speaker 4 (00:16):
Thank you, thank you. I'm doing all right now. You
feel you, thank you. Nice to see you.
Speaker 5 (00:20):
I'm sending you positive energy and love. And like we
just saw that you lost your house in the La Wild.
Speaker 4 (00:26):
Yes, right in Mali, and you said you found out
on social media. Yes, got on Twitter video. Yeah, somebody's
just driving down pH and I was like, oh, that's
my intersection. Oh shit, there's no house.
Speaker 3 (00:41):
Did you get a chance to go back to see
whatever was there to rubble if you can find it.
Speaker 4 (00:45):
I haven't. I haven't been able to be back yet.
So it's like, you know, everybody's just waiting to see
when we're allowed to go back and see what is left.
Although you know there's nothing left, but I think there's
still something about the grief process where you just need
to see it to know yourself that it's totally gone.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
Do you feel like, is it a grief.
Speaker 4 (01:04):
It is a grief, yeah, because it's a loss. It's
a big loss. You know. It's like I think, you know,
people have said things like, oh, well, at least you
have your life and you know it's just things and
you can replace it. I'm just like, you know how
long it took me to get there, twenty five years
of hard work? Did you lose pictures, passports, all, like
so many things?
Speaker 1 (01:24):
But when you evacuated, what were you able to grab
if anything?
Speaker 4 (01:26):
Nothing? Well, first of all, I wasn't even in the
country you were. I was in Zambia.
Speaker 6 (01:31):
Yeah, yeah, birthday right, yes, happy belated.
Speaker 4 (01:33):
Thank you so much. Two yeah, thank you. That's a lie.
But it was like it was just it was so
scary and overwhelming because you know, all you know is
that the fires are coming, you don't know which direction
they're going in, and the evacuations happen so quickly that
(01:54):
you know, the people who are in their homes like really,
you don't have time to think. I think we've all
had that moment right where you been like, oh, you know,
it's like if there was something like who would you
save or what would you take? And you make those theories.
But in reality, it doesn't work like that. There's this panic,
and for me, since I was so far away, there
was really nothing I could do, and Who's I gonna
(02:15):
send to go get myself? I was gonna do that,
you know, so you gotta let it burn.
Speaker 3 (02:19):
Did you see online which I thought was horrible and
the tasteful people were saying, you know when rich people
are wealthy people were losing their cribs. Good for them,
they could get another one and all that, you know,
And I'm thinking, like, it doesn't matter if you're wealthy,
if you're not, you're losing things that care and me.
Speaker 1 (02:34):
The most of you.
Speaker 3 (02:34):
So so how did you feel when you're seeing that,
Like now you just lost your all your property, You
lost all your things, and then you see this online?
Speaker 4 (02:40):
Well it pisses me off because it's like who you
think gave me the house?
Speaker 6 (02:43):
Right?
Speaker 2 (02:44):
You know?
Speaker 4 (02:44):
You think somebody just came here and gave me the house.
You don't know that I worked for it. So what
if you worked for it, you should just lose it
and it should be all right. No, of course I'm sad.
I cry, I'm mad. Know. It's like, yes, of course
I'm in a better position because I will be able
to replace things. I we'll be able to rebuild. But
who wants to do that? You know, we got enough
going on. I don't want to have to do that too,
(03:06):
Like can I get some peace? Just want some rest?
And so it's like it makes me upset when people
say stuff like.
Speaker 3 (03:11):
That, what was the most important thing or the one
thing that you are so upset that you couldn't get
or that you missed out on.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Or you lost you know.
Speaker 4 (03:18):
To be honestly, I haven't even really thought that far
into it. I think it would be too overwhelming for
me right now, you know too. But like what happens
is that every once in a while, I'm just like,
oh damn, that thing was over there, that was there,
you know what I mean, Like, you know, I go
reach for something like it's gone, you know. And that's
the part that is really upsetting because it could be
(03:40):
such small things, you know, and then there's like the
really big stuff that you you can't replace.
Speaker 2 (03:44):
You know.
Speaker 3 (03:45):
Me and my wife were talking the other day when
we see you know, we were like, you know, what
would we grab Like we tried, we try to start
setting things up in the house, and she's like, well,
I gotta go get the photo albums.
Speaker 2 (03:53):
I gotta get the pictures.
Speaker 1 (03:53):
I need the memories. And then she was like, but damn,
what about the kids? First outfit? You want to be
able to pass that on, And then you think about
what about this.
Speaker 2 (04:00):
About the kids? You got thirteen of them?
Speaker 4 (04:01):
You know how.
Speaker 7 (04:05):
She dealing with all of this because she's you know,
she's young, and explaining it to her, she's.
Speaker 4 (04:09):
Fifteen, and I think it's I mean, it's a tough time.
You know, you're already a teenager with all these emotions
going on, you know. But she has friends who've also
lost their houses, so at least she has some community
that she can talk to about shared experience. But you know,
how do you comfort a child who's like, well, what what?
(04:30):
What if the fire comes again? You know, and then
what So it's just a tough thing.
Speaker 1 (04:37):
Yeah that was going happen. So what happens with school
and living?
Speaker 3 (04:39):
Don't well, first of all, was that your main house
because you got money?
Speaker 1 (04:43):
Second house your second house for you?
Speaker 4 (04:45):
Yea, So it's definitely not.
Speaker 2 (04:48):
Gonna feel sorry for you.
Speaker 6 (04:50):
I don't like anybody.
Speaker 7 (04:51):
The only reason why I say that with you, I
don't know any of the other celebrities personally, but for me,
when I moved to LA you were one of the
girls that like a lot of us were watching, like
when you were in Mark Get in and now you're
on the show, and you worked hard for what you had.
So I love that it's my second house and you
can still go through things as well.
Speaker 4 (05:07):
So exactly. And the thing is that the second house,
It's like, look, I still had to fight for that house.
I still had to battle racist neighbors for that house.
I still had to put my house in a trust,
inside of a trust so nobody would know a single
black woman was buying the house. And so I'm like, yes,
it's my second house, but like, look I should have
a third house. I should have a fourth house. All
these people get it, so why can't I have it?
(05:29):
And so yeah, I get pissed when it's like people
are like, oh, well that's all right, you know you
have another one. N I want more and we deserve more.
So it's like when I get it and then I
lose it, I want everybody to be pissed off. It's like,
you know, we don't get a chance to buy in
these neighborhoods and so when we do and then we
lose it, we should all be pissed because then about
when it's your turn and then you can't buy it?
Speaker 2 (05:51):
How are you able to show up and do this though?
Because I mean the show what's going? Right?
Speaker 5 (05:54):
You got your beauty brand eat by by promoting the
reality show, but then you got all of this heavy
How are you able to even show up and just
do what you're doing right now?
Speaker 4 (06:03):
Well, unfortunately, I'm not unused to grief.
Speaker 2 (06:06):
Yeah, you know, it's.
Speaker 4 (06:07):
Like I've faced a lot of it in my life.
And one thing I know for sure is that the
son is going to come up the next day. People
are going to keep moving and if you don't move
with it, you'll get left behind, you know. And it's like, look,
I think one of the things for me is that, yes,
I do want to rebuild, Yes I do want another house.
Yes I want more things in my life. And how
am I gonna get it? Nobody's gonna give it to me.
(06:27):
So I got to get up and go do the
work myself.
Speaker 1 (06:29):
And what made you do Real Housewives at Beverly Hills?
Why did you jump into that?
Speaker 2 (06:34):
That's the first thing I said.
Speaker 6 (06:35):
That announce me. I was like, I didn't think it
was boredom.
Speaker 7 (06:40):
I just thought I was like, well, maybe this is
going to like lean into like future business. She's so
successful already, she's the girl for us girls. Why would
she go over there with them people?
Speaker 4 (06:51):
Well, you know what's so funny, the the idea of
being on the show is actually really interesting to me
because I do feel like there's no representation for women
like me or like us. You know that. It's like, look,
the corporate girlies who are ambitious, who are smart, who
are loyal and will defend their friends and all of that,
they don't exist in this space. No disrespect to anybody else,
(07:15):
but they just don't. And so I'm like, well, I've
already represented in so many different spaces, like why not
do it here and also work on a bigger platform
and also do things that I want to do in
a different way, So why not?
Speaker 5 (07:28):
I guess we always look at you as an executive,
like I want to run down some of your resume.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
You the global CMO and Netflix CMO.
Speaker 5 (07:33):
Of in Devil, CEO, CBO of Uber, head of marketing
of Apple Music, and its head of Music and Entertainment
Marketing at PEPSI coo, I'm missing anything.
Speaker 4 (07:43):
God's favorite baby.
Speaker 5 (07:45):
What would you say the key to all of that
success has been and do you prefer being behind the
scenes in front of.
Speaker 4 (07:50):
The Yeah, oh that's an interesting I mean, I think
the key to success always has been that I truly
am myself. You know, I think that a lot of
people like to say that. It's hard to do because
when you're in these spaces, conformity is what wins. You know,
You've got to just be like everybody else. You got
to wear the gray suit like everybody else. But anybody
who has seen my career or seen me walking around
(08:11):
has known that, like, I am a black girl first
and foremost, I represent exactly who I am. I don't
try to pretend not to be. And so for me,
it's like that has been my key to differentiation of
what has made me successful, and so now moving out
of that space is just another unexpected thing.
Speaker 2 (08:29):
You know.
Speaker 4 (08:29):
It's like, look, you read my resume and it sounds
great because people are like, oh my gosh, you did
that and that that. But it's like if you were
there with me day to day and were advising me,
you'd see that people never cheered me on even when
I made jumps, like people never did. So when I
left Apple to go to Uber, people were like why
would you do that? Like why would you leave Apple?
(08:49):
And at the time I went to Uber was like
the company was going down in flames. They're like, why
would you do that? And much like yeah, because first
of all, y'all think that I'm getting these jobs as
some sort of token, and so what I'm going to
show you is actually I'm the greatest marketer of life
and that a company that is on its knees, I'm
going to help rebuild. And when I do that, you
can't ask me another question. And then it's like, okay,
(09:10):
I moved from Uber to Endeavor and then Endeavor to
Netflix and Netflix I joined right at the start of
the pandemic, and people are like, oh, why would you
do that? Like it's such a big company, like the
spotlight is on it. If you fail, you're going to
fail big. And I'm like, yeah, but if I can
do that, then you again, you can ask me whether
or not they can do this right, because now I've
done it at four different companies, who's gonna deny me?
(09:32):
And then I was inducted into the Marketing Hall of Fame,
and I was like, yeah, okay, there, I'm done retire,
Thank you.
Speaker 3 (09:38):
Franchise shooting down, So I guess you're there to save
the Real Housewives franchise because that franchise seemed like it
was going down.
Speaker 4 (09:46):
Well, I think that it deserves a reinvention.
Speaker 2 (09:49):
You know.
Speaker 4 (09:50):
I think the relationships between women has been really shown
poorly in ways that are not helpful. I'm not saying
that there's not conflict. There's always conflict. There's conflict the boardroom. Okay,
the fights I had in the boardroom were far scarier
than any fight have had on this damn.
Speaker 1 (10:04):
You know any of those women, were you friends with them?
Speaker 4 (10:06):
I knew one of them?
Speaker 7 (10:07):
Yeah, oh okay, because because people thought that your connection
to the show was a sa vander pump because you
guys were at that.
Speaker 4 (10:14):
I know, at one event together.
Speaker 6 (10:17):
It was like other people in the picture.
Speaker 7 (10:18):
So they thought, I thought that maybe you knew her
because she does so much business in Beverly Hills and
then she ushered you into the show.
Speaker 4 (10:25):
But no, no, no, suddenly because just socially, you know,
we know each other that way. But yeah, I just
I just think that there are opportunities for us to
continue to show the diversity and relationships with women. And
I don't know that this is like a one trick thing. Yeah,
we should have more ability to show the drama and
conflict and the things that happened in your life that
(10:47):
don't necessarily have to be with you just screaming and
yelling at people needlessly.
Speaker 2 (10:52):
You do what comfortable feels like?
Speaker 4 (10:53):
Both, Do I know what comfortable feels like?
Speaker 2 (10:56):
You have allowed yourself to get comfortable.
Speaker 4 (10:58):
I don't think in a workspace, No, I mean in
the workspace, Yeah, I haven't. No, I don't know because
there isn't one, you know, not because I haven't allowed
myself to, but because that's just death. You know. It's
like if you get too comfortable in the corporate spaces, uh,
(11:19):
somebody's gonna come get you, you know. And I don't
think that there's any nirvana for black people, or especially
black women in these spaces. And so I'm like, yeah,
you always got to watch your back. So I don't
think I've ever been comfortable.
Speaker 5 (11:32):
No, I'm glad you said that too, because I feel
the same way. And I think that sometimes when you
get too comfortable, you start to play it safe. And
then that's when I think all of these industries start
to die out because you've got people who are playing
it safe. And my thing is like, they're probably gonna
fire you if you play it safe, you might as
well take the risk because if you get fired doing that,
at least you feel good about yourself.
Speaker 4 (11:52):
Well, I've always said that, like, look, when I leave
a space, I want you to know that I was there,
Like I will never leave a space, and you were
just like, oh, what'll she even here at all? No,
I got to leave some sort of footprint, and so
it's like, how am I going to do that if
not representing for who I am in my community and
all of those things. Now, look, I recognize the fact
that it is a burden to be in these spaces
(12:15):
and to be the one and people, you know, when
something happens to black people, they turn to you and
be like, oh, so, what do you think we should do?
And yes, that is annoying, but at the same time,
it's like, yeah, well maybe that's why I'm actually in
this room to actually say the things that are hard
to say and the things that they wouldn't know otherwise.
And so for me, the comfortability aspect has never really
(12:36):
been part of what I have tried to achieve because
I know that that's not my destiny, that's not what
I'm meant to do.
Speaker 7 (12:44):
So are you staying in the room to do that?
Because people think you're leaving the show because of the
post that you put up on.
Speaker 4 (12:48):
This are No, I'm not leaving the show. That's by
something else. But then my house burned down, so then
I couldn't even talk about it.
Speaker 2 (12:55):
But oh, so he was gonna quit something else? You
had an announcement company.
Speaker 4 (12:58):
Yeah, No, I was thinking about like life changes and
things I need to do, not about the show at all.
Speaker 2 (13:03):
Got you.
Speaker 5 (13:04):
Yeah, But how will eliminate Well, you see Trump's in
office now and you know, yes, all of these DEI
initiatives getting eliminated across the country.
Speaker 2 (13:11):
How will that impact us black people?
Speaker 4 (13:15):
Well, I mean in a terribly adverse way, because you know,
everything is cyclical, you know, so it's like you just
look at society and culture and realize that things just
go back around and around and around, and so we
are headed back into like the mid eighties, you know,
with the idea that America was only great when you
(13:37):
had you know, a monolith only you know a few
people at the top who want to make the decisions. Yeah,
and so everything else has felt like you're taking away
from that community and from those people, and so yeah,
it's like they're coming back to be like, hey, look, everybody,
get out. We need to make this country better. And
we can't have all of these people telling us what
(13:59):
to do, not even the majority. And so until we
actually come together as multiples of communities, we're never going
to be in power. And so that's the thing that
always confuses me. I'm like, I realized that there are
challenges for black people that are different from Latinos, or
different from Asian people or you know, anybody else who's
(14:21):
of color. But the challenges that like, we can't fight
the battles individually. We really can't.
Speaker 3 (14:25):
I wanted to know, you know, from we're proud of
you as a community, from what you've done, what you've accomplished,
but you know, some people might not know the educational
background and how you got there.
Speaker 1 (14:34):
So for people.
Speaker 3 (14:35):
That's in your field that's admire you and want to say, damn,
I want to even go a notch of what she did.
Speaker 1 (14:41):
How did you do it right?
Speaker 4 (14:42):
What is the education right, Well, I mean I have
my bachelor's degree. You know, I don't have a master's degree.
I decided after my bachelor's that I wanted to jump
right into work. You know that I had the opportunity
to go to Spike Lee's advertising agency, which is where
I got my start. And you know, I think the
(15:05):
difference with how I did it is that I never
thought that a job was too small, you know, for
me to actually like.
Speaker 1 (15:13):
Say that again, because people, I don't think they heard
of that. And did you get paid at first? You
didn't get paid it.
Speaker 4 (15:18):
I got paid nothing, got paid nothing. But you know,
the jobs were never too small. Like I brought my
full self to every single job. There was never a
time where I was just like, you know what, when
I get into that corner office, that's when I'm gonna
do da da da da da. No I did that
when I was an assistant. Yo. It's like you can
ask Pike today and he will tell you that like
(15:38):
I crushed. In fact, like when I was getting inducted
into the Hall of Fame, he did an interview and
he said he knew then that he would work for
me one day. Wow, And that happened when I was
at Netflix and he got an overall deal while I
was the CMO, you know. And so for me, it's like, look,
there's never been a moment in my career where I
felt like I can't wait for the next thing. I
(15:58):
brought everything to the job I had, and so even
now as I sit here and doing this show and
all that, I'm bringing everything everything I have, you know,
because I want to be able to have the next
opportunity and the next opportunity and the next opportunity.
Speaker 5 (16:12):
I should know when the job is done. How do
you know when your time at a places.
Speaker 4 (16:17):
That's a very complicated question, Like I think some of
it is intuition, you know, just feeling like the energy
is shifted. So but that requires knowing yourself and knowing
what it is that you're trying to do and accomplish.
Speaker 7 (16:28):
You know.
Speaker 4 (16:29):
Back to what I was saying about people not cheering
for me when I was done with the job and
moving to the next thing, because they always feel like
they know when you should go. You know, They're like, oh, wait,
but you didn't do that big thing, so you should wait,
And I'm like, well, but I can feel it. I
can see that either I'm not going to be able
to do it because somebody's in my way or there's
(16:51):
something that has stopped me. And why stay in a
place when you're going to have diminishing return. It's like,
at some point you've got to realize that you got
to get out when you're on top, and that's how
you keep at the top. You know, if you come
down towards a decline, it is much harder to rise again.
It's much easier to jump from top to top to top.
Speaker 1 (17:11):
Do you consider yourself an alpha woman?
Speaker 4 (17:13):
Absolutely? Yes, So with being.
Speaker 3 (17:15):
An alf woman, how is that in relationships? Do you
feel like you have to submit a little bit? Do
you feel like you have to fall back a little bit?
Speaker 2 (17:22):
You can that question the Lauren, Huh, you couldn't pass
that question.
Speaker 3 (17:28):
I'll tell you the truth, no, because you know, when
it comes to the Real House. You know, my wife
watches the show, so she's a fan, and she she
loves who you are. So she's always asked like, damn,
I wonder how is that in a relationship? Because she's
very strong and she had that question. She also wanted
to know, did you feel like those friendships on Real
Housewives of Beverly Hills are real friendships.
Speaker 1 (17:49):
So do you think it's bullshit?
Speaker 4 (17:50):
But start without start with Okay, So here's the thing.
I can't diminish who I am. It's not possible. So yes,
I want the soft girl life and the whole thing,
and I can have that too, But at the end
of the day, this is who I am. You know,
I walk into a room and I demand things. It
is my energy and my aura, and so the need
(18:13):
for a partner who is not threatened by that or
not afraid of that is absolutely necessary, you know. So
it's not necessarily about me dimming or getting quieter or
being more subservient. Is that? Like, who's just going to
match my energy? You know? My mom says every pot
has a lid, and I feel like, now I found
a lid.
Speaker 6 (18:32):
How did you know that, Kiley?
Speaker 7 (18:33):
Because also too, not only is he coming and you're
like already this super successful marketing Hall of Famer, but
now he's having to be introduced on real house as
of Beverly Hills. Right, he's got questions after your late
husband as well. Yeah, how did you usher him into
all that? And how did you know he was fit
for that?
Speaker 4 (18:49):
Job, right. Well, also I have to add that, like,
I also respect him a great deal, you know, so
that that has to be at the bottom of it,
you know, which is like, that's where we have to start.
I have a tremendous amount of respect for him. And
so the conversation even telling him that like, hey, look,
I'm on the show, right I would like you to
be on the show, but let's talk about that whether
(19:10):
or not you feel comfortable doing it. And when he
said he did, and I was like, all right, look,
you haven't been in the scrutiny like I have, so
we're gonna have to talk about what that looks like
for you, you know. And so to me, it's like
there's a responsibility that I have to him, you know,
in being my partner on being on the show, and
(19:30):
therefore making sure that he's also protected. So perhaps that's
even where the alpha woman shows up, is that like
I feel that, you know, I want to be protected
by him, but I also feel a responsibility to protect
him as well. And as for the relationships on the show, Look,
I'm the first one to tell you that I really
thought that these conversations were played up, you know, I
(19:52):
thought it was yeah, you know, people be like, oh,
she talked about you, and I was shocked to find
out that the relationships are really real. So people get
upset about real things, you know, and that you really
don't know. It's just like life, like you don't know
if somebody's talking about you behind your back. You do
(20:13):
not know that, and so you're making assumptions based on
the facts that are given to you. So you might
be really nice to somebody. But yet she was over
here talking about whatever it is that she wanted to
talk about you, and you didn't even know. And so
you see it on screen later and people will be like, oh,
she should have known she was fake and this and that.
You're just like, how would you know that. You'd have
(20:34):
to be psychic you would have known. And so I
am continuously learning about the relationships between the women and
myself and then also how it appears on camera. Reunions
are going to be very interesting. That's all I know.
Speaker 5 (20:53):
Could you data? Could you have a house husband? Like
if it was just a guy who.
Speaker 4 (20:56):
I don't think, No, I don't believe so, yeah, I
don't think so, I don't think so that nice guy.
Speaker 2 (21:03):
He looked good, he putting it down. He cooks, yeah,
keeps everything.
Speaker 4 (21:08):
I think it's it's probably more about like mindset and
ambition than anything else, you know. I'm just I'm way
too ambitious, I think to have somebody who would not
want to also be ambitious.
Speaker 3 (21:18):
I also noticed on the show they changed a lot
on the show where and I watched the show with
my wife.
Speaker 2 (21:23):
That's little thing, but.
Speaker 3 (21:25):
I noticed on the show. When I do watch it,
I love seeing them women bow down to you a
little bit, like they tiptoe.
Speaker 1 (21:31):
Around you, and you know, like you could tell that
they look for your approval. Do you notice that because
it's a shift and it's a change.
Speaker 4 (21:38):
I do think it's a shift because I'm not like them,
and so I think anytime somebody new or like a
new situation presents itself, they're also going to be a
little careful, you know, because you just don't know. You
got to test the water right now. If I come
back for a second season, I think that would be
a different situation because now they know they know you
right right, and they're like, oh okay, so she's got
(22:00):
her opinions, she can stand up for herself, and they'll
have a different way to interact with me. I'm sure
that's going to happen.
Speaker 5 (22:07):
How did putting out your book, The Urgent Life of
My Story of Love, Loss and survily, Well, how did
that being vulnerable in that book prepay you to be
vulnerable on reality time?
Speaker 4 (22:16):
Oh that's a great question. It was so hard to
write my memoir. You know, it was so hard because
I think what happens is that, you know, as I
was saying, with grief, you know, you just want to
get it behind you. You just you want to feel better,
you want to feel quote unquote normal. And what happens
is that we don't realize that you put away the
(22:39):
sadness and the fear and the anger and all those things,
which also put away the happiness and the joy and
all the good things that were a part of that
because your brain doesn't know how to separate any of
those things. And so in writing the book, I had
to go get all of that stuff back. You know,
I had to be really honest about how I was
feeling in a situation, or you know, what was my
(23:01):
true feelings about the thing, in order to write an
honest book. And I didn't feel like anyone would would
connect with it if I was just writing fiction, and
that absolutely prepared me for this particular role because I
don't have the need to hold back from my personal life.
(23:22):
You know, so much of my life has been about
my professional pursuits, and so in writing the book, I
was able to talk about love. I was able to
talk about you know, things that made me cry and
you know, things that hurt me. And so now it's
like I can do that more comfortably because I've already
done it by writing it.
Speaker 7 (23:40):
How do you this is a back to the show stuff,
How does it feel with you and Garcel? Like you
guys are like the two black women on the show, right,
and you already talked about like feeling like you're there
to say certain things that people can't say, whatever the
case may be.
Speaker 6 (23:53):
Does it make you feel like a token?
Speaker 7 (23:54):
You don't give the energy that you would just be
okay with that, But does it make you feel like that?
Speaker 6 (23:58):
Do you ever have to be like to like now,
am I doing it happening? Yes?
Speaker 4 (24:02):
All the time. Well, the thing is that, like I
don't necessarily have to tell producers I'm not going to
do whatever it is that because they're not really orchestrating anything,
you know, But I know that I'm not doing the
thing that perhaps would be expected of me to do.
You know, It's like I often said that, you know,
I wasn't going to come down into the mud. It's like,
(24:24):
if you have a conflict with me, you're gonna have
to rise to where I am, you know, in order
for me Like, look, you know, yeah, I'm like, I'm
not I'm not having petty disagreements right now. It's like
I have enough going on in my life that I
don't need to go down into like some small little things. Now.
You know, if there is conflict about what is right
(24:45):
and how somebody is perceived or what I believe is
like an indefensible thing, yeah, then I'm going to talk
about it.
Speaker 7 (24:52):
Do you feel the need to like do you and Garsel?
I don't know what your relationship is off camera?
Speaker 6 (24:56):
Yeah, what is that?
Speaker 4 (24:57):
Like it's a good relationship, Okay.
Speaker 6 (24:58):
Do you feel the need to defend her?
Speaker 7 (25:00):
Certain things happen and she like, I know, she was
going through stuff where like they were attacking like her.
Speaker 6 (25:03):
I think it was her son.
Speaker 7 (25:04):
And her case right right, right, right now, there's a
lesbian common thing where people were dragging her for that
with Kyle Richards.
Speaker 4 (25:09):
Yeah. See, here's the other challenge is that, like I
feel like I can defend things when I am present.
You know, It's like, I think it's a very thin
line when you start to talk about stuff that's' was
not present for I've already said I was at it
publicly that like if somebody has said something about my child,
oh man, I don't know that we'd be we'd be
friends today, you know, Like I, I don't know that
(25:30):
I can get over that. I and I have yet
to talk to Garcela about how she got over that,
you know, just because I just felt that, like it
just crossed such a line. And perhaps she is, you know,
more evolved than I am over it.
Speaker 2 (25:44):
She was waiting on the shot.
Speaker 4 (25:45):
Maybe maybe she wait on I don't know that's a
good point, But I do think that, you know, for
her and I, I hope that what people are seeing
is that there's a possibility to be more than one
type of black woman. You know that like ourselves, is
an accomplished actress who has her own life and her
own challenges and issues, and the conflicts that she's had
(26:06):
with the women don't necessarily have to be my conflicts
because I don't. I don't have those conflicts with them,
you know I have. I probably have my own, And
so why is it that we can only have one?
Like I really hate the comments with people are like,
oh okay, boss here and now carself can go. And
I'm like, why why can't win the white girls back?
Like why has it got to be her? Why are
we pitying she and I against each other? You know?
(26:28):
So I'm like, no, there there can be more of
us in these spaces without having to be oh, there's
only one type and that's it.
Speaker 5 (26:36):
And I know you've experienced that to being, you know,
the head of marketing and all these places, because they'll
turn to you and say, what is a.
Speaker 2 (26:42):
Seventeen year old black guy?
Speaker 4 (26:43):
And oh, my god, care about like I don't even
know exactly.
Speaker 5 (26:50):
We've been at meetings like so what is a black
a thirty two year old black woman?
Speaker 2 (26:54):
And Patterson think, I'm like.
Speaker 4 (26:56):
How the hell do you know that? Exactly? I'm like,
that's why you have research search departments.
Speaker 2 (27:00):
Go do your job, just black women?
Speaker 6 (27:03):
Do that?
Speaker 4 (27:04):
Yes, that part, that's a better answer, that's part of
the researcher yet direct.
Speaker 1 (27:08):
Yeah, Now I have one other question you know what
the fire is in LA. Who do you blame? If
you blame anybody? Do you blame the government for not
having enough water to city to town?
Speaker 2 (27:18):
Do you?
Speaker 4 (27:19):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (27:19):
Who do you blame?
Speaker 4 (27:20):
M Well, God and I have had this discussion because
I don't really delve into conspiracy theories and do all
of that stuff. Now, look that I think our public
officials are have a job to do to been sure
that you know, the response teams have what they need
in order to do the things. But like if you
saw any video of Los Angeles on fire, you knew
(27:43):
that was armaged. I mean, it was just I don't Yeah,
It's like I don't know that there was any amount
of water that could have saved a majority of the houses.
Speaker 6 (27:55):
You know.
Speaker 4 (27:55):
It's like people were taking their own hoses and you know,
like wetting their houses and then the thing was dry
in like five minutes because the heat of the fire.
So I don't know that I lay blame on a
human you know. I'm like, that's why there's insurance and
it's called the act of God.
Speaker 7 (28:12):
Now are you still again going back to the show again,
I'd be watching the show. You had talked about your
using a platform for stuff like being able to talk
about like fibroids, and and I thought it was interesting
because you mentioned that you weren't in like a dire
situation where it's like you're in pain, you had to
You're just planning because you want to have another kid.
Speaker 6 (28:30):
Potentially, right, Yeah, how you feeling like today?
Speaker 4 (28:33):
Yeah? I feel really good today. I'm just glad that
I was able to talk about that publicly because, you know,
I don't know why it is that when we talk
about reproductive health, especially for black women, it's like this
point of shame. Yeah, you know, it's like I don't
know how many people sent me messages commented on the post,
like friends who were texting me and being like, girl,
(28:54):
I went through that last year. I'm like, why did
I not know that? You know, It's like there's some
strange shame that's the associated with it, as if like
we're not good enough, or that we're not whole women
because you have fibroids and you've got to get that
removed in order to have any kind of we can
reproduce at all. And so I'm just like, wait, but no,
(29:15):
this is a health issue, you know, And it's like
if we take care of that, we take care of ourselves,
we will be in better shape. And I don't know
that there's any benefit to hiding any of that.
Speaker 7 (29:25):
I think you also brought up a good conversation too,
because one of the things you said was like, I'm
not getting any younger, so I want to make these plans.
Speaker 4 (29:30):
Now, that's right.
Speaker 7 (29:31):
Have you been having conversations with those same people about,
you know, just you're not getting younger, but you do
want to have another camera?
Speaker 4 (29:36):
Yeah, yeah, that looks like for you and how you're
planning for that. Yeah, I mean, Killie and I of
course talked about it. You know, my daughter and I
talked about it because you know, well, there are the
two people who be impacted. I don't really care about
anybody else's opinions, but for me, it was really important
to talk about the risks because I did not have
easy pregnancies in the past, and so I wanted to
(29:57):
make sure that I am in the health theest place
that I can be. And again, thank God that I'm
in a position to have insurance and you know, the
access to healthcare, and we know what black maternal health
looks like. It is dire. You know, it's like we're
dying at a rate faster than everybody. So for me,
it's like, look, I wanted to be able to use
the show to talk about health, to talk about my
(30:18):
reproductive health. And then also, I do think that there's
a conversation to be had for the corporate girls who've
waited a long time to have.
Speaker 7 (30:27):
Their babies, get babies fifteen Yeah, right exactly, and you
start all over again right now, yeap, I.
Speaker 4 (30:32):
Would, And I think that there's a lot of women
who are doing that. You know. It's like, I like,
I look at a majority of my friends who are
in their mid forties, and a lot of them don't
have children yet. Some of them haven't gotten married yet
either because they were focused on their careers and didn't
you know, make that commitment, or they didn't find partners
who could manage their alphinis or whatever the reason is.
(30:57):
But who want families. And so I'm like, again, there
is no shame in that. It's like, you can say
it out loud that I want a baby or I
want a family and then take the steps to get it.
I just think we should remove the shame from it. So, yeah,
I'm gonna be an old ass mom, but I'm gonna
do it.
Speaker 7 (31:12):
I was going to ask you mentioned marriage, Yeah, and
now know that you know you've been married before. Now
you and Kelley together, it seems like I saw y'all
pictures of your way.
Speaker 6 (31:23):
Is that going to be? Is that a conversation for y'all?
Speaker 4 (31:25):
Right, Yes, it is a conversation. Well, because I want
to have a family in a nuclear unit, so I
want to be married and then have babies.
Speaker 6 (31:34):
So we're gonna see an engagement on the show.
Speaker 4 (31:35):
Look, girl, talk to him?
Speaker 2 (31:36):
Where's he?
Speaker 5 (31:38):
How do you keep key from getting gassed up because
of the TV show? Because the cameras in front of
getting a little hot?
Speaker 4 (31:44):
Now, you know what I think that I think i'd
probably if I didn't know that he would be all right,
I probably wouldn't have wanted to be with him in
the first place, you know, because you got to have
a level head. You can't let, you know, anybody make
you feel like, now I'm a big man on campus.
You know, that's that can't be. That can't be the
(32:04):
way we behave So I trust that he's level headed
enough to take everything with the grain of salt. You know,
people love you. One day they're gonna hate you the
next day. Look, you just gotta take it as it comes.
Speaker 6 (32:15):
Y'all should get the T shirts and.
Speaker 1 (32:19):
Appreciate it.
Speaker 5 (32:20):
I got one last question about the EEI because you know,
to me, these corporate DEI initiatives have always been some
bs because like the number of black CEOs never increased.
The money corporations you know, pledged all these black organizations.
Speaker 4 (32:34):
They never gave that out.
Speaker 5 (32:36):
And I think it was easy for them to get
rid of him because they never wanted them to begin with.
Speaker 4 (32:39):
WHOA.
Speaker 5 (32:39):
Yeah, so I keep saying, real DEI has to be
created by us.
Speaker 2 (32:44):
Yes, what does that look like?
Speaker 4 (32:45):
I completely agree. And the other issue, and nobody wants
to talk about this, is that the DEI offices never
were funded. And so it's like as a CMO, I
had a billion dollars to spend my d de partner,
chief diversity officer, zero budget.
Speaker 2 (33:04):
Wow.
Speaker 4 (33:04):
And so you had all these companies and organizations where
those officers would have to go asking for money for
their projects. Now, if I have the ROI on what
I'm doing with my money, why would I give it
to you. I don't know what you're going to do
with it, and I don't know that you're really going
to turn it into more profit because you probably can't.
(33:25):
And so how am I going to trace that the
money I assigned to you is going to do the thing.
So most of the time those DEI officers didn't get
any money at all. Wow, And so I don't know
how you succeed. I think the whole system was set
up for failure. And so yes, I agree with you
in that it does have to start with us. It
has to start with executives who are currently en roles
who are afraid to hire black and brown people because
(33:47):
they don't want to look like they have bias. And
I'm like, no, you should have bias. That is actually
your job in that role. So even though like in
the roles, I never had DEI against my name, I
absolutely put that as part of what I want to
do increase the number of my employees and the peoples
on my on the on my team who were black
(34:08):
and brown or other that I don't have the perspective
of theirs, and I need it in order to do
the job well. So it just made mathematical and business sense.
But also that you know, we have to look at
the other offices and make sure that those folks are
also feeling the responsibility of promoting DN I of doing
the work because once those offices go, don't think that
(34:29):
you're safe.
Speaker 6 (34:32):
I got one more, I got one more show question.
Speaker 4 (34:34):
Yes, do you so?
Speaker 6 (34:36):
I know that there was an episode that yesterday.
Speaker 7 (34:38):
I didn't get to see the episode, but y'all were
at the y'all did like the Tranquil spat day.
Speaker 6 (34:42):
Yeah, they were talking about the messages.
Speaker 4 (34:44):
Yes, the Serenity soiree.
Speaker 6 (34:45):
Yes. Do you still feel like Kyle Richards was on BS?
Speaker 4 (34:49):
Yes? You do. Yeah.
Speaker 6 (34:50):
So you think she was trying to take old girl's husband?
Speaker 4 (34:53):
No, no, no, no, I don't think she was trying
to take her man. But I do think that she
was talking trash about her.
Speaker 6 (34:59):
That's why she You like, what is it? What is
the overall Goalden?
Speaker 4 (35:02):
Do you think to like? Because they were friends and
if you're talking about like, I'm gonna put myself in
the shoes because that's how I reviewed it. I'm like, look,
if you're gonna say something about me, you should just
say it to my face. No, you know, but don't
go say it to my man and then say that
you're gonna keep a secret and separating yeah, I'm like, so, well,
who side are you on? You know, I just think
(35:24):
that that breaks a girl code.
Speaker 7 (35:25):
And then in real life, does that make you and
coll Richard's now y'all are at odds?
Speaker 4 (35:28):
Or like she well, you have to watch the rest
of the season.
Speaker 6 (35:32):
That's my last question.
Speaker 4 (35:34):
That's been great than we appreciate you for joining us
by boss Oh yes, yes, yes, well so yes. So.
By the way, when I retired from corporate life and
promoted my book and all those things, I thought that like, okay,
that was it. I'm done. But interestingly enough, like it
or not, my hair has always been a topic of
conversation in my corporate career. I mean it's like when
(35:56):
I did the Apple keynote, I was the first black
person to present you know, tech chnology on that stage,
and half of the tweets that night were about my hair,
you know. And I have always been an advocate of
being able to use the laws and you know, the
rules that have been written, whether it's the Crown Act
or anything else which allows for you to be fired
(36:16):
or like you know, suspended from school if your hair
isn't straight or whatever, like those rules still exist on
the books and figure out like, well, how can I
celebrate that? How can I, you know, encourage us, How
can I make sure that, Like, yeah, if I want
to wear my hair any kind of way I want,
let me do it the way I want to do it.
And when I looked at the hair extension industry, eighty
percent of the consumer bases black women are women of color,
(36:39):
Yet we don't have any ownership in manufacturing and distribution
and innovation. So I'm like, why is a lace white?
Like I could see your lace, yes, because it's white,
you know what I mean. I'm like why? And look,
you could go on YouTube or google it and you'll
find fourteen million videos of black women kitchen chemists. Why
we're out here telling you how to lay your lace
(37:00):
and make the color like you. And I'm just like,
why is that? So I went to China by myself
and to the biggest hair show in the world and
just walked around and asked questions. And then when I
realized that, like, oh wait, hold on, this is actually
an industry that's making a lot of money, but we're
not anywhere in the seats, I was like, well, I'm
going to do it myself. I'm going to get in
there so I built a factory in Ghana. I started
manufacturing and then now I'm selling it.
Speaker 7 (37:23):
How is it going to impact your business with Trump
and an administration.
Speaker 4 (37:27):
Well, look, as long as the exactly I'm not. As
long as the tariffs of hold, I'll be fine. But
the good news is that there are really great trade
agreements between Africa and the US and the UK, and
so I can distribute anywhere I want.
Speaker 2 (37:41):
You said you built a factory.
Speaker 6 (37:44):
Girls just be getting vendor list. You went and built
a factory.
Speaker 4 (37:47):
I built a factory because the thing is, I also
didn't want to argue with people. I'm tired of that.
Speaker 7 (37:53):
You know.
Speaker 4 (37:53):
I'm like, look, and I used every dime of my
own money to build it. And Nasareni investors, I was like,
you know again, I've worked for twenty five years. It's
like I have all these stocks and all these companies.
It's like, why not invest it in what's going to
help us and what's gonna be better for us? That?
Speaker 1 (38:08):
Wow?
Speaker 4 (38:09):
So how did they buy some eve www dot bos
dot com dot so much they thought the Eve Well, yes,
a few reasons. I My first child actually did not
survive her her delivery day. Her name was Eve and
also the even the Bible and the even science all
(38:32):
originated from the continent of Africa, and so I was like,
you know what, we are the original woman, and so
we're going to take back that narrative too. Because when
I looked at all the pictures for Eve, as I
was like concepting the brand, all of them were pale
and redheaded. I was like, why is that? Where's the
blackie Eve at? So I was like, all right, that's
gonna be the name of the company.
Speaker 2 (38:49):
Amazing.
Speaker 1 (38:50):
Yeah, those a the Saint John ladies.
Speaker 4 (38:52):
Thank you so much, thank you for having me club.
Speaker 1 (38:54):
Good morning, wake that ass up in the morning.
Speaker 2 (38:57):
The Breakfast Club