INTERVIEW: Jaleel White On How Urkel Saved 'Family Matters', Black Hollywood Dynamic, Bullies, Bulges + More

The Breakfast Club Sits Down With Jaleel White To Discuss How Urkel Saved 'Family Matters', Black Hollywood Dynamic, Bullies, And Bulges. Listen For More! 

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Wake that ass up in the morning, the Breakfast Club Morning.

Speaker 2 (00:05):
Everybody's DJ Envy, Jess, Hilarrys, Charlamagne and the guy. We
are the Breakfast Club lawn, the roaster filling in for jests.

Speaker 1 (00:11):
And we got a special guest in the building. Indeed,
we got Jalil White. Welcome.

Speaker 3 (00:16):
What's up? Okay, how you feeling, man, I'm doing great, man, Man,
good morning.

Speaker 1 (00:19):
Good to see you, but we'll see you.

Speaker 4 (00:20):
Brother.

Speaker 5 (00:20):
You got your new book, Growing Up Arcle a memoir.
Why you do the eighties nineties R and B cover
on the front.

Speaker 4 (00:26):
This is even eighties, like seventy.

Speaker 1 (00:30):
Early eighties, early eighties. That's the Mike Jacksons the whitest post.

Speaker 3 (00:36):
You know. I did it because for anybody who's a
fan of the Stefan character, they know that he was
debuted in a white suit.

Speaker 4 (00:40):
I said that when I first thought, I said, this
is the fund said he.

Speaker 3 (00:45):
Was debuted in a white suit. And then I love
having fun on Instagram anyway. And Instagram has that meme
that has all four of the of the greats. There
was like Luther vandrus H Litel, Richie, Teddy Pedagras, Michael, Yeah,
they all Michael actually hit it last, but of course
he hit it the biggest. So for a black man
in the eighties or born around that period, when you

(01:07):
put that picture on the front, it just means, hey,
the contents are fire, but nobody even notices.

Speaker 1 (01:11):
On the back, I actually see you jumping around.

Speaker 3 (01:13):
Yeah, And on the back I give you the high
water pants and the ercle shoes and nobody even noticed. Nobody.

Speaker 4 (01:20):
You don't got the glasses on it? Yes, probably so
you don't mind being caused to funt.

Speaker 3 (01:25):
It's not even about mind. It is Stefan saved my life.
Like just black women everywhere just choose to call me
to it.

Speaker 6 (01:33):
When he walked in, I I was like, oh my
god lit up when you walked in. Does that happen
to you all the time? And you were like yeah,
because when you walked in, I instantly remember you walking
on the screen and be like, oh shoot, like I
heard the music and everything that that is.

Speaker 1 (01:44):
Watch the music that I love it.

Speaker 3 (01:47):
They with black women in particular, but on the twenty
four episodes out of two hundred and fifteen that I did,
they only keep it on Stepan and they would just
relieved that I wasn't really like that.

Speaker 5 (01:58):
I've always loved your story though, because you know you
already epitted me of you know, taking advantage of a moment.
He's an opportunity, right, because you were so only supposed
to be on one.

Speaker 1 (02:06):
Episode the Family.

Speaker 3 (02:09):
How'd that happen again, Charlamagne? I was I was just
a black kid at one of the saga Jensis. It
really wasn't that deep. My dad told me that I
could get one of anything whenever I got a job,
because I was resisting going on auditions at this point.
I was five foot four of me was ready to
play basketball. We don't get in basketball talks at some point,

(02:30):
and I really wasn't. I wasn't booking jobs at age
twelve too much because a lot of the stereotypical roles
I just wasn't fitting it. My profile. Like I said
at Braceist, I'm five foot four and I saw this
audition come through and I was like, I can get
this job.

Speaker 1 (02:47):
What was it? What was it?

Speaker 4 (02:48):
What did it say?

Speaker 3 (02:49):
The description I included in the book was just, you know,
nerdy character. As matter of fact, I was described as
a Rick Moranis type. So that just shows you what
the writer's room was already doing. The cast of a
black kid and asking for Rick moranis type. So I
actually read that literally, and then I went and got
the Best of Saturday Night Live VHS tape that we

(03:09):
had in our house, and I found Ed Grimley and
I basically was doing a black kid's version of Ed Grimley.
And it wasn't really a good impersonation, quite frankly, but
because nobody thought that was my inspiration, it became it
became mine.

Speaker 4 (03:24):
You can't trademark, uh.

Speaker 5 (03:26):
I don't want to say a character, because I'm sure
you can trade our character, but the mannerisms of a character.

Speaker 3 (03:30):
Oh wow, that's a voice?

Speaker 4 (03:32):
Did I do that? Do you know what I mean?

Speaker 3 (03:34):
We only think about this stuff in America?

Speaker 1 (03:36):
Man, did you get the second Genesis?

Speaker 2 (03:40):
I was always curious did you want to act?

Speaker 3 (03:45):
Acting? It was just something that I just did natural,
I mean joining this. I was three, so you know,
did you want to do anything that your parents got?
You started when you were three? It was just it
just came naturally. I didn't resist it, and I enjoyed it.
Of course. You always joined and enjoyed getting a day
off of school to go someplace and and yeah, exactly,
and have some fun. But as I got to be
around the age of twelve, I didn't really want to

(04:05):
act and well I wanted to play play basketball. But
once I got the show, then I started getting reps
in at a different pace. And now, once you get
reps in, you prove yourself good at something proficient. Like
I remember the exact episode where I'm like, oh, this
is fun and this audience is my toy. And the
episode is called the Big Fix where I took Lower

(04:25):
on a date for the first time because Eddie needed
to pay off a bet and I leveled this French restaurant. Now,
before we get to episode, yeah, that's the first episode
where I'm like, I can hear the audience different. I
can see it in my eyes when I watched the episode.

Speaker 2 (04:39):
Before we get into that part of it, is it
true that you tried out for Rudy Huxtable Pot.

Speaker 3 (04:44):
Yeah, I did the route. That's what n ain't. Rudy
was poor boy. Oh wow, it was poor Boy. So
there was a debate there, and you know, he obviously
went out over the network at the end and and
Kisha got the roll and did you get Oh, it
came down to me and her.

Speaker 4 (04:59):
That's it.

Speaker 3 (05:00):
They auditioned us all day. I actually never forget that
audition because they brought in They always bring in like
two or three options for each role. But they put
us in one room for like several hours and kept
paaring us and going in and out, and I talk
about that book as well, and and then at the
end they said, hey, listen, we are pressed for time,

(05:20):
so we will take you. You, you, and you and
the rest of you. Thank you for coming out. So
you had all these crying kids just pouring out of
that building that had been there all day. And I
remember my mom was like she just had a huge
reaction to that. She was like, do you ever react
like that to losing an audition again?

Speaker 1 (05:37):
Are you cry?

Speaker 6 (05:38):
Oh?

Speaker 3 (05:39):
Every I mean, that's a cold way to lose a
job when you're seven years old?

Speaker 7 (05:43):
Did you really understand it to be picked right in front?

Speaker 3 (05:45):
And I've been right in front because generally it happened.
You know, your agent will call you or your agent
didn't call you. And my mom was never the type
to call the agent also and be like did we
or did we not get the job?

Speaker 6 (05:54):
And a lot of parents do that, But did you
really understand at seven years old? Like, oh my god,
I'm losing this job. This is like what this could be.
You were just like a kid and it was like no,
so you cried, like what did you think?

Speaker 3 (06:05):
No, Well, we were supposed to move to New York,
so they were. They had already talked to my parents
through our agent and everything, and my dad was trying
to figure out because he was just graduating from dental
school at the time. My dad was trying to figure
out how to do this from New York. They had
practically said the job is yours, and then a little
girl came walking. I mean, they do that kind of
stuff all the time. Now that I'm an adult and I

(06:26):
know that, but at the time, it was just it
was just very shocking. And then you've become a big
fan of the show, right, so you're looking at the
show and it's like, oh man, that could have been me. Right,
you're doing that, but that passes too.

Speaker 4 (06:37):
Especially when you end up with your own iconic role
in the future.

Speaker 1 (06:41):
Right.

Speaker 3 (06:41):
I didn't even look at it that way, seriously, I
just during that time, Sean. I'm telling you, Matt, it's
wild to watch Fame now because everybody kind of believes
like they can have a famous moment and it should
come easy to them. But back then, like you know,
if you got a chance to meet Magic Johnson, you
got a chance to meet Chatty Jackson in person. They
were inaccessible, they were all talented, they were you know,

(07:02):
they there was an aura. Literally. I remember the time
I met Michael Jordan for the first time and he
crept up behind me at the Magic john'son Midsummer Nights Classic,
and it's just like he literally had like this little
glow around him, this black Jesus glow around him, and
and it's different now, it really is. So you didn't
think you could be that, you see what I'm saying.

Speaker 4 (07:20):
Now, I don't think that. I don't think there is
real celebrity now.

Speaker 3 (07:23):
Oh now, no celebrity has completely been deluded.

Speaker 4 (07:25):
Yeah, it really is.

Speaker 3 (07:26):
I'll disagree and say, there's still some people who have it.
I can you know, I can see it. There's some
people where they walk in and they have that natural
it factor where it's like, yeah, okay, you just you
affect the room, you know what I'm saying. Like even
when Will Smith used to come in for the NBA
All Star Games, Like when Will was in the room
it was just different.

Speaker 4 (07:44):
That's just aura though.

Speaker 3 (07:45):
Yeah, that's exactly so. But that's but that's traditional celebrity
this stuff. Now, Like I said, it's just it can
feel real temporary and it's like you ain't got the
it factor, but but you got the light on you.

Speaker 2 (07:54):
The cast like you because you went from just supposed
to be one episode to taking over the whole thing.

Speaker 1 (08:03):
So did they like it? There had to be some
resentment a little bit. It's like a nerdy kid coming
in here.

Speaker 3 (08:08):
Like I said, it was weird at first. The kids
and I we worked it out the easiest because they
had to hear a lot of things that some of
their parents are even saying. And you know, when you're
a kid and you're hearing what your parents are saying,
you're just gonna follow suit that. But Darius and Kelly
and I and we became we became like brothers and sisters.
You know, it's that's our puberty. So I just feel

(08:30):
like the division really kind of took place more along
the lines of the adults were the adults and the
kids were the kids.

Speaker 6 (08:37):
Do you think that it was weird during that time
like that you knew like you were very well aware
as a kid that like you were becoming the star
of the show, but you had to do so much
stuff to kind of like not act like you knew that.
Like even in the book you talk about like how
the introductions were on the show, and your agent would
always be like, we need to rearrange these introductions because

(08:57):
you're the star.

Speaker 7 (08:57):
The world knows you're the start. And you'd be like, no, let's.

Speaker 1 (08:59):
Not well, my mom.

Speaker 3 (09:00):
My mom didn't want to do that. My mom wanted
to keep a lot of things status quarro. When it
came to the call sheet and just pecking order, it
just it would have it would have just disrupted the
balance of the set to another degree. Why that we
didn't need. It's it's almost kind of like, all right,
you ever noticed like Shack runs out last, you know

(09:22):
what I'm saying, When Shack and Kobe ridding their prime,
but then towards the end, Kobe starts running out last,
and that's around the time when they broke up too.
It's just like there's ego, there's little ego things that
just can happen on a set that you have to
ask yourself, is that the sword I want to die on?
Is it worth it.

Speaker 5 (09:37):
You would think that at some point in life, people
would understand that y'all are a team and it doesn't
matter who the star of the team is if the
team is winning.

Speaker 3 (09:46):
Yeah, but the magic words you say is you would.

Speaker 5 (09:47):
Think, yeah, yeah, but I would it. I mean, after
all of these years, we haven't learned that. Even when
you use the Shaq and Kobe.

Speaker 3 (09:52):
Example, like that's you know, you can't change the way
people are going to think when when they're coming from
a place of ego. You know, for me, I just
there was I did a lot to extend our run
because the reality was she was about to get canceled.
I know, but that was the fact. I get it.
I get it, but I'm like, I don't. You can
say that I don't need to to to lean in

(10:13):
on that, you know, but you know, whether if it
was keeping my hair to cut the same way, I mean,
it got to the point where I was sick of
my own haircut, or staying out of the gym, not
working out, you know that suck playing basketball. And finally
in my scene, they made you change the pants. Yeah,
they made me changed in the final season, it was like,
no more jeans. He doesn't wear any jeans. So I
was doing things that was I read that about to

(10:40):
get mess.

Speaker 4 (10:41):
It was your bowl.

Speaker 7 (10:49):
I mean, he wants to talk about your bag.

Speaker 6 (10:51):
I want to be I want you said coming. I
was getting there. I was one of little fishing statement.
You jumped to the bulge, you jumped on down.

Speaker 7 (10:59):
It's been it's go.

Speaker 3 (11:00):
Ahead, fling to work it out.

Speaker 4 (11:02):
But it won't come to the package.

Speaker 3 (11:06):
It's crazy, y'all. Don't get to sit here. He he
gives it off. He's waiting for that.

Speaker 1 (11:14):
It's back to the boats.

Speaker 3 (11:15):
That the James bottom line. They just said no jeans
in the final season. That was Oh they didn't tell
you why they said no jeans in the final The
cad tell you that.

Speaker 6 (11:27):
They said it was getting a little awkward to see
the bult. That's what the coult said.

Speaker 3 (11:30):
Jesus, they said no jeans in.

Speaker 7 (11:33):
The fun Do they come to your parents and say
that or did it come directly to you know?

Speaker 3 (11:36):
At that point, I mean, come on, I'm on seting,
I'm taking I'm getting notes from producers.

Speaker 5 (11:39):
And you know that's a funny ass note to tell somebody.

Speaker 7 (11:45):
That's an uncomfortable note.

Speaker 6 (11:48):
I feel like you said that in private, like you
pull my family to the side and we have a
very closed discussion talk.

Speaker 4 (11:53):
About your son's boat.

Speaker 2 (11:57):
While so so things changed on the set because you
didn't have a dressing room.

Speaker 1 (12:00):
Now you I'm sure you got the biggest dressing room
and all that.

Speaker 2 (12:03):
So how was that change?

Speaker 1 (12:08):
Money? Change?

Speaker 3 (12:09):
Well, the thing about money, which was cool, is that
my mom was so petrified the show would get canceled
anyway that she never bought a new car for the
first four seasons of the show. You know, my mom
was that. I think that's why I'm so passionate about
the protective job that my parents did. Uh. They did
so much to try to keep me attached to normal life.

(12:33):
You know, they didn't get new cars themselves. My mom
demanded that I went to public school. I went to
public school during the entire time. Ye we didn't, but
we didn't have cell phones. We didn't have all we
had cell phone but they were big bricks at that time,
but we didn't have smartphones to invade the privacy to
that degree and let everybody know what school he goes to,
at least on a nationwide level. So you know, I

(12:55):
would pop into school like every two weeks to three weeks,
and you know, that was something actually enjoyed doing, kind
of like a magic trick. And you know, because I
could go in and I could take tests, I could
raise my hand, I could answer answer questions from the teacher,
and my peers are looking at me like, how do
you know this stuff? It's like I study on set too.

Speaker 1 (13:12):
How was school? It was it a did you ever
get bullied? Because people loved you?

Speaker 3 (13:16):
You know, that's the whole there's a whole thing. It
was like the first school I was attending at the time,
I was the only black kid at the entire school,
which was awkward too. It was it was it was
half Asian, it was half white. And now it's sense
taking over all Asian when I'll go back and past
that school and uh, you know that's all you know,
the usual stuff. Can I touch your hair? And you know,

(13:36):
not getting invited to boy mitzvahs and all that kind
of stuff. And then that all changed as soon as
I got on the show. Hey, you want to go
to the Laker game with me? And you know, my
mom wants your agent number. She thinking about putting me
in the business. And now I'm suddenly so popular. H
so I left that school and then I went to
what I like to call, like, you know, the Joe
Clark School, the lean on Me Light and uh. And
in that in that case, I was just I stood

(13:57):
out a little too much and it also raised my
hand too much. And I had a teacher that liked me,
and I liked this last of the too, and you
know at schools like that, they don't like those kind
of relationships. So ran into problems there. And then my
mom found the school that was the porch that was
just warm enough for me and in three bare story analogy,
and and that was South Pasadena High School. And they

(14:18):
kind of had to sprinkle everybody. It was Asian, it
was Mexican, it was black, it was was wonderful. And
I had a great principal named Ben Ramirez may he
rest in peace, who just you know, kind of went
out of his way to make sure that I was
always welcome on campus.

Speaker 6 (14:30):
They didn't like the fact that your teacher was trying
to make sure you were okay. What do you mean,
like you said that the school you had a teacher
that no.

Speaker 3 (14:37):
No, no, I'm saying at hood school, you can't, you know,
raising your hand a lot in cans and having a
great relationship with the teacher the kids.

Speaker 6 (14:43):
Yeah, okay, yeah, exactly, a question like the lasts you
see again, you wasn't too minute.

Speaker 3 (14:57):
You know, you're not gonna play me like that. I
wasn't asking the teacher to collect the home work. Okay,
I wasn't that. I wasn't reminded if we had that.
But the bottom line is we had a good relationship
and she was teaching stuff I'd already learned at the
other school, so they were hella behind the other school.
So I was just like, this is easy. I'm saying,

(15:17):
come on, I'm in the eighth grade.

Speaker 1 (15:18):
You know what.

Speaker 3 (15:19):
I'm saying that that's great.

Speaker 2 (15:20):
It's awkward exactly exactly, but did you wish you got
that treatment?

Speaker 1 (15:24):
I remember, you remember the first time I met No,
you don't remember. I don't remember.

Speaker 3 (15:26):
That's when you have to remind me. Nicks Camp. Now,
Nick haven't remember so much about.

Speaker 2 (15:30):
Madison Square guard in Knicks Camp. He was a Nicktam
And I was surprised because I don't remember. We were young, young,
But I was surprised because I'm like, at the time,
he's Steve Verkle, He's on the biggest show.

Speaker 1 (15:39):
I'm like, his parents put him in, so why would
he remember you. I'm gonna tell you, well, I don't know.

Speaker 3 (15:43):
I told you anybody could get it, not I was.

Speaker 1 (15:50):
I had the glasses.

Speaker 2 (15:50):
The braceist want to say, you know him, you were
actually enough.

Speaker 3 (15:58):
I love seeing this dynamic because no one should ever
take this personal.

Speaker 1 (16:02):
Shouldn't say I was, you know, the classes races, I was.

Speaker 3 (16:07):
Let me help you out. Any black man who didn't
even look like me is if he wore glasses, he
was called Steve.

Speaker 4 (16:13):
That's true.

Speaker 2 (16:15):
They called me metal mouth in whole bunch of things.
But I'm not going to that trump. But the reason
I say that is during basketball tap you got.

Speaker 1 (16:20):
Into a fight? Did I? With some Spanish dude?

Speaker 3 (16:23):
Right?

Speaker 1 (16:24):
And I would remember.

Speaker 2 (16:24):
I was like, damn, is this happened all the time
when you come to the hood because people think that
you're better than them.

Speaker 1 (16:29):
So I was wondering if that always happened?

Speaker 3 (16:31):
Well, when you hooping like people try you. You know
what I'm saying. So it's like I took basketball seriously.
So in between those lines, that's why I'm like, I
don't even remember I was there to play ball. Fights,
did you get into if you don't remember on a
basketball court.

Speaker 1 (16:45):
I didn't.

Speaker 3 (16:45):
I didn't have a history of getting into a bunch
of fights. But I'm just saying, like you know, on
the basketball board, people don't try you. I mean, do
you remember every frack as you got to do on
a basketball court?

Speaker 1 (16:52):
I kind of do, yeah, oh wow, kind of.

Speaker 3 (16:58):
Lost a lot of them remember, And that means I
probably did pretty good. And whatever we was doing, what
did you and all others fanis kids do?

Speaker 5 (17:04):
And saw beating up like nobody get at.

Speaker 7 (17:12):
A meeting and he started seeing He said, either I'm
going I'm going with.

Speaker 1 (17:14):
People, which was where was you? I was riding work right?

Speaker 4 (17:18):
All right?

Speaker 3 (17:19):
You know another thing you're talking, But you didn't tell
me how I played though?

Speaker 1 (17:22):
Now you was? You was good.

Speaker 2 (17:24):
You were surprisingly good because everybody, everybody thought the nerve
was gonna come out, but you was good.

Speaker 1 (17:29):
We could tell that you play boy, But I remember
you scrapping.

Speaker 7 (17:32):
What would point guard position?

Speaker 4 (17:34):
You play point?

Speaker 6 (17:35):
Okay, So, because even in your book you talk about
having your dressing room kind of like set up like dresom.

Speaker 3 (17:41):
My dress room was cool addressing you.

Speaker 7 (17:42):
Really wanted to go to the NBA like that was
like it.

Speaker 3 (17:45):
Was about going in. I was a huge I mean listen,
if you grew up in the nineties, the NBA just
this was different.

Speaker 5 (17:49):
Man.

Speaker 3 (17:50):
It landed on your life. It was it was everything
got you. So I you know, once I started gaining
some influence, you know, you could do certain things. And
the set decorated for our show transformed the second room
in my dressing room into an actual NBA locker room.
So I had all the different lockers and you know
that's where I would change and get ready for the show.

Speaker 4 (18:10):
Wow, you know, did you get paid? Did you make
money money back then?

Speaker 3 (18:14):
Yeah, you had. You made very good money back then.
But the numbers back then just they don't compare it
to numbers now inflation. It's one of my favorite things
I actually have. Is is my first time I ever
said on the court. I kept the ticket stub and
I kept them with magic shoes when he gave them
to me after the game, and every now and then
I'll just I'll still look at those type of ticket stuff.

(18:36):
Guess how much. In nineteen ninety one, the face value
of a Laker game on the court was versus San
Antonio Spurs.

Speaker 5 (18:43):
Three fifty price maybe close to a thousand, maybe seven hundred,
eight hundred.

Speaker 3 (18:47):
This man knows basketball for twenty five twenty five that's crazy, right,
and so yeah for a floor. So that so when
you put that in perspective, nineteen ninety one, four hundred
and twenty five dollars face value on the ticket to
sit on the court, and you see what inflation is now.
It really is like I remember that teaching me about

(19:07):
inflation was like WHOA, something's happening here because there's two inflations.
This is the one they talk about to the country,
and the one they talk about is going on with
the people that's making all the money.

Speaker 4 (19:17):
I love how you described throughout the book.

Speaker 5 (19:19):
You describe yourself as a dedicated people pleaser, and you
said it was your mom who made you that way.

Speaker 4 (19:24):
Can you expound on that a little bit?

Speaker 5 (19:26):
It?

Speaker 3 (19:26):
Can? You know? It can be good and bad to
be a people pleaser because you got to learn how
to say You got to know how to set boundaries,
but then you got to also learn how to say
yes enough to catch blessings that are coming out of nowhere.
But for me, it's always been about the audience experience
that jacked me up. You know, we take in front
of a live studio audience every Friday, and man, I

(19:48):
look forward to that audience like you wouldn't believe. And
they just become your toy after a while. So, you know,
my mom will call me after a table reading, you know,
every Tuesday, and it's like, what do you think of
the script this week? And I was Likeang, it's okay,
you know. And then there would be certain weeks like
the Bruce Lee week where I'm like, oh, no, get
your tickets now, because sometimes she would have to play
games to get a certain number of seats, and this

(20:09):
especially with another opposite, another executive producer's wife, who would
have hog a lot of seats and I'm like, no, no, no,
go ahead and get your tickets for this one. I'm
gonna melt this one down. So it was just always
about just, you know, everything celebrity came from a different
place than it was about being excellent. It was about
being on point. You know. We would shoot our show

(20:29):
and we'd be done with a whole episode in like
just over two hours. And I was so proud of
that because everybody else on the lot, especially if they
had kids on their show, it would take. You know,
shows would take three and four hours and people wouldn't
even be able to see the end of the show
at times. But we've been now two hours flat. We
were done. So I'm just took proud of that, that
kind of stuff.

Speaker 5 (20:49):
What about Julia when he's not, you know, performing, are
you still dealing with being people pleasing?

Speaker 3 (20:53):
No, not as much. You know, when you have a
you have a daughter. At least when you have a
kid and you enter the family dynamic, a lot of
your values just changed. They shift overnight, at least they
did for me.

Speaker 7 (21:05):
It was the biggest thing. They shifted for you overnight.

Speaker 3 (21:08):
Oh man, I got a funny story on that one though. Actually,
when you know, when single parents don't date, like single
parents prospect, they don't, they don't date. It's different. And
I remember my boy was he told me to come
out and meet him at the club. You know, he
had a he had a group. At this point, I'm
single dad, and and I hopped in my car and

(21:29):
at the time I drove asked to Martin Repeat, which
is at a four door, and so I pulled up
at the end and he comes walking over with three
girls and it's like, yo, what we're doing. This is
before Uber? All right, it is before Uber?

Speaker 1 (21:41):
What were doing?

Speaker 3 (21:41):
Where were we headed? And then one of the girls just
reached for the back door and the baby seat was
in the back and the way them girls just jumped
back and all of the sudden it just threw off
the whole chemistry for the rest of the night, and
it was just like, uh, okay, what matters. More? As
a dad, I knew, I'm like, I'm not taking a

(22:01):
baby seat out. It's a painting the butt putting them
down baby, And any dad who has a baby knows that.
So it was like, well, that's just the way it's
gonna be. But that was a moment where I had
to accept where I was just kind of like, she
really comes first in every aspect of my life now,
and uh, like it or not, even in times when
I want to be grown and sexy, it's going to
affect it.

Speaker 5 (22:22):
You know what I wanted to did the cast members
on Family Matters what he was? It a level of
hate and jealousy and envynous viianus inbianus envenous are us.

Speaker 3 (22:33):
It was you know what I mean, your chance to
get him are in hindsight, were you really difficult to work. No,
absolutely not, you know because Johnson said that. Okay, but okay,
so let me make it easy for you. Then how
come how come you never heard that from the kids
Kelly speaks, there is everywhere is everywhere?

Speaker 1 (22:56):
How come you never heard that?

Speaker 4 (22:57):
Again?

Speaker 3 (22:59):
You know it's it's you know, when you when you
leave a show. First of all, the difference between movies
start and the TV start is when your movie star,
you still a star, even if you don't have a
movie out. When you a TV star, unless you're on TV,
you're not a starting. And that's just the way the
business treats you. So I think people go through a
lot of personal traumas sometimes after a show is gone

(23:21):
off the air, divorces, investments, maybe they go right, et cetera,
et cetera, And it causes people to look back on
things with, you know, kind of a jaded look. And
it was like, man, we had fun. We did. Even
the pictures I picked out for the book, you know,
I wanted to show pictures of us chilling, you know,
I wanted to show me Reggie and Darius, you know,

(23:41):
chilling in Paris. When we shot two episodes in Paris
We're the only black show to ever shoot in Europe.
That was a big deal. You know, we had this
I'll never forget. We had this giant, twelve thousand dollars
meal at the top of an Eiffel Tower as a cast. Oh,
I'm glad you asked. My mom took that bill and
handed the production because she had the clout to do that.
But Joe Burry's there, Reggie's there. Well, we was balling

(24:03):
at the top. But again you balling, So you know,
it's almost kind of like when you hear Scotty Pittman
talking about the Bulls. Now, it's like, Scotty, you can't
say nothing nice about the bulls. You nigga, here was
rock stars. You and Mike didn't kick it at all.
You should that's how you remember it.

Speaker 6 (24:18):
Have you recently talked to any of the casts, because
I know Joe Maripay and like she had come out
and said that you guys had a little whatever.

Speaker 4 (24:24):
That s whatitu is whyn't want to fight each other?

Speaker 6 (24:26):
Yeah, Like, can you first of all clarify that story
because that's just a wow.

Speaker 3 (24:29):
No, there's just there's nothing to clarify. Like I'm talking
about a coworker of over thirty years ago, and I
was a minor. You don't think if there was any
validity of that, they wouldn't have come out.

Speaker 7 (24:41):
I'm like, now, so nothing happened, I.

Speaker 3 (24:44):
Mean, no, like, but I'm not I'm not getting it
back and forth. I'm sorry. I'm just doing too good
getting it back and forth. Well, you know, with a
woman who's over seventy and I've been trying to like
mentally ingrained to not fight with my elders, Like, all right,
if that's the way you saw it, cool, it.

Speaker 1 (24:58):
Is what it is.

Speaker 6 (24:59):
Well, she recently said on the stage, I think where
I forget where they were at, but the cast was
there and you weren't there, and she said that, like,
you know, she wished that you were there, and if
you were there, she would hug you, and she.

Speaker 7 (25:09):
Kind of you know that whole thing.

Speaker 3 (25:10):
So have y'all talked or why does what she have
to say hold so much more validity than what my
other cast members have to say. I'm just curious.

Speaker 6 (25:18):
I think, Oh, I think that the age thing does
play a factor, but what you say, you know what
I mean? I think that definitely plays a factor as well.
But I think she's one of the first people that
alleged like the bad stuff that I saw come out
and be like, man, we should just hug it out.

Speaker 7 (25:32):
I wanted to know. It made me wonder like, have
y'all talked? Like what changed?

Speaker 3 (25:35):
So the people that I talked to regularly is Kelly
and Darius. And again I don't call them Laura Netty,
So I you know, I called Kelly about this book,
you know, and we spoke extensively, and you know, Kelly
called me two weeks ago. But it's weird for us.
By the way. Also when we go out and eat
or anything like that, you know, we like little back
rooms and stuff like exactly if people saw if people
saw me and Kelly just at Crustaceans in Beverly Hills,

(25:58):
what it tends to turn into a big Hey, can
I get a selfie fest? So you know, damn work on one.
Gotta So you know, we we keep it private. But
I have a very good relationship with all the cast
members who've ever wanted a relationship with me beyond the show.
And I don't have anything negative to say about Reggie.

(26:19):
When people ask me who is your favorite scene partner,
I'm like the chemistry I had with Reginald L. Johnson.
I remember the episode where it clicked for us. It's
called box Car Blues, when we were stuck in the
train together with all these cows and Steve is just
getting on his nerves, and you know, Reggie just couldn't
look at me without breaking up, without you know, without
breaking character. And we just we developed this amazing chemistry.

(26:42):
But adults are adults and they're going through adult things too.
And also I'm a kid. So you know what I'll
tell you one way, maybe I could have been annoying.
I dribbled my basketball everywhere everywhere. If I was in school,
did you let me? We need you? All? Said? Boomom boom?
Basketball basketball basketball. Adults get annoyed when a kid is
just dribbling and bouncing the ball all over the place.
Is that difficult?

Speaker 4 (27:02):
How old you that?

Speaker 3 (27:03):
Talk about? Thirteen? Fourteen years old?

Speaker 5 (27:04):
Yeah, that's what I'm saying. I would feel like adults
would have a little bit more.

Speaker 3 (27:09):
I'm approaching it from a very self where you know, standpoint.
So I'm like, okay, yeah, no, that's and I remember
Joyce Web, one of our script supervisors, be like, oh
here it comes with the basketball. It's like, okay, you know,
I'm like, but if that's that that translates twenty five
years later to being difficult, I'll take it.

Speaker 1 (27:27):
I want to talk about your first kiss.

Speaker 2 (27:31):
Talk about your first kiss, because everybody was getting arrested
and nowadays if that.

Speaker 4 (27:35):
Was so because he's a guy, Oh and only they
don't do that.

Speaker 3 (27:38):
To guy exactly.

Speaker 1 (27:39):
So break down your first kiss sixteen years old. On set.

Speaker 3 (27:42):
He's ahead of me on this one. No, we had
a we had a scene man, where you know, Steve
and Eddy get hot at the dice table and they're
rolling the dice and uh, this woman, you know, he's
supposed to give me a kiss, just planting one on
me before my last dice roll, and uh, during rehearsals
all we she had just pretty much given me a pack.
It was just a pack, yeah, because you just go

(28:03):
through the motions, but with that hot live studio audience there, man,
she just yoah, she gave me the whole she bang.
And so when I pulled back, this was your first
time because yeah, I had never kissed the girl.

Speaker 7 (28:13):
I said, how did you know what to do?

Speaker 3 (28:15):
No?

Speaker 1 (28:15):
I didn't.

Speaker 3 (28:15):
I wasn't First of all, I wasn't even planning for that.
I know, you're supposed to put your lips together, but
I didn't know that anything else was really supposed to
happen to them. Yeah, I wasn't. I wasn't seasoned. It was,
and so she does it, and my whole my thinking
at the time was do not break character. You do
not ruin a good take. You know, That's what you
just kind of taught as as a comedic actor and

(28:37):
as a kid. And so when I went to my
dressing room, I just kind of involuntarily tears start coming
down my face because I was just like, that was weird.
And then my dad corners me and he's like, what's wrong.
Exact the producer comes back, like what's wrong? And it
was just like, you know, like she put her tongue
in my mouth.

Speaker 1 (28:52):
I surprised your mother, and you know, so funny.

Speaker 3 (28:55):
Everybody says that, but it was like my father was
present and was dealing with the issue, so there was
no reason to inject. And once it was revealed what happened,
they all started laughing.

Speaker 4 (29:06):
The moment.

Speaker 1 (29:10):
My dad's my.

Speaker 3 (29:12):
Dad's left, No, do not find this woman, do not
troll this woman at all. No, I'm serious, because it's
like that's one of the things that I'm very protective
of is, you know, we have to embrace what double
standards were lead them in the past. But it's okay,
like I can laugh at it. I'm saying, like from
the time that it happened to my dad and the
executive producer coming in to me walking back out on

(29:34):
stage to do now the next scenes, even the hot
the crew Hot five, she put it on you, young fella.
You hung in there, you did your thing, and it
was like it was very clear to me. All the
signals that I was getting was that might have been
yucky the way it went down, but apparently I'm going
to get a lot more of that. So Cheesemo says, yeah, okay,
all right, go with the flow.

Speaker 5 (29:52):
What about the trauma you went through because it was
immediately after that scene they told you that you can't
wear pants anymore?

Speaker 1 (29:56):
You know what I see, I see how you do
it here.

Speaker 4 (30:01):
You know what else I want to know? It was
black Hollywood more of a community back then.

Speaker 5 (30:11):
Ah, could you tell a story in the book about
you know, connecting with Malcolm Jamal warning Yeah, and putting
you in the afternoth commercial and.

Speaker 4 (30:19):
You know, your mom being your mom being a fan
of Malcolm. So I don't know if he.

Speaker 3 (30:23):
Was the extent the extent to which Black Hollywood was
putting each other on, I won't say was more of
a community. Uh, there are specific people who put a
lot of people on, like Ice Q put a lot
of people on, absolutely like that dude, just like John
Singleton put a lot of people on, like he identified talent.

(30:45):
That's really the dream I kind of have for myself
because I picked that up back then of being able
to recognize other talent and be like, well you got it,
you got it, and that that's a pay it forward joy.
That's separate and apart from from actually being the focus.
But but back then, because there was just a lack
of you know, cell phone communication and social media wasn't

(31:06):
what it was. The connections were made more organically. You know.
You you wrote a number down, you gave it to somebody,
you know, and yeah, so I will say that, I
will say it was just I don't know, it was different.
Helped me out on this because I feel like we
connected on this community. It definitely was. But I'm saying
to the extent that I could count on somebody having

(31:28):
the power to give me a job. No, no, not
not that at all. But to the extent of walking
in the room and seeing to Sheena Arnold and Tisha
Campbell and they're like, oh yeah, it was like okay, yes, yes, absolutely,
you know. And and there was also a sense of
like like being a part of an exclusive club, you

(31:49):
know what I'm saying. It was like you didn't walk
into a room and see another black TV star and
just sit at your table and just be like, oh,
he's over there. You typically were gonna get up and
you were gonna you know, you were gonna greet each other,
address each other, and probably exchange information.

Speaker 6 (32:01):
Was that because there wasn't a lot of people, like
it was just like you guys with a cream and
or crop.

Speaker 7 (32:05):
It wasn't a lot.

Speaker 3 (32:06):
It wasn't even like there was you know what we're
missing now is everything is niche program, so very few
people are always talking about the same thing at the
same time. Like today, all anybody's talking about from a
cultural standpoint is Mike Tyson's ass cheeks because we all
saw that at the same time, so, you know exactly,
So it was like even the step fan moment where

(32:26):
it was just like a lot of black families saw
that at the same time when it airs, so they
calling each other on each other for a girl. You
got to see him in his white suit. So it's
a different connection back there, man. And I'm like, yeah, special.

Speaker 2 (32:39):
Do you get tired of the Steve Verrkle character, because
I'm sure people have to come with you all the
time and be like the Saalne.

Speaker 5 (32:45):
Well in the book you say nothing makes you happier
and than when somebody recognized you as julil Well.

Speaker 3 (32:49):
That makes me happy, you know when that happens. And
I kind of got saved by millennials. You know, the
Google A has helped me, It really has. I can
hear ton and I try to talk about that in
the books. So you know, if a Southern grandmother comes
up to me and and she's you know, referencing a character,
that doesn't bother me as much as compared to some
guys in a bar who you know, they're having a

(33:11):
sausage press in the corner and we're doing well over
here and they want to bring light to that, and okay,
I see what you're doing. Now that's those are two
completely different things in terms of being tired of the
characters that we're doing well over here. Basically we got
all the ladies, every single lady. All right, you know
what I'm saying. So that that that that that that

(33:32):
part is obvious, what the dichotomy is there. But people
come up to me for a variety of different reasons.
Man like your man outside, he was just like, yo,
I know about the ericle stuff, but I'm here for sonic.
He's I did the voice of Soign of the Hedgehog
for one hundred episodes, and that lands hugely with a
lot of people. I did two episodes of Psych that
people just love those two episodes of Psych. So for me,

(33:55):
it's a conveyor belt of people acknowledging me for different things.
And as you get older, like I said, well, my
focus being on my daughter. I'm a game show host.
Now I'm just like, look, as long as you pleasant
and you chill, and you respectful of my family and
my environment. I just love being known for a good reason,
because in this day and age, you could be known
for a real sucker reason any day.

Speaker 1 (34:14):
Like it's wild the sucker reason you.

Speaker 3 (34:16):
Could be known for.

Speaker 5 (34:17):
You know, it's interesting what you said, even about being
a black people all can coming down on one moment
because I think about that even with you as a star, right,
like you have to be a certain caliber star for
us to know your real name, right, you know what
I'm saying, Like like for you for you to play
earcle so well that we know who Jalil White is,
that sys a lot.

Speaker 3 (34:35):
I appreciate. You.

Speaker 6 (34:35):
Know What's crazy though, for a long time meye, because
I was so young, I didn't know that je Little
White was your real name.

Speaker 7 (34:41):
I thought that that was another person I did, but
I was so young, I was confused.

Speaker 6 (34:50):
I thought it was and then I knew the ste fine,
And when I started hearing your Little White, I'm like, oh,
maybe this is another persona that he's taking off.

Speaker 7 (34:56):
And then I got old enough.

Speaker 6 (34:58):
To really understand like characters and like it not being
really you and like all that, and I was like, oh, okay,
that was just like a me moment.

Speaker 3 (35:05):
Yeah, but I'm just glad the light went on. Thank you.
Speaking but speaking of right, you got the ennef.

Speaker 7 (35:10):
My aol dollar back in them days.

Speaker 6 (35:12):
Okay, speaking of though, I know in the book you
talk about the meeting that you had with the exactly
about the remak, er, the spin off, the reboot, your
version that you wanted to happen, in my opinion, was
way better. I don't know if you want to say it.
You want people to read the book, but it was

(35:33):
way better than what they had pitched to you. We
are I mean, I guess we have to talk about
it because I want to know that. Will we ever
get that?

Speaker 3 (35:40):
And can you?

Speaker 7 (35:41):
Could you do that on your own?

Speaker 4 (35:42):
Listen?

Speaker 3 (35:43):
First of all, you can't do it on your own.

Speaker 1 (35:44):
You know.

Speaker 3 (35:45):
That's the thing about television that people have to respect.
It's you know, it's the It's the only art form
I feel that still has gatekeeping still very much in place.
And you can either be bitter about it or you
can fight the good fight and look for the person
that's gonna be your champion. That's just it is what
it is. I was never offered a reboot. I always
want to make that very clear, and even my vision

(36:06):
for the show that I have, it's not about me.
It's about three dimensional characters that would actually resonate and translate.
In twenty twenty four, because I worked for the producers
who coined the phrase jump the shark, Fonzie jumped the shark.
He jumped over a shark, right, those are my producers,
the exact same producers, So you're not going to invite

(36:26):
me to jump the shark again. I was offered a
blind contract and half my pay of what I got
for the last episode, and there was no consideration. I mean,
there was no consideration given to the adults that actually,
you know, have such a large opinion over what terms
they would return to. I'm like the way they were

(36:48):
being discussed was, well, you know, Hard and Carl will
come by and they'll visit the new family every now
and then, Like Hollywood doesn't really They engage talent when
they need talent, they pay talent when they need talent.
And this isn't even a black thing. I don't want
this to turn into a black thing. I'll hear guys
like Chris Pine or whatever, who's you know, He's like,
I don't know what they're going to do next with

(37:09):
Star Trek, Like I love playing the character, but when
they call me, they called me, so I'd love the
opportunity to make the show that I envisioned. That was
never turned down, It was never pitched. I was just
offered a blind contract and around that they were going
to develop the reboots.

Speaker 6 (37:27):
There were two versions, though, correct me if I'm wrong, right,
because you said one of them you wanted to do
like what's the Netflix show with the kid.

Speaker 7 (37:34):
The little kid that we follow is super smart? Yes,
young Sheldon?

Speaker 3 (37:39):
Oh yeah, yeah.

Speaker 6 (37:39):
There was one version that was kind of going to
be like the young Sheldon from like a different perspective.
And then there was another version where it would be
you and now you're an adult and you are in
a relationship, but then Myra is still around at that
point or something wasn't there.

Speaker 3 (37:51):
I'll simplify it, you know. I really feel like it
could be like a Young Rock to be quite honest.
The only difference is, you know, imagine if they Young
Rocket started off famous and then gets into reality. You know,
you still want to keep it light, you know what
I'm saying. But I just I just if you do
a half hour comedy, where are the story's gonna come from?

Speaker 7 (38:12):
You know what?

Speaker 3 (38:12):
You they literally just choose to make it up back
in the day, you know, and they would take stories too,
from old sitcoms and Happy Days whatever. They dust them
off and they just you know, update them a little bit.
You can't do that in twenty twenty four. You're gonna
watch for one episode and you're gonna turn that off.
I asked a reporter recently. I said, well, in the
traditional reboot that everybody thinks that they want, where Steve

(38:34):
and Laura get married and have a kid that's just
like Arkle, would you watch that? And he said yeah.
For about four minutes, I said, Okay, thank you for
being honest with me. If I do anything, I am
an advocate of kids. I see exactly how young performers
get derailed. I want to push the agenda. I want
to push the legend for a kid to come play

(38:58):
a future version of me, whatever that turns out to be.
That kid's got to be able to get invited to
the Golden Globes. That kid's got to be able to
get invited to the Emmys, and he can't look back
as me and looking back at me and I'm a
stain on his career. You know what I'm saying. It's
like I will point this out, but I won't say
names because I don't want to even make them feel bad.
But like the kids on Fuller House, they don't work

(39:20):
Fuller House. The reboots, they don't work. The adults that
put them in that role, they knew they wouldn't work
in prestige television, in prestige film because now casting directors
will say, oh, all those are the kids from Fuller House.
We want somebody a fresh face, etc. Etc. And I
promise you, as parents and as kids, they didn't go

(39:40):
into that project thinking that that was going to be
a blight on their career as soon as the show
was over. They didn't go into that. I want to
make sure anybody that I work with, no, they go
in with open eyes. This is what we stand to achieve.
And it was so awesome watching Will Smith give it
up to Quincy Jones after all these years when Quincy passed,

(40:02):
because Quincy touched his life in a positive way with
The Fresh Prince, he never had to look back on
The Fresh Prince like it was this show he needed
to get away from. So I don't know. That's my
take on what I feel about reboots and opportunity.

Speaker 1 (40:15):
Let me ask you.

Speaker 2 (40:16):
I was gonna ask, was that a stain on your
career where you had to lose racle because people always
looked at you when you did roles.

Speaker 3 (40:22):
Again, I don't look at it as I've never stopped working.
It's a tough business just to work in, you know.
Is it easier for some with better reps and different imaging.

Speaker 1 (40:33):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (40:33):
When I think of Harry Potter or Al Bundy, I
think about those guys in those characters, but they had
better reps in different images, and it hasn't slowed them
down at all as far as the tgif people are concerned,
I like where I've landed. You know, I've I've never
stopped working. Have I have always gotten the dream job

(40:54):
that I wanted? No, But I talk about it in
the book. A couple of jobs want in particular, that
I wanted that went on to become the worst that year.
It's like, WHOA, be careful what you want? So I
just I don't know it. Like I said, when my
daughter got here, man, a lot of stuff just crystallized
for me that it was like, Yo, let's go out here,
let's be a working dad, and it's a beautiful thing
to come home with a check to take care of

(41:15):
your kid, and you're doing it in a way where
you don't have to give up your damn dignity.

Speaker 4 (41:18):
That's right. You mentioned though, Will Smith.

Speaker 5 (41:20):
Will Smith, you said, was the first influential black person
to hire you to do something outside of family.

Speaker 4 (41:25):
Matt, Yeah, break that down. How did you have a relationship.

Speaker 3 (41:29):
Well, I would see I had seen Will. You know,
I would always cross paths with it, with NBA stuff,
and you know, Will Will invite me to the office everything.
When he was his offices on Third Street. I saw
Will coming a mile away, just like I could identify,
you know, just like I talked about ICEQB identifying talent
and stuff like that. And I will actually just share

(41:51):
the story as a matter of fact that I'm like, oh,
I never would have shared that enough to violate your privacy.
But I remember Charlie Mack having me over to his
dressing room when he was shooting four, and I was
just a curious dude. I love reading scripts. I loved
just devouring film. And I was in his dressing room
and he had a script on the table and I
asked to go. I was checking it out, and he said, oh,
that's just another sci fi movie. And I'm I'm not

(42:12):
gonna do another sci fi movie after this one. And
I went to visit him again after that, and like
a couple of weeks later and when I got to
the set, he wasn't there, and Charlie was like, I'm sorry.
Will was supposed to be here, but you know, Steven
Spielberg sent a helicopter four and I'm like, oh, okay,
well that's a good reason for him to not be
here to receive me. And then months and months later

(42:33):
after that, Will was coming out with Men in Black,
and then it clicked that was the script for B
but he said he wasn't doing another sci fi movie,
so I guess the helicopter ride was to change some opinions.
So I just had this really cool relationship with Will.
He was always open doors back then to me, and
when he called me on the set, he called me

(42:54):
to be on a Fresh Prince bel Air, it just
meant a lot to me because he made it his
personal business to put me on the show.

Speaker 4 (43:02):
I got two more questions. One, when did Family Matter
jump the Shark?

Speaker 1 (43:06):
Oh?

Speaker 3 (43:07):
Man, we probably jumped the shark somewhere around the six
or seventh season.

Speaker 4 (43:11):
Remember what.

Speaker 3 (43:12):
No, I don't remember the episode he had. It just
it happens gradually. You know, you start going, you just
start going into port the party and coming out of
too many characters. You know, before you know what I
was Elvis, I was, you know, we we sending Pold
families to Paris and come back by standing on a
teleportation device.

Speaker 4 (43:27):
I think when you moved in with them, I never
moved in with them.

Speaker 3 (43:30):
I never moved in with them.

Speaker 4 (43:31):
Win, I thought you more, I thought your parents.

Speaker 3 (43:33):
You ain't got to lie to kick it.

Speaker 4 (43:34):
I never moved with I thought your parents went away.

Speaker 3 (43:38):
And no, I never moved in with him though, oh
I never did. It was about like I said, it
was probably around about about the sixth season, just to
was you living. I was always next to your neighbor.
I was. They never That was the thing again. Back
they they never showed Steve's parents. They always kept See's
parents this big mission.

Speaker 4 (43:53):
They said, your parents moved to Russia or something.

Speaker 3 (43:56):
Yeah, they never They would always reference my parents. My
parents were treated the same way.

Speaker 5 (44:00):
You remember.

Speaker 3 (44:00):
They were followed cheers. Remember Norm's wife Vera. They they
they never showed Vera, so he they would always talk
about his wife at home. And that was the way
you treated it back then. They never talked. They never
showed the gooch on on different strokes. They always talked
about the gird. So they treated family matters, the character
my parents the exact same way. You couldn't do that

(44:23):
in this day and this day and age wouldn't take
that kind of just constant referencing mistique. They'd be like, no, no, no,
bring in the parents and make sense of this.

Speaker 4 (44:32):
I thought you.

Speaker 1 (44:34):
No, Now you never did.

Speaker 2 (44:35):
I was watching an interview you did, and you said
you never got invited to none of the Hollywood parties.

Speaker 3 (44:40):
Nah. Nah, I mean I didn't. I would do a
lot of nice parties, but now none of the like
the stuff that started gaining a lot of steam on
on on social media, like you know, the Rock Nation
Brunch or or obviously you know you're talking about my man.
You know you're the Diddy parties or whatever. Like, Noah,
nothing organically not did you.

Speaker 4 (44:58):
Used to get invited?

Speaker 3 (44:59):
You got calm down, You gotta you gotta go, You
gotta calm down.

Speaker 1 (45:06):
You just around.

Speaker 3 (45:08):
We just we're gonna slow it down for a second.
You know what I'm saying. Sometimes you can just be
driving too fast and you're not paying attention to the
to to you know, the speed limits, speed exactly. We're
in a thirty five zone right now.

Speaker 4 (45:20):
What happened to Judy?

Speaker 6 (45:21):
Man?

Speaker 4 (45:22):
How Judy just walked up talking about it? I know
you don't give nothing to the listeners.

Speaker 3 (45:27):
I mean, listen, how do you think I covered it
in the book? Was I fair? Even? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (45:38):
Was I fair? Yeah?

Speaker 4 (45:39):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (45:39):
Yeah? Yeah?

Speaker 4 (45:39):
Because because you want you?

Speaker 3 (45:41):
I mean, but what you laughing about?

Speaker 4 (45:47):
I guess because she didn't really have a roll. So
it's like you get you know what I mean, I
get what you're trying to say.

Speaker 6 (45:54):
I didn't get to that part in the book, But
I'm inferring and reading between the lines. Or was it
that they didn't think she was good to stay on
this sh she didn't.

Speaker 1 (46:01):
Have a role.

Speaker 4 (46:01):
Really, that part of the family didn't matter.

Speaker 3 (46:08):
Jesus, So in the book, how do you get up?

Speaker 6 (46:15):
I'm I'm only a couple of chapters in, but not
to give it all the way, but just some of it.
How do you cover when you asked were you fair?
Did someone tell you you weren't fair and wasn't thank you?

Speaker 3 (46:25):
I like I've said, a kind of threw me all.
He wasn't wrong, okay, all right? You know there were
a multitude of factors that went into her departure from
the show that I blame all on her mother, but
there were but as a performer, they weren't giving her storylines,
and she wasn't the best at delivering a joke, and

(46:48):
so you know, sometimes they would give her material and
it would just fall flat. And if you fall flat
and run through, they're gonna rewrite you. And you know,
we're kids back then, so you know, kids, that's the thing.
You can't roat each other nowadays, at least not in public,
but trust me, kids are still roasted each other. That's
never going to go away. So you know, we'd be
sitting in the background and they're like, and she blows
the layup. You know, it was just like you know,

(47:13):
and it's just like, you know, you can only mess
up so much and be arrogant about it in the
FIR Code and the Mercedes too before somebody says, enough
of this, and don't forget my producers. You know, this
is a story that precedes my show. They famously fired
a woman named Valerie Harper. We had a show called Valerie,

(47:33):
and the show became The Hogan Family and Tom Miller
may he Rest in peace, walked onto the set and
said you are done, and in one file swoop, change
the name of the show from Valerie to the Hogan
Family and put the focus on Jason Bateman. And people
forget those kinds of history.

Speaker 7 (47:47):
So why they didn't just un vim Judy then? So
didn't just bring somebody else.

Speaker 3 (47:50):
Because they didn't they didn't feel like they needed the character,
like they we didn't have social media, so they were like,
she's already only in one you know that we've written
her down as much as we possibly can. There reaches
a point where the corporation does the corporation thing. It
was like, well, how much are we banned? Right, Okay,
we'll just save the money and you don't have to

(48:12):
answer to social media either. And the thing that I
do like where I like to address it with sensitivity
is you know, and I talk about that, I say, look,
the first miracle we have in our lives is who
you born to. You know, some people were born on
third base, you know, And in this situation, I really
felt like, you know, Jamie was born to a mother
who put herself before her daughter, and she had ideas
of grandeur that weren't necessarily very realistic. And it sucks

(48:35):
for Jamie that she has to wear that scarlet letter
for the rest of her life. And I hope that
Jamie finds peace outside of show business. To be quite honest,
you know, this show business can start to make you
think that this is the only way to make money,
this is the only way to live, like if it
didn't I talk about that with Jonathan Brandis because he
passed away and he took his life, and I just
I was very close to him at that particular time,

(48:57):
and I saw signs of someone that was really putting
too much emphasis on what this business meant to his
existence on Earth.

Speaker 1 (49:04):
I got one last question. I know you got to go.
Are you heavy? And I have to go?

Speaker 3 (49:07):
I membering class?

Speaker 1 (49:10):
Now? Did you jump into cannabis early? Oh man, I'm listen.

Speaker 3 (49:13):
Cannabis is just something I'm really passionate about because it
landed on me. That's my plymouth rock. It just landed
on me, you know. The I've been trying to get
at the cannabis game for probably about shoot eight or
nine years now, to be quite honest, and it's just
it's been very challenging to meet the right people that
are placed where they need to be placed. They care

(49:34):
about quality, they care about diversity because they're they're gonna
change these laws and play with these laws in such
a way that the big guys are gonna come in
and they're gonna scoop it all up, and just the
way they just played us with bitcoin, it's gonna go
down all the same way. So I'm lucky to do
a mess some really cool cats. We're not nationwide, but

(49:54):
but my guide to Wool group, they gonna, we're gonna
have some fun.

Speaker 4 (49:58):
You got a dispensary, No, it's They named the streets.

Speaker 3 (50:02):
Then back in two thousand and three, named a strain
after my uh, after my old character. I don't even
know if it was after my old character. Maybe somebody
would just inspired they were watching an episode of Family Matter.
So they call the strain purple Arcle. I've been name
checked everywhere. Rap songs, TV shows have been named that
Purplecle has been name checked everywhere, and people think that
I made money off of it. So my brand name

(50:23):
is it's purple. I always like to let people know.
And that actually came from a joke where it was like,
when people see me, they think they're being discreet sometimes
where they go, oh, it's racle, And I always just
wanted to have something to say back, like, no, it's purple,
so that's what. Yeah, so that's what it's So that's
what it's purple. The brand even stands for. But we
are the house of purple arcle. We make the best
damn purple arcle that anybody makes out there.

Speaker 1 (50:44):
Did you bring something? I got what? I tell you what.
I left it at the damn hotel.

Speaker 3 (50:53):
But I'm telling you I will find you dog here
for the week.

Speaker 7 (50:59):
Jump in Mara Michelle Thomas.

Speaker 3 (51:01):
Yes, every time, I'm careful. Now that's MC girl.

Speaker 5 (51:03):
I know.

Speaker 6 (51:03):
I was going to say, every time you talk about her,
it's very emotional for you and like I feel that
that's your girl, right or was I want to know
off off camera when you guys developed your relationship that
we didn't saw on camera because it was so believable,
what was that off camera relationship like and like building
that for the characters on camera?

Speaker 7 (51:20):
Like, how did you guys cause you were so young?

Speaker 1 (51:22):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (51:22):
No, just you know, Michelle started off playing Malcolm Jamal
Warner's girlfriend on the on The Cosby Show, and so
she was always older than me. So even though she
was so small and bubbly and you know, big, but
she was. I looked at her like a little sister.
I'm like a big sister. Yeah, And we just had
this amazing chemistry. My mama loved her too, so that

(51:44):
always that that made things easy. And she just made
it her business to always want to always want to
hook me up with somebody. And she introduced me to
Martha's Vineyard and and and you know, spending summers there,
and we just had an amazing chemistry. She was just
and she was just down. Like everybody knew Michelle. Everybody
knew Michelle in the music business, everybody music, just everywhere

(52:04):
we went, people loved Michelle. And unfortunately she passed away
to summit cancer. And that was just a very emotional
time because we just knew what she was going through
as an actress. And that's why I always like to
remind people too. You know, they always try to apply
this type casting narrative to me. I said, man, listen,
this is a tough business. If you really want me
to make you a list of people who are, you know,

(52:25):
trying to get to their next opportunity, I can, and
you'll see it doesn't have as much to do with
type casting as you think. So during the time when
she went out, I just I wish that there have
been some better opportunities for her, you know what I'm saying,
Like Carl Weather's just passed away, and you know, Mandalorian
was a nice thing for him man to have on
the way out.

Speaker 5 (52:42):
So we want people to buy the book Growing Up Oracle,
But you know, it is it is interesting to see
how much of the love y'all created off camera.

Speaker 4 (52:50):
Yeah you know, yeah, no, it was.

Speaker 3 (52:52):
It was real love, man, Like you know, I get it. Yes,
it was bumpy in the beginning, especially with the adults
and the parents to some of the kids. But that's
my puberty.

Speaker 1 (53:02):
You know.

Speaker 3 (53:03):
Darius is out here while in the times and you know,
we he and I we slide each other's dms. But
that's my brother. I mean, we've all had, you know,
brothers or whatever, frat brothers or college friends that you know,
bugging out or whatnot. But you don't abandon that cat.
You still taking this call and y'all just laugh it off.
And that's what my relationship is with with Kelly and Darius.
It's very brotherly and sisterly. And you know, I'll always

(53:24):
defend our entire cast actually for the work that we did.

Speaker 1 (53:26):
That's what it is.

Speaker 2 (53:27):
Well, Jalil White, ladies and gentlemen growing up. Pleasure right
now makes you pick it up and thank you for
joining us. There's been a long time you supposed to
come here.

Speaker 1 (53:34):
Like years ago.

Speaker 3 (53:35):
But I would run gee all the airports and stuff.

Speaker 5 (53:39):
You know.

Speaker 3 (53:39):
I always give credit to a brother though, who'll see
me at you know who's famous, and he'll see me
at the airport and be like, Okay, how you gonna act?
He was cool. Well, you know I've had other people
would be Howard Stern. You know, I remember Howard Stern
was sitting in coach behind me flying in New York.
I was flying New York and do his show and
and then I got up and I actually took him

(54:00):
some dessert and uh on the flight and he's like, oh,
I can't believe you came back here and uh. And
then when I did the show, he was like, Okay,
I knew you were cool, dude, because you came back
to say what's up to me and coach?

Speaker 1 (54:13):
And I was like, yeah, Coach, what was howling?

Speaker 3 (54:14):
Coach might just need to get exactly and that's so
that'll happen the famous folks tours. Like you know, sometimes
you get stuck.

Speaker 1 (54:21):
I figured how it makes so much money.

Speaker 3 (54:23):
You gotta get on this is before this is like
before this is before private party.

Speaker 1 (54:26):
Sometimes you just gotta get it before private part.

Speaker 3 (54:30):
So he had looke, but he didn't have the bag.

Speaker 5 (54:32):
You know.

Speaker 3 (54:32):
Right now he's like, you better get your hands back
to work.

Speaker 2 (54:35):
He helicoptered. I think building the building up. Well, ladies
and gentlemen, it's to little White Cloud now, good morning.

Speaker 1 (54:42):
Wake that ass up in the morning. The Breakfast Club