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February 5, 2024 77 mins

In this episode, Caroline sits down with country artist Drake White and his wife, Alex. They dive into their individual health struggles and the hardships they’ve overcome in recent years. In 2019, Drake suffered a hemorrhagic stroke on stage at a show due to a rare condition called an Arteriovenous Malformation (AVM). He received life-saving care and began a long journey to recovery. That is when his wife Alex’s health began to decline due to undiagnosed diabetes. Drake and Alex share how their faith was tested again and again through a season of illness and infertility which ultimately led them to their IVF journey and having their son, Hawk.

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Episode Transcript

Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
At carl Line. She's a queen and talking song.

Speaker 2 (00:17):
She's getting not afraid to fings episode, so just let
it flow.

Speaker 1 (00:22):
No one can do we quiet car Line is sounding.

Speaker 2 (00:28):
Caroline, I am so excited to be in person with
Alex and Drake White. We did a podcast together in
twenty twenty in the middle of the pandemic for my
living room from your living room. We did on Zoom
When the whole World shut down. Drake, obviously, you're a
huge touring artist. You're one of the most electrifying artists

on stage in my personal opinion, and I'm sure Alex
agrees with me.

Speaker 3 (00:53):
She does.

Speaker 2 (00:56):
And the world shut down. And not only did the
world shut down in twenty twenty, but you had a
massive stroke on stage that altered the whole course of
your life. And we were talking about that in our podcast,
and we had not even gotten to the part where
Alex then you were diagnosed with autoimmune disorder and diabetes.
And so Drake, you went from not being able to walk,

and then Alex you went to not being able to
walk in the middle, which we both struggled with. The
fertility journey, y'all were in the middle of the fertility
journey of six years. Yeah, I mean, God, did you
did you ever just feel like what is happening?

Speaker 1 (01:34):

Speaker 2 (01:34):
Because you too are also two of the biggest believers
that I know in my life and two of the
most positive, optimistic people. You have a whole album called
Optimistic optim No you spell it in your own way,
which I love. Yeah, But like, was there ever a
moment where You're like, why is this happening to me?
Because I actually am so faithful God, and like what

are you doing? Or did you know it was gonna
pan out? Or like that was a lot?

Speaker 3 (02:02):
No? Go ahead, go ahead?

Speaker 4 (02:04):
No, I just feel like, you know, we went through
his stroke and then you know, the pandemic and music
getting put on a shelf and doing live shows from
our barn and trying to make the best out of
a hard situation for the world, and then you know,
taking care of Drake, helping him get back on his feet,
and then not taking care of myself and then basically

you know, him going from in a wheelchair not being
able to walk to myself being in a wheelchair not
able to walk because the numbness like that I had.

Speaker 2 (02:35):
And so did you get the autoimmune disorder? Because you
weren't taking care of yourself.

Speaker 4 (02:39):
So they think that my dad's a type one diabetic,
and they think that I was just so active for
so many years that I kind of kept my blood
sugar down enough to keep me, you know, stable and
healthy enough to not have full blown type one diabetes.
They caught it the honeymoon phase. So I was living
in this honeymoon phase of diabetes for probably years and

had these flare ups and didn't really know what they were.
So when I stopped working out because I was training
for half marathons and you know, working out all the
time and eating healthy, I kind of just started focusing
on him and his health and what we needed to
do to get him healthy. And once I just pulled
the reins back on myself, oh I start.

Speaker 2 (03:21):
Working out and eating healthy. Was keeping it yeah.

Speaker 4 (03:23):
Subsided, Yeah, because I was like, oh, why do I
feel so bad. I'm gonna try I'm gonna be a
vegetarian and I'm gonna try this vegetarian diet and I'm
gonna work out this and I'm gonna go do this.
I'm gonna train for half marathons. So I kept myself
really active, kept my blood sugar down enough. Obviously didn't
realize I was a diabetic. And then when once he
had a stroke, everything stopped. You know, I like lived

at the hospital with him. This was before the pandemic,
and you know, he was in physical therapy for thirty
days and so was I. You know, so I just
focused on him and and you know that's a big
lesson that we learned through all this, just to you know,
take care of yourself and your health is really important.
But yeah, so once we went through that, I remember thinking, like,
we've been through this before. We can do this again.

But what is God showing us through this? What does
he want us to see, to hear, to know to
do through this? You know? So I was like, we've
been through this before, we can do this again. But
what the heck?

Speaker 2 (04:20):
Yeah, so did you figure out what God is showing you?

Speaker 4 (04:24):
Yeah? You know it's we had to pump the brakes
on our fertility journey.

Speaker 2 (04:29):
When you and I we had gotten together and talked
about this, Yeah, to Pinewood Social, I think I had
been trying for two years. You guys have been trying
for I haven't been there for ever since. It's so
fun and you guys have been trying like three or four,
because you'll have been trying a few years ahead of us,
and it was so defeating, Like, yeah, I don't know,
I don't think you can understand how I mean, I'll

go and just start crying talking about it. How heartbreaking
it is when all you want to do is be
a parent. Yeah, and it just doesn't happen, you know it.

Speaker 4 (05:00):
It's hard to in those moments to not get bitter
when you see other people get dressing. But then it's
also one of those things where you have to flip
the switch and you say, like, if God will do
it for them, he'll do it for us. And so
I constantly had to tell myself that, and I still
you know, we still have to tell each other that
for certain things. But but that was one of the things,
like the prayer journal that I shared with you, and

then you know, we were doing National Fertility i UIs.
Then he had a stroke and we were like, oh,
the AVM. That's the infertility issue, you know now because
the stroke was like blood flow and because you had the.

Speaker 2 (05:32):
AVM is what it's called, and you were on stage
performing and like like you, I said, electrifying set. So
you use a ton of energy on stage and then
you just like collapse.

Speaker 3 (05:42):
Yeah. The AVM stands for arterior venus malformation, which I
think we covered in the first half. But it was
about the size of a line, and it was right
here in the kind of the right side of my behind,
my right ear, which is the mobile cortex to your
left side, so the part of your brain that operates
your left side. So that AVM ruptured on stage in

Roanoke just due to me pushing when I sing, I pushed.
You know, there's a lot of vains, a lot of
blood flow, and a lot of things being pushed around,
and you know, a very very small chance of what
happened happening, and.

Speaker 2 (06:21):
Most people are just stay there forever and be fine,
and you just don't know.

Speaker 3 (06:24):
Usually they find people in the backyard about sixty five
years old. You know, either it ruptures and they and
I'm so active and really singing, singing in Layman's terms,
just wore the brakes out on that AVM sooner. So
at thirty five mine was worn out. You know, the
brake's worn out, okay, And it was a two percent

chance of it rupturing, and it ruptured in Roanoke, August
the sixteenth of twenty nineteen, and and just paralyzed this
left side. So that's kind of what she's talking about.
It was all hands on deck with Alex I mean
for a long time. I mean she had to help
me go to the bathroom, had to help me learn
how to walk again.

Speaker 2 (07:08):
And that sure will show you what love is. Want it,
Yeah quickly.

Speaker 4 (07:13):
I mean we were still in the thick of it.
You know when we did the interview with you the
first time. He was still doing actual in person physical therapy,
like four or five days a week at Vanderbilt, you know,
and I was having a driving I don't even think
he was driving yet.

Speaker 2 (07:26):
Yeah, And like that first podcast was so great because
you were telling all the details, but like for some
reason you had made like a whole notebook of all
these things that like Drake needed to have for safety. Yeah.

Speaker 4 (07:37):
Yeah, I'm super type a organized. You know. I used
to be a school teacher, so that is in me forever.
So I had his folder of medical information.

Speaker 2 (07:46):
Did you have a lot of medical stuff before?

Speaker 3 (07:48):

Speaker 4 (07:48):
No, No, it was just we had you just had surgeries
and they were like, oh, he has an Angie seal
where they went in through the funeral artery. If for
some reason that ruptures, he could hemorrhage. And so you know,
I'm like, okay, here's all the information older together to
the emergency room if this happens. And luckily, his tour
manager was just a godsend awesome human being, and he

was like, I've got the folder. His wife said for
me to give this to you. So they give that
straight to the ambulance, and the ambulance, you know, the
paramedic realized, oh, this is serious. This he's vomiting, This
is a traumatic brain injury, this is a hemorrhage. And
so they instantly take him to a Troumoline facility that
just so happened to be around the corner.

Speaker 3 (08:27):
And yeah, three three minutes, five minutes away.

Speaker 2 (08:30):
Yeah, yeah, because like timing was everything with us too, right,
Like it wasn't the timing crucial, Like if you wouldn't
gotten to that hospital at a certain time, it would
have been over toast.

Speaker 3 (08:39):
Yeah, I mean it. I think they got the blood flow.
The blood flow like uh closed off within like twenty
minutes of its starting.

Speaker 2 (08:47):
And I mean the fact that they could identify what
it was so quickly.

Speaker 4 (08:50):
Well, yeah, the fold, the folder, the fu the folder
had animation. Doctor's information was in there. Yeah, we were
planner and some folder is why they like the folder
has to go with You didn't know you had.

Speaker 2 (09:01):
A brain thing.

Speaker 3 (09:02):
Well, yeah we did. Oh and the tour manager, we knew.
We were taking my blood pressure. We were taking blood
pressure medicine. We were taking because this was the fourth procedure.
And because people have asked me, like, why the whord
was you performing? But there was a two percent chance
of it happening, and you know, with your husband and
a performer, you know, you can't stop us from really performing,

unless doctor Miracle would have been.

Speaker 2 (09:26):
Like his name was doctor Miracle.

Speaker 3 (09:27):
Yeah, that's pretty awesome.

Speaker 2 (09:28):
Y'all are so blessed. Everything about y'all's life is touched,
even though y'all had so many hard things, which also
makes it more touched because your story is so big.

Speaker 3 (09:35):
Go ahead, well well, and so we had everything prepared
like we were. We were walking on eggshells doing it,
and I was performing differently, but I felt good and
everything felt right. It just was you did.

Speaker 2 (09:49):
Were you having brain headaches and stuff? That's what was happening,
and so you you knew to go to the doctor
to get this checked out because you're having issues.

Speaker 3 (09:55):
Yeah, I got an MRI because of a like a
level ten mid grain.

Speaker 2 (10:00):
And then they found this and then they thought, then
you're treating it where they were going in and like
doing the glue and all that. But it was like
in different Trea, because that's how you stop it.

Speaker 3 (10:07):
Yeah, you know what I was doing. I was doing SHD.
You're working out does workout SHD? And then and my
head just started hurting the hit training.

Speaker 2 (10:15):
Oh yeah, you know what I'm talking about. Yeah, yeah,
it's like that uh yeah that.

Speaker 4 (10:19):
Hit the CrossFit tight.

Speaker 2 (10:20):
Yeah, get in your blood Stupberri's boot camp back in
the day.

Speaker 3 (10:23):
Yeah, I remember that.

Speaker 2 (10:24):
It was great when I was in my twenties. But no,
thank you.

Speaker 4 (10:27):
It's so great. And that's what revealed it. I mean,
had he not pushed himself like that, we probably wouldn't
have found it.

Speaker 2 (10:33):
Okay, So the migrante happened. You found that it was
you knew it was going on. Alex had the polt.
I'm sorry, I'm just repiecing together. Alex had the folder.

Speaker 4 (10:39):
It's a lot and.

Speaker 2 (10:41):
Because the folder was there, you dropped on the stage
and you were able to get in the ambulance, the
hospital treatments, and it was three minutes away and your
life was able to be saved. Otherwise it really might
not have been.

Speaker 3 (10:53):
Oh for sure. We were in Bahrain two weeks prior.
Like Bahrain, playing for the troops.

Speaker 2 (11:00):
Happened over there, oh yeah.

Speaker 3 (11:01):
Or Germany or anywhere we had been, you know, or Ohio,
middle of Ohio, I mean Ohio. This was three minutes
from a trauma one unit. We were prepared. The fact
that I was in you know, singing the man in
the spotlight. There was EMTs watching me, you know, so
they they were there immediately, you know, I had staff

pull me off stage. And so it was a miracle
and God was had his hand on that, and that
that is part of this story, you know.

Speaker 2 (11:31):
So yeah, okay, so then you start recovery my favorite
story and then we'll get because this all is in
podcast part one. But there's one of my favorite things though,
was when we were talking about it, you guys were
praying and you literally saw angels in all four corners
of your hospital room.

Speaker 3 (11:50):
Yeah. I've told this story hundreds of times now. From stage,
the music that came, like you said, I came out
with a record called The opt To Mystic H and
spelled to op t I n y s t I
C because it was about remaining opt to, you know,
positive through the mystery of all this stuff, because I

was I was mad at first because we had it
going on and had everything kind of laid out, and
we had worked hard and deserved that, you know, we
deserved that success, and I felt like that the rug
was was put out, pulled out from under us. But
you know, after that record and after we got we're
just kind of the last four years has been us

realizing we didn't understand why it happened, but we're starting to.
We're starting to now it's little things, and I'm.

Speaker 2 (12:41):
Not exciting it is.

Speaker 3 (12:44):
It's still hard.

Speaker 4 (12:45):
You know, our baby that we have a one year
old baby that we have now is I just turned one. Yeah, Saturday, Saturday.

Speaker 2 (12:51):
Because you're starting it's starting to piece together because you've
done the roadmap. You don't see it when you're in
the middle of and you've I have quote of yours, Drake,
which I'm just going to read because I love it,
and it says you can push, pull, grunt, grind your
teeth everything happens exactly how it's supposed to. It's so
frustrating when you're the man and the woman in the storm,
and that is so true. And when you're in the storm,

it's there's no way you can see that it's ever
going to work out unless you just have this blinding faith.
But even then you're hanging on to your faith, but
you're pissed off about it. I mean, I know I
have been.

Speaker 3 (13:22):
Coming out of these Yeah, well you're talking about the angels.
You know, I didn't know what that was at the time,
and that was that was fast forward. You know. We
were back home and actually saw this cloud that looked
like an angel. I told Alex that I'd seen these
four figures in the corners of the room and she
was praying. She wasn't even there yet. She was on
her way from Nashville. It's a seven hour trip from

Nashville to Roanoke. And you know, that's one of those things.
Now I have the authority to go and say, look,
these these prayers, these things, these this faith. You know,
this Jesus, this this is real And I mean I
saw it. And you can't argue really with that, because
I don't have any reason to you know, I was mad.

I was mad, and I would I would, you know,
I had every reason to be to be mad mad,
But I saw that and I saw her answers being,
her prayers being answered, my prayers being answered. You know,
Nash was so cutthroat, and and we love it, We
love this city. But we watched the city come together

and people support us that didn't even know us and
get back on it. And it was so frustrating watching
all of my friends, and I broke many cell phones,
you know, in the hospital, you know, very mad because
I'm so competitive and I wasn't able to to go
for those you know, songs or number ones or CMA's

or all the stuff that I had worked so hard
to do.

Speaker 2 (14:52):
You're so poised for it at.

Speaker 3 (14:53):
That and you're meant, like, that's your dreams. You've seen that.
So I'm a firm believer in manifest and you get
what you dream of and what you put out there.
And so it was happening for us, it was happening
for Alex, the baby journey, all the stuff was happening,
and then it all got pulled out from under us.

And I saw angels through it and saw prayers answered.
And that was four or five years ago, and I'm
starting to now means like the person that I am,
the person that she is, the marriage that we have,
the baby that we have, the lessons that I'm gonna
be able to pass to him, She's gonna be able
to pass to him. They're all. They're all tempered, you know,

they're all they're all seasoned. Now, Like we know we've
been through stuff. We know how to get through stuff,
and I've got confidence that we can do anything, like
literally through it. But it's still hard as hell, and
I still get frustrated every day. I mean, we argued
yesterday about some stupid shit, you know that we that

I'm not I'm not sure what we argued about, but
it's like.

Speaker 2 (16:00):
That's Michael and I are two well, because when you're
like so in it with someone and I feel like,
obviously Michael and I don't have the same story as
you guys, but like we've been together forever, like we
I met him when he was coming up as a dreamer,
me coming up as a dreamer. Like he's had four
major label record deals like huge number one, just to

crash back down, to have to start back over in
the middle of it all, we have like five miscarriages,
you know, and like the baby journey and it's just like,
oh my god, like his dad dies. And that's where
no news came. When y'all wrote that song that A
Thousand Horses just put out that it's my favorite song.

Speaker 3 (16:40):
The phone doesn't ring because that that meant this bad news.
Alex tell her about if you want to that. I
don't feel like you're talking enough.

Speaker 2 (16:48):
Ye look, how cute, La.

Speaker 4 (16:50):
He's the talker for sure, But no, I was thinking about,
you know, the story that we shared about the angels
in the room and him being able to see them. Well,
just one small on the radar. After your podcast, this
girl reaches out to me on Instagram. And I'm not
very active on social media. It's just not my jam,
you know. So this girl reaches out to me and
she said, Hey, I just want you to know I

listened to the podcast with Caroline. I think I sent
you this. It's been a really long time though, And
she said, I felt encouraged to pray for angels to
surround our foster son's room. We're foster parents. We can't
have children. We are getting our first foster son, and
I prayed for protection over him, and I went into

his room and she said, I prayed over the four
corners of his room and that he would feel guarded
and safe and protected. And so she goes into the
living room and he's coloring and she said, what is that?
What are you drawing? And I have an image of it,
and he drew himself on his bed in these four
images in the corners of the room. And she said,
what is that and he said, well, that's me and

these are the four people who protect me. And so
that I mean, I have like holy from head to toe.
Again every time I tell that story, and it's like,
if we went through that, for me to pray that prayer,
for Drake to verbalize it and share on your podcast,
for this woman to pray over her child, for this
child to feel safe and protected, that that's worth it,

you know, Like.

Speaker 2 (18:16):
If you.

Speaker 4 (18:18):
Know, you know, we're as Christians, we're not called to
a life of ease, and so the saf y'all know that. Yeah,
And so the suffering sometimes you're like, dang it, you know,
it's hard, it's hard to go through the suffering. But
if I don't go through this suffering, and then share
my story or talk to someone in conversation, you know,
and share your testimony, your faith and how in the

world are you ever going to help someone else? Like
why did we go through it if I'm not going
to share share it and help someone else?

Speaker 2 (18:46):
That is so true.

Speaker 4 (18:48):
That's like the sweetest, you know, little story from the
last podcast.

Speaker 3 (18:52):
I think that's the point. That's what we're trying to say,
is like.

Speaker 4 (18:56):
The infertility too.

Speaker 2 (18:57):
I mean, infertility will knock you out.

Speaker 4 (18:59):
Let she starts to share a tidbit of your journey,
people come out of the woodwork and start to call
you or text you or connect you. I mean, I
have met numerous mamas IVF women people who are going
through this, you know, IVF journey, are starting out with
EUIs and they're reaching out there. It's like a secret.

Speaker 2 (19:22):
I don't why does it feel Why does it feel
like a secret. Why is there like a shame around it?
Because I didn't feel like I couldn't get pregnant for
like two years of trying, and then I had two
miscarriages and then Sunny and then we tried again and
had just three miss carriages and now I'm done, Like
I've just decided, like my bandwidth with it. Do you

ever reach that where it's like you just have reached
the end of your bandwidth with something and you're grateful
for what you have and like it's just time to
like walk away from that part of the journey.

Speaker 1 (19:52):
You know.

Speaker 4 (19:53):

Speaker 2 (19:54):
But it's like I didn't feel the shame until this
last miscarriage. I felt a shame like, oh my god,
I can't do this, you know, yeah, Like I'm not
like capable to do this. Why not?

Speaker 4 (20:09):
Well, I do feel like a lot of times the
enemy attacks us where he knows we as women, you know,
are on earth. What we're on earth men to do?
We are we are the only image bears of Christ.
We carry the image of Christ. We are the only
people on earth who can do that. And so the
enemy is scared of us, and so he's going to

attack you any way he can, me included, and so
the shame comes from him, It doesn't come from, you know,
from God. So I felt like a lot of a
lot of the women that were coming out to me
and saying, you know, we're struggling to or we're going
through this, can you help? And I'd like to meet
and pick your brain, you know everybody. And I even
did that in the beginning because I was like, what

is this? Is this like can we do this? Or
we playing God? Like is this okay for us?

Speaker 2 (20:57):
That's a whole other ball's actually being so faithful, like
you guys.

Speaker 4 (21:02):
Because I UI, we were like.

Speaker 2 (21:04):
You just throw the sperm in there, Cli.

Speaker 4 (21:07):
Yeah, But then I just kept being like, you know,
only God can net this embryo to my womb. Only
God can create a heartbeat. And then we listened you know,
of course we go through the whole journey and we
have our precious angel baby.

Speaker 2 (21:18):
Hawk the story about that too.

Speaker 4 (21:21):
But we recently listened to Granger Smith's book Like a River,
and one of my favorite things that he said, Yeah,
he said his son asked him, Dad, does God made
his Well? His other son asked him. They were they
were driving Lincoln. Yeah, he was like, Dad, do we do?
Does God make all the trees? And he was like, well, yeah, buddy,
God makes all the trees, but sometimes man has to

plant the seed. And he said it was like a
download to him of like, oh, this is kind of
like what it's like to have an embryo planted in
a woman's womb. You know, like sometimes man has to
plant the seed. God creates all the babies, God creates
all the people. Sometimes a man has to plant the seed.

And so you know, that was just another confirmation in
me of like, you know, we have a precious angel
baby from the Lord, you know, and there's people that
don't have no shame. I will talk about it with anybody.

Speaker 2 (22:17):
You know, you guys feel okay, so I have a
question about this, and you were actually the perfect people
to talk to. She all got like seven embryos.

Speaker 4 (22:24):
We have seven embryos, so you feel pressure, not pressure?

Speaker 2 (22:28):
Do you feel like you need to have all those babies?

Speaker 4 (22:32):
So seven is such a like holy number, the number
of completions.

Speaker 2 (22:38):
So he love they all know all this stuff. I
learned every time I so well, I was just so
I just don't. I was just you know, you need
you need a God to speak to you in this journey.

Speaker 4 (22:48):
Yeah, And I was like, I mean the morning of
just the scripture that I read, and then the number
came in of how many and so we knew how
many healthy you know, embryos that would be a viable,
healthy pregnant. And when they said seven, it was another
like goosebump moment of God just saying I'm here with
you in this moment. So when you go through IVF,

it's actually very like a legal journey. I mean, we
have to sign paperwork separately. You have to sign paperwork together,
you have to watch videos together separately, you have to
sign off on everything, like huge, what happened if he does,
if I die, if we like?

Speaker 2 (23:25):
What happened with is embryos?

Speaker 4 (23:26):
Like what if something happened to both of us? You
got these embryos because our embryos are are crowd preserved
right now. And so we we prayed about it and
we really were like, Okay, so this means we're gonna
have seven children, and you know.

Speaker 2 (23:40):
Which would I'm so lucky to have you guys. We
need more seven. We need seven more Drake and Alex's
in the world, that's for sure.

Speaker 1 (23:46):
You know.

Speaker 4 (23:46):
But it's just that's a lot of I'm almost forty,
he can't keep What am I going to be fifty?
And you know I'm not Jane to Jackson. I don't
know if I can have a baby at fifty, you
know what I mean? Maybe I could do it at
you Alex, So what is that so you can't. You
have the option to donate to science, but worse.

Speaker 2 (24:05):
What does that mean people studying them, like break them
apart and look at them and stuff.

Speaker 4 (24:08):
You have that option, or you have the option to
donate to an adoption bank.

Speaker 2 (24:14):
But then someone else has these babies and you're going
to want to go meet them. Yeah, so or do
you just let it go?

Speaker 4 (24:18):
Said until we're you know, seventy, and then you know,
we can't have any more children, Our children can't have children.

Speaker 2 (24:27):
Hold on those? How crazy that y'all's embryos could live
until you're seventy, Yes, and then they could go be
a baby with someone else when Hawk is like thirty
yeah or older.

Speaker 4 (24:39):
Yeah, that is wild.

Speaker 2 (24:41):
It's mind blowing.

Speaker 4 (24:42):
But what it felt we I mean, of course we're
not through having babies, you know, we want to go
through this journey again, and maybe several other times, who knows,
but God willing. It's such a high risk that we
did genetic testing, and so we the reason we did
that they wanted us to because of his health issues
in mind, and so the risk would definitely be you

would have twins and I'm already high risk anyways because
of type one diabetes. What does this mean, Like you
you can just get pregnant, you know, and it would
be twins and both would take easily. Oh oh okay,
and you don't want to do that, so they won't.
They just won't do it because it's such high risk.

Speaker 2 (25:20):
It's not safe for you.

Speaker 4 (25:21):
Yeah for me, okay, yeah, And in some instances I
think they will. You know, depending on what your doctor
chooses for you.

Speaker 2 (25:28):
You are going to wait till you're seventy yeah, until then,
until you know, we just will prompted.

Speaker 4 (25:33):
Yeah, because I was like, no, who knows what if
someone's like someone else is struggling with infertility and we're
like we have I don't know.

Speaker 2 (25:42):
I just God will guide. Oh my God, that is certain.
I know you're about to talk about this, Jake, and
I want to hear you preach because you are the
Tony Robbins of the world. But it's like, but I
feel that way. It's like, come up with your plan
and then wait for God to prompt you.

Speaker 4 (25:55):
Yeah. If any if anybody needs that lesson, that's me
because I'm such a planer. Oh yeah. And so it's
just like, you know, let the reins go and like
God take control.

Speaker 3 (26:11):
Do you feel that with the prompting though, well, I mean,
for sure, I'm trying to figure out like I'm I'm
a hunter. I love being outside. I've always loved being outside,
and I've always, you know, for lack of better ways
to explain it, had this very whimsically hippie way of
looking at whether it be a redbird flying right, that's
good luck. I didn't know if you knew that. It's

not really a superstition. It's really that's how God talks
to me. And people are like, yeah, people are like,
come on, but like I read signs in the wilderness
or the the that sounded in the woods or whatever
outside you know, how my day's going on? What which

way we need to go? And uh, and I'm sure
we'll get the hawk's name here in a minute, and
why wi his name's talk. But I'm sitting here listening
to us talking. I was so apprehensive on stage to talk.
Not apprehensive or not scared. Just you don't want to
end this culture of offensive like people being offended. Or

maybe you know that their IVF journey didn't work out
like yours, or you didn't. They may not be a
Christian or they may do this, or they may do that,
or may When you go through what we've been through,
you understand that that is not the spirit of the Lord.
That is that is the devil making you, that's making

you second guess what you fill in your gut. Like
writing songs. I just got through writing one and we
talked about it. Everybody is so apprehensive to release the
music because once you release the music, it's not yours anymore.
It's it's the peoples. So the signs like reading these
signs all the way to the name of our son,
you know, it felt right in our guts to do this.

And me and Alex talk a lot. I'm a verbal processor.
I say that a lot. And we talked it out,
we pray about it, we go to sleep, we wake up,
and we make a decision. And that's the way I
live my life. And I don't really have time for
the naysayer, and I don't care like this is the
way I'm living my life. And there's one person that

can judge it, and that's my heavenly Father, and that
is my faith. And I understand. I've been around the
world three or four times. Alice has been around the
world twice, and we love different cultures, we love different beliefs,
we love all the people that I've met. I really do,
But it takes hitting rock bottom to really understand what

your faith is made of. I think sometimes and you.

Speaker 2 (28:48):
Said, now you have an authority, and I love that
you use that word, because it's like I do feel
like for so long before you hit rock bottom or
before life really gives you a knock out, it's like
you kind of don't, at least for me, like I
grew up and I didn't have a whole lot of
like trauma per se that like I could like pinpoint

and you just I didn't really know like what to do.
I didn't have authority with my faith because I didn't
really like.

Speaker 3 (29:17):
Know would they know?

Speaker 2 (29:20):
How would you know? And then it's like that's not
like with like Sonny, and I'm like I want to
just preserve her innocence as long as I can, because
I'm like life is coming for you. It's gonna get
you somewhere. You know, you cannot escape it. It Sometimes
it gets you early, sometimes it gets you later. Sometimes
people have it the whole journey, you know, but it's
like you're not gonna get out of here without getting
some sort of like hard knock. But it's like, I

love that you say that. Now I have the authority
because like, once you do hit the bottom, you you're
there's nowhere but up, and it's like you have to
figure out how to get up. And the only way
to get up, in my opinion, that has worked, because
I have tried a lot of different ways, is God. Like,
It's the only way to have joy in your life.

Speaker 3 (30:00):
It's the only way to have joy.

Speaker 2 (30:01):
In your life. If you when you finally get to
that rock Schott place, if you really want to figure
out how to be happy, like, you cannot get there
without God. You can't. I and I, like I said,
I've tried a lot of different ways and none of
them work.

Speaker 3 (30:14):
Yeah, that's that's that's exactly right. Me and Alex have
talked miles about and I'm a huge Tony Robbins advocate.
I love Tony Robbins.

Speaker 2 (30:22):
You've gone like four times.

Speaker 3 (30:23):
Yeah, we've gone, and we've done it, and you know you.

Speaker 2 (30:26):
Are going to be it, you know.

Speaker 4 (30:31):
They one of our friends called it like spring training
for your mind. Like you you it's almost like you
need a revamp, you know. Yeah, every now and then,
but when I when you got DrAk in your ears
kind of like.

Speaker 3 (30:45):
But with that said, at the same time, when you
when you hit rock the proverbial rock bottom or whatever
you want to call it, it's really it really gets
down to you can self help it all you want,
but you can't. You cannot do it on your own.
You can't do it. You have to cry out to

somebody in something. And that's something is Jesus. It just is.
And that's I'll say it from stage. I'll say it
from you know, people talk about the two thousand year
old relic. I've had great conversations with with all because
you know the people we talk with, and they're beautiful
people inside and out, non Christians, Muslims, Buddhist, all kinds

of people. I've talked with everybody and have I can
have a conversation with anybody. I pride myself on that.
But it for me, I've seen it in the corners
of the room. I've seen Alex's prayers. She has a
one way phone line to because.

Speaker 2 (31:42):
You're actually an angel on this.

Speaker 3 (31:44):
On I agree, she puts up. She's got to put
up with me. So it's like I've seen it and
I think I'm saying this and reiterating and again to
the listeners out there because I've also people say, well,
I've been I've been burnt by the church, or I've
seen the church. You know, why would I go to church?
You know? Uh, why does people that are out of

shape go to the gym to get in shape? And
I know the church is full of hypocrites.

Speaker 2 (32:10):
Not everybody in the church is you know, truly a
representation of what your God is, just like because they're
a person. It is the.

Speaker 3 (32:18):
Human it's the human attempt.

Speaker 2 (32:20):
Human is what messes it up.

Speaker 3 (32:21):
That's all it is.

Speaker 4 (32:22):
I always say, like why not, why not just give
God a shot? What else?

Speaker 2 (32:29):
What do you have to lose?

Speaker 3 (32:30):

Speaker 4 (32:30):
Why not?

Speaker 2 (32:31):
And you can spin your wheels for a while and
like avoid it and like have a decent run and
have some fun and you can get into some stuff
that's exciting and the like they gets you. Your juice
is flowing and you're like, oh, I got this, and
then you get hit and when you get hit that
doesn't work.

Speaker 3 (32:47):
What's that markson quote? Everybody is a fighter til they
get hit in the mouth, until they get hit in
the face or something.

Speaker 2 (32:54):
It's true, Like, finally you're going to get so knocked
down that you either you get the hit and you
stay down there and you die and you're angry and
you you know, you go down in a ball of
flames and you don't rise back up because you try
to do it on your own and you can't, or you surrender.
I feel like you only get two options when you're there.

Speaker 4 (33:14):
Do you all agree?

Speaker 2 (33:16):

Speaker 4 (33:16):
Yeah, for sure, yep. And that's goes back to that.
I just why not, why not just surrender to Jesus,
surrender everything in your life to the Lord and see
what he does with what you're going through.

Speaker 2 (33:26):
Let's a magic come in. Then you get a magic
that's totally different.

Speaker 4 (33:30):
Yeah, man. And like the favor, the favor that God
pours onto your life for you know, your sacrifice, for
the suffering that you didn't even know was your sacrifice,
and then the favor pours in unknowingly. You know, all
this fun starts to happen in your life, and it's
because it's the favor of the Lord.

Speaker 2 (33:49):
And you stayed faithful when you were in the Valley
of the Shadow of Death. Yeah, because honestly, you going
from your your stroke to you going to diabetes, with
your autom immune disorder, with your infertility stroke on, with
your imfertility on top of it, with the fact that you,
Drake are a superstar and everyone knows it, and it's like,
why have you not had your Chris Stableton moment yet?

You know? It's like when is it coming? Which, by
the way, I ran into Christapleton at Walgreens looking for
candy canes and I did not know that it was
Chris Stapleton and I he was standing in front of
the candy canes and I was like going up, looking around,
there's this guy standing in for the candy canes and
it was freaking Chris Stapleton, and I was like, Hi, Christableton,
is that my Chris Tableton moment? I think that was

my Christableton and Michael had a song out with him
at the time that they wrote seven years ago called
Roomful of Strangers, and I played him his song in Walgreens.

Speaker 3 (34:41):
My husband, I said, never already wrote this song.

Speaker 2 (34:43):
With Michael's that right now? Can I play it for you?
And He's like, uh, what, I'm like here, Chris Stapleton
and I just played on the song with Walen so
I had a Chris Stableton moment and this need to
announced my Christableton moment. But it's like, why have you
not had your Chris Stapleton moment yet? You know, because
you know you're supposed to have it. Everyone knows you're
supposed to have it. Anybody who knows you, anyone who's

followed your career, anyone who sees you on stage, who
knows your song run in your heart, all it knows
you're supposed to be this huge thing. But it's like,
why has that moment not happened? And you fought for
it for so long and you got knocked down for
so long, and it's like it's so fresh, it's beyond frustrating.

Speaker 3 (35:18):
Actually right, I mean not battle it every day a
battle the I call it the battle between your ears.
And alex Is she she sees such a deep personality,
like as far as driven, like I'm driven so hard,

and like even though you know we've had Hawk and
he is a massive priority, that the biggest priority music
is for me is something that I don't even I
don't even think about. I don't even try. It just
consumes And I mean you know that you're you're a musician.
You you lived with one, and as far as what

I've came, I'm super competitive, and I just I really
try to live in the fact that everything's happening as
it should. Everything, everybody's for.

Speaker 2 (36:13):
Me, everybody for me, nobody.

Speaker 3 (36:15):
Nobody is. Nobody's trying to manipulate the system. So Drake
White doesn't have as Chris Stapleton moment. But sometimes, oh,
I mean, I definitely feel that way, and I have
felt that way, and Alex talks me off the ledge
and I did it might happen tomorrow. I mean, because
I am human. Uh, I don't have it all figured out.

I never will have it all figured out. My goal
is to play Madison Square Garden three nights in a row,
and I'm going to do it. But there are voices
in my head every day that says, you're forty, your
window of opportunity is gone, Your song is not enough.
If you're not right with Natalie Henby, you're not going
to get the thing. If you're not writing with this guy,
if you're not in this click, if you're not looking

like this, if you don't you know, have more hair.

Speaker 2 (37:00):
Talk perfect talk generation.

Speaker 3 (37:03):
Now I'm like, oh God, there's a lot of pressure.
But that's where the peace comes in. Of I always
pray this prayer or my two I call them the
two thirty am shakes. You know, when you wake up
at two thirty and you got a pee and then
how you're going to pay the bills creeps in or something, yeah,
and you're like hmm.

Speaker 2 (37:23):
And then the mind starts racing. It's like, Okay, I
have all this face in God, but I got to
get back to my human right now because my bills
are due and I got a kid.

Speaker 3 (37:34):
The prayer is like, please protect my mind, protect my
put a hedge of protection around this house, around my baby,
and around my wife, and help me, help me, help,
because I know what I want to do. Well to
put that in you, yeah, with the platform, and you
put these seeds of people in front of me. You

put my dreams in front of me, and I know
it's coming. I know that everything's setting up and I'm
going to be blown away by because why would he
have brought us through what he brought us through if
he didn't have something massive on the other side. I
know whatever that that may look like. And I surrender,
And I'll say this, this is hard because I know
what I want, and I think I know what he wants.

But whatever my prayer is, you know, whatever is your will,
that's what I want to happen. And if it's for
me to go playing nursing homes and all that stuff,
that would right now. I hate saying that because I
love the fact of the I'm so competitive and I
see people and I'm like, man, you know, I'm better

than them, but it's not really that, but it is that,
but it's not that much.

Speaker 2 (38:43):
But you're like, listen, you're a twenty three year old
guy who just started singing yesterday and now you're blowing
on TikTok and oh my god. It's like and you're not.
It's not even to like hate on them, because I'm
so happy for everyone to have their moment. But it's
like when you truly are this artist and this craftsman
and this like it's so deep in you and you've

given your entire existence in life and soul to it
and you've had like so many things, but it's never
ticked over. You're just like there comes in the moments
you're like, what am I even doing?

Speaker 3 (39:16):
This story? You know, yeah, I'll tell you this story.
I've never told this story publicly, but it's the Raleigh story.
Riley had this thing during the pandemic called the Golden Green. Yeah,
and he had this thing that's he lives. He's from
five miles away from where I'm from.

Speaker 2 (39:34):
Were you a friends growing up?

Speaker 3 (39:35):
No, he was like five years younger and honestly, and
I'm really good buddies with him now. Support him. I
love Raley. I think he's an amazing dude. And shout
out to Raleigh. Okay, he wants me to come do
this Golden Sauce series. You're in the pandemic. I didn't
know Rally yet. I can't really walk, I can't play guitar.

I'm getting to the point drive him there, and Alex goes,
you're doing it. I said, I'm not doing it. I'm
not doing it. I was. So it wasn't jealousy. It
was just, you know, I'd been dropped by basically everybody
that was my team was now his team.

Speaker 2 (40:18):
Oh God, talk about rubbing salt in the womb.

Speaker 3 (40:21):
And so everybody, every I mean literally verbatim, like everybody,
and then.

Speaker 2 (40:27):
You just had this stroke on top of it. So
it's not just it's you're just like on the mat.

Speaker 3 (40:31):
So that was one of the cell phones that broke,
was he he said, if anybody, And dude, he's like
I said, he's a good buddy. Now he said, if
there's anybody, if there's anything me or my team can
do to help y'all, let me.

Speaker 2 (40:43):
Know, like, oh, maybe don't drop me break the cell phone.
Maybe you wouldn't have dropped me and you could have
pushed my song up the charts. That would have helped.

Speaker 3 (40:49):
So we we go do the saw the Golden Sauce series.

Speaker 2 (40:55):
Swallowing your pride right there, I mean, talk about taking
a humble pill, like not only you just got dropped,
you just had your stroke and now the hot new
thing's calling you and asking you to come play, and
you're supposed to show up with a good attitude. Man
talking and he's got.

Speaker 3 (41:09):
To play guitar on my songs.

Speaker 2 (41:11):
And he's so cute on top of it, a little
star out there, and you're just like, well, ship, he's.

Speaker 4 (41:18):
Like he's the most kind of course he is human.
And that's why when I when he called and was
checking on Drake and you know, we you know there's
a full circle moment. But I was like, if God
has done.

Speaker 3 (41:31):
Wait a minute, I got that's my punchline. You're going
to take the punchline. Don't you know you're about to
take that. You're about to say it. Yes, you are. No,
we come in, we we go, and we go and
do the thing, and and I'm I'm still like, I
do not want to go do this?

Speaker 4 (41:50):
Why would you?

Speaker 3 (41:51):
And she's she's like, you're I think you should do it.

Speaker 2 (41:54):
That's a good wife right there, pushing.

Speaker 3 (41:56):
You well through it all. Now that we're good buddies,
we hunt together. We you know, we've wrote I don't
know why he has it. Cut some of the songs
we wrote because they're great, but cut the songs. But
we are buddies and I love this, dude, I really do.
We'll be buddies forever. God showed me through that that
if you will help him do what you want to do,

I'll help you do what you want to do.

Speaker 2 (42:20):
But man, that's one of the you'll have gotten some
This is why it's going to be so big.

Speaker 3 (42:25):
I'm sitting here pissed off.

Speaker 2 (42:26):
I mean, it's some of the hardest lessons though. You
had to do the hardest lessons, and you've had to
put your face on through it.

Speaker 4 (42:35):
You know, it's tough, you know when you're going through
the thick of it, of like, you know, why are
we going through this? Why are we going through this? Well,
they're not going through it, they're not having to deal
with this. Well, if God will do it for them,
he'll do it for us. If God will do it
for you know, Riley.

Speaker 2 (42:50):
And who knows what riley struggles are?

Speaker 3 (42:51):
He probably you never know what a man's going.

Speaker 2 (42:54):
Through is, So just like who knows that what he's
had to deal with? Because That's what I've learned too.
Everybody is silence struggling.

Speaker 1 (43:00):
You know.

Speaker 2 (43:01):
Somes are more open, Like you had a struggle on stage,
people know about that. You know, you've had a fertility journey,
Like people find out about that, saying with like me.
You know, it's like but sometimes people are so silently
struggling and they have this whole backstory of trauma.

Speaker 4 (43:12):
But it connected us in so many ways to the music,
to the music industry in general, like the Opry Trust
and music Cares and so many artists. I think we
might have told you this, but so many artists, you know,
very well known artists reaching out on their own and
we didn't know them from Adam really and just saying like, hey,

I'm going to take care of this for you. Hey,
I'm gonna fill your bank account until you can get
back on the road touring again, because I know you're going.

Speaker 2 (43:41):
To tour artists, like filling your like giving oh yeah,
like saying.

Speaker 4 (43:44):
What's what's the debt? What's the cost? Because they were
supposed to go to Australia and the travel it doesn't
the numbers shon't matter and the names don't matter. But
like God was so faithful and connected the dots with
these people that I mean, who knows if God would
have for you know, like if they would have ever
had this friendship if it wasn't for God putting us

through what we went through.

Speaker 2 (44:07):
You know, it's just it though, where there he is,
that shiny, new, flashy thing sitting on the stage with
your whole team that just dropped you and you got
to roll up and have him play guitar for you.

Speaker 3 (44:22):
But the age, see, you're making Alice nervous. She's like
justifying like it it's so She's right though, it is
so redemptive now, like looking back, I'm trying to that moment.

Speaker 2 (44:36):
Though, that in that particular one moment, I know it's redemptive.
I feel you too, but like as a human having
to having to get and you're on the stage and
you're walking up there. Probably you had your cane, you
know too, you're fresh off.

Speaker 4 (44:50):
He wouldn't. He was too profful to use the cane.
But I was like, please, God, don't let him fall,
don'tlet him fall. I was like sitting out in the
little but.

Speaker 3 (44:56):
I remember I had to put a box under my
foot because I couldn't my foot was going to sleep,
so I had to put this box in front of
my foot, on top of my foot. So it was
it was very humbling.

Speaker 2 (45:08):
That what was the message you got from God in
that moment?

Speaker 3 (45:10):
It said, if you will help him do what he
wants to do. And I don't know how much i've
helped him do I just think that I've befriended him,
and you know, And he said, if you will help
him do what he wants to do, I'll help you
do what you want to do. So I think I
had this kind of thought that we're dealt this stack

of cards, and we're dealt this hardship and now I've
kind of taken this stance of when I see challenges
or something like this, like I have to say, I
think I got named Jocko the military guy. It's a
big podcaster. He was like, good. I look at these
challenges and say good because I know, like, if God
trusts me with that challenge, to go out and go

through it gracefully and then come out to the other
side with this knowledge and to be able to talk
about it, because we don't judge the people that are
more closed on their infertility issues, like that is their choice.
It's their choice not to talk about their medical issues.
It's your choice. I think he gave us this stack

of cards because he knew we would share it, and
he knew we would speak the name, and he knew
we would talk about the angels, and he knew we would.
And he is not concerned about the ACMs or CMAS.
He's concerned about his kingdom in the heart. And it's
made our hearts better. And you know, I'm still work

in progress. I struggle every day and Alex Alex does too,
and it's hard because I'm still competitive. But I'm here
to tell you it's as real as you know. It's
microphone I've got in my hand. You just got to
tap into it.

Speaker 2 (47:05):
I feel like for me, it's like on this on
my personal journey, on this last miscarriage, it's like I
had so much hope. I was like, oh, you know,
we got pregnant again. God's not gonna Like, We're not
gonna Why would I go through this five times? You know,
like this one's gonna work. And I felt it. I
just knew it was gonna be great. And then it didn't,
and I was like, oh my god. It was almost though,

in that moment, like a feeling of complete surrender I've
never felt before, because I did have all this hope
and then like it didn't work out, and then I
was back to the bottom. But then I was also like,
oh my god, I'm just gonna be free. I'm actually
just gonna be free here. I'm not gonna cause I
had been so caught up in the sadness of it

and the wanting it and the pursuit of it, and
the you know, the mmm just like all the things
that have to happen for that to work out, and
I was so obsessed with it that finally I was like,
I'm just gonna let all this go. I'm actually just
gonna let all of this go. And that was like
the first time I've surrendered that hard because it's something

you wanted so badly. But it's like, Okay, God, if
you're gonna make this happen, it's gonna be so clear
to me. It's gonna be so obvious because I am
done doing it this way. If it's if we're supposed
to have another kid, or if we're gonna expand our family,
it's gonna hit me over the head like a freight
train because I am not gonna force it and I'm

gonna surrender. And I have And that's why I picked
a word this year, and you have a song called free.
But it's like my word has been like lighthearted and free,
and I'm like, God, you're gonna take care of it all.
Like you're gonna take care of it all. I'm not
gonna worry about money. I'm not gonna worry about how
this podcast I'm not gonna worry about Like it's like,
you know, forcing this podcast to do a certain way

and be a certain way. And actually it's been more
blessed than ever. This year got an amazing new president.
Here we are in a great studio and like awesome
Abby over there doing the pre It's like it's been
more blessed than it has ever been already this year.
And I feel like I'm just like releasing control in
a way I never had before, because it's like, why
am I forcing this so hard? It's gonna be what

it's gonna be, and God's gonna do what it's supposed
to happen if I just stay faithful.

Speaker 4 (49:22):
I do feel like that was one of the big
lessons for me too, because I am such a control
freak type a personality and you know, everything planned.

Speaker 2 (49:30):
You got to take care a bunch of kids with
your teacher curriculum.

Speaker 4 (49:33):
Yeah, so for sure, it's you know, just a quality,
a trait that's great to have.

Speaker 2 (49:36):
But a teacher, a young teach, a teacher who is
of young children is a true angel and also a
type it's probably a very It's like a tie paper
is not even mixed with an angel on earth, because
you have to be that to be a teacher.

Speaker 4 (49:49):
Well and then but sometimes like internally there's just this
crazy storm going on trying to keep it all together out,
you know. But I do feel like with infertility and
just health issues in general. It's just, you know, I
just want to have such a tight grip on everything.
But when I finally do release and actually like I'm
a visual learner and just release it and visually like

loosen the grasp in the grip, that's when God actually
has the ability to weave into what I've.

Speaker 2 (50:15):
Let go of, and then things come in that you
could never have planned for, that are better than you
could have never planned for because God did it.

Speaker 4 (50:23):
It's like let out your nets. Just let out your
nets and keep.

Speaker 2 (50:27):
Shaking, do the work, do the work that you know
you're called to do, show up as hard as you
can be the best version that you can be. And
then just like truly they say this, let go of
the outcome, which is so hard to do until, like
for me, I hit this point where I was like
pushing for this outcome so hard, so hard, so hard,
so hard, so hard, and I didn't get it, and

I'm finally like, I'm just gonna let go and just
see what what's gonna come my way and just be
excited by it. Let the magic happen, you know, let
God bring some magic into my life instead of me
trying to force crank out this destiny that I think
I'm supposed to have, like let some God magic flow
in and let it, let it, let him blow me away,
you know. Yeah, I don't know.

Speaker 4 (51:09):
I mean it kind of goes back to what I
was talking about with the surrender and let the favor
come in. And that's where the fun. That's where the
fun is. You know, like, once you have the surrender,
the favor has room to come in and that's where
all of the fun is because you're not trying to
strive and you know, work for what God has for you.

It's already there. Yeah. So, and I think that's why
we're such a good balance because he's such a you know,
driven striver, goal setter, you know, and I and I
can be at times too, but also kind of like, hey,
you are away.

Speaker 2 (51:45):
Just all of a sudden, you whip you decided. I
remember this when you're like, I just feel like I
got to quit teaching, Like it's just time for me
to move on. I really want to start this catering business,
milk and honey, I don't know how I'm gonna do it,
but like you are very driven and focused when you're prompted. Yeah,
it's and that's the thing. Y'all listen to the prompts.

And when you were you quit teaching, you didn't have
your business up and running all the way. You just
had a dream. Then y'all built white Wood Hollow and
it's become this huge event space that's so magical and
so blessed and so special, and I mean it's just
but you've taken leaps, You've taken huge leaps of faith. Yeah,
because you've focused in and trusted it.

Speaker 4 (52:23):
Yeah, it's always like a holy spirit gut feeling, you know,
like an overwhelming thing for me. So if it's something
that I have been told over and over and over again,
you know, to do or to kind of like lean into,
That's what I know. Especially we like talking about having
a baby and IVF. We just constantly saw hawks throughout

the whole journey, and so that was another thing, you know,
just like all these signs and downloads from the Lord
of just like you're going in the right direction, you're
doing the right thing. So moving forward.

Speaker 3 (52:54):
Yeah, So the story of Hawk and his name, we
looked up kind of the symbolism of seeing a hawk
like Native American symbolism, that kind of stuff. And I
think it was the chero key like there. It was
a symbolic when a hawk siding happened or occurred, that

they were going in the right direction, you know. And
I've always you know, I bush hogged and cleared a
bunch of property, you know, That's what I did before
I did music full time, and I had this tractor company,
and there were just hawks around me all the time,
and like I would ask about song titles and songs
in what direction I should make. But I shared this

with Alex and was like, hey, you know every time
that we were talking about, you know, adoption came up,
and infertility came up, and should we keep trying, should
we quit trying? Should we do this? Should we bank them?
Should we not? There was just there were all these
hawks in the backyard when when we were talkingalking about

you know, divy f stuff, should we keep going? You know,
should we spend the money on this? Should we?

Speaker 2 (54:05):
It ain't cheap?

Speaker 3 (54:06):
Right, So, and we would see a hawk and when
we were talking about you know, adoption or something like that,
the routes that we didn't go it, we didn't We
didn't see him, and so I shared this whether I said,
you know, it'd be a cool name. Is if when
she finally did get pregnant, and I said, Hawk will

be a cool name, and she was like, you know,
I really liked that. I was like, are you kidding me?
You're gonna let me name get this? Let us let
us name our kid hall.

Speaker 4 (54:36):
This was up because we didn't know if we were
having a boy or girl. We just said, hey, the
healthiest embryo. You know, we want to be surprised. Yeah,
And I wore these prayer bracelets with a boy and
a girl's name on them. And I had the name
Willis because if it was a boy, we're gonna name
him William James and Colin Willis and Della Elizabeth. It
was my grandmother's names.

Speaker 2 (54:55):
And I said, Della are still on there.

Speaker 4 (54:57):
Yeah, so I still I still wear these bad boys
that we you know, still like prayer reminders. But the
Willis bracelet broke. Stop it. The Willis bracelet broke.

Speaker 2 (55:06):
God, y'all are so in sync with Like I was like,
God gives y'all sign.

Speaker 4 (55:10):
I just told Draco was like, the my Willis bracelet
bracelet broke and had through pregnancy like I was probably
like two months pregnant and it broke. And it broke
and I was like, oh, I got to get something else,
you know, a w or something.

Speaker 2 (55:22):
And I thought was off the table.

Speaker 4 (55:24):
Well, maybe we're that means we're having a girl. Maybe
God tell me we're having a girl. Just start praying
over Della. Well, then we start seeing more and more hawks,
and then I read some more and it says like
the meaning of seeing a hawk is God, here's your prayers.
So he was like, if it's a boy, what if
we name him William Hawk and call him hawk instead?
And so that's where that kind of came from. And

then he came out and they were like, who's gonna
tell her? Who's gonna tell mom? He was like, oh,
I'm telling her if it's a boy or girl. And
the het hawk came out and they the doctors were like, okay.

Speaker 2 (55:54):
Dad, tell her what it is.

Speaker 4 (55:55):
He goes, it's a it's a baby hawk.

Speaker 2 (55:59):
Is that what he said?

Speaker 4 (56:00):
Yeah, we had a sweet nurse. That video. The whole
thing is awesome.

Speaker 1 (56:03):
He was.

Speaker 4 (56:04):
He was like, it's a it's a baby hulk. He
couldn't say boy. He could, like.

Speaker 3 (56:10):
For once, it was kind of speechless and like, uh.

Speaker 4 (56:13):
He's very nervous in the video you can tell, and
he doesn't ever get nervous. He's never speechless.

Speaker 3 (56:19):
I think I was nervous. I just think it's like
a holy, holy pocket of time that's like very thick.
It's very thick, and like the spirit is there.

Speaker 2 (56:28):
When that baby tell me about that? How did that
feel for y'all after the waiting, because like I know,
for me, after wanting Sonny so badly, like to the
point I could not live without her, Like if I
wouldn't have gotten her, Oh she's awesome. If I would
have gotten her, I would have just been devastated with

life like I was at that point. It was so strong,
it was so heavy, Like the longing for her was
just so intense. Like I was like, I'm not gonna
be able to make it through this life if I
don't get this baby, Like I just felt that way.
And I don't know if y'all ever got to that spot,
But it's like when you've waited for so long and

you don't know if it's going to happen, and you
go through so much and all the ivy uh, I
means so hard on your body, emotionally, spiritually, everything here.
He is like, what is that moment here?

Speaker 3 (57:19):
He is, well, I mean for me, you know that
that two seconds of when he especially if you don't
find out what it is, that two seconds of right
before he cries or and he's out, and I'm I'm
like all in. You know, I've seen growing up in

the country, like I've seen all kinds. Like it doesn't
gross me out, Like I'm I'm there, I want to
see it.

Speaker 2 (57:46):
I want to.

Speaker 3 (57:48):
I wanted to, yes, sort of, No, he was like he.

Speaker 4 (57:52):
Was a little nervous because he was like, you know,
my left hand and he told the nurse that too,
and she was like it's okay, dad, I got you.
And he was holding my leg with his good hands,
you know.

Speaker 3 (58:01):
So it's I called it the Holy Pocket because that
two seconds is like there's nothing, there's no podcast, no single,
there's no there's no nothing on earth that's true. It
doesn't matter, none of it doesn't matter. And you realize
that we're here, if we're lucky seventy five years, you know,

we have seventy five springs, seventy five summers, seventy five
falls and winters like that moment is one of those
moments like you don't want to capture that on Instagram,
And that's the way you want that's it just is
like that's the way you want your life to be.
You want everything to be in high death, that that

high death of like man, I was truly in that
moment and truly it's a holy pocket of time where
so you know, I would say what you said just
a minute ago, I was my My word is frequency
this year you we are so in touch, I guess

now with with like the frequency at which we we work,
consistency of frequency, like keeping it not a fake like
oh I'm in a good mood when you're when you're not,
but like when you work at that high level, I
really convince and not convinced. But I really find it
troubling when a mom that has what I've got, a

really we've got a really good friend. This went through
some stuff and she kept talking about she was very
hesitant about celebrating that she was, you know, pregnant or whatever.
Everybody like, you're speaking of frequency over yourself and that
that stuff works. That stuff is what you're thinking. If
you think it, you are it. You are it. You

are it. If I think I'm going to pack out
Madison Square Garden. That's what I'm gonna do. If you think,
and I understand, we have bad thoughts. I have bad thoughts,
just had one right before I started this conversation. But
you have you have to know what to do with them,
and everybody has them, and it's just like, oh, that's
just not true.

Speaker 2 (01:00:10):
What do you do with your bad thoughts?

Speaker 3 (01:00:12):
Well, you know, a lot of times they get on
top of me and I realize I've been thinking about
them for two or three days, not much now, and
they've grown. But now that compartmentalization of like my thoughts,
this is a very important thing now to me because
everything that you want is in that frequency, everything that
you wants in that discipline of like, no, these thoughts

are not true, this thought that I'm moving that Alex,
we have a healthy baby, that we have Chile with
good you know, good uh salt whatever meat in it,
and we have a good warm house and its two
degrees outside. That's true. This stuff is true. The fact
that we've never missed a bill, we've never missed a payment,

the fact that we have our self, we're free to
worship or free. We've got a new church, We've got
a new That stuff's true and it's not all sunshine
and rainbows. The fact that I can't play guitar yet
is frustrating. I couldn't tune a guitar last night and
it was frustrating and that stuff. But the frequency at

which I go about that now is like, well, what
is what is he trying to show me through that struggle?
What what are we learning through the struggle? And it's taken.
It might take a pot Alexis, I'm sure she's like, well,
sometimes I wish I would be more present and realize
that before I, you know, blow up and do it

because I have break you know, breakdowns all the time.

Speaker 2 (01:01:41):
You get the feeling in your body of frustration, especially
when you're highly competitive like you and you're so talented,
it has to come out. Yeah, you know, it's like
a surge of like emotions and then you have to
like process it.

Speaker 3 (01:01:52):
But consistency of frequency, like you're gonna have the thought that,
oh man, if I've had five miscarriages that and you
get pregnant a sixth time, that this is going to
be here we go again with another heartbreak or something
you can't let that you have and it takes work.
And I'm very proud of Alex and myself of redirecting

those thoughts and becoming becoming a you know, we've done it.
We've done it, and we've built you know, we have
we have records now, we have you know, we have dreams.
We we've you know, we we've watched our bank accounts
be emptied and then filled back up. You know, we've
watched our dogs die and be buried them and got

new dogs. We've watched you know, chickens dyeing and we're
never getting chickens again. And it's it's.

Speaker 4 (01:02:47):
No, this is funny. When he had his stroke, everything
started to just like die. I was like chickens dead,
beest dead, Me almost died, you know, like the life
I just need, Like Lord, we just need to focus,
help us focus on your show.

Speaker 2 (01:03:02):
Maybe everything was and I've heard and I feel I mean,
Michael and I've had a different journey than you guys,
but like we I feel like we were literally stuck
in cement for like three years, no matter how hard
we tried to make a move, no matter how good,
You're giving it everything you have, like every ounce of
your being it's like could not move our feet from

this cement block that we were stuck in. And it's
like everything was not working, was dying off, losing people,
losing deals, losing you know, and it's but it's almost
like it all prunes off and then look at this
birth that's happening. Now, look at the life that's coming.
But it's the death and it's when it the harder,

the suffering, the more you go through, the more favor
that comes. And you but you got to know that
when it's happening, like y'all have, y'all were able to
keep that respect.

Speaker 3 (01:03:57):
Well, I don't know if we knew it when it
was happening.

Speaker 4 (01:03:59):
I feel like we had a like a little bit
of it, you know, and we just kept relying on
our faith because we knew we had seen God do
it for other people, so we just knew deep within
that he was going to do it for us, the healing,
the health, you know, the fertility. And so in the beginning,
it was very hard to dig deep, like.

Speaker 2 (01:04:21):
Truly literally everything's dying.

Speaker 4 (01:04:23):
But you had to, I mean, we had to go
deep in the word and dig our feet in and
our roots get deeper and deeper, and of course we
were pruned back to nothing all the way and then
you see the fruit and the abundance that's come through it.
You know, it's taken. We're in twenty twenty four and
here we are and Drake's still working us butt off
every single day trying to get him his left side back,

you know, and I'm still struggling with health stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:04:48):
You know.

Speaker 4 (01:04:49):
If we, you know, decide we want to have another baby,
then we've got to go through IVF again. And does
God want us to do that? Like what does that
journey look like?

Speaker 2 (01:04:57):
You know?

Speaker 4 (01:04:57):
Of course we're still working through things every day, but
we definitely the tools now of seeing what God's you know,
like the faithfulness.

Speaker 2 (01:05:04):
And the harvest is like come though, like here comes Hawk,
you know. Yeah, And like you have this great new
music that's coming out and I feel like you have
a whole like new zest for it too. It's like
it's it's like you really are like you always have been,
like a creature on stage. You know, You've always had

a you've always been like a message it's coming through you.
But it's even more now.

Speaker 3 (01:05:39):
Well that yeah, we I'm as passionate about it. Now
as I've ever been, just because I'm excited, I mean.

Speaker 2 (01:05:49):
To be excited though. How good does that feel to
be excited again?

Speaker 3 (01:05:52):
Yeah, it feels really good. I was going to mention
earlier when when, back when we've watched each other's careers,
like me and Michael's been friends for over ten years,
I'm not.

Speaker 2 (01:06:02):
Such a different yet similar journey.

Speaker 3 (01:06:04):
And I remember, yeah, when everything was a yes for us.
We know what that feels like for everybody in Music
City to go, yeah, yeah, they're the thing, You're the thing.
Everything's the thing, and the number ones and the things
that happened. So that is another very humbling thing when
the phone doesn't ring, or the phone and I've heard

a lot of interviews like this, you know, and the
important thing to understand about that is you can't place
your importance in that stuff. I mean, it's just you
write your songs. I showed up to work today, went
down to Music Road to Sony and I wrote a
song with a guy and we had a good time.
And I'll come home tonight and you know, we'll eat

some soup and hang out with Hawk and and I'll
think about another song. You know, I'll go call Singleton.
See if you got what he was supposed to get
done to the new songs, and you got to the
process is there and everything is okay, and everything's gonna
be okay in the end. So if it's not okay,
it's not the end. I say that all the time.

Speaker 2 (01:07:05):
If it's not okay, it's not the end. Yeah, and
then you die.

Speaker 3 (01:07:08):
Yeah, you know, and then then nobody seventy five years and.

Speaker 2 (01:07:11):
It's seventy five years up and then like honestly, in
a few years, people don't even remember or care that
you even existed, no matter how important you were.

Speaker 3 (01:07:18):
Yeah, or you can't. You can get you know, talked
by a shark like your dad almost did.

Speaker 2 (01:07:23):
Yeah, he got attacked by a shark. I mean he was.
He manifested that. He used talk about it before. He's like,
I just need a shark bike right here on my arm.
I'd ray Land on the podcast yesterday and she was
talking about my dad's shark bike too. He's like, if
I just got a shark bike right here in my arm,
that would be so awesome. And then he just went
ahead and got on his face and his lag and.

Speaker 3 (01:07:39):
I thought that was cool.

Speaker 2 (01:07:40):
It's pretty cool. I just love y'all so much. I
really do. Like, not only do I just admire you
guys who you are in your life journey and your
perseverance and your commitment to your faith and your commitment
to your marriage. That's another thing. People don't commit to marriage.
And I'll wrap this interview up. I could literally talk
for hours. We've probably been going for a long time
and we've been doing over an hour. Okay, OK, I'm

been a rap it up. But like even your marriage,
people don't value marriage anymore, you know. And it's like
if it gets hard, or if it isn't fun, or
if you get into the park where you have to
like help someone go to the bathroom and it's not
easy er, it's just like people like just I just
don't feel like they make marriage like they used to.
And you guys are the example for that too. Like,

but don't you feel like when you weather these hard storms,
Like even if there's some storms, I mean there's been
some storms where Michael and I have been like, oh,
this is hard, you know, And it's not like you're
like in the notebooks throwing each other but up against
the wall trying to get after it. You're just trying
to survive, you know, and you.

Speaker 4 (01:08:41):
Get through it and it's like man, yeah, and it
takes work. I mean, it's like work on those types.

Speaker 3 (01:08:47):
We worked on it last night. We had to sit
Indian stuff. Was that last night?

Speaker 4 (01:08:50):
Yeah, we were sitting up you know, like.

Speaker 3 (01:08:51):
I mean, it took a thirty minute conversation of why
why do you think like this? Or why do I
think like this?

Speaker 4 (01:08:57):
But it's great to be able to sit and talk
like that, you know.

Speaker 2 (01:09:00):
To live with someone else. It's not easy.

Speaker 4 (01:09:02):
Yeah, but that's that's always been our thing. Like, I'm
not gonna sit and yell. We're not gonna yell and
scream through something a disagreement. We're just going to sit
and talk and we're going to process this and figure
this out, and we're going to talk about it until
you know it's resolved.

Speaker 2 (01:09:15):
And you're not going to get mad and throw your
hands up there and walk away and sit down. You're
going to talk about it.

Speaker 4 (01:09:19):
There are times where I'm like, you're getting on my nerves,
so I'm gonna go in here, we'll talk about this.
We're going to show up him too. He'll be like, well,
we'll talk about this a little bit like I can
tell you're not in a place where this would be
good if we discussed it right now.

Speaker 2 (01:09:31):
You need to calm down.

Speaker 4 (01:09:33):
Yeah, meantime, Yeah, remember why we looked away. I'm going outstays,
you stay down here.

Speaker 3 (01:09:37):
I heard a sermon one time that this this twenty
twenty three is so the culture is like me twenty
twenty four. It's like me, you know me and me?
Am I happy?

Speaker 2 (01:09:50):
Are you?

Speaker 3 (01:09:50):
How do you feel? Well? We made a covenant in
front of everybody and look saying this with confidence, like
he where we're committed to that covenant. Is it gonna
be hard, Yes, it's gonna be hard. It's already been hard.
Like there's been times where I wanted to punch in

the face and and it happens daily, you know.

Speaker 2 (01:10:15):
But it's likely if you are married, if you don't
feel that way about your life.

Speaker 3 (01:10:22):
Yeah, he's more concerned with you keeping the covenant, the
promise that you made to him than he is about
your happiness. And I'm careful to say that because I
know there's a lot of divorces out there, and so
it's like, I'm not judging. I'm not judging. I just
think we are a society of so many feelings. Just stop,

like do what you say you're gonna do. Your nose,
your nose, you're and your yes is your yes, and
show up, show up and be even though you want
to sometimes fill up punching them in the face, like
I'm here, I'm I'm hers, and she's mine and I'm
she's stuck, you know, and I'm stuck. And it's just like,
I mean, that's.

Speaker 2 (01:11:06):
A nice feeling that he's stuck, because I mean, honestly,
I feel that with Michael. Sometimes I'm like, gosh, like
I mean, not like it's hard to be married to him.
I love being married to him, but sometimes it's just hard,
Like it's just hard, and it's like but I'm like, oh,
but here we are because I know he feels the
same way that y'all feel about each other and I
feel about him, and it's like, Okay, we're gonna make

it through this, and I we've already made through, made
it through things and getting on the other side. You
have this history and this depth that you can never
put into words. It's just and it's only yours because
you're the only two people that know what you lived through, really,
and you did it and you got to the other side,
and then you look back and you're like, ma'am, that's marriage. Yeah,
Like that's love, that's what it is.

Speaker 4 (01:11:49):
Yeah. Yeah, It's just a deep connection that you know,
in a firm foundation that's always going to be there.
Whether you're on each other's nerves in the moment you
hate each other, you know, you can always fall back
on the fact that I'm always going to be here,
I'm yours, your mind, we're together, We're in this right now.
You might be driving me crazy, but you know, you
know I still love you.

Speaker 3 (01:12:09):
And that's so much more valuable than the Instagram insta
hot famous love.

Speaker 2 (01:12:14):
Like it's just agreed.

Speaker 3 (01:12:15):
It's just so much more valuable to know that you're
you're going to wipe my ask for me if I
need you to, Hey, I did.

Speaker 4 (01:12:23):
We've been there.

Speaker 2 (01:12:24):
I love you guys so much. Oh my gosh, Drake
and Alex like, Okay, I always wrap up with leave
your light and everything y'all say is light. And it's
just I feel like when I'm with you, I'm with
the spirit. I really do. And then tell after we
do this, tell us about your music and what we
can be looking for to but like leave your light?
What do you want people to know?

Speaker 4 (01:12:45):
Like if I was to die tomorrow, yes, if.

Speaker 2 (01:12:48):
You're but you're not going to die until you're eighty five.
I'm going to push that seventy five years.

Speaker 4 (01:12:52):
Ago, any kinds like the average or something, Okay.

Speaker 2 (01:13:00):
Even about ninety two, So ninety two is going.

Speaker 4 (01:13:01):
To be it. Yeah, my biggest thing. I mean I
say this all the time, like I just want people
to know that I love Jesus, And I always like
you're you're saying that you can see this, And I
hope that people can always just see the light and
love of Jesus shining through me, they feel his presence
in my presence because I don't ever want myself to
That's why I struggle with social media so much, because

I don't ever want to put anything out there that
is me.

Speaker 2 (01:13:26):
I just want to see those gifts.

Speaker 4 (01:13:28):
Yeah. Well, and that's the thing I struggle with it
so much because I'm like, he a platform to share
this story of what we've been through, and I just
want him to shine through. I don't ever want myself
to shine through. I don't ever want something that I
say or do to not be you know, of what
he wants for me on this earth. And that may sound,

you know, all wrapped up in a bow, but it's
true for me.

Speaker 2 (01:13:52):
I know that's true for you.

Speaker 4 (01:13:53):
I mean, I just want to be kind of people,
to love people. That's why I told him last night.
I was like, I just want it, you know, lighthearted
joy and happiness because you know, life is hard it is,
Why make it any harder?

Speaker 2 (01:14:06):
I love that and give it to God. Okay, Alex
you are that though, just so you know, Okay, a leader,
light drake.

Speaker 3 (01:14:14):
I think it's just there's a lot of there's a
lot of buzz and a lot of things out there,
and a lot of times you're going to be confused
and you don't know what's going on. And mental health
is a thing, and everybody's got their struggle. You never
know what somebody is going through. There's always a reason

for it. There's always a reason that you're getting through
the struggle. Rejoice in the struggle, and uh find your way,
you know. John Price said, move to the country, eat
a lot of peaches, try to find Jesus on your own,
like find him, find him on your own. I ain't

talking about the one you know, you dads or your
moms or your we uh find them, find it because
that is that is the true thing to happiness. It's
it's the true light to the music in which I
push out there. And you know, I think about shooting
whiskey and drinking beer and love to do it and

will to the end of my days. But it is
the most peace when you see a world that seems
like it's on fire in the media that pushes all
these trigger words and these trigger things, there's such a
calmness and there's such a serenity, you know, in in

knowing that you can't control any of it and to
let it go and there's a there's a heavenly father
that's waiting on you, and you got seventy five years
to ninety two years to to you know, have a
good time and and try not to take yourself too serious.
And I'm telling myself that, like, oh amen, because I

take myself serious sometimes it's.

Speaker 2 (01:16:04):
So stupid, don't we all?

Speaker 3 (01:16:06):
Yeah, So yeah, find it, Try move to the country,
eat a lot of peaches, try to find Jesus.

Speaker 2 (01:16:13):
I love that. That's so great, okay, And new music's
coming out.

Speaker 3 (01:16:18):
Yeah, yeah, we you know, we We're really good friends
with Casey and Jonathan Singleton. I love those guys so much.
And me and Jonathan have been wanting to to a
record for for years. And we went down to Mississippi
and did this soul country funk stop. It just appalation

James Brown thing, and it is my favorite thing. And uh,
I about told you the name of it. We hadn't
even We're about to release the single a bit in March.
We've got a as a duo.

Speaker 4 (01:16:51):
No no, no, he produced it.

Speaker 3 (01:16:52):
No he produced it. We we did. We're not a
Mississippi did it. We've got a year full of dates
and you know, it's just, uh, it's time to get
it on. It's time to come to rock and roll.
So I feel, you know, revived by all that. And
the shows are a party in a circus and and

there's a lot of uh it's church. It's just straight
up church. So anyway, I love that.

Speaker 2 (01:17:25):
I love you guys so much. Alex and Dragon Way,
thank you so much for coming on. I know we
almost thought about bringing Michael on. Oh my gosh, I'm
doing all the four of us well because studies homes
from school where she brought her well then nothing would
about that the same. If I love y'all, y'all lady,
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