The Science Behind Sound Healing (The Velvet)

Kelly talks to sound healer and founder of Sound RX, Avi Sherbill. Avi explains how sound healing works and how he got into this field of work after having such success maintaining his sobriety with the help of sound healing. He tells listeners how sound healing and sound frequencies work with our bodies to restore our cells to their most authentic state. He also explains the physical symptoms this kind of modality can help with. In a society that loves to through the fastest solution at the symptoms, Avi tells listeners the benefits of using other tools to target the root issue and heal for good. 

 

Socials: @getsoundrx 

Book mentioned: The Humming Effect 

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:01):
Conversations on life, style, beauty and relationships. It's The Velvet's
Edge podcast with Kelly Henderson.

Speaker 2 (00:08):
Avi Sherbel Sound Healer is here. And you just asked
me how did you get interested in this sound healing
at all? And yeah, I'm gonna tell the quick story
because I want to talk about when I found your Instagram.
But I've basically done a lot of different healing work
and that's basically what this podcast is too, as I

(00:29):
talk to different facilitators and I love to show people
all of the different options that we have available to
us to help ourselves heal, you know, without throwing a
pill at it or actually doing the deep dive to
rewire our nervous systems and things like that. And so
sound healing was introduced to me a couple of years
ago just in sound baths during certain therapeutic things I

(00:52):
would be doing, like an intensive or different breathwork. Facilitators
that I saw and introduced me with different different sounds,
and then recently I have just really been way more
into it.

Speaker 3 (01:05):
I don't know.

Speaker 2 (01:06):
I start my morning every day with the five two
eight frequency and it just really has changed a lot
in my life. And just like we always say our
phones are stalking us. My phone and my Instagram served
me your page about a month ago, and I just
think you're doing such a good job of explaining to

(01:27):
the people, the listeners, everyone, the benefits of these different
sound frequencies. And so as I went on a deetav
on your page and you talk about addiction, which is
something I talk about a lot too, and just healing
in general, and so I am so excited. That was
the long winded way to say, I'm so excited to
have you here and really break down the ways that

(01:48):
sounds and frequencies and vibrations can help us all heal.
So I want to let's get started that way. How
did you get into the sound healing world and business
and how has it impacted your life?

Speaker 4 (02:03):
Yeah, great question. And I got started in the sound
healing journey first with being introduced to music and the
love of music. And so for a long time I
was working in music, you know, as first a teenager
obviously just experiencing a love of music. And then I

(02:26):
started to be in bands, and then I started to create,
and I went to school for music and then cut
you know, ten years later, and I was working in
music working in production. And the beautiful thing about music
is obviously we all know it's cathartic, it's emotional. It
makes you cry, it makes you dance, it makes you happy.

(02:49):
That is different from sound, where is more about pure vibrations. Right,
They actually say the differences with music, it's organized by patterns,
and sound is just vibrational patterns. Okay, So with music
you get da da da da, and it's much more organized.

(03:13):
There's layers to it, there's melody, there's rhythm, and so
I always had this love of music. But early life
I grew up very religious and went to religious schools.
My dad was a rabbi, so I grew up in
like this orthodox Jewish world that you know, of course

(03:35):
isn't just one thing, but a part of it was.
There's a lot of hypocrisy, a lot of duality, a
lot of seeing one thing but then hearing another. And
so there's abuse going on at the elementary school that
I went to, the religious school, there's abuse that was

(03:57):
just going on around me, and then also just in
my own home. Growing up, we were made to appear
like the family that has it all together, the pulpit
family and such, but inside it was very different, and
there is a lot of verbal abuse going on, and

(04:21):
before I came around, physical abuse and so a lot
of early developmental trauma that I of course didn't understand.
And so at a certain point when I was working
in music, I just kind of hit a point where
a lot of my own difficulties were catching up to

(04:41):
me and it was coming out in the form of
unhealthy relationships, unhealthy work dynamics. Things were going well externally,
but internally, my quality of life was poor. It was
falling apart, and that with addiction, which also kind of

(05:03):
reached a fever pitch, led to just my life falling apart,
and I kind of stepped away from music. There's probably
some three years where I was on my own healing
journey and then you know, like they say, when the
student is ready, the teacher appears. Somebody brought me to
a healing session with just sound, just pure vibration, and

(05:26):
I was just like mind blown, couldn't believe. How had
I never come across this, But I think it was
just I wouldn't have been receiving it in the way
that I was when I did.

Speaker 2 (05:41):
Yeah, I love that you have a background of music.
I obviously work in the music industry too, and so
my listeners know we talk about that a lot. And
one of the reasons I was so drawn to work
in the music industry was just because music makes.

Speaker 3 (05:53):
You feel something. Right.

Speaker 2 (05:55):
It's such the thing that people say, it's like, oh
that song, I love that song most of the time.
The reason we love the songs we love is because
they're shifting something within us. So what is the difference.
You say that just the music is more like organized
sound in all these different ways, but then this sound

(06:16):
frequency and sound healing is a little bit different. Can
you talk a little bit about why.

Speaker 4 (06:21):
Yeah. Yeah, So with music, you have a melody, you
have a rhythm. You have just layers of guitar, bass, drums, vocals,
and within each of those there's a wide range of
frequencies that you're hearing. You know, just a synthesizer, for instance,
is covering a range of frequencies. And then you get

(06:44):
music producers who are putting eqs and compressors, so they're
limiting the frequencies and so it's not as pure okay,
just the pure energy of it. Yeah, the same experience
is when you're hearing just a tuning fork. You're hearing
just a crystal bowl. It is just that pure tonal sound.

(07:07):
There isn't anything on it, unless of course it's recorded.
And so when you're using that as a means of communication,
it conveys a different message. You know, it would be
like ten people talking to you versus a single voice.
You know, you're hearing a lot of different things at once.

(07:27):
You're trying to make sense of a lot of information
with a melody with a rhythm. And also the intention
behind it is different, you know, the intention with most music. Yes,
there is the release that makes you feel good, but
a lot of it is to entertain, you know, right, yeah,
And if you look at just that, you know that's
only a certain hundreds years old, this idea of an

(07:50):
audience and a stage. Before that, though, we were using
sound as a way to resonate with each other, as
a way to as a collective harmonize and connect. And
we would gather around a fire and we would play
drums and we would use our voices. And you go

(08:11):
into any tradition, any culture and that existed in some way,
you know, Berlin to South America to India, anywhere you go,
there is the voice there is the drum, There is
the flute being used as a way to harmonize and
connect and to vibrate with one another and to usually

(08:32):
express what couldn't be expressed with words. And so that
is kind of more where sound is coming from is
with the intention of harmonizing either the collective or a
single person and healing at a root level these blockages

(08:53):
or these challenges that somebody is experiencing. So it's a
mixture of just the sign of quality and also the
intention behind it.

Speaker 2 (09:03):
Okay, well, so I'm sure some people are listening and
they're like, Okay, you like because you know, I have
all kinds of different facilitators on this podcast, and I
you know, I talk about psilocybin trips and like all
these different things that a lot of my listeners are like, Okay, Kelly,
Like you've really like gone to some deep end here.

(09:23):
You know, this is crazy, and how is sound gonna
make anything in my body different? But what I love about,
like what I discovered on your page. You talk so
clearly about this to people, about how everything happening in
our world is based on a vibration, right, and you
I saw this one post used it and it was
like animals and plants, they instinctively are constant. They're just

(09:46):
operating on vibration in life. And I want you to
speak a little more to that, because I'm sure I'm
butchering it. But like, how is it actually that sound
is impacting our bodies in a way to shift either
our nervous system, our brain waves or the actual like
physiological parts of that. And why do we as humans
do anything different than like animals and plants, And like

(10:08):
where do we miss this?

Speaker 4 (10:10):
Yeah? Yeah, I mean, so what we share with animals
is we share a social engage something called a social
engagement system. We share a similar nervous system, right, Okay,
there are some differences, but you know, if you ever
look to a dog, a dog is able to attune
to you and orient and see kind of you know,

(10:31):
what are you thinking? What are you feeling? Right, because
they're able to engage with you at that level. The
difference is we have a higher brain Okay, helps and
hinders us.

Speaker 3 (10:43):
You know, it's totally Yeah.

Speaker 4 (10:45):
It allows for us to be on computers right now
and create and work and do all of the things
humans do. It also, though, keeps us in a state
of worry and a state of anxiety and a state
of panic. And the thing even with that is that
has been hardwired into us over millennia, over this period

(11:06):
of time as a means of you know, we are
the product of ancestors who survived right, otherwise we would
be here right. Part of how they survived is they
were able to detect whereas a threat, you know, what
should I be looking out for? You know, if you
go back to hunter gatherer periods, that was a huge

(11:28):
part of life. I mean even two hundred years ago,
that was a much bigger part of life. And so, yes,
we are in these comfortable rooms talking on microphones, but
there's a mammalian part of us, this animal part of us,
that is taking in information less logically and more in

(11:49):
terms of sensations and threats and trying to It's a
non rational part of us, right, and so that's kind
of what separates us from animals. And also the interesting
thing with animals is they shake off their trauma. They
go through trauma and then they detect where's their threat. Oh,

(12:10):
there isn't a threat, and they just kind of shake
it off and then they go back to their group, go.

Speaker 3 (12:15):
Back to their herd, what wouldn't that be nice?

Speaker 4 (12:19):
Yeah, I don't know if any of the therapy industries
would exist without that, but sure. Yeah. But what we
do is we experience those things and then it gets
stored in our body, and then we go into our
mind and we're worrying and we're anxious, and we're replaying
things and we're talking about it and processing it, and
so in that way, all of these experiences get stored

(12:42):
in our body. And if you want to go like
a little farther than that, it gets stored in our
energy field. Okay, So there's something that's extending about sick,
like two arms length outside of us that is like
standing sound waves. It is carrying all of the information
of our life. And that is why we always talk

(13:05):
about somebody having good or bad vibrations. Right, Oh, yeah,
such good vibes. You don't actually see anything, but you're
experiencing something vibrationally that makes you feel like you are
a match to that person. That person I feel like
myself around, I feel like I kind of let my
guard down. You're not seeing anything, but you're vibrationally receiving information,

(13:30):
understanding that this person I feel safe around and in
the opposite way. That person has bad vibes. You kind
of pull back. You don't want to reveal things, but
you're not physically seeing anything, you know, right, you are
getting this intuitive, this spontaneous information that's coming into you.
It's not rational, it's a feeling. It's speaking to you

(13:53):
in feeling tones. And so that is how we are
receiving vibrational and all the time, and plants and animals
are doing the same. And part of why that is
so important is we at our root are electrical. We
are electric. We are vibrational beings. We have underneath our

(14:15):
skin trillions of cells that are moving through us, and
those trillions of cells are trillions of frequencies because it's
we're moving, we're alive, we're pulsating, we're energy, we're vibrating.
So everything that we go through, like everything you've gone
through even today, Yeah, it's occurring in your mind and

(14:36):
your memory and your planning and you're remembering all those things.
But it's also occurring at a level of energy in
your body that's living inside of you, and so you
get kind of agitated, and that affects your cells, it
affects your hormones, It affects your immune and your nervous system,

(14:56):
and it affects your brain, which is also electric with neurons,
and so all of these things are vibrating. And so
when we take in vibration, naturally, it is going to
affect our own inner vibration, from our cells, from our
nerve endings, from our body, from the way that even

(15:18):
our brain is operating. You know, sound has an ability
to literally shift the state of our brain, to slow
our brain waves down because it is electric, because it
is vibrating, and so everything when we take in sound
is being affected by vibration. And so when you want

(15:39):
to really get to the root of something, we work
with vibration because at its root level, it is happening
at a vibratory level.

Speaker 2 (15:49):
So would this be why sound healing has maybe become
so popular, because like, can we control we're what vibrations
we're taking in on the regular? You know, like if
we're going about our day as normal, how are we
going to control what is vibrating to us?

Speaker 4 (16:06):
Yeah, I mean, you know, there's there's of course, different
ways of going about it. And you know, if you
think about it, like I said, there's trillions of frequencies
moving through us and so you know, you're not just
vibrating at this level or that level. But I think
what ends up happening is when we go through different experiences.

(16:31):
You go through traumatic events, you go through whatever you
experience as a child, whatever I experienced as a child.
You take that in and then you want to protect
yourself from experiencing it again, right, Yeah, And what that
can do is you didn't really process the experience. It
just got kind of stored in you. You know, let's

(16:52):
say something really simple like being yelled at a lot
as a kid. You know, you kind of take that
in and then you're like, whoa, that was a lot,
But because you're not able to process it, it just
gets kind of stored. And then later on in life,
somebody's yelling at you and you don't know why, but
you get so activated. Yeah, some other people around you

(17:15):
aren't as activated, right, because there's this stress that got
stored in you from those early years that went through
that experience. And so, yes, life is always happening, and
you're not going to just be in a zen moment
your entire day. But what can happen is when we

(17:36):
take in sound and learn to slow down and learn
to slow down again, and we learn to rest and relax.
The more we do that, the more that becomes our
baseline as opposed to I'm in this frenetic like always
going and moving and doing and you know, and then

(17:57):
suddenly we're in this like fight or flight and all
of the time. And then your cortisol levels are through
the roof, you know, and then you're having hormonal issues.
Then you have autoimmune issues because your body is speaking
to you saying it's out of whack, you know, right,
it's spiking up all the time. And so yeah, you're
not going to be able to like live in a

(18:18):
slow down state all the time. But what does happen
is when you hang out in that space more than
when you are dealing with stressors, you have a greater
capacity to deal with them and you handle them in
a different way.

Speaker 3 (18:33):
That's such a good way to say it. I love that.

Speaker 2 (18:41):
I want to get to how sound healing specifically works,
but I want to know too. When we're speaking of
vibrations and we mentioned the animals and the plants and
then how humans, it does seem like we're almost teaching
ourselves to go to your mind before you listen to
your intuition and your body and the way that things
are feeling.

Speaker 3 (18:59):
But what about.

Speaker 2 (19:03):
Like if you're at if you're at the baseline and
you're drawing in things that maybe you don't want, or
like when I hear a lot of people saying things like, well,
I want to raise my vibration, so I attracked a
better relationship for instance, like that example. So is it
something that if we're changing our internal vibration, we're going

(19:25):
to start vibing at a different level with different people
or different relationships or even different job circumstances or things
like that, Like is that how this works?

Speaker 4 (19:35):
Yeah? So I think a lot of us, great question,
I think a lot of us. You know, there are
these ideas of our nervous system being in either a
pair sympathetic or a sympathetic response. So paira sympathetic is
where we are. There's a greater sense of safety. Like
I was saying, it's a slow down feeling. You know,

(19:58):
if you think of when you're resting watching some Netflix,
you know, ideally your bodi's just slow down and a
general your heartbeat, you're breathing, all of those things. What happens, though,
is due to trauma which comes in all different forms,
and trauma is really just stressed that got stored in
your body, right, and then you weren't able to integrate

(20:21):
it or process it. Okay, and you know that's also
what sound helps us do, helps us release stress, release
trauma from the body so that we're able to kind
of go into that parasympathetic state more. But if you
grew up, let's say, experiencing different forms of trauma, different experiences,

(20:43):
and then you weren't able to process it, you weren't
able to integrate it, then what happens is, unknowingly, you're
in a survival state a lot of the time, but
because our bodies are incredible at adapting to environments, were
not even aware that weren't a survival state. You know,
this is just me, This is just abby. You know,

(21:05):
I'm just kind of wired, a little funny, you know,
I'm just I'm just a little crazy.

Speaker 3 (21:08):
I'm a little fucked up.

Speaker 5 (21:10):
Yeah, I just want to I just you know, I
just like drinking in the morning, Like, yeah, you do,
you but like me, I like you know, so a
lot of these things become the ways that we learn
to self soothe, you know, So it's like I go

(21:30):
through these experiences.

Speaker 4 (21:31):
Most of us don't have the tools or the language
for what we were experiencing, and so we just kind
of take it on and we're amazing at pushing past
our limits and just kind of going and doing. And
so it's like we don't even know anything's wrong, you know.
But it's like I'm attracting these unhealthy relationships. O. My

(21:56):
work life balance is a mess, and I'm happy all
of these physical symptoms going on, right, yes, and so
all of these are a result of you living in
that survival state, but they're just these manifestations of that,
you know. Yeah, And so part of the thing that happens,

(22:16):
and I was using the term before, is when we
feel safe, when we feel relaxed, when our body is
slowed down, it turns on something called our social engagement system,
which means I want to engage with you. I'm like curious,
like what is going on in your life? Like what
is happening? Yeah, And not only that, I'm compassion to

(22:37):
what you're experiencing. It's like, damn, like I'm really sorry
you went through that. Like like a good friend would
act right, yeah, but instead of acting like a good
friend to somebody else, you're acting like a good friend
to yourself. Right, So that's that social engagement system where
I'm able to engage in a curious and compassionate way.

(22:58):
But that's existing when I'm in that slow down, parasympathetic state.
When I'm in a survival state, that gets turned off
and it's more of a reptilian response. I'm more like fearful.
I'm always evaluating did they like me? Like was that cool?
What I just did? Like should I go here? Should
I go there? Because you can't settle because your nerve,

(23:19):
your nerves are just kind of wired. You know, you're
running hot, your everything's spiked up a little bit because
your system is sending you the signal like overdrive, like
alarm on, you know, go into alert mode, focus. And
then who do you think we choose in those states?
You know, what type of situations do we bring into
our life? You know, what do we think we deserve

(23:42):
in those states? They're all as a result of you know,
how we're experiencing ourselves.

Speaker 2 (23:49):
I love that explanation because it's also like, if you're
operating in the fight or flight or any of those
places that you mentioned, if we're just like going through
the motions and not paying it to into our bodies.
I would imagine that you are attracted or drawn or
bringing in the same that same energy. So if it's
even if it looks pretty on the outside, if internally

(24:12):
like what you're saying, you're second guessing yourself, you're in
your head, you're not operating from a place of capacity. Yeah,
you're gonna bring in things to match just that, and
so of course it would be off.

Speaker 4 (24:25):
Yeah, yeah, And a lot of this is coming from
early life, like on what we thought we deserve and
what we think that we're worthy of. You know, there's
this doctor I love, Bruce Lipton, and you know he
did a lot of research around the our genes and
cells and quantum physics versus Newtonian physics, and you know

(24:49):
he talks about how our subconscious got programmed when we
were zero to seven years old, right, you know, because
that's actually when our brain was in a slow down state.
We were actually in the subconscious. You know, if you
think about when you were younger, Like if you see
young kids, they're always so much more playful and more

(25:10):
imaginative because they are in their brain waves are in
a literal dreamlike state where they're downloading, taking everything in,
and then the rest of their life becomes a pattern
based off of those early subconscious beliefs. And so a
lot of the time, you know, we think, well, I'm
in control of like what I'm doing, and you know,

(25:32):
I'm determining things. But a lot of it is these
unconscious programs that we're kind of running off of. And
so that's why when we start to change the program,
start to change just the way the wiring is working,
by slowing it down, by moving into the subconscious and
feeding it new beliefs, feeling its senses of well being

(25:53):
and calm. Then suddenly what you're seeing in your life
is different, and it's subtle. You know, it's not like,
you know, snap of the fingers.

Speaker 3 (26:02):
But yeah, I love too. That.

Speaker 2 (26:05):
So the reason I'm so drawn we kind of touched
on this already. But the reason I'm so drawn to
all these different kind of modalities in different ways that
we can get healing is because so much of what's
discussed in our society now feels to me or or
maybe this is in the past years and it feels
like it's shifting a little bit, but it feels to
me like, Okay, you're uncomfortable.

Speaker 3 (26:27):
So here's a pill to throw at that, or.

Speaker 2 (26:30):
Yeah, go have a drink, or go get in another
relationship so you don't have to grieve that last one.
And I know you've I've seen some posts you've done
about this as well. You actually said in a caption
that seventy percent of Americans are on a pill of
some sort to cure a symptom of some like whatever,
but we don't ever or seems like a lot of

(26:51):
people don't go to address the root cause. And to me,
these kind of modalities start with the root, like getting
in touch with your body, why am I feeling this way?
Like where did this come from? And being in touch
enough to know to have the awareness when you're going
throughout your day when that gets off and off base.

(27:12):
So can you talk a little bit to that, Like
what do you see in our society that's just completely
missing in the healing world?

Speaker 4 (27:21):
Oh boy, big question. I mean so many directions you
can go, yeah, And I mean this is like really
what kind of gets me fired up in a good
anthy Yeah, I get like so activated I find over
these topics and sometimes engaging with people you know, and

(27:45):
I think what part of it is is a lot
of our culture, just like in the medical space, is
based off of Newtonian physics, which is like we only
prescribe or only validate anything that can be measured, you know.
And so if I take this thing, then measurably the
symptoms stop, you know, and great, the symptoms stopped, you know,

(28:10):
And like you're quoting, like yes, seventy percent of Americans
aren't at least one prescription drug. That is bonkers to me,
you know, like, how is that even possible? And then
as we get older, more and more prescription drugs, you know.

Speaker 2 (28:26):
And you have to take one to get rid of
the other symptoms that the one the other one brings in.
So it's just like you keep just adding more.

Speaker 4 (28:32):
To the table, yeah, exactly. And so all that we're
doing in those moments is we're quieting the symptoms, right,
you know. But then if you stop taking the drug,
well then they're right back, you know, So did you
even do anything? And all you're kind of doing is
just taking a vocation away from the symptoms. And we

(28:54):
like quick fixes, and so we take it and we're
not experiencing the symptoms. But Yeah, in terms of healing,
the differences out of the Western model, which is looking
at you know, you have this with your shoulder. What
can we prescribe you, what do you need to take?
What surgeries do you need? Whereas more of the Eastern

(29:17):
approach is taking in the entire person, you know, taking
in what is what energy is flowing or not flowing
through the body. What are emotional experiences that you're going
through that could be contributing to that. Where are those
emotions coming from? You know, somebody's saying that, you know,

(29:38):
I'm just I'm really depressed. Naturally, we're going to prescribe
you an antidepressant instead of asking what is going on
in your life? You know, what are you going through?
What are some of the things that you're facing right now?
What is your sleep? Like? You know, what is your
what is your health? What are your eating habits? You know,
none of not usually, none of those things are being asked.

(30:01):
And so we've created this culture that is addicted. You know,
we are addicted. Like the number one killer of men
eighteen to forty five right now is fentanyl, right, and
you don't see that being talked about, I mean, not

(30:23):
nearly enough, right, and I've seen just like boys men
my age, go from using vic it in and oxyconton
two then establishing like an addiction to harder, harder drugs.
And you could say, well, they have a problem or

(30:47):
you know, the AA model is usually that it's you know,
it's an allergy of the body, it's an obsession of
the mind, and there's a certain chemical wiring. But all so,
what's going on is the environment that they're in. Also,
what's going on is their internal life. And like I

(31:07):
was saying, from their developmental years, they learn, oh, this
is how I soothe myself, you know, this is how
I feel okay, this is how I feel balanced. And
then things get wired and suddenly you have a habit,
Suddenly you have a pattern, and then you identify as
your habits as your pattern. Like yeah, like like you're saying,
it's like, yeah, I just like to get a little crazy,

(31:28):
you know. Yeah, so I can't drink now, you know,
it's like right, you know, but all of these aren't
stemming from yeah, I like to have a good time.
I'm just a little wild. No, there's something that you've
gone through that you've experienced that wasn't addressed. It wasn't integrated,
and now you've created an identity based off of that

(31:51):
as opposed to what is really going on. Like they
say with drugs, drugs are never the problem. They're the
solution to the problem. So it's like, once you are
able to access the pain, then you're better able to
understand it. And in order to get to the pain,
you have to get to the root cause of something,

(32:13):
but we don't hold that up as an important part
in the journey. And so you get seventy percent of
Americans on at least one prescription drug.

Speaker 3 (32:23):
Well, and so much.

Speaker 2 (32:25):
This one gets me fired up too, so I'll just
go on my little rant for a second. But like
with the addiction piece specifically, yes, I think that some
look more hardcore than others. But I love that you
were saying, like so much of our society is addicted,
because I really do believe that it's just that some
things are more acceptable, like binging Netflix is an acceptable
you know, quote unquote medicator, or working too much or

(32:49):
all these other things that we do to make ourselves
feel better, bouncing from one relationship to a next to
the next, and it's like all of the things are
still this avoidance piece of dealing with the root, and
we're just looking for the thing to make us less
uncomfortable without actually addressing what's going on. And so the

(33:10):
chase is gonna be constant. It's gonna be one pill
to the next pill. It's going to be vicotin to heroin,
you know, like you're constantly having to upgrade because you've
got a numb with something more hardcore. This is my
belief and so to take it back to sound, I
have found in my personal life like getting in touch
with my own body and asking myself simple questions like

(33:34):
what's happening, or like if I'm feeling anxious, like talking
to my anxiety, you know, like, hey, anxiety, I feel you.
What are you trying to tell me today? That kind
of stuff, which sounds silly to some people, but it's
been so helpful in my journey of actually understanding where
all the feelings are coming from or where all the
things so I don't have to go run out. I mean,

(33:55):
of course I sti't want to everyone like it's just easy.
It seems easier sometimes, but if you're committed to a
path of healing for like a future of happiness and stuff,
it does seem like some of these modalities of really
getting in touch with your body, like really facing the
pain of the trauma or whatever it is you went through,

(34:16):
are ultimately going to be more helpful in our lives.

Speaker 4 (34:20):
Yeah. Yeah, And I think the body part is super important.
You know. I think we weren't trained in society how
to listen to our bodies and what our bodies are
telling us. I think we are mostly taught how to
judge our bodies, you know, totally. Yes, you know, it's
like I'm too I'm too fat, I'm too skinny, I'm

(34:42):
too tall, too short, my hair's like this, my hair's
not like that, you know, And so we're really accustomed
to the critical, you know, being critical of our bodies.
And I think what we're not as accustomed to, which
is probably like the number one place to start, is
really learning to listen to the to your body, listening

(35:05):
to the impulses that your body is needing to get up,
your body is needing to move, you know, sometimes something
as simple as like I'm seeing at a computer and
I need to go use the bathroom. But I'm just
gonna like keep on typing away. But now I'm going
to get up. You know, I'm going to kind of
move a bit slower today because my body's asking me to.

(35:26):
And so, you know, just that piece alone is so foundational,
and you know none of us were taught that, so it's.

Speaker 2 (35:39):
Yeah, yeah, Well, so much of what we're talking about
with the body goes back into like feeling, and so
can you talk a little bit about when you're doing
like a sound healing session. I want to explain to
the listeners. Maybe some listeners have never even done a
sound bath or heard of this or anything like that,
but do you remember.

Speaker 3 (35:59):
What you felt like?

Speaker 2 (36:01):
You mentioned the moment earlier when you said, you know,
whenever you're ready, it seems to come to your life.
And so do you remember the first time you were
exposed to was it a sound bath or the different
frequencies and what that felt like?

Speaker 4 (36:15):
Yeah, of course, of course. You know I at that time,
I was living in a sober living. I was trying
to get my life together, and I was trying to
figure things out for myself. And you know, when you
first get sober, you're socially so awkward, like you're so
your head and it's like, oh my god, why did

(36:37):
I say that? Like, yeah, not my best moment, you know,
and so you're constantly just you know. In part of
that also is just neurologically, your brain waves are moving
quicker than they would normally. You're in what's called like
a high beta brainwave activity because it's kind of having
to rewire, you know. And and so it's very normal

(37:01):
in that state, Like I hear it all the time
from people dealing with addiction, where it's like I'm future tripping,
I'm ruminating over the past, like my mind is just
moving so quickly, you know. And so that was kind
of my experience. And then when I came into the
session where the person was using the sound healing, first off,

(37:22):
I just am like very quickly felt my anxiety levels
go down and I started to have greater clarity around
things of like I felt like I was like processing
things at a really quick speed, like and I want
to do this, and I'm like going to do this,
and it was like I was making these to do lists,

(37:45):
but it was really what I was wanting for myself.
It was probably like some subconscious stuff, yeah, And it
was like I'm wanting to do this, I'm wanting to
do that. And I think when you move into those states,
like they say, in those beta brain wave activities, like
when you are in more of an awake an alert state,

(38:05):
there's a lot of emotional interferences. You know, there's your
life that's kind of getting in the way and all
of the things. When you go into that dream like state,
when you drop down, you move out of the rational
mind and a lot of your conscious defenses come down
and you move into you know, like more angelic thoughts,

(38:28):
these like higher wavelengths of thinking of like who am
I actually what am I actually wanting for myself? And
so you're moving out of some of those things that
you identify with and into these deeper aspects of yourself.
And I just felt that I felt like I was
moving into these deeper parts of myself and what I
was wanting. And then I came out and I just

(38:51):
felt like my body was so relaxed, you know. I
was like, Wow, my body just feels so calm, you know,
and I just feel feel so loose, like I'm not
tight in the areas that I was. I'm not as tense.
And I of course didn't understand any of this at
the time, but I was experiencing a slow down feeling

(39:13):
of safety in my body, and I was able to
engage with myself in a compassionate and curious way. So
I think that was my first experience of it.

Speaker 2 (39:29):
And so what does a sound bath look like for
listeners who are like, Okay, that sounds cool, OVI, But
like what do I do?

Speaker 3 (39:37):
Where do I start?

Speaker 5 (39:39):
Like?

Speaker 3 (39:39):
What is it?

Speaker 2 (39:40):
Can you talk about like the bulls people might use,
or the different frequency tones or things like that.

Speaker 4 (39:46):
Yeah, yeah, of course, can I ask you a question before?

Speaker 3 (39:49):
Of course?

Speaker 4 (39:50):
What was your first experience with it? Like if you
can remember.

Speaker 2 (39:54):
Oh god, mine's so emotional. Actually, So the first time
I ever did a sound a friend of mine got
a sound healer to come to her house and it
was like five or six of my friends and I
and you know, one of the people fell asleep and
then another one just was like antsy, and I had
the biggest emotional release And that was not surprising to

(40:17):
any of my friends. I'm a big feeler and so,
and I'm also not scared to just like feel out
loud like whatever it is, I can't really control.

Speaker 3 (40:24):
It, it just happened.

Speaker 2 (40:26):
So I yeah, I had a lot of moments where
with different frequencies or different it was with she was
using healing bowls or you might you can probably explain
better what that is to people. But like certain ones
of the tones, I would feel my entire body just vibrate,
like actually feel like I was almost not electrocuted and

(40:48):
being electrocuted in like a harsh way, but almost like
it was like I'd stuck my finger in a like
a light socket, you know, and it was like it
almost felt like it was just waking up parts of
me that had been asleep or maybe my whole life,
I don't know. And then there would be other sounds
that I would just like start crying, and I wouldn't
know why it wasn't anything that she was doing or

(41:12):
that the noise specifically seemed like it would do to anyone,
because it wasn't happening to my friends. But I just
think I had so much bottled up that I needed
to release, and so that that tone, whatever it was,
which just helped me to get to that place, you know,
because a lot of times I feel like we're taught
almost don't cry or don't release, and so, like you said,

(41:32):
it just gets stored in our bodies. And I think
I had so much of that from over the years
of feeling like no, I've got to be strong or yes,
I'm feeling all these things, but I'm gonna stuff it.
And yeah, it was just really helpful to me. And
then I mentioned, you know how I use it now
and sometimes I just google my symptoms with sound healing

(41:53):
like noise, like I'm like anxious sound frequency and that's
what I listened to you or to know the number,
you know. And it really is interesting because I can
just have it on in the background, even like doing
stuff around my house, and before I know it, something
has passed or I just feel physically different, and it's harder.

(42:18):
It's hard to know how to explain it other than that.
But yeah, my first experience, I remember leaving and being
like that was the best thing I ever did. That
was amazing, Like I want to do it again, you know.
It was just so great.

Speaker 4 (42:30):
Yeah. Yeah, and I think the best things in life
you almost can't explain, Like that's true. Yeah, you know,
it's as soon as you start to explain it, you're like.

Speaker 3 (42:39):
That sounds crazy.

Speaker 2 (42:41):
I feel that way every time I do a podcast.
So I'm like, oh my god, there was this experience
and I know It sounds crazy to listeners, but try it.

Speaker 4 (42:49):
Like I was electrocuted and it was the best thing ever,
and I just want to keep feeling.

Speaker 3 (42:54):
That, right, That's why I wanted to backtrack. It didn't
feel bad, you guys want.

Speaker 2 (42:59):
It was like just every part of my body, Like
when I say waking up is there's no other explanation
than that, because it just I felt tingly everywhere and
I was so aware of my shoulder or my finger,
you know, like things that I just don't pay attention
to on the regular. It like that sound awakened something

(43:22):
that made me feel every piece of my body like
a vibration.

Speaker 4 (43:25):
Yeah. Yeah, it's amazing, And you know, I think touching
on something you said. I was talking a lot about
the body and the nervous system, but at a deeper level,
it is really us awakening. It's like waking up to
who we actually are, like in this life, you know,

(43:46):
And I think we don't have a lot of moments
where we can kind of make contact with that part
of us of like who am I actually like away
from all the things that I'm doing and these parts
that I identify with as like my name is this
and I live here and I do this. It's like,
you know, that's a layer of who you are, you know, right,

(44:09):
But whether we want to or not, there will come
a time where we're going to shed that, you know,
and we're going to turn into something else. And so
when we go into sound, we go into that really
deep aspect of who we are. You know. It's like
that place we come from before we got into this
body and the place we're going to after we leave

(44:30):
this body. And I feel like we have those moments
with that, and yeah, it has these effects on the
nervous system and on the brain, but it's also touching
this really deep part of us that we can't even
fully explain, you know, in terms of what is a
sound bath though, you know, a sound bath is it's

(44:55):
an experienced design to put the body and the brain
into a relaxed state. Okay, and you are bathed in sound,
I mean that is the term. Like a sound bath.
You are bathed in different sounds. And so some of
the sounds that people use are the sounds coming from
crystal bowls. Part of why crystal bowls I think are

(45:18):
so popular and you know, are so impactful is quarts,
which is what the bulls are made of it's like
a crushed quartz essentially, So the crushed quartz quartz is
at its fundamental level water and then because it gets
trapped under earth and pressure heat in time, it crystallizes.

(45:40):
Most of our body is of a watery substance, right,
and so our lungs, our skin, our bones, all of
these parts are kind of watery by nature. And so
when we take in sound that's coming from essentially water
and it's going into us, which is essentially water, it's
like vibrating water going to vibrating water almost. It has

(46:04):
this real immediate effect at harmonizing and rebalancing and restructuring
these part of us, these parts of us that have
been stressed, that are unhealthy, that are holding onto patterns,
and so we release these patterns and it harmonizes our celves,

(46:26):
our bloodstream. You know, I post on my Instagram like
it shows sometimes your blood even after an hour of sound,
starts to actually like detox parasites start to leave, right.
And so it's not just some like wu out there
idea really grounded studies on these concepts and what it's
doing to our brain waves. And so when we take

(46:48):
in sound, it usually starts off with a meditation, and
the meditation allows us to be more intentional with what
we are wanting from that space from that time. And
then once we're able to do that, we usually do
some breathing a light body meditation to just bring us
more into our body or more into the intention of

(47:10):
that space of that time. And then we go into
the sound, which allows us to process things at a
cellular level, really, and so it's releasing different chemicals in
the body and we're syncing up with the vibration and
so it's really gentle and really passive, really impactful, and

(47:33):
sometimes it takes us a while to even process what
has happened, you know, because we're just laying down and
receiving it. And so, yeah, they use crystal bowls, they'll
use gongs, they'll use chimes, they'll use different sounds to
elicit different responses. Some sounds are deeper, and deeper sounds

(47:53):
tend to bring us more into our body. Some sounds
are lighter and airer, and they tend to create more
more of lightness or alertness in the mind. And it's
almost like sounds are Some sounds are like the meat
and potatoes of it. And other sounds are like palate cleanser.
You know, it's like, yeah, you know, it's like frozen

(48:14):
grapes after a meal or something. So you know, they
they're creating these different responses, and at the end of it,
the brain waves have kind of gone through a series
of different states. The body has released these different stressors
and tensions that it's been holding on too, and I

(48:35):
think we start to feel a little bit more like
who we actually are, away from the stress, away from
you know, some of the overwhelmed that we deal with.

Speaker 2 (48:46):
I love that we start to feel like who we
actually are. I mean, sounds really simple, but I actually
think that it's pretty rare these days to actually feel that.

Speaker 4 (48:58):
Yeah, I think that's the important part is at the
end of it, it's like how do you actually feel
about yourself?

Speaker 3 (49:07):
You know?

Speaker 4 (49:08):
And and you know, sometimes like we're talking about, you're
you're addicted to this, you're putting this, you're avoiding this,
you're distracting yourself, and sometimes we even get rewarded for it.
You know. Sometimes, like I hear this a lot with addiction,
is like everything was going well, my job was going
even better than it had been, so you get rewarded

(49:28):
for it. But the question is like, what is the
quality of your life? How do you feel about yourself?
You know, when you're alone at night, how do you feel?
You know, it's like and I think when you when
you go through sound, you're able to achieve this inner quiet,
this inner peace that Yeah, it allows you to see like, wow,

(49:50):
there's a there's a quieter, simpler, more peaceful version of
me out there.

Speaker 2 (49:56):
What's the craziest thing that you've seen in healing with sound?
Like whether it was with you yourself or with other
people that you've worked with, Like what would listeners think
was like undoable by sound?

Speaker 3 (50:11):
But you've seen it happen.

Speaker 4 (50:15):
Good question.

Speaker 3 (50:16):
Thank you.

Speaker 4 (50:21):
Putting me on the spot.

Speaker 3 (50:22):
Oh, I'm like, now I feel like I should play
the Jeopardy music.

Speaker 4 (50:31):
You know. I think I think one of the things
that I've seen a number of times is people trying
to process something at a cognitive level with the years
of therapy, and as impactful as that can be to
create a relationship with your past or create a relationship

(50:52):
with like a pattern that you keep on seeing. Part
of what that misses out on is it's just cognitive.
You know. You notice the pattern. Okay, I see myself
doing it, but you'll usually repeat it, you know, because
it's just happening in the mind, and we need to
have that release, We need to kind of have that

(51:14):
processing at the somatic level, at the bodily level. And
so I've seen where people through, you know, cause I
incorporate breath work a lot with my own work, and
so I've seen through breathing and then sound and the intention,
people release and get clarity on things that years of

(51:38):
therapy weren't able to. And I've seen like, so one case,
without getting too into it, somebody was wanting to leave
their partner for years but wasn't able to kind of
navigate it and kept on kind of telling themselves like, no,
this is something that could be worked on, but there

(51:58):
was just unhealthy dynamics. And that week after the healing
session that we did, she left her part and she
left her husband, and you know, I know, like in
contact and I just like watch her stuff and she's
like shed like thirty pounds, changed her whole life around.

(52:22):
Is just like like I was saying, who she actually
is away from that pain and away from these things
that are not serving you. They are not helping you.
But because we're we were only able to process things
at the cognitive level, will continue to use the mind
to create reasons why I should stay in it, you know,

(52:43):
because we like to stay in safe situations, even if
they are uncomfortable, even if they're terrible.

Speaker 3 (52:48):
They're familiar though a lot a lot of times, yeah,
it we.

Speaker 4 (52:52):
Choose a familiar hell over an unfamiliar heaven, you know, right,
because our bodies attracted to that. Are you know these patterns,
So yeah, like different situations like that, I would say
are probably the most incredible. And then I think just
like the craziest was I think it would just be

(53:17):
seeing people kind of get into these like it's funny
you were seeing electrocute. I've seen people where it look
like they're being shocked almost you know, where like a
part of their body is just kind of like convulsing
a little bit, and there's usually a lot of tension,
there's a lot of like store trauma in that area,

(53:40):
and then in that moment they are having a really
huge release of that. It's not usually the case, you know,
but I've seen that where it's like this huge release
where it's it's not seeing the body's convulsing and then
they're crying, and then they look like they just you know,
it became like five years younger, like just their whole faith.

Speaker 3 (54:02):
You know, it's like, uh, the way was just dropped.

Speaker 4 (54:05):
Yeah exactly.

Speaker 2 (54:11):
Oh, I have so many thoughts on that, but I
know we're running out of time. I want you guys, well,
I just I was I was thinking. I was thinking
about that when I was crying. I think because I
think crying is like a release as well, and it's
just the way that my body seems.

Speaker 3 (54:24):
To process it. But that is what it was. It
was like this.

Speaker 2 (54:26):
Uncontrollable something had tapped into this certain part of my body.
And I wonder do different sounds do that or is
it just that they're tapping into different traumas, or like
why is that working?

Speaker 4 (54:39):
Yeah? Yeah, I mean so, like I was saying, we
have so many frequencies moving through us at one time, Okay,
I find it a little hard to say, like this
exact vibration is going to have this exact effect. Yeah,
even the I'll go into a couple of directions with it.
I'll come back to that. With that said, one of

(55:03):
the ways, and there's some great head talks on this
and Royal Rife, who somebody I like love and was
not believed he did heal people of different cancers using sound,
and then the medical establishment tried to shut him down.
He went to the Supreme Court and won against the
FDA all of these crazy things. And he was using vibrations,

(55:26):
like almost one hundred years ago, was using vibration to
heal people of cancer. And then his laboratory was broken
into his microscopes were, you know, and his whole his
whole life was kind of decimated, became an alcoholic, all
of these things. And so his form, which still is

(55:50):
carried over in certain ways, is where we'll use certain
frequencies because he found that, for instance, cancer or Alzheimer's
or different things, there's a certain vibration that those cancer
cells are operating at. And if you can meet that
exact vibration. Let's just say it's like nine hundred herts

(56:12):
that you have a cancer cell. So if you play
nine hundred herts to the cancer cell, it's going to
blast apart the cancer cell because you're meeting that vibration
with another vibration. And then it's like a singer when
they're singing and then the glass breaks, Yeah, because you're meeting,
it's coming into residence, and then it blasts apart. And

(56:34):
so sometimes there's trapped emotions, stored emotions that a certain
tone or a certain range hits, and it hits a
part of you, and then you're like, and then you
have this release. You know, it just touched some trapped
part of you. And then yeah, like you were saying,

(56:55):
crying is the natural release. You know, it's like a
letting go of some kind. And so different ranges of frequencies,
different tones can have that effect on us. And then
when you go, like I was saying, more into that
world of royal rife, there are exact frequencies that you

(57:15):
can I don't want to say you can't. Allegedly, you
could potentially heal yourself of different diseases, different cancers. I
know people I've gotten this a lot in my DMS,
people who have used these Royal Rife machines that have
healed themselves of cancers that doctors have said that they

(57:35):
were going to die from in like the next four months,
and that years later they are alive from using these machines,
they believe, allegedly.

Speaker 2 (57:44):
Allegedly, but I mean you mentioned this on your Instagram too.
But if you say the medical field wouldn't want to
encourage sound healing or things like that because they can't
make the same kind of money that they would with
the prescribing pills.

Speaker 4 (57:58):
Yeah, I think the FDA right now is actually approving
sound waves being used to treat cancer. Okay, I think,
like I was saying this, this doctor Royal Rife had
this information one hundred years ago. So what's what's been
happening in the last hundred years.

Speaker 5 (58:17):
Right?

Speaker 4 (58:18):
Of course they have access to this. Of course they
have unlimited funding for research the research that they want
to do because they want to be able to patent things,
not a patent on things, and once they have a
patent on things, then suddenly they release it, you know.
And so I think, first off, they FDA is approving

(58:42):
sound waves being used to treat I forget the types
of cancer, but sorry, I lost my train of thought.
Can you help me?

Speaker 2 (58:53):
You've said the FDA is using are there approving sound
waves as treatment for certain types of cancer? And you
were trying think of the cancers where.

Speaker 4 (59:00):
You lost ye yeah, yeah, And so they're not going
to bring something into to the public unless they're sure
that they can make that in tablet form, they can
make it in a shot, they can make it as
a form of treatment, and then they'll release it. And
there's just a number of doctors like Royal Rife. There's

(59:23):
another doctor, Mitchell Gainer out of Austin, Texas, who was
a cancer researcher at Cornell University who wrote amazing book
called The Healing Power Sound, who was believing that it
was possible to heal cancers and different long term illnesses
with sound and combination with other effective treatments. And he

(59:45):
also in twenty fourteen committed suicide. Right, And you just
hear of these different stories where these people are going
up against the medical establishment and their careers are roomed,
their lives are taken. And so I think that's why
we see these practices as fringe, you know, I mean

(01:00:08):
even something like chiropractors, you know, like there is this length.
They won court battles against the American Medical Association in
the nineties because they were trying to delegitimize their entire
practice and see it as alternative, see it as fringe,

(01:00:30):
And so it occurs with all of these things. And
so I think the more we talk about, the more
we experience, the more we spread what it is. I
think we combat, you know, the other the darkness of that.

Speaker 2 (01:00:49):
Yeah, I mean I could go on a whole tangent
about that because that was my with the plant medicine stuff.
I have a similar feeling is that some of it
is not being used in the way that could because
you do it once and then it's done, and like
there's not a money maker there.

Speaker 4 (01:01:04):
So yeah, and I mean not that I use it now,
but it's like now that the that they are legalizing psilocybin,
it's like you have to use it in a contained environment,
you have to pay X amount for it. But shamanic
cultures for thousands of years have been in communication with

(01:01:25):
those plants, knowing the properties of it and what it's
able to do. And somehow, now because it's being legalized,
is it only seen as you know, a proper form
of treatment. It's like, what, yeah, that makes sense right?

Speaker 2 (01:01:43):
Well, we could obviously go on and for days, but
if people want to know more about sound healing, I
do feel like your Instagram page is a really great
place to start because you break things down. So can
you tell the people where to find you.

Speaker 4 (01:01:55):
Yeah, so I'm on Instagram and TikTok at a sound
r x. And then also I offer trainings where I
train others and becoming conscious practitioners of sound. And so
you could go to my website get sounder x dot
com and yeah, I have other offerings there, other guides

(01:02:21):
and yeah, and if you ever want to work one
on one, that's available.

Speaker 3 (01:02:26):
Also, do you offer virtual sessions?

Speaker 4 (01:02:29):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, virtual sessions and doing one tomorrow.

Speaker 2 (01:02:32):
So yeah, okay, cool, Well I'll put all of the
info of that in the link of sorry, the description
of this podcast.

Speaker 3 (01:02:40):
What about what I do where I like Google? How
I told you I do five to.

Speaker 2 (01:02:44):
Eight It hurts frequency in the morning, and it does
seem to be helping me.

Speaker 3 (01:02:49):
But do you have a way that.

Speaker 2 (01:02:51):
You would suggest people start using sound if they're kind
of just wanting to dip their toe in a little bit.

Speaker 4 (01:02:57):
Yeah, you know one of my fas practices. I'll show
you this book I have right here too. One of
my favorite practices. The book is called the Humming Effect.

Speaker 3 (01:03:10):
Okay.

Speaker 4 (01:03:12):
One of my favorite practices is using our own voice
as a healing agent. A lot of what we're able
to do when we take in outer sounds from instruments,
we're able to do with our own voice, you know,
And so I'm not joking. Try breathing from your diaphragm,

(01:03:33):
so feel like your belly expand and then contract as
you exil. And hum for five minutes and you're going
to fifteen x your nitric oxide levels, which helps with
blood flow, oxygenating the blood, all these different effects, producing oxytocin,
and just creating an overall sense of well being. I

(01:03:56):
would say my favorite practice is hum for five minutes.
It's okay for when you're feeling stressed out. And I
don't want to say I guarantee, but like you will,
I will guarantee this one. Okay, I will guarantee your
anxiety levels will be completely different and whatever was kind

(01:04:18):
of stressing you out beforehand, will you'll have a different
relationship with H And yeah, I feel like in general,
frequencies are amazing. I love that they're people are going
to them and using them, and I mean five point
twenty eight is it's amazing. You know, it's believed to
repair DNA and sell, so it's go for it. That's

(01:04:42):
why I share that exactly.

Speaker 2 (01:04:44):
But it does it does seem to help me. I
love the humming thing. I catch myself sometimes when I'm meditating,
I just will start humming and I just I don't
stop my body from doing things during meditation. I'm like,
whatever it needs to do. But for me, it's the
same as crying. It's like some sort of like physical
release of something that's stuck somewhere. So I don't know,
that's really interesting, look at that.

Speaker 3 (01:05:05):
Let's just do it. Actually.

Speaker 4 (01:05:07):
Yeah, And the last thing I'll say is like you're
communicating without using words, which I think, yeah, really important.
It's like you're using your voice but not for to
form words, but just to release and express something, which
is powerful.

Speaker 2 (01:05:24):
Well, it takes out the intellectualizing that we were talking
about and you're just actually feeling and communicating and vibrating.

Speaker 3 (01:05:31):
I love that.

Speaker 2 (01:05:32):
Yeah, Auvy, thank you. This was so great for me.
I needed this on my Monday, so I really appreciable.
The listeners will be hearing it on Wednesday. But what
a great conversation. I'm going to link everywhere for you
guys to go find Avi's work. In the description of
this podcast. Thank you so much for being here.

Speaker 4 (01:05:48):
Yeah, thanks so much for having me. I really really
enjoyed it.

Speaker 3 (01:05:52):
Yeah, thank you, Thank you guys for listening.

Speaker 1 (01:05:54):
Thanks for listening to the Velvet's Edge podcast with Kelly Henderson,
where we believe everyone has a little velvet in a
little edge. Subscribe for more conversations on life, style, beauty
and relationships. Search Velvet's Edge wherever you get your podcasts.