June 10, 2025 • 38 mins
Guest Jessica Levinson, Clinical Professor of Law and Director of Loyola Law School's Public Service Institute. The legal implications of Trump's deployment of the National Guard and Marines in Los Angeles. Los Angeles Mayor Karen Bass's reaction to the federalized National Guard troops in her city. An Australian reporter covering immigration protests in Los Angeles was hit by a rubber bullet during a live broadcast. Live coverage of Mayor Bass discussing the anti-ICE protests.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
This is Gary and Shannon and you're listening to KFI
AM six forty, the Gary and Shannon Show on demand
on the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
We've seen all of the protests in downtown Los Angeles.
There were protests against immigration rates in Santa Ana last
night that also turned pretty chaotic. They were throwing things
at law enforcement officers. By midnight, the ongoing protests had
largely dispersed. As of this morning, though a couple of
different camera shots of that area right around downtown, that
(00:32):
two or three block area that's been sort of the
hotbed of this was covered in graffiti, and as of
this morning, they've made incredible progress either painting over it
or cleaning it off.
Speaker 3 (00:41):
A lot of spaces, well, we have a.
Speaker 1 (00:42):
Lot of jurisdiction questions, legal jurisdiction questions. This is the
first time, as I mentioned, that a president is sent
in the National Guard in sixty years without the governor's okay.
Who gets to say what goes on the streets of
LA Where does state sovereignty the land when it comes
to the big power spectrum?
Speaker 3 (01:03):
I guess?
Speaker 2 (01:04):
And joining us to talk more about this is a
professor with one of those fold out business cards because
the title is so long. Jessica Levinson, Clinical Professor of Law,
director of Loyal LA Law School's Public Service Institute. Excuse me,
Director of Loyal LA Law Schools Journalists Law School, Jessica,
thank you for taking time for us today.
Speaker 3 (01:23):
He's so jealous.
Speaker 4 (01:26):
I did not know about this fold out business card situation.
Speaker 5 (01:30):
I feel very in the dark.
Speaker 4 (01:31):
I thought I was here to talk about silkwood scrubs.
Speaker 5 (01:34):
I feel there.
Speaker 4 (01:35):
I feel very much like the rug was pulled out
from under me, and now you're asking me legal questions.
Speaker 5 (01:41):
So here we go, Here we go.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
Let's begin with the legal jurisdiction that the President used
in order to go around the governor and federalize the
California National Guard.
Speaker 4 (01:54):
Okay, so I think it's really important that we just
stick to what these statutes say, stick to what Congress
said when they provided presidents with this power. And so
we're looking at Title ten. Why are we looking there.
Speaker 5 (02:08):
Because the President wrote in his.
Speaker 4 (02:10):
Memorandum he cited to the statutes Title ten, section twelve
four h six.
Speaker 5 (02:16):
I'm sorry, I'm not going to do that again. And
what that section says.
Speaker 4 (02:20):
Is that the president can federalize the National Guard when
he believes that there is a rebellion or the danger
of a rebellion. There is language in there that says
that the orders must be issued through the governor.
Speaker 5 (02:35):
And so what I would.
Speaker 4 (02:36):
Highlight is there are basically two legal questions here. One
is what's a rebellion and who gets to decide? Is
it the president that gets to decide? Can a federal
judge say, you know what, I don't think it rises
to the level? And second guess the president. We can
talk about that. And then there's this question of whether
or not the language of an order issued through the
(02:57):
governor means that the governor has to consent. I think,
as you said, there are situations where the president has
sent in the National Guard without the governor's consent. We
can think about enforcing desegregation orders, for instance. So there's
history and practice to indicate that that language does not
require consent.
Speaker 3 (03:18):
So this could go to a federal judge.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
Does this go the distance when it comes to different
definitions of what rebellion means and who makes the final call?
Speaker 3 (03:31):
I guess if.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
It goes to distance of Supreme Court in terms of
does the president get to decide what the definition of
rebellion is right.
Speaker 4 (03:41):
So yes, this goes to a federal judge. California filed
last night. I think I was on my way to
teach constitutional law when the suit was filed. And California
is certainly arguing here that there is no rebellion, and
I think there can be an honest discs question about.
Speaker 5 (04:00):
Whether or not there truly is a rebellion. But I
want to pick up on the second part of your question,
which is who gets to decide? And so when we
think about.
Speaker 4 (04:08):
These questions, generally speaking, federal judges are pretty deferential to
the president when it comes to questions about what is
a rebellion, when it comes to broader questions about national security.
And so if we take this out of just what
is happening right now today and think about who gets
to make the determination, you know, think about Trump versus
(04:32):
Hawaii that was the travel band case, think about other
cases where the president is saying their national security concerns.
Generally speaking, federal judges do defer to the judgment of
an elected president.
Speaker 3 (04:46):
Can we talk about the timing.
Speaker 2 (04:48):
We know that California Attorney General Rob Bonta has sued
the president over what Rob Bonta says, is this unlawful order?
What kind of a timeline are we looking at in
terms of getting this thing literally before a judge and
having some sort of a decision. Is it going to
impact what's going on on the streets of LA.
Speaker 4 (05:10):
So potentially, I'm going to give an answer that everybody hates,
which is basically, it depends.
Speaker 5 (05:15):
It depends on how quickly the judge who.
Speaker 4 (05:19):
Gets this case wants to set briefing, And my guess
is very very quickly.
Speaker 5 (05:24):
So we know that judges can act on.
Speaker 4 (05:28):
An expedited basis when the facts call for it, and
I would say the facts call for it right at
this point, where this isn't a contract dispute, This isn't
a matter of interpreting a bankruptcy code where we can
all wait a while and purposely you notice not using
words like it's going to be by the end of
the day or we're going to have an answer within
(05:49):
X number of weeks. I think we're talking about something
that's going to happen much more quickly than a typical
federal suit. I think that a judge will set a
quick briefing schedule, will allow the Department's Justice to respond,
and we're going to have a hearing, I would guess
within a week.
Speaker 1 (06:07):
So just looking at a casual definition of rebellion, going
back to that open resistance to an established government, is
there an argument because I see in the echo chamber
that is Twitter, that people are pointing to the fact
that people are here illegally and they're waving foreign flags
and that that is a definition or that is an
(06:29):
example of a rebellion. Is there an argument that in California,
in Los Angeles and disagree with it or not to
people listening that in California Los Angeles it's a sanctuary city,
it's a sanctuary state essentially, So in the established government
of Los Angeles in California, that's not open resistance.
Speaker 3 (06:51):
Frankly, that's allowed now. It may be.
Speaker 1 (06:54):
Resistance to the established federal government and the federal laws
US not being a say, sanctuary country, but they are operating.
If you're going to split hairs under the umbrella of
what's acceptable when it comes to the government in LA
in California, So.
Speaker 5 (07:12):
I think that's an important question.
Speaker 4 (07:13):
I'd like to separate a couple of issues when it
comes to being a sanctuary city or a sanctuary state.
Speaker 5 (07:19):
I think you have the power.
Speaker 4 (07:21):
We talk about the Tenth Amendment and state sovereignty and
state autonomy and independence. The states have the power to
say to the federal government, I'm not going to carry
your water, I'm not going to help you enforce federal law.
But states also can't undermine cities can't undermine the federal
government in carrying out federal law.
Speaker 5 (07:40):
So those are just two things that we need to
think about.
Speaker 4 (07:43):
I would say I think about the rebellion as being
separate this question of whether or not there's a rebellion,
and I think very specifically about whether or not the
actions that have taken place over the last few days
would rise to the law under the definition of the statue,
under the statute. And I think you can have an
(08:07):
honest conversation about whether or not this truly does look
like a rebellion. But we get back to the same
question of who gets to make the final call, and
we certainly have a president who's embracing a very broad
view of his power. We see this when it comes
to other immigration laws, the Alien Enemies Act, we see
(08:28):
it when it comes to tariffs, and we see in
some cases federal judge is saying no, for instance, for tariffs,
we think you're pointing to statutes that don't give you
this power in this case. I will just kind of
offer these are the things that a judge is going
to look at, whether or not the judge wants to
second guess a president when it comes to these questions.
(08:49):
And some judges may be comfortable saying we are just
so far from what the statute envisions as a rebellion
that I'm going to say no.
Speaker 2 (08:58):
Well, what an absolutely boring yawn full time to be
a constitutional law professor.
Speaker 3 (09:05):
I really don't know.
Speaker 1 (09:06):
I like want to jump into your awesome Jessica.
Speaker 3 (09:11):
Thank you for your time today. We appreciate it.
Speaker 5 (09:14):
Thank you you, bet.
Speaker 2 (09:15):
Jessica Levinson there again from Loyal Law School, about what's
going on in terms of these constitutional questions that are
being played out in the courts while all of this
other stuff is being played out on the streets of LA.
Speaker 6 (09:30):
You're listening to Gary and Shannon on demand from KFI.
I am six.
Speaker 1 (09:34):
Forty quick distinction I want to make is that, well,
you were talking earlier about a line that should be
crossed or should not be crossed, and we have gotten
a little complacent, to say the least when it comes
with allowing certain behaviors from protesters. You know, yes, we
were built on protesting. Yes, you know, you go back
(09:55):
to the tea party, the whole bit. There's a rich history,
there's a rich history of peaceful protest. But he was killed,
nobody was hurt. Of course, we didn't have social media,
so we don't know that for a fact. But yes,
when violence starts, when breaking the law starts at a protest,
that is the line. The looting, the robbery, the assault
(10:17):
not part should not be a part of protest in
this country. Absolutely don't want to. What's the word equivocate?
Speaker 4 (10:30):
Vague?
Speaker 1 (10:31):
Equivocate is good. It's not exactly the word I'm looking for,
but it's there. Equivocate waiver waiver? I want a waiver
on that? Are you learning Hawaiian before your trip there?
Speaker 3 (10:45):
That's the fish, that's the state fish. What else? Do
you know? What other Hawaiian things do you know? I
don't know much. Do you know? Mahaalo that I know? Aloha? See?
Should I do my duo link Maya Maya Highway? Yes?
Hali akola? Uh huh?
Speaker 5 (11:06):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (11:07):
What else you got?
Speaker 5 (11:08):
I know?
Speaker 3 (11:09):
There's something else. You're holding something back and feel it. No, no,
just the fish that was it? Okay, we are standing by.
Speaker 2 (11:19):
We do expect Mayor Bass to hold a news conference
coming up in a few minutes. Based on what we've
seen in the past. It won't start on time, not
necessarily because of her, but that's just the way things go.
There are about seventeen hundred National Guard troops currently operating
throughout the LA area, and as we mentioned before, they
(11:39):
will be joined by a few hundred Marines who are
also going to be coming in. These are not the
only protests that are going on. Obviously, there were some
in Santa Anna last night where they protesters had to
be dispersed, and an estimated nine thousand people showed up
last night in San Francisco. Nine thousand far out numbers
(12:01):
I think what we've seen so far in LA over
the last few days. But this was a protest at
twenty fourth in Mission at the bart Plaza about six
o'clock last night. People in or police in San Francisco,
so that they arrested nine thousand.
Speaker 1 (12:16):
I mean that must have been people brought in from
other places.
Speaker 3 (12:21):
Or it's just people.
Speaker 2 (12:24):
Well, yeah, they've been Yeah, because there's not a lot
of I don't even think there's nine thousand people living
in San Francisco anymore. At it's not in inside. But
the protests are beginning to spread. There are expectations that
we will see at least twenty five rallies and demonstrations
coast to coast, from New York to Chicago and Dallas
(12:46):
and Atlanta. They have been advertised on social media asking
people to come and gather in those states and cities
as they take this stand against the immigrant enforcement operations.
I suppose is that is the way to put it.
So anyway, we'll keep an eye on all of that stuff.
(13:08):
And again we're waiting for an update from Mayor Bass
here in just a few minutes.
Speaker 1 (13:12):
Yeah, we'll break a little bit early, just because we
want to be able to break into that when it unfolds.
See what the plan is here, because there has been
pushed back amongst the police chief and the mayor as
well when it comes into sending the Marines and more
National Guard troops.
Speaker 3 (13:30):
So we'll see what their response is.
Speaker 6 (13:33):
You're listening to Gary and Shannon on demand from KFI
A M six forty.
Speaker 2 (13:37):
There are standing by Mayor Karen Bass is expected to
hold a news conference for updates from the city's perspective
on what's been going on with the protests outside in
this streets of downtown LA. So when we get to that,
we'll break in for you.
Speaker 3 (13:52):
Right now, I believe they are in the prayer.
Speaker 1 (13:54):
There are people in tears.
Speaker 3 (13:57):
It's all a big How can I use this politically?
The prayer? What do you mean, Oh, they do a prayer.
Oh before the news conference?
Speaker 5 (14:05):
Oh?
Speaker 3 (14:05):
Sure.
Speaker 2 (14:07):
You were asking earlier to in the show sort of
a tongue in cheek moment if something were to happen
to you, if you would end up on an episode
of Dateline.
Speaker 3 (14:15):
Well I would hope.
Speaker 1 (14:16):
So Robbie, listen, if I'm going to be taken out,
I want it to be in spectacular fashion, and I
want Keith Morrison to be the guy that handles it.
Speaker 5 (14:27):
Well, Hey Gary, Hey.
Speaker 7 (14:27):
Hannon, Kenny. Yeah, I'm gonna hate to burst your bubble here.
I don't think you're going to qualify for Dayline. I
don't think anyone has ever said once, Wow, she really
just brightens up every room she walks into. So, yeah,
you're saying you're not going to get killed by anybody,
all right, take care of everyone.
Speaker 3 (14:43):
It's so true.
Speaker 1 (14:44):
I am so safe because that is not my personality.
Speaker 3 (14:48):
I appreciate that.
Speaker 1 (14:48):
It's so nice to feel seen, like when somebody really
knows you.
Speaker 3 (14:53):
It's such a warm feeling. That's pretty good. One of
the issues that has come that people like it's so true.
Speaker 1 (15:02):
It's like if Dayline was to interview my friends, they'd be.
Speaker 3 (15:05):
Like, what what was she like?
Speaker 1 (15:07):
Like, yeah, I could see this coming, like it wasn't
gonna be good. I can see somebody wanting to kill her.
I can see her husband chopping up her body and
throwing it across three different states. Absolutely, I said counties.
You did say counties in your hypothesis.
Speaker 3 (15:23):
How much he likes to drive? You you know he
likes to drive? Okay, well maybe three states.
Speaker 1 (15:28):
But I don't think you'd think I was worth it,
you know, I think counties was much more realistic.
Speaker 3 (15:34):
The worst the gas money.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
One of the issues that has come up in these
not just these protests, but other protests that we have seen,
of course, is reporters getting involved with this and and
and I'm talking about not the street what's the word,
not the citizen. Reporters right, everybody with their phone out
or you know, you hold a camera with a long
lens on it and you think you've become a photojournalist
(15:58):
in some way, when in all honesty, you're getting in
the way. But I mean people fully credentialed members of
the media who arguably should have some insight into what's
going on now for those of you who don't know. Generally,
reporters have the ability in an event like that to
(16:19):
in many cases not be subject to the same rules
that protesters are. For example, oftentimes there will be sections
of an intersection or a street or a loc park
maybe where the law enforcement will tell you this is
your designated media area, and we know that if you're
(16:40):
in the area you have credentials. We assume you have credentials,
and we're not going to make you move.
Speaker 1 (16:45):
I know, and you probably know because you were in
the field around the same time as I was people
personally who got quite the payout from the city for
violence at the hands of.
Speaker 3 (16:57):
The LAPD while they covered protest.
Speaker 1 (17:00):
So now, specifically in Los Angeles, everyone is very well
versed on how to cover a protest, where to go,
what orders to give, what orders to listen to, and
all of the above.
Speaker 2 (17:11):
There was a reporter on Sunday, an Australian TV reporter
who was shot in the leg with rubber bullets, or
I should say hit in the leg. We don't know
if the officer was aiming at her specifically or what
he was aiming at, but she got hit with rubber
bullets in the leg. The Prime Minister of Australia got
her on the horn to see if she was.
Speaker 3 (17:31):
Okay, that's it.
Speaker 2 (17:34):
You're covering a protest in downtown Los Angeles that had
already at that point become violent.
Speaker 1 (17:43):
Well, who is the protest? What's the relationship between Australia
and Trump? Number one? Do they hate him? Do they
hate us? Okay, then let's use this chaos for our
own political gain. Right Number two? Is this like the
Barbara Walters of Australia? Is she a big deal? Is
this Katie Kuric?
Speaker 3 (17:58):
Is this was somebody more topical like the mid nineties
Kelly Rippa? I don't know. Is it somebody? Is it
somebody who will?
Speaker 6 (18:11):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (18:12):
Is it a national journalistic treasure that we're talking about?
Speaker 3 (18:15):
That was hitting no idea?
Speaker 1 (18:16):
Because then I could understand it rising to that level
but otherwise it seems so.
Speaker 4 (18:20):
As I was walking over to men last night.
Speaker 6 (18:24):
As I was walking over to the officer tried to explain,
what's you know, who I was, identified, who I was with.
I turned it. He said, I'd like you to turn around.
I turned around it.
Speaker 2 (18:36):
But this is a CNN reporter who was detained, not arrested.
Detained because he was in the wrong place at the
wrong time. He wasn't arrested, He was never cuffed. Once
they he his description of it. He cooperated with the
officer who was asking him to move, and he didn't
move at the time. Once they show his credentials, or
once he gets his credentials, they let him go and
(18:58):
they just tell him, hey, next time, pay attention what
we're saying.
Speaker 3 (19:00):
Or if you're in a dangerous area.
Speaker 2 (19:03):
The whole thing is cops don't want to go out
there and just beat the living crap out of everybody.
They would rather you just turn and went home. That
that's what they would rather do. Mix their day a
lot easier. And if you're one of the people that's
out there and there's nothing that necessarily delineates you from
somebody else in the crowd, granted the guy had a
or a photographer with him with a giant camera on
(19:26):
his shoulder, which would have I would have assumed, given
some sort of indication, that he was a member of
the credentialed media.
Speaker 3 (19:33):
But you you.
Speaker 2 (19:34):
Go out there knowing that there is potential danger out there.
Speaker 3 (19:40):
The last time I covered an.
Speaker 2 (19:43):
Event of that size, and it was much bigger than
what we've seen the last couple of days was the
World Trade Organization riots in nineteen seven or seventy, sorry,
nineteen ninety nine in Seattle.
Speaker 3 (19:54):
All right, what happened? I did just spill.
Speaker 2 (19:56):
I was cutting a potato and were you eating lunch
in the middle of my story?
Speaker 3 (20:02):
I'm sorry, you can't even turn the mic on.
Speaker 1 (20:07):
In my defense, I was quietly eating my soup, which
has big chunks of vegetables in it. And this was
a large potato, as you can see I can, and
I was cutting it with my spoon, and half and
half the potato jumped out of the cup and landed
right here, and it was quite a big piece.
Speaker 2 (20:25):
Well, the half potato was more excited to hear my
story than you were.
Speaker 3 (20:28):
I know, I'm listening story. It's about the WTO in Seattle, nineteen,
nineteen ninety nine.
Speaker 2 (20:33):
This was about a week after my son was born,
and listen one day.
Speaker 3 (20:40):
Off, two days, two days off.
Speaker 2 (20:42):
But the indication from not just Seattle Police, but King
County Sheriff at the time, and then all of the
federal agents that were involved, Secret Service, et cetera. We
had to be credentialed through the Secret Service to cover
the World Trade Organization because it was literally economic leaders
and the heads of state from around the world. And
(21:05):
they said after the first day and things start getting crazy,
they basically said, your credential doesn't mean anything.
Speaker 3 (21:13):
You are on the street at your own risk.
Speaker 2 (21:15):
Which was clear from the beginning, which was if things
go well, this credential will get you into areas that
otherwise you wouldn't be able to. But we have the
right on a moment's notice to revoke your individual credential
or change the rules about where the media is allowed
to go and be. And it was very clear after
(21:36):
that first day when things started going south, they just said,
you're on your.
Speaker 1 (21:40):
Own same message when I was in Seattle covering that,
I want to say two thousand and five, which would
I guess make sense, They said, credentials.
Speaker 3 (21:51):
Mean nothing.
Speaker 2 (21:52):
Right, Yeah, and it's you take a chance when you
go out there as a reporter, photographer, whatever you run
the risk of.
Speaker 1 (22:02):
You know, I kind of wanted to get shot, not shot.
Speaker 3 (22:07):
I didn't want to get shot. I should dial that back.
Speaker 1 (22:10):
I wanted to get grazed with a less than lethal
bullet just because I knew that was guaranteed Murrow Award territory.
Speaker 3 (22:18):
At the time. I was young.
Speaker 1 (22:19):
I was twenty four years old. And if you were
a reporter.
Speaker 3 (22:23):
That got into it.
Speaker 1 (22:24):
I had a friend who was tear gassed in taste
and he got the.
Speaker 3 (22:28):
Murrow that year.
Speaker 1 (22:30):
Oh jealous because of it. Now, I'll take a quick
little tasing. I'll take some pepper spray for that award.
I mean, I learned everything I know from Steve Gregory.
I'll go out on a limb for a piece of
hardware like that to put on my mantle. There are
reporters that insinuate themselves into the stories, just like the
(22:51):
agitators do for personal gain. I'm saying that half joking,
by the way, Like I'm not completely joking and I'm
not completely serious about.
Speaker 3 (23:02):
The less than lethal shot to the thigh. Yeah, just
to see what it would do well.
Speaker 1 (23:05):
My thigh could take it, as we know, but my
calf would strike.
Speaker 3 (23:10):
Keep beating them potatoes, you know what I mean?
Speaker 1 (23:13):
Good thing that half fell out of the cups.
Speaker 2 (23:15):
Standing by for an update from Mayor Karen Bass from
somewhere downtown.
Speaker 3 (23:20):
We hope to bring that to you live as soon
as it happens.
Speaker 6 (23:24):
You're listening to Gary and Shannon on demand from KFI
Am six forty.
Speaker 2 (23:29):
We're gonna go live now downtown Los Angeles for this
update for Mayor Karen Bass.
Speaker 8 (23:33):
A series of them, and we don't have a lot
of information about that one rally. I do want to
say that at six o'clock tonight, though, there will be
an inter faith prayer vigil of which I will be
honored to attend, and it will be at six o'clock,
calling for peace, calling for unifying our community, calling for
supporting immigrant Angelinos.
Speaker 9 (23:54):
So let me just say.
Speaker 8 (23:55):
Now, commenting about last night, the violence we saw last night,
there is just no way to view it as unacceptable.
So I do not believe that individuals that commit vandalism
and violence in our city really are in support of immigrants.
Speaker 9 (24:11):
They have another agenda.
Speaker 8 (24:12):
If you support immigrants and the rights of immigrants to
be in our city, you would not be tearing the
city apart or vandalizing it. And I do want to say,
especially for our national audiences, that those of us in
Los Angeles understand that the unrest that has happened are
a few blocks within the downtown area. It is not
(24:34):
all of downtown, and it is not all of the city. Unfortunately,
the visuals make it seem as though our entire city
is in flames, and it is not the case at all,
And I think it's important to.
Speaker 9 (24:46):
Say that now.
Speaker 8 (24:47):
Having said that, though the violence and the damage is unacceptable,
it is not going to be tolerated and individuals will
be arrested and prosecuted to the full extent of the law.
And individual that is involved in vandalism should think because
they went home that night that they're off scot free,
because investigations will take place, and I am assured by
(25:10):
the police department that there will be follow up and arrests.
The extensive vandalism downtown, especially of the graffiti that is
just blanketing a number of blocks, has been extensive.
Speaker 9 (25:26):
We are one year away from the World Cup.
Speaker 8 (25:29):
This is about beautifying our city and bringing our city
together and so I am calling on business leaders, community leaders,
faith leaders to come together downtown in the next few
days to talk about how we are going to clean
up the city. Obviously, city workers are already out there
removing the graffiti, but this is so extensive it's going.
Speaker 9 (25:50):
To take community wide involvement.
Speaker 8 (25:52):
We had launched a program called Shine LA a couple
of months ago in preparation for the World Cup, and
now we are called on to direct that citywide. We
need people from all over the city to come to
downtown and to help with this effort. The staff, the
mayoral staff standing behind me represent the best of our
(26:13):
organizers and community liaisons, and they will be leading that effort.
I do want to go back and say that, just
go back in time a minute. On Thursday of last week,
Los Angeles was peaceful. There was nothing going on here
that warranted the federal intervention that took place the very
next day. If we want to look at the cause
(26:35):
of what is happening here, I take it back to
raids that took place on Friday, and the uncertainty and
the fear, and the fact that families across the city
are terrified that they don't know if they should go
to work. They don't know if they should go to school.
We have people that were detained. We don't even know
the exact numbers of the people that were detained. We
(26:56):
have people that have not had contact with legal represent
nor have they even had contact with their families, and
so there is an awful lot of concern. When the
administration started, they said that this was about crime. They
were going to go after violent felons, drug dealers, and
I don't know how that matches with the scenes that
we saw of people in home depot running through the
(27:19):
parking lot because they were afraid that they were going
to get arrested. You were talking about people who are
trying to survive day by day, which is what a
day laborer is doing, and why they would be considered
as part of a problem as opposed to contributing to
our economy is very difficult for me to understand. We've
also received reports of people who were here legally, who
(27:43):
were showing up for their annual appointment at the immigration
office and maybe even showing up with their family and
getting detained. This is just absolutely unnecessary. People have asked
me what are the Marines going to do when they
get here. That's a good question. I have no idea.
The National Guard that are here now have one assignment
and that is to protect one building, which is the
(28:05):
Federal Building downtown the second building, which is the Federal
building on Westwood Boulevard, And as far as I know,
nothing has happened in Westwood at all, So this was
not needed. The idea that the administration would usurp the
authority of our state government, take it away from our
Governor Gavin Newsom. The governor knows that if we put
(28:28):
a request in for the National Guard and it went
to him, he would comply. There was never an issue
there because we were never thinking about calling upon the
National Guard. So I do want you to know that
the violence that has happened has required LAPD to ask
for additional assistance, but not.
Speaker 9 (28:46):
From the federal government.
Speaker 8 (28:48):
We are a county of eighty eight cities. There's a
number of police departments in those cities, and we have
the Sheriff's department, and so we have received assistance from
the California Highway Patrol. I mentioned the sheriffs from Orange County,
San Bernardino, Riverside, Santa Barbara, Ventura County, and a number
of law enforcement departments around the county. So with them
(29:11):
being fully deployed. Now we're establishing a unified command under
LAPD and Chief McDonald, which will accelerate our ability to
respond to hotspots when people splinter off and create pockets
of trouble. So I do want to thank all the
officers who've been working tirelessly and putting themselves at risk to.
Speaker 9 (29:30):
Keep our city safe. But the real.
Speaker 8 (29:32):
Solution of all of this is for the administration to
stop the raids. We have heard that these raids might
take place for the next thirty days.
Speaker 9 (29:40):
We don't know how many are going to take place
in a given nave been listening to a Markica ambassadre.
Speaker 3 (29:45):
I don't know why they're cutting it off there. It's
going to be interesting.
Speaker 1 (29:50):
LAPD should do well with budget concerns moving forward.
Speaker 3 (29:54):
They should get whatever they want.
Speaker 1 (29:57):
If they didn't feel like their force was an enough
and were like she said, we've got eighty eight cities.
You ask for help, you ask for reinforcements. But the
fact that the national government is coming in and adding
those reinforcements and the local political leadership's not going to
like that.
Speaker 8 (30:12):
Back to mayor best federal government decides they want to
roll up on a state, a roll up on a
city and take over. So if that I would open
it up for questions of which Zach will manage.
Speaker 5 (30:25):
Thanks, Mayor Bathk.
Speaker 3 (30:26):
I know that you're saying that some of the violence
that we've seen, any chaos later in the evenings, that
it's only limited to a few streets, but it does
seem to be ramping up.
Speaker 1 (30:35):
There was a lot of looting last night's running to
other parts of downtown LA.
Speaker 5 (30:39):
I know you've said that the solution is.
Speaker 2 (30:40):
To stop the raids, but the federal government has said
that's not going to happen.
Speaker 3 (30:44):
What is your plan to bring.
Speaker 8 (30:46):
Calm to the city. Well, first of all, when I
say a few streets, I don't mean that to mean
like it's very small, because the vandalism, especially the graffiti,
has happened kind of outside of that. But nevertheless, I'm
trying to counter the image that this is happening all
over our city because it is not, and so we
do want law enforcement to respond aggressively. Anybody that is
(31:09):
out committing crimes are not doing it in solidarity with immigrants.
They are doing the exact opposite. So we have to
enforce the law here. I'm going to continue advocating with
the federal government though, to see how.
Speaker 9 (31:20):
Disruptive this is.
Speaker 8 (31:22):
But there needs to be a call that says this
is unacceptable and if you engage in this behavior, you
will be prosecuted. Now we're looking at things like curfews,
We're looking at other aggressive response that we can have
in case this violence breaks out again.
Speaker 4 (31:38):
Do you think they're willing to a confu and wouldn't
you say the LAPD is being aggressive?
Speaker 8 (31:43):
Well, I do think that they are, but I do
think that we need to be in terms of prevention,
and I don't mean aggressive in terms of engaging with
the crowd, but there's things that you can do to prevent.
So I had a brief conversation with the chief this
morning about a curfew, so we will be meeting about
that later on today. And that's the type of aggressive
tactic I was referring to.
Speaker 1 (32:04):
And that doesn't infringe on protesters' rights because the people
there out after dark aren't there to protest or they're
to loot.
Speaker 9 (32:12):
For sixty millions the new information this minute go ahead.
Speaker 5 (32:18):
Yes, And so.
Speaker 8 (32:19):
Your response to that, it seems like despite the calls
from you and the governor, the answers are going up
for the Well, that doesn't mean that I will stop.
You know that I'm not going to give up. But
on the other hand, you just said sixty days. Somebody
else is going to say thirty. Somebody's going to say ninety.
The bottom line is we don't know, and that is
consistent with ice raids. Of course, we never know when,
(32:40):
we never know how long. But that very notion creates
such a terrible sense of fear in our city, and
it's just not right to do that to a population
who's trying to survive.
Speaker 9 (32:51):
We are a city of immigrants.
Speaker 3 (32:54):
Follow up the price tags.
Speaker 9 (32:56):
Let's put over I think one hundred and thirty million
right us.
Speaker 8 (33:00):
The government federal at some point come back to the
city for reimbursement of any part of this. No, I
think that was money as they wants.
Speaker 9 (33:09):
To spend on the true motilization. Maybe that's what you're
referring to.
Speaker 8 (33:13):
They don't need to spend it themselves, so I could
not even imagine that they would come here and ask
us to reimburse their unnecessary expense. Just imagine what we
could do with one hundred and thirty million dollars in
terms of preparing our city for the World Cup. Exactly, No,
LA cannot afford it.
Speaker 4 (33:35):
Yes, c for notes my understanding correctives is wrong and
the city has not ever received any reenforcements on fire
money Spence and.
Speaker 1 (33:46):
Go.
Speaker 8 (33:47):
I'm wondering as no, that that is correct, But Julia,
at this point in time, that would be really early.
Speaker 9 (33:54):
Oh okay, where are you going with the government?
Speaker 3 (33:58):
Are we worried that they will not follow through on.
Speaker 9 (34:03):
Let me just I'm sorry you finished?
Speaker 8 (34:05):
Yeah, okay, I was worried about that before the ice rates.
Speaker 9 (34:10):
I mean that is a worry.
Speaker 8 (34:11):
I mean, you know, the theme of the administration is uncertainty,
and so I have been very hopeful and you know
this in terms of the fires and the cooperation we
received from the federal government working well with the administration.
And now the pendulum has swung in a whole nother area.
Speaker 3 (34:28):
What would that mean for the city? Exact money in
the papers?
Speaker 9 (34:31):
Well, you know what it would mean.
Speaker 8 (34:32):
I mean, you know that we came off of a
very difficult budget year. But you also it's very important
to understand that it takes FEMA a long time. We're
still looking for some reimbursements from COVID and that didn't
have anything to do with this administration.
Speaker 5 (34:46):
Are there are reports in la USC would ploy school
police instead of saying young, you're our campus graduations.
Speaker 6 (34:54):
I made the ice raids. The superintendent did not move
out the potential for a standoff involving school police if
federal officers attention to enter the school on campus.
Speaker 3 (35:06):
Have you been coordinating LAPD?
Speaker 9 (35:09):
What sort of respond with LAPD?
Speaker 6 (35:11):
What LPD should Would LAPD be a part of any
response should the federal government?
Speaker 1 (35:22):
No?
Speaker 8 (35:22):
Well, yeah, let me just say that I have been
a close coordination has not been necessary right now, but
I have been in conversation with Superintendent Kvala. We spoke
the other day, and what he is deciding to do.
I know he's deciding to.
Speaker 9 (35:37):
Protect the children.
Speaker 8 (35:39):
You know that a month ago or two months ago,
I say, ICE agents showed up to an elementary school
to do a welfare check on some kids. It's it's
very interesting that you would send federal officers in to
check on elementary school kids. But I know he's also
dealing with the fear from the parents. So, for example,
at my grandson's school yesterday, there was ICE that was visible.
(36:02):
And you have parents who were dropping off and picking
up their kids, how do you think they feel? You know,
I mean, it's a sense of intimidation and fear that
is just so unnecessary and so corrosive to our city.
Speaker 3 (36:20):
Good warning, you're watching the NBC four News.
Speaker 1 (36:22):
All right, we will cut away from this as well.
We'll monitor all of the questions that are asked and answered.
One of the stories that we'll get to at some
point in the show was something that was highlighted when
John Coblts interviewed.
Speaker 3 (36:39):
Tom Holman.
Speaker 1 (36:40):
Tom Holman yesterday, and it was what happened at the
outset of all this, what the what the ignition point was,
And it wasn't home depot. It was the fact that
there was a business in the garment district that was
looking at for trafficking and other things that were like
real bad federal racketeering type trafficking charges behavior activity that
(37:07):
was going on. That's what started this whole thing. It
wasn't picking up day laborers at home depots.
Speaker 2 (37:14):
She also referred to that that people running through the
home depot parking lot afraid that they were going to
be picked up, but bill a sale the US attorney
explained the facility, the federal facility where agents were staging
for other operation. They weren't even looking at the home.
They even smell the home depot. They were across the
(37:34):
street from it, and people got caught up in it. Now,
I mean, her point is that that causes fear to
see Federal Border Patrol, immigration customers enforcement. That I get it,
but be clear about what exactly happened.
Speaker 1 (37:50):
When you lie to people about that, then they're not
going to believe you down the road.
Speaker 2 (37:54):
Gavin Newsom the other day as well, and that interview
with MSNBC on Sunday night said when you you know,
he told I'm home and come after me, tough guy, whatever,
and he said hands get your hands off the four
year old.
Speaker 3 (38:06):
Yeah, that was an odd turn of phrase.
Speaker 2 (38:08):
Give me the explain that if you want, if there's true,
if there's truth to them, there's an anecdote that a
four year old was picked up and taken away by ice,
then tell me exactly rolling on a plane and taken
to a prison in El Salvador. You've been listening to
the Gary and Shannon Show. You can always hear us
live on KFI AM six forty nine am to one
pm every Monday through Friday, and anytime on demand on
(38:30):
the iHeartRadio LAP
This is Gary and Shannon and you're listening to KFI
AM six forty, the Gary and Shannon Show on demand
on the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
We've seen all of the protests in downtown Los Angeles.
There were protests against immigration rates in Santa Ana last
night that also turned pretty chaotic. They were throwing things
at law enforcement officers. By midnight, the ongoing protests had
largely dispersed. As of this morning, though a couple of
different camera shots of that area right around downtown, that
(00:32):
two or three block area that's been sort of the
hotbed of this was covered in graffiti, and as of
this morning, they've made incredible progress either painting over it
or cleaning it off.
Speaker 3 (00:41):
A lot of spaces, well, we have a.
Speaker 1 (00:42):
Lot of jurisdiction questions, legal jurisdiction questions. This is the
first time, as I mentioned, that a president is sent
in the National Guard in sixty years without the governor's okay.
Who gets to say what goes on the streets of
LA Where does state sovereignty the land when it comes
to the big power spectrum?
Speaker 3 (01:03):
I guess?
Speaker 2 (01:04):
And joining us to talk more about this is a
professor with one of those fold out business cards because
the title is so long. Jessica Levinson, Clinical Professor of Law,
director of Loyal LA Law School's Public Service Institute. Excuse me,
Director of Loyal LA Law Schools Journalists Law School, Jessica,
thank you for taking time for us today.
Speaker 3 (01:23):
He's so jealous.
Speaker 4 (01:26):
I did not know about this fold out business card situation.
Speaker 5 (01:30):
I feel very in the dark.
Speaker 4 (01:31):
I thought I was here to talk about silkwood scrubs.
Speaker 5 (01:34):
I feel there.
Speaker 4 (01:35):
I feel very much like the rug was pulled out
from under me, and now you're asking me legal questions.
Speaker 5 (01:41):
So here we go, Here we go.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
Let's begin with the legal jurisdiction that the President used
in order to go around the governor and federalize the
California National Guard.
Speaker 4 (01:54):
Okay, so I think it's really important that we just
stick to what these statutes say, stick to what Congress
said when they provided presidents with this power. And so
we're looking at Title ten. Why are we looking there.
Speaker 5 (02:08):
Because the President wrote in his.
Speaker 4 (02:10):
Memorandum he cited to the statutes Title ten, section twelve
four h six.
Speaker 5 (02:16):
I'm sorry, I'm not going to do that again. And
what that section says.
Speaker 4 (02:20):
Is that the president can federalize the National Guard when
he believes that there is a rebellion or the danger
of a rebellion. There is language in there that says
that the orders must be issued through the governor.
Speaker 5 (02:35):
And so what I would.
Speaker 4 (02:36):
Highlight is there are basically two legal questions here. One
is what's a rebellion and who gets to decide? Is
it the president that gets to decide? Can a federal
judge say, you know what, I don't think it rises
to the level? And second guess the president. We can
talk about that. And then there's this question of whether
or not the language of an order issued through the
(02:57):
governor means that the governor has to consent. I think,
as you said, there are situations where the president has
sent in the National Guard without the governor's consent. We
can think about enforcing desegregation orders, for instance. So there's
history and practice to indicate that that language does not
require consent.
Speaker 3 (03:18):
So this could go to a federal judge.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
Does this go the distance when it comes to different
definitions of what rebellion means and who makes the final call?
Speaker 3 (03:31):
I guess if.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
It goes to distance of Supreme Court in terms of
does the president get to decide what the definition of
rebellion is right.
Speaker 4 (03:41):
So yes, this goes to a federal judge. California filed
last night. I think I was on my way to
teach constitutional law when the suit was filed. And California
is certainly arguing here that there is no rebellion, and
I think there can be an honest discs question about.
Speaker 5 (04:00):
Whether or not there truly is a rebellion. But I
want to pick up on the second part of your question,
which is who gets to decide? And so when we
think about.
Speaker 4 (04:08):
These questions, generally speaking, federal judges are pretty deferential to
the president when it comes to questions about what is
a rebellion, when it comes to broader questions about national security.
And so if we take this out of just what
is happening right now today and think about who gets
to make the determination, you know, think about Trump versus
(04:32):
Hawaii that was the travel band case, think about other
cases where the president is saying their national security concerns.
Generally speaking, federal judges do defer to the judgment of
an elected president.
Speaker 3 (04:46):
Can we talk about the timing.
Speaker 2 (04:48):
We know that California Attorney General Rob Bonta has sued
the president over what Rob Bonta says, is this unlawful order?
What kind of a timeline are we looking at in
terms of getting this thing literally before a judge and
having some sort of a decision. Is it going to
impact what's going on on the streets of LA.
Speaker 4 (05:10):
So potentially, I'm going to give an answer that everybody hates,
which is basically, it depends.
Speaker 5 (05:15):
It depends on how quickly the judge who.
Speaker 4 (05:19):
Gets this case wants to set briefing, And my guess
is very very quickly.
Speaker 5 (05:24):
So we know that judges can act on.
Speaker 4 (05:28):
An expedited basis when the facts call for it, and
I would say the facts call for it right at
this point, where this isn't a contract dispute, This isn't
a matter of interpreting a bankruptcy code where we can
all wait a while and purposely you notice not using
words like it's going to be by the end of
the day or we're going to have an answer within
(05:49):
X number of weeks. I think we're talking about something
that's going to happen much more quickly than a typical
federal suit. I think that a judge will set a
quick briefing schedule, will allow the Department's Justice to respond,
and we're going to have a hearing, I would guess
within a week.
Speaker 1 (06:07):
So just looking at a casual definition of rebellion, going
back to that open resistance to an established government, is
there an argument because I see in the echo chamber
that is Twitter, that people are pointing to the fact
that people are here illegally and they're waving foreign flags
and that that is a definition or that is an
(06:29):
example of a rebellion. Is there an argument that in California,
in Los Angeles and disagree with it or not to
people listening that in California Los Angeles it's a sanctuary city,
it's a sanctuary state essentially, So in the established government
of Los Angeles in California, that's not open resistance.
Speaker 3 (06:51):
Frankly, that's allowed now. It may be.
Speaker 1 (06:54):
Resistance to the established federal government and the federal laws
US not being a say, sanctuary country, but they are operating.
If you're going to split hairs under the umbrella of
what's acceptable when it comes to the government in LA
in California, So.
Speaker 5 (07:12):
I think that's an important question.
Speaker 4 (07:13):
I'd like to separate a couple of issues when it
comes to being a sanctuary city or a sanctuary state.
Speaker 5 (07:19):
I think you have the power.
Speaker 4 (07:21):
We talk about the Tenth Amendment and state sovereignty and
state autonomy and independence. The states have the power to
say to the federal government, I'm not going to carry
your water, I'm not going to help you enforce federal law.
But states also can't undermine cities can't undermine the federal
government in carrying out federal law.
Speaker 5 (07:40):
So those are just two things that we need to
think about.
Speaker 4 (07:43):
I would say I think about the rebellion as being
separate this question of whether or not there's a rebellion,
and I think very specifically about whether or not the
actions that have taken place over the last few days
would rise to the law under the definition of the statue,
under the statute. And I think you can have an
(08:07):
honest conversation about whether or not this truly does look
like a rebellion. But we get back to the same
question of who gets to make the final call, and
we certainly have a president who's embracing a very broad
view of his power. We see this when it comes
to other immigration laws, the Alien Enemies Act, we see
(08:28):
it when it comes to tariffs, and we see in
some cases federal judge is saying no, for instance, for tariffs,
we think you're pointing to statutes that don't give you
this power in this case. I will just kind of
offer these are the things that a judge is going
to look at, whether or not the judge wants to
second guess a president when it comes to these questions.
(08:49):
And some judges may be comfortable saying we are just
so far from what the statute envisions as a rebellion
that I'm going to say no.
Speaker 2 (08:58):
Well, what an absolutely boring yawn full time to be
a constitutional law professor.
Speaker 3 (09:05):
I really don't know.
Speaker 1 (09:06):
I like want to jump into your awesome Jessica.
Speaker 3 (09:11):
Thank you for your time today. We appreciate it.
Speaker 5 (09:14):
Thank you you, bet.
Speaker 2 (09:15):
Jessica Levinson there again from Loyal Law School, about what's
going on in terms of these constitutional questions that are
being played out in the courts while all of this
other stuff is being played out on the streets of LA.
Speaker 6 (09:30):
You're listening to Gary and Shannon on demand from KFI.
I am six.
Speaker 1 (09:34):
Forty quick distinction I want to make is that, well,
you were talking earlier about a line that should be
crossed or should not be crossed, and we have gotten
a little complacent, to say the least when it comes
with allowing certain behaviors from protesters. You know, yes, we
were built on protesting. Yes, you know, you go back
(09:55):
to the tea party, the whole bit. There's a rich history,
there's a rich history of peaceful protest. But he was killed,
nobody was hurt. Of course, we didn't have social media,
so we don't know that for a fact. But yes,
when violence starts, when breaking the law starts at a protest,
that is the line. The looting, the robbery, the assault
(10:17):
not part should not be a part of protest in
this country. Absolutely don't want to. What's the word equivocate?
Speaker 4 (10:30):
Vague?
Speaker 1 (10:31):
Equivocate is good. It's not exactly the word I'm looking for,
but it's there. Equivocate waiver waiver? I want a waiver
on that? Are you learning Hawaiian before your trip there?
Speaker 3 (10:45):
That's the fish, that's the state fish. What else? Do
you know? What other Hawaiian things do you know? I
don't know much. Do you know? Mahaalo that I know? Aloha? See?
Should I do my duo link Maya Maya Highway? Yes?
Hali akola? Uh huh?
Speaker 5 (11:06):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (11:07):
What else you got?
Speaker 5 (11:08):
I know?
Speaker 3 (11:09):
There's something else. You're holding something back and feel it. No, no,
just the fish that was it? Okay, we are standing by.
Speaker 2 (11:19):
We do expect Mayor Bass to hold a news conference
coming up in a few minutes. Based on what we've
seen in the past. It won't start on time, not
necessarily because of her, but that's just the way things go.
There are about seventeen hundred National Guard troops currently operating
throughout the LA area, and as we mentioned before, they
(11:39):
will be joined by a few hundred Marines who are
also going to be coming in. These are not the
only protests that are going on. Obviously, there were some
in Santa Anna last night where they protesters had to
be dispersed, and an estimated nine thousand people showed up
last night in San Francisco. Nine thousand far out numbers
(12:01):
I think what we've seen so far in LA over
the last few days. But this was a protest at
twenty fourth in Mission at the bart Plaza about six
o'clock last night. People in or police in San Francisco,
so that they arrested nine thousand.
Speaker 1 (12:16):
I mean that must have been people brought in from
other places.
Speaker 3 (12:21):
Or it's just people.
Speaker 2 (12:24):
Well, yeah, they've been Yeah, because there's not a lot
of I don't even think there's nine thousand people living
in San Francisco anymore. At it's not in inside. But
the protests are beginning to spread. There are expectations that
we will see at least twenty five rallies and demonstrations
coast to coast, from New York to Chicago and Dallas
(12:46):
and Atlanta. They have been advertised on social media asking
people to come and gather in those states and cities
as they take this stand against the immigrant enforcement operations.
I suppose is that is the way to put it.
So anyway, we'll keep an eye on all of that stuff.
(13:08):
And again we're waiting for an update from Mayor Bass
here in just a few minutes.
Speaker 1 (13:12):
Yeah, we'll break a little bit early, just because we
want to be able to break into that when it unfolds.
See what the plan is here, because there has been
pushed back amongst the police chief and the mayor as
well when it comes into sending the Marines and more
National Guard troops.
Speaker 3 (13:30):
So we'll see what their response is.
Speaker 6 (13:33):
You're listening to Gary and Shannon on demand from KFI
A M six forty.
Speaker 2 (13:37):
There are standing by Mayor Karen Bass is expected to
hold a news conference for updates from the city's perspective
on what's been going on with the protests outside in
this streets of downtown LA. So when we get to that,
we'll break in for you.
Speaker 3 (13:52):
Right now, I believe they are in the prayer.
Speaker 1 (13:54):
There are people in tears.
Speaker 3 (13:57):
It's all a big How can I use this politically?
The prayer? What do you mean, Oh, they do a prayer.
Oh before the news conference?
Speaker 5 (14:05):
Oh?
Speaker 3 (14:05):
Sure.
Speaker 2 (14:07):
You were asking earlier to in the show sort of
a tongue in cheek moment if something were to happen
to you, if you would end up on an episode
of Dateline.
Speaker 3 (14:15):
Well I would hope.
Speaker 1 (14:16):
So Robbie, listen, if I'm going to be taken out,
I want it to be in spectacular fashion, and I
want Keith Morrison to be the guy that handles it.
Speaker 5 (14:27):
Well, Hey Gary, Hey.
Speaker 7 (14:27):
Hannon, Kenny. Yeah, I'm gonna hate to burst your bubble here.
I don't think you're going to qualify for Dayline. I
don't think anyone has ever said once, Wow, she really
just brightens up every room she walks into. So, yeah,
you're saying you're not going to get killed by anybody,
all right, take care of everyone.
Speaker 3 (14:43):
It's so true.
Speaker 1 (14:44):
I am so safe because that is not my personality.
Speaker 3 (14:48):
I appreciate that.
Speaker 1 (14:48):
It's so nice to feel seen, like when somebody really
knows you.
Speaker 3 (14:53):
It's such a warm feeling. That's pretty good. One of
the issues that has come that people like it's so true.
Speaker 1 (15:02):
It's like if Dayline was to interview my friends, they'd be.
Speaker 3 (15:05):
Like, what what was she like?
Speaker 1 (15:07):
Like, yeah, I could see this coming, like it wasn't
gonna be good. I can see somebody wanting to kill her.
I can see her husband chopping up her body and
throwing it across three different states. Absolutely, I said counties.
You did say counties in your hypothesis.
Speaker 3 (15:23):
How much he likes to drive? You you know he
likes to drive? Okay, well maybe three states.
Speaker 1 (15:28):
But I don't think you'd think I was worth it,
you know, I think counties was much more realistic.
Speaker 3 (15:34):
The worst the gas money.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
One of the issues that has come up in these
not just these protests, but other protests that we have seen,
of course, is reporters getting involved with this and and
and I'm talking about not the street what's the word,
not the citizen. Reporters right, everybody with their phone out
or you know, you hold a camera with a long
lens on it and you think you've become a photojournalist
(15:58):
in some way, when in all honesty, you're getting in
the way. But I mean people fully credentialed members of
the media who arguably should have some insight into what's
going on now for those of you who don't know. Generally,
reporters have the ability in an event like that to
(16:19):
in many cases not be subject to the same rules
that protesters are. For example, oftentimes there will be sections
of an intersection or a street or a loc park
maybe where the law enforcement will tell you this is
your designated media area, and we know that if you're
(16:40):
in the area you have credentials. We assume you have credentials,
and we're not going to make you move.
Speaker 1 (16:45):
I know, and you probably know because you were in
the field around the same time as I was people
personally who got quite the payout from the city for
violence at the hands of.
Speaker 3 (16:57):
The LAPD while they covered protest.
Speaker 1 (17:00):
So now, specifically in Los Angeles, everyone is very well
versed on how to cover a protest, where to go,
what orders to give, what orders to listen to, and
all of the above.
Speaker 2 (17:11):
There was a reporter on Sunday, an Australian TV reporter
who was shot in the leg with rubber bullets, or
I should say hit in the leg. We don't know
if the officer was aiming at her specifically or what
he was aiming at, but she got hit with rubber
bullets in the leg. The Prime Minister of Australia got
her on the horn to see if she was.
Speaker 3 (17:31):
Okay, that's it.
Speaker 2 (17:34):
You're covering a protest in downtown Los Angeles that had
already at that point become violent.
Speaker 1 (17:43):
Well, who is the protest? What's the relationship between Australia
and Trump? Number one? Do they hate him? Do they
hate us? Okay, then let's use this chaos for our
own political gain. Right Number two? Is this like the
Barbara Walters of Australia? Is she a big deal? Is
this Katie Kuric?
Speaker 3 (17:58):
Is this was somebody more topical like the mid nineties
Kelly Rippa? I don't know. Is it somebody? Is it
somebody who will?
Speaker 6 (18:11):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (18:12):
Is it a national journalistic treasure that we're talking about?
Speaker 3 (18:15):
That was hitting no idea?
Speaker 1 (18:16):
Because then I could understand it rising to that level
but otherwise it seems so.
Speaker 4 (18:20):
As I was walking over to men last night.
Speaker 6 (18:24):
As I was walking over to the officer tried to explain,
what's you know, who I was, identified, who I was with.
I turned it. He said, I'd like you to turn around.
I turned around it.
Speaker 2 (18:36):
But this is a CNN reporter who was detained, not arrested.
Detained because he was in the wrong place at the
wrong time. He wasn't arrested, He was never cuffed. Once
they he his description of it. He cooperated with the
officer who was asking him to move, and he didn't
move at the time. Once they show his credentials, or
once he gets his credentials, they let him go and
(18:58):
they just tell him, hey, next time, pay attention what
we're saying.
Speaker 3 (19:00):
Or if you're in a dangerous area.
Speaker 2 (19:03):
The whole thing is cops don't want to go out
there and just beat the living crap out of everybody.
They would rather you just turn and went home. That
that's what they would rather do. Mix their day a
lot easier. And if you're one of the people that's
out there and there's nothing that necessarily delineates you from
somebody else in the crowd, granted the guy had a
or a photographer with him with a giant camera on
(19:26):
his shoulder, which would have I would have assumed, given
some sort of indication, that he was a member of
the credentialed media.
Speaker 3 (19:33):
But you you.
Speaker 2 (19:34):
Go out there knowing that there is potential danger out there.
Speaker 3 (19:40):
The last time I covered an.
Speaker 2 (19:43):
Event of that size, and it was much bigger than
what we've seen the last couple of days was the
World Trade Organization riots in nineteen seven or seventy, sorry,
nineteen ninety nine in Seattle.
Speaker 3 (19:54):
All right, what happened? I did just spill.
Speaker 2 (19:56):
I was cutting a potato and were you eating lunch
in the middle of my story?
Speaker 3 (20:02):
I'm sorry, you can't even turn the mic on.
Speaker 1 (20:07):
In my defense, I was quietly eating my soup, which
has big chunks of vegetables in it. And this was
a large potato, as you can see I can, and
I was cutting it with my spoon, and half and
half the potato jumped out of the cup and landed
right here, and it was quite a big piece.
Speaker 2 (20:25):
Well, the half potato was more excited to hear my
story than you were.
Speaker 3 (20:28):
I know, I'm listening story. It's about the WTO in Seattle, nineteen,
nineteen ninety nine.
Speaker 2 (20:33):
This was about a week after my son was born,
and listen one day.
Speaker 3 (20:40):
Off, two days, two days off.
Speaker 2 (20:42):
But the indication from not just Seattle Police, but King
County Sheriff at the time, and then all of the
federal agents that were involved, Secret Service, et cetera. We
had to be credentialed through the Secret Service to cover
the World Trade Organization because it was literally economic leaders
and the heads of state from around the world. And
(21:05):
they said after the first day and things start getting crazy,
they basically said, your credential doesn't mean anything.
Speaker 3 (21:13):
You are on the street at your own risk.
Speaker 2 (21:15):
Which was clear from the beginning, which was if things
go well, this credential will get you into areas that
otherwise you wouldn't be able to. But we have the
right on a moment's notice to revoke your individual credential
or change the rules about where the media is allowed
to go and be. And it was very clear after
(21:36):
that first day when things started going south, they just said,
you're on your.
Speaker 1 (21:40):
Own same message when I was in Seattle covering that,
I want to say two thousand and five, which would
I guess make sense, They said, credentials.
Speaker 3 (21:51):
Mean nothing.
Speaker 2 (21:52):
Right, Yeah, and it's you take a chance when you
go out there as a reporter, photographer, whatever you run
the risk of.
Speaker 1 (22:02):
You know, I kind of wanted to get shot, not shot.
Speaker 3 (22:07):
I didn't want to get shot. I should dial that back.
Speaker 1 (22:10):
I wanted to get grazed with a less than lethal
bullet just because I knew that was guaranteed Murrow Award territory.
Speaker 3 (22:18):
At the time. I was young.
Speaker 1 (22:19):
I was twenty four years old. And if you were
a reporter.
Speaker 3 (22:23):
That got into it.
Speaker 1 (22:24):
I had a friend who was tear gassed in taste
and he got the.
Speaker 3 (22:28):
Murrow that year.
Speaker 1 (22:30):
Oh jealous because of it. Now, I'll take a quick
little tasing. I'll take some pepper spray for that award.
I mean, I learned everything I know from Steve Gregory.
I'll go out on a limb for a piece of
hardware like that to put on my mantle. There are
reporters that insinuate themselves into the stories, just like the
(22:51):
agitators do for personal gain. I'm saying that half joking,
by the way, Like I'm not completely joking and I'm
not completely serious about.
Speaker 3 (23:02):
The less than lethal shot to the thigh. Yeah, just
to see what it would do well.
Speaker 1 (23:05):
My thigh could take it, as we know, but my
calf would strike.
Speaker 3 (23:10):
Keep beating them potatoes, you know what I mean?
Speaker 1 (23:13):
Good thing that half fell out of the cups.
Speaker 2 (23:15):
Standing by for an update from Mayor Karen Bass from
somewhere downtown.
Speaker 3 (23:20):
We hope to bring that to you live as soon
as it happens.
Speaker 6 (23:24):
You're listening to Gary and Shannon on demand from KFI
Am six forty.
Speaker 2 (23:29):
We're gonna go live now downtown Los Angeles for this
update for Mayor Karen Bass.
Speaker 8 (23:33):
A series of them, and we don't have a lot
of information about that one rally. I do want to
say that at six o'clock tonight, though, there will be
an inter faith prayer vigil of which I will be
honored to attend, and it will be at six o'clock,
calling for peace, calling for unifying our community, calling for
supporting immigrant Angelinos.
Speaker 9 (23:54):
So let me just say.
Speaker 8 (23:55):
Now, commenting about last night, the violence we saw last night,
there is just no way to view it as unacceptable.
So I do not believe that individuals that commit vandalism
and violence in our city really are in support of immigrants.
Speaker 9 (24:11):
They have another agenda.
Speaker 8 (24:12):
If you support immigrants and the rights of immigrants to
be in our city, you would not be tearing the
city apart or vandalizing it. And I do want to say,
especially for our national audiences, that those of us in
Los Angeles understand that the unrest that has happened are
a few blocks within the downtown area. It is not
(24:34):
all of downtown, and it is not all of the city. Unfortunately,
the visuals make it seem as though our entire city
is in flames, and it is not the case at all,
And I think it's important to.
Speaker 9 (24:46):
Say that now.
Speaker 8 (24:47):
Having said that, though the violence and the damage is unacceptable,
it is not going to be tolerated and individuals will
be arrested and prosecuted to the full extent of the law.
And individual that is involved in vandalism should think because
they went home that night that they're off scot free,
because investigations will take place, and I am assured by
(25:10):
the police department that there will be follow up and arrests.
The extensive vandalism downtown, especially of the graffiti that is
just blanketing a number of blocks, has been extensive.
Speaker 9 (25:26):
We are one year away from the World Cup.
Speaker 8 (25:29):
This is about beautifying our city and bringing our city
together and so I am calling on business leaders, community leaders,
faith leaders to come together downtown in the next few
days to talk about how we are going to clean
up the city. Obviously, city workers are already out there
removing the graffiti, but this is so extensive it's going.
Speaker 9 (25:50):
To take community wide involvement.
Speaker 8 (25:52):
We had launched a program called Shine LA a couple
of months ago in preparation for the World Cup, and
now we are called on to direct that citywide. We
need people from all over the city to come to
downtown and to help with this effort. The staff, the
mayoral staff standing behind me represent the best of our
(26:13):
organizers and community liaisons, and they will be leading that effort.
I do want to go back and say that, just
go back in time a minute. On Thursday of last week,
Los Angeles was peaceful. There was nothing going on here
that warranted the federal intervention that took place the very
next day. If we want to look at the cause
(26:35):
of what is happening here, I take it back to
raids that took place on Friday, and the uncertainty and
the fear, and the fact that families across the city
are terrified that they don't know if they should go
to work. They don't know if they should go to school.
We have people that were detained. We don't even know
the exact numbers of the people that were detained. We
(26:56):
have people that have not had contact with legal represent
nor have they even had contact with their families, and
so there is an awful lot of concern. When the
administration started, they said that this was about crime. They
were going to go after violent felons, drug dealers, and
I don't know how that matches with the scenes that
we saw of people in home depot running through the
(27:19):
parking lot because they were afraid that they were going
to get arrested. You were talking about people who are
trying to survive day by day, which is what a
day laborer is doing, and why they would be considered
as part of a problem as opposed to contributing to
our economy is very difficult for me to understand. We've
also received reports of people who were here legally, who
(27:43):
were showing up for their annual appointment at the immigration
office and maybe even showing up with their family and
getting detained. This is just absolutely unnecessary. People have asked
me what are the Marines going to do when they
get here. That's a good question. I have no idea.
The National Guard that are here now have one assignment
and that is to protect one building, which is the
(28:05):
Federal Building downtown the second building, which is the Federal
building on Westwood Boulevard, And as far as I know,
nothing has happened in Westwood at all, So this was
not needed. The idea that the administration would usurp the
authority of our state government, take it away from our
Governor Gavin Newsom. The governor knows that if we put
(28:28):
a request in for the National Guard and it went
to him, he would comply. There was never an issue
there because we were never thinking about calling upon the
National Guard. So I do want you to know that
the violence that has happened has required LAPD to ask
for additional assistance, but not.
Speaker 9 (28:46):
From the federal government.
Speaker 8 (28:48):
We are a county of eighty eight cities. There's a
number of police departments in those cities, and we have
the Sheriff's department, and so we have received assistance from
the California Highway Patrol. I mentioned the sheriffs from Orange County,
San Bernardino, Riverside, Santa Barbara, Ventura County, and a number
of law enforcement departments around the county. So with them
(29:11):
being fully deployed. Now we're establishing a unified command under
LAPD and Chief McDonald, which will accelerate our ability to
respond to hotspots when people splinter off and create pockets
of trouble. So I do want to thank all the
officers who've been working tirelessly and putting themselves at risk to.
Speaker 9 (29:30):
Keep our city safe. But the real.
Speaker 8 (29:32):
Solution of all of this is for the administration to
stop the raids. We have heard that these raids might
take place for the next thirty days.
Speaker 9 (29:40):
We don't know how many are going to take place
in a given nave been listening to a Markica ambassadre.
Speaker 3 (29:45):
I don't know why they're cutting it off there. It's
going to be interesting.
Speaker 1 (29:50):
LAPD should do well with budget concerns moving forward.
Speaker 3 (29:54):
They should get whatever they want.
Speaker 1 (29:57):
If they didn't feel like their force was an enough
and were like she said, we've got eighty eight cities.
You ask for help, you ask for reinforcements. But the
fact that the national government is coming in and adding
those reinforcements and the local political leadership's not going to
like that.
Speaker 8 (30:12):
Back to mayor best federal government decides they want to
roll up on a state, a roll up on a
city and take over. So if that I would open
it up for questions of which Zach will manage.
Speaker 5 (30:25):
Thanks, Mayor Bathk.
Speaker 3 (30:26):
I know that you're saying that some of the violence
that we've seen, any chaos later in the evenings, that
it's only limited to a few streets, but it does
seem to be ramping up.
Speaker 1 (30:35):
There was a lot of looting last night's running to
other parts of downtown LA.
Speaker 5 (30:39):
I know you've said that the solution is.
Speaker 2 (30:40):
To stop the raids, but the federal government has said
that's not going to happen.
Speaker 3 (30:44):
What is your plan to bring.
Speaker 8 (30:46):
Calm to the city. Well, first of all, when I
say a few streets, I don't mean that to mean
like it's very small, because the vandalism, especially the graffiti,
has happened kind of outside of that. But nevertheless, I'm
trying to counter the image that this is happening all
over our city because it is not, and so we
do want law enforcement to respond aggressively. Anybody that is
(31:09):
out committing crimes are not doing it in solidarity with immigrants.
They are doing the exact opposite. So we have to
enforce the law here. I'm going to continue advocating with
the federal government though, to see how.
Speaker 9 (31:20):
Disruptive this is.
Speaker 8 (31:22):
But there needs to be a call that says this
is unacceptable and if you engage in this behavior, you
will be prosecuted. Now we're looking at things like curfews,
We're looking at other aggressive response that we can have
in case this violence breaks out again.
Speaker 4 (31:38):
Do you think they're willing to a confu and wouldn't
you say the LAPD is being aggressive?
Speaker 8 (31:43):
Well, I do think that they are, but I do
think that we need to be in terms of prevention,
and I don't mean aggressive in terms of engaging with
the crowd, but there's things that you can do to prevent.
So I had a brief conversation with the chief this
morning about a curfew, so we will be meeting about
that later on today. And that's the type of aggressive
tactic I was referring to.
Speaker 1 (32:04):
And that doesn't infringe on protesters' rights because the people
there out after dark aren't there to protest or they're
to loot.
Speaker 9 (32:12):
For sixty millions the new information this minute go ahead.
Speaker 5 (32:18):
Yes, And so.
Speaker 8 (32:19):
Your response to that, it seems like despite the calls
from you and the governor, the answers are going up
for the Well, that doesn't mean that I will stop.
You know that I'm not going to give up. But
on the other hand, you just said sixty days. Somebody
else is going to say thirty. Somebody's going to say ninety.
The bottom line is we don't know, and that is
consistent with ice raids. Of course, we never know when,
(32:40):
we never know how long. But that very notion creates
such a terrible sense of fear in our city, and
it's just not right to do that to a population
who's trying to survive.
Speaker 9 (32:51):
We are a city of immigrants.
Speaker 3 (32:54):
Follow up the price tags.
Speaker 9 (32:56):
Let's put over I think one hundred and thirty million
right us.
Speaker 8 (33:00):
The government federal at some point come back to the
city for reimbursement of any part of this. No, I
think that was money as they wants.
Speaker 9 (33:09):
To spend on the true motilization. Maybe that's what you're
referring to.
Speaker 8 (33:13):
They don't need to spend it themselves, so I could
not even imagine that they would come here and ask
us to reimburse their unnecessary expense. Just imagine what we
could do with one hundred and thirty million dollars in
terms of preparing our city for the World Cup. Exactly, No,
LA cannot afford it.
Speaker 4 (33:35):
Yes, c for notes my understanding correctives is wrong and
the city has not ever received any reenforcements on fire
money Spence and.
Speaker 1 (33:46):
Go.
Speaker 8 (33:47):
I'm wondering as no, that that is correct, But Julia,
at this point in time, that would be really early.
Speaker 9 (33:54):
Oh okay, where are you going with the government?
Speaker 3 (33:58):
Are we worried that they will not follow through on.
Speaker 9 (34:03):
Let me just I'm sorry you finished?
Speaker 8 (34:05):
Yeah, okay, I was worried about that before the ice rates.
Speaker 9 (34:10):
I mean that is a worry.
Speaker 8 (34:11):
I mean, you know, the theme of the administration is uncertainty,
and so I have been very hopeful and you know
this in terms of the fires and the cooperation we
received from the federal government working well with the administration.
And now the pendulum has swung in a whole nother area.
Speaker 3 (34:28):
What would that mean for the city? Exact money in
the papers?
Speaker 9 (34:31):
Well, you know what it would mean.
Speaker 8 (34:32):
I mean, you know that we came off of a
very difficult budget year. But you also it's very important
to understand that it takes FEMA a long time. We're
still looking for some reimbursements from COVID and that didn't
have anything to do with this administration.
Speaker 5 (34:46):
Are there are reports in la USC would ploy school
police instead of saying young, you're our campus graduations.
Speaker 6 (34:54):
I made the ice raids. The superintendent did not move
out the potential for a standoff involving school police if
federal officers attention to enter the school on campus.
Speaker 3 (35:06):
Have you been coordinating LAPD?
Speaker 9 (35:09):
What sort of respond with LAPD?
Speaker 6 (35:11):
What LPD should Would LAPD be a part of any
response should the federal government?
Speaker 1 (35:22):
No?
Speaker 8 (35:22):
Well, yeah, let me just say that I have been
a close coordination has not been necessary right now, but
I have been in conversation with Superintendent Kvala. We spoke
the other day, and what he is deciding to do.
I know he's deciding to.
Speaker 9 (35:37):
Protect the children.
Speaker 8 (35:39):
You know that a month ago or two months ago,
I say, ICE agents showed up to an elementary school
to do a welfare check on some kids. It's it's
very interesting that you would send federal officers in to
check on elementary school kids. But I know he's also
dealing with the fear from the parents. So, for example,
at my grandson's school yesterday, there was ICE that was visible.
(36:02):
And you have parents who were dropping off and picking
up their kids, how do you think they feel? You know,
I mean, it's a sense of intimidation and fear that
is just so unnecessary and so corrosive to our city.
Speaker 3 (36:20):
Good warning, you're watching the NBC four News.
Speaker 1 (36:22):
All right, we will cut away from this as well.
We'll monitor all of the questions that are asked and answered.
One of the stories that we'll get to at some
point in the show was something that was highlighted when
John Coblts interviewed.
Speaker 3 (36:39):
Tom Holman.
Speaker 1 (36:40):
Tom Holman yesterday, and it was what happened at the
outset of all this, what the what the ignition point was,
And it wasn't home depot. It was the fact that
there was a business in the garment district that was
looking at for trafficking and other things that were like
real bad federal racketeering type trafficking charges behavior activity that
(37:07):
was going on. That's what started this whole thing. It
wasn't picking up day laborers at home depots.
Speaker 2 (37:14):
She also referred to that that people running through the
home depot parking lot afraid that they were going to
be picked up, but bill a sale the US attorney
explained the facility, the federal facility where agents were staging
for other operation. They weren't even looking at the home.
They even smell the home depot. They were across the
(37:34):
street from it, and people got caught up in it. Now,
I mean, her point is that that causes fear to
see Federal Border Patrol, immigration customers enforcement. That I get it,
but be clear about what exactly happened.
Speaker 1 (37:50):
When you lie to people about that, then they're not
going to believe you down the road.
Speaker 2 (37:54):
Gavin Newsom the other day as well, and that interview
with MSNBC on Sunday night said when you you know,
he told I'm home and come after me, tough guy, whatever,
and he said hands get your hands off the four
year old.
Speaker 3 (38:06):
Yeah, that was an odd turn of phrase.
Speaker 2 (38:08):
Give me the explain that if you want, if there's true,
if there's truth to them, there's an anecdote that a
four year old was picked up and taken away by ice,
then tell me exactly rolling on a plane and taken
to a prison in El Salvador. You've been listening to
the Gary and Shannon Show. You can always hear us
live on KFI AM six forty nine am to one
pm every Monday through Friday, and anytime on demand on
(38:30):
the iHeartRadio LAP
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