March 15, 2024 • 26 mins
This sweet syrup adds smooth, fruity flavors to cocktails, coffee, and beyond thanks to the ‘milk’ of almonds (or other nuts/seeds). Anney and Lauren contend with what they’ve wrought in the science and history of orgeat.
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Speaker 1 (00:09):
Hello, and welcome to Save Your Protection of iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
I'm Anny Reese and I'm Lauren Vogelbaum, and today we
have an episode for you about or Shot.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
Yes, a fun one, a complete heck and mess.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
I we were just saying before we hit record that, man,
you really never know where the reading is going to
take you. And I thought that this was going to
be a nice, simple episode and I was I was incorrect.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
Yeah, it was funny because you that was your kind
of preliminary suggestion message about this was like, I think
gonna be a nice short one and then LUs, you
can't tell. Oh the hubris of man. And it continues,
it continues. We never learned our lesson, but you don't.
Was there any particular reason this was on your mind.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
We had just done that classic about my ties and
I heckn love my ties and I heckn love or
Shot and yeah, so I was like, what is up
with that? Let's find out.
Speaker 1 (01:13):
And oh the finding has occurred. Oh the finding out
what a process it was. I don't I've had or
shot obviously, but I didn't have a familiarity with it.
But my mom loves or shots. Oh okay, that sticks out.
To me because she doesn't drink cocktails.
Speaker 2 (01:35):
Not all.
Speaker 1 (01:36):
Sure, yeah, but she loves or Shot and she loves Ameretto.
And so when I was going to college and I
became a drinking age, you know when you're at least
in my case, you don't know what to order and
you're trying to sound cool. I remember trying to order.
I was like, we're shot, and the person was like,
what what with? What with? Who?
Speaker 2 (01:59):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (02:00):
Anne, I'm pretty sure I just left. This interaction did
not go well.
Speaker 3 (02:08):
Yeah, but I went back and got a screwdriver later.
Oh there you go, Yeah, because I knew what that was. Sure,
You're like, I'm aware that this is a cocktail, I'll
order one.
Speaker 1 (02:19):
Sure, Yeah, But I always think of these kind of
nutty liquors with my I associate them with my mom
because she really likes that flavor. Also, you could see
our our horse Shot episode, along with the Mytai classic
that we just reran.
Speaker 2 (02:37):
M hm, and various nut episodes that we've done. Maybe
Grains of kinds.
Speaker 1 (02:45):
I don't know, grains of kinds. I like that. Sure, Well,
I guess that breaksast to our question.
Speaker 3 (02:56):
Does all right.
Speaker 1 (02:59):
Or what is it?
Speaker 2 (03:04):
Well? Orgeatte is a type of horrible syrup, made traditionally
by steeping crushed almonds in water and then sweetening the
resulting liquid. It can also have alcohol, usually some kind
of neutral spirit added to make it a liqueur. It
can also be made of almond flavoring instead of actual almonds.
It can also also be made with nuts and flavors
(03:25):
other than or in addition to almond. Orange. Flower water
is common but okay so the result depending on how
you make and filter. It can be milky, cloudy or clear,
thinner or thicker, sweet to like cloying, but should have
that sort of like sweet, nutty, creamy, smooth, light richness
(03:46):
that almonds have with a bit of a light floral note.
It can be added to cocktails or coffee drinks, or
desserts or sweet sauces. It's like it's like liquid Marzapan.
It's like it's like if a very light maple syrup
or maybe a thin honey tasted like almonds.
Speaker 1 (04:06):
It's like it's like.
Speaker 2 (04:07):
If almond milk were trying to be a candy. It's
it's like it's like the it's like the diluted memory
of the very first sip of like your favorite cool
beverage treat, just smooth and sweet and so nice.
Speaker 1 (04:24):
Now I want so.
Speaker 2 (04:28):
It took me a really long time to remember that
that orgate is just like a common name for almond
syrup these days, which is a common thing that every
cafe has, right, And so especially if for example, you're
going to a cafe are that also has a bar,
which many cafes in Atlanta do, you could probably order
(04:52):
you could like, as long as the bar isn't busy
and they don't hate you, you know, like, you could
probably order some kind of orgeade drink.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
Noted thank you.
Speaker 2 (05:04):
Yeah, you're welcome, mand or I apologize a little bit
of both, a little bit of both, okay, though, So
almonds are a type of culinary nut that is technically
a seed, not a botanical nut. Nuts and seeds are
like like a square rectangle situation, like all nuts are seeds,
but not all seeds are nuts. I bring this up
(05:25):
because to understand what orighot is, it does help to
understand what a seed is, all right, We've talked about
this various times, but basically, a seed is a little
packet of potential that a plant will produce in order
to hopefully grow a new plant, a seed well does
contain a lot of nutrition and like helpful environmental situators
(05:46):
for this potential baby plant. The exact makeup will depend
upon the type of plant. You know, just for illustration
that the makeup of a seed of wheat is pretty
different from the makeup of a seed of a walnut tree,
partially because humans have helped select for the kinds of
seeds that we want from both of those things. And
(06:06):
that is in turn, because as cool as it is
that like baby plants get protection and nutrition from seeds suckers,
we can get nutrition from them too.
Speaker 1 (06:16):
Suckers. Yeah, plants, they think they can keep us away.
Speaker 2 (06:26):
Nope, we make tools here, we are, Okay. In any
given seed, you're gonna have some balance of proteins and
carbs and fats, plus various other compounds, some of which
we experience as flavors. In the case of a pertinent
to today's topic, almonds, you've got a bunch of fats,
(06:48):
which we generally experiences as being kind of rich and creamy,
and then a little bit of sugar, and then like
a couple dozen flavor compounds ranging from a like fruity
and cherry life to floral to roasty, too sweet. But
all of that stuff is packed up in there. Some
(07:10):
of it only exists in the whole almond as precursors
to the compounds that we can taste. So how do
you get the stuff out? Well, you crush the nut
and in this case, you mix it with water. Yep, yeah,
hot water is a little bit more effective than cold,
but you don't want to boil it. That allows the
reactions to happen that get the most almondy flavor and
(07:33):
the most fats out of your almonds. Delicious and nutritious,
does not taste like chicken. You do often take the
skins off of the almonds first by by blanching them
that that is, heating them briefly in water, and then
manually removing the skins. That's because the skins contain bitter
tannins that you probably don't want in your oarshot or
your palmond milk or any other kind of almond product
(07:55):
that you're making. So you've got your almond water. However,
at this point that almond water is like some water
and a bunch of oils and stuff, none of which
necessarily want to play nice with each other. So in
order to help create a stable emulsion, that is a
mix of things what do not want to mix. One
(08:17):
of the things you can do in certain circumstances like
this one is add sugar. Sugar molecules can help disrupt
large globs of fats in a base of water and
divide those fats up into small globs and help evenly
distribute them throughout the water. Also, sugar tastes good. All
(08:38):
that being said, sweet almond water orghot is only the beginning.
All kinds of nuts can be used. A pistachio, walnut, pecan,
pine nuts, peanuts, pumpkin seeds, other things like the aforementioned orange,
flower water or maybe rosewater will provide a nice confluence
and or contrasting sweet, fruity floralness. I'd like to see
(09:00):
you return to some other flavorings that have historically been used,
like cinnamon. More on that in the history section. And yeah,
orzhot is most often used to flavor beverages, like to
give a little creaminus to sort of fruity rich cocktails
made with rum like the mytaie, or to add layers
to a sweetened coffee or tea or a milk type
drink or to make a nice sweet soda water. Though
(09:22):
I will say that almond is one of my very
favorite flavors, and so I'm really curious about any like
extracurricular uses anyone has for or shot.
Speaker 4 (09:33):
Yes, yeah, yeah, I think my university had a bending
machine that just had the flavor or shot and you
can add it as a shot into your coffee.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
Oo.
Speaker 1 (09:47):
Yeah, it was. It was a go to. It was good,
so good. M hm. Well what about the nutrition.
Speaker 2 (09:56):
It depends, of course on how it is made, but
with the sugar content or zhot is likely to be
a bit of a treat. Treats are nice, and to
be fair, these tend to be pretty strongly flavored, so
a little bit does go a long way.
Speaker 1 (10:09):
Hmmm, well, numbers peek behind the.
Speaker 2 (10:16):
Curtain, y'all. In the in the numbers bullet in our outline,
I just drew a little sad face.
Speaker 1 (10:26):
M communicate, which which means.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
That I could not find any relevant numbers. I was,
to be fair busy doing looking into many other different things.
As I said, this one took me places and and
I didn't even get to talk about cyanide.
Speaker 1 (10:46):
So the real tragedy of the whole thing.
Speaker 2 (10:51):
It is although bonus. This led to a conversation in
which we decided that we might do a little mini
series about poisons, especially tasty ones.
Speaker 1 (11:04):
I think that'd be fun. Absolutely, I gonna be a
grand ole time. Uh. You definitely can check out again
our classic on mind ties about how popular that drink is.
But one is to assume or shot pretty popular, yeah,
I would say, and it's gotta it's got a history
(11:26):
behind it. It does, it does.
Speaker 2 (11:28):
Uh, yes, And we are going to get into that
as soon as we get back from a quick break
forward from our sponsors.
Speaker 1 (11:42):
And we're back. Thank you sponsor, Yes, thank you. And Okay, Almonds,
no different episode. We've it's been on our list. We've
talked about it a lot. Yeah, I think we even
had someone who was looking to do like guess pitches
with us and Almonds is going to be a whole
(12:04):
thing and environmental ramifications like yeah, yeah going on.
Speaker 2 (12:11):
Yeah, yeah, a lot going on there.
Speaker 1 (12:13):
Also. I have to say that like.
Speaker 2 (12:16):
Plant based milks in general are their own episodes because right,
as it turns out, people have been like extracting like
milky type substances from seeds and nuts for a very
long time, Like almond milk is discussed as early as
the twelve hundreds in the Levant, so that's a separate
(12:39):
that's kind of a separate issue. Yes, I think barley
barley milks go back about the same period of time
in ancient China and or Japan, so right.
Speaker 1 (12:51):
And that can be the difficulty of when you're trying
to unravel the history of these things because they are related.
But also we can't just have a twelve our podcast.
But speaking of barley water, most historians believe that or
jot nice words related or originated in France, with the
(13:12):
first versions popping up in the fourteenth century. The word itself,
though okay, it most likely derives from Italian meaning barley water,
although fun with etymology, I also read it could come
from the French word for barley, both of which come
from the Latin word for barley. This is because the
first iterations of orgot were typically made with barley and
(13:37):
the oil to be precise, after the barley crop had
been harvested. The oil was then mixed with water and
or sugar there you go, or early orhot. So this, yeah,
this whole thing most likely got started in the Middle
Ages in Europe, when people were looking to use up
everything that they could, which included the leftover water after
(13:58):
boiling the bar bar crop, which i'd in some places
I read people believed it was nutritious absolutely, yeah. Yeah.
Other sources, though, they go way further back to sixth
century Europe, when the water left after boiling barley was seen, yeah,
as nutritious and medicinal and a curative for things like fever.
Speaker 2 (14:19):
Or even earlier. There are ancient Greek mentions of barley water. However,
for a really long time, sweeteners were expensive and not
accessible to everyone as certainly not in the amounts that
we use today.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
Right, and accounts that I read indicate that barley syrup
barley water wasn't very tasty, so people were looking for
ways to elevate the taste. As almonds became more accessible
in France between the seventeenth and nineteenth centuries, their oil
or milk depending on who you ask, And.
Speaker 2 (14:52):
It's really kind of the same way of saying the
same thing, or two different ways of saying the same thing, sorry.
Speaker 1 (14:57):
Exactly, almonds started to replace the barley water as the
plant component in or shot. At first just in part,
like just a piece of it, but over time, completely
erasing the barley altogether, possibly in part due to the
popularity of almonds and French desserts and baked goods at
the time. People were like, like this flavor, let's do this.
(15:20):
Folks started experimenting with spices too, things like rose or
orange water and cinnamon. I read people often drink or
shot on its own. So maybe I wasn't so wrong
at this far. We're showing them. Yeah right, I definitely wasn't.
But hey as a cordial with light snacks, sort of
(15:41):
a like tea time thing, but with or shot. Oh
yeah sure.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
Apparently it was popular in coffee houses as well, which
see our coffee episodes were very posh around the Middle
East starting in the fifteen hundreds and then throughout Europe
during the sixteen seventeen hundreds. One recipe, for example, from
London from seventeen seventy five, I've called for equal parts
barley and almonds soaked and then strained, and then that
(16:05):
liquid sweetened and flavored with ambergris or musk.
Speaker 1 (16:09):
Ooo comes up again.
Speaker 2 (16:12):
Many of these recipes called for some amount of bitter
almonds in addition to sweet almonds. Better almonds do contain
more of the precursor that leads to that like cherry
nutty almond flavor. But it's also a precursor to cyanide,
so having more of that isn't necessarily the best thing.
Historically speaking, it probably wasn't what you were, like the
(16:34):
most concerned about. But these days recipes do tend to
emit bitter almonds for safety's sake, and some recipes from
the eighteen hundreds include dairy milk in addition to barley
and or almonds.
Speaker 1 (16:48):
The first known recorded instance of orgatte and cocktails dates
back to eighteen sixty two, in Jerry Thomas's work How
to Mix a Drink. It was in the recipe for
what he called the Japanese Cocktail, which was a cognac
based drink that called for bidders and or jots. Of note,
this recipe didn't contain Japanese ingredients, nor did it come
(17:09):
from Japan.
Speaker 2 (17:10):
No no, It was named in honor of the arrival
of Japanese diplomats in the United States for the first
time in eighteen sixty.
Speaker 1 (17:18):
Or Shots certainly was being used in several cocktails and
drinks at the time, but the documentation around it is
hard to find or just lost or was never made
in the first place.
Speaker 2 (17:29):
Yeah, there was apparently a trend for orgot lemonade in
America a little bit later, according to this cooking encyclopedia
out of London from the eighteen nineties. I mean, you know,
it certainly makes sense that if bars and or soda
fountains had or jot, it would have found its way
into all kinds of things.
Speaker 1 (17:48):
So if we jump ahead, we get to Trader vis
in their nineteen forties my Thai recipe, and it was
really big in popularizing that drink and or jot as
a key ingredient in it, and further or jot as
a cocktail ingredient. Trader Vix did a lot to solidify
this idea too, of using or jot in all kinds
(18:11):
of tiki drinks at their establishments. So I guess you
can go. We talked about we've talked about this in
several episodes, but our mind to my episode. Victor Jules
Berjeenon's Trader Vix as he is known. His parents were
French and French Canadian, and they sold or jot at
the grocery store that they owned. When Vic got into
(18:34):
cocktails and especially like tropical teki cocktails. He surmised that
Orgot it went really well with like lime and rum,
which it does.
Speaker 2 (18:44):
Yeah, yeah, here we are accurate. Meanwhile, I wanted to
put a note here about this Italian cafe culture had
purposed sweet syrups like or Jot for use in coffees sodas,
and that all came over to the United States with
waves of integration. And specifically this is its own episode,
(19:09):
but I feel pretty confident in this one. Specifically, the
Trani brand's presence in San Francisco starting in the nineteen
twenties and continuing up through the nineteen eighties and nineties
and today may have influenced the spread of flavored lattes
in the eighties and nineties and made those kind of
(19:29):
flavored syrups kind of ubiquitous in coffee shops around America.
Speaker 1 (19:35):
Right and as we've discussed many times in our cocktail
episodes or Liquors Drinks, there is a kind of renaissance
in the US happening right now. So I feel like,
even if we couldn't find numbers behind it, I wouldn't
be surprised if Orgot is experiencing an upswing during that.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
Oh yeah, oh yeah, yeah, certainly there are all kinds
of really interesting recipes for like alternative or jhots out there.
If you are curious about any of that I think
didn't didn't I'm I'm pretty sure I'm not making this up.
Our former uh producer, Christopher hassiotis at one point gifted
(20:22):
us a bottle of pecan or shot.
Speaker 1 (20:26):
Ooh that sounds right again. I feel like I have
a lot of things that I don't associate, like I
don't know if I knew it was a shot, but yeah.
Speaker 2 (20:40):
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (20:43):
Oh well, listeners, if you have any recipes that you
use orgot for or to make or shots mm hmmm hmm,
just uses in general, we would love to hear from you. Absolutely. Uh.
Speaker 2 (21:00):
We do already have some listener mail for you though,
and we are going to get into that as soon
as we get back from one more quick break forward
from our sponsors.
Speaker 1 (21:16):
And we're back. Thank you sponsor, Yes, thank you, and
we're back with listening. Yes. Okay, So we have two
lovely messages about Chili Crisp and recipes with Chili Crisp. Yeah.
(21:37):
So this first one, I'm not going to read the recipe,
but if you would like it, just reach out and
I'll afford it along. Brian wrote, just listen to the
Chili Crisp episode. While I haven't seen any trend according
to the McCormick phone, no marketing trends. Heat is on
the rise, so it's possible my area of nowhere West
(22:00):
just hasn't caught on just yet. I found this recipe
in twenty twenty. Recipe included a couple of notes after that.
We recommend storing this spicy flavor packed oil and butter
concoction in the fridge until needed before using. Warm it
slightly in the microwave or melt in a small pan
on the stovetop. It will keep in the fridge for
about a month. Put it on everything. Use this condiment
(22:23):
to level up any and everything. Amazing on fried chicken
or turkey. Is also delicious on noodles, grilled meats, and
swirled into soup bros. It goes really well with fried chicken,
mixed vegetables, noodles, or just a scoop out of the
fridge for a quick snet. I would love to try
this on peanut butter, but with a peanut and treenut
allergy in the house. I don't take those kinds of chances.
(22:48):
I typically replace the peanuts with sunflower seeds, but sometimes
pumpkin seeds. Ooh, yes, So this recipe sounds amazing. Again,
it was quite very detailed and long, so we're not
gonna read it, but if you want to, can send along.
But yes, put it on everything. It sounds and as
(23:09):
we discussed in that episode, the Chili Crisp episode, I
mean the possibilities you can. There's so much space experiments.
I got a new jar. I also, but I got
a new jar, so exciting. Yeah, see what I could
put it on?
Speaker 2 (23:32):
All right, all right, okay, Joe wrote, Chili crisp is
the best. It's so good on almost everything, although I
have yet to put it on ice cream. Something to
try in the summer.
Speaker 1 (23:42):
Perhaps.
Speaker 2 (23:43):
I have two chili crisp recipes for you, and they
both revolve around brahmen. The first comes from Jean chen Li,
a member of the K pop group NCT Dream. I
don't know anything about K pop, y'all. I'm so sorry
if that's not how any of that is pronounced. I'm
gonna keep going, all right. Chop one to two medium
tomatoes into wedges, and mash them into your boiling water.
(24:04):
Once it makes a tomato broth. Add one spoon or
more of chili crisp, followed by the ramen seasoning and
the noodles. When the noodles are almost done, stir in
a whisked egg. You're ready to go. When the eggs
and nooles are cooked. I was skeptical of the tomato
at first, but it really does balance everything out. The
other is something adapted from somewhere on the interwebs, but
I can't remember where. This is a spicy called cucumber
(24:28):
Ramen noodle salad, which is great for the summer when
you're craving ramen but don't want the soup. Chop have
a cucumber or more into diagonal slices and then thin
matchsticks and set aside. Set your water to boil, and
then dump in the noodles while they're cooking. Mixed together
a sauce using chili crisp, the ramen seasoning packet, vinegar
any basic one we'll do, and honey to taste. I
(24:50):
usually don't use the whole seasoning packet since there's more
than enough salt between it and the chili crisp. When
your noodles are done, drain and rinse them in cold water.
Mix the noodles, cucumber and sauce together, top with chopped
green onions and sesame seeds. Believe me when I say
I usually eat this all summer long. Crunchy cucumber, chewy
ramen and a perfectly balanced spicy, sweet, vinegary sauce. Yum, Annie,
(25:17):
you look like you're suffering by not eating this right now.
Speaker 1 (25:21):
Sounds so good. Oh oh gosh, wow, And I love
I love mixing up ramen. Oh yeah, me too, kinds,
So this is exciting.
Speaker 2 (25:36):
Yeah, I've never had a tomato to my to my
cooking broth. That is definitely a thing. I've added tomato
like as a kind of garnish at the end.
Speaker 1 (25:44):
But yeah, same, But I really want to do that now.
That's so good. Oh, dear well, thank you, yes, yes,
thank you to both of these listeners for writing in.
If you would like to write you as you can
or email us hello at saverpod dot com. We're also
(26:06):
on social media.
Speaker 2 (26:07):
You can find us on Twitter, Facebook, and Instagram at
saver pod and we do hope to hear from you.
Save is production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from my
heart Radio, you can visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,
or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. Thanks as
always for super producers Dylan Fagan and Andrew Howard. Thanks
to you for listening, and we hope that lots more
good things are coming your way.
Hello, and welcome to Save Your Protection of iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
I'm Anny Reese and I'm Lauren Vogelbaum, and today we
have an episode for you about or Shot.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
Yes, a fun one, a complete heck and mess.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
I we were just saying before we hit record that, man,
you really never know where the reading is going to
take you. And I thought that this was going to
be a nice, simple episode and I was I was incorrect.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
Yeah, it was funny because you that was your kind
of preliminary suggestion message about this was like, I think
gonna be a nice short one and then LUs, you
can't tell. Oh the hubris of man. And it continues,
it continues. We never learned our lesson, but you don't.
Was there any particular reason this was on your mind.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
We had just done that classic about my ties and
I heckn love my ties and I heckn love or
Shot and yeah, so I was like, what is up
with that? Let's find out.
Speaker 1 (01:13):
And oh the finding has occurred. Oh the finding out
what a process it was. I don't I've had or
shot obviously, but I didn't have a familiarity with it.
But my mom loves or shots. Oh okay, that sticks out.
To me because she doesn't drink cocktails.
Speaker 2 (01:35):
Not all.
Speaker 1 (01:36):
Sure, yeah, but she loves or Shot and she loves Ameretto.
And so when I was going to college and I
became a drinking age, you know when you're at least
in my case, you don't know what to order and
you're trying to sound cool. I remember trying to order.
I was like, we're shot, and the person was like,
what what with? What with? Who?
Speaker 2 (01:59):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (02:00):
Anne, I'm pretty sure I just left. This interaction did
not go well.
Speaker 3 (02:08):
Yeah, but I went back and got a screwdriver later.
Oh there you go, Yeah, because I knew what that was. Sure,
You're like, I'm aware that this is a cocktail, I'll
order one.
Speaker 1 (02:19):
Sure, Yeah, But I always think of these kind of
nutty liquors with my I associate them with my mom
because she really likes that flavor. Also, you could see
our our horse Shot episode, along with the Mytai classic
that we just reran.
Speaker 2 (02:37):
M hm, and various nut episodes that we've done. Maybe
Grains of kinds.
Speaker 1 (02:45):
I don't know, grains of kinds. I like that. Sure, Well,
I guess that breaksast to our question.
Speaker 3 (02:56):
Does all right.
Speaker 1 (02:59):
Or what is it?
Speaker 2 (03:04):
Well? Orgeatte is a type of horrible syrup, made traditionally
by steeping crushed almonds in water and then sweetening the
resulting liquid. It can also have alcohol, usually some kind
of neutral spirit added to make it a liqueur. It
can also be made of almond flavoring instead of actual almonds.
It can also also be made with nuts and flavors
(03:25):
other than or in addition to almond. Orange. Flower water
is common but okay so the result depending on how
you make and filter. It can be milky, cloudy or clear,
thinner or thicker, sweet to like cloying, but should have
that sort of like sweet, nutty, creamy, smooth, light richness
(03:46):
that almonds have with a bit of a light floral note.
It can be added to cocktails or coffee drinks, or
desserts or sweet sauces. It's like it's like liquid Marzapan.
It's like it's like if a very light maple syrup
or maybe a thin honey tasted like almonds.
Speaker 1 (04:06):
It's like it's like.
Speaker 2 (04:07):
If almond milk were trying to be a candy. It's
it's like it's like the it's like the diluted memory
of the very first sip of like your favorite cool
beverage treat, just smooth and sweet and so nice.
Speaker 1 (04:24):
Now I want so.
Speaker 2 (04:28):
It took me a really long time to remember that
that orgate is just like a common name for almond
syrup these days, which is a common thing that every
cafe has, right, And so especially if for example, you're
going to a cafe are that also has a bar,
which many cafes in Atlanta do, you could probably order
(04:52):
you could like, as long as the bar isn't busy
and they don't hate you, you know, like, you could
probably order some kind of orgeade drink.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
Noted thank you.
Speaker 2 (05:04):
Yeah, you're welcome, mand or I apologize a little bit
of both, a little bit of both, okay, though, So
almonds are a type of culinary nut that is technically
a seed, not a botanical nut. Nuts and seeds are
like like a square rectangle situation, like all nuts are seeds,
but not all seeds are nuts. I bring this up
(05:25):
because to understand what orighot is, it does help to
understand what a seed is, all right, We've talked about
this various times, but basically, a seed is a little
packet of potential that a plant will produce in order
to hopefully grow a new plant, a seed well does
contain a lot of nutrition and like helpful environmental situators
(05:46):
for this potential baby plant. The exact makeup will depend
upon the type of plant. You know, just for illustration
that the makeup of a seed of wheat is pretty
different from the makeup of a seed of a walnut tree,
partially because humans have helped select for the kinds of
seeds that we want from both of those things. And
(06:06):
that is in turn, because as cool as it is
that like baby plants get protection and nutrition from seeds suckers,
we can get nutrition from them too.
Speaker 1 (06:16):
Suckers. Yeah, plants, they think they can keep us away.
Speaker 2 (06:26):
Nope, we make tools here, we are, Okay. In any
given seed, you're gonna have some balance of proteins and
carbs and fats, plus various other compounds, some of which
we experience as flavors. In the case of a pertinent
to today's topic, almonds, you've got a bunch of fats,
(06:48):
which we generally experiences as being kind of rich and creamy,
and then a little bit of sugar, and then like
a couple dozen flavor compounds ranging from a like fruity
and cherry life to floral to roasty, too sweet. But
all of that stuff is packed up in there. Some
(07:10):
of it only exists in the whole almond as precursors
to the compounds that we can taste. So how do
you get the stuff out? Well, you crush the nut
and in this case, you mix it with water. Yep, yeah,
hot water is a little bit more effective than cold,
but you don't want to boil it. That allows the
reactions to happen that get the most almondy flavor and
(07:33):
the most fats out of your almonds. Delicious and nutritious,
does not taste like chicken. You do often take the
skins off of the almonds first by by blanching them
that that is, heating them briefly in water, and then
manually removing the skins. That's because the skins contain bitter
tannins that you probably don't want in your oarshot or
your palmond milk or any other kind of almond product
(07:55):
that you're making. So you've got your almond water. However,
at this point that almond water is like some water
and a bunch of oils and stuff, none of which
necessarily want to play nice with each other. So in
order to help create a stable emulsion, that is a
mix of things what do not want to mix. One
(08:17):
of the things you can do in certain circumstances like
this one is add sugar. Sugar molecules can help disrupt
large globs of fats in a base of water and
divide those fats up into small globs and help evenly
distribute them throughout the water. Also, sugar tastes good. All
(08:38):
that being said, sweet almond water orghot is only the beginning.
All kinds of nuts can be used. A pistachio, walnut, pecan,
pine nuts, peanuts, pumpkin seeds, other things like the aforementioned orange,
flower water or maybe rosewater will provide a nice confluence
and or contrasting sweet, fruity floralness. I'd like to see
(09:00):
you return to some other flavorings that have historically been used,
like cinnamon. More on that in the history section. And yeah,
orzhot is most often used to flavor beverages, like to
give a little creaminus to sort of fruity rich cocktails
made with rum like the mytaie, or to add layers
to a sweetened coffee or tea or a milk type
drink or to make a nice sweet soda water. Though
(09:22):
I will say that almond is one of my very
favorite flavors, and so I'm really curious about any like
extracurricular uses anyone has for or shot.
Speaker 4 (09:33):
Yes, yeah, yeah, I think my university had a bending
machine that just had the flavor or shot and you
can add it as a shot into your coffee.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
Oo.
Speaker 1 (09:47):
Yeah, it was. It was a go to. It was good,
so good. M hm. Well what about the nutrition.
Speaker 2 (09:56):
It depends, of course on how it is made, but
with the sugar content or zhot is likely to be
a bit of a treat. Treats are nice, and to
be fair, these tend to be pretty strongly flavored, so
a little bit does go a long way.
Speaker 1 (10:09):
Hmmm, well, numbers peek behind the.
Speaker 2 (10:16):
Curtain, y'all. In the in the numbers bullet in our outline,
I just drew a little sad face.
Speaker 1 (10:26):
M communicate, which which means.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
That I could not find any relevant numbers. I was,
to be fair busy doing looking into many other different things.
As I said, this one took me places and and
I didn't even get to talk about cyanide.
Speaker 1 (10:46):
So the real tragedy of the whole thing.
Speaker 2 (10:51):
It is although bonus. This led to a conversation in
which we decided that we might do a little mini
series about poisons, especially tasty ones.
Speaker 1 (11:04):
I think that'd be fun. Absolutely, I gonna be a
grand ole time. Uh. You definitely can check out again
our classic on mind ties about how popular that drink is.
But one is to assume or shot pretty popular, yeah,
I would say, and it's gotta it's got a history
(11:26):
behind it. It does, it does.
Speaker 2 (11:28):
Uh, yes, And we are going to get into that
as soon as we get back from a quick break
forward from our sponsors.
Speaker 1 (11:42):
And we're back. Thank you sponsor, Yes, thank you. And Okay, Almonds,
no different episode. We've it's been on our list. We've
talked about it a lot. Yeah, I think we even
had someone who was looking to do like guess pitches
with us and Almonds is going to be a whole
(12:04):
thing and environmental ramifications like yeah, yeah going on.
Speaker 2 (12:11):
Yeah, yeah, a lot going on there.
Speaker 1 (12:13):
Also. I have to say that like.
Speaker 2 (12:16):
Plant based milks in general are their own episodes because right,
as it turns out, people have been like extracting like
milky type substances from seeds and nuts for a very
long time, Like almond milk is discussed as early as
the twelve hundreds in the Levant, so that's a separate
(12:39):
that's kind of a separate issue. Yes, I think barley
barley milks go back about the same period of time
in ancient China and or Japan, so right.
Speaker 1 (12:51):
And that can be the difficulty of when you're trying
to unravel the history of these things because they are related.
But also we can't just have a twelve our podcast.
But speaking of barley water, most historians believe that or
jot nice words related or originated in France, with the
(13:12):
first versions popping up in the fourteenth century. The word itself,
though okay, it most likely derives from Italian meaning barley water,
although fun with etymology, I also read it could come
from the French word for barley, both of which come
from the Latin word for barley. This is because the
first iterations of orgot were typically made with barley and
(13:37):
the oil to be precise, after the barley crop had
been harvested. The oil was then mixed with water and
or sugar there you go, or early orhot. So this, yeah,
this whole thing most likely got started in the Middle
Ages in Europe, when people were looking to use up
everything that they could, which included the leftover water after
(13:58):
boiling the bar bar crop, which i'd in some places
I read people believed it was nutritious absolutely, yeah. Yeah.
Other sources, though, they go way further back to sixth
century Europe, when the water left after boiling barley was seen, yeah,
as nutritious and medicinal and a curative for things like fever.
Speaker 2 (14:19):
Or even earlier. There are ancient Greek mentions of barley water. However,
for a really long time, sweeteners were expensive and not
accessible to everyone as certainly not in the amounts that
we use today.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
Right, and accounts that I read indicate that barley syrup
barley water wasn't very tasty, so people were looking for
ways to elevate the taste. As almonds became more accessible
in France between the seventeenth and nineteenth centuries, their oil
or milk depending on who you ask, And.
Speaker 2 (14:52):
It's really kind of the same way of saying the
same thing, or two different ways of saying the same thing, sorry.
Speaker 1 (14:57):
Exactly, almonds started to replace the barley water as the
plant component in or shot. At first just in part,
like just a piece of it, but over time, completely
erasing the barley altogether, possibly in part due to the
popularity of almonds and French desserts and baked goods at
the time. People were like, like this flavor, let's do this.
(15:20):
Folks started experimenting with spices too, things like rose or
orange water and cinnamon. I read people often drink or
shot on its own. So maybe I wasn't so wrong
at this far. We're showing them. Yeah right, I definitely wasn't.
But hey as a cordial with light snacks, sort of
(15:41):
a like tea time thing, but with or shot. Oh
yeah sure.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
Apparently it was popular in coffee houses as well, which
see our coffee episodes were very posh around the Middle
East starting in the fifteen hundreds and then throughout Europe
during the sixteen seventeen hundreds. One recipe, for example, from
London from seventeen seventy five, I've called for equal parts
barley and almonds soaked and then strained, and then that
(16:05):
liquid sweetened and flavored with ambergris or musk.
Speaker 1 (16:09):
Ooo comes up again.
Speaker 2 (16:12):
Many of these recipes called for some amount of bitter
almonds in addition to sweet almonds. Better almonds do contain
more of the precursor that leads to that like cherry
nutty almond flavor. But it's also a precursor to cyanide,
so having more of that isn't necessarily the best thing.
Historically speaking, it probably wasn't what you were, like the
(16:34):
most concerned about. But these days recipes do tend to
emit bitter almonds for safety's sake, and some recipes from
the eighteen hundreds include dairy milk in addition to barley
and or almonds.
Speaker 1 (16:48):
The first known recorded instance of orgatte and cocktails dates
back to eighteen sixty two, in Jerry Thomas's work How
to Mix a Drink. It was in the recipe for
what he called the Japanese Cocktail, which was a cognac
based drink that called for bidders and or jots. Of note,
this recipe didn't contain Japanese ingredients, nor did it come
(17:09):
from Japan.
Speaker 2 (17:10):
No no, It was named in honor of the arrival
of Japanese diplomats in the United States for the first
time in eighteen sixty.
Speaker 1 (17:18):
Or Shots certainly was being used in several cocktails and
drinks at the time, but the documentation around it is
hard to find or just lost or was never made
in the first place.
Speaker 2 (17:29):
Yeah, there was apparently a trend for orgot lemonade in
America a little bit later, according to this cooking encyclopedia
out of London from the eighteen nineties. I mean, you know,
it certainly makes sense that if bars and or soda
fountains had or jot, it would have found its way
into all kinds of things.
Speaker 1 (17:48):
So if we jump ahead, we get to Trader vis
in their nineteen forties my Thai recipe, and it was
really big in popularizing that drink and or jot as
a key ingredient in it, and further or jot as
a cocktail ingredient. Trader Vix did a lot to solidify
this idea too, of using or jot in all kinds
(18:11):
of tiki drinks at their establishments. So I guess you
can go. We talked about we've talked about this in
several episodes, but our mind to my episode. Victor Jules
Berjeenon's Trader Vix as he is known. His parents were
French and French Canadian, and they sold or jot at
the grocery store that they owned. When Vic got into
(18:34):
cocktails and especially like tropical teki cocktails. He surmised that
Orgot it went really well with like lime and rum,
which it does.
Speaker 2 (18:44):
Yeah, yeah, here we are accurate. Meanwhile, I wanted to
put a note here about this Italian cafe culture had
purposed sweet syrups like or Jot for use in coffees sodas,
and that all came over to the United States with
waves of integration. And specifically this is its own episode,
(19:09):
but I feel pretty confident in this one. Specifically, the
Trani brand's presence in San Francisco starting in the nineteen
twenties and continuing up through the nineteen eighties and nineties
and today may have influenced the spread of flavored lattes
in the eighties and nineties and made those kind of
(19:29):
flavored syrups kind of ubiquitous in coffee shops around America.
Speaker 1 (19:35):
Right and as we've discussed many times in our cocktail
episodes or Liquors Drinks, there is a kind of renaissance
in the US happening right now. So I feel like,
even if we couldn't find numbers behind it, I wouldn't
be surprised if Orgot is experiencing an upswing during that.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
Oh yeah, oh yeah, yeah, certainly there are all kinds
of really interesting recipes for like alternative or jhots out there.
If you are curious about any of that I think
didn't didn't I'm I'm pretty sure I'm not making this up.
Our former uh producer, Christopher hassiotis at one point gifted
(20:22):
us a bottle of pecan or shot.
Speaker 1 (20:26):
Ooh that sounds right again. I feel like I have
a lot of things that I don't associate, like I
don't know if I knew it was a shot, but yeah.
Speaker 2 (20:40):
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (20:43):
Oh well, listeners, if you have any recipes that you
use orgot for or to make or shots mm hmmm hmm,
just uses in general, we would love to hear from you. Absolutely. Uh.
Speaker 2 (21:00):
We do already have some listener mail for you though,
and we are going to get into that as soon
as we get back from one more quick break forward
from our sponsors.
Speaker 1 (21:16):
And we're back. Thank you sponsor, Yes, thank you, and
we're back with listening. Yes. Okay, So we have two
lovely messages about Chili Crisp and recipes with Chili Crisp. Yeah.
(21:37):
So this first one, I'm not going to read the recipe,
but if you would like it, just reach out and
I'll afford it along. Brian wrote, just listen to the
Chili Crisp episode. While I haven't seen any trend according
to the McCormick phone, no marketing trends. Heat is on
the rise, so it's possible my area of nowhere West
(22:00):
just hasn't caught on just yet. I found this recipe
in twenty twenty. Recipe included a couple of notes after that.
We recommend storing this spicy flavor packed oil and butter
concoction in the fridge until needed before using. Warm it
slightly in the microwave or melt in a small pan
on the stovetop. It will keep in the fridge for
about a month. Put it on everything. Use this condiment
(22:23):
to level up any and everything. Amazing on fried chicken
or turkey. Is also delicious on noodles, grilled meats, and
swirled into soup bros. It goes really well with fried chicken,
mixed vegetables, noodles, or just a scoop out of the
fridge for a quick snet. I would love to try
this on peanut butter, but with a peanut and treenut
allergy in the house. I don't take those kinds of chances.
(22:48):
I typically replace the peanuts with sunflower seeds, but sometimes
pumpkin seeds. Ooh, yes, So this recipe sounds amazing. Again,
it was quite very detailed and long, so we're not
gonna read it, but if you want to, can send along.
But yes, put it on everything. It sounds and as
(23:09):
we discussed in that episode, the Chili Crisp episode, I
mean the possibilities you can. There's so much space experiments.
I got a new jar. I also, but I got
a new jar, so exciting. Yeah, see what I could
put it on?
Speaker 2 (23:32):
All right, all right, okay, Joe wrote, Chili crisp is
the best. It's so good on almost everything, although I
have yet to put it on ice cream. Something to
try in the summer.
Speaker 1 (23:42):
Perhaps.
Speaker 2 (23:43):
I have two chili crisp recipes for you, and they
both revolve around brahmen. The first comes from Jean chen Li,
a member of the K pop group NCT Dream. I
don't know anything about K pop, y'all. I'm so sorry
if that's not how any of that is pronounced. I'm
gonna keep going, all right. Chop one to two medium
tomatoes into wedges, and mash them into your boiling water.
(24:04):
Once it makes a tomato broth. Add one spoon or
more of chili crisp, followed by the ramen seasoning and
the noodles. When the noodles are almost done, stir in
a whisked egg. You're ready to go. When the eggs
and nooles are cooked. I was skeptical of the tomato
at first, but it really does balance everything out. The
other is something adapted from somewhere on the interwebs, but
I can't remember where. This is a spicy called cucumber
(24:28):
Ramen noodle salad, which is great for the summer when
you're craving ramen but don't want the soup. Chop have
a cucumber or more into diagonal slices and then thin
matchsticks and set aside. Set your water to boil, and
then dump in the noodles while they're cooking. Mixed together
a sauce using chili crisp, the ramen seasoning packet, vinegar
any basic one we'll do, and honey to taste. I
(24:50):
usually don't use the whole seasoning packet since there's more
than enough salt between it and the chili crisp. When
your noodles are done, drain and rinse them in cold water.
Mix the noodles, cucumber and sauce together, top with chopped
green onions and sesame seeds. Believe me when I say
I usually eat this all summer long. Crunchy cucumber, chewy
ramen and a perfectly balanced spicy, sweet, vinegary sauce. Yum, Annie,
(25:17):
you look like you're suffering by not eating this right now.
Speaker 1 (25:21):
Sounds so good. Oh oh gosh, wow, And I love
I love mixing up ramen. Oh yeah, me too, kinds,
So this is exciting.
Speaker 2 (25:36):
Yeah, I've never had a tomato to my to my
cooking broth. That is definitely a thing. I've added tomato
like as a kind of garnish at the end.
Speaker 1 (25:44):
But yeah, same, But I really want to do that now.
That's so good. Oh, dear well, thank you, yes, yes,
thank you to both of these listeners for writing in.
If you would like to write you as you can
or email us hello at saverpod dot com. We're also
(26:06):
on social media.
Speaker 2 (26:07):
You can find us on Twitter, Facebook, and Instagram at
saver pod and we do hope to hear from you.
Save is production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from my
heart Radio, you can visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,
or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. Thanks as
always for super producers Dylan Fagan and Andrew Howard. Thanks
to you for listening, and we hope that lots more
good things are coming your way.
Savor News
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