January 24, 2024 • 30 mins
This sweet syrup is a baker’s friend -- and an industrial byproduct of sugar refinement. Anney and Lauren dip into the history and science of golden syrup.
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Speaker 1 (00:09):
Hello, and welcome to Savor Protection of iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
I'm Annirie's and I'm Moan volbah bam, and today we
have an episode for you about golden syrup.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
Yes, which I had no idea what it was, never
had heard of it.
Speaker 3 (00:21):
Oh really, Oh wow.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
I'm given to understand that if I watched The Great
British Bakeoff, I would have an idea. Yeah, if I
lived in the.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
UK, but right, or Australia or New Zealand.
Speaker 1 (00:38):
No, no, no, nope. But the logo is very memorable.
We'll talk about that.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
Okay, Well, I mean, okay, but you've you've all right,
if you've heard of treacle tart, yes, then that is
made with golden syrup.
Speaker 1 (00:53):
Yes, so, I mean I must have encountered it. I
just didn't know what it was when you suggested it.
And it sounds like such a regal item, old syrup.
It sounds like a video game thing that I'd be
hunting down. Was there any particular reason it was on
your mind?
Speaker 2 (01:14):
It had been on our idealist for a while, I
assume because one of y'all suggested it, and for some
heck and reason, some part of my brain was like, oh,
golden syrup. That's just a nice brand, kind of related
like Industrial revolution product. It'll be relatively easy to research.
Speaker 3 (01:38):
It should be a.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
Light load for last week when I was trying to
take a heck in little bit of a vacation, weird.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
Didn't like it.
Speaker 3 (01:50):
Don't worry never again.
Speaker 1 (01:52):
I'm joking.
Speaker 3 (01:52):
It was terrific.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
But yeah, and I had forgotten that sugar is complicated.
I don't know why I forgot that, but we're going
to have lots of fun with this one.
Speaker 1 (02:10):
It was quite humorous because it all came together very
quickly as you were leaving, and then it became apparent
that wasn't Yeah.
Speaker 3 (02:21):
Yeah. The reason that our last episode was a classic,
y'all was that I.
Speaker 2 (02:26):
Like messaged Annie in a state of panic at like
three thirty or four o'clock, like half an hour before
we were supposed to record.
Speaker 3 (02:37):
Oh, like, I can't do it today?
Speaker 1 (02:40):
Can we do classic?
Speaker 3 (02:43):
Yeah? I don't understand molasses at all.
Speaker 1 (02:48):
It's complicated. I tried to figure it out. At one
point during the history section. I was like, no, no, oh,
that's not for me. Wow. Speaking of our episodes we've
done on honey sugar, maple syrup, and molasses. Yes, I
feel like there's other related things, but those are the
(03:09):
big ones that came to my mind. Yeah, yeah, yes,
which I suppose brings us to our question. Golden syrup.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
What is it?
Speaker 3 (03:22):
Well?
Speaker 2 (03:23):
Golden syrup, also sometimes called light treacle, is a type
of syrup made from sugar. It is golden in color
and has a sort of similar consistency to honey, but
with a more directly sweet taste and hints of like
caramel and kind of mildly tart to bitter sort of flavors. Yeah,
those come from its production process. It is an industrial
(03:44):
byproduct of refining cane or beet juice into granulated sugar,
though it is further processed a little bit itself. It
can be used directly as a sweet topping or sauce
for baked goods like pancakes or sponge cakes, or on
savory dishes like roast vegetables or a ham, but it's
perhaps mostly used in applications where granulated sugar would be
(04:05):
like a little bit of a pain in the rear. Like,
it's already a liquid, so you can easily dissolve it
into cold drinks, and it's designed to resist crystallization, So
it's useful in candy making and baking to keep your
end product like ungrainy. It can also help baked good
stain moist. It's like, it's like if light corn syrup
(04:25):
had a flavor. It's like molasses's less bitter cousin. It's
just this this very sweet, golden round sort of experience,
like a like eating a childhood memory of the sun.
Speaker 1 (04:42):
Aw yeah, yeah syrup. And then I like to imagine
molasses being all bitter in the background in the shade. Well,
should we break down some of the sugar sci its?
Speaker 3 (04:56):
I don't want to. All right, right, all right, sugar
sugar hoo boy, Okay.
Speaker 2 (05:04):
Starting at the top, Refined white crystallized sugar, like table sugar,
is made by taking the juice from sugar cane or
sugar beets and boiling it down to get most of
the water out, then spurring on the crystallization process somehow,
usually with a few crystals of sugar, because essentially, on
(05:25):
a molecular level, if you put a few crystals of
sugar in with liquid sugar, a lot of the liquid
stuff goes, oh oh that's a great idea, fabulous yes,
and it will crystallize as well. You can then centrifuge
out the crystals from the remaining cooked down syrup because
the cooked down syrup is sticky. If you're doing this
on like an industrial level, it helps if you simultaneously
(05:49):
wash the crystals using a solution of already refined sugar
in water. If you use just water, it had dissolved
those hard earned crystals. But this solution is it's like, no,
we're already full up on sucrose here, We're cool. So
it's an effective I guess, like gentle wash.
Speaker 3 (06:06):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:08):
But so after you take the crystals out, you were
left with this slightly watered down syrup. That syrup is
referred to as refiners return syrup, and very basically you
can keep reusing it, but sometimes you have too much
to use, or you decide to start a fresh batch.
(06:28):
So if you want, you can boil it and crystallizes
as much sugar as possible out of it, which will
darken it in color and make it develop all kinds
of these rich bitter flavors from caramelization, and that's a
dark treacle, or if it's a little bit darker, it's molasses,
or if it's basically not even sweet anymore. It's black
strap molasses. But if you just take that refiner's return
(06:53):
syrup and purify it a little bit, that is golden
syrup or light treacle or cane syrup. Yeah, and it's
just incredibly shelf stable, resistant crystallization, golden in color and
with just a little bit of the toasty flavors that
you get from caramelization, and about a fit again as
sweet as table sugar. That's like twenty percent more sweet
(07:15):
if you don't speak British, and okay, it is so
resistant to crystallization because again extremely basically, I'm not a chemist.
Table sugar is sucrose, which is a molecule made up
of glucose and fruit toose that are holding hands, and
(07:36):
sucrose really enjoys being a crystal. But if you can
get the glucose and the fruit toase to stop holding hands,
they're a lot happier to exist as a liquid at
room temperature. This is also sometimes called invert sugar because
of the way the light shines through it compared with
liquid sucrose, which is the way that you assess the
(07:59):
content sugar syrup.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
Okay, that's not what I Okay, Okay, sure.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
Yeah, it's not it's not well, I mean, I guess
it's technically like poetically inverted because it's a liquid rather
than a crystal. But this is the real reason that
that's the name of that. If you are a chemist
and I'm wrong, let me know. I'm pretty sure that's
what's up. H I do have the general idea that
(08:37):
since this became a popular and also a modern product,
the production process has become extremely precise. I say a
general idea because I don't understand what it's talking about.
That is a factually correct statement that I just made.
And also I can't explain it any furthers, So here
we are. But anyway, yes, this is a industrial product.
(09:00):
You can't approximate it at home by cooking down some
water and table sugar with a little bit of acid
like a like a lemon juice to help invert the
sucrose until you have something the consistency and color of
like a light honey. And yeah, at that point you
can use it in just whatever whatever you like that
calls for golden syrup if you have bought a tin
(09:21):
of it or a bottle. I understand it comes in
bottles these days. But it's really hard to find outside
of the x United Kingdom.
Speaker 1 (09:32):
So yes, yes, And I found a very funny article
that was like, Americans, stop trying to recreate with the substitute,
buy it online and forget it. Made laugh. Well, what
about the nutrition?
Speaker 3 (09:50):
A sugar is a treat?
Speaker 2 (09:51):
Treats are nice, that being said, because in golden syrup
that sucrose has been broken down into fruitose and glucose.
And because different sugar and other sweeteners can taste sweeter
than sucrose. Right, you don't need to use as much
golden syrup versus like white table sugar to get the
same level of sweetness. Fruit toase tastes a decent bit
(10:12):
sweeter than sucrose, A glucose just a little bit less
sweet anyway.
Speaker 1 (10:16):
Oh okay, well, h we have some numbers for you.
Some of them are in the history section.
Speaker 2 (10:27):
Yeah all right, So y'all, I am one of the
times that I yelled at my computer screen today it
was more than once, was that I could not find
industrial numbers on how much golden syrup is produced and sold.
This seems like the kind of thing that sugar companies
(10:49):
would be so excited to talk about and I could
find nothing, so I wanted to share with you a
little bit of the text from Rageouses that that's rageous
being one of the companies that produces a golden syrup
in the UK, some of their casual information about how
(11:14):
golden syrup is made. All right, this is kind of
coming in in the middle of it. Here we go.
The remaining thirty six percent of sugar needed for the
final product is then added to the inversion pan to
produce a partial invert. Once dissolved, the density of the
sucrose in the solution is a maximum of eighty three percent,
and the polarization is plus money, skipping a bit of
a head. Finally, the golden syrup must pass through an
(11:36):
eighty micron filter before it's packed to customers requirements ready
for delivery.
Speaker 3 (11:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (11:44):
Well, uh, I will say they do have a history
of being pretty close to the chest with this recipe
and process. So it makes sense that we've both left,
perhaps not more educated than before from that description.
Speaker 2 (12:07):
I mean, I basically get what it's saying. I'm just like,
oh heck, yeah, yeah, I really don't understand the light thing.
I just I light is confusing. At any rate, we
do have some history for you, which is we do
a little bit more understandable, just a.
Speaker 1 (12:24):
Little bit yes, and we'll get into that after we
get back from a quick break for a word from
our sponsors, and we're back.
Speaker 3 (12:38):
Thank you sponsored, Yes, thank you okay.
Speaker 1 (12:41):
So Golden Syrup is often credited to Abram Le of
the Glebe Sugar Refinery in Greenock, Scotland in eighteen eighty one.
Well I was born there in eighteen twenty. The first
job he had was as a cooper with the barrels,
and then he expanded that into a small shipping business
and through this he got involved in the sugar trade
(13:03):
and this eventually led him to taking a part share
in a nearby sugar refinery factory.
Speaker 2 (13:10):
The story goes that he was given his share in
the refinery by someone who owed him money and couldn't
pay any other way.
Speaker 1 (13:16):
Right, But he stuck with it and he realized that
he could make a lot of money if he set
up shop selling sugar in London, so in eighteen eighty
one he relocated to that city where he opened a
sugar refining factory called Abram lyleand Sons on the Thames
in London, where he and his sons processed sugarcane into
sugar loaves, and these loaves were how sugar was typically
(13:40):
consumed at the time. People would buy them and they
would grate or pound them to suit their needs at
home after purchasing.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
Yeah, rather than like a bag of sugar, you would
get a loaf of sugar exactly.
Speaker 1 (13:51):
So the story goes that one day, while feeding the
by products of his sugar refining process two pigs, he
got the idea to find a way to turn this
byproduct into something that people could eat and enjoy, and
of course, something that he could sell and make money
off of. So to accomplish this he enlisted the help
of three chemist brothers named John, Joseph, Samuel and Charles
(14:12):
Eastick in eighteen eighty two.
Speaker 2 (14:15):
Since eighteen eighty the Eastics had been working in the
sugar business in London, analyzing imported sugar to help sellers
determine prices and duty payments, but there were issues in
the supply chain. The corporate website that I was reading
this on doesn't mention what issues exactly, though I suspect
it had to do with the abolition of slavery in
(14:36):
a number of Cain growing places in the Americas around
that time.
Speaker 3 (14:41):
At any rate.
Speaker 2 (14:43):
Yes, sugar refiners were particularly motivated in the early eighteen
eighties to find new ways to make money and keep
the sugar supply flowing right.
Speaker 1 (14:54):
So together they came up with golden syrup, which they
called Goldie. Mid eighteen eighties, it was available in the
UK commercially. It was first sold only at grocers from
like large wooden barrels, but by eighteen eighty five it
was in those metal tens, yes iconic, which we'll talk
about in a second. In some sources, Lyle previously had
(15:16):
sold the byproduct, which was this thick syrup that he'd
refined using charcoal, to his workers in large barrels, and
through this he built up a demand, and that was
part of the impetus of his desire to sell the product.
I saw a couple different stories about the start of
this whole thing, but however it started. This product soon
(15:40):
became something of a staple in the UK. It could
be found in pantries across the UK the ten and label,
which if you haven't seen this label, go look it up.
Apparently it costs quite a stir. Recently, when people were like, wait,
what it's a deadlon surrounded by bees. Some people thought
was sleeping. I guess it's a deadlon. Yeah, yeah, okay.
(16:07):
It became pretty iconic. Allegedly, Lyle was very religious and
the logo was inspired by the story of Samson in
the Old Testament's Book of Judges. Samson was attacked by
a lion but was able to kill it by ripping
it open, and then he later realizes that bees have
built a hive within the lion's carcass, and Samson gets
(16:30):
some of the honey from the hive and there and
his family and friends use it in a feast after
he gives it to them a knowing of its origin,
and he kind of presents them with the riddle about it.
Here's the quote from Judges, and he said onto them,
out of the eater came forth meat, and out of
the strong came forth sweetness. And they could not in
(16:52):
three days expound the riddle. So he's basically, yeah, I
don't know what you're saying, man, but their slogan is,
out of the strong came forth sweetness. The tens with
this design first hit shelves in eighteen eighty four and
they haven't changed since. Then other than the listed weights
(17:14):
that were changed to meet EU regulations, though at one point,
thanks to shortages during World War Two, the tins were
made of cardboard. The recipe has remained the same since
then too, according to the company, which is why, Yeah,
which is why some have dubbed it the oldest brand
in the world. Were on that in a second as well.
(17:36):
For the one hundred and twenty fifth anniversary, there were
gold tens available. The green ones were still there, but
it was the addition of oh gold tents. Yes, I
did read one thing. I couldn't really verify this anywhere,
but I did read this source that suggested that golden
(17:56):
syrup was first mentioned in the written record in eighteen
forty in Australia, and according to this source, this product
was probably imported from America or the Caribbean and sold
by J and T. Waterhouse of Rundle Street. It earned
the nickname Cocky's Joy, which I looked up and is
still in use. Okay, Yeah, it was like it was
(18:19):
a newspaper, Like It's not like just some source that
had nothing behind it. But it was just I couldn't
get beyond that part.
Speaker 2 (18:26):
Yeah, I mean, for sure, like the reason that we
have rum is that molasses and refiners syrup are industrial
byproducts of what was around that time and extremely productive industry.
So it is it would not be a surprise to
me if something similar to golden syrup was in fact
being sold elsewhere around the same time. Or yes.
Speaker 3 (18:47):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:49):
Abram Lyle died in eighteen ninety one, but the legacy
lived on. The family was involved in a lot of it.
When Captain Scott trecked to the Antarctic in the early
nineteen hundreds, golden syrup was part of the expedition, and
Scott wrote to Lyle, your golden syrup has been in
daily use in this hut throughout the winter and has
(19:12):
been much appreciated by all members of the expedition.
Speaker 2 (19:16):
Spoiler alert that that trip did not go well, though.
When explorers unearthed some of his party's supplies from that
hut in like nineteen fifty six, they did find a
tin of golden syrup and it was still fine.
Speaker 1 (19:33):
Well, who there you go, Yes, there you go. In
nineteen twenty one, Abram Lyle and Sons, which was the
name of the company, emerged with Henry Tate and Sons
to form Tate and Lyle, and from what I read,
they had kind of a rivalry but also kind of
an understanding, like they wouldn't like mess with each other's territory.
(19:53):
But then they came together. By nineteen twenty two, King
George the Fifth was a big fan of golden syrup.
Speaker 2 (20:02):
Yeah, he gave a tit and loyal royal warrant. He
also made Charles Eastick a member of the Most Excellent
Order of the British Empire. As during World War One,
Eastick had headed up the Kingdom's sugar rationing program. And
speaking of Eastick, Charles Eastick had left Lyle's company back
in eighteen ninety to do other work in sugar. I
(20:23):
don't think that there was hard feelings, but at any rate,
in nineteen twenty eight he opened his own sugar refining
factory and company, the aforementioned Rageous. They began producing tens
of Eastick's golden syrup, which are also still available to
this day.
Speaker 1 (20:39):
Yes. By World War two, the Tate and Lyle factory
in London employed two thousand people. During the war, they
operated around the clock and survived air raids. The one
person did die during a bombing in nineteen forty four,
the factory was producing one thousand tons of Golden syrup
a week. Yeah, yep. The Tait and Lyle Company released
(21:03):
Lyles Black Treacle in nineteen fifty, which also went on
to become pretty iconic. Yes. In nineteen sixty seven, Lyles's
original refining location at Plasto Wharf stopped producing sugar for
sale and instead they focused solely on the syrup. So
then when we're talking about these factories in London, is
the original place.
Speaker 2 (21:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (21:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (21:23):
Also in the nineteen sixties, plastic jars were introduced plastic
I know.
Speaker 3 (21:31):
Well.
Speaker 1 (21:32):
The Guinness Book of World Records recognized Lyles Golden Syrup
as having the world's oldest packaging and branding in two
thousand and eight. Basically they were like, it's really haven't
changed the recipe, really haven't changed the branding, So there
you go, and that's when they released the golden packaging.
(21:53):
But yes, from what I read from a US perspective,
a lot of people got introduced to thanks to the
great British Big Yeah, but they're fans. People are fans.
Some of them just realized what was on the logo.
(22:14):
I had to have a whole moment about it.
Speaker 2 (22:16):
Yeah, they're also like anti fans are people like it's
too sweet, I don't like it, and I don't like
you for liking it.
Speaker 3 (22:25):
Kind of vibe.
Speaker 1 (22:27):
Yeah, I got you, okay. Yeah, And I did see
a couple of people who were kind of fighting about
like this is really the product you should be getting
that this one which we love those opinions.
Speaker 3 (22:39):
Oh yeah, oh of course.
Speaker 1 (22:41):
Yes. So if you have any of those opinions.
Speaker 2 (22:44):
Oh yeah, if you have a brand that you prefer
if certainly, if you have recipes that require it, no
other substitution will do.
Speaker 1 (22:54):
Yes, please let us know.
Speaker 2 (22:59):
We in the In the meanwhile, we do have some
listener mail already for you, but we are going to
get into that after we get into another quick break
for a word from our sponsors.
Speaker 1 (23:18):
They we're back, Thank you, sponsors, Yes, thank you, And
we're back with smooth pouring of sirrup. Yes great, Yes, Well,
we continue on with these messages about fitzzle. I love this,
(23:42):
so many thoughts about Patzille, Ali wrote, I've attached a
picture of the cookie table at my Pittsburgh cousin's wedding.
I don't live in that area, so it's the only
one I've ever seen, and they set the bar high.
I wanted to send you the video I took walking
around it, but Gmail says the thirty two second file
is too large. A note on cookie table etiquette. While
(24:07):
I am by no means an expert, a cousin of
the groom other side of the family, so no relation
showed up with a cooler and extra takeaway boxes for themselves.
That is round upon it turned into a good laugh,
though they were still copious cookies for the other guests
(24:28):
and for leftovers.
Speaker 2 (24:30):
Ah okay, And so to set the scene for y'all,
this is not a single table. This is a amalgamation
of tables set up in a ring. There's potted plant
life in the center of the ring, and the table
is blatten with cookie trays. If I had to guess,
(24:53):
I'd say it's about thirty Yeah, I think so all
different kinds. They all look glorious. Yes, people are. We're
all on different platters. Yeah, some are rays, some are square,
some around there's one like multi tier tray out there. Yeah,
and everyone has a plate and they are circling the
(25:15):
cookie buffet table, and uh, what a wonderful thing.
Speaker 1 (25:19):
I mean, that is a lot of cookies and look,
I you know, I understand the looking down upon the
cousin who show is a cooler, but there's a part
of me that's like.
Speaker 2 (25:32):
I mean, I mean game recognized game man, Like, that's
totally something that you would do.
Speaker 3 (25:38):
I would try not to do.
Speaker 1 (25:39):
It if, like I wasn't wanted, but like, we used
to have lunches in her office, like every Thursday, once
upon a time, and I would come on. I would
show up with upperware probably like nope, this is gonna
go away.
Speaker 3 (25:52):
There were always leftovers.
Speaker 2 (25:53):
There were always so many left especially when there was
that one glorious period where there had been some kind
of mix up and we were getting to lunches every
week and we didn't know how to stop the second one.
Speaker 1 (26:06):
I mean honestly with the cooler rolling cooler. Oh my gosh,
that's great, that's great.
Speaker 2 (26:16):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (26:18):
Oh heck, oh I miss I do miss those office days.
Yeah yeah, all right.
Speaker 2 (26:24):
Uh, Angelo wrote, I've been a listener since the food
Stuff days, but this might actually be the first time
I'm writing in. I was so excited when I saw
the Pizzell episode come through, as that is something I
have fond memories of as a child. My family comes
from a small city south and east of Rome called Farentino.
It lies right on the border of Lazio and Abruzzo.
(26:46):
Am I saying, I'm so sorry? Sure those things on
the other side of the mountains. Unfortunately I had never
witnessed my aunt make them, only the intricate and beautifully
patterned cookies that she delivered at Christmas time. They were
crisp and golden brown, delicately flavored with almond and dusted
with powdered sugar, and I haven't had them since she passed.
Her English was broken, but I still remember the kindness
(27:08):
and care and her dark olive eyes when she delivered
them or hosted a handmade pasta dinner as a labor
of love for our family. Seeing pasta draped over every cabinet,
door and chair in her home was such a fun
thing to see as a child. I don't know whether
she made the pizzele with an electric or hand press,
but now, thanks to your episode, I'm going to ask
around and see if her pizzelle maker has survived the
(27:29):
year's gone by. I hope I'll have something more to
share with you, but if not, thank you so much
for making these memories come back, and of course for
all the care and research you both put into each episode.
Speaker 3 (27:40):
PS.
Speaker 2 (27:41):
This summer, I will be in an art restoration workshop
in the Apulia region of southern Italy, so I am
very excited to experience the regional cuisine there. I'll send
a postcard your way, since I know your show will
be playing in my headphones while I spend hours patiently
cleaning paintings.
Speaker 1 (27:59):
Cool, so cool.
Speaker 3 (28:02):
All of that is cool.
Speaker 2 (28:03):
Art restoration, painting cleaning. Uh, it sounds really terrifically nerdy
and precise, Yes, and wonderful. Also, oh, what beautiful memories.
And I'm so sorry I just butchered a lot of
Italian Yes once again, I was like, all I take that, thanks, Annie.
Speaker 1 (28:27):
I know, these are beautiful memories. I love I love
those when it comes back to you and you're like, oh, yeah,
that used to be when I was a kid. Maybe
I didn't like understand it or appreciate it as much,
but when you get older and that memory comes back,
like oh yeah, it was so like precious, so like
I knew what that meant when there was pastive everywhere,
or when the cookies would be delivered.
Speaker 2 (28:50):
Yeah, yeah, and I'm like appreciating the work that went
into it because as a kid, everything seems kind of magic, right,
Like until someone really shows you the process, you're just like,
oh cool, Uh.
Speaker 1 (29:02):
Where are my cookies? Yeah? And I hope you find
if you do, let us know if you find me
that's la press. Uh, yeah, because that would be such
a cool fine. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (29:15):
Oh, and certainly let us know about the regional cuisine, yes,
that you encounter, because yes, please absolutely.
Speaker 1 (29:27):
Let us live vicariously through you. I need to hear
about it, yes, please. Well, thanks to both of these
listeners for writing in. If you would like to write
to us, we would love to hear from you our emails,
Hello at saberpod dot com.
Speaker 3 (29:43):
We are also on social media.
Speaker 2 (29:45):
You can find us on Twitter, Facebook, and Instagram at
saber pod, and we do hope to hear from you.
Savor is production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts my Heart Radio,
you can visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever.
Speaker 3 (29:56):
You listen to your favorite shows.
Speaker 2 (29:58):
Thanks as always to our super producer Dylan Fagan and
Andrew Howard. Thanks to you for listening, and we hope
that lots of more good things are coming your way,
Hello, and welcome to Savor Protection of iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
I'm Annirie's and I'm Moan volbah bam, and today we
have an episode for you about golden syrup.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
Yes, which I had no idea what it was, never
had heard of it.
Speaker 3 (00:21):
Oh really, Oh wow.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
I'm given to understand that if I watched The Great
British Bakeoff, I would have an idea. Yeah, if I
lived in the.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
UK, but right, or Australia or New Zealand.
Speaker 1 (00:38):
No, no, no, nope. But the logo is very memorable.
We'll talk about that.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
Okay, Well, I mean, okay, but you've you've all right,
if you've heard of treacle tart, yes, then that is
made with golden syrup.
Speaker 1 (00:53):
Yes, so, I mean I must have encountered it. I
just didn't know what it was when you suggested it.
And it sounds like such a regal item, old syrup.
It sounds like a video game thing that I'd be
hunting down. Was there any particular reason it was on
your mind?
Speaker 2 (01:14):
It had been on our idealist for a while, I
assume because one of y'all suggested it, and for some
heck and reason, some part of my brain was like, oh,
golden syrup. That's just a nice brand, kind of related
like Industrial revolution product. It'll be relatively easy to research.
Speaker 3 (01:38):
It should be a.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
Light load for last week when I was trying to
take a heck in little bit of a vacation, weird.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
Didn't like it.
Speaker 3 (01:50):
Don't worry never again.
Speaker 1 (01:52):
I'm joking.
Speaker 3 (01:52):
It was terrific.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
But yeah, and I had forgotten that sugar is complicated.
I don't know why I forgot that, but we're going
to have lots of fun with this one.
Speaker 1 (02:10):
It was quite humorous because it all came together very
quickly as you were leaving, and then it became apparent
that wasn't Yeah.
Speaker 3 (02:21):
Yeah. The reason that our last episode was a classic,
y'all was that I.
Speaker 2 (02:26):
Like messaged Annie in a state of panic at like
three thirty or four o'clock, like half an hour before
we were supposed to record.
Speaker 3 (02:37):
Oh, like, I can't do it today?
Speaker 1 (02:40):
Can we do classic?
Speaker 3 (02:43):
Yeah? I don't understand molasses at all.
Speaker 1 (02:48):
It's complicated. I tried to figure it out. At one
point during the history section. I was like, no, no, oh,
that's not for me. Wow. Speaking of our episodes we've
done on honey sugar, maple syrup, and molasses. Yes, I
feel like there's other related things, but those are the
(03:09):
big ones that came to my mind. Yeah, yeah, yes,
which I suppose brings us to our question. Golden syrup.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
What is it?
Speaker 3 (03:22):
Well?
Speaker 2 (03:23):
Golden syrup, also sometimes called light treacle, is a type
of syrup made from sugar. It is golden in color
and has a sort of similar consistency to honey, but
with a more directly sweet taste and hints of like
caramel and kind of mildly tart to bitter sort of flavors. Yeah,
those come from its production process. It is an industrial
(03:44):
byproduct of refining cane or beet juice into granulated sugar,
though it is further processed a little bit itself. It
can be used directly as a sweet topping or sauce
for baked goods like pancakes or sponge cakes, or on
savory dishes like roast vegetables or a ham, but it's
perhaps mostly used in applications where granulated sugar would be
(04:05):
like a little bit of a pain in the rear. Like,
it's already a liquid, so you can easily dissolve it
into cold drinks, and it's designed to resist crystallization, So
it's useful in candy making and baking to keep your
end product like ungrainy. It can also help baked good
stain moist. It's like, it's like if light corn syrup
(04:25):
had a flavor. It's like molasses's less bitter cousin. It's
just this this very sweet, golden round sort of experience,
like a like eating a childhood memory of the sun.
Speaker 1 (04:42):
Aw yeah, yeah syrup. And then I like to imagine
molasses being all bitter in the background in the shade. Well,
should we break down some of the sugar sci its?
Speaker 3 (04:56):
I don't want to. All right, right, all right, sugar
sugar hoo boy, Okay.
Speaker 2 (05:04):
Starting at the top, Refined white crystallized sugar, like table sugar,
is made by taking the juice from sugar cane or
sugar beets and boiling it down to get most of
the water out, then spurring on the crystallization process somehow,
usually with a few crystals of sugar, because essentially, on
(05:25):
a molecular level, if you put a few crystals of
sugar in with liquid sugar, a lot of the liquid
stuff goes, oh oh that's a great idea, fabulous yes,
and it will crystallize as well. You can then centrifuge
out the crystals from the remaining cooked down syrup because
the cooked down syrup is sticky. If you're doing this
on like an industrial level, it helps if you simultaneously
(05:49):
wash the crystals using a solution of already refined sugar
in water. If you use just water, it had dissolved
those hard earned crystals. But this solution is it's like, no,
we're already full up on sucrose here, We're cool. So
it's an effective I guess, like gentle wash.
Speaker 3 (06:06):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:08):
But so after you take the crystals out, you were
left with this slightly watered down syrup. That syrup is
referred to as refiners return syrup, and very basically you
can keep reusing it, but sometimes you have too much
to use, or you decide to start a fresh batch.
(06:28):
So if you want, you can boil it and crystallizes
as much sugar as possible out of it, which will
darken it in color and make it develop all kinds
of these rich bitter flavors from caramelization, and that's a
dark treacle, or if it's a little bit darker, it's molasses,
or if it's basically not even sweet anymore. It's black
strap molasses. But if you just take that refiner's return
(06:53):
syrup and purify it a little bit, that is golden
syrup or light treacle or cane syrup. Yeah, and it's
just incredibly shelf stable, resistant crystallization, golden in color and
with just a little bit of the toasty flavors that
you get from caramelization, and about a fit again as
sweet as table sugar. That's like twenty percent more sweet
(07:15):
if you don't speak British, and okay, it is so
resistant to crystallization because again extremely basically, I'm not a chemist.
Table sugar is sucrose, which is a molecule made up
of glucose and fruit toose that are holding hands, and
(07:36):
sucrose really enjoys being a crystal. But if you can
get the glucose and the fruit toase to stop holding hands,
they're a lot happier to exist as a liquid at
room temperature. This is also sometimes called invert sugar because
of the way the light shines through it compared with
liquid sucrose, which is the way that you assess the
(07:59):
content sugar syrup.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
Okay, that's not what I Okay, Okay, sure.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
Yeah, it's not it's not well, I mean, I guess
it's technically like poetically inverted because it's a liquid rather
than a crystal. But this is the real reason that
that's the name of that. If you are a chemist
and I'm wrong, let me know. I'm pretty sure that's
what's up. H I do have the general idea that
(08:37):
since this became a popular and also a modern product,
the production process has become extremely precise. I say a
general idea because I don't understand what it's talking about.
That is a factually correct statement that I just made.
And also I can't explain it any furthers, So here
we are. But anyway, yes, this is a industrial product.
(09:00):
You can't approximate it at home by cooking down some
water and table sugar with a little bit of acid
like a like a lemon juice to help invert the
sucrose until you have something the consistency and color of
like a light honey. And yeah, at that point you
can use it in just whatever whatever you like that
calls for golden syrup if you have bought a tin
(09:21):
of it or a bottle. I understand it comes in
bottles these days. But it's really hard to find outside
of the x United Kingdom.
Speaker 1 (09:32):
So yes, yes, And I found a very funny article
that was like, Americans, stop trying to recreate with the substitute,
buy it online and forget it. Made laugh. Well, what
about the nutrition?
Speaker 3 (09:50):
A sugar is a treat?
Speaker 2 (09:51):
Treats are nice, that being said, because in golden syrup
that sucrose has been broken down into fruitose and glucose.
And because different sugar and other sweeteners can taste sweeter
than sucrose. Right, you don't need to use as much
golden syrup versus like white table sugar to get the
same level of sweetness. Fruit toase tastes a decent bit
(10:12):
sweeter than sucrose, A glucose just a little bit less
sweet anyway.
Speaker 1 (10:16):
Oh okay, well, h we have some numbers for you.
Some of them are in the history section.
Speaker 2 (10:27):
Yeah all right, So y'all, I am one of the
times that I yelled at my computer screen today it
was more than once, was that I could not find
industrial numbers on how much golden syrup is produced and sold.
This seems like the kind of thing that sugar companies
(10:49):
would be so excited to talk about and I could
find nothing, so I wanted to share with you a
little bit of the text from Rageouses that that's rageous
being one of the companies that produces a golden syrup
in the UK, some of their casual information about how
(11:14):
golden syrup is made. All right, this is kind of
coming in in the middle of it. Here we go.
The remaining thirty six percent of sugar needed for the
final product is then added to the inversion pan to
produce a partial invert. Once dissolved, the density of the
sucrose in the solution is a maximum of eighty three percent,
and the polarization is plus money, skipping a bit of
a head. Finally, the golden syrup must pass through an
(11:36):
eighty micron filter before it's packed to customers requirements ready
for delivery.
Speaker 3 (11:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (11:44):
Well, uh, I will say they do have a history
of being pretty close to the chest with this recipe
and process. So it makes sense that we've both left,
perhaps not more educated than before from that description.
Speaker 2 (12:07):
I mean, I basically get what it's saying. I'm just like,
oh heck, yeah, yeah, I really don't understand the light thing.
I just I light is confusing. At any rate, we
do have some history for you, which is we do
a little bit more understandable, just a.
Speaker 1 (12:24):
Little bit yes, and we'll get into that after we
get back from a quick break for a word from
our sponsors, and we're back.
Speaker 3 (12:38):
Thank you sponsored, Yes, thank you okay.
Speaker 1 (12:41):
So Golden Syrup is often credited to Abram Le of
the Glebe Sugar Refinery in Greenock, Scotland in eighteen eighty one.
Well I was born there in eighteen twenty. The first
job he had was as a cooper with the barrels,
and then he expanded that into a small shipping business
and through this he got involved in the sugar trade
(13:03):
and this eventually led him to taking a part share
in a nearby sugar refinery factory.
Speaker 2 (13:10):
The story goes that he was given his share in
the refinery by someone who owed him money and couldn't
pay any other way.
Speaker 1 (13:16):
Right, But he stuck with it and he realized that
he could make a lot of money if he set
up shop selling sugar in London, so in eighteen eighty
one he relocated to that city where he opened a
sugar refining factory called Abram lyleand Sons on the Thames
in London, where he and his sons processed sugarcane into
sugar loaves, and these loaves were how sugar was typically
(13:40):
consumed at the time. People would buy them and they
would grate or pound them to suit their needs at
home after purchasing.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
Yeah, rather than like a bag of sugar, you would
get a loaf of sugar exactly.
Speaker 1 (13:51):
So the story goes that one day, while feeding the
by products of his sugar refining process two pigs, he
got the idea to find a way to turn this
byproduct into something that people could eat and enjoy, and
of course, something that he could sell and make money
off of. So to accomplish this he enlisted the help
of three chemist brothers named John, Joseph, Samuel and Charles
(14:12):
Eastick in eighteen eighty two.
Speaker 2 (14:15):
Since eighteen eighty the Eastics had been working in the
sugar business in London, analyzing imported sugar to help sellers
determine prices and duty payments, but there were issues in
the supply chain. The corporate website that I was reading
this on doesn't mention what issues exactly, though I suspect
it had to do with the abolition of slavery in
(14:36):
a number of Cain growing places in the Americas around
that time.
Speaker 3 (14:41):
At any rate.
Speaker 2 (14:43):
Yes, sugar refiners were particularly motivated in the early eighteen
eighties to find new ways to make money and keep
the sugar supply flowing right.
Speaker 1 (14:54):
So together they came up with golden syrup, which they
called Goldie. Mid eighteen eighties, it was available in the
UK commercially. It was first sold only at grocers from
like large wooden barrels, but by eighteen eighty five it
was in those metal tens, yes iconic, which we'll talk
about in a second. In some sources, Lyle previously had
(15:16):
sold the byproduct, which was this thick syrup that he'd
refined using charcoal, to his workers in large barrels, and
through this he built up a demand, and that was
part of the impetus of his desire to sell the product.
I saw a couple different stories about the start of
this whole thing, but however it started. This product soon
(15:40):
became something of a staple in the UK. It could
be found in pantries across the UK the ten and label,
which if you haven't seen this label, go look it up.
Apparently it costs quite a stir. Recently, when people were like, wait,
what it's a deadlon surrounded by bees. Some people thought
was sleeping. I guess it's a deadlon. Yeah, yeah, okay.
(16:07):
It became pretty iconic. Allegedly, Lyle was very religious and
the logo was inspired by the story of Samson in
the Old Testament's Book of Judges. Samson was attacked by
a lion but was able to kill it by ripping
it open, and then he later realizes that bees have
built a hive within the lion's carcass, and Samson gets
(16:30):
some of the honey from the hive and there and
his family and friends use it in a feast after
he gives it to them a knowing of its origin,
and he kind of presents them with the riddle about it.
Here's the quote from Judges, and he said onto them,
out of the eater came forth meat, and out of
the strong came forth sweetness. And they could not in
(16:52):
three days expound the riddle. So he's basically, yeah, I
don't know what you're saying, man, but their slogan is,
out of the strong came forth sweetness. The tens with
this design first hit shelves in eighteen eighty four and
they haven't changed since. Then other than the listed weights
(17:14):
that were changed to meet EU regulations, though at one point,
thanks to shortages during World War Two, the tins were
made of cardboard. The recipe has remained the same since
then too, according to the company, which is why, Yeah,
which is why some have dubbed it the oldest brand
in the world. Were on that in a second as well.
(17:36):
For the one hundred and twenty fifth anniversary, there were
gold tens available. The green ones were still there, but
it was the addition of oh gold tents. Yes, I
did read one thing. I couldn't really verify this anywhere,
but I did read this source that suggested that golden
(17:56):
syrup was first mentioned in the written record in eighteen
forty in Australia, and according to this source, this product
was probably imported from America or the Caribbean and sold
by J and T. Waterhouse of Rundle Street. It earned
the nickname Cocky's Joy, which I looked up and is
still in use. Okay, Yeah, it was like it was
(18:19):
a newspaper, Like It's not like just some source that
had nothing behind it. But it was just I couldn't
get beyond that part.
Speaker 2 (18:26):
Yeah, I mean, for sure, like the reason that we
have rum is that molasses and refiners syrup are industrial
byproducts of what was around that time and extremely productive industry.
So it is it would not be a surprise to
me if something similar to golden syrup was in fact
being sold elsewhere around the same time. Or yes.
Speaker 3 (18:47):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:49):
Abram Lyle died in eighteen ninety one, but the legacy
lived on. The family was involved in a lot of it.
When Captain Scott trecked to the Antarctic in the early
nineteen hundreds, golden syrup was part of the expedition, and
Scott wrote to Lyle, your golden syrup has been in
daily use in this hut throughout the winter and has
(19:12):
been much appreciated by all members of the expedition.
Speaker 2 (19:16):
Spoiler alert that that trip did not go well, though.
When explorers unearthed some of his party's supplies from that
hut in like nineteen fifty six, they did find a
tin of golden syrup and it was still fine.
Speaker 1 (19:33):
Well, who there you go, Yes, there you go. In
nineteen twenty one, Abram Lyle and Sons, which was the
name of the company, emerged with Henry Tate and Sons
to form Tate and Lyle, and from what I read,
they had kind of a rivalry but also kind of
an understanding, like they wouldn't like mess with each other's territory.
(19:53):
But then they came together. By nineteen twenty two, King
George the Fifth was a big fan of golden syrup.
Speaker 2 (20:02):
Yeah, he gave a tit and loyal royal warrant. He
also made Charles Eastick a member of the Most Excellent
Order of the British Empire. As during World War One,
Eastick had headed up the Kingdom's sugar rationing program. And
speaking of Eastick, Charles Eastick had left Lyle's company back
in eighteen ninety to do other work in sugar. I
(20:23):
don't think that there was hard feelings, but at any rate,
in nineteen twenty eight he opened his own sugar refining
factory and company, the aforementioned Rageous. They began producing tens
of Eastick's golden syrup, which are also still available to
this day.
Speaker 1 (20:39):
Yes. By World War two, the Tate and Lyle factory
in London employed two thousand people. During the war, they
operated around the clock and survived air raids. The one
person did die during a bombing in nineteen forty four,
the factory was producing one thousand tons of Golden syrup
a week. Yeah, yep. The Tait and Lyle Company released
(21:03):
Lyles Black Treacle in nineteen fifty, which also went on
to become pretty iconic. Yes. In nineteen sixty seven, Lyles's
original refining location at Plasto Wharf stopped producing sugar for
sale and instead they focused solely on the syrup. So
then when we're talking about these factories in London, is
the original place.
Speaker 2 (21:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (21:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (21:23):
Also in the nineteen sixties, plastic jars were introduced plastic
I know.
Speaker 3 (21:31):
Well.
Speaker 1 (21:32):
The Guinness Book of World Records recognized Lyles Golden Syrup
as having the world's oldest packaging and branding in two
thousand and eight. Basically they were like, it's really haven't
changed the recipe, really haven't changed the branding, So there
you go, and that's when they released the golden packaging.
(21:53):
But yes, from what I read from a US perspective,
a lot of people got introduced to thanks to the
great British Big Yeah, but they're fans. People are fans.
Some of them just realized what was on the logo.
(22:14):
I had to have a whole moment about it.
Speaker 2 (22:16):
Yeah, they're also like anti fans are people like it's
too sweet, I don't like it, and I don't like
you for liking it.
Speaker 3 (22:25):
Kind of vibe.
Speaker 1 (22:27):
Yeah, I got you, okay. Yeah, And I did see
a couple of people who were kind of fighting about
like this is really the product you should be getting
that this one which we love those opinions.
Speaker 3 (22:39):
Oh yeah, oh of course.
Speaker 1 (22:41):
Yes. So if you have any of those opinions.
Speaker 2 (22:44):
Oh yeah, if you have a brand that you prefer
if certainly, if you have recipes that require it, no
other substitution will do.
Speaker 1 (22:54):
Yes, please let us know.
Speaker 2 (22:59):
We in the In the meanwhile, we do have some
listener mail already for you, but we are going to
get into that after we get into another quick break
for a word from our sponsors.
Speaker 1 (23:18):
They we're back, Thank you, sponsors, Yes, thank you, And
we're back with smooth pouring of sirrup. Yes great, Yes, Well,
we continue on with these messages about fitzzle. I love this,
(23:42):
so many thoughts about Patzille, Ali wrote, I've attached a
picture of the cookie table at my Pittsburgh cousin's wedding.
I don't live in that area, so it's the only
one I've ever seen, and they set the bar high.
I wanted to send you the video I took walking
around it, but Gmail says the thirty two second file
is too large. A note on cookie table etiquette. While
(24:07):
I am by no means an expert, a cousin of
the groom other side of the family, so no relation
showed up with a cooler and extra takeaway boxes for themselves.
That is round upon it turned into a good laugh,
though they were still copious cookies for the other guests
(24:28):
and for leftovers.
Speaker 2 (24:30):
Ah okay, And so to set the scene for y'all,
this is not a single table. This is a amalgamation
of tables set up in a ring. There's potted plant
life in the center of the ring, and the table
is blatten with cookie trays. If I had to guess,
(24:53):
I'd say it's about thirty Yeah, I think so all
different kinds. They all look glorious. Yes, people are. We're
all on different platters. Yeah, some are rays, some are square,
some around there's one like multi tier tray out there. Yeah,
and everyone has a plate and they are circling the
(25:15):
cookie buffet table, and uh, what a wonderful thing.
Speaker 1 (25:19):
I mean, that is a lot of cookies and look,
I you know, I understand the looking down upon the
cousin who show is a cooler, but there's a part
of me that's like.
Speaker 2 (25:32):
I mean, I mean game recognized game man, Like, that's
totally something that you would do.
Speaker 3 (25:38):
I would try not to do.
Speaker 1 (25:39):
It if, like I wasn't wanted, but like, we used
to have lunches in her office, like every Thursday, once
upon a time, and I would come on. I would
show up with upperware probably like nope, this is gonna
go away.
Speaker 3 (25:52):
There were always leftovers.
Speaker 2 (25:53):
There were always so many left especially when there was
that one glorious period where there had been some kind
of mix up and we were getting to lunches every
week and we didn't know how to stop the second one.
Speaker 1 (26:06):
I mean honestly with the cooler rolling cooler. Oh my gosh,
that's great, that's great.
Speaker 2 (26:16):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (26:18):
Oh heck, oh I miss I do miss those office days.
Yeah yeah, all right.
Speaker 2 (26:24):
Uh, Angelo wrote, I've been a listener since the food
Stuff days, but this might actually be the first time
I'm writing in. I was so excited when I saw
the Pizzell episode come through, as that is something I
have fond memories of as a child. My family comes
from a small city south and east of Rome called Farentino.
It lies right on the border of Lazio and Abruzzo.
(26:46):
Am I saying, I'm so sorry? Sure those things on
the other side of the mountains. Unfortunately I had never
witnessed my aunt make them, only the intricate and beautifully
patterned cookies that she delivered at Christmas time. They were
crisp and golden brown, delicately flavored with almond and dusted
with powdered sugar, and I haven't had them since she passed.
Her English was broken, but I still remember the kindness
(27:08):
and care and her dark olive eyes when she delivered
them or hosted a handmade pasta dinner as a labor
of love for our family. Seeing pasta draped over every cabinet,
door and chair in her home was such a fun
thing to see as a child. I don't know whether
she made the pizzele with an electric or hand press,
but now, thanks to your episode, I'm going to ask
around and see if her pizzelle maker has survived the
(27:29):
year's gone by. I hope I'll have something more to
share with you, but if not, thank you so much
for making these memories come back, and of course for
all the care and research you both put into each episode.
Speaker 3 (27:40):
PS.
Speaker 2 (27:41):
This summer, I will be in an art restoration workshop
in the Apulia region of southern Italy, so I am
very excited to experience the regional cuisine there. I'll send
a postcard your way, since I know your show will
be playing in my headphones while I spend hours patiently
cleaning paintings.
Speaker 1 (27:59):
Cool, so cool.
Speaker 3 (28:02):
All of that is cool.
Speaker 2 (28:03):
Art restoration, painting cleaning. Uh, it sounds really terrifically nerdy
and precise, Yes, and wonderful. Also, oh, what beautiful memories.
And I'm so sorry I just butchered a lot of
Italian Yes once again, I was like, all I take that, thanks, Annie.
Speaker 1 (28:27):
I know, these are beautiful memories. I love I love
those when it comes back to you and you're like, oh, yeah,
that used to be when I was a kid. Maybe
I didn't like understand it or appreciate it as much,
but when you get older and that memory comes back,
like oh yeah, it was so like precious, so like
I knew what that meant when there was pastive everywhere,
or when the cookies would be delivered.
Speaker 2 (28:50):
Yeah, yeah, and I'm like appreciating the work that went
into it because as a kid, everything seems kind of magic, right,
Like until someone really shows you the process, you're just like,
oh cool, Uh.
Speaker 1 (29:02):
Where are my cookies? Yeah? And I hope you find
if you do, let us know if you find me
that's la press. Uh, yeah, because that would be such
a cool fine. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (29:15):
Oh, and certainly let us know about the regional cuisine, yes,
that you encounter, because yes, please absolutely.
Speaker 1 (29:27):
Let us live vicariously through you. I need to hear
about it, yes, please. Well, thanks to both of these
listeners for writing in. If you would like to write
to us, we would love to hear from you our emails,
Hello at saberpod dot com.
Speaker 3 (29:43):
We are also on social media.
Speaker 2 (29:45):
You can find us on Twitter, Facebook, and Instagram at
saber pod, and we do hope to hear from you.
Savor is production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts my Heart Radio,
you can visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever.
Speaker 3 (29:56):
You listen to your favorite shows.
Speaker 2 (29:58):
Thanks as always to our super producer Dylan Fagan and
Andrew Howard. Thanks to you for listening, and we hope
that lots of more good things are coming your way,
Savor News
Hosts And Creators
Dylan Fagan
Anney Reese
Lauren Vogelbaum
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