Divine Bovine prompts a conversation about the Apple Vision Pro. Moons of Athos shares some of the (awesome) music he creates while inspired by Stuff They Don't Want You To Know. A ton of fellow Conspiracy Realists write in to confirm our earlier story on Oklahoma and cannabis-related human trafficking, assuring us the problem is much, much worse than the news is letting on. All this and more in this week's listener mail segment.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is
riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or
learn the stuff they don't want you to know. A
production of iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Hello, welcome back to the show. My name is Matt,
my name is Nol.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
They call me Ben. We're joined as always with our
super producer, LE'SUS code named Doc Holliday Jackson. Most importantly,
you are you. You are here, and that makes this
the stuff they don't want you to know. It is
February seventh as you are hearing this, folks, let me
let me check the math there. Yeah, I think that's right. Well,
(00:48):
sometime in February as you're hearing this, it's one of
the most exciting evenings for us. We get to hear
from our fellow conspiracy realist. We're going to have some
old friends from real life contact us with some inspirational words.
We're going to gosh, guys, we really hit a nerve
(01:09):
with our recent exploration of Oklahoma, so we'll get to
some of that before we do any of that. Folks,
we sold out. We're so excited about the future of
the surveillance state. How do you like that?
Speaker 3 (01:24):
Set? Up at where we go.
Speaker 2 (01:26):
Yes, as we surveil the world and it surveils us back.
Speaker 1 (01:31):
I guess do you guys remember when our pal our
complaint department Jonathan Strickland please always email him Jonathan Strickland
at iHeartMedia dot com. Do you guys remember when he
had those Google glasses that he was rocket?
Speaker 2 (01:43):
I do remember the Google glass.
Speaker 4 (01:46):
It was such a flop kind of They never even
mass produced them. It was just always sort of like
a beta test for like, you know, people in the
tech space and you know, bloggers and podcasters and stuff.
Speaker 3 (01:56):
So he did get a hold of some of them.
Speaker 4 (01:59):
I never heard much about it beyond that because it
turned out people didn't want to wear that on their
face all the time.
Speaker 2 (02:06):
Oh, Google glass. I actually was kind of interested in
that one, but not really.
Speaker 3 (02:12):
I know.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
I was because because it felt like something you might wear.
If it had if it looked like regular glasses exactly,
then sure.
Speaker 1 (02:20):
If it didn't look like just the top frame of glasses, yeah,
with a weird obvious camera.
Speaker 2 (02:26):
Yeah, it might have been into it. Well, guys, Apple
has an answer to all of these, you know, questions
about how are we going to see the future, how
are we going to interact with the future. We can't
all be walking over around with an oculus quest seven
on in twenty thirty, well what will we be doing?
Speaker 3 (02:47):
What will we.
Speaker 2 (02:48):
Be doing in twenty twenty four? Well, Apple's answer was
brought to us by ye Anointed Bovine. Someone who emailed
us Anointed Bovine says, I saw an ad for a
new product, Vision Pro by Apple. It's a weird future.
We're propelling toward amazing uses in engineering, but a weird
(03:10):
future for sure. They also started thirty five hundred dollars
you can call me Anointed Bovine, and then Anointed Bovine
send us this video.
Speaker 3 (03:19):
That's a fun little joke for Sacred cow, right exactly.
That's sorry stating the obvious, but that's cute.
Speaker 2 (03:26):
So what we are going to do now everyone is
watch this one minute, eight second video, which is an
ad from Apple for the Vision Pro, and we're going
to react to what we're seeing.
Speaker 1 (03:39):
And no one but Matt has seen this yet.
Speaker 4 (03:42):
Oh really, I've seen an early I mean this was
announced a while back and Apple's clearly so hot on it.
Speaker 3 (03:48):
They announced it without a.
Speaker 4 (03:49):
Release date, so there was a little early look kind
of video that I have seen.
Speaker 3 (03:54):
I don't think it's this one. It couldn't possibly be
the same one.
Speaker 1 (03:57):
We's all teaser versus trailer, right.
Speaker 2 (03:59):
Correct, Well, this is this is the juice everybody, alexis.
We're gonna look to you maybe for a reaction if
you want, if you choose to give one, here we go.
Speaker 1 (04:09):
Okay, what got a guy putting on scuba goggles?
Speaker 4 (04:12):
I was to say, yeah, and researching scuba equipment. It
looks like a boat of some sort.
Speaker 2 (04:17):
But it looks to be Oculus Quest style interactions, but
with swimming goggles on.
Speaker 1 (04:24):
Well it's slight much shorter, I guess snout for the goggles.
Speaker 4 (04:29):
Right, and if anyone's messed with the Quest, that's fun.
Uh you know that it's it's opaque. It's a big
plastic front on it. This one has a transparent front
that I believe also can do some ar stuff where
it'll project to outward viewers some facsimile of your eyes
and her expression, or maybe it's actually not clear, it's
creating an AI facsimile of what's behind it.
Speaker 2 (04:50):
Were interacting with the world, so it's normal, like they're
they're riding on a plane wearing giant goggles.
Speaker 1 (04:59):
That was that was nice. The screen to screen move
from the vision pro to a desktop monitor, that was
probably the hardest flex there. But yeah, kids being diverted
on an airplane, that's a classic.
Speaker 3 (05:13):
Well that's the thing.
Speaker 4 (05:14):
About Apple though, whenever they release a product, at the
very least, whatever you say about Apple or Apple fan,
you know stands. You know it's going to integrate with
theirs their other equipment really well. So like this is
something you could not hook an Oculus quest up and
just have it natively become a second monitor for your
for your device. You've got to use all kinds of
different cables or whatever even if it.
Speaker 3 (05:33):
Will work at all.
Speaker 4 (05:34):
And they're obviously going to have it interact with their
ecosystem of games, Apple Arcade and stuff like that.
Speaker 5 (05:39):
They have eye messages popping up in front of people's faces,
and people are opening their eye messages the whole like gesture.
Speaker 3 (05:48):
It's minority report, is what it is.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
But they also show a man in his kitchen kicking
a soccer ball around with what appears to be his offspring,
like as though he's just interacting with his family, wearing
these giant effing goggles like it's cool, it's normal. Everybody's
fine with it. The kid's like, hey Dad, that's just
what dad looks like.
Speaker 1 (06:11):
Now, hey Dad, Yeah, offspring, not as in the band,
but like his They appear to be his children.
Speaker 2 (06:16):
The children he allegedly sired.
Speaker 3 (06:22):
Is the kid wearing the glasses too or not?
Speaker 1 (06:24):
The airport and on the airline, the kid is wearing
the glasses. The idea is it's normalized for everybody who
can pay a minimum price of three hundred and fifty
US dollars three five hundred. Well, obviously I'm not going
to get him.
Speaker 3 (06:40):
I'm not gonna I'm not going to dox him here.
Speaker 4 (06:41):
But I do have a friend that has pre ordered theirs,
and it is supposed to be arriving soon. And it's
a friend I spent a lot of time with, So
he's going to bring it up when he comes to
hanging You're going to be.
Speaker 5 (06:50):
Hanging out with somebody wearing these goggles pretty soon.
Speaker 4 (06:53):
The funny thing is is he and his family were
visiting recently and I kind of dusted off the old
Oculus quest that Matt turned me onto.
Speaker 3 (07:00):
So mad, don't act.
Speaker 4 (07:01):
Like a VR elitist here like this is some world
that terrifies you.
Speaker 3 (07:05):
Tell us what it is that gives you pause about
this particular VR.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
Really picture it, really, imagine hanging out with somebody wearing
these goggles. Let's just imagine all of us hanging out together,
and we've got your friend who's gonna be wearing these things? Right,
what is that? How does that change our interaction with
this person?
Speaker 3 (07:29):
I would really rethink my relationship with that friend.
Speaker 2 (07:32):
No, no, but I really like, maybe it's fine. Maybe
it is the same thing as us just having our
cell phones with us and being preoccupied with what's happening
on that screen. Maybe it is that. But to me,
it's not.
Speaker 3 (07:46):
That it's meant to be worn and mixed company though.
Speaker 1 (07:49):
That's just that's literally what it's meant to be, Like,
it's meant to be on you at all times, like
a cell phone.
Speaker 4 (07:58):
Yeah, nobody's gonna go for I mean, if people go
for that, I pity the fool to quote mister T.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
I just know nobody lost money investing in stupidity.
Speaker 2 (08:08):
Well, okay, so there are many futurists who have positive
and we've had the discussion on the show that we
are already cyborgs because of our relationships with our phones.
Speaker 3 (08:18):
Right in some way, shape or form, right.
Speaker 2 (08:21):
Yes, we are. We are inexorably tied to these things.
We cannot be anywhere without them. We have anxieties when
we don't know where our phone is. Like we I
think we collectively all feel that is it the same
thing as wearing this kind of augmented reality, true cyborg
in thing?
Speaker 1 (08:42):
Like?
Speaker 2 (08:42):
Is it the same?
Speaker 1 (08:43):
It's a necessary step. I mean, it's it's like you know,
when you see those old school textbook pictures of the
evolution of primates. Right, this kind of technology right now,
it's sort of in the middle of that spectrum because
the next step obviously Ella Musk just announced or elon whatever,
(09:04):
just to announce the first human brain implant. Guys saw that.
So that this stuff is, as you said, Matt inexorable,
it's inevitable. It's on the way. The next step is
going to be it'll be more popularized the less intrusive
it appears. Right, So, the closer you get the contacts
or something that people already recognize, like spectacles.
Speaker 4 (09:28):
Well, if you guys are familiar with the game Cyberpunk,
which I know you are, as we've talked about it,
but there's actually a really great anime accompanying anime made
by the same come Project Red or CD.
Speaker 3 (09:37):
Something like that is quite good.
Speaker 4 (09:39):
And it's all about this hardware. People being able to
afford the hardware implants. It creates this varying strata of
sort of haves and have nots, because if you can't
afford to get your your muscles beefed up with tech,
you're not gonna win in a fight against the school
bully who's from like a higher class, you know, strata
of society. Matt, I keep keep picking on you here,
(09:59):
But how is this It depends on your behavior towards it.
Speaker 3 (10:03):
How is this any different than.
Speaker 4 (10:05):
U Uri trading back and forth to VR we cast
it to as TV and watching each other play Beat Saber.
Speaker 3 (10:11):
Or you know, do the plank game.
Speaker 4 (10:13):
Like this really requires a difference in behavioral attitudes towards
these things, and I guess Apple's pushing for that with
their marketing, But it doesn't necessarily mean people are going
to go for it, And I would.
Speaker 3 (10:25):
Argue people that do go for it are going to
look like a holes.
Speaker 2 (10:28):
Well, I think the difference is it's ten times more
expensive than Inoculus Quest two was when I got one right, true. First,
that's the first thing. The second thing is I almost
immediately stopped using that piece of hardware. Who except to
work out there's a boxing thing I used on it,
and that was it. I didn't see a use for it.
Speaker 3 (10:49):
Really.
Speaker 2 (10:50):
I guess that's where I'm going there, first of all,
And it is a solitary thing, so I had to
choose to just hang out alone and play around with
myself and my but but but like I had to
choose to do that, and like spend my time that way,
I would.
Speaker 5 (11:08):
There's also a difference between like I'm gonna sit down
and play this game versus I am living my life
and interacting with my children with other people with this.
Speaker 4 (11:20):
And I'm only picking on you because you're the one
that brought the quest over the first time. And I
tho the first time I'd ever really messed with one,
and I hadn't picked mine up in a long long
time either until this kid who's friends with my kid,
who's actually the kid of the person that's getting the
thing you're talking about, picked mine up and started playing
with it, and I was like, oh, I forgot there's
(11:41):
things that are fun about this. But what we've been
doing is casting it to the TV while one person
does it, so the rest of them can see what
they're seeing and also make fun of them for looking silly.
It's just kind of a fun party game.
Speaker 3 (11:52):
That's how I'm looking at it.
Speaker 1 (11:53):
I'm looking I put I don't Matt, You and I
talked about I have a quest as well. I was
super turned off by the requirement to have it log
into Facebook or meta and uh and so like you,
Matt also having a quest. The best way to say
it is, it solved problems I did not have the right,
(12:14):
So like, it's fun to explore the pro preception is
scientifically quite fascinating, however, in mind.
Speaker 4 (12:22):
By the way your mind accepts what's being presented to it.
Speaker 1 (12:25):
Right. Yeah, However, in my cost benefit analysis, just personally,
just one one person, in my cost benefit analysis, the
erosion of privacy outweighed the novelty of something that was
clearly this is like the quest was like early adopter technology, right.
It's it's like it's like an early version of a car.
(12:47):
The next thing, or the next two or three things
are going to be where I think the Overton windows
shifts where.
Speaker 4 (12:54):
Becomes more valuable because you're taking places and you're using
it out in the world. Right, is that what you're
getting that mat This becomes a much more robust tracker
and captura God because you're taking it the quest is
it really? Because you're just in your living room? So
what what useful information is?
Speaker 5 (13:12):
It?
Speaker 4 (13:12):
Knows how often I play beat Saber or freaking you know,
job simulator, But like this one, if people use it
the way they're suggesting, it'll know exactly where you're going.
It'll capture everything around you in three hundred and sixty
degrees of it.
Speaker 3 (13:24):
Could you know of data? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (13:26):
I got a scenario for you. Imagine you show up
at a pretty nice restaurant. You've planned a date with
somebody you found on one of these apps, right you,
and you show up and you sit down and the
person walks in wearing these goggles.
Speaker 3 (13:41):
I'm gone, man from God or I'm like, are you joking?
Speaker 4 (13:46):
And there's gonna be rules, restaurants are gonna make like
wearing a hat, you know, I mean, I'm sorry, Please continue.
Speaker 3 (13:52):
This is just baffled in my mind. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (13:53):
Please.
Speaker 2 (13:54):
Weren't there issues with Google Glass, like for a little
bit it was.
Speaker 1 (13:58):
Banned issues, yeah, specifically in techbro country. But there's also,
I mean, there's also the other side of that coin,
which is that at some point that may become like
things become normalized so insidiously quickly and rapidly. You know,
if you travel a lot, you may have noticed that
(14:19):
facial recognition was once an option for customs, and it
is increasingly required, and something similar may happen, like right
now in the surveillance state of the West or the
global West. In the US particular, it is considered anomalous
(14:40):
and notable to not have a cell phone. Not quite
a red flag, but it is a thing that stands
out and perhaps if not Vision pro, something after Vision PRO,
some descendant thereof will hit that cell phone moment. I
don't know.
Speaker 4 (14:57):
Maybe this is me being the old man shouting at clouds,
but I don't see that happening. I don't see mass
adoption of this A because it's too expensive and B
it's just kind of idiotic.
Speaker 1 (15:08):
Well that's what I'm talking about. The descendant.
Speaker 2 (15:11):
Yeah, okay, fair enough, that's exactly I see exactly that vision.
Speaker 3 (15:14):
You're playing a long game, Okay.
Speaker 2 (15:15):
Give event, because I think at some point this is
the kind of technology, if you know, put out in
like version five, where everybody is encouraged through incentives to
have a twenty four to seven stream from their perspective
right that they are doing. Oh did you see Ben's
stream last Friday? This crazy thing happened, or people are
(15:39):
tuning in, people are commenting, people are like checking in
on your stream to see where you are and what
you're doing, and you can check in on theirs and
like just a seamless communication. It is to me, it's horrifying.
Speaker 4 (15:51):
That's the black Mirror episode the entire history of you.
It is literally that episode.
Speaker 2 (15:56):
And this is a piece of technology that gets us
through that first half step, right of actually having wearable
technology beyond something that we hold in our hands that
would allow us to do that and to serve commercials,
and we would get served commercials and anointed bovine. No
(16:17):
thank you.
Speaker 3 (16:17):
I'm gonna say, well, last thing. I'm gonna shut up.
Speaker 4 (16:19):
I just I think Apple is also very rarely placed
to bet that didn't win, you know what I mean?
When they go all in on a technology, it usually
takes the frick off. I can't think of anything that
they've put out and put all of their marketing efforts
behind that has failed. Maybe you can maybe like a
certain generation of iPod or something, but in general they
are disruptors in this space.
Speaker 5 (16:41):
That sort of reminded me of when they like forcefully
put a YouTube album on everybody's.
Speaker 3 (16:45):
Phone that failed.
Speaker 5 (16:47):
It did fail, But specifically it makes me think about
like if people are wearing this Apple Vision thing, Like
I'm thinking about what Matt said about ads and also
the idea of like what can sort of forcefully be
put in front of your eyes that regard. That was
sort of the thought that hit me.
Speaker 1 (17:02):
Right think think about emergency alerts on cell phones and then.
Speaker 2 (17:05):
That yeah, right, but what would you do for an
extra twenty maybe one hundred, maybe thousand dollars a month?
Like if you had this technology, I bet there are
people out there that would use you as a node
for quite a bit of money.
Speaker 1 (17:20):
One hundred percent.
Speaker 3 (17:21):
What do you mean a node?
Speaker 2 (17:22):
A note of data of like what's happening in this area?
What is think about the track like the tracking on
this thing and what Ben said, the tracking on that thing,
but the visual data that you're you would constantly be getting,
the audio data you'd be getting.
Speaker 1 (17:37):
Real time processing troublesome things like protests for instance. Oh
my god, especially considering also, you know, economy of scale. Like,
the easier it is to say yes to stuff like this,
and not to sound like a luddye, but the easier
it is to say yes to stuff like this, the
more people have it, creating a feedback loop, which means
(17:57):
it is cheaper to produce an individual iteration of the product,
and people want to keep up with the joneses. So
the next deal you get is, hey, this just like
what happens with cell phones. It's a great case study. Hey,
this is three five hundred US dollars. Now, however, if
you go with a provider or agree to a certain
(18:17):
regimen of ads, yeah, then it's only you know, one
thousand or fifty.
Speaker 3 (18:23):
You got to see the BlackBerry movie.
Speaker 4 (18:25):
That moment, that aha moment when the BlackBerry people realize
that's what Apple was doing and that's literally what tanked BlackBerry.
That was like the big kind of turning point of
that story. Fascinating, dude.
Speaker 2 (18:37):
Think about when you target spends a great deal of
time and money trying to figure out what you as
an individual want, what you're interested in, what you're willing
to buy what you're not buying, even though you're showing
interest on their website or their app. Think about when
you go into Kroger and they're trying to do the
same things. What does this individual want that is also
(18:59):
in this social strata, in this economic strata. What if
they are willing to give you those deals too? Just
where you're what is this thing called Apple Vision pros
or whatever? Where are that when you shop in Target
next time? And it's going to measure your reaction to
certain shirts that you're looking at in a line or
(19:20):
certain food products.
Speaker 1 (19:22):
Think about also how when the Kroger Plus or whatever
loyalty card came out, it gave you a discount as
the price is purposely gradually frogs boiling rows, such that
now if you go there without a card, if you
go to a lot of places without a card, you
are paying extra because you have refused to submit your
(19:44):
information to the system. That is ten ten. What is
happening or what will.
Speaker 4 (19:49):
Happen really cooly before you go is when you guys
have to peep this link I put in the chat.
Speaker 2 (19:52):
Oh, it's the blue blocker.
Speaker 3 (19:54):
What is that?
Speaker 4 (19:55):
It's from Back to the Future too, it's like an
accessory that exists in back of the too.
Speaker 3 (20:01):
It looks exactly like we were talking about.
Speaker 4 (20:02):
And it's that it's by JVC you'll see on the side,
which is like a big company in the eighties.
Speaker 3 (20:07):
You know, they made cam quarters and stuff.
Speaker 4 (20:10):
I mean, this is this is the future we were
promised by Back to the Future too.
Speaker 3 (20:14):
Finally coming coming to fruition.
Speaker 2 (20:16):
All right, final word, alexis are you getting one?
Speaker 5 (20:19):
I was about to curse, so I'll say f no.
And also to answer your earlier question, like iref somebody
showed up to that like on a dat or I
was hanging out with somebody and they put them on.
I would roast the absolute out.
Speaker 1 (20:31):
Of You heard her here first, folks heard her here first.
There is a there is a certain standard to romance
on stuff. They don't want you to know.
Speaker 2 (20:40):
Oh beautiful, let us know what you think. We'll be
right back with more messages from you.
Speaker 3 (20:51):
And we've returned.
Speaker 4 (20:52):
After that illuminating conversation about the future that is the
present that is a little bit terrifying and really dorky.
Speaker 3 (21:02):
But let's refresh.
Speaker 4 (21:03):
Let's do a little reset and refresh, recycle, reduce, reuse,
and hear a message from a listener of the show
and someone i'd consider to have become a pal of mine.
We're gonna go by their nickname Moons of Athos. I'm
gonna read some segments of this lovely email that Moons
wrote us. My name is Moons of Athos. He gives
(21:23):
the real day, but I'm not sure he didn't get
give it permission to use the nickname, so I'm not
gonna give.
Speaker 3 (21:27):
The real name.
Speaker 4 (21:27):
I'm a musician and multimedia specialist from the south east
of Ireland, currently based in Berlin, Germany. Hopefully Noel remembers
me from his visit to Berlin just about two years ago. Now,
of course I remember you, Moons. We had lovely pintes
together and it was great. We actually hung out twice.
Was great meeting you that time. Man had a blast
hanging out with you, Frank and your other mates in
the metal bars here. It's true we went to some
(21:48):
awesome metal bars, of which there are copious amounts in Berlin.
I just wanted to touch base with you guys since
I've been listening for about.
Speaker 3 (21:54):
Six and a half years now.
Speaker 4 (21:56):
Also in the latest Listener Mail episode, Missing in Missouri,
Corruption and Illinois, Australia and Insight. You guys put out
a call for art inspired even loosely by your podcasts,
So here goes. I play guitar and write music in
a post rock, post metal band called Sky Trumpets. We're
gonna get to where that name came from or the
inspiration Ben and Nol. I know you both follow us
(22:16):
on Instagram. Many thanks for that, But since so many
of us conspiracy realists have so much in common, I
thought it might be worth sharing this with the wider community,
especially since I'm working on new material to release later
this year. So many of us, being the fun type
of weirdos who worship at the altar of Fox Mulder
and Dana Scully, find endless pleasures in rewatching Agent Cooper,
visit Twin Peaks each spooky season, and seemingly a lot
(22:37):
of us are also arts practitioners and gear nerds in
our respective fields. Recalling Noel and I's conversation about studio equipment,
vintage SyncE and guitar gear, maybe a weird droney ambient
metal band from the South coast of Ireland can be
another common interest for more of the community. The story
goes that I began writing music for what would become
Sky Trumpets about the same time I found your podcast
(22:59):
in October two, twenty seventeen, when I lived in Hamburg, Germany.
I remember the feeling of delight at working a job
which didn't require too much brain power, my first office
job as an intern, and loving syncing into your podcast
each day. I think I began with episodes on the
flat Woods Monster Alisa Lamb and the interview with the
guy who ran the Bigfoot Museum, David Bacara, Right McAra, Yeah,
(23:20):
I love that guy. It was great to hear a
bunch of guys talking about this stuff and not taking
it too seriously, while also not talking down on the
fun cryptid stories and similarly not taking sick pleasure in
talking about true crime and conspiracy cases like some other
podcasts seemed to do. This alongside the binge watching of
The Walking Dead from the beginning at the time, allowed
(23:43):
me to come up with the first Sky Trumpet song
Crime project. The idea of it was that it would
be the soundtrack playing in my synesthetic brain while listening
to your podcast, or if I were in real life
TWD situation. I moved back to Ireland just before Christmas
twenty seventeen to complete my degree. Six months later, some
of my musician mates had heard this demo of Crime
Project and asked me to be a part of a
(24:04):
live band for this music. If I was planning on
starting one, well now I was. Now we need a name, right.
I wanted something epic, almost biblical. Some of my favorite
post rock bands have names that really suit the biblical, cathartic,
spiritual sound of their music. God Speed You, Black Emperor,
personal favorite, Ben, I know you're a fan as well.
Speaker 3 (24:22):
God is an astronaut.
Speaker 4 (24:23):
Explosions in the sky cloud kicker if these trees could talk,
so I liked the idea of sky in there somewhere.
I remember hearing the term sky trumpets mentioned by Ben
on one of the episodes, talking about the phenomena of
weird noises seemingly without a source occurring around the world.
I think it was when you were discussing the windsor
hum maybe. Anyway, when I remember the term, it felt
(24:45):
like the nice snap of two lego bricks in my head.
That had to be our band name. I mentioned it
to the guys and they liked it. It's the last
bit here, I'm gonna read Ben, my fellow senisthete it's
worth noting that Sky Trumpets is not just a band,
but a multim projects. One of my goals with this
project was to create abstract films for each song based
(25:05):
off of my own music, matching or mismatching colors intentionally
in my head, grouping songs together for certain releases based
on their colors, writing set lists based on songs colors, etc.
And Sky Trumpet's music has been the most explicit example
of this. Since we are instrumental, I have built a
few music visualizers to try to visualize my synesthesia for
(25:27):
live performances, admittedly to varying degrees of success, but hoping
to have it usable later this year in a more
coherent format than I've done before.
Speaker 3 (25:37):
I just think this is super cool.
Speaker 4 (25:38):
We talked a little about number stations he goes on
and talk about some other projects that he's involved in.
But before I toss to the group, highly recommend you
check out Sky Trumpets. They're on Instagram and there's the
link in bio situation that links you out to a
lot of these other projects. So man, thanks to moons
of Athos for this lovely trip down memory Lane a
(25:59):
for some of these topics, and just from doing exactly
what Ben sent the call out to have people share
with us making art, you know, out of some of
the stuff that we talk about.
Speaker 3 (26:08):
It's a real honor.
Speaker 2 (26:10):
I want to shout out something Moon said at the
end here that we did not read yet. Moon says,
might I make a suggestion while I'm here for this
year's spooky season, maybe you could bring back the segment
of reading out listeners ghost stories. I think we should
do more of that this year or anybody who's listening,
and we could do those year round. It doesn't have
to be spooky season.
Speaker 1 (26:29):
It's always Halloween in America.
Speaker 4 (26:32):
Yeah, or at the very least, you know on stuff
that I want you to know we love it. Also,
he said that another band that he's in that's kind
of a queer punk band is how he described it,
Skin on Flesh, which you can find at Skin on Flesh.
Band recently had a song featured in the latest Cyberpunk DLC.
We were talking about cyberpunk a little while ago, So
(26:53):
that's pretty cool for an indie type band to have
their song featured in a game like that.
Speaker 3 (26:57):
That's good money and good exposure. Well well done, Well done, y'all.
Speaker 2 (27:01):
I listened to a bit of Thinking Hours from Sky
Trumpets and I really did enjoy what I was hearing.
And awesome work.
Speaker 1 (27:09):
You came to the right place, man.
Speaker 4 (27:12):
Yeah, I guess I should have maybe written him back
to ask if we could play a sample on the show.
So maybe we'll leave a space here just for a
little sample in the in the event that I hear
back from them with permission before.
Speaker 2 (27:25):
This errors, I'm gonna recommend around two minutes in and
Thinking Hours when the the drums really kick in.
Speaker 5 (27:32):
Dang it.
Speaker 3 (28:05):
Yeah, big, this is shorty, Ben.
Speaker 4 (28:07):
Any thoughts about the specifically the visual aspects of this
trying to recreate the experience of synesthesia.
Speaker 3 (28:14):
I think that's so cool. Yeah, agreed.
Speaker 1 (28:17):
As we said, you can find the website Experiment sixty
four dot com where we can learn more about this stuff.
And these are the kind of letters we love. Anything
that we in this show do that somehow inspires our
fellow listeners makes it worth it, I would argue, you
(28:38):
know what I mean, and we've got again, as you
pointed out, Nol, we do always ask for permission before
we air or share your stuff because it is your stuff.
But keep them coming. This is just awesome. It really
makes our day, I think collectively, or makes our evening.
Speaker 4 (28:55):
Well, let's take a quick break, hear a word from
our sponsor, and then come back with another message from you.
Speaker 1 (29:08):
And we have returned with a bit of a round up.
We are going to share a couple of different emails
from some of our fellow conspiracy realists, all commenting about
the same thing. Quite recently, folks, As you may recall,
we discussed an intensely troubling story about human trafficking and
(29:29):
the gray market cannabis trade in Oklahoma. It appears gang
that we have hit a bit of a nerve in
a good way, because we had a ton of people
writing to us and many calling us likely as well,
who were responding and saying largely the same thing, agreeing
(29:51):
with our take on the recent news and telling us
it goes much much deeper. So what I'm thinking we
could do is just a brief recap of the story
we first found, and then some helpful responses from from
our friends in Oklahoma. So the quick recap is this,
(30:13):
two men were recently convicted of a drug trafficking conspiracy
Chinese nationals. They were popped for illegally trafficking cannabis from
an Oklahoma grow operation. Oklahoma does have medical marijuana laws,
so there are ways to legally grow distribute cell weed.
(30:37):
But what we found was that there were a lot
of strings leading away from this. It had been politicized
by some authorities as a way of like arguing for
a border wall. It had been turned into you know,
a little bit of somewhat racist sinophobia. But Noel Matt
I was shocked by how many people wrote to us
(31:01):
about this. Did you see some of these emails? We
got quite a few, Yeah.
Speaker 4 (31:04):
I did, And it was nice to get a little
bit of meat on the bones around what's going on
on the ground, you know, in Oklahoma and the relationship
with cannabis. In terms of the questions we asked, like, way.
Speaker 3 (31:16):
Is it legal? Why isn't it legal?
Speaker 4 (31:18):
Like just like the there seems to be some some
wrenches in the works in terms of making that happen.
And it's sort of an odd situation from from some
of the perspectives that I caught a glimpse of.
Speaker 1 (31:29):
Yeah, agreed fully, and we've not been to Oklahoma or wait,
let me check this code named DOC. Have you been
to Oklahoma?
Speaker 5 (31:37):
I have I passed through there when I toured with
that metal band that I told you about.
Speaker 1 (31:42):
Oh that's right, but I didn't stay. You didn't stay.
Speaker 5 (31:45):
Also dated a guy from Oklahoma.
Speaker 1 (31:48):
Okay, do you want to shout about on the air?
I don't?
Speaker 3 (31:53):
All right?
Speaker 1 (31:54):
Well, okay, so at least we have one person who's
had some boots on the ground here. Our first letter says, Hi,
my name is Whitney. I own a medical marijuana dispensary
in Durant. Durant, Oklahoma, and I am thrilled you guys
covered the human trafficking issue. It's the worst kept secret
(32:14):
in the state, especially in our industry. We've been trying
to bring attention to the horrors that are happening all
around us. We've been to farms that were housing workers
from Asia and we immediately knew something was wrong. They're
in the middle of nowhere, no cell service, not much
law enforcement. They're living in warehouses with bunk beds. These
groups have shady business practices. They don't follow the regulatory guidance.
(32:40):
So this dispensary has never bought any of their products.
By the way, this is Magnolia City Apothecary. I love
the word apothecary, me too. We should use that more often, right, Yeah,
it's actually a really cool tape label called Oris Apothecary.
Speaker 3 (32:54):
Love it.
Speaker 1 (32:55):
And Whitney continues and says that for the past couple
of years this has been kind of like the Wild West,
lots of open spaces, not much oversight. The Russian mafia
may have also caught onto this trafficking. We're starting to
see their farms pop up. They guard their farms with
armed security and machine guns. Stuff is wild. Sorry, when
(33:16):
he editing for a family show, and Whitney says, hoping
law enforcement continues to shut down these outfits that are
exploiting these people. Then we got another recommendation directing us
to an Instagram account called healthy dot Buffalo that talks
about that has a story with someone who had to
(33:37):
deal with the crazy issues concerning the Oklahoma marijuana industry.
And I looked into this. It seems that the state
is as this conspiracy really says, the state has been
trying to shut down those illegal growth farms. They're owned
by out of state or out of country owners. The
paperwork filed with the State of Oklahoma has go ghost owners. Sadly,
(34:01):
I read some of these ghost owners were lawyers. Imagine
that I have read and watched the shutdown of many
illegal farms, and I've read about executions of foreign workers
at these illegal growtharms. This is nuts. This person also
recommends we go to Oklahoma dot gov slash omma for
(34:22):
more information. And these are just like a couple of
the things. I didn't know it w this deep, but
we talked about this a little bit, right, We talked
about how there appeared to be more at work than
just two sketchy dudes.
Speaker 4 (34:36):
One hundred percent, And I mean, it's another one of
these examples where prohibition of any kind often yields a
smoke screen with which to conduct all kinds of shady
business under behind whatever you do with a smoke screen.
Speaker 1 (34:54):
Around just in the air, it's weird, you know what
I mean?
Speaker 4 (34:57):
Though, Like if it weren't if there weren't an asp
of this that were kind of off book, then they
wouldn't have been able to disguise a lot of these
other like mega shady activities.
Speaker 1 (35:07):
Agreed one hundred percent. And there are more letters that
we received. One is from the Circumspect coyote who says,
good day, gentlemen. As I listened to your strange news
segment on human trafficking in Oklahoma, I could only think, yep,
that's about par for the course. In two thousand and two,
says our friendly coyote, the John Pickle Company in Tulsa
(35:30):
had brought in a number of Indian nationals and sequestered
them on the property and made them into de facto's slaves.
These individuals were here legally on a work visa, but
those visas and any personal identification was taken from them
and held hostage to ensure their cooperation. They were drawn
in under the banner of higher pay and select fields
(35:51):
than they were subjected to two dollars an hour wages,
poor living in work conditions, and no freedom. And this
coyote were in records or did work in records at
the Tulsa Police Department for years and says, human trafficking
comes up constantly, and maybe again, you know, maybe we
were just a bit unfamiliar or naive. But I think
(36:15):
most Americans outside of Oklahoma do not immediately think of
human trafficking when they think of that state. We all
thought of the musical.
Speaker 4 (36:23):
Well yeah, and I think that's not an accident, right.
I mean, I hate the term because it seems dismissive,
but oftentimes people will describe Oklahoma as a flyover state.
Speaker 3 (36:33):
You know, a lot of those the states sort of
in the middle.
Speaker 4 (36:37):
Are often off the radar of mainstream reporting, which is
what allows things like this to maybe go on for
longer unnoticed.
Speaker 1 (36:47):
Yeah, that's a really good point, though it's easy to
ignore it, you know. And it reminds me a little
bit of the situation that can happen with immigrant workers
in Middle Eastern countries. Don't you travel and then the
person employing you possesses your documents and may indeed take
possession of your passport. It's a very very dangerous thing.
(37:08):
And also Coyote points out that these people would be
controlled by having threats made against their family members, and
a lot of them came from US cities, from Los
Angeles or New York. And then Coyote shares with us
a story from the Oklahoman from two thousand and eight,
(37:30):
so it gives us a sense of how long this
kind of stuff has been happening. In this case, there
were fifty two captive workers from India who were basically
laboring in forced servitude, and it took the way the
Oklahoma puts it is it took one quote unquote crazy
Christian to intervene, the implication being that law enforcement wasn't
(37:54):
doing anything.
Speaker 4 (37:56):
I do have to point out one thing that maybe
will lighten them MO just a little bit. And again
I pologize if this is stating the obvious, but I
love that this coyote is circumspect rather than Wiley. Yes,
just throw that out there in case it flew by anybody.
Speaker 3 (38:10):
Some clever nicky names coming through on today's episode.
Speaker 1 (38:14):
And then Crystal writes to us saying much the same thing,
and points out specifically the history of the history of
medical marijuana in the state. Crystal says, quote, since medical
marijuana was legalized in Oklahoma in twenty eighteen, there have
been big repercussions. The law was rushed through with little
(38:36):
real oversight of grow licensing or regulation in the issuance
of medical licenses. And pause there, because that's something we've
seen with pretty much every medical marijuana state. Right Like
I have glaucoma maybe or a vague sense of unease.
Speaker 4 (38:51):
It's a loophole, yes, a million percent. I mean, you know,
that's why it's comical that there's something, whether it philosophically
or whatever, that's venting these states from taking that leap
to to pure recreation because it's obviously going to need
more money because it's open to the floodgates. But yeah,
I mean when California went legal for you know, medical,
(39:11):
all you hear was stories about people saying generalized anxiety disorder,
which is honestly something that I don't think smoking weed
would would help very much. It tends to make people
more anxious, but I guess it depends on the strain.
But yeah, it's weird, like why are where? Why are
people getting log jammed between medical and recreational, Like Georgia
(39:32):
is so puritanical in the way that we handle that
stuff that I think we've only got medical in a
very specific situation that involves not even the smokable flower,
just the like change pills at all, I think is
what it's called. And it's apparently kind of bull crap.
You know, it doesn't really do the job.
Speaker 1 (39:50):
It only went over the finish line in the state's
legislative body because, uh, because some some politician promised it
would not be fun they literally said, don't worry, no
one's getting high. No one has a new appreciation of
baselines or ambient music. Right, this is just medicine. And
(40:12):
we see that kind of turtanical is a perfect word.
We see this occur in a lot of other states.
You know, I think for a long time in Michigan,
you could just say that you were a fan of
Michigan State and they would they would sign you up
for a they would sign you up for some weed.
Speaker 3 (40:29):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1 (40:31):
We're just gonna take that. True. It's too late, Doc,
you can't stop us. No, no comment.
Speaker 3 (40:40):
I don't know if I have a heck of a
lot to add here.
Speaker 4 (40:42):
I obviously thrown a Matt, but he's dealing with some
home renovation stuff. He had to jump away for him.
And unless you worry that that he's being so quiet,
I don't know, Ben anything else to any other noteworthy
responses to that topic.
Speaker 3 (40:57):
Okay, got it.
Speaker 1 (40:57):
Yeah, let's end on. Let's and on just one or
two more things that are important for us non Oklahomas
to know. Continuing with Crystal, by law, a grow operation
in Oklahoma is required to be owned a majority by
a resident of the state a year or two ago,
it was discovered that foreign owners were using Oklahoma law
firms as straw man owners, and hundreds of grows were
(41:21):
shut down. The state stopped issuing new licenses. It's still
reworking the system. Many of these illicit operations work with
drug cartels as well as using quote unquote not so
legal employment methods. All of this does, unfortunately make a
great cover for moving things and people for nefarious purposes.
Even before the grow problem, Oklahoma has been a hub
(41:43):
for human trafficking, add major cartel and gang activity. There
are several interstates crossing in Oklahoma City, so it's very
easy to lose track of suspicious vehicles and to get things.
Speaker 4 (41:55):
Yeah, good points, right crossroads, you know what I mean,
easy to obscure all these movements. No, I'm so glad
that this hit a nerve because this was news to
all of us. And the more we hear back from
you conspiracy realists out there, the picture the pieces really
start to come into full focus and lie. Of course
this makes sense and this is gosh. It wouldn't be
(42:16):
able to do that without you, you know.
Speaker 1 (42:17):
Yeah, I'm still writing back to everyone, but I want
to thank all our fellow conspiracy realists for weighing in
with this first hand experience. The major highways that a
lot of our Oklahoma and friends are talking about are
I thirty five, I forty, and I forty four. There
is a huge problem with potential trafficking. There is a
(42:38):
lot of political controversy here. I think just to keep
this one short, I think the best way for us
to end or thank everybody for tuning in is back
is to let you know, Hey, Matt, we'll come back.
Is to let you know that if you suspect a
case of human trafficking here in the United States, it
(43:01):
is very important for you to speak up because often
this stuff only functions because people ignore fairly obvious signs.
So if you suspect a case of human trafficking, please
do contact one eight eight three seven three seven eight
eight eight. That's one eight eight eight three seven three seven.
Speaker 3 (43:23):
Eight eight eight.
Speaker 1 (43:25):
That's the National Human Trafficking Hotline. And folks, this stuff
does matter. Human trafficking is a real conspiracy.
Speaker 2 (43:33):
Said that I missed this. I looked through the messages
that we got that you compiled there, Ben, and it's
just really intense And sorry, I wasn't here for that discussion.
I did just learn that you can get a brand
new garage door for significantly less than an Apple Vision Pro.
Speaker 1 (43:49):
Okay, yeah, pretty soon you'll have to have a Vision
Pro to buy a garage door. It's coming, there's some
version of it. I also had a great conversation with
a friend of the show who is the United States
needs a new deal to improve things in this country,
but people are so sensitive to names. We're trying to
figure out what you would call a new deal to
(44:10):
get voters on board, and we came up with an idea.
You guys are gonna love wait for it, America.
Speaker 3 (44:15):
Plus, hey, I got a pitch for you guys. How
about this?
Speaker 4 (44:19):
Okay, ready, you're ready, virtual garage door boom. Just chew
on that.
Speaker 1 (44:28):
So, fellow conspiracy realists, thank you, as always so much
for tuning in. You are the best part of the show.
We would love for you to join up with us.
We can't wait to hear your thoughts. We try to
be easy to find online even if you don't have
an Apple Vision Pro.
Speaker 4 (44:43):
That's true, not necessary, and our barrier of entry is
quite low. You have actually three ways you can get
touch with us. First is on the Internet, where you
can reach us at the handle conspiracy Stuff, or we
exist on Facebook, or we have a Facebook group. Here's
where it gets crazy, is what that's called. We also
exist under that handle on YouTube and also on x
FKA Twitter. If you'd rather find us on Instagram and
(45:04):
TikTok or conspiracy Stuff show.
Speaker 2 (45:06):
Hey, you want to call us, use our voicemail system.
It's one eight three three std WYTK. Put the number
in your phone as a contact and you might get
a callback accidentally or very very purposefully, be like Ducky
who called us about small town corruption in Johnson City, Tennessee,
(45:27):
something we may have to talk about in the future.
Looking at you, Ben, especially because I think you might
even know where that place is, just because of where
you have existed previously. Sir, when you do call in,
give yourself a cool nickname and let us know if
we can use your message on the air. If you
don't want to use that system, why not use our
email system.
Speaker 1 (45:45):
We are the people who read every email we get.
Conspiracy at iHeartRadio dot com.
Speaker 2 (46:00):
H Stuff they Don't want you to know is a
production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio, app,
Apple podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is
riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or
learn the stuff they don't want you to know. A
production of iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Hello, welcome back to the show. My name is Matt,
my name is Nol.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
They call me Ben. We're joined as always with our
super producer, LE'SUS code named Doc Holliday Jackson. Most importantly,
you are you. You are here, and that makes this
the stuff they don't want you to know. It is
February seventh as you are hearing this, folks, let me
let me check the math there. Yeah, I think that's right. Well,
(00:48):
sometime in February as you're hearing this, it's one of
the most exciting evenings for us. We get to hear
from our fellow conspiracy realist. We're going to have some
old friends from real life contact us with some inspirational words.
We're going to gosh, guys, we really hit a nerve
(01:09):
with our recent exploration of Oklahoma, so we'll get to
some of that before we do any of that. Folks,
we sold out. We're so excited about the future of
the surveillance state. How do you like that?
Speaker 3 (01:24):
Set? Up at where we go.
Speaker 2 (01:26):
Yes, as we surveil the world and it surveils us back.
Speaker 1 (01:31):
I guess do you guys remember when our pal our
complaint department Jonathan Strickland please always email him Jonathan Strickland
at iHeartMedia dot com. Do you guys remember when he
had those Google glasses that he was rocket?
Speaker 2 (01:43):
I do remember the Google glass.
Speaker 4 (01:46):
It was such a flop kind of They never even
mass produced them. It was just always sort of like
a beta test for like, you know, people in the
tech space and you know, bloggers and podcasters and stuff.
Speaker 3 (01:56):
So he did get a hold of some of them.
Speaker 4 (01:59):
I never heard much about it beyond that because it
turned out people didn't want to wear that on their
face all the time.
Speaker 2 (02:06):
Oh, Google glass. I actually was kind of interested in
that one, but not really.
Speaker 3 (02:12):
I know.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
I was because because it felt like something you might wear.
If it had if it looked like regular glasses exactly,
then sure.
Speaker 1 (02:20):
If it didn't look like just the top frame of glasses, yeah,
with a weird obvious camera.
Speaker 2 (02:26):
Yeah, it might have been into it. Well, guys, Apple
has an answer to all of these, you know, questions
about how are we going to see the future, how
are we going to interact with the future. We can't
all be walking over around with an oculus quest seven
on in twenty thirty, well what will we be doing?
Speaker 3 (02:47):
What will we.
Speaker 2 (02:48):
Be doing in twenty twenty four? Well, Apple's answer was
brought to us by ye Anointed Bovine. Someone who emailed
us Anointed Bovine says, I saw an ad for a
new product, Vision Pro by Apple. It's a weird future.
We're propelling toward amazing uses in engineering, but a weird
(03:10):
future for sure. They also started thirty five hundred dollars
you can call me Anointed Bovine, and then Anointed Bovine
send us this video.
Speaker 3 (03:19):
That's a fun little joke for Sacred cow, right exactly.
That's sorry stating the obvious, but that's cute.
Speaker 2 (03:26):
So what we are going to do now everyone is
watch this one minute, eight second video, which is an
ad from Apple for the Vision Pro, and we're going
to react to what we're seeing.
Speaker 1 (03:39):
And no one but Matt has seen this yet.
Speaker 4 (03:42):
Oh really, I've seen an early I mean this was
announced a while back and Apple's clearly so hot on it.
Speaker 3 (03:48):
They announced it without a.
Speaker 4 (03:49):
Release date, so there was a little early look kind
of video that I have seen.
Speaker 3 (03:54):
I don't think it's this one. It couldn't possibly be
the same one.
Speaker 1 (03:57):
We's all teaser versus trailer, right.
Speaker 2 (03:59):
Correct, Well, this is this is the juice everybody, alexis.
We're gonna look to you maybe for a reaction if
you want, if you choose to give one, here we go.
Speaker 1 (04:09):
Okay, what got a guy putting on scuba goggles?
Speaker 4 (04:12):
I was to say, yeah, and researching scuba equipment. It
looks like a boat of some sort.
Speaker 2 (04:17):
But it looks to be Oculus Quest style interactions, but
with swimming goggles on.
Speaker 1 (04:24):
Well it's slight much shorter, I guess snout for the goggles.
Speaker 4 (04:29):
Right, and if anyone's messed with the Quest, that's fun.
Uh you know that it's it's opaque. It's a big
plastic front on it. This one has a transparent front
that I believe also can do some ar stuff where
it'll project to outward viewers some facsimile of your eyes
and her expression, or maybe it's actually not clear, it's
creating an AI facsimile of what's behind it.
Speaker 2 (04:50):
Were interacting with the world, so it's normal, like they're
they're riding on a plane wearing giant goggles.
Speaker 1 (04:59):
That was that was nice. The screen to screen move
from the vision pro to a desktop monitor, that was
probably the hardest flex there. But yeah, kids being diverted
on an airplane, that's a classic.
Speaker 3 (05:13):
Well that's the thing.
Speaker 4 (05:14):
About Apple though, whenever they release a product, at the
very least, whatever you say about Apple or Apple fan,
you know stands. You know it's going to integrate with
theirs their other equipment really well. So like this is
something you could not hook an Oculus quest up and
just have it natively become a second monitor for your
for your device. You've got to use all kinds of
different cables or whatever even if it.
Speaker 3 (05:33):
Will work at all.
Speaker 4 (05:34):
And they're obviously going to have it interact with their
ecosystem of games, Apple Arcade and stuff like that.
Speaker 5 (05:39):
They have eye messages popping up in front of people's faces,
and people are opening their eye messages the whole like gesture.
Speaker 3 (05:48):
It's minority report, is what it is.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
But they also show a man in his kitchen kicking
a soccer ball around with what appears to be his offspring,
like as though he's just interacting with his family, wearing
these giant effing goggles like it's cool, it's normal. Everybody's
fine with it. The kid's like, hey Dad, that's just
what dad looks like.
Speaker 1 (06:11):
Now, hey Dad, Yeah, offspring, not as in the band,
but like his They appear to be his children.
Speaker 2 (06:16):
The children he allegedly sired.
Speaker 3 (06:22):
Is the kid wearing the glasses too or not?
Speaker 1 (06:24):
The airport and on the airline, the kid is wearing
the glasses. The idea is it's normalized for everybody who
can pay a minimum price of three hundred and fifty
US dollars three five hundred. Well, obviously I'm not going
to get him.
Speaker 3 (06:40):
I'm not gonna I'm not going to dox him here.
Speaker 4 (06:41):
But I do have a friend that has pre ordered theirs,
and it is supposed to be arriving soon. And it's
a friend I spent a lot of time with, So
he's going to bring it up when he comes to
hanging You're going to be.
Speaker 5 (06:50):
Hanging out with somebody wearing these goggles pretty soon.
Speaker 4 (06:53):
The funny thing is is he and his family were
visiting recently and I kind of dusted off the old
Oculus quest that Matt turned me onto.
Speaker 3 (07:00):
So mad, don't act.
Speaker 4 (07:01):
Like a VR elitist here like this is some world
that terrifies you.
Speaker 3 (07:05):
Tell us what it is that gives you pause about
this particular VR.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
Really picture it, really, imagine hanging out with somebody wearing
these goggles. Let's just imagine all of us hanging out together,
and we've got your friend who's gonna be wearing these things? Right,
what is that? How does that change our interaction with
this person?
Speaker 3 (07:29):
I would really rethink my relationship with that friend.
Speaker 2 (07:32):
No, no, but I really like, maybe it's fine. Maybe
it is the same thing as us just having our
cell phones with us and being preoccupied with what's happening
on that screen. Maybe it is that. But to me,
it's not.
Speaker 3 (07:46):
That it's meant to be worn and mixed company though.
Speaker 1 (07:49):
That's just that's literally what it's meant to be, Like,
it's meant to be on you at all times, like
a cell phone.
Speaker 4 (07:58):
Yeah, nobody's gonna go for I mean, if people go
for that, I pity the fool to quote mister T.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
I just know nobody lost money investing in stupidity.
Speaker 2 (08:08):
Well, okay, so there are many futurists who have positive
and we've had the discussion on the show that we
are already cyborgs because of our relationships with our phones.
Speaker 3 (08:18):
Right in some way, shape or form, right.
Speaker 2 (08:21):
Yes, we are. We are inexorably tied to these things.
We cannot be anywhere without them. We have anxieties when
we don't know where our phone is. Like we I
think we collectively all feel that is it the same
thing as wearing this kind of augmented reality, true cyborg
in thing?
Speaker 1 (08:42):
Like?
Speaker 2 (08:42):
Is it the same?
Speaker 1 (08:43):
It's a necessary step. I mean, it's it's like you know,
when you see those old school textbook pictures of the
evolution of primates. Right, this kind of technology right now,
it's sort of in the middle of that spectrum because
the next step obviously Ella Musk just announced or elon whatever,
(09:04):
just to announce the first human brain implant. Guys saw that.
So that this stuff is, as you said, Matt inexorable,
it's inevitable. It's on the way. The next step is
going to be it'll be more popularized the less intrusive
it appears. Right, So, the closer you get the contacts
or something that people already recognize, like spectacles.
Speaker 4 (09:28):
Well, if you guys are familiar with the game Cyberpunk,
which I know you are, as we've talked about it,
but there's actually a really great anime accompanying anime made
by the same come Project Red or CD.
Speaker 3 (09:37):
Something like that is quite good.
Speaker 4 (09:39):
And it's all about this hardware. People being able to
afford the hardware implants. It creates this varying strata of
sort of haves and have nots, because if you can't
afford to get your your muscles beefed up with tech,
you're not gonna win in a fight against the school
bully who's from like a higher class, you know, strata
of society. Matt, I keep keep picking on you here,
(09:59):
But how is this It depends on your behavior towards it.
Speaker 3 (10:03):
How is this any different than.
Speaker 4 (10:05):
U Uri trading back and forth to VR we cast
it to as TV and watching each other play Beat Saber.
Speaker 3 (10:11):
Or you know, do the plank game.
Speaker 4 (10:13):
Like this really requires a difference in behavioral attitudes towards
these things, and I guess Apple's pushing for that with
their marketing, But it doesn't necessarily mean people are going
to go for it, And I would.
Speaker 3 (10:25):
Argue people that do go for it are going to
look like a holes.
Speaker 2 (10:28):
Well, I think the difference is it's ten times more
expensive than Inoculus Quest two was when I got one right, true. First,
that's the first thing. The second thing is I almost
immediately stopped using that piece of hardware. Who except to
work out there's a boxing thing I used on it,
and that was it. I didn't see a use for it.
Speaker 3 (10:49):
Really.
Speaker 2 (10:50):
I guess that's where I'm going there, first of all,
And it is a solitary thing, so I had to
choose to just hang out alone and play around with
myself and my but but but like I had to
choose to do that, and like spend my time that way,
I would.
Speaker 5 (11:08):
There's also a difference between like I'm gonna sit down
and play this game versus I am living my life
and interacting with my children with other people with this.
Speaker 4 (11:20):
And I'm only picking on you because you're the one
that brought the quest over the first time. And I
tho the first time I'd ever really messed with one,
and I hadn't picked mine up in a long long
time either until this kid who's friends with my kid,
who's actually the kid of the person that's getting the
thing you're talking about, picked mine up and started playing
with it, and I was like, oh, I forgot there's
(11:41):
things that are fun about this. But what we've been
doing is casting it to the TV while one person
does it, so the rest of them can see what
they're seeing and also make fun of them for looking silly.
It's just kind of a fun party game.
Speaker 3 (11:52):
That's how I'm looking at it.
Speaker 1 (11:53):
I'm looking I put I don't Matt, You and I
talked about I have a quest as well. I was
super turned off by the requirement to have it log
into Facebook or meta and uh and so like you,
Matt also having a quest. The best way to say
it is, it solved problems I did not have the right,
(12:14):
So like, it's fun to explore the pro preception is
scientifically quite fascinating, however, in mind.
Speaker 4 (12:22):
By the way your mind accepts what's being presented to it.
Speaker 1 (12:25):
Right. Yeah, However, in my cost benefit analysis, just personally,
just one one person, in my cost benefit analysis, the
erosion of privacy outweighed the novelty of something that was
clearly this is like the quest was like early adopter technology, right.
It's it's like it's like an early version of a car.
(12:47):
The next thing, or the next two or three things
are going to be where I think the Overton windows
shifts where.
Speaker 4 (12:54):
Becomes more valuable because you're taking places and you're using
it out in the world. Right, is that what you're
getting that mat This becomes a much more robust tracker
and captura God because you're taking it the quest is
it really? Because you're just in your living room? So
what what useful information is?
Speaker 5 (13:12):
It?
Speaker 4 (13:12):
Knows how often I play beat Saber or freaking you know,
job simulator, But like this one, if people use it
the way they're suggesting, it'll know exactly where you're going.
It'll capture everything around you in three hundred and sixty
degrees of it.
Speaker 3 (13:24):
Could you know of data? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (13:26):
I got a scenario for you. Imagine you show up
at a pretty nice restaurant. You've planned a date with
somebody you found on one of these apps, right you,
and you show up and you sit down and the
person walks in wearing these goggles.
Speaker 3 (13:41):
I'm gone, man from God or I'm like, are you joking?
Speaker 4 (13:46):
And there's gonna be rules, restaurants are gonna make like
wearing a hat, you know, I mean, I'm sorry, Please continue.
Speaker 3 (13:52):
This is just baffled in my mind. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (13:53):
Please.
Speaker 2 (13:54):
Weren't there issues with Google Glass, like for a little
bit it was.
Speaker 1 (13:58):
Banned issues, yeah, specifically in techbro country. But there's also,
I mean, there's also the other side of that coin,
which is that at some point that may become like
things become normalized so insidiously quickly and rapidly. You know,
if you travel a lot, you may have noticed that
(14:19):
facial recognition was once an option for customs, and it
is increasingly required, and something similar may happen, like right
now in the surveillance state of the West or the
global West. In the US particular, it is considered anomalous
(14:40):
and notable to not have a cell phone. Not quite
a red flag, but it is a thing that stands
out and perhaps if not Vision pro, something after Vision PRO,
some descendant thereof will hit that cell phone moment. I
don't know.
Speaker 4 (14:57):
Maybe this is me being the old man shouting at clouds,
but I don't see that happening. I don't see mass
adoption of this A because it's too expensive and B
it's just kind of idiotic.
Speaker 1 (15:08):
Well that's what I'm talking about. The descendant.
Speaker 2 (15:11):
Yeah, okay, fair enough, that's exactly I see exactly that vision.
Speaker 3 (15:14):
You're playing a long game, Okay.
Speaker 2 (15:15):
Give event, because I think at some point this is
the kind of technology, if you know, put out in
like version five, where everybody is encouraged through incentives to
have a twenty four to seven stream from their perspective
right that they are doing. Oh did you see Ben's
stream last Friday? This crazy thing happened, or people are
(15:39):
tuning in, people are commenting, people are like checking in
on your stream to see where you are and what
you're doing, and you can check in on theirs and
like just a seamless communication. It is to me, it's horrifying.
Speaker 4 (15:51):
That's the black Mirror episode the entire history of you.
It is literally that episode.
Speaker 2 (15:56):
And this is a piece of technology that gets us
through that first half step, right of actually having wearable
technology beyond something that we hold in our hands that
would allow us to do that and to serve commercials,
and we would get served commercials and anointed bovine. No
(16:17):
thank you.
Speaker 3 (16:17):
I'm gonna say, well, last thing. I'm gonna shut up.
Speaker 4 (16:19):
I just I think Apple is also very rarely placed
to bet that didn't win, you know what I mean?
When they go all in on a technology, it usually
takes the frick off. I can't think of anything that
they've put out and put all of their marketing efforts
behind that has failed. Maybe you can maybe like a
certain generation of iPod or something, but in general they
are disruptors in this space.
Speaker 5 (16:41):
That sort of reminded me of when they like forcefully
put a YouTube album on everybody's.
Speaker 3 (16:45):
Phone that failed.
Speaker 5 (16:47):
It did fail, But specifically it makes me think about
like if people are wearing this Apple Vision thing, Like
I'm thinking about what Matt said about ads and also
the idea of like what can sort of forcefully be
put in front of your eyes that regard. That was
sort of the thought that hit me.
Speaker 1 (17:02):
Right think think about emergency alerts on cell phones and then.
Speaker 2 (17:05):
That yeah, right, but what would you do for an
extra twenty maybe one hundred, maybe thousand dollars a month?
Like if you had this technology, I bet there are
people out there that would use you as a node
for quite a bit of money.
Speaker 1 (17:20):
One hundred percent.
Speaker 3 (17:21):
What do you mean a node?
Speaker 2 (17:22):
A note of data of like what's happening in this area?
What is think about the track like the tracking on
this thing and what Ben said, the tracking on that thing,
but the visual data that you're you would constantly be getting,
the audio data you'd be getting.
Speaker 1 (17:37):
Real time processing troublesome things like protests for instance. Oh
my god, especially considering also, you know, economy of scale. Like,
the easier it is to say yes to stuff like this,
and not to sound like a luddye, but the easier
it is to say yes to stuff like this, the
more people have it, creating a feedback loop, which means
(17:57):
it is cheaper to produce an individual iteration of the product,
and people want to keep up with the joneses. So
the next deal you get is, hey, this just like
what happens with cell phones. It's a great case study. Hey,
this is three five hundred US dollars. Now, however, if
you go with a provider or agree to a certain
(18:17):
regimen of ads, yeah, then it's only you know, one
thousand or fifty.
Speaker 3 (18:23):
You got to see the BlackBerry movie.
Speaker 4 (18:25):
That moment, that aha moment when the BlackBerry people realize
that's what Apple was doing and that's literally what tanked BlackBerry.
That was like the big kind of turning point of
that story. Fascinating, dude.
Speaker 2 (18:37):
Think about when you target spends a great deal of
time and money trying to figure out what you as
an individual want, what you're interested in, what you're willing
to buy what you're not buying, even though you're showing
interest on their website or their app. Think about when
you go into Kroger and they're trying to do the
same things. What does this individual want that is also
(18:59):
in this social strata, in this economic strata. What if
they are willing to give you those deals too? Just
where you're what is this thing called Apple Vision pros
or whatever? Where are that when you shop in Target
next time? And it's going to measure your reaction to
certain shirts that you're looking at in a line or
(19:20):
certain food products.
Speaker 1 (19:22):
Think about also how when the Kroger Plus or whatever
loyalty card came out, it gave you a discount as
the price is purposely gradually frogs boiling rows, such that
now if you go there without a card, if you
go to a lot of places without a card, you
are paying extra because you have refused to submit your
(19:44):
information to the system. That is ten ten. What is
happening or what will.
Speaker 4 (19:49):
Happen really cooly before you go is when you guys
have to peep this link I put in the chat.
Speaker 2 (19:52):
Oh, it's the blue blocker.
Speaker 3 (19:54):
What is that?
Speaker 4 (19:55):
It's from Back to the Future too, it's like an
accessory that exists in back of the too.
Speaker 3 (20:01):
It looks exactly like we were talking about.
Speaker 4 (20:02):
And it's that it's by JVC you'll see on the side,
which is like a big company in the eighties.
Speaker 3 (20:07):
You know, they made cam quarters and stuff.
Speaker 4 (20:10):
I mean, this is this is the future we were
promised by Back to the Future too.
Speaker 3 (20:14):
Finally coming coming to fruition.
Speaker 2 (20:16):
All right, final word, alexis are you getting one?
Speaker 5 (20:19):
I was about to curse, so I'll say f no.
And also to answer your earlier question, like iref somebody
showed up to that like on a dat or I
was hanging out with somebody and they put them on.
I would roast the absolute out.
Speaker 1 (20:31):
Of You heard her here first, folks heard her here first.
There is a there is a certain standard to romance
on stuff. They don't want you to know.
Speaker 2 (20:40):
Oh beautiful, let us know what you think. We'll be
right back with more messages from you.
Speaker 3 (20:51):
And we've returned.
Speaker 4 (20:52):
After that illuminating conversation about the future that is the
present that is a little bit terrifying and really dorky.
Speaker 3 (21:02):
But let's refresh.
Speaker 4 (21:03):
Let's do a little reset and refresh, recycle, reduce, reuse,
and hear a message from a listener of the show
and someone i'd consider to have become a pal of mine.
We're gonna go by their nickname Moons of Athos. I'm
gonna read some segments of this lovely email that Moons
wrote us. My name is Moons of Athos. He gives
(21:23):
the real day, but I'm not sure he didn't get
give it permission to use the nickname, so I'm not
gonna give.
Speaker 3 (21:27):
The real name.
Speaker 4 (21:27):
I'm a musician and multimedia specialist from the south east
of Ireland, currently based in Berlin, Germany. Hopefully Noel remembers
me from his visit to Berlin just about two years ago. Now,
of course I remember you, Moons. We had lovely pintes
together and it was great. We actually hung out twice.
Was great meeting you that time. Man had a blast
hanging out with you, Frank and your other mates in
the metal bars here. It's true we went to some
(21:48):
awesome metal bars, of which there are copious amounts in Berlin.
I just wanted to touch base with you guys since
I've been listening for about.
Speaker 3 (21:54):
Six and a half years now.
Speaker 4 (21:56):
Also in the latest Listener Mail episode, Missing in Missouri,
Corruption and Illinois, Australia and Insight. You guys put out
a call for art inspired even loosely by your podcasts,
So here goes. I play guitar and write music in
a post rock, post metal band called Sky Trumpets. We're
gonna get to where that name came from or the
inspiration Ben and Nol. I know you both follow us
(22:16):
on Instagram. Many thanks for that, But since so many
of us conspiracy realists have so much in common, I
thought it might be worth sharing this with the wider community,
especially since I'm working on new material to release later
this year. So many of us, being the fun type
of weirdos who worship at the altar of Fox Mulder
and Dana Scully, find endless pleasures in rewatching Agent Cooper,
visit Twin Peaks each spooky season, and seemingly a lot
(22:37):
of us are also arts practitioners and gear nerds in
our respective fields. Recalling Noel and I's conversation about studio equipment,
vintage SyncE and guitar gear, maybe a weird droney ambient
metal band from the South coast of Ireland can be
another common interest for more of the community. The story
goes that I began writing music for what would become
Sky Trumpets about the same time I found your podcast
(22:59):
in October two, twenty seventeen, when I lived in Hamburg, Germany.
I remember the feeling of delight at working a job
which didn't require too much brain power, my first office
job as an intern, and loving syncing into your podcast
each day. I think I began with episodes on the
flat Woods Monster Alisa Lamb and the interview with the
guy who ran the Bigfoot Museum, David Bacara, Right McAra, Yeah,
(23:20):
I love that guy. It was great to hear a
bunch of guys talking about this stuff and not taking
it too seriously, while also not talking down on the
fun cryptid stories and similarly not taking sick pleasure in
talking about true crime and conspiracy cases like some other
podcasts seemed to do. This alongside the binge watching of
The Walking Dead from the beginning at the time, allowed
(23:43):
me to come up with the first Sky Trumpet song
Crime project. The idea of it was that it would
be the soundtrack playing in my synesthetic brain while listening
to your podcast, or if I were in real life
TWD situation. I moved back to Ireland just before Christmas
twenty seventeen to complete my degree. Six months later, some
of my musician mates had heard this demo of Crime
Project and asked me to be a part of a
(24:04):
live band for this music. If I was planning on
starting one, well now I was. Now we need a name, right.
I wanted something epic, almost biblical. Some of my favorite
post rock bands have names that really suit the biblical, cathartic,
spiritual sound of their music. God Speed You, Black Emperor,
personal favorite, Ben, I know you're a fan as well.
Speaker 3 (24:22):
God is an astronaut.
Speaker 4 (24:23):
Explosions in the sky cloud kicker if these trees could talk,
so I liked the idea of sky in there somewhere.
I remember hearing the term sky trumpets mentioned by Ben
on one of the episodes, talking about the phenomena of
weird noises seemingly without a source occurring around the world.
I think it was when you were discussing the windsor
hum maybe. Anyway, when I remember the term, it felt
(24:45):
like the nice snap of two lego bricks in my head.
That had to be our band name. I mentioned it
to the guys and they liked it. It's the last
bit here, I'm gonna read Ben, my fellow senisthete it's
worth noting that Sky Trumpets is not just a band,
but a multim projects. One of my goals with this
project was to create abstract films for each song based
(25:05):
off of my own music, matching or mismatching colors intentionally
in my head, grouping songs together for certain releases based
on their colors, writing set lists based on songs colors, etc.
And Sky Trumpet's music has been the most explicit example
of this. Since we are instrumental, I have built a
few music visualizers to try to visualize my synesthesia for
(25:27):
live performances, admittedly to varying degrees of success, but hoping
to have it usable later this year in a more
coherent format than I've done before.
Speaker 3 (25:37):
I just think this is super cool.
Speaker 4 (25:38):
We talked a little about number stations he goes on
and talk about some other projects that he's involved in.
But before I toss to the group, highly recommend you
check out Sky Trumpets. They're on Instagram and there's the
link in bio situation that links you out to a
lot of these other projects. So man, thanks to moons
of Athos for this lovely trip down memory Lane a
(25:59):
for some of these topics, and just from doing exactly
what Ben sent the call out to have people share
with us making art, you know, out of some of
the stuff that we talk about.
Speaker 3 (26:08):
It's a real honor.
Speaker 2 (26:10):
I want to shout out something Moon said at the
end here that we did not read yet. Moon says,
might I make a suggestion while I'm here for this
year's spooky season, maybe you could bring back the segment
of reading out listeners ghost stories. I think we should
do more of that this year or anybody who's listening,
and we could do those year round. It doesn't have
to be spooky season.
Speaker 1 (26:29):
It's always Halloween in America.
Speaker 4 (26:32):
Yeah, or at the very least, you know on stuff
that I want you to know we love it. Also,
he said that another band that he's in that's kind
of a queer punk band is how he described it,
Skin on Flesh, which you can find at Skin on Flesh.
Band recently had a song featured in the latest Cyberpunk DLC.
We were talking about cyberpunk a little while ago, So
(26:53):
that's pretty cool for an indie type band to have
their song featured in a game like that.
Speaker 3 (26:57):
That's good money and good exposure. Well well done, Well done, y'all.
Speaker 2 (27:01):
I listened to a bit of Thinking Hours from Sky
Trumpets and I really did enjoy what I was hearing.
And awesome work.
Speaker 1 (27:09):
You came to the right place, man.
Speaker 4 (27:12):
Yeah, I guess I should have maybe written him back
to ask if we could play a sample on the show.
So maybe we'll leave a space here just for a
little sample in the in the event that I hear
back from them with permission before.
Speaker 2 (27:25):
This errors, I'm gonna recommend around two minutes in and
Thinking Hours when the the drums really kick in.
Speaker 5 (27:32):
Dang it.
Speaker 3 (28:05):
Yeah, big, this is shorty, Ben.
Speaker 4 (28:07):
Any thoughts about the specifically the visual aspects of this
trying to recreate the experience of synesthesia.
Speaker 3 (28:14):
I think that's so cool. Yeah, agreed.
Speaker 1 (28:17):
As we said, you can find the website Experiment sixty
four dot com where we can learn more about this stuff.
And these are the kind of letters we love. Anything
that we in this show do that somehow inspires our
fellow listeners makes it worth it, I would argue, you
(28:38):
know what I mean, and we've got again, as you
pointed out, Nol, we do always ask for permission before
we air or share your stuff because it is your stuff.
But keep them coming. This is just awesome. It really
makes our day, I think collectively, or makes our evening.
Speaker 4 (28:55):
Well, let's take a quick break, hear a word from
our sponsor, and then come back with another message from you.
Speaker 1 (29:08):
And we have returned with a bit of a round up.
We are going to share a couple of different emails
from some of our fellow conspiracy realists, all commenting about
the same thing. Quite recently, folks, As you may recall,
we discussed an intensely troubling story about human trafficking and
(29:29):
the gray market cannabis trade in Oklahoma. It appears gang
that we have hit a bit of a nerve in
a good way, because we had a ton of people
writing to us and many calling us likely as well,
who were responding and saying largely the same thing, agreeing
(29:51):
with our take on the recent news and telling us
it goes much much deeper. So what I'm thinking we
could do is just a brief recap of the story
we first found, and then some helpful responses from from
our friends in Oklahoma. So the quick recap is this,
(30:13):
two men were recently convicted of a drug trafficking conspiracy
Chinese nationals. They were popped for illegally trafficking cannabis from
an Oklahoma grow operation. Oklahoma does have medical marijuana laws,
so there are ways to legally grow distribute cell weed.
(30:37):
But what we found was that there were a lot
of strings leading away from this. It had been politicized
by some authorities as a way of like arguing for
a border wall. It had been turned into you know,
a little bit of somewhat racist sinophobia. But Noel Matt
I was shocked by how many people wrote to us
(31:01):
about this. Did you see some of these emails? We
got quite a few, Yeah.
Speaker 4 (31:04):
I did, And it was nice to get a little
bit of meat on the bones around what's going on
on the ground, you know, in Oklahoma and the relationship
with cannabis. In terms of the questions we asked, like, way.
Speaker 3 (31:16):
Is it legal? Why isn't it legal?
Speaker 4 (31:18):
Like just like the there seems to be some some
wrenches in the works in terms of making that happen.
And it's sort of an odd situation from from some
of the perspectives that I caught a glimpse of.
Speaker 1 (31:29):
Yeah, agreed fully, and we've not been to Oklahoma or wait,
let me check this code named DOC. Have you been
to Oklahoma?
Speaker 5 (31:37):
I have I passed through there when I toured with
that metal band that I told you about.
Speaker 1 (31:42):
Oh that's right, but I didn't stay. You didn't stay.
Speaker 5 (31:45):
Also dated a guy from Oklahoma.
Speaker 1 (31:48):
Okay, do you want to shout about on the air?
I don't?
Speaker 3 (31:53):
All right?
Speaker 1 (31:54):
Well, okay, so at least we have one person who's
had some boots on the ground here. Our first letter says, Hi,
my name is Whitney. I own a medical marijuana dispensary
in Durant. Durant, Oklahoma, and I am thrilled you guys
covered the human trafficking issue. It's the worst kept secret
(32:14):
in the state, especially in our industry. We've been trying
to bring attention to the horrors that are happening all
around us. We've been to farms that were housing workers
from Asia and we immediately knew something was wrong. They're
in the middle of nowhere, no cell service, not much
law enforcement. They're living in warehouses with bunk beds. These
groups have shady business practices. They don't follow the regulatory guidance.
(32:40):
So this dispensary has never bought any of their products.
By the way, this is Magnolia City Apothecary. I love
the word apothecary, me too. We should use that more often, right, Yeah,
it's actually a really cool tape label called Oris Apothecary.
Speaker 3 (32:54):
Love it.
Speaker 1 (32:55):
And Whitney continues and says that for the past couple
of years this has been kind of like the Wild West,
lots of open spaces, not much oversight. The Russian mafia
may have also caught onto this trafficking. We're starting to
see their farms pop up. They guard their farms with
armed security and machine guns. Stuff is wild. Sorry, when
(33:16):
he editing for a family show, and Whitney says, hoping
law enforcement continues to shut down these outfits that are
exploiting these people. Then we got another recommendation directing us
to an Instagram account called healthy dot Buffalo that talks
about that has a story with someone who had to
(33:37):
deal with the crazy issues concerning the Oklahoma marijuana industry.
And I looked into this. It seems that the state
is as this conspiracy really says, the state has been
trying to shut down those illegal growth farms. They're owned
by out of state or out of country owners. The
paperwork filed with the State of Oklahoma has go ghost owners. Sadly,
(34:01):
I read some of these ghost owners were lawyers. Imagine
that I have read and watched the shutdown of many
illegal farms, and I've read about executions of foreign workers
at these illegal growtharms. This is nuts. This person also
recommends we go to Oklahoma dot gov slash omma for
(34:22):
more information. And these are just like a couple of
the things. I didn't know it w this deep, but
we talked about this a little bit, right, We talked
about how there appeared to be more at work than
just two sketchy dudes.
Speaker 4 (34:36):
One hundred percent, And I mean, it's another one of
these examples where prohibition of any kind often yields a
smoke screen with which to conduct all kinds of shady
business under behind whatever you do with a smoke screen.
Speaker 1 (34:54):
Around just in the air, it's weird, you know what
I mean?
Speaker 4 (34:57):
Though, Like if it weren't if there weren't an asp
of this that were kind of off book, then they
wouldn't have been able to disguise a lot of these
other like mega shady activities.
Speaker 1 (35:07):
Agreed one hundred percent. And there are more letters that
we received. One is from the Circumspect coyote who says,
good day, gentlemen. As I listened to your strange news
segment on human trafficking in Oklahoma, I could only think, yep,
that's about par for the course. In two thousand and two,
says our friendly coyote, the John Pickle Company in Tulsa
(35:30):
had brought in a number of Indian nationals and sequestered
them on the property and made them into de facto's slaves.
These individuals were here legally on a work visa, but
those visas and any personal identification was taken from them
and held hostage to ensure their cooperation. They were drawn
in under the banner of higher pay and select fields
(35:51):
than they were subjected to two dollars an hour wages,
poor living in work conditions, and no freedom. And this
coyote were in records or did work in records at
the Tulsa Police Department for years and says, human trafficking
comes up constantly, and maybe again, you know, maybe we
were just a bit unfamiliar or naive. But I think
(36:15):
most Americans outside of Oklahoma do not immediately think of
human trafficking when they think of that state. We all
thought of the musical.
Speaker 4 (36:23):
Well yeah, and I think that's not an accident, right.
I mean, I hate the term because it seems dismissive,
but oftentimes people will describe Oklahoma as a flyover state.
Speaker 3 (36:33):
You know, a lot of those the states sort of
in the middle.
Speaker 4 (36:37):
Are often off the radar of mainstream reporting, which is
what allows things like this to maybe go on for
longer unnoticed.
Speaker 1 (36:47):
Yeah, that's a really good point, though it's easy to
ignore it, you know. And it reminds me a little
bit of the situation that can happen with immigrant workers
in Middle Eastern countries. Don't you travel and then the
person employing you possesses your documents and may indeed take
possession of your passport. It's a very very dangerous thing.
(37:08):
And also Coyote points out that these people would be
controlled by having threats made against their family members, and
a lot of them came from US cities, from Los
Angeles or New York. And then Coyote shares with us
a story from the Oklahoman from two thousand and eight,
(37:30):
so it gives us a sense of how long this
kind of stuff has been happening. In this case, there
were fifty two captive workers from India who were basically
laboring in forced servitude, and it took the way the
Oklahoma puts it is it took one quote unquote crazy
Christian to intervene, the implication being that law enforcement wasn't
(37:54):
doing anything.
Speaker 4 (37:56):
I do have to point out one thing that maybe
will lighten them MO just a little bit. And again
I pologize if this is stating the obvious, but I
love that this coyote is circumspect rather than Wiley. Yes,
just throw that out there in case it flew by anybody.
Speaker 3 (38:10):
Some clever nicky names coming through on today's episode.
Speaker 1 (38:14):
And then Crystal writes to us saying much the same thing,
and points out specifically the history of the history of
medical marijuana in the state. Crystal says, quote, since medical
marijuana was legalized in Oklahoma in twenty eighteen, there have
been big repercussions. The law was rushed through with little
(38:36):
real oversight of grow licensing or regulation in the issuance
of medical licenses. And pause there, because that's something we've
seen with pretty much every medical marijuana state. Right Like
I have glaucoma maybe or a vague sense of unease.
Speaker 4 (38:51):
It's a loophole, yes, a million percent. I mean, you know,
that's why it's comical that there's something, whether it philosophically
or whatever, that's venting these states from taking that leap
to to pure recreation because it's obviously going to need
more money because it's open to the floodgates. But yeah,
I mean when California went legal for you know, medical,
(39:11):
all you hear was stories about people saying generalized anxiety disorder,
which is honestly something that I don't think smoking weed
would would help very much. It tends to make people
more anxious, but I guess it depends on the strain.
But yeah, it's weird, like why are where? Why are
people getting log jammed between medical and recreational, Like Georgia
(39:32):
is so puritanical in the way that we handle that
stuff that I think we've only got medical in a
very specific situation that involves not even the smokable flower,
just the like change pills at all, I think is
what it's called. And it's apparently kind of bull crap.
You know, it doesn't really do the job.
Speaker 1 (39:50):
It only went over the finish line in the state's
legislative body because, uh, because some some politician promised it
would not be fun they literally said, don't worry, no
one's getting high. No one has a new appreciation of
baselines or ambient music. Right, this is just medicine. And
(40:12):
we see that kind of turtanical is a perfect word.
We see this occur in a lot of other states.
You know, I think for a long time in Michigan,
you could just say that you were a fan of
Michigan State and they would they would sign you up
for a they would sign you up for some weed.
Speaker 3 (40:29):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1 (40:31):
We're just gonna take that. True. It's too late, Doc,
you can't stop us. No, no comment.
Speaker 3 (40:40):
I don't know if I have a heck of a
lot to add here.
Speaker 4 (40:42):
I obviously thrown a Matt, but he's dealing with some
home renovation stuff. He had to jump away for him.
And unless you worry that that he's being so quiet,
I don't know, Ben anything else to any other noteworthy
responses to that topic.
Speaker 3 (40:57):
Okay, got it.
Speaker 1 (40:57):
Yeah, let's end on. Let's and on just one or
two more things that are important for us non Oklahomas
to know. Continuing with Crystal, by law, a grow operation
in Oklahoma is required to be owned a majority by
a resident of the state a year or two ago,
it was discovered that foreign owners were using Oklahoma law
firms as straw man owners, and hundreds of grows were
(41:21):
shut down. The state stopped issuing new licenses. It's still
reworking the system. Many of these illicit operations work with
drug cartels as well as using quote unquote not so
legal employment methods. All of this does, unfortunately make a
great cover for moving things and people for nefarious purposes.
Even before the grow problem, Oklahoma has been a hub
(41:43):
for human trafficking, add major cartel and gang activity. There
are several interstates crossing in Oklahoma City, so it's very
easy to lose track of suspicious vehicles and to get things.
Speaker 4 (41:55):
Yeah, good points, right crossroads, you know what I mean,
easy to obscure all these movements. No, I'm so glad
that this hit a nerve because this was news to
all of us. And the more we hear back from
you conspiracy realists out there, the picture the pieces really
start to come into full focus and lie. Of course
this makes sense and this is gosh. It wouldn't be
(42:16):
able to do that without you, you know.
Speaker 1 (42:17):
Yeah, I'm still writing back to everyone, but I want
to thank all our fellow conspiracy realists for weighing in
with this first hand experience. The major highways that a
lot of our Oklahoma and friends are talking about are
I thirty five, I forty, and I forty four. There
is a huge problem with potential trafficking. There is a
(42:38):
lot of political controversy here. I think just to keep
this one short, I think the best way for us
to end or thank everybody for tuning in is back
is to let you know, Hey, Matt, we'll come back.
Is to let you know that if you suspect a
case of human trafficking here in the United States, it
(43:01):
is very important for you to speak up because often
this stuff only functions because people ignore fairly obvious signs.
So if you suspect a case of human trafficking, please
do contact one eight eight three seven three seven eight
eight eight. That's one eight eight eight three seven three seven.
Speaker 3 (43:23):
Eight eight eight.
Speaker 1 (43:25):
That's the National Human Trafficking Hotline. And folks, this stuff
does matter. Human trafficking is a real conspiracy.
Speaker 2 (43:33):
Said that I missed this. I looked through the messages
that we got that you compiled there, Ben, and it's
just really intense And sorry, I wasn't here for that discussion.
I did just learn that you can get a brand
new garage door for significantly less than an Apple Vision Pro.
Speaker 1 (43:49):
Okay, yeah, pretty soon you'll have to have a Vision
Pro to buy a garage door. It's coming, there's some
version of it. I also had a great conversation with
a friend of the show who is the United States
needs a new deal to improve things in this country,
but people are so sensitive to names. We're trying to
figure out what you would call a new deal to
(44:10):
get voters on board, and we came up with an idea.
You guys are gonna love wait for it, America.
Speaker 3 (44:15):
Plus, hey, I got a pitch for you guys. How
about this?
Speaker 4 (44:19):
Okay, ready, you're ready, virtual garage door boom. Just chew
on that.
Speaker 1 (44:28):
So, fellow conspiracy realists, thank you, as always so much
for tuning in. You are the best part of the show.
We would love for you to join up with us.
We can't wait to hear your thoughts. We try to
be easy to find online even if you don't have
an Apple Vision Pro.
Speaker 4 (44:43):
That's true, not necessary, and our barrier of entry is
quite low. You have actually three ways you can get
touch with us. First is on the Internet, where you
can reach us at the handle conspiracy Stuff, or we
exist on Facebook, or we have a Facebook group. Here's
where it gets crazy, is what that's called. We also
exist under that handle on YouTube and also on x
FKA Twitter. If you'd rather find us on Instagram and
(45:04):
TikTok or conspiracy Stuff show.
Speaker 2 (45:06):
Hey, you want to call us, use our voicemail system.
It's one eight three three std WYTK. Put the number
in your phone as a contact and you might get
a callback accidentally or very very purposefully, be like Ducky
who called us about small town corruption in Johnson City, Tennessee,
(45:27):
something we may have to talk about in the future.
Looking at you, Ben, especially because I think you might
even know where that place is, just because of where
you have existed previously. Sir, when you do call in,
give yourself a cool nickname and let us know if
we can use your message on the air. If you
don't want to use that system, why not use our
email system.
Speaker 1 (45:45):
We are the people who read every email we get.
Conspiracy at iHeartRadio dot com.
Speaker 2 (46:00):
H Stuff they Don't want you to know is a
production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio, app,
Apple podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
Stuff They Don't Want You To Know News
Hosts And Creators
Matt Frederick
Ben Bowlin
Noel Brown
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