Angus, Thongs, and Perfect Snogging with Kate Cheka

On this episode, Jamie, Caitlin, and special guest Kate Cheka dicuss kissing and cats and Angus, Thongs, and Perfect Snogging (2008)!

Follow Kate on Instagram at @katecheka, visit her website at katecheka.co.uk for tickets to upcoming tour dates, and grab tickets to her London shows at https://sohotheatre.com/events/kate-cheka-a-messiah-comes/ 

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
On the Bechdelcast. The questions ask if movies have.

Speaker 2 (00:04):
Women and them, are all their discussions just boyfriends and husbands,
or do they have individualism? It's the patriarchy, Zephyn bast
start changing with the Bechdel Cast.

Speaker 3 (00:16):
Hello, listeners, Just a reminder about our upcoming shows starting
in a couple weeks. First, a show in Los Angeles
on January nineteenth. This is a Bechdel Cast celebration. It's
a variety show with special guests and lots of hilarious bits,
just celebrating us doing the show for a whopping eight years.

(00:38):
This show is also being live streamed, and even if
you cannot watch it as it's happening live, if you
buy a live stream ticket, you'll have access to the
video for one week after, so no excuse not to
see it. The next show is in San Francisco as
a part of SF's Sketch Fest on January twenty third.
This is a part of our famed Shrek Tannic show,

(00:59):
and this one specifically on Titanic. If it sells out,
I will get naked on stage so that Jamie can
draw me like one of her French girls. So you know,
come see that, plus lots of other fun bits, you know,
Titanic related stuff that you've never seen before, that you've
never heard us talk about before. It's all brand new stuff.
And then finally our show in Portland at Curious Comedy

(01:21):
Theater on January twenty sixth, also Shrek Tannic and this
show is on Shrek. So in person tickets for this
are close to selling out. There's still a few left,
but you know, get them now while you still can.
But this show is also being live streamed, so you
can watch from anywhere in the world, and same deal

(01:42):
as the other live stream show, you can watch for
one week after if you buy a live stream ticket.
So those are the shows. They will all have meet
and greets with myself and Jamie afterward we sell exclusive merch.
All the tickets can be found at link Tree Bechdel Cast,
so we'll see you there and enjoy this episode. Dear

(02:08):
Diary slash, Dear Jamie.

Speaker 1 (02:11):
Hi, Caitlyn, it's me your diary. Y.

Speaker 3 (02:14):
Yeah, I love my cat angus and I love boys.

Speaker 1 (02:21):
And that sounds probably like that's it pretty much. I
would not want to hear about you having any sort
of hobby or interests that would suck. Oh thank god. Okay, Well,
I mean Kat is Angus is a hobby. Angus seems
like a full time job.

Speaker 3 (02:35):
He's a fully developed character as far as I'm concerned.

Speaker 1 (02:39):
He's a piece of work. He's a real piece of work.
He's the protagonist. Yeah, I mean the titular tituler. Yeah.
I don't know what cat actor they had on this,
but what a star? Whoa he was taking direction? I
don't think that. I mean, I'm sure that there was
like a fake cat in there at some point, but
it seemed like he was really owning the space.

Speaker 3 (03:03):
Yeah, every thing I saw on screen that resembled a
cat seemed like a real cat.

Speaker 1 (03:08):
It was that cat. And it's I like, I, you know,
we've talked about animal acting on the show before, and like,
what are the ethics of it? And then occasionally there's
a born star and you're just like, I'm not going
to tell that guy to get off stage. He clearly
belongs there.

Speaker 3 (03:22):
A star is born and it's not Lady Gaga. It
is Angus.

Speaker 1 (03:27):
The cat cat rip to him maybe is kind of
an old movie.

Speaker 3 (03:31):
Ooh, sad, but come to the cat. Sad but true, Yes,
welcome My name is Caitlin Deronte.

Speaker 1 (03:38):
My name is Jamie Loftus, and this is our podcast
where we talk about your favorite movies using an intersectional
feminist lens, using the Bechdel test as a jumping off
point for discussion. But Caitlin, what the hell is that?

Speaker 4 (03:52):
Oh?

Speaker 1 (03:53):
We didn't. I think the whole beginning of it, for example,
didn't pass because we were talking about the Kale cat.

Speaker 3 (03:58):
Well, cats don't have gen or so I think talking
about a cat is not talking about a man, a
human man. I think that would say.

Speaker 1 (04:06):
I do think that Angus has a very masculine energy.

Speaker 3 (04:10):
Well, he is intense, but he's also so freaking chill.
Did you see the scene where the little sister's putting
spaghetti on his head.

Speaker 1 (04:19):
And that was the real cat? I was like, yeah,
how was this real cat like spaghetti trained? You're like,
what the hell? And yeah, he does like et also
very gender fluid with the dress. Yes, wears all sorts
of outfits. Okay, okay, point taking.

Speaker 3 (04:36):
And Georgia, the main character is always like stop dressing
Angus and drag.

Speaker 1 (04:41):
Well, Georgia has a lot of issues with gender that
we'll get to. Georgia has to answer for her crimes
and it's like leave angus out of it. Yeah, so
that did pass the Bechtel test. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (04:49):
And when you say that, what do you mean? Oh,
it's just a media metric created by queer cartoonist Alison Bechdel.
There are many versions of the tests. The one that
we use is do two characters of a mo originalized
gender have names? Do they speak to each other? And
is it about something other than a man for two
lines of dialogue or a like substantial meatia conversation. So

(05:12):
that's the Bechdel test. We will I'm not really sure
about this one.

Speaker 1 (05:16):
We'll get there, but yeah, I think it's a softy
as but not as much as you'd want. Yes, all
things considered.

Speaker 3 (05:24):
Also, I want to point out listeners that we are
recording in person for the first time in ages.

Speaker 1 (05:31):
It's weird because we have a guest visiting us all
the way from the UK. Ever heard of it?

Speaker 3 (05:38):
And stare We're all like breathing the same air right now,
and so let's bring her in.

Speaker 1 (05:45):
She's a comedian.

Speaker 3 (05:46):
You may have seen her at our live Shrek Tannic
show in Manchester, UK. Ever heard of that?

Speaker 5 (05:55):
It's Kate cheka, welcome, Thank you for having me.

Speaker 1 (06:00):
Wow, you really had to like sit through us doing
that whole thing, didn't you.

Speaker 5 (06:03):
I really enjoyed it there.

Speaker 4 (06:06):
This is why I flew all the way for it
to be live, because you don't get that, you.

Speaker 1 (06:10):
Don't get that same experience, right, Yeah, I.

Speaker 5 (06:12):
Was like, I need to be in the room for that.

Speaker 4 (06:15):
Life's just many experiences stats on top of each other,
and that was one of them.

Speaker 1 (06:19):
Well, you're welcome, very judicious, Thank you so much for
being here. Caitlin's living room. Yeah, here we are. Yeah,
what a day. What a day. And we're also recording
this the day before the American election, so we're to be.

Speaker 3 (06:36):
Because you'll probably be listening to this listeners in January.

Speaker 5 (06:41):
Yeah, so the moth might have ended.

Speaker 1 (06:45):
Yeah, you might never actually be in the revolution at
that point. Yeah. Yeah, so if you're listening from the
from the front lines of the revolution, Hello and thank you.

Speaker 5 (06:58):
Feel sady.

Speaker 1 (06:58):
Here are our thoughts about it, Angus perfect snaring.

Speaker 5 (07:04):
About a movie work twenty years ago.

Speaker 1 (07:05):
Maybe this movie is so interesting, Yes we are. This
is a very common request on the movie. I feel
like it is a like millennial, like late millennial. Maybe
earlier gen Z Staple movie, So I want to know
what everyone's history. Yeah, okay, kid.

Speaker 4 (07:21):
So I got the books, but not the first one.
Someone gave me like the fourth book in the sequence
of books as a present when I was like twelve,
and I thought it was the funniest thing I'd.

Speaker 5 (07:34):
Ever read in my hold.

Speaker 4 (07:35):
Like it was just I remember like bringing it to school,
like reading it during reading time in class and like laughing,
and all my friends.

Speaker 5 (07:41):
But why is she laughing so much?

Speaker 4 (07:43):
And then they'd read it and be like, I don't
even think it's that funny, but I thought it was
so funny. Yeah, and then I think I read the books,
and then I anticipated the movie because I loved the books, Okay, and.

Speaker 5 (07:53):
Then I don't remember the movie that well.

Speaker 4 (07:55):
I definitely saw it, but I think I was like,
you know when you read the books and you're like,
it's not the books.

Speaker 1 (08:01):
The book is better.

Speaker 5 (08:02):
The book is better.

Speaker 4 (08:03):
My imagination's wondrous fast and you could never do what
I can do in my mind, of course, of course,
you know, but yeah, so, but I just adored the books.

Speaker 1 (08:17):
Okay.

Speaker 3 (08:18):
Did you ever go back and like read the first one?

Speaker 5 (08:20):
Yeah?

Speaker 4 (08:20):
Yeah, I know, I re read them all again. But
then at some point I aged out of them before
they've been finished being written, because there's ten in total.

Speaker 1 (08:31):
There's so many more.

Speaker 4 (08:32):
I aged out and I got to the point where
I couldn't read them, but I wanted to, Okay, And
then some one time, a fourteen year old or like child,
not a child, a fourteen year old air teenage they
like offered me like, do you want to borrow my ones?

Speaker 5 (08:45):
And I really wanted to, but I was too embarrassed
to see it.

Speaker 1 (08:48):
Yeah, that always takes to me so sad, Like the
first time I remember like turning away a ya classic
because I'm like, I'm over it, I'm over it. Why Yeah, yeah,
you hate to see it. But a day comes for
us all.

Speaker 5 (09:01):
And then you can get you just know a young adults.
Now let me just go to be like I'm at today.

Speaker 1 (09:09):
I grew up.

Speaker 3 (09:11):
I've just come of age too much and I'm over this.

Speaker 4 (09:15):
Yeah, but now I would read them again, and now
I maybe will after this, I think I'm gonna Kaitlyn.

Speaker 1 (09:20):
Did Kaitlyn Kaitlyn, who vows to never read a book
on the show regularly hate read a book.

Speaker 3 (09:30):
Well, let's be honest, I had an e book be
read to me.

Speaker 1 (09:35):
Oh, okay, this would be I mean, I feel like,
if I'm remembering the cadence of the books, that it
would be a fun listen.

Speaker 3 (09:41):
Yeah, especially when you listen to it on like two
times speed. It really makes it go nicely. So yeah,
my history with this, so I did read the first book.
I don't think I read beyond that first one and
didn't even know there were more than two books, So
my bad.

Speaker 1 (09:59):
Can is wild. Yeah, I think I got to three.

Speaker 3 (10:03):
Okay, I yeah, I got to the first two, I believe,
and I read them when I was already too old,
so this would have been the mid two thousand. I
think I was still in high school. I did the
same thing with Sisterhood of the Traveling Pants, where I
read these books that were geared toward a demographic that
was like maybe two or three years younger than me.

(10:25):
They were more for like eleven, twelve, thirteen year olds,
and I was like fifteen, and I was like, I've
already kissed the boys and I've touched a penis at
this point. So these little a loser, these little babies
who were still having their first kiss. I can't relate
but for some reason I still read these books. I

(10:45):
think I thought that angus thongs and full frontal snogging
was funny. I liked her sense of humor, and so
I guess that's why I kept reading. Like I finished
that book and I read onto the second one. But
by the time the movie came out, which was two
thousand and eight, I had fully aged out of the
whole thing, and so I didn't see the movie until
we started prepping for the episode.

Speaker 1 (11:07):
Oh wow, yeah, same same. I read the I read
I think the first three books. I loved diary style
books when I was a kid. I feel like this
was like probably a series I would have picked up
when I ran out of Princess Diaries books to read,
which were like other I just like love them and
you're like, oh, it's kind of like British Princess Diaries.
And I also knew I don't know. I was very like, wow,

(11:29):
she was using all these words I've never heard of.
I loved the slang and these books. I flagg, slaggy, lindsay.
I had to look up what slag was.

Speaker 3 (11:40):
Whoa I know, we don't know over, you don't say slag.
We don't know what it means it's like slut.

Speaker 1 (11:46):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's kind of but yeah, like I
had to, like, I think, if I'm remembering qurectly or
maybe like came at the Scholastic book fair or something,
you would get like a little glossary to be like,
if you're American, here's what they're talking about.

Speaker 5 (11:59):
Yes, I did think that I did have gloceries in them.

Speaker 1 (12:02):
Yeah, and it was very helpful and I tried to
integrate it into my like daily word usage and all
my friends were like, shut up, nerdy is not a thing.

Speaker 5 (12:16):
Oh, you tried to make it happen.

Speaker 1 (12:18):
I was really trying to make it hatt.

Speaker 2 (12:19):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (12:19):
I was Gretchen Wiener's style, like trying to make thatch happen.

Speaker 5 (12:23):
Yeah, trying to make British slang app was not.

Speaker 1 (12:26):
I was always trying to like get the slang from
Angustong's in full frontal snogging and also just random Gilmore
Girls references I didn't fully understand and just eke them
into conversation and other twelve year olds were like, shut
the fuck up. Anyways, I enjoyed these books, but I
also did not see the movie because I think I
was in high school when it came out and I

(12:47):
was like, I'm not going to see it. And also
I didn't realize this is a Nickelodeon movie, which I
feel like as I was watching it felt it really
felt like a Nickelodeon movie. So I think I missed
this one because I was probably like, I'm you know,
I'm fifteen, I'm tootle when it's like I should have
just seen it.

Speaker 5 (13:05):
Then Okay, I've got a question. What's the feel of
a Nickelodeon movie.

Speaker 1 (13:10):
It's very I think I said this one yesterday. It's
very like boying like, it's very like it's like what
I feel like, it's weird. It's weird that this is
like a movie or like a story about like coming
of age and adolescence that I feel like normally would
be treated with like some sense sensitivity. But it's like

(13:32):
they sort of the parents are written in the movie
to feel more like sitcom parents than I remember them
in the book. They it just feels like a Nickelodeon
sitcom at certain places, it does, but I think that
the books.

Speaker 3 (13:44):
I think that it actually pretty accurately reflects the tone
of the act.

Speaker 1 (13:49):
Having just reread it, it's interesting, Well.

Speaker 3 (13:52):
She spends a lot of the book talking about how
much she hates her parents and especially her dad. Yeah
so and she like, oh, they're so corny blah blah blah.

Speaker 1 (14:02):
But it's also like, if you're adapting the book, you
should probably assume that Georgia's words are to be taken
with a grain of salt, because everyone like you shouldn't
just adapt a twelve year old characterization of their parents
and be like, here are these fucking weird losers.

Speaker 5 (14:18):
You're just like, whoa, oh, maybe we should do that
whole Maybe that's what everything's lacking.

Speaker 1 (14:23):
That's true, It's true. We have to get more twelve
year olds in the writers.

Speaker 5 (14:26):
Yes, we're not digging the opinions of twelve year old seriously.

Speaker 1 (14:31):
I mean that probably is true. But yeah, I guess
that's what I mean. When it felt it felt like
Nickelodeon movie like snow Day and like other ones that
were just like kind of edgier kids movies.

Speaker 5 (14:42):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I've got a question.

Speaker 4 (14:43):
Was the book called Anger Songs and Perfect Snugging here? No,
it was called full frontal Snogging here.

Speaker 1 (14:49):
Yeah. I'm just assuming they didn't want full frontal as
a name for a kid's movie, which I could understand.

Speaker 4 (14:55):
I remember reading this is Gonna be I remember reading
an art school about how this music movie was developed.
Oh wow, yes, in like some kind of teenage magazine
work an article with the director, and they said it
was a nightmare to try and get filming permission in
locations with the title full frontal snogging because everyone thought
they were filming a porn movie.

Speaker 1 (15:14):
I mean, it does sound.

Speaker 4 (15:16):
To change the name to get permission to film in
these locations.

Speaker 1 (15:21):
Yeah, that makes sense. I was reading that the book
is I wouldn't have guessed this, but it's like frequently
on banned books because of George's disrespect for authority.

Speaker 5 (15:34):
And that's respect for other people, would reason.

Speaker 1 (15:41):
Yeah, and then and then some of the and then
some of the homophobia, right.

Speaker 3 (15:44):
Yeah, well it's more like just references to lgbt Q
plus people at all, rather than like the homophobia itself.
And then just like you know, references to like sexual
like Christian Yeah, yeah, because most of what book banning
is is like, yes, conservative agenda, like crystal fascists, weirdos.

(16:05):
You know, let's take a quick break and then we'll
come back for the recap, shall we, And we're back,
and here's the recap for angus songs and perfect snogging. Sorry,

(16:28):
I'm gonna do that and it's going to be offensive,
but I won't be.

Speaker 1 (16:33):
Able to stop. Okay we are.

Speaker 5 (16:37):
We're in Eastbourne, UK, Eastbourn, Eastbourne, which is funny enough,
where my mother was born and.

Speaker 3 (16:44):
Where is it in relation to the only place I
know London?

Speaker 4 (16:48):
So if you go straight down from London, it's Brighton,
and it's very close to Brighton, it's like just a
little bit further along the coast.

Speaker 5 (16:53):
But it is just one of those old people places,
like just a place full of loads of old people.

Speaker 1 (16:59):
All right. So when Georgia says it's boring, she's not lying.

Speaker 5 (17:02):
Yeah, she's not lying about the vibe. Okay, Yeah, people
come here to die.

Speaker 1 (17:08):
God, it's the Florida.

Speaker 5 (17:09):
Oh yeah, it's the Florida of the UK.

Speaker 1 (17:12):
But not that's crazy, okay, not, it's very cuckock cole. Okay.

Speaker 3 (17:18):
So we meet a fourteen year old girl, Georgia played
by Georgia Groom, while she's heading to a costume party
dressed as a stuffed all of in this like big
bulky costume. And she gets to the party and realizes
she's very out of place and her friends and all
everyone else is like dressed in like not goofy costumes.

(17:41):
We meet her friends Ellen, Rosie, and Georgia's best friend Jazz,
who again they were supposed to all be dressed as
orders but they bailed and Jazz points out that boys
don't like girls for funniness, and we'll talk about that.

Speaker 1 (18:01):
Except one one time.

Speaker 3 (18:04):
Right, So then Georgia is humiliated and she runs home,
where we meet her family, her mom and dad, who
constantly embarrass her.

Speaker 1 (18:15):
They're very boying and she's like stop.

Speaker 3 (18:20):
Her little sister Libby, and her cat Angus, the most
important character of the film, played by one of the
great cat actors of our.

Speaker 1 (18:30):
Time, acting his ass off.

Speaker 3 (18:34):
Georgia gears up for the first day of a new
school year. She accidentally shaves off half of her eyebrow.
She's insecure because she thinks her nose is too big.
She's worried that she'll never get a boyfriend. Stuff like that. Then,
on the first day of school, Georgia is in the
school yard chatting with Jazz, Ellen, and Rosie. They call

(18:56):
themselves the Ace Gang, and they're talking about kissing, or.

Speaker 1 (19:01):
Rather snogging boys.

Speaker 3 (19:04):
Yeah, they're talking about having their boobs touched. They're grossed
out by anything that seems quote unquote lesbiany as they
put it.

Speaker 1 (19:16):
Yep, they sure didn't edit any of that. Well, I
guess maybe they did edit some of that out, according.

Speaker 3 (19:21):
It is more prevalent in the book.

Speaker 1 (19:24):
It is so prevalent in the movie that's wild.

Speaker 3 (19:26):
Well it's well like triple triple it and that's the
amount that it's in the book. Then these two boys
walk past, who the friends think are proper fit that
a sorry.

Speaker 1 (19:40):
I can't sorry listeners. Kate is sinking into the floor.
She's like stop.

Speaker 5 (19:49):
It's like being the Ace.

Speaker 3 (19:54):
Gang follows these boys around, stalks them with binoculars and
every which is also.

Speaker 1 (20:01):
Very Nickelodeon movie Harriet the Spy.

Speaker 3 (20:03):
Coded true uh, And they discover that they're twin brothers
who just moved from London.

Speaker 1 (20:11):
And one of them is Aaron Johnson.

Speaker 3 (20:13):
Oh my gosh, I okay. I watched like an hour
of this movie before I realized.

Speaker 5 (20:17):
Who that was.

Speaker 1 (20:18):
I was like, because, yeah, he's kind of got like
the Bieber hair, So you have to like squint really
hard to be like, oh whoa is that guy.

Speaker 5 (20:25):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (20:26):
So that's Robbie played by Aaron Taylor Johnson. And every
time I hear that night name, I'm like, don't you
mean Anya Taylor Joy And they're like, no, it's a
different person I got.

Speaker 1 (20:36):
I mean it's too close. It's too close.

Speaker 3 (20:39):
And he just has one of those like white man
faces that I cannot by, just like my eyes and
my brain do not register or recognize.

Speaker 1 (20:46):
I am like, what do I even know him from?
He's in kick Ass. I haven't seen he's in.

Speaker 3 (20:55):
He was in that Ryan Gosling movie that came out
where Ryan Gosling played his stunt double fall Guy.

Speaker 1 (21:02):
He's in. He's in the New Noes Foratu, So I
won't he also Tenant Wild.

Speaker 3 (21:11):
Yeah, don't remember him being in that. Anyway, He's a
guy and he plays Robbie.

Speaker 2 (21:17):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (21:17):
The other brother is Tom, played by I didn't bother
to look it up and.

Speaker 1 (21:24):
Get his ass.

Speaker 3 (21:26):
Uh.

Speaker 1 (21:26):
He doesn't even have a Wikipedia page Sean Bork.

Speaker 3 (21:30):
Wow, whoa Yeah. Anyway, their parents have opened up an
organic grocery store in town. So Georgia and Jazz go
to the store one day so that Jazz can flirt
with Tom. She she has like staked her claim on Tom. Meanwhile,
Georgia is crushing on Robbie the Anya Taylor joy Man

(21:55):
and she learns that he's in a band called the
Stiff Dylan's and that.

Speaker 1 (22:00):
Band name and god have being fourteen having a crush
on a boy and a band. What a vibe?

Speaker 5 (22:06):
Yeah that is a good name for a band. It's
pretty cool, correct, Yeah.

Speaker 1 (22:10):
Yeah I was. I feel like that felt authentically like
a teenage boy band.

Speaker 5 (22:15):
Yeah, yeah, exactly, which maybe shows how cool and the
musical lie music listening. I do.

Speaker 3 (22:24):
You're down with the kids with the kids, Hello, fellow kids,
I'm here for the stuff Llans concert.

Speaker 1 (22:31):
I used to have a huge crush on this kid, Stephen.
I'm the full name. I'm Stephen MASSARONI who like worked
part time at the Hot Topic and played like the
bass and like a scream oh band, And I was like,
he's a dreaming would not talk to me, but like, well,
I mean I lost Yeah, look at me now, still
thinking about him. There.

Speaker 3 (22:55):
So she's trying to flirt with Robbie, Georgia is and
then her mom comes in and embarrasses her and talks
about her farting, and she's like.

Speaker 1 (23:04):
Mom, stop, she's doing the boring thing.

Speaker 3 (23:08):
But Georgia keeps daydreaming about kissing and snogging Robbie. But
then Georgia sees Robbie with her classmate Lindsay, who Georgia
thinks is a boring slag. Though Georgia thinks she can't
compete with Lindsay because she feels Lindsay is like more
conventionally attractive, so.

Speaker 1 (23:30):
Quote unquote developed, just like a big deal when you're that.

Speaker 3 (23:33):
Age, right, And so Georgia and her friends spy on
Lindsay to try to learn some tricks on how to
be more attractive to boys, and they learn that Lindsay
wears thongs and uses these like silicone bra inserts to
make her boobs look bigger.

Speaker 1 (23:51):
Which is proof that she's a bad person. Is how
the movie, and it was the Lindsay thing is so
wild because it's like before we even really hear her
say or do anything, we learn that about her, and
then it just does translate to like, so obviously she's
a horrible she's a liar. You're like, I don't know,

(24:12):
check the math there.

Speaker 3 (24:14):
Right, yes, So then Georgia decides to pay a visit
to a boy named Peter Dyer, who gives kissing lessons jail.

Speaker 5 (24:25):
This movie runs a minute. It's crazy how much they
do in one day.

Speaker 1 (24:31):
Truly, like, yeah, Peter Dyer, jail.

Speaker 3 (24:36):
But shout out to the huge poster. He has a
few Grant in his bedroom.

Speaker 1 (24:42):
Why do we think that's there? Is that for him
or oh oh maybe clients? I bet it's for his
That makes.

Speaker 5 (24:52):
I assume the client because he wants to just stare
at this.

Speaker 1 (24:56):
What it's because this is hetero world, except we hate
lesbians and so what's going to get a girl in
the mood more than a huge poster of Hugh Grant?
That makes more sense to me.

Speaker 3 (25:07):
Yeah, okay, So my theory is that he just knows
that in I don't know, ten years from now, that
Hugh Grant will be cast as the villain in Paddington
I giving the performance of a lifetime, and he's just anticipating,
he's getting ready, he smuggling and yeah, yeah, yeah, he's
like he's going to play Phoenix Buchanan and it's going

(25:28):
to be the best performance of all time. I think
that's the more likely theory. Then, So Peter teaches Georgia
how to do different types of kissing, including tongue kissing,
we will have and he tells her that she's a natural.

Speaker 1 (25:50):
When I was around that age, because I was like
a super late bloomer with like first kisses and stuff
like that, or I was probably younger. I was like
probably like eleven or twelve. But my mom was like,
I don't know why I bought it, but she was like,
kissing with tongue is I would never do that. I
would never do that. And I was like oh, and

(26:11):
she's like it's really unsanitary. I would never do it,
and like I asked her about it years later, she's like, yeah,
I guess I don't know why I said that.

Speaker 5 (26:20):
What was she trying to do scam me out?

Speaker 1 (26:22):
I think it's just I don't know. I guess it's
like I'll do that when i'm a parent too. I'm like,
I'm just gonna fuck with them today. Like, I don't know,
I don't know why she I think it was like
I was reading a teen magazine, but like a kissing
article or something. She's like, don't do that. I would
never do that, and I was like ooh, And then
you know, a year later, I was doing tongue kissing. Yeah,
let me just say wow.

Speaker 5 (26:42):
Maybe Yeah, she knew she couldn't really hold the gates back.

Speaker 1 (26:44):
Yeah, but she was just trying to buy time.

Speaker 5 (26:46):
Yeah, I would never you will.

Speaker 1 (26:49):
I would get the flu. That was I think part
of the argument she wasn't gonna get the flu.

Speaker 3 (26:52):
I will say that as a full adult who has
snogged many times, I hate tongue kissing. Do not put
your tongue in my mouth. I don't want to put
my tongue.

Speaker 5 (27:03):
Okay, So what this is huge is an American thing
because I'm from Europe and we just I know.

Speaker 1 (27:08):
I know it's a thing.

Speaker 3 (27:11):
I will do very light, very subtle tongue, but I
would I just want an open mouth kiss with I
don't want anyone's tongue really near me that much.

Speaker 1 (27:22):
For me, it's like a skill thing, like if you
if you, if you're skilled with the tongue and you're
not slobbering around like well.

Speaker 3 (27:28):
Most men aren't skilled.

Speaker 1 (27:32):
I know, I know, I know, So I don't know.

Speaker 3 (27:34):
Maybe I should be a Maybe I should be a
kissing teacher. You should be less creepy, Peter, just to
teach all these.

Speaker 1 (27:41):
Men how to get you a giant I must have
one around here somewhere.

Speaker 5 (27:47):
Because that's what you need. That's your qualification.

Speaker 1 (27:49):
You have a you have a full Monty poster. It's
close enough.

Speaker 4 (27:52):
Yeah, then we'll just do set up a time people
can come back to. That's the point of kissing.

Speaker 3 (27:59):
Well, I would not mind it if people were better
at it, but it's just that it's I don't know,
they do it so grossly and it grosses me out.

Speaker 1 (28:07):
I've been I mean, when I've been in like long
term relationships. If if the kissing is not solid right away,
I'm just like, look, if you're if you're hanging around,
we've I've got to show you how it works for me,
which does not proclude tongue. I'm like into that, but
it's like, but you know, try to develop some technique
for crying out loud.

Speaker 5 (28:26):
It's why to me that people some people can't.

Speaker 4 (28:28):
Yeah, like and also like, you know, I'm in my
mid thirties, I'm like, what's happening?

Speaker 5 (28:32):
How did you get this fun?

Speaker 1 (28:33):
How did you gussd?

Speaker 3 (28:34):
Like?

Speaker 1 (28:34):
And the hotter they are, the less good they're at it,
because I feel like people are just afraid to tell
them or something. I don't know not me, No, not you.
You've you've been doing that.

Speaker 3 (28:43):
I've already kind of a kissing teacher because I have
I know, I'll be like, sir, stop and do it
this way and not that way.

Speaker 1 (28:53):
Yeah. I had to say once. I was like, you
can't like your tongue, can't hit me before your lips.

Speaker 5 (28:57):
That's like that would be insane.

Speaker 1 (28:59):
But there's but there's but there's people out there that
they're like, they're like they're leading with the tongue.

Speaker 5 (29:05):
Yeah, so wild.

Speaker 1 (29:06):
I've been there. I've been like, you're thirty five, How
is that awsible? Like, what's going on?

Speaker 5 (29:13):
Yeah? Do you know what I mean?

Speaker 4 (29:14):
Like in the olden days, you'd be dead by now
and you wouldn't have even failed the thing.

Speaker 1 (29:19):
Well, your life is over. You never learned to kiss skill,
I mean tragic.

Speaker 3 (29:24):
Okay, back to the flim. So Georgia is learning how
to kiss. It's also her birthday coming up, and she's
trying to convince her parents to let her throw a
big party at a nightclub.

Speaker 1 (29:39):
And this is another upper middle class like formative story.
So it's not a money problem, it's just they don't
want her to be at a nightclub.

Speaker 3 (29:49):
Right, And then her dad tells her that he's been
offered a job in New Zealand and that he's going
there for a few months, and she's like, oh fine,
My dad is so embarrassing. And so then Georgia comes
up with a plan to pretend that her cat Angus

(30:10):
has gone missing so that she can enlist Robbie's help
in finding Angus, because Robbie also loves cats, and she
sees this as a way to get closer to him,
and it kind of works because they're vibing while they're
looking for Angus and Robbie does eventually rescue him, but
then he like leaves to go hang out with his
girlfriend Lindsey. But the plan does help Jazz, Georgia's best friend,

(30:35):
because Robbie's brother Tom asks Jazz out and she's thrilled
about it. Then Georgie's dad leaves for New Zealand, and
then her mom starts having a man named Jem come
over to redo the kitchen.

Speaker 1 (30:50):
This storyline that yeah, I can't which is Steve Jones.

Speaker 5 (30:54):
I don't know who that is, Okay, real quick, Steve Jones, yeah,
British TV presenter, Okay, he's well, she's very, very hot
and very attracted.

Speaker 4 (31:04):
But he's dated so many he for a while was
like he was a slack. I'm gonna I'm calling him.
I'm calling it now, but dated so many Hollywood women
because he'd interview them when they'd come to the UK,
and they were like, this guy is really hot with
a fun accent. So he's had like a thing with
Pamela Anderson. Oh yeah, and Angelina Jolie asked for his

(31:27):
number and hey didn't.

Speaker 5 (31:30):
I can't Yeah that one and they had Yeah, they
were like seen together on a yacht.

Speaker 3 (31:37):
And can Okay, Well, good for him, and he is
handsome and muscular, and George worried that her mom is
having sex with Jem.

Speaker 5 (31:48):
Correctly worried because he's like a flag and.

Speaker 1 (31:51):
He's sure, you know how your interior decorator is topless,
just like that's the boying I'm talking about. Does the
adults do not behave rationally? Yeah?

Speaker 3 (32:05):
So Robbie's girlfriend Lindsay seems to know that Georgia likes Robbie,
so she tells Georgia to stay away from her man,
and then she pushes her down in gym class while
they're playing field hockey, which is very similar to a
scene from a movie we covered recently, Ginger Snaps, where
the popular mean girl pushes over the protagonist, but this

(32:26):
time it's into a dog carcass, so it's a little
different in Ginger Snaps, but similar vibes. And so then
Georgia and her friends go to a classmate's birthday party.
Georgia is hoping that Robbie will be there, but she
doesn't see him. But who is there is kissing instructor

(32:48):
boy Peter, and he, like surprise, kisses slash lunges at Georgia,
making her fall into the bushes and causing her dress
to fly up. And just then Robbie shows up with
Lindsay and Tom and Jazz, and everyone sees George's underwear.

Speaker 1 (33:05):
And it's two thousand and eight, so no one is like, hey,
that's an assault we just saw. They're just like, oh
my god, Georgia, you're so embarrassing, which, unfortunately, I think
is probably how that would have went down at that
time for.

Speaker 3 (33:18):
Sure, And of course Georgia is humiliated. And then I
don't know if it's like the next day or a
few days later, but Georgia goes to the pool with
her sister, knowing that Robbie will be there, and she
tells him like, don't worry, I'm not dating that Peter boy.
And he's like, oh, really, well in that case, and

(33:41):
he kisses her. Yeah, but then he runs off because
he's like, I have to sort some things out, but
he says he'll call her. Several days past, he hasn't called. Meanwhile, though,
Peter asks out Georgia and she lies and says she
can't go out with him because she's alone lesbian, and

(34:02):
he's like, oh no. Other things are falling apart as well.
Lindsay moves her birthday party to the same day as
Georgia's party. George's dad wants to take the job in
New Zealand permanently, so she's afraid she's gonna have to
move there, and she's still sad that Robbie hasn't called.

(34:24):
Then Georgia's mom gives her a copy of the book
Men Are from Mars, Women Are from Venus, in.

Speaker 1 (34:31):
Which which is another what a two thousand's move.

Speaker 3 (34:36):
So in the book, Georgia learns the trick of basically
playing hard to get, so she gets the idea to
go to Robbie's band's gig with a friend.

Speaker 1 (34:47):
Of his, This boy Dave the Laugh What a brittal nickname.
They're just like they might as well just be like Dave,
who no one wants to have sex with? Like that
is what that is how the movie approaches You're funny,
no one wants you. Yeah, and let's compare our lived experiences.

Speaker 3 (35:11):
And also at this gig, the band play the Stiff
Dylan's plays a cover of a song that I know
exclusively from the soundtrack of Say It with Me Now
Shrek Too. Really, yeah, it's the ever fallen in love
parentheses with someone you shouldn't have by buzz Coos is.

Speaker 1 (35:30):
The name of the love I love Buzzcocks. I didn't
know that was Wow, it's in Shrek Too. I'm a
fake fan. Yeah, I'm a fake fan. I should have
known that. I was like, wait a minute, why do
I recognize this song? And I was like, and then
you're like with regrets Shrek too?

Speaker 5 (35:47):
Yep. Okay.

Speaker 3 (35:49):
So this plan of Georgia's to like make Robbie jealous
backfires because Dave, who seems to really like Georgia, finds
out from Jazz the Georgia just used Dave to make
Robbie jealous. So Georgia gets mad at Jazz for like blabbing,
and they get in a huge fight and they like

(36:10):
say they're never going to talk to each other again.
Plus Robbie is pissed at Georgia for hurting his friend
Dave's feelings. And then also Georgia had like very classiestly
told Jazz that Tom isn't good enough for her because
he's like a grosser, and so Robbie realizes how immature
and shallow Georgia is. Meanwhile, it really seems like her

(36:34):
mom is having sex with Jem and she's gonna leave her.

Speaker 1 (36:38):
Dad for Also, just the signifier in the two thousands
of like wearing a thong being like something bad it's
gonna happen to this, something bad's about to happen. Did
you I did either of you watch Degrassy No, there's
such an iconic scene where it's like the character who

(37:00):
I think. It's like she's coming in for her sophomore
year of high school a Manny Santo's everyone's screaming on
the other end of the podcast, but she comes back
after a summer and in the way that sometimes teenagers do,
and she's wearing a thong and everyone's like, oh, you've changed.
You're hot now, Like it was just like the two thousands.

(37:22):
That's how you told people I'm hot.

Speaker 5 (37:24):
Now, that's how you inlerted people. You were hot and
down exactly exactly.

Speaker 3 (37:31):
The whale tail was what was like, yeast infections, be damned,
I'm hot to know I'm hot and at.

Speaker 1 (37:40):
Risk for.

Speaker 4 (37:42):
I do remember being a teenager and wanting the thong look,
but not being able to wear one for uncomfortable reasons.

Speaker 1 (37:48):
Yeah, they're so uncomfortable. Yeah, I think I like sneakily
bought one in high school because my cousin worked at
Victoria's Secret. And then I got it and then I
put it on.

Speaker 5 (37:56):
I was like, what the yeah, what the hell is this?

Speaker 1 (37:59):
Never mind, sorry, this was a mistake.

Speaker 5 (38:03):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (38:04):
The only time I've worn a thong is I dressed
up one year speaking of the Full Monty as like
their strip costume and they wear these like little red
thongs that they like expose at the end, and so
I did that for a Halloween costume. No, I had
the full like they're dressed is like security guards that
they like then remove them. But so I was wearing

(38:24):
that most of the time, but sometimes I would like
show my butt and I'd be like look and people
will be like, oh, scandalous, she's down, she's she's so cool,
she's hot.

Speaker 1 (38:36):
Now I was like nineteen at the time. Yeah, this
was in college.

Speaker 5 (38:48):
Cool, that is cool. It was so cool.

Speaker 1 (38:51):
Thank you. It's however new you were hot now exactly.

Speaker 3 (38:56):
Okay, So yeah, the whole thing with Georgie's mom maybe
having an affair with Jem. So then this makes Georgia
go to her dad's company to try to speak with
his boss to convince him to like have her dad
come back to the UK, but the boss isn't there,
so she's just like crying to a receptionist. And then

(39:16):
she goes home having decided that the whole family should
move to New Zealand, and her mom's like what, oh
my gosh. And then she like starts doing yoga and
like other forms of self care and spiritual cleansing. She's
growing up, this Georgia. And then she approaches Robbie to
apologize for her behavior and he's like, yeah, you were

(39:41):
a bitch, but I can't stop thinking about you. And
also I broke up with Lindsay.

Speaker 1 (39:46):
Last night, and she's like, well, the teen drama, so drama.

Speaker 3 (39:51):
And then she tells him she's moving to New Zealand
and he's like, damn, well, let's hold hands. So they
do that, and then we cut to the next morning.
It's her birthday and her mom tells her she's taking
her out dancing at a nightclub that night, which I
don't think any teenager would want, but she's.

Speaker 1 (40:15):
Like really into it.

Speaker 3 (40:18):
But it turns out to be this huge surprise party
that Jazz helped organize, which means that Georgia and Jazz
are best friends again. And surprise, also, George's dad is there,
and it turns out he's not going to stay in
New Zealand after all, he's been offered an even better
job right there at home. And then another huge twist,

(40:39):
her mom has not been having sex with Jem because he's.

Speaker 1 (40:43):
Gay and his boyfriend owns the club.

Speaker 3 (40:51):
And guess who else is there? Robbie playing with the
stiff Dylan's.

Speaker 1 (40:56):
Wow, I can't believe this stiff Dylan's probably made money
off of her party. Oh yeah, unless they played for free.
Hard to say.

Speaker 3 (41:06):
Then Lindsay crashes the party and she comes on stage
and she insults Georgia, and she tries to get back
together with Robbie, but he's like, no, I like Georgia.
She's goofy and I like that actually, And then they
kiss on the lips in front of everyone. What and
they're all cheering. And now Georgia's life is perfect because

(41:26):
she's got a cute boyfriend and great friends. Her parents
are horny for each other again, and she's more confident
and mature, and most importantly, her cat angus is awesome.

Speaker 1 (41:40):
The end, the end. What a journey.

Speaker 3 (41:46):
So let's take another quick break and we'll come back
to discuss, and we're back.

Speaker 1 (42:03):
Where to begin with this movie? I wanted to start
with something I did not previously know about this movie
that I found surprising, which is that this movie was
co written and directed by Grinder Chada, who also wrote
and directed Bend It, like Beckham and Brydon, Prejudice and

(42:23):
all of these kind of iconic millennial movies. I did
not know that she was the director behind this movie,
and I wouldn't have guessed it. I guess well, because
I feel like Bend It like Beckham, I mean, and
I have a quote from her that sort of contextualizes
this a little bit. But I feel like her style
of writing is not this right, and so I have

(42:47):
a quote from her here. There is like a whole
oral history done in the Independent about this movie last
year with the star Georgia Groome, who is also fun fact,
I think married to Rupert Grint. I know, I don't
think she performs very much anymore, but yeah, that's.

Speaker 5 (43:07):
Ruper Grint's probably got so much money.

Speaker 1 (43:09):
I mean that Harry Potter. Yeah, I was married to
Ruper Grint. I may retire also, no, but but yeah,
because like Angus songs and full frontals snot smogging snogging,
we're in la here. It's Smoggings has like such a
specific cadence and like authorial voice. But I feel like

(43:31):
so do her movies. But it's like clear that the
book got preference here. So I have a quote from her,
hear saying I'd already made it, bend it like Beckham,
which in a way was my teen movie. It captured
that sense of girls who were smart and real as
opposed to high school the not mean girls as it
were just authentic girls with a dream that really had
a big impact. But Angus was different. It was Louise's
version of Teenagers, which was great. When I read it,

(43:53):
I thought, yeah, I know how to do this, and
I can do it well. So she's also acknowledging. She's like,
this is not really this kind of movie I would
normally yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3 (44:02):
So she also co wrote the screenplay along with three
other credited writers, and I have a quote about yes, yes,
where she says quote when the project came to me,
the studio Paramount had it for five years, and even
though they're British books, they had these two American guys
adapt the book and they couldn't get it to work.

(44:23):
I read the script and thought, how weird. This is
sort of La Male's version of an English girl's childhood God,
and then I read the books and I thought, there's
something here that relates to me growing up that I
hadn't seen in the script. I thought this could be
a British genre film, or be like Clueless or Mean
Girls in England, and I liked the idea of doing

(44:45):
a British version of those films. Then it clicked that
it should be like sixteen Candles unquote. So she had
to like kind of clean up the mess that these
like two American men.

Speaker 1 (44:57):
Of course they would hire two American men about a
British teenage girl.

Speaker 5 (45:02):
That would have been a worrying film.

Speaker 1 (45:04):
I think, yeah, I'm very glad that she got a
hand in it. I wish she'd maybe gotten more of
a hand in it, but I did. Like, I mean,
starting with the positive stuff. I like, reading through this
oral history was really nice. It seemed like, you know,
everyone had a good experience. And also working with a
woman director seemed to be really impactful on the young

(45:24):
women in the cast. I've got a quote from Georgia
Groom here, watching Grinder lead as a woman was quite
a pivotal moment for all of us as young teenagers
to see that strength and tenacity that she had to
be able to lead that charge. It's not an easy job,
and she just did it so well and was so
much fun inside of her. It was a real girl
power thing. Also, she had just had twins when she

(45:45):
directed this movie, so there's all of these really like
cool pictures of Grinder Tata and her twins on set.
And also it seems like she prioritized like teaching the
child actors how the cameras worked, and like was really
like hands on with like kind of giving them an
education if they ever wanted to. I don't know. I
was like, yeah, that's it just seems like she's I'm

(46:06):
sure we talked about this on the Benditt like back
of my episode two, but she just seems like a
terrific person who's like really sweet and supportive of her cast,
and you know she she also has a couple quotes
and hear about how you know, infrequent girls are centered
in stories and how she felt like in wait, I
do want to get this quoted of how the release

(46:29):
in America. I also didn't remember this was kind of botched,
like it was never released theatrically and it was only
aired on Nickelodeon because they're like the parents go boing.
I'm not gonna stop saying it, but yeah, Grindotada says
in America, Nickelodeon didn't know what to do with the film.
They didn't think it would be a big hit, so

(46:50):
they never released it theatrically and aired it on a
big day on Nickelodeon and ratings went through the roof.
An executive did say to me after that they'd made
a huge mistake and they should have put it out
theatrically because the amount of times girls have watched that
film over and over again. So it's just like, I
feel like yet another example of people underestimating Do.

Speaker 4 (47:08):
They just think that women don't do anything like that?
We just are in the house, like not doing it,
like absorbing any culture.

Speaker 1 (47:16):
It's so I feel like we learned that time and
time again with any like non white male audience, where
I mean, like, I think we talked about it on
our first Wives Club episode where they're like, no one
wants to see women over forty and then that movie
made up aajillion dollars and like how difficult it was
to get Black Panther made, And then that movie made
an actual billion dollars And I was just like, it's.

Speaker 5 (47:37):
Like they keep doing the conversation again with Bobby. They
were like, who knew that were women out here?

Speaker 1 (47:43):
And where's another billion? And women watch things? Oh my god?

Speaker 5 (47:48):
What they What do they think we're up to? Or
do they just not know that we're here?

Speaker 1 (47:53):
They kind of just freak you out of sight, out
of mind because we won't hang out with them.

Speaker 5 (47:59):
But I've never seen any around but both my mom.

Speaker 1 (48:05):
But those are those are some of the positive things
I have to say about the movie. It seems like
it was a really good on set experience, and I
like the director's body of work, but this may be
one maybe not as much.

Speaker 3 (48:15):
Right, So I want to touch on the book because
I did spend all that time.

Speaker 1 (48:20):
Reading it, all those you know, all those late nights,
all those.

Speaker 3 (48:25):
Five hours listening to the audio book on one point
nine speed. So this movie is based on the first
two books in the series. I didn't read this second book, which.

Speaker 1 (48:37):
Has it now I'm the girlfriend of a sex God.

Speaker 3 (48:41):
Yeah, on the bright side, I'm now the girlfriend of
a sex god. That's the American title. Oh no, it's okay,
big yeahs.

Speaker 1 (48:49):
Yes, that's so. I feel like the American title is
like Saucier in that case.

Speaker 5 (48:54):
Yeah yeah, just because you didn't know what Nick is,
well probably.

Speaker 1 (48:57):
Okay, yeah, Fortunately that we already had so much confusion.

Speaker 5 (49:01):
We know what nogging, so we didn't want to confuse
anyone again.

Speaker 1 (49:06):
I still don't.

Speaker 3 (49:07):
So in the movie they call each other mingers a lot.
What is that.

Speaker 4 (49:13):
You've never come across mingus? Oh, it's just like an
ugly person like they're minging.

Speaker 1 (49:17):
I would not they're like ugly.

Speaker 4 (49:21):
Yes, I guess, I guess it's like an abject an adjective.

Speaker 5 (49:26):
But they are minging.

Speaker 1 (49:27):
Yeah, yeah, they are minging.

Speaker 5 (49:31):
And the minging was like very much thing. I remember saying.

Speaker 1 (49:35):
Okay, so is is minge something also?

Speaker 4 (49:38):
And what inge is just the giant minge is separate
from ming I think. I hope so, I hope they
don't have the same etymology.

Speaker 3 (49:46):
They might do, I don't They're spelled quite similarly. Okay,
just ye clearing mingus minging. You wouldn't say ming okay, okay,
you wouldn't have that, but you would say minge. But
you wouldn't say, oh she minging she's having extra vagina, but.

Speaker 1 (50:05):
You can't be vagina.

Speaker 5 (50:07):
No, okay, just minge okay, okay.

Speaker 4 (50:09):
But I would say minge, but I would say that
to like my best friend now because it's funny.

Speaker 5 (50:15):
Or I would say clunge because plunges. I did I
know about clumb Yeah, because I alway, I think they're
quite funny words.

Speaker 1 (50:22):
They are really yeah wow.

Speaker 3 (50:24):
Oh wait, I did know about minge because shout out
to my former roommate, British Martinage. She taught me about minge.
And then I was like, oh, so do you call
pubic hair minge fringe?

Speaker 5 (50:38):
Oh we should call it that, but we don't. But
you can make that, but I will.

Speaker 1 (50:42):
Okay, Yeah, I'm gonna make mine fringe happen. Yeah's watch
out world. Okay.

Speaker 3 (50:48):
So the book is what I'm trying to talk about.
So written by Louise Renaissan, who I think wrote, who
wrote all ten r I p oh, I didn't really
had a passage.

Speaker 1 (51:00):
She passed in her mid sixties, which is crazy. Yeah,
so really sad.

Speaker 3 (51:05):
So the book was the first book was published in
ninety nine. The sequel, which I didn't read but the
movie is partially based on, published a year later in
two thousand. The format of the books is like Georgia's diary, right,
So you know, middle school aged teens in the late
nineties early two thousands, you know, not known for being

(51:28):
the most progressive people. So there's a lot of problematic
stuff in the book. A lot of it translates to
the movie, but there's even more in the book where
there's a lot, as we mentioned of like homophobia and
specific like anti lesbian rhetoric. There's like a phizzed teacher

(51:48):
that makes an appearance in the movie, but in the
book she's always talking about like, ooh, she was staring
at me again because she's a lesbian, and Georgia's like
praying to God that she's not a lesbian.

Speaker 1 (52:02):
Things like that, such like casual homophobia that is like
it it really sucks because it's like, I feel like
books like that at the time would have like reinforced
the culture that already existed, which was so so so
hostile that it's like a reflection of what was already acceptable,
but then putting it in the mouth of like Georgia,

(52:23):
who's supposed to be like the coolest girl ever to
readers at least, like the self insert it's like it's yeah,
very tender age to be getting that kind of messaging.
Not good.

Speaker 3 (52:34):
So there's not only that, there's casual transphobia. Where in
the book, Georgia finds a garment of her dad's that
she thinks as an apron I think it's implied that
it's like some like sexual outfit or something.

Speaker 1 (52:48):
But okay, because her parents are really horny for each other.
Yeah Christ for them, I guess.

Speaker 3 (52:54):
But she finds this garment that she thinks is like
a feminine garment, and so she now asson that her
dad is transitioning and it's like very disgusting to her.

Speaker 5 (53:04):
Yeah, she keeps, I've forgotten about that.

Speaker 1 (53:07):
Yeah, yeah, I honestly really just remember nervy. B that's
like really all that stuck.

Speaker 3 (53:13):
The only thing I remember from the book from reading
it all those years ago was her being self conscious
of her nose. That was the main thing I remembered.

Speaker 1 (53:21):
That's interesting, Cash, I'm glad I don't remember the transphobia storyline, Like.

Speaker 5 (53:26):
What the fun It's good, it's important your brain blocks
out things. Yes, yeah, this isn't good, like this is.

Speaker 3 (53:32):
Trash self preservation.

Speaker 5 (53:34):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (53:34):
There's also it's not prominent in the book, but it
is there. There's racism, where there's at least one example
of Georgia making a comment that h anti Asian racism.
There's a fair amount of fat phobia and body shaming,
which does translate to the movie. Georgia makes remarks that

(53:55):
are ablests that are disparaging about sex workers. She's very
callous about suicide. So there's like all these very problematic
things in the books.

Speaker 1 (54:05):
Some of which monsters rible.

Speaker 5 (54:07):
She does not deserve Robby.

Speaker 1 (54:11):
A lot of it does.

Speaker 3 (54:11):
Carry over to the movie, namely the homophobia and the
fat phobia.

Speaker 1 (54:18):
It's interesting because it's like the there are certain things
that are presented in a way that is like, at
least I think at the time would have been clear
to me, like Georgia's insecure and sensitive about her nose.
That's not presented as like and she should be. But
all of the homophobia is presented very like matter of
factly is never challenged in any.

Speaker 5 (54:39):
Way, and all the slat shaming. But the thing is
that was like having been a British teenage girl, that
is what the culture was. It was a real like,
oh god, we grew up in not good.

Speaker 1 (54:53):
Times, yeah, but like the worst West time.

Speaker 5 (54:57):
Yet this is the worst of time.

Speaker 1 (54:58):
So I don't know how they managed it keeps getting worse, yeah, because.

Speaker 5 (55:03):
They look back nostalgically, but then weirdly and then you
want it and you're like, oh wait, this is the
West of times?

Speaker 1 (55:09):
Have we ever had it good?

Speaker 5 (55:11):
When was the good of.

Speaker 1 (55:14):
In Charles Dickens's Tale of Two Cities, it was the
best of times, But then really quickly she really cooked
with that.

Speaker 3 (55:26):
And there is racism in the movie in the sense
of how the Ellen character.

Speaker 4 (55:31):
Yeah, it's like watching that, I was like, what did
they just bring on this South Asian character to bully
to bully her?

Speaker 1 (55:37):
Which is like wild to me because Grindotata is she's
I think Kenyan born British of Indian descent, but like
more to the point the writer director of Bend it
like Beckham.

Speaker 5 (55:50):
That was where I was really like, yeah, it was
very jarring.

Speaker 1 (55:53):
Yeah, I have to I mean, based on what Caitlin
you found about, like her having to clean this grip,
I'm wondering like how much she was able to ultimately
have influence over because that was just like really jarring
from someone who has like made such thoughtful inclusive movies
in the past.

Speaker 5 (56:12):
What happened there?

Speaker 4 (56:13):
If I speculate on how I feel like the UK
is is that it was going to be four white girls,
and then she would have pushed to be like can we.

Speaker 5 (56:21):
Have one for some representation? Yeah, the one that gets buddied.

Speaker 1 (56:26):
Do you know like that?

Speaker 5 (56:26):
I think how it would have gone down. It's like, yeah,
but she can't be cool.

Speaker 1 (56:30):
We can't like her. Yeah, I have honestly believed that
in the two thousands movie environment, Yeah, like yeah, poor Ellen,
like I just and she disappeared for like such large
swaths of the movies. She felt like very disconnected from
the rest of the friend group because it's like Georgia
and Jazz are the you know, core friends, and then

(56:51):
there's two other friends. But there's there's times where what's
the other is Ellen? Ellen? Ellen is the one we're
talking about, but who's the who's the fourth Rosie Rosie?
So it's like you'll see scenes where like Rosie and
Jazz are walking together and they're like we're mad at Georgia,
and I'm like, Okay, where's Ellen. Like there, She's just
like disappeared from the movie for just whole chunks. It's

(57:14):
really bizarre.

Speaker 3 (57:15):
Yeah, And like anytime she like tries to make a
suggestion or like give advice or say like what about me?
Do I get a boy to have a crush on?

Speaker 1 (57:24):
And they're always just.

Speaker 5 (57:25):
Like Eude, shut up, shut up. Ellen.

Speaker 3 (57:30):
We treat her like Jerry on Parks and Reck like
it's brutal, which is a dynamic that is reflective of
real life when there's a close friend group who is
predominantly white, but there's like maybe one person of colar
so I.

Speaker 5 (57:43):
Was in there, but I don't think I was an Alan.
I would like to put it. I was cool, I
was saying there's no problems, but I'm like, I'm not Alan, right.

Speaker 1 (57:51):
So it's not as though growing Ellen under the busy.

Speaker 3 (57:56):
Why So it's not as though this doesn't happen. It's
just that the movie doesn't like interrogate this at all.

Speaker 4 (58:02):
Also, they left her at Peter's house, so when Geordia
goes in, oh yeah, then Ellen's.

Speaker 5 (58:07):
Queuing up to go in as well, like all right,
we're all going to Peter now, right, and then they
all leave her like the other two. Like everyone's waited
for Georgia to come.

Speaker 1 (58:17):
Yeah, they do not wait for Ellen. But I also
was wondering, I mean, because the interests of these characters
is very limited, but that Ellen seems to be obviously
like really interested in boys and wants to kiss and whatever.
She seems to have booked a session with Peter or whatever.
She's looking at the Hugh Grant poster. You know, she's

(58:39):
locked in, but that like doesn't really go anywhere. Like
I feel like that is more presented as a joke
of like, and even Ellen's doing it because that doesn't
really come back around in any meaningful way. I was
sort of wondering, I'm like, I wonder if Ellen will
head it off with Peter, but they just sort of
toss her a Dave the laugh towards the end. That's right?

Speaker 3 (58:59):
Is that?

Speaker 1 (58:59):
Who she?

Speaker 3 (59:00):
So?

Speaker 5 (59:00):
What's the end?

Speaker 3 (59:00):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (59:01):
At the at the party.

Speaker 4 (59:02):
Yeah, that's a weird moment as well. You know, any
powerful your friends with other men.

Speaker 1 (59:07):
I feel like that happens at the end of this
type of movie so often, where they're like, which characters
are still single?

Speaker 4 (59:14):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (59:14):
There they go there, Yeah that.

Speaker 5 (59:19):
In the movie. That'd be great.

Speaker 1 (59:20):
We can have a single fourteen year old at this party, like.

Speaker 5 (59:24):
What an embarrassing body? Single and fourteen. Uh.

Speaker 3 (59:28):
There's also a scene where Ellen and Georgia are getting
ready for the party they go to, and Ellen expresses
insecurities about her dark body hair and she's like, oh,
I have a mustache. I'm worried I have sideburns. And
she says this to Georgia and she's like, you're lucky
you don't have dark hair like me. And Georgia's just like,

(59:50):
I know, first of all, Georgia is white, but she
does have dark hair and like speaking as a white
person with dark hair, like it is visible in my body.
My body here, it's visible unless I remove it. So
for Georgia to just be like, yeah, sucks for you.

Speaker 4 (01:00:06):
Also, we saw Georgia shave off one of her eyebrows
basically to deal with a monobrows situation.

Speaker 5 (01:00:11):
So I don't know why she's out here talking like
she doesn't have a propes.

Speaker 1 (01:00:14):
It was just like an opportunity to have these two
characters connect over something that would have made sense, and
it's like yet another be like yeah, Ellen, you suck.
You're like, come on, come on, and we never I mean,
I don't think we meet any of the girl's families.
But again, it's just I feel like we just have
the least insight into Ellen, and she's like, I feel

(01:00:35):
like it's worse than tokenized because they just are dumping
just mean yeah right.

Speaker 3 (01:00:41):
I was feeling like Rosy gets even slightly less characterization
than Ellen, but at least she's not like bullied by
her friends. And she she has like a Swedish friend, yeah,
I assume, because he's yeah, yeah yeah. In the book,
she talks about her very tall and yeah, I think
Swedish boyfriend.

Speaker 5 (01:01:00):
Wow, but well here's this before it breaks it, so obviously.

Speaker 1 (01:01:04):
They could have seen each other. Yeah, Like I always,
I don't know. Anytime I think about your I'm like, whoa.
So if you're in the UK and then you're dating
someone in Sweden, that would be like what if we
were dating someone from Chicago? Like distance wise, it's so
boring when we do it.

Speaker 4 (01:01:21):
I don't know, I think unless because how long is
the flight to Chicago? Like three right, so like a
flight to Sweden, it's not going to be more than two,
So maybe Denver.

Speaker 1 (01:01:33):
I think.

Speaker 3 (01:01:35):
The book makes it seem like Spinn is there as
like an exchange student, so I don't think it's like
long distance. But speaking of the book, I don't even
remember the Ellen character from the book.

Speaker 1 (01:01:46):
At all, so I don't she is in the book.

Speaker 3 (01:01:48):
She is, okay, at least if she is, she's mentioned,
but not necessarily as like someone who is like hanging out.

Speaker 4 (01:01:54):
With later books, she's in the books, oh sure, she's
No one's given like any race that's not white.

Speaker 5 (01:02:02):
I just assume everyone's white in the books.

Speaker 4 (01:02:04):
But the Ellen character and Georgia are definitely like in
the same friend group but have a rivalry. Oh so
down the line there's some issue. Maybe Ellen dates Tom's
m okay, I don't know. Maybe Dave, the last Dave.

Speaker 1 (01:02:19):
Oh well, that's where she ends up with. At the
end of the movie.

Speaker 5 (01:02:23):
Something happens with the kind of friends but not friends.
In the books later I can remember.

Speaker 3 (01:02:28):
At least again, I only reread the first one. I'm
sure Ellen is there, but she's so little of a
presence that you wouldn't necessarily like remember her. A huge
focus on the friendship with Jazz in the like enemy
ship with Lindsey, and then there's all the there's other
girls that don't make it to the movie that like

(01:02:49):
are like kind of the girls who are like, come on,
let's do this thing that is scandalous and that will
get us into trouble. And so there's like things like
that that are kind of memorable. But as far as
like Ellen's presence, if she is there at all in
the first book, it's like not very noticeable, which means
that the writing like beefed up her character for.

Speaker 1 (01:03:12):
The movie, but for people to be horrible.

Speaker 5 (01:03:14):
Yeah, So it's just.

Speaker 1 (01:03:18):
Upsetting, a huge, huge, huge bummer. I want to blame
the three American eyes.

Speaker 5 (01:03:24):
But let's do that. Let's do it. That's okay, sometimes
you can.

Speaker 1 (01:03:29):
But yeah, it was a real bummer and really stuck out.
And also that I think it's Ellen's character who like
says the first homophobic comment too of the movie, who
is like, we can't grab our own boobs. That would
make that.

Speaker 5 (01:03:42):
Makes us Yeah, and that's that's sitting on their hands.
Just tried.

Speaker 2 (01:03:50):
I know.

Speaker 5 (01:03:51):
I was like, does it feel good?

Speaker 1 (01:03:53):
I'm not gonna lie. I did it as I was
watching the movie.

Speaker 5 (01:03:57):
You tried it? Yeah, Like.

Speaker 1 (01:04:01):
It did feel like I was just grabbing my own
boob and then my hands really hurt.

Speaker 5 (01:04:06):
But then I had and needles.

Speaker 1 (01:04:07):
It was really sad. It was hard for me. But
I'm a grown up, so I can just have someone
grab my boobs. These losers, yeah, grabbing their own boobs. Yeah,
what do we think about? Okay, Georgia I had such
a hard time with because like, I feel like the
whole internal logic of the movie is like and also

(01:04:28):
she's like a kid, but still still she's like, boys
don't like me because I'm funny, and I'm like, I
would not say that that's not and that's why boys
don't like you, which I guess does go into like
she's immature, which Robbie does call out, and that she
has to I guess grow up a little bit.

Speaker 4 (01:04:49):
Well, what is this storyline that's like men are so
much more mature right where he is older, he's seventeen
and she he's fourteen.

Speaker 3 (01:05:01):
Yeah, so this is more clear in the book where
he says.

Speaker 5 (01:05:05):
To her, Yeah, but it was a stop dating fourteen
year olds to seventeen year old maybe. Also, if you
are worried that they're so immature, that feels like a really.

Speaker 1 (01:05:12):
Easy fix on your data. Fourteen year old, easily done.

Speaker 4 (01:05:16):
Yes, And I do remember the article being like it
was very hard to cast a seventeen year old that
we could get to snog a fourteen year old that
wouldn't feel weird and it turns out yeah, yeah, I
do remember that from the article. Wow, it was like
we had trouble casting and it turned out it was
Aaron Johnson who's now married to Sam Taylor Wood.

Speaker 5 (01:05:40):
Yes, so he has no trouble snogging anyone of multiple
ag He doesn't mind an age gap, he doesn' mind
age up in either direction. He's good to snug anyone that.

Speaker 1 (01:05:49):
Is such a weird thing to put in an article. Yeah,
and also just I uh wow, yeah, And I think
that's a good point, is that like the boys are
more mature. It doesn't doesn't really track.

Speaker 5 (01:06:04):
Doesn't track.

Speaker 1 (01:06:04):
Yeah, but they're older, I guess, which is still.

Speaker 5 (01:06:08):
Also the whole point is that they're not. That's why
seventeen year olds maybe date fourteen year olds, right, I
just I.

Speaker 1 (01:06:15):
Feel like when I was fourteen, I was more mature
than most seventeen year old place. Sure, yeah, like yeah, anyways,
but I'll suspend my disbelief. I like, like, I like Georgia.
I think it's like the attachment to the books as
a kid, where you like you're rooting for her. I
feel like it was cathartic to be like, yeah, my
parents are really annoying too, but if they ever got divorced,

(01:06:37):
I'd be so sad. Like I thought, like those beats
worked better for me in the movie where it's like
her balancing like that, very like tween ish age, Like
I hate my family, but if anything changes, I'll I'll die.
Like that stuff felt good. But I don't know, I

(01:06:57):
don't know what do we think of Georgia, Folks?

Speaker 3 (01:07:00):
The thing that I connected with I think the most
as a thirty eight year old person consuming this was that,
you know, she values humor and being a funny person. Yes,
and she learns that boys don't like girls for funniness,
and so part of the movie is her like trying

(01:07:21):
to like figure out what boys do like and like
catering to that while also trying to like figure out
who she is and wants to be like a unique
person who has a personality, but like feels like she
has to suppress her like silliness.

Speaker 4 (01:07:38):
All yeah, I like a commitment to the bit. I
like that she was like I'm going as a stuff,
don't it this party?

Speaker 1 (01:07:45):
And that that does I mean, I feel like that's
such a great like establishing scene too, where it's like
she's the only one who was confident enough to follow
through on the olive and the girls are.

Speaker 5 (01:07:54):
Like and it's a great idea for I think that
would be hilarious.

Speaker 1 (01:07:57):
It looks like so much work, like she was destroying
it and I was like, oh my god.

Speaker 5 (01:08:01):
Days days.

Speaker 3 (01:08:03):
I love that it's become a trope for usually a
character who's a woman to show up to a to
a party in a mood because it happens in Bridget
Jones diary, it happens in Girls, it happens in Legally Blonde,
where like the person in.

Speaker 1 (01:08:19):
Question forgot it happened in Legally Blonde, shows up.

Speaker 4 (01:08:21):
As like a bunny, like a the same I don't
know which one came first. This sends a woman in
a buddy outfit to somewhere where no one's stressed.

Speaker 5 (01:08:31):
She feels.

Speaker 2 (01:08:32):
Then.

Speaker 1 (01:08:32):
It reminds me of my favorite tweet ever, the Katie
Dippled tweet. Yes Baba do come first? She stresses the
Baba duck and everyone else is just wearing clothes. There
is an example, so it does happen in real life.
How did it happen? I don't know. I need to
find it. It's the funniest thing.

Speaker 5 (01:08:51):
Ever.

Speaker 3 (01:08:51):
While you're looking for that, I can think of one
example of a man, or like a male character showing
up to a party in a costume that's like very
inappropriate for the party he's at, which is zac Efron
in a movie that I don't remember what it's called,
but Michael B. Jordan is also in the movie. I
think anyway, He shows up to a costume with like

(01:09:13):
a prosthetic penis like hanging out of his pants. And
it's like because it was pitched to him as a
dress up party, so he thought that meant costume party.
But it meant like dress in an elegant dress outfit.

Speaker 4 (01:09:26):
Okay that no, if you say it's a dress up party,
that means costumes.

Speaker 1 (01:09:31):
Well, so he was correct. So Zach Cafron innocent.

Speaker 5 (01:09:36):
I mean the choice of costume questionable, right for sure? Yeah?
But what was he supposed to be?

Speaker 3 (01:09:41):
Just a man with his Yeah, just like he's gonna
he's like, I'm rocking out with my cock out or
something like that.

Speaker 5 (01:09:47):
Because that's a choice.

Speaker 4 (01:09:48):
I think if I went to a Halloween Putts, I'd question,
oh for sure if a man came in that outfit.

Speaker 1 (01:09:57):
Yeah, it was a bad costume.

Speaker 4 (01:09:59):
I don't know if I I want to chat even
my bunny outfit, which I will be wearing because I'm
a girl that I'm just stats.

Speaker 5 (01:10:08):
So I won't be stuffed.

Speaker 1 (01:10:09):
I have the tweet here. I also realized when I
looked it up, because it was Halloween last week, that
friend of the show Ben Rogers is sitting next to her.
I noticed that here it is. It'll still so funny.

Speaker 5 (01:10:26):
This is so good.

Speaker 1 (01:10:28):
You can see it really sinking it. It's sinking in
for her as the victures. We'll post it, We'll post
it on our Instagram. I'm so glad it's so good.
I love that you got to see it for the
first time. It's one of the greatest tweets of all time. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:10:43):
Yeah, anyway, So the point is that, you know, Georgia
is like, she doesn't want to suppress this funny, like
humorous aspect of herself, but she's learned, like many of
us have as comedians.

Speaker 1 (01:10:58):
We learned that like men.

Speaker 3 (01:10:59):
Tend not to val if they value a sense of
humor in a woman, what they mean is that they
want a woman to laugh at all their jokes, but
they don't want a woman who generates her own humor.

Speaker 1 (01:11:10):
Especially not funnier than they are, certainly not yead forbid,
which is hard because men aren't very funny.

Speaker 5 (01:11:18):
Express a lot of your funny.

Speaker 3 (01:11:21):
But it turns out that Robbie does like that about her.

Speaker 1 (01:11:24):
He does, like, you know, like other voice.

Speaker 3 (01:11:27):
But he does it in a condescending way where he's like,
you're mad, you're such a nutter, But I love it.

Speaker 4 (01:11:34):
Yes, he does call her that a lot. I don't
know how much I'd love that actually if someone was
like she just just nuts, but I love it.

Speaker 1 (01:11:41):
I think I feel like that's how a lot of
boomer husbands talk about their wives. They're like this broad
like they're just like Jesus.

Speaker 5 (01:11:51):
If I hadn't murder should be in the greasy Yeah
I really did.

Speaker 1 (01:11:55):
Like that's that is like a very boomer dad kind
of post where you're like, easy, say something nice, like
you've been married for forty fucking years, like something nice.
But yeah, I I uh, he does do that. He
also what is the name of the song song he
writes about her bitch in a Uniform? You're like, yeah,

(01:12:15):
I was like, do you like her?

Speaker 5 (01:12:17):
Do you like her?

Speaker 1 (01:12:18):
Well, this was after she was classist, so that's true,
Like not that excuse. That's that's the tricky thing with George.
I guess that was what I was trying to get
at earlier, where it's like I like her, and it's
hard to be too mad at her because she is
canonically fourteen years old, right, and it feels weird at
my large age to be like, I don't respect this

(01:12:41):
fictional teenage.

Speaker 5 (01:12:43):
Got her shit together.

Speaker 1 (01:12:46):
But but I do think, like, yeah, she's uh, she
does catch it sometimes, I think deservedly. Yeah, Like yeah,
but it seems like the movie does sort of address
that just not and I don't know. I feel like
it's because the goal, the endgame goal for all of
the young girls in the movie is to have a
cute boyfriend. That the only way that like growing up

(01:13:09):
is like addressed or the way that like, oh, she
like addressed this like internalized classism where she like had
to figure out like how to develop a better relationship
with her parents or like whatever. The sort of broad
lesson is she's like rewarded quote unquote with boyfriend at
the end, Yeah, which just feels a little I don't know.

Speaker 4 (01:13:28):
Of the time, I guess yeah, and it's not a
good reward, no, but but maybe is when actually is
when you're horny and your teenager.

Speaker 1 (01:13:37):
I'm sure at the time it is, but yeah, I
don't know. And then they're like, oh, wait, we forgot
about Ellen. She's dating Dave, like movie over.

Speaker 4 (01:13:47):
Yeah, Okay, Actually, maybe Ellen wins in the end because
she gets the funny guy, and.

Speaker 1 (01:13:55):
Dave did seem like a nice, nice young man and
he's I think like right to be hurt with how
Georgia treats him. Yeah, she uses him and he finds
out about it. Yeah. Yeah, it's like this is the
life of a lab.

Speaker 4 (01:14:08):
But that was a bit where I was like, I
don't know, I just feel like he'll know soon that
men will use women, so he'll be fine, He'll be fine.

Speaker 3 (01:14:18):
Yeah, well, especially the way he's like he talks about
what does he call He's like, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:14:25):
That's one of the names of the books.

Speaker 5 (01:14:27):
It's like, yeah, that was the one I got as
a present. Was knocked out by.

Speaker 1 (01:14:32):
I, Like you started there. I will say that I
was looking and I was like.

Speaker 5 (01:14:36):
This is fab because they say fabl.

Speaker 1 (01:14:39):
I was looking at the list of book titles and
Louise Renaissan really committed to having the most British titles possible.
Knocked out by my nonga nungers. We don't say that
dancing Oh really.

Speaker 5 (01:14:51):
Yeah, that's what Dave Cools breasts. Do you want to explain?

Speaker 3 (01:14:56):
Oh, because he's like yeah, when you grab them and
then let go, they go looks like the bound they.

Speaker 1 (01:15:05):
Kind of got boing. Okay, then he ate my boy
and trancers startled by his furry shorts. Lorve is a
many trousered thing. Are these my bazoomas I see before me? Yeah,
the title's gone.

Speaker 4 (01:15:21):
I stopped at some point because they because it was
the general vibers. He goes between rob in the books,
she goes between Robbie and.

Speaker 5 (01:15:27):
Dave the Laugh.

Speaker 4 (01:15:29):
Because David Laugh is her age and they do have
a lot, and George is funny, so they have a
laugh together.

Speaker 5 (01:15:33):
And then Robbie's kind of not that funny, but he's
very hot and in a band. That's the kind of.

Speaker 4 (01:15:38):
General viber But then they brought in a third love interest, Massimo,
who's Italian.

Speaker 1 (01:15:43):
Wait I remember him, Okay, so you remember.

Speaker 4 (01:15:46):
And he had a little purse that he carried around.
And I was like, I can't deal with a third
love interest. I think that's what I checked out.

Speaker 5 (01:15:54):
I was like, you, it's either going to be Robbie
or Dave, but I can't. You can't bring in a thing.

Speaker 1 (01:16:00):
I do feel like it is in a way like
having what's a feeling about Georgia, especially when I was
a kid, was like, it's very much like she is
like a funny, like normal looking quote unquote girl who
so many boys want to take her and you're like, oh,
of course I'm going to love that book. That's that
was my dream at the time. It's like, what if
nothing about me changed and every hot boy I knew

(01:16:23):
was like.

Speaker 5 (01:16:23):
I love you, like, but you did have to change.
You had to do yoga. Remember it's true, it's true.

Speaker 1 (01:16:30):
True. It's not that no, no, I had to get
on the mat. I wish that this.

Speaker 3 (01:16:39):
I mean, there is obviously a component of this movie
that focuses on like the female friendship, but it's all
in the context of like they're talking about boys, and
they're talking about how to be more attractive to boys, and.

Speaker 1 (01:16:53):
It's all like in service of the goal of getting
a boyfriend.

Speaker 5 (01:16:57):
Yeah, they are close friends, except yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:17:01):
But tragically.

Speaker 3 (01:17:03):
And then I think even the way the like parental
dynamic and like relationship between Georgia and her parents is
framed is like, Oh, my dad's so corny, but now
that he's gone, I really miss him and I don't
want to have I don't want my parents to split up. Meanwhile,
my slag of a mom is over here right having sex, Yeah,

(01:17:24):
I with someone else.

Speaker 1 (01:17:26):
Well, and also even like if Georgia was right, I
mean again and just like she's fourteen. I get it,
like you're fourteen. Probably a lot of fourteen year olds
don't want their parents to split up. I know my
I didn't want my parents to but then they did,
and I was like, oh, that was so the right call. Wow,
oh good god.

Speaker 5 (01:17:43):
You know you guys knew cool.

Speaker 1 (01:17:45):
You're like, oh, we should have done this years ago.
But I get that it's like scary for kids when
it happens. But yeah, it's like she's totally taking it
out on her mom. And also her mom seems happier,
Like her mom's going out, she has hobbies, she's with
your friends, things that I don't. It's not implied she
was really doing when her dad was around. I was like, Georgia,

(01:18:05):
I think your mom like might be happier without your dad.
You would have to accept that. She's like, I hate
how my mom is wearing clothes she likes and having fun.
I missed when my dad was here and she was miserable.

Speaker 5 (01:18:19):
But she wasn't miserable. She was really horny for her.
It seems like he's just really horny, basically horny for life.

Speaker 1 (01:18:28):
She's hardy for life. Yeah, I don't know, but I
just yeah, that was like a weird. There is sort
of like a paternalistic frame to how the parents are shown.

Speaker 5 (01:18:36):
But her dad also played by Alan Davies.

Speaker 1 (01:18:39):
Yeah, where do I know him from?

Speaker 5 (01:18:41):
Who is easing? Do you watch QI here?

Speaker 2 (01:18:44):
No? No?

Speaker 1 (01:18:45):
Sorry?

Speaker 5 (01:18:45):
Did you watch Oh my God Jonathan Creek?

Speaker 3 (01:18:50):
Is that?

Speaker 5 (01:18:50):
What's cooled?

Speaker 4 (01:18:51):
No?

Speaker 5 (01:18:52):
I never watched.

Speaker 4 (01:18:53):
Okay, he's just like a really classic British comedian actor.

Speaker 1 (01:18:58):
Okay, I recognize him from something, and.

Speaker 5 (01:18:59):
He in these murder mysteries. But he's just yeah, he's like,
he's like my dad, if you know what I mean.
You know these people that you grow up with, and
it's like, yeah, I feel like I know him. I've
never met him. I don't think i've met him.

Speaker 1 (01:19:12):
He's very charming, like yeah, yeah.

Speaker 5 (01:19:14):
He's got that kind of energy and everything.

Speaker 1 (01:19:16):
Yeah, yeah I did. I mean it's like her parents
do love each other. I don't know, I don't know.
It just feels the movie is weird.

Speaker 4 (01:19:25):
I mean, it's rare that you're allowed to break into
your dad's work office to be like, I need my
parents not to boss, so please send him home from
his job.

Speaker 5 (01:19:33):
I mean it's hard to do that.

Speaker 1 (01:19:35):
We can't accuse Georgia of not having narrative agency. She
literally said bring him home.

Speaker 5 (01:19:44):
And it worked and they were like, yes, we should
bring him home and give him a raise.

Speaker 1 (01:19:47):
Yeah, yeah, yes, yeah.

Speaker 5 (01:19:49):
I don't know.

Speaker 3 (01:19:50):
It's just the movie and the book feel very just
reflective of the times and not challenging any of the
like internalized misogyny and the like focused on like heteral
romance and.

Speaker 1 (01:20:04):
Stuff like that, right, which a book of this time,
I feel like it's like, if it was part of
the filmmaker or writer's intent to present that and then
challenge it, that could be really useful for young girls,
but that's obviously like this is more of just like
a reflecting the prejudices of the time persons saying anything
about it.

Speaker 4 (01:20:23):
It's I think that the success I guess of like
something like Mean Girls, which is like the comparison, right
of like fourteen fifteen year old girls.

Speaker 5 (01:20:31):
Trying to get a boyfriend, and then there's one like
weird one, but.

Speaker 4 (01:20:35):
Like, because they're supposed to all suck, it doesn't matter
what they say because you know they're bad characters.

Speaker 5 (01:20:42):
But then the problem is we're trying to like Georgia, right,
She's yeah, It's like.

Speaker 1 (01:20:47):
The Nickelodeon movie style is not built for the kind
of character that that Georgia is. I don't know. Yeah,
I had a hard time when this look. Yeah, it's
a it's a tricky one.

Speaker 4 (01:20:59):
Yeah, it was just it's just had to deal with.
Like she gets pushed into a bush by this man.
I mean, missy, she's paid this man to go around
his house to snog him.

Speaker 1 (01:21:09):
And then he's, well, that was consensual.

Speaker 5 (01:21:12):
That was consensual, and that's fine. That's a kind of
sex work.

Speaker 1 (01:21:17):
I was wondering if she does pay him. We don't
see money exchanged on the screen.

Speaker 5 (01:21:21):
Maybe maybe it's a voluntary service.

Speaker 1 (01:21:23):
Maybe he just doesn't because he wants to snog or
he's fourteen years old. I think probably best not to
overthink kiss it's a consensual encounter.

Speaker 5 (01:21:34):
But maybe he just offers it voluntarily.

Speaker 1 (01:21:36):
I don't know for.

Speaker 3 (01:21:38):
Sure either way. Yeah, like that that is you know,
two consenting parties. It's not snogging. But then he does
surprise kiss her and put.

Speaker 5 (01:21:47):
Her into a bush. Here shelter, you shelter, and people
are not sympathetic about it.

Speaker 1 (01:21:52):
No, And then that's like her best friend calls her
basically like the next thing was jazz. Jazz is so
mean to her.

Speaker 5 (01:21:57):
Yeah, like, well, your nickers were just stop.

Speaker 1 (01:22:00):
They were too big, Mike, they were too big. Grandma
whears nickers like that.

Speaker 4 (01:22:04):
I was like we And I was like, that's upsetting
because I feel like, also I remembering a teenager and
that sort of thing may be kind of happening and
people not being sympathetic because it is your fault.

Speaker 3 (01:22:15):
I mean again, very reflective of the time. Yeah, there's
also something that I'm glad the movie leaves out, but
that is present in the book where she has this
cousin who comes to visit every now and then, and
then like.

Speaker 4 (01:22:27):
Yeah, I'd forgotten about the cousin. Whoa, and you already
do broadcast stuff, don't you.

Speaker 3 (01:22:32):
So like the cousin is like a boy her age,
but he's like ancestually like groping her leg and I
think tries to kiss her and like, yes, like really
upsetting troubling things. Again, the movie leaves this out, but again,
but also the book doesn't. Like She's just like, well
that was weird. I don't want to hang out with
that cousin anymore. A very like you know, fourteen year

(01:22:55):
old way.

Speaker 5 (01:22:55):
To process that, honest, see how I process it? No, right,
you Honestly, if that happened, I'd be like, I'm going
to hang out less than my cousin. Yea, for sure.

Speaker 1 (01:23:05):
It's just I don't know this. The book in the
movie touch on things that like aren't.

Speaker 5 (01:23:10):
Equipped to like really handle it handle right. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:23:15):
Well, and I also read that Louise rennaiscing Yeah, started
as like an edgy stand up and it feels like
she just sort of adapted that style to her fourteen
year old's voice, which like didn't work is a standard yeah,
And then I guess she wrote these books in her forties,
Like she didn't start as a youth writer. So it's like,
I see what she's going for and it definitely worked

(01:23:36):
for us at the time.

Speaker 4 (01:23:39):
This comedy doesn't work out, I'm gonna write inappropriate books.

Speaker 5 (01:23:45):
Famously, like don't Read Now. Publishing is very famously not
a well paid, no, not a livable gig.

Speaker 3 (01:23:56):
Something that the movie does and I think the book
does to a slightly more extent, is like commentary from
Georgia talking about how like unoriginal, uncreative, how dim boys are,
how they're like losers who she generally doesn't want. And
there's like I think one extra boy that she like

(01:24:17):
dates for a little while in the book that's not
in the movie, but she's like always trying to avoid
him because she's like, I don't even know if I
like him, but it's nice to have a boyfriend because
that's that's what society tells me I should have. So
you know, there's things like that. But I do like
that she's often like ragging on boys.

Speaker 5 (01:24:34):
Yeah, and also the boys aren't very fully formed, they're
very they're undeveloped.

Speaker 1 (01:24:41):
Yeah, does anyone have anything else they'd like to discuss.
I wanted to just touch really quick on how they
had the Lindsay character. Yeah, because they are. I felt
like like there should is there a phrase for this
where it was like the movie was extremely focused on
her body. There was literally like a close up of

(01:25:02):
her boobs because because you're seeing I think her body
from like George's perspective of like she's hyper focused on
So it is the female gaze, but it's still not great.

Speaker 5 (01:25:13):
But the female game is very judgmentally yes, yes, and
like which it can.

Speaker 1 (01:25:17):
Be that absolutely and like that's sort of how I like,
I don't love how they treat Lindsay at the beginning
where they just sort of say she's mean, but then
they hyper fixate on her body. But then it turns
out like the judgment they're projecting on her turns out
to be true and she is mean, and I feel
like it's, yeah, like they just have no these girls

(01:25:38):
have no empathy for each other whatsoever, which can be true,
it seems, but I'm like, it just made me really uncomfortable,
especially at the end when Lindsay comes back and you know,
does the whole like you're a bitch and he's my boyfriend,
like just not even acting like a person. I don't know.

Speaker 3 (01:25:55):
Oh, and then they humiliate her by like ripping out
the silicone.

Speaker 1 (01:25:58):
Like bra and she's is having a carry moment and
then but the music is like, yeah, like.

Speaker 5 (01:26:05):
She wears faked. You shouldn't reach into people's bros.

Speaker 1 (01:26:08):
No, that's assault. That is assault. And it's also like
I don't know.

Speaker 5 (01:26:12):
And then it's having a bad time anyway because she's
already a bathday when no one's uh at the club.
I also has two clubs, they're both free Friday night,
and that two teenagers hire them out instead. I was
like this is not realistic.

Speaker 1 (01:26:27):
It's really I just like thought that character was so
uneven in the way she was treated, especially because I
don't know, like being a teen without Teddies in two
thousand and eight, there would be pressure to like I
remember like wearing padded bras in the two thousands because
I didn't want to get made fun of for having
small boobs. There's no way to win. Yeah, there's no

(01:26:48):
way to win. And the fact that they are like
extremely judgmental for her, which for what I'm they make
it seem like, I feel like it's a very common
internalized misogyny thing. They project that she is like vain
and not that they're that like the oppressive ways that
women's bodies are viewed applies to them, but not to

(01:27:10):
Lindsay because they don't like her, and it's just like, well,
no like. But then Lindsay turns out to be awful
and she does.

Speaker 5 (01:27:17):
Hoky stics, right, Well, maybe we know she's bad.

Speaker 3 (01:27:24):
Well because of the thing is like, if she is
mean and mean to them, that is a great reason
not to like her.

Speaker 4 (01:27:30):
But if someone spy don't meet through my house, maybe
I would hit them home with hoy stacks and it's.

Speaker 3 (01:27:36):
Like her being mean is separate from her like, you know,
succumbing to societal pressure to try to be attractive. But
that's I think a larger reason why they don't like her,
versus like that she's mean.

Speaker 5 (01:27:48):
It seems that way they don't like her, Yeah, because
she's the hall right.

Speaker 1 (01:27:53):
It's and it's also like, yeah, it's fine to imply
that they don't like her because she's mean, but it
just doesn't I don't know, it just doesn't really feel
like the whole story. And also it's like, I don't know,
there's grown ups made this movie, like like you can, like.

Speaker 5 (01:28:09):
You've got to remember all the time the two men
and two American men, people.

Speaker 1 (01:28:15):
In their forties made this whole thing, and so it
was like so it's like, yeah, it is. I feel
like there is like a level of authenticity of like
I'm sure we all have examples of like whether it
was happening to you or coming from you, like resenting
other girls for their body, especially at this age, Like
I remember being really jealous of, like and like resentful

(01:28:36):
in some ways of girls who were more developed than
I was. It's a fine thing to reflect, but again
it's like they just show it and they're like, and
that's how the world is. And there's no like, I
don't know, not that it needed to be like a
you know, total Disney movie of like I'm sorry I
was mean to you about your boobs or whatever the fuck,
but like it just is presented very like, yeah, Lindsay's horrible,

(01:28:58):
and show is her slaggy body. Like it just feels
like it's all included.

Speaker 3 (01:29:04):
And she deserves to be humiliated at the end, and
Georgia deserves to have the reward of a cute boyfriend.

Speaker 5 (01:29:10):
And the end a really huge party, like it doesn't
imply that Georgia is particularly popular, and there's a hundreds
of and no one goes to Lindsay's party. And I
was like, I don't see it, Like what, No, she
did all this internal work and everyone's watched from a
distance and was like, you've got really good with yogas,
so now we're will come to your past.

Speaker 1 (01:29:29):
If I was Ellen, I wouldn't even show up, Like,
you've never said a nice thing to me.

Speaker 3 (01:29:33):
Yeah, you've been bullying me the whole movie. Well, you
have to remember that there are so many adults at
this party, including both of her parents and.

Speaker 5 (01:29:40):
Her grandparents and her.

Speaker 3 (01:29:43):
And the interior decorator, which, by the way, Jem, who
is like the interior decorator, is like, hello, I'm an
interior decorator. Obviously I'm gay, and it's like, okay, that.

Speaker 4 (01:29:56):
Was wild where it was like suddenly she was like no,
don't an affair with Jem and everyone he was like hello,
and it was like okay, but he's not actually said
to hello like that the whole time, so we didn't.

Speaker 1 (01:30:09):
Know that literally, Like it was just I was like,
was this Did people see this in two thousand and
eight and be like wow, representation is so important, Like.

Speaker 5 (01:30:21):
I didn't even know that. I knew he was an
interior decorator. Yeah, right, Like no, that means anything I need.
We can't, of course, but she can come in all sexuality.

Speaker 1 (01:30:34):
She calls him a builder the whole time, and then
he's like why would you lie about that?

Speaker 5 (01:30:38):
And also build, he is.

Speaker 1 (01:30:40):
An interior decorator. Nothing about the house changes.

Speaker 5 (01:30:43):
What did he do?

Speaker 1 (01:30:45):
He's a bad He takes off his shirt and just
sort of looks at the wall.

Speaker 5 (01:30:50):
Yeah, what is he like when he's existing a light bulb?

Speaker 1 (01:30:56):
And then yeah, they just go out dancing all the time.

Speaker 5 (01:30:59):
That's what I mean when I which you don't do
with your.

Speaker 1 (01:31:03):
Question to bring them back to boying parents. That's exactly
what it is like there. If you like think about
what they just always do the goofiest thing possible in
this scene, that's the most embarrassing. But if you think about, like, well,
what are they actually doing, like, the answer is like,
I have.

Speaker 5 (01:31:15):
No fucking idea what they're doing.

Speaker 1 (01:31:17):
They're just they were born to embarrass Georgia. That's all
they do. Yeah, yeah, my last thing.

Speaker 3 (01:31:24):
And we've already touched on this, but it's just like
yet another example of a coming of age movie about
teen girls that center white middle class to upper middle
class characters. And that's so many of movies of this ILK. Yeah,
and this is yet another entry into.

Speaker 1 (01:31:42):
That cannon.

Speaker 5 (01:31:44):
So Christian not Bend and I Beckham. So that's weird
that I know.

Speaker 3 (01:31:49):
Yeah, So I guess, yeah, the takeaway skip this movie
and watch Bend it like Beckham instead.

Speaker 1 (01:31:56):
Honestly, Yeah, And I don't think that the director agree
with them. I think she would probably be like, no,
definitely that one.

Speaker 4 (01:32:04):
Well, I mean I found it funny but in a
painful way. Yes, there were parts I had to I will.

Speaker 1 (01:32:10):
It's like one of the movies that I understand why
people liked it at the time, but like it's such
a product of its time and there's so many better
alternatives that I wouldn't be Like even for nostalgia. I
feel like it wasn't it wasn't great.

Speaker 5 (01:32:23):
Yeah, it was bad nostalgia. It was it was triggering.

Speaker 4 (01:32:28):
Because it was like, oh, I did live this, but
I wouldn't want. I have no desire to read of
my teenage.

Speaker 1 (01:32:32):
Yeah, nostalgia culture is wild in that way where you're like, oh, yeah,
I really miss when people would bully you for fucking anything. Yeah,
I mean not that that's not true now, but it's
different now. Different anyways. Yeah, this movie does pass the
Bechdel test, but not very much. They're mostly talking about boys,
if I think it mainly passes when they're talking about
angus or what they think.

Speaker 5 (01:32:54):
About, but not frontal of the women.

Speaker 1 (01:32:58):
Right, I was saying when they're judging each other's bodies,
I think that whole like scene where they're passing around
the notes of like judging each other's spot.

Speaker 5 (01:33:05):
For each other's bodies. Out of ten Okay, that.

Speaker 1 (01:33:09):
With my friend. I hope I didn't do that, but
that's I remember boys doing that to girls. Yeah, god, yeah,
I'll never forget seventh grade, there was like a list
going around and it accidentally came to my desk of
like the boys were ranking girls by butt and I
remembered being like, I'm in I'm in the middle, just coast,
just coast. Yeah, but it was like, I mean horrible,

(01:33:30):
but I and I know that like young women especially
that time, were you know, conditioned to judge each other too,
But that seem was so weird. It passes the Bechel test,
but it's just being like, here's what's ugly about you. Yeah,
you're like, yeah, your nose gets a four out of ten. Yeah,
and that's what she's So it'scure about I know, I
kind of didn't forgive Jazz for that. I was like,
that was that was dark. You shouldn't have done that.

Speaker 3 (01:33:52):
So, yeah, it does pass the Bechtel test, but most
of the conversations, either the context or the subtext is
still about boys and being attractive to boys and stuff
like that, so it's like almost not pass Honestly.

Speaker 1 (01:34:05):
Spiritually, I don't feel like it passes.

Speaker 3 (01:34:07):
Yeah, yeah, as far as our nipple scale, though, where
we rate the movie based on a scale of zero
to five nipples, examining it through an intersectional feminist lens.

Speaker 1 (01:34:19):
I'm gonna give it, like.

Speaker 3 (01:34:21):
I'll say, like a one, somewhere between like a one
point five and a two maybe, like I guess one
point seventy five, just because it is about young girls
and they are friends that are like mostly on good
terms with each other, except for when they're bullying Ellen.

Speaker 1 (01:34:40):
Or they're you know, fighting or horrible to each other. Yeah,
it is definitely about younger.

Speaker 5 (01:34:50):
Girls, but it's it is very much one.

Speaker 1 (01:34:53):
Yeah, I'll go one.

Speaker 3 (01:34:56):
Okay, I'll give all my nipples to Angus the cat obviously, Okay.

Speaker 1 (01:35:00):
I love to hear it. I'll meet you at one
point five. I And it's partially out of like my
love for Garundo Chada's other work. And it was really
nice reading about how, like how the young actors on
set learned a lot from her and felt empowered by
like watching a woman direct a movie which happened even

(01:35:23):
less then than it did now, and particularly a woman
of color, and like there's there are things to love about,
but like, but I like the behind the scenes story
way more than I like the actual product. It's just
like so of its time. It feels really studio workshopped
to death and yeah, justice for Ellen. So I'll go

(01:35:43):
one point five and I'll also give them to Angus
and now Gus three three, Well, he's half cats have
eight nipples? Oh way, how did how did you? Jamie cat?

Speaker 2 (01:35:54):
Well?

Speaker 3 (01:35:54):
I haven't, to be fair, I have not talked about
cat facts with Caitlin in a very long time.

Speaker 1 (01:35:57):
I count my own cat's nipples and I only see, well,
some of them do only have six, okay, but some
of them have eight. Casper has six. Wow, I know special,
unless he's got some fair tires.

Speaker 3 (01:36:09):
Maybe maybe they'rehidden. Some of them I think are kind
of smaller than the others.

Speaker 1 (01:36:12):
His are like very out. It's weird. Yeah, yeah, like
you're not even using these things?

Speaker 5 (01:36:18):
What do you do?

Speaker 3 (01:36:19):
I also quickly want to say, to be clear, the
hetero girls liking boys is not inherently bad, Like I
don't know, it's just that like the way it's framed
in this movie, and also all the extra stuff of
them being homophobic and fat phobic and all that kind
of stuff. It's just it could have been framed very
differently or thought more thoughtfully.

Speaker 1 (01:36:39):
And I think it's like just the thing that we
talk about a lot in movies like this, where it's
it's not even like of course, like you know, most
kids that age are becoming interested in someone. I mean,
this is very heteronormative. But also they usually have a
hobby or like another interest or like something that they
bond over that isn't just talking about each other. It's

(01:37:00):
like their whole friendship is predicated on judging each other
and trying to get boys. Where it's like I'm sure,
like like I did that with my friends, but we
also like loved watching TV.

Speaker 3 (01:37:13):
I'd play soccer with my friends all these things. So yeah, yeah, anyway, okay,
what's your nipple?

Speaker 1 (01:37:19):
Rab?

Speaker 5 (01:37:19):
I think one point five is fair?

Speaker 4 (01:37:21):
Yeah, yeah, one one and a half nipples And maybe
I'm going to give them to Gem's boyfriend.

Speaker 1 (01:37:28):
Oh wait, oh yeah. We don't learn his name, but
he only no but.

Speaker 4 (01:37:32):
He's a gay guy who owns a nightclub in Eastbourne,
which is actually incredibly aggressive for two thousand and eight.

Speaker 5 (01:37:39):
I'm surprised that there was. And he seems like he's
a man of color.

Speaker 1 (01:37:42):
Yeah, I think so.

Speaker 5 (01:37:43):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:37:44):
So I'm surprised that there's a man of color, a
queer man of color who owns a nightclub in Eastpown
in two thousand and eight because I was willing to
rent it out to a fifteen year old.

Speaker 1 (01:37:54):
I was like, maybe the business is struggling and you
had to rent it out to a fifteen year olds.

Speaker 5 (01:37:58):
But I'm like, yeah, you, yeah, you're There's a lot
of representation because he's one character.

Speaker 1 (01:38:03):
This is a very like conservative area.

Speaker 4 (01:38:05):
Yeah, it's just like full of old people. I don't know,
so I'm just I love that for him. He lives
by the sea with his boyfriend. He's aner. They're doing
really well for themselves.

Speaker 1 (01:38:17):
Inspirational. Yeah, Kate, thank you so much for joining Thank
you today. Where can we find you online? Where can
we follow?

Speaker 5 (01:38:24):
Yeah, Kate Checker c htka Instagram. That's basically beautiful.

Speaker 3 (01:38:30):
Thanks for coming on and come back anytime. Thank you
for having me Caitlyn from the Future popping in here.
Because our memory card ran out of storage before we
could do plugs, so I'm doing everyone's plugs, starting with
our guest Kate Cheka. Big thanks to her once again
for joining us on this episode. She has a great
solo show called A Messiah Comes, which she is doing

(01:38:53):
at Soho Theater in London on January sixteenth, seventeenth, and eighteenth.
Tickets are available at the Soho Theater website will include
the link in the description of this episode. She's also
doing a UK tour of this show in addition to
the ones in London, and you can find details about
that at her website Katechecka dot co dot UK. You

(01:39:16):
can follow Kate on Instagram at Katecheka, and you can
follow us The Bechdel Cast on Instagram. You can subscribe
to our Patreon aka Matreon, where you get two bonus
episodes every month, plus access to the back catalog, which
is full of many iconic themes and episodes, all for

(01:39:39):
five dollars a month at patreon dot com slash Bechdel Cast.
That's the best way to support the show, as well
as coming to the live shows and buying tickets to
the live streams. So once again, if you go to
linktree slash Bechtel Cast, you can find information about our
upcoming shows in January in Los Angeles, San Francisco and Portland.

(01:40:02):
All of the details are on our link Tree, so
hope to see you there. Check out Kate's shows in
the UK, and we'll be back next week for another episode.

Speaker 1 (01:40:12):
Bye bye.

Speaker 3 (01:40:16):
The Bechdel Cast is a production of iHeartMedia, hosted by
Caitlin Derante and Jamie Loftis, produced by Sophie Lichterman, edited
by Mola Boord. Our theme song was composed by Mike
Kaplan with vocals by Katherine Vosskrosenski. Our logo and merch
is designed by Jamie Loftis and a special thanks to
Aristotle Assevedo. For more information about the podcast, please visit

(01:40:39):
Linktree slash Bechdel Cast