October 26, 2023 • 32 mins
In different yet interconnected experiences, Cathie and Elicia discuss navigating our industry as successful businesswomen while balancing their personal lives.
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Speaker 1 (00:05):
Hello and welcome to season two of the Future Legends
of Advertising podcast on iHeart, featuring the hottest up and
coming stars in advertising as well as the biggest legends
in the game.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
In this series, we explore the future of the advertising
industry through never before heard conversations between those who created
it and those who are shaping its future.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
We're your hosts, Hailey Romer.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
And Ross Martin.
Speaker 3 (00:29):
Now let's meet the legends.
Speaker 1 (00:41):
Hello, good afternoon, and welcome. Thank you so much for
joining me today. I'm thrilled to be here on another
episode of Future Legends of Advertising through the Advertising Hall
of Achievement. We are joined today by Alicia Azali, marketing
executive board member. We are so lucky Alisha is here
(01:03):
because she spent more of a decade of her career
as a marketer in the insurance industry, of course, and
there's so much more to what Alisha's done. We'll get
to that in just a second. Most recently, Alisha was
the Enterprise Chief Marketing Officer at American Family Insurance, and
in that role, she served as the company's top marketer,
setting the marketing strategies for the entire portfolio of brands
and representing thirteen billion dollars in sales. As the Enterprise CMO,
(01:27):
she was overseeing branch strategy, advertising and media, consumer insights,
and much more. Alicia was previously the Chief Revenue Officer
at the General Insurance, where she also served as executive
advisor for the diversity and inclusion efforts that happened there.
Alicia's held executive roles at Nationwide Insurance and PNG. But
regardless of her professional role, she is a leader with
purpose who uses her voice to champion diversity, equity, and inclusion.
(01:51):
It's worth noting that she currently serves on the Shaquille
O'Neil Foundation Board, the Global Board of Mobile Marketing Association,
the advisory board of Morehouse College, and is a founding
board member of Color Vision. Alicia, it's incredible to have
you here. Everybody raves about you. Thank you for joining us,
and thanks for coming on and having this conversation.
Speaker 4 (02:10):
Oh, it's a privilege to be here. Thank you so much.
Speaker 1 (02:13):
Terrific And we are joined by none other than the
legend Kathy Black, currently principal of Madison Park Ventures and
former chairman and president of Hirst Magazines, where she was
my boss's boss's Boss's Boss's Boss. Kathy is a name
synonymous with groundbreaking achievements in the fields of advertising and publishing.
(02:36):
She launched her career selling magazine Classifieds, and capped it
as the president and chairman of Hearst Magazines for twelve years. Today,
as a principal and Madison Park venture, she continues to
be a driving force in the industry. Throughout her journey,
Kathy consistently shattered glass ceilings, earning her the distinction of
being the first in various pivotal roles. The first ad
(02:57):
manager of Miss Magazine, the first female publisher of New
York Magazine, the first president and publisher of US Today,
the first female president of Hirst Magazines. Her visionary leadership
laid the foundation for countless women myself included in the
publishing field, and earned her title of America's first Lady
of Magazines. Her enduring influence and impact are nothing short
(03:20):
of legendary. Kathy's legacy was commemorated with her induction into
the AAS Advertising Hall of Fame in twenty twenty three.
And beyond her incredible professional accolades, Kathy dedicates her time
to mentoring and advising female entrepreneurs, using her profound ability
to harness the power of partnerships to foster transformative success. Kathy,
(03:41):
I've looked up to you for so many years. It's
such an honor and a privilege to have you here.
Thank you for joining us.
Speaker 5 (03:49):
Oh, You're welcome. I think I can only disappoint you
after all of that.
Speaker 1 (03:54):
I highly doubt that that is possible. But it's so
fun because I think the idea of this podcast for
us was really about getting people together who are shaping
the future of the industry, and in that we so
clearly have Alisha, and of course Kathy. There's so much
to learn from you, as you have shaped not only
industries but the careers of so many people. So I
(04:15):
might just sort of kick it off with a quick
question to you, Alicia, which is, as you think about
your legacy, how do you think about those who've come
before you, like Kathy.
Speaker 4 (04:27):
Well, first, I want to start kind of where you
left off, which is a thank you to you, Kathy
for blazing trails that I get to walk on. And
I don't mean that in jest. I mean that in
I'm not the only woman in the room. There might
be still more men to be clear. But I know
that when there are other firsts, and you were so
(04:48):
many times a first, that that allows me to, especially
as a woman of color, a black woman, be able
to very proudly represent those voices in the chairs and
the tables that I sit in. So I want to
start with a thank you and to your question, Hailey,
when I think about my legacy, which goodness, I don't
(05:09):
reflect on it that much because I feel like I'm
still very much into it. It is really about creating
space for others and really about being intentional about what
that looks like. And so I'll start with a bit
of a story. I was giving a speech to an
organization and I just happen to have my hair and braids.
And I wasn't really thinking anything of that moment because
(05:31):
I was on vacation and had to do this speech,
and so my hair was braided, and I got maybe
five or seven text messages from other women who said, gosh,
thank you for being yourself, for bringing yourself and wearing
your hair and braids. Which seems simple, but when you
think about legacy and creating space for others, representation matters
(05:55):
a big deal. And so when you can see it
you think that that can do that, And so I
would say when I think about legacy, for me, I
don't really do that because I feel like I'm in it,
and when I'm in it, I'm trying to make sure
that I'm pulling the chair out, make sure I'm lifting
the voice in the room if someone's quiet, hey, what
(06:16):
are you thinking? And making sure that that inclusivity is
is just ever present. Because I'm privileged to have a
seat at the table. Great, and so I would I've
got lots of questions for Kathy, and I'd love to
Kathy hear from you around. You know, you're a trailblazer,
You're an entrepreneur, you're a CEO, author, like all the things,
(06:40):
just a badass woman period. And so I wonder how
you and where you are in your life. How do
you define purpose for you?
Speaker 5 (06:52):
You know, defining purpose is a is a multi layered question,
but I would take to a simpler level. You know,
when I was young, twenty two, just out of college,
and I promise I will not take you through all
of this, but it was so important to me to
have a job that I loved, and not everybody has
(07:15):
that opportunity. Many people have to slug it away and
hate every single day, and I just have always felt like, well,
if you don't like it, move on. But I remember
my first real interview. I'm from Chicago originally was at
Jay Walter Thompson and I was just out of college
and I'd heard that they had an executive training program.
So I was really excited. So I have an appointment
(07:37):
and this guy that hit whether he was head, I
have no idea, and we didn't even call it har
It's called personnel back then. And so I said, well,
I'm very interested, you know, with my little sort of
smiley Chicago face, I'm very in in hearing about that.
And he looked at me and he said, well, that's
for men. The executive training program was for men. And
I said, why any kind of flimm fly around and
(08:01):
he said, well, let's put it this way. You know
you're going to be getting married in a couple of years,
you're gonna have kids, and you'll leave the workforce. Now,
mind you, I never took any time off in a
forty plus year career. I have no idea what the
man's name is, but I hope he remembers what he
said to me as an gotcha, gotcha, gotcha. But you know,
I just I feel like the things that I cared
(08:22):
the most about. I mean when I went to MISS
in the early days and we did sales calls across
the country for anybody that would see us, I mean,
they just looked at us like we were freaks and weirdos.
They could not contemplate what MIS even meant. You know,
they expected that we would be appreciative of the simplest
(08:44):
little job, and we were beginning to say. I mean,
I remember sitting with a big media director at an
ad agency, and right behind him on his credenza there
was a beautiful picture of his family, five daughters, and
he was he just couldn't understand what MIS would be about.
And I said, you know, with respect, but I said,
(09:05):
if you'll turn around and look at the picture of
your five young, beautiful daughters in their twenties, this is
why we are here, that part. We are here to
make change. We want the same jobs that you did
as a younger person, and we are going to open
up you know, not just the ceiling, but every door
(09:27):
up and down these ad agency you know. I mean,
we would have people like like literally hanging out of
those offices to see what the freaks and weirdos from
mis would look like. And they could never kind of
get their hands around it very much. And so as
time went on, you know, we got a little smarter,
we got a little better, but still, I mean we
(09:48):
would come back to the office every night there were
like five salespeople and ready to beat our head against
the wall. And I you know, it wasn't then, you know,
a situation of black and white. It was just we
just wanted to allow women to think in a bigger
way about their potential to not be shoved into either
a category, you know, or a small position that they
(10:11):
had to understand that we, you know, we are human beings.
We want to believe the same things that guys do,
and we want to take take our shot at getting
those jobs. And it was a long, hard slug, I'll
tell you that, but you know, in time, and that
makes me so happy to see so many women in
wonderful positions, executive positions, happy lives, figuring out how to
(10:33):
work family with their positions, but also knowing that in
today's world there's there's something there for everybody. It's no
longer just a prescription.
Speaker 4 (10:43):
I love that, and and you mentioned and there is
data that shows that in the C suite roles, the
chief marketing officer role does have disproportionate women representation relative
to other C suites. And so, you know, I'll give
a small handclap for the momentum that we have there
within that CMO role, but we know there's still a
(11:05):
gap and there's still work to do. And so you know,
in your in your mind kind of knowing where we've been,
what can be done to further that that momentum of
you know, women occupying whatever chair they want, and they
aspire and dream too.
Speaker 5 (11:21):
Well, no one's going to give it to us. You know,
it's not going to come on any kind of a plate.
So I think it's it is still about making your
voice heard, you know, being in the right place at
the right time, getting to know the right people, because
most of those positions start higher. And you know, in
the old days, you know, the guy just you know,
(11:43):
promoted his buddy and all of a sudden the women
come in and they were very you know, those guys
were not happy to see us saying, you know, but
I want those same opportunities, you know, and I want
the same compensation. You know, I remember, you know, one time,
going to my super boss and saying, you know, I'm
so underpaid it is ridiculous. I thought he was going
(12:03):
to have a heart attack. I kind of wish he had,
you know, but I mean he just couldn't imagine that.
I was like, not happy for this measly little raise
I got. And you know, it was all those kind
of early things. But you know what they give you.
They give you a foundation of belief, of belief in
your in your in your in yourself, belief in what
(12:24):
you can become. You know, I didn't know at twenty
two what I really wanted to become, but I knew
that I was very serious about a career and they
found all of that hard to believe. And I'm so
excited today with the women who you know, whether they've
gone to graduate school or not or MBAs you know,
they see a very different future or even a present,
I should say, but as you know, it's still a slog.
Speaker 4 (12:47):
Yeah, I have to acknowledge how I feel. Your confidence
just jumped through the screen and I love it. And
you know, in your book you offer key lessons for
success in the work, and one of those lessons is
about confidence, and so I would just love to hear
you talk about the importance of confidence. And I obviously
(13:08):
it's been an enabler of your success. You know, where
did you cultivate? Like where did it come from? Like
were you born with it? Did you build on it?
Speaker 5 (13:17):
You know, I actually think I probably was born with it.
My father died when I was relatively young. I was
just twenty twenty two, but he and I were much
more in tandem than my older brother. You know. I
just I was just dying to go out there and
make it happen. You know. I didn't know what that
actually meant, but I just and I was intrigued. One
(13:39):
of my first interviews in Chicago, when my parents really
were hoping that I would stay in Chicago, was at
the Chicago Tribune, and so I just had I was
an English major in college, so I was I was
drawn to newspapers. And then when I went to New York,
which was just months later. You know, one of my
roommates was interviewing at a big mag at the time,
(14:01):
and I thought, oh, and she was in the editorial,
and so I went and interviewed, and the man said, well,
we don't have anything in editoriable. We if something in
advertising sales, well I didn't even know what advertising sales meant,
but you know, I am a seller, and you know,
I'm not afraid of asking for the order you get
better at it. But nonetheless, I'm not afraid of that.
And in fact, there's there aren't a whole lot of
(14:22):
things that I'm really afraid of. You know, I'm not
afraid of failure. I mean, I've made mistakes along the way,
but you just have got to, I think, built into
yourself an expectation that you're going to be fine. You know,
you can have a terrible day or a big fight
with a boss or whatever it is, and it's it's
gonna it's gonna go away. It's not. It's not the
(14:44):
end of the world. And I think too many people
give up too soon, you know. At Miss, I mean
that was that was baptism by fire. I mean, it
was just unbelievable what people thought of the magazine, what
people thought of whatever mis meant. And so that you know,
we got we had kind of hard skin in a
nice way. I mean, we weren't horrible or anything like that,
but it was like, you go right back in there girl,
(15:07):
and you just you do it. And we were a
tiny little team. And I think that those early jobs
teach you a lot, you know, like like what do
I want this to happen? What do I want it
to become? Is it going to become something here? And
if not, well then I'm going to figure out somewhere
where I'm going to be appreciated more and where my
opportunities are greater. I'm always sad when I hear somebody say, well,
(15:27):
I stuck out that job for so long, Like, well, then,
don't you know. I mean, we live in a free country,
and I think that that's really really important. But attitude
is important also, you know, you like, I mean I
like to be surrounded with people who have a positive attitude.
You know, one one bad germ in a group can
(15:48):
really pull you down, and so it's that sort of
upbeat attitude. Confidence. I mean, it's a long way of
getting around to confidence. But you know, if you are
if you are recognized as someone with something to give,
confidence begins to get. I mean it doesn't come overnight,
but you begin to think, well, you know, like it mives.
I mean, my god, we sold a couple of ads
(16:09):
finally like, wow, we can do this, and you know
it gets bigger the bigger you've become. You know it
gets harder but bigger and you know, more opportunities. But
it's been you know, I've love the advertising business forever
and ever and ever.
Speaker 1 (16:24):
I want to jump in on that topic of confidence, because, Alicia,
I suspect you have a little bit of your own confidence,
and I think as women in particular, you know that
so many people talk about how women can be less
confident than men, And clearly, when you spend time building
a career, and you spend time developing relationships both inside
(16:46):
organizations and outside organizations, or just quite frankly, you know,
doing anything in the course of your day, you'll have
moments of different degrees of confidence. And as you said, Kathy,
I think over time your confidence builds. But Alicia, I'm
typically curious about your relationship to confidence and if there's
anything you do to help drive up your level of
(17:06):
confidence in moments of need, because we all have those
times when we're like, I'm not sure I'm feeling it.
You know, where am I going to dig deep and
pull this out of?
Speaker 4 (17:17):
Yeah? I love that question, and I think Oftentimes you
can look at people who are quote unquote successful and
you just assume that they've done everything right. And I
would say that my confidence is a lot of times
come from the things that you know, you got to
be okay with message some stuff up, you got to
be okay with breaking some things, you know, and and
then just saying, you know what, I didn't get that
one right, whether that be you know, a work product
(17:40):
or you know someone on a team or et cetera,
and having the wherewithal to get right back up and say, Okay,
I'm gonna do it again. And so I think you
know that that's one way to look at it. I would
say the second thing is I have I have pretty
humble beginnings and would have never dreamed of the spaces
that I been able to occupy. And so in many ways,
(18:02):
I feel like, you know, I owe it to myself,
I owe it to my family, I owe it to
where I come from, to like you know, we're going,
we're going all in. And so just kind of wearing
that that grit you can work hard, stay humble is
the sign that you that is behind me. I know
it's a podcast, you can't see it, but that's work hard,
stay humble, that's a thing.
Speaker 1 (18:21):
You know.
Speaker 4 (18:21):
We're gonna we're gonna grind it out, but we're gonna
hold our heads up high and keep at it. Just
feeling like I'm bringing again others with me and representing
a voice that needs to be heard and needs to
have space. I get confidence from my tribe of girlfriends.
I get confidence from from my children. I get confidence
from my aunties and my mother, you know, and try
to bring them, you know, for my husband. I bring
(18:43):
them with me.
Speaker 5 (18:44):
And those four little boys, four little boys.
Speaker 4 (18:46):
That's exactly right. You got to be confident in this out.
Speaker 1 (18:50):
Okay, that's right. I want to tell you a funny
little secret. Sometimes, if you know, when I'm having moments
of doubt, I will imagine that my children are watching
me in a room where I have to say something
and I'm feeling uncertain, and I think they can't wonder
whether or not I am doubting myself. They need to
(19:11):
believe that I believe in myself. And I'll use that,
you know, sort of like that. You know, people say,
stand up in front of a room and imagine you're,
you know, the whole crowd is undressed. You know that
that's not what I'm imagining. I'm imagining my children are
watching me, and I actually have to project confidence that
they think that their mom knows what she's talking about.
It helps.
Speaker 5 (19:26):
Oh, I love that. I think that's great.
Speaker 1 (19:28):
Yeah, I love that, Kathy. Do you have any specific
questions for Alicia?
Speaker 5 (19:33):
You know, I love the fact of your total commitment
to DEI and I think, you know, for your generation
and for the changes that have already bug on but
are certainly slow to come and frustrating. I am sure.
But you know, I felt myself that I was opening
(19:54):
up the doors for women, and I think in a
different way today what you and others are doing, I mean,
you know, across the world for that matter, it just
makes the whole world and globe feel so much better.
We're not there yet, we have struggles, but I think
it's I think it's very exciting. I really do. Going
(20:17):
to all of those AAF meetings the other day and
just in all of the winners, I mean, it was
just so uplifting to think those are the things that
matter now.
Speaker 4 (20:28):
I love that.
Speaker 5 (20:29):
Thank you, thank you.
Speaker 4 (20:30):
No, thank you, And it reminds me of one of
my favorite quotes by Tony Morrison, which I'd love to share,
which is when you get these jobs that you have
been so brilliantly trained for, just to remember that your
real job is that if you are free, you need
to free somebody else. If you have some power, then
your job is to empower somebody else.
Speaker 5 (20:53):
And that's great.
Speaker 4 (20:53):
It's really the essence of what you said when you
were doing your thing and you were grinding as CEO
and your tribal women, you're bringing them along and run
in the world. You had your focus, you knew the
space that you were creating, and so I feel that responsibility,
you know, and I hope that I'm in a fraction
living into these words that Tony Morrison left with us.
Speaker 5 (21:17):
I think you are. I think you are. You kind
of know it right in your heart.
Speaker 1 (21:23):
I recognize that there is quite a distinct difference in
terms of the timing of your careers and the expectations
put on you both as individuals as leaders, which is
to say that Kathy, while you were building your career
and bringing others along very much in a trailblazer fashion,
and you were doing work in the community, I'm not
sure it was as expected of you as perhaps it
(21:46):
is expected of leaders today. And so, Alicia, as you
think about the time you spend with your day job
and balancing that with the time you spend in communities
and bringing others along and you know, sort of driving
cammunity impact, what advice would you give to others who
think about those things and where to best spend your
(22:06):
time and how to think about you know, the value
of each of those components of your life today.
Speaker 4 (22:12):
There is an expectation for authenticity. And so if I
walk in a room and I say I am for
accelerating the careers of women and women of color in
advertising media fields, and I've got nothing behind that statement,
people are going to pull me on the carpet and
caught me out. And so you know, and the and
(22:35):
I think that's a beautiful thing because you know, that's
where the action live. That's where the impact happens. Is
when you know it's not just lip service or you're
not just saying things to sort of playcate to. Whether
it be your customer or your employees or your teams,
there's an expectation for being authentic for whatever it is
you say you stand for. And so you know where
(22:56):
everyone's connected through social everyone's connect did through you know,
their phones, and you know, here we are today and
from three different cities convening on this important topic. You know,
everything's highly accessible and so you can check my credibility
and the authenticity of the words that I say. And
I truly believe that that that expectation from again, our teams,
(23:19):
from our customers hopefully will make us better over time.
You know, I'm going to choose to find the value
in being able to, you know, check people's authenticity because
I think that realness and that humanity is what pulls
us together and frankly, where we can get inspiration and
help even dream bigger, aroute what it's possible. Who knows what,
(23:41):
you know, the next generation will come with the type
of technology and in connectiveness, and so I try every
day to live into that. But I'll tell you what,
It's a non negotiable to be authentic. It's non negotiable
to be what you stand for. And I'm grateful that
I have space to be able to, you know, not
(24:03):
shy away from that responsibility and obligation.
Speaker 5 (24:06):
That's really well, very well said. You know, I was
just thinking in a slightly different way. You know, when
we got out of college. You know, it was like
go to that first job, and it was all sort
of sequential. You either did better and you got a
different job or a different company, whatever. But we were
totally or I was solely dedicated to that, and I
(24:27):
think for the current generation and all this, you know,
three days at home, where do you come to the
office or do you even care? I say this to
a younger woman just recently, and I said, like, I
don't have the feeling like people even care that much
about their jobs anymore. Now that's a broad statement, but
I'm just not so sure that that the energy that
(24:50):
we put into in quotes, you know, getting ahead, getting
a bigger job, whatever, building a family is as important
on the work side. And so if you're if you're
a leader and you know your your staff is sort
of like just kind of I don't know what if
that's going to be a critical thing, a problem. I
(25:12):
don't know.
Speaker 4 (25:13):
I talk a lot with teams around you know, we
just have one life, yeah, and I think you know,
there was a time, you know, fifteen years ago where
you could have a work life and a home life,
and we tried really hard to separate those things and
These are the types of things we say at home,
These are the types of conversations we have at work.
(25:35):
And I think for lots of reason they were accelerated.
But I do think the pandemic. Remember when we were
all vulnerable on zoom calls in early twenty twenty, we
had to bring some stuff that we would have never
brought to the office to the office. And so I
think the question is how can we find the power
or build the trust in acknowledging that it is just
(25:56):
one life and so honoring both what work brings to
the table and also that you are a whole person
and you get one time at this thing. And so
I have to do this. My colleague and friend lost
her son in a car accident. His name was Christian
Files and Hugh Douglas. They went to Morehouse and they
(26:21):
were twenty years old, best friends and roommates and just
accelerating on all dimensions. And they live short lives, but
they lived like life was short. And so when you
think about, you know, this next generation finding that you
know how things work together, you know, I'm encouraged by
(26:44):
the next generation who is finding a way to make
you know, live life like it is short. And that
means that sometimes their life really is more important than work.
And that doesn't mean they're not ambitious. But I think
the magic will be figuring that, figuring that out.
Speaker 5 (27:00):
It's going to be a very interesting five to ten years.
You know, change doesn't happen, as we know, overnight, and
it's not all of them anyway. I mean that's a
silly statement, because who knows. I mean, everyone's different. But
I think that you know, from my generation, if you
wanted to really get somewhere, you were you were all in,
you know, and then I adopted two kids and then
(27:20):
you realize the pulls and the twists and all of
that that goes on. But it's it's doable and a
good mate as well. But I just think there's following covid.
I think there's a real difference in attitude these days.
Speaker 4 (27:34):
I agree with you.
Speaker 1 (27:35):
I think that's right, and maybe you know. In closing,
we can get ready to wrap. But I do have
one question, Oh no, are we over? I'm sure I
could listen to the two of you speak all day.
For sure.
Speaker 5 (27:48):
You're doing just fine.
Speaker 1 (27:51):
I love I love all of the anecdotes that you're sharing.
But because we are here, in celebration of alicious induction
into the Advertising of Achievement, and Kathy, because you've already
been inducted into the Advertising Hall of Fame. I'm sure
Alicia you are well on your way to that induction
in the future. I guess I would ask you both
(28:11):
with respect to the impact of the advertising industry today,
where do you feel like there is room for growth
for the industry and what do you think the industry
as a whole might think differently about as we look
toward the future and we are introduced to new technologies,
new ways of engagement, new understanding of audiences and how
(28:34):
they consume content, and so on and so forth. So
really just parting thoughts with respect to the advertising industry
moving forward and how people who are coming into the
industry might think about driving impact.
Speaker 5 (28:47):
I think one thing that has always been the same
about the advertising industry and its success is that it's
about ideas. I mean, at the end of the day,
advertising is an idea. It's to compel someone to do
something good or eat or drink or whatever it is.
And that's why I think it's an industry that has
sustained itself because it is full of really smart people,
(29:12):
really driven people with great expectations and great creativity. And
creativity at the end of the day, is what is
going to drive you know, success, businesses, new companies, all
of the things that we are so excited about, you
know these days. Is it is those things and the
(29:32):
rest of it will become perhaps less important.
Speaker 4 (29:35):
I'm all in on that, and I'm just going to
build on top of on top of that note, Kathy,
you know, advertising at its core is human centric. It's
centered on knowing people and understanding how people are motivated
to buy something, sell something, to take action better than
anyone else. And so even with our shifts and use
(29:57):
of AI and technology, I would offer that you'd have
to put human centered in front of that. It's not
tech for tech's sake, it's not social for no. You
are tapping into a customer, a person, a human, and
you're using that to move them to do something. And
so that's why you know, we've talked a lot about
(30:18):
D and I today. That's why the representation of marketers
and advertisings of the future have to represent your customer base.
It's not you know, there's so much conversation around brand
versus performance. No, what are we What are we trying
to accomplish, And let's get down to being very specific
around what the objectives are. But at the end of
the day, we're talking about people, you know, We're talking
(30:41):
about people and ideas, and sometimes we might complicate things,
you know, because there is technology involved and things do
change faster than ever. But I think if we kind
of keep things down, making sure that we keep the
people part of our industry intact, will continue to be
in good shape.
Speaker 5 (30:59):
I think the people part of it has really come
very alive in the last couple of decades. I mean,
we used to sort of follow in line, but now
there's so many different ways you can do something. And
I love the word performance. You know, if you perform,
you know, it doesn't matter whether you're sitting in you know,
California or Chicago or Miami or anywhere else. I mean,
(31:19):
if you perform, you should be able to build a
very successful career. And I think that those the doubters
have become less and less.
Speaker 1 (31:31):
I love all of that. And how lucky are we
to be joined by two of the most incredible people
within the industry and whose impact continues to help move
us all along. So thank you. Thank you so much
for joining, for making the time for this conversation obviously,
for all of the impact, for paving the way, and
for continuing to be committed to driving our industry forward.
(31:53):
What a gift you too are. Thank you so much.
Speaker 5 (31:56):
Oh, thank you, and thank you Alicia. It was fun
being with you, lots of fun.
Speaker 3 (32:01):
Thank you, Jeffy.
Speaker 2 (32:06):
Well, that does it for this episode of the Future Legends.
Speaker 3 (32:09):
Of Advertising podcast on Ihearten.
Speaker 2 (32:12):
I'm Ross Martin.
Speaker 1 (32:13):
And I'm Hailey Romer and thank you for listening. We'll
be back with another episode before you know it. And
for more information on the American Advertising Federation, go to
AAF dot org.
Hello and welcome to season two of the Future Legends
of Advertising podcast on iHeart, featuring the hottest up and
coming stars in advertising as well as the biggest legends
in the game.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
In this series, we explore the future of the advertising
industry through never before heard conversations between those who created
it and those who are shaping its future.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
We're your hosts, Hailey Romer.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
And Ross Martin.
Speaker 3 (00:29):
Now let's meet the legends.
Speaker 1 (00:41):
Hello, good afternoon, and welcome. Thank you so much for
joining me today. I'm thrilled to be here on another
episode of Future Legends of Advertising through the Advertising Hall
of Achievement. We are joined today by Alicia Azali, marketing
executive board member. We are so lucky Alisha is here
(01:03):
because she spent more of a decade of her career
as a marketer in the insurance industry, of course, and
there's so much more to what Alisha's done. We'll get
to that in just a second. Most recently, Alisha was
the Enterprise Chief Marketing Officer at American Family Insurance, and
in that role, she served as the company's top marketer,
setting the marketing strategies for the entire portfolio of brands
and representing thirteen billion dollars in sales. As the Enterprise CMO,
(01:27):
she was overseeing branch strategy, advertising and media, consumer insights,
and much more. Alicia was previously the Chief Revenue Officer
at the General Insurance, where she also served as executive
advisor for the diversity and inclusion efforts that happened there.
Alicia's held executive roles at Nationwide Insurance and PNG. But
regardless of her professional role, she is a leader with
purpose who uses her voice to champion diversity, equity, and inclusion.
(01:51):
It's worth noting that she currently serves on the Shaquille
O'Neil Foundation Board, the Global Board of Mobile Marketing Association,
the advisory board of Morehouse College, and is a founding
board member of Color Vision. Alicia, it's incredible to have
you here. Everybody raves about you. Thank you for joining us,
and thanks for coming on and having this conversation.
Speaker 4 (02:10):
Oh, it's a privilege to be here. Thank you so much.
Speaker 1 (02:13):
Terrific And we are joined by none other than the
legend Kathy Black, currently principal of Madison Park Ventures and
former chairman and president of Hirst Magazines, where she was
my boss's boss's Boss's Boss's Boss. Kathy is a name
synonymous with groundbreaking achievements in the fields of advertising and publishing.
(02:36):
She launched her career selling magazine Classifieds, and capped it
as the president and chairman of Hearst Magazines for twelve years. Today,
as a principal and Madison Park venture, she continues to
be a driving force in the industry. Throughout her journey,
Kathy consistently shattered glass ceilings, earning her the distinction of
being the first in various pivotal roles. The first ad
(02:57):
manager of Miss Magazine, the first female publisher of New
York Magazine, the first president and publisher of US Today,
the first female president of Hirst Magazines. Her visionary leadership
laid the foundation for countless women myself included in the
publishing field, and earned her title of America's first Lady
of Magazines. Her enduring influence and impact are nothing short
(03:20):
of legendary. Kathy's legacy was commemorated with her induction into
the AAS Advertising Hall of Fame in twenty twenty three.
And beyond her incredible professional accolades, Kathy dedicates her time
to mentoring and advising female entrepreneurs, using her profound ability
to harness the power of partnerships to foster transformative success. Kathy,
(03:41):
I've looked up to you for so many years. It's
such an honor and a privilege to have you here.
Thank you for joining us.
Speaker 5 (03:49):
Oh, You're welcome. I think I can only disappoint you
after all of that.
Speaker 1 (03:54):
I highly doubt that that is possible. But it's so
fun because I think the idea of this podcast for
us was really about getting people together who are shaping
the future of the industry, and in that we so
clearly have Alisha, and of course Kathy. There's so much
to learn from you, as you have shaped not only
industries but the careers of so many people. So I
(04:15):
might just sort of kick it off with a quick
question to you, Alicia, which is, as you think about
your legacy, how do you think about those who've come
before you, like Kathy.
Speaker 4 (04:27):
Well, first, I want to start kind of where you
left off, which is a thank you to you, Kathy
for blazing trails that I get to walk on. And
I don't mean that in jest. I mean that in
I'm not the only woman in the room. There might
be still more men to be clear. But I know
that when there are other firsts, and you were so
(04:48):
many times a first, that that allows me to, especially
as a woman of color, a black woman, be able
to very proudly represent those voices in the chairs and
the tables that I sit in. So I want to
start with a thank you and to your question, Hailey,
when I think about my legacy, which goodness, I don't
(05:09):
reflect on it that much because I feel like I'm
still very much into it. It is really about creating
space for others and really about being intentional about what
that looks like. And so I'll start with a bit
of a story. I was giving a speech to an
organization and I just happen to have my hair and braids.
And I wasn't really thinking anything of that moment because
(05:31):
I was on vacation and had to do this speech,
and so my hair was braided, and I got maybe
five or seven text messages from other women who said, gosh,
thank you for being yourself, for bringing yourself and wearing
your hair and braids. Which seems simple, but when you
think about legacy and creating space for others, representation matters
(05:55):
a big deal. And so when you can see it
you think that that can do that, And so I
would say when I think about legacy, for me, I
don't really do that because I feel like I'm in it,
and when I'm in it, I'm trying to make sure
that I'm pulling the chair out, make sure I'm lifting
the voice in the room if someone's quiet, hey, what
(06:16):
are you thinking? And making sure that that inclusivity is
is just ever present. Because I'm privileged to have a
seat at the table. Great, and so I would I've
got lots of questions for Kathy, and I'd love to
Kathy hear from you around. You know, you're a trailblazer,
You're an entrepreneur, you're a CEO, author, like all the things,
(06:40):
just a badass woman period. And so I wonder how
you and where you are in your life. How do
you define purpose for you?
Speaker 5 (06:52):
You know, defining purpose is a is a multi layered question,
but I would take to a simpler level. You know,
when I was young, twenty two, just out of college,
and I promise I will not take you through all
of this, but it was so important to me to
have a job that I loved, and not everybody has
(07:15):
that opportunity. Many people have to slug it away and
hate every single day, and I just have always felt like, well,
if you don't like it, move on. But I remember
my first real interview. I'm from Chicago originally was at
Jay Walter Thompson and I was just out of college
and I'd heard that they had an executive training program.
So I was really excited. So I have an appointment
(07:37):
and this guy that hit whether he was head, I
have no idea, and we didn't even call it har
It's called personnel back then. And so I said, well,
I'm very interested, you know, with my little sort of
smiley Chicago face, I'm very in in hearing about that.
And he looked at me and he said, well, that's
for men. The executive training program was for men. And
I said, why any kind of flimm fly around and
(08:01):
he said, well, let's put it this way. You know
you're going to be getting married in a couple of years,
you're gonna have kids, and you'll leave the workforce. Now,
mind you, I never took any time off in a
forty plus year career. I have no idea what the
man's name is, but I hope he remembers what he
said to me as an gotcha, gotcha, gotcha. But you know,
I just I feel like the things that I cared
(08:22):
the most about. I mean when I went to MISS
in the early days and we did sales calls across
the country for anybody that would see us, I mean,
they just looked at us like we were freaks and weirdos.
They could not contemplate what MIS even meant. You know,
they expected that we would be appreciative of the simplest
(08:44):
little job, and we were beginning to say. I mean,
I remember sitting with a big media director at an
ad agency, and right behind him on his credenza there
was a beautiful picture of his family, five daughters, and
he was he just couldn't understand what MIS would be about.
And I said, you know, with respect, but I said,
(09:05):
if you'll turn around and look at the picture of
your five young, beautiful daughters in their twenties, this is
why we are here, that part. We are here to
make change. We want the same jobs that you did
as a younger person, and we are going to open
up you know, not just the ceiling, but every door
(09:27):
up and down these ad agency you know. I mean,
we would have people like like literally hanging out of
those offices to see what the freaks and weirdos from
mis would look like. And they could never kind of
get their hands around it very much. And so as
time went on, you know, we got a little smarter,
we got a little better, but still, I mean we
(09:48):
would come back to the office every night there were
like five salespeople and ready to beat our head against
the wall. And I you know, it wasn't then, you know,
a situation of black and white. It was just we
just wanted to allow women to think in a bigger
way about their potential to not be shoved into either
a category, you know, or a small position that they
(10:11):
had to understand that we, you know, we are human beings.
We want to believe the same things that guys do,
and we want to take take our shot at getting
those jobs. And it was a long, hard slug, I'll
tell you that, but you know, in time, and that
makes me so happy to see so many women in
wonderful positions, executive positions, happy lives, figuring out how to
(10:33):
work family with their positions, but also knowing that in
today's world there's there's something there for everybody. It's no
longer just a prescription.
Speaker 4 (10:43):
I love that, and and you mentioned and there is
data that shows that in the C suite roles, the
chief marketing officer role does have disproportionate women representation relative
to other C suites. And so, you know, I'll give
a small handclap for the momentum that we have there
within that CMO role, but we know there's still a
(11:05):
gap and there's still work to do. And so you know,
in your in your mind kind of knowing where we've been,
what can be done to further that that momentum of
you know, women occupying whatever chair they want, and they
aspire and dream too.
Speaker 5 (11:21):
Well, no one's going to give it to us. You know,
it's not going to come on any kind of a plate.
So I think it's it is still about making your
voice heard, you know, being in the right place at
the right time, getting to know the right people, because
most of those positions start higher. And you know, in
the old days, you know, the guy just you know,
(11:43):
promoted his buddy and all of a sudden the women
come in and they were very you know, those guys
were not happy to see us saying, you know, but
I want those same opportunities, you know, and I want
the same compensation. You know, I remember, you know, one time,
going to my super boss and saying, you know, I'm
so underpaid it is ridiculous. I thought he was going
(12:03):
to have a heart attack. I kind of wish he had,
you know, but I mean he just couldn't imagine that.
I was like, not happy for this measly little raise
I got. And you know, it was all those kind
of early things. But you know what they give you.
They give you a foundation of belief, of belief in
your in your in your in yourself, belief in what
(12:24):
you can become. You know, I didn't know at twenty
two what I really wanted to become, but I knew
that I was very serious about a career and they
found all of that hard to believe. And I'm so
excited today with the women who you know, whether they've
gone to graduate school or not or MBAs you know,
they see a very different future or even a present,
I should say, but as you know, it's still a slog.
Speaker 4 (12:47):
Yeah, I have to acknowledge how I feel. Your confidence
just jumped through the screen and I love it. And
you know, in your book you offer key lessons for
success in the work, and one of those lessons is
about confidence, and so I would just love to hear
you talk about the importance of confidence. And I obviously
(13:08):
it's been an enabler of your success. You know, where
did you cultivate? Like where did it come from? Like
were you born with it? Did you build on it?
Speaker 5 (13:17):
You know, I actually think I probably was born with it.
My father died when I was relatively young. I was
just twenty twenty two, but he and I were much
more in tandem than my older brother. You know. I
just I was just dying to go out there and
make it happen. You know. I didn't know what that
actually meant, but I just and I was intrigued. One
(13:39):
of my first interviews in Chicago, when my parents really
were hoping that I would stay in Chicago, was at
the Chicago Tribune, and so I just had I was
an English major in college, so I was I was
drawn to newspapers. And then when I went to New York,
which was just months later. You know, one of my
roommates was interviewing at a big mag at the time,
(14:01):
and I thought, oh, and she was in the editorial,
and so I went and interviewed, and the man said, well,
we don't have anything in editoriable. We if something in
advertising sales, well I didn't even know what advertising sales meant,
but you know, I am a seller, and you know,
I'm not afraid of asking for the order you get
better at it. But nonetheless, I'm not afraid of that.
And in fact, there's there aren't a whole lot of
(14:22):
things that I'm really afraid of. You know, I'm not
afraid of failure. I mean, I've made mistakes along the way,
but you just have got to, I think, built into
yourself an expectation that you're going to be fine. You know,
you can have a terrible day or a big fight
with a boss or whatever it is, and it's it's
gonna it's gonna go away. It's not. It's not the
(14:44):
end of the world. And I think too many people
give up too soon, you know. At Miss, I mean
that was that was baptism by fire. I mean, it
was just unbelievable what people thought of the magazine, what
people thought of whatever mis meant. And so that you know,
we got we had kind of hard skin in a
nice way. I mean, we weren't horrible or anything like that,
but it was like, you go right back in there girl,
(15:07):
and you just you do it. And we were a
tiny little team. And I think that those early jobs
teach you a lot, you know, like like what do
I want this to happen? What do I want it
to become? Is it going to become something here? And
if not, well then I'm going to figure out somewhere
where I'm going to be appreciated more and where my
opportunities are greater. I'm always sad when I hear somebody say, well,
(15:27):
I stuck out that job for so long, Like, well, then,
don't you know. I mean, we live in a free country,
and I think that that's really really important. But attitude
is important also, you know, you like, I mean I
like to be surrounded with people who have a positive attitude.
You know, one one bad germ in a group can
(15:48):
really pull you down, and so it's that sort of
upbeat attitude. Confidence. I mean, it's a long way of
getting around to confidence. But you know, if you are
if you are recognized as someone with something to give,
confidence begins to get. I mean it doesn't come overnight,
but you begin to think, well, you know, like it mives.
I mean, my god, we sold a couple of ads
(16:09):
finally like, wow, we can do this, and you know
it gets bigger the bigger you've become. You know it
gets harder but bigger and you know, more opportunities. But
it's been you know, I've love the advertising business forever
and ever and ever.
Speaker 1 (16:24):
I want to jump in on that topic of confidence, because, Alicia,
I suspect you have a little bit of your own confidence,
and I think as women in particular, you know that
so many people talk about how women can be less
confident than men, And clearly, when you spend time building
a career, and you spend time developing relationships both inside
(16:46):
organizations and outside organizations, or just quite frankly, you know,
doing anything in the course of your day, you'll have
moments of different degrees of confidence. And as you said, Kathy,
I think over time your confidence builds. But Alicia, I'm
typically curious about your relationship to confidence and if there's
anything you do to help drive up your level of
(17:06):
confidence in moments of need, because we all have those
times when we're like, I'm not sure I'm feeling it.
You know, where am I going to dig deep and
pull this out of?
Speaker 4 (17:17):
Yeah? I love that question, and I think Oftentimes you
can look at people who are quote unquote successful and
you just assume that they've done everything right. And I
would say that my confidence is a lot of times
come from the things that you know, you got to
be okay with message some stuff up, you got to
be okay with breaking some things, you know, and and
then just saying, you know what, I didn't get that
one right, whether that be you know, a work product
(17:40):
or you know someone on a team or et cetera,
and having the wherewithal to get right back up and say, Okay,
I'm gonna do it again. And so I think you
know that that's one way to look at it. I would
say the second thing is I have I have pretty
humble beginnings and would have never dreamed of the spaces
that I been able to occupy. And so in many ways,
(18:02):
I feel like, you know, I owe it to myself,
I owe it to my family, I owe it to
where I come from, to like you know, we're going,
we're going all in. And so just kind of wearing
that that grit you can work hard, stay humble is
the sign that you that is behind me. I know
it's a podcast, you can't see it, but that's work hard,
stay humble, that's a thing.
Speaker 1 (18:21):
You know.
Speaker 4 (18:21):
We're gonna we're gonna grind it out, but we're gonna
hold our heads up high and keep at it. Just
feeling like I'm bringing again others with me and representing
a voice that needs to be heard and needs to
have space. I get confidence from my tribe of girlfriends.
I get confidence from from my children. I get confidence
from my aunties and my mother, you know, and try
to bring them, you know, for my husband. I bring
(18:43):
them with me.
Speaker 5 (18:44):
And those four little boys, four little boys.
Speaker 4 (18:46):
That's exactly right. You got to be confident in this out.
Speaker 1 (18:50):
Okay, that's right. I want to tell you a funny
little secret. Sometimes, if you know, when I'm having moments
of doubt, I will imagine that my children are watching
me in a room where I have to say something
and I'm feeling uncertain, and I think they can't wonder
whether or not I am doubting myself. They need to
(19:11):
believe that I believe in myself. And I'll use that,
you know, sort of like that. You know, people say,
stand up in front of a room and imagine you're,
you know, the whole crowd is undressed. You know that
that's not what I'm imagining. I'm imagining my children are
watching me, and I actually have to project confidence that
they think that their mom knows what she's talking about.
It helps.
Speaker 5 (19:26):
Oh, I love that. I think that's great.
Speaker 1 (19:28):
Yeah, I love that, Kathy. Do you have any specific
questions for Alicia?
Speaker 5 (19:33):
You know, I love the fact of your total commitment
to DEI and I think, you know, for your generation
and for the changes that have already bug on but
are certainly slow to come and frustrating. I am sure.
But you know, I felt myself that I was opening
(19:54):
up the doors for women, and I think in a
different way today what you and others are doing, I mean,
you know, across the world for that matter, it just
makes the whole world and globe feel so much better.
We're not there yet, we have struggles, but I think
it's I think it's very exciting. I really do. Going
(20:17):
to all of those AAF meetings the other day and
just in all of the winners, I mean, it was
just so uplifting to think those are the things that
matter now.
Speaker 4 (20:28):
I love that.
Speaker 5 (20:29):
Thank you, thank you.
Speaker 4 (20:30):
No, thank you, And it reminds me of one of
my favorite quotes by Tony Morrison, which I'd love to share,
which is when you get these jobs that you have
been so brilliantly trained for, just to remember that your
real job is that if you are free, you need
to free somebody else. If you have some power, then
your job is to empower somebody else.
Speaker 5 (20:53):
And that's great.
Speaker 4 (20:53):
It's really the essence of what you said when you
were doing your thing and you were grinding as CEO
and your tribal women, you're bringing them along and run
in the world. You had your focus, you knew the
space that you were creating, and so I feel that responsibility,
you know, and I hope that I'm in a fraction
living into these words that Tony Morrison left with us.
Speaker 5 (21:17):
I think you are. I think you are. You kind
of know it right in your heart.
Speaker 1 (21:23):
I recognize that there is quite a distinct difference in
terms of the timing of your careers and the expectations
put on you both as individuals as leaders, which is
to say that Kathy, while you were building your career
and bringing others along very much in a trailblazer fashion,
and you were doing work in the community, I'm not
sure it was as expected of you as perhaps it
(21:46):
is expected of leaders today. And so, Alicia, as you
think about the time you spend with your day job
and balancing that with the time you spend in communities
and bringing others along and you know, sort of driving
cammunity impact, what advice would you give to others who
think about those things and where to best spend your
(22:06):
time and how to think about you know, the value
of each of those components of your life today.
Speaker 4 (22:12):
There is an expectation for authenticity. And so if I
walk in a room and I say I am for
accelerating the careers of women and women of color in
advertising media fields, and I've got nothing behind that statement,
people are going to pull me on the carpet and
caught me out. And so you know, and the and
(22:35):
I think that's a beautiful thing because you know, that's
where the action live. That's where the impact happens. Is
when you know it's not just lip service or you're
not just saying things to sort of playcate to. Whether
it be your customer or your employees or your teams,
there's an expectation for being authentic for whatever it is
you say you stand for. And so you know where
(22:56):
everyone's connected through social everyone's connect did through you know,
their phones, and you know, here we are today and
from three different cities convening on this important topic. You know,
everything's highly accessible and so you can check my credibility
and the authenticity of the words that I say. And
I truly believe that that that expectation from again, our teams,
(23:19):
from our customers hopefully will make us better over time.
You know, I'm going to choose to find the value
in being able to, you know, check people's authenticity because
I think that realness and that humanity is what pulls
us together and frankly, where we can get inspiration and
help even dream bigger, aroute what it's possible. Who knows what,
(23:41):
you know, the next generation will come with the type
of technology and in connectiveness, and so I try every
day to live into that. But I'll tell you what,
It's a non negotiable to be authentic. It's non negotiable
to be what you stand for. And I'm grateful that
I have space to be able to, you know, not
(24:03):
shy away from that responsibility and obligation.
Speaker 5 (24:06):
That's really well, very well said. You know, I was
just thinking in a slightly different way. You know, when
we got out of college. You know, it was like
go to that first job, and it was all sort
of sequential. You either did better and you got a
different job or a different company, whatever. But we were
totally or I was solely dedicated to that, and I
(24:27):
think for the current generation and all this, you know,
three days at home, where do you come to the
office or do you even care? I say this to
a younger woman just recently, and I said, like, I
don't have the feeling like people even care that much
about their jobs anymore. Now that's a broad statement, but
I'm just not so sure that that the energy that
(24:50):
we put into in quotes, you know, getting ahead, getting
a bigger job, whatever, building a family is as important
on the work side. And so if you're if you're
a leader and you know your your staff is sort
of like just kind of I don't know what if
that's going to be a critical thing, a problem. I
(25:12):
don't know.
Speaker 4 (25:13):
I talk a lot with teams around you know, we
just have one life, yeah, and I think you know,
there was a time, you know, fifteen years ago where
you could have a work life and a home life,
and we tried really hard to separate those things and
These are the types of things we say at home,
These are the types of conversations we have at work.
(25:35):
And I think for lots of reason they were accelerated.
But I do think the pandemic. Remember when we were
all vulnerable on zoom calls in early twenty twenty, we
had to bring some stuff that we would have never
brought to the office to the office. And so I
think the question is how can we find the power
or build the trust in acknowledging that it is just
(25:56):
one life and so honoring both what work brings to
the table and also that you are a whole person
and you get one time at this thing. And so
I have to do this. My colleague and friend lost
her son in a car accident. His name was Christian
Files and Hugh Douglas. They went to Morehouse and they
(26:21):
were twenty years old, best friends and roommates and just
accelerating on all dimensions. And they live short lives, but
they lived like life was short. And so when you
think about, you know, this next generation finding that you
know how things work together, you know, I'm encouraged by
(26:44):
the next generation who is finding a way to make
you know, live life like it is short. And that
means that sometimes their life really is more important than work.
And that doesn't mean they're not ambitious. But I think
the magic will be figuring that, figuring that out.
Speaker 5 (27:00):
It's going to be a very interesting five to ten years.
You know, change doesn't happen, as we know, overnight, and
it's not all of them anyway. I mean that's a
silly statement, because who knows. I mean, everyone's different. But
I think that you know, from my generation, if you
wanted to really get somewhere, you were you were all in,
you know, and then I adopted two kids and then
(27:20):
you realize the pulls and the twists and all of
that that goes on. But it's it's doable and a
good mate as well. But I just think there's following covid.
I think there's a real difference in attitude these days.
Speaker 4 (27:34):
I agree with you.
Speaker 1 (27:35):
I think that's right, and maybe you know. In closing,
we can get ready to wrap. But I do have
one question, Oh no, are we over? I'm sure I
could listen to the two of you speak all day.
For sure.
Speaker 5 (27:48):
You're doing just fine.
Speaker 1 (27:51):
I love I love all of the anecdotes that you're sharing.
But because we are here, in celebration of alicious induction
into the Advertising of Achievement, and Kathy, because you've already
been inducted into the Advertising Hall of Fame. I'm sure
Alicia you are well on your way to that induction
in the future. I guess I would ask you both
(28:11):
with respect to the impact of the advertising industry today,
where do you feel like there is room for growth
for the industry and what do you think the industry
as a whole might think differently about as we look
toward the future and we are introduced to new technologies,
new ways of engagement, new understanding of audiences and how
(28:34):
they consume content, and so on and so forth. So
really just parting thoughts with respect to the advertising industry
moving forward and how people who are coming into the
industry might think about driving impact.
Speaker 5 (28:47):
I think one thing that has always been the same
about the advertising industry and its success is that it's
about ideas. I mean, at the end of the day,
advertising is an idea. It's to compel someone to do
something good or eat or drink or whatever it is.
And that's why I think it's an industry that has
sustained itself because it is full of really smart people,
(29:12):
really driven people with great expectations and great creativity. And
creativity at the end of the day, is what is
going to drive you know, success, businesses, new companies, all
of the things that we are so excited about, you
know these days. Is it is those things and the
(29:32):
rest of it will become perhaps less important.
Speaker 4 (29:35):
I'm all in on that, and I'm just going to
build on top of on top of that note, Kathy,
you know, advertising at its core is human centric. It's
centered on knowing people and understanding how people are motivated
to buy something, sell something, to take action better than
anyone else. And so even with our shifts and use
(29:57):
of AI and technology, I would offer that you'd have
to put human centered in front of that. It's not
tech for tech's sake, it's not social for no. You
are tapping into a customer, a person, a human, and
you're using that to move them to do something. And
so that's why you know, we've talked a lot about
(30:18):
D and I today. That's why the representation of marketers
and advertisings of the future have to represent your customer base.
It's not you know, there's so much conversation around brand
versus performance. No, what are we What are we trying
to accomplish, And let's get down to being very specific
around what the objectives are. But at the end of
the day, we're talking about people, you know, We're talking
(30:41):
about people and ideas, and sometimes we might complicate things,
you know, because there is technology involved and things do
change faster than ever. But I think if we kind
of keep things down, making sure that we keep the
people part of our industry intact, will continue to be
in good shape.
Speaker 5 (30:59):
I think the people part of it has really come
very alive in the last couple of decades. I mean,
we used to sort of follow in line, but now
there's so many different ways you can do something. And
I love the word performance. You know, if you perform,
you know, it doesn't matter whether you're sitting in you know,
California or Chicago or Miami or anywhere else. I mean,
(31:19):
if you perform, you should be able to build a
very successful career. And I think that those the doubters
have become less and less.
Speaker 1 (31:31):
I love all of that. And how lucky are we
to be joined by two of the most incredible people
within the industry and whose impact continues to help move
us all along. So thank you. Thank you so much
for joining, for making the time for this conversation obviously,
for all of the impact, for paving the way, and
for continuing to be committed to driving our industry forward.
(31:53):
What a gift you too are. Thank you so much.
Speaker 5 (31:56):
Oh, thank you, and thank you Alicia. It was fun
being with you, lots of fun.
Speaker 3 (32:01):
Thank you, Jeffy.
Speaker 2 (32:06):
Well, that does it for this episode of the Future Legends.
Speaker 3 (32:09):
Of Advertising podcast on Ihearten.
Speaker 2 (32:12):
I'm Ross Martin.
Speaker 1 (32:13):
And I'm Hailey Romer and thank you for listening. We'll
be back with another episode before you know it. And
for more information on the American Advertising Federation, go to
AAF dot org.
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