December 19, 2023 • 43 mins
🎙️ On this episode of Conflict Managed, I’m joined by Kim Longacre, realtor with Dream Homes LPT.
Listen in as we discuss:
👩💼 Examples of excellent management and its impact on teams.
🚫 The consequences of gossip and drama in leadership.
😊 The joy of enjoying colleagues.
✨ The power of one person to inspire change and de-escalate conflicts.
🤝 Celebrating and addressing the good and bad in team interactions for a healthier workplace.
Tune into Conflict Managed on your favorite podcast platform to explore the complexities of workplace dynamics.
Kim Longacre has been a Realtor for almost 8 years. She initially started her career by dealing with foreclosures but later transitioned into helping people find their ideal homes as a real estate broker. Prior to that, Kim ran her local coffee shop, The Looking Glass. Additionally, she has served as a member of the Weakley County Schoolboard for a period of 9 years. In 2023, she was elected as the President of the Reelfoot Regional Association of Realtors and will continue to serve on the board next year. Kim has a passion for art and enjoys indulging in various art forms, ranging from ceramics to painting.
Conflict Managed is hosted by Merry Brown and produced by Third Party Workplace Conflict Restoration Services (3pconflictrestoration.com).
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:03):
All right,
this is all right.
I got it.
I do wraps now.
Get a sound side uptight,
asking questions.
(00:25):
Welcome to Conflict Managed.
I'm your host,
Merry Brown.
Today in Conflict Managed,
we are joined by Kim Longacre.
Kim has been a realtor for almost eight years.
She initially started her career by dealing with foreclosures but later transitioned into helping people find their ideal homes as a real estate broker.
Prior to that,
Kim ran her local coffee shop,
(00:47):
The Looking Glass.
Additionally,
she has served as a member of the Weakley County School Board for a period of nine years in 2023.
She was elected as the president of the Realfoot Regional Association of Realtors and will continue to serve on the board.
The next year,
Kim has a passion for art and enjoys indulging in various art forms ranging from ceramics to painting.
(01:08):
Good morning,
Kim and welcome to Conflict Managed.
Good Morning.
So happy to have you here today on the show.
Thank you.
Happy to be here.
So let's just go ahead and start from the very beginning.
Will you tell us about your first job?
Oh,
my gosh.
Yes.
My first job was,
uh,
at a check recovery business and it was a family friend.
(01:30):
I think I made $3.80 an hour.
It was back in those days.
and also when there were more checks being written at the time it was,
yeah,
return check company.
So I would answer the phone when they would try to get the money for businesses.
And I ended up just doing little side work for them when I was 15 or 16.
(01:57):
I guess it was,
that was my very first job.
So,
were you dealing with upset customers sometimes?
But mostly just to transfer the call?
Thank goodness.
Oh,
just a minute.
I've got someone else for you to talk with.
Right.
And how long did you do that job?
Uh,
I just did that for about a year and then I worked for a grocery store for several years all the way until I was in college and went from cashier to working in the office and being a front end manager.
(02:29):
So,
and that was only when I was 16 to 19 or 20 maybe 19,
I guess,
would probably be about right.
What was that experience as a first time manager?
Like for you?
I really loved it.
There were,
I had a lot of friends there and so we just had some sort of bond,
I guess,
would be the best way to put that.
(02:50):
And we also had really good management there.
And for a small,
you know,
grocery store,
it,
it,
it was just a lot of fun.
I,
I loved working there.
What did they do?
I mean,
what made it good management.
I think they were just friendly,
reasonable people.
They weren't,
you know,
that number one,
all the breaks were very well timed.
They made sure everybody was getting their break when they needed to.
(03:13):
Of course,
that was also the days when you clocked in.
So,
you know,
they would say no,
you need to sit upstairs until you're ready to clock in and then you clock in right at the time and go,
you know,
get your till and go to the front and,
but they,
you know,
there were a lot of teenagers that worked there so easily they could have been taken advantage of,
I guess,
or,
(03:33):
you know,
management could have been really ridiculous about stuff,
but they were really,
really good.
I'm still even friends with a lot of the same people from back then.
So,
yeah,
I like those three words,
friendly,
organized and reasonable.
I mean,
what else do you want in a work?
Exactly.
And I think that kind of set the tone of like,
basically how things should be for me in the future,
(03:55):
you know,
didn't always work that way,
but it certainly was like,
ok,
that was a really good first ex,
first couple,
really experiences.
So,
um,
I really enjoyed working there quite a bit and also the tone of a work culture.
So,
if the work culture is already like that and somebody gets hired in,
that's the expectation that's been set.
Yes,
absolutely.
(04:15):
I mean,
we did stuff together outside of work,
even like the management would take us bowling or,
you know,
they'd order pizza for us and it was just,
and what was funny about that job is I remember being a little anxious about it.
They had us take one of those personality tests at the beginning and I was like,
what does this even mean?
Like?
And so I was,
I wasn't sure,
(04:36):
but then after that,
I mean,
it was totally fine.
So that was the only weird thing that I was like,
ok,
this is new.
How interesting.
I wonder how they used it.
I wonder if they use it.
I know,
because it was,
let's say the nine,
early nineties,
late eighties,
early nineties,
I guess when.
So.
Yeah,
I don't know what they used it for.
(04:56):
I wish I knew it is.
It is.
Yeah.
So,
then you went off to college?
I did.
And what did you major in psychology?
So,
yeah.
Yeah,
minor in art.
So,
I,
I did that and still use both of those things regularly.
So,
with my current job,
(05:16):
of course,
and then I,
when I graduated my first job was a mortgage company.
We had moved and I've gotten married and I worked at this mortgage company.
It was a small mortgage company.
And I got there in the first day I knew something was not right.
(05:39):
I should say the second day,
the first day it seemed,
you know,
you just go in and you're like,
ok,
this is your first day.
Second day.
A girl came up to me and said you can fax your resume out in the back room back here and showed me where to do it.
And so I was like,
oh,
this is a red flag right away.
And I think I only stayed there maybe six months or a year and saw why nobody stayed.
(06:06):
It was very,
I guess,
kind of stuck back in time like they didn't do anything,
everything was paper and I mean,
this was 1999.
So by that point,
things were changing quite a bit but they didn't even have computers.
So there was just,
it was a really,
(06:28):
yeah,
I was lucky,
I guess that they had a fax machine.
A lot of us ended up at this same company after that,
which did foreclosures.
And that's kind of when I started doing foreclosures for lots of it was,
it was one bank and,
but it was a nationwide bank.
And so we had an office that had about two or 300 employees and did foreclosures for a few years until I got laid off from that.
(06:56):
And then I went to a completely different field which was communications they did fiber underground and I really,
that job was weird.
Uh,
you know,
you,
nobody ever gave us,
it was very corporate and we never had any direction of what we were actually supposed to be doing.
(07:17):
So,
it seemed really like I was just kind of floating along there for a couple of years and then got laid off from there and then ended up working at a law firm first 12 years.
Let's see,
it was quite a while.
But no,
it must not have been 12 years.
It was shorter than that.
(07:37):
But that job was my main job until we left that town.
So,
and that was an interesting job too.
I mean,
it was really good and that I made a lot of really good friends but,
uh,
toxic work environment.
Yes,
100% very bad management.
What kinds of things did they do?
(07:59):
Uh,
encouraged gossip.
You know,
it would just petty things,
you know,
the management would always say,
well,
this job isn't brain surgery.
So y'all just need to calm down but then immediately turn around and like lay the pressure on and we were doing foreclosures for every bank in the state at that point.
And so,
you know,
(08:20):
there was a constant numbers coming in all the time but the management there just,
uh,
unreal always would bring people in her office and,
you know,
start at some sort of gossip chain of whatever.
And it was just and fire people all the time.
You know,
that really did not deserve how they were treated.
(08:40):
It was pretty incredible.
But I think that,
that also had some sort of trauma bonding in that,
you know,
uh,
some of my,
and again,
my best friend who I still talk to all the time and I was really thankful to meet her there because,
and actually I met her at,
at the business before that and then she helped me get the job there.
(09:02):
And then of course,
we had a whole little group of friends that worked there and that really helped us get through because it was rough.
You know,
it's interesting that you say petty because so much of a toxic work environment feels like it's a compounding of pettiness.
And like we think about gossip,
(09:23):
gossip happens in an isolated conversation and another isolated.
And so when you tell somebody,
it makes it sound like you're the problem,
you know,
and,
you know,
we talk about gas line say that's exactly how it was.
I mean,
it was really a weird environment to be in.
We had to beg for getting,
we were promised at the beginning we would get yearly evaluations.
(09:46):
We would have to beg for those for months to get that to happen,
you know,
so that we could just get basic,
you know,
pay raises that,
I mean,
even just a minimal pay raise and still it would be months late even though.
That was something we were promised at the beginning.
But,
yeah,
gas lighting 100%.
I mean,
that,
that,
and that wasn't even a term back then,
(10:07):
you know.
Yeah,
things happened before we have that.
But yeah,
there was a lot,
a lot of that.
So it was really a weird place.
I mean,
I would say probably that she was one of the worst bosses I ever had.
So,
why was she allowed to continue?
I think the partners in the firm probably didn't realize what all she,
(10:31):
they,
they just felt like she managed,
there were about 50 to 100 employees at the time and I think they thought that she was because they just weren't present or they weren't present in what was going on.
There were several different attorneys who did different things and she managed all of,
you know,
under one specific attorney and then there were attorneys below him.
(10:53):
And so it just was not,
it was not noticed how she behaved.
I think she had been there so long and she's probably still there.
I mean,
but after leaving a friend told me and she had left,
I was still there and she,
she said you wouldn't believe how you're going to feel when you do leave.
(11:16):
And I,
I didn't,
uh,
I listened to that and at the time I was like,
ok,
sure.
And then I left and I knew exactly what she was talking about.
It.
Was that freedom of just like letting that whole thing go.
And it was,
it was shockingly like,
just like a weight had been lifted and I just didn't know because I've been stuck in that for so long,
(11:38):
you know,
and you're,
when you're comfortable in those situations,
I think you don't really pay attention to all of the red flags at once.
You're just like,
ok,
this is,
what do,
what do they always say?
This is the evil.
I know.
But yeah,
it's so interesting that,
(11:59):
and it happens everywhere,
this unnoticed,
you know,
that people are allowed to get away with.
And sometimes,
you know,
we say,
well,
we're busy or I don't want to be a micro manager which is excuse,
excuse.
Right.
For sure.
And needing these mechanisms so that the good bosses shine and we're able to shine a light on those people who are making everybody else's life miserable.
(12:21):
Yeah.
Yeah.
I think it really also brought forward how later down the road when I was a boss myself,
I realized there was no way I was gonna be like that.
And that was not long after that job.
So,
you know,
I owned a coffee shop for seven years and I made a point to never ever be like that.
(12:43):
And now mind you,
I did not have the same amount of employees and didn't have to deal with the same type of stuff.
But I just knew how I wasn't going to be and it did help.
I feel like,
I mean,
I still talk to the people that I,
that worked for me and one of them asks me for a reference every now and then and I still give it because she was a great employee and she,
she made it so easy to,
(13:04):
to be a good boss too.
You know,
she was,
she would always arrived on time.
She did what I asked her to,
I didn't have to ever worry about it,
but I just knew that I wasn't going to perpetuate any of that type of behavior.
Do you see any,
because you were there for quite some time?
Do you see any of that still affecting you today?
(13:26):
Yeah.
Yeah.
I mean,
every now and then I'll still have a nightmare about it or,
which is kind of interesting because it,
you know,
something will happen that triggers that thought or,
or thinking about it,
you know,
like having a dream about it or,
but,
and just,
you know,
in my day to day life I just realized,
(13:47):
you know,
being kind and not being like that was certainly something I didn't wanna,
I just didn't wanna be like that,
knowing what,
you know,
today,
if you were to go back to an experience like that,
what if anything would you do differently?
I'd probably start,
I'd run.
(14:09):
Where is the fax machine?
Yeah,
exactly.
Where is the resume fax machine?
Um,
yeah.
I don't,
I don't think I would have stayed as long as I did.
I mean,
the pay was good and,
and that part was good,
but I just don't think I could deal with that kind of stuff again.
You know,
at this age too.
(14:30):
I,
you know,
I was young back then so,
you know,
it was a little or younger and you can put up with more when you're younger,
I guess.
And you know,
when you're the one,
like at the time I was the breadwinner of the,
of the house.
So you just,
I did what I had to do.
Yeah,
I mean,
that is the answer for a lot of it.
We are in jobs because we have mortgages to pay the bills.
(14:53):
This isn't like,
you know,
that is certainly the case.
I remember working with somebody who I was told that she was the secretary at this particular place because they were,
they had tons of money and she wanted something to do.
She was the nicest person,
but that was a really bad environment and she did not stay very long because she,
(15:17):
I'm not going to be treated this way.
So I'm gonna leave and I think that's the most important thing is that most people that,
I mean,
what,
what else are you gonna do?
You,
you were there to do a job,
you're gonna get paid.
So then you stick it out and just do it and I think sometimes you end up just staying longer because it's easier because it's what,
you know.
That's right.
It's,
it's,
(15:38):
it may not be comfortable but it's comfortable.
Right.
That's right.
It's a lot harder to go out and find something new and,
you know,
but I would say that that's like,
I think,
I don't want to say it,
it would stop you,
you know.
But I think it does stop a lot of people that fear of the unknown.
And so ending up like,
and that would be,
(15:58):
you know,
something I think,
I think about all the time is just that don't be afraid of that because sometimes it works out a lot better than you think.
I mean,
it might be scary at first,
but it helps to,
to go on,
you know,
and that's why I think we need to talk to people more about conflict management and change management that changes the name of the game.
(16:19):
So there's going to be change in your organization,
the people you really like will leave the people that you don't like will stay and then whatever is happening in the economy in your particular field.
So there's always going to be change.
So if you get comfortable with change that maybe you're more likely to read the writing on the wall when this place no longer fits with your values or you're being treated in a way that is really unacceptable.
(16:44):
And so being aware that first of all that treatment is unacceptable and then not being afraid to act.
Yeah,
100%.
Yes.
And yet,
you know,
I,
I read a lot about conflict management and sometimes people get too theoretical pie in the sky where the reality is,
you know,
we're paying,
you know,
for our mortgage and our food and we have health insurance and the options may not be if you live in a small town or your industry is very small,
(17:13):
there may not be a lot of options.
And so instead of looking elsewhere,
one thing that you can definitely do is what can I do?
What can I be the change because one person really can make a big change.
Right.
And I think,
you know,
in that job at the law firm,
I think I certainly kept my head down and tried to do,
(17:34):
just do my job and avoid a lot of that drama that it's just,
it got where,
you know,
drama is perpetuated downward.
And so from management,
then the next person would,
you know,
fall into that.
And so I tried to stay out of that fray but it didn't,
you know,
it doesn't always work.
But yeah,
(17:55):
change,
like saying it's ok for change and that maybe,
you know,
if you ha well,
again,
like you just said,
with the small town,
you might have as many things available to you or,
you know,
but certainly you can always be keeping your eye open for stuff like that,
you know,
and I think when we tell ourselves,
you know,
when I,
when I saw a few years before I left philosophy that it was time for me to leave.
(18:19):
I stayed longer than I should have because what am I supposed to do?
I'm a philosopher in a small town,
you know,
believe it or not.
Folks got a lot of jobs.
They're philosophers shocking,
but that's actually false.
Once I stepped out,
I didn't see any of the opportunities because I wasn't looking for the opportunities.
(18:39):
I wasn't putting myself in a space to meet people.
I lived in a small town for 20 years and only know university people and whose fault was that it was mine.
But I didn't see that because I had told myself this narrative that there isn't anything available and so make it work well.
And I think,
yeah,
with the in psychology,
(19:00):
I thought I was gonna,
you know,
go work with kids in some manner and,
and the reality was those were minimum wage,
paying jobs that couldn't pay the bills.
And so that,
that's how I even ended up in,
you know,
from that field.
And,
but what's funny is,
of course,
I had never really even thought of it until I've had this job is how much I use that degree.
(19:23):
Now,
you know,
being a realtor,
you constantly are doing some sort of psychological,
like,
ok,
let's keep calm.
My cousin has this thing that I,
and I even joke with her about it all the time.
But she's like,
you know,
you just need to use your Christina voice,
which is my cousin.
And so she's,
it's this calm voice that,
(19:45):
you know,
you,
you used to talk to people so that they stay calm and that,
you know,
and I,
I'm probably fail at that 99% of the time,
but it's something I aspire to always and that,
you know,
deescalating a situation where something might be.
And so that psychology comes in and,
and I hear her in my back of my head telling me to use that voice to come in and,
(20:09):
you know,
try to keep people calm.
But while that degree was maybe not used in the way I thought it was going to be used,
it is definitely used.
And your art minor.
Yes.
Yeah.
Still do that.
So well,
I would also imagine,
I mean,
so much of reality obviously is the visual aspect,
definitely.
And so helping people either to sell it or the book.
(20:30):
Right.
Yeah.
With photography,
with,
you know,
of course,
our marketing and especially now we're doing our own marketing all the time.
So that certainly comes up and,
and it's what I used to keep me calm at home.
So I still do a lot of art stuff at home and that's really kind of my outlet of that.
(20:51):
So I try to,
I use that in multiple ways,
for sure.
So,
when you came to Martin,
so you had a job and then you opened a coffee shop for seven years.
Why did you go into business for yourself?
Well,
I think part of it was we were in a small town that,
and I had always dreamed about opening at the time.
I wanted like some sort of little home decor type shop and as that progressed,
(21:19):
you know,
I,
I thought about it and thought about it and tried to,
you know,
bring all that together and,
and,
but the more it progressed,
the more people were like,
could you please have coffee?
And honestly,
the,
I,
I barely even drink coffee.
So I didn't know much about it at all.
And I luckily I had a couple friends that taught me a lot and previous coffee shop owners that taught me a lot about it.
(21:43):
And so I made that a integral part of that business and that really ran the business.
I mean,
so it was really,
I wanted just like a little gift shop,
but then that sort of kind of just tumbled into that.
Yeah.
But,
you know,
the thing about owning your own business,
(22:04):
of course,
is all the stress that comes with that.
So,
you know,
every night I was always like thinking what was what I needed to do because I could only rely on myself for that.
And,
you know,
it felt pretty at the end of that.
I think it felt pretty isolating number one.
But I,
it took me an adjustment moving into real estate in that,
(22:27):
you know,
I was kind of stuck there all the time and,
and I,
and I don't mean stuck in the worst way or anything.
I enjoyed it.
I loved talking to the people and I really miss a lot of the things,
those people I see every single day because they would drink coffee.
I know you being one of them,
of course,
now we get to see each other more.
But,
um,
you know,
that portion of things.
But I was also,
I had to change my mindset of how to be free.
(22:52):
And I guess what I mean by that is,
uh,
I didn't have to ask anybody's permission anymore,
even my own to go to my kids events or,
you know,
like in the middle of the day.
And I never could do that before because I was down there and I could not leave.
I needed to be there.
And so,
you know,
(23:12):
it's like working an 8 to 5 job.
You'd have to,
you know,
ask somebody permission.
But real estate,
you know,
there's just a lot more freedom in your scheduling because of course,
you're working in the evenings and on the weekends.
And so that's kind of the trade off is that you're,
but I had to get it out of my head that I needed to work 8 to 5.
And that was a weird concept for me and I could just go off and,
(23:35):
you know,
go do what I needed to do.
Start a little laundry in the middle of the day if I needed to,
whatever it takes.
So,
you love the coffee shop in,
into reality.
And you've been in that for eight years and you started a bit of a new venture.
Yes.
Yeah.
Um,
we,
we've changed companies and four of us and have come over here together to,
(23:58):
to work for L BT reality and we love it.
We wanted to stay together after our broker passed away.
And so we've had some really good feedback about that,
which I,
we weren't really sure how that was gonna be,
but a lot of people have been,
I mean,
really,
everybody that has said anything has just said,
(24:18):
you know,
how smart that is and how great it is.
The four of us get along so well,
which I,
you know,
I was kind of laughing thinking we're all about 10 years apart.
And so we just have a whole range of ages,
but we all genuinely like each other.
And so I think that's been like one of the best things is if some,
(24:39):
you know,
something comes up with one of us,
even though we are all independent contractors and we're all doing our own thing,
helping each other when needed,
especially with a new venture because it is different than how we've done things in the past.
But we all are just so thrilled about all of it.
It has been really exciting and very happy.
(25:00):
So it's just been a lot of fun with those three ladies for sure.
So,
what do you think about building a team?
What,
because there were other brokers and I'm sure you're still friendly with them.
But what brought the four of you together,
I think for one,
you know,
we,
we had all worked for the same place and when this opportunity came up,
(25:24):
we and we had talked about,
you know,
that we wanted to stay together,
period.
That,
that was just going to be the case.
We,
the four of us had been in an office together in the same room together for many years.
We even at one point,
had a wall up between,
you know,
two of us were on one side and two of us were on,
on the other and we asked that the wall be taken down and so that we could,
(25:50):
you know,
and that really,
that was kind of where we had realized how much we all actually like each other.
And there's all different levels of experience too.
So again,
we can help each other.
And it's,
yeah,
it,
I don't know really what made it happen other than we just said,
(26:10):
we all like each other and want to stay together.
And so we just decided that's what we were going to do and we were stronger together.
And that has been really very true in this situation.
So that is such a happy accident when you get happy.
That is a great word for that.
Yeah,
it's so wonderful because you,
you know,
(26:31):
you,
you hear about people who have these sort of these golden experiences where the energy just sort of happens and a lot of it is maturity of individual work ethic,
similar ideas about the work itself and to be able to find each other because in a work environment is an accident,
you don't know who you're gonna be working with and while you might respect your colleagues,
(26:55):
it doesn't mean you want to go out with them afterwards.
And I think that's so true,
especially about work ethic.
You know,
I,
I think the,
the four of us in our situation,
we did have the same,
you know,
that we have our differences in how we do things,
but we also have so many similarities in how we want to be and who we want to be.
And so especially to our clients.
(27:16):
And so I think that really made all the difference of us coming together in that,
you know,
we just,
we're,
we're similar enough without it even ever being said.
And we just know,
but like,
yeah,
the synergy is probably the best way to,
to put that for sure.
I like it so much because of what you were saying,
made me think about values and like when you have a common mission and a common value that can really unite people.
(27:43):
And I've seen that in my own work at a university,
you have a lot of different beliefs and sometimes people are very vocal about it.
And I could find myself,
I found myself really enjoying some of my colleagues who I knew that I did not believe the same,
I believe politically religiously,
but we have the same mission.
(28:03):
Like I respect their work ethic.
I respect the mission that they're on and how they treat students and what they think they're up to are the same things that I think I'm up to.
And I think that's wonderful that we don't have to agree with somebody all the way down into the husband side.
But we can find these common grounds and work together right forward.
Right.
(28:23):
And,
you know,
it's,
it's been noted certainly in our situation,
just our level of happiness together.
And,
you know,
we've all talked about it after about,
you know,
making the right decision and how we all think we made the right decision,
but just how happy we are about that.
And so I think that really was the main thing and no,
(28:46):
you know,
there was just never any doubt that,
that we would stay together.
I think it was just automatic that,
that we wanted to do that.
But it's just,
yeah,
and,
you know,
having that,
whatever it is,
whatever,
you know,
that we all,
I don't,
I don't know exactly how to word it or what exactly,
you know,
made that turn but we just bonded.
(29:10):
I guess that was the best,
that's the best way to put it.
That is so lovely because I,
I am against talking about workplaces as families because of your different experiences.
Right.
And if somebody uses the family word,
you know,
the F word and the environment,
I think that's family.
Um,
and yet when you look at studies,
(29:31):
the,
the best sort of work environment is when you really feel that sort of kindred,
I think you can have a wonderful fruitful environment and not everybody at work is gonna be your BFF and you shouldn't think that.
But when it happens,
what a blessing,
what a gift.
Yeah,
absolutely.
Uh It's kind of a,
it's funny because you,
(29:52):
you know,
I,
you say that f word for,
you know,
work and,
uh you think about your own family and there,
it's similar in that you have some of those same conflicts or,
you know,
but you accept it for what it is.
And so far we've been very lucky that we haven't had anything that we couldn't figure out and that conflict,
(30:15):
you know,
but there's been that in,
in your,
in my own family,
you know,
the,
the conflict you can't always resolve and,
but in this so far,
so good that you know,
we haven't and it will happen that at some point we will have,
do I have any doubt we can work it out?
No,
not at all.
Yeah.
Yeah.
You know,
that's so wonderful.
(30:36):
When we think about managing conflict,
it starts way before conflict happens.
It's all about the relationship.
If you trust somebody and respect them,
then even what the situation is,
you can think about differently and,
and as you said,
yeah,
of course,
we're going to work it out because you already have this foundation.
And so my best advice for conflict management is work on your relationships before there's a conflict so that,
(31:01):
you know,
and you can trust and you can partner with when it all possible.
Now we inherit issues.
We go into issues.
But even then every individual can decide who they're going to be with.
Even the curmudgeon,
even the blood or the narcissist they run across.
You can still build a variety of different kind of relationships so that you can deal with the conflict that comes up.
(31:26):
Yeah,
I think that is the hard part too and that is the work because it doesn't,
you know,
I tend I know for myself to just shut down because I can't,
you know,
I just have to cut it off and I,
because I'm also somebody who wants to address whatever issues are happening immediately.
I cannot sit on something and let it fester because then it also festers in me and that I,
(31:50):
and I don't like that,
that is one part of,
you know,
of,
I guess just my internal,
you know,
personality that I cannot,
I just don't want to have that sort of thing weighing on me and it does because I internalize things.
And so,
you know,
when something happens,
I just wanna address it and that's not always going to be the case that that's possible.
(32:14):
And so I think that's a hard thing to sort of manage in itself and my own issues with conflict.
I know.
So I,
how do you do that?
I don't know.
I mean,
we go into a work environment and everybody has these vast pasts and we have successes and wounds and different ways in which we deal with conflict and whatever is going on with our own mental and physical health.
(32:39):
I am 100% because that's like having to be set aside to deal with whatever work conflict you have.
And then what if you're having,
you know,
then it's all compounded.
That's right.
And how do you do that?
I,
I don't know.
I mean,
I think part of that is,
you know,
each personality you just have to do.
Like,
what do they always say?
You know,
like bit by bit by bit by bit,
(33:00):
minute by minute,
you know,
you,
you have to try and one thing at a time and for me,
I know,
like I have to write lists of everything.
That's just how I deal with things or sometimes I'll write out an email that I never intend to send and it helps me just process that.
And then I,
you know,
if something comes up again and,
you know,
it might sit in my draft forever,
(33:22):
but sometimes I have to go back and read it and be like,
ok,
that's,
that's what I was thinking.
I need to set that.
That's the only way to,
to work through this is,
is let it just sit in that draft and not send it.
But it's a way for me to process some of that information.
And I think that's so wise finding that thing for us.
How do we process?
(33:42):
And so then when you have a group,
that's why I'm really interested in talking about professionalism and civility codes because we have all of our past and our present and we come together in this big mix,
which is actually really good.
But then we need to talk about what is civility here.
Oh my gosh,
that word could be,
yes,
(34:02):
it needs to be spread everywhere all the time and having conversations because I will come across people who are labeled a bully and they have no idea because we don't use our words,
we don't articulate,
we don't say that way of addressing is causing this effect.
What else can we do and constantly having those conversations with one another.
(34:24):
And then that's also how you build teams and trust and understand that the world doesn't revolve around me,
think like me need to act like me.
But we can really have a variety of ways of responding.
Well,
and I think that's so true.
You know,
someone might send an email that everybody thinks is not ok.
And how do you respond to that?
(34:45):
Because then they have no idea that,
you know,
they think that how they're talking is ok.
And you have to,
you know,
how do you respond to that?
I mean,
especially in group situations where there's like mass,
you know,
emails going out and,
and multiple people involved and you just don't,
you know,
having to try and respond civilly is not always the easiest,
(35:10):
right?
And,
and letting people know that how they talk to you is not ok or you know,
or is great,
you know,
a lot of times it's just like,
so refreshing when you get an email from somebody or a comment or for us,
you know,
reviews on Facebook and they talk about how we were with them during a transaction or,
(35:30):
you know,
and that is really what keeps us going for sure.
I mean,
making those bonds with people that we work with and on a day to day basis,
you know,
buying a house is probably one of the most stressful things anybody's ever done.
And like,
it's really interesting because some people are super stressed about it and some people are like,
yeah,
sign right there,
whatever,
you know.
(35:51):
I'm like,
ok,
do you want me to explain?
No?
Ok,
let's,
uh,
let's still go over it,
you know,
and,
and a lot of times people can be no matter what,
they're gonna be stressed from the moment you start to the moment you end and then some after that,
because our job never stops with that,
you know,
they'll call us for needs after,
(36:11):
you know,
like who can I get to,
you know,
do this or that or it,
it's kind of just a funny thing that,
you know,
these long term relationships we have with people.
And so,
you know,
we definitely wanna keep that positive as positive as we can.
Buying a house should be exciting or selling a house.
You know,
even though that's probably a little more stressful because there's some reason unless you're just selling to move away or,
(36:36):
you know,
selling to move just to a different house.
So you're,
that whole process comes together and you wanna,
you know,
especially buying and selling two houses at the same time,
particularly stressful.
And,
uh,
but it's still interesting,
of course,
you have a lot of different personalities in that situation.
It's such a good reminder because we see people doing good all the time and we don't say anything but we know how it feels when somebody articulates us,
(37:03):
we see people misbehaving and we don't say anything and then we wonder why they're still doing that because you've trained them.
And it's scary,
I think to say something to somebody,
I think it's scary for people to have to hear or have to articulate that someone is doing something you don't like.
And,
you know,
in,
in certain cases I've had to do that and,
(37:26):
or sometimes again I just shut down because,
and that's,
you know,
where I have a hard time telling people that's not ok.
What you said is not ok or what you did is not ok and you know,
but telling people,
oh my gosh,
you were the best to work with.
I could do that in a second.
(37:47):
No problem.
But the other is a lot more complicated.
It is.
And yet when we do it,
we feel better and we can learn to speak up for ourselves and not feel like we have to speak up for other people.
I mean,
like,
well,
it's good to speak up for others.
But sometimes we feel like if I say something I'm saying it's something for the whole,
(38:10):
you know,
we don't want everybody to always be speaking for you and you don't want to always speak for everybody.
So that certainly is the case that,
you know,
it's kind of a,
a very fine balance I think.
So I do conflict management for a living.
I find it very difficult personally.
Something just happened yesterday that it was really frustrated with and I decided to,
(38:33):
ok,
Mary de escalate yourself.
So I spent some time my Christina voice,
I deescalated.
I thought about it like,
what is the issue?
I realized it was residual issues from things that had happened before.
And I said,
well,
ok,
but that is how I feel and this is still disheartening and it shouldn't be happening.
(38:54):
So how can I not put all the burden on the situation and yet because of my past with this situation,
but I did it and I then there was a series of emails back and forth and I felt so much better and they were able to see the problem and they were able to work on it and stuff got resolved.
Instead of me saying,
why aren't they acting,
(39:15):
spending the narrative?
I think it is kind of scarier even in a small town than it is,
you know,
I,
I felt like I was more able to do those things when I lived in cities in a small town,
you know,
everybody and you see them on the,
on a regular basis,
which you would think sometimes that would make it easier,
but it's not always easier.
Sometimes that could make it harder in that,
(39:38):
you know,
ok,
I've got to see this person at XY and Z event.
So I really need to be very cautious on how I handle this,
but I still need to speak up for myself.
So how,
how do you do that?
And that is why people don't deal with conflict.
Exactly.
Because it is hard because our livelihood,
reputation and usually by the time something is really out of control,
(40:01):
we don't trust that person.
So,
are they gonna do character assassination?
You immediately think the worst of the person and,
you know,
not everything is so black and white,
it's probably gray.
And so you've just got to be a little,
you know,
more careful with how you do it,
but you can do it.
It's,
but you know,
I say that to you right now,
(40:22):
but you know,
will I do it with myself.
Not always baby steps as you always trying to be better tomorrow.
That's all we can do.
Well,
Kim,
I could talk to you forever now and I could have these conversations all the time.
So I would like to end with this question.
So your daughters are going out in the workforce or about to go in the workforce.
(40:46):
And what do you hope happens in the next 5 to 10 years so that they and others will be in work environments that are not like that law firm,
but rather that uh respect people and encourage them to thrive.
Well,
I think for my oldest daughter,
she's already experienced that.
(41:06):
And so she knows what's right and not right already in a work environment now,
my youngest has not had a,
she has managed a theater group but not actually had an employable like,
job,
job.
And so,
uh,
it'll be interesting to see but I really hope that they just pay attention to red flags when they go in and really realize they don't have to stay in that place if,
(41:35):
if they don't want to,
you know,
that,
that they can go on and,
and do something better for themselves and not be afraid to do those things or a,
afraid to speak up about stuff.
And I know,
I know,
I think I raised them to,
to not put up with anything but,
you know,
it's again,
(41:55):
I've put up with stuff myself.
So while I may have raised them that way,
you know,
it doesn't mean that that's always gonna be like that so that,
you know,
I just hope their work experience,
they just pay attention as they go in.
I love that.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
Well,
thank you so much,
Kim.
It's been so great talking with you about this.
You too.
I appreciate it.
Well,
take care.
You too,
(42:16):
Kim.
Thank you so much for being on Conflict Managed.
And may we all take your advice of paying attention to red flags so that we can act for our good and the good of others around us.
Conflict Managed is produced by Third Party Workplace Conflict Restoration Services and hosted by me,
Merry Brown.
You can find us online at 3PConflictRestoration.com.
(42:38):
If you haven't had a chance to check out my new book,
How to Be Unprofessional at Work (42:40):
Tips,
to Ensure Failure.
It's 80 tips of what NOT to do and starts a conversation about
what should we do instead.
What do we want our workplaces to be like?
What are our expectations of ourselves and our colleagues? Join us again.
Next week we have new episodes every Tuesday.
(43:00):
Our music is courtesy of Dove Pilot. And remember,
conflict is normal and to be expected,
let's deal with it until next time.
Take care.
(43:22):
So.
All right,
this is all right.
I got it.
I do wraps now.
Get a sound side uptight,
asking questions.
(00:25):
Welcome to Conflict Managed.
I'm your host,
Merry Brown.
Today in Conflict Managed,
we are joined by Kim Longacre.
Kim has been a realtor for almost eight years.
She initially started her career by dealing with foreclosures but later transitioned into helping people find their ideal homes as a real estate broker.
Prior to that,
Kim ran her local coffee shop,
(00:47):
The Looking Glass.
Additionally,
she has served as a member of the Weakley County School Board for a period of nine years in 2023.
She was elected as the president of the Realfoot Regional Association of Realtors and will continue to serve on the board.
The next year,
Kim has a passion for art and enjoys indulging in various art forms ranging from ceramics to painting.
(01:08):
Good morning,
Kim and welcome to Conflict Managed.
Good Morning.
So happy to have you here today on the show.
Thank you.
Happy to be here.
So let's just go ahead and start from the very beginning.
Will you tell us about your first job?
Oh,
my gosh.
Yes.
My first job was,
uh,
at a check recovery business and it was a family friend.
(01:30):
I think I made $3.80 an hour.
It was back in those days.
and also when there were more checks being written at the time it was,
yeah,
return check company.
So I would answer the phone when they would try to get the money for businesses.
And I ended up just doing little side work for them when I was 15 or 16.
(01:57):
I guess it was,
that was my very first job.
So,
were you dealing with upset customers sometimes?
But mostly just to transfer the call?
Thank goodness.
Oh,
just a minute.
I've got someone else for you to talk with.
Right.
And how long did you do that job?
Uh,
I just did that for about a year and then I worked for a grocery store for several years all the way until I was in college and went from cashier to working in the office and being a front end manager.
(02:29):
So,
and that was only when I was 16 to 19 or 20 maybe 19,
I guess,
would probably be about right.
What was that experience as a first time manager?
Like for you?
I really loved it.
There were,
I had a lot of friends there and so we just had some sort of bond,
I guess,
would be the best way to put that.
(02:50):
And we also had really good management there.
And for a small,
you know,
grocery store,
it,
it,
it was just a lot of fun.
I,
I loved working there.
What did they do?
I mean,
what made it good management.
I think they were just friendly,
reasonable people.
They weren't,
you know,
that number one,
all the breaks were very well timed.
They made sure everybody was getting their break when they needed to.
(03:13):
Of course,
that was also the days when you clocked in.
So,
you know,
they would say no,
you need to sit upstairs until you're ready to clock in and then you clock in right at the time and go,
you know,
get your till and go to the front and,
but they,
you know,
there were a lot of teenagers that worked there so easily they could have been taken advantage of,
I guess,
or,
(03:33):
you know,
management could have been really ridiculous about stuff,
but they were really,
really good.
I'm still even friends with a lot of the same people from back then.
So,
yeah,
I like those three words,
friendly,
organized and reasonable.
I mean,
what else do you want in a work?
Exactly.
And I think that kind of set the tone of like,
basically how things should be for me in the future,
(03:55):
you know,
didn't always work that way,
but it certainly was like,
ok,
that was a really good first ex,
first couple,
really experiences.
So,
um,
I really enjoyed working there quite a bit and also the tone of a work culture.
So,
if the work culture is already like that and somebody gets hired in,
that's the expectation that's been set.
Yes,
absolutely.
(04:15):
I mean,
we did stuff together outside of work,
even like the management would take us bowling or,
you know,
they'd order pizza for us and it was just,
and what was funny about that job is I remember being a little anxious about it.
They had us take one of those personality tests at the beginning and I was like,
what does this even mean?
Like?
And so I was,
I wasn't sure,
(04:36):
but then after that,
I mean,
it was totally fine.
So that was the only weird thing that I was like,
ok,
this is new.
How interesting.
I wonder how they used it.
I wonder if they use it.
I know,
because it was,
let's say the nine,
early nineties,
late eighties,
early nineties,
I guess when.
So.
Yeah,
I don't know what they used it for.
(04:56):
I wish I knew it is.
It is.
Yeah.
So,
then you went off to college?
I did.
And what did you major in psychology?
So,
yeah.
Yeah,
minor in art.
So,
I,
I did that and still use both of those things regularly.
So,
with my current job,
(05:16):
of course,
and then I,
when I graduated my first job was a mortgage company.
We had moved and I've gotten married and I worked at this mortgage company.
It was a small mortgage company.
And I got there in the first day I knew something was not right.
(05:39):
I should say the second day,
the first day it seemed,
you know,
you just go in and you're like,
ok,
this is your first day.
Second day.
A girl came up to me and said you can fax your resume out in the back room back here and showed me where to do it.
And so I was like,
oh,
this is a red flag right away.
And I think I only stayed there maybe six months or a year and saw why nobody stayed.
(06:06):
It was very,
I guess,
kind of stuck back in time like they didn't do anything,
everything was paper and I mean,
this was 1999.
So by that point,
things were changing quite a bit but they didn't even have computers.
So there was just,
it was a really,
(06:28):
yeah,
I was lucky,
I guess that they had a fax machine.
A lot of us ended up at this same company after that,
which did foreclosures.
And that's kind of when I started doing foreclosures for lots of it was,
it was one bank and,
but it was a nationwide bank.
And so we had an office that had about two or 300 employees and did foreclosures for a few years until I got laid off from that.
(06:56):
And then I went to a completely different field which was communications they did fiber underground and I really,
that job was weird.
Uh,
you know,
you,
nobody ever gave us,
it was very corporate and we never had any direction of what we were actually supposed to be doing.
(07:17):
So,
it seemed really like I was just kind of floating along there for a couple of years and then got laid off from there and then ended up working at a law firm first 12 years.
Let's see,
it was quite a while.
But no,
it must not have been 12 years.
It was shorter than that.
(07:37):
But that job was my main job until we left that town.
So,
and that was an interesting job too.
I mean,
it was really good and that I made a lot of really good friends but,
uh,
toxic work environment.
Yes,
100% very bad management.
What kinds of things did they do?
(07:59):
Uh,
encouraged gossip.
You know,
it would just petty things,
you know,
the management would always say,
well,
this job isn't brain surgery.
So y'all just need to calm down but then immediately turn around and like lay the pressure on and we were doing foreclosures for every bank in the state at that point.
And so,
you know,
(08:20):
there was a constant numbers coming in all the time but the management there just,
uh,
unreal always would bring people in her office and,
you know,
start at some sort of gossip chain of whatever.
And it was just and fire people all the time.
You know,
that really did not deserve how they were treated.
(08:40):
It was pretty incredible.
But I think that,
that also had some sort of trauma bonding in that,
you know,
uh,
some of my,
and again,
my best friend who I still talk to all the time and I was really thankful to meet her there because,
and actually I met her at,
at the business before that and then she helped me get the job there.
(09:02):
And then of course,
we had a whole little group of friends that worked there and that really helped us get through because it was rough.
You know,
it's interesting that you say petty because so much of a toxic work environment feels like it's a compounding of pettiness.
And like we think about gossip,
(09:23):
gossip happens in an isolated conversation and another isolated.
And so when you tell somebody,
it makes it sound like you're the problem,
you know,
and,
you know,
we talk about gas line say that's exactly how it was.
I mean,
it was really a weird environment to be in.
We had to beg for getting,
we were promised at the beginning we would get yearly evaluations.
(09:46):
We would have to beg for those for months to get that to happen,
you know,
so that we could just get basic,
you know,
pay raises that,
I mean,
even just a minimal pay raise and still it would be months late even though.
That was something we were promised at the beginning.
But,
yeah,
gas lighting 100%.
I mean,
that,
that,
and that wasn't even a term back then,
(10:07):
you know.
Yeah,
things happened before we have that.
But yeah,
there was a lot,
a lot of that.
So it was really a weird place.
I mean,
I would say probably that she was one of the worst bosses I ever had.
So,
why was she allowed to continue?
I think the partners in the firm probably didn't realize what all she,
(10:31):
they,
they just felt like she managed,
there were about 50 to 100 employees at the time and I think they thought that she was because they just weren't present or they weren't present in what was going on.
There were several different attorneys who did different things and she managed all of,
you know,
under one specific attorney and then there were attorneys below him.
(10:53):
And so it just was not,
it was not noticed how she behaved.
I think she had been there so long and she's probably still there.
I mean,
but after leaving a friend told me and she had left,
I was still there and she,
she said you wouldn't believe how you're going to feel when you do leave.
(11:16):
And I,
I didn't,
uh,
I listened to that and at the time I was like,
ok,
sure.
And then I left and I knew exactly what she was talking about.
It.
Was that freedom of just like letting that whole thing go.
And it was,
it was shockingly like,
just like a weight had been lifted and I just didn't know because I've been stuck in that for so long,
(11:38):
you know,
and you're,
when you're comfortable in those situations,
I think you don't really pay attention to all of the red flags at once.
You're just like,
ok,
this is,
what do,
what do they always say?
This is the evil.
I know.
But yeah,
it's so interesting that,
(11:59):
and it happens everywhere,
this unnoticed,
you know,
that people are allowed to get away with.
And sometimes,
you know,
we say,
well,
we're busy or I don't want to be a micro manager which is excuse,
excuse.
Right.
For sure.
And needing these mechanisms so that the good bosses shine and we're able to shine a light on those people who are making everybody else's life miserable.
(12:21):
Yeah.
Yeah.
I think it really also brought forward how later down the road when I was a boss myself,
I realized there was no way I was gonna be like that.
And that was not long after that job.
So,
you know,
I owned a coffee shop for seven years and I made a point to never ever be like that.
(12:43):
And now mind you,
I did not have the same amount of employees and didn't have to deal with the same type of stuff.
But I just knew how I wasn't going to be and it did help.
I feel like,
I mean,
I still talk to the people that I,
that worked for me and one of them asks me for a reference every now and then and I still give it because she was a great employee and she,
she made it so easy to,
(13:04):
to be a good boss too.
You know,
she was,
she would always arrived on time.
She did what I asked her to,
I didn't have to ever worry about it,
but I just knew that I wasn't going to perpetuate any of that type of behavior.
Do you see any,
because you were there for quite some time?
Do you see any of that still affecting you today?
(13:26):
Yeah.
Yeah.
I mean,
every now and then I'll still have a nightmare about it or,
which is kind of interesting because it,
you know,
something will happen that triggers that thought or,
or thinking about it,
you know,
like having a dream about it or,
but,
and just,
you know,
in my day to day life I just realized,
(13:47):
you know,
being kind and not being like that was certainly something I didn't wanna,
I just didn't wanna be like that,
knowing what,
you know,
today,
if you were to go back to an experience like that,
what if anything would you do differently?
I'd probably start,
I'd run.
(14:09):
Where is the fax machine?
Yeah,
exactly.
Where is the resume fax machine?
Um,
yeah.
I don't,
I don't think I would have stayed as long as I did.
I mean,
the pay was good and,
and that part was good,
but I just don't think I could deal with that kind of stuff again.
You know,
at this age too.
(14:30):
I,
you know,
I was young back then so,
you know,
it was a little or younger and you can put up with more when you're younger,
I guess.
And you know,
when you're the one,
like at the time I was the breadwinner of the,
of the house.
So you just,
I did what I had to do.
Yeah,
I mean,
that is the answer for a lot of it.
We are in jobs because we have mortgages to pay the bills.
(14:53):
This isn't like,
you know,
that is certainly the case.
I remember working with somebody who I was told that she was the secretary at this particular place because they were,
they had tons of money and she wanted something to do.
She was the nicest person,
but that was a really bad environment and she did not stay very long because she,
(15:17):
I'm not going to be treated this way.
So I'm gonna leave and I think that's the most important thing is that most people that,
I mean,
what,
what else are you gonna do?
You,
you were there to do a job,
you're gonna get paid.
So then you stick it out and just do it and I think sometimes you end up just staying longer because it's easier because it's what,
you know.
That's right.
It's,
it's,
(15:38):
it may not be comfortable but it's comfortable.
Right.
That's right.
It's a lot harder to go out and find something new and,
you know,
but I would say that that's like,
I think,
I don't want to say it,
it would stop you,
you know.
But I think it does stop a lot of people that fear of the unknown.
And so ending up like,
and that would be,
(15:58):
you know,
something I think,
I think about all the time is just that don't be afraid of that because sometimes it works out a lot better than you think.
I mean,
it might be scary at first,
but it helps to,
to go on,
you know,
and that's why I think we need to talk to people more about conflict management and change management that changes the name of the game.
(16:19):
So there's going to be change in your organization,
the people you really like will leave the people that you don't like will stay and then whatever is happening in the economy in your particular field.
So there's always going to be change.
So if you get comfortable with change that maybe you're more likely to read the writing on the wall when this place no longer fits with your values or you're being treated in a way that is really unacceptable.
(16:44):
And so being aware that first of all that treatment is unacceptable and then not being afraid to act.
Yeah,
100%.
Yes.
And yet,
you know,
I,
I read a lot about conflict management and sometimes people get too theoretical pie in the sky where the reality is,
you know,
we're paying,
you know,
for our mortgage and our food and we have health insurance and the options may not be if you live in a small town or your industry is very small,
(17:13):
there may not be a lot of options.
And so instead of looking elsewhere,
one thing that you can definitely do is what can I do?
What can I be the change because one person really can make a big change.
Right.
And I think,
you know,
in that job at the law firm,
I think I certainly kept my head down and tried to do,
(17:34):
just do my job and avoid a lot of that drama that it's just,
it got where,
you know,
drama is perpetuated downward.
And so from management,
then the next person would,
you know,
fall into that.
And so I tried to stay out of that fray but it didn't,
you know,
it doesn't always work.
But yeah,
(17:55):
change,
like saying it's ok for change and that maybe,
you know,
if you ha well,
again,
like you just said,
with the small town,
you might have as many things available to you or,
you know,
but certainly you can always be keeping your eye open for stuff like that,
you know,
and I think when we tell ourselves,
you know,
when I,
when I saw a few years before I left philosophy that it was time for me to leave.
(18:19):
I stayed longer than I should have because what am I supposed to do?
I'm a philosopher in a small town,
you know,
believe it or not.
Folks got a lot of jobs.
They're philosophers shocking,
but that's actually false.
Once I stepped out,
I didn't see any of the opportunities because I wasn't looking for the opportunities.
(18:39):
I wasn't putting myself in a space to meet people.
I lived in a small town for 20 years and only know university people and whose fault was that it was mine.
But I didn't see that because I had told myself this narrative that there isn't anything available and so make it work well.
And I think,
yeah,
with the in psychology,
(19:00):
I thought I was gonna,
you know,
go work with kids in some manner and,
and the reality was those were minimum wage,
paying jobs that couldn't pay the bills.
And so that,
that's how I even ended up in,
you know,
from that field.
And,
but what's funny is,
of course,
I had never really even thought of it until I've had this job is how much I use that degree.
(19:23):
Now,
you know,
being a realtor,
you constantly are doing some sort of psychological,
like,
ok,
let's keep calm.
My cousin has this thing that I,
and I even joke with her about it all the time.
But she's like,
you know,
you just need to use your Christina voice,
which is my cousin.
And so she's,
it's this calm voice that,
(19:45):
you know,
you,
you used to talk to people so that they stay calm and that,
you know,
and I,
I'm probably fail at that 99% of the time,
but it's something I aspire to always and that,
you know,
deescalating a situation where something might be.
And so that psychology comes in and,
and I hear her in my back of my head telling me to use that voice to come in and,
(20:09):
you know,
try to keep people calm.
But while that degree was maybe not used in the way I thought it was going to be used,
it is definitely used.
And your art minor.
Yes.
Yeah.
Still do that.
So well,
I would also imagine,
I mean,
so much of reality obviously is the visual aspect,
definitely.
And so helping people either to sell it or the book.
(20:30):
Right.
Yeah.
With photography,
with,
you know,
of course,
our marketing and especially now we're doing our own marketing all the time.
So that certainly comes up and,
and it's what I used to keep me calm at home.
So I still do a lot of art stuff at home and that's really kind of my outlet of that.
(20:51):
So I try to,
I use that in multiple ways,
for sure.
So,
when you came to Martin,
so you had a job and then you opened a coffee shop for seven years.
Why did you go into business for yourself?
Well,
I think part of it was we were in a small town that,
and I had always dreamed about opening at the time.
I wanted like some sort of little home decor type shop and as that progressed,
(21:19):
you know,
I,
I thought about it and thought about it and tried to,
you know,
bring all that together and,
and,
but the more it progressed,
the more people were like,
could you please have coffee?
And honestly,
the,
I,
I barely even drink coffee.
So I didn't know much about it at all.
And I luckily I had a couple friends that taught me a lot and previous coffee shop owners that taught me a lot about it.
(21:43):
And so I made that a integral part of that business and that really ran the business.
I mean,
so it was really,
I wanted just like a little gift shop,
but then that sort of kind of just tumbled into that.
Yeah.
But,
you know,
the thing about owning your own business,
(22:04):
of course,
is all the stress that comes with that.
So,
you know,
every night I was always like thinking what was what I needed to do because I could only rely on myself for that.
And,
you know,
it felt pretty at the end of that.
I think it felt pretty isolating number one.
But I,
it took me an adjustment moving into real estate in that,
(22:27):
you know,
I was kind of stuck there all the time and,
and I,
and I don't mean stuck in the worst way or anything.
I enjoyed it.
I loved talking to the people and I really miss a lot of the things,
those people I see every single day because they would drink coffee.
I know you being one of them,
of course,
now we get to see each other more.
But,
um,
you know,
that portion of things.
But I was also,
I had to change my mindset of how to be free.
(22:52):
And I guess what I mean by that is,
uh,
I didn't have to ask anybody's permission anymore,
even my own to go to my kids events or,
you know,
like in the middle of the day.
And I never could do that before because I was down there and I could not leave.
I needed to be there.
And so,
you know,
(23:12):
it's like working an 8 to 5 job.
You'd have to,
you know,
ask somebody permission.
But real estate,
you know,
there's just a lot more freedom in your scheduling because of course,
you're working in the evenings and on the weekends.
And so that's kind of the trade off is that you're,
but I had to get it out of my head that I needed to work 8 to 5.
And that was a weird concept for me and I could just go off and,
(23:35):
you know,
go do what I needed to do.
Start a little laundry in the middle of the day if I needed to,
whatever it takes.
So,
you love the coffee shop in,
into reality.
And you've been in that for eight years and you started a bit of a new venture.
Yes.
Yeah.
Um,
we,
we've changed companies and four of us and have come over here together to,
(23:58):
to work for L BT reality and we love it.
We wanted to stay together after our broker passed away.
And so we've had some really good feedback about that,
which I,
we weren't really sure how that was gonna be,
but a lot of people have been,
I mean,
really,
everybody that has said anything has just said,
(24:18):
you know,
how smart that is and how great it is.
The four of us get along so well,
which I,
you know,
I was kind of laughing thinking we're all about 10 years apart.
And so we just have a whole range of ages,
but we all genuinely like each other.
And so I think that's been like one of the best things is if some,
(24:39):
you know,
something comes up with one of us,
even though we are all independent contractors and we're all doing our own thing,
helping each other when needed,
especially with a new venture because it is different than how we've done things in the past.
But we all are just so thrilled about all of it.
It has been really exciting and very happy.
(25:00):
So it's just been a lot of fun with those three ladies for sure.
So,
what do you think about building a team?
What,
because there were other brokers and I'm sure you're still friendly with them.
But what brought the four of you together,
I think for one,
you know,
we,
we had all worked for the same place and when this opportunity came up,
(25:24):
we and we had talked about,
you know,
that we wanted to stay together,
period.
That,
that was just going to be the case.
We,
the four of us had been in an office together in the same room together for many years.
We even at one point,
had a wall up between,
you know,
two of us were on one side and two of us were on,
on the other and we asked that the wall be taken down and so that we could,
(25:50):
you know,
and that really,
that was kind of where we had realized how much we all actually like each other.
And there's all different levels of experience too.
So again,
we can help each other.
And it's,
yeah,
it,
I don't know really what made it happen other than we just said,
(26:10):
we all like each other and want to stay together.
And so we just decided that's what we were going to do and we were stronger together.
And that has been really very true in this situation.
So that is such a happy accident when you get happy.
That is a great word for that.
Yeah,
it's so wonderful because you,
you know,
(26:31):
you,
you hear about people who have these sort of these golden experiences where the energy just sort of happens and a lot of it is maturity of individual work ethic,
similar ideas about the work itself and to be able to find each other because in a work environment is an accident,
you don't know who you're gonna be working with and while you might respect your colleagues,
(26:55):
it doesn't mean you want to go out with them afterwards.
And I think that's so true,
especially about work ethic.
You know,
I,
I think the,
the four of us in our situation,
we did have the same,
you know,
that we have our differences in how we do things,
but we also have so many similarities in how we want to be and who we want to be.
And so especially to our clients.
(27:16):
And so I think that really made all the difference of us coming together in that,
you know,
we just,
we're,
we're similar enough without it even ever being said.
And we just know,
but like,
yeah,
the synergy is probably the best way to,
to put that for sure.
I like it so much because of what you were saying,
made me think about values and like when you have a common mission and a common value that can really unite people.
(27:43):
And I've seen that in my own work at a university,
you have a lot of different beliefs and sometimes people are very vocal about it.
And I could find myself,
I found myself really enjoying some of my colleagues who I knew that I did not believe the same,
I believe politically religiously,
but we have the same mission.
(28:03):
Like I respect their work ethic.
I respect the mission that they're on and how they treat students and what they think they're up to are the same things that I think I'm up to.
And I think that's wonderful that we don't have to agree with somebody all the way down into the husband side.
But we can find these common grounds and work together right forward.
Right.
(28:23):
And,
you know,
it's,
it's been noted certainly in our situation,
just our level of happiness together.
And,
you know,
we've all talked about it after about,
you know,
making the right decision and how we all think we made the right decision,
but just how happy we are about that.
And so I think that really was the main thing and no,
(28:46):
you know,
there was just never any doubt that,
that we would stay together.
I think it was just automatic that,
that we wanted to do that.
But it's just,
yeah,
and,
you know,
having that,
whatever it is,
whatever,
you know,
that we all,
I don't,
I don't know exactly how to word it or what exactly,
you know,
made that turn but we just bonded.
(29:10):
I guess that was the best,
that's the best way to put it.
That is so lovely because I,
I am against talking about workplaces as families because of your different experiences.
Right.
And if somebody uses the family word,
you know,
the F word and the environment,
I think that's family.
Um,
and yet when you look at studies,
(29:31):
the,
the best sort of work environment is when you really feel that sort of kindred,
I think you can have a wonderful fruitful environment and not everybody at work is gonna be your BFF and you shouldn't think that.
But when it happens,
what a blessing,
what a gift.
Yeah,
absolutely.
Uh It's kind of a,
it's funny because you,
(29:52):
you know,
I,
you say that f word for,
you know,
work and,
uh you think about your own family and there,
it's similar in that you have some of those same conflicts or,
you know,
but you accept it for what it is.
And so far we've been very lucky that we haven't had anything that we couldn't figure out and that conflict,
(30:15):
you know,
but there's been that in,
in your,
in my own family,
you know,
the,
the conflict you can't always resolve and,
but in this so far,
so good that you know,
we haven't and it will happen that at some point we will have,
do I have any doubt we can work it out?
No,
not at all.
Yeah.
Yeah.
You know,
that's so wonderful.
(30:36):
When we think about managing conflict,
it starts way before conflict happens.
It's all about the relationship.
If you trust somebody and respect them,
then even what the situation is,
you can think about differently and,
and as you said,
yeah,
of course,
we're going to work it out because you already have this foundation.
And so my best advice for conflict management is work on your relationships before there's a conflict so that,
(31:01):
you know,
and you can trust and you can partner with when it all possible.
Now we inherit issues.
We go into issues.
But even then every individual can decide who they're going to be with.
Even the curmudgeon,
even the blood or the narcissist they run across.
You can still build a variety of different kind of relationships so that you can deal with the conflict that comes up.
(31:26):
Yeah,
I think that is the hard part too and that is the work because it doesn't,
you know,
I tend I know for myself to just shut down because I can't,
you know,
I just have to cut it off and I,
because I'm also somebody who wants to address whatever issues are happening immediately.
I cannot sit on something and let it fester because then it also festers in me and that I,
(31:50):
and I don't like that,
that is one part of,
you know,
of,
I guess just my internal,
you know,
personality that I cannot,
I just don't want to have that sort of thing weighing on me and it does because I internalize things.
And so,
you know,
when something happens,
I just wanna address it and that's not always going to be the case that that's possible.
(32:14):
And so I think that's a hard thing to sort of manage in itself and my own issues with conflict.
I know.
So I,
how do you do that?
I don't know.
I mean,
we go into a work environment and everybody has these vast pasts and we have successes and wounds and different ways in which we deal with conflict and whatever is going on with our own mental and physical health.
(32:39):
I am 100% because that's like having to be set aside to deal with whatever work conflict you have.
And then what if you're having,
you know,
then it's all compounded.
That's right.
And how do you do that?
I,
I don't know.
I mean,
I think part of that is,
you know,
each personality you just have to do.
Like,
what do they always say?
You know,
like bit by bit by bit by bit,
(33:00):
minute by minute,
you know,
you,
you have to try and one thing at a time and for me,
I know,
like I have to write lists of everything.
That's just how I deal with things or sometimes I'll write out an email that I never intend to send and it helps me just process that.
And then I,
you know,
if something comes up again and,
you know,
it might sit in my draft forever,
(33:22):
but sometimes I have to go back and read it and be like,
ok,
that's,
that's what I was thinking.
I need to set that.
That's the only way to,
to work through this is,
is let it just sit in that draft and not send it.
But it's a way for me to process some of that information.
And I think that's so wise finding that thing for us.
How do we process?
(33:42):
And so then when you have a group,
that's why I'm really interested in talking about professionalism and civility codes because we have all of our past and our present and we come together in this big mix,
which is actually really good.
But then we need to talk about what is civility here.
Oh my gosh,
that word could be,
yes,
(34:02):
it needs to be spread everywhere all the time and having conversations because I will come across people who are labeled a bully and they have no idea because we don't use our words,
we don't articulate,
we don't say that way of addressing is causing this effect.
What else can we do and constantly having those conversations with one another.
(34:24):
And then that's also how you build teams and trust and understand that the world doesn't revolve around me,
think like me need to act like me.
But we can really have a variety of ways of responding.
Well,
and I think that's so true.
You know,
someone might send an email that everybody thinks is not ok.
And how do you respond to that?
(34:45):
Because then they have no idea that,
you know,
they think that how they're talking is ok.
And you have to,
you know,
how do you respond to that?
I mean,
especially in group situations where there's like mass,
you know,
emails going out and,
and multiple people involved and you just don't,
you know,
having to try and respond civilly is not always the easiest,
(35:10):
right?
And,
and letting people know that how they talk to you is not ok or you know,
or is great,
you know,
a lot of times it's just like,
so refreshing when you get an email from somebody or a comment or for us,
you know,
reviews on Facebook and they talk about how we were with them during a transaction or,
(35:30):
you know,
and that is really what keeps us going for sure.
I mean,
making those bonds with people that we work with and on a day to day basis,
you know,
buying a house is probably one of the most stressful things anybody's ever done.
And like,
it's really interesting because some people are super stressed about it and some people are like,
yeah,
sign right there,
whatever,
you know.
(35:51):
I'm like,
ok,
do you want me to explain?
No?
Ok,
let's,
uh,
let's still go over it,
you know,
and,
and a lot of times people can be no matter what,
they're gonna be stressed from the moment you start to the moment you end and then some after that,
because our job never stops with that,
you know,
they'll call us for needs after,
(36:11):
you know,
like who can I get to,
you know,
do this or that or it,
it's kind of just a funny thing that,
you know,
these long term relationships we have with people.
And so,
you know,
we definitely wanna keep that positive as positive as we can.
Buying a house should be exciting or selling a house.
You know,
even though that's probably a little more stressful because there's some reason unless you're just selling to move away or,
(36:36):
you know,
selling to move just to a different house.
So you're,
that whole process comes together and you wanna,
you know,
especially buying and selling two houses at the same time,
particularly stressful.
And,
uh,
but it's still interesting,
of course,
you have a lot of different personalities in that situation.
It's such a good reminder because we see people doing good all the time and we don't say anything but we know how it feels when somebody articulates us,
(37:03):
we see people misbehaving and we don't say anything and then we wonder why they're still doing that because you've trained them.
And it's scary,
I think to say something to somebody,
I think it's scary for people to have to hear or have to articulate that someone is doing something you don't like.
And,
you know,
in,
in certain cases I've had to do that and,
(37:26):
or sometimes again I just shut down because,
and that's,
you know,
where I have a hard time telling people that's not ok.
What you said is not ok or what you did is not ok and you know,
but telling people,
oh my gosh,
you were the best to work with.
I could do that in a second.
(37:47):
No problem.
But the other is a lot more complicated.
It is.
And yet when we do it,
we feel better and we can learn to speak up for ourselves and not feel like we have to speak up for other people.
I mean,
like,
well,
it's good to speak up for others.
But sometimes we feel like if I say something I'm saying it's something for the whole,
(38:10):
you know,
we don't want everybody to always be speaking for you and you don't want to always speak for everybody.
So that certainly is the case that,
you know,
it's kind of a,
a very fine balance I think.
So I do conflict management for a living.
I find it very difficult personally.
Something just happened yesterday that it was really frustrated with and I decided to,
(38:33):
ok,
Mary de escalate yourself.
So I spent some time my Christina voice,
I deescalated.
I thought about it like,
what is the issue?
I realized it was residual issues from things that had happened before.
And I said,
well,
ok,
but that is how I feel and this is still disheartening and it shouldn't be happening.
(38:54):
So how can I not put all the burden on the situation and yet because of my past with this situation,
but I did it and I then there was a series of emails back and forth and I felt so much better and they were able to see the problem and they were able to work on it and stuff got resolved.
Instead of me saying,
why aren't they acting,
(39:15):
spending the narrative?
I think it is kind of scarier even in a small town than it is,
you know,
I,
I felt like I was more able to do those things when I lived in cities in a small town,
you know,
everybody and you see them on the,
on a regular basis,
which you would think sometimes that would make it easier,
but it's not always easier.
Sometimes that could make it harder in that,
(39:38):
you know,
ok,
I've got to see this person at XY and Z event.
So I really need to be very cautious on how I handle this,
but I still need to speak up for myself.
So how,
how do you do that?
And that is why people don't deal with conflict.
Exactly.
Because it is hard because our livelihood,
reputation and usually by the time something is really out of control,
(40:01):
we don't trust that person.
So,
are they gonna do character assassination?
You immediately think the worst of the person and,
you know,
not everything is so black and white,
it's probably gray.
And so you've just got to be a little,
you know,
more careful with how you do it,
but you can do it.
It's,
but you know,
I say that to you right now,
(40:22):
but you know,
will I do it with myself.
Not always baby steps as you always trying to be better tomorrow.
That's all we can do.
Well,
Kim,
I could talk to you forever now and I could have these conversations all the time.
So I would like to end with this question.
So your daughters are going out in the workforce or about to go in the workforce.
(40:46):
And what do you hope happens in the next 5 to 10 years so that they and others will be in work environments that are not like that law firm,
but rather that uh respect people and encourage them to thrive.
Well,
I think for my oldest daughter,
she's already experienced that.
(41:06):
And so she knows what's right and not right already in a work environment now,
my youngest has not had a,
she has managed a theater group but not actually had an employable like,
job,
job.
And so,
uh,
it'll be interesting to see but I really hope that they just pay attention to red flags when they go in and really realize they don't have to stay in that place if,
(41:35):
if they don't want to,
you know,
that,
that they can go on and,
and do something better for themselves and not be afraid to do those things or a,
afraid to speak up about stuff.
And I know,
I know,
I think I raised them to,
to not put up with anything but,
you know,
it's again,
(41:55):
I've put up with stuff myself.
So while I may have raised them that way,
you know,
it doesn't mean that that's always gonna be like that so that,
you know,
I just hope their work experience,
they just pay attention as they go in.
I love that.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
Well,
thank you so much,
Kim.
It's been so great talking with you about this.
You too.
I appreciate it.
Well,
take care.
You too,
(42:16):
Kim.
Thank you so much for being on Conflict Managed.
And may we all take your advice of paying attention to red flags so that we can act for our good and the good of others around us.
Conflict Managed is produced by Third Party Workplace Conflict Restoration Services and hosted by me,
Merry Brown.
You can find us online at 3PConflictRestoration.com.
(42:38):
If you haven't had a chance to check out my new book,
How to Be Unprofessional at Work (42:40):
Tips,
to Ensure Failure.
It's 80 tips of what NOT to do and starts a conversation about
what should we do instead.
What do we want our workplaces to be like?
What are our expectations of ourselves and our colleagues? Join us again.
Next week we have new episodes every Tuesday.
(43:00):
Our music is courtesy of Dove Pilot. And remember,
conflict is normal and to be expected,
let's deal with it until next time.
Take care.
(43:22):
So.
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